From: owner-h-costume-digest (H-Costume Digest) To: h-costume-digest@lunch.engr.sgi.com Subject: H-Costume Digest V3 #273 Reply-To: h-costume Sender: owner-h-costume-digest@lunch.engr.sgi.com Errors-To: owner-h-costume-digest@lunch.engr.sgi.com Precedence: bulk H-Costume Digest Friday, December 15 1995 Volume 3, Number 273 Compilation copyright (C) 1995 Diane Barlow Close and Gretchen Miller Use in whole prohibited. Individual articles are the property of the author. Seek permission from that author before reprinting or quoting elsewhere. Important Addresses: Send submissions to: h-costume@lunch.engr.sgi.com (or reply to this message). Adds/drops/archives: majordomo@lunch.engr.sgi.com Real, live person: h-costume-request@andrew.cmu.edu Topics: Black Why Wear a Corset? Re: Why Wear a Corset? In the Russian Style Brother Cadfael finally hits Aus!!!! Re: 16th century snoods Re: 16th century snoods -- the pattern source. Re: ..thoughts on peasants and time Re: In the Russian Style Male dressforms different? Why? Any Japanese-based lists out there? caning Fine linen thread Re: Why Wear a Corset? Re: Why Wear a Corset? Re: Why Wear a Corset? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 10:41:57 +1000 From: Sarah Randles Subject: Black I think that "they couldn't dye black in the Middle Ages" may be a myth right up there with " they didn't use pink/purple/green" or "they didn't have buttonholes/knitting". I have looked at lots of medieval embroidery in museums, which while it may not be a true black (and how many modern fabrics are either?) looks pretty black to me. After 400+ years. If you can't tell that it's not really black, does it matter? Sure ferrous dyes will eventually oxidise to a red brown, but it takes a long time. My black clothing, dyed with modern dyes, which I have had a long time and worn lots isn't really black anymore either. Sarah **************************************************************************** ******** Sarah Randles ser@adminserver.canberra.edu.au Research Office Phone: (06) 201 2955 University of Canberra Fax: (06) 201 5381/5999 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Dec 1995 21:24:49 -0500 From: sunfire@muskoka.com (Stephen & Krista Fraser) Subject: Why Wear a Corset? Greetings! Please forgive my ignorance and please help me with this question. Should I or should I not wear a corset? I will be wearing a Renaissance Maiden costume and want a push up effect in the bosom. Now, can the same effect be achieved by using a push-up bra, or does the corset do other things that I'm not aware of. My measurements are 36-25-36. Do I need a corset or not?? Thanks in advance for your help! Krista sunfire@muskoka.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Dec 1995 22:57:54 -0500 From: MacRuimmon@aol.com Subject: Re: Why Wear a Corset? In a message dated 95-12-14 21:20:43 EST, sunfire@muskoka.com (Stephen & Krista Fraser) writes: >Subj: Why Wear a Corset? >Date: 95-12-14 21:20:43 EST >From: sunfire@muskoka.com (Stephen & Krista Fraser) >Please forgive my ignorance and please help me with this question. >Should I or should I not wear a corset? >I will be wearing a Renaissance Maiden costume and want a push up effect in >the bosom. Now, can the same effect be achieved by using a push-up bra, or >does the corset do other things that I'm not aware of. >My measurements are 36-25-36. Do I need a corset or not?? Hello Krista, I have been wearing corsets and bodices (the vest over the corset) at faire for some time. The corset is a seperate undergarment that doubles as a bra and a girdle. It's function was to give the body a look of the times, whatever that look may be. This is why a renaissance corset is different in construction and wear from a victorian corset. To answer your question best, is to say at your measurements, you probably don't want or nead to wear a full corset. A push up bra is OK, but it really isn't as comfortable as a well made boned-bodice. It is a long discription, but if you can make or get a boned bodice (a vest that has strips of metal or plastic sewn into stategic locations) shaped to your body, it is far more comfortable and flattering than any push up bra. And it will give you a great push up effect in the chest. ;-) Kimiko MacRuimmon@aol.com "she's a bridge to stop the flow of blood upon the fields... she's a weaver of peace." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Dec 1995 22:56:23 -0500 From: kl94ag@badger.ac.BrockU.CA (Kathleen Leggat) Subject: In the Russian Style >Subject: book search > >i am looking for a book entitle "In the Russian Style" I got a chance to look >through it a couple of years ago but have not seen it since. It is an >absolutely wonderful book that I would love to add to my collection and if >anyone knows where i could find it i would be very appreciative. > >thanks for your help, > >dennis :-) I'm behind on my email, so sorry this is so late. _In the Russian Style_ Edited by Jacueline Onassis A Studio Book, The Viking Press, New York ISBN 670-39696-6 My library put their stamp directly over the ISBN number, but I'm reasonably certain that's right. It does have some lovely examples of costuming. Kathleen (Catriona) "Teehee," quod she, and clapte the windowe to. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 14:55:09 +1100 From: "GILLIAN RICHARDS (02) 716 3712" Subject: Brother Cadfael finally hits Aus!!!! For those of us down under, the Brother Cadfael series is FINALLY coming to our screens. Channel 9 swear blind that they have it marked in for 8.30pm Saturday Nights, starting January 6. There was mention of it at the beginning of this year in the SMH Pink Guide, and although I have called the channel at various times to bug them (and from what I hear, several other people have been too), I reckon they just didn't feel that this sort of tV would pull the ratings. Never mind - better late than never. No affiliation with Channel 9 - although from the number of times I have rung them, I should get free membership! Gillian + - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - + | Gillian Richards - Multicultual Ed Unit |\__/| | | aka: gillian.richards@tafensw.edu.au / \ | | Official TAFE bit - did you know Christmas /_.~ ~,_\ | | is a Public Holiday? TAFE NSW - (02) 716 3712 \ / | + - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - @ - - - - - - + ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 14:35:04 +1000 (EST) From: Carolyn Fraser Subject: Re: 16th century snoods > On Thu, 23 Nov 1995, Gwen Carnegi wrote: > > > > About two years ago, snoods in the 16th century was brought up as a > > topic. The debate between crochet and knotting (fillet de something?) > > was quite comprehensive. Someone actually had a pattern for the knotting > > technique if I remember correctly. > > > > The information was wonderful and the thread was quite long. I > > have managed to delete this file and I cannot find it in the archives. > .....snip > I have been hoping that this information would be posted again. If anyone has saved the files, could you please forward them on to me as well? I would very much appreciate it. Thanks Carolyn Fraser Brisbane Australia ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Dec 1995 21:01:37 -0800 (PST) From: close (Diane Barlow Close) Subject: Re: 16th century snoods -- the pattern source. Carolyn Fraser wrote: > > On Thu, 23 Nov 1995, Gwen Carnegi wrote: > > > > > > About two years ago, snoods in the 16th century was brought up as a > > > topic. The debate between crochet and knotting (fillet de something?) > > > [snip] Anyone have that pattern? > If anyone has saved the files, could you please forward them on to me as > well? I would very much appreciate it. There's one in the archives! You can find a crochet pattern for a snood in v03.n244. You can get that file by sending: get h-costume v03.n244 to: majordomo@lunch.engr.sgi.com and the server will send you back the file! For more info on snoods you may also want to check out: TOPICS.94:Definition of Snood (fwd) hcos.940823 TOPICS.94:More on Snoods (16th C.) hcos.940706 TOPICS.94:re Snoods hcos.940628 TOPICS.94:snoods hcos.940217, hcos.940221, hcos.940628 TOPICS.94:Snoods & Netting (long) hcos.940706 TOPICS.94:Snoods, and other coiffure topics (19... hcos.940221 TOPICS.94:Snoods, bread, and chainmail hcos.940823 TOPICS.94:Snoods? hcos.940819, hcos.940822 TOPICS:16th century snoods v03.n258 TOPICS:snoods v03.n255 Anything in "TOPICS.94" can be retrieved by sending: get h-costume hcos-94/hcos.94#### (with "####" filled in with the proper date, found in the list above) to majordomo@lunch.engr.sgi.com. Anything in "TOPICS" can be retrieved by sending: get h-costume v03.n### (with "####" filled in with the proper numbers, found in the list above) to majordomo@lunch.engr.sgi.com. Happy crocheting everyone. Aren't archives great?! :-) - -- Diane Close I'm at lunch all day. :-) If a Canadian Had Said It First (The Globe & Mail): "Cry havoc, and let loose the dogs of a peacekeeping mission!" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 12:18:57 +0000 (GMT) From: Dorothy Stein Subject: Re: ..thoughts on peasants and time I don't know about medieval peasants, but am more familiar with work on Chinese and Indian peasant and tribal people. These too have very laborious lives, particularly the women. Nevertheless, many of them do exquisite needlework for themselves and others, often while walking along the roads and paths carrying water, fuel or goods. This is both to gain status for their skill and as one of the few feasible and approved means of artistic self-expression. Interestingly enough, embroidering was associated with the development of a women's script in South China. Peasant women who were not literate in the regular Chinese characters developed their own form of writing and used it to write stories and newsletters which were read by one or another of them to a circle of friends while the latter pursued their embroidery. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 10:11:07 -0600 (CST) From: "Maria A. Sanders" Subject: Re: In the Russian Style On Thu, 14 Dec 1995, Kathleen Leggat wrote: > > >Subject: book search > > > >i am looking for a book entitle "In the Russian Style" I got a chance to look > >through it a couple of years ago but have not seen it since. It is an > >absolutely wonderful book that I would love to add to my collection and if > >anyone knows where i could find it i would be very appreciative. > > > >thanks for your help, > > > >dennis :-) > > > I'm behind on my email, so sorry this is so late. > > _In the Russian Style_ Edited by Jacueline Onassis A Studio Book, > The Viking Press, New York > > ISBN 670-39696-6 > > My library put their stamp directly over the ISBN number, but I'm > reasonably certain that's right. > > It does have some lovely examples of costuming. > > Kathleen (Catriona) > > > > "Teehee," quod she, and clapte the windowe to. > > Pretty close, it should be 0-670-39696-6. Depends on how picky your library system is one numbers. According to the system that we download this from, the copywrite is 1976. Maria \\\|/// (O O) - -----------------------------oooO---U---Oooo---------------------------------- MARIA SANDERS LIBRARY ACQUISITIONS EMAIL: MARIAS@COMP PHONE: (501) 575-4657 OR FAX: (501) 575-6656 MARIAS@SATURN \\\|/// (O O) U O .........thanks.... - ----------------------------oooO-------Oooo----------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 95 09:49:52 PST From: michael.di.matteo@autodesk.com Subject: Male dressforms different? Why? I am curious. Why does a men's clothing form have a opening at the waist and a female dressmakers form doesn't. It sounds like a crazy question, and it shouldn't make any difference when draping fabric, but it's been on my mind ever since I got the forms. I just have to know. Mike in California ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 95 12:21:37 PST From: michael.di.matteo@autodesk.com Subject: Any Japanese-based lists out there? I know that this board is for passing of information on costuming and not seeking help, but I do not have access to AOL or any other service. I can only communicate with addresses that I know. Does anyone know of any Japanese based lists. I am looking to communicate with others who are into the Japanese way of life. From costuming (native clothing construction of:) to house decor to Pen Paling: electronic to snail mail. Sorry if I have over stepped my limit with the board. But I am desperate. Mike in California. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 13:15:25 -0800 (PST) From: "erin k. gault" Subject: caning Hello everyone. I am trying to make a wheel farthingale and I am having a really tough time trying to find the correct cane to use in it. All of the caning they have at the craft stores (Ben Franklin, etc.) is much too thin and is in very short lengths. Does anybody know of any good mail order sources for the right stuff? I'm not even sure exactly what I should be using. Perhaps there is something to substitute for it? I was hoping to have this made by January 12 but it doesn't look like I'll be able to. I think for now I'll just make a few hip pads to make the correct shape (like in Hunnisett). Thanks for your help! ***************************************************************** * Erin K. Gault Evergreen State College * * Eglentyne de Gaulle College of Witt's Haven * * Barony of Glymm Mere, Kingdom of An Tir * * e-mail: gaulte@elwha.evergreen.edu * ***************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 18:10:34 -500 From: "Carol Kocian" Subject: Fine linen thread Another source for fine linen thread in Frederick Fawcett. Their phone number is easy - 1-800-BUY-YARN Weaving yarn is frequently one ply, which is unsuitable for sewing. One ply thread tends to pull apart as you try to stitch with it. Remember that weaving yarns are meant to be strong in combination with the other warp & weft yarns, not on their own! Lacemaking thread is plied so the lace won't be fuzzy, and it makes wonderful handsewing thread (as mentioned before.) -Carol Kocian ckocian@epe.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 17:41:06 -0700 From: cwood@primenet.com Subject: Re: Why Wear a Corset? >Greetings! > >Please forgive my ignorance and please help me with this question. >Should I or should I not wear a corset? >I will be wearing a Renaissance Maiden costume and want a push up effect in >the bosom. Now, can the same effect be achieved by using a push-up bra, or >does the corset do other things that I'm not aware of. >My measurements are 36-25-36. Do I need a corset or not?? > >Thanks in advance for your help! > >Krista >sunfire@muskoka.com > > Yes. The outer sillouette is entirely dependent on the underpinnings. Would you go to work not wearing a bra? Probably not, if for no other reason than you wouldn't "look right." The line of an Elizabethean gown is entirely dependent on the correct corset. A push up bra will push you up, but not necessarily gird you in. You could make a bodice with stays, but if you are going to do that, might as well make the corset. Elizabethean corsets are fast and easy to make. Even a novice sewer like me can do it. You'll look better and feel more comfortable. Eliz. corsets did not constrict the waist, they merely made the entire torso into a sort of tube. And in my humble opinion, they do a better job than a push up bra in giving you amazing clevage. It's not that difficult to be correct and believe me, taking the little bit of extra trouble is worth in it the long run. Check out the Eliz. corset construction web page and go for it! Ysa ps I hope I didn't sound strident, but one of my pet peeves is people who go to a lot of trouble with the outerwear and then skip on the underwear. Remember, they aren't called foundation garments for nothing! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Dec 1995 17:29:40 -0800 From: fishcat@hooked.net (Trystan L. Bass) Subject: Re: Why Wear a Corset? >Please forgive my ignorance and please help me with this question. >Should I or should I not wear a corset? >I will be wearing a Renaissance Maiden costume and want a push up effect in >the bosom. Now, can the same effect be achieved by using a push-up bra, or >does the corset do other things that I'm not aware of. >My measurements are 36-25-36. Do I need a corset or not?? It's entirely a matter of personal choice! Are you attenting a Ren. faire or working one? If you're working one, do they have particular costuming standards? If not, and you're just wearing the costume for fun, there's no need to go thru the hassle of making and wearing a corset unless you really want to. Also, you call it a "ren. maiden" costume, which sounds like peasant class to me. In that case, the historical sillouhette is less rigid & cone-shaped than a noblewoman's gown would be, so a corset would be unneeded. A decent peasant bodice should have some boning to help shape you, & you could even add that push-up bra for extra "oomph"! - --Trystan (one of the only people on this list who is *not* a big corset fan!) fishcat@hooked.net @->->-- Trystan L. Bass --<-<-@ TrystBass@aol.com http://www.hooked.net/users/fishcat/ ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 1995 17:53:22 -0800 From: "Carole Newson-Smith" Subject: Re: Why Wear a Corset? Reply to: RE>>Why Wear a Corset? Trystan writes: :unneeded. A decent peasant bodice should have some boning to help shape :you, & you could even add that push-up bra for extra "oomph"! Trystan, Have you ever tried wearing a bodice and a bra at the same time? I have, and it's mighty uncomfortable for me. Besides, the bodice does all the pushing up I am ever likely to want, and more than I've ever been able to achieve with 20th century undies. Cordelia ------------------------------ End of H-Costume Digest V3 #273 ******************************* A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, send the command lines: unsubscribe h-costume-digest subscribe h-costume end in the body of a message to majordomo@lunch.engr.sgi.com. Thanks and enjoy the list!