From: owner-h-costume-digest (Historic Costume Digest) To: h-costume-digest@lunch.engr.sgi.com Subject: Historic Costume Digest V3 #160 Reply-To: h-costume Errors-To: owner-h-costume-digest@lunch.engr.sgi.com Precedence: bulk Historic Costume Digest Thursday, August 10 1995 Volume 3, Number 160 Important Addresses: Submissions to the list: h-costume@lunch.engr.sgi.com (or reply to this message). Adds/removes/archives: majordomo@lunch.engr.sgi.com Real, live person: h-costume-request@andrew.cmu.edu Topics: Re: numbering change Re: H-Costume Digest, Volume 360, 8/9/95 Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r Adieu Re: Alcega's Tailors Pattern Book help! Feather mites--! Civil War Era Clothiers help with SCA Re: Alcega's Tailors Pattern Book Re: Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r Re: Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r RE: Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r Re: Horizontal Boning in 18th Century Stays Costume early 19th Century England To wash, or not to wash...? Hollywood Fashion History San Jose Hysterical Museum info Shoe info & bibliography ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 11:33:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Gretchen Miller Subject: Re: numbering change Excerpts from mail: 10-Aug-95 numbering change by Tim Allison@mcs.com > Why did the numbering jump from 158 to 360? And which sequence is current? > Is this related to the machine change? Inquiring minds want to know The jump is due to the machine change--the 360 number was the "by-hand" number scheme I was using. The new numbers are the ones generated by the automatic digester on the new machine. toodles, gretchen (h-costume list co-maintainer) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 09:13:21 -0700 From: Susan Fatemi Subject: Re: H-Costume Digest, Volume 360, 8/9/95 I don't know which pattern co. it was, maybe more than one, but definately Big Four. Anyway there are patterns for choir robes/ pastoral robes etc. in the section with costumes. This works for the gown part of the basic "cap and gown" Susan Fatemii susanf@eerc.berkeley.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 12:22:54 -0700 From: Crataegus@eworld.com Subject: Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r Does anyone know of medieval/historical groups that wear their costuming other than these two groups? Info would be much appreciated. - --allen - -------------------------------------------------------------- Crataegus@eworld.com - -------------------------------------------------------------- Please send all replies, flames to crataegus@eworld.com - -------------------------------------------------------------- L'enfer, c'est les autres.--Sartre - -------------------------------------------------------------- Il faut que je practique le franc,ais. S'il vous-plait, envoyez tous les re'ponses a`crataegus@eworld.com - -------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Aug 95 17:47:17 EST From: kathleen@anstec.com Subject: Adieu Alas, friends whom I have met on this list, due to heavy traffic on the e-mail at work (where I have internet access), I must unscribe. If you want to contact me privately, my e-mail address is: kathleen@anstec.com I will be setting up an account soon on my home computer (as soon as I find the telephone jack for the modem!). It's been great fun and I've learned a lot. TTFN, Kathleen ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Aug 95 11:30:59 EST From: kathleen@anstec.com Subject: Re: Alcega's Tailors Pattern Book I know that several years ago, a gentleman named Robert Trump put out a large paperback book based on one of Alcega's patterns that he had made up. It was heavily illustrated with layouts and construction of the garment. I have a copy at home. I'll try to find the citation. I have to unsubscribe because of traffic on our server at work, but I will give it to some one else to post. Or maybe somebody here will recognize the reference. Kathleen _______________________________________________________________________________ >Subject: Alcega's Tailors Pattern Book >From: TheaG@aol.com at internet-mail >Date: 8/7/95 8:24 AM I have recently been able to ILL Juan de Alcega's Tailors Pattern Book. To have the diagrams is very useful in terms of seeing pattern shape and layout but it would be nice to have a sketch or photo of the garment made up. Does anyone know whether anyone has made the various garments Alcega gives and make pictures of them? Just wondering, Thea TheaG@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Aug 95 09:55:27 PST From: decampg@ngc.com Subject: help! Feather mites--! Hello to all. I had a question about feather mites. I bought a nice bunch of guinea fowl feathers and some ostrich plumes several months ago, and recently pulled out the guinea fowl feathers, only to find bare spots on them. "Feather mites," said my friend. "That's terrible." He recommended that I wash them in hot water (which I did) and steam them back to shape (which I haven't done yet). Just for ducks, I also microwaved the feathers. Another friend recommended that I store them with cedar or bay leaves or some other form of "vermin repellent" which I will do. My questions are: (a) is there anything else I can do to kill the little beasties? (b) Do I also need to do it to the ostrich plumes with which the guinea feathers were stored? (c) is the water and microwave enough? Thanks Gail DeCamp decampg@ngc.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Aug 1995 15:59:00 -0400 From: arisaid@aol.com Subject: Civil War Era Clothiers Hi everyone, I have noticed by the recent mail that there are a lost of SCA subscribers or those interested in the era's covered by that group. Are there any Civil War era nuts out there who are interested in conversing about the era's clothing? Hope so! Karen ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Aug 1995 16:21:17 -0400 From: eliza28@aol.com Subject: help with SCA I am new to researching historic costume and would like to contact the closest SCA to me. I am in Austin, Texas. Also, can anyone recommend some books to get my "library" started? I have interests mostly in 17th and early 18th century Western European designs (maybe late 16th century). Any help is greatly appreciated! Jennifer Parmerter (Eliza28@aol.com) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 13:56:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Margaret Griffith Subject: Re: Alcega's Tailors Pattern Book On Mon, 7 Aug 1995 kathleen@anstec.com wrote: > I know that several years ago, a gentleman named Robert Trump put out a large > paperback book based on one of Alcega's patterns that he had made up. It was > heavily illustrated with layouts and construction of the garment. I have a copy > If I'm not mistaken, Robert Trump (who works for the St. Louis Opera costume shop, btw), published a paperback book called _The Annotated Arnold_, which deals with a garment he made up from Janet Arnold's Patterns of Fashion (The one with the Elizabethan stuff, sorry I don't remember the dates - it's long and thin with a brown cover). If he published one about Alcega I'd be very interested in any information. Meg Griffith ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 16:21:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Teresa Shannon Subject: Re: Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r There is a Black Prince Society that takes each year individually and does it for a year (It hasn't been around long enough to reach the death point yet). At least I have had a reference to them. Also Sealed Knot? Perhaps there are others, these are just British. Teresa> ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 17:33:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Gretchen Miller Subject: Re: Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r Excerpts from mail: 10-Aug-95 Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r by Crataegus@eworld.com > Does anyone know of medieval/historical groups that wear their costuming > other than these two groups? > > Info would be much appreciated. Wellll, there's Markland (this appears in the frontspiece of The Old Norse Name) The MARKLAND CONFEDERATION is a union of independent medievalist educational organizations; its central administration, the MARKLAND MEDIEVAL MERCENARY MILITIA, LTC., in in corporated as a non-profit corporation in the State of Maryland. Present constituent members of the Confederation are the MARYLAND MEDIEVAL MERCENARY MILITIA (UMd/College park), the WHITE COMPANY (Annapolis), THE LONGSHIP COMPANY (Severn River), the MJOLLNIFIAN ORDER (Montgomery community College/Rockville), the VIKING HORDE (Baltimore, and the MARCHE DE LA WARR (university of Delaware/Newark). ...Among the public events are: recreations of historic battles, feast and revels, participation in medieval fairs and in parades, wars wtihin Markland and with other medeivalist organizations.....There is an old address for info "Atli jarl Vad\ason, MARKLAND MEDIEVAL MERCENARY MILITIA, 4998 Battery Lane #203, Bethesda, Maryland 20014 There's the Sealed Knot folks, who do English Civil Wars. Some of these folks are on the list. There's the Kingdom of Acre--an SCA spinoff, but more temporaily consistent, i.e. a much narrower range of periods and places. Unfortunately, I don't have contact info on them. I'm sure there's others as well, but I don't know their names. toodles, gretchen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 15:50:00 -0400 (edt) From: "Herriman, Karey" Subject: RE: Not SCA not Dagor-Hi^r There is a group here in Maryland that is similar to SCA but is not affiliated with them. I believe their name is the Brothers of the Mark or something like that. I am sure someone out there should know it. Also the State sport of Maryland is Jousting so they have tournaments that are publicly sponsored usually in conjunction with a Renfaire. Karey ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 19:44:23 -0400 From: Carodec@aol.com Subject: Re: Horizontal Boning in 18th Century Stays >>I am about to start work on a Period Impressions pattern for half-boned >>1760's-1770's stays. These stays have rows of horizontal boning at the top >>front which must take and hold a curved shape (if you laid the stays down on >>a table, they would not lie flat; the front curve would stand up from the >>table). Does anyone have any ideas on the most suitable boning material to >>use? > >I've never tried the horizontal boning in my 1770's stays, though >it is there on the "source documentation" from Diderot too. >Nonetheless, if I used it, I would use regular steel corset >boning. I haven't read your pattern instructions, but my take >on the horizontal boning is that it maintains a curved shape >while the corset is ON you -- and who cares that it lays flat >when laid on the table. Actually, I saw a set of these stays at the Winterthur museum at this spring's symposium on eighteenth century women's clothing. They do not lie flat, and it does seem to make a difference in the shape and support they give your figure. The stays I've been using for the last few years don't have this feature, but I wanted to try it out for use with more formal clothing. Thanks for the response! - --- Caroline ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Aug 1995 10:56:13 +1000 From: M.Murray@gupsa.gu.edu.au (Meredith Murray) Subject: Costume early 19th Century England I invite comment from the H-COSTUME group on the following extract (1809) from the soon-to-be-published Journals of Reverend William Greenwood 1778-1842. I would appreciate any comments or references to the appearance of the people in this extract. As Reverend Greenwood was a qualified London-apprenticed draper his description of fabric is most-likely accurate. I am completing a detailed biographical study as part of a higher degree at Griffith University, Australia. Any comments received would be worked into an annotation for the journal. Scholars wishing to quote from the material presented here should acknowledge its source thus: Murray, Meredith (unpub.) Journals of the Reverend William Greenwood, 1809, M.Phil thesis, Griffith University, 1996 'Accompanied Mrs Senier on a visit to some relations (maiden ladies who had past the meridian of life) residing at Pilling - a large ancient looking farmstead, situated on the banks of the estuary known by the name of Cokerham Sands....... On arriving at our intended temporary abode I was not less struck with the interior appearance, and the antique rude-looking furniture, than I was with the exterior of the dwelling, and the drear scenery round. But the inmates were more like the inhabitants of a strange land than of my own. The elder of the two sisters, who was full and well formed, wore a dress not unlike that seen in pictures of the female peasantry two centuries ago: a high-crowned cap - long-waisted chintz print gown, one side looped up by the pocket-hole, displaying a twilled petticoat; high heeled shoes, and hair hanging down behind as low as the waist, and tied in the centre with a little ribband: this latter appearance seemed to me a little grotesque and outlandish. The younger sister was similarly attired - with hair equally long; but the features of her face were fine and there was an intelligence in her eye that gave her whole countenance a pleasing expression. A brother, who seemed about fifty years of age, dwelt with them. He had been a man of dissipated habits. Leaving his paternal home when young, he had past many years at sea; and since his return he had more the air of a Corsair Captain, or a Brigand Chief, than anything else. There was about him a sullen reserve; a moodiness of countenance, that betokened a heart brooding over some bold, adventurous ruthless deed. I did not feel so much prepossession in his favour, as to his singularly-looking, oddly-dressed maiden sisters. The mode of living was also new to me; loaves made of oatmeal, which they called Bunnock, and their pancake-like bread, formed considerably thinner than the oat-cake seen in the West Riding of Yorkshire, on which they denominated bannock, appeared on the table at every meal. The general cooking was homely, plain and substantial and I possessed that improvement in my appetite that I was led to esteem all that I eat, very good. My lodging room formed a singular contrast to some where I had recently slept; it was spacious lofty - and un-underdrawn. The bed was placed nearly in the centre of the chamber; and chests - boxes - and wardrobes were placed round, not in the most regular order. All were filled, as Mrs Senier informed me with clothes, linen and other valuables which the ancient ladies of the house had been collecting through a long series of years. Feelings, not entirely divested of superstition, haunted me when I retired to rest in this gloomy apartment, but my sleep was sound and undisturbed.' end quote Meredith Murray, M.Phil candidate, Griffith University M. Murray@gupsa.gu.edu.au if the above address does not work try M.MURRAY@NGRIFFIN.ITC.GU.EDU.AU Meredith Murray POSTGRADUTE ORGANISER #7602 (MON, TUES, FRI) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 95 17:54:00 -0700 From: Carol Ann Krug Subject: To wash, or not to wash...? For the corset experts on this list, I recently finished my first corset, and would like to get your advice. The instructor recommends not washing the corset. She said she once washed and dried a corset by machine, and it rusted and was ruined. I will wear the corset with a chemise and corset cover, but would prefer to wash it, if possible. I believe I've seen people on this list say that they wash their corsets. Is there a method that works? My corset has the standard (sprung steel?) boning. I spent a lot of effort to make this corset, so I don't want to ruin it! Any advice? Thanks, Carol Ann Krug carolann@cup.hp.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 95 09:42:32 TZ From: Edward Wright Subject: Hollywood Fashion History FYI -- American Movie Classics (AMC) is advertising a new series on Hollywood Fashion History. It's called Hollywood Fashion or something like that and will premiere Tuesday, Aug 22 at 8 PM Eastern (make the appropriate adjustments elsewhere). ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 19:34:10 -0700 From: cynthia@caere.com Subject: San Jose Hysterical Museum info San Jose Historical Museum info. 408.287.2290 The "costume shop" is called Vintage Reflections --cin Cynthia Barnes internet: Cynthia@caere.com "Sorry I haven't been around much. I'm easily distracted by shiny objects." --The Tick ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Aug 1995 19:48:07 -0700 From: cynthia@caere.com Subject: Shoe info & bibliography Couldnt help but notice all the request for SHOE info. I posted several sections on the topic Make Your Own Shoes (prior to Feb this year) that should still be available in the archives. From the upcoming revised h-costume bibliography, I offer, for your perusal, the new SHOE section. As always, I'm happy to add your suggestions to the bibliography. (Yup, the biblio is in the archives, too.) --cin Cynthia Barnes internet: Cynthia@caere.com SHOES (history, make your own) - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Instructional: _Custom Make Your Own Shoes & Handbags_, Mary Wales Loomis (earlier editions are Mary Wales), Crown Publishers, NY, 1978, ISBN 0.517.53138.9 _The Make It Yourself Shoe Book_, Christine Clark, Alfred Knopf, NY, 1977, ISBN 0.394.41057.2 _Every Lady Her Own Shoemaker_, by A Lady, 1855, reprinted by Amazon Vinegar. Inspirational: _Put Your Foot Down: a treatise on the history of shoes_. Florence E. Ledger. Meksham, Wiltshire, U.K.: C. Venton, 1985. 214p. An illustrated history of shoes. ISBN 0854751114. _Shoes: Fashion & Fantasy_, Colin McDowell, Rizzoli, NY, 1989. Voted best of the lot! _(The Costume Accessories Series) Shoes_, June Swann, gen. ed. Aileen Ribeiro, Butler & Tanner Ltd, Fromm, Somerset, 1982, ISBN 0.7134.0942.8 _Schuhe, Drei Jahrtausende in Bildern_, Paul Weber, AT Verlag, Aarau, Stuttgart. Color plates every other page. _Heavenly Soles, Extrodinary 20th Century Shoes_, Mary Trako, Abbeville Press, NY. _Un Passo Dopo L'Altro, shoes from Italy_, SF exhibition catalog, B/W photos, examples from 17th thru the 20th century. annual calendars from the Bata Shoe Museum Collection, Firefly Books, 250 Sparks Av, Willowdale Ontario M2H 2S4. Issues of "Godey's Lady's Book" & "Petersen's Magazine" often have patterns, especially for decorating the uppers. Just Plain Silly: _Cinderella's Revenge_, Samuel Mazza, Chronicle Books, SF, 1994, ISBN 0.8118.0681.2, by the author of _Brahaus_ ------------------------------ End of Historic Costume Digest V3 #160 ************************************** A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, send the command lines: unsubscribe h-costume-digest subscribe h-costume end in the body of a message to majordomo@lunch.engr.sgi.com. Thanks and enjoy the list!