From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 09:40:18 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81DeHCB013662 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 09:40:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81DdWlE093792 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 07:39:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81DdSNE073525; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 07:39:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81DdP5d073484 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 07:39:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maricelt@gmail.com) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so154289rne for ; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 06:39:24 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=qgJmsDghb91v5HsHF2khBu5fQixJ5k2t5pM4uBvFaAOyldDA+gKkESF638Kao3+nBMpOveNTeUrkQdXRyqSjX4V/bLtQdrdtgqmH33tu96CiXHQFlMDsQKi2HlCnOWKs+Ut5z0NMLUqdF4Sc0wbVQtj5GgcbCr8x7lV49wowxfM= Received: by 10.38.78.45 with SMTP id a45mr17831rnb; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 06:39:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.38.101.56 with HTTP; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 06:39:24 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <72adc26605090106395175bcdb@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 09:39:24 -0400 From: Marie Stewart To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: Gores In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 References: <72adc266050831155525e0f6cb@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1050/Thu Sep 1 02:26:43 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1050/Thu Sep 1 02:26:43 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j81DeHCB013662 Status: RO Hi folks... good discussion here... thanks, > Just how many extant garments do we have to make that assumption on? I > > would personally think that gores varied ... some pointy, some not. > > I didn't say "no gores in the 13th century are sharp." I said it's a > mistake > to assume, from the evidence we have, that sharpness of gores was > considered an important workmanship issue, or that medieval methods would, > if properly done, necessarily produce sharp gores. Excellent point - and one on which many re-creators, re-enactors get stuck. It's a point where the modern aesthetic conflicts with the medieval evidence. but I haven't seen evidence that they had any motivation to do this. Let me look through my resources... it'll be an interesting thing to go look for. One area that is a bit later than medieval is the Tudor and Elizabethan shirt, in these we tend to see very precise stitching and setting in of gores and godets. My point is this: hallelujah! Yes... it is true that many people assume that a flat or even tucked gore is wrong. And it is true that there are only a few of us out there that teach this alternative to the masses, but as you know education is a process... and I have faith that one day the balance will tip so that the "common wisdom" comes more in line with actual evidence. Until then, we keep teaching. But we have absolutely no reason to think that flat, sharp gore points were > valued, and what > little data we have seems to suggest otherwise. This I would point out is arguable, mainly because we do have so little data to work with. We do know that longevity and wearability would be valued... so if someone was to use a non-flat topped gore, it would be to their benefit, and help the life of the garment to make that insertion to the best of their ability. but I typically hear the "razor-sharp gore point" presented as a quality of > accurate or well-made garb, Well, it is a quality of well made clothing. If that is what you are going for. As to accuracy, I think we have a new question to investigate, just what type of gore/godet was used when? I wouldn't be surprised, for instance, to find out that some judges at SCA > costume competitions would grade people down for gores with rounded tops or > slight pleats, under the assumption that it's badworkmanship. I agree with you, and again that would be the triumph of the modern aesthetic over the actual. But it could also be for a lack of knowledge... so we have another place to educate. Now this crosses over into a far broader topic... one that I've been starting to address at my lectures. The battle between the modern aesthetic and period construction. It's been an interesting area of research. > "this is good sewing technique" without realizing that the garments *of > the period they're teaching* show no evidence of those methods (e.g. > gathered sleeve caps, French seam finishing, stay-stitching, facings, > pattern matching -- and other techniques that were valued in some periods > but not in others). In this instance, and in many others, ISTM that if you approach the > construction of a garment using the materials and techniques available to > the person of the period you're reconstructing and consistent with the known > evidence, you're likely to come to different conclusions about what > makes sense and what works well than you would if you use modern > techniques and materials. I'll take this one step further. Working with accurate methods and materials does indeed give you a better understanding of the process. I highly recommend it. BUT you also need to approach the process with an open mind and without preconceptions. For example with needle and thread I can produce "sharp" gores and I have also produced rounded gores (a chemise) and Flat topped gores (the infamous Kielbasa dress), and pleated gores (a different chemise). It's not only about familiarity with the media, but working towards mastery. On that line, I've been thinking about the small pleat in the top of the St. > Louis shirt gore. There's no question that the shirt is well-made by a > person highly skilled at sewing, so I would assume the pleat is intentional. > I wonder if that slight pleating would make the gore wear better and work > better, because it would allow you to spread the body of the shirt a little > wider before encountering resistance at the stress point. If the gore is > perfectly flat, you can't open the angle of the slash quite as far (unless > you make the bottom of the gore correspondingly wider). With a flat gore, if you need to allow for a sizable amount expansion over a > short vertical distance from waist to hip, you need to make a fairly wide > angle, which commits you to a certain degree of width at the bottom. Making > the top of the gore a little flatter and wider, and taking up that excess > width in a small pleat, lets you get the sides of the finished gore further > apart in those top few inches without as much stress, and without requiring > more width at the bottom. > > Something else to try in an experiment... Interesting thinking. I'll be interested to see the findings from your experiments. Please do let us know. Meanwhile I'll do a bit of looking into the gore/godet timeline. -- Mari / Bridgette _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 12:14:53 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81GEqjs015139 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:14:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81GDhMJ010786 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:13:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81GDYtV078107; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:13:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zproxy.gmail.com (zproxy.gmail.com [64.233.162.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81GDTeW077951 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:13:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id z31so426702nzd for ; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 09:13:24 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=pGrAhuSgl0oy2aDZWsjCw71qgWu+/f1Y22TKKQ5iRzdDdcj/E+r29lceL+0faW1gSk4YniW2adtyTCraB6AvbM7o4I2NYP9n6PLbCvE7bLJIrvZ1P9n4ieG6EXkAWBORh7XNmWBp1h7Giq+OcEosQ+cZA/lYGTJSd232X8/zqDE= Received: by 10.36.250.44 with SMTP id x44mr1794271nzh; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 09:13:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.79.17 with HTTP; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 09:13:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 09:13:23 -0700 From: Cin To: h-cost Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1050/Thu Sep 1 02:26:43 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1050/Thu Sep 1 02:26:43 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id j81GDTeW077951 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Kimono styles (was: Sari ... Victorian) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 01:51 PM 8/31/2005, Kimiko wrote: >>The shinto wedding kimono is pure white (shiromoku = pure white). >When did Japanese wedding gowns become pure white? Or is it Shinto only? My >mom was Buddhist, not Shinto. When? I dont know. Presently in Tokyo, some women do as many as 4 outfits for a wedding, uchikake or tomosode formal kimono with mon (family crest), another in pure white for the shinto ceremony, a western gown and a suit or dress for leaving the festivities. That's 4, all for the same bride, same wedding. Zowie. >My mother's wedding kimono is dark, almost black IIRC, both in her wedding photos and what I remember when she wore it when I was a child for a fashion show on wedding gowns. I have yet to go through all her kimono stash in her house (I just found a pretty one for her funeral near the top), but I will this fall as I inventory everything. She had two large metal chests holding everything. Sounds like the mostly black one is a formal tomosode. (B/W only, is for attending funerals IIRC; mostly black w/ splash of color is for other formal, yet serious events.) I hesitate to respond further given that you've got the cultural & ethnic background. I do not. I merely lived there. My sympathies on your recent(?) loss. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 13:05:29 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81H5OLo017044 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:05:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81H4J8d016425 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:04:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81H4G0D017779; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:04:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from simmts8-srv.bellnexxia.net (simmts8.bellnexxia.net [206.47.199.166]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81H4CZH017613 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:04:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from shaneandsheridan@sympatico.ca) Received: from sherry ([70.48.167.168]) by simmts8-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.10 201-253-122-130-110-20040306) with SMTP id <20050901170406.OOUK28065.simmts8-srv.bellnexxia.net@sherry> for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:04:06 -0400 Message-ID: <002001c5af17$2da19540$0a02a8c0@nodomainset.bellcanada> From: "Shane & Sheridan" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:04:10 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Skirt question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello all! I'm wanting to make a skirt that looks like this one: http://ursus.smugmug.com/photos/33402851-L.jpg http://www.folkwear.com/120.html but I'm thinking it's kinda silly to buy a pattern for something that is essentially a series of strips of fabric, and I want mine to be much fuller than most of the commercial patterns look, as this will be used for a dance costume of the same style as the top picture. What I am wondering is if there is a formula for construction, such as: first strip is x long, second strip is double x, third strip is three or four x. (if that makes sense?) Once I have that, then I can figure out my yardage. Any input is appreciated. :-) Sheridan *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* You are only young once, but you can stay immature indefinitely. Ogden Nash _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 13:42:02 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81Hg18K017364 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:42:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81Hevag020243 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:40:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81HekQY045307; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:40:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.197]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81Heid4045287 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:40:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maricelt@gmail.com) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so206082rne for ; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 10:40:44 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=aMKii1q4GftBT5sQ3KACkB2i0W7a7NtY5s8HXnp9lxPElaCdywRFo1TrfT5x0KL3ahcicfGJoyMszszasQkml4MLyAZQe/kO1Ok5pxLfX/jwj2S4cgkRkg6UbKYILIdchfp2LgVsEGfesAf6UkKmd/e+tVAn8F8p5NvOJrAivOk= Received: by 10.38.97.72 with SMTP id u72mr126815rnb; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 10:40:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.38.101.56 with HTTP; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:40:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <72adc26605090110401114037f@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:40:43 -0400 From: Marie Stewart To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Skirt question In-Reply-To: <002001c5af17$2da19540$0a02a8c0@nodomainset.bellcanada> Mime-Version: 1.0 References: <002001c5af17$2da19540$0a02a8c0@nodomainset.bellcanada> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j81Hg18K017364 Status: RO Quick and dirty summary... Circle skirt with length to the bottom of your tush, waist opening "a little" larger than you need. Gather gently into a waistband... or elastic. Measure the bottom circumference of the first level. Multiply this by 2, 2.5, or 3 depending on how much gather you want. Write down this number for future reference, call it layer 2. Cut your strip for layer 2 to the length you need, gather it onto your first level. Use the number for Layer 2 multiply this by 2, 2.5, or 3 depending on how much gather you want. Repeat.... > I'm wanting to make a skirt that looks like this one: > http://ursus.smugmug.com/photos/33402851-L.jpg > http://www.folkwear.com/120.html > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 13:51:41 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81Hpe0D017523 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:51:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81HnQs6021107 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:49:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81HnCtP051501; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:49:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j81Hn0ND051388 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:49:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 2952 invoked from network); 1 Sep 2005 17:48:15 -0000 Received: from [209.142.2.163] (HELO www.inreach.com) (209.142.2.163) by smtp.inreach.com (qpsmtpd/0.28) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 10:48:15 -0700 Received: from 67.188.164.116 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by www.inreach.com with HTTP; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:49:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1045.67.188.164.116.1125596940.squirrel@www.inreach.com> In-Reply-To: <002001c5af17$2da19540$0a02a8c0@nodomainset.bellcanada> References: <002001c5af17$2da19540$0a02a8c0@nodomainset.bellcanada> Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:49:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Skirt question From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Hello all! > > I'm wanting to make a skirt that looks like this one: > http://ursus.smugmug.com/photos/33402851-L.jpg > http://www.folkwear.com/120.html > > but I'm thinking it's kinda silly to buy a pattern for something that is > essentially a series of strips of fabric, and I want mine to be much > fuller > than most of the commercial patterns look, as this will be used for a > dance > costume of the same style as the top picture. > > What I am wondering is if there is a formula for construction, such as: > first strip is x long, second strip is double x, third strip is three or > four x. (if that makes sense?) Once I have that, then I can figure out my > yardage. > > Any input is appreciated. :-) > > Sheridan Sheridan, I don't have a formula for you, but you may want to invest in a gathering or pleating foot for your machine. I am a purist and never thought to get a pleating foot or anything like that until my friend got a new version of my machine and I saw her catalog of additional options. Well, I went and bought a pleating foot and it is so awesome!! Once you learn how to thread it, it will make even pleats in a fraction of the time (and frustration) it would normally take. I assume a gathering foot would be the same for your project! Good luck! Diana www.RenaissanceFabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 13:52:08 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81Hq7Dx017535 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:52:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81HoSEL021217 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:50:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81HoI4V052359; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:50:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from omta16.mta.everyone.net (sitemail2.everyone.net [216.200.145.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81HoAE0052253 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:50:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from generys@blazemail.com) Received: from dm18.mta.everyone.net (bigiplb-dsnat [172.16.0.19]) by omta16.mta.everyone.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9245D40660 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:50:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Eon-Dm: dm18 Received: from marketing3 (69.38.51.209 [69.38.51.209]) by dm18.mta.everyone.net (EON-AUTHRELAY2) with ESMTP id dm18.43147589.4ae9c for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:50:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Eon-Sig: AQBKBEVDFz9JQ7uaCQIAAAAB,aec331d7c37875569dd53fef073e80c7 From: "Jennifer / Guenievre" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Skirt question Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:48:15 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 In-Reply-To: <72adc26605090110401114037f@mail.gmail.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Thread-Index: AcWvHIql/QrY99u7Sh22fHGdNLCjwAAAGn6g Message-Id: <20050901105004.7EBCB20@dm18.mta.everyone.net> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id j81HoAE0052253 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hmm, now I'm thinking about making myself one of these for "normal" wear. Sewing question, though - wouldn't it be easier to gather from the bottom up? As in start with Tier 3 (or 4, depending on the skirt), gather that onto the next tier up, which then gets gathered onto the next tier up - seems like that way you wouldn't be trying to sew onto something that was already trying to fall into ruffles/gathers... Guenièvre > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On > Behalf Of Marie Stewart > Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 1:41 PM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Skirt question > > Quick and dirty summary... Circle skirt with length to the bottom of your > tush, waist opening "a little" larger than you need. Gather gently into a > waistband... or elastic. Measure the bottom circumference of the first > level. Multiply this by 2, 2.5, or 3 depending on how much gather you > want. > Write down this number for future reference, call it layer 2. Cut your > strip > for layer 2 to the length you need, gather it onto your first level. Use > the > number for Layer 2 multiply this by 2, 2.5, or 3 depending on how much > gather you want. Repeat.... > > > > I'm wanting to make a skirt that looks like this one: > > http://ursus.smugmug.com/photos/33402851-L.jpg > > http://www.folkwear.com/120.html > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 13:56:05 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81Hu5UE017597 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:56:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81HtAY8021694 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:55:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81Hsu4Z055605; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:54:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81Hsp9v055562 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:54:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1EAtH00XZE-00067D; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 13:54:50 -0400 Message-ID: <00ca01c5af1e$427969a0$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:54:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Great News!!!!! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j81Hu5UE017597 Status: RO Thank you to ALL of your for your prayers, thoughts, and money sent to charities for the Hurricane victims. I spent three days on the phone with no sleep. I finally slept yesterday for 10 hours and still going strong. I have several great news to tell you but this one great part is so wonderful I am sending it in a message on its own. Please feel free to pass this one along to others to let them know there is hope. We thought my mom had lost her home because it was on the beach in Biloxi. But read what we found out today. Print off this message and then go to an image I put on the web at: www.costumegallery.com/momshouse.jpg If you are in IE browser, go to the lower right corner and some arrows will appear. Click on them. Look at the photo and read the rest of my message. We have been able to go on the NOAA's website www.noaa.gov . They have excellent aerial photos of all the houses and streets. The photos have been taken since the hurricane hit the Mississippi Gulf Coast. Look at the photo on my website. I downloaded it from the NOAA website and labeled it for you. We found my mom's house which is located close it the beach in Biloxi on the photos and can see that it is still standing. I drew a red circle around mom's house. A very old large stone hotel that was a block wide on the beach stopped the water from coming up to my mom's house. I drew a red square around hotel. This hotel saved all but the first two houses on Mom's street from getting damaged. It blocked the water. Funny the hotel hasn't been used in years, until this hurricane. Maybe they should use it in the levees in New Orleans. My mom's house is (not was) just outside the main gate to Keesler Air Force base. The Old Historic Biloxi Cemetery is just behind my Mom's house and 3/4 of it was not destroyed. BTW, my mom's house is about a half mile east from where the apartments with all the bodies that was first announced on the news. It is so funny, a man bought that old hotel and gutted one part of it, but left the part facing the beach in tack. He ran out of money, and quit work on it. The city wanted to tear it down. But the coastal residents fussed so much that the city didn't tear it down. A lot of memories were in that hotel from the Biloxi citizens. The irony of the hotel... my husband and I went disco dancing in their ballroom when we were dating 30 years ago. My sister met her first husband dancing in the hotel's ballroom. Thanks again, for listening. With all the bad news coming our of the Hurricane damaged areas, I thought you might wanted to hear some good news. I have more good news that I will send it in another message. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 13:59:01 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81Hx1TD017629 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:59:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81Hwba7022039 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:58:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81HwRK5058253; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:58:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81HwK93058146 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:58:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-13.sonic.net [209.148.113.13]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81HwIml006114 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 10:58:18 -0700 Message-ID: <4317413D.9030201@lavoltapress.com> Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2005 10:58:21 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Broomstick skirts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If anyone wants to _buy_ broomstick skirts (rather than make them) right now they are all over eBay for prices ranging from $10 to $40, the average being about $20. A search for "boho* skirts" (the * is to pick up both "boho" and "bohemian"), "gypsy skirts," "hippie skirts," or even "broomstick skirts" yields dozens and dozens of listings. I've been stocking up on them in all my favorite colors. My favorites are the plain fabric ones with gradient/dip dye/ombre. But there's a ton of calico print ones out there too (which I don't like, but lots of people do). Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 14:14:59 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81IEsIZ017835 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:14:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81IE3tJ023807 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:14:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IDvWV069382; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:14:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.197]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IDkqu069217 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:13:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maricelt@gmail.com) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so213047rne for ; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 11:13:46 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=FheNt57+eeU1oYDHDKNVY1f58jPBFcrQpmfHb1L6ti0gr1XaBr8RSih83rNelO4DroXd2DjTsjHUME+sieLLt0poc41KE8HYMlSyxIgiu9al7xCtyAol1Vo7hWWFC/mvNlaGshaMFjnmF9JcaqUAUp3ANqn+OE1Vl/cPYZxSaxQ= Received: by 10.38.181.9 with SMTP id d9mr141024rnf; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 11:13:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.38.101.56 with HTTP; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:13:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <72adc266050901111359b546c2@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:13:46 -0400 From: Marie Stewart To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Great News!!!!! In-Reply-To: <00ca01c5af1e$427969a0$6800a8c0@Penny> Mime-Version: 1.0 References: <00ca01c5af1e$427969a0$6800a8c0@Penny> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j81IEsIZ017835 Status: RO Dear Penny... This is surely one Blessing. I'm so happy for you. And I hope many more are coming in the days ahead. Sounds to me like that Hotel was put there for a reason... and maybe it's work isn't done yet. Thank you for sharing this joyous news with us. It helps. ::hugs:: Mari / Bridgette It is so funny, a man bought that old hotel and gutted one part of it, but > left the part facing the beach in tack. He ran out of money, and quit work > on it. The city wanted to tear it down. But the coastal residents fussed > so much that the city didn't tear it down. A lot of memories were in that > hotel from the Biloxi citizens. > > The irony of the hotel... my husband and I went disco dancing in their > ballroom when we were dating 30 years ago. My sister met her first husband > dancing in the hotel's ballroom. > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 14:31:12 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81IVCsn018013 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:31:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81IUJ7e025544 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:30:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IUHML081791; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:30:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zproxy.gmail.com (zproxy.gmail.com [64.233.162.193]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IUECa081662 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:30:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from irmgart@gmail.com) Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 16so247329nzp for ; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 11:30:09 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=issBAf0JSCNVEkkl7xhdWYGWEQibten4T5HHdRICJ3KLGjsmhf5l5gmh03bFs22oawD+wFKpkOgZ6QHdVNuvn6jSfuLHF5Bz1UM4xmpD/IPbmmuWVsj3HcEj1HvvFm3/eDSM9RTNdr7PNRM6+aZjvVazzsOm0Z0a+JrFGPhyaj0= Received: by 10.36.221.73 with SMTP id t73mr1485127nzg; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 11:30:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.109.1 with HTTP; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:30:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:30:09 -0400 From: Irmgart To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Skirt question In-Reply-To: <1045.67.188.164.116.1125596940.squirrel@www.inreach.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 References: <002001c5af17$2da19540$0a02a8c0@nodomainset.bellcanada> <1045.67.188.164.116.1125596940.squirrel@www.inreach.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j81IVCsn018013 Status: RO Try this: http://www.annabella.net/skirt.html -Irmgart (they also have a *fabulous* choli top pattern...not H-cost, but it's *incredible* and is even supportive for my size 44DDD chest) -Irmgart On 9/1/05, Diana Habra wrote: > > > > Hello all! > > > > I'm wanting to make a skirt that looks like this one: > > http://ursus.smugmug.com/photos/33402851-L.jpg > > http://www.folkwear.com/120.html > > > > but I'm thinking it's kinda silly to buy a pattern for something that is > > essentially a series of strips of fabric, and I want mine to be much > > fuller > > than most of the commercial patterns look, as this will be used for a > > dance > > costume of the same style as the top picture. > > > > What I am wondering is if there is a formula for construction, such as: > > first strip is x long, second strip is double x, third strip is three or > > four x. (if that makes sense?) Once I have that, then I can figure out > my > > yardage. > > > > Any input is appreciated. :-) > > > > Sheridan > > Sheridan, > > I don't have a formula for you, but you may want to invest in a gathering > or pleating foot for your machine. I am a purist and never thought to get > a pleating foot or anything like that until my friend got a new version of > my machine and I saw her catalog of additional options. > > Well, I went and bought a pleating foot and it is so awesome!! Once you > learn how to thread it, it will make even pleats in a fraction of the time > (and frustration) it would normally take. I assume a gathering foot would > be the same for your project! > > Good luck! > > Diana > > www.RenaissanceFabrics.net > "Everything for the Costumer" > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 14:35:27 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81IZQuR018065 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:35:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81IYpZW025964 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:34:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IYg6X085154; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:34:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IYICN084743 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:34:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lynndownward@gmail.com) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id i31so175378wra for ; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 11:34:13 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=ZseX4A9V5Sg5jChYgT4rWuJbaGftnb8Kkq+2bAadWDeSFZ2CiEn8bgciyupkVA24Q4aZOUhz2i6XXHRpwO7PCJYaF7psIjwu5N491ZweOW+wEU0m0C18Vu1TqlkNSZpx9z5MblLnYbvk2kXaAUsW8prSQHNFSsI9VFYuGil1QKU= Received: by 10.54.71.11 with SMTP id t11mr1271702wra; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 11:34:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.37.42 with HTTP; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:34:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <8296995c050901113468e512bc@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:34:12 -0700 From: Lynn Downward To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Skirt question In-Reply-To: <20050901105004.7EBCB20@dm18.mta.everyone.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline References: <72adc26605090110401114037f@mail.gmail.com> <20050901105004.7EBCB20@dm18.mta.everyone.net> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id j81IYICN084743 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I made several of these skirts in the 70s when they were first (?) popular from a Vogue pattern. I don't know the formula for the gatherings, but I DO remember that each tier was wider than the one above it to give a nicer proportion - not by much, maybe 1-3" - but definitely wider. Maybe tier 2 was +1", tier 3 was +2", tier 4 was +3".... This would probably depend on how tall/round you are and how much your fabric would drape. LynnD On 9/1/05, Jennifer / Guenievre wrote: > Hmm, now I'm thinking about making myself one of these for "normal" wear. > Sewing question, though - wouldn't it be easier to gather from the bottom > up? As in start with Tier 3 (or 4, depending on the skirt), gather that onto > the next tier up, which then gets gathered onto the next tier up - seems > like that way you wouldn't be trying to sew onto something that was already > trying to fall into ruffles/gathers... > > Guenièvre > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On > > Behalf Of Marie Stewart > > Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 1:41 PM > > To: Historical Costume > > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Skirt question > > > > Quick and dirty summary... Circle skirt with length to the bottom of your > > tush, waist opening "a little" larger than you need. Gather gently into a > > waistband... or elastic. Measure the bottom circumference of the first > > level. Multiply this by 2, 2.5, or 3 depending on how much gather you > > want. > > Write down this number for future reference, call it layer 2. Cut your > > strip > > for layer 2 to the length you need, gather it onto your first level. Use > > the > > number for Layer 2 multiply this by 2, 2.5, or 3 depending on how much > > gather you want. Repeat.... > > > > > > > I'm wanting to make a skirt that looks like this one: > > > http://ursus.smugmug.com/photos/33402851-L.jpg > > > http://www.folkwear.com/120.html > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 14:43:55 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81IhtU4018148 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:43:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81Ih7Sx026835 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:43:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81Ih0D7091217; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:43:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31010.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31010.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.200.173]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j81Igmam090990 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:42:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from emeraldepona@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 58192 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Sep 2005 18:42:42 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=t8MY1ITipd0e42Cz2YWJvq2B1zcxkOtg0DmxgSoQkBSlDhZeYty/79UCDJIsqGuzhRyh3bEGL4Beo6jdDcel0GFVA65ieyI0joySjKmATDGLBhvJ33gwX4Ih3Y+/FusEP83ns/sC0ZV05WrKfGxEWoVSnaCsvV2skNHj8Qu2GuI= ; Message-ID: <20050901184242.58190.qmail@web31010.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.21.101.84] by web31010.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 11:42:41 PDT Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:42:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Subject: Re: [h-cost] Great News!!!!! To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <00ca01c5af1e$427969a0$6800a8c0@Penny> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh Penny that is WONDERFUL NEWS!!! I am so happy for you and your family! I will keep praying the rest of the news is as good. ALL the best, Chris G. Penny Ladnier wrote: Thank you to ALL of your for your prayers, thoughts, and money sent to charities for the Hurricane victims. I spent three days on the phone with no sleep. I finally slept yesterday for 10 hours and still going strong. I have several great news to tell you but this one great part is so wonderful I am sending it in a message on its own. Please feel free to pass this one along to others to let them know there is hope. We thought my mom had lost her home because it was on the beach in Biloxi. But read what we found out today. Print off this message and then go to an image I put on the web at: www.costumegallery.com/momshouse.jpg If you are in IE browser, go to the lower right corner and some arrows will appear. Click on them. Look at the photo and read the rest of my message. We have been able to go on the NOAA's website www.noaa.gov . They have excellent aerial photos of all the houses and streets. The photos have been taken since the hurricane hit the Mississippi Gulf Coast. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 14:58:04 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81Iw3V9018289 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:58:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81IvLoq028391 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:57:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IvI1E001824; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:57:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.176] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IvBD7001733 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:57:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BBC13FB9C for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:57:11 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 1381BC41B for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:57:11 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Skirt question Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:57:18 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <72adc26605090110401114037f@mail.gmail.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Actually from the look on the dancer on the left, the length of the circle skirt is to the knee, then three tiers. But you need to think of your height as to were the best placement of the hem of the circle skirt. Then add your 3 tiers. Marie's instructions for the tiers are good. It is best to work top to bottom on your first skirt so that you can get the proper length and division of bands for your height. If you are petite then you want short to medium band widths. Tall, wide widths, etc. Exception is if you are coordinating with a group, then a the best width that compliments all of you. Once you have the measurements and working pattern, it won't matter whether you sew the pieces from the bottom up or top down. De -----Original Message----- Quick and dirty summary... Circle skirt with length to the bottom of your tush, _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 15:26:36 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81JQVVk023107 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 15:26:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81JPs9Z031630 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:25:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81JPjfZ023301; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:25:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.176] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81JPbV7023146 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:25:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09F773F9EA for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:25:34 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id C0A73C5DE for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:25:33 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Kimono styles (was: Sari ... Victorian) Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:25:41 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >From my understanding, the white outfit which is for the ceremony is symbol for death. It symbolizes the end of one life (with biological family) and the being of a new life (rebirth with husband) I believe that the white is Shinto specific but I could be wrong. I know that white for the ceremonial outfit goes back to at least the 1930s. De -----Original Message----- At 01:51 PM 8/31/2005, Kimiko wrote: >>The shinto wedding kimono is pure white (shiromoku = pure white). >When did Japanese wedding gowns become pure white? Or is it Shinto only? My >mom was Buddhist, not Shinto. When? I dont know. Presently in Tokyo, some women do as many as 4 outfits for a wedding, uchikake or tomosode formal kimono with mon (family crest), another in pure white for the shinto ceremony, a western gown and a suit or dress for leaving the festivities. That's 4, all for the same bride, same wedding. Zowie. Sounds like the mostly black one is a formal tomosode. (B/W only, is for attending funerals IIRC; mostly black w/ splash of color is for other formal, yet serious events.) I hesitate to respond further given that you've got the cultural & ethnic background. I do not. I merely lived there. My sympathies on your recent(?) loss. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 16:17:22 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81KHMUs023945 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 16:17:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81KGadr037062 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:16:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81KGIaE062293; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:16:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-61.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81KFuof062052 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:16:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (unknown [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03E253B5E2 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 15:15:44 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <43176177.7090003@reddawn.net> Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2005 15:15:51 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Skirt question References: <002001c5af17$2da19540$0a02a8c0@nodomainset.bellcanada> In-Reply-To: <002001c5af17$2da19540$0a02a8c0@nodomainset.bellcanada> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Shane & Sheridan wrote: > What I am wondering is if there is a formula for construction, such as: > first strip is x long, second strip is double x, third strip is three or > four x. (if that makes sense?) Once I have that, then I can figure out my > yardage. I make these for people all the time. You can put as much fabric into them as you want, depending on how well the fabric gathers. Thinner fabric gets you more ruffles, but also takes more yardage because it gathers so well. Start with your waist measurement, double that for the first tier. Double that for the 2nd, double that for the third. That will get you approximately what will fit in each tier, as it's going to vary according to how the fabric gathers. I make each tier from 12-15" depending on the height of the wearer. If the skirt sits on your hips you need much less length to dance with and not trip in it. I use at minimum 3 yards (quilt cotton), up to 5 (gauze) or sometimes more depending on the fabric. I have tried using a circle for the topmost tier and found that it stretched badly on the bias when completed, giving me a very uneven hem. I second getting a ruffler. I cut and join strips and then feed them through by the mile in mere minutes. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 17:14:25 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j81LEKpW025075 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 17:14:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j81LDa1a043736 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 15:13:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81LDLsF005238; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 15:13:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81LDDed005102 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 15:13:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1EAwMu3XH2-0004Fz; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 17:13:08 -0400 Message-ID: <010b01c5af39$f6d70310$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 17:13:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1052/Thu Sep 1 14:20:32 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1052/Thu Sep 1 14:20:32 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Coastal news: Part 3 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j81LEKpW025075 Status: RO My brother #3 who owns a business in Biloxi about a mile or so from my mother's house... we saw on the NOAA website, that the building for his business is still standing. He has owned this business for about 25 years. Unfortunately he can't work until electricity is restored in Biloxi. That will be a good while. His owns an appliance repair business. When the lights come back on I am sure he will be swamped with business. He lost his home... a condo directly on the beach in Pass Christian. Thankfully he had evacuated to Pensacola to a friend's house. My mom heard from my sister with M.S. yesterday. She was the one who told us Mom's house was standing and we all thought she was crazy until today when we looked at the NOAA website. Tonight, my brother #4 in Hattiesburg is taking my mother to the fire station where he works, and have her call me. I am in charge of talking her to fly to Virginia and stay with me until the electricity comes back on at her home...probably three months. I am the only one in the family that she will listen to when Mom's go off the deep end emotionally. She wants to go back now to her house which is impossible. She has health problems and can't take the heat and will need more heart and blood pressure meds soon. So pray for strength for me when talking with her tonight. My #1 brother in Mobile does have electricity and water again, but they do not have gas in the city. He can't run his trucks for his business because of the gas shortage. They are all running so short of money because the banks are not open. Mobile will hopefully be opening the banks tomorrow. He is going to give cash to Brothers #3 and #4. Yesterday, all these brothers meet in Mobile. My mom, brother #4 and his wife saw on TV the new shows about the condition of the coast. Everyone had a big long cry. Because this was the third tropical system to come into the area, and the other two were not that bad, noone took that much cash out of the banks in advance. Brother #1 vacation house on Dauphin Island got flooded but it stood its ground. He had just finished restoring it from Hurricane Ivan from last year and it was hit again. I asked him the stupid question that the press asked, "Why do you keep living in an area where so many hurricanes hit?" I also told him that was the press' question not mine. I know the reason. Because the Coast is my home, I love the water, fishing, and swimming. My family is here, it is home. There is a blessing with this home... when you see the news footage of the island and see an oil rig that hit the island, my brother house is the one still standing next to the rig. This brother was a Navy Seal. Brother #2 made it in from Africa from the oil rigs, and my sister's husband made it in from the rigs in the Gulf of Mexico. My brother and sister are married to a brother and sister. The oil rigs guys are in Monroe, Louisiana and are coming to the Coast this weekend to pick up my M.S. sister and her children to go back to Monroe. My husband's family in Bayou La Batre, Alabama house were all flooded. But everyone is safe. Our family joke, Bayou La Batre is where in the movie Forrest Gump went to start his shrimp boat business. Our cousin Bubba did own a shrimp boat business in Bayou La Batre until Hurricane Frederick wiped the business out in the 1980s. This whole community is a fishing community. Susan, my asst. who is married to one of my husband's cousins, lives near Bayou La Batre. She has phone service and water, but no electricity. She went to Bayou La Batre and gave us a report. Our relatives in Slidell and Pearl River, Louisiana lost their homes. But they are safe in Northern Mississippi. I think I covered everyone in the family. BTW, the MS Coast newspaper said that several of the antebellum homes in Pass Christian did survive. (The ones in my online photo collection.) The new homes did not. Some history of the Coast does live on!!! People have asked me what can they do to help. Please keep praying for the people of this area of our country. Volunteer for one of the charity agencies or donate money. You can answer phones, pack kits, load trucks, etc. Go by and say thank you to some of the corporations that are sending massive amounts of aid. Some are Wal-Mart, Home Depot, Food Lion, etc. Make a point to talk to the manager of the store and let him know that you appreciate their corporation's charity. I went to Food Lion grocery this morning and personally thanked the manager and asked that he let the corporate offices know how much we appreciate their efforts. The manager told me they hardly ever have people outside the affected areas tell them thank you. Food Lion stores are not located in the Mississippi Gulf Coastal area. But they were one of the first corporations to rush supplies to the Coast. Thank the citizens of states like Alabama and Texas who are taking the children into their schools until Mississippi and Louisiana can rebuild their schools. That is a lot of tax money to do put out. Thank the family members of the police, search and rescue, military, electric and phone specialists, etc. from all over the U.S. who are going into the Coast. Their families need to hear thank you. I personally thank all of you for the hundreds of emails you have sent me. I have read all of them and found them very comforting. I have told all of our family members that you all have offered your prayers and support. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 21:00:07 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82107S3029272 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 21:00:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j820xThr075067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 18:59:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j820xPnf045783; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 18:59:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j820x5Cx045635 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 18:59:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA26625 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 19:20:53 -0500 Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 19:20:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1052/Thu Sep 1 14:20:32 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1052/Thu Sep 1 14:20:32 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Literary fashion (humor) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I found these amusing: http://www.geist.com/comix/comix.php?id=15 http://www.geist.com/comix/comix.php?id=3 --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Sep 1 23:33:36 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j823XVSY031667 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 23:33:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j823WxTX088276 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 1 Sep 2005 21:33:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j823Wvj4015646; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 21:32:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j823WrkC015592 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 21:32:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j8250DSd000330 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 01:00:18 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Literary fashion (humor) Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 23:32:42 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.7 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200509012332.42225.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1052/Thu Sep 1 14:20:32 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1052/Thu Sep 1 14:20:32 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 01 September 2005 8:20 pm, Robin Netherton wrote: > I found these amusing: > > http://www.geist.com/comix/comix.php?id=15 > http://www.geist.com/comix/comix.php?id=3 I love it! Better quality of information than (some) serious costume histories. Thanks! -- Cathy Raymond "So what if the universe is a pointless mass of hydrogen refuse powered by entropy. I'm spreading ketchup on a rubber duck, and after that I'm going to brush its teeth. So there."-- Rob Landley _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 06:57:28 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82AvR1g004788 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 06:57:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82Atf7d032081 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 04:55:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82AtKP1082764; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 04:55:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.tpg.com.au (mail7.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.103]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82AsrNa082291 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 04:55:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) Received: from e9q5h8 (220-245-213-92-act.tpgi.com.au [220.245.213.92]) by mail.tpg.com.au (8.13.4/8.13.4) with SMTP id j82Asmpc021644 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:54:50 +1000 Message-ID: <002601c5afac$a04a8080$5cd5f5dc@e9q5h8> From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historical Costume" References: <083120051836.20991.4315F8A80000A0EB000051FF22073007930809070E029D0E0A0809079BA101A10E020A040A@comcast.net> <8296995c050831123353382579@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:storm prayers Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:53:58 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1053/Fri Sep 2 01:01:53 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1053/Fri Sep 2 01:01:53 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lynn Downward" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 5:33 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:storm prayers > I agree, but I think we should wait a month or so until these > communities get back on their feet and have places to live, let alone > start a stash of fabric and such. > LynnD > > On 8/31/05, elena_o_tighearnaigh@comcast.net > wrote: > > Penny, > > > > I love the idea of helping with rebuilding stashes and such. May I send some as well? For those who would like to give their stash to SCA members a yahoo group has been set up to help organise and coordinate donations of garb & gear once our friends and family are ready to resume their SCA life: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-BackToNormal/ Or if you'd rather give it to somebody who does a different time period or a school (as Penny suggested) You'll have to do a web search. Elizabeth -------------------------------------------- Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/e_walpole/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 12:31:26 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82GVPLb009341 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:31:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82GUfxR064687 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:30:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82GURG4069841; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:30:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m14.mx.aol.com (imo-m14.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82CYVR6023360 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 06:34:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r5.3.) id 6.99.65d220c8 (3948) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 08:34:21 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <99.65d220c8.3049a0cc@aol.com> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 08:34:20 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:storm prayers To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=10% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1054/Fri Sep 2 08:26:51 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 9/2/2005 7:01:56 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, ewalpole@tpg.com.au writes: I agree, but I think we should wait a month or so until these > communities get back on their feet and have places to live, let alone > start a stash of fabric and such. > Yes, the need right now, and for some time to come, is cash to pay for food and such, to the established organizations working in the region. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 12:40:27 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82GeRQV009453 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:40:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82GdwkK065997 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:39:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82GdpB8076966; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:39:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81IOH3e076748 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:24:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id 6.1d4.435f9cfb (18707) for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:24:06 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1d4.435f9cfb.3048a146@aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:24:06 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Skirt question To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6036 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1054/Fri Sep 2 08:26:51 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 9/1/2005 1:51:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, generys@blazemail.com writes: > gather that onto > the next tier up, which then gets gathered onto the next tier up - seems > like that way you wouldn't be trying to sew onto something that was already > trying to fall into ruffles/gathers... > Well, since the small bit of fabric under the presser foot is all you need to really worry about when sewing, I don't know that either way is easier. But starting at the bottom as you suggest does mean you're sewing shorter distances as bulk increases. This sounds good. If you're slow and careful, you can skip gathering threads and such but carefully putting in little tucks as the ruffle goes under the presser foot. Keep it neat! Have fun! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 12:42:08 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82Gg8aA009469 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:42:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82GaaAK065554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:36:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82GaYaq074545; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:36:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-61.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82FpwkN040822 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 09:52:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (unknown [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B8803B5F9 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:51:47 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <43187524.8060607@reddawn.net> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 10:52:04 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1054/Fri Sep 2 08:26:51 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1054/Fri Sep 2 08:26:51 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] fabric sale X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Among other things, Joann's has its muslin on sale for 50% off over the Labor Day holiday weekend. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 13:24:45 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82HOj3V009965 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:24:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82HOFnQ072032 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:24:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82HOBF0011690; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:24:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82H8eC8000187 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:09:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@vanburen.patriot.net) Received: from webmail.patriot.net (vanburen.patriot.net [209.249.176.8]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id j82H8d1r002073 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:08:39 -0400 Received: from 12.34.13.238 (SquirrelMail authenticated user aquazoo) by webmail.patriot.net with HTTP; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:08:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <56081.12.34.13.238.1125680919.squirrel@webmail.patriot.net> In-Reply-To: <99.65d220c8.3049a0cc@aol.com> References: <99.65d220c8.3049a0cc@aol.com> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:08:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:storm prayers From: aquazoo@patriot.net To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Here is a site if you can offer housing to displaced people: http://www.hurricanehousing.org/ Also I'm on a museum list where they mentioned that people can volunteer with the Red Cross. It may be work such as collecting donations in one's own area. At some point, cultural institutions may need volunteers to assess damage to collections, etc. If anything is costume related, hopefully people will post it to the list. -Carol > Yes, the need right now, and for some time to come, is cash to pay for > food and such, to the established organizations working in the region. > > Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 13:47:27 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82HlQAD010266 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:47:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82HfeXB075756 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:41:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82HfMAw023918; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:41:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail10.mdx.safepages.com (mail10.mdx.safepages.com [216.127.133.33]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82Heuhl023569 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:41:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: by mail10.mdx.safepages.com (Postfix, from userid 1012) id 42FDC2051C; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:51:30 +0000 (GMT) Received: from compaqub (dialup-4.245.1.181.Dial1.StLouis1.Level3.net [4.245.1.181]) by mail10.mdx.safepages.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 8922320540 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:51:00 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <05a001c5afe5$a824c200$0400a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00f101c5af2f$18a027c0$6800a8c0@Penny> Subject: Re: [h-cost] More Coastal News Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:42:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO As of yesterday evening, I wasn't able to call north MS either (Oxford), so anyone trying to contact family further north might want to try the text message trick as well. -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 13:48:28 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82HmRTt010281 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:48:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82Hm2hq076479 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:48:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82HlONp028236; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:47:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82HkvFH027887 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:47:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maricelt@gmail.com) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so406567rne for ; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 10:46:56 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=GQWOfRKMr7sCRQbW2vHZ+kfDTvx7gRjvJDvF7j3CTyfjKBiczN/yWLWZgAkFcP3f85Jpo3L0fK7F5MqPUAUpzQYSDnEshPoRQ1oVHgy+OvPfp7wyJQdW9TIDVfJWNyPL4pbGdZeWCva1d10ztZCB7NmZxMVlWhmMi8/urv9LCAI= Received: by 10.38.209.3 with SMTP id h3mr200208rng; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 10:46:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.38.101.56 with HTTP; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:46:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <72adc266050902104674891311@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:46:56 -0400 From: Marie Stewart To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] More Coastal News In-Reply-To: <05a001c5afe5$a824c200$0400a8c0@compaqub> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline References: <00f101c5af2f$18a027c0$6800a8c0@Penny> <05a001c5afe5$a824c200$0400a8c0@compaqub> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id j82HkvFH027887 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny - Thank you for this information. I've forwarded it to some other lists. Thanks again. And congrats on finding your family. ;> Bridgette _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 14:40:29 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82IeTNY010808 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 14:40:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82IdhYL081914 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:39:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82IdeVg066505; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:39:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82IdVeT066409 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:39:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f554c.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.76]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id DDE2526281D for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:39:26 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:39:49 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] coastal news X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am shocked down into my privacy and dont know how i can say this. I thoaght America was such a rich comunity, you know big houses, dogs at least two cars and overweight people. Now i see in the television that poor people lives in USA two. Well Well what can a poor soul in Denmark do except say to you all: Never, never again ellect such a poor president as Bushes.................. Hail Freedom of America and all its poor inhabitants. And may God be with you alllll.......................... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 14:46:04 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82Ik4aI010900 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 14:46:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82IgMJq082192 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:45:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82GpSZV086620; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 10:51:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j81JtMxV046326 for ; Thu, 1 Sep 2005 13:55:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1EAv9c2sT9-0001zc; Thu, 01 Sep 2005 15:55:20 -0400 Message-ID: <00f101c5af2f$18a027c0$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 15:55:25 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=16% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1051/Thu Sep 1 08:57:21 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] More Coastal News X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j82Ik4aI010900 Status: RO I actually did a radio interview for the Red Cross about this topic this morning. As of yesterday at 6:00 pm, we had heard from all of our family members but my husband's brother and sister and their collective six children. They decided to stayed in the Northern part of Gulfport during the hurricane. We were watching the Weather Channel and giving them and my brother in Hattiesburg updates as to what part of the storm was coming at them every 30 minutes. When their electricity went out in the early morning and they didn't know that the eye of the hurricane was coming at them. They thought it was going to New Orleans. The last we had heard from either of them was at 11:00 Monday just before the worse part of the hurricane hit. Water was coming into my brother-in-law's garage at the times and they had lost nine trees at the time. My brother-in-law who is in management at MCI, told us last night that you can text message people with cell phones in Mississippi, and ask them to call you. You don't have to have MCI service to do this. Anyone with text message reception can do this. We texted a message and my brother-in-law called us in minutes. The Gulf Coast Mississippians can receive text messages but not phone calls. BUT they can call out!!! Most of the people in South Mississippi do not know they can phone out until you tell them. They can't call the area code for South Mississippi, 228, but can call anywhere else in the country. My brother-in-law and his family are safe in their home. They have food and a neighbor with a well is giving them water. My sister-in-law who lives in downtown Gulfport went back to their home Wednesday. We text messaged her and she called us in 10 minutes. Amazingly enough, her house was my husband's families home since 1920, is standing strong and took no damage. This home was built by my husband's father and his grandfather. The house is located about 8 blocks from the beach in Gulfport, where all the reporters are reporting from. We have now heard from ALL of our family members. Some family members have lost their homes and/or jobs. But they are not standing on standing on roof-tops waiting to be rescued. What most people need on the Coast is water, gas, and ice. They also need cash because the banks or either in rubble or don't have electricity. Debit and check cards do not work because the electricity is out. My diabetic sister-in-law in Gulfport paid $10 for a bag of ice to cool her insulin. She said she couldn't stand in the lines @ 98 degree weather for hours to get a bag of ice at the free distribution centers. They really need organization at these centers. But they just don't have enough people to help. Please let people know about the text messaging their family members in Mississippi. It will relieve their minds when their family calls back. It also give the people in Mississippi that we have not forgotten about them and that they are not cut off from the world. Just before we found out about the text messaging, we were planning to drive to Mississippi to get our families to bring back to Virginia. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 15:25:23 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82JPNCB011355 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:25:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82JOoLO090951 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:24:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82JOZB7001124; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:24:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from host101.apollohosting.com (host101.apollohosting.com [209.239.35.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82JNaQG000495 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 13:24:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from [192.168.1.3] (71-35-65-29.phnx.qwest.net [71.35.65.29]) by host101.apollohosting.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j82JNZMP020284 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:23:35 -0400 Message-ID: <4318A6BB.1010806@msn.com> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 12:23:39 -0700 From: WickedFrau User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] coastal news References: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, I think there are a lot of us who are as deeply shocked as you. I also think that Americans are a spoiled lot, myself included, and that many of us cannot fathom (again, myself included) the reality of this kind of disaster. We are all so used to just seeing it on TV and it is always "over there." While I did not vote for President Bush, I don't think this has a whole lot to do with him. Having run emergency drills on a MUCH smaller scale (on a navy ships and at nuclear power plants) and seen how much can go awry in even the smallest setting with much planning, it does not surprise me ,in the least, that America is still very unprepared for much of any kind of disaster. This will be yet another hard lesson for us to absorb and respond to. I am not suffering here in Arizona, so it is very easy for me to sit back and say "That which does not kill us makes us stronger," so I too, send out hope and prayers to those who are suffering so much. Sg Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > I am shocked down into my privacy and dont know how i can say this. > ............................. > And may God be with you alllll.......................... > > _______________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 16:28:58 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82KSvYu012017 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:28:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82KRwfD097809 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 14:27:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82KRoNH048586; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 14:27:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:HFmEsHlJ91lXZx8XVR2+rqRACkZi+QZH@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82KRjbk048479 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 14:27:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.3] (206-124-5-3.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.3]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id j82KOBA28189; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 14:24:11 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v622) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <4d0c05f6e90d3326d7d9d9f969cdcfbf@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 14:27:41 -0600 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com Subject: [h-cost] children's sizes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm trying to make some simple Halloween costumes to sell on ebay to supplement my already too small income. I know they need to be simple because people don't generally pay much on ebay, so I'm using up old fabric scraps. I have run into a problem already with sizing. i was using a Burda pattern and its sizes seem to be quite different than those of the big 3 American pattern companies. It's been a long time since I had a young child so I was wondering if any of you with small girls or boys would mind giving me their chest, waist and hip measurements along with their height. A measurement from waist to floor would help too. And let me know their age and gender. I think I am going to make stuff for about ages 1-11. If I get enough responses, I can figure out averages. Thanking you all in advance, Syrog (Sylvia Rognstad) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 17:09:00 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82L90xU012518 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:09:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82L7gpJ001976 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:07:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82L7W2M077324; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:07:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.mc.surewest.net (smtp1.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.50]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j82L7NIW077200 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:07:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (s3-18591); Fri, 02 Sep 2005 14:06:30 -0700 Received: from unknown (64.30.124.106) by smtp1.mc.surewest.net (s3-smtpd/0.90-beta3) with SMTP; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 14:06:28 -0700 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20050902140419.03136af0@pop.surewest.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 14:07:10 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] children's sizes In-Reply-To: <4d0c05f6e90d3326d7d9d9f969cdcfbf@ntw.net> References: <4d0c05f6e90d3326d7d9d9f969cdcfbf@ntw.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-TST: smtp1 SNWK3 0.31-80 ip=64.30.124.106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 01:27 PM 9/2/2005, you wrote: >I'm trying to make some simple Halloween costumes to sell on ebay to >supplement my already too small income. I know they need to be >simple because people don't generally pay much on ebay, so I'm using >up old fabric scraps. I have run into a problem already with >sizing. i was using a Burda pattern and its sizes seem to be quite >different than those of the big 3 American pattern companies. It's >been a long time since I had a young child so I was wondering if any >of you with small girls or boys would mind giving me their chest, >waist and hip measurements along with their height. A measurement >from waist to floor would help too. And let me know their age and >gender. I think I am going to make stuff for about ages 1-11. If I >get enough responses, I can figure out averages. > >Thanking you all in advance, >Syrog (Sylvia Rognstad) Sylvia, Have you considered going to the web sites of the major pattern companies and checking their measurements? That would give you a better way to let your buyers know about sizes since they are already accustomed to those. Or you could check on the sites for some clothing companies, like L. L. Bean; they usually have charts showing measurements for sizing. Joan Jurancich joanmj@surewest.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 18:01:12 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82M1BDQ013184 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:01:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82M0awC007244 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:00:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82M0PPK013490; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:00:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:GLH1dEndc6nuYljS18c+FC2Ta0bUpm7u@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82M0FRc013378 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:00:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.222] (206-124-5-222.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.222]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id j82LufA02635 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:56:41 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v622) In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20050902140419.03136af0@pop.surewest.net> References: <4d0c05f6e90d3326d7d9d9f969cdcfbf@ntw.net> <6.2.3.4.2.20050902140419.03136af0@pop.surewest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <955acfc64a76391a68f0698744c001f9@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: [h-cost] children's sizes Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:00:11 -0600 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The problem is that I compared the sizes for a Burda pattern I have with one from one of the big 3 and they were totally different. I want to use the Burda pattern but am confused by the discrepancies. Sylrog On Sep 2, 2005, at 3:07 PM, Joan Jurancich wrote: > At 01:27 PM 9/2/2005, you wrote: >> I'm trying to make some simple Halloween costumes to sell on ebay to >> supplement my already too small income. I know they need to be >> simple because people don't generally pay much on ebay, so I'm using >> up old fabric scraps. I have run into a problem already with sizing. >> i was using a Burda pattern and its sizes seem to be quite different >> than those of the big 3 American pattern companies. It's been a long >> time since I had a young child so I was wondering if any of you with >> small girls or boys would mind giving me their chest, waist and hip >> measurements along with their height. A measurement from waist to >> floor would help too. And let me know their age and gender. I think >> I am going to make stuff for about ages 1-11. If I get enough >> responses, I can figure out averages. >> >> Thanking you all in advance, >> Syrog (Sylvia Rognstad) > Sylvia, > Have you considered going to the web sites of the major pattern > companies and checking their measurements? That would give you a > better way to let your buyers know about sizes since they are already > accustomed to those. Or you could check on the sites for some > clothing companies, like L. L. Bean; they usually have charts showing > measurements for sizing. > > > Joan Jurancich > joanmj@surewest.net > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 19:05:00 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j82N50wX013812 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:05:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82N4NEX013268 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:04:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82N4J0I052343; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:04:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jade.spiritone.com (jade.aracnet.com [216.99.193.136]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j82N4EJX052257 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:04:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by jade.spiritone.com (8.13.4/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j82N43qT001458 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:04:04 -0700 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "H-Costume" Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 16:12:57 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1506 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] OT - To the People of Gleann Abhann and the SCA X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, This might give you an even better idea of what the US is all about, even when we are stripped down to the essentials. The Coronation may seem trivial, but the determination to make it happen isn't. Sort of like the Danish Crown not giving up when the Nazi's poured over your borders. Not a natural disaster, but close enough for government work. Regina -----Original Message----- From: SCA-Disaster@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SCA-Disaster@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Susan B. Farmer Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 3:02 PM To: SCA-Disaster@yahoogroups.com Subject: [SCA-Disaster] [VR] Fwd: [Gleann Abhann] To the People of Gleann Abhann and theSCA Greetings from Radu and Broinnfinn, Lord and Lady Heir of Gleann Abhann, First and foremost, we wish to offer our deepest thanks to the overwhelming offers of aid to ourselves personally, to all of our friends and family affected by this disaster, and to our Principality. We have been touched to tears by the concerns of mere acquaintances and total strangers. We also offer profound thanks to Their Majesties of Meridies and the Meridian Seneschal for coordinating relief efforts to those members of the SCA in the affected areas. As has been posted on our behalf, our ability to communicate has been somewhat limited. We can call out by cell, but nobody can call in to us. We have internet access only by invading the houses of others. We are grateful to the Principality Officers and the members of our personal household who have taken our dropped reins and have been coordinating our concerns. If you do not receive quick responses to our emails, please give us time. Somebody WILL get back with you. We apologize that our situation has prevented us from being the kind of Kingdom Leaders we wish to be. We will briefly outline our situation. One block from our home, which we built less than four years ago, a neighbor was rescued by boat from his second story. Our house took on over eight feet of water and is a total loss. Our truck, which was left behind in the evacuation, cannot be seen at all on reconnaissance photos of the area. The house and all of our contents is a complete loss, and we, and our 2-month old son are homeless. Our places of employment are unable to function for many months. We cannot get home to salvage what little we have left because we have been unable to get gasoline in Jackson, MS. We tell you this, not to be self-centered, but to put a face on this enormous tragedy. There are thousands of people just like us - they have not only lost their homes, but their entire city and livelihood. We have discovered, through this tragedy, our enormous good fortune. Our lifelong involvement in the Society has given us a safety net of people that we never truly appreciated until this moment. There are many of those thousands who are far worse off than us. Please remember these souls as well - we meet them at everyplace we go in Jackson. You may not know them, and they may know nothing of us, but we are united in this tragedy. Her Ladyship found herself comforting a sobbing girl in Target as she bought soap because she had lost her home and job, and she had nowhere to turn. In the light of this devastation, SCA matters seem trivial. But this is far from the case. When all else has been lost, we cling to those things we still have - the slivers of normalcy and a life beyond the loss. Things like Gleann Abhann's First Coronation ARE important. Because, when all the banners, crowns and thrones are stripped away, when we stop addressing each other with funny titles, and go past that we dress in funny clothes, what is left is a community of the most generous and caring people that has ever existed. This is a community that deserves to be celebrated and recognized and cherished for the concern and brotherhood that we have shared. We are in communication (in fact, currently in the house of) the Gleann Abhann Seneschal Master Stephan of Durham. We are determined that Gleann Abhann Coronation WILL occur as soon as we can make alternative arrangements. As Her Ladyship says - we will do it barefoot in our shifts in a parking lot if necessary. We thank those who have assured us it will be more dignified than that! Please keep tuned in for the final announcement of the Coronation plans. And we hope that the rest of the Known World will still come and join us in both celebration and thanksgiving. Radu and Broinnfinn Lord and Lady Heir of Gleann Abhann Please use this UNOFFICIAL discussion list chivalrously. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "gleannabhann" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: gleannabhann-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- ~*~*~*~*~ Consciousness: that annoying time between naps. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] The VR list is not a part of the SCA or any branch of the SCA. VR Community email addresses: Post message: vr@onelist.com Subscribe: vr-subscribe@egroups.com Unsubscribe: vr-unsubscribe@egroups.com List owner: vr-owner@egroups.com The Vulpinereach website is at: vulpinereach.vei.net Yahoo! Groups Links ----- End forwarded message ----- ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ SPONSORED LINKS Living history Expressions of sympathy Used car history Vehicle history Common sense ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "SCA-Disaster" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: SCA-Disaster-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 20:21:19 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j830LIHi014459 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:21:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j830GFJB020527 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:16:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j830G4H3090169; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:16:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j830Ftm1089998 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:15:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1EBLhG3yok-00079u; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 20:15:50 -0400 Message-ID: <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:15:57 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Response to conditions in Coastal Areas X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is probably the only time I have ever written ANY message like this online. But that message hits me close to home and I have to respond. Please forgive me for taking my white gloves off, and speaking my mind. But this must be said. A message for Susan an h-costumer lurker who lives the Gulf Coast of Alabama: Quote: "In sitting right in the middle of the disater area of the Gulf Coast I appreciate Bjarne's thoughtful and compassionate political advice. Too bad, you don't have any compassion for the victims. It has really helped me get water, ice, and electricity in for my home. BTW, George Bush didn't make the hurricane. Nature did." Unquote. She made me promise to write that. She is VERY, VERY hurt by your comment. >From Me: That message is very upsetting to me, and I and the others involved in this disaster would appreciate you NOT trying to make this situation into a political platform. H-costume is not a political platform list. First, very few people on this list have lived in this area of the U.S. Most people watching on TV do not truly understand the situation in this area. The news networks want you to think is 100% fact for ratings. They can not even say the names of the locations half the time correct. Footage they are showing is named incorrect, etc. They are jump-cutting parts of the aerial footage out of areas undamaged, etc. As my brother-in-law, who works for Neilson Ratings in marketing, pointed out last night, these news networks started Saturday pulling marketing information and getting top dollar for advertising because they thought this would be that their big story. Do you seeing any of these news networks giving money to the Red Cross or other charities to help these people. No! The only real reports of the areas came from Robin Roberts who entire family lives on the Gulf Coast. Yesterday when they were showing footage of Pass Christian did you see ANY images of those nice antebellum homes that survived? No! They jump-cut the aerial footage of the entire area of where my mother's home was. I know the areas of Southern Louisiana, Mississippi, and Alabama as well as I know my children. I lived there 21 years and ALL of our families still live there but 4 members. My family and Susan have informed me of the majority of the places that survived and how much damage there is. According to the news 90% of everything is destroyed. More has survived. There are areas of all three states that are very low land. Generally this is the area where the lower income people live because it is the property is cheap. New Orleans has the same problems that almost every city in the most of the world has. The lower income people are the majority of our present day inner cities. In Richmond, Virginia the majority of the people in the city earn lower incomes. Just like Chicago, LA, DC, Detroit, etc. We all have a prosperous areas of the city and less prosperous areas of the city. NYC has had this problem since immigrants came to the country 200 years ago. We had this discussion previously on this list about that some people think the people in the U.S. as all rich people in big 10,000+ sq. foot homes. If you choose to believe what you see on TV or in magazines it is your choice. But you probably also believe from every home or office window in Paris that you can see the Eiffel Tower or in London you can see Big Ben from every window. Hollywood wants you to think so. The majority of Americans do not believe that. Historically, Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana, and Arkansas are the lowest income states in the U.S. They are agricultural, and seafood, and oil producing states. That is the main reason we have an oil shortage this week. The majority of oil refineries in the Coastal areas are down. New Orleans, Gulfport, and Biloxi depend heavily on the tourism industry. Biloxi also depends heavily on business from the local Air Force base. Hattiesburg, 60 miles inland, where my brother lives, is a college town and depends on the railroad and chemical industries. I heard one reporter say when reporting from where the Grand Casino is in the middle of the highway in Gulfport, that this was a poor area of town. This is actually a middle class area. Those house are a nice size inside. Our families were livid about that reporter's comment. The only low income area of the Mississippi Gulf Coast is the Point in Biloxi... where the Biloxi bridge collapsed, and the area just North of downtown Gulfport before I-10. The majority of people on the Gulf Coastal areas live in houses with 1,500 -2,000 square feet. They work on oil rigs, tourism (like the Casinos), military bases, shipyards, or the seafood industry. The Gulf Coast States supplies the majority of the oil drilling & refining (as you at the gas pumps found out this week), seafood, shipbuilding & restoration, and crystal white beaches for those who take vacations. The cost of living in this area of the country is by far less than the majority of the U.S. Compare a nice 2,000 sq. foot home, for $60 to $75,000 for a middle income person on the Coast to those in California, Chicago, or Washington DC metros. Probably about three to four times higher or more. The majority of these Coastal homes were built in the 1920s when the tourism industry took off. 60 miles inland from these coastal areas, the cost of living is even cheaper. This is where the agricultural counties are. These counties/parishes supply the WORLD with cotton, beef, pork, rice, lumber, etc. Gulfport, Mobile, and New Orleans are the ports for import and export for goods worldwide. Mobile's port will be the only one functioning until the others recover. Yes, you can expect the prices of these items to rise. All railroad running east and west on the Gulf Coast have to be rebuild. Tracks needs repairing and the majority of major railroad bridges are out. Mississippi has been supplying the majority of the world with cotton for over 100 years. It is their number one cash crop. As for oil production, I don't know anyone from the Coastal area who does not have a family member who not in the oil industry, either refining or on oil rigs. These people who work on the rigs are gone from their families every other month and sitting on a rig in an Ocean around the world. My brother has been on rigs for the past 30 years all over the world. He has spent the past 10 years off the Coast of Africa next to war-torn countries and my brother-in-law works on rigs off of the coast of South America just to bring the World oil and support his families. Next time you use these any of these products think about these people from this Gulf Coast of the U.S. who have spent half their life devoted to bring the world oil and goods. If you think they live so much in poverty, just write out a second check to: Gulf Coast Poverty Fund everytime you purchase gasoline, or something made of cotton, or enjoy shrimp, fish, or oysters dinners. I will be very happy to personally manage the fund to give it to them. The people who take the oil out of the water, on those hot on shrimp boats, or in the hot fields of the cotton fields are proud people, but I will make sure they get your money. As for the some people in New Orleans misbehavior and the slow speed of response with supplies to the Coast: Not all 20,000+ people in New Orleans were out looting. Gulfport had very like looting. Honey the last thing in this world I would do is mess with a Mississippi policeman. The press found the looters. This was a despite situation, people were hungry and thirsty. I wouldn't begrudge anyone taking food or water for their families, but ATVs, big screen TVs, yes, I do have a problem with that. New Orleans has been known for years as for having a high crime rate, and have been rebuilding their police dept. after years of corruption. Everyone who lives on the Gulf of Mexico and the Atlantic Coast knows we are prone to hurricanes. We had eight tropical systems in Richmond, Virginia last year. That is the most it has ever had. We generally receive a tropical storm ever other year. I live 100 miles from the Atlantic coast. We ALL know that we might have to go a week or so without electricity water, food. When it is hurricane season, we all know we need to be prepared with water saved up, non-perishable food, and hurricane lamps & candles for at least a week of survival. Just like Richmonders know that when it turns winter in I should have these same things in the winter in case we get snowed in or have ice storms. On our Coastal regions we all know when to evacuate. The difference with this storm is that it grew very powerful in one day and that it turned at the last minute. Some other factors: The two weeks I was on the Coast, a tropical storm hit, (no evacuation ordered), and a minor hurricane was coming into the area (we were in 8 hrs of evacuation traffic for this the day before the storm). People had evacuated and the storm turned. So when Katrina moved into the Gulf, people were hesitant. Katrina is one of four of the most devitasting hurricanes that has hit the U.S. since records have been keep. It is going to take some time to co-ordinate the rescue and recovery. Just remember that it has been 35 years since the last major hurricane hit this area. Most of the people who coordinated that effort are now senior citizens or have passed on. I can speak for this from personal experience... my father was one of the Camille's Civil Defense coordinators. I have been through so many hurricanes and tropical storms in my life I can't even remember all of their names. There have been over 30 something hurricanes when I last counted. Only one time in all of these storms any of my family members lost their home and that was from Hurricane Camille. And as you have seen we have a very large family. Today's count, three of our family members have lost their home from this hurricane. I think the problem is that people outside of North America view the U.S. according as to what you see on TV or in films. Just remember, that is Hollywood's version is not the real thing. We do not have a great mass transit system like England. Our country is very large. We have two cars because my husband drives 45 minutes one way to go to work and needs a vehicle. My car is used to transport my living-at-home children to go their jobs in the opposite direction. The Richmond metro does not have mass transit outside of the actual city limits. The majority of mid-size U.S. cities with suburbs are this way. Small towns generally do not have mass transit at all, except if you want to count a Greyhound bus station. Trains for the most part are used for the transport of goods, like coal, lumbers, oil, etc. As for the flooding problems in N.O. When you build a city on a marsh, it will flood. "N.O. floods almost every time it rains... that's why they bury people above the ground." New Orleanians say that all the time. What the Press is not showing you are the parts of the city that did not flood... the original part of the city! Flooding is a fact of life in N.O., just like living in the flood zone of Richmond, the BIG ONE (flood) will come on day. The Big One happened in N.O. this week. The Big One happened in Richmond last year from a tropical storm in 2 hours and 11 inches of rain. It wiped out a whole business district when it happened. Sometimes unforeseen things happen, like in Richmond's flood last year a dam almost broke and places downstream were severely flooded. The people who live in the fault line of California know the Big One will happen one day. So should we not use the products and services from these areas to encourage them to move. We seem to like all those fruits and vegetables we receive from Florida and California. Do we say tough luck and not help these people. No! We are humans and we try to help those in need as much as possible. Just like we try to help people when earthquakes happen, volcanoes erupt, massive wildfires, droughts, etc. BTW, in case you didn't read my original message in July about the website with the antebellums homes, I made it very clear to point out, these homes were an exception in the South and are a declared historic district. That's why I have them on my website... they are historic. 99% people in the South do not live have big columned Plantation houses and strolling yards. A good many of the modern homes do have porches. Even my home built in 1978 is an exception with a 3/4 wrap-around porch. I looked for months to find a house to purchase with a wrap-around porch. I wanted one because it reminded me of the houses that face the beach in Pass Christian. But my columns, if you would call them that, are 6" X 6" boards. My porch is not a status system like the plantation style home but as functional as another room in our house. Please be careful when you stereo-type people and cultures. Don't judge people by what you see on TV and the movies. The reason I have always loved to travel and study costumes, is because I love to find out how others live. Education teaches us all to respect one another. That is why I am in the business I am in. But if you jump in and insult people or cultures, you end up causing conflict and hurt feeling. We all live differently because of our history, cultures, climate, income levels, etc. That is what makes us all so unique as a world. BTW, there is nothing wrong about not being a lot of having money. The majority of people live paycheck to paycheck. I have know a lot of people who have little money who are happier than those who have a lot. "Poor" is a state of mind not how much money you make or where you live. You can have all the money in the world and not be happy. I was always taught to not condemn a person, before you way a mile in their shoes. Bjarne please come out of the bubble and please walk a mile in someone's others shoes before condemning their lifestyles. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 20:48:18 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j830mI0w014716 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:48:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j830lST6022963 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:47:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j830lNod004578; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:47:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web54715.mail.yahoo.com (web54715.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.49.205]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j830lL3p004514 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:47:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from carolscostuming5@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 5325 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Sep 2005 00:47:15 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=N9RwHOISCMdEX+keqKbUq8oL9MRsRJVKvXzFklaZQFwxl8wgDDqEDReODMdHVZSRc/w6P2MYSXpMtJlHlSSRGrt53RKYc/NWU2trAYUbVT2cUrBLqDif5s8WdiZDQpIN8iH1d7g9zBvEKZBoIhNNd50T5Qn/oBH/E+oeWFVqePo= ; Message-ID: <20050903004715.5323.qmail@web54715.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.107.144.132] by web54715.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 17:47:15 PDT Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:47:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Carol Mitchell To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200508291848.j7TIjmxm089585@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] saris for Victorian dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO According to one of my favorite books, in the year 1700 Indian silk and chintz (called chints) were banned from the English market because they were hurting domestic manufacturers. I don't think that means Indian fabrics were unheard of in the following century, or that they died out after the Regency period.. Carol Mitchell Carol Mitchell listowner Costumemidwest www.yahoogroups.com/group/costumemidwest --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 20:51:47 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j830plEh014745 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:51:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j830pSTO023229 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:51:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j830pRwv006360; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:51:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j830pPiW006339 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:51:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maricelt@gmail.com) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so453469rne for ; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 17:51:25 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=ptJPoZ8YrwelE+XU/vSjEjca0AwLL/5f8/j059N25TLnZiUIsOvS/gAxe7vTIjM0oRRixKAMLUX+D+YXhnTfKUiCnbu7uryPWzWWk3KLTDoK3haCHot7gUEXrXaJQtve1dEsoigv0IGP6Um7geyHtzCBsN2dEGo6HSngLY+luG8= Received: by 10.38.101.59 with SMTP id y59mr29939rnb; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 17:51:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.38.101.56 with HTTP; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:51:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <72adc26605090217516fbab27@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:51:25 -0400 From: Marie Stewart To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline References: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id j830pPiW006339 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] avoiding pain and distress, hang in there all X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi folks... I'm sorry to see that Bjarne is being insensitive again. I did not see what he wrote, and I have no desire to - I made a policy some time ago to send all his posts to the trash unread. I hope he hasn't hurt anyone with his words. The last thing we need is more pain and distress. Hang in there all. Much love Mari / Bridgette On 9/2/05, Wanda Pease wrote: > Bjarne, This might give you an even better idea of what the US is all > about, even when we are stripped down to the essentials. The Coronation may > seem trivial, but the determination to make it happen isn't. Sort of like > the Danish Crown not giving up when the Nazi's poured over your borders. > Not a natural disaster, but close enough for government work. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 21:36:16 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j831aFhe015179 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:36:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j831ZWuP026782 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:35:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831ZUaJ025985; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:35:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831ZPER025948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:35:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.246] (pool180-246.patriot.net [209.249.180.246]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id j831ZHrA006174 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:35:24 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> References: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:34:43 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Subject: Re: [h-cost] Response to conditions in Coastal Areas Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Penny and Susan, While Bjarne's comments were awkward, I read it as his expressing surprise, learning about the diversity of people in America. The comments about Bush were not necessary, although there has been criticism with the slowness of the response. I think it always will sting when someone from a different country criticizes something about another. That there were people who did not have means to evacuate is tragic. Others decided to ride out the storm. I lived in Metarie, Louisiana (just west of New Orleans) when Camille came through. We boarded up the house and left, and fortunately our neighborhood was fine and we were back in a day. I find Penny's historic information interesting, the descriptions of the old houses are interesting and I hope to be able to enjoy the surviving historic buildings. I would like to ask listmembers to keep some things on private e-mail, however, and not argue (or discuss) non-historic, non-costume things! Costume content: It was in New Orleans that I first saw a lady in a lovely hoop-skirted gown (I think she was a tourguide). Also it was in Jackson Square that I first saw a hippie in person. :-) -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 21:54:59 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j831sxa6015380 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:54:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j831sZrF027910 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:54:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831sWv9034077; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:54:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831sRAs034034 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:54:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (pimout6-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.22]) by ylpvm15.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j831saxH001015 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:54:36 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j831sJgX270290 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:54:25 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050902181021.02666a40@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 18:54:13 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows In-Reply-To: <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> References: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] costuming and natural disasters X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >The people who live in the fault line of California know the Big One will >happen one day. Next year is the 100th anniversary of the last Big One that happened in Northern California, the San Francisco Earthquake. About half of the city burned, including the entire downtown and many homes, including everything from squalid tenements to fine mansions. (Our 1989 earthquake was minor by comparison.) The death toll soared, survivors lived in Army tents in public parks, food and water and medical supplies were scarce, charity poured in from all over the country, and the rebuilding took many years. The characteristic historical architectural style of San Francisco dates from the period right after the quake, when whole neighborhoods were rebuilt within a few years. By 1915 San Francisco hosted the Pan Pacific Exposition, celebrating, among other things, the phoenix-like rebirth of San Francisco from the ashes. I do living history at the San Francisco Maritime National Historical Park. In 2006 there will be many civic events in San Francisco commemorating this milestone in the city's history, and our living history program is making its plans already. Many park Rangers and living history docents have begun researching what parts the various ships in our collection played in the reconstruction of the city, as well as where each of them was at 5:12am on April 18, 1906. And I get to make a new outfit, since our program used to only do 1901 and now we'll be doing up to 1906. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 21:58:37 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j831waHt015432 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:58:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j831wJIx028120 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:58:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831wI8N035515; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:58:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.tpg.com.au (mail5.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.101]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831wCoW035470 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:58:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) Received: from e9q5h8 (220-244-241-246-act-pppoe.tpgi.com.au [220.244.241.246]) by mail.tpg.com.au (8.13.4/8.13.4) with SMTP id j831wArW015210 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:58:11 +1000 Message-ID: <007301c5b02a$d2ae9920$31d5f5dc@e9q5h8> From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] coastal news Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:57:20 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 4:39 AM Subject: [h-cost] coastal news > I am shocked down into my privacy and dont know how i can say this. > I thoaght America was such a rich comunity, you know big houses, dogs at > least two cars and overweight people. > Now i see in the television that poor people lives in USA two. > Well Well what can a poor soul in Denmark do except say to you all: > Never, never again ellect such a poor president as Bushes.................. > Hail Freedom of America and all its poor inhabitants. > And may God be with you alllll.......................... > Bjarne, Please don't make this about politics right now, it's too late to complain about what should have been done, right now it's important to concentrate on helping those who have been caught by this disaster and leave the blame game of who should have done what until later. WARNING, the following contains comments which could be interpreted as criticism of the USA, I hope people will not be offended by it I am trying to keep my personal opinions out and give facts to help people understand a bit more. If it is inaccurate please correct me. If you are offended by these comments let me know why. I agree that this has been mis-handled, having spoken with an ex New Orleans resident (she moved to Australia about 5 years ago and still has family there {thankfully all accounted for}) and watched the news it's clear that many locals knew a storm of this magnitude would break the levees and given the high poverty rate in the city it should have been clear that simply telling people to evacuate was not enough, they needed to provide transport to get people out. The 'rich' people (or those who could afford a car) have mostly got out and it's the poor who are stranded in these evacuation centres (like the superdome). >From my studies of different countries' social welfare systems (admittedly it was only a couple of weeks as part of a larger course) it's not really accurate to compare wealth between the USA and Denmark (or most other European countries) in Denmark there is a strong social security system and very little gap between rich and poor, the USA has very little social security or welfare (I can't recall which term is used over there) And the minimum wage is very low (many people working full time on the minimum wage find it very difficult to get by without assistance from charity). Therefore there is a big gulf between the rich and the poor, the rich are very rich and the poor are very poor. And finally, don't judge wealth by house size the land prices in countries like Australia and America are far lower than they are in Europe (as the population is far less concentrated), therefore somebody on the same wage is going to be able to afford a much larger house in America than they could in Europe. Elizabeth -------------------------------------------- Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/e_walpole/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 22:00:00 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j831xxon015459 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:59:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j831xZdm028208 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:59:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831xYPT036103; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:59:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831xUUc036069 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:59:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-52.sonic.net [209.148.113.52]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j831xSQm012642 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:59:29 -0700 Message-ID: <43190385.20606@lavoltapress.com> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 18:59:33 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Response to conditions in Coastal Areas References: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> In-Reply-To: <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Naturally I feel compassion for the hurricane victims. In San Francisco, we've been waiting for the next Big One (earthquake) for years. This is the Gulf Coast's Big One. Having said that, the whole discussion is off topic here. This is, after all, a costuming list. I vote that everyone who feels for the victims go contribute what cash they can afford to the Red Cross, or some other organization doing useful relief work. But here, let's get back to costume. I should add, that should the Big One (earthquake) occur here, I would not feel at all bad about h-costume not discussing it. Assuming I was even able to log on, I'd still have more urgent things to worry about. And now, I'm off to make a contribution. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com Penny Ladnier wrote: > This is probably the only time I have ever written ANY message like > this online. But that message hits me close to home and I have to > respond. Please forgive me for taking my white gloves off, and > speaking my mind. But this must be said. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 22:14:43 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j832Egw9015677 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:14:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j832EAXq029571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:14:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j832E6uX041854; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:14:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j832E2RL041817 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:14:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (pimout6-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.22]) by ylpvm15.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j832ECxH030289 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:14:12 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j832DxAX449396 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:14:01 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 19:13:47 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Response to conditions in Coastal Areas In-Reply-To: References: <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Costume content: It was in New Orleans that I first saw a lady in a > lovely hoop-skirted gown (I think she was a tourguide). Also it was in > Jackson Square that I first saw a hippie in person. :-) I have to laugh. A real Hippie, in person - like wow, man. But then, I grew up in California. I saw dozens of Hippies in person before I ever saw one in a hoop skirt. I went to school with Hippies, many of my best friends were Hippies, I even was a Hippie. The most important skill being a Hippie gave me was an appreciation for the fiber crafts, especially historical and ethnic. These days my historical costumes are known for their handwork and their historical embroidery and needle-embellishment. My non-historical 'costumes' are the style currently called "fiber art" or "wearable art", again using many fiber craft techniques I discovered as a Hippie. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 22:25:51 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j832PoR0015782 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:25:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j832PUmX030458 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:25:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j832PSVE046533; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:25:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j832PO21046495 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:25:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-52.sonic.net [209.148.113.52]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j832PMA4017812 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:25:23 -0700 Message-ID: <43190997.4070701@lavoltapress.com> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 19:25:27 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Was: Response to conditions Now: Fiber Art References: <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The whole modern wearable art movement is an outgrowth of DIY hippie crafts. I'm hoping to see the DIY aspects, the loving-hands-at-home experiments, revived as a foundation for a new generation of fiber artists. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com > My non-historical 'costumes' are the style currently called "fiber > art" or "wearable art", again using many fiber craft techniques I > discovered as a Hippie. > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 22:57:46 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j832vjXE016106 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:57:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j832vEP5033308 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:57:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j832vCxL060014; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:57:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j832v7rj059978 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:57:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.246] (pool180-62.patriot.net [209.249.180.62]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id j832uwD1021482 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:57:05 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> References: <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:55:27 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Hippie sightings... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I have to laugh. A real Hippie, in person - like wow, man. Oh, yes! It was around 1967. And, of course, I was warned to stay away from them. :-) >I saw dozens of Hippies in person before I ever saw one in a hoop skirt. Maybe because they were out of style by 1906? :-) It's interesting how an era is frozen into/associated with the identity of certain places. There's a good question, other than hoops in the south, what other places are associated with historic dress? Hmmm, Philadelphia 1776 comes to mind. Plymouth and 17thC puritan dress. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 23:27:51 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j833RjU0016343 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:27:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j833RFht035189 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:27:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j833RCXY071166; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:27:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp103.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com (smtp103.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.198.202]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j833R9Gx071122 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:27:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cabbagerose@sbcglobal.net) Received: (qmail 60401 invoked from network); 3 Sep 2005 03:27:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lazear1) (cabbagerose@sbcglobal.net@67.118.230.145 with login) by smtp103.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Sep 2005 03:27:03 -0000 Message-ID: <00e401c5b037$a419a0c0$0701a8c0@lazear1> From: "Cabbage Rose Costumes" To: "Historical Costume" References: <72adc26605090217516fbab27@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT posts re storm Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 20:29:06 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Gentle List I made a donation to the American Red Cross this afternoon. I agree with Fran that it may be far more productive to send money if this is weighing on one's conscience or heart, than for the list to discuss or decide whether or not the off topic comments that have been made by folks from other countries are deliberately insensitive or simply naievete manifesting itself in an unpleasant way. I read the offending post, and honestly believe that Bjarne's shaky English is the culprit. It did not seem offensive to me. I thought it sounded like he'd heard some news stories abroad blaming Bush or the Federal gov't for the "mishandling" (again not taking a position, just repeating the news' latest spin) and was only commiserating, not trying to stir the pot. I genuinely thought he was trying to be kind, but he really doesn't have much command of the language. That said, Fran's also right, this isnt' the place for this discussion. People's hearts are breaking and it is way, way too real a catastrophe for those of us here to be discussing in any meaningful way. There's nothing we can do but send money or pray, or both. My heart goes out to those who are living this nightmare. Please let's not make this a place that is unpleasant by making it a political forum. Again, you all in the Gulf Coast are in my prayers. God speed. Back to costume content discussion.... angela +++++ Angela F. Lazear Cabbage Rose Costumes www.cabbagerosecostumes.com Theatrical Costume Design "Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none: be able for thine enemy rather in power than use, and keep thy friend under thy own life's key: be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech..." W. Shakespeare ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marie Stewart" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 5:51 PM Subject: [h-cost] avoiding pain and distress, hang in there all > Hi folks... I'm sorry to see that Bjarne is being insensitive again. > I did not see what he wrote, and I have no desire to - I made a > policy some time ago to send all his posts to the trash unread. I > hope he hasn't hurt anyone with his words. The last thing we need is > more pain and distress. > > Hang in there all. > Much love > Mari / Bridgette > > On 9/2/05, Wanda Pease wrote: >> Bjarne, This might give you an even better idea of what the US is all >> about, even when we are stripped down to the essentials. The Coronation >> may >> seem trivial, but the determination to make it happen isn't. Sort of >> like >> the Danish Crown not giving up when the Nazi's poured over your borders. >> Not a natural disaster, but close enough for government work. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 23:54:21 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j833sKUP016584 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:54:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j833rwFZ036878 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:53:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j833rvrc081158; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:53:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j833rrgs081131 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:53:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j833rmmU030243 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:53:48 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j833rl2P045184 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:53:52 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 20:41:11 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hippie sightings... In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Maybe because they were out of style by 1906? Or maybe because there were so few wearers of hoop skirts in California, compared to in other parts of the country. > :-) It's interesting how an era is frozen into/associated with the > identity of certain places. There's a good question, other than hoops in > the south, what other places are associated with historic dress? Hmmm, > Philadelphia 1776 comes to mind. Plymouth and 17thC puritan dress. Berkeley, CA, and the 1960s. You see aging Hippies, and ones whose parents were barely born in the 1960s, on the streets in Berkeley, CA, even today. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 23:54:47 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j833slhQ016594 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:54:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j833sGYC036918 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:54:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j833sGJv081260; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:54:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j833sDsH081237 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:54:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1EBP6a0zZh-0005T7; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 23:54:12 -0400 Message-ID: <006601c5b03b$24b15e50$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <007301c5b02a$d2ae9920$31d5f5dc@e9q5h8> Subject: Re: [h-cost] coastal news Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:54:10 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This will be my last comment about the Coastal situation.... more wonderful news! Susan got her electricity back on tonight! YIPPEE!! My brother in Mobile got his lights yesterday. Southern Alabama is pulling up gradually. Also, today my sister went into my mom's house and everything is okay! No lights or water and a lot of limbs in her yard of course, but her house is intact! Double YIPPEE!! We really do appreciate all the love, support letters, the prayers, and donations to the charities. I have read some of your letters to my family on the phone. Being in a disaster makes people feel like they are not cut off from the world, and that the world has forgotten them. I have been in aftermaths of hurricanes with all communication cut off, and it does feel that way. Your letters have given them hope that people care. Hope is one of the best things for them. Thanks so much again, Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Sep 2 23:59:23 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j833xN7N016639 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:59:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j833wq8w037214 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:58:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j833wnAo083119; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:58:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:wQtIvK/qQDQxTiDCjm3MnzqY9KGOE6yd@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j833wjQf083100 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:58:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.143] (206-124-5-143.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.143]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id j833tEA22939 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:55:14 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v622) In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> References: <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <0edfe55d0f9cc0249dca06c97f2f6453@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hippie sightings... Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:58:44 -0600 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I just have to laugh when you place Berkeley in the sixties with historic dress. I was one of those Berkeley hippies of the '60s and I didn't realize I was considered historic! Sylrog On Sep 2, 2005, at 9:41 PM, Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > >> Maybe because they were out of style by 1906? > > Or maybe because there were so few wearers of hoop skirts in > California, compared to in other parts of the country. > >> :-) It's interesting how an era is frozen into/associated with the >> identity of certain places. There's a good question, other than >> hoops in the south, what other places are associated with historic >> dress? Hmmm, Philadelphia 1776 comes to mind. Plymouth and 17thC >> puritan dress. > > Berkeley, CA, and the 1960s. You see aging Hippies, and ones whose > parents were barely born in the 1960s, on the streets in Berkeley, CA, > even today. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 00:05:23 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j8345NYI016682 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:05:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8344qGG037623 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:04:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j8344oQR085474; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:04:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j8344lSc085450 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:04:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1EBPGn2tBn-00056B; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 00:04:45 -0400 Message-ID: <007101c5b03c$9e261770$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:04:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] One last important message X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j8345NYI016682 Status: RO This is so wonderful! I just received this message and please pass it on: Midwestern State University, Wichita Falls, Texas, http://www.mwsu.edu/ is opening its doors to students who now have no university for the fall because of the hurricane. If you know of university students who are in need of temporary (or permanent) university education because their school has been closed for the fall semester, (or longer) due to Hurricane Katrina, they can contact Barbara Merkle at 1-800-842-1922 or 940-397-4328. They will admit students late, and will charge in-state tuition. We need to be contacted by September 13th. Housing will be available. They have a theater department. Bless their hearts for being so thoughtful! Texas sure does have a big heart and is a good neighbor! Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 00:24:14 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j834OEnt016819 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:24:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j834NoML038589 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:23:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j834Nnuw092460; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:23:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j834NkSW092447 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:23:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j834NfmU004542 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:23:41 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j834NiXC064756 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:23:45 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050902210425.03280c58@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 21:23:35 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hippie sightings... In-Reply-To: <0edfe55d0f9cc0249dca06c97f2f6453@ntw.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I just have to laugh when you place Berkeley in the sixties with historic >dress. I was one of those Berkeley hippies of the '60s and I didn't >realize I was considered historic! Well, a friend of mine (same age) was speechless when her son was studying the Hippie period in school in history class. One of my daughters asked me what it was like "back then". I told her I got up in the morning, ate breakfast, etc. She was not amused, but I got her a modern book about the period (nicely written and illustrated) so she could read about all the things I missed (nobody could have gone to all the concerts, met all the people, etc.) So by now anything you and I wore in the 1960s is at least 'vintage'. My other daughter discovered plaid polyester double-knit trousers at a thrift store and pronounced them the coolest thing she'd ever bought. I did not share her enthusiasm... Hippies were more varied than the media ever gave them credit for - everything from Timothy Leary to Charles Manson. There were Christian Hippies, alternate religion Hippies, Eastern religion Hippies, Jewish Hippies, and atheist Hippies. There were political activist Hippies and back to nature Hippies who pretty much dropped out of the world of politics to live on agricultural communes out in the country. There were drug-using Hippies and drug-free Hippies. There were gun-toting, bomb-building Hippies and anti-violence, Peace-and-Love Hippies. And, of course, there were fiber craft Hippies and ethnic garment Hippies. I was those two kinds of Hippie. I still collect ethnic garments and needlework pieces, which, if they are made in traditional ways, are part of a living historical tradition. And I learned, or at least dabbled in, every fiber technique that I could get my hands on. I took up historical costuming in 1971 while I still dressed like a Hippie the rest of the time. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 00:36:11 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j834aBpo016904 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:36:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j834ZJYG039162 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:35:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j834ZHf2096846; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:35:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j834ZDnJ096824 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:35:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1EBPkA1xyL-0005vX; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 00:35:06 -0400 Message-ID: <007601c5b040$db7e4c10$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny><001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711><002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny><4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hippie sightings... Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:35:04 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carol, Williamsburg: Colonial dress (Goof-ball that is where I met you! Remember my missing night-gown!) I remember seeing you dressed to the T for a dance with patches on your bosom! And what a handsome dandy your husband was! I always think of you two in costume as Mr. & Mrs. Williamsburg! Jamestown: (400 years celebration soon) All those Civil War Battlefields/Forts and the soldier reenactors. Natchez, MS and Bellegrath Gardens (down the road from Susan"s home) Azalea Trail Maids. (I just see Albert Cat grit his teeth. I remember that very old thread on the list.) Maymont and the Dooley Mansion in Richmond, Virginia. The 1890s and early 1900s Victorian Days. Carol, remember the Victorian picnic on the mansion's lawn for Costume Society's National Symposium. I loved the gentlemen and ladies playing croquet in their summer white costumes. As for New Orleans, I loved the men in their Southern gentlemen attire who were driving the carriages around the French Quarter. Susan and I had the time of our life doing that one night. Another New Orleans one, the groups dressed in costumes, all black capes and in Goth makeup, doing the Vampires tours around the French Quarters are night. What a hoot! My all time favorite costumes at N.O. Mardi Gras, a brother and sister dressed as ghosts coming out of graves. I have a photo of them that I have been searching for years for. An honorable mention, Duck Hunt, I have a photo of him... http://www.onlinecostumeball.com/1998/Guest5.htm he is one the first row. How creative! BTW, Robin you wrote me that your photo wasn't working on the online Ball just before I went on vacation. Can you please tell me the Ball year and the page number. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 00:57:27 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j834vQAN017075 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:57:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j834uiBs040393 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:56:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j834uhQ3004847; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:56:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1b.socket.net [216.106.88.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j834ueLl004803 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:56:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9FEE40669 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:56:39 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 8C244D3FF for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:56:39 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] One last important message Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:56:50 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <007101c5b03c$9e261770$6800a8c0@Penny> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This was posted through the MU systems. Dear University of Missouri family: The news of the devastation in the Gulf Coast region is heartbreaking. We extend our deepest sympathies to all the victims of Hurricane Katrina. We are taking the swiftest measures possible to aid those whose lives have been affected by this terrible tragedy. The four University of Missouri campuses have multiple plans in place to assist students who have been displaced by the hurricane and who wish to enroll in classes. University of Missouri Health Care is working with the Missouri Hospital Association, which is coordinating hospital relief efforts with the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services and the American Hospital Association. Just some of the hospital system’s efforts include compiling lists of health worker volunteers, coordinating ambulance availability, making Columbia Regional and University Hospital beds available for victims, and making available telehealth services to victims and videoconferencing services to link families. For further information on the University’s hurricane relief efforts, please visit the following link: http://www.umsystem.edu/katrina Our thoughts remain with the victims of this disaster, and we wish them strength during this terrible time. Sincerely, Elson S. Floyd, Ph.D. President _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 00:57:50 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j834viXN017079 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:57:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j834uifo040392 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:56:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j834ugtS004834; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:56:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1b.socket.net [216.106.88.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j834uddW004794 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:56:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF7703FFCF for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:56:38 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 605F9D497 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:56:38 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] costuming and natural disasters Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:56:49 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050902181021.02666a40@mail.frys.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO St. Louis has the Missouri and Mississippi rivers that have flooded areas in the past. I remember one year in school some students skipped school to help sandbag the man made river DePare(sp?) The New Madrid fault which is expected to have "the big one" sometime soon which will probably shift the Mississippi bank lines and periodic tornados. Most St. Louisians know that you need a house with a basement for the tornados but understand that it can and does flood in your basement so store in plastic emergency items. De -----Original Message----- >The people who live in the fault line of California know the Big One will >happen one day. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 01:15:26 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j835FQCZ017218 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 01:15:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j835ExcC041321 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:14:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j835Evs8011250; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:14:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1b.socket.net [216.106.88.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j835Esfp011229 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:14:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3035F406C3 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:14:54 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id D4580D3FF for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:14:53 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] OT posts re storm Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:15:05 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <00e401c5b037$a419a0c0$0701a8c0@lazear1> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I agree the your statement with Bjarne. The reason most are talking is because they/we are trying to make some sense of it all and in some cases see what went wrong in hopes that if it happens again then there will not be a repeat of the wrongs if possible. As well as a "what if some disaster happened here in my area" what would happen? are we prepared?" And yes this "topic" needs to dissipate and get back to costumes. De -----Original Message----- Gentle List I made a donation to the American Red Cross this afternoon. I agree with Fran that it may be far more productive to send money if this is weighing on one's conscience or heart, than for the list to discuss or decide whether or not the off topic comments that have been made by folks from other countries are deliberately insensitive or simply naievete manifesting itself in an unpleasant way. I read the offending post, and honestly believe that Bjarne's shaky English is the culprit. It did not seem offensive to me. I thought it sounded like he'd heard some news stories abroad blaming Bush or the Federal gov't for the "mishandling" (again not taking a position, just repeating the news' latest spin) and was only commiserating, not trying to stir the pot. I genuinely thought he was trying to be kind, but he really doesn't have much command of the language. That said, Fran's also right, this isnt' the place for this discussion. People's hearts are breaking and it is way, way too real a catastrophe for those of us here to be discussing in any meaningful way. There's nothing we can do but send money or pray, or both. My heart goes out to those who are living this nightmare. Please let's not make this a place that is unpleasant by making it a political forum. Again, you all in the Gulf Coast are in my prayers. God speed. Back to costume content discussion.... angela +++++ Angela F. Lazear Cabbage Rose Costumes www.cabbagerosecostumes.com Theatrical Costume Design _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 01:20:23 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j835KM2U017256 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 01:20:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j835JxiR041661 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:19:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j835Jw0Y012897; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:19:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j835Jt5r012867 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:19:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1EBQRV2jXE-00076V; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 01:19:53 -0400 Message-ID: <009001c5b047$1d30ef40$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] One last important message Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 01:19:52 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is the second message about different college's help since I posted that message. I am going to make a webpage with listings of universities that will take college students from the affected areas and their message. Poor University of Southern Mississippi lost their college in Pass Christian and the Hattiesburg campus received a lot of damage. Please get the word out that if a college is willing to accept these hurricane effected students, please let me know and I will post it to my website. I will have a link on the front of my website for students to go to late tomorrow night. This is a wonderful thing these colleges are doing, especially since most colleges started the week before the hurricane hit. Please make sure there is a website URL in message and a person to contact and their phone number. These affected students don't need to run a telephone gambit to get back into college. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 02:40:57 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j836euGC026168 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 02:40:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j836eFwn046241 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:40:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j836eAMS041789; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:40:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jade.spiritone.com (jade.aracnet.com [216.99.193.136]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j836e2QU041737 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 00:40:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by jade.spiritone.com (8.13.4/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j836e1Aq013552; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:40:02 -0700 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "H-Costume" , "SCA-GARB" Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 23:48:54 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1506 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] New to me Eleonora of Toledo X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.hermitagemuseum.org/fcgi-bin/db2www/descrPage.mac/descrPage?selLa ng=English&indexClass=PICTURE_EN&PID=GJ-1586&numView=1&ID_NUM=2&thumbFile=%2 Ftmplobs%2FK1NDGRTTW_23_23OF3QT6.jpg&embViewVer=last&comeFrom=quick&sorting= no&thumbId=6&numResults=2&tmCond=Allori+Alessandro&searchIndex=TAGFILEN&auth or=Allori%2C%26%2332%3BAlessandro Sorry for the cross post. I was looking for a copy of the Wedding at Cana by Allesandro Allori to look at Catherine de Medici's dress and found this instead. Ever since I made my first "Eleonora" dress from Janet Arnold's book I have found her fascinating. I know the above URL is ridiculously long but snipurl doesn't want anything to do with it. It is a portrait of Eleonora in the Hermitage collection. It is unlike any portrait of her that I've see, but Allori was a fosterling of Bronzino so he might have had some sittings. The dress is fantastic! Wanda Pease/Regina Romsey Never attribute to malice what can as easily be attributed to simple social ineptness _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 07:33:46 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83BXjDI018456 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:33:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83BWtNq064570 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 05:32:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83BWoSV046440; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 05:32:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.200.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j83BWk5s046408 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 05:32:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sismith42@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 58069 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Sep 2005 11:32:41 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=Q9axujjvkYNkJxFOjueo8c7zMsGIzzKKd2bAOTAaRQ5KhDSMW7JzZsKQ8fgm2NpX2fI6U+cIBtEkEQ95afbjhG0NR+eOp+kXMGVln/hfKC0Iy0Sb/aehYnGiNozfDy6DQP1I7RTtsFgf/+6NjlnL/SnBzBlaJZLt118m2KNlhiA= ; Message-ID: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.192.34.140] by web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 04:32:41 PDT Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 04:32:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Stephanie Smith To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200509030401.j833wnoQ083121@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fran wrote: "The whole modern wearable art movement is an outgrowth of DIY hippie crafts. I'm hoping to see the DIY aspects, the loving-hands-at-home experiments, revived as a foundation for a new generation of fiber artists." I reply: Huh. My first encounters with fiber-arts came with my grandmother (now 79); I doubt she'd enjoy being called a hippie (but i won't tell) ;-) Good to know that's where/when/how working with textiles and fiber went from something one did if you were too poor to buy you clothes to something one did as an artform :-) When did "off the rack" clothes become THE WAY to go, as opposed to just being what people who couldn't afford to have clothes made for them wore? Stephanie __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 07:55:54 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Btr6O018620 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:55:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83Bswrh068987 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 05:54:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83BsvtE054119; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 05:54:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-cowbird.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-cowbird.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.68]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83BsrAw054102 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 05:54:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from rapierlady@earthlink.net) Received: from elwamui-mouette.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([209.86.224.41]) by pop-cowbird.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #10) id 1EBWbl-0003Es-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 07:54:53 -0400 Message-ID: <11834440.1125748493563.JavaMail.root@elwamui-mouette.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:54:53 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: Wendy Colbert To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] One last important message Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny, Both CMU and PITT, in Pittsburgh, PA have also made the same offer. BOth have Theatre departments. Wendy Proud grad of the PITT theatre program -----Original Message----- From: Penny Ladnier Sent: Sep 3, 2005 12:04 AM To: h-costume Subject: [h-cost] One last important message This is so wonderful! I just received this message and please pass it on: Midwestern State University, Wichita Falls, Texas, http://www.mwsu.edu/ is opening its doors to students who now have no university for the fall because of the hurricane. If you know of university students who are in need of temporary (or permanent) university education because their school has been closed for the fall semester, (or longer) due to Hurricane Katrina, they can contact Barbara Merkle at 1-800-842-1922 or 940-397-4328. They will admit students late, and will charge in-state tuition. We need to be contacted by September 13th. Housing will be available. They have a theater department. Bless their hearts for being so thoughtful! Texas sure does have a big heart and is a good neighbor! Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 08:23:27 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83CNRMa018786 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:23:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83CN3ag076508 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 06:23:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83CN2DY064232; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 06:23:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83CMwda064203 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 06:23:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout7-ext.prodigy.net (pimout7-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.147]) by ylpvm15.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83CN8xH018254 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:23:08 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout7-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83CMphc125960 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:22:57 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903051734.03360f20@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 05:18:06 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes In-Reply-To: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <200509030401.j833wnoQ083121@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >When did "off the rack" clothes >become THE WAY to go, as opposed to just being what >people who couldn't afford to have clothes made for >them wore? Probably as soon as they became plentiful and cheap. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 09:46:10 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Dk9U8019305 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:46:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83Dj62E085036 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:45:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Dj20N095990; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:45:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay106-dav1.bay106.hotmail.com [65.54.161.73]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83DiwoF095870 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:45:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from bear_janet@msn.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 06:44:53 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.161.200 by BAY106-DAV1.phx.gbl with DAV; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:44:52 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [65.54.161.200] X-Originating-Email: [bear_janet@msn.com] X-Sender: bear_janet@msn.com From: "JAMES OGILVIE" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009001c5b047$1d30ef40$6800a8c0@Penny> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:44:50 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 8.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202 Seal-Send-Time: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:44:51 -0400 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Sep 2005 13:44:53.0196 (UTC) FILETIME=[A995A0C0:01C5B08D] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] collages and hurricane relief X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j83Dk9U8019305 Status: RO Another generous offer: http://www.mercyhurst.edu/ne/college_news_detail.php?id=777&m=9&y=2005 although I'm confused as to whether the tri-state area they are referring to is the tri-state area around Erie or the tri-state area hit by the hurricane. Janet _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 10:12:18 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83ECHLJ019513 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:12:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83EBauH087044 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:11:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83EBWDQ007260; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:11:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83EBTxn007196 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:11:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (unknown [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 668843B5F9 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:11:24 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <4319AF29.5080804@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 09:11:53 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes References: <200509030401.j833wnoQ083121@net.indra.com> <4.3.1.2.20050903051734.03360f20@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050903051734.03360f20@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > >> When did "off the rack" clothes >> become THE WAY to go, as opposed to just being what >> people who couldn't afford to have clothes made for >> them wore? > > > Probably as soon as they became plentiful and cheap. > Store bought clothing and household goods became a sign of affluence after the Depression, and again after WW2. People hid quilts under Sears bedspreads and only wore flour sack underwear to school on days they didn't have to change for gym. The 60's and 70's hippie movement spawned re-interest in those old crafts, and by the 80's it was being called "art". Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 10:19:57 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83EJv70019573 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:19:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83EJR7w087751 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:19:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83EJQet010345; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:19:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83EJMLM010311 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:19:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.242] (pool180-242.patriot.net [209.249.180.242]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id j83EJIwP021059 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:19:19 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <009001c5b047$1d30ef40$6800a8c0@Penny> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:18:44 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Subject: Re: [h-cost] collages and hurricane relief Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There are many colleges and universities offering to accept students from hurricane areas, so unless people are talking about schools with a costume/theatre/textile program, I don't think they all need to be sent to the list. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 10:48:20 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83EmKQN019896 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:48:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83ElO7Y089602 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:47:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83ElLMX022412; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:47:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from omta16.mta.everyone.net (sitemail2.everyone.net [216.200.145.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83ElICj022389 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:47:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lalahcatlady@netscape.com) Received: from dm22.mta.everyone.net (bigiplb-dsnat [172.16.0.19]) by omta16.mta.everyone.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CB153FC72 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:47:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Eon-Dm: dm22 Received: from mailweb09.everyone.net (172.16.0.19 [172.16.0.19]) by dm22.mta.everyone.net (EON-AUTHRELAY2) with ESMTP id dm22.4317aafd.10a23 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:47:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Eon-Sig: AQI79nRDGbd29xN7TwIAAAAB,8bb3db0b69abc314eba3c430bf88557d Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.41 (Entity 5.404) Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:47:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Lalah To: Historical Costume X-Originating-Ip: [205.188.116.132] Message-Id: <20050903074718.1472E818@dm22.mta.everyone.net> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Bjarne X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I know this isn't costume related and I am not one of the popular people on this list, but I just couldn't keep quiet. The message Bjarne sent sounded like he was more surprised than critical, and give the guy credit - he writes better English than most of us do Danish. I wish I could speak any other language as well as he does. I know that many of us have family or dear friends in the areas hit and are a bit on edge right now, but it isn't fair to take it out on someone who was making an honest mistake. People the world over think that we in the United States are all rich - if you watch TV at all you will understand why. I do believe he was trying to be sympathetic and now he is just being quiet while he is being blasted. I, for one, admire his attempts at English and his wonderful handwork and costuming. I would sorely miss him if he left the list. Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _____________________________________________________________ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 10:50:49 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83EommX019921 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:50:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83EoU62089761 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:50:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83EoTZ2023606; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:50:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83EoO6i023566 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:50:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.242] (pool180-15.patriot.net [209.249.180.15]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id j83EoKwW005380 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:50:22 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> References: <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:48:54 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Eras and places (was hippies) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn said, >Berkeley, CA, and the 1960s. You see aging Hippies, and ones whose >parents were barely born in the 1960s, on the streets in Berkeley, >CA, even today. I have an "ageing" hippie next door who just turned 40. :-) Do you think, though, that the hippie styles in Berkeley are only due to the area, or because kids like the style again? Maybe a bit of both? I agree, though that the hippie look says Berkeley or Haight Ashbury. (Is that in Berkeley?) Or Woodstock, which is not close at all. :-) Goth styles are all over the place, particularly at night in cities. Or game conventions where they play Vampire. Hoopskirts evoke many places in the south east US - New Orleans, Atlanta, Mobile. I was thinking of the style that defines a specific city or area - black & white pilgrim/puritan is Massachussets and not anywhere else. Except, of course, Dutch paintings. Bustle gowns make me think of the midwest, I suppose due to the amount of growth during that era and I've seen a few houses that have them in their collection. But those era houses are all over the place. And to extend this discussion to the rest of the world, late 1500s/early 1600s is London due to Elizabeth. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 10:56:54 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Eus3F019991 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:56:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83EuP3T090113 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:56:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83EuNSp026082; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:56:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web31002.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web31002.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.200.165]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j83EuJrt026015 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 08:56:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from emeraldepona@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 26682 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Sep 2005 14:56:14 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=qf1tRVkLU49xObe3Xhh0YWmYt6foyRlnkmuA5DAPO8oWkFS/pZmkFSqGRg57WSiDbdXAJC7+Zoz4exScDG3DOa18AjNFTZ7upj53JE6qQ6H3+eNdbCiIKwZxzypGIIpIcyq8DQrtHd1FxvR/sMsel6PORV1XdG0h9KFCM+ZPp6c= ; Message-ID: <20050903145614.26680.qmail@web31002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [207.69.137.8] by web31002.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 07:56:14 PDT Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:56:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bjarne To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20050903074718.1472E818@dm22.mta.everyone.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.86.2, clamav-milter version 0.86 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I second that and Thank You Lalah for wording it so much better than I would have/could have. I can NOT imagine Bjarne ever being rude and I realize we've never met nor probably ever will, but his whole demeanor online has always been respectful IMHO. Christine Gallucci Lalah wrote: I know this isn't costume related and I am not one of the popular people on this list, but I just couldn't keep quiet. The message Bjarne sent sounded like he was more surprised than critical, and give the guy credit - he writes better English than most of us do Danish. I wish I could speak any other language as well as he does. I know that many of us have family or dear friends in the areas hit and are a bit on edge right now, but it isn't fair to take it out on someone who was making an honest mistake. People the world over think that we in the United States are all rich - if you watch TV at all you will understand why. I do believe he was trying to be sympathetic and now he is just being quiet while he is being blasted. I, for one, admire his attempts at English and his wonderful handwork and costuming. I would sorely miss him if he left the list. Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _____________________________________________________________ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. Dr. Seuss Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. Ralph Waldo Emerson __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 11:31:12 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83FVCRf020283 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:31:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83FUiZl092136 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:30:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83FUgJa040266; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:30:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83FUdoh040222 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:30:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from jaurbik@optonline.net) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (ool-18bdecc2.dyn.optonline.net [24.189.236.194]) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.06 (built May 11 2005)) with ESMTP id <0IM8007UVZ2VFK2S@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:30:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:31:33 -0400 From: J Schueller Subject: Re: [h-cost] Eras and places (was hippies) In-reply-to: To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4319C1D5.4080104@optonline.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en References: <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Netscape/7.2 (ax) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On the topic of the south and hoop skirts.... Were the hoop skirts popular later in the south then the north? I mean, our (ok, mine and I am a typical yankee) picture of "THE SOUTH" is alweays with ladies in hoops, but I would assume that the north had just as many ladies wearing hoops at the same time..... jordana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 11:51:22 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83FpMBw020550 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:51:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83FoYsB093230 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:50:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83FoXbm048034; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:50:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.131]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83FoS7w047984 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:50:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from genteelarts (oh-69-34-25-82.dyn.sprint-hsd.net [69.34.25.82]) by smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D54E32C00C for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:50:28 -0500 (CDT) From: "Carolann Schmitt" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Eras and places (was hippies) Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:50:00 -0400 Organization: Genteel Arts Message-ID: <001001c5b09f$29be6780$0600a8c0@genteelarts> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 In-Reply-To: <4319C1D5.4080104@optonline.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2670 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id j83FoS7w047984 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I did some extensive research on mid-19th century skirt supports (corded petticoats, cage and covered crinolines, etc.) for a presentation last year. Based on manufacturing and sales records, crinolines were widely available and worn anywhere in the country, including the far west. This is amply supported by original photographs, extant crinolines, and commentary in period magazines, newspapers, letters and journals. The average retail price for a crinoline c. 1855-1865 was $0.25-$2.00 each, depending on the overall style and the number of steels. Documentation indicates that the style spread quite rapidly across the country - within a few months at most. Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 2-5, 2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 11:54:00 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83FrxMq020573 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:54:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83FrhEa093445 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:53:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Frgut049378; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:53:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83FrZwl049320 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:53:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.50] (pool180-50.patriot.net [209.249.180.50]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id j83FrW92002854 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:53:34 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4319C1D5.4080104@optonline.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> <4319C1D5.4080104@optonline.net> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:52:58 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Subject: Re: [h-cost] Eras and places (was hippies) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Jordana said, >On the topic of the south and hoop skirts.... Were the hoop skirts >popular later in the south then the north? I mean, our (ok, mine >and I am a typical yankee) picture of "THE SOUTH" is alweays with >ladies in hoops, but I would assume that the north had just as many >ladies wearing hoops at the same time..... Perhaps we have Scarlett O'Hara to thank for the hoopskirts, especially the barer evening dress worn at the picnic. :-) The American Civil War marked a great change for the south, and therefore an era greatly identified with the region. When I think of the real daytime wear, the buttoned up hooped gowns in the sepia toned portraits, I think of Gettysburg, PA. That's probably because it's near me and I've done reenactments there, so it's strictly personal. But the fluffy pastel colored ballgowns - that's the south. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 12:13:00 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83GD0wH020714 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:13:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83GCdTV094622 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:12:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GCaKp057289; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:12:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.131]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GCQYW057193 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:12:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from genteelarts (oh-69-34-25-82.dyn.sprint-hsd.net [69.34.25.82]) by smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1084A32C00C for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:12:25 -0500 (CDT) From: "Carolann Schmitt" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:12:01 -0400 Organization: Genteel Arts Message-ID: <001301c5b0a2$3d4527a0$0600a8c0@genteelarts> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2670 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id j83GCQYW057193 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] regional crinoline fashions X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I disagree. For every extant pastel colored ballgown *documented* to the South, I can show you one documented to the North, or the Midwest, or the West, or Canada, or Europe. And I can do the same for every "buttoned up" dress documented to the North or any other region of the country. There are some regional differences in style, but they are minor elements of the overall fashion and stem more frequently from local customs and availability than a "if this is pale pink it must be Mississippi" trend. One of the most stunning original dresses I've seen is in the collection of the Cincinnati Art Museum: a bright sapphire blue silk taffeta woven a disposition, originally from Gettysburg, PA. Carolann Schmitt, Life-long Gettysburgian cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies and Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 2-5, 2006 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83GDtNw020720 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:13:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83GDU9n094684 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:13:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GDTa6057642; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:13:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GDQba057561 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:13:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from [10.0.1.2] (c-24-21-156-164.hsd1.or.comcast.net [24.21.156.164]) by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id j83GDKR03564 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:13:21 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v734) In-Reply-To: References: <009001c5b047$1d30ef40$6800a8c0@Penny> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <9AD4B7A6-C80F-4D3C-A68F-D1E8B83CD58B@alfalfapress.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Althea Turner Subject: Re: [h-cost] collages and hurricane relief Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:13:17 -0700 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.734) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oregon State University is also taking in hurricane displaced students. We have both a theater and textiles program. It's a great place to live, but I'm tremendously biased. :D Althea _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 12:34:39 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83GYdTG020847 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:34:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83GYFaE096135 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:34:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GYDes066832; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:34:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GY96P066761 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:34:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1EBaxl-0003YA-DA; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:33:53 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:33:53 -0500 Message-ID: <20050903113353.9rtqwy5polwc44kg@www.goldsword.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:33:53 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] collages and hurricane relief References: <009001c5b047$1d30ef40$6800a8c0@Penny> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The University of Tennessee is as well -- and they also have a theatre Department. In fact, as of Tuesday, my department will have a Tulane grad Student for at least the semester. Susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 12:44:36 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Giasc020952 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:44:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83Gi1Vm096772 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:44:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Ghxe8070971; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:43:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop03.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop03.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.48]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GhsVB070944 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:43:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from mswamui-billy.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([209.86.224.27]) by pop03.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #10) id 1EBb7S-0000pX-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 12:43:54 -0400 Message-ID: <22365507.1125765834184.JavaMail.root@mswamui-billy.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:43:53 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: ruthanneb@mindspring.com To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bjarne Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO May I echo Chris and Lalah, and further suggest (in the great American tradition of free speech) that anyone who has shared hundreds of pieces of useful costume information and dozens of beautiful and inspiring pictures of finished costumes and works-in-progress can be considered to have earned the right to express one political opinion a year on this list. I haven't earned that right yet, but would be delighted to discuss politics off-list any time! Meanwhile, thank you, Bjarne, for your concern for the people in this country. And my own deepest sympathy for those affected by this disaster, both those in Katrina's zone and their loved ones and associates. Ruth Anne Baumgartner gypsy scholar and amateur costumer -----Original Message----- From: Chris Sent: Sep 3, 2005 9:56 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bjarne I second that and Thank You Lalah for wording it so much better than I would have/could have. I can NOT imagine Bjarne ever being rude and I realize we've never met nor probably ever will, but his whole demeanor online has always been respectful IMHO. Christine Gallucci Lalah wrote: I know this isn't costume related and I am not one of the popular people on this list, but I just couldn't keep quiet. The message Bjarne sent sounded like he was more surprised than critical, and give the guy credit - he writes better English than most of us do Danish. I wish I could speak any other language as well as he does. I know that many of us have family or dear friends in the areas hit and are a bit on edge right now, but it isn't fair to take it out on someone who was making an honest mistake. People the world over think that we in the United States are all rich - if you watch TV at all you will understand why. I do believe he was trying to be sympathetic and now he is just being quiet while he is being blasted. I, for one, admire his attempts at English and his wonderful handwork and costuming. I would sorely miss him if he left the list. Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _____________________________________________________________ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. Dr. Seuss Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. Ralph Waldo Emerson __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 12:44:41 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Gif76020955 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:44:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83GiNO6096807 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:44:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GiMDa071155; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:44:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GiI7V071088 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:44:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1EBb7a-0004GL-UL; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:44:02 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:44:02 -0500 Message-ID: <20050903114402.v1w6u6guycpw48ck@www.goldsword.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:44:02 -0500 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bjarne References: <20050903145614.26680.qmail@web31002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20050903145614.26680.qmail@web31002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Quoting Chris : > I second that and Thank You Lalah for wording it so much better than > I would have/could have. > > I can NOT imagine Bjarne ever being rude and I realize we've never > met nor probably ever will, but his whole demeanor online has always > been respectful IMHO. > IWhile I normally don't like the "Me Too" posts, I have to add my "me too" to this. Often, Bjarne's work is a calm oasis in this hectic life that we lead. Susan who has heard similar comments from new foreign students this week -- and nobody was being critical, just surprised. ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 12:49:45 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Gni8B021006 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:49:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83GnR9v097158 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:49:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GnQrO073326; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:49:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GnMLZ073296 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:49:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.50] (pool180-88.patriot.net [209.249.180.88]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id j83GnHUQ007423 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:49:20 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <001301c5b0a2$3d4527a0$0600a8c0@genteelarts> References: <001301c5b0a2$3d4527a0$0600a8c0@genteelarts> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:48:43 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Subject: Re: [h-cost] regional crinoline fashions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I was looking at the way certain eras of fashion are associated with an area, which is different than what people were actually wearing. It's not the reality, it's what we perceive based on movies, popular culture, etc. Hippies were everywhere, but now identified with Berkeley. Black hats with buckles on them were not the fashion at Plymouth, Mass, but they're all over the souvenir shops. I'm imagining a "what city is this" sort of thing based on the historic costume icons. -Carol >I disagree. For every extant pastel colored ballgown *documented* to >the South, I can show you one documented to the North, or the >Midwest, or the West, or Canada, or Europe. And I can do the same >for every "buttoned up" dress documented to the North or any other >region of the country. There are some regional differences in style, >but they are minor elements of the overall fashion and stem more >frequently from local customs and availability than a "if this is >pale pink it must be Mississippi" trend. > >One of the most stunning original dresses I've seen is in the >collection of the Cincinnati Art Museum: a bright sapphire blue silk >taffeta woven a disposition, originally from Gettysburg, PA. > >Carolann Schmitt, Life-long Gettysburgian >cschmitt@genteelarts.com >www.genteelarts.com >Ladies and Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 2-5, 2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 12:52:09 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Gq9EI021032 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:52:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83GpddV097303 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:51:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Gpcn1074383; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:51:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GpYQg074332 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:51:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-97.sonic.net [209.148.113.97]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GpWdk016340 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:51:33 -0700 Message-ID: <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 09:51:35 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Off-the-rack clothes became THE WAY to go in the 1920s. Problem was, during the depression of the 1930s and the war rationing and shortages of the 1940s, a great many people had to home sew, restyle clothing, and think up ways to use things like flour sacks just to get something to wear. While home dressmaking was associated with economy even in the 19th century--the small amount one would spend on a low-end dressmaker was still worth saving if you had a small clothes budget--economy became its primary association. 1950s dressmaking manuals told women they could make clothes that would look just like RTW, so they didn't have to admit they home sewed. Then, in the late 1960s and early 1970s, there was a "counterculture" reaction against things manufactured by the "establishment," including clothing, food, and many other things. People took up not only home sewing (see _The Illustrated Hassle-Free Make Your Own Clothes Book_), but bread baking (see the _Tassajara Bread Book_), organic gardening, candle making, and lots of other crafts. The emphasis was not only on doing it yourself, but on _not_ imitating "plastic" ready-made clothes, supermarket food, etc. Many completely inexperienced people were experimenting with various crafts; and inexperience, as well as a "go with the flow" attitude, led to many original approaches. And by the 1980s, some people had become very skilled, in fact professional, at patchwork, free-form crochet, and lots of other things. (The Tassajara bakery morphed into the very expensive, sophisticated, gourmet vegetarian restaurant Greens.) They published and taught about new approaches and techniques they'd developed. Companies like Folkwear were founded. Banks bought enormous fiber art hangings for their lobbies. It was very hip to study "fiber arts" in college (not usually sewing, but weaving, spinning, crochet, embroidery, and such). The modern reenactment movement (I'm excluding things like Victorian costume balls and jousts when I say "modern") also, I believe, got its start as part of the counterculture. The SCA started as a bunch of hippies who enjoyed dressing in colorful clothes and evolved into a much larger organization with much more complicated goals. While I'm greatly enjoying the modern "boho" revival (especially gypsy skirts; I've accumulated a largish collection), as far as I can tell it focuses on people buying styles, not making them. Yes, in the 1960s and 1970s the RTW industry eagerly jumped on the counterculture bandwagon, manufacturing and selling "hippie" clothes. Still, there was a lot of DIY, which I don't think I'm seeing currently as a mainstream movement. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com >Good to know that's where/when/how working with >textiles and fiber went from something one did if you >were too poor to buy you clothes to something one did >as an artform :-) When did "off the rack" clothes >become THE WAY to go, as opposed to just being what >people who couldn't afford to have clothes made for >them wore? > >Stephanie > > > >__________________________________ >Yahoo! Mail for Mobile >Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. >http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 12:54:58 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83GswV3021055 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:54:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83GsbG7097500 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:54:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83GsZx4076204; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:54:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52809.mail.yahoo.com (web52809.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.252]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j83GsXNP076143 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:54:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kjp1685@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 33124 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Sep 2005 16:54:28 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=T5TOl+kFAOdDLcBMNx8PgY470aBDff/tWx6ZLKVa4/xtgcAbEsyFRd9CSv+zLe6MQ62OTZbKORPOaugc8LvLSle1YpaFH6Hub0Nu0m2HUDRax/7/181AQmZ6bpkp4sUgoNecForamK6PnGybACzmB5x8zQkS9WAMBX/3DNJFaQI= ; Message-ID: <20050903165428.33122.qmail@web52809.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.103.24.30] by web52809.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 09:54:28 PDT Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:54:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Kathryn Parke To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20050903145614.26680.qmail@web31002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] belted houppelandes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Could someone walk me through the process of belting a houppelande just below the bustline? How did they keep the belts there, without having it "walk" itself down to the natural waistline? Was it tacked in places, and if so, wouldn't that interfere with the drape? And how were they fastened in back -- buckled, tied, pinned? This is for a stage costume, "accuracy" isn't the primary goal (don't hate me!) -- I want that look, but I'm not sure how best to achieve it. Thank you -- KP __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 13:05:38 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83H5bZQ021132 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:05:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83H59Yv098394 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:05:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83H57AA081969; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:05:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83H54v0081934 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:05:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j83Gxsjf025366 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:59:54 -0400 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 12:59:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4319D7BE.1080304@thibault.org> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:05:02 -0400 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] belted houppelandes References: <20050903165428.33122.qmail@web52809.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20050903165428.33122.qmail@web52809.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kathryn Parke wrote: > Could someone walk me through the process of belting a houppelande > just below the bustline? How did they keep the belts there, without > having it "walk"itself down to the natural waistline? Was it tacked > in places, and if so, wouldn't that interfere with the drape? And > how were they fastened in back -- buckled, tied, pinned? All excellent questions. And all answers that we can only guess at, except for the last one. There are some illustrations which show a buckle in the back, with a long tail hanging down from it. Some may have had short tails in the back. How were they kept up there? This is all conjecture. You could definitely tack it in place while the belt and houp are on the body -- which would allow a way to keep all those pleats even. You could make belt loops -- that's what I've done for my husband's houp. The men's houp belts often seem to be at the hip, and you *know* men's belts wouldn't magically stay put there! I belt my own houps tightly under the bust, and because I'm squishy, that works for me. But I am not sure it would work for everyone. There's a marvelous illustration at the USA National Gallery which shows a closeup of the top of a houp from 1410, which I recommend to everyone because it's so fascinating. Her belt seems to float magically over the top of her houp. http://www.nga.gov/collection/gallery/gg39/gg39-31.0.html -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pre Argent "Such virtue hath my pen...." -Shakespeare, Sonnet 81 "I knew this wasn't _my_ pen!" --Cynthia Virtue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 13:09:50 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83H9nYr021149 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:09:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83H9Wci098708 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:09:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83H9UqF084050; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:09:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83H9Qv8084026 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:09:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.50] (pool180-111.patriot.net [209.249.180.111]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3) with ESMTP id j83H9MJC011159 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:09:24 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:07:59 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fran wrote, >1950s dressmaking manuals told women they could make clothes that >would look just like RTW, so they didn't have to admit they home >sewed. I worked in a clothing store in the early 1980s (got to look at a lot of ready-made), and also took sewing/tailoring/design classes in college. The clothing we made was far better quality than most of the ready-to-wear available. I would still hear "You made that? I thought you bought it!", in the sense that people expected home-made to look bad. When in fact, because we were learning how to fit, we could see that the self-sewn clothing looked a lot better! Also by then I found that home sewing was more expensive than store-bought just for the materials. But I would have the fit and quality of clothing that was otherwise unavailable to me. This is also apparent for reenactment clothing. In eras of fitted clothing, some items that are sold off-the-rack at events do not look as good as something custom-made (whether by one's self or someone else). -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 13:10:52 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83HAqiB021155 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:10:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83HAN90098794 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:10:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83HAMl4084479; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:10:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83HAJrA084449 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:10:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-97.sonic.net [209.148.113.97]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83H9xEr020220 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:10:13 -0700 Message-ID: <4319D8E6.2040801@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 10:09:58 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] regional crinoline fashions References: <001301c5b0a2$3d4527a0$0600a8c0@genteelarts> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO BTW, my husband's answer to the question "What did hippies wear?" is "dense clouds of smoke." Fran Carol Kocian wrote: > > I was looking at the way certain eras of fashion are associated > with an area, which is different than what people were actually > wearing. It's not the reality, it's what we perceive based on movies, > popular culture, etc. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 14:05:21 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83I5LCb021600 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:05:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83Hxrtn002378 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:59:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83HxnQc005911; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:59:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Hxc9C005785 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:59:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-97.sonic.net [209.148.113.97]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83HxTt7004807 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:59:30 -0700 Message-ID: <4319E485.5020401@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 10:59:33 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm wondering, though, if anyone on h-costume is making RTW clothes for the boho market, perhaps selling on eBay? I'd think tiered crushed velvet gypsy skirts and tunics with bell sleeves might sell well this fall and winter. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com > > This is also apparent for reenactment clothing. In eras of > fitted clothing, some items that are sold off-the-rack at events do > not look as good as something custom-made (whether by one's self or > someone else). > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 14:11:35 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83IBYdo021672 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:11:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83I6B12002895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:06:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83I6A5u008628; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:06:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web42107.mail.yahoo.com (web42107.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.200]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j83I685o008579 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:06:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from faerieglenstudios@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 82725 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Sep 2005 18:06:03 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=ScHfLY9UcXKIOJ+cLr9SrzSRcm7a7hK1/aEl/aRAilFp1CPyrO55jKxtANthqQ/VVn01dPVw4cIxwy+J1iI+meNUwAbp6SvqJOiYVTLYAj5Naihm+yT/dY9iHx654r5cBSN+vg3GiS63lG2ZLdSBqY/hzEFKr7EFmJNKHDyMtAk= ; Message-ID: <20050903180603.82723.qmail@web42107.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [204.113.91.64] by web42107.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 11:06:03 PDT Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:06:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Jodi Nelson To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Good News/Storm updates X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny, I am so glad to hear of the wonderful progress being made in the areas your family is near. I cried as I read each post and showed my DH the photos you shared. I am still offering any help you feel is needed for your family personally, as I have donated for the general relief.A local quilt guild I am a member of was discussing how to help. We have decided to make quilts for those who will be relocating to Utah {I live in St.George; Utah's "Dixie"}as they will not be prepared for a Salt Lake City snowy winter. Jodi --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 14:20:18 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83IKIrS021753 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:20:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83IEjKT003336 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:14:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83IEfw9012221; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:14:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.131]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83IEbLS012184 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:14:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from genteelarts (oh-69-34-25-82.dyn.sprint-hsd.net [69.34.25.82]) by smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E12C32C01C for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:14:37 -0500 (CDT) From: "Carolann Schmitt" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] regional crinoline fashions Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:14:12 -0400 Organization: Genteel Arts Message-ID: <001b01c5b0b3$4eec7100$0600a8c0@genteelarts> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2670 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My apologies - I misunderstood what you were saying. :-) Carolann Schmitt On Behalf Of Carol Kocian I was looking at the way certain eras of fashion are associated with an area, which is different than what people were actually wearing. It's not the reality, it's what we perceive based on movies, popular culture, etc. Hippies were everywhere, but now identified with Berkeley. Black hats with buckles on them were not the fashion at Plymouth, Mass, but they're all over the souvenir shops. I'm imagining a "what city is this" sort of thing based on the historic costume icons. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 14:56:01 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Iu0hr022027 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:56:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83Isq8W005913 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:54:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Iso0Z028621; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:54:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id j83IskBH028597 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:54:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 16057 invoked from network); 3 Sep 2005 19:32:02 -0000 Received: from [209.142.2.163] (HELO www.inreach.com) (209.142.2.163) by smtp.inreach.com (qpsmtpd/0.28) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 12:32:02 -0700 Received: from 67.188.164.116 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by www.inreach.com with HTTP; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:54:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1040.67.188.164.116.1125773686.squirrel@www.inreach.com> In-Reply-To: References: Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 11:54:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] New to me Eleonora of Toledo From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > Sorry for the cross post. > > I was looking for a copy of the Wedding at Cana by Allesandro Allori to > look > at Catherine de Medici's dress and found this instead. Ever since I made > my > first "Eleonora" dress from Janet Arnold's book I have found her > fascinating. I know the above URL is ridiculously long but snipurl > doesn't > want anything to do with it. It is a portrait of Eleonora in the > Hermitage > collection. It is unlike any portrait of her that I've see, but Allori > was > a fosterling of Bronzino so he might have had some sittings. The dress is > fantastic! Wanda, Could you give us a "how to get there" instead? I can't use the URL but if you said "go to the _____ website and hit the ____ button, etc" I could navigate to it myself.... Thanks! Diana > > > Wanda Pease/Regina Romsey > Never attribute to malice what can as easily > be attributed to simple social ineptness > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > www.RenaissanceFabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 14:59:05 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Ix5DS022058 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:59:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83IwiTr006184 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:58:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Iwiml030058; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:58:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83IwdCj030017 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:58:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j83IrUjf029797 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:53:30 -0400 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:53:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4319F25D.3010105@thibault.org> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:58:37 -0400 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "h-costume@indra.com" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 1968 SCA views of medieval clothing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi H-Costume, You may remember a few months back that I was in pursuit of a legendary statement about how ugly real medieval clothes were said to be by folks teaching early SCAers how to dress. The East Kingdom Historian was kind enough to give me a copy of: ********************* "A Handbook of the Current Middle Ages" 1968, for Baycon -- this was the only demo at that time. Some excerpts from the clothing section, which is about six pages long: Please note that my tailoring instructions are not completely authentic. If this offends you, there are many texts available for more accurate patterns. A truly authentic dress is likely to appear clumsy to the modern eye. Old bedspreads, especially the sort with scalloped edges, frequently make fine dresses. The ones with scalloped edges make hemming unnecessary and so save time in sewing. Knit fabrics hang nicely in dresses, but tend to lose their shapes in banners. ********************** Now, please note that one of the areas which has seen a HUGE amount of study in the past dozen years of the SCA has been in clothing. I'm not trying to make rude fun of the writer, or the early SCA folks here, but it is interesting to see what was advised in those early days. Whatever the method, the pictures I've seen from those times (mostly courtesy of the West Kingdom History Project website) are charming and medieval-looking. As far as I know, there were not any "texts available for more accurate patterns" despite what the writer had said -- at least, not by our 21st century standards -- but if some of you who were doing historical sewing in the 60s knew of any, please do post! The amazing detail in the Museum of London books only came out some dozen years ago, propagated by devoted folks like Mistress Tangwystl (Heather Rose Jones) and Robin Netherton, and with it, an astonishing realization by the archeological community that there were re-enactment hobbyists who might want to buy their journals. And then hobbyists draping fabric and trying to figure out the fabric tech of the Middle Ages -- not assuming that a set-in sleeve was of course what you did for a tunic, and so on. (Note that the writer of this section does say that darts and set-in sleeves are "recent" inventions, but the included patterns include them anyway.) A last detail: the writer calls a sideless surcoat a "cotehardie." These days, that's what we call the fitted gown which goes under a woman's sideless surcoat, unless we're being really precise, and then we clothing-wonks call it a Gothic Fitted Dress. (There was another site with pictures, but it's offline at the moment.) -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pre Argent "Such virtue hath my pen...." -Shakespeare, Sonnet 81 "I knew this wasn't _my_ pen!" --Cynthia Virtue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 15:22:01 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83JM0OW022304 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:22:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83JKMPS007819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:20:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JKKhk038987; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:20:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JKHWF038959 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:20:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKoyl-1EBdYm0IpE-000686; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:20:16 -0400 Message-ID: <000a01c5b0bc$83a78020$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20050903180603.82723.qmail@web42107.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Good News/Storm updates Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:20:15 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Jodi, Thank you for your help. This has been a sad, sad, situation. But good things are occurring daily. You might want to contact your local Red Cross. They are coordinating the people moving into other areas of the country. I talked with the chair of our local chapter and he said they can use all the local help they can get. They had a crash training course. Please give your quilt guild our heart felt thanks. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 15:28:25 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83JSP0R022380 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:28:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83JRrfW008253 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:27:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JRqMW041802; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:27:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JRm0M041770 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:27:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1EBdg245yT-0005ps; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:27:46 -0400 Message-ID: <002d01c5b0bd$906590d0$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20050903180603.82723.qmail@web42107.mail.yahoo.com> <000a01c5b0bc$83a78020$6800a8c0@Penny> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Good News/Storm updates Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:27:45 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am sorry, I thought I had sent that off-list. My apologies. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 15:31:02 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83JV2V4022407 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:31:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83JUjRh008378 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:30:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JUiPf043046; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:30:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1b.socket.net [216.106.88.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JUgMk043028 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:30:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDE4F40079 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:30:41 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 92FCCC49C for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:30:41 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] collages and hurricane relief Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:30:54 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well to cover my posting of Univ. of MO. Univ. of MO, Columbia has a textile college (Human Environment Sciences) and a theatre college. Stephens College near by which has a major enrollment and focus with costuming and textiles may join the ranks of assistance to students. De -----Original Message----- There are many colleges and universities offering to accept students from hurricane areas, so unless people are talking about schools with a costume/theatre/textile program, I don't think they all need to be sent to the list. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 16:00:00 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83K00Z9022780 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:00:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83JxZUV009923 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:59:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JxXYP053937; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:59:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from host101.apollohosting.com (host101.apollohosting.com [209.239.35.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JxUhr053916 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:59:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from [192.168.1.3] (71-35-65-29.phnx.qwest.net [71.35.65.29]) by host101.apollohosting.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83JxTbv019613 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:59:30 -0400 Message-ID: <431A00A9.5040806@msn.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 12:59:37 -0700 From: WickedFrau User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I missed the first post. What is RTW??? I used to never buy any clothing because I would always think..."I can make that." But of course I rarely got around to it. Then another sewing friend of mine set me straight. "Never make anything you can buy-only make those things that you can't buy." Thats has been my new motto for several years now, and has suited me well since I spend most of my sewing time doing historic stuff! You were lucky that you learned how to fit and sew. Most folks I know now only learned how to sew. If they didn't have a pattern for it, forget it...and I was never taught how to adjust a pattern as a younster sewing. I picked all that up much later. Sg Carol Kocian wrote: > > Fran wrote, > >> 1950s dressmaking manuals told women they could make clothes that >> would look just like RTW, so they didn't have to admit they home sewed. > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 16:02:39 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83K2cg8022809 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:02:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83K2FEf010085 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:02:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83K2E4A055007; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:02:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from host101.apollohosting.com (host101.apollohosting.com [209.239.35.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83K2B0R054953 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:02:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from [192.168.1.3] (71-35-65-29.phnx.qwest.net [71.35.65.29]) by host101.apollohosting.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83K2Abv024193 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:02:10 -0400 Message-ID: <431A014A.3010109@msn.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:02:18 -0700 From: WickedFrau User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume References: <001301c5b0a2$3d4527a0$0600a8c0@genteelarts> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Woven a disposition? was: regional crinoline fashions X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What does this mean? Sg > > One of the most stunning original dresses I've seen is in the > collection of the Cincinnati Art Museum: a bright sapphire blue silk > taffeta woven a disposition, originally from Gettysburg, PA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 16:06:33 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83K6WmB022831 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:06:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83K6F2j010300 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:06:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83K6EOA056544; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:06:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1b.socket.net [216.106.88.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83K6BOS056498 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:06:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38B023FBB8 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:06:11 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id EECF214D6D for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:06:10 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] New to me Eleonora of Toledo Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:06:24 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.hermitagemuseum.org click on English go to quick search and type in A.Alessandro, click on go scroll down to the paintings, click on "next 5-16 matches" click on "next 17 - 28 matches". scroll down to #25 You probably have seen this. Someone has it on their website. Eleanor has a high collared cream dress with a light teal sleeveless overdress that has red and gold embroidery on it. I like this site as you can zoom in much better. Her dress is pleated w/red and green braid holding it in place w/matching pleated sleeves. Wonderful details. De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 16:19:08 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83KJ7Wm022944 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:19:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83KIhg6011241 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:18:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KIgV6061395; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:18:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1b.socket.net [216.106.88.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KIdiS061376 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:18:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03CC3401A3 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:18:39 -0500 (CDT) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id C4ED914D13 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:18:38 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] New to me Eleonora of Toledo Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:18:52 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm not sure what happened but the number switched. It is now #22. De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 16:21:49 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83KLmWf023005 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:21:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83KLUc5011407 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:21:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KLT0G062483; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:21:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jade.spiritone.com (jade.aracnet.com [216.99.193.136]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KJdIb061803 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:19:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by jade.spiritone.com (8.13.4/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j83KJXud025771 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:19:38 -0700 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] New to me Eleonora of Toledo Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:28:26 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <1040.67.188.164.116.1125773686.squirrel@www.inreach.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1506 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Pardon me if this looks patronizing. It isn't. I am putting these down as I try it out, hoping it works. I should have done it this way in the first place instead of plastering that ridiculous URL in my message (it was late - hangs head) Go to http://www.hermitagemuseum.org/html_En/index.html go to Digital Collection http://www.hermitagemuseum.org/fcgi-bin/db2www/browse.mac/category?selLang=E nglish Choose Paintings beside the search box. Then click Browse by Artist. Go down the list until you see Allori, Allesandro. There are two pictures and Eleonora is the lady in peacock blue with her hair very close to her head. You can put in Allori in the Quick search box but that brings up a number of works in other media that aren't necessarily relevant. Regina Romsey OL, OP, Drachenwald/East, Now Proud Resident of the Laurel Kingdom of AnTir and the Pacific NorthWet > Wanda, > > Could you give us a "how to get there" instead? I can't use the URL but > if you said "go to the _____ website and hit the ____ button, etc" I could > navigate to it myself.... > > Thanks! > > Diana > > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 16:22:04 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83KM3Vx023010 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:22:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83KLiRC011436 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:21:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KLhQ4062567; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:21:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpauth04.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth04.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KKe0b062189 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:20:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from heather.jones@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=DPJGRP4dTfSxUBZ/Mv9JXXS4OSkP2lGdPGkQoYflKbZ+eTw2WLzigh6fZbCAxXYx; h=Received:Mime-Version:X-Sender:Message-Id:In-Reply-To:References:Date:To:From:Subject:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [67.101.97.45] (helo=[10.0.1.3]) by smtpauth04.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1EBeVD-0008Fx-MW for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 16:20:39 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: heather.jones@earthlink.net@earthlink.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20050903165428.33122.qmail@web52809.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20050903165428.33122.qmail@web52809.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:21:36 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] belted houppelandes Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-ELNK-Trace: c920284270743d76aa459df8244ac33774bf435c0eb9d4780ee233803547b910e411024af1e562727fdc682fe2517d03350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 67.101.97.45 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 9:54 AM -0700 9/3/05, Kathryn Parke wrote: >Could someone walk me through the process of belting a houppelande >just below the bustline? How did they keep the belts there, without >having it "walk" itself down to the natural waistline? Was it >tacked in places, and if so, wouldn't that interfere with the drape? >And how were they fastened in back -- buckled, tied, pinned? This >is for a stage costume, "accuracy" isn't the primary goal (don't >hate me!) -- I want that look, but I'm not sure how best to achieve >it. Although this isn't a style that I wear very often (except for the masculine version with the more natural belt-line), my experience has been that if your belt is wide and relatively stiff, e.g., made from oak-tan leather, then if you buckle it rather snugly just under the breasts, the lower edge will ride right around where your waist starts flaring to the hips. (Women with a relatively long waist or narrow hips will have a different experience than me.) If you remember that the fashionable silhouette of the time included a gently rounded belly, it seems plausible that this method may have been part of how it worked. Another factor may be that if your gown fabric is relatively heavy (as seems to be the case from how it is depicted) and the gown is relatively flared (ditto), then the change in volume of fabric between the upper and lower edges of the belt may also help keep it from slipping downwards. Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones heather.jones@earthlink.net ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 16:35:37 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83KZbDc023101 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:35:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83KZ3VH012303 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:35:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KZ27Q067875; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:35:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com [64.41.126.131]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KYw8T067838 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:35:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from genteelarts (oh-69-34-25-82.dyn.sprint-hsd.net [69.34.25.82]) by smtpauth00.csee.siteprotect.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA07732C01D for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:34:57 -0500 (CDT) From: "Carolann Schmitt" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Woven a disposition? Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:34:32 -0400 Organization: Genteel Arts Message-ID: <001e01c5b0c6$e9e55060$0600a8c0@genteelarts> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 In-Reply-To: <431A014A.3010109@msn.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2670 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id j83KYw8T067838 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fabrics that are woven or printed "a disposition" are designed for a particular use or particular area in a garment, frequently along one edge of a flounce. (Our modern border prints are a distant cousin.) They were particularly popular during the mid-late 1850s, when the technology was at its peak. In addition to printed or woven designs, they were also made with trimmings - braids or fringe - woven into the edge of the fabric; and were often sold with matching or coordinating plain fabric and/or other trimmins. Some were produced with the pattern along the lengthwise edge; others had the pattern produced crosswise. Here are some links to just a few examples of dresses made from these fabrics: http://www.bowesmuseum.org.uk/collections/image.php3?Name=Woman%27s+Dress&im age=1989-4-3-cst-2-793.jpg http://www.zum.de/Faecher/G/BW/Landeskunde/schwaben/schloesser/ludwigsburg/m ode/rundgang/krinolin01.htm http://images.vam.ac.uk/images/photo/sch/20030207/high/1089-003.jpg http://www.mfa.org/collections/search_art.asp?recview=true&id=458194&coll_ke ywords=dress&coll_package=0&coll_start=561 Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 2-5, 2006 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83KvgDg023274 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:57:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83KvKbe013819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:57:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KvJMC076203; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:57:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KvGRp076141 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:57:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (unknown [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 086563B5FF for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:57:10 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:57:43 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> <4319E485.5020401@lavoltapress.com> In-Reply-To: <4319E485.5020401@lavoltapress.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lavolta Press wrote: > I'm wondering, though, if anyone on h-costume is making RTW clothes for > the boho market, perhaps selling on eBay? I'd think tiered crushed > velvet gypsy skirts and tunics with bell sleeves might sell well this > fall and winter. I can't compete with China, unfortunately. The RTW being imported is selling for less than my cost of materials. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:01:37 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83L1ao0023305 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:01:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83L1Fc1014100 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:01:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L1DLV077802; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:01:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L19te077766 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:01:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-85.sonic.net [209.148.113.85]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L17p3006664 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:01:08 -0700 Message-ID: <431A0F17.40007@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:01:11 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> <431A00A9.5040806@msn.com> In-Reply-To: <431A00A9.5040806@msn.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO RTW=Ready-to-wear. I've pretty much quit making modern fashion clothes. My motto is, as well as making what I can't buy, to only buy things that I find interesting, as a process, to make. So I do almost exclusively historic clothes now . . . and, since I'm short, a lot of alterations of modern RTW. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com WickedFrau wrote: > I missed the first post. What is RTW??? > > I used to never buy any clothing because I would always think..."I can > make that." But of course I rarely got around to it. Then another > sewing friend of mine set me straight. "Never make anything you can > buy-only make those things that you can't buy." Thats has been my new > motto for several years now, and has suited me well since I spend most > of my sewing time doing historic stuff! > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:03:56 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83L3tgM023338 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:03:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83L3XE6014263 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:03:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L3Wsd078807; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:03:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L3U5N078781 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:03:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-85.sonic.net [209.148.113.85]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L3SvA007108 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:03:29 -0700 Message-ID: <431A0FA4.6060901@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:03:32 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Woven a disposition? was: regional crinoline fashions References: <001301c5b0a2$3d4527a0$0600a8c0@genteelarts> <431A014A.3010109@msn.com> In-Reply-To: <431A014A.3010109@msn.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A disposition means with a pattern printed or woven in, to be arranged a certain way when making the garment. For example, you can get modern "border" fabrics, with a special border intended to be used at the bottom of a skirt. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com WickedFrau wrote: > What does this mean? > Sg > >> >> One of the most stunning original dresses I've seen is in the >> collection of the Cincinnati Art Museum: a bright sapphire blue silk >> taffeta woven a disposition, originally from Gettysburg, PA > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:08:02 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83L82AE023387 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:08:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83L7cYm014468 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:07:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L7cTr080327; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:07:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L7WSW080301 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:07:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-85.sonic.net [209.148.113.85]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83L7Upu007906 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:07:31 -0700 Message-ID: <431A1097.3040101@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:07:35 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> <4319E485.5020401@lavoltapress.com> <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> In-Reply-To: <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It can be really amazing. I've been buying cotton gauze skirts from a Thai seller whose eBay ID is aonneo. He (or she? I can't figure out the gender from the name) sells them for as low as $8 apiece, never more than $15. It depends on the skirt style and how well the auctions are going. Shipping is very reasonable too, less than I've paid many eBay sellers for shipping within the US. And fast, and efficient. BUT, those are all thin cotton skirts . . . and I'm looking for velvet for fall/winter. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com Dawn wrote: > Lavolta Press wrote: > >> I'm wondering, though, if anyone on h-costume is making RTW clothes >> for the boho market, perhaps selling on eBay? I'd think tiered >> crushed velvet gypsy skirts and tunics with bell sleeves might sell >> well this fall and winter. > > > > I can't compete with China, unfortunately. The RTW being imported is > selling for less than my cost of materials. > > > Dawn > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:10:49 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LAml1023413 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LAXFD014579 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LAWfQ081399; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LASqP081357 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83LANmU013026 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:23 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LACFh083218 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:27 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:54:37 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes In-Reply-To: <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >1950s dressmaking manuals told women they could make clothes that would >look just like RTW, so they didn't have to admit they home sewed. It was a big day in my brother's life when he stopped letting my mother sew his shirts for him. That was about 1964. >Then, in the late 1960s and early 1970s, there was a "counterculture" >reaction against things manufactured by the "establishment," including >clothing, food, and many other things. People took up not only home >sewing (see _The Illustrated Hassle-Free Make Your Own Clothes Book_), but >bread baking (see the _Tassajara Bread Book_), organic gardening, candle >making, and lots of other crafts. The emphasis was not only on doing it >yourself, but on _not_ imitating "plastic" ready-made clothes, supermarket >food, etc. Many completely inexperienced people were experimenting with >various crafts; and inexperience, as well as a "go with the flow" >attitude, led to many original approaches. That's when Hippies started embroidering their blue jeans and wearing ethnic garments. >And by the 1980s, some people had become very skilled, in fact >professional, at patchwork, free-form crochet, and lots of other >things. (The Tassajara bakery morphed into the very expensive, >sophisticated, gourmet vegetarian restaurant Greens.) They published and >taught about new approaches and techniques they'd developed. Companies >like Folkwear were founded. Banks bought enormous fiber art hangings for >their lobbies. It was very hip to study "fiber arts" in college (not >usually sewing, but weaving, spinning, crochet, embroidery, and such). You must live in Northern CA. >The modern reenactment movement (I'm excluding things like Victorian >costume balls and jousts when I say "modern") also, I believe, got its >start as part of the counterculture. The SCA started as a bunch of >hippies who enjoyed dressing in colorful clothes and evolved into a much >larger organization with much more complicated goals. Ren. Faires started in the early 1960s, and their founder coined the term "living history". >Still, there was a lot of DIY, which I don't think I'm seeing currently as >a mainstream movement. "Wearable art", while not being exactly mainstream is at least common. Places like Michael's craft stores carry supplies for making wearable art, and a few kits for the same. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:10:55 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LAssl023417 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LAWfp014574 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LAVBT081388; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LAR87081355 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83LALmU013014 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:22 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LACFd083218 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:25 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903132748.03420770@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:43:28 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: RE: [h-cost] Eras and places (was hippies) In-Reply-To: <001001c5b09f$29be6780$0600a8c0@genteelarts> References: <4319C1D5.4080104@optonline.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I did some extensive research on mid-19th century skirt supports (corded >petticoats, cage and covered crinolines, etc.) for a presentation last year. >Based on manufacturing and sales records, crinolines were widely available >and worn anywhere in the country, including the far west. This is amply >supported by original photographs, extant crinolines, and commentary in >period magazines, newspapers, letters and journals. The average retail price >for a crinoline c. 1855-1865 was $0.25-$2.00 each, depending on the overall >style and the number of steels. > >Documentation indicates that the style spread quite rapidly across the >country - within a few months at most. Our Gold Rush started in 1849. In the circular-skirt-support period there were substantially fewer women in California, per capita, than in other parts of the country. So fewer circular-skirt-supports were being worn. (This includes Chinese and Hispanic women, who were also few and far between, and much less likely to wear circular-skirt-supports anyway.) Circular-skirt-supports were less common because women were less common. As the years went by more women arrived, increasing their percentage of the population. But by like 1870 very few, if any, women were still wearing circular-skirt-supports. My point being that women in hoop skirts never became part of the Gold Rush image. Men wearing Levis did, to the extent that there's one on the California State Seal. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:10:56 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LAtSV023420 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LAVxD014571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LAUcA081380; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LARwH081354 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83LAKmU013006 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:22 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LACFb083218 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:22 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903131125.033da448@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:26:45 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Eras and places (was hippies) In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Kayta said, >>Berkeley, CA, and the 1960s. You see aging Hippies, and ones whose >>parents were barely born in the 1960s, on the streets in Berkeley, CA, >>even today. > > I have an "ageing" hippie next door who just turned 40. :-) Do you > think, though, that the hippie styles in Berkeley are only due to the > area, or because kids like the style again? Maybe a bit of both? I > agree, though that the hippie look says Berkeley or Haight Ashbury. (Is > that in Berkeley?) Or Woodstock, which is not close at all. :-) Haight Ashbury (or "the Haight") is the name of the area around the intersection of Haight Street and Ashbury Street in San Francisco. In my sartorial opinion, people today are more likely to wear Hippie clothes in Berkeley than in San Francisco, even people too young to have been Hippies the first time. In the San Francisco Bay Area, Hippie clothes say Berkeley rather than San Francisco, to the locals. The Haight Ashbury neighborhood has moved on beyond Hippie things, mostly, and is a mixture of gentrification and modern street kids. A mile downhill on Haight Street ("the Lower Haight"), things are more Hippie-like and more young-artist driven. Telegraph Avenue in Berkeley, a street dead-ending at the U.C.Berkeley campus, is another mix of gentrification and modern young people, but there's a daily street fair of sidewalk crafts booths that adds a distinct Hippie flavor to the area. More than one of these booths sells tie-dye shirts and other tie-dye items. A few sell bead jewelry. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:11:05 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LB48x023423 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:11:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LAgJ8014617 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LAfPc081480; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LATHw081363 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83LAOmU013050 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:24 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LACFj083218 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:28 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903135819.0253f2b0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:03:57 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1968 SCA views of medieval clothing In-Reply-To: <4319F25D.3010105@thibault.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >As far as I know, there were not any "texts available for more accurate >patterns" despite what the writer had said -- at least, not by our 21st >century standards -- but if some of you who were doing historical sewing >in the 60s knew of any, please do post! Hill and Bucknell's The Evolution of Fashion was published in 1969. It was intended for theatrical use rather than strict historical recreation, but at least it came with patterns. I joined the SCA in 1971 and was an anomaly because I already owned Davenport's costume book and tried to recreate costumes from in there. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:13:30 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LDTIp023458 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:13:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LD8MO014930 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LD8Oa082641; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JSDJE041982 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:28:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-97.sonic.net [209.148.113.97]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JSBuk022094 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:28:12 -0700 Message-ID: <4319F94F.6070609@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 12:28:15 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1968 SCA views of medieval clothing References: <4319F25D.3010105@thibault.org> In-Reply-To: <4319F25D.3010105@thibault.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Norris's books were all under heavy pirated/photocopy circulation in the SCA for many years. Norah Waugh's books "start" a bit past SCA period but were all originally published from the mid 1960s to 1970. Janet Arnold's _/Patterns of Fashion 1: Englishwomen's Dresses and Their Construction 1660–1860_ also "starts" past SCA period but was published in the early 1970s. Despite the "late" dates, all Waugh's books and the Arnold one I mentioned were popular with "serious" SCA costumers from fairly early on. //Karl Kohler's _A History of Costume_ (with patterns) was first published in the 1920s and was reprinted by Dover as early as 1963. Whatever you think of the "authenticity" of these books, their intention is more "serious" than a brochure on constructing a beginning T-tunic just to look acceptable at events. I've never been a member of the SCA, but I've known quite a lot of them. Renaissance Faires, BTW, are another outgrowth of the "hippie" movement. //Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com / > > > As far as I know, there were not any "texts available for more > accurate patterns" despite what the writer had said -- at least, not > by our 21st century standards -- but if some of you who were doing > historical sewing in the 60s knew of any, please do post! > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:13:47 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LDlRW023464 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:13:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LDJAg014982 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LDJ76082749; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JwLPr053592 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:58:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-114-95.sonic.net [209.148.114.95]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JwECs027843 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:58:14 -0700 Message-ID: <431A005A.9050205@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 12:58:18 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My grandmother used to make hippie crocheted vests and such for my cousin Donna (who is some years older than I am). Donna was obsessed with clothes, but never sewed (her mother made all her enormous wardrobe) or crocheted (my grandmother did that). Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com >I reply: >Huh. My first encounters with fiber-arts came with my >grandmother (now 79); I doubt she'd enjoy being called >a hippie (but i won't tell) ;-) > > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:13:47 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LDljR023465 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:13:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LDNhp014999 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LDNLV082791; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.205]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83K9vf0057831 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:09:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kristalori@gmail.com) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 55so639661wri for ; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:09:52 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=TZn2xmSZI2umiR+R/u8aCoTFV4JYANsBLTDUYD1hGN0aQVuj+5mZyrZZqXOiVwzrJuAahFIBF6m0eUYxAMcnqegYCSPA05IQSV9NxCyJw6M1+v3nfprHC5ryKhpbdO8trYPWL29tnMtkzOQ7XebHaw+1CakCTdGeCfldUGfgLWk= Received: by 10.54.34.20 with SMTP id h20mr367383wrh; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:09:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.105.6 with HTTP; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:09:52 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <7164eae905090313094c7d1972@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:09:52 -0400 From: Jacqueline Johnson To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes In-Reply-To: <431A00A9.5040806@msn.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> <431A00A9.5040806@msn.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j83LDljR023465 Status: RO Read To Wear. I make a lot of my own clothes. In fact I'm getting to make a wiggle dress. A lot of people in the goth and FrUiTs movement do their own clothes. DIY clothing is really making a heavy duty stand. I just wrote a really short blurb on it for my own zine I produce. Bice On 9/3/05, WickedFrau wrote: > > I missed the first post. What is RTW??? > > I used to never buy any clothing because I would always think..."I can > make that." But of course I rarely got around to it. Then another > sewing friend of mine set me straight. "Never make anything you can > buy-only make those things that you can't buy." Thats has been my new > motto for several years now, and has suited me well since I spend most > of my sewing time doing historic stuff! > > You were lucky that you learned how to fit and sew. Most folks I know > now only learned how to sew. If they didn't have a pattern for it, > forget it...and I was never taught how to adjust a pattern as a younster > sewing. I picked all that up much later. > > Sg > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:13:47 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LDl0Q023466 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:13:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LDEA1014961 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LDDvG082693; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [217.160.230.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83JcKLp045920 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:38:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from pcp0010981916pcs.centrl01.va.comcast.net [68.57.35.138] (helo=Penny) by mrelay.perfora.net with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKp2t-1EBdqF2BhC-0006U7; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:38:19 -0400 Message-ID: <004701c5b0bf$099048a0$6800a8c0@Penny> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009001c5b047$1d30ef40$6800a8c0@Penny> Subject: Re: [h-cost] colleges and hurricane relief Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:38:18 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Provags-ID: perfora.net abuse@perfora.net login:3d9d98f5735ac15b24f809ddf014658e X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carol, I am compiling a listing of college with theater and fashion related that are accepting students. I am looking for the schools to fill in specific information that a student would need to know. I will be posting the listing to my site early in the week. I am asking each school listing to have a contact person who can co-ordinate the transfer. The last thing these students need is to play telephone tag and go through miles of red tape. If you all sincerely want to help with this project, please contact me off-list. The transferring students will need people to pick them up at airports, help find houses, etc. We hope to be co-coordinating with the Red Cross. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery, www.costumegallery.com Costume Classroom, www.costumeclassroom.com Costume Research Library, www.costumelibrary.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:13:49 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LDng0023473 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:13:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LDWtk015032 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LDVFg082877; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LAREN081356 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:10:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83LAMmU013018 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:22 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LACFf083218 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:10:26 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903134406.0253f5e8@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:45:58 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Eras and places (was hippies) In-Reply-To: References: <4319C1D5.4080104@optonline.net> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <001201c5afed$b4b1d370$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002501c5b01c$a8879d80$6800a8c0@Penny> <4.3.1.2.20050902190715.03dd2cf8@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050902203903.0264bdb0@mail.frys.com> <4319C1D5.4080104@optonline.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Perhaps we have Scarlett O'Hara to thank for the hoopskirts, > especially the barer evening dress worn at the picnic. :-) If you mean that ruffly short-sleeved white dress, I found the historical image they must have taken that costume from. It was one of the hardest things I ever did, shifting gears in my head to accept that one as actually period. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:13:51 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LDomf023477 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:13:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LDRPZ015015 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LDRYq082830; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:13:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83KUO0w066229 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:30:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA13042 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:52:20 -0500 Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:52:17 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] belted houppelandes In-Reply-To: <20050903165428.33122.qmail@web52809.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sat, 3 Sep 2005, Kathryn Parke wrote: > Could someone walk me through the process of belting a houppelande > just below the bustline? How did they keep the belts there, without > having it "walk" itself down to the natural waistline? In addition to the good advice already given, I've found it's essential to be wearing an underdress that provides the right lift to the bust (meaning high, contained, and stable). That way you don't have the pressure from the bust pressing down on the belt, and you don't get any unattractive flop of the bust over the belt. The belt's job is not to raise the bust, but simply to contain the folds of the houppelande. Alas, I've seen many people who think that if the houppelande covers everything, they can get away without the underdress. It's not a pretty sight. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:18:34 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LIYI5023516 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:18:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LID1d015264 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:18:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LICe3084556; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:18:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LI9Bv084533 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:18:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout7-ext.prodigy.net (pimout7-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.147]) by ylpvm15.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83LIJxH017712 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:18:19 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout7-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LI3r0250982 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:18:08 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903141049.0253fb40@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:16:50 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: RE: [h-cost] Woven a disposition? In-Reply-To: <001e01c5b0c6$e9e55060$0600a8c0@genteelarts> References: <431A014A.3010109@msn.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Fabrics that are woven or printed "a disposition" are designed for a >particular use or particular area in a garment, frequently along one edge of >a flounce. (Our modern border prints are a distant cousin.) They were >particularly popular during the mid-late 1850s, when the technology was at >its peak. The modern equivalent of this is the "border print", printed with a design along one edge, for use in making skirts or curtains. Then there are printed lengths of fabric intended for making things like vests or aprons, where all the pieces come printed on the fabric ready to cut out and sew. Some Daisy Kingdom fabric is printed in such a way that you can make a cute little girl's dress with different parts of the printed design in different places. And some saree fabric comes with an extra piece at one end, woven or printed to match, intended for making a choli (under-blouse). CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:21:17 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LLHwj023528 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:21:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LL1aH015406 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:21:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LL0Xh085684; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:21:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LKvdw085668 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:20:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from pimout7-ext.prodigy.net (pimout7-int.prodigy.net [207.115.4.147]) by ylpvm15.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83LL7xH020283 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:21:07 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by pimout7-ext.prodigy.net (8.13.4 outbound domainkey aix/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LKuBX060184 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:20:57 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903141851.0265de20@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:20:50 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes In-Reply-To: <431A1097.3040101@lavoltapress.com> References: <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> <4319E485.5020401@lavoltapress.com> <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >BUT, those are all thin cotton skirts . . . and I'm looking for velvet for >fall/winter. Does it make sense to layer one of these over what would amount to a petticoat underneath? The underskirt would keep you warm and the over skirt would look nice for both of them. I'm not usually a skirt-wearer, so I don't know. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:24:54 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LOref023569 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:24:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LNPUG015680 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:23:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LNO7p086627; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:23:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from tomts22-srv.bellnexxia.net (tomts22.bellnexxia.net [209.226.175.184]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LNIWm086595 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:23:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from janetpaine@sympatico.ca) Received: from jptwr001 ([65.95.122.79]) by tomts22-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.10 201-253-122-130-110-20040306) with SMTP id <20050903212317.USLZ21470.tomts22-srv.bellnexxia.net@jptwr001> for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:23:17 -0400 Message-ID: <004601c5b0cd$b36a9ca0$0400a8c0@jptwr001> From: "Janet Paine" To: References: <200509031651.j83GpdwV074385@net.indra.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:23:16 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 4, Issue 564 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 12:51 PM Subject: h-costume Digest, Vol 4, Issue 564 > Send h-costume mailing list submissions to > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > h-costume-request@mail.indra.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > h-costume-owner@mail.indra.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of h-costume digest..." > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Today's Topics: > > 1. Bjarne (Lalah) > 2. Eras and places (was hippies) (Carol Kocian) > 3. Re: Bjarne (Chris) > 4. Re: Eras and places (was hippies) (J Schueller) > 5. RE: Eras and places (was hippies) (Carolann Schmitt) > 6. Re: Eras and places (was hippies) (Carol Kocian) > 7. regional crinoline fashions (Carolann Schmitt) > 8. Re: collages and hurricane relief (Althea Turner) > 9. Re: collages and hurricane relief (Susan B. Farmer) > 10. Re: Bjarne (ruthanneb@mindspring.com) > 11. Re: Bjarne (Susan B. Farmer) > 12. Re: regional crinoline fashions (Carol Kocian) > 13. Re: fiber arts and making vs buying clothes (Lavolta Press) > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:33:30 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LXUNU023652 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:33:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LX0oD016272 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:33:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LWxiE090190; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:32:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LWuSO090166 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:32:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-234.sonic.net [209.148.113.234]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LWsZm001925 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:32:55 -0700 Message-ID: <431A168B.7@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:32:59 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > Ren. Faires started in the early 1960s, and their founder coined the > term "living history". Wasn't there some early connection with the SCA? > >> Still, there was a lot of DIY, which I don't think I'm seeing >> currently as a mainstream movement. > > > "Wearable art", while not being exactly mainstream is at least > common. Places like Michael's craft stores carry supplies for making > wearable art, and a few kits for the same. > > But what do you call "wearable art"? I'd say it's something more avant-garde, or arty, than a nice but mainstream hand-knitted sweater. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:33:56 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LXuuK023656 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:33:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LXdHx016328 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:33:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LXcnE090431; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:33:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LXZLp090384 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:33:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (unknown [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C07C13B5FE for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:33:30 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <431A16CC.2060605@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 16:34:04 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> <4319E485.5020401@lavoltapress.com> <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> <431A1097.3040101@lavoltapress.com> In-Reply-To: <431A1097.3040101@lavoltapress.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://snipurl.com/hf4r $8. You couldn't buy the fabric for that little, never mind the work involved. http://snipurl.com/hf4t $24. Still a steal. Dawn Lavolta Press wrote: > > BUT, those are all thin cotton skirts . . . and I'm looking for velvet > for fall/winter. > > Fran > Lavolta Press > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > Dawn wrote: > >> Lavolta Press wrote: >> >>> I'm wondering, though, if anyone on h-costume is making RTW clothes >>> for the boho market, perhaps selling on eBay? I'd think tiered >>> crushed velvet gypsy skirts and tunics with bell sleeves might sell >>> well this fall and winter. >> >> >> >> >> I can't compete with China, unfortunately. The RTW being imported is >> selling for less than my cost of materials. >> _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:35:45 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LZi8G023670 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:35:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LZUSN016620 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:35:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LZTvR091289; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:35:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LZQf0091261 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:35:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-113-234.sonic.net [209.148.113.234]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LZOpY012798 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:35:25 -0700 Message-ID: <431A1721.7070802@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:35:29 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes References: <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> <4319E485.5020401@lavoltapress.com> <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> <4.3.1.2.20050903141851.0265de20@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050903141851.0265de20@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've been thinking about layering the cotton ones, yes. Although, as you guessed, I live in northern CA--San Francisco. I believe it's been established that it was not Mark Twain who said that "the coldest winter he ever spent was a summer in San Francisco," _somebody_ clearly did. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > >> BUT, those are all thin cotton skirts . . . and I'm looking for >> velvet for fall/winter. > > > Does it make sense to layer one of these over what would amount to a > petticoat underneath? The underskirt would keep you warm and the over > skirt would look nice for both of them. I'm not usually a > skirt-wearer, so I don't know. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:39:20 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LdJ7L023698 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:39:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83Lcvsc016881 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:38:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Lct1D092626; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:38:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LcqtJ092592 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:38:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j83LXejf030861 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:33:40 -0400 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 17:33:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <431A17E7.6070109@thibault.org> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 17:38:47 -0400 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1968 SCA views of medieval clothing References: <4319F25D.3010105@thibault.org> <4319F94F.6070609@lavoltapress.com> In-Reply-To: <4319F94F.6070609@lavoltapress.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lavolta Press wrote: > Whatever you think of the "authenticity" of these books, their intention > is more "serious" than a brochure on constructing a beginning T-tunic > just to look acceptable at events. Right you are. Thank you! -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pre Argent "Such virtue hath my pen...." -Shakespeare, Sonnet 81 "I knew this wasn't _my_ pen!" --Cynthia Virtue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:40:03 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83Le3cI023711 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:40:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LdiJ0016991 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:39:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LdiNX092972; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:39:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.205]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Ldf2O092908 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:39:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kristalori@gmail.com) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id i3so660593wra for ; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:39:36 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=rITdMsv/J220Vb24yF/Gig6U7bIERzF6B93bJpYDsBI1c3lxRPWZqoPlg347Z6It+M4UVpfPV7Qng18CbK7cm1tZoCMOL9sKai5oC6C5noH9UKAS5w0vBwi+gBd6ZIbjPri3tCfj+wcj89WEmBTQJTZ5sEZ309HpCbdkd42Lg5w= Received: by 10.54.21.70 with SMTP id 70mr3343101wru; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:39:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.105.6 with HTTP; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:39:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <7164eae905090314393ba4211c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:39:36 -0400 From: Jacqueline Johnson To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes In-Reply-To: <431A168B.7@lavoltapress.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> <431A168B.7@lavoltapress.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j83Le3cI023711 Status: RO I would agree. Define wearable art. The DIY movement is VERY strong and VERY mainstream. In particular among teenage girls. Just take a look at Etsy and you'll see the demographics. http://www.etsy.com/ The most popular thing to make right now in the "reconstruct" part of DIY is t-shirts recounstructed to look like corsets. Some are really nice. B. > > "Wearable art", while not being exactly mainstream is at least > > common. Places like Michael's craft stores carry supplies for making > > wearable art, and a few kits for the same. > > > > > But what do you call "wearable art"? I'd say it's something more > avant-garde, or arty, than a nice but mainstream hand-knitted sweater. > > Fran > Lavolta Press > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:46:27 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LkR6n023763 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:46:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83Lk3Xl017339 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:46:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LjxTd095359; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:45:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LjrvV095332 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:45:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-114-113.sonic.net [209.148.114.113]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Ljqf2014929 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 14:45:52 -0700 Message-ID: <431A1994.4070103@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:45:56 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4319D497.7020806@lavoltapress.com> <4319E485.5020401@lavoltapress.com> <431A0E47.1040300@reddawn.net> <431A1097.3040101@lavoltapress.com> <431A16CC.2060605@reddawn.net> In-Reply-To: <431A16CC.2060605@reddawn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you see any velvet gypsy skirts (unworn, new) that are earthtones rather than jewel tones, lemme know. I agree about the price competition, but if it were something of higher quality (cotton velvet instead of rayon, or rayon/silk devore velvet), or different (interesting design and/or trimming), I personally would pay more. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com Dawn wrote: > http://snipurl.com/hf4r > $8. You couldn't buy the fabric for that little, never mind the work > involved. > > http://snipurl.com/hf4t > $24. Still a steal. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:51:12 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LpBgP023805 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:51:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LoseU017773 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:50:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Los39097550; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:50:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m17.mx.aol.com (imo-m17.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LoooL097467 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:50:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id 6.1a2.3b294b02 (57317) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:50:41 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <1a2.3b294b02.304b74b1@aol.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:50:41 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bjarne To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO While I know we were glad to get updates on people personally known on the Gulf Coast, I think this exchange just proves that politics doesn't belong on this list. We went through this before, and it got kind of nasty. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 17:57:16 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83LvFOP023839 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:57:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83LutLw018244 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:56:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83Lutl3000169; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:56:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d20.mx.aol.com (imo-d20.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.136]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83LupBi000102 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:56:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id 6.1f7.11501a10 (57317) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:56:41 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <1f7.11501a10.304b7619@aol.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:56:41 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] regional crinoline fashions To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 9/3/2005 2:15:06 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, cschmitt@genteelarts.com writes: I'm imagining a "what city is this" sort of thing based on the historic costume icons. One of my most vivid memories of Mobile, Alabama, is the Azalea Trail Maids, who wore "ante-bellum" gone wild--Big hoop-skirted dresses with rows of tiny ruffles on the skirt, pantalets, big hats, parasols, and mitts, all in a matching color, like peach, lime green, or turquoise. This was back in the early 1980s--don't know if they still dress that way. Even then, I think we all knew better. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 18:07:42 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83M7fue023914 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 18:07:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83M7Mmt018957 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:07:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83M7JNV003893; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:07:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83M7EWX003866 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:07:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-114-113.sonic.net [209.148.114.113]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83M7CZa007060 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:07:13 -0700 Message-ID: <431A1E94.7080203@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:07:16 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> <431A168B.7@lavoltapress.com> <7164eae905090314393ba4211c@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <7164eae905090314393ba4211c@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-servers-Metrics: net.indra.com 1049; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's pretty easy to put lace-up trimming down the front of a tank top. BTW, that was a "hippie" style too. It's certainly heavily done in ready-to-wear for the American "junior" market. In shopping malls and online catalogs, I've seen a lot of ready-to-wear "decorated" T shirts and tank tops. They're often quite charming. I would guess Goths have to make most of their Goth clothes, although I've seen Goth clothing for sale on the net. In fact I bought some skirts that I found out are by a Goth ready-to-wear manufacturer, at www.artfulwears.com. Something else about "wearable art"--to my mind it has a kind of "wild and wooly" aspect. It's not a well-made but conservative hand-knitted sweater. I love hand-knitted sweaters, but I don't think they're all wearable art. It's not a commercial T-shirt with some lace trim and/or appliques sewn on. Those can be very cute, but I don't think they're wearable art either. It's also not ticky-tacky-craftsy, kits-and-kitsch. Wearable art may or may not be related to current fashion, but it's experimental, and "different." That's what makes it art. I agree that sewing an embroidered patch on your blue jeans, as many people did in the late 60s and early 70s, is not wearable art either. But some people went further, and were more "arty." I should add that the modern vintage clothing market, or rather the modern perception of it, also dates from the "hippie" movement. To the generation before that, buying used clothing was something you avoided if possible, for its connotations of not being able to afford new, and even catching parasites or diseases from the previous owner. The "hippie" movement siezed on vintage clothing ("reconstructed" or not) as a way to both find different styles and to benefit the environment by recycling. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com Jacqueline Johnson wrote: >I would agree. Define wearable art. The DIY movement is VERY strong and VERY >mainstream. In particular among teenage girls. Just take a look at Etsy and >you'll see the demographics. >http://www.etsy.com/ >The most popular thing to make right now in the "reconstruct" part of DIY is >t-shirts recounstructed to look like corsets. Some are really nice. > >B. > > > > >>>"Wearable art", while not being exactly mainstream is at least >>>common. Places like Michael's craft stores carry supplies for making >>>wearable art, and a few kits for the same. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>But what do you call "wearable art"? I'd say it's something more >>avant-garde, or arty, than a nice but mainstream hand-knitted sweater. >> >>Fran >>Lavolta Press >>http://www.lavoltapress.com >> >> >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> >> >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 18:23:13 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83MNDSY024049 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 18:23:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83MMp93019817 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:22:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83MMo00009672; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:22:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.202]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83MMlbt009625 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:22:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kristalori@gmail.com) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id i12so860220wra for ; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:22:42 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=KIVl9Qq7L3TNWqrnNAD/OFBmKf46SI2U+jx0dYbRIUL4VFGE0c0tHNQk6SLQpGxKLE2sji/CKXPbVdz23QYWw7o2rrA0xMYl5wIl9UiEeZuMqhDiE752qxYfX7IkW8Hlh1Oi7lpzhTy1VZ8lejqg2pnE5mpRlroW0jjev8saNBA= Received: by 10.54.2.74 with SMTP id 74mr2370401wrb; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:22:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.105.6 with HTTP; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 15:22:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <7164eae905090315223bc1cc44@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 18:22:42 -0400 From: Jacqueline Johnson To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes In-Reply-To: <431A1E94.7080203@lavoltapress.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 References: <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> <431A168B.7@lavoltapress.com> <7164eae905090314393ba4211c@mail.gmail.com> <431A1E94.7080203@lavoltapress.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id j83MNDSY024049 Status: RO I'm unsure if you've seen the corset t-shirts but what they are is essentially the body of the t-shirt intact with pieces of fabric added either on the front or back with grommets in. Then you lace just like a corset. Some are really wild others are the basic style. Also the old "add a skirt to the bottom of a t-shirt" is still standard. Heck I was doing that in HS (I was born in 72 if it says much) . Depending on what facet of goth you are doing you have a few great choices for clothing. If you do LBG or Lolita Rose and Thorn is amazing. http://www.angelfire.com/ab6/roseandthorn/ If you like cyber goth Lip Service has some nice pieces although I'm not real keen on the method of making them or their lastability. The Gothic Lolita Bible is a must for anyone who studies modern costume or is in the Lolita or FrUiTs movement of clothing. Blue Period hosts scans of the book: http://www.blue-period.fsnet.co.uk/egl.html Goth Fashion Info gives simple circle skirt instruction: http://gothfashion.info/circlepixie.html I like Morbid Outlook's explanation of Japanese Lolita: http://www.morbidoutlook.com/fashion/articles/2002_07_gothiclolita.html Metamorphose Temps des Filles sells great clothes for those into GL: http://www.metamorphose.gr.jp/english/index.html I have more links of course. If anyone wants them just ask. To my mind if you've made it chances are its wearable art. Its handmade and its OOAK. You aren't going to run into Hot Topic or Kmart and grab it off the rack. B~ On 9/3/05, Lavolta Press wrote: > > It's pretty easy to put lace-up trimming down the front of a tank top. > BTW, that was a "hippie" style too. It's certainly heavily done in > ready-to-wear for the American "junior" market. In shopping malls and > online catalogs, I've seen a lot of ready-to-wear "decorated" T shirts > and tank tops. They're often quite charming. > > I would guess Goths have to make most of their Goth clothes, although > I've seen Goth clothing for sale on the net. In fact I bought some > skirts that I found out are by a Goth ready-to-wear manufacturer, at > www.artfulwears.com . > > Something else about "wearable art"--to my mind it has a kind of "wild > and wooly" aspect. It's not a well-made but conservative hand-knitted > sweater. I love hand-knitted sweaters, but I don't think they're all > wearable art. It's not a commercial T-shirt with some lace trim and/or > appliques sewn on. Those can be very cute, but I don't think they're > wearable art either. It's also not ticky-tacky-craftsy, kits-and-kitsch. > > Wearable art may or may not be related to current fashion, but it's > experimental, and "different." That's what makes it art. > > I agree that sewing an embroidered patch on your blue jeans, as many > people did in the late 60s and early 70s, is not wearable art either. > But some people went further, and were more "arty." > > I should add that the modern vintage clothing market, or rather the > modern perception of it, also dates from the "hippie" movement. To the > generation before that, buying used clothing was something you avoided > if possible, for its connotations of not being able to afford new, and > even catching parasites or diseases from the previous owner. The > "hippie" movement siezed on vintage clothing ("reconstructed" or not) as > a way to both find different styles and to benefit the environment by > recycling. > > Fran > Lavolta Press > http://www.lavoltapress.com > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 18:34:52 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83MYpjr024128 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 18:34:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83MYHKZ020455 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:34:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83MYErr014144; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:34:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83MY6Lb014099 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:34:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from ylpvm01.prodigy.net (ylpvm01-int.prodigy.net [207.115.5.207]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.12.10 outbound/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j83MY1mU015577 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 18:34:01 -0400 X-ORBL: [69.107.93.242] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-93-242.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.93.242]) by ylpvm01.prodigy.net (8.13.4 dk-milter linux/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83MY1c6031632 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 18:34:02 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20050903152718.026571f0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 15:31:15 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes In-Reply-To: <431A168B.7@lavoltapress.com> References: <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>Ren. Faires started in the early 1960s, and their founder coined the term >>"living history". > >Wasn't there some early connection with the SCA? Not really. The same kind of people joined each one, but there wasn't as much crossover as you might think. There's still some awkwardness to this day, because of different goals for the two different groups. "Wearable art", while not being exactly mainstream is at least common. Places like Michael's craft stores carry supplies for making wearable art, and a few kits for the same. >But what do you call "wearable art"? I'd say it's something more >avant-garde, or arty, than a nice but mainstream hand-knitted sweater. What I call wearable art and what Michael's craft stores call wearable art are rather different. They call things like craft-decorated t-shirts by that name, when they're selling supplies for making same. I have a little more highbrow definition, and would go with the more avant guarde and arty look. Upscale art and wine festivals have more what I would call wearable art. I also call it fiber art, which the craft stores pretty much don't. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Sep 3 19:25:13 2005 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j83NPDkG024572 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 19:25:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83NOre8023619 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:24:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83NOoFN034045; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:24:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83NOleH034016 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 17:24:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-114-37.sonic.net [209.148.114.37]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j83NOj18001081 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 16:24:46 -0700 Message-ID: <431A30C2.8070309@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2005 16:24:50 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fiber arts and making vs buying clothes References: <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20050903113241.58067.qmail@web31104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4.3.1.2.20050903134942.03426458@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20050903152718.026571f0@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20050903152718.026571f0@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.86.2/1060/Sat Sep 3 08:44:35 2005 on net.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'd agree with your definition, except that I associate the term "fiber art" with textile arts other than sewing. Whereas, to me "wearable art" covers sewing, weaving, spinning, knitting, crochet, embroidery, the whole spectrum. Oh, except a hanging or sculpture is fiber art, but not wearable. As for Goths, who I supect may be a rather large DIY crowd, I've never been tempted to become one because, as far as I can tell from the historic costumers I know who are also Goths, they hang out in clubs and listen to modern music. I can't stand modern music. Also, I look awful in black. But so