From: Gretchen Miller Date: Wed, 15 Feb 1995 17:36:34 -0500 (EST) Subject: H-Costume Digest, Volume 228, 2/15/95 The Historic Costume List Digest, Volume 228, February 15, 1995 Send items for the list to h-costume@andrew.cmu.edu (or reply to this message). Send subscription/deletion requests and inquiries to h-costume-request@andrew.cmu.edu Enjoy! --------------------------------------------------------------- Topics: The Madness of King George (movie) Question and answers: 15th Century shirt construction Question and answers: T-tunic construction Early Siberian costume description Question and answers: Shaving your legs ISO: Documentation about US Military uniforms ----------------------- From: DLTR@aol.com Date: Sat, 11 Feb 1995 21:56:32 -0500 Subject: Madness of King George I just saw "The Madness of King George" this afternoon. It is a wonder to behold. For the costume purists it was a treat for the eyes. Wigs, hair makeup, settings and lighting were all wonderful. If you just want to be entertained, it was an interesting view of the man who lost the colonies. I can't attest to it's historic accuracy, but so much effort was put into the other aspects of the film that I am comfortable assuming it was as accurate as "bio-pics" can get. It's kind of hard to find but definitely worth the search. ----------------------- Date: Sat, 11 Feb 1995 22:55:18 -0400 (EST) From: andrea ruth leed Subject: 15th Century Shirts I've been trying to find out exactly how fifteenth century linen shirts, that were worn under virtually everything, are made. Portraits aren't much help, as most of the shirt is covered. The only thing I've been able to conclude is that the collar fitted closely to the neck, was sometimes open down the front, And sometimes not. But what kind of cuffs did they have? How did they fasten? Did they have yokes or not? If anyone can point me to some books or other references that talk about these things, I'd be more than grateful. Drea Leed ============================= aleed@ezmail.ucs.indiana.edu ----------------------- Date: Sat, 11 Feb 1995 20:30:47 -0800 (PST) From: "Sarah E. Goodman" Subject: Re: Madness of King George On the other hand, there is a certain amusement in knowing it was based on the play THE MADNESS OF KING GEORGE III and they changed the title for the flick because they didn't want anyone to think it was a sequel. ******************************************************* Sarah E. Goodman goodston@well.sf.ca.us Senior Designer and Chief Cat Herder goodston@netcom.com Wee Cottage Daly City, California, USA ******************************************************** ----------------------- Date: Sun, 12 Feb 1995 08:49:34 -0800 (PST) From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: 15th Century Shirts On Sat, 11 Feb 1995, andrea ruth leed wrote: > I've been trying to find out exactly how fifteenth century linen shirts, > that were worn under virtually everything, are made. Portraits aren't > much help, as most of the shirt is covered. The only thing I've been Don't look at portraits, look for pictures of martyrs, prisoners, and others in a state of undress. Hagiography is a good source as long as you look for clues confirming whether the clothing is contemporary with the painter or or an attempt as "classical" dress. Heather Rose Jones ----------------------- From: gst6710@msu.oscs.montana.edu Date: Sun, 12 Feb 1995 10:18:46 MST Subject: t-tunics Gentle folks- I have found many useful bits of information here, so I thought I might de-lurk long enough to ask a question of my own. I make T-tunics to wear in the SCA. However, I haven't figured out two things about them: 1. How do I keep them from riding back and having the front of the neck strangle me? 2. Is there an easy way to make a neck? (no collar, just facing) Any assisamce rendered would be *greatly* appreciated. Morgan ----------------------- Date: Sun, 12 Feb 1995 16:09:43 -0600 (CST) From: Cynthia Lucille Rosser Subject: Re: t-tunics On Sun, 12 Feb 1995 gst6710@trex.oscs.montana.edu wrote: > Gentle folks- > > I have found many useful bits of information here, so I thought I might de-lurk > long enough to ask a question of my own. I make T-tunics to wear in the SCA. > However, I haven't figured out two things about them: > > 1. How do I keep them from riding back and having the front of the neck > strangle me? Embroidery around the neck, especially if that in front is of greater volume will help keep the tunic from riding back and add to the overall decorative effect. Dover publishes many cheap (most $1-10) books of Cletic interlace designs, some are transfers. > 2. Is there an easy way to make a neck? (no collar, just facing) > > Any assisamce rendered would be *greatly* appreciated. Fusable interlining saves many a neckline from fraying and adds weight to the front of the garment. Look in any regular pattern book for collar-less blouses/shirts and adapt. > Morgan > ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 12:48:57 +1100 From: S.Randles@UTS.Edu.Au (Sarah Randles) Subject: Early Siberian Costume Just something that caught my eye in Saturday's paper (Sydney Morning Herald, 11 February, 1995), that I thought might be of interest to readers of this list. The article "Siberia's Ice Maiden Returns from her Ancient Pastures of Heaven" by Helen Womack, refers to the discovery of the preserved corpse of a woman believed to be about 2400 years old. The body was discovered in 1993 in the Altai mountains near the Chinese mountains, by an excavation led by Ms Natalya Polosmak of the Siberian branch of the Russian Academy of Sciences The womans clothing is described: "She was dressed in white wollen stockings, a wool skirts with horizontal white and maroon stripes and a yellow Chinese silk blouse with maroon piping. The blouse was an old one which had been mended several times. Ms Polosmak explained: 'Her tribe had plenty of wood and wool, but silk was a rare, traded item and therefore had to be made to last.' ...her head was shaved and she wore a wig and a tall wooden headdress, decorated with cats and swans." She is also described as having tattoos of deer and snow leopards. Sarah ****************************************************** Sarah Randles S.Randles@uts.edu.au Research Office Telephone: (02)330 1252 University of Technology, Sydney Fax: (02)330 1252 ----------------------- From: AlisounF@aol.com Date: Sun, 12 Feb 1995 22:26:45 -0500 Subject: Re: t-tunics On February 12, 1995, Morgan asked: >1. How do I keep them from riding back and having the front of the neck > strangle me? The neck of a garment should be positioned so that one quarter of the opening is on the back of the garment and three quarters is on the front. Our necks are a bit front of center. Take a look at the neck of a shirt for a visual example. Pat LaPointe ----------------------- Date: Sun, 12 Feb 1995 22:42:52 -0500 From: Beverly Roden Subject: T-Tunic Necklines How to make a successful neckline that does not choke you : First - look at any T-Shirt - the opening for your head is more in the manner of an oval than a circle, the largest part hanging in the front. This is because, anatomically speaking, your head and neck are set forward on top of your shoulders (look at yourself sideways in a mirror - you'll see!) Now, if you're making the t-tunic in the quick and dirty style (lay on the fabric which is on the floor, mark a neck and where your underarm is, angle out (and down) to hem, and draw a line out from the underarm to the selvedge to make the sleeves, sew, and whalla, instana-garb), after you make that hole for your head and have cut everything else out and sewed the sides, put the t-tunic on and have someone else make a neckline that curves down along your collar bone. Make certain the person helping you also makes the neckline fit in the back, as well (so you don't have fabric sticking halfway up into your hair!) You can now do a rolled edging on your sewing machine (like a shirtail hem, but smaller), and you are done. Keyhole necklines are only slightly more complex - you just need to decide how far down you want the keyhole to go! Does this help? Beverly Roden ac508@dayton.wright.edu ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 07:32:31 -0800 (PST) From: Sue Toorans Subject: shaving I had a question about when it became accepted/stylish for a woman to shave her legs. I seem to remember that this became the practice in the U.S. in the twenties but I can't remember why I think this. Does anyone have an idea when this became common and maybe even a reference sourse to the information? Thanks loads. Sue I am *NOT* a rabid feminist! I had my shots last year. ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 10:21:00 CDT From: donna parker Subject: resources on military uniforms Our museum is currently working on an exhibit of occupational clothing which will include a United States Maritime Service dress uniform (WWII era) and a flight deck jumpsuit worn by landing officer (WWII- Navy). Can anyone give us a good source(s) for the documentation of these uniforms? Donna Parker The Kentucky Museum Western Kentucky University Bowling Green, KY 42101 parkedc@wkuvx1.wku.edu ----------------------- From: Jennifer Bray Date: Mon, 13 Feb 95 16:10:01 GMT Subject: Re: t-tunics >1. How do I keep them from riding back and having the front of the neck > strangle me? Cut the neck deeper at the front so that the bit that's strangling you isn't there any more. >2. Is there an easy way to make a neck? (no collar, just facing) To get the line of the neck copy the opening on a T shirt, you can fold up a piece of paper, stuff it into the top of the shirt & trace around the neck to get a pattern. Cut the neck out of your tunic maybe half an inch smaller than the T shirt neck to give yourself a seam allowance. Stick your head through the neck hole to check it's big enough before you start sewing up. Because T shirts are stretchy some of them have small neck holes that don't work on other fabrics. If it's too small just cut it slightly larger, you shouldn't have to enlarge much because you are taking cloth off quite a large oval. If you are even vaguely competent at hand sewing turn the neck seam outwards & bind it down with herringbone stitch in a colour that contrasts the cloth. This method of finishing seams is documented from Saxon London, There's a paper by Francis Pritchard that describes various methods of sewing seams including this one. You don't need to cut a seperate facing piece or do anything particularly complicated you just fold the edge outwards & stitch over the raw edge. As long as Saxon London isn't too far out of the time & place you're costuming for this is the easiest way I know to make a tunic neck. If you like the herringbone effect you can finish the hem cuffs the same way. Jennifer P.S. I can look up the name of the Pritchard paper if anyone wants it. ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 12:01:54 -0400 (EST) From: andrea ruth leed Subject: Re: shaving It likely had something to do with rising skirt levels. Until the flapper era, legs were something seldom seen by anyone but their owner, close family, and friends. On Mon, 13 Feb 1995, Sue Toorans wrote: > > I had a question about when it became accepted/stylish for a woman to > shave her legs. I seem to remember that this became the practice in the U.S. > in the twenties but I can't remember why I think this. Does anyone have > an idea when this became common and maybe even a reference sourse to the > information? Thanks loads. > > Sue I am *NOT* a rabid feminist! > I had my shots last year. > > ============================= aleed@ezmail.ucs.indiana.edu ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 95 10:02:11 PST From: Gail DeCamp Subject: Re: T-Tunic Necklines Greetings! Beverly Roden says this: >Now, if you're making the t-tunic in the quick and dirty style (lay on >the fabric which is on the floor, mark a neck and where your underarm >is, angle out (and down) to hem, and draw a line out from the underarm >to the >selvedge to make the sleeves, sew, and whalla, instana-garb), I have only one caveat: Please take into account that the person is not two-dimensional. If you mark exactly where their armpit is, the tunic will not fit--add some garment ease. (Apologies if this is blazingly obvious to everyone on the list. I made this mistake, and it was very embarrassing.) Gail DeCamp Speaking from, not for, Network General Corporation ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 14:58:24 CDT From: donna parker Subject: RE: shaving The 1937 Montgomery Ward spring and summer catalog lists 10 creams or wax solutions for women's hair removal on legs, underarms, and body, and two razor's (women's) - a pretty good indication the practise was common by this time. Without going to the library I can't tell you more - the next time I'm there I'll look in earlier mail order catalogs and see what I can find. Donna Parker ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 95 16:18:07 EST From: "Dawn E. Nakroshis" Subject: corsets (early 20th century) Is this an item which can still be purchased commercially? Apparently these were the ordinary corsets worn by women from about 1900 on, and even Sears sold them until about 15 years ago...at that time made by Cortland Corset Company in Cortland, NY. If you have any sources for these corsets or their consituent parts, please email me!! (Thank you very much!) Dawn E. Nakroshis dawn@us.net ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 16:33:05 CDT From: donna parker Subject: RE: Shaving I failed to find anything in our collection of mail order catalogues about hair removal, because (I realized) we have a gap in our collections from 1923-1941. Sears, Roebuck and Company catalogues *are* on microfilm though, and I assume are available through interlibrary loan. Anyway, what I did find out: 1900 - Sears sold a depilatory to remove facial hair 1902 - Sears sold a depilatory to remove hair from the face, neck and arms 1923 - Sears sold both a powder and liquid depilatory for the removal of underarm hair I'm sorry, some of you must think this is gross and I'm a little strange to take such an interest, but finally: 1936-37 Chicago Mail Order - advertises both a cream and wax hair remover and of the latter describes that it "removes hair effectively, quickly, and safely. Destroys hair-roots. 'It's off because it's out!'" Ouch! Donna Parker parkedc@wkuvx1.wku.edu ----------------------- From: Allison Thurman Subject: shavng? Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 17:41:30 -0500 (EST) just a few comments. last time i went to the smithsonian (dec) i saw an exhibit of several different kinds of womens razors. i think the earliest dated from the 1880's 1890's, though the exhibit said nothing about how widespread the use of razors were for women. allison ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 16:50:59 -0600 (CST) From: Cynthia Lucille Rosser Subject: Re: shaving On Mon, 13 Feb 1995, Sue Toorans wrote: > > I had a question about when it became accepted/stylish for a woman to > shave her legs. I seem to remember that this became the practice in the U.S. > in the twenties but I can't remember why I think this. Does anyone have > an idea when this became common and maybe even a reference sourse to the > information? Thanks loads. > > Sue I am *NOT* a rabid feminist! > I had my shots last year. > I'll have to double check my historical sources, but I assume that rising hem-lines and the popularity of Hollywood motion pictures had something to do with it. Close-ups of starlets legs in bathing suits with shaved legs initiated copying by young film-fans. Photographic evidence suggest that many stage performers (of the more risque vaudeville type) shaved their legs in the late nineteenth century. ----------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 16:54:53 -0600 (CST) From: Cynthia Lucille Rosser Subject: Re: 15th Century Shirts On Sat, 11 Feb 1995, andrea ruth leed wrote: > > I've been trying to find out exactly how fifteenth century linen shirts, > that were worn under virtually everything, are made. Portraits aren't > much help, as most of the shirt is covered. The only thing I've been > able to conclude is that the collar fitted closely to the neck, was > sometimes open down the front, And sometimes not. But what kind of cuffs > did they have? How did they fasten? Did they have yokes or not? If > anyone can point me to some books or other references that talk about > these things, I'd be more than grateful. > > Drea Leed > ============================= > aleed@ezmail.ucs.indiana.edu > In "The History of Underclothes" C. Willel and Phillis Cunnington, Dover Publications, 1992 (ISBN 0-486-27124-2 $9.95) has a picture of a 15th C. undershirt/chemise. It is not very clear for pattern making purposes, but it might help you. ----------------------- End of Volume 228 -----------------------