From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 02:12:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416CBqa011833 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 02:12:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416BDdx021782 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 00:11:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416BCMB023142; Thu, 1 May 2003 00:11:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416BAMB023129 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 00:11:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AAA41A90076; Thu, 01 May 2003 01:11:48 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA7E33021A; Thu, 01 May 2003 01:11:10 -0500 Message-ID: <01bb01c30fa8$3b61e6a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200304291938.h3TJcR2F019874@net.indra.com><5.1.0.14.0.20030429144800.02ccd708@127.0.0.1><5.2.0.9.0.20030429170510.00aa5550@pop.sonic.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030429192646.00aed4b0@pop.sonic.net><013e01c30ec5$fb9380c0$6501a8c0@sharon><003801c30ecd$a5de4e00$d71277d8@pavilion><005601c30f1f$50204200$6501a8c0@sharon><002601c30f22$2407c6e0$a80477d8@pavilion><008401c30f25$809d39a0$6501a8c0@sharon> <003d01c30f28$2e377240$a80477d8@pavilion> Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 02:09:31 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] Re: Internships X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The majority of my interns are over 30 y.o. Most of you remember Kelly who was on the list. She was my intern and I taught her how to build webpages and work with graphics. I gave her a job referral to Ford Motor Co. in Detroit and she became their principal web designer making over $75,000 a year. She had no other experience but with me. The portfolio she showed them was on my website. Yes, Ford called about the referral and me asked about her work experience with me. BTW, she was over 30 y.o. changing careers. I have meet a lot of people doing internships at Costume Society of America meetings. They are working for museums and professors unpaid. They sing praises for about their learning experiences. On the other hand, talking with the curators and professors, they are pleased as punch and proud to introduce the interns around the groups. As for volunteering, I volunteered for three years for CSA as their webmaster. I meet so many people. Most people remember me in the society for being the webmaster. I also graduated from college when I was 40 y.o. I have done a lot of volunteering over the years. I have been a landscaper (not a grounds keeper) for our very large church, parish neighborhood chair for over 40 neighborhoods, board member for parish council, served on regional and national CSA symposium committees, and cubmaster & den leader for 7 years. I have learned so much from all of these unpaid positions. I like to think that all of these experiences have made me the person I am. Yes, I have listed these experiences on my resume and have never had someone turn their nose up at them. Gee... you never know, someone interviewing me might be Catholic, a former Boy Scout or leader, or a member of CSA. Every little bit helps. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 02:54:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416stqa024347 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 02:54:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416rtdx024014 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 00:53:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416rsMB008980; Thu, 1 May 2003 00:53:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416roMB008949 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 00:53:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.171]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/linuxconf) with SMTP id h4179LM21977 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 17:09:24 +1000 Message-ID: <076901c30fae$c77d2720$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 16:54:34 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO To all UK H-Costers: My husband and I are booked to go to England (and a little bit of Wales) this September. We're arriving on the 8th and travelling around the country for till the 27th, and spending the last week in London, leaving on the 6th of October. We'll have a small car for the time we're travelling around the country. Is there any good reenactment fairs (with traders) that we shouldn't miss while we're there? Our current interests are ECW, 8th-10th century Anglo-Saxon and Anglo-Danish and 1st century Romanised-British, but we enjoy everything from 1st century to mid 17th century. Thanks heaps, Glenda. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 02:56:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416uFqa024754 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 02:56:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416tDdx024114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 00:55:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416tDZY009559; Thu, 1 May 2003 00:55:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net (turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.126]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h416tAZY009539 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 00:55:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-008-019.jps.net ([216.119.8.19] helo=pavilion) by turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19B7yH-000682-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 23:55:10 -0700 Message-ID: <001001c30fb0$619f5ac0$130877d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030430135051.052ba8f0@mail.frys.com> <000101c30df9$d5116290$723ba7d1@Elizabeth> <4.3.1.2.20030430220910.051b2590@mail.frys.com> Subject: Self supporting costumers??? was Re: [h-cost] original question A costumer's dream career? Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 00:07:49 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" > Question - is anyone on this list actually self-supporting by > costuming? That is, with nobody else paying your rent and living expenses > or renting you studio/shop space or paying your operating expenses, and > costuming is your only job? I can think of two among the total of my > acquaintances, but they're not on this list. I'd be surprised if there > were as many as five here. > Not me! And full time work is not something that is a goal for me either although as a supplemental income it's great. I like the research and test garments more than commercial production and I'm very picky about the jobs I do for other people, although I am generous with resources and assistance for those trying to learn the craft. I don't work for the "exposure" or "experience" anymore, but it was valueable to me at one time to do so. I will volunteer my services if the cause is right for small projects. I enjoy other work in addition to costuming, event planning is fun too. Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 04:12:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h418Cgqa024139 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 04:12:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h418Badx027945 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 02:11:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h418BXrk006745; Thu, 1 May 2003 02:11:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41510.mail.yahoo.com (web41510.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.93]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h418BVrk006689 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 02:11:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030501081125.99437.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41510.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 01 May 2003 09:11:25 BST Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:11:25 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT A robinhood Convention looking for costumers etc .. To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030430195528.24994.qmail@web12501.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ahhh, but that's nothing like the REAL Robin of Sherwood convention 'Silver Arrow' where every year members of the cast still turn up, especially this year the 20th anniversary. *teasing grin* I'm just envious you know, because this year's convention here in the homeland was sold out already! *winge* I agree, a good looking man in tights is yummy, but nothing compared to a good looking man in studded black leather or a good looking man in blue cloaks. :-) Have fun! Nicole --- Lil Sorepaws wrote: > Hi there, just got this through one of my SCA lists and thought it may > interest a few of you in the SE Michigan or midwest area ... > > Weekend in Sherwood, the Spirit of Sherwood RoS convention > > Spirit of Sherwood organises an annual three-days RoS con > called 'Weekend in Sherwood' in Michigan, USA. The next one, Weekend > in Sherwood VIII, will be held Fri-Sun July 4-6, 2003 at the Holiday > Inn in Farmington Hills (a suburb of Detroit), Michigan, USA. > > We will be looking for fan panellists, filkers, "archers", costumers, > artists, dealers, volunteers (gofers), and some staff positions! > > http://dutepp0.et.tudelft.nl/~tirza/RoS/ > > Have fun ;) > > - Lil (I love a good looking man in tights ;) > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 04:52:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h418qHqa010603 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 04:52:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h418pEdx029645 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 02:51:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h418pDrk019890; Thu, 1 May 2003 02:51:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay02.roc.frontiernet.net (relay02.roc.frontiernet.net [66.133.131.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h418p9rk019848 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 02:51:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 3836 invoked from network); 1 May 2003 08:51:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO livingroom) ([65.73.37.71]) (envelope-sender ) by relay02.roc.frontiernet.net (FrontierMTA 2.3.2) with SMTP for ; 1 May 2003 08:51:08 -0000 Message-ID: <006201c30fbe$cea182c0$01fea8c0@livingroom> From: "Lyn Greaves- home" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030430135051.052ba8f0@mail.frys.com><000101c30df9$d5116290$723ba7d1@Elizabeth><4.3.1.2.20030430220910.051b2590@mail.frys.com> <001001c30fb0$619f5ac0$130877d8@pavilion> Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 04:51:07 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [h-cost] Re: Self supporting costumers??? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" > > > Question - is anyone on this list actually self-supporting by > > costuming? That is, with nobody else paying your rent and living expenses > > or renting you studio/shop space or paying your operating expenses, and > > costuming is your only job? I can think of two among the total of my > > acquaintances, but they're not on this list. I'd be surprised if there > > were as many as five here. Yup- that would describe me. My husband has been out of work since February- thus, the costuming/design business has been paying for itself and all of the household expenses, since unemployment is diddly. . . At least I have 11 years of being supplemental income to bolster business. Not something I would recommend with 2 kids, 4 cats, and one husband underfoot at all times. . . Lyn Greaves www.thornyrose.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 07:21:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41BLaqa010892 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:21:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41BKOdx011984 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 05:20:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41BKLFL012285; Thu, 1 May 2003 05:20:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41B6bFL006006 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 05:06:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h41B6ap04203.; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:06:36 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 01 May 2003 12:06:36 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 12:06:06 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h41B6bFL006006 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO As Glenda says, we saw this series some time ago in the UK. IIRC it was filmed at a house in the Scottish Border country. I thought the butler was the most convincing. He said he had taken the role as a tribute to his grandfather who was a real butler. Personally I thought the kitchenmaid who didn't even last one day was ridiculous, and a waste of everyone's time; why had she volunteered for the project with so little thought, and why hadn't the TV company briefed her properly on what to expect? I think it was on Channel Four's website for the series that Antonia admitted that she had used modern sanitary protection (because if she had had an accident she would still have had to wear the same dress for the rest of the week). The comment about the Family having little time to develop personal relationships was to me one of the most interesting revelations. You would imagine that such a lifestyle would allow ample leisure time for sisters to talk in private, but I suppose the requirement for several changes of clothes per day, always necessitating the presence of a servant, must have been very time-consuming. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 07:44:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Bi2qa010921 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:44:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Bcmdx018689 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 05:38:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41BclFL025559; Thu, 1 May 2003 05:38:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41BN7FL014334 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 05:23:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h41BN6p05342.; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:23:06 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 01 May 2003 12:23:06 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 12:23:00 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h41BN7FL014334 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Glenda, September is the tail-end of the reenactment season here (nights are getting chilly for camping). I think the Sealed Knot (ECW) does have some events planned, but I don't have the list with me and won't be back at my computer until next Tuesday. However, the traders available to the public at our events are generally of the "souvenir stall" variety; merchants usually set up in the "members only" area. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 08:17:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41CH8qa010980 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:17:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41C8fdx020575 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 06:08:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41C8dfL011575; Thu, 1 May 2003 06:08:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41C8afL011507 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 06:08:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Marionetta@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.134.1f19dfa6 (4328) for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:08:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Marionetta@aol.com Message-ID: <134.1f19dfa6.2be2683a@aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 08:08:26 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] manor house and hobbles X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all, I just had a question about the hobble used in manor house. They showed the lady of the house putting a hobble around her legs which they there then going to put a hobble skirt over. Was this really done? I dont remember ever reading anything about ankles being actually hobbled...but then I dont know all that much about that era. Cheers, Loren Dearborn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 08:53:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Cruqa011087 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:53:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41CqIdx023545 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 06:52:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41CqGfL002298; Thu, 1 May 2003 06:52:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41CqBfL002202 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 06:52:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.110] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A556153C019C; Thu, 01 May 2003 08:38:46 -0400 Message-ID: <003101c30fe0$e7968c40$6e5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "H-Costume" Subject: Fw: [h-cost] Manor House Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 08:55:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I"m not sure if you character descriptions are for the actors or the Personages when you describe them...particularly for the Grands. I think Sir John has a lot of guts to tough out the class stance he is expected to uphold. Milady likewise works at keeping her place but here again, the modern woman (memories?) give her more than one reflection about whether or not she will last the three months of the Life. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 4:01 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House > > I did notice a lot of whining from everyone, but I agree that it seems > > that nearly all the younger servants seem to have gone in with no idea > > what they were getting into. I did notice in the intro that most of > > them were part-time employed before - maybe just not used to working? > > The scullery maid who was from a farm environment seemed to handle it > > better - until she fell for the hall-boy, that is. > > I think there's a lot less whining compared to "1900 House" and > "Frontier House", honestly. However, I think there's definitely some > discipline problems with the kids in the serving staff. That hall boy > is just a git. I can't stand him, his shifty little eyes... Yech. > Now, the first footman, however, is totally yummy. Strong, silent, a > total knockout in that uniform... ;) > > > I think they would not have been able to get people who "knew what > > they were getting into" very easily - how many of us can just drop our > > jobs and paychecks for three months to do something like this? (It is > > stressed that they were "volunteers"). I would love to try something > > like this, and I think I could take it if I looked at it like an > > acting excercise AND I knew it was for only three months. Even as > > First Housemaid, however, the sheer amount of dust would probably send > > me into asthmatic shock in about three days. > > I actually think the majority of the staff went in knowing they'd be up > for a challenge, but had a really hard time giving up their basic human > rights that they figured were 100% guaranteed. Most of them, > particularly the females, really did not understand that they were not > going to be allowed any of the freedoms they take for granted now, such > as weekends, free speech, decent working conditions, etc. The only > ones who seemed utterly clueless were the first two of the scullery > maids who absolutely could not cope with *anything*. The third one > seemed like a smart girl until she got all gooey over the nasty hall > boy creature. > > > I found the end of episode 4 very interesting, where the "lady"'s > > sister gets sent off by a doctor on holiday because she is so stressed > > out from not being allowed to do anything or be anything. It really > > lets you in to the headspace of the era. The Lord seems to be taking > > to it quite easily, and getting pompous and insensitive as a result. > > Many of the Family said that the extreme formality, and the fact that > > no one ever really talks to each other is putting increasing distance > > on their presonal relationships, which are getting "strage" as they > > put it. Veyr enlightening. > > I think Sir John is totally clueless. This is a world that was totally > set up to cater directly to him and he's absolutely oblivious to the > pain that's going on with the staff and even his own family. I don't > think he's a bad guy in the least... He just illustrates how blind a > person can become when they are basically allowed all the freedom in > the world at the expense of others. I think Milady is at least a > little more concerned with the feelings of the staff and her children, > but even she's a little blinded by the pampering and primping. Master > Guy, the 10 year old, is absolutely adorable, and he's the one who is > the most perceptive of the bunch, as he can move freely between the > upstairs and the downstairs and while he's not really aware of the > hardships of the staff, he at least has a better idea of both worlds. > > And I definitely think the butler takes everything far too personally... > > Looking forward to tonight's conclusion! > > Sarah > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:03:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41D3Qqa011123 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:03:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41D2Qdx024323 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:02:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41D2Pq2006807; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:02:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41D2Nq2006667 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:02:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.110] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7BBD7501A4; Thu, 01 May 2003 08:48:59 -0400 Message-ID: <006701c30fe2$555eaf40$6e5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00be01c30ee4$d7ea6160$820377d8@w7m1l6><004501c30f49$58dca3f0$056d0dcf@gateway> <006001c30f4f$a86aa420$b60277d8@w7m1l6> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:05:22 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Do we see some Red Necks out there? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Bergdahl" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 3:35 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? > Hell as far as I am concerned they can have the southern part of the state > back. It's only good for fabric, and someplace to send our waste water. > > Stephen > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Joan Broneske" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 11:50 AM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? > > > > Well, you probably won't have to worry about that too much longer, since > > Mexico is slowly but surely taking it back. > > > > > > ,%%%, > > --==% `%%%, > > |' )`%%, > > \_/\ @%%, > > __@@" %%%--"""-.%, > > /`__| \%% > > \\ \ / | /'%, > > \] | /----'. < `%, > > Joan Broneske || `>> > > > unicorn@softcom.net || ///` > > /( //( > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Stephen Bergdahl" > > To: "Historical Costume" > > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 11:50 PM > > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Sarah" > > > To: "Historical Costume" > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 7:09 PM > > > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? > > > > > > > > > I can see Regency and 18th century > > > > reenactment being a bigger priority on the East Coast, which has a > > > > personal history that dates back that far. Whereas most people in > > > > California only know that things started to get going around the > > > > 1850's, so the personal interest in reenacting groups is more focused > > > > on the last 150 years or so. > > > > > > > > > > That is a problem with the schools out here in California. They only > > teach > > > history of California starting with the 1850's. But we have a much > longer > > > history than just when the US stole California from Mexico. The > pre-gold > > > rush history is rich with intrusting people and clothing. But it is all > > > sweep under the rug, because a lot of people don't want to face facts. > > > > > > Stephen - On his soap box. > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:08:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41D80qa011151 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:08:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41D72dx024638 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:07:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41D72q2009045; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:07:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41D6xq2008979 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:07:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a223.in-tch.com [66.62.107.23]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h41Cmsv03508 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 06:48:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EB11C42.68E0CCE8@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 07:08:18 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "h-costume@indra.com" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Another GFD question.... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey, Robin, when planning on making two gowns, one to be worn over the other, does one need to add ease to the outer garment? And how? by separately fitting the outer layers *over* the inner gown? or by figuring a set amount into increasing the seams? --sue, counting on using KWCS this fall as a "goal" to get her outfit done..... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:11:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DBnqa011156 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:11:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DAkdx024950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:10:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DAkq2010424; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:10:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay2.primushost.com (relay2.primushost.com [207.244.125.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DAhq3010410 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:10:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from (shell3.shore.net) [207.244.124.103] by relay2.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 19BDs9-0001at-00; Thu, 01 May 2003 09:13:13 -0400 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for id 19BDps-0001qO-00; Thu, 01 May 2003 09:10:52 -0400 Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:10:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Katy Bishop To: sewinggoddess@att.net Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: wedding dressses In-Reply-To: <200305010324.h413OK38010066@net.indra.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: Historical Costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I used to do weddings before I had twins. Now I can't handle the deadlines so well. At least vintage ballgowns will be worn more than once so the trims can sometimes wait for the second wearing. I have a few favorite anecdotes from my wedding days. One where the brides grandmother wanted to make sure her granddaughter had enough cleavage. Another where the bride asked me if the gown we had designed would still be fashionable when she got married in 6 months! A third bride called me and said she wanted to come back and redesign her gown without her Mom. I had many period wedding dress requests,and a lot of mothers' and grandmothers' gowns to redo. That was always very satisfying work, they are so happy to wear the gown after it is brought back to life! Dissapointingly, a lot of the requests for Victorian wedding gowns (I advertised as Victorian reproduction gowns a specialty) were just the standard modern puffed sleeve gown that bore little resemblance to an actual Victorian gown. I also found that the customers I got from advertising in the Boston Globe newspaper were more able to appreciate and willing to pay for a custom made gown than those who came from ads in the local bridal magazine (to which any bride could get a free subscription). Doing wedding gowns was a great experience in having to figure out a wide variety of construction techniques, fabrics and working with very varying personalities. It was also fun to deal with people during a very happy time in their lives. One of my favorites was an 18th Century wedding where I did both the bride, groom, bridesmaids and mother; the groom was having as much fun with the costumes as the bride was. Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:14:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DE2qa011159 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:14:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DD3dx025166 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:13:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DD2q2011585; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:13:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DBfq2010886 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:11:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.110] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A9E91F000184; Thu, 01 May 2003 08:58:17 -0400 Message-ID: <007901c30fe3$a1d3a1e0$6e5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200304301803.h3UI3G2k003132@net.indra.com><3EB025D6.3040206@ripco.com> <00ca01c30f83$2ea789d0$befc8218@hopperflop2> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:14:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My reaction to this segment was that we would be hearing from the lady as she found something to do...like join the Suffrage Movement. I think it is no accident that the Movement drew so many intelligent women to the force from the many who were educated but unemployable because of their class. Except as a companion governess... Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 9:44 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "zski" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 12:36 PM > Subject: RE: [h-cost] Manor House > > > > > I found the end of episode 4 very interesting, where the "lady"'s sister > > gets sent off by a doctor on holiday because she is so stressed out from > > not being allowed to do anything or be anything. It really lets you in > > to the headspace of the era. The Lord seems to be taking to it quite > > easily, and getting pompous and insensitive as a result. Many of the > > Family said that the extreme formality, and the fact that no one ever > > really talks to each other is putting increasing distance on their > > presonal relationships, which are getting "strage" as they put it. Veyr > > enlightening. > > Although what irked me about this (and always does in similar situations) is > that the way this was portrayed was that it would have upset Edwardian > people just as much. Obviously the people in the "Manor House" program are > bringing their modern expectations and experiences with them. An Edwardian > woman may have felt similarly to Miss Anson (the Lady's sister), but she may > not have, or she may have felt something we can't even imagine. > > - Kendra > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:19:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DJOqa011168 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:19:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DINdx025526 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:18:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DIMq2013856; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:18:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41506.mail.yahoo.com (web41506.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.89]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h41DIKq2013816 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:18:20 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030501131815.34148.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41506.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 01 May 2003 14:18:15 BST Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 14:18:15 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <006701c30fe2$555eaf40$6e5183d1@rmitchellras> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > Do we see some Red Necks out there? > Kathleen What the doodah are Red Necks???????????????? Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:20:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DK0qa011171 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:20:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DJ2dx025569 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:19:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DJ2q2014143; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:19:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.115]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DJ0q2014116 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:19:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [68.51.39.139] (pcp456688pcs.shklfd01.ar.comcast.net [68.51.39.139]) by mtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HE7005POM9YSO@mtaout02.icomcast.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 01 May 2003 09:17:58 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 08:17:52 -0500 From: Allison In-reply-to: <200305010445.h414jJHO018220@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com, "Margo's Patterns List" Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: [h-cost] Re: "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Margo's new signature line is this: > "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" I have heard of this (historical fiction?) writer. What I want to know is why the comparison? And I suppose now I must read her books?! Like I don't have enough on my plate - because I believe her books are about eleventy-thousand pages long. aaaargh. Allison P. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:29:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DTrqa011189 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:29:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DSWdx026389 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:28:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DSVq2018651; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:28:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DSIq2018515 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:28:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a223.in-tch.com [66.62.107.23]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h41DACv16926 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:10:12 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EB1213F.5FD7F16C@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 07:29:35 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? References: <20030501131815.34148.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A, -uhm-, less-than-complimentary (American) slang term used to refer to those who are, well, -uhm- stereotypically reactionary/conservative (as in, NOT a thinking conservative), usually poorly educated, lower-class, prone to bigotry and disdain for just about anybody different. At least in my experience, more of a "rural" than "urban" flavor to the stereotype. I always thought the origins of the word came from the (sunburned) red necks of the (usually) white men described by the term.... --Sue N Kipar wrote: > > --- Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > Do we see some Red Necks > out there? > > Kathleen > > What the doodah are Red Necks???????????????? > > Nicole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:30:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DU2qa011195 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:30:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DT1dx026417 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:29:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DT1q2018859; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:29:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DSwq2018816 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:28:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.110] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id ADF61FA10184; Thu, 01 May 2003 09:15:34 -0400 Message-ID: <00a701c30fe6$0c2ee340$6e5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:31:57 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you have no outside life or are not addicted to getting a life from books, it is not surprising the women don't use their leisure time for conversation. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 7:06 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House > As Glenda says, we saw this series some time ago in the UK. IIRC it was filmed at a house in the Scottish Border country. > I thought the butler was the most convincing. He said he had taken the role as a tribute to his grandfather who was a real butler. > Personally I thought the kitchenmaid who didn't even last one day was ridiculous, and a waste of everyone's time; why had she volunteered for the project with so little thought, and why hadn't the TV company briefed her properly on what to expect? > I think it was on Channel Four's website for the series that Antonia admitted that she had used modern sanitary protection (because if she had had an accident she would still have had to wear the same dress for the rest of the week). > The comment about the Family having little time to develop personal relationships was to me one of the most interesting revelations. You would imagine that such a lifestyle would allow ample leisure time for sisters to talk in private, but I suppose the requirement for several changes of clothes per day, always necessitating the presence of a servant, must have been very time-consuming. > > Kate Bunting > Library, University of Derby > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:37:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dbvqa011205 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:37:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dahdx027245 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:36:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dagq2022501; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:36:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dadq2022462 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:36:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.110] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AFC3DFD01A4; Thu, 01 May 2003 09:23:15 -0400 Message-ID: <00af01c30fe7$1eecc000$6e5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <134.1f19dfa6.2be2683a@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] manor house and hobbles Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:39:41 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have seen two skirts with a hobble rigging attached to the lining . They were set at about knee level. With the strait skirts recently in fashion, the gait would be the same if they were not sporting suvh long vents or splits. I have often thought the style was the last "fettering" of female movement/activity left over from the various strictures of the Victorian Age. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 8:08 AM Subject: [h-cost] manor house and hobbles > > Hi all, > > I just had a question about the hobble used in manor house. They showed the > lady of the house putting a hobble around her legs which they there then > going to put a hobble skirt over. Was this really done? I dont remember > ever reading anything about ankles being actually hobbled...but then I dont > know all that much about that era. > > Cheers, > > Loren Dearborn > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:38:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dcdqa011213 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:38:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DbYdx027330 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:37:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DbXq2022851; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:37:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail020.syd.optusnet.com.au (mail020.syd.optusnet.com.au [210.49.20.135]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DbTq2022797 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:37:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from valadan (c17417.brodm1.vic.optusnet.com.au [210.49.162.24]) h41DbNG24555 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 23:37:24 +1000 Message-ID: <01a201c30fe7$3135d760$18a231d2@valadan> From: "Baralier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 23:39:24 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I think it was on Channel Four's website for the series that Antonia admitted that she had used modern sanitary protection (because if she had had an accident she would still have had to wear the same dress for the rest of the week). There are some interesting tid-bits on the website and some of the "unscreened" interviews as well as thoughts from the participants after the series finished. Check out http://www.channel4.com/history/microsites/C/countryhouse/index.html Jess is still my favourite :-) Paul -- It's easier to ask forgiveness than to get permission. - W. Slovotsky http://members.optushome.com.au/velvetspyder Costumier & Reprobate _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:48:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DmTqa011239 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:48:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DlQdx028202 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:47:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DlPq2027098; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:47:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41509.mail.yahoo.com (web41509.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.92]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h41DlNq2027052 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:47:24 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030501134718.48924.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41509.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 01 May 2003 14:47:18 BST Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 14:47:18 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <3EB1213F.5FD7F16C@in-tch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Aha! Thanks for the explanation, I got it, even with all the 'uhms'. *G* But isn't it then a mean thing to say to someone else here? Back to the strawberries and coffee ;-) Nicole --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > A, -uhm-, less-than-complimentary (American) slang term used to refer to > those who are, well, -uhm- stereotypically reactionary/conservative (as > in, NOT a thinking conservative), usually poorly educated, lower-class, > prone to bigotry and disdain for just about anybody different. At least > in my experience, more of a "rural" than "urban" flavor to the > stereotype. > I always thought the origins of the word came from the (sunburned) red > necks of the (usually) white men described by the term.... > --Sue > > N Kipar wrote: > > > > --- Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > Do we see some Red > Necks > > out there? > > > Kathleen > > > > What the doodah are Red Necks???????????????? > > > > Nicole > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:52:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dqlqa011248 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:52:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dpkdx028607 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:51:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dpkq2029009; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:51:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dpeq2028977 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:51:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail22.ureach.com (mail22.ureach.com [172.16.2.82]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA17266 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:51:40 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-33-100-243.asm.bellsouth.net [67.33.100.243]) by mail22.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA16707 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:51:40 -0400 Message-ID: <07b801c30fe8$6d10e940$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EB11C42.68E0CCE8@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Another GFD question.... Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:49:02 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am also planning on attending the KWCS. Is anyone else going? I am new to this list, but it is so active I feel like I know you all already! My husband is going with me (he actually WANTS to go!), but it would be nice to put faces with names. :) Teena who is also hoping to have spiffy new stuff for KWCS, but has to make spiffy new stuff for KWHS first. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 9:08 AM Subject: [h-cost] Another GFD question.... > Hey, Robin, when planning on making two gowns, one to be worn over the > other, does one need to add ease to the outer garment? And how? by > separately fitting the outer layers *over* the inner gown? or by > figuring a set amount into increasing the seams? > --sue, counting on using KWCS this fall as a "goal" to get her outfit > done..... > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 09:59:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dx3qa011254 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:59:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Dvtdx029436 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 07:57:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DvsY3001786; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:57:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41DvpY3001759 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:57:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail22.ureach.com (mail22.ureach.com [172.16.2.82]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA19063 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:57:50 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-33-100-243.asm.bellsouth.net [67.33.100.243]) by mail22.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA22224 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:57:50 -0400 Message-ID: <07c901c30fe9$49e8b550$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:55:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hmm..... Diana Gabaldon wrote books about a woman who went back in time and fell in love with a handsome Scot named Jamie and brought him back with her. (I only read 3 books in the series) Perhaps Margo went back in time to Elizabethan England and fell in love with a bodice that she brought back with her? ;-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Allison" To: ; "Margo's Patterns List" Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 9:17 AM Subject: [h-cost] Re: "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" > Margo's new signature line is this: > > "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" > I have heard of this (historical fiction?) writer. What I want to know is > why the comparison? And I suppose now I must read her books?! Like I don't > have enough on my plate - because I believe her books are about > eleventy-thousand pages long. aaaargh. > Allison P. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 10:22:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EMFqa011317 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:22:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EL7dx005249 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 08:21:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EL4Y3015285; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:21:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EKxY3015100 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:20:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LLWatts@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.65.fffe567 (30950) for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:20:49 -0400 (EDT) From: LLWatts@aol.com Message-ID: <65.fffe567.2be28740@aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 10:20:48 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume business, internships, volunteering and value X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Very OT, I know, but I'm getting caught up on digests and this jumped out: >>> When people ask me why something costs so much. I ask > > them what they make in an hour, and why what they do costs so much? This > usually shuts > them up. > > Amazingly, my dentist husband, gets the same questions... undervaluing a > service is not > just a costumers plight evidently. > >>> My stepfather is an ordained minister, and though he's past retirement age he has a part-time associate minister position just to keep his brain ticking over. Last fall the budget committee at his church had to deal with a major financial shortage. Part of their solution was to 1) cut his job and 2) tell him they're so happy with what he's been doing that they'd like him to continue working in the same job _as a volunteer_ (in other words, for free). OK, back to on topic posts now. Leah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 10:52:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Eqpqa011370 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:52:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Eoudx013222 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 08:50:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EouY3003292; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:50:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from janus.directcon.net (janus.directcon.net [206.170.184.16]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EoqY3003249 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:50:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dnyeaqvf (r14a107.directcon.net [207.215.72.107]) by janus.directcon.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h41ErQT06859; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:53:26 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20030501075318.00b4eb60@pop.directcon.net> X-Sender: margospatterns@pop.directcon.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 07:53:18 -0700 To: Historical Costume , Historical Costume From: Margo Anderson Subject: Re: [h-cost] original question A costumer's dream career? In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030430220910.051b2590@mail.frys.com> References: <3.0.6.32.20030430155102.00b42250@pop.directcon.net> <4.3.1.2.20030430135051.052ba8f0@mail.frys.com> <000101c30df9$d5116290$723ba7d1@Elizabeth> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Question - is anyone on this list actually self-supporting by >costuming? That is, with nobody else paying your rent and living expenses >or renting you studio/shop space or paying your operating expenses, and >costuming is your only job? Well, not by costuming, but the costume pattern business plus my husband's tiny unemployment check is currently supporting my family and me. Thank heavens, he's found lucrative freelance work so that's about to change, but it's felt really great to be able to do it, especially since he did support me for a long time while I was trying to make a living costuming and while I was developing the business. Margo "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 10:54:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Eseqa011458 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:54:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Erodx013647 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 08:53:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41ErnY3005224; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:53:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m05.mx.aol.com (imo-m05.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41ErLY3004878 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:53:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from JAzo478796@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.179.199aaada (4222) for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:53:14 -0400 (EDT) From: JAzo478796@aol.com Message-ID: <179.199aaada.2be28ed9@aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 10:53:13 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 10577 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] period costume classifieds X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Everyone: I'm not sure if this is an acceptable topic for the list or not so please excuse me if it's an affront to list sensibilities. We're getting ready to lay out our debut issue of Vintage Fashion magazine and we're looking for people who have services or products to advertise in our classifieds. Research, costume design and production, accessories, music, conservation - anything related to period apparel, historical costume or antique textiles. Please contact me if you're interested. Thanks, Julia _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 10:57:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EvQqa011465 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:57:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Et2eb013786 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 08:56:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EkJY3000192; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:46:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EkEY3029980 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:46:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.105] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A0111B77018E; Thu, 01 May 2003 10:32:49 -0400 Message-ID: <001501c30ff0$d7268760$695183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030501131815.34148.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> <3EB1213F.5FD7F16C@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 10:49:16 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you Sue for the concise explanation. I too understand that it's derivation came from sun burned necks of people who worked in the fields. When you consider the lengths one would take to avoid signs of sun exposure via bonnets, veils, or even to staying inside, if the attitudes of mind were not also protective or enlightened, a red neck could also be a Red Neck. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 9:29 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? > A, -uhm-, less-than-complimentary (American) slang term used to refer to > those who are, well, -uhm- stereotypically reactionary/conservative (as > in, NOT a thinking conservative), usually poorly educated, lower-class, > prone to bigotry and disdain for just about anybody different. At least > in my experience, more of a "rural" than "urban" flavor to the > stereotype. > I always thought the origins of the word came from the (sunburned) red > necks of the (usually) white men described by the term.... > --Sue > > N Kipar wrote: > > > > --- Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > Do we see some Red Necks > > out there? > > > Kathleen > > > > What the doodah are Red Necks???????????????? > > > > Nicole > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 10:58:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EwFqa011470 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:58:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EvFdx014179 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 08:57:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41EvF0Y007496; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:57:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (root@mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Etk0Y006476 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:55:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bently (dialport58.tukwila.eskimo.net [208.187.8.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with SMTP id HAA01304 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 07:55:39 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <009701c30ff1$83b7c660$0d08bbd0@bently> From: "David" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305010324.h413OK38010066@net.indra.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: wedding dressses Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 07:53:59 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I can vouch that non-stressed brides exist...I was one of them. I didn't care what I wore (wound up with my Aunt's 1958 crinolined lace dress), didn't care where I got married, didn't care who was there -- all I cared about was marrying David, anytime, anywhere. And after 23 years, I still feel the same way! I just let my Mom make whatever arrangements she thought were needed, showed up when she told me to, got married and so far have lived happily ever after. Pam Dotson ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 8:24 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: wedding dressses > Non-stressed bride---- > > Yes they do exist, rare and very few in the world, but I did actually have > the pleasure of sewing for one. We had designed a Medieval-oid gown for her > with silk chiffon flowy sleeves and a small amount of embellishment around the > bodice detail. The Caveat? She was four months pregnant when I measured her and > would be seven months pregnant at the wedding. Mock up done at four and half > months. We had another friend present at the fitting who happened to be > a nurse, and between the three of us we took an educated guess at *how* > pregnant she would be at the time of the wedding. Sooooo... withthe help of a > stragecally placed pillow we took "final" measurements and I commenced with > my guess-dress. Just in case she got *really* pregnant early, I had a two inch > allowance safety margin in the side seams. > She was also the most low stress bride I have ever worked with. WE went > shopping for fabrics once, ordered the silk chiffon online and when the fabrics > came in, I asked if she wanted to go shopping to finalize everything. Her > answer.. " No that's great I trust your judgement. You know what I like and I > have every confidence in you." I asked her when she'd like the dress by.. > figuring on finishing it at least two weeks before the wedding, just in case I > have to do any last minute altertions. She said " well.. as long as I have it > by 10:30 the morning of the wedding I'm fine with that." ????? The wedding > was scheduled for 11am! Let me just say in hindsight, I had the best time > working on that dress. No one breathing down my back and the embellishment as I > desired. She got her dress the morning of the wedding and it was jsut perfect. > ( she did make her fittings--She had come over to get it hemmed two weeks > prior to the wedding. Due to the fact that she and I lived two hours apart it > was a bit of astretch for either of us to get to see each other. but It cam out > wonderful!) > > Everyone needs a bride like that once in a while! > > Crissy > > > At 4:03 PM -0500 4/29/03, zski wrote: > > > > > >One of the reasons I don't do wedding work anymore is that I ended > > >up with a lot of brides and bridesmaids who expected me to do > > >everything for them for free - the 6:00 AM call on a Sunday asking > > >me where to buy kilt hose, for example. Even my friends don't get > > >to call me at that hour on a Sunday unless someone is dead. Or the > > >ones who expected me to go to the rehearsal for free "just to make > > >sure everything is OK". Or who changed patterns mid-stream. I have > > >had several want to back out mid-project because of this, and I > > >usually suggest that they visit a bridal shop and ask what they > > >would charge for the same thing. I usually end up with rather > > >sheepish brides. > > > > > > > I had a housemate once who swore off weddings after the bride's > > mother spent the entire rehearsal fussing because the ribbons on the > > ring pillow didn't match the flower girls' dresses. > > > > > Not to mention the brides who have their hearts set on a style that > > makes them look about twelve, or 55 (when they aren't), or fat, or > > washed out; who gain or lose 20 pounds at random intervals; who fight > > with their mothers in front of the dressmaker about how low the > > neckline can be; or who expect a custom-made gown to be cheaper than > > a store-bought one (fortunately a small number of these last). > > > > The wedding business is particularly difficult because it's a very > > emotional time with big changes for most people, and a lot of people > > get sufficiently overwhelmed by it that they begin to think that how > > the wedding dress goes, or how the wedding itself goes, is going to > > somehow determine how the marriage will go. :-/ So of course > > everything has to be "perfect". > > > > OTOH, I learned that brides who think they want to make their wedding > > and/or bridesmaids' dresses themselves are a seamstress' best friend > > -- when they buy $50 per yard lace and are afraid to cut into it, or > > > their first six attempts at sewing slippery fabric are a total > > disaster, or they are pressured by their in-laws-to-be into having > > eight bridesmaids rather than two. (The problem with these jobs is > > that they tend to have short deadlines, since the seamstress doesn't > > get called until they are really running out of time.) > > > > I think the funniest one I saw was when someone came to my housemate > > wanting six bridesmaids' dresses in three weeks. She had actually > > ordered the dresses from a bridal shop weeks earlier, but had picked > > the color from a very small fabric sample. The color was called > > "aubergine," and apparently the bride had never studied French -- > > where that's the word for "eggplant." When the dresses came in, > > that's the color that they were . . . which is why my housemate got > > the job of making six dresses in a much nicer color. > > -- > > _________________________________________________________ > > O Chris Laning > > | > > + Davis, California > > > _________________________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 11:01:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41F1jqa011492 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:01:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41F0rdx014693 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 09:00:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41F0q0Y009952; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:00:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Ewx0Y008650 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 08:58:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from brujne (Cindy-Abel.creighton.edu [147.134.201.85]) JAA02947 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:58:58 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004601c30ff2$8f4b87e0$55c98693@creighton.edu> From: "Cynthia Abel" To: "Historical Costume" References: <06f201c30f93$7cefb800$eaf4fea9@glendaii> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 10:01:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Unless he had extremely high cholesterol, "Sir" John should have had to adhere to the Edwardian food. And there were plenty of physicians of the day that had patients on special diets, so something could have been worked out. In real life, the chef would have walked out right away! And no wonder the servants got burned out--they were overworked: yes, I know a real lord of a house that size would have had many more outdoor servants and maybe the family didn't take over the entire house, but to have a chef, but not a valet and to have stinted on housemaids--and not to have extra servants hired in for the several big events which would have been the norm at the time! So, in a way, the experiment got skewed to the detriment of the "downstairs" cast.As the staff were volunteers, about the only persons that could have gotten free for three months would be part-time workers, those between jobs, those who had enough holiday/vacation time, or had employers that were willing to let them do the project. Antonia and Rebecca were really great at just getting on with what they had to do. It would be great to find out(as we did with "Frontier House" on this side of pond) how the participants recoped with modern life 3-6 months after the project ended as well. Cindy Abel ----- Original Message ----- From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 10:40 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Manor House > Manor House was shown in the UK and later Australia as the Edwardian Country > House. I thought the kitchen maid Antonia was just wonderful in her > attitudes towards the experiment. And the chef - marvellous! I'm glad he was > horrified at the family's insistance that non-period food be eaten. > > Glenda. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 11:13:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FDiqa011518 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:13:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FCkdx016178 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 09:12:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FCj0Y017763; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:12:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.113]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41F7f0Y014446 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:07:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.net (pcp03486178pcs.indpnd01.mo.comcast.net [68.86.79.197]) by mtaout03.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HE70074YR9O83@mtaout03.icomcast.net> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Thu, 01 May 2003 11:05:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 10:05:58 -0500 From: "Linda J. Thompson" To: h-costume@net.indra.com Message-id: <3EB137D6.6090302@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 Subject: [h-cost] Structural Help X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is not a historical question exactly, but there may be some research out there of a historical nature. This morning I was contacted by someone wanting me to make her something that will help to support her "apron" stomach. The individual in question is a size 10X (no comments on her size please). Anyway, her stomach is down to her knees when standing, and when sitting it folds over the knees. What she is hoping for is a "truss like" corset or something that would lift her stomach. I can only imagine the courage it took for her to take a risk and call me... Being a large woman (5X) myself, I know a little of what she is enduring. She can still stand, but must use a walker. When she sits the top of her thighs bear the brunt of the weight. What I am seeking is any information on a method to distribute the weight I will be trying to lift, over the entire back torso. From my personal experience, a large stomach's major weight is carried by the muscles in the back hips and the lower back. (When I have been swimming or relaxing in the water for an hour or more, when I stand up, that is where the major stress is felt) If I shift all that wieght up to say the shoulder area, she wont be able to stand straight... so I want to try to distribute it all along her back (thinking Cross Your Heart style of structure perhaps).... Any ideas out there? Or perhaps a direction to begin... Send messages to me offlist, so we don't glom up the list with OT stuff more than we already do. :) Thanks -- Linda Thompson Attitude Is Everything http://corsetsandcostumes.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 11:26:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FQgqa011599 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:26:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FPpdx017981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 09:25:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FPo0Y027678; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:25:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kumc-gateway-fs.kumc.edu (kumc-gateway-fs.kumc.edu [169.147.166.77]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FPm0Y027640 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:25:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from KUMC-GATEWAY-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-gateway-fs.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 01 May 2003 10:25:47 -0500 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 10:25:42 -0500 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [h-cost] Wedding dresses X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I usually avoid making these like the plague :). Besides my own, I have done two, both for good friends as a wedding present. Both brides were pretty calm, only one dress was stressfull as we purposefully waited until the last minute since the bride was on a diet. The wedding was the first weekend after thanksgiving and if I had not had the entire four-day holiday weekend to work on it we couldn't have done it, there was a lot of handwork with the lace and embellishing. This was the first time I worked with the mega-buck a yard lace but I think my husband was more nervous around it, he was afraid he would accidently vacuum up $$ of lace without realizing it :). Done a few bridesmaid dresses over the years, especially if I was going to be wearing one of them. Gave me a little more input into color and style! Catherine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 11:34:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FYaqa011619 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:34:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FXfdx018930 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 09:33:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41FXd0Y003171; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:33:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80106.mail.yahoo.com (web80106.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.79]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h41FXa0Y003105 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:33:36 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030501153335.1681.qmail@web80106.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80106.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 01 May 2003 08:33:35 PDT Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 08:33:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Jacobson Dawn To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200304302103.h3UL3qFi021422@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: internships X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Not to pick nits (so I will), but... Paid internships are normally called "externships." This indicates that someone is receiving some type of compensation, but are not officially connected to the institution. The term "internship" is used to denote an unpaid opportunity for an individual to gain additional education and/or experience in a specific field. The rules regarding internships and other work-based learning experiences are fairly stringent in California (where I work); employers that are found to be using interns as a way to avoid hiring and paying employees are frequently subject to fines and penalties. OCC: Opening today! An exhibition exploring the impact of the concept of the goddess in Greek mythology on fashion at the Met in NYC. Included in the exhibition are the gold dress Nicole Kidman wore to the Oscars and the white Chanel recently worn by Jennifer Lopez. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 11:37:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Fbvqa011624 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:37:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Fb9dx019433 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 09:37:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Fb90Y005598; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:37:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80101.mail.yahoo.com (web80101.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h41Fb70Y005556 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 09:37:07 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030501153706.59735.qmail@web80101.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80101.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 01 May 2003 08:37:06 PDT Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 08:37:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Jacobson Dawn To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305010117.h411HnXh006082@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Manor House--DVDs available X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO FYI-- For those interested in watching Manor House, but not wanting to hassle with videotaping it, PBS has a 3-DVD set for sale for $69.98 plus shipping. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 12:37:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41GbDqa011750 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:37:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41GaOdx026935 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 10:36:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41GaMj5019514; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:36:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h41GaJj5019383 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:36:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWoqKBJ5rsT6aKtQRlfSev6ARCV7P9I8H3g==">; Thu, 01 May 2003 09:35:21 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HW4YBAF7; Thu, 01 May 2003 09:35:21 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 12:33:56 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] re:crazy brides Message-ID: <20030501.123356.-358857.1.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 11-13 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have done several wedding dresses (including my own many years ago). The one I remember most was for the daughter of a friend. She had the absolute best figure and was so easy to please. I ended up making her gown and the bridesmaids gowns, half the food for the reception (including a wedding cake for two hundred people complete with fountain), and photographing the wedding. At the last minute the organ player didn't show so the bride's mother had to play and I had to get the show moving from the background. It was a lot of work and I can't remember having as much fun at a wedding. The wedding was beautiful and the photos turned out perfect and I am afraid to ever do that again for fear it would be a disaster and I would remember the disaster instead of the success. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 13:00:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41H0kqa011814 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 13:00:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Gxqdx029731 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 10:59:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Gxp4P007290; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:59:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Gxm4P007253 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 10:59:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA07112 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:19:20 -0500 Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 12:19:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Another GFD question.... In-Reply-To: <07b801c30fe8$6d10e940$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 1 May 2003, Beteena Paradise wrote: > I am also planning on attending the KWCS. Is anyone else going? I'll be teaching there. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 13:11:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41HB6qa011836 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 13:11:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41HAHdx001280 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 11:10:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41HAB4P016019; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:10:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41H9v4P015752 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:09:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA07187 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:29:28 -0500 Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 12:29:28 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Another GFD question.... In-Reply-To: <3EB11C42.68E0CCE8@in-tch.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 1 May 2003, Sue Clemenger wrote: > Hey, Robin, when planning on making two gowns, one to be worn over the > other, does one need to add ease to the outer garment? And how? by > separately fitting the outer layers *over* the inner gown? or by > figuring a set amount into increasing the seams? I fit the outer gown over the inner gown. This not only allows for the extra smidgen of circumference, it also takes into account the fact that the inner gown is doing the real work of support. The outer gown need not work so hard and doesn't have stress in the same places, so the cut can be more relaxed. I start by cutting the outer gown to the same shape, but with a tiny bit more allowance on the vertical seams. I cut the armhole the same or even slightly smaller on the assumption I won't enlarge it unless/until I know exactly where it's going. You can ruin your dress if you cut the armhole too big too early and then find out it's in the wrong place. ========================================================== Robin Netherton // Editor at Large robin@nightowl.net voice: (314) 439-1222 // fax: (314) 439-1333 Life is just a bowl of queries. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 13:48:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41HmSqa011913 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 13:48:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41HkCdx005494 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 11:46:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41HkA4P014581; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:46:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Hk64P014493 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 11:46:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.103] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA3989401A2; Thu, 01 May 2003 13:32:41 -0400 Message-ID: <001d01c31009$f7de58c0$675183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030501.123356.-358857.1.catpurson@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] re:crazy brides Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 13:49:08 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My favorite tale was the bride with 9 bridesmaids, three of whom were in various stages of pregnancy. Fortunately, the bride had chosen the 1830s as the general period for the design. But she did not know that any of the 'maids' were pregnant when we settled on the style. Slightly raised waist lines fit the bill exactly. The bride wore a party dress ovrwhich we put a more formal coat which carried a court train. One of the 'maids' showed up the day before the wedding after a 5 hr trip from Baltimore, at 9 1/2 mos, Pregnant! Determined to be part of the wedding, I pinned the gown for the hem and practically stayed up all night finishing it as I had not expected that she would be "marching". She made it through the vigorous out door day of ceremonies and festivity and drove back to Baltimore to get a CSection on Monday Morn. The baby was almost 12 lbs. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 12:33 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] re:crazy brides > I have done several wedding dresses (including my own many years > ago). The one I remember most was for the daughter of a friend. She had > the absolute best figure and was so easy to please. I ended up making > her gown and the bridesmaids gowns, half the food for the reception > (including a wedding cake for two hundred people complete with fountain), > and photographing the wedding. At the last minute the organ player > didn't show so the bride's mother had to play and I had to get the show > moving from the background. It was a lot of work and I can't remember > having as much fun at a wedding. The wedding was beautiful and the > photos turned out perfect and I am afraid to ever do that again for fear > it would be a disaster and I would remember the disaster instead of the > success. > > Lalah > Never give up, Never surrender > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 14:33:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IXOqa012039 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 14:33:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IVsdx010911 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 12:31:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IVrHg018908; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:31:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IVmHg018849 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:31:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19BIqR-000Jvm-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 01 May 2003 19:31:47 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 22:52:27 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Average waist size. References: <3EADA17B.5050503@comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <3EADA17B.5050503@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think it's also to do with what you get used to in terms of comfort. If you are always used to having your waist somewhat constricted, you don't notice it. If you grow up never wearing anything tight like that, obviously it's going to be harder to cope with as an adult, so people tend to wear things looser. Jean Linda J. Thompson wrote >After reading Lil Sorepaws post about her waist size makes me >remininsce about my past days. >Can anyone else remember when the style was to wear a belt with >clothing? I was raised in the US during the 50's and I can remember if >I wore a skirt or slacks or even shorts (Bermuda of course) they were >always very well tailored and you always wore a belt with them, this >was up to the mid 1960"s. My mother was a tennis player in her youth >and she wore a belt then also. And I can remember wearing a girdle at >the ripe age of 12 to give me that sleek smooth look under some of the >skirts and to hold my stockings up. >The end result was smaller waists than what is commonly seen today. At >14 I weighed 158 lbs., was 5'6" and my figure was 38-24-37. I don't >recall deliberately tightening my belt or anything, it just fit at that >size. My waist was naturally compressed over the years and since you >only bought a new belt when the old one was out of style, or you gained >excessive weight, I guess it just kept your waist smaller. Look at >pictures of Marilyn Monroe, or Jane Mansfield, both very well fed >females of very curvy proportions, and they had fairly small waists I >believe. I believe that compression of the soft flesh is fairly easy >to do so severely if done over a series of weeks, months years. I am >not advocating doing it, (although I have many clients that do so) I am >just saying it is possible to do so without great harm if done slowly. -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 14:41:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IfGqa012058 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 14:41:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Ie9e3011919 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 12:40:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IXBHg019914; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:33:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IVuHg018948 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:31:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19BIqa-000Jyc-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 01 May 2003 19:31:56 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 22:52:27 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Average waist size. References: <3EADA17B.5050503@comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <3EADA17B.5050503@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think it's also to do with what you get used to in terms of comfort. If you are always used to having your waist somewhat constricted, you don't notice it. If you grow up never wearing anything tight like that, obviously it's going to be harder to cope with as an adult, so people tend to wear things looser. Jean Linda J. Thompson wrote >After reading Lil Sorepaws post about her waist size makes me >remininsce about my past days. >Can anyone else remember when the style was to wear a belt with >clothing? I was raised in the US during the 50's and I can remember if >I wore a skirt or slacks or even shorts (Bermuda of course) they were >always very well tailored and you always wore a belt with them, this >was up to the mid 1960"s. My mother was a tennis player in her youth >and she wore a belt then also. And I can remember wearing a girdle at >the ripe age of 12 to give me that sleek smooth look under some of the >skirts and to hold my stockings up. >The end result was smaller waists than what is commonly seen today. At >14 I weighed 158 lbs., was 5'6" and my figure was 38-24-37. I don't >recall deliberately tightening my belt or anything, it just fit at that >size. My waist was naturally compressed over the years and since you >only bought a new belt when the old one was out of style, or you gained >excessive weight, I guess it just kept your waist smaller. Look at >pictures of Marilyn Monroe, or Jane Mansfield, both very well fed >females of very curvy proportions, and they had fairly small waists I >believe. I believe that compression of the soft flesh is fairly easy >to do so severely if done over a series of weeks, months years. I am >not advocating doing it, (although I have many clients that do so) I am >just saying it is possible to do so without great harm if done slowly. -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 14:44:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IiNqa012072 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 14:44:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IhNdx012345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 12:43:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IhMHg027878; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:43:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (mta06-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IhIHg027825 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:43:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from HP411.jigrah.co.uk ([80.6.241.239]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.comESMTP <20030501184317.DCHC12018.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@HP411.jigrah.co.uk> for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 19:43:17 +0100 Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20030501193530.00b1e060@pop.oneandone.co.uk> X-Sender: pt8296337-1938@pop.oneandone.co.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 19:41:52 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jill Hadfield Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September In-Reply-To: <076901c30fae$c77d2720$eaf4fea9@glendaii> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-2875183A; boundary="=======4CE96ECB=======" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --=======4CE96ECB======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-2875183A; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 13th and 14th September there is the Military Odyssy, Detling, Kent. "The Country's Largest Multi-Period Living History Show and collector's Market. Sort of Kirby Hall of the south with large historical and militaria market. www.military-odyssey.com " Is this the sort of thing you mean? Jill >Our current interests are ECW, 8th-10th century Anglo-Saxon and Anglo-Danish >and 1st century Romanised-British, but we enjoy everything from 1st century >to mid 17th century. > >Thanks heaps, > >Glenda. JiGraH Resources - www.jigrah.co.uk --=======4CE96ECB======= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --=======4CE96ECB=======-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 14:46:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IkHqa012087 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 14:46:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Ie9e5011919 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 12:40:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IXKHg020005; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:33:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41IVmHg018839 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 12:31:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19BIqR-000Jvl-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 01 May 2003 19:31:47 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 23:07:02 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Graveyard research? References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429181000.040b2668@mail.earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429181000.040b2668@mail.earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I don't follow the religion my parents brought me up with, and I would plan a very different funeral than what they would consider traditional and appropriate. I would want to be buried with things that are important to me, and because I'm a re-enactor, that means reproduction medieval artefacts. If I should ever have more money than I know what to do with, I would buy a plot and order a double effigy, holding hands, for my husband and I in costumes of our favourite period. Not deliberately to confuse people, just because I like it, and I like to think of us looking like that rather than in modern clothes. Jean Brenda wrote >Reading you gals planning the "time capsules" that you expect to be >your coffins, and the idea of throwing wrenches in other folks' >research (albeit many years in the future) makes me wonder a bit. If >you want to bury a time capsule, bury a time capsule and be done with. >Not only will the funeral thing be a problem 'cos you won't be able to >supervise it , there's no way of telling whether thirty, fifty, >sixty, or eighty years from now we will be burying our dead intact, >rather than requiring cremation or complete organ harvesting and >organic recycling, or anything like that. > >Another thing to consider -- since you may be young enough for your >parents to have shielded you from your culture's death customs -- is >whether or not you would be buried in *clothes* to begin with, and >whether your coffin would be one that would be designed to last, or >whether it would disintegrate into the soil in a few decades. > > > >Brenda, whose culture sews linen shrouds around the washed corpses, >builds nail-less pine boxes around them, and at most uses >no-longer-readable prayer books and scrolls as "pillows" for the >linen-wrapped heads of the dead > >webwarren@earthlink.net > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 15:58:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Jw0qa012338 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:58:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Jv7dx023879 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 13:57:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Jv5qg025061; Thu, 1 May 2003 13:57:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m05.mx.aol.com (imo-m05.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Jv3qg024952 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 13:57:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LoreleiMorte@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.119.22c982a9 (4459) for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:56:51 -0400 (EDT) From: LoreleiMorte@aol.com Message-ID: <119.22c982a9.2be2d603@aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 15:56:51 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Another GFD question.... To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/1/2003 12:00:38 PM Central Standard Time, robin@shell.nightowl.net writes: > On Thu, 1 May 2003, Beteena Paradise wrote: > > >I am also planning on attending the KWCS. Is anyone else going? > > I'll be teaching there. > I'll be learnin' there. :) Sarra Wryght http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 16:10:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41KATqa012383 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 16:10:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41K9Hdx025639 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 14:09:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41K9FDX004833; Thu, 1 May 2003 14:09:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41K9DDX004756 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 14:09:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LoreleiMorte@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.103.2d1cdd2d (4459) for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 16:09:02 -0400 (EDT) From: LoreleiMorte@aol.com Message-ID: <103.2d1cdd2d.2be2d8de@aol.com> Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 16:09:02 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/1/2003 8:18:46 AM Central Standard Time, nicolas_fouquet@yahoo.com writes: > What the doodah are Red Necks???????????????? > You might be a Red Neck if: that billboard that says, "Say No To Crack" reminds you to pull up your jeans. . . . your wife's hairdo was ever ruined by a ceiling fan. . . . you go to your family reunions looking for a date. . . . you think a Volvo is part of a woman's anatomy. . . . your Junior/Senior Prom had a Daycare. . . . you've got more than three cousins named "Bubba". . . . you have an Elvis Jell-O mold. . . . taking your wife on a cruise means circling the Dairy Queen. . . . you've got more than one other named "Darryl". . . . you ever won first prize in a tobacco spittin' contest. . . . on Thanksgiving Day you have to decide which pet to eat. . . . you've ever come home and found crime scene tape across your front porch. . . . your favorite entree is Spam barbecued on the grill. . . . your child's first words were, "Attention K-Mart shoppers!". . . . your idea of high-quality entertainment is a six-pack and a bug-zapper. . . . your whole family is Democrats except little Mary. She got to readin'. . . . you think the last words to The Star Spangled Banner are "Gentlemen, start your engines." . . . you kissed your own wife at midnight at the New Year's Eve party. . . . you've ever taken reading material into an airplane restroom. . . . you've ever gotten an official letter of recognition from a tobacco or beer company. . . . you vacuum the sheets instead of washing them. . . . you've ever valet parked a snow plow. . . . you've ever stood in line to have your picture made with a freak of nature. You might be a redneck... (totally ripped off from Jeff Foxworthy) Sarra Wryght http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 17:13:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41LDSqa012518 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 17:13:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41LCUdx004152 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 15:12:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41LCOK8023372; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:12:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41LCLK8023321 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:12:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HE800J5688I9A@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 01 May 2003 14:12:18 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 14:07:38 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Another GFD question.... In-reply-to: <119.22c982a9.2be2d603@aol.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030501140725.02c6f2c0@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 4/29/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 03:56 PM 5/1/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > >I am also planning on attending the KWCS. Is anyone else going? > > > > I'll be teaching there. > > > >I'll be learnin' there. :) What is KWCS? Kimiko _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 17:39:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Ldwqa012566 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 17:39:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Ld4dx006958 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 15:39:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Ld2K8012260; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:39:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta2.adelphia.net (mta2-0.mail.adelphia.net [64.8.50.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41LcnK8012035 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:38:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from adelphia.net ([68.65.179.208]) by mta2.adelphia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.32 201-253-122-126-132-20030307) with ESMTP id <20030501213843.SNZS23895.mta2.adelphia.net@adelphia.net> for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 17:38:43 -0400 Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 17:38:43 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: rob and laurie gage To: h-costume@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200305011500.h41F0I0Z009604@net.indra.com> Message-Id: <481EE6B8-7C1D-11D7-A094-000393D2F36E@adelphia.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO diana gabaldon writes the "outlander" series which is about a 20c (1940's) woman who gets pulled thru a standing stone to 18c scotland, prior to the scottish uprising, while on her 2nd honeymoon in the highlands. lots of history (accurate, detailed and a bit gory), romance and adventure. tho' it sounds a bit "bodice ripper-esq"... it's a darned good read! starts in scotland and ends up (by the 3rd book) in colonial america. some decent garb research, too (must satisfy costume content:) she doesn't bring him back w/her, that's "knight in shining armor" by jude deveraux. very "brain candy", but fun:) laurie > ----------------------------- > > Message: 11 > Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:55:13 -0400 > From: "Beteena Paradise" > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" > To: "Historical Costume" > Message-ID: <07c901c30fe9$49e8b550$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hmm..... Diana Gabaldon wrote books about a woman who went back in > time and > fell in love with a handsome Scot named Jamie and brought him back > with her. > (I only read 3 books in the series) Perhaps Margo went back in time to > Elizabethan England and fell in love with a bodice that she brought > back > with her? ;-) > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 17:54:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Ls6qa012623 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 17:54:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Lr9dx008522 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 15:53:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Lr8K8021487; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:53:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Lr6K9021464 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:53:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from eliz@localhost) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.8/Submit) id h41Lr5qo021462 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 1 May 2003 15:53:05 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 15:53:05 -0600 From: Elizabeth Lear To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Another GFD question.... Message-ID: <20030501215305.GB9794@net.indra.com> References: <119.22c982a9.2be2d603@aol.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030501140725.02c6f2c0@127.0.0.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030501140725.02c6f2c0@127.0.0.1> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > What is KWCS? > Kimiko Known World Costume Symposium - a national SCA event for costuming. http://www.caerthe.org/kwcs/ ...eliz -- Please allow 8-12 weeks for delivery. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 18:40:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Mepqa012747 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 18:40:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41Mdtdx013999 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 16:39:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41MdpSu024727; Thu, 1 May 2003 16:39:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h41MdlSu024658 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 16:39:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA31726 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 18:39:46 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-33-100-243.asm.bellsouth.net [67.33.100.243]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA12282 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 18:39:46 -0400 Message-ID: <08dc01c31032$31c57820$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <481EE6B8-7C1D-11D7-A094-000393D2F36E@adelphia.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 18:37:06 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I knew that she didn't literally bring him back with her, but I thought in one of the books (and it has been a while since I read them) he finds his way to her in the modern time period. I was simplifying it to go with the whole bodice statement. ----- Original Message ----- From: "rob and laurie gage" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 5:38 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" > diana gabaldon writes the "outlander" series which is about a 20c > (1940's) woman who gets pulled thru a standing stone to 18c scotland, > prior to the scottish uprising, while on her 2nd honeymoon in the > highlands. lots of history (accurate, detailed and a bit gory), romance > and adventure. tho' it sounds a bit "bodice ripper-esq"... it's a > darned good read! starts in scotland and ends up (by the 3rd book) in > colonial america. some decent garb research, too (must satisfy costume > content:) > she doesn't bring him back w/her, that's "knight in shining armor" by > jude deveraux. very "brain candy", but fun:) > laurie > > > ----------------------------- > > > > Message: 11 > > Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 09:55:13 -0400 > > From: "Beteena Paradise" > > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: "The Diana Gabaldon of costume patterns" > > To: "Historical Costume" > > Message-ID: <07c901c30fe9$49e8b550$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > > > Hmm..... Diana Gabaldon wrote books about a woman who went back in > > time and > > fell in love with a handsome Scot named Jamie and brought him back > > with her. > > (I only read 3 books in the series) Perhaps Margo went back in time to > > Elizabethan England and fell in love with a bodice that she brought > > back > > with her? ;-) > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 20:02:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42027qa013008 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 20:02:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4201Fdx022266 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 18:01:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4201DAO012057; Thu, 1 May 2003 18:01:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42018AO012019 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 18:01:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.153]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/linuxconf) with SMTP id h420GsM18537 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:16:54 +1000 Message-ID: <089f01c3103e$407a9ce0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.0.2.1.0.20030501193530.00b1e060@pop.oneandone.co.uk> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 10:03:20 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh my goodness!!! That looks amazing. Damn. Damn. Damn. We can't fit any of my outfits in to our meagre luggage allowance (though it IS tempting!) . I'd really love to go in costume. Maybe we'll have to see how we can organise our schedule just to watch, but it won't be the same. Too bad we can't wear our reenactment gear around in general, or we would be tempted to take the 1st-2nd century Roman-British Senator and wife outfits - they're the lightest and are warm enough for Aussie bodies to wear with an average max of 18. Glenda. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jill Hadfield" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 4:41 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September > On 13th and 14th September there is the Military Odyssy, Detling, Kent. > > "The Country's Largest Multi-Period Living History Show and collector's > Market. Sort of Kirby Hall of the south with large historical and > militaria market. www.military-odyssey.com " > > Is this the sort of thing you mean? > > Jill > > > > >Our current interests are ECW, 8th-10th century Anglo-Saxon and Anglo-Danish > >and 1st century Romanised-British, but we enjoy everything from 1st century > >to mid 17th century. > > > >Thanks heaps, > > > >Glenda. > > JiGraH Resources - www.jigrah.co.uk > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 1 23:42:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h423gPqa013666 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 23:42:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h423fIdx009574 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 21:41:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h423fE7t027571; Thu, 1 May 2003 21:41:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net (smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net [206.210.69.156]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h423fB7t027553 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 21:41:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 11696 invoked from network); 2 May 2003 03:41:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bookbusiness) (208.166.66.11) by smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net with SMTP; 2 May 2003 03:41:10 -0000 Message-ID: <005c01c3105c$ad4546e0$0b42a6d0@bookbusiness> From: "Janet Davis" To: Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 23:41:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] manor house to warriors X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h423gPqa013666 Status: RO PBS is coming out with another "History meets reality TV" series on Warriors - knights, Vikings, Romans and gladiators. http://www.pbs.org/wnet/warriorchallenge/index.html It looks like fun. Janet Janet Davis Castle Furnishings http://www.medievalbookstore.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 00:32:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h424WSqa013830 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 00:32:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h424Vedx013025 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 1 May 2003 22:31:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h424VdKP021357; Thu, 1 May 2003 22:31:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h424VaKP021261 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 22:31:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m205.in-tch.com [216.166.191.205]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h424DUv12051 for ; Thu, 1 May 2003 22:13:30 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EB1F4F6.F2305F7A@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 22:32:54 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? References: <20030501134718.48924.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Mean? It *could* be, I suppose, but that would depend on context. Sometimes it's just d@mned funny (like the Jeff Foxworthy bits that someone else posted)--somewhat situational and culture-specific (and not just American, but rural American). It can also be used (as perhaps it was in the case that started this) as a less-inflamatory term than "bigot" or "prejudiced." Calling someone, or someone's utterance "red-necked" still has a bit of casualness to it, while still containing a hint of "that remark or that behavior was kinda out of line." Hope the strawberries and coffee were good...mmmm....what a divine thing to have for breakfast (oh, wait....late afternoon snack for you? ) --sue, heading off to bed.... N Kipar wrote: > > Aha! Thanks for the explanation, I got it, even with all the 'uhms'. *G* > But isn't it then a mean thing to say to someone else here? > > Back to the strawberries and coffee ;-) > > Nicole > > --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > A, -uhm-, > less-than-complimentary (American) slang term used to refer to > > those who are, well, -uhm- stereotypically reactionary/conservative (as > > in, NOT a thinking conservative), usually poorly educated, lower-class, > > prone to bigotry and disdain for just about anybody different. At least > > in my experience, more of a "rural" than "urban" flavor to the > > stereotype. > > I always thought the origins of the word came from the (sunburned) red > > necks of the (usually) white men described by the term.... > > --Sue > > > > N Kipar wrote: > > > > > > --- Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > Do we see some Red > > Necks > > > out there? > > > > Kathleen > > > > > > What the doodah are Red Necks???????????????? > > > > > > Nicole > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 03:00:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4270Vqa000350 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 03:00:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h426xfdx022077 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 00:59:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h426xbxn020555; Fri, 2 May 2003 00:59:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41503.mail.yahoo.com (web41503.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.86]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h426xWxn020476 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 00:59:32 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030502065927.82785.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41503.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 02 May 2003 07:59:27 BST Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 07:59:27 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <089f01c3103e$407a9ce0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Glenda Robinson wrote: > Oh my goodness!!! That looks amazing. It's okay. We've been doing this since the first Military Odyssey in 2001. > Damn. Damn. Damn. We can't fit any of my outfits in to our meagre luggage > allowance (though it IS tempting!) . I'd really love to go in costume. Sorry Glenda you can't go in costume. It isnot open to the public in costume, only invited re-enactors wear costume. That's how re-enactment always goes here. If you were a member of one of the invited groups then this is different of course. > Maybe we'll have to see how we can organise our schedule just to watch, but > it won't be the same. > > Too bad we can't wear our reenactment gear around in general, or we would be > tempted to take the 1st-2nd century Roman-British Senator and wife outfits - > they're the lightest and are warm enough for Aussie bodies to wear with an > average max of 18. You do NOT want to wear that at Detling. Even if you were a member of one of the invited Roman groups. It is not an average of 18 degrees in september here (at least not since I have been doing Military Odyssey *snortle*) and the show ground is on top of a hill, that is seriously windswept and damp. (it ALWAYS rains, gods I hate re-enactment nowadays!) it is blooming cold and freezing there because there's nothing between the North Sea and the Detling show ground to break the cold and wind. *shiver* Wool, trust me, wool is what you want and warm shoes and warm stockings etc. Nicole > Glenda. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jill Hadfield" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 4:41 AM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September > > > > On 13th and 14th September there is the Military Odyssy, Detling, Kent. > > > > "The Country's Largest Multi-Period Living History Show and collector's > > Market. Sort of Kirby Hall of the south with large historical and > > militaria market. www.military-odyssey.com " > > > > Is this the sort of thing you mean? > > > > Jill > > > > > > > > >Our current interests are ECW, 8th-10th century Anglo-Saxon and > Anglo-Danish > > >and 1st century Romanised-British, but we enjoy everything from 1st > century > > >to mid 17th century. > > > > > >Thanks heaps, > > > > > >Glenda. > > > > JiGraH Resources - www.jigrah.co.uk > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 08:21:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CLhqa017752 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 08:21:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CKbdx010086 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 06:20:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CKV5N013575; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:20:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CKQ5N013552 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:20:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.139]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/linuxconf) with SMTP id h42CaFM08555 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 22:36:16 +1000 Message-ID: <09eb01c310a5$7ebd76a0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030502065927.82785.qmail@web41503.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 21:31:49 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > Sorry Glenda you can't go in costume. It isnot open to the public in costume, > only invited re-enactors wear costume. That's how re-enactment always goes > here. If you were a member of one of the invited groups then this is different > of course. I'm sure we'd be able to scrape in with some group or other if we could bring our costumes, but it isn't to be. Is there much chance for the public to talk to the reenactors, or are they tucked away between performances? I don't suppose it would be worthwhile for us to come along unless we could get to meet other reenactors, as that would be the main attraction for us. Having a look at the trading tables would be interesting, but most things we can buy over the internet, except for the interesting wools, which I'd really love to see. > > > > Too bad we can't wear our reenactment gear around in general, or we would be > > tempted to take the 1st-2nd century Roman-British Senator and wife outfits - > > they're the lightest and are warm enough for Aussie bodies to wear with an > > average max of 18. > > You do NOT want to wear that at Detling. Even if you were a member of one of > the invited Roman groups. It is not an average of 18 degrees in september here > (at least not since I have been doing Military Odyssey *snortle*) and the show > ground is on top of a hill, that is seriously windswept and damp. (it ALWAYS > rains, gods I hate re-enactment nowadays!) it is blooming cold and freezing > there because there's nothing between the North Sea and the Detling show ground > to break the cold and wind. *shiver* > > Wool, trust me, wool is what you want and warm shoes and warm stockings etc. The weather people say it's an average max of 18 in September, but they mustn't take into account that it's always bleak and rainy when reenactment events are on! I wish it was like that over here - we could break the drought! Our Roman gear I was talking about is wool, mine with a linen undertunic (last worn in 5-18 degree temp) - warm shoes and socks as per Vindolanda finds. The Senatorial tunic and toga, though, are not heavy wool, and anything that short isn't hugely warm in cold winds. Wouldn't even think of wearing my Mediterranean Roman clothing in Britain - just doesn't make sense. > > Nicole Glenda. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 08:35:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CZrqa017780 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 08:35:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CYxdx011200 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 06:35:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CYn5N020615; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:34:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CYk5N020571 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:34:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-116-236-107.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.116.236.107]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h42CYgMi010295 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 05:34:45 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030502045053.00d44500@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 05:21:17 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? In-Reply-To: <20030501134718.48924.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> References: <3EB1213F.5FD7F16C@in-tch.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Aha! Thanks for the explanation, I got it, even with all the 'uhms'. *G* >But isn't it then a mean thing to say to someone else here? It's actually pretty mild. My take on the term is that it implies a lower-class beer-guzzling male with a beer belly, unfashionable prejudices, simple pleasures, and (as the obligatory costume content) a dirty white t-shirt. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 08:36:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CaJqa017784 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 08:36:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CZPdx011262 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 06:35:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CZP5N020909; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:35:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CYm5N020603 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:34:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-116-236-107.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.116.236.107]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h42CYgMm010295 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 05:34:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030502052239.05401e10@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 05:32:02 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? In-Reply-To: <006001c30f4f$a86aa420$b60277d8@w7m1l6> References: <00be01c30ee4$d7ea6160$820377d8@w7m1l6> <004501c30f49$58dca3f0$056d0dcf@gateway> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Hell as far as I am concerned they can have the southern part of the state >back. It's only good for fabric, and someplace to send our waste water. > >Stephen Now, now, Stephen. There are some great museums in Southern CA, and my mother lives there. You may not like having to see what you are breathing, but there are some nice things about Southern CA besides the LA garment district. I guess I won't be seeing you at Costume College then? CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 08:53:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Crhqa017824 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 08:53:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Cqgdx012406 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 06:52:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Cqf5N027506; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:52:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41501.mail.yahoo.com (web41501.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42Cqd5N027460 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:52:39 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030502125233.76638.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41501.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 02 May 2003 13:52:33 BST Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 13:52:33 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <09eb01c310a5$7ebd76a0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Is there much chance for the public to talk to the reenactors, or are they > tucked away between performances? Yes of course. It is a living history event, not a bash-and-bang and otherwise nothing coz we are too damn dumb and bone idle to get into living history thing. hehehehe. :-) > The weather people say it's an average max of 18 in September, harharhar, not in Detling, not in the middle of September. but they > mustn't take into account that it's always bleak and rainy when reenactment > events are on! I wish it was like that over here - we could break the > drought! No tanks, I have not done a single re-enactment with L'Age d'Or where it did not rain. I have had it! Nicole - who really doesn't like re-enactment/living history anymore *SIIIIIIIIGH* Totally burnt out and it did not get any better. I dread the season! *shudder* ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 09:01:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42D1hqa017842 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 09:01:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Cwodx012821 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 06:58:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CwnZr029878; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:58:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42CwkZr029844 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 06:58:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.148] (pm5-148.eos.net [205.133.149.148]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA05348 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 08:58:44 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 08:53:13 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305020700.h4270Nxo020849@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re:Warriors X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The PBS "Warriors" sounds interesting, although I imagine the reenactor crowd will be laughing like crazy. I hope they acknowledge that people do recreate all of the four periods they're doing, rather than pretending they're the first people to have done this in 2000 years (in the case of the Romans). Did anyone catch "Chariot Race 2002" on The History Channel (I believe)? I had someone tape it for me. Very poor show, about what I expect from cable "history" stuff. It wouldn't have been bad for a half-hour segment, or even an hour, but stretched out to two hours it was very dull. The premise was that four modern people, two men and two women, were taught to race Roman chariots. They did a good job of showing how hard it was to control the horses, but that's it. Obligatory costume content: they wore crude tunics over their modern clothes. With the material they had, it could have been very entertaining. I am really beginning to appreciate good film editing. Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 10:58:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Ewkqa018175 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:58:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Evqdx024304 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 08:57:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42EvpFf000529; Fri, 2 May 2003 08:57:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42EvkFf000476 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 08:57:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-008-191.jps.net ([216.119.8.191] helo=elizabethanlady.com) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Bbyr-00048B-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 02 May 2003 07:57:45 -0700 Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 07:54:17 -0700 Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030502052239.05401e10@mail.frys.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > You may not like having to see what you are breathing, but there are > some nice things about Southern CA besides the LA garment district. Er. Sacramento is worse than LA these days when it comes to air quality. I worked for the EPA last year on the 23rd floor of the building and in the summer, there was a thick layer of brown smudge hanging about 30 feet below my window. So, Sac can't brag about being better than LA in this arena any more. :P Obligatory Costume Content (OCC): Without Hollywood, we wouldn't have all those historical movies with bad costumes to rant about. And I actually like the southern end of the state... LA can be quite pretty if you know where to look, and nothing beats the overall beauty of San Diego. :) Sarah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 12:18:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42GIsqa018389 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:18:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42GHtdx004149 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 10:17:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42GHr2Q026451; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:17:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d02.mx.aol.com (imo-d02.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42GHn2Q026359 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:17:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.74.2dbd248d (4254) for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:17:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Kitsune242@aol.com Message-ID: <74.2dbd248d.2be3f41d@aol.com> Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 12:17:33 EDT Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Okay, so I just have to say it, my favorite quote about L.A. One recited with all the love and understanding of a person who TRULY loves Los Angeles, but can see all her problems: There are over 3 millon people in the City of Angels, according to the last census. Over half of them are up to something they don't want the other half to know about. Palm trees finger the sky and there's enough sunshine to lay some off on Pittsburg. But that's all on top, L.A. truth to tell, it not much different than a pretty girl with the clap. - City of Angels Costume Content: It was a fabulous musical set in the 30's. At least I thought it was a really great show. I hope I am not the only person who saw it. Costumes were fab, and the story line itself, although as cliche as Hollywood, was rather inventive and captured the attitude prevelent in the Film Industry at the time. It was one of those shows that (at least in my opinion) if you were into Early Hollywood Glamour, there was not a single reason you should miss it. Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 12:41:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Gftqa018424 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:41:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Gf4dx007143 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 10:41:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Gf12Q013328; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:41:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mx1.famvid.com (a.mx.famvid.com [208.16.68.101] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42Ges2Q013257 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:40:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 29391 invoked by uid 89); 2 May 2003 16:40:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO jeanne) (66.94.197.35) by mx1.famvid.com with SMTP; 2 May 2003 16:40:52 -0000 Message-ID: <226501c310c9$afbe96c0$9865fea9@jeanne> From: "Jeanne Harney" To: "Historical Costume" References: <74.2dbd248d.2be3f41d@aol.com> Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 12:41:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ! ----- Original Message ----- From: > Okay, so I just have to say it, my favorite quote about L.A. One recited > with all the love and understanding of a person who TRULY loves Los Angeles, > but can see all her problems: > > There are over 3 millon people in the City of Angels, according to the last > census. Over half of them are up to something they don't want the other half > to know about. Palm trees finger the sky and there's enough sunshine to lay > some off on Pittsburg. But that's all on top, L.A. truth to tell, it not > much different than a pretty girl with the clap. - City of Angels One of my favorites too... > Costume Content: It was a fabulous musical set in the 30's. At least I > thought it was a really great show. I hope I am not the only person who saw > it. Costumes were fab, and the story line itself, although as cliche as > Hollywood, was rather inventive and captured the attitude prevelent in the > Film Industry at the time. It was one of those shows that (at least in my > opinion) if you were into Early Hollywood Glamour, there was not a single > reason you should miss it. My local theatre group did it and I worked backstage. One of the best and most challenging shows I've ever done. Having to have duplicates of EVERYTHING from set pieces to costumes in both black and white and color was a really hard thing to do, and the set changes were murder. Quick, and complex. Jeanne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 12:57:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Gvfqa018475 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:57:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Guldx009490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 10:56:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42GuiZt025319; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:56:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r03.mx.aol.com (imo-r03.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42GubZt025177 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:56:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LoreleiMorte@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.12a.290034e2 (25098) for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:56:29 -0400 (EDT) From: LoreleiMorte@aol.com Message-ID: <12a.290034e2.2be3fd3d@aol.com> Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 12:56:29 EDT Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/2/2003 9:59:37 AM Central Standard Time, sarah@elizabethanlady.com writes: > Obligatory Costume Content (OCC): Without Hollywood, we wouldn't have > all those historical movies with bad costumes to rant about. And I > actually like the southern end of the state... LA can be quite pretty > if you know where to look, and nothing beats the overall beauty of San > Diego. :) > Woooo, S-Dog! My family are long time San Diego residents. Rubio's fish tacos are the shizznit. Sarra Wryght http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 13:15:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42HFlqa018566 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:15:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42HErdx011692 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 11:14:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42HEjZt009105; Fri, 2 May 2003 11:14:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42HEWZt008823 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 11:14:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.ca.1bde90b9 (15877) for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:14:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aol.com (mow-m10.webmail.aol.com [64.12.184.138]) by air-id07.mx.aol.com (v93.8) with ESMTP id MAILINID74-3e053eb2a772255; Fri, 02 May 2003 13:14:26 -0400 Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 13:14:26 -0400 From: Kitsune242@aol.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <4CAA8D33.32455AA1.0BD9917F@aol.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/2/2003 11:41:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, jeanne@parrotfantasy.com writes: > My local theatre group did it and I worked backstage. One of the best and > most challenging shows I've ever done. Having to have duplicates of > EVERYTHING from set pieces to costumes in both black and white and color was > a really hard thing to do, and the set changes were murder. > Quick, and > complex. > > Jeanne I was wondering if the black & white was going to carry over into local/smaller theaters or not. It was so creative! Did you all do the make-up changes as well? Kit _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 13:43:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Hhvqa018656 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:43:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Hh5dx015186 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 11:43:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Hh2Zt005659; Fri, 2 May 2003 11:43:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (root@mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42HgwZt005610 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 11:42:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bently (dialport69.tukwila.eskimo.net [208.187.9.205]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA06555 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 10:42:53 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <000901c310d2$0de083a0$cd09bbd0@bently> From: "David" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4CAA8D33.32455AA1.0BD9917F@aol.com> Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 10:41:21 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > My local theatre group did it and I worked backstage Ok, I wasn't paying enough attention when this started...what show are y'all talking about? Pam Dotson Everett, WA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 14:03:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42I3Fqa018728 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:03:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42I2Gdx017401 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 12:02:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42I2BPh022503; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:02:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mx1.famvid.com (a.mx.famvid.com [208.16.68.101] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42I0iPh021430 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:00:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 4553 invoked by uid 89); 2 May 2003 18:00:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO jeanne) (66.94.197.35) by mx1.famvid.com with SMTP; 2 May 2003 18:00:41 -0000 Message-ID: <230201c310d4$d7457370$9865fea9@jeanne> From: "Jeanne Harney" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4CAA8D33.32455AA1.0BD9917F@aol.com> Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 14:01:21 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: > In a message dated 5/2/2003 11:41:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, jeanne@parrotfantasy.com writes: > > > My local theatre group did it and I worked backstage. One of the best and > > most challenging shows I've ever done. Having to have duplicates of > > EVERYTHING from set pieces to costumes in both black and white and color was > > a really hard thing to do, and the set changes were murder. > > Quick, and > > complex. > > > > Jeanne > > I was wondering if the black & white was going to carry over into local/smaller theaters or not. It was so creative! Did you all do the make-up changes as well? > We did. We had a HUGE crew backstage. It was unbelievable. We could strip those people in the wings and get 'em back out in 40 seconds sometimes. We were told that smaller theatres wouldn't be able to pull it off, but we managed, with split second precision Jeanne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 14:14:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IEbqa018777 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:14:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42I3Ndx017562 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 12:03:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42I32Ph023376; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:03:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mx1.famvid.com (a.mx.famvid.com [208.16.68.101] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42I1APh021715 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:01:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 5381 invoked by uid 89); 2 May 2003 18:01:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO jeanne) (66.94.197.35) by mx1.famvid.com with SMTP; 2 May 2003 18:01:07 -0000 Message-ID: <230701c310d4$e6e2cbc0$9865fea9@jeanne> From: "Jeanne Harney" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4CAA8D33.32455AA1.0BD9917F@aol.com> <000901c310d2$0de083a0$cd09bbd0@bently> Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 14:01:47 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Original Message ----- From: "David" > > > My local theatre group did it and I worked backstage > > Ok, I wasn't paying enough attention when this started...what show are y'all > talking about? > > Pam Dotson City of Angels... Jeanne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 14:15:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IFLqa018784 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:15:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IEMdx018999 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 12:14:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IEKPh002533; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:14:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f70.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.70]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IEIPh002482 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:14:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 2 May 2003 11:14:12 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.245 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 02 May 2003 18:14:12 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.245] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 18:14:12 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 May 2003 18:14:12.0764 (UTC) FILETIME=[A23FC5C0:01C310D6] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dude... I just have to comment now! Fins fish tacos and shrimp tacos beat Rubios, hands down!!! OCC: Since I am a resident of So. CA (San Diego), Costume College is a lot more feasable to attend then Costume Con was. I was very sad about that. But it looks like it will be back here in a couple of years (by then I'll probably have moved to the East Coast or something... but I can at least look forward to it!). Please tell me more about Costume College. I think it's a yearly event, but what exactly is it? Has anyone gone and now have stories raving (or not) about it? Is it worth going to (I know, what am I saying?!? It's costume related... of course it WORTH going to!!!!)? :) jessica >------------------------------ > >Message: 9 >Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 12:56:29 EDT >From: LoreleiMorte@aol.com >Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? >To: h-costume@indra.com >Message-ID: <12a.290034e2.2be3fd3d@aol.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > >In a message dated 5/2/2003 9:59:37 AM Central Standard Time, >sarah@elizabethanlady.com writes: > > > Obligatory Costume Content (OCC): Without Hollywood, we wouldn't have > > all those historical movies with bad costumes to rant about. And I > > actually like the southern end of the state... LA can be quite pretty > > if you know where to look, and nothing beats the overall beauty of San > > Diego. :) > > > >Woooo, S-Dog! My family are long time San Diego residents. Rubio's fish >tacos >are the shizznit. > >Sarra Wryght >http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ > _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 14:35:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IZSqa018868 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:35:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IYXdx021060 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 12:34:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IYVPh016913; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:34:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80106.mail.yahoo.com (web80106.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.79]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42IYSPh016887 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:34:28 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030502183427.8433.qmail@web80106.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80106.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 02 May 2003 11:34:27 PDT Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 11:34:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO For Nicole: About the closest equivalent you would have in the UK to an American redneck would be someone like the character Osmond in the British TV comedy "Keeping Up Appearances." And for Bergdahl, who wrote: > >Hell as far as I am concerned they can have the > southern part of the state > >back. It's only good for fabric, and someplace to > send our waste water. And this coming from someone who lives in "Sack O' Tomatoes." 'Scuse me, but your provincialism is showing. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 14:43:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IhXqa018929 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:43:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IgWdx021903 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 12:42:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IgPPh022104; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:42:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IfqPh021690 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:41:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be5b.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.91]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B7CB826294A for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:41:50 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000701c310da$c97e04e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 20:43:56 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] copyright declaration X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. Does any of you remember i told you that the Museum of Decorative Art in Copenhagen refused me to take photos of my favourite fashion printed series: Galleries des Modes et Costumes Francaises? Well i looked at the V&A picture archive site on the net and it says that it is not allowed to take any photocopyes because they cannot tollerate the light, but photos may be taken and you just have to sign a paper where you sign that you wont use it in public. This is just what i have thoaght the danish museum would have done. I am only interrested in these fashion prints for costume documentation, nothing else. So next time i go to London, i shall write them a letter and ask them if they would allow me to digital photo the whole set.............. As a matter of fact i have had several sleapless nights because of this refusion from the danish museum. I actually think it is illegal to do that........... Well i hope the best for my next London Trip.............. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 14:49:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42In4qa018943 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:49:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Im0dx022727 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 12:48:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IlsPh025881; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:47:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42IllPh025778 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:47:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HE900GS3W7LDN@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 02 May 2003 11:47:46 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 11:42:04 -0700 From: Kimiko Small In-reply-to: X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030502112946.00b011c8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/2/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Costume College (was: So. CA) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 06:14 PM 5/2/2003 +0000, you wrote: >Please tell me more about Costume College. I think it's a yearly event, >but what exactly is it? Has anyone gone and now have stories raving (or >not) about it? Is it worth going to (I know, what am I saying?!? It's >costume related... of course it WORTH going to!!!!)? You asked for it! ;-) http://www.costumecollege.org/ I went to CC once, several years ago, and fully immersed myself in the experience. I had registered early enough that I got my choice of tour, which was Western Costumes. OH MY GOODNESS, that place was just to die for! Room after room of costumes from floor to ceiling. They were working on Crusade costumes (I am a B5 fan, as is my hubby, so this made me happy.) Volumes in a large room of research material. Shoes including a pair of ruby slippers, and the list for this one tour alone was just... incredible! Then it was several days of classes. Lots of classes. Some were lectures, some were hands on for several hours of the day, like creating corsets. I enjoyed bobbin lace, and metal embroidery, and a discourse on the meaning of colors in costumes, and many more classes. I met many wonderful people who shared anything you asked of them. And then on Saturday night I enjoyed the Ball, where everyone was in costumes of all imaginable sorts. I even got my photo taken of me in my first English Renaissance nobles (which I can't wear anymore... sob!). From breakfast with all these creative people, to the time I went to bed, it was creative heaven. Ideas, theories, comparisons, people asking people "how did you create what you are wearing?" Wonderful displays and movies and merchants (take lots of money or a big credit card open balance). Ok, I have talked myself into going back again... just need someone to go with me. I will be fair however, one of my friends just did not enjoy herself at CC. She registered late, and didn't get into any tours or the Ball or Tea Party, and she just didn't get into many of the classes she wanted to. So to her it sucked and she didn't want to go back. My opinion is to register early (I had registered in January prior to that year's event), and immerse yourself with all CC has to offer. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 14:51:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Ipjqa018956 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:51:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Imrdx022900 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 12:48:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42ImlPh026578; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:48:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80104.mail.yahoo.com (web80104.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.77]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42ImHPh026199 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:48:18 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030502184817.1031.qmail@web80104.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80104.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 02 May 2003 11:48:17 PDT Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 11:48:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: So. CA X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kit wrote: > Okay, so I just have to say it, my favorite quote > about L.A. One recited > with all the love and understanding of a person who > TRULY loves Los Angeles, > but can see all her problems: > > There are over 3 millon people in the City of > Angels, according to the last > census. Over half of them are up to something they > don't want the other half > to know about. Palm trees finger the sky and > there's enough sunshine to lay > some off on Pittsburg. But that's all on top, L.A. > truth to tell, it not > much different than a pretty girl with the clap. - > City of Angels Actually, it's "PittsburgH" (my emphasis on the H at the end). The one without the "h" is about 30 miles down the Sacramento River from you. Pittsburgh's another city known for it's smog, and lesser-known (in some circles) for it's tremendous cultural arts and philanthropy. OCC: For Jeanne on switching from B&W to color and back-- Whoooeeeeeee! My kudos and sympathy! We were almost going to do that with "Oz," but couldn't get a B&W backdrop for Kansas. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 15:04:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42J4Xqa018998 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:04:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42J3fdx024581 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 13:03:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42J3eM6007025; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:03:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42J3bM6006989 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:03:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 26670 invoked from network); 2 May 2003 19:03:36 -0000 Received: from turbo.sonic.net (208.201.224.26) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 2 May 2003 19:03:36 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-187.sonic.net [209.148.112.187]) by turbo.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h42J3af19802 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:03:36 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 12:04:55 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA In-Reply-To: <20030502184817.1031.qmail@web80104.mail.yahoo.com> References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I used to live in Pittsburgh. The smog went away years ago along with the steel industry. Do they have any reenactment type activities there now? Fran >Actually, it's "PittsburgH" (my emphasis on the H at >the end). The one without the "h" is about 30 miles >down the Sacramento River from you. Pittsburgh's >another city known for it's smog, and lesser-known (in >some circles) for it's tremendous cultural arts and >philanthropy. > >OCC: For Jeanne on switching from B&W to color and >back-- > >Whoooeeeeeee! My kudos and sympathy! We were almost >going to do that with "Oz," but couldn't get a B&W >backdrop for Kansas. > >Dawn > >===== >Dawn Jacobson >Vallejo, CA, USA > >"Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those >socks?" > --Wicked Witch > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 15:46:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Jksqa019202 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:46:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Jjtdx029316 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 13:45:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42JjiM6006955; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:45:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42JjTM6006666 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:45:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.114] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7AF1BA001AA; Fri, 02 May 2003 15:31:59 -0400 Message-ID: <001501c310e3$d0cfb640$725183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030502184817.1031.qmail@web80104.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 15:48:33 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And, we ain't the Smokey City no more! And, Indeed the Arts are alive and well in all areas. So what if we have two new spots arenas! Coming up is "The Three Rivers Arts Festival" where can strut our stuff...canvas to stage, and all the lively arts in-between. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn Jacobson" To: Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 2:48 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > Kit wrote: > > > Okay, so I just have to say it, my favorite quote > > about L.A. One recited > > with all the love and understanding of a person who > > TRULY loves Los Angeles, > > but can see all her problems: > > > > There are over 3 millon people in the City of > > Angels, according to the last > > census. Over half of them are up to something they > > don't want the other half > > to know about. Palm trees finger the sky and > > there's enough sunshine to lay > > some off on Pittsburg. But that's all on top, L.A. > > truth to tell, it not > > much different than a pretty girl with the clap. - > > City of Angels > > > Actually, it's "PittsburgH" (my emphasis on the H at > the end). The one without the "h" is about 30 miles > down the Sacramento River from you. Pittsburgh's > another city known for it's smog, and lesser-known (in > some circles) for it's tremendous cultural arts and > philanthropy. > > OCC: For Jeanne on switching from B&W to color and > back-- > > Whoooeeeeeee! My kudos and sympathy! We were almost > going to do that with "Oz," but couldn't get a B&W > backdrop for Kansas. > > Dawn > > ===== > Dawn Jacobson > Vallejo, CA, USA > > "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" > --Wicked Witch > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 15:53:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Jqqqa019218 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:53:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Jpedx000300 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 13:51:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42JpYM6011386; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:51:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42JpVM6011295 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:51:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.114] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A91B1BBE01AA; Fri, 02 May 2003 15:38:03 -0400 Message-ID: <001b01c310e4$a9cd5560$725183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 15:54:37 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There is the "Wayne" group, a Few Mountain men(and women), Trent's Brigade, The Pennsylvania 9th Regiment and such that I know of re customers, but also some I do not know the official names of. But I understand that you can find an encampment almost any weekend...pick you time period. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 3:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > I used to live in Pittsburgh. The smog went away years ago along with the > steel industry. Do they have any reenactment type activities there now? > > Fran > > > >Actually, it's "PittsburgH" (my emphasis on the H at > >the end). The one without the "h" is about 30 miles > >down the Sacramento River from you. Pittsburgh's > >another city known for it's smog, and lesser-known (in > >some circles) for it's tremendous cultural arts and > >philanthropy. > > > >OCC: For Jeanne on switching from B&W to color and > >back-- > > > >Whoooeeeeeee! My kudos and sympathy! We were almost > >going to do that with "Oz," but couldn't get a B&W > >backdrop for Kansas. > > > >Dawn > > > >===== > >Dawn Jacobson > >Vallejo, CA, USA > > > >"Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those > >socks?" > > --Wicked Witch > > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 15:58:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42JwZqa019236 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:58:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42JvYdx001080 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 13:57:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42JvUKw016160; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:57:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42JvQKw016078 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 13:57:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 26969 invoked from network); 2 May 2003 19:57:26 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 2 May 2003 19:57:26 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-93.sonic.net [209.148.112.93]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h42JvP019572 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 12:57:25 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030502125801.00af41d8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 12:58:44 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA In-Reply-To: <001b01c310e4$a9cd5560$725183d1@rmitchellras> References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What about non-military? Also, 18th century and very early 19th century? Thanks, Fran At 03:54 PM 5/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: >There is the "Wayne" group, a Few Mountain men(and women), Trent's Brigade, >The Pennsylvania 9th Regiment and such that I know of re customers, but also >some I do not know the official names of. But I understand that you can find >an encampment almost any weekend...pick you time period. >Kathleen >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Lavolta Press" >To: "Historical Costume" >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 3:04 PM >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > > > > I used to live in Pittsburgh. The smog went away years ago along with the > > steel industry. Do they have any reenactment type activities there now? > > > > Fran > > > > > > >Actually, it's "PittsburgH" (my emphasis on the H at > > >the end). The one without the "h" is about 30 miles > > >down the Sacramento River from you. Pittsburgh's > > >another city known for it's smog, and lesser-known (in > > >some circles) for it's tremendous cultural arts and > > >philanthropy. > > > > > >OCC: For Jeanne on switching from B&W to color and > > >back-- > > > > > >Whoooeeeeeee! My kudos and sympathy! We were almost > > >going to do that with "Oz," but couldn't get a B&W > > >backdrop for Kansas. > > > > > >Dawn > > > > > >===== > > >Dawn Jacobson > > >Vallejo, CA, USA > > > > > >"Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those > > >socks?" > > > --Wicked Witch > > > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > > >_______________________________________________ > > >h-costume mailing list > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 16:17:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KHsqa019328 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 16:17:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KJVdx003778 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 14:19:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KJTKw003320; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:19:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20209.mail.yahoo.com (web20209.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.64]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42KJOKw003268 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:19:24 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030502201924.76998.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20209.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 02 May 2003 13:19:24 PDT Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 13:19:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030502112946.00b011c8@127.0.0.1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] dress shields; & bone tipping X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello everybody, hope all you lucky folks who attended Costume Con had a good time, though it sounds like you did. I had planned to go, but ended up having to stay home to work on my wedding dress instead. Which is what I have a couple of questions about. First, I'm wondering about sweat shields. The sleeves on my dress are sheer, so anything that wouldn't work on a sleeveless gown probably wouldn't look right on my dress, either. So, is there some good method for protecting the underarms of a sleeveless gown? Second, I'm trying to shorten a couple of flat steel stays, but when I went to my local Home Depot to buy a fresh can of Rubberize-It (my opened jar had dried up), they don't carry it any more, and a quick web search didn't turn up anything. Is that stuff still available? Where? What about this "liquid electrical tape" that they did have, only black and red in the store, but supposedly also available in white and clear? Thanks- Angela __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 16:41:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Kfhqa019432 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 16:41:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KhQdx006457 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 14:43:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KhMKw020403; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:43:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (mta5.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KgaKw019826 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:42:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.116.236.107]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HEA00L9I1IZ9X@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 02 May 2003 13:42:36 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 13:35:45 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? In-reply-to: <12a.290034e2.2be3fd3d@aol.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030502133319.05135410@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Woooo, S-Dog! My family are long time San Diego residents. Rubio's fish tacos >are the shizznit. They're better at Alberto's. (OCC: if you don't drip sauce on your costume.) CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 16:42:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Kgmqa019438 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 16:42:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KiUdx006582 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 14:44:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KiSKw021173; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:44:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KiMKw021084 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:44:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA14202 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 16:03:58 -0500 Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 16:03:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] dress shields; & bone tipping In-Reply-To: <20030502201924.76998.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Fri, 2 May 2003, Angela Kovatch wrote: > Which is what I have a couple of questions about. First, I'm > wondering about sweat shields. The sleeves on my dress are sheer, so > anything that wouldn't work on a sleeveless gown probably wouldn't > look right on my dress, either. So, is there some good method for > protecting the underarms of a sleeveless gown? In the past, I've been able to find dress shields meant for sleeveless dresses. They're a single crescent that goes inside just the body part of the dress. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 16:46:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Kkfqa019451 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 16:46:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KmGdx007002 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 14:48:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42KmEKw023519; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:48:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Km5Kw023365 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:48:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.111] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A65C1D5501AA; Fri, 02 May 2003 16:34:36 -0400 Message-ID: <000c01c310ec$906d14e0$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502125801.00af41d8@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 16:51:10 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fran, I am aware of a Scottish group and a River life group but all the rest are connected in some way to the military...that I know of. We do have various sites like the Bradford House and the Miller Homestead that are connected to the Whiskey Rebellion (1792-6) that feature costumed interpreters. Of course the Civil War folk have maneuvers as well as balls, teas and outings. Trent And Wayne are 18th C reinactors. We do have the Pike Festival coming up in May (other wise known as The National Road Festival. All sorts of reinactor folk will strut their stuff in costume along Route 40, including a couple of wagon trains. Their costumes tend to be everything from Westward Ho to Country Western...but the wagons, gigs and horses are great! Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > What about non-military? Also, 18th century and very early 19th century? > > Thanks, > > Fran > > At 03:54 PM 5/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > >There is the "Wayne" group, a Few Mountain men(and women), Trent's Brigade, > >The Pennsylvania 9th Regiment and such that I know of re customers, but also > >some I do not know the official names of. But I understand that you can find > >an encampment almost any weekend...pick you time period. > >Kathleen > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Lavolta Press" > >To: "Historical Costume" > >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 3:04 PM > >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > > > > > > > I used to live in Pittsburgh. The smog went away years ago along with the > > > steel industry. Do they have any reenactment type activities there now? > > > > > > Fran > > > > > > > > > >Actually, it's "PittsburgH" (my emphasis on the H at > > > >the end). The one without the "h" is about 30 miles > > > >down the Sacramento River from you. Pittsburgh's > > > >another city known for it's smog, and lesser-known (in > > > >some circles) for it's tremendous cultural arts and > > > >philanthropy. > > > > > > > >OCC: For Jeanne on switching from B&W to color and > > > >back-- > > > > > > > >Whoooeeeeeee! My kudos and sympathy! We were almost > > > >going to do that with "Oz," but couldn't get a B&W > > > >backdrop for Kansas. > > > > > > > >Dawn > > > > > > > >===== > > > >Dawn Jacobson > > > >Vallejo, CA, USA > > > > > > > >"Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those > > > >socks?" > > > > --Wicked Witch > > > > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > > > >_______________________________________________ > > > >h-costume mailing list > > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 16:59:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Kx0qa019492 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 16:59:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42L0Xdx008258 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 15:00:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42L0W4H001701; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:00:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42L0Q4H001623 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:00:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 8451 invoked from network); 2 May 2003 21:00:26 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 2 May 2003 21:00:26 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-176.sonic.net [209.148.112.176]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h42L0Oc10332 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 14:00:24 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030502135546.00aa9ca0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 14:01:44 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA In-Reply-To: <000c01c310ec$906d14e0$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502125801.00af41d8@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sounds good. But is this all in the Pittsburgh area? I've think I've been to the Oliver Miller homestead--isn't that the one they call the Old Stone Manse? Twenty miles or so southwest of Pittsburgh? But isn't the Bradford place in Ohio? Several hours' drive from Pittsburgh if I remember right. BTW, for the DC residents--what is the reenactment, costuming, and vintage dance scene in the Washington DC area like? My husband's company is working on a project with another company in that area and he may be making some trips there. I want him to go to G Street Fabrics sometime but maybe there's something else to take in too. Fran At 04:51 PM 5/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Fran, I am aware of a Scottish group and a River life group but all the rest >are connected in some way to the military...that I know of. We do have >various sites like the Bradford House and the Miller Homestead that are >connected to the Whiskey Rebellion (1792-6) that feature costumed >interpreters. Of course the Civil War folk have maneuvers as well as balls, >teas and outings. Trent And Wayne are 18th C reinactors. >We do have the Pike Festival coming up in May (other wise known as The >National Road Festival. All sorts of reinactor folk will strut their stuff >in costume along Route 40, including a couple of wagon trains. Their >costumes tend to be everything from Westward Ho to Country Western...but >the wagons, gigs and horses are great! >Kathleen >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Lavolta Press" >To: "Historical Costume" >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 3:58 PM >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > > > > What about non-military? Also, 18th century and very early 19th century? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Fran > > > > At 03:54 PM 5/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > >There is the "Wayne" group, a Few Mountain men(and women), Trent's >Brigade, > > >The Pennsylvania 9th Regiment and such that I know of re customers, but >also > > >some I do not know the official names of. But I understand that you can >find > > >an encampment almost any weekend...pick you time period. > > >Kathleen > > >----- Original Message ----- > > >From: "Lavolta Press" > > >To: "Historical Costume" > > >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 3:04 PM > > >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > > > > > > > > > > I used to live in Pittsburgh. The smog went away years ago along with >the > > > > steel industry. Do they have any reenactment type activities there >now? > > > > > > > > Fran > > > > > > > > > > > > >Actually, it's "PittsburgH" (my emphasis on the H at > > > > >the end). The one without the "h" is about 30 miles > > > > >down the Sacramento River from you. Pittsburgh's > > > > >another city known for it's smog, and lesser-known (in > > > > >some circles) for it's tremendous cultural arts and > > > > >philanthropy. > > > > > > > > > >OCC: For Jeanne on switching from B&W to color and > > > > >back-- > > > > > > > > > >Whoooeeeeeee! My kudos and sympathy! We were almost > > > > >going to do that with "Oz," but couldn't get a B&W > > > > >backdrop for Kansas. > > > > > > > > > >Dawn > > > > > > > > > >===== > > > > >Dawn Jacobson > > > > >Vallejo, CA, USA > > > > > > > > > >"Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with >those > > > > >socks?" > > > > > --Wicked Witch > > > > > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > > > >h-costume mailing list > > > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > h-costume mailing list > > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > >h-costume mailing list > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 17:08:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42L8dqa019539 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 17:08:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42LAGdx009097 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 15:10:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42LAF4H007432; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:10:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pop2b.ripco.com (root@pop2b.ripco.com [209.100.227.27]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42L9u4H007212 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:09:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ripco.com (tcr219.dynip.ripco.net [209.100.226.219]) by pop2b.ripco.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id h42LC6N02148 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 16:12:07 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3EB2DE9B.9030909@ripco.com> Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 16:09:47 -0500 From: zski User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] getting started X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO and it's all Drea's fault! I fitted the toile and cut the bodice for my new flemish kirtle today. This is after spending waaaay too much on sale linen the other day. Now I'm off to lok for hemp cord for the new corded corset. I can stop costuming any time - I just like the way it tastes! Wendy Z under a huge pile of fabric in Chicago IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 17:22:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42LMVqa019574 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 17:22:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42LO8dx010264 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 15:24:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42LO74H014893; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:24:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay2.primushost.com (relay2.primushost.com [207.244.125.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42LNr4I014713 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:23:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from (shell3.shore.net) [207.244.124.103] by relay2.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 19Bi2z-0002fR-00; Fri, 02 May 2003 17:26:25 -0400 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for id 19Bi0g-0000Xz-00; Fri, 02 May 2003 17:24:02 -0400 Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 17:24:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Katy Bishop To: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] dress shields; & bone tipping In-Reply-To: <20030502201924.76998.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: Historical Costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Angela, You might want to try greenberg and Hammer, they haev a couple of styles of sleeveless dress shields. They also carry tipping fluid. Katy PS. Jeff just picked up the replacement bones for you. 2 12" spiral steel and 2 12 1/2 " flat steel. On Fri, 2 May 2003, Angela Kovatch wrote: >Hello everybody, hope all you lucky folks who attended >Costume Con had a good time, though it sounds like you >did. I had planned to go, but ended up having to stay >home to work on my wedding dress instead. > >Which is what I have a couple of questions about. >First, I'm wondering about sweat shields. The sleeves >on my dress are sheer, so anything that wouldn't work >on a sleeveless gown probably wouldn't look right on >my dress, either. So, is there some good method for >protecting the underarms of a sleeveless gown? > >Second, I'm trying to shorten a couple of flat steel >stays, but when I went to my local Home Depot to buy a >fresh can of Rubberize-It (my opened jar had dried >up), they don't carry it any more, and a quick web >search didn't turn up anything. Is that stuff still >available? Where? What about this "liquid electrical >tape" that they did have, only black and red in the >store, but supposedly also available in white and >clear? > >Thanks- >Angela > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. >http://search.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 17:46:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42LkAqa019621 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 17:46:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Llidx012011 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 15:47:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h42Llc4H027403; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:47:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20206.mail.yahoo.com (web20206.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h42LlY4H027367 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 15:47:35 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030502214733.64555.qmail@web20206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 02 May 2003 14:47:33 PDT Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 14:47:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] dress shields; & bone tipping To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks- it's good to know those are out there. I will look for them. -Angela --- Robin Netherton wrote: > > On Fri, 2 May 2003, Angela Kovatch wrote: > > > Which is what I have a couple of questions about. > First, I'm > > wondering about sweat shields. The sleeves on my > dress are sheer, so > > anything that wouldn't work on a sleeveless gown > probably wouldn't > > look right on my dress, either. So, is there some > good method for > > protecting the underarms of a sleeveless gown? > > In the past, I've been able to find dress shields > meant for sleeveless > dresses. They're a single crescent that goes inside > just the body part of > the dress. > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 22:07:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43271qa020327 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 22:07:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4328hdx029477 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 20:08:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4328ZIm020893; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:08:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4328WIm020858 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:08:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (00217146@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.11.5/8.11.5) with ESMTP id h4328W0339193 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 21:08:32 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 21:08:31 -0500 (CDT) From: Emma Elizabeth Lehman <00217146@bigred.unl.edu> To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I don't know if I'm looking for advice or sympathy or if I'm just ranting, but I'm starting to get very frustrated. In the last couple of years I've probably made half a dozen complete outfits for other people (for money, trade or satisfaction--I'm not being taken advantage of) but I've only managed one simple gown for myself. It isn't a question of time, it's just that I have a lot of trouble sewing for myself. If I'm sewing for somebody else and encounter a problem, I'll grit my teeth and handle it. If I'm sewing for myself, I throw the offending piece of garment across the room and refuse to look at or speak of it for a week. I don't know if I hold my own garments to higher standards than I do those I make for others, or if I just consider other people's deadlines more firm than my own, but now that I've decided that I'm not making anything for anybody else before finishing something for myself, I haven't done any sewing in two weeks. I'm strongly considering hiring a friend to do *my* sewing for me, but that feels too much like giving up. Has anyone else dealt with this? Can anybody think of any way to get past it? I'm not burned out on costuming, I'm just burned out on costuming for *myself.* Emma, frustrated in Nebraska _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 22:27:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432RFqa020361 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 22:27:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432Stdx001049 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 20:28:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432SsIm029637; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:28:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc52.attbi.com (rwcrmhc52.attbi.com [216.148.227.88]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432SqIm029583 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:28:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from c59303a (12-238-186-49.client.attbi.com[12.238.186.49]) by rwcrmhc52.attbi.com (rwcrmhc52) with SMTP id <2003050302284605200al6hoe>; Sat, 3 May 2003 02:28:46 +0000 Message-ID: <0d4f01c3111b$b96662f0$31baee0c@c59303a> From: "chiara" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 21:28:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You are more right than you know. I do the same thing to a lesser degree. Something that I can make for someone else in three hours and do it well, I cannot do for myself. It takes me a month or more to do the same thing. I do not have the answer but I am going to try something new and will let you know if it works. I am going to put myself on a schedule. Spend "x" amount of time on drawing out the pattern. Stop, do something not costume related. Go back "x" hours later and work on the next step, etc. I found that this works for other things in my life and hope that it works here too. I am more behind than I can tell you in making things not only for myself but my family. Making things for them is equally as difficult. The idea came from an executive class I had to take while at Neiman Marcus, that Franklin Covey time management course. Chiara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Emma Elizabeth Lehman" <00217146@bigred.unl.edu> To: Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 9:08 PM Subject: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others : I don't know if I'm looking for advice or sympathy or if I'm just ranting, : but I'm starting to get very frustrated. In the last couple of years I've : probably made half a dozen complete outfits for other people (for money, : trade or satisfaction--I'm not being taken advantage of) but I've only : managed one simple gown for myself. It isn't a question of time, it's : just that I have a lot of trouble sewing for myself. If I'm sewing for : somebody else and encounter a problem, I'll grit my teeth and handle it. : If I'm sewing for myself, I throw the offending piece of garment across : the room and refuse to look at or speak of it for a week. : : I don't know if I hold my own garments to higher standards than I do those : I make for others, or if I just consider other people's deadlines more : firm than my own, but now that I've decided that I'm not making anything : for anybody else before finishing something for myself, I haven't done any : sewing in two weeks. : : I'm strongly considering hiring a friend to do *my* sewing for me, but : that feels too much like giving up. Has anyone else dealt with this? Can : anybody think of any way to get past it? I'm not burned out on costuming, : I'm just burned out on costuming for *myself.* : : : Emma, frustrated in Nebraska : : _______________________________________________ : h-costume mailing list : h-costume@mail.indra.com : http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 22:43:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432h4qa020414 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 22:43:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432iedx002101 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 20:44:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432iZIm006836; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:44:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432iWIm006792 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:44:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ppp052188.usmo.com ([209.248.52.188] helo=hppav) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Bn0o-0000yW-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 02 May 2003 22:44:31 -0400 Message-ID: <012401c3111d$f6fceb00$b834f8d1@hppav> From: "Genie" To: Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 21:44:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4920.2300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4920.2300 Subject: [h-cost] Hi Wendy X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Love the cow costume. Genie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 22:50:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432oiqa020437 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 22:50:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432qRdx002721 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 20:52:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432qPIm010412; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:52:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc53.attbi.com (rwcrmhc53.attbi.com [204.127.198.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h432qMIm010296 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 20:52:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fenris.net (12-246-237-231.client.attbi.com[12.246.237.231]) by rwcrmhc53.attbi.com (rwcrmhc53) with SMTP id <2003050302521605300ncnuee>; Sat, 3 May 2003 02:52:16 +0000 Message-ID: <3EB32EE6.4030708@fenris.net> Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 19:52:22 -0700 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have the opposite problem - I can sew for myself, but I have problems finishing sewing projects for others. I finally learnt not to take on sewing projects for others because 90% of the time, they don't get done! There a few exceptions. In my case, I believe it is because I'm a darn perfectionist. What's OK for me is not good enough for others. I used to chuck a lot of projects that were unfinished (projects for me) in the bin. Now I just put it down and walk away for a little while - sometimes weeks, sometimes just an hour or two. I find that I can *help* someone sew something, or teach them to sew with no problem. I don't know if having an 'audience' keeps me from flipping out, or if the process of teaching prevents it.. Maybe you could find a friend who wants to learn to sew and try working on a project together, a project for you! good luck Elizabeth Young Emma Elizabeth Lehman wrote: >I don't know if I'm looking for advice or sympathy or if I'm just ranting, >but I'm starting to get very frustrated. In the last couple of years I've >probably made half a dozen complete outfits for other people (for money, >trade or satisfaction--I'm not being taken advantage of) but I've only >managed one simple gown for myself. It isn't a question of time, it's >just that I have a lot of trouble sewing for myself. If I'm sewing for >somebody else and encounter a problem, I'll grit my teeth and handle it. >If I'm sewing for myself, I throw the offending piece of garment across >the room and refuse to look at or speak of it for a week. > >I don't know if I hold my own garments to higher standards than I do those >I make for others, or if I just consider other people's deadlines more >firm than my own, but now that I've decided that I'm not making anything >for anybody else before finishing something for myself, I haven't done any >sewing in two weeks. > >I'm strongly considering hiring a friend to do *my* sewing for me, but >that feels too much like giving up. Has anyone else dealt with this? Can >anybody think of any way to get past it? I'm not burned out on costuming, >I'm just burned out on costuming for *myself.* > > >Emma, frustrated in Nebraska > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 2 23:19:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h433J6qa020556 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 23:19:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h433Kmdx004327 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 21:20:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h433KlVN022243; Fri, 2 May 2003 21:20:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net (smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net [206.210.69.156]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h433KhVN022213 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 21:20:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 8536 invoked from network); 3 May 2003 03:20:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bookbusiness) (208.166.66.23) by smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net with SMTP; 3 May 2003 03:20:42 -0000 Message-ID: <003901c31122$fc7b86e0$1742a6d0@bookbusiness> From: "Janet Davis" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com><5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030502125801.00af41d8@pop.sonic.net> <000c01c310ec$906d14e0$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 23:20:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Of course, Pittsburgh has a very large SCA group, if you want to count that. Janet Janet Davis Castle Furnishings http://www.medievalbookstore.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 01:23:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h435Ngqa020815 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 01:23:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h435P8dx011144 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 23:25:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h435OxoS010594; Fri, 2 May 2003 23:24:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h435OtoS010575 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 23:24:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEA0018JPPGSW@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 02 May 2003 22:24:53 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 22:18:00 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others In-reply-to: X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030502221208.00af7468@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/2/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:08 PM 5/2/2003 -0500, you wrote: >I'm strongly considering hiring a friend to do *my* sewing for me, but >that feels too much like giving up. Has anyone else dealt with this? Can >anybody think of any way to get past it? I'm not burned out on costuming, >I'm just burned out on costuming for *myself.* > > >Emma, frustrated in Nebraska I was there Emma, for the past several years I didn't do any costuming, except for friends. I realized that I held myself to higher standards because I know what mistakes I was making, and I got frustrated at myself. I finally made a new outfit for myself for faire, and already it came apart in the wings and neck. The culprit was the wool, and my trimming it too close to the selvage. It frustrated me so much I haven't sewn for a week, and I need to finish other outfits. What we both need to do is accept we make mistakes, and try to look at them as learning experiences and move on. Otherwise, we will "burn out" and feel disillusioned with ourselves, when we know we can do better for ourselves. And we both probably need to do something else for a day, to get our minds cleared and our spirits rejuvenated. I know I need this badly right now. So I am working on my web site, and this weekend if it doesn't rain, I will be working on my house projects. And come Monday, I will be back to the sewing machine (I hope) refreshed and ready for costuming again. {{{{{HUGS}}}}} You are not alone. We are here and I bet many of us understand what you are feeling. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 01:57:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h435vUqa020906 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 01:57:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h435x5dx012712 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 2 May 2003 23:59:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h435x4Op022389; Fri, 2 May 2003 23:59:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h435x2Op022366 for ; Fri, 2 May 2003 23:59:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AACE2E7D001E; Sat, 03 May 2003 00:59:42 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AAA81B65012C; Sat, 03 May 2003 00:59:04 -0500 Message-ID: <00b201c31138$ed8d3140$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030430140814.71173.qmail@web13401.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Internships Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 01:57:49 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Mara, I am sorry I didn't get back to you sooner.... I have been down with my back again for a couple of days. I came back to over 1000 emails backed up. We have thought about going to the universities for interns. The biggest problem is finding people that are interested in computers and historic fashions. I believe our interns need to have a strong background in both to work on these publications. When I went through school 5 years ago, only two of us out of the whole fashion department were into historic costume. There was an interest in the costume design part of the theater dept. but not the computer skills. I thought about going to the graphic design dept. but think it would be harder to find that combination. I did put an announcement on the USITT College Costume Design email list. We do have a couple of interns from there. We are looking for really unique people who have a strong desire to learn more about historic fashions and computers. We have found over the years working in one time period can start to drive you crazy quickly... then you need to be willing to hop to another time period. A good example is our 1922 maternity catalog. I scanned and cleaned a good portion of the images. But after a while the 1920s silhouette can get to you. I handed the project over to Sharon. This was a new area and period to her. Sharon completed it but by the time she did... she was more than willing to move to another time period. This work like sewing has a high burn out rate. I tell the interns to send up the white flag when before they reach the burn out phase. Then we will move to another subject matter in another time period. We do have interns that have specific interests that we try to cater to. I asked all of them if they have something special they are interested in fashion. I want to know more than one interest. Some are catered towards specific talents on the computer. We have an email list for the staff and interns. In the past couple of months, we have already started giving one another nicknames for our areas of interest. One intern's nickname is the Queen of Tables... she is really good at making tables... bless her heart, she has typed up some wonderful tables of colors documentation. I have taken her off of tables for a week or so to do just plain typing. I don't want to burn her out on tables. Costume people are generally very creative. They can do very tedious work, but can also get burned out quickly. So we try to keep that in mind when assigning projects. It is really nice to see all of our interns working together. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 02:51:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h436p0qa002651 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 02:51:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h436qedx014943 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 00:52:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h436qYOp009254; Sat, 3 May 2003 00:52:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h436qUOp009239 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 00:52:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7562EC4001E; Sat, 03 May 2003 01:53:10 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A731BD200DA; Sat, 03 May 2003 01:52:33 -0500 Message-ID: <017601c31140$65eb3b80$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: internships Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 02:51:17 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO LOL!!!!!!!!! Gail, my kids think I have a money orchard in back of the house. One tree is not enough for six kids. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 02:52:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h436qdqa003120 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 02:52:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h436sIdx015025 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 00:54:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h436sHOp010111; Sat, 3 May 2003 00:54:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h436sEOp010089 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 00:54:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7BE2ECD001E; Sat, 03 May 2003 01:54:54 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A799E4601F2; Sat, 03 May 2003 01:54:17 -0500 Message-ID: <017d01c31140$a406e400$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200304300535.h3U5ZfnD022754@net.indra.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030430132951.02c6f2c0@127.0.0.1> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: internships Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 02:53:01 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kim does a wonderful job on the graphics too. Her Sept. 1838 ladies are beautiful!!!!!!! Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kimiko Small" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 4:33 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: internships > At 04:18 PM 4/30/2003 -0400, you wrote: > >the skills these interns are > >learning are a great return for their work. > > > As one of her interns, I already had the skills she needed for the graphics > work, but Penny has taught me new things. My payoff is the time in her > library, and free classes that I want to take as soon as I have time to > devote to them (client outfit first priority). I also enjoy cleaning up the > images I have to work on. That is a thrill to see the pretty ladies looking > better than their originals. > > I imagine that when I no longer am getting a thrill from the graphics, or > no longer need to learn anything, I shall move on. But that won't be for > awhile with the satisfaction level I am currently at. > > Kimiko > > > > Kimiko Small > Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother > kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com > > Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery > http://www.costumegallery.com > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 04:49:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h438nXqa023367 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 04:49:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h438pBdx020710 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 02:51:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h438p7Fl019504; Sat, 3 May 2003 02:51:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h438p4Fl019485 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 02:51:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7beee.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.238]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id EEED326297A for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:51:02 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001301c31151$77631070$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 10:53:28 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This idea of yours i have thoaght about two. A very good idea. And i have thoaght about using it for other things i never do anymore two. I have ben so frustrated lately because i have not made any bobbin lace for sooooooooo long time, and i really miss it very much. So this would be a good idea to let me have x hours of lace making also. Another reason why i dont make so many things for myself is because it is very very difficult to try on the garments on yourself. You cant see if it sits properly in the back. So i would suggest, if you have the possibility to do it, to help another sewer with the same thing. She or he could help you fit your garments and you could help her or him with the same thing. But the difficult thing is to get to know somebody who could help you and vise versa. Bjarne Chiara wrote: You are more right than you know. I do the same thing to a lesser degree. Something that I can make for someone else in three hours and do it well, I cannot do for myself. It takes me a month or more to do the same thing. I do not have the answer but I am going to try something new and will let you know if it works. I am going to put myself on a schedule. Spend "x" amount of time on drawing out the pattern. Stop, do something not costume related. Go back "x" hours later and work on the next step, etc. I found that this works for other things in my life and hope that it works here too. I am more behind than I can tell you in making things not only for myself but my family. Making things for them is equally as difficult. The idea came from an executive class I had to take while at Neiman Marcus, that Franklin Covey time management course. Chiara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Emma Elizabeth Lehman" <00217146@bigred.unl.edu> To: Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 9:08 PM Subject: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 06:08:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43A8aqa023573 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 06:08:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h439AIdx021456 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 03:10:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h439AH8b025612; Sat, 3 May 2003 03:10:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay8-f49.bay8.hotmail.com [64.4.27.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h439AD8b025559 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 03:10:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 3 May 2003 02:10:07 -0700 Received: from 62.253.32.5 by by8fd.bay8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 03 May 2003 09:10:07 GMT X-Originating-IP: [62.253.32.5] X-Originating-Email: [jennierussell@hotmail.com] From: "jennie russell" To: h-costume@net.indra.com Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 10:10:07 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 May 2003 09:10:07.0956 (UTC) FILETIME=[CAD72140:01C31153] Subject: [h-cost] Re: sewing for self vs. sewing for others X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO i totally agree, i have the same problem, i think its because i am so perfectionistic towards myself, and other people are like wow! thats great" buti know all the things that could have been better. I am making my wedding dress at them moment-with quite alot of fear and trepidation!! but i'm taking my time and trying to just enjoy it rather than stress to much over it. My biggest fear though at moment is that i'll get to the end of it and on my wedding day hate it, not because its bad, but because I made it and im a perfectionist, so i freely admit that this time,just this once, if i feel myself getting way overly annoyed or whatever with it i am going to hand it over to someone else! but we'll see,its been good so far! jennie _________________________________________________________________ Use MSN Messenger to send music and pics to your friends http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 08:07:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43C7uqa023898 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 08:07:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43BvYdx029262 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 05:57:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43BvVbX017134; Sat, 3 May 2003 05:57:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43BvTbX017088 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 05:57:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.106] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB7D13F101A6; Sat, 03 May 2003 07:43:57 -0400 Message-ID: <000f01c3116b$9bd05340$6a5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502125801.00af41d8@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502135546.00aa9ca0@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 08:00:35 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO All that I have mentioned are in the Pgh area! The Miller homestead is in South Park, about 15 Miles from the city and the Bradford house is in Washington, Pa. which is 25 miles or 40 Minutes from the Duquesne parking lot. We also have the Julius Lemoyne house which is our 19th C mansion. Lemoyne was a doctor and ardent abolitionist.That house is now the home of the Washington County Historical Society. We also boast of the first crematory in the US...another project of Lemoyne. Wheeling WV is another 25 miles west, bordering Ohio...still on the national road. They are working hard at restoring some of the lovely river-front homes and have a group trying to get a Hist-society up and running there. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 5:01 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > Sounds good. But is this all in the Pittsburgh area? I've think I've been > to the Oliver Miller homestead--isn't that the one they call the Old Stone > Manse? Twenty miles or so southwest of Pittsburgh? But isn't the Bradford > place in Ohio? Several hours' drive from Pittsburgh if I remember right. > > BTW, for the DC residents--what is the reenactment, costuming, and vintage > dance scene in the Washington DC area like? My husband's company is > working on a project with another company in that area and he may be making > some trips there. I want him to go to G Street Fabrics sometime but maybe > there's something else to take in too. > > Fran > > At 04:51 PM 5/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > >Fran, I am aware of a Scottish group and a River life group but all the rest > >are connected in some way to the military...that I know of. We do have > >various sites like the Bradford House and the Miller Homestead that are > >connected to the Whiskey Rebellion (1792-6) that feature costumed > >interpreters. Of course the Civil War folk have maneuvers as well as balls, > >teas and outings. Trent And Wayne are 18th C reinactors. > >We do have the Pike Festival coming up in May (other wise known as The > >National Road Festival. All sorts of reinactor folk will strut their stuff > >in costume along Route 40, including a couple of wagon trains. Their > >costumes tend to be everything from Westward Ho to Country Western...but > >the wagons, gigs and horses are great! > >Kathleen > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Lavolta Press" > >To: "Historical Costume" > >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 3:58 PM > >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > > > > > > > What about non-military? Also, 18th century and very early 19th century? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Fran > > > > > > At 03:54 PM 5/2/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > >There is the "Wayne" group, a Few Mountain men(and women), Trent's > >Brigade, > > > >The Pennsylvania 9th Regiment and such that I know of re customers, but > >also > > > >some I do not know the official names of. But I understand that you can > >find > > > >an encampment almost any weekend...pick you time period. > > > >Kathleen > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: "Lavolta Press" > > > >To: "Historical Costume" > > > >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 3:04 PM > > > >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > > > > > > > > > > > > > I used to live in Pittsburgh. The smog went away years ago along with > >the > > > > > steel industry. Do they have any reenactment type activities there > >now? > > > > > > > > > > Fran > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Actually, it's "PittsburgH" (my emphasis on the H at > > > > > >the end). The one without the "h" is about 30 miles > > > > > >down the Sacramento River from you. Pittsburgh's > > > > > >another city known for it's smog, and lesser-known (in > > > > > >some circles) for it's tremendous cultural arts and > > > > > >philanthropy. > > > > > > > > > > > >OCC: For Jeanne on switching from B&W to color and > > > > > >back-- > > > > > > > > > > > >Whoooeeeeeee! My kudos and sympathy! We were almost > > > > > >going to do that with "Oz," but couldn't get a B&W > > > > > >backdrop for Kansas. > > > > > > > > > > > >Dawn > > > > > > > > > > > >===== > > > > > >Dawn Jacobson > > > > > >Vallejo, CA, USA > > > > > > > > > > > >"Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with > >those > > > > > >socks?" > > > > > > --Wicked Witch > > > > > > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > > > > >h-costume mailing list > > > > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > > > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > > > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > > > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > h-costume mailing list > > > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > > >h-costume mailing list > > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 10:40:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Ee1qa024416 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:40:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43EYtdx007853 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 08:34:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43EYri9012840; Sat, 3 May 2003 08:34:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web12501.mail.yahoo.com (web12501.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.193]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h43EYpi9012831 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 08:34:51 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030503143451.6192.qmail@web12501.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.41.38.39] by web12501.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 03 May 2003 07:34:51 PDT Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 07:34:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Lil Sorepaws To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305030654.h436sVOr010168@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm right there with you folks in the "sewing for self" is harder than sewing for others, although my reason is a little different .. I get so frustrated with FITTING things to actually fit myself. I'm mainly self taught and can't just look at a pattern and know where to alter it to have it fit *me* right .. and there are parts that are hard to measure properly even if you ARE a contortionist!!! Fitting garments to someone else you can pin and tuck and modify .. on self its a lot more difficult .. and since my family is very AGAINST my sewing, asking mom for fitting help is on par with asking her to come with me to get a nose ring or a tatto on my forehead ... something that is simply "not done by normal people" according to her ... Anyways, pardon the rant ... her main problem is the fact that I want to sew costumes .. if I wanted to hem my pants or sew up a ripped seam, she'd be *grudgingly* ok with that .. but costumes? "when are you going to grow up" ?? My family is very old world. If i want to sew I have to pick time when they are out of the house AND clean up any "evidence" of what I was doing. Is it any wonder I still haven't finished the 3 projects I started a month ago (a simple italian renn dress, a very basic jerkin, and 2 corsets - one needs grommets the other straps) .. guess I better go and get some work done before they get home and I get screamed at for wasting my time (again) ;) - Lil (riding uphill on a unicycle) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 11:18:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43FIEqa024536 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:18:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43FGBdx010258 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 09:16:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43FG7cV026808; Sat, 3 May 2003 09:16:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.113]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43FG4cV026762 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 09:16:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.net (pcp03486178pcs.indpnd01.mo.comcast.net [68.86.79.197]) by mtaout03.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEB00BKSH1Z6R@mtaout03.icomcast.net> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Sat, 03 May 2003 11:15:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 10:15:49 -0500 From: "Linda J. Thompson" Subject: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others To: h-costume@net.indra.com Message-id: <3EB3DD25.1050607@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am that exact same way... In all the years I have been sewing costumes I have made myself exactly 6 things.. 2 bodices, 1 gown 2 skirts, 2 chemises... ooh and I forgot the corset.. That is over an 8 year period. And that was simply because I "had" to have something to wear at fair. For some reason when I start to sew for myself, it becomes a chore. It is like when I have to wash dishes to cook... I would rather eat macaroni out of the pot and find a clean spoon rather than "have" to wash dishes. Now I can do the dishes any other time and it never bothers me.. but when it becomes something I have to do, I baulk... Never figured out why, but it has always been that way with me.:) >I'm strongly considering hiring a friend to do *my* sewing for me, but >that feels too much like giving up. Has anyone else dealt with this? Can >anybody think of any way to get past it? I'm not burned out on costuming, >I'm just burned out on costuming for *myself.* >Emma, frustrated in Nebraska -- Linda Thompson Attitude Is Everything http://corsetsandcostumes.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 12:06:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43G67qa024674 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:06:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43G3wdx013118 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 10:03:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43G3usP015389; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:03:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43G3ssP015370 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:03:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA18253 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:23:34 -0500 Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 11:23:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030503143451.6192.qmail@web12501.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] Gaining family approval for sewing (was: sewing for self) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sat, 3 May 2003, Lil Sorepaws wrote: > since my family is very AGAINST my sewing, asking mom for fitting help > is on par with asking her to come with me to get a nose ring or a > tatto on my forehead ... something that is simply "not done by normal > people" according to her ... > Anyways, pardon the rant ... her main problem is the fact that I want > to sew costumes .. if I wanted to hem my pants or sew up a ripped > seam, she'd be *grudgingly* ok with that .. but costumes? "when are > you going to grow up" ?? My family is very old world. If i want to > sew I have to pick time when they are out of the house AND clean up > any "evidence" of what I was doing. What a shame. They should be proud of you! A couple of thoughts. You might see if there's a Costume Guild in your area. Or a member of this list. You might find yourself a fitting partner that way, or even someone who would be willing to let you sew at his/her house. Once you do have some finished projects, consider entering them in a competition -- SCA, con masquerade, or even a local sewing store (stores or chains sometimes have contests for design or workmanship or just for making clothes from bought patterns -- and historic patterns count). If you win some recognition for your work, your family might realize you're not just playing kiddie dress-up. You might also sew something modern, or "vintage" but very stylish -- get a "designer" pattern that isn't too difficult and doesn't require too much fitting -- that you can wear to nice dinners or family events. If your family thinks saving money is good, you can mention how much it would have cost in the store or professionally made vs. your "tailor-making" it yourself. If they're impressed by labels or names, just being able to say "It's a [designer's name] design, but I made it myself" can be very effective ... particularly if you're saying it to a family friend or relative who then gives the expected "ooh, aah" response. I don't know whether you're still in high school, but if so you might enlist the support of the home ec teacher or art teacher or drama teacher. If you can say you're doing a project for a student show or display, it can become "reputable." Or you might even manage to arrange an independent study (for credit) that involves researching and making historic costumes. That suddenly turns your hobby into a potential career choice (even if you're not planning this as a career). For that matter, if you can make contact with someone in a local costumers organization or a professional costumer who comes off as stable, serious, and not flaky, and who is clearly doing costuming as an adult profession with pay and recognition, and that person is willing to "sponsor" your work (meaning: you can come over to their place and sew, or just show them your plans and get suggestions, or anything in between), that might add some legitimacy. It can mean a lot for an adult professional to say to a parent, "Your daughter has talent in this field." If you are in my geographical area I would be happy to help you out. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 12:16:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GGnqa024685 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:16:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GEgdx013950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 10:14:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GEesP019822; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:14:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h43GEasP019748 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:14:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWrrbtUv1TQ4hPbw1J2kxT0yMN0ZOtipQxg==">; Sat, 03 May 2003 09:13:53 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HW93VEQP; Sat, 03 May 2003 09:13:53 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 12:12:51 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others Message-ID: <20030503.121252.-387651.0.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 9-11 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think we have all had this problem. For a while I was making ball gowns and gentleman's ball garb for friends doing early 18th century, making garb for SCA friends and wearing a beat up old T-tunic to events myself. What got me moving was being asked to portray Mary Queen of Scots at a week long event. Since then I have managed to make myself one other outfit in between half a dozen for others. I figure that a one for me, six for others is a decent ratio. But yesterday I found the most yummy fabric (NOT period, but great color and texture) on the dollar table at WalMart. I only have two other garments promised so maybe I will make it two for others and one for me this time. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 12:24:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GOHqa024703 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:24:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GMEdx014384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 10:22:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GMDsP022761; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:22:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h43GMBsP022730 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:22:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWrrbtUv1TQ4hLRhYIswmGfvu/Bi8R39Ynw==">; Sat, 03 May 2003 09:21:17 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HW94AXW8; Sat, 03 May 2003 09:21:17 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 12:19:37 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others Message-ID: <20030503.121938.-387651.1.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,4-6 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO <<>> I think I have the opposite reaction. If I am sewing for someone else I am doing something constructive and if I am sewing for myself I am selfish. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 12:31:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GVXqa024751 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:31:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GTLdx014868 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 10:29:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GTKsP026321; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:29:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h43GTFsP026233 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:29:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCoUsHY1gxqVUIysg1CtXpzK6/1r+bkyExQ==">; Sat, 03 May 2003 12:28:34 EDT Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HW94P99T; Sat, 03 May 2003 12:28:34 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 10:42:03 -0500 Message-ID: <20030503.104204.-266916497.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-2,5-9,13-24,29-36,39-42,48-51,55-58,60-71,73-76,81-84,87-90,92-105,107-115,117-129 From: seamstrix@juno.com Subject: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Sills To: betsy@hawkswood.com ; Costume-Con@Costume-Con.org ; 'Glen Boettcher' ; HenryOsier@cs.com ; sue@just-for-kids.com ; AhayEsq@aol.com ; 'Ricky & Karen Dick' Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 7:34 AM Subject: Costume Con Photographs On-Line Please forward the following e-mail to all attendees at Costume Con 21. While there are still a few more images which will go on-line later today (they are being transferred from film) the vast majority are already up on-line for viewing and ordering. E-mail follows. COSTUME CON 21 PHOTOS NOW ONLINE - ORDERING AVAILABLE! First, let me say ThankYou to everyone who attended Costume Con 21 and allowed us to photograph them. My team and I had a wonderful time, and costumes were incredible. Between three photographers, we shot several thousand images. Over the last two weeks we have culled these down to the 600 or so you will find on-line here: http://www.dotphoto.com/go.asp?l=digitalfocus&AID=729167 Every single costume which we were able to see was captured. There is also at least one full-body shot for each costume entered in the various events/masquerades, as well as many alternative takes as well. The photographs are arranged on-line in chronological order, but by photographer. If you do not see an image you are looking for, be sure to check through the remaining images. It is more than likely there. If you do not see one you are looking for, please send me an e-mail at peters@digitalfocus.net, and we will see if we can get it on-line as quickly as possible. Additionally, we are now hard at work putting together the CD-ROM of the event. The CD will contain images suitable for screen viewing on a PC or Mac*, but will not be printable. Additionally, the CD will be re-ordered so that each shot of a specific costume is together for viewing. If you are interested in a CD-ROM, and did not order at the show, you can still send a check for $25 to: Peter Sills 25382 Wren Rd. Tower Lakes, IL 60010 Please make all checks out to Peter Sills, and include your mailing address, as well as a daytime phone and e-mail address. We will be keeping the photos on-line for ordering as long as possible, but can make no guarantees as to how long that will be. If there is a photo you want, please do not hesitate to order it on-line. There are also additional options for gift items (coffee mugs, keychains, etc.) which can be ordered with your favorite images. Orders for the CD-ROM (and photos ordered at the show) will be going out over the next couple of weeks. If you are interested, please get your order to me as quickly as possible. Once again, thank you for this wonderful opportunity. We look forward to possibly being able to do this again in the future. Sincerely, Peter Sills Digital Focus (Adobe Acrobat required for CD-ROM viewing - available as a free download) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/KXUxcA/fNtFAA/uetFAA/JJTolB/TM ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Community email addresses: Post message: cc2003@onelist.com Subscribe: cc2003-subscribe@onelist.com Unsubscribe: cc2003-unsubscribe@onelist.com List owner: cc2003-owner@onelist.com Shortcut URL to this page: http://www.onelist.com/community/cc2003 Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 12:51:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GpYqa024829 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:51:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GmKdx015973 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 10:48:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GmGsP004008; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:48:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from post.its.mcw.edu (post.its.mcw.edu [141.106.32.10]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Gm7sP003962 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:48:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from post.its.mcw.edu (york.is.mcw.edu [141.106.12.17]) by post.its.mcw.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.4) with ESMTP id h43Gm5K13320 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:48:05 -0500 (CDT) Received: from post (net-60-219.dhcp.mcw.edu [141.106.60.219]) by post.its.mcw.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.4) with SMTP id h43Gm5G13308 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:48:05 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001b01c31193$9b7f9400$db3c6a8d@its.mcw.edu.aghlab> From: "mls" To: Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 11:46:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Subject: [h-cost] looking for a larger/better image....14c Italian cotehardie X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi All! A friend of mine (who is not on this list, but know I am) is looking for.... a larger image of a picture in Boucher's "20,000 Years of Fashion" (yeah, I'm sure anything this broad is held in low regard), in the 14th C. section (p. 196) there is a picture of a red and gold cotehardie identified as "Italian Breviary c. 1380, Paris, Bib. Nat., ms. lat. 757, f. 109". He has tried going to the Bib. Nat. de France on-line, but hasn't been able to find it. Can anyone help? Thanks! Arthur (via Marie, a lurker) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 12:55:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Gtvqa024848 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:55:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GrVdx016214 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 10:53:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GrUsP006046; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:53:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h43GrLsP005984 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:53:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 22064 invoked from network); 3 May 2003 16:53:21 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 3 May 2003 16:53:21 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-170.sonic.net [209.148.112.170]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h43GrKb15461 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 09:53:20 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030503094324.00a981c8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 09:54:38 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Internships In-Reply-To: <00b201c31138$ed8d3140$0400a8c0@comcast.net> References: <20030430140814.71173.qmail@web13401.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >Costume people are generally very creative. They can do very tedious work, >but can also get burned out quickly. So we try to keep that in mind when >assigning projects. It is really nice to see all of our interns working >together. > Hmm . . . I can work more than eight hours a day, seven days a week including holidays, for over two years at a stretch. On one costume book for one time period spanning as little as about a year. Much of this time is spent on intensive graphics editing. I don't get bored and I don't "burn out." I'm always interested enough in what I'm doing to think about it whenever I wake up in the night, and talk about it to my husband all the time. As soon that book is done, I start another book. One thing I don't like is not having a project. This is nothing unique, as most other publishing professionals I know who work at it full time do the same thing. One book goes out, another comes in. There's a lot of detail work, and you have to be fully engaged to do it. On the other hand, people who drop something the minute they get bored, don't tend to become professionals. So I'm not sure that encouraging that practice in your interns is doing them a service. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 13:02:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43H2Sqa024866 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:02:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43H00dx016566 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 11:00:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GxxKs009344; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:59:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43GxtKs009323 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 10:59:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0826E7A643 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 09:56:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 09396-01 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 09:56:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-64-172-60-196.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [64.172.60.196]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C699E7A612 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 09:56:05 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 09:56:30 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030503143451.6192.qmail@web12501.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <2FF00317-7D88-11D7-92AD-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would STRONGLY recommend this book: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0870057758/ qid=1051980944/sr=8-2/ref=sr_8_2/002-0421753- 7502454?v=glance&s=books&n=507846 Fitting & Pattern Alteration: A Multi-Method Approach by Elizabeth G. Liechty, Della N. Pottberg, Judith A. Rasband, Elizabeth L. Liechty It's very helpful as a place to start learning pattern alteration! On Saturday, May 3, 2003, at 07:34 AM, Lil Sorepaws wrote: > I'm right there with you folks in the "sewing for self" is harder than > sewing for others, although my reason is a little different .. I get so > frustrated with FITTING things to actually fit myself. I'm mainly self > taught and can't just look at a pattern and know where to alter it to > have > it fit *me* right .. and there are parts that are hard to measure > properly > even if you ARE a contortionist!!! Fitting garments to someone else > you > can pin and tuck and modify .. on self its a lot more difficult .. and > since my family is very AGAINST my sewing, asking mom for fitting help > is > on par with asking her to come with me to get a nose ring or a tatto > on my > forehead ... something that is simply "not done by normal people" > according to her ... > > Anyways, pardon the rant ... her main problem is the fact that I want > to > sew costumes .. if I wanted to hem my pants or sew up a ripped seam, > she'd > be *grudgingly* ok with that .. but costumes? "when are you going to > grow > up" ?? My family is very old world. If i want to sew I have to pick > time > when they are out of the house AND clean up any "evidence" of what I > was > doing. Is it any wonder I still haven't finished the 3 projects I > started > a month ago (a simple italian renn dress, a very basic jerkin, and 2 > corsets - one needs grommets the other straps) .. guess I better go > and > get some work done before they get home and I get screamed at for > wasting > my time (again) ;) > > - Lil (riding uphill on a unicycle) > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 13:08:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43H8fqa024886 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:08:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43H6adx017095 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 11:06:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43H6YKs012252; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:06:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h43H6WKs012188 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:06:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWrrbtUv1TQ4hi2rkvFY4bFdsxwXU+9jXFg==">; Sat, 03 May 2003 10:05:44 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HW96UBWC; Sat, 03 May 2003 10:05:44 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 13:04:00 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line Message-ID: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-3 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wow, what great costumes. Would the members of h-costume please identify yourselves? Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 13:35:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HZdqa024991 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:35:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HXZdx018799 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 11:33:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HXYKs022045; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:33:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc53.attbi.com (rwcrmhc53.attbi.com [204.127.198.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HXUKs022011 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:33:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cc632021-b.attbi.com (12-246-76-5.client.attbi.com[12.246.76.5]) by rwcrmhc53.attbi.com (rwcrmhc53) with SMTP id <2003050317332505300la6cje>; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:33:25 +0000 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20030502122909.00a447a0@mail.attbi.com> X-Sender: mabse@mail.attbi.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 12:29:49 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: MaryAnn Jones Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20030502052239.05401e10@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sarah, do you still work there? I am on the 15th floor. maryann At 07:54 AM 5/2/2003 -0700, you wrote: >>You may not like having to see what you are breathing, but there are some >>nice things about Southern CA besides the LA garment district. > >Er. Sacramento is worse than LA these days when it comes to air >quality. I worked for the EPA last year on the 23rd floor of the building >and in the summer, there was a thick layer of brown smudge hanging about >30 feet below my window. > >So, Sac can't brag about being better than LA in this arena any more. >:P > >Obligatory Costume Content (OCC): Without Hollywood, we wouldn't have all >those historical movies with bad costumes to rant about. And I actually >like the southern end of the state... LA can be quite pretty if you know >where to look, and nothing beats the overall beauty of San Diego. :) > >Sarah > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 13:45:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HjRqa025045 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:45:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HfNdx019081 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 11:41:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HfMKs024152; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:41:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sccrmhc02.attbi.com (sccrmhc02.attbi.com [204.127.202.62]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HfEKs024072 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:41:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from c59303a (12-238-186-49.client.attbi.com[12.238.186.49]) by sccrmhc02.attbi.com (sccrmhc02) with SMTP id <20030503174109002001fpshe>; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:41:09 +0000 Message-ID: <017401c3119b$2f15b260$31baee0c@c59303a> From: "chiara" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030503.121938.-387651.1.catpurson@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 12:38:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO YES!!! That is it to the "T" for me!!! Chiara ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 11:19 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others : <<>> : : I think I have the opposite reaction. If I am sewing for someone : else I am doing something constructive and if I am sewing for myself I am : selfish. : : Lalah : Never give up, Never surrender : _______________________________________________ : h-costume mailing list : h-costume@mail.indra.com : http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 13:46:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Hk2qa025053 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:46:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Hi2dx019225 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 11:44:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Hi1Ks025023; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:44:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc51.attbi.com (rwcrmhc51.attbi.com [204.127.198.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43HhtKs024974 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:43:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cc632021-b.attbi.com (12-246-76-5.client.attbi.com[12.246.76.5]) by rwcrmhc51.attbi.com (rwcrmhc51) with SMTP id <20030503174350051002qk47e>; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:43:50 +0000 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20030503104057.00a494d0@mail.attbi.com> X-Sender: mabse@mail.attbi.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 10:41:43 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: MaryAnn Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: sewing for self vs. sewing for others In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I find that the answer to this is to put it away when you are done for a while. It gives you some distance so you aren't so invested in the mistakes. maryann At 10:10 AM 5/3/2003 +0100, you wrote: >i totally agree, i have the same problem, i think its because i am so >perfectionistic towards myself, and other people are like wow! thats >great" buti know all the things that could have been better. I am making >my wedding dress at them moment-with quite alot of fear and trepidation!! >but i'm taking my time and trying to just enjoy it rather than stress to >much over it. My biggest fear though at moment is that i'll get to the end >of it and on my wedding day hate it, not because its bad, but because I >made it and im a perfectionist, so i freely admit that this time,just this >once, if i feel myself getting way overly annoyed or whatever with it i am >going to hand it over to someone else! but we'll see,its been good so far! >jennie > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Use MSN Messenger to send music and pics to your friends >http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 14:07:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I7iqa025175 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:07:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Hwhdx019822 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 11:58:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Hwggo028998; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:58:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r07.mx.aol.com (imo-r07.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.103]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Hwago028934 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:58:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.156.1ee3332d (3924) for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:58:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Kitsune242@aol.com Message-ID: <156.1ee3332d.2be55d43@aol.com> Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 13:58:27 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/2/2003 7:09:54 PM Pacific Standard Time, 00217146@bigred.unl.edu writes: > I don't know if I hold my own garments to higher standards than I do those > I make for others, or if I just consider other people's deadlines more > firm than my own, but now that I've decided that I'm not making anything > for anybody else before finishing something for myself, I haven't done any > sewing in two weeks. > Hi Emma, I don't know if you are holding your own garments to a higher standard or not... But with me it is generally because I have an obligation to another person. If it is a gift and they don't know it is coming, it is becuase I want to give it to them by a specific date. If it is a promised item, I want to make sure they have it when they need it. Because I want to make sure someone has whatever item I am working on, I work through any problems. For someone else, I take it apart, I hand sew it instead of machine sew, I start over, whatever... For my own stuff, I allow myself to get up and leave the room. The longer I stay away from the project, the less likely I am to finish it. I currently have 12 projects waiting to be finished in 8 different sizes. I have started asking around to see who will fit into what so that I can just get them out of the house. I had to stop making things for other people for a while so I could concentrate on myself. My armor doesn't fit, I have one dress for SCA and nothing for any other time period I do. I got one dress done last year, and to be comepletely honest, I normally wouldn't call it done but I had to leave for the event. What makes all this even worse, is at times I prefer to sew for other people. I don't like the hassle of sewing for myself. Fitting myself. It is probably some psychological trick I am attempting to play on myself, a denial thing about my body image or some such.... I am sure a therapist could tell me. Anyway, you are not alone. Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 14:09:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I9Oqa025179 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:09:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I7Mdx020270 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 12:07:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I7Lgo002043; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:07:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net (turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.126]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I7Hgo002027 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:07:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-11-168.smf.jps.net ([216.119.11.168] helo=elizabethanlady.com) by turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19C1Po-0004bL-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 03 May 2003 11:07:16 -0700 Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 11:03:46 -0700 Subject: Re: So. CA (was Re: [h-cost] Re: A costumer's dream job? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030502122909.00a447a0@mail.attbi.com> Message-Id: <95A294FA-7D91-11D7-9A5C-0003934DD4B0@elizabethanlady.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Sarah, do you still work there? I am on the 15th floor. maryann LOL! You're the second person I've encountered in the last week who works there (my new landlord works on the 16th floor), but unfortunately, I no longer darken it's halls. I quit so I could go away to school (I was CIWMB Legal Office's student assistant. They're really a great bunch of people, no matter what you've heard. And the chief counsel really isn't Satan incarnate). It was a fun gig while it lasted... The Chief Counsel liked me so I got away with a lot of stuff I probably wouldn't have otherwise. ;) OCC: Three of the 8 attorneys I worked for were avid Renaissance Faire goers... I got a lot of notoriety in that office for the costumes I made. I miss working there (I'm so crazy for even saying this), but it really was a lot of fun. Sarah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 14:09:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I9qqa025183 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:09:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I7ndx020290 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 12:07:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I7mgo002216; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:07:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gw.retro.com (gw.retro.com [205.179.181.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43I7Kgo002036 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 12:07:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by gw.retro.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id h43I6e310025 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 3 May 2003 11:06:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 11:06:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Thompson-Herbert Message-Id: <200305031806.h43I6e310025@gw.retro.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've figured out a new strategy: I do a costume piece for a friend at low cost (or as a special occasion gift) as a way of testing out a new method or idea. I just did a block-printed shirt for our newest musician at a very low cost (dress shirt cost $15, I charged $30) so that I had an excuse to use my newest set of blockprinting stamps from Hot Potatoes. I also tried out some ideas I had about pumping up the volume of interference pigment in my gold textile paint. It looks fab, and even if it wasn't "perfect", I wasn't charging much either. And it's still better than he could've gotten elsewhere. I left my camera at home for May morning, so I'll have to try and get a shot of Richard in the shirt next time we have a gig. I used these stamps: http://www.hotpotatoes.com/store/product.asp?dept%5Fid=90&pf%5Fid=L403 http://www.hotpotatoes.com/store/product.asp?dept%5Fid=90&pf%5Fid=I402 Despite the names, these are very, very old designs, the types seen before the incoming La Tiene celts had mixed with the anglo saxons (who are the ones who contributed the knotwork). I used a blood red dress shirt, then laid down a black ground for the border down the sleeves and the front placket of the shirt. That was outlined in gold, then the stamps were laid down in gold as well. I used Jaquard Lumiere paint, with a considerable amount of gold mica sparkle and gold interefence pigment added to get a very shiny, very dense color. When I brought it into practice to present to Richard, all the dancers tried to swipe it before I got to him. ;} I told him if he didn't like it, I was taking it back. [grin] I, on the other hand, just finished another shirt with a celtic spiral design painted on by hand with JonesTones Plexy flexible adhesive, then covered in silver hologram glitter. Certain strategic parts of the design have Swarovski rhinestones set in. This costume also needs a good photo, as the only one from May Morning is of me sitting in my wheelchair while playing for the morris dancers. Our other musician, Jody, received a black wingtip tuxedo shirt (ordered specially for his birthday) and a hand-painted silk bowtie. Dharma Trading now has them for something insane like $3 a piece, less if you buy a dozen. I'm seriously considering doing the ties as a money-making venture, as I can easily sell them for $10 or $15. All these pieces were done as proof-of-concept. The trick seems to be for me to pick things that are relatively small, then they get done. If the project is too big, it'll progress for a while...then sit in the corner for months because life has distracted me. Having a hard deadline helps as well if I need items for a particular performance, they tend to get done on time. Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 15:28:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43JSCqa025380 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 15:28:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43J0ddx022219 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 13:00:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43J0Vw4015729; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:00:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net (albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.120]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43J0Rw4015712 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:00:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19C2FG-0001Fg-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 03 May 2003 12:00:26 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 12:00:27 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01c311a6$42f37280$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <74.2dbd248d.2be3f41d@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Who is giving out my email address? -OT X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I just got the nicest email from a gentleman (in French) who had been given my email address by someone whom he met at the Sylvia White Gallery Tursday. She claimed to be a script writer/magazine editor in L.A. Now hink it is rather funny, but I am curious as to why my address? I figured Saragrace _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 15:30:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43JUoqa025392 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 15:30:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43J3odx022334 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 13:03:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43J3ow4016514; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:03:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net (pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43J3mw4016508 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:03:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19C2IV-0004Rq-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 03 May 2003 12:03:48 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 12:03:47 -0700 Message-ID: <000001c311a6$ba99a2a0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Were any of you at the Sylvia White Gallery Thursday Evening in L.A?-OT X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Were any of you at the L.A. Sylvia White Gallery Thursday Evening? Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 16:51:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Kp3qa025756 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 16:51:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KNrdx025596 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 14:23:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KNqAn006101; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:23:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe61.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.196]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KNnAn006069 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:23:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:23:44 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe61.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Sat, 03 May 2003 20:23:44 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030503143451.6192.qmail@web12501.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 16:23:00 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 May 2003 20:23:44.0724 (UTC) FILETIME=[E51C8140:01C311B1] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lil Sorepaws" > I'm mainly self > taught and can't just look at a pattern and know where to alter it to have > it fit *me* right .. That depends on what kind of patterns you're using. Simplicity and the kind are standard, and so are Margo's patterns for Elizabethan (and that's about all the standard ones I've tested). But if you go with small lines, they don't always follow the same basic measurements. But if you work with "standard" patterns often enough you'll end up learning what needs to be done. For example, I know I need to remove one inch in length because I'm short-waisted. Also, since I have a small ribcage, most patterns will fit better if I remove between 1/2 and 1 inch in the center front, when possible. Things were easy for me because my mom has the same problem and she's the one who taught me to sew. However, she doesn't have quite as much hips as I have. (I'm a 8 bust, 10 waist, 12 hips in most modern sewing patterns), and I still don't have quite enough experience yet to be able do deal with it with my eyes closed. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 16:59:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Kxgqa025776 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 16:59:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43K3Zdx024992 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 14:03:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43K3XAn000960; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:03:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43K3VAn000945 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:03:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.117] (pm4-117.eos.net [205.133.149.117]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA21373 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 16:03:28 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 15:58:45 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305031700.h43H0LKt009496@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: sewing for self vs. others X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I can't remember the last time I made something for myself. I don't like to sew and I can always find something else to do with my time -- and something else to wear. But if someone else (these days, usually my daughter) needs something, then I can get past all my problems and just do the darn thing. The only thing I've sewn for months was my daughter's (modern) Easter dress, and I made it in four days despite the numerous problems that invariably come up. My mother, who had just had an operation and so didn't get all the blow-by-blow I usually inflict on her, saw the pictures and thought it was a very expensive dress! So I guess I did a good job. But now I need a new kitchen curtain, and the fabric is just sitting there in a pile. No one needs it, you see, and no one really wants it but me. So no curtain. If I had another person who lived nearby and felt the same way, it would be ideal! We could just sew for each other, and we'd always be doing our best and working in a timely manner! Hmm ... I think the same thing would work for housecleaning! :-) Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 17:02:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43L2Iqa025784 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:02:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KZGdx025964 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 14:35:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KZEAn008684; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:35:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KZAAn008665 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:35:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A82717800076; Sat, 03 May 2003 15:35:51 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A8031400010C; Sat, 03 May 2003 15:35:15 -0500 Message-ID: <00a201c311b3$52c70a20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EB3DD25.1050607@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 16:33:47 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My hat is off to those who can sew for non-family members. I find it a chore to sew for others outside of my family. I find satisfaction watching my loved ones wearing something that I make for my family. I get so attached to something I have sewn. A lot of love goes into each piece. My needlework, I only give to those who I know will really appreciate its beauty and work for a l-o-n-g time. My sister was engaged. I worked for six months on a wedding present of needlework with gold thread. I gave it to her at the wedding. She only stayed married for 9 months. She doesn't even know where the piece is now. Needless to say that is the last thing I made for her. Just broke my heart. Before my mother-in-law went into a nursing home, she gave back all the needlework pieces that I made for her. She wanted the items to be passed on to our children. For now, most of the work hangs in our living room. I guess what I work on are heirloom pieces. I really do admire people who can make something and sell it. My son is an artist and makes things to sell all the time. I am amazed that he can do this. To me, I am so attached to my sewing and needlework, I want to visit it occasionally. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 17:02:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43L2hqa025787 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:02:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KZedx025990 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 14:35:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KZdAn008786; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:35:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe60.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.195]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43KZbAn008759 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:35:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 3 May 2003 13:35:32 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe60.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Sat, 03 May 2003 20:35:31 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001b01c31193$9b7f9400$db3c6a8d@its.mcw.edu.aghlab> Subject: Boucher was: Re: [h-cost] looking for a larger/better image....14c Italian cotehardie Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 16:29:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 May 2003 20:35:32.0004 (UTC) FILETIME=[8AAEDE40:01C311B3] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Actually, Boucher is well thought of as a beginner's book because it presents *real period sources* instead of faulty line drawings like so many others. It's a very good reference for someone who doesn't know which period he/she wants to portray, or who saw something but doesn't know when/where it was worn, or simply wants to know a little bit more about the history of costume in general. (And it has a repro of Laudomia de'Medici, which I haven't yet seen anywhere else. ;-) As for the cotehardie question, I'm afraid I can't help :-( ----- Original Message ----- From: "mls" To: Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 12:46 PM Subject: [h-cost] looking for a larger/better image....14c Italian cotehardie > Hi All! > A friend of mine (who is not on this list, but know I am) is looking for.... > > a larger image of a picture in Boucher's "20,000 Years > of Fashion" (yeah, I'm sure anything this broad is held > in low regard), in the 14th C. section (p. 196) there is > a picture of a red and gold cotehardie identified as > "Italian Breviary c. 1380, Paris, Bib. Nat., > ms. lat. 757, f. 109". > > He has tried going to the Bib. Nat. de France on-line, but hasn't been able > to find it. > > Can anyone help? > > Thanks! > Arthur > (via Marie, a lurker) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 17:03:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43L3Aqa025790 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:03:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Ka9dx026026 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 14:36:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Ka9An008997; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:36:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Ka6An008932 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:36:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.1c3.90a4a7a (26116) for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 16:35:54 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <1c3.90a4a7a.2be5822a@aol.com> Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 16:35:54 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] sewing for self vs. sewing for others To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have a toned-down version of this problem. My parents "encourage" my sewing when it is constructive. I.e. when I made costumes for a play. Of course, at the same time they told me that I couldn't possibly finish everything within my time limit. Now that I'm making costumes, not only do they tell me NOT to sew because I "have too much schoolwork", but they believe that the entire thing is a waste of money. Granted, I've probably spent $300 on the Liz gown I'm making, but that's on everything: the undergarments, fabric for the overskirt and bodice, and fabric for the forepart and sleeves. Okay, so I don't have the lining for the sleeves, or the fabric for the underskirt yet. I can get that for $4 a yard or less in NYC. I'm also "not allowed" to purchase more fabric than I absolutely, positively NEED for the current project. Le sigh. Guess we'll both just have to hang in, until we live separately from the parents, hm? Christine In a message dated 5/3/03 10:37:39 AM Eastern Daylight Time, sorepaws@yahoo.com writes: > Anyways, pardon the rant ... her main problem is the fact that I want to > sew costumes .. if I wanted to hem my pants or sew up a ripped seam, she'd > be *grudgingly* ok with that .. but costumes? "when are you going to grow > up" ?? My family is very old world. If i want to sew I have to pick time > when they are out of the house AND clean up any "evidence" of what I was > doing. Is it any wonder I still haven't finished the 3 projects I started > a month ago (a simple italian renn dress, a very basic jerkin, and 2 > corsets - one needs grommets the other straps) .. guess I better go and > get some work done before they get home and I get screamed at for wasting > my time (again) ;) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 17:39:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Ldfqa025875 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:39:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43LCYdx027267 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 15:12:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43LCXx9017478; Sat, 3 May 2003 15:12:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe24.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.81]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43LCVx9017456 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 15:12:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:12:26 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe24.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Sat, 03 May 2003 21:12:25 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: sewing for self vs. others Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 17:11:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 May 2003 21:12:26.0155 (UTC) FILETIME=[B26B7FB0:01C311B8] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Something just occured to me - I find it a great motivation to keep an online dress diary of my projects, even if not many people are actually reading it :-) It keeps me going. It helps me not to put aside the project for too long. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 18:05:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43M5xqa025952 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 18:05:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Lcrdx028150 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 15:38:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Lcqx9023614; Sat, 3 May 2003 15:38:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f55.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.55]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Lcmx9023573 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 15:38:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 3 May 2003 14:38:43 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 03 May 2003 21:38:43 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Gaining family approval for sewing (was: sewing for self) Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 14:38:43 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 May 2003 21:38:43.0581 (UTC) FILETIME=[5EA39AD0:01C311BC] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >A couple of thoughts. You might see if there's a Costume Guild in your >area. Or a member of this list. You might find yourself a fitting partner >that way, or even someone who would be willing to let you sew at his/her >house. >If you are in my geographical area I would be happy to help you out. > >--Robin > > > I'm in the Portland Oregon area and have a garage sized sewing shop. You're all welcome to come by and play at my house. Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 18:18:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43MITqa025988 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 18:18:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Londx028582 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 15:50:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Lolx9026410; Sat, 3 May 2003 15:50:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h43Loix9026374 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 15:50:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCoUsHY1gxqVUUXCsRpuIIhXjN2CoB2QGlA==">; Sat, 03 May 2003 17:49:44 EDT Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HXAN4C8K; Sat, 03 May 2003 17:49:44 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 15:57:44 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line Message-ID: <20030503.155745.-264291149.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-14 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Okay, I'll admit to it, I'm in the dark red Elizabethan on the last couple of pages..... Karen On Sat, 3 May 2003 13:04:00 -0400 catpurson@juno.com writes: > Wow, what great costumes. Would the members of h-costume > please > identify yourselves? > > Lalah > Never give up, Never surrender ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 18:29:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43MTPqa025999 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 18:29:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43M0pdx028978 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 16:00:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43M0n3t029080; Sat, 3 May 2003 16:00:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m08.mx.aol.com (imo-m08.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.163]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43M0k3t029036 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 16:00:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.d.fc0a659 (26116) for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 18:00:34 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 18:00:33 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/3/03 5:52:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, seamstrix@juno.com writes: > Okay, I'll admit to it, I'm in the dark red Elizabethan on the last > couple of pages..... > I guess that means I'll have to admit to being the Padme part of the Padme-and-Leia picture, and to being in the angry Gothic Elizabethan. I'll be making it better, I promise. Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 19:45:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43NjEqa026166 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:45:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Njcdx003154 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 17:45:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43NjapY026048; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:45:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43NjWpY025972 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:45:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A16F17E601A6; Sat, 03 May 2003 19:31:59 -0400 Message-ID: <000f01c311ce$86d5ce80$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001b01c31193$9b7f9400$db3c6a8d@its.mcw.edu.aghlab> Subject: Re: Boucher was: Re: [h-cost] looking for a larger/better image....14cItalian cotehardie Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 19:48:40 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Back in the dark ages, Boucher was the second costume book I got to connect with after Davenport for compendiums of costume history. Unless I spent the afternoon(s) at the art room at the college. Since then, and since I have been developing my own Library , it still holds it's own standard for first "g;impse". Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 4:29 PM Subject: Boucher was: Re: [h-cost] looking for a larger/better image....14cItalian cotehardie > Actually, Boucher is well thought of as a beginner's book because it > presents *real period sources* instead of faulty line drawings like so many > others. It's a very good reference for someone who doesn't know which period > he/she wants to portray, or who saw something but doesn't know when/where it > was worn, or simply wants to know a little bit more about the history of > costume in general. (And it has a repro of Laudomia de'Medici, which I > haven't yet seen anywhere else. ;-) > > As for the cotehardie question, I'm afraid I can't help :-( > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "mls" > To: > Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 12:46 PM > Subject: [h-cost] looking for a larger/better image....14c Italian > cotehardie > > > > Hi All! > > A friend of mine (who is not on this list, but know I am) is looking > for.... > > > > a larger image of a picture in Boucher's "20,000 Years > > of Fashion" (yeah, I'm sure anything this broad is held > > in low regard), in the 14th C. section (p. 196) there is > > a picture of a red and gold cotehardie identified as > > "Italian Breviary c. 1380, Paris, Bib. Nat., > > ms. lat. 757, f. 109". > > > > He has tried going to the Bib. Nat. de France on-line, but hasn't been > able > > to find it. > > > > Can anyone help? > > > > Thanks! > > Arthur > > (via Marie, a lurker) > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 19:48:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43Nmiqa026175 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:48:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43NnGdx003261 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 17:49:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h43NnGpY026920; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:49:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h43NnBpY026885 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 17:49:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 18451 invoked from network); 3 May 2003 23:49:11 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 3 May 2003 23:49:11 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-116.sonic.net [209.148.112.116]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h43NnAi09827 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 16:49:10 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030503164928.00aa6090@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 16:50:29 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA In-Reply-To: <000c01c310ec$906d14e0$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502125801.00af41d8@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >We do have >various sites like the Bradford House and the Miller Homestead that are >connected to the Whiskey Rebellion (1792-6) that feature costumed >interpreters. That's the stone farmhouse in South Park. They used to call it the Old Stone Manse. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 21:39:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441drqa026495 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 21:39:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441Srdx007227 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 19:28:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441Sn4I019735; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:28:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m06.mx.aol.com (imo-m06.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.161]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441Sk4I019711 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:28:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from FyneHats2@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.1e6.813bc24 (4592) for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 21:28:39 -0400 (EDT) From: FyneHats2@aol.com Message-ID: <1e6.813bc24.2be5c6c7@aol.com> Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 21:28:39 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10637 Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Jessica-Costume College is like you've died and gone to Costume Heaven and the Dean of Costume College (it rotates) has the keys to the Pearly Gates! (This is not an exaggeration.) As Kimiko has said, there are various costume themed tours (backstage at Disneyland wardrobe, Western Costuming, Knott's Berry Farm wardrobe, one year it was Universal and Warner Brothers) where we are given an in-depth, behind-the-scenes tour because they know WE APPRECIATE COSTUMES. There are lectures and demonstrations on all aspects of costuming and in many areas (SF, Historical Costume, Animal Mascots). The workshops are fee based and are quickly snapped up on a first come first, served basis. They are worth it. I have been going to Costume College since 1998 and been privileged to teach at three (Renaissance hats, Victorian straw hats and Dickens Bonnets). Whether you are teaching or taking the classes, you learn sooooo much. Not to mention shopping in the dealer's room. Alter Years, which sells just about every historical costume pattern you could search for, has a large area with books (BOOKS!) and trims (TRIMS!) and corsets and things to make them. Other dealers sell jewelry, hats, feathered masks, needlework books and supplies (Hedgehog Handiworks) and since the lineup keeps changing, there is always someone new. If you don't have someone to share a room with, they do set up a roommate registry, so if you only wanted a room for Saturday night (to flop into after the Time Traveler's Ball), they might be able to set you up with someone who also only wanted one night. It is a fantastic experience. People walk through the halls in costume (no hoops, please) and we practically take over the whole hotel from Friday - Monday. You can actually go up to people and give them the costumer's handshake, which is: as you take their hand, you position yourself so you can more closely observe an interesting part of their costume and say, "That is beautiful! How did you do that?" and no one is put off but spouts forth the entire process to create what you are gawking at. Go, if at all possible, at some time in your costuming life. You will never be sorry and will meet and make many wonderful costuming friends. Donna Scarfe Fyne Hats By Felicity Period Headgear for Past Ages www.fynehatsbyfelicity.com Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 18:14:12 +0000 From: "jessica stier" Please tell me more about Costume College. I think it's a yearly event, but what exactly is it? Has anyone gone and now have stories raving (or not) about it? Is it worth going to (I know, what am I saying?!? It's costume related...of course it WORTH going to!!!!)? :) jessica _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 22:03:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4423vqa026596 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:03:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441r3dx008102 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 19:53:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441r24I024629; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:53:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441qv4I024602 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:52:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.183]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/linuxconf) with SMTP id h4428tM07949 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:08:55 +1000 Message-ID: <0b5201c311e0$15344740$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030502125233.76638.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 11:54:20 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > Yes of course. It is a living history event, not a bash-and-bang and otherwise > nothing coz we are too damn dumb and bone idle to get into living history > thing. hehehehe. :-) Well, I wasn't sure if it was a look-at-us type Living History, or a look and talk. Reenactment displays are always different in different places, so I thought I'd better check. > > > Nicole - who really doesn't like re-enactment/living history anymore > *SIIIIIIIIGH* Totally burnt out and it did not get any better. I dread the > season! *shudder* Don't participate this year - tell your groups you're taking a sabbatical. If they don't understand, then that's their problem, not yours. Glenda. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 22:04:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4424gqa026602 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:04:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441rbdx008152 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 19:53:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441rb4I024756; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:53:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.kc.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441rZ4I024747 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:53:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail5.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 3 May 2003 20:52:25 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030503205712.00a0db30@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 20:58:52 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] CC21 photos X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The official photographer has put his photos of CC21 online for ordering. He has 14 pages full of photos if anyone wants to see them. (663 shots) http://www.dotphoto.com/go.asp?l=digitalfocus&AID=729167 Sheryl Nance-Durst _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 22:06:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4426Lqa026606 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:06:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441tTdx008291 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 19:55:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441tSIU025220; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:55:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail4.kc.rr.com (fe4.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.51]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441tQIU025204 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:55:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail4.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 3 May 2003 20:54:36 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030503205957.009f1d50@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 21:00:43 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] dress shields; & bone tipping In-Reply-To: <20030502201924.76998.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030502112946.00b011c8@127.0.0.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My Home Depot carries it (as of 2 months ago). But they moved it out of the hardware section. It's now in the PAINT section. Sheryl N-D At 01:19 PM 5/2/03 -0700, you wrote: >Second, I'm trying to shorten a couple of flat steel >stays, but when I went to my local Home Depot to buy a >fresh can of Rubberize-It (my opened jar had dried >up), they don't carry it any more, and a quick web >search didn't turn up anything. Is that stuff still >available? Where? What about this "liquid electrical >tape" that they did have, only black and red in the >store, but supposedly also available in white and >clear? > >Thanks- >Angela _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 22:08:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4428Gqa026611 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:08:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441vKdx008355 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 19:57:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441vKIU025627; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:57:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.kc.rr.com (fe2.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441vIIU025618 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:57:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail2.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 3 May 2003 20:57:18 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030503210152.009f10d0@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 21:02:36 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 06:00 PM 5/3/03 -0400, you wrote: >I guess that means I'll have to admit to being the Padme part of the >Padme-and-Leia picture, >Christine Oooh...That was a really good presentation! I liked it! Sheryl Nance-Durst _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 22:09:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4429Xqa026615 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:09:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441wDdx008392 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 19:58:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441wCIU025825; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:58:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.kc.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h441wBIU025816 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 19:58:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail5.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 3 May 2003 20:56:56 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030503210255.009ff290@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 21:03:23 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line In-Reply-To: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 01:04 PM 5/3/03 -0400, you wrote: > Wow, what great costumes. Would the members of h-costume please >identify yourselves? > >Lalah I'm the black & white Victorian in the last few pages. Sheryl Nance-Durst _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 22:24:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442OUqa026652 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:24:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442DUdx009021 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 20:13:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442DSIU029290; Sat, 3 May 2003 20:13:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pop2a.ripco.com (root@pop2a.ripco.com [209.100.227.25]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442DPIU029277 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 20:13:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ripco.com (tcr131.dynip.ripco.net [209.100.226.131]) by pop2a.ripco.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id h442Fet03849 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 21:15:40 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3EA7876F.9070408@ripco.com> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 01:42:55 -0500 From: zski User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@net.indra.com References: <200304240522.h3O5MVIH001280@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] new to list X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A big "Hello" from a new list member. Wendy Z from Chicago, who was on here years ago but couldn't keep up! Hi to Margo, Wayne, Liz, Drea, and all the others from CostumeCon 21 - I was the "Magic (The Gathering) Cloak" and the "Dodo of the Internet" at Iron Costumer. I'm stuck competing as a Master ever since winning a "Best Presentation" at the CostumeCon in Pittsburgh. I'm also a professional musician (Minstrosity) at Renaissance Faires. Next projects will be a hemp-cord corset and a Flemish gown. Pity I can't make Atlanta - and I know what Margo is planning........(I was rooming with "'Big Pink' Marie") I have written a report of my experiences at CostumeCon on my Live Journal. Go to livejournal.com and search for "wendyzski". Looking forward to trying to keep up! Wendy Z _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 22:25:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442PLqa026656 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:25:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442Dqdx009043 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 20:13:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442DqIU029398; Sat, 3 May 2003 20:13:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pop2a.ripco.com (root@pop2a.ripco.com [209.100.227.25]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442DXIU029312 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 20:13:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ripco.com (tcr131.dynip.ripco.net [209.100.226.131]) by pop2a.ripco.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id h442Fnt03855 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 21:15:49 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3EB47735.6040706@ripco.com> Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 21:13:09 -0500 From: zski User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200305032349.h43NnXpa027006@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] CC-21 photos X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Christine wrote: > I guess that means I'll have to admit to being the Padme part of the > Padme-and-Leia picture, Hi! - I'm the one who laced you into it. (Does anyone know who took the photos of me doing this - with the bright yellow lacing in my teeth) Pg 5 left side 5th from bottom is me, in my cloak made entirely of Magic cards (343 of them) and string. Pg 9 fourth row second from right is me and my Iron Costumer team. The next row down the two left shots are me in all my bird-butt glory! (It was very sparkly) Wendy Z happily finished with my new kirtle in Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 22:33:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442Xbqa026679 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:33:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442Ladx009368 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 20:21:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442LZIU001300; Sat, 3 May 2003 20:21:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r08.mx.aol.com (imo-r08.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.104]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442LWIU001274 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 20:21:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.30.3e1aafcb (26116) for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 22:21:21 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <30.3e1aafcb.2be5d321@aol.com> Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 22:21:21 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] CC-21 photos To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/3/03 10:14:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, zski@ripco.com writes: > Christine wrote: > >I guess that means I'll have to admit to being the Padme part of the > >Padme-and-Leia picture, > > Hi! - I'm the one who laced you into it. (Does anyone know who took the > photos of me doing this - with the bright yellow lacing in my teeth) Hi! I can't thank you enough for that- would have taken Deanna (Leia) and I a half-hour to attempt it on our own! Especially since she doesn't know how, and I can't lace myself since there's no front opening (and the whole thing's a bit too fragile to slip over-head). I, too, would like to see the photos of the lacing process- at least I washed the excess dye from the lacing before you had it in your teeth! Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 3 23:02:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4432Cqa026777 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 23:02:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442xudx010834 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 3 May 2003 20:59:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h442xtWo009417; Sat, 3 May 2003 20:59:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com ([216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h442xqWo009406 for ; Sat, 3 May 2003 20:59:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 27187 invoked from network); 4 May 2003 03:41:26 -0000 Received: from 66-44-103-40.s294.apx2.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.103.40) by shada.com with SMTP; 4 May 2003 03:41:26 -0000 Message-ID: <3EB476E8.6020103@oldwaylane.net> Date: Sat, 03 May 2003 22:11:52 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line References: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> In-Reply-To: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO catpurson@juno.com wrote: > Wow, what great costumes. Would the members of h-costume please > identify yourselves? Ok, I'll fess up: my Grandmother Tree has one pic on pg 4 and some more on page 6 (yeah, I thought I didn't do the makeup quite right -sigh-), and my historic 1860s Danish (Ringkobing/Velling region) is at the top on pg 10 and a couple more on pg 10. Wish I didn't fade into that black background so much! You can barely see the wonderful top hat. -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 06:14:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44AEOqa003093 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 06:14:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44ABwdx021188 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 04:11:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44ABsPS002191; Sun, 4 May 2003 04:11:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41509.mail.yahoo.com (web41509.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.92]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44ABpPS002153 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 04:11:51 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030504101146.12758.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41509.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 04 May 2003 11:11:46 BST Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 11:11:46 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <0b5201c311e0$15344740$eaf4fea9@glendaii> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Glenda Robinson wrote: > > Don't participate this year - tell your groups you're taking a sabbatical. > If they don't understand, then that's their problem, not yours. I can't. It is _my_ group and I own pretty much everything from tents over furniture to soft furnishings and cutlery and crockery and pottery etc etc etc. Oh well. One never knows, maybe it doesn't rain this time. harharhar. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 08:17:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CHHqa007342 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 08:17:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CF5dx023603 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 06:15:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CF363025794; Sun, 4 May 2003 06:15:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CEw63025750 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 06:14:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.111] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1141EA801AA; Sun, 04 May 2003 08:01:24 -0400 Message-ID: <003b01c31237$3a034560$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305021801.h42I1APi021712@net.indra.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502120302.00afc588@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030502125801.00af41d8@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030503164928.00aa6090@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 08:18:08 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You are remembering the Miller House, I presume. The Bradford House is on main street, and is also of fieldstone. It is thought to be the first stonehouse in the area, having been built in 1782. After the Rebellion it remained in the hands of the Bradford family although David had fled the country(down river to New Orleans) After his wife and children joined him in about1806, it was 'let' several times and by early 1900 served as a store...grocery, furniture, and etc. In 1964 it was dismantled to the ground and reconstructed to its presumed 18th C standard, then furnished by the State historical Commission. While they own the house, its operation and care is in the province of a Board . Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 7:50 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: So. CA > > >We do have > >various sites like the Bradford House and the Miller Homestead that are > >connected to the Whiskey Rebellion (1792-6) that feature costumed > >interpreters. > > That's the stone farmhouse in South Park. They used to call it the Old > Stone Manse. > > Fran > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 08:38:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CcLqa007428 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 08:38:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CaIdx023897 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 06:36:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CaG63029497; Sun, 4 May 2003 06:36:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CaD63029473 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 06:36:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f96.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.150]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 43953262A4D for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 14:36:12 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000b01c3123a$3116b240$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> <3EB476E8.6020103@oldwaylane.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:39:23 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Judith, I recognised you because of that costume. You had told me about it, and all the things you baught for it here at Silke Anette in Denmark. Dont worry about the dark background, the hat shows very well. It is lovely, congratulations with that. Didnt you had a lot of feed back for it? I think there were many beautifull historical costumes, i particularly like the colonial ones, very well done! Who are they, anybody on this list? Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Judy Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 4:11 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line > catpurson@juno.com wrote: > > Wow, what great costumes. Would the members of h-costume please > > identify yourselves? > > Ok, I'll fess up: my Grandmother Tree has one pic on pg 4 > and some more on page 6 (yeah, I thought I didn't do the > makeup quite right -sigh-), and my historic 1860s Danish > (Ringkobing/Velling region) is at the top on pg 10 and a > couple more on pg 10. Wish I didn't fade into that black > background so much! You can barely see the wonderful top hat. > -Judy Mitchell > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 08:42:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44CgIqa007435 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 08:42:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Ce5dx023951 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 06:40:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Ce463000279; Sun, 4 May 2003 06:40:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Ce263000271 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 06:40:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f96.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.150]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B13752628FE for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 14:40:01 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001101c3123a$bd2d94b0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030504101146.12758.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:43:18 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Nicole! What about you made a party dressed up. Like the pictures you showed last where you were dressed in the red corset and dark long haired wig. You seemed to have a lot of fun there, and it was inside, so it couldnt rain on you all! As long as you have an opportunity to dress up and have fun two, that wouldnt be that bad. I pray that you wont have rain this year................ Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:11 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September > --- Glenda Robinson wrote: > > > > Don't participate this year - tell your groups you're taking a sabbatical. > > If they don't understand, then that's their problem, not yours. > > I can't. It is _my_ group and I own pretty much everything from tents over > furniture to soft furnishings and cutlery and crockery and pottery etc etc etc. > > Oh well. One never knows, maybe it doesn't rain this time. harharhar. > > Nicole > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 11:50:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44FoOqa007875 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 11:50:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44FmFdx029236 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 09:48:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Fm8YT007223; Sun, 4 May 2003 09:48:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Fm5YT007192 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 09:48:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail05.onetel.net.uk (mail05.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.157]) 3.2.2-GA) with ESMTP id ACP80337; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:47:57 +0100 (BST) Received: from mail05.onetel.net.uk (localhost.onetel.net.uk [127.0.0.1]) by mail05.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.1-GA) with ESMTP id ARR19943; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:47:56 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <200305041547.ARR19943@mail05.onetel.net.uk> Received: from 217.149.105.99 by mail05.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.1-GA) with HTTP/1.1; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:47:56 +0100 Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 16:47:56 +0100 From: Melanie Wilson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Webmail Mirapoint Direct 3.2.1-GA MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO can anyone tell me the Costume con URL recently posted please ? I'm at my sisters & it is o my computer at home Thanks Mel I'm away right now so I'll try & pick up emails but don't expect a fast response sorry ! Anything urgent text me _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 12:00:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44G0Vqa007917 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:00:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Fv6dx029642 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 09:57:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Fv5CM009017; Sun, 4 May 2003 09:57:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Fv2CM008993 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 09:57:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f2f.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.47]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id AD1775EE2B9 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:57:01 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001a01c31256$4491f750$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305041547.ARR19943@mail05.onetel.net.uk> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 18:00:22 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.dotphoto.com/go.asp?l=digitalfocus&AID=729167 Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Melanie Wilson" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 5:47 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line > can anyone tell me the Costume con URL recently posted > please ? > > I'm at my sisters & it is o my computer at home > > Thanks > > Mel > > I'm away right now so I'll try & pick up emails but don't expect a fast response sorry ! Anything urgent text me > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 12:03:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44G3lqa007938 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:03:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44G1jdx029822 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 10:01:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44G1iCM009976; Sun, 4 May 2003 10:01:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com ([216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44G1eCM009959 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 10:01:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 25315 invoked from network); 4 May 2003 16:43:12 -0000 Received: from 66-44-47-164.s1942.apx1.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.47.164) by shada.com with SMTP; 4 May 2003 16:43:12 -0000 Message-ID: <3EB52E27.2010600@oldwaylane.net> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 11:13:43 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line References: <200305041547.ARR19943@mail05.onetel.net.uk> In-Reply-To: <200305041547.ARR19943@mail05.onetel.net.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Melanie Wilson wrote: > can anyone tell me the Costume con URL recently posted > please ? > > I'm at my sisters & it is o my computer at home Hi Mel- It's at http://www.dotphoto.com/GuestViewAlbum.asp?AID=729167 Hopefully today I'll get that pdf of my doc online for you. I've just about finished creating a webpage for the Danish Dress, just have to fix the pointers - it will be off my regular costuming page; http://www.oldwaylane.net/costuming.html once everything is lined up right. -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 12:12:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44GBxqa007979 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:11:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44G9idx000324 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 10:09:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44G9hCM011756; Sun, 4 May 2003 10:09:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44G9dCM011736 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 10:09:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f2f.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.47]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B46F947FF0B for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 18:09:38 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000e01c31258$08430da0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 18:12:59 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. This very moment i just finished the embroidery for the robe francaise. Finally i can go on to the more speedy things. Tomorrow i shall start fresh on the stays and the panier. I want to make it in some nice grey linen i baught some time ago. The direct link to the finished embroidery is here: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary.html Hope you like it! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 12:16:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44GGNqa007999 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:16:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44GCfdx000454 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 10:12:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44GCeCM012389; Sun, 4 May 2003 10:12:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44GCaCM012370 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 10:12:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail05.onetel.net.uk (mail05.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.157]) 3.2.2-GA) with ESMTP id ACP81447; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:12:34 +0100 (BST) Received: from mail05.onetel.net.uk (localhost.onetel.net.uk [127.0.0.1]) by mail05.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.1-GA) with ESMTP id ARR21950; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:12:34 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <200305041612.ARR21950@mail05.onetel.net.uk> Received: from 217.149.105.99 by mail05.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.1-GA) with HTTP/1.1; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:12:33 +0100 Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 17:12:33 +0100 From: Melanie Wilson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Webmail Mirapoint Direct 3.2.1-GA MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks Mel I'm away right now so I'll try & pick up emails but don't expect a fast response sorry ! Anything urgent text me _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 12:26:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44GQ9qa008020 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:26:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44GNMdx000922 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 10:23:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44GNLCM014748; Sun, 4 May 2003 10:23:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44GNHCM014649 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 10:23:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/Oqx0zgCrX5EskhFTe8BYSQE=">; Sun, 04 May 2003 09:22:14 PDT Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HXCNREAZ; Sun, 04 May 2003 09:22:14 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 09:21:55 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. Message-ID: <20030504.092155.1480.2.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,5-30 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lovely work, as always! :-) Arlys On Sun, 4 May 2003 18:12:59 +0200 "Bjarne og Leif Drews" writes: > Hi. > This very moment i just finished the embroidery for the robe > francaise. > Finally i can go on to the more speedy things. Tomorrow i shall > start fresh > on the stays and the panier. I want to make it in some nice grey > linen i > baught some time ago. > The direct link to the finished embroidery is here: > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary.html > Hope you like it! > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 14:23:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44INsqa008294 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 14:23:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44ILqdx005839 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 12:21:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44ILo64012119; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:21:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail6.kc.rr.com (fe6.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.53]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44ILl64012108 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:21:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail6.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sun, 4 May 2003 13:22:08 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030504132520.009e7410@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 13:27:06 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] CC-21 photos In-Reply-To: <3EB47735.6040706@ripco.com> References: <200305032349.h43NnXpa027006@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wendy Z wrote: >Pg 5 left side 5th from bottom is me, in my cloak made entirely of Magic >cards (343 of them) and string. That was a great one! >Pg 9 fourth row second from right is me and my Iron Costumer team. The >next row down the two left shots are me in all my bird-butt glory! >(It was very sparkly) I thought that the Iron Costumer was a great idea. You guys were amazing to come up with those costumes in 1 hour's sewing time. They were all 3 great presentations, too! Sheryl N-D _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 15:37:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Jbnqa008444 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:37:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44JZDdx009022 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 13:35:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44JZ8QQ001413; Sun, 4 May 2003 13:35:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe18.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44JZ6QQ001382 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 13:35:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 4 May 2003 12:35:01 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe18.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Sun, 04 May 2003 19:35:01 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 15:34:18 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 May 2003 19:35:01.0817 (UTC) FILETIME=[41560A90:01C31274] Subject: [h-cost] Not very historical but... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I remember seeing a wonderful site with high quality pictures of the costumes from Star Wars episodes 1 and 2... do you know what I'm talking about? Do you have the URL handy? Seeing those Costume Con pics has awakened a sleeping demon inside of me... :-) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 15:42:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Jgfqa008468 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:42:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Jdtdx009194 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 13:39:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44JdsQQ002537; Sun, 4 May 2003 13:39:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44JdpQQ002483 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 13:39:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.28.3798267a (26116) for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:39:41 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <28.3798267a.2be6c67d@aol.com> Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 15:39:41 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Not very historical but... To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/4/03 3:37:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, audreybmorin2@hotmail.com writes: > I remember seeing a wonderful site with high quality pictures of the > costumes from Star Wars episodes 1 and 2... do you know what I'm talking > about? Do you have the URL handy? That would probably be the Padawan's Guide: http://www.padawansguide.com That's what I used for my reference pictures of both the meadow/picnic dress in Attack of the Clones, and a shot of the Leia senate gown from A New Hope. Hope this helps you! Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 16:52:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44KqQqa008640 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:52:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Kewdx012231 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 14:40:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44KevaG019652; Sun, 4 May 2003 14:40:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44KeraG019634 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 14:40:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AAFE69A008E; Sun, 04 May 2003 15:41:34 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AADC1B6F010C; Sun, 04 May 2003 15:41:00 -0500 Message-ID: <005701c3127d$492e7820$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000e01c31258$08430da0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 16:39:38 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, You work is really beautiful!!!! One question?????? How do you make the fluffy edges on the flowers? Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 16:59:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Kxnqa008646 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:59:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44KmMdx012465 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 14:48:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44KmLaG021404; Sun, 4 May 2003 14:48:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com ([216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44KmHaG021384 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 14:48:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 2569 invoked from network); 4 May 2003 21:29:48 -0000 Received: from 66-44-109-70.s1848.apx2.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.109.70) by shada.com with SMTP; 4 May 2003 21:29:48 -0000 Message-ID: <3EB57154.1000502@oldwaylane.net> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:00:20 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line References: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> <3EB476E8.6020103@oldwaylane.net> <000b01c3123a$3116b240$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <000b01c3123a$3116b240$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Dear Judith, > I recognised you because of that costume. You had told me about it, and all > the things you baught for it here at Silke Anette in Denmark. Dont worry > about the dark background, the hat shows very well. Thank you. glad you recgonized it! I had so much fun on that trip! I need to get a good pic to mail to Silke-Annet to show her how I finally did. I've made up a webpage of details for it, if you're interested. It's at http://www.oldwaylane.net/danishdetails.html - the rest of my costumes are at http://www.oldwaylane.net/costuming.html (if you click on the pics from the main page, you get my bibliography). > I think there were many beautifull historical costumes, i particularly like > the colonial ones, very well done! Who are they, anybody on this list? Yes, there were a lot of beautiful costumes - although I wish there were more people doing recreation instead of interpretation. But at least they are thinking "historic". The colonial dressed couple were Bruce & Nora Mai. They had a very interesting presentation, they showed in both the SF/Fantasy and the historic although I'm not certain why. I know I want to order a pic of them, since I wasn't able to shoot them at the time. I don't believe they are on this list. -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:13:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LDTqa008684 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:13:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44L23dx013027 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:02:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44L22hA024655; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:02:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44L1xhA024624 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:01:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 208-58-249-38.s38.tnt1.nwhv.ct.dialup.rcn.com ([208.58.249.38] helo=rcn.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19CQcP-00058U-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 04 May 2003 17:01:58 -0400 Message-ID: <3EB57FCE.9020301@rcn.com> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 17:02:06 -0400 From: Catelli User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200305041602.h44G21CO010031@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Photos of Costume-Con 21 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Okay, so she identified herself. >I'm the black & white Victorian in the last few pages. > >Sheryl Nance-Durst > She neglected to mention that white Victorian with black trim fit through the bodice with Zero Wrinkles! even when she moved, as smooth as could be over her corsetry. I know, I was her 'den mom'. Sheryl looked beyond fabulous & won a prize. yay. I'm on page 7 (iirc) at the bottom in the bright blue with the red poncho with ribs. It was a Future Fashion Folio design that I submitted and made up. Fantasy, but the gown is cut after the St. Louis shirt. : ) Ann in CT _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:17:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LHWqa008696 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:17:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44L63dx013173 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:06:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44L63hA025564; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:06:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from email.accessus.net (email.accessus.net [209.145.128.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44L60hA025522 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:06:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [207.206.136.137] (HELO accessus.net) by email.accessus.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.5) with ESMTP id 158661722 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 04 May 2003 16:05:54 -0500 Message-ID: <3EB58175.6050105@accessus.net> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:09:09 -0500 From: Karen Heim User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020318 Netscape6/6.2.2 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line References: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> <3EB476E8.6020103@oldwaylane.net> <000b01c3123a$3116b240$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3EB57154.1000502@oldwaylane.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Judy Mitchell wrote: > Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > >> I think there were many beautifull historical costumes, i >> particularly like >> the colonial ones, very well done! Who are they, anybody on this list? > > Yes, there were a lot of beautiful costumes - although I wish > there were more people doing recreation instead of interpretation. But > at least they are thinking "historic". The colonial dressed couple > were Bruce & Nora Mai. They had a very interesting presentation, they > showed in both the SF/Fantasy and the historic although I'm not > certain why. I know I want to order a pic of them, since I wasn't able > to shoot them at the time. I don't believe they are on this list. > I'll try to answer. I'm the other person who was involved in the two presentations - the puppeteer. This concept was Bruce's - it's an old ghost story. Nora tied it in to a couple of dolls she had seen that showed a woman with two marionettes. They then asked me to join them to portray that woman. Because it was a ghost story, and because they had some interesting special effects (for those who weren't there, parts of their costume glowed under black light, giving a more "ghostly" effect - except that the audience laughed when they saw the glow; not exactly what they had in mind). I chose to enter the Historical masquerade, as my goals for competing were different than theirs. So, I acted as a prop for their presentation, and they were props in mine. It was entirely their decision to enter F&SF. There was, however, at least one judge who told them flat out afterwards that anything even vaguely historical-looking should enter in Historical. Period. We were trying to push the boundaries a little; we weren't particularly rewarded for it. That's the way it goes sometimes. Karen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:31:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LVLqa008713 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:31:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LJtdx013668 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:19:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LJqhA029016; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:19:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com ([216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44LJnhA028997 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:19:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 3514 invoked from network); 4 May 2003 22:01:19 -0000 Received: from 66-44-109-70.s1848.apx2.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.109.70) by shada.com with SMTP; 4 May 2003 22:01:19 -0000 Message-ID: <3EB578B8.6090301@oldwaylane.net> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:31:52 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line References: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> <3EB476E8.6020103@oldwaylane.net> <000b01c3123a$3116b240$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3EB57154.1000502@oldwaylane.net> <3EB58175.6050105@accessus.net> In-Reply-To: <3EB58175.6050105@accessus.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Karen Heim wrote: > Because it was a ghost story, and because they had some interesting > special effects (for those who weren't there, parts of their costume > glowed under black light, giving a more "ghostly" effect - except that > the audience laughed when they saw the glow; not exactly what they had > in mind). Oh that's right, it did glow! See, I didn't see the stage presentation at all (no video feed to the green room) so I only saw the tape that night. I thought only Bruce's trousers glowed. It ws very interesting, but I'm afraid it didn't come off looking ghostly. Well that explains the makeup then! I had wondered. > We were trying to push the boundaries a little; we weren't particularly > rewarded for it. That's the way it goes sometimes. I thought it was really interesting. I did love how in the first masq you took the puppets out and "began" it, and in the second you put them away and "closed" it. It was really cool. I thought you guys should have gotten an award in Historical! I was surprised. -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:31:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LVWqa008717 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:31:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LKSdx013693 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:20:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LKShA029149; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:20:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LKPhA029139 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:20:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fe8.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.232]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 6D2DC262A0B for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 23:20:24 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000701c31283$796ae450$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000e01c31258$08430da0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <005701c3127d$492e7820$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 23:23:57 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Penny. thanks for your words. When you refer to fluffy edges, do you men the red flowers? The red flowers is entirely made out of Chenille Silk. Chenille Silk looks like a hairy caterpillar, so the edges gets fluffy because of that. It is a thick thread wich i sew on to the fabric with thin thin silk floss. It gets the look, as if the flowers are made of velvet. It looks like a million dollars, but actually it is very very ekonomic to sew with. I have only used 3 skeins of silk chenille for the entire embroidery. There is 5 meters in each. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 10:39 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. > Bjarne, > > You work is really beautiful!!!! One question?????? How do you make the > fluffy edges on the flowers? > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:42:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lg8qa008789 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:42:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LVCdx014154 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:31:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LVBhA001812; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:31:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44LV7hA001767 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:31:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCsgGsb/LvjLqvSW7oPrRaEnRLAb3V+qilg==">; Sun, 04 May 2003 17:30:25 EDT Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HXC8DPVZ; Sun, 04 May 2003 17:30:25 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 15:25:45 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Puppet Masquerade Presentation Message-ID: <20030504.152546.-274070321.4.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,22-26 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I was one of your Friendly Neighborhood Judges for the Historical Masquerade and I was in the audience for the F&SF Masquerade. In my opinion, the main problem with the presentation was that it didn't have a very clear story arc. It was kind of pretty in the F&SF, but I heard a number of people comment on the VERY historical look that all of you had. The black-light effects weren't terribly visible from the back of the room and the audience was a good ways back from the stage so details got lost. I understand that you were trying to push the envelope, but it might have been more effectively pushed if the costumes of the 'ghosts' and the puppet lady were of more distinctly different time periods, that would have accentuated the 'Other Worldliness' of the puppet figures. Also, since it's not a ghost story that is in common circulation (I am a fan of ghost stories and I don't think I can identify the one you were portraying), more explanation, or a snippet of the story referring to the action on stage, might have made it more obvious. What it looked like to me was a slightly childish 18th century lady playing with her puppets and pretending that they came to life. There's nothing wrong with that as a story arc, but it doesn't scream Fantasy or SF, it could very easily go in Historical. I never got that they were supposed ot be ghosts. I think that the presentation has some very good elements, but it could be sharpened quite a bit to clarify the story line. That would make it much more understandable. Just my tuppence on the performance- the costumes were really very good! Karen ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:43:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lhfqa008799 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:43:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LWFdx014220 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:32:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LWFhA002094; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:32:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp805.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp805.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44LWDhA002086 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:32:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from adsl-67-122-75-203.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net (HELO angelap3a8d978) (cabbagerose@sbcglobal.net@67.122.75.203 with login) by smtp-sbc-v1.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 May 2003 21:32:13 -0000 Message-ID: <004801c31284$d048f090$cb4b7a43@angelap3a8d978> From: "Cabbage Rose" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000e01c31258$08430da0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711><005701c3127d$492e7820$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <000701c31283$796ae450$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:33:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Where do you get your silk chenille threads? In Europe? Is there a place here in the US to buy it? That looks fabulous! I started my "career" as an embroidery freak, most recently most of my handwork is beaded, but I think you've inspired me! Again with the big WOW Bjarne! angela +++++ Angela F. Lazear Cabbage Rose Costumes http://www.cabbagerosecostumes.com Theatrical Costume Design "Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none: be able for thine enemy rather in power than use, and keep thy friend under thy own life's key: be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech..." W. Shakespeare ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 2:23 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. > Dear Penny. > thanks for your words. When you refer to fluffy edges, do you men the red > flowers? The red flowers is entirely made out of Chenille Silk. Chenille > Silk looks like a hairy caterpillar, so the edges gets fluffy because of > that. It is a thick thread wich i sew on to the fabric with thin thin silk > floss. It gets the look, as if the flowers are made of velvet. > It looks like a million dollars, but actually it is very very ekonomic to > sew with. I have only used 3 skeins of silk chenille for the entire > embroidery. There is 5 meters in each. > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Penny Ladnier" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 10:39 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. > > > > Bjarne, > > > > You work is really beautiful!!!! One question?????? How do you make the > > fluffy edges on the flowers? > > > > Penny Ladnier > > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > > http://www.costumegallery.com > > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:51:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lpuqa008813 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:51:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LeZdx014679 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:40:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LeXhA004182; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:40:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from email.accessus.net (email.accessus.net [209.145.128.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LeUhA004137 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:40:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [207.206.136.137] (HELO accessus.net) by email.accessus.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.5) with ESMTP id 158664624 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 04 May 2003 16:40:24 -0500 Message-ID: <3EB5898C.5040002@accessus.net> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:43:40 -0500 From: Karen Heim User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020318 Netscape6/6.2.2 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line References: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> <3EB476E8.6020103@oldwaylane.net> <000b01c3123a$3116b240$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3EB57154.1000502@oldwaylane.net> <3EB58175.6050105@accessus.net> <3EB578B8.6090301@oldwaylane.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Judy Mitchell wrote: > > I thought it was really interesting. I did love how in the first > masq you took the puppets out and "began" it, and in the second you > put them away and "closed" it. It was really cool. I thought you guys > should have gotten an award in Historical! I was surprised. > Well, the presentation wasn't all that exciting, so the awards had to rest primarily on my costume and documentation. I did get a workmanship award for the quilted petticoat, but I guess, compared to the other entries, my dress wasn't considered very inspiring or award-worthy. *shrug* I learned a lot, though. I have other opinions about that masquerade, but I think I'll refrain. We are discussing them in detail on another group. Bruce, Nora, and I usually put together a review of Costume-Con on the trip back. We have strong opinions, and we aren't afraid to express them. That's not always very comfortable; truth is a mirror few can look into without flinching. We try to be as objective as possible, but admit our personal preferences. Karen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:53:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lrvqa008817 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:53:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lncdx015168 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:49:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LnahA006397; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:49:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LnUhA006362 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:49:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fe8.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.232]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 2A9F2480002 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 23:49:29 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000701c31287$8bd40a00$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000e01c31258$08430da0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711><005701c3127d$492e7820$0400a8c0@comcast.net><000701c31283$796ae450$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <004801c31284$d048f090$cb4b7a43@angelap3a8d978> Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 23:53:06 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Angela. I have had silk chenille from Hedgehog Handworks. They have a lovely range of yoummy colours. But i also found a supplier in the UK. So thats where i get it these days. A funny detail, i always gets so hungry for sweets when i am working with these threads. I think it is because they remind me of wine gums :-) Bjarne. Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cabbage Rose" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:33 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. > Where do you get your silk chenille threads? In Europe? Is there a place > here in the US to buy it? That looks fabulous! I started my "career" as an > embroidery freak, most recently most of my handwork is beaded, but I think > you've inspired me! > > Again with the big WOW Bjarne! > > angela > +++++ > Angela F. Lazear > Cabbage Rose Costumes > http://www.cabbagerosecostumes.com > Theatrical Costume Design > > "Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none: > be able for thine enemy rather in power than use, > and keep thy friend under thy own life's key: > be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech..." > W. Shakespeare > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 2:23 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. > > > > Dear Penny. > > thanks for your words. When you refer to fluffy edges, do you men the red > > flowers? The red flowers is entirely made out of Chenille Silk. Chenille > > Silk looks like a hairy caterpillar, so the edges gets fluffy because of > > that. It is a thick thread wich i sew on to the fabric with thin thin silk > > floss. It gets the look, as if the flowers are made of velvet. > > It looks like a million dollars, but actually it is very very ekonomic to > > sew with. I have only used 3 skeins of silk chenille for the entire > > embroidery. There is 5 meters in each. > > > > Bjarne > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Penny Ladnier" > > To: "Historical Costume" > > Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 10:39 PM > > Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. > > > > > > > Bjarne, > > > > > > You work is really beautiful!!!! One question?????? How do you make > the > > > fluffy edges on the flowers? > > > > > > Penny Ladnier > > > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > > > http://www.costumegallery.com > > > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > > > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > > > > > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:54:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Ls9qa008820 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:54:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lpidx015284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:51:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LpghA007200; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:51:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from email.accessus.net (email.accessus.net [209.145.128.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LpbhA007130 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:51:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [207.206.136.137] (HELO accessus.net) by email.accessus.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.5) with ESMTP id 158665572 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 04 May 2003 16:51:30 -0500 Message-ID: <3EB58C26.7050401@accessus.net> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:54:46 -0500 From: Karen Heim User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020318 Netscape6/6.2.2 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Puppet Masquerade Presentation References: <20030504.152546.-274070321.4.Seamstrix@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO h-costume-bounces@indra.com wrote: >I was one of your Friendly Neighborhood Judges for the Historical >Masquerade and I was in the audience for the F&SF Masquerade. In my >opinion, the main problem with the presentation was that it didn't have a >very clear story arc. It was kind of pretty in the F&SF, but I heard a >number of people comment on the VERY historical look that all of you >had. The black-light effects weren't terribly visible from the back of >the room and the audience was a good ways back from the stage so details >got lost. > That's the hazard of special effects. We tried to get as much black light as possible, but it's always a gamble. > I understand that you were trying to push the envelope, but it >might have been more effectively pushed if the costumes of the 'ghosts' >and the puppet lady were of more distinctly different time periods, that >would have accentuated the 'Other Worldliness' of the puppet figures. > I admit, we chose the 2 periods to neatly avoid having to do large panniers. They did differ by some 40 years. We could have made a larger gap; however, it then would not have been in sync with the dolls Nora was influenced by. > >Also, since it's not a ghost story that is in common circulation (I am a >fan of ghost stories and I don't think I can identify the one you were >portraying), more explanation, or a snippet of the story referring to the >action on stage, might have made it more obvious. > Agreed. Bruce and Nora did not submit documentation that might have helped, and chose to forgo exposition. Since I was part of the same theme, I thought it would have seemed odd to get an explanation for the second half, but not the first. They picked the music and set the choreography. > What it looked like to >me was a slightly childish 18th century lady playing with her puppets and >pretending that they came to life. There's nothing wrong with that as a >story arc, but it doesn't scream Fantasy or SF, it could very easily go >in Historical. > As I said, not my call. Their bias is towards F&SF, so that's where they chose to show it. My bias is Historical. Karen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 17:58:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44LwKqa008826 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:58:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lr4dx015373 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 15:53:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lr3hA007639; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:53:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44Lr0hA007619 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:53:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HED000WUU4B79@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 04 May 2003 14:52:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 14:47:28 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. In-reply-to: <000e01c31258$08430da0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030504110106.02c46bd8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/2/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, As always it is very beautiful. You are an inspiration to my dreams of embroidering sleeves and a forepart for my Elizabethan dress. Thank you for sharing your work. Kimiko At 06:12 PM 5/4/2003 +0200, you wrote: >Hi. >This very moment i just finished the embroidery for the robe francaise. >Finally i can go on to the more speedy things. Tomorrow i shall start fresh >on the stays and the panier. I want to make it in some nice grey linen i >baught some time ago. >The direct link to the finished embroidery is here: >http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary.html >Hope you like it! > >Bjarne > >Leif og Bjarne Drews >www.my-drewscostumes.dk Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 18:13:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44MDaqa008851 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 18:13:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44M29dx015724 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 16:02:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44M28vi010031; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:02:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44M24vi010003 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:02:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-32-181.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.32.181]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h44M21Mc007611 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 15:02:03 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030504145650.05146be0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 14:59:58 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. In-Reply-To: <000e01c31258$08430da0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >This very moment i just finished the embroidery for the robe francaise. >Hope you like it! I'm sitting here drooling into my shoe, wondering how human hands can embroider that precisely, and you only 'hope' we like it? This makes me wish I could win the lottery and commission such a dress from you, even tho I have no place to wear one. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 19:23:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NNFqa009010 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:23:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NKJdx021114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 17:20:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NKHGC006546; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:20:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NKDGC006504 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:20:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fe8.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.232]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 40AB75EE1F4 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:20:12 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001701c31294$3a68eac0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 01:23:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Carolyn It is a very good idea you have here. I am not an expert of Edwardian style but i think ecry was very fashionable those days. Therefore i think you should dye your fine lawn in tea. This would give a perfect shade to the ecry laces. This is my 2 pence, but dont do anything before others have answered you. As i say, i am no expert in Edwardian style............. I dont think you should mix the white lawn with the ecry laces unles you dye it first. Bjarne. Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 1:12 AM Subject: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > I want to make one of those Edwardian 'lingerie' dresses of lawn and yards > of insertion lace. I have the perfect fabric, but it is stark white and > all my insertion lace is ecru/bone/off-white. One place I want to be able > to wear the dress is for 1901 living history. > > Questions: > > Did those 'lingerie' dresses ever occur in ecru, or only in white? I > couldn't be sure after looking at extant historical examples, including one > I own and could examine in natural light. And using the ecru lace with the > white material just seemed wrong to me. > > When was this type of dress first worn? They appear to have been very > popular summer dresses by 1910. Do they go back as far as the late 1890s? > > Is there a better way to get my fabric ecru than by the tea dye > process? For this dress I can't have streaking or other colour variations, > and I'm not sure I can get the same colour, evenly on all the pieces, with tea. > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 19:24:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NO9qa009016 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:24:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NCYdx020652 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 17:12:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NCSGC003540; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:12:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NCPGC003512 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:12:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-32-181.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.32.181]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h44NCOMc000430 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:12:24 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:12:21 -0700 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I want to make one of those Edwardian 'lingerie' dresses of lawn and yards of insertion lace. I have the perfect fabric, but it is stark white and all my insertion lace is ecru/bone/off-white. One place I want to be able to wear the dress is for 1901 living history. Questions: Did those 'lingerie' dresses ever occur in ecru, or only in white? I couldn't be sure after looking at extant historical examples, including one I own and could examine in natural light. And using the ecru lace with the white material just seemed wrong to me. When was this type of dress first worn? They appear to have been very popular summer dresses by 1910. Do they go back as far as the late 1890s? Is there a better way to get my fabric ecru than by the tea dye process? For this dress I can't have streaking or other colour variations, and I'm not sure I can get the same colour, evenly on all the pieces, with tea. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 19:27:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NREqa009024 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:27:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NOedx021388 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 17:24:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NOeGC008239; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:24:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NOaGC008213 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:24:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fe8.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.232]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 115A05EE116 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:24:36 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002001c31294$d7e7d360$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> <001701c31294$3a68eac0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 01:28:18 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh, and if you water your fabric first and then fill up your bath tub with lots of tea, you should not worry so much about getting the colour uneaven. Stern the fabric for about 10 minuttes and then take it up. Dip it in fresh water and then hang up to dry................. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > Dear Carolyn > It is a very good idea you have here. I am not an expert of Edwardian style > but i think ecry was very fashionable those days. > Therefore i think you should dye your fine lawn in tea. This would give a > perfect shade to the ecry laces. > This is my 2 pence, but dont do anything before others have answered you. As > i say, i am no expert in Edwardian style............. > I dont think you should mix the white lawn with the ecry laces unles you dye > it first. > > Bjarne. > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" > To: > Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 1:12 AM > Subject: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > > > > I want to make one of those Edwardian 'lingerie' dresses of lawn and yards > > of insertion lace. I have the perfect fabric, but it is stark white and > > all my insertion lace is ecru/bone/off-white. One place I want to be able > > to wear the dress is for 1901 living history. > > > > Questions: > > > > Did those 'lingerie' dresses ever occur in ecru, or only in white? I > > couldn't be sure after looking at extant historical examples, including > one > > I own and could examine in natural light. And using the ecru lace with > the > > white material just seemed wrong to me. > > > > When was this type of dress first worn? They appear to have been very > > popular summer dresses by 1910. Do they go back as far as the late 1890s? > > > > Is there a better way to get my fabric ecru than by the tea dye > > process? For this dress I can't have streaking or other colour > variations, > > and I'm not sure I can get the same colour, evenly on all the pieces, with > tea. > > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > > www.FunStuft.com > > > > //// \\\ > > ////-@@\\\ > > (((( 7 ))) > > ((( <> )))) > > ) (((((( > > /----\ /---\)) > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 19:29:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NTNqa009027 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:29:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NQWdx021487 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 17:26:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NQVGC008954; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:26:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scanmail3.cableone.net (scanmail3.cableone.net [24.116.0.123]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NQRGC008917 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:26:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scanmail3.cableone.net ([10.116.0.123]) by scanmail3.cableone.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Sun, 4 May 2003 16:20:35 -0700 Received: from scanmail3.cableone.net [24.116.0.123] by scanmail3.cableone.net (SMTPD32-7.04) id A043401C0140; Sun, 04 May 2003 16:20:35 -0700 Received: from kimathlon (24-116-185-234.cpe.cableone.net [24.116.185.234]) by mail.cableone.net with SMTP (MailShield v2.04 - WIN32 Jul 17 2001 17:12:42); Sun, 04 May 2003 16:20:35 -0600 From: "Kim Baird" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 18:26:23 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c31294$93d363b0$0201a8c0@kimathlon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> X-SMTP-HELO: kimathlon X-SMTP-MAIL-FROM: kbaird@cableone.net X-SMTP-PEER-INFO: 24-116-185-234.cpe.cableone.net [24.116.185.234] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn-- I have seen many of these dresses, almost always in white. I think I may have seen a pink and or yellow one--it sure looked strange! But never ecru. Can you bleach the lace? Definitely not ecru lace with white lawn--doesn't work. Kim Victorian/Edwardian "expert" -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Carolyn Kayta Barrows Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 6:12 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress I want to make one of those Edwardian 'lingerie' dresses of lawn and yards of insertion lace. I have the perfect fabric, but it is stark white and all my insertion lace is ecru/bone/off-white. One place I want to be able to wear the dress is for 1901 living history. Questions: Did those 'lingerie' dresses ever occur in ecru, or only in white? I couldn't be sure after looking at extant historical examples, including one I own and could examine in natural light. And using the ecru lace with the white material just seemed wrong to me. When was this type of dress first worn? They appear to have been very popular summer dresses by 1910. Do they go back as far as the late 1890s? Is there a better way to get my fabric ecru than by the tea dye process? For this dress I can't have streaking or other colour variations, and I'm not sure I can get the same colour, evenly on all the pieces, with tea. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 20:00:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45004qa009117 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:00:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NmYdx023207 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 17:48:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NmWGC018633; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:48:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44NmTGC018603 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:48:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 17360 invoked from network); 4 May 2003 23:48:28 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 4 May 2003 23:48:28 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-86.sonic.net [209.148.112.86]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h44NmRe32247 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:48:27 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504163226.00a772d8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:49:47 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 04:12 PM 5/4/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I want to make one of those Edwardian 'lingerie' dresses of lawn and yards >of insertion lace. I have the perfect fabric, but it is stark white and >all my insertion lace is ecru/bone/off-white. One place I want to be able >to wear the dress is for 1901 living history. > >Questions: > >Did those 'lingerie' dresses ever occur in ecru, or only in white? Yes, they occurred in ecru, although the ecru ones are often all-lace examples, or ecru lace on ecru silk, or cru lace over a pastel silk lining. (The ones that were not all white may not be technically lingerie dresses, but otherwise the style and decoration is the same.) > I couldn't be sure after looking at extant historical examples, > including one I own and could examine in natural light. And using the > ecru lace with the white material just seemed wrong to me. Ecru lace on white fabric would be a little strange for this period, though in actual examples sooner or later you see everything. >When was this type of dress first worn? They appear to have been very >popular summer dresses by 1910. Do they go back as far as the late 1890s? Definitely as far back as the late 1890s. In fact, sheer white summer dresses in the prevailing style were perennial throughout the 19th century. But by the late 1890s, the style with lots of lace insertions and so on that you are probably thinking of, was in fashion. >Is there a better way to get my fabric ecru than by the tea dye >process? For this dress I can't have streaking or other colour >variations, and I'm not sure I can get the same colour, evenly on all the >pieces, with tea. > > I'm not sure if actual tea is as colorfast as some of the dyes that produce a tea color. There are some, though I have not used them. nyway, whatever dye you use, you want the fabric to be all the same. That is, if you were using some pure cotton, and some linen, and some linen/cotton blend, and some eyelet-embroidery, they would probably all come out different shades. Even if the fabric is all the same, you want to agitate it a lot during the dyeing process, to make sure some parts are not more exposed to the dye than others. This can be a pain if there is a lot of fabric and you are agitating it by hand in a tub or wherever. Which you might want to do if the fabric or your washer or the dye is not suitable for washer dyeing. If you're really worried, buy some ecru fabric and save the white fabric for something else. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 20:03:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4503eqa009127 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:03:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NqCdx023520 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 17:52:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h44NqBGC020310; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:52:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h44Nq8GC020276 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 17:52:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 1188 invoked from network); 4 May 2003 23:52:08 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 4 May 2003 23:52:08 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-86.sonic.net [209.148.112.86]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h44Nq7w03028 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 16:52:07 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504165202.00aef7b8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:53:27 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress--again In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504163226.00a772d8@pop.sonic.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >If you're really worried, buy some ecru fabric and save the white fabric >for something else. > >Fran Speaking of which, if you don't have the actual lingerie to wear under it, you could use the white fabric for that. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 21:26:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451QMqa009338 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:26:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451Endx029278 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 19:14:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451ElIW023247; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:14:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451EiIW023230 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:14:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-32-181.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.32.181])h451EgPj011041 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:14:43 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030504171042.04fa09b0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:14:39 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504163226.00a772d8@pop.sonic.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>Did those 'lingerie' dresses ever occur in ecru, or only in white? > >Yes, they occurred in ecru, although the ecru ones are often all-lace >examples, or ecru lace on ecru silk, or ecru lace over a pastel silk >lining. (The ones that were not all white may not be technically lingerie >dresses, but otherwise the style and decoration is the same.) I guess I'm especially sensitive about criticism here. I have been collecting lace for this dress for years, making sure it was the right kind, the right quality, and the right quantity, but it's all ecru, bone-coloured, or off-white. And I if my dress is to match the high level of finish the originals have, I will need to put in hours and hours of handwork and embroidery. So after all that effort, I don't want anyone telling me it's the wrong colour. Do you think I can get away with an ecru cotton dress, with ecru insertion, in the style of these dresses? Or should I shelve the project till I can afford enough silk? CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 21:39:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451dHqa009365 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:39:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451Rpdx000415 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 19:27:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451RmIW028493; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:27:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451RiIW028467 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:27:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AE391D430076; Sun, 04 May 2003 20:28:25 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AE1723E80076; Sun, 04 May 2003 20:27:51 -0500 Message-ID: <00d201c312a5$54a35540$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 21:26:18 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] Library Cards X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Some one asked me when our Library will be open for registration for Library Cards. We are trying to work out a couple of problems with the Netscape browser. If you are using IE as a browser you can go on and sign up for a library card at www.costumegallery.com/librarycard.htm . We are adding a whole lot of articles every week. I will come out with an official announcement about the Library Cards on Monday or Tuesday. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 21:47:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451lZqa009387 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:47:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451a8dx000847 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 19:36:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451a7IW001563; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:36:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451a4IW001542 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:36:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A02E1D620076; Sun, 04 May 2003 20:36:46 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A00B1EF4010C; Sun, 04 May 2003 20:36:11 -0500 Message-ID: <00e701c312a6$7def1f00$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000001c31294$93d363b0$0201a8c0@kimathlon> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 21:34:36 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn, I have seen the white lingerie dress in white natural fabrics from 1900-1910 in the Valentine's collection. For some reason, they have a lot of them. I think I saw one in ecru but white was the predominate color in their collection. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 22:04:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4524kqa009503 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:04:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451rGdx001977 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 19:53:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451rEIW007850; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:53:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h451r9IW007801 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:53:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 6660 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 01:53:08 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 5 May 2003 01:53:08 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-102.sonic.net [209.148.112.102]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h451r7q21361 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 18:53:07 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504182413.00aad150@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:54:27 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030504171042.04fa09b0@mail.frys.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504163226.00a772d8@pop.sonic.net> <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Silk would be better to be honest. I'm going by memory here but I think the ecru silk ones I have are all silk pongee. Somewhat rough but not as slubby as what we now call Thai silk. I'm looking for silk pongee on the web. Here is a site that's rather pricey but people might be interested in it, as they say they only use natural dyes: http://www.aurorasilk.com/shop/fabric_pongee.shtml So here's another irrelevant site; but I kind of like their satin plaid dupionis (not for a lingerie dress!): http://www.passementerie.net/shop/fabrics/ Thai Silks is probably a better source for basic silk pongee: http://www.thaisilks.com/ They have an ecru one called Shen's Pongee and another one that claims to be natural tan pongee, though the picture shows up white on my monitor. I can't tell from the web picture what the texture is really like, but I think Thai Silks would swatch for you. Angus International has been selling silk from Hong Kong since before the web. Their web site isn't fancy but I have ordered from them and been very pleased with their products and (very fast) service. The owner is Scottish, so no language problems. Their URL is: http://www.angelfire.com/biz2/angussilkshongkong/ Hope this helps, Fran >I guess I'm especially sensitive about criticism here. I have been >collecting lace for this dress for years, making sure it was the right >kind, the right quality, and the right quantity, but it's all ecru, >bone-coloured, or off-white. And I if my dress is to match the high level >of finish the originals have, I will need to put in hours and hours of >handwork and embroidery. So after all that effort, I don't want anyone >telling me it's the wrong colour. > >Do you think I can get away with an ecru cotton dress, with ecru >insertion, in the style of these dresses? Or should I shelve the project >till I can afford enough silk? > > CarolynKayta Barrows >dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 22:06:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4526Aqa009507 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:06:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451sZdx002082 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 19:54:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451sZIW008440; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:54:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h451sWIW008398 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:54:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4525X4m022303 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:05:34 -0700 Message-ID: <3EB5C443.5070508@misc.com> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:54:11 -0700 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress References: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO To Carolyn- I have just one of those delightful dresses - a princess seamed one with the seams all replaced with cluny lace and the front panel embroidered with arts and crafts motifs. The entire thing, including the embroidery is just off white or a bonish color. It may be a odd fish example, though, being more in the arts and crafts mode than the true Edwardian type. I found this Lingerie Dress information on Google: I don't know what the quality of the scholarship is in this article but it's interesting reading. Hope I didn't just muddy(or tea-dye) the waters!!! Theresa Eacker Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote:(Pruning ensues) > I want to make one of those Edwardian 'lingerie' dresses of lawn and > yards of insertion lace. > Questions: > Did those 'lingerie' dresses ever occur in ecru, or only in white? > > When was this type of dress first worn? > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 22:16:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452GOqa009545 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:16:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45241dx002723 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 20:04:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45240V2012649; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:04:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m04.mx.aol.com (imo-m04.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4523vV2012584 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:03:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.140.10c01e77 (4012) for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:03:41 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <140.10c01e77.2be7207d@aol.com> Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 22:03:41 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/4/03 9:58:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, fran@lavoltapress.com writes: > Silk would be better to be honest. I can't claim to be even a novice in Edwardian clothing- I'm stuck in the Elizabethan era. But hey...no zippers to contend with! Anyhow. I'm fairly sure that The Silk Connection has pongees, or something close to it. Their prices are very nice. The only downside: unless you get tussah, you'll probably have to dye the stuff. But, there's good news! The same company (Jacquard products) also sells silk dyes. And Dharma Trading has silk dye too. Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 22:16:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452Gxqa009552 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:16:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4525Ydx002819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 20:05:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4525XV2013334; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:05:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f68.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4525VV2013257 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:05:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 4 May 2003 19:05:24 -0700 Received: from 68.6.212.114 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 02:05:24 GMT X-Originating-IP: [68.6.212.114] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 02:05:24 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 May 2003 02:05:24.0434 (UTC) FILETIME=[CA4DC320:01C312AA] Subject: [h-cost] Re: finished my embroidery for the dress. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, if I had the means to commission a dress from Bjarne, I tell ya, I'd wear it EVERYWHERE!!!!!! I'd never want to take it off. :) jessica Kayta wrote: This makes me >wish I could win the lottery and commission such a dress from you, even tho >I have no place to wear one. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 22:34:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452Ynqa009598 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:34:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452NHdx004273 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 20:23:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452NFV2021958; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:23:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452NCV2021944 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:23:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.161]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/linuxconf) with SMTP id h452d6M13744 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:39:09 +1000 Message-ID: <02a201c312ad$432a6580$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030504101146.12758.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 12:11:04 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole, There must be some way in which you can take more of a back seat - could you try delegating more of the tasks? Finer weather always raises the spirits, doesn't it? It's overcast here today - we really need the rain, as we're in severe drought, with our dams at 55%, have water restrictions etc, and I still feel a tad grumpy from the lack of sunlight. Glenda. > > Don't participate this year - tell your groups you're taking a sabbatical. > > If they don't understand, then that's their problem, not yours. > > I can't. It is _my_ group and I own pretty much everything from tents over > furniture to soft furnishings and cutlery and crockery and pottery etc etc etc. > > Oh well. One never knows, maybe it doesn't rain this time. harharhar. > > Nicole > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 22:53:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452rEqa009629 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:53:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452gCdx005767 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 20:42:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452gBV2000533; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:42:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay2.primushost.com (relay2.primushost.com [207.244.125.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452g7V3000502 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:42:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from (shell3.shore.net) [207.244.124.103] by relay2.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 19CVy4-0006lZ-00; Sun, 04 May 2003 22:44:40 -0400 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for id 19CVvk-0004Jo-00; Sun, 04 May 2003 22:42:16 -0400 Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 22:42:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Katy Bishop To: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sun, 4 May 2003, Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: >I want to make one of those Edwardian 'lingerie' dresses of lawn and yards >of insertion lace. I have the perfect fabric, but it is stark white and >all my insertion lace is ecru/bone/off-white. One place I want to be able >to wear the dress is for 1901 living history. I did some quick looking through my period library of catalogues. For the 1905-1917 period (All my 1900-04 catalogues are fall-winter) I found many cotton voile dresses, almost all were white only. Some in the 1905-08 were white or blue, pink or lavender. I saw no ecru cotton dresses available. I am also not seeing typical lingere dresses as early as 1901. They seem to take off later in the decade. The ecru silk in question may be the Thai Silks "Nan Shan Pongee" and the texture and color are great for the natural ecru silks in the early 20th Century. It matches a couple of period dresses in my collection, especially after it is washed. I ordered a roll of it a year ago from Exotic silks (Thai Silks wholesale branch) at $4 a yard. I would pair it with an ecru chemical lace. It is 34" wide. They also have a couple of other ecru pongees to get that 1908-12 slubby silk texture. I think it would be a good fabric choice for 1901. I have a ca. 1900-1902 2 piece dress in slightly slubby ecru raw silk, and chemical lace applique. Most of the others in ecru I have are closer to 1910. If you need any design resources for 1901 I have a bound year of Harper's Bazar for 1901 (I did a booklet for someone last fall 1899-1901 for inspiration for a production of "the Little Foxes"). I'd be glad to make some xeroxes for you. Katy Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 23:02:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45328qa009653 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 23:02:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452oYdx006268 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 20:50:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h452oXV2003817; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:50:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com ([216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h452oVV2003799 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:50:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 12152 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 03:32:00 -0000 Received: from 66-44-106-203.s1219.apx2.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.106.203) by shada.com with SMTP; 5 May 2003 03:32:00 -0000 Message-ID: <3EB5C63B.9090809@oldwaylane.net> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 22:02:35 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Con Photographs On-Line References: <20030503.130401.-387651.3.catpurson@juno.com> <3EB476E8.6020103@oldwaylane.net> <000b01c3123a$3116b240$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3EB57154.1000502@oldwaylane.net> <3EB58175.6050105@accessus.net> <3EB578B8.6090301@oldwaylane.net> <3EB5898C.5040002@accessus.net> In-Reply-To: <3EB5898C.5040002@accessus.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Karen Heim wrote: >> Well, the presentation wasn't all that exciting, I must admit that it did sorta confuse me. Once I saw the Historic finish to it, it felt better, but I didn't completely understand. Never would have guessed it was based on a ghost story. I think the other Karen has a point - if you and the "dolls" were dressed in different time periods... I also think if you were at a venue with better lighting that could have tried some ghostly blue or something focused on them it might have looked different. so the awards had to > rest primarily on my costume and documentation. I did get a workmanship > award for the quilted petticoat, It was very nice quilting. I've often wanted to do one (I've saved this log of h-costume discussions from a few years ago on them!) but I guess, compared to the other > entries, my dress wasn't considered very inspiring or award-worthy. > *shrug* I learned a lot, though. There were a lot of amazing entries. I just sat down looking at the stats of the SF/F competition today: there were 19 masters competing of which 11 received presentation awards. That's amazing competition! -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 23:12:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h453CLqa009672 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 23:12:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4530odx006921 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 21:00:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4530nM1007287; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:00:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4530kM1007276 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:00:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 31469 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 03:00:46 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 5 May 2003 03:00:46 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-102.sonic.net [209.148.112.102]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4530jC04276 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:00:45 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504195353.00a9c190@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 20:02:05 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >I did some quick looking through my period library of catalogues. For >the 1905-1917 period (All my 1900-04 catalogues are fall-winter) I found >many cotton voile dresses, almost all were white only. Some in the >1905-08 were white or blue, pink or lavender. I saw no ecru cotton >dresses available. I am also not seeing typical lingere dresses as >early as 1901. They seem to take off later in the decade. I have some white cotton lingerie dresses from the 1890s. However, I think once you get into silk with similar decoration it's not called a lingerie dress any more. But it's a very nice type of dress and can serve a similar purpose. Now that my memory has been jogged, I do have at least one early 20th-century dress in brownish "natural" linen, with embroidery but no lace as I recall. But none in cotton. >The ecru silk in question may be the Thai Silks "Nan Shan Pongee" and >the texture and color are great for the natural ecru silks in the early >20th Century Thai silks a Nan San Pongee in "natural," which is coming up rather white on my monitor, and a Shen's Pongee in ecru. Thai Silks' images don't always show the color described, so the safe thing would be to swatch. > It matches a couple of period dresses in my collection, >especially after it is washed. I ordered a roll of it a year ago from >Exotic silks (Thai Silks wholesale branch) at $4 a yard. I would pair >it with an ecru chemical lace. It is 34" wide. I'd pair an ecru pongee with any ecru laces except the most delicate. Irish crochet for preference, just because it's a favorite lace of mine. Or several types of ecru lace at once. Ecru pongee is really a nice fabric, you're tempting me to buy some for my stash. Fran >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 23:32:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h453WNqa009709 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 23:32:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h453L1dx008496 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 21:21:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h453KxM1015155; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:20:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dc-mx04.cluster1.charter.net (dc-mx04.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.14]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h453KvM1015091 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:20:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [24.196.130.120] (HELO laptop) by dc-mx04.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 112288417 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 04 May 2003 23:20:52 -0400 Message-ID: <010701c312b5$45860f20$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030503.155745.-264291149.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 22:20:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ummm...I'm on page 7, 3rd row, last three - the wine/paisley Vintage Vogue from 1928 and page 10 bottom 2 rows, the evergreen evening gown (Vintage Vogue from 1934). ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** > > On Sat, 3 May 2003 13:04:00 -0400 catpurson@juno.com writes: > > Wow, what great costumes. Would the members of h-costume > > please > > identify yourselves? > > > > Lalah > > Never give up, Never surrender > > ________________________________________________________________ > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 4 23:46:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h453kcqa009741 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 23:46:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h453Yvdx009486 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 21:34:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h453YuM1020232; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:34:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h453YsM1020222 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 21:34:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 25378 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 03:34:53 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 5 May 2003 03:34:53 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-102.sonic.net [209.148.112.102]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h453Yqn06402 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 20:34:53 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504202336.00a9e300@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 20:36:12 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504195353.00a9c190@pop.sonic.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > >Now that my memory has been jogged, I do have at least one early >20th-century dress in brownish "natural" linen, with embroidery but no >lace as I recall. But none in cotton. An in fact, at least a couple of two-piece suits in brown linen with heavy lace. But for lots of decoration, if I were making an ecru dress I'd go for the silk pongee. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 00:16:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h454GSqa009789 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 00:16:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4545Xdx011320 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 22:05:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4545W4c000925; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:05:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4545S4c000905 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:05:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-32-181.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.32.181])h4545RPj029039 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 23:05:27 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030504203444.0555c6f0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 20:47:56 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030504182413.00aad150@pop.sonic.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20030504171042.04fa09b0@mail.frys.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030504163226.00a772d8@pop.sonic.net> <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Silk would be better to be honest. Sigh. But I think I know the material you're thinking of. I have a small piece of it - enough for a doll but not for me. >Thai Silks is probably a better source for basic silk pongee: > >http://www.thaisilks.com/ > >They have an ecru one called Shen's Pongee and another one that claims to >be natural tan pongee, though the picture shows up white on my monitor. I >can't tell from the web picture what the texture is really like, but I >think Thai Silks would swatch for you. Or I could drive 45 minutes and go see the stuff in person. BTW, their remnants are to drool for, if you're a quilter or don't need much or do doll clothes. Thanx for the excuse. I'll be down that way anyway tomorrow... -snip- >Now that my memory has been jogged, I do have at least one early >20th-century dress in brownish "natural" linen, with embroidery but no >lace as I recall. But none in cotton. I've seen several brownish linen dresses with embroidery, from what I could call the 'Craftsman' school of thought. The embroidery and fabric are larger scale than those of the earlier lingerie dresses. I'd do one of these in a heartbeat if this new living history venue did later than 1901, as I can easily do that size of embroidery. The teensy compulsive Edwardian stuff will take lots more time, and I will have to break out the magnifying lamp. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 00:30:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h454U2qa009819 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 00:30:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h454J9dx012181 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 4 May 2003 22:19:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h454J84c005898; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:19:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h454J44c005877 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 22:19:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA25358 for ; Sun, 4 May 2003 23:38:51 -0500 Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 23:38:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line In-Reply-To: <010701c312b5$45860f20$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sun, 4 May 2003 lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: > Ummm...I'm on page 7, 3rd row, last three - the wine/paisley Vintage Vogue > from 1928 > and page 10 bottom 2 rows, the evergreen evening gown (Vintage Vogue from > 1934). Oh, I LOVED these. Especially the green one. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 02:16:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h456Gkqa015252 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 02:16:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4565Mdx017812 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 00:05:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4565Kn1011823; Mon, 5 May 2003 00:05:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from maynard.mail.mindspring.net (maynard.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.243]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4565In1011811 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 00:05:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ap-014caburbp0371.dialsprint.net ([63.191.9.117] helo=[0019381808]) by maynard.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19CZ6C-00027G-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 05 May 2003 02:05:17 -0400 From: "Katherine" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 23:05:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Message-ID: <3EB59CBC.30974.28FD226@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with insertion. I have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it was. The color is very even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it doesn't look like it aged that way but was originally that way. I have a page about it here: http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html No pictures of the inside yet, I've been promising those for months :) Katherine On 4 May 2003 at 19:54, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: > Message: 9 > Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:14:39 -0700 > From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows > > Do you think I can get away with an ecru cotton dress, with ecru insertion, > in the style of these dresses? Or should I shelve the project till I can > afford enough silk? > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com Katherine "I go by-by." Alexandra Feodorovna, last empress of Russia, in a letter to her husband, Nicholas II _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 03:14:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457E5qa003248 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 03:14:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45777dx020830 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 01:07:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45776Jr000857; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:07:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45773Jr000837 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:07:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ADC12E210064; Mon, 05 May 2003 02:07:45 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD9F20C9010C; Mon, 05 May 2003 02:07:11 -0500 Message-ID: <007a01c312d4$bc033780$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EB59CBC.30974.28FD226@localhost> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 03:05:37 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO OMG, I was just running copies from my 1902 Delineators and I think I have found this pattern... #6156. Everything is the same but the sleeves. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Katherine" To: Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:05 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with insertion. I > have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it was. The color is very > even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it doesn't look like it aged that way but > was originally that way. > > I have a page about it here: > > http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html > > No pictures of the inside yet, I've been promising those for months :) > > Katherine > > On 4 May 2003 at 19:54, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: > > > Message: 9 > > Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:14:39 -0700 > > From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows > > > > Do you think I can get away with an ecru cotton dress, with ecru insertion, > > in the style of these dresses? Or should I shelve the project till I can > > afford enough silk? > > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > > www.FunStuft.com > > > Katherine > > "I go by-by." > > Alexandra Feodorovna, last empress of Russia, in a letter to her husband, > Nicholas II > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 03:14:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457E7qa003281 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 03:14:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457AQdx020977 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 01:10:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457AOJr002189; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:10:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457AMJr002162 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:10:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-32-181.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.32.181])h457AIPl000623 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 02:10:20 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030505000308.04cac280@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 00:10:08 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <3EB59CBC.30974.28FD226@localhost> References: <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with >insertion. I >have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it was. The >color is very >even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it doesn't look like it aged >that way but >was originally that way. > >I have a page about it here: > >http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html Thank you so much for posting this. Fran - what do you think of this? Is the colour an aberration, an unusual example, or a case of age discolouration? Seriously, can I get away with a dress this far off of white? Much of the historical Valenciennes lace I have been using as examples of what to shop for are this colour too. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 03:30:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457UQqa009375 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 03:30:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457J4dx021424 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 01:19:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457J3Jr005018; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:19:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457J1Jr005009 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:19:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A08E2E3F0064; Mon, 05 May 2003 02:19:42 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A06B117001E8; Mon, 05 May 2003 02:19:07 -0500 Message-ID: <008001c312d6$668688a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com> <4.3.1.2.20030505000308.04cac280@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 03:17:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta, I have seen off-white in a sheer muslin or lawn fabric just not ecru. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 3:10 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > > >I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with > >insertion. I > >have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it was. The > >color is very > >even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it doesn't look like it aged > >that way but > >was originally that way. > > > >I have a page about it here: > > > >http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html > > Thank you so much for posting this. > > Fran - what do you think of this? Is the colour an aberration, an unusual > example, or a case of age discolouration? Seriously, can I get away with a > dress this far off of white? Much of the historical Valenciennes lace I > have been using as examples of what to shop for are this colour too. > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 03:52:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457qFqa020013 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 03:52:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457eidx022476 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 01:40:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457ehJr011834; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:40:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.iskon.hr (mail.iskon.hr [213.191.128.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h457edJr011807 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:40:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 29766 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 09:40:21 +0200 Received: from st02-160.dialin.iskon.hr (HELO o5q7t5.public.srce.hr) (213.202.67.161) by mail.iskon.hr with SMTP; 5 May 2003 09:40:21 +0200 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030505094030.03af29b0@jagor.srce.hr> X-Sender: jkale@public.srce.hr X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 09:40:58 +0200 To: h-costume@net.indra.com From: Jadran Kale Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h457edJr011807 Subject: [h-cost] review: "Goddess" exhibition by MoMA's Costume Institute X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO From Olympus, Divine Dresses NYT, May 2, 2003 By HERBERT MUSCHAMP No this is the kind of looting we admire: old looting; remote, half-forgotten, lost-in-the-mists-of-time looting. As if the priceless rubble had been spirited away not by base temple robbers but by beauteous beings attuned to the highest spiritual calling. Or, if we must have new loot, let it be in the form of purloined ideas: inspiration, as it used to be called. Echoes are more ethereal than stones. And concepts are nearly as gossamer as the gowns in "Goddess," the new show at the Metropolitan Museum of Art's Costume Institute. As feather-light, in fact, as the show itself. Blow gently, ye Aeolian winds, or the entire exhibition may float up and away into the trees of Central Park. Organized by the Costume Institute's curator, Harold Koda, "Goddess" presents a couture version of Arcadia, late-18th-century Europe's sanitized re-creation of a Greece that never was. Gamboling Graces. Primavera. One hundred and forty variations on the theme of nymphs wrapped in gauze. That's the harmonious and sisterly conceit. This may not be the ideal moment for Arcadian idylls, however. Not when large chunks of our Mediterranean heritage have just been blown to smithereens. It is peculiar, moreover, to see such an important art museum standing history on its head. The presentation mingles fragments of ancient Greek statuary with 20th-century fashions that resemble them. This combination is intended to illustrate what Philippe de Montebello, the Met's director, describes in the show's catalog as "the unbroken line of classical influence." Actually, the 20th-century fashions on view depict precisely the reverse process: how modern Europeans created a purely ahistorical myth of Greek ancestry to compensate for the collapse of unifying social traditions in their own times. "Goddess" echoes but does not illuminate this Neo-Classical impulse. It withholds from viewers the cultural history of the myth the clothes act out. It is delightful when fashion makes light of history, less so when museums make a shambles of it. But begone, dull conscience. Let's be fancy and carefree. Fashion is fashion. Primavera is the right idea for the season. And "Goddess" is one of the most beautiful shows the Costume Institute has ever put on. Three red-robed Nikes greet the viewer on the way to the Met's own intimate Hades, the basement galleries where the Costume Institute is infernally lodged. Identically garbed in gowns of layered scarlet chiffon designed by Issey Miyake, the trio bring to mind the scene in "Funny Face" in which Audrey Hepburn holds aloft a red silk wrap to mimic the Victory of Samothrace looming behind her. Take the picture! These rippling "waterfall" dresses make the perfect introduction to a show that should leave many visitors with the feeling that modern civilization is vastly superior to that of the Greeks. They did have superb profiles. But our cosmetic surgery is improving every day. Greek plays aren't as good as Shakespeare's; their sculpture is less virtuosic than Bernini's. Even our dresses are superior to their statues, particularly when Jennifer Lopez wears them. And we live longer. The average Greek life span was 32 years. No wonder the Greeks went in for total simplicity. Who had time to waste on shopping? If you spent your free hours at the gym, you stood a good chance of leaving a pretty corpse. Like Chanel, the Greeks devised a way of dressing that worked for them and stuck with it. They practically invented cloning, at least in matters of art. Actually, as a text on the wall informs, Greek women had three basic outfits to choose from: the chiton, a plain chemise, worn floor-length; the peplos, a chemise with a deep overhang of cloth to the waist; and the himation, a large cloak, similar to the Roman toga, that could be draped in many ways. The show's modern dresses offer variations on these prototypes, which are sometimes used in combination. With few exceptions, the modern examples are drawn from the world of high fashion. There is an etymological justification for this focus: the word classical initially referred to languages associated with upper-class society, as opposed to vernacular forms of expression. The haute couture approach, however, has some major disadvantages. By excluding athletic attire, for example, it fails to connect contemporary values to the pivotal place the Greeks granted to the human body. The omission of that specialized form of sportswear, the ballet costume, is especially glaring. Balanchine's use of practice clothes in Stravinsky ballets like "Agon" was the supreme expression of classical temperament in the 20th century. Noguchi's designs for "Orpheus" and Karinska's costumes for "Chaconne" would have made handsome additions. The omission of modern folk or tribal dress is also an unfortunate lapse. You would never guess from looking at this show that there are still parts of the world - Turkey, for one - where people commonly wear tunics of beautifully pleated muslin. (I used to wear those shirts many years ago, when I was a student and had hair as long as a Cretan bull dancer, and believe me, they opened doors.) Universality is often held to be a leading characteristic of classical art. True or not, that notion is rendered more convincing by an inclusive approach. The show's sensibility is rooted in 1930's Hollywood. Lighting for black-and-white movies conferred on Hollywood stars a monochromatic allure similar to that attained by Greek buildings and sculptures after centuries of weathering had stripped away their original polychrome finishes. It is a Depression-era mood that we encounter here - in other words, an atmosphere oddly parallel to that of present-day America, where most consumers are compelled by economic necessity to live their dreams vicariously on Oscar night. The show's black-and-white poster presents the archetypal image: evening pajamas designed by Madeleine Vionnet in 1931. As photographed by George Hoyningen-Huene, the outfit is black and white and silver all over, as if cut from the screen implanted in many a young 1930's shopgirl's head. Miuccia Prada updates the siren image in a pleated silk jersey dress designed in 2002. Fluidity is a leading motif: a metaphor for women's freedom. Madame Grès, Pierre Balmain and Edward Molyneux define the Venus genre with long gowns possibly conceived in a marriage between a column and the sea. The galleries are packed with showstoppers. May I present Venus and Juno? Designed by Christian Dior in 1949, evening gowns named for those two Olympians typify a strain of Surrealist Baroque. The "Venus" dress, named after Botticelli's depiction of Aphrodite, is festooned with immense oyster shells made from opalescent sequins and rhinestones. The wide skirt of Dior's "Junon" dress is encrusted with overlapping, wavelike scales made of blue, green and rust sequins. Thank you, ladies. The show's peak is a white wedding dress designed by Yohji Yamamoto in 1998. Evidently conceived for a bride who wanted to have her cake and be it, too, this is a wild froth of a dress, again a Baroque manifestation, barely held together by coils of silk braid. Slice? Alexander McQueen's "shipwreck dress" of 2003 is a study in beige silk crepe tatters. As if urban life were analogous to rough weather, the dress ends in torn and shredded hems. This could be the winding shroud for Isadora Duncan, made from remnants of the scarf that broke her neck when one trailing end got caught in the wheel of the roadster she was riding in. These four very different dresses highlight the show's most authentically classical theme: the Greeks' passion for discovering unifying patterns in the world around them. Greek physicians practiced a method called the doctrine of signatures: since the form of walnuts resembled that of brains, the nut was commonly prescribed for mental disorders. Waves pass through hair, fabric and water. Greek art emphasized the similarity between them. In the Dior gowns, sea shells, scales and wavelets morph into one another, as if by design or Surrealist transformation. This is what poetry meant to the Greeks: the art of weaving connective tissue. "Goddess" can be seen as one big showcase of fashion signatures. Mariano Fortuny's early-20th-century pleated dresses wear the strongest personal sign. As familiar as they have become in recent decades, these gem-colored sheaths still powerfully evoke the mythical world of Marcel Proust. You'd think it would become tiresome to review the repetition of pleats, harness bodices, columnar sheaths and other standard devices. But discovering the infinite variations on these motifs is as untiring as watching waves break on the sand. In a famous essay, "The Greeks and Us," Auden urges his readers to judge civilization by "the degree of diversity attained and unity retained." Yet in modern civilization something like the reverse standard must be applied. Diversity is a given. Unity must be fought for. Unification is what Greece signified to modern Europeans, who did not lay eyes on the Acropolis until 1751. To the modern mind, ancient Greece was first of all a symbol of nationalism. During the Greek war of independence from the Turks (and Islam), the need arose for a unifying myth of Western origins. The myth of our descent from the Greeks satisfied that need. (Until then, Rome was our official ancestor.) The same myth was invoked to gloss over the social upheaval caused by the Industrial Revolution. Parallels could be drawn between the rationality of machine production and the refined economy of Greek art. Modern science, as Peter Gay has argued, is a kind of paganism, a form of nature worship. The Neo-Classical notion of timeless, universal aesthetic values derived from the view that cultural experience was subject to scientific law. History and timelessness may be intellectually irreconcilable, but who cares if you're wearing Halston? Perhaps the last major designer to dedicate his career to fashioning a contemporary classical image, Halston is represented here by a trio of simple chiffon evening gowns that command the elegance of polychrome columns. Unpleated, the chiffon would gather into supple, flutelike folds when worn by bodies in motion, subtly transforming the Doric into the Ionic order. Halston is my idea of a myth of origins. Norma Kamali is a strong contender, too. No one makes filminess look more desirable. Seen here, Ms. Kamali's diaphanous outfits lack the benefit of contrast with the stark gray concrete walls of her flagship store in New York. But they capture the odd fusion of innocence and eroticism on which the appeal of Arcadia is substantially based. Tom Ford's do, too. At least the context of this show helps to clarify Mr. Ford's intentions as a designer, such as they are. Gucci, his fashion house, paid for this show, with additional support from Condé Nast Publications, and Mr. Ford's essays in goddess style put in cameo appearances here and there among groupings of dresses by other designers. Peek-a-boo, we see you, Tom! Thus far, Mr. Ford's brilliance as a projector of images has outdazzled his talent for design. That isn't meant as criticism. What else does anyone want today besides an image? A new car? The Ford designs, represented by the clothes on view, may not bring on fainting spells. But they signal the most fertile of the directions the designer has set for himself. Savagery and violence, the dark underside of classical restraint, are more than hinted at by Mr. Ford's deconstructed evening gown of brown silk chiffon designed in 2002 for Yves Saint Laurent Rive Gauche. A true classic, the dress appears tailored less for a nymph than for a maenad, an intoxicated celebrant of Dionysian rites. We prettify spring, but for the ancients it was a time of violence, when new vegetation cracks the surface of the earth. It is difficult, now, for novelty to break through fashion's upper crust. http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/02/arts/design/02MUSC.html?ex=1052982480&ei=1&en=adf6542b76c66977 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 03:52:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457qvqa020796 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 03:52:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457fadx022578 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 01:41:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457faJr012106; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:41:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h457fWJr012075 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 01:41:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f3a.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.58]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 287B95EE374 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:41:31 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000f01c312da$445f1b80$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20030504171042.04fa09b0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:45:15 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Carolyn. I just wondered when you are going to make all those insertions, how do you do it? Is it made the same way, as lacemakers use when they sew on lace to fabric. Lacemakers uses a nun's seam where you pull out threads and sew the lace on that way with a hemstitch? That would take you very long time to do! I can imagine how beautifull this would be! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 3:14 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > > >>Did those 'lingerie' dresses ever occur in ecru, or only in white? > > > >Yes, they occurred in ecru, although the ecru ones are often all-lace > >examples, or ecru lace on ecru silk, or ecru lace over a pastel silk > >lining. (The ones that were not all white may not be technically lingerie > >dresses, but otherwise the style and decoration is the same.) > > I guess I'm especially sensitive about criticism here. I have been > collecting lace for this dress for years, making sure it was the right > kind, the right quality, and the right quantity, but it's all ecru, > bone-coloured, or off-white. And I if my dress is to match the high level > of finish the originals have, I will need to put in hours and hours of > handwork and embroidery. So after all that effort, I don't want anyone > telling me it's the wrong colour. > > Do you think I can get away with an ecru cotton dress, with ecru insertion, > in the style of these dresses? Or should I shelve the project till I can > afford enough silk? > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 05:32:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h459Wnqa012769 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 05:32:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h459RIdx027665 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 03:27:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h459RGgr009380; Mon, 5 May 2003 03:27:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41511.mail.yahoo.com (web41511.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.94]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h459REgr009340 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 03:27:14 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41511.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 10:27:09 BST Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 10:27:09 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= To: H-Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfish one? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I know I chip in late but have not been at the comp much (am not at the comp much anymore generally - only when at work). However, it's Benk Holiday Monday after our Sci-Fi sinner party (first installment) and I thought I better make a dress diary for the D'hay-larian Empress costume (finished). Just a quickie on the topic of sewing for others or self, I seem to be totally different: I like sewing for myself, I always did, because I can make pretty/extraordinary things to adorn my SELF (yes, sure I am selfish! *laughs* Arrogant, selfish lil someone I am, and happily so *winks*) and am having fun trying out things, imagining what I'd look like, the effect on others etc etc etc. I don't like sewing for others, and I never ever sew outside of the family. I do sew for Ben, but only coz I have to, who else would make his costume??? It annoys me though, tremendously, because in the last years, since I moved to England, I was not able to do anything for myself, only for him. Bah! That has changed this year, and slowly I am finding fun again in sewing: making clothing for everyday wear (mundane is not the right word for most of them...) and I started making costumes again. Starting with non-historical ones (total burn-out for historical costumes too, still. Preferring to do the pure research for now) and boy did I have fun making the Empress costume! Next is the baby blanket for little Eli who we'll visit on the 15th of this month, and then the Imperial war uniform for the Empress for the next party :-) Okay, to cut a long story short: am I really the only one here who likes sewing for herself and having fun (and NOT needing to worry if I might make a mistake because it is for me and not for someone else, it always drives me mad the need to be perfect when making something for someone else) and disliking sewing for others? Nicole - not worried at all about the above, hey, I don't have children coz I am far too selfish to, so? *G* ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 06:30:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45AUZqa012864 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 06:30:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45AQndx000412 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 04:26:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45AO6Uk026796; Mon, 5 May 2003 04:24:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45AO3Uk026783 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 04:24:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-32-181.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.32.181]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h45AO1Me023252 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 03:24:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030505024755.04fd2b50@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 03:22:26 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <008001c312d6$668688a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> References: <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com> <4.3.1.2.20030505000308.04cac280@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h45AO3Uk026783 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Kayta, > >I have seen off-white in a sheer muslin or lawn fabric just not ecru. I may be getting my colour names wrong here. The lace is unbleached muslin colour (each piece is slightly different) and the fabric is bleached muslin colour. >Hi Carolyn. >I just wondered when you are going to make all those insertions, how do you >do it? >Is it made the same way, as lacemakers use when they sew on lace to fabric. >Lacemakers uses a nun's seam where you pull out threads and sew the lace on >that way with a hemstitch? >That would take you very long time to do! >I can imagine how beautifull this would be! I have a Dover Books reprint of a 1905 Butterick sewing manual which has instructions for applying insertion lace, and I was going to use them for this dress. These instructions are simpler than the way you suggest, and may involve a sewing machine, but an original Butterick booklet I have, also from 1905, shows a way to attach insertion lace pieces to fabric using what they call 'Bermuda faggoting' stitch. Your suggested hemstitching method may be in one of my antique books where I didn't notice it. I will have to go back and look. At least some of the inserted pieces should be attached with a fancy openwork stitch. But most of it will probably get attached by machine, if I can figure out how to do it neatly. I too can imagine how beautiful the dress would be, if all the stitches were stitches neat and even. So I plan to take all the time required to make the dress as beautiful as the one in my mind, even if I can't finish it to wear it this year. BTW, my name, in the original German, is Käthe, if that's any help. Only people like my mother call me Carolyn anymore. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 06:37:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45AbVqa012873 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 06:37:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45AYJdx000774 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 04:34:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45AVcUk028729; Mon, 5 May 2003 04:31:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp2.suscom.net (userweb.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45AVaUk028671 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 04:31:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (userweb.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9722E111F03 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 06:31:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id D2C5C111E34 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 06:31:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <00cc01c312f1$7d3305e0$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfish one? Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 06:31:29 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS new-20020517 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Okay, to cut a long story short: am I really the only one here who likes sewing > for herself and having fun (and NOT needing to worry if I might make a mistake > because it is for me and not for someone else, it always drives me mad the need > to be perfect when making something for someone else) and disliking sewing for > others? Nope. I LIKE making things for me, for pretty much the same reason. I love big, full, swooshy skirts (and farthingales, I love them!), and I love the way elegant clothing makes me feel. I'm short, and overweight, and mundane clothing either doesn't fit, or, if it does, I just don't like it! Dianne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 08:56:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Cu8qa013108 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:56:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Crsdx009279 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 06:53:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Cp9qc011246; Mon, 5 May 2003 06:51:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay1.primushost.com (poseidon.shore.net [207.244.124.88]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Cp6qd011221 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 06:51:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from (shell3.shore.net) [207.244.124.103] by relay1.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 19CfQs-0006y8-00; Mon, 05 May 2003 08:51:02 -0400 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for id 19CfR3-0005xl-00; Mon, 05 May 2003 08:51:13 -0400 Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 08:51:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Katy Bishop To: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030505024755.04fd2b50@mail.frys.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by net.indra.com id h45Cp6qd011221 cc: Historical Costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I found some 1901 descriptions with white cloth and ecru lace, see below. To do lace insertion: 1.I find it helps to starch the cloth before doing the incertion--and the lace too. 2.Then topstitch very close to the edge of the lace, 3.slit the cloth on the back under the lace 4.press the edges open 5.and topstitch again 6.trim raw edges 7.makes for a nice neat look I have a pic. of a lingerie blouse I made ages ago on my site: http://www.vintagevictorian.com/images/white_b.jpg copied the design from a 1909 catalogue, and used this method to do the incertion all by machine. For period color schemes: Looking back at Harper's Bazar: Summer Gowns for School Girls , June 1901 "Summer Gown of Pale Pink batiste with bands of ecru lace and violet satin belt" (it's really cute) another:" Graduation gown of white batiste with tucks; trimming of narrow bands of ecru lace; white satin sash." April 1901: "Gown for Garden Party, tucked and plain white muslin over white, bands of ecru lace, ribbon belt "(this lace looks fairly heavy not light incertion) Another for a young girl (late teens) "White albatross encrusted with cream lace." (now what is albatross?) On Mon, 5 May 2003, Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > >>Kayta, >> >>I have seen off-white in a sheer muslin or lawn fabric just not ecru. > >I may be getting my colour names wrong here. The lace is unbleached muslin >colour (each piece is slightly different) and the fabric is bleached muslin >colour. > >>Hi Carolyn. >>I just wondered when you are going to make all those insertions, how do you >>do it? >>Is it made the same way, as lacemakers use when they sew on lace to fabric. >>Lacemakers uses a nun's seam where you pull out threads and sew the lace on >>that way with a hemstitch? >>That would take you very long time to do! >>I can imagine how beautifull this would be! > >I have a Dover Books reprint of a 1905 Butterick sewing manual which has >instructions for applying insertion lace, and I was going to use them for >this dress. These instructions are simpler than the way you suggest, and >may involve a sewing machine, but an original Butterick booklet I have, >also from 1905, shows a way to attach insertion lace pieces to fabric using >what they call 'Bermuda faggoting' stitch. Your suggested hemstitching >method may be in one of my antique books where I didn't notice it. I will >have to go back and look. At least some of the inserted pieces should be >attached with a fancy openwork stitch. But most of it will probably get >attached by machine, if I can figure out how to do it neatly. > >I too can imagine how beautiful the dress would be, if all the stitches >were stitches neat and even. So I plan to take all the time required to >make the dress as beautiful as the one in my mind, even if I can't finish >it to wear it this year. > >BTW, my name, in the original German, is Käthe, if that's any help. Only >people like my mother call me Carolyn anymore. > > CarolynKayta Barrows >dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 09:21:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DLQqa013178 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:21:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DEHdx010366 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 07:14:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DBtNY017791; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:11:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (IDENT:root@mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DBrNY017776 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:11:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail22.ureach.com (mail22.ureach.com [172.16.2.82]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA31102 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:11:53 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-33-100-243.asm.bellsouth.net [67.33.100.243]) by mail22.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA28631 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:11:52 -0400 Message-ID: <003401c31307$7e8881c0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfish one? Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:09:00 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am with you Nicole! I love sewing for myself as I love wearing pretty gowns and such. To sew for others is completely nerve-wracking. If I make a little mistake, but it isn't obvious from the outside, I wouldn't sweat it for myself, but would not be able to give it to someone else. Theirs would have to be perfect. The only person I sew for is my hubby. Yes, it is sometimes annoying, but I love seeing him walk into a room proudly in his new houpelande or whatever. Teena ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "H-Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:27 AM Subject: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfish one? > I know I chip in late but have not been at the comp much (am not at the comp > much anymore generally - only when at work). However, it's Benk Holiday Monday > after our Sci-Fi sinner party (first installment) and I thought I better make a > dress diary for the D'hay-larian Empress costume (finished). > > Just a quickie on the topic of sewing for others or self, I seem to be totally > different: I like sewing for myself, I always did, because I can make > pretty/extraordinary things to adorn my SELF (yes, sure I am selfish! *laughs* > Arrogant, selfish lil someone I am, and happily so *winks*) and am having fun > trying out things, imagining what I'd look like, the effect on others etc etc > etc. I don't like sewing for others, and I never ever sew outside of the > family. I do sew for Ben, but only coz I have to, who else would make his > costume??? It annoys me though, tremendously, because in the last years, since > I moved to England, I was not able to do anything for myself, only for him. > Bah! That has changed this year, and slowly I am finding fun again in sewing: > making clothing for everyday wear (mundane is not the right word for most of > them...) and I started making costumes again. Starting with non-historical ones > (total burn-out for historical costumes too, still. Preferring to do the pure > research for now) and boy did I have fun making the Empress costume! Next is > the baby blanket for little Eli who we'll visit on the 15th of this month, and > then the Imperial war uniform for the Empress for the next party :-) > > Okay, to cut a long story short: am I really the only one here who likes sewing > for herself and having fun (and NOT needing to worry if I might make a mistake > because it is for me and not for someone else, it always drives me mad the need > to be perfect when making something for someone else) and disliking sewing for > others? > > Nicole - not worried at all about the above, hey, I don't have children coz I > am far too selfish to, so? *G* > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 09:23:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DNvqa013186 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:23:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DLndx010919 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 07:21:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DJ8NY020586; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:19:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DJ5NY020476 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:19:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1973A01D2; Mon, 05 May 2003 09:05:27 -0400 Message-ID: <003801c31309$5ae07a00$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EB59CBC.30974.28FD226@localhost> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:22:18 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Katherine, I think your blouse is discolored from age and that it most likely was stark white in it's original construction. The yellowing seems to be much stronger than ecru even if it was aged. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Katherine" To: Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:05 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with insertion. I > have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it was. The color is very > even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it doesn't look like it aged that way but > was originally that way. > > I have a page about it here: > > http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html > > No pictures of the inside yet, I've been promising those for months :) > > Katherine > > On 4 May 2003 at 19:54, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: > > > Message: 9 > > Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:14:39 -0700 > > From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows > > > > Do you think I can get away with an ecru cotton dress, with ecru insertion, > > in the style of these dresses? Or should I shelve the project till I can > > afford enough silk? > > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > > www.FunStuft.com > > > Katherine > > "I go by-by." > > Alexandra Feodorovna, last empress of Russia, in a letter to her husband, > Nicholas II > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 09:28:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DSLqa013199 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:28:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DPkdx011224 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 07:25:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DN6NY022462; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:23:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dc-mx10.cluster1.charter.net (dc-mx10.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DN3NY022408 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:23:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [24.196.130.120] (HELO laptop) by dc-mx10.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 111080767 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 05 May 2003 09:22:57 -0400 Message-ID: <001a01c31309$66045820$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [cc2003] Fw: Costume Con Photographs On-Line Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 08:22:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO thanks. ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** > > > Ummm...I'm on page 7, 3rd row, last three - the wine/paisley Vintage Vogue > > from 1928 > > and page 10 bottom 2 rows, the evergreen evening gown (Vintage Vogue from > > 1934). > > Oh, I LOVED these. Especially the green one. > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 09:35:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DZsqa013269 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:35:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DSkdx011370 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 07:28:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DQ5NY023765; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:26:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45DPkNY023564 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:25:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3286901D2; Mon, 05 May 2003 09:12:08 -0400 Message-ID: <004201c3130a$49704100$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com><4.3.1.2.20030505000308.04cac280@mail.frys.com> <008001c312d6$668688a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:28:55 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And I too, Kayta. I have examples of fine linen that used ecru lace for trim, and both are of palest blue in tone. And I have a pic somewhere that shows a gown in pink. As a matter of fact, did Sally Q"s calendar feature some of these? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 3:17 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > Kayta, > > I have seen off-white in a sheer muslin or lawn fabric just not ecru. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 3:10 AM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > > > > > > >I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with > > >insertion. I > > >have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it was. The > > >color is very > > >even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it doesn't look like it aged > > >that way but > > >was originally that way. > > > > > >I have a page about it here: > > > > > >http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html > > > > Thank you so much for posting this. > > > > Fran - what do you think of this? Is the colour an aberration, an unusual > > example, or a case of age discolouration? Seriously, can I get away with > a > > dress this far off of white? Much of the historical Valenciennes lace I > > have been using as examples of what to shop for are this colour too. > > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > > www.FunStuft.com > > > > //// \\\ > > ////-@@\\\ > > (((( 7 ))) > > ((( <> )))) > > ) (((((( > > /----\ /---\)) > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > > > > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 09:55:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Dtqqa013460 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:55:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Drkdx013369 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 07:53:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Dp5NY004014; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:51:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Dp2NY003948 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 07:51:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A91419A101A4; Mon, 05 May 2003 09:37:24 -0400 Message-ID: <005401c3130d$d180fd20$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com> <4.3.1.2.20030505000308.04cac280@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20030505024755.04fd2b50@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:54:15 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta, I have a large box of Val Lace, and much of it was found still on the little blue cards it was marketed with. In unwind the cards to measure the lace, I have often found it more white underneath than ecru. This made me believe that the ecru tone was aging and not original color. By just soaking it in syntropol (Darhma silk soap) the piece most always comes out white. If you proposed garment is going to be washed, You may want to make sure your lace will wash to the same color as the fabric. Otherwise, you will be left with the same dilemma of fabric and lace not matching. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 6:22 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress >Kayta, > >I have seen off-white in a sheer muslin or lawn fabric just not ecru. I may be getting my colour names wrong here. The lace is unbleached muslin colour (each piece is slightly different) and the fabric is bleached muslin colour. >Hi Carolyn. >I just wondered when you are going to make all those insertions, how do you >do it? >Is it made the same way, as lacemakers use when they sew on lace to fabric. >Lacemakers uses a nun's seam where you pull out threads and sew the lace on >that way with a hemstitch? >That would take you very long time to do! >I can imagine how beautifull this would be! I have a Dover Books reprint of a 1905 Butterick sewing manual which has instructions for applying insertion lace, and I was going to use them for this dress. These instructions are simpler than the way you suggest, and may involve a sewing machine, but an original Butterick booklet I have, also from 1905, shows a way to attach insertion lace pieces to fabric using what they call 'Bermuda faggoting' stitch. Your suggested hemstitching method may be in one of my antique books where I didn't notice it. I will have to go back and look. At least some of the inserted pieces should be attached with a fancy openwork stitch. But most of it will probably get attached by machine, if I can figure out how to do it neatly. I too can imagine how beautiful the dress would be, if all the stitches were stitches neat and even. So I plan to take all the time required to make the dress as beautiful as the one in my mind, even if I can't finish it to wear it this year. BTW, my name, in the original German, is Käthe, if that's any help. Only people like my mother call me Carolyn anymore. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 10:25:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EP8qa013518 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:25:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EN0dx016281 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 08:23:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EKIw4017707; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:20:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41509.mail.yahoo.com (web41509.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.92]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45EJrw4017277 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:19:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505141948.36863.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41509.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 15:19:48 BST Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 15:19:48 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= To: H-Costume , KC , Lagedor ListSmartgroups MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Not really historical (not even remotely so, but the idea was ripped off 6th/7th century Byzantine Imperial clothing and a 10th century German Reichskrone - after all, I come from Aachen) but lots of fun nevertheless. There was no possible 'wrong' only creativity and imagination, I had a blast! It felt like a true costuming-holiday. Here is the stroy of the emergence of Empress K'hay-Thora from the planet of D'hay-lar: http://www.kipar.org/dress-diary/empress-khay-thora.html Have fun - I hope Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 10:43:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EhUqa013581 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:43:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EdBdx017944 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 08:39:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EaUw4026683; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:36:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.mackie.com (mail1.mackie.com [12.144.237.151]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EaRw4026649 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:36:28 -0600 (MDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 07:36:26 -0700 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] looking for a larger/better image....14c Italian cotehardie Thread-Index: AcMRk/097UuHe6UJR4iectqSeGfMDQBf0nJg From: "Colleen McDonald" To: "Historical Costume" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h45EaRw4026649 Subject: [h-cost] looking for a larger/better image....14c Italian cotehardie X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO <> Try Rosita Levi-Pisetzky's _Storia dell Costume in Italia_, volume 2. There's a full page picture of this plate in the 1300's section. Colleen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 11:02:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45F21qa013614 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:02:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45ExYdx020129 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 08:59:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EvL3R008743; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:57:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45EvH3R008644 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:57:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.104] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A89B25C101AA; Mon, 05 May 2003 10:43:39 -0400 Message-ID: <001301c31317$126fd3c0$685183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030505141948.36863.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 11:00:26 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole, What Fun! I am interested in how the 'gems' were attached to the fabric. Several years ago I was doing costumes for" Mid Summers Night" and for Oberon's and Titania's costumes tried to do something "like" yours. Spent a whole day hot gluing the silver pearls and large stones to the collars, cuffs,belts and etc after using gem cement. Both failed. Then I watched these pieces diminish trim by the movement at the rehearsal. I"ve always had a rule in my shop of "NO GLUE" and this experience sure reinforced it. Ended up with a lot of couching and shiska application, which of course contributed to the stress of meeting the deadline. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "H-Costume" ; "KC" ; "Lagedor ListSmartgroups" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:19 AM Subject: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) > Not really historical (not even remotely so, but the idea was ripped off > 6th/7th century Byzantine Imperial clothing and a 10th century German > Reichskrone - after all, I come from Aachen) but lots of fun nevertheless. > There was no possible 'wrong' only creativity and imagination, I had a blast! > It felt like a true costuming-holiday. > > Here is the stroy of the emergence of Empress K'hay-Thora from the planet of > D'hay-lar: http://www.kipar.org/dress-diary/empress-khay-thora.html > > Have fun - I hope > > Nicole > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 11:17:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FHwqa013633 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:17:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FFhdx021946 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 09:15:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FD13R019153; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:13:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45FCw3R019110 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:12:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 30337 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 15:12:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail2.inreach.com) (209.142.2.51) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 5 May 2003 15:12:57 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:12:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <18878.162.119.64.111.1052147577.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 08:12:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfish one? From: To: In-Reply-To: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Okay, to cut a long story short: am I really the only one here who likes > sewing for herself and having fun (and NOT needing to worry if I might > make a mistake because it is for me and not for someone else, it always > drives me mad the need to be perfect when making something for someone > else) and disliking sewing for others? You are not alone. I love to sew for myself because I like to look nice, too. I only sew for others if they are a personal friend and I am really inspired. I don't do this to be exclusive, I do it because I have seen what happens to people who sew for others....they either get paid crap for their talent or the person insists that they want something and then complains that it doesn't look right on them (after the tailor tried to convince them of this fact). Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 11:27:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FRMqa013654 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:27:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FJWdx022487 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 09:19:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FGp3R021885; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:16:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41508.mail.yahoo.com (web41508.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45FGl3R021775 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:16:47 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505151642.19649.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41508.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 16:16:42 BST Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:16:42 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <001301c31317$126fd3c0$685183d1@rmitchellras> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > Nicole, What Fun! I am interested in how the 'gems' were attached to the > fabric. Well... glue *G* I hate to say it, reading your woes below, but it simply is glue. Several different ones for that matter. The crown, BTW, is cardboard and then many layers of Mod Podge over it, then spray painted, then the three-headed eagles painted on with varnish, then the bits glued on. The pearsl, however, do not stay on easily. I couldn't be bothered to wire them on though. They stay on no problem unless you touch them/hit against something. The glue I used for the glass and plastic stones on the gold PVC coated fabric is Anita's PVA Tacky Glue. Dries transparent (very important, or the stones would not sparkle, of course.) The glue for the crown is a German one. By Greben and called simply 'Hart Kleber'. It dries transparent, is super good for anything larger than a wee little pearl, and is a resin based one. But only one component, not the hassle of two. The rectangular facetted stones are partly glued on and partly sewn on for stabilisation. The pearls are all sewn on (pallium and superhumeral), not individually, gods beware! but they were all pearl necklaces and pearl strings for German Christmas trees. Sheesh, I really have to go a-hunting this Christmas when visiting my parents. Thank goodness I found big batches of pearls yesterday at the charity shops and antique & thrift shops in Rochester at the sweeps festival. My stock was mightly deplenished and I need lots more for the Empress' Imperial war uniform. *G* Nicole > Several years ago I was doing costumes for" Mid Summers Night" and for > Oberon's and Titania's costumes tried to do something "like" yours. Spent a > whole day hot gluing the silver pearls and large stones to the collars, > cuffs,belts and etc after using gem cement. Both failed. Then I watched > these pieces diminish trim by the movement at the rehearsal. I"ve always had > a rule in my shop of "NO GLUE" and this experience sure reinforced it. Ended > up with a lot of couching and shiska application, which of course > contributed to the stress of meeting the deadline. > Kathleen ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 11:49:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Fnmqa013705 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:49:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Fledx025608 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 09:47:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Fiw3R011047; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:44:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Fit3R011001 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:44:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be2c.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.44]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 05C5C47FF5F for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 17:44:54 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000d01c3131d$d501a520$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030505141948.36863.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:48:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Whow!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is fabulous Nicole. I had no idea you were making that kind two. Have i ben sleaping or have i ignored your posts because it was about star wars! That is absolutely lovely! Congratulations! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "H-Costume" ; "KC" ; "Lagedor ListSmartgroups" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:19 PM Subject: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) > Not really historical (not even remotely so, but the idea was ripped off > 6th/7th century Byzantine Imperial clothing and a 10th century German > Reichskrone - after all, I come from Aachen) but lots of fun nevertheless. > There was no possible 'wrong' only creativity and imagination, I had a blast! > It felt like a true costuming-holiday. > > Here is the stroy of the emergence of Empress K'hay-Thora from the planet of > D'hay-lar: http://www.kipar.org/dress-diary/empress-khay-thora.html > > Have fun - I hope > > Nicole > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 11:54:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FsKqa013723 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:54:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Fpudx026075 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 09:51:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FnF3R014091; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:49:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FnC3R013945 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:49:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.108] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A4C65E501B0; Mon, 05 May 2003 11:35:34 -0400 Message-ID: <001601c3131e$53a3dba0$6c5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "H-Costume" Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 11:52:25 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h45FsKqa013723 Status: RO Greetings, I'm working the 'achieves this AM and have a renewed interest in what to do with a gorgeous linen piece I found last summer at a flea-market. It is 14 1/2 inches wide by 11yds + long. The edges bear 3" strips of stripes enclosing fleur did lis motifs and the center has the same motifs in two sizes over all. The color is natural and what I might call chalk white. Damask? Brocade? In any event, it is woven, and rather heavy weight...like mogushal. I am open to period; the main concern is that I use it to best advantage to display this beautiful piece and give it a good historical reference. Any ideas? Kathleen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 11:58:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Fwgqa013736 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:58:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45FuTdx026660 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 09:56:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Frh3R017150; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:53:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f86.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.86]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Fra3R016953 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 09:53:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 5 May 2003 08:53:31 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.226 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 15:53:30 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.226] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 15:53:30 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 May 2003 15:53:31.0265 (UTC) FILETIME=[79F67F10:01C3131E] Subject: [h-cost] Selfish Sewing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, Nicole, you're not the only one! I very rarely sew for other people. In fact, I rarely even sew for Ben (also my DH's name). I am just too selfish. I love to wear my creations. If I make something great for someone else, then I have to make one for me too... I am pretty tall and have a hard time finding ready made clothes that fit unless I am paying an arm and a leg for them, so I tend to spend my money on fabric and make my own. I can usually get three pairs of pants for the price of one pair of J.Crew slacks. It's more fun and cost effective! I LOVE it when people compliment what I am wearing and ask where I got it. I got it at a little place called "Jessica's sewing room!!!". :) jessica BTW, your Empress costume looks awesome!!! Very fun. :) _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 12:20:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45GKeqa013778 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:20:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45GIHdx029133 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 10:18:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45GFXw5002736; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:15:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80110.mail.yahoo.com (web80110.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.83]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45GFUw5002655 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:15:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505161530.38533.qmail@web80110.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80110.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 09:15:30 PDT Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:15:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305030654.h436sVOq010168@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: sewing for self vs. sewing for others X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Emma wrote: Has anyone else > dealt with this (able to sew for others but not for self)? Can > anybody think of any way to get past it? I'm not > burned out on costuming, > I'm just burned out on costuming for *myself.* I was in the same situation about 6 months ago, until I started to really think about WHY I was having so much trouble. I finally realized that I was building a bunch of very finely finished garments (lots of handsewing and hand-finishing) for myself for a period in which I have absolutely no interest (this happens occasionally when you do period-specific reenacting with friends). I broke through it by building something entirely different, in the manner I'm most comfortable building costumes (the overlock and the sewing machine ARE my friends). It was a liberating experience, and the results were great. My advice (take it for what it's worth): Sit down and think about the differences between what you're building for others, and what you're building for yourself. It may be that you're building stuff for yourself that you're not that interested in wearing, or you might not care for the construction techniques. That might give you a clue to breaking through this "costuming block." Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 12:37:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Gblqa013817 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:37:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45GZTdx001453 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 10:35:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45GWlw5016507; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:32:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41510.mail.yahoo.com (web41510.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.93]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45GWbw5016295 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:32:37 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505163232.79243.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41510.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 17:32:32 BST Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:32:32 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000d01c3131d$d501a520$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Whow!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is fabulous Nicole. I had no idea you were making that > kind two. Have i ben sleaping or have i ignored your posts because it was > about star wars! > That is absolutely lovely! > Congratulations! Thanks so much Bjarne, and thanks everyone else! So glad you enjoy the costume though it's really not historical, only 'inspired heavily'. Quite frankly, Bjarne, I didn't know either that I was making such costumes until I started! :-) Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 12:43:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Ghlqa013828 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:43:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45GfKdx002273 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 10:41:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Gccw5020954; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:38:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45GcXw5020850 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:38:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWkd9b2HyVm2z1mBfRIE+v2TwJ3VfR+zTOQ==">; Mon, 05 May 2003 09:37:45 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HXE92H94; Mon, 05 May 2003 09:37:45 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 12:36:26 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) Message-ID: <20030505.123626.-194753.0.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 7-9 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole, that looks like so much fun. I have to agree with you that just making a costume and not authentic as possible reproduction garb is a whole lot of fun. I get the chance every now and again and truly enjoy it. I never pass up a chance to make a kid's Halloween costume (or one for myself if I can come up with an excuse to wear it). Used to do a lot more Sci/fi than now, but got almost as nutso about authenticity there as I do with medieval. But, I don't think I ever created anything so elegant as the Empress K'hay-Thora. Thanks for sharing. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 13:10:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HAcqa013892 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:10:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45H7Xdx005460 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 11:07:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45H4oIC009645; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:04:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe22.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.79]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45H4gIC009478 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:04:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:04:37 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe22.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 05 May 2003 17:04:37 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfish one? Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 13:03:58 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 May 2003 17:04:37.0501 (UTC) FILETIME=[68D672D0:01C31328] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "H-Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:27 AM Subject: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfish one? > > Okay, to cut a long story short: am I really the only one here who likes sewing > for herself and having fun (and NOT needing to worry if I might make a mistake > because it is for me and not for someone else, it always drives me mad the need > to be perfect when making something for someone else) and disliking sewing for > others? I'm like that too. But mostly I think it annoys me to sew for others because right now I don't even have enough time to get a fraction of my own projects finished. Also, when I sew for others, it has to be absolutely perfect. I don't allow myself to take shortcuts. And I don't like giving my most beautiful projects away, because I like being able to keep them in sight. I guess I'm just too proud of myself for my own good :-) Unless it's made for someone very close who I'm sure will take good care of it, or it's a very special gift (like those huge animal pillows I made for the new babies in the family). If someone pays me for my work, then it becomes a chore. If I make it as a gift, then it becomes a personal project, because I'm the one offering something (though I do accept payment for material). Weird, but it's the way my brain works :-) And I hate sewing with a deadline, mostly because I like to jump from project to project. I'll work on my Liz intensely for 3 months, then I'll just leave it there for 4 months while I work intensely on a 1943 dress. Then I'll drop everything and enter knitting frenzy mode. Then eventually I'll come back to the first project. It's a cycle. And I've finally figured out that I work much better if I let the process happen naturally. One major reason for this is that I often stall because I have doubts about something. When I go to another project, I come back to the first one with a fresh perspective, and very often I've had time to let it roll around inside my head long enough for a choice to be made without my having to make it consciously. Most of the times it works fine. When I don't have a project, it means I'm not feeling good with myself. This winter I got bad winter blues, and I kept looking at projects lying about and I just didn't feel like working on anything. That's a major warning sign. It also means I HAVE to find something to work on if I want to start feeling better. Keeping busy keeps the blues away, in my case. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 13:15:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HFjqa013902 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:15:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HDVdx006151 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 11:13:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HAnIC014055; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:10:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe28.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.85]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45H7mIC011766 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:07:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:07:42 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe28.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 05 May 2003 17:07:42 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> <003401c31307$7e8881c0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfishone? Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 13:07:07 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 May 2003 17:07:42.0749 (UTC) FILETIME=[D7410CD0:01C31328] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beteena Paradise" > The only person I sew for is my hubby. Yes, it is > sometimes annoying, but I love seeing him walk into a room proudly in his > new houpelande or whatever. And I used to think I was selfish for that same thing :-) Now I think I have to enjoy the result if I want to enjoy the process of making the clothing. And I enjoy seeing my bf in great clothes. That's my payment! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 13:21:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HLlqa013921 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:21:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HJadx006926 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 11:19:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HGsIC018545; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:16:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45HEdIC016912 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:14:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 17932 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 17:14:38 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 5 May 2003 17:14:38 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-109.sonic.net [209.148.112.109]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h45HEbL04059 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:14:37 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030505101456.00aa9888@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 10:15:57 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20030505024755.04fd2b50@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >"White albatross encrusted with cream lace." (now what is albatross?) A soft untwilled woolen dress fabric withe an irregular weave. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 13:28:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HSAqa013953 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:28:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HPXdx007638 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 11:25:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HMqIC022828; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:22:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web21411.mail.yahoo.com (web21411.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.232.80]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45HFJIC017355 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:15:19 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505171519.14133.qmail@web21411.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.187.14.104] by web21411.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 10:15:19 PDT Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 10:15:19 -0700 (PDT) From: "Angharad ver' Reynulf" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030505151642.19649.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Truly, truly spiff Nicole! I love it, and all of the detail you put into the dress diary too. Angharad __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 13:34:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HY3qa013983 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:34:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HVDdx008260 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 11:31:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HSWIC026737; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:28:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80107.mail.yahoo.com (web80107.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.80]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45HGqIC018507 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:16:52 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505171651.79664.qmail@web80107.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80107.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 10:16:51 PDT Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 10:16:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305041602.h44G21CN010031@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Jessica wrote: > Please tell me more about Costume College. I think > it's a yearly event, but > what exactly is it? Has anyone gone and now have > stories raving (or not) > about it? Is it worth going to (I know, what am I > saying?!? It's costume > related...of course it WORTH going to!!!!)? In a word, yes. It's worth going. A little history (I guess this makes me a "geezer"--I can actually remember why Costume College was started): A bunch of us in the CosMaf (the old name of the CGW) were, IIRC, sitting around, Janet and Gary Anderson's house one afternoon, probably drinking too much, and complaining that even with CostumeCon, there still weren't enough classes for the really advanced costumers. The biggest complaints were: a) most of the classes taught were (are?) geared toward the beginning costumer; and b) the advanced costumers are so busy teaching classes at CostumeCon that they don't have time to learn anything themselves. At some point, I think Adrian Butterfield said, "Why don't we have a weekend of classes and workshops for the really advanced people, so we can exchange information between ourselves?" Costume College is the result of that "booze-up." There are no masquerades at Costume College to give everybody a break from competing. Instead there is the Time Travelers' Ball and the Fantasy Tea to show stuff off, the shopping is nothing short of amazing, there is almost always a "native guide" tour of the L.A. Fashion District, and most of all, it's a little more "low key," to allow more time for schmoozing. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 13:40:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45He7qa014004 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:40:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HbJdx009070 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 11:37:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HYbIC001205; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:34:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45HNhIC023535 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:23:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 19925 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 17:23:43 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 5 May 2003 17:23:43 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-109.sonic.net [209.148.112.109]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h45HNg610277 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:23:42 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030505102413.00aac5b0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 10:25:02 -0700 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Lavolta Press Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] Re: ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is not ecru, it is showing a yellowish white on my monitor. It looks like age discoloration to me. That can be very even. Fran At 11:05 PM 5/4/2003 -0700, you wrote: I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with insertion. I have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it was. The color is very even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it doesn't look like it aged that way but was originally that way. I have a page about it here: http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html No pictures of the inside yet, I've been promising those for months :) Katherine Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 13:46:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Hkxqa014021 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:46:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HiEdx010000 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 11:44:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45HfpIC006297; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:41:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45HfmIC006246 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:41:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 24046 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 17:41:47 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 5 May 2003 17:41:47 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-109.sonic.net [209.148.112.109]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h45Hfk617758 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:41:47 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030505102650.00aa7888@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 10:43:06 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030505000308.04cac280@mail.frys.com> References: <3EB59CBC.30974.28FD226@localhost> <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >Fran - what do you think of this? Is the colour an aberration, an unusual >example, or a case of age discolouration? Seriously, can I get away with >a dress this far off of white? Much of the historical Valenciennes lace I >have been using as examples of what to shop for are this colour too. > > I went through a major Edwardian whites phase years ago and collected a couple of hundred garments in that genre. Anyway, the white originals have mostly turned off-white, a few into the yellow range, with age. This is also true of the Edwardian white lace I collected. As long as the color is even and the item is free of dirt, I just accept it. An original that is bright white today is often a warning sign that the antique dealer did such heavy-duty bleaching the textile may fall apart soon. I prefer the off-white color anyway. So I'd feel fine about it. BTW if you haven't prewashed the lace, I'd suggest doing so (by hand in warm water with mild soap). It can definitely shrink a fair amount, even if it's that old. It may also lighten in color. I've never seen ecru lace on white fabric in garments of this type, but I'm not at all surprised Katy found fashion magazine references to it. As I said, sooner or later you see everything. (I have seen this contrast in reproduction garments.) I have a couple Edwardian white blouses with bright embroidery (one with blue, one with red) which is not usually what people think of as "whites" either. The true ecru fabrics and laces were usually meant to be that color. Although, people certainly did dye white laces ecru to hide stains, or just because they preferred the color. But, a real ecru is not usually age discoloration (though that too may lighten with cleaning). BTW, coffee, which I have used to a limited extent as a lace dye, gives a yellowish ecru color. I just made some really strong (undrinkable) instant coffee, dissolved the crystals well, left the lace in it a while, and rinsed it. It was basically an experiment but turned out well. This was for a small amount of easily removable lace on a garment I don't plan to clean a lot. Tea is said to dye more of a pink beige, but I haven't tried it. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 14:07:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45I7Sqa014079 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 14:07:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45I51dx012619 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 12:05:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45I2K5J021265; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:02:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f58.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.58]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45I295J021102 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:02:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:02:04 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 18:02:04 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Selfish Sewing Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 11:02:04 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 May 2003 18:02:04.0756 (UTC) FILETIME=[6F8FD140:01C31330] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I LOVE it when people compliment what I am wearing and ask where I got it. >I got it at a little place called "Jessica's sewing room!!!". > I make clothing for my family and my daughters' friends all the time. I have the most fun though when I'm making something elaborate for myself. I know how I fit a standard pattern and I love to decorate, so my stuff is usually pretty fancy. I found it difficult to just make stock when I did have a business because there was no personality to guide the design for. I guess I'm a bipolar sewer. I like both kinds of sewing(for me vs. for others)just at different times. Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 14:08:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45I8hqa014084 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 14:08:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Hpndx010949 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 11:51:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Hn8IC011312; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:49:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Hn4IC011269 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:49:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0167C7AA10 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:48:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 49313-09 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:48:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-207-101-203.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.207.101.203]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FF1C7A9C0 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 10:48:28 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 10:48:51 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030505171651.79664.qmail@web80107.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Really? My main complaint with Costume College the last two years is that all the information was really geared towards beginners... On Monday, May 5, 2003, at 10:16 AM, Dawn Jacobson wrote: > Jessica wrote: > >> Please tell me more about Costume College. I think >> it's a yearly event, but >> what exactly is it? Has anyone gone and now have >> stories raving (or not) >> about it? Is it worth going to (I know, what am I >> saying?!? It's costume >> related...of course it WORTH going to!!!!)? > > In a word, yes. It's worth going. > > A little history (I guess this makes me a "geezer"--I > can actually remember why Costume College was > started): A bunch of us in the CosMaf (the old name of > the CGW) were, IIRC, sitting around, Janet and Gary > Anderson's house one afternoon, probably drinking too > much, and complaining that even with CostumeCon, there > still weren't enough classes for the really advanced > costumers. The biggest complaints were: a) most of the > classes taught were (are?) geared toward the beginning > costumer; and b) the advanced costumers are so busy > teaching classes at CostumeCon that they don't have > time to learn anything themselves. At some point, I > think Adrian Butterfield said, "Why don't we have a > weekend of classes and workshops for the really > advanced people, so we can exchange information > between ourselves?" Costume College is the result of > that "booze-up." > > There are no masquerades at Costume College to give > everybody a break from competing. Instead there is the > Time Travelers' Ball and the Fantasy Tea to show stuff > off, the shopping is nothing short of amazing, there > is almost always a "native guide" tour of the L.A. > Fashion District, and most of all, it's a little more > "low key," to allow more time for schmoozing. > > Dawn > > ===== > Dawn Jacobson > Vallejo, CA, USA > > "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with > those socks?" > --Wicked Witch > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 14:28:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45ISSqa014160 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 14:28:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45IPidx015077 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 12:25:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45IMx5J007081; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:22:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt28.cluster1.charter.net (remt28.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45IMo5J006903 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:22:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [24.196.130.120] (HELO laptop) by remt28.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 18323231; Mon, 05 May 2003 14:22:44 -0400 Message-ID: <009401c31333$4453ac60$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Margo's Patterns" , "fofsew" , "Bristol FOF" , Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 13:22:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] Cotton Velvet Panels at Target X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I was just going through my Sunday paper flyers and this appeared in the Target flyer: http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/ref=br_1_3/602-1656132-6657460?asin=B00 008RS93 100% cotton velvet panels - 55 x 84" for $18. I figured that made it ~$7.75/yd, 54" wide. There are limited colors, but one of them is "natural" so I imagine it would dye well. The velvet is advertised as machine washable, so I would also guess that there is no backing on it. ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 14:51:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45IpQqa014217 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 14:51:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45ImGdx017828 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 12:48:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45IjYLI022938; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:45:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45IjULI022893 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:45:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C3317A95B for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:45:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 50242-08 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-207-101-203.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.207.101.203]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00EB37A94B for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 11:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 11:45:18 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton Velvet Panels at Target Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <009401c31333$4453ac60$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Too bad they are all listed as "unavailable" on the website! On Monday, May 5, 2003, at 11:22 AM, wrote: > I was just going through my Sunday paper flyers and this appeared in > the > Target flyer: > > http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/ref=br_1_3/602-1656132- > 6657460?asin=B00 > 008RS93 > > 100% cotton velvet panels - 55 x 84" for $18. I figured that made it > ~$7.75/yd, 54" wide. There are limited colors, but one of them is > "natural" > so I imagine it would dye well. The velvet is advertised as machine > washable, so I would also guess that there is no backing on it. > > > ********************** > Rebecca Schmitt > aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot > BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence > > A room without books is like a body without a soul > ---Cicero > > lotsofteapots@charter.net > ********************** > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 14:58:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45IwGqa014235 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 14:58:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Itpdx018700 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 12:55:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Ir9LI028174; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:53:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web21401.mail.yahoo.com (web21401.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.232.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45Ir4LI028089 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:53:05 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505185303.12009.qmail@web21401.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.187.14.104] by web21401.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 11:53:03 PDT Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 11:53:03 -0700 (PDT) From: "Angharad ver' Reynulf" Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon & other con congrats To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > (I never wanted to do that one, I wanted to do one > of Tanu) > > Like this? > > http://www.ireadh.demon.co.uk/cguk/ccxvdisp/page5.html > > And yes, that's Teddy :-) > Robin, yep...like that one....I've also seen the "Lady Epona" in my b-day prezzie (_Costume-Maker's Art_) but I don't like that one as well. *sigh* all the spiffy things I want to aspire to....so many things to learn to do them...thank goodness for the lists! Angharad __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 15:23:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JNRqa014377 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 15:23:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JKgdx021688 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 13:20:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JIKU4017109; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:18:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80102.mail.yahoo.com (web80102.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.75]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45JIHU4017052 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:18:18 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030505191817.17092.qmail@web80102.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80102.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 05 May 2003 12:18:17 PDT Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 12:18:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305051801.h45I1f5K020825@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Heather wrote: > Really? My main complaint with Costume College the > last > two years is that all the information was really > geared towards > beginners... As I said, the Original Idea was intermediate/advanced classes for the more "seasoned" costumers. Most of us know draping, how to build an SF costume with $1.98 worth of supplies and a hot glue gun, stage presence, etc. Also, we wanted something where We Did Not Have To Spend The Entire Con Getting Ready For The Masquerade(s). While I haven't been to Costume College in several years, I know that a lot of the "heavy hitters" are no longer involved in the "convention costuming" circuit, and many others have stopped doing costuming altogether (funny how when you hit 40, your house and family suddenly seem to take on a higher priority). This may be part of the reason that more classes are geared toward the less experienced costumer. If you want more advanced classes offered, let Janet Anderson know. I believe she's still the Dean of the College, and she can route your request to whoever is doing programming now. BTW, Janet is the person in the gold Dior ballgown on p. 10 of the CostumeCon photos. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 15:29:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JTvqa014385 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 15:29:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JHHdx021197 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 13:17:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JEYU4013540; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:14:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r03.mx.aol.com (imo-r03.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JEVU4013446 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:14:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.60.307bf95b (2612) for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 15:14:24 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <60.307bf95b.2be81210@aol.com> Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 15:14:24 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon & other con congrats To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/5/03 3:03:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dragonwolfcat@yahoo.com writes: > >And yes, that's Teddy :-) > > *Points and giggles* It's Teddy wearing a big headdress! Looks rather different in a dress and minus the glasses.. Then again, that was also what, six years ago? I wish I could make things that awe-inspiring. Ah well...someday. AFTER I manage to get to another Con, dragging along my farthingale plus a myriad of other costumes, and attend a light-up-costume program. Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 15:55:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Jtvqa014452 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 15:55:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JqDdx025382 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 13:52:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JnVOV008643; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:49:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45JnQOV008563 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 13:49:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43E087A6A0 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:45:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 51115-10 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:45:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-207-101-203.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.207.101.203]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4626D7A690 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 12:45:22 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 12:45:45 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030505191817.17092.qmail@web80102.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <299844D9-7F32-11D7-98DF-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My solution to the issue was to try to start teaching class there. I can't this year because of a conflict, but I'll be teaching next year - I'm really looking forward to it! I did have a great time there, I just had to find classes on topics I knew nothing about. On Monday, May 5, 2003, at 12:18 PM, Dawn Jacobson wrote: > Heather wrote: > >> Really? My main complaint with Costume College the >> last >> two years is that all the information was really >> geared towards >> beginners... > > As I said, the Original Idea was intermediate/advanced > classes for the more "seasoned" costumers. Most of us > know draping, how to build an SF costume with $1.98 > worth of supplies and a hot glue gun, stage presence, > etc. Also, we wanted something where We Did Not Have > To Spend The Entire Con Getting Ready For The > Masquerade(s). > > While I haven't been to Costume College in several > years, I know that a lot of the "heavy hitters" are no > longer involved in the "convention costuming" circuit, > and many others have stopped doing costuming > altogether (funny how when you hit 40, your house and > family suddenly seem to take on a higher priority). > This may be part of the reason that more classes are > geared toward the less experienced costumer. > > If you want more advanced classes offered, let Janet > Anderson know. I believe she's still the Dean of the > College, and she can route your request to whoever is > doing programming now. > > BTW, Janet is the person in the gold Dior ballgown on > p. 10 of the CostumeCon photos. > > Dawn > > ===== > Dawn Jacobson > Vallejo, CA, USA > > "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with > those socks?" > --Wicked Witch > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 17:33:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45LXDqa014686 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 17:33:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45LUVdx007242 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 15:30:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45LUTmv020964; Mon, 5 May 2003 15:30:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45LUQmv020928 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 15:30:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-32-181.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.32.181]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h45LUKMi029699 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 14:30:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030505141924.04fd43a0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 14:28:02 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <005401c3130d$d180fd20$665183d1@rmitchellras> References: <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com> <4.3.1.2.20030505000308.04cac280@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20030505024755.04fd2b50@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Kayta, I have a large box of Val Lace, and much of it was found still on the >little blue cards it was marketed with. In unwind the cards to measure the >lace, I have often found it more white underneath than ecru. This made me >believe that the ecru tone was aging and not original color. By just >soaking it in syntropol (Darhma silk soap) the piece most always comes out >white. If you proposed garment is going to be washed, You may want to make >sure your lace will wash to the same color as the fabric. Otherwise, you >will be left with the same dilemma of fabric and lace not matching. >Kathleen I am using modern-made lace, and keep intending to pre-wash it, just in case. But after the dress is made, it will never see the inside of a washing machine again. >syntropol (Darhma silk soap) Or something like Orvus. -snip- >I've never seen ecru lace on white fabric in garments of this type, but >I'm not at all surprised Katy found fashion magazine references to it. As >I said, sooner or later you see everything. (I have seen this contrast in >reproduction garments.) I have a couple Edwardian white blouses with >bright embroidery (one with blue, one with red) which is not usually what >people think of as "whites" either. Off-white lace on a white garment would remind me of the new ones I saw in Mexico, and looked so wrong to me that I wasn't going to do that even if it did turn out to be period, as we see it has. Meanwhile, I have a Butterick pamphlet from c.1905 which shows an example of bright coloured peasant embroidery one can do on a white shirtwaist. I nearly dropped my teeth, then got right to work planning one for me. Mine will have 'Copenhagen blue' on white, because I do cross stitch better than I do any other kind of embroidery. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 18:44:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45MiZqa014893 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 18:44:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Mfldx016402 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 16:41:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Mfg3g010618; Mon, 5 May 2003 16:41:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h45Mfd3g010570 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 16:41:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 18376 invoked from network); 5 May 2003 22:41:39 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 5 May 2003 22:41:39 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-163.sonic.net [209.148.112.163]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h45Mfcf17290 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 15:41:38 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030505153346.00aed408@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 15:42:58 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030505141924.04fd43a0@mail.frys.com> References: <005401c3130d$d180fd20$665183d1@rmitchellras> <200305050154.h451spIY008553@net.indra.com> <4.3.1.2.20030505000308.04cac280@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20030505024755.04fd2b50@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >Off-white lace on a white garment would remind me of the new ones I saw in >Mexico, and looked so wrong to me that I wasn't going to do that even if >it did turn out to be period, as we see it has. To me ecru lace on white does have a look of either "don't know historic clothing but just discovered Folkwear patterns" or "poor color discernment." >Meanwhile, I have a Butterick pamphlet from c.1905 which shows an example >of bright coloured peasant embroidery one can do on a white shirtwaist. These blouses don't even have what I'd think of as peasant style embroidery, just the usual satin stitch type florals. Not the lingerie look, but they also had shirtwaist blouses in colors, flannel, taffetas, plaids, what have you. I have a dress made around 1905 that someone made out of a white tablecloth and napkins. Just ordinary damask weave household linens. They used the tablecloth for the skirt and the napkins for the bodice. They did some hand satin stitch embroidery on the bodice, but overall the outfit definitely has a homemade look. Interesting that they did it though. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 18:52:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Mqmqa014908 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 18:52:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45MoEdx018122 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 16:50:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45MoB3g018089; Mon, 5 May 2003 16:50:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail7.kc.rr.com (fe7.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.162.160]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Mo23g017956 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 16:50:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail7.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Mon, 5 May 2003 17:49:13 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030505175208.009f7ad0@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 17:55:22 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others: am I the only happily selfish one? In-Reply-To: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:27 AM 5/5/03 +0100, you wrote: >Okay, to cut a long story short: am I really the only one here who likes >sewing >for herself and having fun (and NOT needing to worry if I might make a mistake >because it is for me and not for someone else, it always drives me mad the >need >to be perfect when making something for someone else) and disliking sewing for >others? Nicole, You're not the only one. I prefer sewing for myself. When I sew for others, I'm always too nit-picky (is that a word?). Sewing for myself is much more fun because I don't have to worry about how it's going to be received, if the fit is just perfect, etc. People sometimes ask me why I don't do my sewing (or my crafts or my gardening or my....etc) for a living. I always tell them that being forced to do it would take the fun out of it for me. Sheryl N-D _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 19:27:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45NRJqa014995 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:27:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45NOSdx025033 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 17:24:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45NOROi013532; Mon, 5 May 2003 17:24:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net (hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45NOOOi013517 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 17:24:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19CpJn-0007V2-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 05 May 2003 16:24:23 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:24:23 -0700 Message-ID: <000401c3135d$76ab2600$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-Reply-To: <20030505141948.36863.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Waaaay Cooool! Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 19:49:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45NnKqa015069 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:49:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45NjBdx028858 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 17:45:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Nj9Oi028586; Mon, 5 May 2003 17:45:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from apollo.gti.net (apollo.gti.net [199.171.27.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h45Nj6Oi028528 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 17:45:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gti.net (ts6m-pool0-74.gti.net [208.216.115.74]) by apollo.gti.net (mail) with ESMTP id 767E0357ED for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:45:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EB6F785.CE1C16F3@gti.net> Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 19:45:09 -0400 From: martyr@gti.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO For attching insertion lace to lightweight fabric like batiste, voile, etc it really helps to use water soluble-(not tear away!!)-stabilizer. It comes in clear, gelatin-like sheets & you use as many layers as necesary to get good crisp stitches. It's by Sulky, I think? & probably others make it too. I also found it helps to use a zigzag stitch rather than straight. That's the method Martha Pullen teaches or whatever. Actually, her website or any of the heirloom sewing sites might be helpful with tips for this kind o sewing. The biggest problem with these materials is they can get sucked into the needle hole in the plate, especially with the zigzag plate with the long slit. Or the feed dogs don't feed the fabric properly. But the stabilizer *really* works & saves a lot of time starching & endlessly pressing which can scorch the fabric if you overdo it..Once you get going with this type of work though, it's pretty much smooth sailing. And BTW, I've seen several lingerie dresses with mixed white & ecru materials, actually it's a pretty effect, especially white fabric with a darker lace, or a pastel peach, pink or blue with ecru lace..looks even prettier than pastels with white IMO. Well, Good luck with your project.. Lisa R. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 20:33:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460X1qa015148 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 20:33:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460Ondx003790 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 18:24:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460Ohm3019781; Mon, 5 May 2003 18:24:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460Oem4019755 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 18:24:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h460PLN1015498 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 20:25:21 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h460PLOl015496 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 5 May 2003 20:25:21 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton Velvet Panels at Target Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 20:25:20 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <009401c31333$4453ac60$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> In-Reply-To: <009401c31333$4453ac60$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305052025.20717.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday 05 May 2003 02:22 pm, lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: > I was just going through my Sunday paper flyers and this appeared in the > Target flyer: > > http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/ref=br_1_3/602-1656132-6657460?asin=B0 >0 008RS93 > > 100% cotton velvet panels - 55 x 84" for $18. I figured that made it > ~$7.75/yd, 54" wide. There are limited colors, but one of them is "natural" > so I imagine it would dye well. The velvet is advertised as machine > washable, so I would also guess that there is no backing on it. I wouldn't bet on it having no backing just because it's machine washable. I used to have cotton curtains that were rubber backed, but were sold as (and actually were) "Machine Washable." -- Cathy Raymond "Intelligence is the ultimate aphrodisiac." Timothy Leary _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 20:57:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460vwqa015209 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 20:57:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460c1dx004746 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 18:38:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460bxm3026139; Mon, 5 May 2003 18:37:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc51.attbi.com (rwcrmhc51.attbi.com [204.127.198.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460bvm3026086 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 18:37:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from c59303a (12-238-186-49.client.attbi.com[12.238.186.49]) by attbi.com (rwcrmhc51) with SMTP id <2003050600375205100jd184e>; Tue, 6 May 2003 00:37:52 +0000 Message-ID: <035001c31367$ba38a6e0$31baee0c@c59303a> From: "chiara" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009401c31333$4453ac60$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> <200305052025.20717.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton Velvet Panels at Target Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 19:37:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I went there today to look at them first hand. They are not backed AND they are not on sale at the stores. They will not honor the sales that are online either. Chiara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:25 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton Velvet Panels at Target : On Monday 05 May 2003 02:22 pm, lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: : > I was just going through my Sunday paper flyers and this appeared in the : > Target flyer: : > : > http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/ref=br_1_3/602-1656132-6657460?asin=B0 : >0 008RS93 : > : > 100% cotton velvet panels - 55 x 84" for $18. I figured that made it : > ~$7.75/yd, 54" wide. There are limited colors, but one of them is "natural" : > so I imagine it would dye well. The velvet is advertised as machine : > washable, so I would also guess that there is no backing on it. : : I wouldn't bet on it having no backing just because it's machine washable. I : used to have cotton curtains that were rubber backed, but were sold as (and : actually were) "Machine Washable." : : : -- : Cathy Raymond : : "Intelligence is the ultimate aphrodisiac." Timothy Leary : _______________________________________________ : h-costume mailing list : h-costume@mail.indra.com : http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 21:10:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h461Aiqa015240 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 21:10:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460x5dx006446 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 18:59:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460x3G3006291; Mon, 5 May 2003 18:59:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scanmail3.cableone.net (scanmail3.cableone.net [24.116.0.123]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h460x0G3006260 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 18:59:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scanmail3.cableone.net ([10.116.0.123]) by scanmail3.cableone.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Mon, 5 May 2003 17:53:24 -0700 Received: from scanmail3.cableone.net [24.116.0.123] by scanmail3.cableone.net (SMTPD32-7.04) id A7845B01A2; Mon, 05 May 2003 17:53:24 -0700 Received: from kimathlon (24-116-185-234.cpe.cableone.net [24.116.185.234]) by mail.cableone.net with SMTP (MailShield v2.04 - WIN32 Jul 17 2001 17:12:42); Mon, 05 May 2003 17:53:24 -0600 From: "Kim Baird" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Cotton Velvet Panels at Target Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 19:59:25 -0500 Message-ID: <000401c3136a$be164ee0$0201a8c0@kimathlon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <035001c31367$ba38a6e0$31baee0c@c59303a> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Importance: Normal X-SMTP-HELO: kimathlon X-SMTP-MAIL-FROM: kbaird@cableone.net X-SMTP-PEER-INFO: 24-116-185-234.cpe.cableone.net [24.116.185.234] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I went to my local Target and bought 2 panels today, on sale. They didn't have much of a selection left. The velveteen is not backed, but it is heavy upholstery weight. Kim in Fargo ND -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of chiara Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:38 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton Velvet Panels at Target I went there today to look at them first hand. They are not backed AND they are not on sale at the stores. They will not honor the sales that are online either. Chiara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:25 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton Velvet Panels at Target : On Monday 05 May 2003 02:22 pm, lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: : > I was just going through my Sunday paper flyers and this appeared in the : > Target flyer: : > : > http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/ref=br_1_3/602-1656132-6657460?asin =B0 : >0 008RS93 : > : > 100% cotton velvet panels - 55 x 84" for $18. I figured that made it : > ~$7.75/yd, 54" wide. There are limited colors, but one of them is "natural" : > so I imagine it would dye well. The velvet is advertised as machine : > washable, so I would also guess that there is no backing on it. : : I wouldn't bet on it having no backing just because it's machine washable. I : used to have cotton curtains that were rubber backed, but were sold as (and : actually were) "Machine Washable." : : : -- : Cathy Raymond : : "Intelligence is the ultimate aphrodisiac." Timothy Leary : _______________________________________________ : h-costume mailing list : h-costume@mail.indra.com : http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 21:49:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h461n5qa015329 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 21:49:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h461cVdx009696 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 19:38:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h461cUG3000931; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:38:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc53.attbi.com (rwcrmhc53.attbi.com [204.127.198.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h461cRG3000874 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:38:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cc632021-b.attbi.com (12-246-76-5.client.attbi.com[12.246.76.5]) by attbi.com (rwcrmhc53) with SMTP id <2003050601382205300q0v7be>; Tue, 6 May 2003 01:38:22 +0000 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505183412.00a671e0@mail.attbi.com> X-Sender: mabse@mail.attbi.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 18:36:13 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: MaryAnn Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? In-Reply-To: <001601c3131e$53a3dba0$6c5183d1@rmitchellras> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey Kathleen, I think that if you really have the best interest of the fabric at heart you should give it to me. I can give it a much better home environment than you can (silliness) maryann At 11:52 AM 5/5/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Greetings, I'm working the 'achieves this AM and have a renewed interest >in what to do with a gorgeous linen piece I found last summer at a flea-market. >It is 14 1/2 inches wide by 11yds + long. The edges bear 3" strips of >stripes enclosing fleur did lis motifs and the center has the same motifs >in two sizes over all. The color is natural and what I might call chalk >white. Damask? Brocade? In any event, it is woven, and rather heavy >weight...like mogushal. >I am open to period; the main concern is that I use it to best advantage >to display this beautiful piece and give it a good historical reference. >Any ideas? > >Kathleen >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 22:07:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46271qa015366 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 22:07:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h461vUdx011161 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 19:57:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h461vOuV010471; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:57:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h461vMuV010417 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:57:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m207.in-tch.com [216.166.191.207]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h461dBD11368 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:39:11 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EB716CF.53D98E0F@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 19:58:39 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] finished my embroidery for the dress. References: <4.3.1.2.20030504145650.05146be0@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yeah. What she said.... -sue Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > >This very moment i just finished the embroidery for the robe francaise. > > >Hope you like it! > > I'm sitting here drooling into my shoe, wondering how human hands can > embroider that precisely, and you only 'hope' we like it? This makes me > wish I could win the lottery and commission such a dress from you, even tho > I have no place to wear one. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 22:19:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h462Jwqa015398 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 22:19:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h462ALdx012115 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 20:10:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h462AKuV016544; Mon, 5 May 2003 20:10:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h462AHuV016501 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 20:10:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m207.in-tch.com [216.166.191.207]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h461q6D17077 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 19:52:06 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EB719D3.EA4E7BD7@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 20:11:31 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] getting started References: <3EB2DE9B.9030909@ripco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I got my hemp cord at: http://www.hemptraders.com/ They have all kinds of hemp products..... --sue, who just has her later-period projects stashed until she gets caught up....;-) zski wrote: > > and it's all Drea's fault! > > I fitted the toile and cut the bodice for my new flemish kirtle today. > This is after spending waaaay too much on sale linen the other day. > > Now I'm off to lok for hemp cord for the new corded corset. > > I can stop costuming any time - I just like the way it tastes! > > Wendy Z > under a huge pile of fabric in > Chicago IL > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 5 23:43:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463hUqa015963 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 23:43:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463Xrdx018296 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 21:33:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463Xnvb022131; Mon, 5 May 2003 21:33:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailrelay.mebtel.net (spambuster4.mebtel.net [64.40.67.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463Xkvb022092 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 21:33:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grics.net (66-79-58-66.dsl.dixnil.grics.net [66.79.58.66]) by mailrelay.mebtel.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E0652818E for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 23:27:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EB73BB6.8040704@grics.net> Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 23:36:06 -0500 From: "H. Law" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sewing for self or others (Long) References: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20030505092709.43836.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO One of the things that drove me out of the sewing biz: Those people who want something "historically accurate" - and then insist on nonperiod details. Like the 10th-c. viking shirt i did for someone - Light colored and with a deep V neckline - In period, a low neckline was for Ladies Only, a man wearing one was considered swishy at best. Then there's the magic robe with the King Tut headdress. Not a historical request and I know it - but I cringed deeply when she said she needed 2 different colors on the "flaps" on both sides of the head. And the front part over the forehead gold, sorta like where they print "Johnson's Feed" on a baseball cap . The rest of the thing had to be white. Finally there was the friend that wanted "just a quick simple robe, just fold it and half, sew down the sides leaving hand holes and a hole for the neck. Quoting her boyfriend I said "S**t don't leave my shop". She said "But I want s***!" Since she was my friend, I did it for her anyhow, for the $10. It only took around 3 hours... i *cannot* do half-a**'d work. Far from perfect, maybe, but not my "second-best". I also run into the same thing doing art stuff. Dearly beloved Grandmother wants another flower on a piece she's crewel embroidering. "Just freehand me something." Like drawing from scratch is *easier* than tracing or copying something else??! Veni, vidi, emi tunicam edwinna N Kipar wrote: >Okay, to cut a long story short: am I really the only one here who likes sewing >for herself and having fun (and NOT needing to worry if I might make a mistake >because it is for me and not for someone else, it always drives me mad the need >to be perfect when making something for someone else) and disliking sewing for >others? > >Nicole - not worried at all about the above, hey, I don't have children coz I >am far too selfish to, so? *G* > >===== >Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > >__________________________________________________ >Yahoo! Plus >For a better Internet experience >http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 00:09:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4649Sqa016006 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 00:09:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463xsdx020134 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 21:59:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463xrC9003621; Mon, 5 May 2003 21:59:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gw.retro.com (gw.retro.com [205.179.181.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463xnC9003606 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 21:59:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by gw.retro.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id h463xBm20308 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 5 May 2003 20:59:12 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 20:59:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Thompson-Herbert Message-Id: <200305060359.h463xBm20308@gw.retro.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO "Lloyd Mitchell" wrote: > Nicole, What Fun! I am interested in how the 'gems' were attached to the > fabric. > Several years ago I was doing costumes for" Mid Summers Night" and for > Oberon's and Titania's costumes tried to do something "like" yours. Spent a > whole day hot gluing the silver pearls and large stones to the collars, > cuffs,belts and etc after using gem cement. Both failed. Then I watched > these pieces diminish trim by the movement at the rehearsal. I"ve always had > a rule in my shop of "NO GLUE" and this experience sure reinforced it. Ended > up with a lot of couching and shiska application, which of course > contributed to the stress of meeting the deadline. For flatback stones, I either use heat-fuse stones or tiffany settings. I bought myself a professional-grade rhinestone setter a couple years ago and it was worth the investment. Among other things, this one has an anvil plate that can be changed out for larger or much smaller stones. The one I've got installed and came with the machine handles anything up to 40ss (8.67mm). For really tiny stones, I'd probably buy the smallest plate just so I didn't have to worry about them skidding around. In about a week, I'll have some photos up of a dress that I did with hologram glitter and tiffany set rhinestones. If you use the tifsets and have either reinforced or use textile paints on the fabric, they're actually machine- washable. If you have to glue stones down, _which_ adhesive you use makes an enormous difference. How you've treated the fabric that's going to hold the stones also can make or break your project. I started out doing bead embroidery and then moved on to learn to sew garments, so this is one of my areas of expertise. Swarovski fusable rhinestones are pretty indestructable, and using double-sided fusable webbing has the same effect (this is how I did the large red stones on the Lady Luck costume). For plastics, you're stuck with less reliable methods or sewing them down if the stones aren't flatbacked or you can't find a setting that will fit the stones. My current favorite adhesive is JonesTones Plexi glue. This is a flexible glue meant for stretch fabrics, essentially a colorless version of their stretch fabric paints. I should also take some photos of the Maman Brigette costume I did a couple years back. I did shisha embroidery on the sleeves, waist and hem guard. The first time I wore the costume, only about half the mirrors were actually firmly sewn down. The rest were glued, then a couple stitches of perl cotton were put across each mirror to hold it in place (essentially the foundation stitching I'd use for shisha). The embroidery has since been finished, so I really ought to drag it out and get photos the same day I do the shoot for the black and silver dress. Shisha is great, but I found out as a teenager to not try it on stretch fabric if you don't have a non-stretch interlining underneath your embroidery. I had mirrors popping off all over the place the first time I wore that dress... [grin] Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 00:10:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h464A1qa016009 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 00:10:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463wmdx020034 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 21:58:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463wjC9003154; Mon, 5 May 2003 21:58:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h463wfC9003118 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 21:58:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (00217146@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.11.5/8.11.5) with ESMTP id h463weM114110 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 22:58:40 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 22:58:40 -0500 (CDT) From: Emma Elizabeth Lehman <00217146@bigred.unl.edu> To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] Russian Ark X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I don't think I blinked for an hour and a half solid while watching this movie. It's not my period and not my area, but the costumes are AMAZING. I strongly recommend you see this movie (though admittedly, with as little knowledge of Russian history as I have, I didn't bother much with the plot and just watched the pretty people go by), on as large a screen as possible. The tagline runs something like this: 2000 actors 300 years of Russian history 17 rooms in the hermatage museum 3 full live orchestras 1 continuous shot. wow. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 01:19:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h465Jsqa016120 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 01:19:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h465Hndx025729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 5 May 2003 23:17:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h465HlEC007339; Mon, 5 May 2003 23:17:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h465HiEC007297 for ; Mon, 5 May 2003 23:17:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEG00H8N9DG3F@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 05 May 2003 22:17:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 21:50:14 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] ?ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-reply-to: <4.3.1.2.20030504150331.00de6c30@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030505214744.02cbaa70@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/2/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 04:12 PM 5/4/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Is there a better way to get my fabric ecru than by the tea dye process? Please, don't use tea. The tannic acid will eventually destroy your fabric, sometimes within a couple of years. I would hate to see your hard work fall apart in a few years time. My friend tea-dyed some fabric for a baby bassinet, and it fell apart in just a few years of careful storage. I have also had some of my first costume chemises fall apart for the same reason. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 03:26:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h467QDqa013678 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 03:26:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h467O9dx003088 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 01:24:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h467O7c7028313; Tue, 6 May 2003 01:24:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h467O3c7028283 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 01:24:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A33E135F008C; Tue, 06 May 2003 02:24:46 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A31F2E85010C; Tue, 06 May 2003 02:24:15 -0500 Message-ID: <004701c313a0$4846cb00$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 03:22:39 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] Official Re-opening X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO We have changed The Costume Gallery's Library http://www.costumegallery.com/research.htm over to a pay site effective immediately. We have added several new articles and image collections over the past couple of months. The index pages can still be accessed for free, the image enlargements with descriptions and fashion articles can only be accessed if you have a Gallery Library Card. Information about obtaining a card can be found at: http://www.costumegallery.com/librarycard.htm , please make sure to read the FAQ section. We have a new beginning is that we have about 30 people working on the Library website. We have a review committee, web development teams, graphic artists, typists, and an editor. Altogether, we hope to build the library into the largest collection of vintage fashion articles from period publications on the web. We have so many articles in production at this moment, I think it would blow some people's minds. We are adding resources to the Library weekly at the moment. NOTE: We are currently having a glitch in the browser Netscape. We are in the process of correcting the problem. All sections of the Library work well in Internet Explorer (IE). Below is a list of some of the new articles and image collections we have added. ***A Year in Fashion: 1804: 8 Paris Fashion Plates: http://www.costumegallery.com/1804/LadiesMagazine/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1828: 8 Parisian Fashion Plates: http://www.costumegallery.com/1828/LadiesMagazine/ **A Year in Fashion: 1838: 7 British Fashion Plates and two fashion reports (one from London, other from Paris) This site will grow to 26 fashion plates and 12 fashion reports. http://www.costumegallery.com/1838/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1882: 11 Peterson's Fashion Plates with descriptions: http://www.costumegallery.com/1882/Petersons/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1882: Funerals and Etiquette. http://www.costumegallery.com/1882/Etiquette/funerals.htm ***1880s: Fashion Colors and Usage: http://www.costumegallery.com/1882/colors.htm This site will be updated continuously as we come across the documentation. We are also making this type of documentation for every decade from 1830-1920s. The 1880 documentation was 40 pages in Word. This is the first part of my long-awaited color documentation. ***A Year in Fashion: 1889: 6 Godey's fashion plates with descriptions and fashion reports for every month of 1889 from Godey's. http://www.costumegallery.com/1889/Godey/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1893: "How Fauntleroy Really Occurred and a Very Real Little Boy Who Became An Ideal One." This story was written by the original author of Little Lord Fauntleroy who patterned the book after her own son. This article is three chapters. http://www.costumegallery.com/1893/LHJ/LLF/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1896: Surf and Bathing Suits: 5 fashion plates with full descriptions. http://www.costumegallery.com/1896/Deline/Swimsuits/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1896: A Bridal Toilette: 6 fashion plates with full descriptions. http://www.costumegallery.com/1896/Deline/Bridal/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1901: Evolution of the Ruff. Large site including: 1902 article about the history of the ruff, a modern day editorial, fashion plates of Victorian/Edwardian Ruffs (12 plates), and Butterick ruff patterns from 1900-1902 (6 patterns with descriptions). http://www.costumegallery.com/Library/1901/Deline/March/Ruffs/evolution.htm ***A Year in Fashion: 1902: Butterick Patterns & Delineator Magazine site. Includes: A 1902 Annual Report from the Butterick Company, an article: "How We Make Paper Patterns" AND another article: "How the Delineator is Made and Published." http://www.costumegallery.com/Library/1902/del/Oct/Butter/annual_report.htm ***A Year in Fashion: 1912: Additions to this popular website includes: Boys' Fashions (6 plates w/descriptions), the Ladies' Spring Shirtwaists (6 plates w/descriptions), Girls' Fashions (7 plates w/descriptions), Ladies' Negligee's (4 plates w/descriptions), AND Toddlers' Fashions (5 plates w/descriptions). http://www.costumegallery.com/Delineator/May_1912/Magazine.htm ***A Year in Fashion: 1921: Color Ladies Fashion Plates (12 total w/ descriptions) http://www.costumegallery.com/Delineator/Sept_1921/Ladies/Dresses/Color/ There is free access to this site because it was covered under the Costume Society of America Grant. ***A Year in Fashion: 1922: Entire Lane Bryant Maternity Catalog including infants wear. This site houses 42 fashion plates with descriptions. http://www.costumegallery.com/1922/Maternity/index.htm There is free access to this site because it was covered under the Costume Society of America Grant. ***A Year in Fashion: 1922: Harmony in Dress book. Currently online four LARGE tables telling you what to wear during given seasons and for special events. This site will vastly expand over the next few weeks to contain the entire book. http://www.costumegallery.com/1922/Color/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1923: Men's Fashion Catalog with fabric swatches. This site houses 10 fashion plates. http://www.costumegallery.com/1923/Men/ ***A Year in Fashion: 1923: Bridal Etiquette. http://www.costumegallery.com/1923/Etiquette/bridal.htm Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 08:04:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46C4Lqa018975 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 08:04:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46C24dx017337 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 06:02:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46C1uL7026814; Tue, 6 May 2003 06:01:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46C1rL7026767 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 06:01:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A0FC26FF0172; Tue, 06 May 2003 07:48:12 -0400 Message-ID: <002f01c313c7$b5f72b00$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505183412.00a671e0@mail.attbi.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 08:04:55 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fat Chance, Mary Ann! And if you were to receive such a largesse, what would you make of it? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "MaryAnn Jones" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:36 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? > Hey Kathleen, I think that if you really have the best interest of the > fabric at heart you should give it to me. I can give it a much > better home environment than you can (silliness) maryann > > At 11:52 AM 5/5/2003 -0400, you wrote: > >Greetings, I'm working the 'achieves this AM and have a renewed interest > >in what to do with a gorgeous linen piece I found last summer at a flea-market. > >It is 14 1/2 inches wide by 11yds + long. The edges bear 3" strips of > >stripes enclosing fleur did lis motifs and the center has the same motifs > >in two sizes over all. The color is natural and what I might call chalk > >white. Damask? Brocade? In any event, it is woven, and rather heavy > >weight...like mogushal. > >I am open to period; the main concern is that I use it to best advantage > >to display this beautiful piece and give it a good historical reference. > >Any ideas? > > > >Kathleen > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 08:12:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CCoqa019028 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 08:12:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CASdx017843 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 06:10:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CARL7000424; Tue, 6 May 2003 06:10:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CAPL7000383 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 06:10:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A2FC27260172; Tue, 06 May 2003 07:56:44 -0400 Message-ID: <003701c313c8$e6b1ba20$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EB2DE9B.9030909@ripco.com> <3EB719D3.EA4E7BD7@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] getting started Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 08:13:23 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And I just received my samples of Hemp Summer cloth ($9.75) and silk and hemp($12.95) from DHarma. Great possibilities. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:11 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] getting started > I got my hemp cord at: > http://www.hemptraders.com/ > They have all kinds of hemp products..... > --sue, who just has her later-period projects stashed until she gets > caught up....;-) > > zski wrote: > > > > and it's all Drea's fault! > > > > I fitted the toile and cut the bodice for my new flemish kirtle today. > > This is after spending waaaay too much on sale linen the other day. > > > > Now I'm off to lok for hemp cord for the new corded corset. > > > > I can stop costuming any time - I just like the way it tastes! > > > > Wendy Z > > under a huge pile of fabric in > > Chicago IL > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 08:25:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CP2qa019071 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 08:25:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CMwdx018505 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 06:22:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CMvL7005360; Tue, 6 May 2003 06:22:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CMtL7005335 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 06:22:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A5EAF7801B4; Tue, 06 May 2003 08:09:14 -0400 Message-ID: <003d01c313ca$a5ddbd80$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305060359.h463xBm20308@gw.retro.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 08:25:53 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you for the additional info on attachments. I will file it with Nicole's. Ive used the gem setter on more delicate stuff myself and have honed the method to good advantage. I guess that i've been too pressed for time to do things over when it comes to glue and thus the No Glue rule has kept me somewhat uneducated in keeping up with new and improved products. The idea of using those plant marbles for jewels is what caught my attention ! One of my projects for the lolling summer is re setting rhinestones in a sweet crown I found while traveling in March.It is suffering with the results of poor settings in the recent past. I'd swear that they were stuck in with rubber cement. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lee Thompson-Herbert" To: Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 11:59 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) > > "Lloyd Mitchell" wrote: > > Nicole, What Fun! I am interested in how the 'gems' were attached to the > > fabric. > > Several years ago I was doing costumes for" Mid Summers Night" and for > > Oberon's and Titania's costumes tried to do something "like" yours. Spent a > > whole day hot gluing the silver pearls and large stones to the collars, > > cuffs,belts and etc after using gem cement. Both failed. Then I watched > > these pieces diminish trim by the movement at the rehearsal. I"ve always had > > a rule in my shop of "NO GLUE" and this experience sure reinforced it. Ended > > up with a lot of couching and shiska application, which of course > > contributed to the stress of meeting the deadline. > > For flatback stones, I either use heat-fuse stones or tiffany settings. > I bought myself a professional-grade rhinestone setter a couple years ago > and it was worth the investment. Among other things, this one has an anvil > plate that can be changed out for larger or much smaller stones. The one > I've got installed and came with the machine handles anything up to 40ss > (8.67mm). For really tiny stones, I'd probably buy the smallest plate just > so I didn't have to worry about them skidding around. > > In about a week, I'll have some photos up of a dress that I did with hologram > glitter and tiffany set rhinestones. If you use the tifsets and have either > reinforced or use textile paints on the fabric, they're actually machine- > washable. If you have to glue stones down, _which_ adhesive you use makes > an enormous difference. How you've treated the fabric that's going to hold > the stones also can make or break your project. I started out doing bead > embroidery and then moved on to learn to sew garments, so this is one of my > areas of expertise. Swarovski fusable rhinestones are pretty indestructable, > and using double-sided fusable webbing has the same effect (this is how I did > the large red stones on the Lady Luck costume). For plastics, you're stuck > with less reliable methods or sewing them down if the stones aren't flatbacked > or you can't find a setting that will fit the stones. My current favorite > adhesive is JonesTones Plexi glue. This is a flexible glue meant for stretch > fabrics, essentially a colorless version of their stretch fabric paints. > > I should also take some photos of the Maman Brigette costume I did a couple > years back. I did shisha embroidery on the sleeves, waist and hem guard. > The first time I wore the costume, only about half the mirrors were actually > firmly sewn down. The rest were glued, then a couple stitches of perl cotton > were put across each mirror to hold it in place (essentially the foundation > stitching I'd use for shisha). The embroidery has since been finished, so > I really ought to drag it out and get photos the same day I do the shoot for > the black and silver dress. Shisha is great, but I found out as a teenager > to not try it on stretch fabric if you don't have a non-stretch interlining > underneath your embroidery. I had mirrors popping off all over the place > the first time I wore that dress... [grin] > > Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 > Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris > Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. > "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 09:49:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Dnqqa019363 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 09:49:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Dktdx024405 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 07:46:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46DkrSQ010600; Tue, 6 May 2003 07:46:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46DkoSQ010557 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 07:46:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be73.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.115]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 4137947FFCA for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 15:46:48 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000b01c313d6$9fe63860$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 15:51:41 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] fashion prints X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. I had emailed Museum of Costume, Bath asking them if it would be allowed to take photos of Galleries des Modes et Costumes Francaises from 1778 - 1789. Unfortunately they only had one fashion print from the above issues. But she told me that they did allow to take photos of the prints. This i will go and show the danish Museum og Fine Arts, they have the whole series and i would give a lot to be allowed to take photos of it. Many greetings Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 10:31:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46EVAqa019473 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:31:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46EVQdx029152 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 08:31:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46EVPhW005426; Tue, 6 May 2003 08:31:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46CUBL7007816 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 06:30:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A79A27710172; Tue, 06 May 2003 08:16:26 -0400 Message-ID: <005601c313cb$a761d000$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "H-Costume" Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 08:33:08 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0052_01C313AA.1F75FCA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 06 May 2003 08:31:23 -0600 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Fw: Call for Doilies X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0052_01C313AA.1F75FCA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Some of you might like to respond to this. Akiko is a wonderful textile = artist in her own right and is now doing some interesting works like = this with museums. Kathleen ----- Original Message -----=20 From: stitches=20 To: stitches@pittsburgharts.org=20 Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:34 PM Subject: Call for Doilies please disseminate Call for Doilies deadline: aug 18, 2003 Stitches That Heal an installation by: Akiko Kotani Please help me collect 2,000 doilies both traditional and = non-traditional, not more than 12" in diameter, for an installation with = an opening on Sept 12, 5:30 to 8pm and continues to Nov 12, 2003 at the = Pittsburgh Center for the Arts. This collaboration to collect doilies by = people from many nations is to show the healing power of making doilies = and the stories they tell. Send each item with your name, address, phone, email, a stamped return = envelope to : Stitches that Heal, Pittsburgh Center for the Arts, 6300 = Fifth Ave, Pittsburgh, PA 15232.=20 More information available at: www.pittsburgharts.org = stitches@pittsburgarts.org ------=_NextPart_000_0052_01C313AA.1F75FCA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ------=_NextPart_000_0052_01C313AA.1F75FCA0-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 10:49:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Enrqa019554 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:49:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46EnYdx001310 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 08:49:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46EnXhW016224; Tue, 6 May 2003 08:49:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web40906.mail.yahoo.com (web40906.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.203]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h46EnUhW016152 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 08:49:30 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030506144925.47646.qmail@web40906.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [12.104.32.34] by web40906.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 07:49:25 PDT Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 07:49:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Tasha McGann To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305061433.h46EWxhY006328@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Russian Ark X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Emma wrote: The tagline runs something like this: 2000 actors 300 years of Russian history 17 rooms in the hermatage museum 3 full live orchestras 1 continuous shot. I respond: I was fortunate enough to visit the Hermitage in 1991 and remember our tour guide telling us that if we spend something like 10 seconds in front of each work of art in it, it would take 9 years to complete the rounds, or something like that. :^) It seemed to me at the time that the Hermitage is more of an homage to the West than it is to native Russian culture, but who's complaining? Thank you for reminding me of this movie! I've always had a soft spot for Russian art/architecture/history and must remember to get my hands on this gem. :^) -Tasha __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 11:18:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46FIdqa020059 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 11:18:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46FA4gd003696 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 09:13:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46ExnOW023083; Tue, 6 May 2003 08:59:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20204.mail.yahoo.com (web20204.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h46ExYOW022838 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 08:59:35 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030506145933.41339.qmail@web20204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 07:59:33 PDT Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 07:59:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Some of the lace I purchased for my wedding dress is too bright of a white, so I planned to tone it down by tea dyeing it. However, when I was looking for some pointers on just how to do this (I've never actually tried it yet), I kept seeing people say how the tannic acid in tea can be damaging to fabrics. Since this is for an "heirloom-quality" piece, and I plan to take precautions like storing it in an acid-free box, I do want to be cautious about this. So I'm hoping one of you knows something more about how much of a risk this is. Can the acid be rinsed out by a thorough rinsing after dyeing? Soap? Multiple washings? Once the dye is set, do multiple washings fade the color? What about that commercial "tea dye" color that Dylon makes? Thanks- Angela __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 11:35:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46FZOqa020274 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 11:35:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46FY8dx006613 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 09:34:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46FY7OW017619; Tue, 6 May 2003 09:34:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20706.mail.yahoo.com (web20706.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.179]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h46FY5OW017607 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 09:34:06 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030506153405.4098.qmail@web20706.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [142.166.234.142] by web20706.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 11:34:05 EDT Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 11:34:05 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030506145933.41339.qmail@web20204.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Angela,in response to your question about tea dying lace there are a few points I would like to make.1- if your lace is cotton it is much better to use a fiber reactive dye than tea. The tannins in tea are terrible nasty things. In using fiber reactive dyes ( like dylon) you will acheive more uniform results and the risk of bleeding onto other fabrics is minimized. I would recommend that you purchase a dye like Procion mx for the best results. try Dharma Trading, or pro Chemical and Dye ( both have websites) 2- If your lace is not a natural fiber then the chances of you getting good dye result is slim to none.3- have fun, and experiment lots good luckliz haines Angela Kovatch wrote:Some of the lace I purchased for my wedding dress is too bright of a white, so I planned to tone it down by tea dyeing it. However, when I was looking for some pointers on just how to do this (I've never actually tried it yet), I kept seeing people say how the tannic acid in tea can be damaging to fabrics. Since this is for an "heirloom-quality" piece, and I plan to take precautions like storing it in an acid-free box, I do want to be cautious about this. So I'm hoping one of you knows something more about how much of a risk this is. Can the acid be rinsed out by a thorough rinsing after dyeing? Soap? Multiple washings? Once the dye is set, do multiple washings fade the color? What about that commercial "tea dye" color that Dylon makes? Thanks- Angela __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 12:00:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46G0Xqa020342 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:00:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46G0ddx009821 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 10:00:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46G0cII006089; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:00:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe35.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.92]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46G0YII005961 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:00:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 6 May 2003 09:00:29 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe35.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 06 May 2003 16:00:28 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030506145933.41339.qmail@web20204.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 11:59:55 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 May 2003 16:00:29.0099 (UTC) FILETIME=[9D6CA7B0:01C313E8] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > So I'm hoping one of you knows something more about > how much of a risk this is. Can the acid be rinsed > out by a thorough rinsing after dyeing? Soap? Remembering my chemistry courses here - acid or bases are very easy to rinse out with plain water. Also, since most soaps are bases it would neutralize the acid. However, I suspect that rinsing the stuff out would not change the weakening of the fiber here. I have two hypotheses for this: 1- The damage might be done while dyeing and be irreversible 2- Some chemical component having nothing to do with the fact that it's acidic might get fused to the fabric and react with time, weakening it. I don't know enough about tannic acid to give you a real answer, except that given the number of warnings against this, I would not tea dye if you want to keep it for a long time. > What about that commercial > "tea dye" color that Dylon makes? It will probably damage the fabric much less than real tea would. I'd go for "real" dye, just to be on the safe side. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 12:03:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46G37qa020351 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:03:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46G3Rdx010186 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 10:03:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46G3QII007954; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:03:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f112.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.112]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46G3MII007850 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:03:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 6 May 2003 09:03:17 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.226 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 16:03:16 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.226] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 16:03:16 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 May 2003 16:03:17.0148 (UTC) FILETIME=[0196E5C0:01C313E9] Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You've convinced me! I also spent a good amount of time reading through the web site. I am really excited to go. There are a lot of classes that are not historical in nature and I think I will focus on those and learn some new things. Heather, I saw that you are listed as a teacher. Too bad about the scheduling conflict, I was really looking forward to meeting you in person. I'm actually a fan. I check into Sew Hip it Hurts every now and then to see if anything is new. I'm a fashion design student right now, so I kind of have this imagined kin-ship with you. So anyway, Costume College, here I come!!!! Whooo-hooo!!! :) jessica _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 12:17:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GHQqa020375 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:17:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GHedx011855 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 10:17:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GHdII017909; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:17:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h46GHZII017850 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:17:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 31134 invoked from network); 6 May 2003 16:17:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail1.inreach.com) (209.142.2.50) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 6 May 2003 16:17:35 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Tue, 6 May 2003 09:17:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <54173.162.119.64.111.1052237855.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 09:17:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College From: To: In-Reply-To: References: X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > You've convinced me! I also spent a good amount of time reading through > the web site. I am really excited to go. There are a lot of classes > that are not historical in nature and I think I will focus on those and > learn some new things. > > Heather, I saw that you are listed as a teacher. Too bad about the > scheduling conflict, I was really looking forward to meeting you in > person. I'm actually a fan. I check into Sew Hip it Hurts every now > and then to see if anything is new. I'm a fashion design student right > now, so I kind of have this imagined kin-ship with you. > > So anyway, Costume College, here I come!!!! Whooo-hooo!!! > > :) jessica Hey Jessica, I will be going for the first time, also. I just sent in my registration fee. It would be fun for the H-costume folks to get together there, don't you think? Maybe as the time gets closer we can organize something.... Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 12:43:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GhVqa020424 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:43:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GfCdx014646 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 10:41:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Gf6II004775; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:41:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailsite.netdefender.net (mail.netdefender.com [63.220.97.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Gf2II004696 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:41:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from netdefender.com (unverified [63.220.97.2]) by mailsite.netdefender.net for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:36:22 -0400 Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 12:41:01 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Jennifer Loggans To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030506145933.41339.qmail@web20204.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <859B3012-7FE1-11D7-B486-000393195F42@netdefender.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday, May 6, 2003, at 10:59 AM, Angela Kovatch wrote: > What about that commercial > "tea dye" color that Dylon makes? > > Thanks- > Angela > YMMV, but I tried this once on some handkerchief linen (in the washing machine) and ended up with a rather bright pinky-peach color. Not at all what I was expecting. Since I figured that I'd never use it at that color, after it dried I ran it back through the machine with some Rit dye remover. Oddly enough, I got the color I wanted. I'd definitely do a test run if you plan to do this. --jen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 12:44:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GiCqa020430 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:44:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Gfqdx014758 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 10:41:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GfqII005360; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:41:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.210]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GfnII005322 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:41:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from modem-2538.lion.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.169.234] helo=lance5) by cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 19D5Vk-0004Hx-Jj for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 06 May 2003 17:41:49 +0100 From: "Freyalyn Close-Hainsworth" To: Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 17:45:23 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <200305061433.h46EWxhZ006328@net.indra.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [h-cost] Dyeing with tea X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I dyed the dupion silk for my wedding dress with tea in 1992, and it's still perfectly strong (I've just been and tugged the fabric, and I dissembled the dress to remake earlier this year with no problems whatsoever). (Don't ask me when it will be remade....) However, I first machine boil-washed the fabric, then soaked it in several gallons of cold tea in the bath, then boil-washed it again twice before drying, ironing and making up. The silk was originally off-white in colour. It took me a year to make the dress, what with the vast amounts of bias Celtic applique in dark green on the gold of the silk. It took my mother at least that long to recover from me chucking the silk in the machine and 'abusing' it. Freyalyn the Fleecily Fabulous _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 13:00:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46H0Hqa020496 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:00:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Gw4dx016988 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 10:58:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Gw3El017586; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:58:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46GvxEl017532 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 10:58:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.135] (pm4-135.eos.net [205.133.149.135]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA09504 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:57:58 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 12:53:13 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305051734.h45HYFID000919@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: Nicole's costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole: I love your empress costume! What fun! It reminds me of my favorite "historically inspired" movie costumes, the ones that are so much fun to analyze. I can see why you say you have fun sewing. Maybe I should try something like that and see if it would be fun for me, too. How did you make the crown? I remember your asking about how the Iron Crown was made, now that I see it. Is it just cardboard, for a one-time use? Or did you manage to figure out a way to make it durable? It's lovely. Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 13:13:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46HD3qa020535 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:13:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46HApdx018530 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 11:10:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46HAoEl027473; Tue, 6 May 2003 11:10:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net (hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46HAmEl027427 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 11:10:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19D5xn-0003U8-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 06 May 2003 10:10:47 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 10:10:47 -0700 Message-ID: <000501c313f2$702f3060$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <20030506153405.4098.qmail@web20706.mail.yahoo.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ~2- If your lace is not a natural fiber then the chances of you getting good dye result is ~slim to none. [Sg:] Oh! Not to be contentious, but this is not true! Lots of doll people dye lace all the time and most have synthetic components. If someone does not lead you to a source, I will ask my doll group for you. Please email me off list and remove the h-cost from the header. (Otherwise it may get lost in the email pile!) Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 13:43:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Hh1qa020652 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:43:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46He7dx022144 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 11:40:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46He5El020131; Tue, 6 May 2003 11:40:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46He3El020090 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 11:40:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEH00H6Q7QP7M@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 06 May 2003 10:40:02 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 10:34:40 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid In-reply-to: <20030506145933.41339.qmail@web20204.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030506102657.02cbaa70@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/6/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 07:59 AM 5/6/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I kept seeing people say how the tannic >acid in tea can be damaging to fabrics. As I mentioned re: the ecru lace issue, my experience has been that tea-dying weakens the fibers so that over time the item fell apart more quickly than if I hadn't tea-dyed. This was with cotton fibers, and the chemise (for ren faire) was washed many times. It fell apart much faster than the cotton skirts that I had chemically dyed, and they were made of the same cotton muslin and washed at the same time (but separate loads). Hence my belief that it was the tea dying, as in almost all respects they were similar materials and handled, worn and washed similarly (warm water and regular detergent). And yes, tea dying does fade after a several washings (and being in the sun), so it had to be reset with more tea dye. Chemical dyes will rinse off for a bit, unless set with mordants (it's been so long, was it alum I used? Salt? Vinegar? I can't remember). Anyway, a good dye book can tell you what you need. My suggestion is to learn about chemical dyes. Dharma Trading's company is great in answering questions, and giving you suggested books on dying materials. I haven't dyed fabric or wool skeins in many years, but plan on returning to this fun activity this summer once I have more space in the garage and my spinning wheel up and running. Have fun with your project! Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 13:48:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Hm0qa020670 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:48:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Hjidx022772 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 11:45:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46HjiEl024266; Tue, 6 May 2003 11:45:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com ([216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h46HjeEl024230 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 11:45:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 8006 invoked from network); 6 May 2003 18:27:02 -0000 Received: from 66-44-40-149.s149.apx1.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.40.149) by shada.com with SMTP; 6 May 2003 18:27:02 -0000 Message-ID: <3EB7E990.4090306@oldwaylane.net> Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 12:57:52 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College References: <20030505191817.17092.qmail@web80102.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20030505191817.17092.qmail@web80102.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dawn Jacobson wrote: > BTW, Janet is the person in the gold Dior ballgown on > p. 10 of the CostumeCon photos. Yes, that's her. She won Best in Show for the Historic Competition! It's a truly beautiful dress with all the lace, sequins, beading and general glitz. Very impressive. -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 14:08:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46I8pqa020742 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:08:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46I6Xdx025198 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 12:06:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46I6V7T010316; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:06:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20703.mail.yahoo.com (web20703.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.176]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h46I6S7T010279 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:06:29 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030506180627.84786.qmail@web20703.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [198.164.251.155] by web20703.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 14:06:27 EDT Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 14:06:27 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <859B3012-7FE1-11D7-B486-000393195F42@netdefender.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO hi again, the basis for my comments about non natural fibers is that if she wants to have even dye saturation and little rub off she will have trouble . The dyes will sit on the surface of nylons and polyesters as compared with true reaction and absorption with natural fibers. Nylon and polyester are essentially smooth monofilament fibers and are non absorbant.Wheras cotton is a very absorbant fiber with great dying properties, especially when using good dyes, proper mordants and lots of attention to detail. the best dyes for cottons are indeed procion fiberreactives, using soda ash and urea, as well as salt to fix the dyes. All are available at dharma and pro chem, and I'm sure many other places that I don't Know about.Dharma has a great staff and are always open to weird and wonderful questions. As I work with antique textiles in my job , I highly recommend that you avoid using any "natural" dyestuffs as the mordants required for these dye are extremely damaging to fibers.! If your lace is silk this is EXTREMELY important. I would recommend using procion h or a good quality acid dye for silk. One dye I like is Jacquard liquids. They have the benefit of a liquid dye set eliminating the need for seaming as is normally required when dying silkgood luck and happy dyeing'liz hainesJennifer Loggans wrote: On Tuesday, May 6, 2003, at 10:59 AM, Angela Kovatch wrote: > What about that commercial > "tea dye" color that Dylon makes? > > Thanks- > Angela > YMMV, but I tried this once on some handkerchief linen (in the washing machine) and ended up with a rather bright pinky-peach color. Not at all what I was expecting. Since I figured that I'd never use it at that color, after it dried I ran it back through the machine with some Rit dye remover. Oddly enough, I got the color I wanted. I'd definitely do a test run if you plan to do this. --jen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 14:25:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46IPYqa020783 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:25:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46INPdx027236 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 12:23:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46INN7T022259; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:23:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r08.mx.aol.com (imo-r08.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.104]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46INL7T022168 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:23:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.1ec.82af290 (17526) for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:23:05 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1ec.82af290.2be95789@aol.com> Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 14:23:05 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Russian Ark To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10629 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/6/2003 10:52:58 AM Eastern Daylight Time, demontsegur@yahoo.com writes: > Thank you for reminding me of this movie! I've always > had a soft spot for Russian art/architecture/history > and must remember to get my hands on this gem. :^) > > It is a very interesting film. Not like anything you've seen before. It's like a dream....confusing sometimes, boring sometimes, astonishing sometimes, rapturously beautiful most the time. It's full of "little stories" that are curiously poignant and never explained: A blind woman feeling a statue....and knowing all about the paintings she's never[?] seen. An old dancer [from the Kirov?] who comes to dance for her favorite paintings. A man making coffins during "the war with Germany". Many great images: Catherine II running out into a snow covered courtyard with a servant running after with her cloak. A group of teenage dancers in costume running and giggling down the corridor to see Nicholas and Alexandra's children..... I'm not sure if the film "works" [whatever that means] but is well worth a look. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 14:37:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Ib5qa020811 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:37:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46IYVdx028521 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 12:34:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46IYT7T001785; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:34:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from tungsten.btinternet.com (tungsten.btinternet.com [194.73.73.81]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46IYN7T001670 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 12:34:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host217-36-6-33.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.36.6.33] helo=dan) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19D7Gf-0007mI-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 06 May 2003 19:34:21 +0100 Message-ID: <008101c313fe$14ee7a60$210624d9@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030505191817.17092.qmail@web80102.mail.yahoo.com> <3EB7E990.4090306@oldwaylane.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 19:34:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Judy wrote: > > BTW, Janet is the person in the gold Dior ballgown on > > p. 10 of the CostumeCon photos. > > Yes, that's her. She won Best in Show for the Historic > Competition! It's a truly beautiful dress with all the lace, > sequins, beading and general glitz. Very impressive. Well, I suspect that I am not the only person who thought that Judy Mitchell should have won Best in Show for the Historic Competition, though she's far too modest, and nice, to think so! And having brooded over why I wasn't impressed with the Diorama gown, when others obviously were, I concluded that it fell between two stools. Some of the trimmings were far too tacky for Dior, and thus one couldn't wear it to the sort of occasion one would wear a Dior ballgown to, and viewed as a stage costume it didn't really make it to the heights which would be expected on the London stage, in the West End, at any rate. So for me Judy was undoubtedly the outstanding competitor. Of course, the previous weekend I'd seen Bjarne's 18th century gentleman's suit, in all its glory, which rather overshadowed anything in the glamour stakes... best wishes Stevie slowly emerging from travel-induced brain death _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 15:09:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46J9rqa020864 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 15:09:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46J7Ydx002348 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 13:07:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46J7WwK025593; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:07:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46J7QwK025502 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:07:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be73.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.115]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id E053B5EE1E0 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:07:24 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000901c31402$b81acc80$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030505191817.17092.qmail@web80102.mail.yahoo.com><3EB7E990.4090306@oldwaylane.net> <008101c313fe$14ee7a60$210624d9@dan> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 21:07:20 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Stevie. Oh thankyou for those words, this was very kind of you. So, you went to costume con. Were you just looking, or did you have any things to show there? When i close my eyes, i can still hear the music and se all the wonderfull costumes from Bath. I am so glad, that you perhaps would like to come next year with Bella. James has asked me to make him a new suit! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 8:34 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College > Judy wrote: > > > > BTW, Janet is the person in the gold Dior ballgown on > > > p. 10 of the CostumeCon photos. > > > > Yes, that's her. She won Best in Show for the Historic > > Competition! It's a truly beautiful dress with all the lace, > > sequins, beading and general glitz. Very impressive. > > Well, I suspect that I am not the only person who thought that Judy > Mitchell should have won Best in Show for the Historic Competition, > though she's far too modest, and nice, to think so! > And having brooded over why I wasn't impressed with the Diorama gown, > when others obviously were, I concluded that it fell between two > stools. Some of the trimmings were far too tacky for Dior, and thus > one couldn't wear it to the sort of occasion one would wear a Dior > ballgown to, and viewed as a stage costume it didn't really make it to > the heights which would be expected on the London stage, in the West > End, at any rate. So for me Judy was undoubtedly the outstanding > competitor. > Of course, the previous weekend I'd seen Bjarne's 18th century > gentleman's suit, in all its glory, which rather overshadowed anything > in the glamour stakes... > > best wishes > Stevie > slowly emerging from travel-induced brain death > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 15:37:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Jbmqa020919 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 15:37:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46JX6dx005147 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 13:33:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46JX4wK014342; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:33:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r02.mx.aol.com (imo-r02.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.98]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46JX0wK014244 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:33:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from PallasAMK@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.2b.3f21251d (15862) for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 15:32:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aol.com (mow-m30.webmail.aol.com [64.12.137.7]) by air-id06.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id MAILINID61-3df63eb80ddd33; Tue, 06 May 2003 15:32:46 2000 Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 19:32:45 +0000 From: PallasAMK@aol.com To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <5524EBFA.2070F293.02708BA2@aol.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: Re: Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Jumping in from lurk mode... Just FYI, Janet Anderson, while still involved in Costume College and the Costumers' Guild West, which puts on CC, has not been dean for several years. It is a rotating position--this year's dean is Laura Rico, and CGW president is Darla Kruger. I held out for years not going because I thought most classes were oriented toward beginners, but I have to say that it's some of the most costume fun I get all year--and for someone interested in historical costuming, like me, it's a great chance to learn from serious heavyweights like Edward Maeder and Sally Queen. Also, it's given me a chance to dabble in eras outside my usual areas of interest, not to mention the odd fabulous tip or two. I mean, I learned to tambor bead there last year, and it was the answer to my prayers, since I LOATHE hand work. My '20s repros have all benefitted from that, as has my sanity. Plus not having a Masquerade competition as most of the Cons do means that fewer people end up trapped in their hotel rooms caught up in last-minute sewing, and can actually get out and about. Pallas _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 15:59:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Jxxqa020972 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 15:59:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46JvZdx008002 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 13:57:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46JvWWn001609; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:57:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46JvSWn001462 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 13:57:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A07119F01D0; Tue, 06 May 2003 15:43:45 -0400 Message-ID: <001601c3140a$261eff60$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030506145933.41339.qmail@web20204.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 16:00:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You might consult with the folk at dharma for a safe alternative...especially for the heirloom future of you gown. I have found them most helpful for suggestions on solving specific problems. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela Kovatch" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 10:59 AM Subject: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid > Some of the lace I purchased for my wedding dress is > too bright of a white, so I planned to tone it down by > tea dyeing it. However, when I was looking for some > pointers on just how to do this (I've never actually > tried it yet), I kept seeing people say how the tannic > acid in tea can be damaging to fabrics. Since this is > for an "heirloom-quality" piece, and I plan to take > precautions like storing it in an acid-free box, I do > want to be cautious about this. > > So I'm hoping one of you knows something more about > how much of a risk this is. Can the acid be rinsed > out by a thorough rinsing after dyeing? Soap? > Multiple washings? Once the dye is set, do multiple > washings fade the color? What about that commercial > "tea dye" color that Dylon makes? > > Thanks- > Angela > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 16:55:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46KtBqa021333 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 16:55:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46KkGdx013969 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 14:46:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46KkFWn006751; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:46:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com ([216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h46KkBWn006720 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:46:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 17941 invoked from network); 6 May 2003 21:27:33 -0000 Received: from 66-44-105-207.s969.apx2.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.105.207) by shada.com with SMTP; 6 May 2003 21:27:33 -0000 Message-ID: <3EB813E0.7020508@oldwaylane.net> Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 15:58:24 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College References: <20030505191817.17092.qmail@web80102.mail.yahoo.com> <3EB7E990.4090306@oldwaylane.net> <008101c313fe$14ee7a60$210624d9@dan> In-Reply-To: <008101c313fe$14ee7a60$210624d9@dan> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stevie Gamble wrote: > Well, I suspect that I am not the only person who thought that Judy > Mitchell should have won Best in Show for the Historic Competition, gee, thank you very much! Although getting best in class is quite an achievement for me. :-D Some of the trimmings were far too tacky for Dior, and thus > one couldn't wear it to the sort of occasion one would wear a Dior > ballgown to, and viewed as a stage costume it didn't really make it to > the heights which would be expected on the London stage, in the West > End, at any rate. But consider: Janet was also entering in the Interpretation category which has a bit more leverage. I was in the Recreation category. My aim, when I do something like this, is to try to be as accurate as possible (if there were a time machine) to be able to walk down the street at that time and not stand out. So we were looking two different ways. > Of course, the previous weekend I'd seen Bjarne's 18th century > gentleman's suit, in all its glory, which rather overshadowed anything > in the glamour stakes... > Ah yes, well, Bjarne would blow us all out of the water! -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 17:24:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46LOsqa021470 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 17:24:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46LHbdx017773 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 15:17:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46LHYwC029477; Tue, 6 May 2003 15:17:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46LHTwC029396 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 15:17:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 300117AB73 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:17:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 73053-08 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:16:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-207-101-206.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.207.101.206]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 547877AB96 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 14:16:52 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 14:17:15 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EB813E0.7020508@oldwaylane.net> Message-Id: <1C7A9DE2-8008-11D7-98DF-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I must admit, I was confused by Janet hair in the photo. I thought the gown was lovely, but wouldn't it have had at least some decoration in the form of hair accessories? On Tuesday, May 6, 2003, at 12:58 PM, Judy Mitchell wrote: > Stevie Gamble wrote: > >> Well, I suspect that I am not the only person who thought that Judy >> Mitchell should have won Best in Show for the Historic Competition, > > gee, thank you very much! Although getting best in class is > quite an achievement for me. :-D > > Some of the trimmings were far too tacky for Dior, and thus >> one couldn't wear it to the sort of occasion one would wear a Dior >> ballgown to, and viewed as a stage costume it didn't really make it to >> the heights which would be expected on the London stage, in the West >> End, at any rate. > But consider: Janet was also entering in the Interpretation category > which has a bit more leverage. I was in the Recreation category. My > aim, when I do something like this, is to try to be as accurate as > possible (if there were a time machine) to be able to walk down the > street at that time and not stand out. So we were looking two > different ways. > > >> Of course, the previous weekend I'd seen Bjarne's 18th century >> gentleman's suit, in all its glory, which rather overshadowed anything >> in the glamour stakes... >> > Ah yes, well, Bjarne would blow us all out of the water! > > -Judy Mitchell > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 18:39:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46MdMqa021784 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 18:39:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46MCudx023394 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 16:12:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46MCraj008102; Tue, 6 May 2003 16:12:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20206.mail.yahoo.com (web20206.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h46MCoaj008062 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 16:12:51 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030506221250.26110.qmail@web20206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 15:12:50 PDT Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 15:12:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030506102657.02cbaa70@127.0.0.1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Kimiko Small wrote: > > As I mentioned re: the ecru lace issue, I haven't read this thread yet, but I will now. Y'all are making me a little nervous. I talked to someone at Dharma about dyeing the rayon, and she recommended their Procion dye, but couldn't speak to its long-term stability. Does anyone have a good source for silk lace? I'm guessing if I could just get silk it would match close enough without my messing with it, and the stuff I bought (2" wide venise) is gorgeous but so cheap I wouldn't mind buying other stuff instead. -Angela __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 18:42:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Mgkqa021792 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 18:42:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46MTIdx024878 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 16:29:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46MTGaj019100; Tue, 6 May 2003 16:29:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46MTBaj019027 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 16:29:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (00217146@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.11.5/8.11.5) with ESMTP id h46MTBr371794 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 17:29:11 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 17:29:11 -0500 (CDT) From: Emma Elizabeth Lehman <00217146@bigred.unl.edu> To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dyeing with tea In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I dyed the dupion silk for my wedding dress with tea in 1992, and it's still > perfectly strong (I've just been and tugged the fabric, and I dissembled the > dress to remake earlier this year with no problems whatsoever). (Don't ask > me when it will be remade....) Yes, but silk takes dye differently than other fibers. Quickie textile science lesson! Silk and wool are protein fibers. They respond well to acidic dyes. They are weakened by bases. That's one reason to be careful when washing silks and wools with soap, because soaps are slightly basic. This is also why (or so I'm told) saris are rinsed in vinegar after they've been washed. A little acid to counteract the potentially damaging soap. Cotton, linen and rayon are cellulosic fibers. They respond well to fiber-reactive dyes, which usually (always?) include some sort of basic solution. Cellulosics are damaged by acids, which is why you can use acids to burn out silk-back/rayon pile velvets. emma _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 19:29:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46NT8qa021925 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 19:29:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46NOQdx000826 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 17:24:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46NOOu3025062; Tue, 6 May 2003 17:24:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46NOMu3025048 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 17:24:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 208-58-250-192.s446.tnt1.nwhv.ct.dialup.rcn.com ([208.58.250.192] helo=rcn.com) by smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19DBnJ-0006dE-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 06 May 2003 19:24:22 -0400 Message-ID: <3EB84436.6090303@rcn.com> Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 19:24:38 -0400 From: Catelli User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200305061800.h46I0g7V006020@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] "Chemical Dyes" a quibble X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would love to know what things anyone uses to dye that aren't chemicals? or mixtures of chemicals. As the Dharma Trading catalog makes quite clear; natural does not mean 'no chemicals' and may well be Less safe than synthetic dyes. After all, lots & lots of poisons are not merely natural, but organic. Ann Catelli Batchelor's and Master's Degrees in Chemistry p.s. Your cloth is a chemical or mixture of chemicals, too. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 20:04:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4704jqa022038 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 20:04:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46Nxkdx004148 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 17:59:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46NxgW0015385; Tue, 6 May 2003 17:59:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f101.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h46NxcW0015318 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 17:59:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 6 May 2003 16:59:33 -0700 Received: from 68.6.212.114 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 23:59:33 GMT X-Originating-IP: [68.6.212.114] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 23:59:33 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 May 2003 23:59:33.0632 (UTC) FILETIME=[8A805000:01C3142B] Subject: [h-cost] Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It would be fun for the H-costume folks to get together there, don't >you think? Maybe as the time gets closer we can organize something.... Diana, That's a great idea! Maybe we can put the red H's on our name tags or something like everyone did at Costume Con. We'll have to arrange a meeting too! As it get's closer we can decide on what to do. Looking forward to it!!! Now, I'm off to school! :) jessica _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 20:21:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h470L4qa022062 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 20:21:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h470G9dx005427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 18:16:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h470G8W0025101; Tue, 6 May 2003 18:16:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web9403.mail.yahoo.com (web9403.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h470G6W0025078 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 18:16:07 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507001606.6391.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.78.208.191] by web9403.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 17:16:06 PDT Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 17:16:06 -0700 (PDT) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Red H's on our badges would be great! I put one on my badge last year, and , alas!! only saw 1 other H costumner.The year before I saw 2.But then, I usually end up teaching classes or prepping for same ,instead, of getting to take classes, or wandering around the halls , socilaizing:(But if someone wants to propose a rendezvous point friday or saturday evening --I'd love to meet more of you---Albra jessica stier wrote:It would be fun for the H-costume folks to get together there, don't >you think? Maybe as the time gets closer we can organize something.... Diana, That's a great idea! Maybe we can put the red H's on our name tags or something like everyone did at Costume Con. We'll have to arrange a meeting too! As it get's closer we can decide on what to do. Looking forward to it!!! Now, I'm off to school! :) jessica _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 23:19:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473Jjqa022588 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 23:19:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473Hcdx018984 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 21:17:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473HZES023393; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:17:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc51.attbi.com (rwcrmhc51.attbi.com [204.127.198.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473HVES023319 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:17:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cc632021-b.attbi.com (12-246-76-5.client.attbi.com[12.246.76.5]) by attbi.com (rwcrmhc51) with SMTP id <20030507031725051009f9iae>; Wed, 7 May 2003 03:17:25 +0000 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20030506201349.00a3f2a0@mail.attbi.com> X-Sender: mabse@mail.attbi.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 20:15:17 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: MaryAnn Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? In-Reply-To: <002f01c313c7$b5f72b00$665183d1@rmitchellras> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505183412.00a671e0@mail.attbi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would appreciate it a lot and take it out and look at it and come up with wild schemes to use it that would require that I buy lots more fabric, but once I did I would realize that they wouldn't work. I would probably never figure it out, but I would enjoy thinking about it! At 08:04 AM 5/6/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Fat Chance, Mary Ann! And if you were to receive such a largesse, what would >you make of it? >Kathleen >----- Original Message ----- >From: "MaryAnn Jones" >To: "Historical Costume" >Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:36 PM >Subject: Re: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? > > > > Hey Kathleen, I think that if you really have the best interest of the > > fabric at heart you should give it to me. I can give it a much > > better home environment than you can (silliness) maryann > > > > At 11:52 AM 5/5/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > >Greetings, I'm working the 'achieves this AM and have a renewed interest > > >in what to do with a gorgeous linen piece I found last summer at a >flea-market. > > >It is 14 1/2 inches wide by 11yds + long. The edges bear 3" strips of > > >stripes enclosing fleur did lis motifs and the center has the same motifs > > >in two sizes over all. The color is natural and what I might call chalk > > >white. Damask? Brocade? In any event, it is woven, and rather heavy > > >weight...like mogushal. > > >I am open to period; the main concern is that I use it to best advantage > > >to display this beautiful piece and give it a good historical reference. > > >Any ideas? > > > > > >Kathleen > > >_______________________________________________ > > >h-costume mailing list > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 23:28:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473Swqa022653 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 23:28:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473O9dx019464 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 21:24:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473O8ES026373; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:24:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc51.attbi.com (rwcrmhc51.attbi.com [204.127.198.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473O5ES026298 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:24:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cc632021-b.attbi.com (12-246-76-5.client.attbi.com[12.246.76.5]) by attbi.com (rwcrmhc51) with SMTP id <20030507032359051009bruhe>; Wed, 7 May 2003 03:23:59 +0000 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20030506202101.00a59d90@mail.attbi.com> X-Sender: mabse@mail.attbi.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 20:21:52 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: MaryAnn Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Diary for Empress K'hay-Thora costume (finished) In-Reply-To: <20030505141948.36863.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole - this is fabulous and really inspirational. You are terrific. maryann At 03:19 PM 5/5/2003 +0100, you wrote: >Not really historical (not even remotely so, but the idea was ripped off >6th/7th century Byzantine Imperial clothing and a 10th century German >Reichskrone - after all, I come from Aachen) but lots of fun nevertheless. >There was no possible 'wrong' only creativity and imagination, I had a blast! >It felt like a true costuming-holiday. > >Here is the stroy of the emergence of Empress K'hay-Thora from the planet of >D'hay-lar: http://www.kipar.org/dress-diary/empress-khay-thora.html > >Have fun - I hope > >Nicole > >===== >Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give >it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ >J.R.R. Tolkien > >__________________________________________________ >Yahoo! Plus >For a better Internet experience >http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 6 23:43:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473hsqa022699 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 23:43:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473dLdx020823 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 21:39:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473dKES003524; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:39:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web12503.mail.yahoo.com (web12503.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.195]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h473dIES003509 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:39:19 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507033918.64930.qmail@web12503.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.41.38.39] by web12503.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 06 May 2003 20:39:18 PDT Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 20:39:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Lil Sorepaws To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305070327.h473RBEU027674@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] HELP?! Looking for sources for Viking/Valkyrie Images X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I am trying to hunt down some images of viking armor and female garb, specifically any images pertaining to the Valkyries ... so far all I have found is a lot of manga fan fiction and the viking answer lady (cool site) .. if anyone can point me in the right direction on the web, that would be fantabulous!!! A group of us are trying to design our combat armour to resemble a valkyrie's but so far few images have been found to substantiate or even give ideas .. any clue and points of interest would be most appreciated... THANK YOU!! - Lil (not a drop of scandinavian blood in me ... ;) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 00:07:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4747aqa022762 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 00:07:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473ujdx022234 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 21:56:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473ugBh011830; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:56:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h473udBh011742 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:56:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.net (pcp03509979pcs.elictc01.md.comcast.net [68.54.185.111]) by mtaout04.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEI001UG0A0WI@mtaout04.icomcast.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 06 May 2003 23:56:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 23:56:24 -0400 From: Cozit / Liz To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: <3EB883E8.7060608@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 References: <200305070327.h473RBET027674@net.indra.com> Subject: [h-cost] Re:Dioresque and hair X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Actually, no. Think of the Eva Peron pictures... hair done in much the way that Janet's was done... sleeked back into one variation of chignon or another. Simple yet elegant like the *lines* of the Dior gowns. There are others who I can picture in my mind wearing "typical" Dior who I can't place names to... also with the simple chignon. At least one picture with the model turned to show most of the back of the gown (low dropped, almost v-back)... same pose as some wedding dress photos are taken in... but the gown was golden... also with the model's hair slicked back into the bun. I'll admit that I wished I could have found some hairspray (no one was over at the table when I went looking, and I didn't see any)... there was one little wisp at the back that was just a tad to short to want to stay exactly as it had been placed. But it doesn't show in the pictures and I knew it wouldn't from the stage... and there was no way in heck I was going to mention that to Janet and make her even more stressed than she was if there was nothing I could do to help her out about it...especially as it was only noticable up close and if you were *looking* at the hair... rather than the gown and the bits that she had found or made for the trimmings. BTW, some of those glitzier bits were off gowns from that period... though I don't remember if she said whether or not any of them had been Dior. *g* Have to admit that whoever set up the dens did a good job in only putting two in that one.... especially with me... who isn't really the greatest of den mothers (I prefer to help out here and there... moreso when I have a bit more of a clue of what's going on where and where I can find what I'm searching for... holding papers in order and bellowing for the next in the line for workmanship judging was much easier the night before than trying to be a calming influence and a help when I really didn't know what to do to do that best). -Elisabeth >From: Heather Meadows >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College > >I must admit, I was confused by Janet hair in the photo. >I thought the gown was lovely, but wouldn't it have had at >least some decoration in the form of hair accessories? > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 00:25:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h474PFqa022898 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 00:25:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h474Kpdx024037 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 22:20:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h474KoBh023625; Tue, 6 May 2003 22:20:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h474KlBh023573 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 22:20:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEI00MLA1EKX0@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 06 May 2003 21:20:45 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 21:15:23 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid In-reply-to: <20030506180627.84786.qmail@web20703.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030506210740.02cbaa70@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/6/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <859B3012-7FE1-11D7-B486-000393195F42@netdefender.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Liz, At 02:06 PM 5/6/2003 -0400, you wrote: >I highly recommend that you avoid using any "natural" dyestuffs as the >mordants required for these dye are extremely damaging to fibers.! Really? I know iron can be, but alum or vinegar or a few others? Is it dependant on types of fiber used, say cotton vs linen vs wool vs silk? Is it dependant on the types of natural dyes? Some of the images I have seen of naturally dyed garments from the past are so vivid, and still in great shape. Even some of the tapestries I have seen that used natural dyes seem to be in good shape. Can you give more info on this, or point me to a source, as I am very curious and don't want to continue my natural dying tests if they aren't good on the fiber. OCC: I plan on using some of my handspun wool dyed with natural dyestuffs to crewel embroider a future costume piece. Something I can do while sitting at court during faire. Thank you. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 00:37:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h474b2qa022926 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 00:37:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h474Wndx025024 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 22:32:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h474WlBh028862; Tue, 6 May 2003 22:32:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h474WjBh028852 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 22:32:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-33-85.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.33.85]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h474WiMc013794 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 21:32:44 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030506212810.051534d0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 21:32:32 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College In-Reply-To: <20030507001606.6391.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The only problem with this is that no name tag ever is period for my historical costumes. I have learned several places to hide my name tag, in case I need to be wearing it to get into function rooms, but otherwise I hate to wear the things when I am in costume. Anybody else bothered by this? Anybody else have a good solution to the problem of being asked to spoil the historical look with such a thing? (I have the same issue with the docent name tag I am required to wear when doing living history.) >Red H's on our badges would be great! I put one on my badge last year, and >, alas!! only saw 1 other H costumner.The year before I saw 2.But then, I >usually end up teaching classes or prepping for same ,instead, of getting >to take classes, or wandering around the halls , socilaizing:(But if >someone wants to propose a rendezvous point friday or saturday evening >--I'd love to meet more of you---Albra > >jessica stier wrote:It would be fun for the >H-costume folks to get together there, don't > >you think? Maybe as the time gets closer we can organize something.... > >Diana, > >That's a great idea! Maybe we can put the red H's on our name tags or >something like everyone did at Costume Con. We'll have to arrange a meeting >too! As it get's closer we can decide on what to do. > >Looking forward to it!!! > >Now, I'm off to school! > >:) jessica > >_________________________________________________________________ >Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. >http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >--------------------------------- >Do you Yahoo!? >The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 01:15:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h475F5qa023051 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 01:15:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4757Adx027707 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 23:07:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47579Xw017452; Tue, 6 May 2003 23:07:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47576Xw017434 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 23:07:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEI0072L3JTCN@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 06 May 2003 22:07:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 22:01:51 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College In-reply-to: <4.3.1.2.20030506212810.051534d0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030506220032.02cbaa70@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/6/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <20030507001606.6391.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:32 PM 5/6/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Anybody else have a good solution to the problem of being asked to spoil >the historical look with such a thing? Hmmm... a friend of mine hides his little clock during faire by putting it on the back of a pretty piece of ribbon "favor" that he wears where he can flip it and look, but you wouldn't know it was there otherwise. Maybe you could do the same. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 01:28:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h475SNqa023086 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 01:28:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h475PQdx029036 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 6 May 2003 23:25:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h475PPXw025459; Tue, 6 May 2003 23:25:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe36.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.93]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h475PLXw025367 for ; Tue, 6 May 2003 23:25:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 6 May 2003 22:25:16 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe36.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 07 May 2003 05:25:16 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <859B3012-7FE1-11D7-B486-000393195F42@netdefender.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030506210740.02cbaa70@127.0.0.1> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 01:24:48 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 May 2003 05:25:16.0721 (UTC) FILETIME=[0B170A10:01C31459] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Some of the images I have seen > of naturally dyed garments from the past are so vivid, and still in great > shape. Even some of the tapestries I have seen that used natural dyes seem > to be in good shape. I know some colors, black for example, damaged the fibers more than others. Well... *I* don't know it but I've heard of it... might even be on this very list! So ask around, someone should be able to provide documentation for it. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 03:00:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4770Tqa010154 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 03:00:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h476uIdx004237 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 00:56:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h476uGdi002971; Wed, 7 May 2003 00:56:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41501.mail.yahoo.com (web41501.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h476uCdi002874 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 00:56:13 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507065607.7922.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41501.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 07:56:07 BST Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 07:56:07 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Black, was Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > > I know some colors, black for example, damaged the fibers more than others. > Well... *I* don't know it but I've heard of it... might even be on this very > list! So ask around, someone should be able to provide documentation for it. Black is, there are some examples of black silk garments (I think there is a 1630s doublet in the museum in Ediburgh, however, it is in Naomi Tarrant's book) that have completely disintegrated and only the lining is left. Same with black silk thread for embroidery: it has just rotted to nothing. I do not cliam knowing anything about dyes (sadly) so does anyone know what is in the black to destroy fibres? Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 03:39:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h477dkqa026708 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 03:39:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h477bXdx006509 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 01:37:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h477bVdi019560; Wed, 7 May 2003 01:37:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41506.mail.yahoo.com (web41506.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.89]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h477bTdi019526 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 01:37:30 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507073724.76131.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41506.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 08:37:24 BST Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 08:37:24 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Crown, Re: [h-cost] Re: Nicole's costume To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Gail & Scott Finke wrote: > > Nicole: > > I love your empress costume! What fun! It reminds me of my favorite > "historically inspired" movie costumes, the ones that are so much fun to > analyze. I can see why you say you have fun sewing. Maybe I should try > something like that and see if it would be fun for me, too. Thank you, and yes, go for it! I was surprised at how much fun I had, it was as if I couldn't _stop_ working on it, and not the other way round. > How did you make the crown? I remember your asking about how the Iron Crown > was made, now that I see it. Is it just cardboard, for a one-time use? Or > did you manage to figure out a way to make it durable? It's lovely. Aha, well, it is actually cardboard (the iron one will be for the Queen of Shadows) but the trick is to use Mod Podge. That;s a glue/varnish for decoupage. Someone used it/talked about it on the LOTR costume list or I would have never known about it. It was a major pain to get hold of it here in the UK. However, I finally got it just in time. You use cardbroard, then mod podge a layer or several of newspaper onto it, and then put layer after layer after layer of that stuff o. When it is dry it is so hard you can even sand it. The crown is fairly substantial and I really don't need to worry about it at al, it'll hold up for a long time to come. The stones are very heavy, but the crown base has no problems with it. That mod podge stuff is a blessing! You can also form it into shape while it's drying and it will stay in that form. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 04:03:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4783Zqa005979 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 04:03:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4781Sdx007751 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 02:01:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4781ROc029468; Wed, 7 May 2003 02:01:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4781OOc029430 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 02:01:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4781Mp04157.; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:01:22 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 07 May 2003 09:01:22 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 09:00:59 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Anything going on in England in September Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4781OOc029430 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Glenda - The Sealed Knot will be involved in the Detling show that others have mentioned; we also have our own event the weekend before (6/7th) at Wicksteed Park near Kettering, Northamptonshire. Our Living History folk are always more than willing to talk to visitors! Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 05:01:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47918qa025765 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 05:01:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h478x1dx010703 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 02:59:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h478x02A024960; Wed, 7 May 2003 02:59:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h478wu2A024917 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 02:58:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fc2.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.194]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id BA64B5EE136 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:58:54 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <005c01c31476$f07b3a50$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030507065607.7922.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Black, was Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 10:59:16 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. Dont know what it is, but there are also a lot of black laces wich has desintegrated. Especially black silk. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 8:56 AM Subject: Black, was Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid > --- Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > > > I know some colors, black for example, damaged the fibers more than others. > > Well... *I* don't know it but I've heard of it... might even be on this very > > list! So ask around, someone should be able to provide documentation for it. > > Black is, there are some examples of black silk garments (I think there is a > 1630s doublet in the museum in Ediburgh, however, it is in Naomi Tarrant's > book) that have completely disintegrated and only the lining is left. Same with > black silk thread for embroidery: it has just rotted to nothing. > > I do not cliam knowing anything about dyes (sadly) so does anyone know what is > in the black to destroy fibres? > > Nicole > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > Email: nicole@kipar.org > URL: http://www.kipar.org > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 07:12:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47BCJqa026093 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:12:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47BA6dx018067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 05:10:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47BA41K012757; Wed, 7 May 2003 05:10:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47BA01K012741 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 05:10:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.169]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/linuxconf) with SMTP id h47BQCM23139 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 21:26:13 +1000 Message-ID: <062c01c31488$f62910a0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030507065607.7922.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Black, was Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 21:08:13 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Just a wild guess here, but it could be the Ferric Tannate. I know that a lot of blacks were made from walnut or oak galls, which form Ferric Tannate in the dye process. Blacks also take a lot of dips to dye well, so the compound would be very strong in these. Wayne says that over time the Iron in the dye could possibly form from the compound and explode the silk in it's molecular structures. Or it could be the Tannic Acids reacting with the silk or surrounding air. He also remembered that in a number of vellum manuscripts, the black has eaten through the pages, He reckons that you'd need an industrial chemist to really work out what's going on. Anyone got a tame one? Glenda. ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 4:56 PM Subject: Black, was Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid > --- Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > > > I know some colors, black for example, damaged the fibers more than others. > > Well... *I* don't know it but I've heard of it... might even be on this very > > list! So ask around, someone should be able to provide documentation for it. > > Black is, there are some examples of black silk garments (I think there is a > 1630s doublet in the museum in Ediburgh, however, it is in Naomi Tarrant's > book) that have completely disintegrated and only the lining is left. Same with > black silk thread for embroidery: it has just rotted to nothing. > > I do not cliam knowing anything about dyes (sadly) so does anyone know what is > in the black to destroy fibres? > > Nicole > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > Email: nicole@kipar.org > URL: http://www.kipar.org > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 08:10:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47CAJqa026244 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 08:10:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47C8Adx020952 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 06:08:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47C88rO005667; Wed, 7 May 2003 06:08:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp2.suscom.net (userweb.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47C85rO005615 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 06:08:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (userweb.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1E2C111B59 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 08:07:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 48AF0111953 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 08:07:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <06b901c31491$4bb59270$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 08:07:56 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS new-20020517 Subject: [h-cost] Fw: [margospatterns] (Fwd) FW: Dylon Machine and Dylon Hand... availablility in USA and Canada X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Teddy" To: Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 7:35 AM Subject: [margospatterns] (Fwd) FW: Dylon Machine and Dylon Hand... availablility in USA and Canada > Hello All > > Since the subjectcame up I contacted the nice people at Dylon and > this is the info they sent me. > > Could someone on H-costume please post it there too - for any > who might be interested? > > Thanks > > Teddy > ------- Forwarded message follows ------- > > Dear Teddy > > It's true that availablility of Dylon's product ranges varies from > market to market, for a number of reasons. In this case, Machine > Dye is unsuitable for the USA because the type of washing > machine in use over there is technically very different from the > European type of machine, for which Dylon Machine Dye is > specifically designed. The dyeing process depends on the volume > and temperature of the water and on the length of the dyeing cycle. > Because of the large amount of water used in US machines, it isn't > possible to use dye in them. > > Hand Dye is not available either, but just recently we launched a > new dye range called Permanent Fabric Dyes (available in Jo-ann > and Michael's Stores) which has similar properties (dyes up to > 250g fabric, hand use, with a colourfast result). To find out exactly > where this and the Cold Water Dyes are available, your contacts > should get in touch with our distributor, Prym Dritz Corporation, > either by telephone on 00 1800 255 7796 or by e-mail on > amysummers@dritz.com. > > Our hot (Multi-Purpose) and Cold Water Dyes are available either > in small tins (dyeing up to 250 dry weight fabric) or, for those dyeing > in bulk, in 500g tins. The latter are handled by a different company, > based in Canada. The details are: > > Farquhar International Ltd. > Tel: 00 1 905 839 3739 > Fax: 00 1 905 839 5694 > E-mail: farquhar@on.aibn.com > > I hope this is helpful. We appreciate your recommending Dylon > products to your contacts and hope you continue to enjoy using > them. > > Yours > > Fenella Wood > Export Department _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 09:11:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DBbqa026469 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:11:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47D9Gdx025299 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 07:09:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47D9Fmd004580; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:09:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47D9Cmd004536 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:09:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.108] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A23EF7301D0; Wed, 07 May 2003 08:55:26 -0400 Message-ID: <002501c3149a$48cb2da0$6c5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505183412.00a671e0@mail.attbi.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030506201349.00a3f2a0@mail.attbi.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 09:12:16 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And That sweet Mary Ann is exactly what I have been doing for the year since I discovered it! The vision that walks my minds eye is taking the shape of some kind of robe with a strip or panel forming a shawl collar hem to hem that will pleat or drape at the back neck. And that is it at present. But as I originally stated, I have been unable to connect this vision with any period...except as a Pre JF Millet fantasy of the medieval times...in my Minds Eye. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "MaryAnn Jones" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 11:15 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? > I would appreciate it a lot and take it out and look at it and come up with > wild schemes to use it that would require that I buy lots more fabric, but > once I did I would realize that they wouldn't work. I would probably never > figure it out, but I would enjoy thinking about it! > > At 08:04 AM 5/6/2003 -0400, you wrote: > >Fat Chance, Mary Ann! And if you were to receive such a largesse, what would > >you make of it? > >Kathleen > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "MaryAnn Jones" > >To: "Historical Costume" > >Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:36 PM > >Subject: Re: [h-cost] ideas for fabric use? > > > > > > > Hey Kathleen, I think that if you really have the best interest of the > > > fabric at heart you should give it to me. I can give it a much > > > better home environment than you can (silliness) maryann > > > > > > At 11:52 AM 5/5/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > >Greetings, I'm working the 'achieves this AM and have a renewed interest > > > >in what to do with a gorgeous linen piece I found last summer at a > >flea-market. > > > >It is 14 1/2 inches wide by 11yds + long. The edges bear 3" strips of > > > >stripes enclosing fleur did lis motifs and the center has the same motifs > > > >in two sizes over all. The color is natural and what I might call chalk > > > >white. Damask? Brocade? In any event, it is woven, and rather heavy > > > >weight...like mogushal. > > > >I am open to period; the main concern is that I use it to best advantage > > > >to display this beautiful piece and give it a good historical reference. > > > >Any ideas? > > > > > > > >Kathleen > > > >_______________________________________________ > > > >h-costume mailing list > > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 09:18:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DIYqa026477 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:18:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DEvdx025729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 07:14:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DEumd007271; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:14:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DEqmd007198 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:14:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.108] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A393F8301D0; Wed, 07 May 2003 09:01:07 -0400 Message-ID: <002d01c3149b$140898e0$6c5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030507033918.64930.qmail@web12503.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] HELP?! Looking for sources for Viking/Valkyrie Images Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 09:17:57 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You might look at Opera costume achives...some of the costumes of the 1950-70 were more historically based than pure fantasy...and lots are a real Hoot ! And after all isn't the character of 'valkyrie' somewhat of a fantasy in itself? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lil Sorepaws" To: Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 11:39 PM Subject: [h-cost] HELP?! Looking for sources for Viking/Valkyrie Images > Hi, > > I am trying to hunt down some images of viking armor and female garb, > specifically any images pertaining to the Valkyries ... so far all I have > found is a lot of manga fan fiction and the viking answer lady (cool site) > .. if anyone can point me in the right direction on the web, that would be > fantabulous!!! A group of us are trying to design our combat armour to > resemble a valkyrie's but so far few images have been found to > substantiate or even give ideas .. any clue and points of interest would > be most appreciated... THANK YOU!! > > - Lil (not a drop of scandinavian blood in me ... ;) > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 09:19:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DJVqa026480 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:19:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DHSdx025893 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 07:17:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DHRmd008398; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:17:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20702.mail.yahoo.com (web20702.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.175]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47DHOmd008366 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:17:24 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507131722.52905.qmail@web20702.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [198.164.201.61] by web20702.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 09:17:22 EDT Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 09:17:22 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: Re: Black, was Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <062c01c31488$f62910a0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Crazy but true, I do have a tame p-block chemist at home!!!!But truly you are correct it is the metal in dyestuffs(iron is nasty) that causes the fibers to disintegrate. I have seen some particularly lovely artifacts that will not be here much longer as the dyestuffs are eatung them Black is the worst but other colours are also susceptable to these metals some to a lesser extentcheers liz haines Glenda Robinson wrote:Just a wild guess here, but it could be the Ferric Tannate. I know that a lot of blacks were made from walnut or oak galls, which form Ferric Tannate in the dye process. Blacks also take a lot of dips to dye well, so the compound would be very strong in these. Wayne says that over time the Iron in the dye could possibly form from the compound and explode the silk in it's molecular structures. Or it could be the Tannic Acids reacting with the silk or surrounding air. He also remembered that in a number of vellum manuscripts, the black has eaten through the pages, He reckons that you'd need an industrial chemist to really work out what's going on. Anyone got a tame one? Glenda. ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 4:56 PM Subject: Black, was Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid > --- Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > > > I know some colors, black for example, damaged the fibers more than others. > > Well... *I* don't know it but I've heard of it... might even be on this very > > list! So ask around, someone should be able to provide documentation for it. > > Black is, there are some examples of black silk garments (I think there is a > 1630s doublet in the museum in Ediburgh, however, it is in Naomi Tarrant's > book) that have completely disintegrated and only the lining is left. Same with > black silk thread for embroidery: it has just rotted to nothing. > > I do not cliam knowing anything about dyes (sadly) so does anyone know what is > in the black to destroy fibres? > > Nicole > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > Email: nicole@kipar.org > URL: http://www.kipar.org > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 09:19:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DJqqa026484 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:19:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DFtdx025816 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 07:15:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DFtmd007730; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:15:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com ([216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47DFrmd007719 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:15:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 6550 invoked from network); 7 May 2003 13:57:11 -0000 Received: from 66-44-44-187.s1203.apx1.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.44.187) by shada.com with SMTP; 7 May 2003 13:57:11 -0000 Message-ID: <3EB8FBD9.6070704@oldwaylane.net> Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 08:28:09 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] HELP?! Looking for sources for Viking/Valkyrie Images References: <20030507033918.64930.qmail@web12503.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20030507033918.64930.qmail@web12503.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lil Sorepaws wrote: > I am trying to hunt down some images of viking armor and female garb, > specifically any images pertaining to the Valkyries ... viking armor.. well if you want to see extant armor, you need to look in some of the books. The Osprey series books (very thin, paper covers) actually have some good photos in them. If you want to see pics of general clothing and a lot of women's styles, you can look at my group's site: http://www.ostvik.org and click on - unless you want to see pics of us in garb with 12 parrots on our head & shoulders! But none of us are in armor. There's a nice pic of some guys who are at http://www.vikings.ndirect.co.uk/ As to images of valkyries. There you're going to have a problem. Firstly, the concept of valkyries in winged hemlents and brass byrnies is extremely victorian and largely Wagner. There is absolutely no proof of any of this existing except in their minds. There are some small silver figures of women that are commonly called "valkyries" basically because they are jewelery, women, and some of them are offering drinking horns. Their clothing isn't any different from basic upper class women's clothing. If you want pics of these silver pendants, let me know and I can forward them to you. A group of us are trying to design our combat armour to > resemble a valkyrie's but so far few images have been found to > substantiate or even give ideas .. any clue and points of interest would > be most appreciated... THANK YOU!! That's because the entire thing is very late period and completely mythological. Whether or not women were ever even warriors is a debated topic. If you want the classic concept - look at victorian books and look at Wagner's Ring Cycle. If you want true historic..... haven't seen any proof of it, which is why you're having so much trouble. > - Lil (not a drop of scandinavian blood in me ... ;) yeah, I know the feeling! -Judy Mitchell (my heart is Scandinavian, even if the rest of me isn't) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 09:37:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DbSqa026515 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:37:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DZPdx027297 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 07:35:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DZOmd016904; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:35:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20713.mail.yahoo.com (web20713.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.154]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47DZLmd016879 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:35:21 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507133521.13530.qmail@web20713.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [198.164.201.61] by web20713.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 09:35:21 EDT Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 09:35:21 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030506210740.02cbaa70@127.0.0.1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO hi kimoko,It is totally dependant on the fiber that you are using with natural dyestuffs. I have had great luck with wools and natural dyes. Silk takes most dyes well both chemical and natural. I can recommend a handy little book called aA DYERS GARDEN I will check the title and ISBN when I get home and post it for you. There are problems with the metal based mordants used to set dyes and alter the colours. This I believe is more of an issue with silk than wool.They not only abuse the fibers but are VERY toxic. Tin, alum,copper,iron and others in powder form are just plain nasty. I recommend that if you use these mordants in any way wear a safety mask rated for fine particles. Don't use your cooking pots to dye stuff and if you can, dye in a well ventilated area-maybe outdoors. Some dyers I know have had some luck using copper pots or throwing pennies in with there dyestuffs. Give it a try, looking forward to hearing the resultscheers, liz Kimiko Small wrote:Hi Liz, At 02:06 PM 5/6/2003 -0400, you wrote: >I highly recommend that you avoid using any "natural" dyestuffs as the >mordants required for these dye are extremely damaging to fibers.! Really? I know iron can be, but alum or vinegar or a few others? Is it dependant on types of fiber used, say cotton vs linen vs wool vs silk? Is it dependant on the types of natural dyes? Some of the images I have seen of naturally dyed garments from the past are so vivid, and still in great shape. Even some of the tapestries I have seen that used natural dyes seem to be in good shape. Can you give more info on this, or point me to a source, as I am very curious and don't want to continue my natural dying tests if they aren't good on the fiber. OCC: I plan on using some of my handspun wool dyed with natural dyestuffs to crewel embroider a future costume piece. Something I can do while sitting at court during faire. Thank you. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 09:37:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Dblqa026518 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:37:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DZkdx027321 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 07:35:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47DZkmd017117; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:35:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41506.mail.yahoo.com (web41506.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.89]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47DZNmd016854 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 07:35:24 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507133517.47108.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41506.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 14:35:17 BST Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 14:35:17 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] HELP?! Looking for sources for Viking/Valkyrie Images To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <002d01c3149b$140898e0$6c5183d1@rmitchellras> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > You might look at Opera costume achives...some of the costumes of the > 1950-70 were more historically based than pure fantasy...and lots are a real > Hoot ! And after all isn't the character of 'valkyrie' somewhat of a > fantasy in itself? > Kathleen Oh good idea, search for Richard Wagner and Ring der Nibelungen or Siegfried or Walkueren (can't do u umlaut here). What a fun idea! Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 10:31:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47EVDqa026602 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:31:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47EKMdx001460 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 08:20:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47EKGQG010308; Wed, 7 May 2003 08:20:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47EK9QG010202 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 08:20:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail22.ureach.com (mail22.ureach.com [172.16.2.82]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA30428 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:20:09 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-33-100-243.asm.bellsouth.net [67.33.100.243]) by mail22.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA26620 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:20:08 -0400 Message-ID: <022901c314a3$54771160$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030506212810.051534d0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 10:17:01 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Depending on your historical period, of course, but what about hanging it from the wrist on or inside a Victorian-style dance card? Teena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 12:32 AM Subject: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College > The only problem with this is that no name tag ever is period for my > historical costumes. I have learned several places to hide my name tag, in > case I need to be wearing it to get into function rooms, but otherwise I > hate to wear the things when I am in costume. Anybody else bothered by > this? Anybody else have a good solution to the problem of being asked to > spoil the historical look with such a thing? (I have the same issue with > the docent name tag I am required to wear when doing living history.) > > >Red H's on our badges would be great! I put one on my badge last year, and > >, alas!! only saw 1 other H costumner.The year before I saw 2.But then, I > >usually end up teaching classes or prepping for same ,instead, of getting > >to take classes, or wandering around the halls , socilaizing:(But if > >someone wants to propose a rendezvous point friday or saturday evening > >--I'd love to meet more of you---Albra > > > >jessica stier wrote:It would be fun for the > >H-costume folks to get together there, don't > > >you think? Maybe as the time gets closer we can organize something.... > > > >Diana, > > > >That's a great idea! Maybe we can put the red H's on our name tags or > >something like everyone did at Costume Con. We'll have to arrange a meeting > >too! As it get's closer we can decide on what to do. > > > >Looking forward to it!!! > > > >Now, I'm off to school! > > > >:) jessica > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > >Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. > >http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > >--------------------------------- > >Do you Yahoo!? > >The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 10:57:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Evrqa026694 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:57:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Ethdx005241 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 08:55:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47EtfHB003486; Wed, 7 May 2003 08:55:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from tecoma.mccc.edu (tecoma.mccc.edu [198.133.170.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47EtaHB003385 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 08:55:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mccc.edu ([198.133.170.246]) by tecoma.mccc.edu (8.12.9/8.11.4) with ESMTP id h47EtR2d028163 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:55:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EB91E63.29A01F2B@mccc.edu> Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 10:55:31 -0400 From: Kate Pinner X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid References: <20030506180627.84786.qmail@web20703.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > The dyes will sit on the surface of nylons and polyesters as compared with true reaction and absorption with natural fibers. Nylon and polyester are essentially smooth monofilament fibers and are non absorbant. > Then how come nylon dance leos and tights take dye beautifully? Kate _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 11:30:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47FUXqa026769 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:30:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47FSKdx008971 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 09:28:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47FSIHB026465; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:28:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80105.mail.yahoo.com (web80105.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.78]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47FSGHB026429 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:28:17 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507152816.10868.qmail@web80105.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80105.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 08:28:16 PDT Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 08:28:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305070327.h473RBET027674@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Need information on the Rowenta DG-580/DG-050 Steam Generator Iron X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Does anybody have one of the Rowenta Steam Generator irons with the separate tank? If so, do you like it? Is it worth dropping $150 on? I just got a 40% off coupon from JoAnn.com, and need to get a heavier, "steamier" iron that can produce steam at very low temperatures (for dealing with man-made fibers and silks). It's either this or continuing to save my pennies for a Sussman Pressmaster. Thanks! Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 11:45:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47FjBqa026789 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:45:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47FeKdx010269 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 09:40:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47FeIHB004956; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:40:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f59.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47FeFHB004864 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:40:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 7 May 2003 08:40:10 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.226 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 15:40:10 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.226] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 15:40:10 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 May 2003 15:40:10.0469 (UTC) FILETIME=[F17A3950:01C314AE] Subject: [h-cost] non-period name tags X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I can see how this would be annoying!!! All the work goes into making a garment as accurate as possible and a non period name tag would just clash. Perhaps you can devise some way to make your own name tag - embroidered or beaded or something that would be more visually pleasing? So, what do people wear at Costume College? Do you come in costume? Or do you wear streat clothes all day and at night wear costumes? I couldn't really get this from the website. :) jessica >Message: 4 >Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 21:32:32 -0700 >From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows >Subject: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College >To: Historical Costume >Message-ID: <4.3.1.2.20030506212810.051534d0@mail.frys.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > >The only problem with this is that no name tag ever is period for my >historical costumes. I have learned several places to hide my name tag, in >case I need to be wearing it to get into function rooms, but otherwise I >hate to wear the things when I am in costume. Anybody else bothered by >this? Anybody else have a good solution to the problem of being asked to >spoil the historical look with such a thing? (I have the same issue with >the docent name tag I am required to wear when doing living history.) > _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 12:07:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47G7mqa026841 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:07:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47G5adx013069 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 10:05:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47G5XX6024012; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:05:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe35.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.92]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47G5WX6023950 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:05:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:05:26 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe35.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 07 May 2003 16:05:26 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030507073724.76131.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Crown, Re: [h-cost] Re: Nicole's costume Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 12:04:46 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 May 2003 16:05:26.0912 (UTC) FILETIME=[79591000:01C314B2] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Aha, well, it is actually cardboard (the iron one will be for the Queen of > Shadows) but the trick is to use Mod Podge. That;s a glue/varnish for > decoupage. I think it's actually a kind of acrylic varnish, same as the paint but thicker. It's completely waterproof when dry. And yes, it's a blessing for all kinds of projects :-) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 12:16:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GGsqa026905 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:16:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GEldx014111 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 10:14:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GEkX6001298; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:14:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47GEhX6001266 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:14:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 17888 invoked from network); 7 May 2003 16:14:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail1.inreach.com) (209.142.2.50) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 7 May 2003 16:14:43 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:14:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <18915.162.119.64.111.1052324083.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 09:14:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] non-period name tags From: To: In-Reply-To: References: X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I can see how this would be annoying!!! All the work goes into making a > garment as accurate as possible and a non period name tag would just > clash. Perhaps you can devise some way to make your own name tag - > embroidered or beaded or something that would be more visually > pleasing? > My suggestion for those who still want to see others from this list is to devise an "H" somewhere on their lapel or equivalent. And then you could hide your nametag wherever you want still. The "H" could be a button, jewelry piece, applique, or however you want to do it. At least then we could know each other but not spoil our "look". Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 12:34:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GYKqa026960 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:34:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GOJdx015260 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 10:24:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GOIX6008214; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:24:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GOFX6008165 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:24:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h47GOF8S000715 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:24:15 -0400 Message-Id: <200305071624.h47GOF8S000715@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 16:21:03 -0000 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] non-period name tags From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The thing is, though, at a Costume Con or College, everyone is wearing a name tag. It's a great way to jog the memory for the name of an old acquaintance or meet someone you know from an e-mail list. And how do you see the red "H" on the name tag if it's not there? The nametag becomes invisible as you view the costume. If someone weren't wearing one, I might think they weren't friendly or maybe even sneaking into the event! There are many times when I've glanced at someone's nametag and it starts a conversation because I recognized their name. If everyone started hiding their nametag, that opportunity is gone. When you are a docent, on the other hand, I can really see a difference. There you are portraying someone who would not be wearing a name tag, and addionally you might use a different name in your portrayal than what's on your tag. It seems it would be obvious enough that you are connected with the site when you are in period clothes and the visitors are not. But for a convention, a nametag is a great way to break the ice. -Carol > >Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 21:32:32 -0700 > >From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows > >Subject: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College > >To: Historical Costume > >Message-ID: <4.3.1.2.20030506212810.051534d0@mail.frys.com> > >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > > > >The only problem with this is that no name tag ever is period for my > >historical costumes. I have learned several places to hide my name tag, in > >case I need to be wearing it to get into function rooms, but otherwise I > >hate to wear the things when I am in costume. Anybody else bothered by > >this? Anybody else have a good solution to the problem of being asked to > >spoil the historical look with such a thing? (I have the same issue with > >the docent name tag I am required to wear when doing living history.) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 12:38:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Gc2qa026974 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:38:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GXHdx016400 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 10:33:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GXHX6016187; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:33:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GXCX6016108 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:33:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E6767AB83 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:32:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 90708-07 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:32:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-202-187-163.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.202.187.163]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFD1E7A9CA for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 09:32:14 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 09:32:40 -0700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <18915.162.119.64.111.1052324083.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Message-Id: <852E5273-80A9-11D7-A981-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [h-cost] name tags at Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At Costume College, however, the nametags themselves are required to show you've paid for the classes. It may be annoying to wear them, but I'm sure it's more annoying to them if people slip in for free. On Wednesday, May 7, 2003, at 09:14 AM, wrote: >> I can see how this would be annoying!!! All the work goes into >> making a >> garment as accurate as possible and a non period name tag would just >> clash. Perhaps you can devise some way to make your own name tag - >> embroidered or beaded or something that would be more visually >> pleasing? >> > > My suggestion for those who still want to see others from this list is > to > devise an "H" somewhere on their lapel or equivalent. And then you > could > hide your nametag wherever you want still. > > The "H" could be a button, jewelry piece, applique, or however you > want to > do it. At least then we could know each other but not spoil our > "look". > > Diana > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 12:38:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Gc7qa026977 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:38:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GUsdx016052 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 10:30:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GUrX6013929; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:30:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80103.mail.yahoo.com (web80103.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.76]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47GUoX6013875 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:30:50 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507163049.59674.qmail@web80103.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80103.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 09:30:49 PDT Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 09:30:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305070327.h473RBET027674@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Masquerade decisions (was "Costume College") X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stevie wrote: > > Well, I suspect that I am not the only person who > thought that Judy > > Mitchell should have won Best in Show for the > Historic Competition, > > though she's far too modest, and nice, to think > so! > > And having brooded over why I wasn't impressed > with the Diorama gown, > > when others obviously were, I concluded that it > fell between two > > stools. Some of the trimmings were far too tacky > for Dior, and thus > > one couldn't wear it to the sort of occasion one > would wear a Dior > > ballgown to, and viewed as a stage costume it > didn't really make it to > > the heights which would be expected on the London > stage, in the West > > End, at any rate. So for me Judy was undoubtedly > the outstanding > > competitor. I think there has been disagreement and controversy regarding who/what wins BoS in the Historical Masquerade ever since CostumeCon was established. All I can do is offer some insight into how the judging usually occurs (having worked as a judges' clerk and a judge on more than one occasion). In the Historical Masquerade, everything is looked at, and even though extra people are supposed to be just "set dressing," they can be (and usually are) included as part of the judged package. This is why groups are inherently dicey in the Historical Masquerade: the entire group is only as good as its weakest costume. How something presents on stage also is a big factor: as beautifully perfect as it is, a perfect Chanel suit is not going to "read" as well as a glitzy Elizabethan or Georgian will. The detailing is just too fine and subtle to be viewed from 20 feet back. This is one of the reasons that "Hall Costume" awards are supposed to be given: they are for those costumes that need to be viewed up close to fully appreciate the fine detailing that is lost on the stage. Unfortunately, there are also times that factors outside the control of the costumer play a deciding role (in other words, the judges may possibly be biased toward one costumer or costume over another). I won't go into the "gory details" of situations when this has happened; I don't want to frighten off the newer costumers. Judy is right: there is more latitude in the "Interpretation" category than in the "Recreation" category. Both have their difficulties, but both are very rewarding. My congratulations to everyone that received awards at CostumeCon 21. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 12:57:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Gvtqa027052 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:57:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Gpmdx018572 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 10:51:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GpkX6022185; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:51:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47GpaX6021977 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 10:51:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.114] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A65F128A01D0; Wed, 07 May 2003 12:37:51 -0400 Message-ID: <000b01c314b9$5b1df0e0$725183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030507152816.10868.qmail@web80105.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need information on the Rowenta DG-580/DG-050 Steam Generator Iron Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 12:54:41 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO unless they have changed their usual policy, irons are not included with the discount coupon ...unless, it is specific for that appliance. If you spend hours with iron in hand on a regular basis, you might find this Rowenta a plus. Otherwise, I would recommend the model that sells for about $80-100 . I've bought three in the last 20 years and find the brand to stand up well. The biggest problem I have experienced is that they tend to "spit" as they age. I used to be able to send it in for repair but they discontinued the service except for irons under warranty...and of course, the iron lasts Long beyond that time period. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn Jacobson" To: Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 11:28 AM Subject: [h-cost] Need information on the Rowenta DG-580/DG-050 Steam Generator Iron > Does anybody have one of the Rowenta Steam Generator > irons with the separate tank? If so, do you like it? > Is it worth dropping $150 on? I just got a 40% off > coupon from JoAnn.com, and need to get a heavier, > "steamier" iron that can produce steam at very low > temperatures (for dealing with man-made fibers and > silks). It's either this or continuing to save my > pennies for a Sussman Pressmaster. > > Thanks! > > Dawn > > ===== > Dawn Jacobson > Vallejo, CA, USA > > "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" > --Wicked Witch > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 13:05:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47H52qa027077 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:05:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47H2kdx019895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 11:02:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47H2icK001844; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:02:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from barry.mail.mindspring.net (barry.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.25]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47H2fcK001783 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:02:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [192.168.167.39] (helo=wamui01.slb.atl.earthlink.net) by barry.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19DSJV-00072k-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 07 May 2003 13:02:41 -0400 Received: from [192.168.167.58] by EarthlinkWAM via HTTP; Wed May 07 13:02:41 EDT 2003 Message-ID: <7254317.1052326961274.JavaMail.nobody@wamui01.slb.atl.earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 13:05:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Laning To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Re: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Earthlink Web Access Mail version 3.0 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kimiko wrote: >Hmmm... a friend of mine hides his little clock during faire by >putting it on the back of a pretty piece of ribbon "favor" that >he wears where he can flip it and look, but you wouldn't know >it was there otherwise. I have a friend who wears hers inside a decorative pendant around her neck -- you don't know anything's in it until she opens it, and even then it's facing her, not whoever she's talking to. Someone in my guild puts his inside the crown of his hat -- so he can casually take off his hat, hold it up to shade his face as he looks at the sun, and say, "Ah -- I would say it is nigh unto three of the clock." ____________________________________________________________ 0 Chris Laning | + Davis, California ____________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 13:30:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HUYqa027182 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:30:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HNWdx022385 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 11:23:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HNTcK018513; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:23:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80104.mail.yahoo.com (web80104.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.77]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47HNQcK018479 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:23:26 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507172325.48554.qmail@web80104.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80104.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 10:23:25 PDT Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 10:23:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305071652.h47GqGX7022598@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: non-period name tags X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta wrote: <> Badges? We don't need no stinkin' badges! 8-D Sorry, I had to say it. I usually keep mine in my pocket, or reticule unless I have to "flash" it to get into specific areas. I've also been known to hide it up my sleeve, inside my hat, under the lapel of my jacket, and even pinned inside my skirt on my petticoat (near the ankle, so I can discreetly show it). On a completely different topic, the black Edwardian suit that I made for CC1 (has it really been that long?!?) and darn near wore to death has been recycled yet again, this time to our school's Performing Arts Dept. I just finished turning and recutting the skirt so that it will fit one of our actresses, and will be used as Almira Gultch/Wicked Witch of the West in "Oz." It's also going to be used again the the fall, as the same actress will be playing Annie Sullivan in "The Miracle Worker." Quite a "retirement" for one of my early historical costumes. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 13:35:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HZ1qa027200 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:35:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HWEdx023244 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 11:32:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HWDcK024519; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:32:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47HWAcK024406 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:32:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCmCYPQax1/zbQAviqpXaIJ/wMiE1ysuwUA==">; Wed, 07 May 2003 13:31:15 EDT Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HXLHVXQT; Wed, 07 May 2003 13:31:15 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 12:16:48 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Masquerade decisions (was "Costume College") Message-ID: <20030507.121648.-78523177.4.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 23-24,31-32,42-45 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think that I can speak with some insight as to the Historical judges' reasoning, seeing that I am half of them. Judy's Danish costume and Janet's Dior-esque were both in consideration for BoS. There is a mind-numbing amount of handwork in BOTH of them. They were both documented to the Nth degree. They were both exquisitely done examples of their type. But the hard cold fact is that we could only give one BoS. Every aspect of Janet's Dior gown was documented down to the type of underwear she was wearing, the way she plucked her eyebrows to match the style of the period, and the shoes she was wearing which were made by a company who has been making them since the period in question and which made the shoes on lasts from the period. Janet had repeatedly hand-dyed and bleached the appliques on the front of her gown to exactly match the color she wanted, the beads and rhinestone pieces were all hand-applied and many of them were artifacts from the period, and each of the 'petals' on the rear of her gown was hand formed with very few of them being exactly alike so that they would lie smoothly and flow with the skirt. Each design element was documented with her dress being very close to a number of dresses in her documentation but with elements borrowed from other dresses by Dior of the same era. Her bodice could have gotten her an engineering degree, the thing practically stood up and waved hello to us in the workmanship judging. The 'cloth of gold' pleated ruffles which went around each petal and the bodice were all individually pleated and changed size and width to accentuate aspects of the design. There was level after level of amazing detail and precision handwork- staggering! Judy- Please don't take this as in anyway indicating that your outfit wasn't fantastic. It's just that you are here to speak for yourself, and Janet isn't so I feel like I need to explain some of the details which folks watching from the audience might not have had a chance to notice. I thought your simple but entirely character driven presentation was terrific and I was particularly taken with it having seen the photos in your documentation. Frankly, it was a very, very hard decision to make, deciding which of you got BoS. Although to the casual observer, your costumes were very different (wools and linen in a 'folk' design, vs gold brocade in high fashion) on the inside you were very much alike in your attention to detail and willingness to go to amazing lengths to recreate a particular style. It was a genuine pleasure and an education to be able to hear from both of you about the way you created your costumes. I learned a great deal from both of you and I came away inspired to make my own costumes even better.....although I don't know if I will ever rise your particularly wonderful levels of insanity! Thank-you for sharing your work with everyone at the Con! Karen ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 13:56:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Husqa027264 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:56:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HlJdx024907 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 11:47:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HlIcK006704; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:47:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47HlDcK006641 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:47:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEJ003HW2QM2X@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 07 May 2003 10:47:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 10:35:39 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] non-period name tags In-reply-to: X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030507103214.00af7cf0@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/6/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 03:40 PM 5/7/2003 +0000, you wrote: >So, what do people wear at Costume College? Do you come in costume? Or >do you wear streat clothes all day and at night wear costumes? I couldn't >really get this from the website. > >:) jessica They wear whatever pleases them. Some of the people wore costumes all day and night, changing as they wanted. Most wore street clothes, and wore costumes for the gala or tea party. I think they request no hoops during the classes, to make moving around easier for all. But I remember the bustle a couple of ladies (who have a pattern company) who wore their bustles during class, and the ease in which they could sit in their bustles convinced me to buy their bustle patterns. I really need to make those dresses soon. hth Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 14:24:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47IOZqa027304 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 14:24:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47IMRdx028497 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 12:22:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47IMQov002175; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:22:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47IMNov002095 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:22:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from demaslaw.com (12-209-93-136.client.attbi.com [12.209.93.136]) by mtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEJ00DZJ44KL5@mtaout01.icomcast.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 07 May 2003 14:17:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 11:17:02 -0700 From: Louis Demas Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Need information on the Rowenta DG-580/DG-050 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <3EB94D9E.2080607@demaslaw.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 References: <20030507174201.50976.qmail@web80104.mail.yahoo.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dawn Jacobson wrote: > >I may have to continue saving up for a Sussman. > Try http://carusew.com/item/steam_iron.html for a gravity feed iron at $139.99. and otyhes at http://www.store.allbrands.com/gravfeedwatb.html startin at 129.99. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 14:25:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47IPOqa027309 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 14:25:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47INEdx028623 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 12:23:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47INDov002737; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:23:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sccrmhc02.attbi.com (sccrmhc02.attbi.com [204.127.202.62]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47IMnov002379 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:22:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cc632021-b.attbi.com (12-246-76-5.client.attbi.com[12.246.76.5]) by attbi.com (sccrmhc02) with SMTP id <20030507182243002006p7aue>; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:22:43 +0000 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507110734.00a71c60@mail.attbi.com> X-Sender: mabse@mail.attbi.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 11:20:33 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: MaryAnn Jones Subject: Re: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030506212810.051534d0@mail.frys.com> References: <20030507001606.6391.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta and everybody else going to costume college: Please wear your name tags. I am so looking forward to picking you out of the crowd at college. Unless of course, I will be able to identify you by your dolls Kayta. that I really want to see. I am very excited about it this year. I love being able to take classes and meet people and shop and be something other than a geologist for a change. Even though everyone is very indulgent about my avocation, it is nice to be with people who actually share it. I had a discussion about fitting Elizabethan corsets versus Victorian corsets with another costumer in a crowded elevator at work one morning. Other than our conversation you could have heard a pin drop. Afterwards someone asked me if I was a fetishist. In an Elizabethan? And no, Jessica, I don't wear a costume. but look for me in a phony grass skirt on Friday night... Maryann At 09:32 PM 5/6/2003 -0700, you wrote: >The only problem with this is that no name tag ever is period for my >historical costumes. I have learned several places to hide my name tag, >in case I need to be wearing it to get into function rooms, but otherwise >I hate to wear the things when I am in costume. Anybody else bothered by >this? Anybody else have a good solution to the problem of being asked to >spoil the historical look with such a thing? (I have the same issue with >the docent name tag I am required to wear when doing living history.) > >>Red H's on our badges would be great! I put one on my badge last year, >>and , alas!! only saw 1 other H costumner.The year before I saw 2.But >>then, I usually end up teaching classes or prepping for same ,instead, >>of getting to take classes, or wandering around the halls , >>socilaizing:(But if someone wants to propose a rendezvous point friday or >>saturday evening --I'd love to meet more of you---Albra >> >>jessica stier wrote:It would be fun for the >>H-costume folks to get together there, don't >> >you think? Maybe as the time gets closer we can organize something.... >> >>Diana, >> >>That's a great idea! Maybe we can put the red H's on our name tags or >>something like everyone did at Costume Con. We'll have to arrange a meeting >>too! As it get's closer we can decide on what to do. >> >>Looking forward to it!!! >> >>Now, I'm off to school! >> >>:) jessica >> >>_________________________________________________________________ >>Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. >>http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >>--------------------------------- >>Do you Yahoo!? >>The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > CarolynKayta Barrows >dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 14:44:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47IiXqa027371 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 14:44:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Hg4dx024334 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 11:42:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Hg3cK002586; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:42:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80104.mail.yahoo.com (web80104.mail.yahoo.com [66.163.169.77]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47Hg1cK002563 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 11:42:01 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030507174201.50976.qmail@web80104.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80104.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 10:42:01 PDT Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 10:42:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305071652.h47GqGX7022598@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Need information on the Rowenta DG-580/DG-050 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kathleen wrote: > unless they have changed their usual policy, irons > are not included with the > discount coupon ...unless, it is specific for that > appliance. > If you spend hours with iron in hand on a regular > basis, you might find this > Rowenta a plus. Otherwise, I would recommend the > model that sells for about > $80-100 . I've bought three in the last 20 years and > find the brand to stand > up well. The biggest problem I have experienced is > that they tend to "spit" > as they age. I used to be able to send it in for > repair but they > discontinued the service except for irons under > warranty...and of course, > the iron lasts Long beyond that time period. Thanks for the "heads-up"; it turns out the coupon isn't good on irons (I didn't read the small print closely enough). I like the Rowenta irons (I'm on my 2nd in 10 years--I dropped the first one and it leaks), as they produce lots of steam at high temperature, but I need something that can produce steam while pressing at low temp. I also need something with a much larger water tank; it gets annoying to refill the iron several times when pressing a large quantity of fabric after pre-washing it. I may have to continue saving up for a Sussman. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 14:58:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47IwAqa027520 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 14:58:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Itvdx002380 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 12:55:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47ItuhW027167; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:55:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47ItphW027121 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:55:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f1c.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.28]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 36C155EE159 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 20:55:50 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000c01c314ca$5da54f50$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 20:56:27 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] fashion prints. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ok guys, sorry for being a pestilens with this topic, but i thoaght i wanted to tell you, that today i was given permission to take photos of this rare issue of fashion prints: Galleries des Modes et Costumes Francaises. Also the lovely old embroidery patterns from 1720. So when i have the day off next week, you can find me on the museums library, taking photos. This is the most beautifull of all old fashion prints, they are hand water colour painted and i am sure i will find a lot of inspiring dresses to make. This is my first week where i myself has designed my working week. I have monday, tuesday and wednesday off my job, and then i work thursday from 8 - 16.30, friday from 8 - 16.30. saturday from 8 - 16.00 and sunday from 8 - 16.00. I guess i wont make much costume related those days, but having 3 whole days off to make costumes will be lovely. I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it monday, so it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i realised that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs with bias tape. What is your most hidious sewing job? Sorry to be off topic and chatting, i am in a chatting mood. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 15:21:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JLhqa027629 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:21:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JJYdx004962 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 13:19:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JJXhW015118; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:19:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JJPhW014972 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:19:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.104] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A9031B080158; Wed, 07 May 2003 15:05:39 -0400 Message-ID: <001301c314ce$01cdf840$685183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000c01c314ca$5da54f50$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 15:22:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Alterations on ready-mades. I hate having to correct problems that were caused by bad cutting, inattention to grain, poor stitching or inappropriate choice of stitching. Running a costume shop has presented some or all of the above in my 25 yr+ experience. I"d rather make it new...and have done so many times. That is how I got started. Tedious work , well I guess putting hand hems in 6 yd skirts. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 2:56 PM Subject: [h-cost] fashion prints. > Ok guys, sorry for being a pestilens with this topic, but i thoaght i wanted > to tell you, that today i was given permission to take photos of this rare > issue of fashion prints: Galleries des Modes et Costumes Francaises. Also > the lovely old embroidery patterns from 1720. > So when i have the day off next week, you can find me on the museums > library, taking photos. > This is the most beautifull of all old fashion prints, they are hand water > colour painted and i am sure i will find a lot of inspiring dresses to make. > This is my first week where i myself has designed my working week. I have > monday, tuesday and wednesday off my job, and then i work thursday from 8 - > 16.30, friday from 8 - 16.30. saturday from 8 - 16.00 and sunday from 8 - > 16.00. I guess i wont make much costume related those days, but having 3 > whole days off to make costumes will be lovely. > I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it monday, so > it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i realised > that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs with bias > tape. > What is your most hidious sewing job? > Sorry to be off topic and chatting, i am in a chatting mood. > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 15:23:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JMxqa027634 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:22:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JKwdx005093 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 13:20:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JKwhW016037; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:20:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JKthW016012 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:20:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h47JKt8S012287 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:20:55 -0400 Message-Id: <200305071920.h47JKt8S012287@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 19:17:43 -0000 To: Historical Costume From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 Subject: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello Bjarne, It's not the worst, but it's close. Sewing with plain woven linen tape is worse, because it's heavier and doesn't flex as easily in and out of the edges of the tabs. Leather would be more difficult to get the needle through, so it's even worse than that. But the really hideous job is binding those tabs after you've been wearing the stays for a while and just hadn't gotten around to it yet. Consider yourself lucky that you're working on new, unworn clothing! -Carol Bjarne og Leif Drews said: > I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it monday, so > it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i realised > that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs with bias > tape. > What is your most hidious sewing job? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 15:29:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JT6qa027640 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:29:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JR4dx005802 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 13:27:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JR2hW024438; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:27:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JQvhW024076 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:26:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.96] (pm4-096.eos.net [205.133.149.96]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA27218 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:26:55 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 15:22:10 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305071315.h47DFHme007488@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: valkyrie X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I haven't done any Viking research for years, but in my college days I did quite a bit and I don't remember ever seeing anything about Valkyries, beyond the name. Certainly no armor. I wouldn't be surprised if there isn't anything. I would go for fantasy, either opera-style or going off of typical Viking armor and combining it with Nordic women's magic (seidr/sedr -- sp?). There was specific clothing associated with that. Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 15:37:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Jb8qa027671 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:37:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JYqdx006756 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 13:34:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JYlhW007547; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:34:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe24.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.81]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47JYehW006699 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 13:34:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 7 May 2003 12:34:35 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe24.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 07 May 2003 19:34:34 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305071920.h47JKt8S012287@jefferson.patriot.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 15:33:53 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 May 2003 19:34:35.0032 (UTC) FILETIME=[B09C3980:01C314CF] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What I hate is not in the sewing part. I love hand sewing, and I don't really have anything against machine sewing. What I hate is marking and cutting. Preparing the fabric is fun, I don't mind ironing, I don't even mind zigzagging the edges, I just hate placing the fabric, pinning pattern pieces, marking (that has to be the very worst part) and cutting. I think the second thing I hate most is putting an insert such as a gore inside a slit. It comes second only because there's less of it than cutting :-) > Bjarne og Leif Drews said: > > I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it monday, so > > it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i realised > > that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs with bias > > tape. > > What is your most hidious sewing job? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 16:42:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Kgsqa027935 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:42:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Kefdx014048 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 14:40:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47KeYOj001130; Wed, 7 May 2003 14:40:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47KeVOj001102 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 14:40:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA05698 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:40:31 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-33-100-243.asm.bellsouth.net [67.33.100.243]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA22897 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:40:30 -0400 Message-ID: <02d401c314d8$764cec30$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000c01c314ca$5da54f50$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 16:37:22 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I know you probably can't share the pictures of the prints at the museum, but I hope you will share photos of your new creations. I enjoy your work so much! I have spoken of it to others so now you have non-costumers going to your site to drool too! Teena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 2:56 PM Subject: [h-cost] fashion prints. > Ok guys, sorry for being a pestilens with this topic, but i thoaght i wanted > to tell you, that today i was given permission to take photos of this rare > issue of fashion prints: Galleries des Modes et Costumes Francaises. Also > the lovely old embroidery patterns from 1720. > So when i have the day off next week, you can find me on the museums > library, taking photos. > This is the most beautifull of all old fashion prints, they are hand water > colour painted and i am sure i will find a lot of inspiring dresses to make. > This is my first week where i myself has designed my working week. I have > monday, tuesday and wednesday off my job, and then i work thursday from 8 - > 16.30, friday from 8 - 16.30. saturday from 8 - 16.00 and sunday from 8 - > 16.00. I guess i wont make much costume related those days, but having 3 > whole days off to make costumes will be lovely. > I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it monday, so > it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i realised > that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs with bias > tape. > What is your most hidious sewing job? > Sorry to be off topic and chatting, i am in a chatting mood. > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 18:11:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47MBCqa028198 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:11:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47M91dx024187 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 16:09:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47M8whE007870; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:08:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47M8qhE007768 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:08:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6DD77A8B7 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:08:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 96015-06 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:07:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-202-187-163.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.202.187.163]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43ABB7AC36 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:06:57 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 15:07:22 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Heather Meadows To: h-costume@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <46FE4E7E-80D8-11D7-A981-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [h-cost] Sutters Fort Dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A friend of a friend (she's a teacher) needs a "Sutter's Fort Pioneer Dress" kind of costume. I'm assuming that is 1850s or so? I have no idea. I'm not going to be making the dress, but the friend that will (who is not a costumer) asked for advice on patterns. Any suggestions? thanks! .heather. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 18:38:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47McWqa028310 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:38:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47MaPdx027991 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 16:36:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47MaOhE029684; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:36:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h47MaJhE029631 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:36:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 23278 invoked from network); 7 May 2003 22:36:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail2.inreach.com) (209.142.2.51) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 7 May 2003 22:36:19 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Wed, 7 May 2003 15:36:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <16489.162.119.64.111.1052346979.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 15:36:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sutters Fort Dress From: To: In-Reply-To: <46FE4E7E-80D8-11D7-A981-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> References: <46FE4E7E-80D8-11D7-A981-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > A friend of a friend (she's a teacher) > needs a "Sutter's Fort Pioneer Dress" > kind of costume. > > I'm assuming that is 1850s or so? > I have no idea. I'm not going to be > making the dress, but the friend that > will (who is not a costumer) asked for > advice on patterns. Any suggestions? James Townsend & son is a company that has items/books/patterns for items from the revolutionary war to the Civil War. You can check them out on line at: http://www.jastown.com/newhome.htm I can't vouch for how easy the patterns are, but she can at least look. Simplicity has some patterns that aren't horrible but they seem more like ballgowns rather than everyday dresses. Good luck! Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 18:57:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47MvLqa028399 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:57:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47MtEdx000176 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 16:55:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47MtDLn013525; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:55:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47Mt8Ln013426 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:55:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AEF8AE2008A; Wed, 07 May 2003 17:55:52 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AEDC120338; Wed, 07 May 2003 17:55:24 -0500 Message-ID: <005d01c314eb$8acf0900$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000c01c314ca$5da54f50$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 18:53:56 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Congrads Bjarne on getting permission!!!!!! Great job!!!! Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 19:12:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47NCYqa028479 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 19:12:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47NAXdx002194 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 17:10:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47NAWLn023872; Wed, 7 May 2003 17:10:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gw.retro.com (gw.retro.com [205.179.181.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47NATLn023843 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 17:10:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by gw.retro.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id h47N9qt02652 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:09:52 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 16:09:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Thompson-Herbert Message-Id: <200305072309.h47N9qt02652@gw.retro.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kate Pinner wrote: > > The dyes will sit on the surface of nylons and polyesters as compared with true reaction and absorption with natural fibers. Nylon and polyester are essentially smooth monofilament fibers and are non absorbant. > > > > Then how come nylon dance leos and tights take dye beautifully? Nylon is dyeable with silk (acid) dyes. Fiber reactive dyes are much more unpredictable. Rayon is dyeable with procion dyes, because's it's a cellulosic fibre. The real problem with some nylons is that they've been treated with an oily compound to make the fibres slick. Parachute and kite nylon has that problem unless you buy untreated stuff. This problem usually comes up when making banners and flags. Polyester and acrylic have the color milled into the fibre during manufacturing, so forget trying to dye those. Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 19:44:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47NiQqa028608 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 19:44:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47NgNdx004855 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 17:42:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47NgLLn013066; Wed, 7 May 2003 17:42:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from janus.directcon.net (janus.directcon.net [206.170.184.16]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h47NgILn013040 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 17:42:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dnyeaqvf (r14a91.directcon.net [207.215.72.91]) by janus.directcon.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h47NjJl25531; Wed, 7 May 2003 16:45:19 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20030507155514.00cb72f0@pop.directcon.net> X-Sender: margospatterns@pop.directcon.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 15:55:14 -0700 To: Historical Costume , h-costume@indra.com From: Margo Anderson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sutters Fort Dress In-Reply-To: <46FE4E7E-80D8-11D7-A981-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 03:07 PM 05/07/2003 -0700, Heather Meadows wrote: >A friend of a friend (she's a teacher) >needs a "Sutter's Fort Pioneer Dress" > kind of costume. Easy, easy! Sutter's Fort sells a pattern for a wrapper style dress, created by one of their long time docents, which I have been told fits like a dream and is easy to sew. I don't have the contact information handy, but the Sutter's Fort store is in the phone book. Margo "One Tough Costumer" www.margospatterns.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 20:38:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h480cNqa028755 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 20:38:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h480aJdx009080 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 18:36:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h480aHm2010341; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:36:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h480aEm2010311 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:36:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-33-85.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.33.85])h480a6Pr020799 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 19:36:13 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030507171421.04fafcc0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 17:36:00 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507110734.00a71c60@mail.attbi.com> References: <4.3.1.2.20030506212810.051534d0@mail.frys.com> <20030507001606.6391.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Kayta and everybody else going to costume college: Please wear your name >tags. I am so looking forward to picking you out of the crowd at >college. Unless of course, I will be able to identify you by your dolls >Kayta. that I really want to see. I am very excited about it this >year. I love being able to take classes and meet people and shop and be >something other than a geologist for a change. Even though everyone is >very indulgent about my avocation, it is nice to be with people who >actually share it. I had a discussion about fitting Elizabethan corsets >versus Victorian corsets with another costumer in a crowded elevator at >work one morning. Other than our conversation you could have heard a pin >drop. Afterwards someone asked me if I was a fetishist. In an Elizabethan? > >And no, Jessica, I don't wear a costume. but look for me in a phony grass >skirt on Friday night... I've been dealing with this question for many years. I always actually wear/carry my name tag somewhere. I have learned a couple of new places to hide it from this list, the best suggestion being to make a period-looking one (what fun - more period accessories!). When I hide mine it usually goes under a lapel or on the layer right inside the jacket. When mine must be visible at all times, I don't usually pin it right in front. At those times I pin it on a sleeve, right under the sleeve cap at the side (where a tattoo would be). That way it kind of shows from the front but isn't so obtrusive, and it doesn't catch on or hide the jewelry. And the main reason I started making shoulder-sitting dolls in the first place was to hold my name tag for me. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 20:38:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h480csqa028758 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 20:38:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h480apdx009128 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 18:36:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h480aom2010590; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:36:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h480aDm2010279 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:36:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-33-85.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.33.85])h480a6Pp020799 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 19:36:11 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030507170820.05205d50@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 17:13:40 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: what to wear at CC (was Re: [h-cost] non-period name tags In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO jessica stier writes, in a message sent 03:40 PM 5/7/03 +0000: >I can see how this would be annoying!!! All the work goes into making a >garment as accurate as possible and a non period name tag would just clash. >Perhaps you can devise some way to make your own name tag - embroidered or >beaded or something that would be more visually pleasing? > >So, what do people wear at Costume College? Do you come in costume? Or >do you wear streat clothes all day and at night wear costumes? I couldn't >really get this from the website. In a word - anything. I plan to wear at least one historical, one fibre-art thing with street clothes, and maybe my Harry Potter academic robe. I will fill in with sarees. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 21:10:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h481AQqa029214 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 21:10:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4818Hdx011594 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 19:08:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4818GwF026240; Wed, 7 May 2003 19:08:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4818EwF026194 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 19:08:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a22.in-tch.com [66.62.107.2]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h480o2D25993 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 18:50:02 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EB9AE4C.B1EDA145@in-tch.com> Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 19:09:32 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs References: <200305071920.h47JKt8S012287@jefferson.patriot.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My most awful sewing jobs have not been clothing related. The worst would be awnings. Really, really big awnings--like 60 ft long, and several feet wide. Even the smaller ones are cranky--all kinds of fabric fitting very, very precisely into the most amazing oddly-angled planes, all to create a rigid, 3-dimensional "shell" over the awning frame. Every tiny bit of bias, every tiny shift of fabric on way or another can create an unwanted wrinkle or bubble or warp, so they are continually tweaked. Made out of heavy vinyl, and intended to be back lit, so every stitch must be perfect, and there can be no "extra" holes. Including where you start and end seams. The graphics on them have to be extra-perfect, because the slightest anomaly casts shadows with the back-lighting. Second on my list of least-favorite jobs would be really big tents, especially the circus-sized ones made of (you guessed it)...vinyl. I ruined my hands making those things, and I am *so* glad I don't ever, ever have to make another one. --sue, who would much rather do embroidery, or something historical..... aquazoo@patriot.net wrote: > > Hello Bjarne, > > It's not the worst, but it's close. Sewing with plain woven linen tape is > worse, because it's heavier and doesn't flex as easily in and out of the edges > of the tabs. Leather would be more difficult to get the needle through, so > it's even worse than that. But the really hideous job is binding those tabs > after you've been wearing the stays for a while and just hadn't gotten around > to it yet. Consider yourself lucky that you're working on new, unworn > clothing! > > -Carol > > Bjarne og Leif Drews said: > > I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it monday, so > > it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i realised > > that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs with bias > > tape. > > What is your most hidious sewing job? > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 21:17:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h481HUqa029223 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 21:17:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h481FSdx012084 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 19:15:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h481FRwF029675; Wed, 7 May 2003 19:15:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc53.attbi.com (rwcrmhc53.attbi.com [204.127.198.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h481FPwF029624 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 19:15:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hopperflop2 (c-24-130-252-190.we.client2.attbi.com[24.130.252.190]) by attbi.com (rwcrmhc53) with SMTP id <2003050801152005300fh2tue>; Thu, 8 May 2003 01:15:20 +0000 Message-ID: <005e01c314ff$4b17c1d0$befc8218@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 18:15:20 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [h-cost] Roomate for Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Heather Meadows (also on this list) and myself are looking for a third roommate for Costume College. We're planning to spend Thurs., Fri., and Sat. nights at the hotel, and if we can get a third it will be $100 per person for all three nights. About us: friendly, redheads, non-snorers, non-smokers. Awfully handy at fastening complicated dresses, lacing corsets, and any other lady's maid-type duties you may require. Promise not to take over the entire room with all of our costumes. Interested? Email me off list. - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 7 23:47:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h483lYqa029494 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 23:47:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h483jQdx024438 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 21:45:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h483jNqZ009280; Wed, 7 May 2003 21:45:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f102.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h483jLqZ009216 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 21:45:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 7 May 2003 20:45:16 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 08 May 2003 03:45:16 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 20:45:16 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 May 2003 03:45:16.0844 (UTC) FILETIME=[3D4C36C0:01C31514] Subject: [h-cost] Re: Black, X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >He also remembered that in a number of vellum manuscripts, the black has >eaten through the pages, He reckons that you'd need an industrial chemist >to >really work out what's going on. Anyone got a tame one? I sent this to my father-in-law,, who happens to be an industrial chemist and asked what he thinks. I'll forward the answer back to the list. Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 00:42:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h484gGqa029591 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 00:42:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h484eBdx028806 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 22:40:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h484e9q5003846; Wed, 7 May 2003 22:40:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h484e5q5003804 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 22:40:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from user-33qtkcp.dialup.mindspring.com ([199.174.209.153] helo=pavilion) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19DdCO-0007Lh-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 07 May 2003 21:40:05 -0700 Message-ID: <000901c3151d$b78e5860$99d1aec7@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305071920.h47JKt8S012287@jefferson.patriot.net> <3EB9AE4C.B1EDA145@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 21:53:04 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO hideous sewing jobs... TENTS, I agree to that one! After a successful quick and simple medieval bell tent I decided to make a 14 by 28 oval tent and 14 feet high. You know, the really pedantically authentic kind, except for the fact that I used cotton fabric instead of linen. It was cream with blue stripes on every seam, triple stitched too. Used blue thread (the stripe colour) for the top thread and bobbin so the blue would show through on the white inside fabric as if were hand sewn. Even used my software and computerized sewing machine to make handsewen looking rope holes with slightly staggard edges on them so no grommets were needed. The group it was sewn for disbanded pretty much after the first trial of getting the thing erected so it's probably sitting in a shed somewhere now and I don't even have decent pictures of it. I thought, never again, but now, since my loose arrangement with the group that had a nice structure for me to use for my tailor's shop fell through, I'm thinking of sewing some sort of tent/shop. I swore that was the end of tent making for me, but........I need a shop now and one that won't require me to buy a truck and flatbed trailor too. At least it wasn't vinyl. That would be hell and then some!! Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 6:09 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs > My most awful sewing jobs have not been clothing related. > The worst would be awnings. > Really, really big awnings--like 60 ft long, and several feet wide. > Even the smaller ones are cranky--all kinds of fabric fitting very, very > precisely into the most amazing oddly-angled planes, all to create a > rigid, 3-dimensional "shell" over the awning frame. Every tiny bit of > bias, every tiny shift of fabric on way or another can create an > unwanted wrinkle or bubble or warp, so they are continually tweaked. > Made out of heavy vinyl, and intended to be back lit, so every stitch > must be perfect, and there can be no "extra" holes. Including where you > start and end seams. > The graphics on them have to be extra-perfect, because the slightest > anomaly casts shadows with the back-lighting. > Second on my list of least-favorite jobs would be really big tents, > especially the circus-sized ones made of (you guessed it)...vinyl. > I ruined my hands making those things, and I am *so* glad I don't ever, > ever have to make another one. > --sue, who would much rather do embroidery, or something historical..... > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 01:36:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h485aQqa029674 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 01:36:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h485YOdx002103 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 7 May 2003 23:34:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h485YNZo026249; Wed, 7 May 2003 23:34:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h485YMZo026231 for ; Wed, 7 May 2003 23:34:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEJ00JGDZH8E2@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 07 May 2003 22:34:21 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 22:28:18 -0700 From: Kimiko Small X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030507222038.02c57620@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/6/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] going to Costume College!!! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I get to go to Costume College!!! Woohooooo!!! I had to share. I so wanted to go and hubby said yes. He figures he leaves me alone with our baby three weeks of the year for him to attend computer conferences, so this is only fair that I get to go. Three days of just doing costume related stuff, and going to make a trip to the garment district. Are the good stores, especially the trim shops, open on Sunday, or is Monday a better day for that area. I am sure someone here knows. I have only been there once before. Hmmm... is there a map somewhere for that district? A friend drove when I went, so I am not sure how to get there. Wooohoooo! Count me in on the "Red H" brigade. And I am even bringing a friend who is relatively new to costuming. Kimiko (doing a happy Snoopy dance!) Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 02:06:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4866Pqa031528 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 02:06:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4864Mdx004018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 00:04:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4864LlP009395; Thu, 8 May 2003 00:04:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web9402.mail.yahoo.com (web9402.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.108]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4864JlP009366 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 00:04:19 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030508060419.94590.qmail@web9402.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.78.208.191] by web9402.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 07 May 2003 23:04:19 PDT Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 23:04:19 -0700 (PDT) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] going to Costume College!!! To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030507222038.02c57620@127.0.0.1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Whoooo!!Terrific, Kimiko! It will be great to meet you and the other H-Costumners in person, finally:)There are SO many place to look at down in the LA Garment District----I usually shop along a couple of block area---around Maple, Wall, Streets, between 8th and 9th Streets. Maple Street seemed to have lots of bridal and trim and button shops. Concentrated just within that few blocks are a LOT of stores.It's late , my brain is fading--so I can't supply you with any names offhand---but hopefully some will come back tomorrow --after some sleep ---and some java:)Albra(off to happy costumning dreamland) Kimiko Small wrote:I get to go to Costume College!!! Woohooooo!!! I had to share. I so wanted to go and hubby said yes. He figures he leaves me alone with our baby three weeks of the year for him to attend computer conferences, so this is only fair that I get to go. Three days of just doing costume related stuff, and going to make a trip to the garment district. Are the good stores, especially the trim shops, open on Sunday, or is Monday a better day for that area. I am sure someone here knows. I have only been there once before. Hmmm... is there a map somewhere for that district? A friend drove when I went, so I am not sure how to get there. Wooohoooo! Count me in on the "Red H" brigade. And I am even bringing a friend who is relatively new to costuming. Kimiko (doing a happy Snoopy dance!) Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 02:48:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h486mTqa013118 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 02:48:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h486kOdx006410 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 00:46:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h486kNlP026626; Thu, 8 May 2003 00:46:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net (stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.188]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h486kLlP026613 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 00:46:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-004-080.jps.net ([216.119.4.80] helo=w7m1l6) by stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19DfAa-0000YD-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 07 May 2003 23:46:20 -0700 Message-ID: <000201c3152d$7983d3a0$500477d8@w7m1l6> From: "Stephen Bergdahl" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000c01c314ca$5da54f50$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <001301c314ce$01cdf840$685183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 19:53:45 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-ELNK-Trace: 08dba192340bde6e1a6ab3b9b70940f894f5150ab1c16ac027907a4ca0ac1adf74d009b70af8c8d8ff12ad4d5d50be29350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stephen's Costume Rule #2 - I only do alterations for people I am sleeping with. This keeps the list short. Is it just me or are off the rack clothing getting worst. Use to be I could take a pair of pants apart no problem. Now it is a pain just to open up the back seam to take them in. Cheap fabric, and overlocked thread, or worst chain stitch. AHHHHH! Stephen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 12:22 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. > Alterations on ready-mades. I hate having to correct problems that were > caused by bad cutting, inattention to grain, poor stitching or inappropriate > choice of stitching. Running a costume shop has presented some or all of the > above in my 25 yr+ experience. I"d rather make it new...and have done so > many times. That is how I got started. Tedious work , well I guess putting > hand hems in 6 yd skirts. > Kathleen > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 03:57:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h487vCqa011349 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 03:57:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h487tBdx009954 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 01:55:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h487t8sN024053; Thu, 8 May 2003 01:55:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h487t4sN024018 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 01:55:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h487t4p01418.; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:55:04 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 08 May 2003 08:55:03 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 08:54:57 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: [h-cost] Re: valkyrie Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h487t4sN024018 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I know very little about Vikings, but surely the Valkyries were mythological beings? There can't be a "right" way to dress one, can there, only your interpretation of how people of that time would envisage them? Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 05:05:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48959qa032072 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 05:05:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48936dx013554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 03:03:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h489337O021118; Thu, 8 May 2003 03:03:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grunt4.ihug.co.nz (grunt4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.254.44]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4892w7O021046 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 03:02:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from p918-apx1.akl.ihug.co.nz (ihug.co.nz) [203.173.195.156] by grunt4.ihug.co.nz with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19DhIl-00051q-00; Thu, 08 May 2003 21:02:56 +1200 Message-ID: <3EBA1D3A.9050004@ihug.co.nz> Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 21:02:50 +1200 From: michaela User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] HELP?! Looking for sources for Viking/Valkyrie Images References: <20030507133517.47108.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20030507133517.47108.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > >>re fantasy...and lots are a real >>Hoot ! And after all isn't the character of 'valkyrie' somewhat of a >>fantasy in itself? >>Kathleen >> >>Oh good idea, search for Richard Wagner and Ring der Nibelungen or Siegfried or >>Walkueren (can't do u umlaut here). >> >> Can't do umlaut here either;) Not even those quick keys I've been told about. Just as alt+print doesn't screen cap either;) Anyway... I have a few Opera Valkyries I could scan if they would be of use? From some fairly standard photos opera singers. Great Oper a Stars/Singers in Photographs I think... Pretty sure they are available through Dover. Oh and while I'm here, great costume Nicole:) Finally got a chance to go look last night:) Been busy documenting my next piece of garb:) And I may have some piccies that might inyterest you too:) michaela http://glittersweet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 06:47:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Al6qa032330 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 06:47:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Aj2dx018496 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 04:45:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Aj0SX024336; Thu, 8 May 2003 04:45:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48AiwSX024314 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 04:44:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-127-220.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.127.220])h48AivPj015845 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 05:44:57 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030508034022.00df0a00@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 03:44:51 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] HELP?! Looking for sources for Viking/Valkyrie Images In-Reply-To: <3EBA1D3A.9050004@ihug.co.nz> References: <20030507133517.47108.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> <20030507133517.47108.qmail@web41506.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h48AiwSX024314 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>>Oh good idea, search for Richard Wagner and Ring der Nibelungen or >>>Siegfried or >>>Walkueren (can't do u umlaut here). >>> >Can't do umlaut here either;) Not even those quick keys I've been told >about. Just as alt+print doesn't screen cap either;) Walküren. ü is 1 and 2 and 9 with the (alt) key held down. Umlauts are easy if you know how. Käthe _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 07:33:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48BXSqa032431 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 07:33:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48BVSdx020965 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 05:31:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48BVRmE013166; Thu, 8 May 2003 05:31:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48BVPmE013124 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 05:31:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.117] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id ACD1C4F01C8; Thu, 08 May 2003 07:17:37 -0400 Message-ID: <002101c31555$cc26bc80$755183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000c01c314ca$5da54f50$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711><001301c314ce$01cdf840$685183d1@rmitchellras> <000201c3152d$7983d3a0$500477d8@w7m1l6> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 07:34:29 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And for me now too, since I've down sized the business by cutting out rentals and other projects I no longer choose to do... As I said recently, saying NO is empowering. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Bergdahl" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 10:53 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. > Stephen's Costume Rule #2 - I only do alterations for people I am sleeping > with. > > This keeps the list short. Is it just me or are off the rack clothing > getting worst. Use to be I could take a pair of pants apart no problem. > Now it is a pain just to open up the back seam to take them in. Cheap > fabric, and overlocked thread, or worst chain stitch. AHHHHH! > > Stephen > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lloyd Mitchell" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 12:22 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. > > > > Alterations on ready-mades. I hate having to correct problems that were > > caused by bad cutting, inattention to grain, poor stitching or > inappropriate > > choice of stitching. Running a costume shop has presented some or all of > the > > above in my 25 yr+ experience. I"d rather make it new...and have done so > > many times. That is how I got started. Tedious work , well I guess putting > > hand hems in 6 yd skirts. > > Kathleen > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 09:53:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Dr1qa000324 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:53:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Doldx001042 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 07:50:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48DogWE015314; Thu, 8 May 2003 07:50:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.uttyl.edu (MAIL.UTTYL.EDU [198.213.56.77]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48DodWE015291 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 07:50:39 -0600 (MDT) To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 March 21, 2000 Message-ID: From: Vicki_Betts@mail.uttyl.edu Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 08:51:38 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on UT Tyler Admin/UT Tyler(Release 6.0.1|February 07, 2003) at 05/08/2003 08:51:44 AM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] Pre-Victoria Balmoral petticoats X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO We've had a question on a Civil War list about the history of Balmoral petticoats. These are decorative wool petticoats, usually with horizontal stripes along the bottom third or so of the garment. Sometimes they are a bright color (often red) and black, or the stripes may be multi-color. The dress skirt is often pinned or looped up, supposedly to keep it out of the mud or snow, or out of the way of skates, but became a fashion statement of its own, exposing dainty ankles and boots along with bright colors. There is an original in the Royal Ontario Museum which shows up in a book on Candian handwoven fabrics. The description in the book gives the account of an elderly Irish-Canadian woman complaining that in her youth the Scottish-Canadian girls wore the petticoats to church and barely got outside before hiking up their skirts to show their ankles. There is an original in the Wisconsin Historical Society's collection from a German-American woman. I saw two in a private collection near Kingston, TN--one very bright, and the other a sort of magenta and black. There are one or two in the collection of the Museum of Appalachia, and one at a small museum in Norris, TN. These petticoats turn up in 1860s Godey's and in 1860's fashion reports in newspapers. They also turn up mentioned in slave narratives, and in a turn of the century semi-fictional account of Appalachian handweaving, the title of which I can't recall at the moment (Aunt ____'s Coverlid?). The 1860's garment supposedly was adopted by Queen Victoria in her Scottish phase and of course was named (along with many other things, including boots) for her estate in Scotland. My question is--is this sort of petticoat with woven in horizontal stripes part of the pre-1850 Scottish tradition? also other traditions? created in mid-19th century but remained popular in more remote areas such as the Appalachians? Has anyone else seen original Balmoral petticoats? Vicki Betts vbetts@gower.net vbetts@mail.uttyl.edu _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 10:59:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48ExPqa000527 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:59:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Euqdx007486 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 08:56:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Euo5H024681; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:56:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80401.mail.yahoo.com (web80401.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48Eum5H024592 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:56:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030508145643.14525.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80401.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 08 May 2003 07:56:43 PDT Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 07:56:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305080037.h480b5m3010711@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Hideous sewing jobs X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kathleen wrote: Tedious work > , well I guess putting > hand hems in 6 yd skirts. I'll second that! And hand-felling seams. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:06:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F6lqa000574 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:06:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F4cdx008481 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:04:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F4b5H001134; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:04:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F4X5H001080 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:04:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be58.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.88]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 86C775EE0C3 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 17:04:32 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001501c31573$4717cbb0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000c01c314ca$5da54f50$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <005d01c314eb$8acf0900$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 17:05:34 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Penny. Thanks for that. You know, i have ben like a spoiled child who cant have his will with this projekt. And i also thoaght it was a strange thing, they would not let me photograph them. I am really glad that i dont have it this way with for instance, i want a Jaguar Car or something like that. Having giving permission for this, has made me very very happy. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 12:53 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] fashion prints. > Congrads Bjarne on getting permission!!!!!! Great job!!!! > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:09:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F90qa000591 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:09:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F6mdx008810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:06:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F6l5H002642; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:06:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48F6h5H002588 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:06:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be58.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.88]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 734605EE1AB for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 17:06:42 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001d01c31573$98d5b2f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030506212810.051534d0@mail.frys.com> <20030507001606.6391.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> <4.3.1.2.20030507171421.04fafcc0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 17:07:52 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO How about those small frame things they used to have miniature paintings in. With a chain. You could embroider the initials in this, and wear the juwel open. I think there are places they make fake ones of the old stuff. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 2:36 AM Subject: Re: non-period name tags (was Re: [h-cost] Costume College > > >Kayta and everybody else going to costume college: Please wear your name > >tags. I am so looking forward to picking you out of the crowd at > >college. Unless of course, I will be able to identify you by your dolls > >Kayta. that I really want to see. I am very excited about it this > >year. I love being able to take classes and meet people and shop and be > >something other than a geologist for a change. Even though everyone is > >very indulgent about my avocation, it is nice to be with people who > >actually share it. I had a discussion about fitting Elizabethan corsets > >versus Victorian corsets with another costumer in a crowded elevator at > >work one morning. Other than our conversation you could have heard a pin > >drop. Afterwards someone asked me if I was a fetishist. In an Elizabethan? > > > >And no, Jessica, I don't wear a costume. but look for me in a phony grass > >skirt on Friday night... > > I've been dealing with this question for many years. I always actually > wear/carry my name tag somewhere. I have learned a couple of new places to > hide it from this list, the best suggestion being to make a period-looking > one (what fun - more period accessories!). When I hide mine it usually > goes under a lapel or on the layer right inside the jacket. When mine must > be visible at all times, I don't usually pin it right in front. At those > times I pin it on a sleeve, right under the sleeve cap at the side (where a > tattoo would be). That way it kind of shows from the front but isn't so > obtrusive, and it doesn't catch on or hide the jewelry. And the main > reason I started making shoulder-sitting dolls in the first place was to > hold my name tag for me. > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:18:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FIjqa000635 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:18:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FBgdx009351 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:11:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FBf5H006208; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:11:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80401.mail.yahoo.com (web80401.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48FBd5H006134 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:11:39 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030508151134.17383.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80401.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 08 May 2003 08:11:34 PDT Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 08:11:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305080037.h480b5m3010711@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Duct-tape Elizabethans X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The ingenuity of high-school students never ceases to amaze me. Two students from Red Wing, Minn. built their prom clothes, court Elizabethans, out of 70 rolls of duct tape and 2 hula hoops. They are hoping to win $5K in college scholarship money offered by the makers of Duck brand duct tape for the most unusual use of duct tape for a prom. For the full article and picture, the link is: http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/0430ducttape-outfits-ON.html Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:31:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FVEqa000729 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:31:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FSndx011481 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:28:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FSm5H019523; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:28:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FSj5H019437 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:28:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a262.in-tch.com [66.62.107.62]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h48FAXD11548 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:10:33 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EBA77FD.BBA27588@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:30:05 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs References: <200305071920.h47JKt8S012287@jefferson.patriot.net> <000901c3151d$b78e5860$99d1aec7@pavilion> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, Lisa. We had a machine that made circular buttonholes that were grommet-sized for our tents (and for the lacing holes on the tipis), but did them by hand when needed (larger holes for smokeflap poles on some tipi styles, or for more-authentic tents). Punch the hole where you want the finished bit to be, and then just buttonhole stitch around the edge, using a heavy, waxed linen thread and a substantial glover's needle. If the fabric's particularly heavy or unwieldy, you can pull the needle through with a pair of pliers, but watch where you yank it! I have a pair of scars (looks like a snake bite) on the meaty, palm-side part of my right hand from when I wasn't watching. --sue, very glad to be sewing for fun these days! (and already saving her money for Atlanta next year--y'all look like you had *way* too much fun in Chicago!) Lisa Sinervo wrote: > > hideous sewing jobs... TENTS, I agree to that one! After a successful quick > and simple medieval bell tent I decided to make a 14 by 28 oval tent and 14 > feet high. You know, the really pedantically authentic kind, except for the > fact that I used cotton fabric instead of linen. It was cream with blue > stripes on every seam, triple stitched too. Used blue thread (the stripe > colour) for the top thread and bobbin so the blue would show through on the > white inside fabric as if were hand sewn. Even used my software and > computerized sewing machine to make handsewen looking rope holes with > slightly staggard edges on them so no grommets were needed. The group it > was sewn for disbanded pretty much after the first trial of getting the > thing erected so it's probably sitting in a shed somewhere now and I don't > even have decent pictures of it. I thought, never again, but now, since my > loose arrangement with the group that had a nice structure for me to use for > my tailor's shop fell through, I'm thinking of sewing some sort of > tent/shop. I swore that was the end of tent making for me, but........I > need a shop now and one that won't require me to buy a truck and flatbed > trailor too. At least it wasn't vinyl. That would be hell and then some!! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:35:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FZlqa000737 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:35:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FXhdx012108 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:33:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FXg5H023050; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:33:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80410.mail.yahoo.com (web80410.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48FXd5H022936 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:33:39 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030508153334.96674.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80410.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 08 May 2003 08:33:34 PDT Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 08:33:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305081507.h48F785I002896@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: going to Costume College!!! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kimiko wrote: > Three days of just doing costume related stuff, and > going to make a trip to > the garment district. Are the good stores, > especially the trim shops, open > on Sunday, or is Monday a better day for that area. > I am sure someone here > knows. I have only been there once before. Hmmm... > is there a map somewhere > for that district? A friend drove when I went, so I > am not sure how to get > there. OK, last question first. Print this e-mail out and put it in your Costume College notebook, as these are the best directions, from somebody used to driving down there from the hotel. Take Sherman Way (the main street in front of the hotel) EAST to the 405 Fwy. Get on the 405 going SOUTH. When you get to the interchange of the 405 and the 101, take the 101 SOUTH (Los Angeles). Take the 101 SOUTH to the interchange of the 101 and the 170, and get onto 170 SOUTH (Los Angeles). Take the 170 SOUTH to the interchange of the 170 and the 110 Fwy, and get onto the 110 SOUTH. It's the first exit of the interchange, and only 1 lane, so be ready for it. Once you are on the 110 Fwy, you'll want to get over to the left about 3 lanes, or you'll immediately exit off the freeway into downtown Los Angeles. Take the 110 SOUTH to the 8th Street/9th Street offramp and exit. Go straight through the first intersection (8th Street) and turn left at the 2nd intersection (9th Street). If you're going the right direction, you'll go under the freeway. Continue on 9th street about 3/4 mile. They've now marked the Garment District with big City signs saying "Los Angeles Fashion District," so you'll know when you get there. The most central lot to park is on top of the building that is on the northwest corner of 9th and Wall (Shannon Fabrics is on the Corner of 9th and Wall). Turn left on Wall, go up about 100 feet, and you'll see the entrance to the parking lot (inside the building, up a ramp). The last time I was there (about 3 weeks ago), it was $4 to park all day. Now to your first question: Best days. Mondays are the best days, as everybody is open. Sunday is OK (but you'll miss the Tea Party). Saturday is bad, as many of the jobbers are Jewish, and are closed for the Sabbath. I hope this answers your questions. If you need more information, try to touch bases with me at Costume College. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:39:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FdEqa000752 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:39:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fatdx012621 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:36:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fas5H025234; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:36:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Faq5H025113 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:36:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a262.in-tch.com [66.62.107.62]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h48FIeD16347 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:18:40 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EBA79E4.6DA0AA3B@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:38:12 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Pre-Victoria Balmoral petticoats References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I dunno about Scots-related traditions for petticoats of these sorts (although they sound like *lots* of fun!), but there's a fairly decent history of *Irish* women wearing red petticoats. ISTR (book's in the other room) seeing a watercolored "sketch" of, I think, an 18th? c. Irish woman clearly wearing a red petticoat with, I *think*, a black stripe on it, reminiscent of the stripes/bands one sees on GermanRen stuff. --sue Vicki_Betts@mail.uttyl.edu wrote: > > We've had a question on a Civil War list about the history of Balmoral > petticoats. These are decorative wool petticoats, usually with horizontal > stripes along the bottom third or so of the garment. Sometimes they are a > bright color (often red) and black, or the stripes may be multi-color. The > dress skirt is often pinned or looped up, supposedly to keep it out of the > mud or snow, or out of the way of skates, but became a fashion statement of > its own, exposing dainty ankles and boots along with bright colors. There > is an original in the Royal Ontario Museum which shows up in a book on > Candian handwoven fabrics. The description in the book gives the account > of an elderly Irish-Canadian woman complaining that in her youth the > Scottish-Canadian girls wore the petticoats to church and barely got > outside before hiking up their skirts to show their ankles. There is an > original in the Wisconsin Historical Society's collection from a > German-American woman. I saw two in a private collection near Kingston, > TN--one very bright, and the other a sort of magenta and black. There are > one or two in the collection of the Museum of Appalachia, and one at a > small museum in Norris, TN. These petticoats turn up in 1860s Godey's and > in 1860's fashion reports in newspapers. They also turn up mentioned in > slave narratives, and in a turn of the century semi-fictional account of > Appalachian handweaving, the title of which I can't recall at the moment > (Aunt ____'s Coverlid?). The 1860's garment supposedly was adopted by > Queen Victoria in her Scottish phase and of course was named (along with > many other things, including boots) for her estate in Scotland. My > question is--is this sort of petticoat with woven in horizontal stripes > part of the pre-1850 Scottish tradition? also other traditions? created > in mid-19th century but remained popular in more remote areas such as the > Appalachians? Has anyone else seen original Balmoral petticoats? > > Vicki Betts > vbetts@gower.net > vbetts@mail.uttyl.edu > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:41:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fflqa000757 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:41:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FdLdx013052 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:39:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FdL5H027071; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:39:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48FdH5H026948 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:39:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWunDrjvBpY8dxkcFUIb/LvZXlzxVRLm6aQ==">; Thu, 08 May 2003 08:38:57 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HXNVUZYQ; Thu, 08 May 2003 08:38:57 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 11:37:39 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Ducts Elizabethans Message-ID: <20030508.113739.-229279.5.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 5-7 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It is wonderful what kids can do when they set their imaginations in the right direction. Time spent making Duck tape costumes sure beats time spent cruising around in cars and looking for mischief to get into. These two did a terrific job with their costumes too. I wonder if they make them from fabric first and then cover it with the tape. It would be too sticky to just make with tape alone. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:45:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fjaqa000769 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:45:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FhLdx013780 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:43:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48FhF5H029996; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:43:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f55.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.55]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fh65H029725 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:43:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 8 May 2003 08:43:01 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 08 May 2003 15:43:00 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 08:43:00 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 May 2003 15:43:01.0153 (UTC) FILETIME=[81A04910:01C31578] Subject: [h-cost] Re: Black, X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Jim says the Tannic acid attacks the proteen that is silk. will eat it with >time. >Marlene Sena >The Sitkum Soap Works >Handmade Goats Milk Soap >Myrtle Point,Oregon >www.sitkum.com > > That is the answer from an industrial chemist. Acids that eat the protiens in fiber. Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:48:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fm6qa000773 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:48:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fjwdx014146 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:45:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fjv5H002205; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:45:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from swmail.southwest.tn.edu (swmail.southwest.tn.edu [198.146.128.51]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fjt5H002115 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:45:55 -0600 (MDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Duct-tape Elizabethans Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 10:45:15 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Duct-tape Elizabethans Thread-Index: AcMVdV81frdYD60XTYq9RMjYJogB3AABJV1w From: "Gloster, Kendall" To: "Historical Costume" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h48Fjt5H002115 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would have given it a go if they had had something like that when I was in school. (grin) The winners for 2002 also did an outfit from the Middle Ages. http://www.ducktapeclub.com/contest_all/winners.asp Luca -----Original Message----- From: Dawn Jacobson [mailto:dme_maud@pacbell.net] Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 10:12 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Duct-tape Elizabethans The ingenuity of high-school students never ceases to amaze me. Two students from Red Wing, Minn. built their prom clothes, court Elizabethans, out of 70 rolls of duct tape and 2 hula hoops. They are hoping to win $5K in college scholarship money offered by the makers of Duck brand duct tape for the most unusual use of duct tape for a prom. For the full article and picture, the link is: http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/0430ducttape-outfits-ON.html Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 11:58:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fw9qa000784 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:58:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fu3dx015432 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 09:56:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Fu2l8009593; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:56:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay2.primushost.com (relay2.primushost.com [207.244.125.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Ftwl9009546 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 09:55:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from (shell3.shore.net) [207.244.124.103] by relay2.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 19Dnmz-0007P2-00; Thu, 08 May 2003 11:58:33 -0400 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for id 19Dnkd-0006IO-00; Thu, 08 May 2003 11:56:07 -0400 Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 11:56:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Katy Bishop To: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid In-Reply-To: <20030506221250.26110.qmail@web20206.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: Historical Costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tue, 6 May 2003, Angela Kovatch wrote: >Does anyone have a good source for silk lace? I'm >guessing if I could just get silk it would match close >enough without my messing with it, and the stuff I >bought (2" wide venise) is gorgeous but so cheap I >wouldn't mind buying other stuff instead. I know G-Street fabrics in Rockville Maryland had wonderful imported silk French laces a couple of years ago. Might be worth contacting them. http://www.gstreetfabrics.com/ Thye don't do online, used to do mailorder. I hear they have scaled back of late though. Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 12:04:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48G45qa000805 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:04:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48G1sdx016152 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 10:01:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48G1rl8014078; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:01:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80410.mail.yahoo.com (web80410.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48G1ml8013962 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:01:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030508160143.2228.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80410.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 08 May 2003 09:01:43 PDT Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:01:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305081507.h48F785I002896@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Saying "No" (was "fashion prints") X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kathleen wrote: > And for me now too, since I've down sized the > business by cutting out > rentals and other projects I no longer choose to > do... As I said recently, > saying NO is empowering. Oddly, I think it's having an effect with all these costumers saying "No." I'm starting to think there may be a shortage of good, hardworking, professional costumers. In the past 3 weeks, I've been offered 2 different jobs at shops, and yesterday had the truly weird experience of 2 people asking me if I could please start my own shop so they could work for me. As I really don't want to keep working the same number of hours I'm working now for 50% of the pay, I'm also saying "No." On another topic, thanks to everyone for the iron information and opinions. I've also done some additional research, and talked to some experts offline, and have decided to spring for a Sussman. A bit more expensive, but they have the best reputation and are the easiest to get parts for and fix. With what I've spent on Rowenta irons in the past 10 years, I could have just about paid for the Sussman. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 12:45:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Gjaqa000931 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:45:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48GhUdx022298 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 10:43:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48GhSl8020370; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:43:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48GhPl8020318 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 10:43:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEK008N5UGAQF@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 08 May 2003 09:43:23 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:01:31 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: going to Costume College!!! In-reply-to: <20030508153334.96674.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030508090111.02d0dad8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/6/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <200305081507.h48F785I002896@net.indra.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 08:33 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Print this e-mail out and put it in your Costume >College notebook, as these are the best directions, >from somebody used to driving down there from the >hotel. Thank you so much Dawn. I look forward to meeting you at CC. Kimiko _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 13:05:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48H53qa000990 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 13:05:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48H2kdx024950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 11:02:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48H2XGe006824; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:02:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48H2KGe006618 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 11:02:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEK00KBJVBVR9@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 08 May 2003 10:02:20 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:56:09 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Pre-Victoria Balmoral petticoats In-reply-to: <3EBA79E4.6DA0AA3B@in-tch.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030508093837.02d0dad8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/6/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In Dress In Ireland there is a lot on women's clothes being red. It speaks of red petticoats as early as the sketches of the Irish women in the 16th c. (commentary on pics shown on page 52 (image #36), which are rendered in B&W, although I have seen the same drawings in color in another book.) "The townswoman's raised overskirt is lined with fur and reveals the red underskirt with bands, the prototype of the 'red petticoats' of later years." The colored plate #3 also show a townswoman in 1575, but based on an earlier 16th c. illustration; she is wearing a red petticoat. The color plate of the woman Sue mentions is of the back of a woman, #7 "An Irish Woman" and "dated between 1670-1750. Red wool gown trimmed with green ribbons on sleeves and skirt, worn over a white chemise, green apron, brown jacket or waistcoat with deep cuffs, linen handkerchief and a linen neckerchief trimmed with lace." In the early 19th c. pgs 140-41. "women's everyday clothes were homespun, woven and dyed red flannel or frieze petticoats and short jackets." Reading the two pages further, they speak of red petticoats, and quilted petticoats, but not yet reading about red quilted petticoats, although that doesn't mean there weren't any. Apparently red was a common color for cloaks as well. And I am not an expert on 19th c. Irish clothes, by any means. Just telling you what I read; no pun intended. Kimiko At 09:38 AM 5/8/2003 -0600, you wrote: >I dunno about Scots-related traditions for petticoats of these sorts >(although they sound like *lots* of fun!), but there's a fairly decent >history of *Irish* women wearing red petticoats. ISTR (book's in the >other room) seeing a watercolored "sketch" of, I think, an 18th? c. >Irish woman clearly wearing a red petticoat with, I *think*, a black >stripe on it, reminiscent of the stripes/bands one sees on GermanRen >stuff. >--sue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 14:10:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48IAaqa001139 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 14:10:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48I8Sdx002830 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 12:08:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48I8Q4c000725; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:08:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20802.mail.yahoo.com (web20802.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.191]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h48I8G4c000585 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:08:18 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030508180815.49505.qmail@web20802.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.67.176.192] by web20802.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 08 May 2003 11:08:15 PDT Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 11:08:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Maggie Pierce Secara To: h-costume@net.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] New "real history" TV opportunity X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.regencyhouseparty.co.uk/index02.htm Regency House party, anyone? ===== Maggie Secara Note: This post may contain misspellings, grammatical errors, disorganized sentence structure, or may entirely lack a coherent theme. These elements are natural to the process of writing, and will only add to the overall beauty of the post. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 14:37:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Ib3qa001195 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 14:37:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48IYpdx006154 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 12:34:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48IYf4c021507; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:34:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48IYb4c021461 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 12:34:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA26721 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 14:34:36 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-155-240-252.asm.bellsouth.net [68.155.240.252]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id OAA32594 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 14:34:36 -0400 Message-ID: <03a701c31590$0651e490$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030508180815.49505.qmail@web20802.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] New "real history" TV opportunity Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 14:31:21 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My dream!! Darn it that it is only open to those living in Britain. Do you think hubby would mind if I moved? ;-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Maggie Pierce Secara" To: Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 2:08 PM Subject: [h-cost] New "real history" TV opportunity > http://www.regencyhouseparty.co.uk/index02.htm > > Regency House party, anyone? > > ===== > Maggie Secara > > Note: This post may contain misspellings, grammatical errors, disorganized sentence structure, or may entirely lack a coherent theme. These elements are natural to the process of writing, and will only add to the overall beauty of the post. > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 15:51:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48JpSqa001678 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 15:51:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48JnDdx014332 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 13:49:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48JnCF7018553; Thu, 8 May 2003 13:49:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mtiwmhc11.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc11.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.115]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Jn9F7018456 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 13:49:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.worldnet.att.net (112.gardena-12rh15rt.ca.dial-access.att.net[12.80.126.112]) by mtiwmhc11.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc11) with SMTP id <20030508194902111005igdae>; Thu, 8 May 2003 19:49:02 +0000 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030508122750.00a441f0@postoffice.att.net> X-Sender: Kiloran@postoffice.att.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 12:48:24 -0700 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Kiloran@worldnet.att.net In-Reply-To: <200305081801.h48I174d024479@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] Directions to garment district from Costume College X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 11:01 AM 5/8/2003, you wrote: >Message: 3 >Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 08:33:34 -0700 (PDT) >From: Dawn Jacobson >Subject: [h-cost] Re: going to Costume College!!! >To: h-costume@indra.com >Message-ID: <20030508153334.96674.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > >Kimiko wrote: > > > Three days of just doing costume related stuff, and > > going to make a trip to > > the garment district. Are the good stores, > > especially the trim shops, open > > on Sunday, or is Monday a better day for that area. > > I am sure someone here > > knows. I have only been there once before. Hmmm... > > is there a map somewhere > > for that district? A friend drove when I went, so I > > am not sure how to get > > there. > >OK, last question first. > >Print this e-mail out and put it in your Costume >College notebook, as these are the best directions, >from somebody used to driving down there from the >hotel. > >Take Sherman Way (the main street in front of the >hotel) EAST to the 405 Fwy. > >Get on the 405 going SOUTH. > >When you get to the interchange of the 405 and the >101, take the 101 SOUTH (Los Angeles). > >Take the 101 SOUTH to the interchange of the 101 and >the 170, and get onto 170 SOUTH (Los Angeles). > >Take the 170 SOUTH to the interchange of the 170 and >the 110 Fwy, and get onto the 110 SOUTH. It's the >first exit of the interchange, and only 1 lane, so be >ready for it. > >Once you are on the 110 Fwy, you'll want to get over >to the left about 3 lanes, or you'll immediately exit >off the freeway into downtown Los Angeles. Take the >110 SOUTH to the 8th Street/9th Street offramp and >exit. > >Go straight through the first intersection (8th >Street) and turn left at the 2nd intersection (9th >Street). If you're going the right direction, you'll >go under the freeway. Continue on 9th street about 3/4 >mile. > >They've now marked the Garment District with big City >signs saying "Los Angeles Fashion District," so you'll >know when you get there. The most central lot to park >is on top of the building that is on the northwest >corner of 9th and Wall (Shannon Fabrics is on the >Corner of 9th and Wall). Turn left on Wall, go up >about 100 feet, and you'll see the entrance to the >parking lot (inside the building, up a ramp). The last >time I was there (about 3 weeks ago), it was $4 to >park all day. Kimiko: Those are pretty good directions Dawn gave you, but there are a couple of incorrect bits that I'd like to correct. They are just confusing enough to someone unfamiliar to LA freeways to cause a real problem. Go east on Sherman Way, and then onto the south 405 - so far you're fine. You'll transition from the 405 south to the 101 South, although you're actually physically going east. Don't worry about that, just go on the 101 South. You want to look for the lanes that are marked "Los Angeles", those are the ones you want. You do NOT want the lanes marked "Ventura". Now to correct the most worrisome part of the directions. Ignore the part about the 170. The 170 part of the 101 doesn't affect you when you head downtown, it only matters when you're coming back, and only then because you don't want to go there. Once you're on the 101, stay in the right three lanes. About 4 miles down the freeway will split between the 101 and the 134. You want to stay on the 101. Do not take the 134. (Please trust me on this - I live right by the 170 and could drive this in my sleep. This is where I meant dangerous - if you're looking for a sign that says "170" right here, and you never see one, you're going to get awfully confused and that's very dangerous when you're going 65mph.) The rest of the directions are fine, but I'd like to offer an alternate once you get downtown. Instead of taking the 110, stay on the 101, and go three more exits to Los Angeles Street. Get off and make a right onto Los Angeles street. Drive down Los Angeles street until you get to 9th. Make a left onto 9th. Maple is two short blocks away. What I do is I start looking for a parking space the moment I turn onto 9th, and if I don't find one, there are several parking lots scattered around the area. The intersection of 9th and Maple is the heart of the garment district. My favorite store is Kashcool, at 418 E 9th Street, about 1/2 block east of Maple. They've got one of the best selections of fabrics around, their prices are some of the lowest, and they've got a fascinating trimming department tucked in the back of the store. After that, there are a couple of trimming stores in the 800 block of Maple that I like (can't remember the names) and basically you just walk from store to store looking at the fabrics. It becomes sensory overload after a while, there's just so MUCH down in the garment district! When you head back to the hotel from the garment district, you can go one of two ways - either go back north on Los Angeles street until you get to the 101 freeway, or go one block south of 9th to Olympic and take that to the 110 freeway. Getting on both can be confusing. If anyone wants more info, please feel free to email me and I'll provide exhaustively detailed directions. Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 17:39:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Ldsqa002036 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 17:39:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Lcgdx027202 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 15:38:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48LcdI1013384; Thu, 8 May 2003 15:38:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48LcbI1013349 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 15:38:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEL00DO684CVS@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 08 May 2003 14:38:36 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 14:31:38 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Directions to garment district from Costume College In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030508122750.00a441f0@postoffice.att.net> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030508142740.02c574e0@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/6/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <200305081801.h48I174d024479@net.indra.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wow, thank Julie. I appreciate the advice on how to get in, other than the main entry. I remember it took us a very long time just to get a few blocks, so any shortcut is really appreciated. I also appreciate you sharing your favorite stores. There are so many and I don't want to waste time in stores that won't carry the right stuff. I found the LA Garment District web site (http://www.fashiondistrict.org/), which lists all the stores and has a map, but I am confused looking at the map (and normally I am very map savvy). I appreciate you and Dawn's directions, and any advice on which of the many many stores to get the good costume stuff. I wish I had more than one day to wander that huge area. Thanks again! Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 18:46:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48MkDqa002187 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 18:46:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Mj7dx004887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 16:45:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Mj6V2004194; Thu, 8 May 2003 16:45:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m03.mx.aol.com (imo-m03.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.6]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48Mj1V2004072 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 16:45:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Marionetta@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.109.235d528c (18555) for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 18:44:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Marionetta@aol.com Message-ID: <109.235d528c.2bec37e4@aol.com> Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 18:44:52 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] La Garment District X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Conveniently for those of you gearing up for Costume College the Washington Post just did an article about the LA Garment District, the link is here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A5694-2003May2.html I'm jealous, when I lived in CA I didn't have the money to go, now I don't have the time, oh well. Have fun! Cheers, Loren Dearborn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 8 19:29:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48NTrqa002259 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 19:29:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48NSkdx009791 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 17:28:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48NSj43009318; Thu, 8 May 2003 17:28:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h48NSe43009253 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 17:28:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.137]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/linuxconf) with SMTP id h48Nj2M21496; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:45:02 +1000 Message-ID: <094d01c315b9$1bb0a3c0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Black, Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 09:25:24 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks Jennifer! Wayne will be pleased that one of his two guesses was right. Glenda. ----- Original Message ----- > > >Jim says the Tannic acid attacks the proteen that is silk. will eat it with > >time. > > >Marlene Sena > >The Sitkum Soap Works > >Handmade Goats Milk Soap > >Myrtle Point,Oregon > >www.sitkum.com > > > > > That is the answer from an industrial chemist. Acids that eat the protiens > in fiber. > > > Jennifer Sena > Distant Designs > http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi > > I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 00:15:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h494Feqa003152 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 00:15:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h494Emdx003710 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 8 May 2003 22:14:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h494Eils029043; Thu, 8 May 2003 22:14:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h494Efls028984 for ; Thu, 8 May 2003 22:14:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.net (pcp03509979pcs.elictc01.md.comcast.net [68.54.185.111]) by mtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEL00H9AQG88X@mtaout01.icomcast.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 09 May 2003 00:14:36 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 00:14:47 -0400 From: Cozit / Liz To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: <3EBB2B37.9070005@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 References: <200305081801.h48I174d024479@net.indra.com> Subject: [h-cost] Re: Duck tape historical costumes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Actually, in last year's contest there were quite a few historicals. Everywhere from t-tunic to a few "My Fair Lady" Ascot types... and quite a few in between. At least 4-5 Tudor or tudoresque outfits, some of which both attendees were in the same period, some not. Wish they still had last year's entries (in addition to winners) up... waiting for this year's. -Elisabeth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 02:57:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h496vuqa022273 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 02:57:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h496xddx013730 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 00:59:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h496xZ80005803; Fri, 9 May 2003 00:59:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail011.syd.optusnet.com.au (mail011.syd.optusnet.com.au [210.49.20.139]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h496xU80005737 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 00:59:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from valadan (c17417.brodm1.vic.optusnet.com.au [210.49.162.24]) h496xOX08074 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 16:59:24 +1000 Message-ID: <009301c315f8$f6fc52f0$18a231d2@valadan> From: "Karen Root" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305081801.h48I174d024479@net.indra.com> <3EBB2B37.9070005@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Duck tape historical costumes Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 17:02:33 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Wish they still had last year's entries (in addition to winners) up... > waiting for this year's. there's pages and pages of archives if you go back to the home page... K ----- www.members.optusnet.com.au/smonster/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 03:40:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h497eMqa007378 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 03:40:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h497g4dx016139 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 01:42:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h497g280022198; Fri, 9 May 2003 01:42:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web40004.mail.yahoo.com (web40004.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h497g080022136 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 01:42:00 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030509074154.25846.qmail@web40004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [62.254.246.61] by web40004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 09 May 2003 08:41:54 BST Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 08:41:54 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Rachel?= To: Historic Costuming , H-costume list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] Fwd: FW: New Victorian Corsetry Workshop in June 2003 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thought a few people here might be interested in this. I went along to the last session and it is well worth it. Had a fabulous time and Ian is a really grat teacher. I now am in the process of making a beautiful perfectly fitting corset for myself. Just need the dress to go with it now! Rachel > From: "Binns, Jessie" > Subject: New Victorian Corsetry Workshop in June 2003 > Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 17:15:18 +0100 > > > Dear all - great news! > > We are repeating our corsetry workshop in June - come along and spend a > wonderful weekend at Hughenden Manor, High Wycombe practising your > cutting & sewing skills. > > Over the 2 days you will create a pattern corset from Calico and modern > boning to fit you perfectly, plus you will gain an insight into the > development of stays and underwear from the 18th Century onwards from > Ian Chipperfield our course leader. Ian (also known as The Staymaker) > is a specialist in reproduction corsetry and underwear, and has worked > with Hampton Court aswell as The National Trust. > > The course costs just £50 for 2 days, includes free entry to Hughenden > Manor itself and is bookable through our Box Office (01494) 755 572, > please quote Event Number E139 Open: Mon - Fri , 9.30am - 4pm (7.30pm in > June, July & August) > > More details below - hope to see you there! > Corset Construction Site! > > Visitors to the National Trust at Hughenden Manor, High Wycombe, will be > getting to grips with steel boning, calculated curves and straight laces > as part of a special Victorian Corsetry Workshop on 14th and 15th June > 2003. > > The 2-day workshop run by Ian Chipperfield of The Staymaker has been > organised following the enormous success of a similar event held at > Hughenden in March, which was a complete sell-out. > > The course will explore the role of Victorian corsets in detail - how > they developed from 18th Century stays into 20th Century patterns, > whilst teaching participants how to measure themselves and how to > construct a corset to complete at home. The 2-day workshop (14th and > 15th June, 10am to 4pm) costs £50 including lunches and participants > must supply their own sewing machines. A reduced rate of £35 applies to > students with a valid NUS card. > > Jessie Binns, Community Learning Officer at Hughenden Manor, says: > "When we look at pictures from the Victorian era we can't help wondering > how people lived and moved around, let alone worked, wearing such > extraordinary underwear! Whether you are a beginner or an experienced > dressmaker and interested in learning in more depth, you will find the > 2-day workshop fascinating." > > Admission to the workshop is by ticket only and the number of tickets is > strictly limited. Tickets are available from the Hughenden Box Office, > telephone (01494) 755572, or write to Victorian Fashion Workshop, > Hughenden Box Office, Hughenden Manor, High Wycombe, HP14 4LA. > > The house and gardens at Hughenden are open to the public Wednesday to > Sunday from 1st April until 2nd November. The country park and woodland > is open all year round. > > > For More Details see NT Learning Website > www.nationaltrust.org.uk/Learning: > > Notes on Hughenden: > Hughenden Manor was the home of Victorian prime minister and statesman > Benjamin Disraeli from 1848 until his death in 1881. Most of his > furniture, books and pictures are on display in his private retreat from > the rigours of parliamentary life in London. Hughenden offers beautiful > walks in the park and woodlands, and the garden is a recreation of the > colourful design of Disraeli's wife, Mary Anne. > > Just returned to the display from two years' conservation work is > Disraeli's breathtaking Chancellor's robe. Reputed to have been made > for Sir William Pitt, the robe came to Disraeli when he was Chancellor > of the Exchequer and became a bone of contention when the opposition > party won the election and Disraeli refused to hand the robe on to his > newly appointed successor, Gladstone. > > > END > > > Kind Regards > > > Jessie Binns > Community Learning Officer > The National Trust > Hughenden and West Wycombe Estate > Tel: (01494) 755596 > *********************************************** > > confidentiality :- > > The National Trust believes in treating information with care. Because > this message and any attachments may contain information which is > confidential, if you have received it in error please contact us > immediately and do not disclose, copy, use or store it in any way. > > viruses :- > > It is our policy to check emails for viruses before sending, but we > recommend that you also check the message and any attachments, as either > could contain viruses which could damage your systems. > > charity details :- > > The National Trust for Places of Historic Interest or Natural Beauty 36 > Queen Anne's Gate London SWIH 9AS > > Registered Charity Number 205846 > Tel: +44 (0)20 7222 9251 > Fax: +44 (0)20 7222 5097 > > www.nationaltrust.org.uk > **************************************************** > ===== Rachel Tudor Bibliography http://website.lineone.net/~reholliday/Tudor/ __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 11:53:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Frgqa007239 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 11:53:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49FqWUw019697 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 09:52:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49FqU1b027001; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:52:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20210.mail.yahoo.com (web20210.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h49FqR1b026951 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:52:27 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030509155226.17837.qmail@web20210.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20210.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 09 May 2003 08:52:26 PDT Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 08:52:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tea Dyeing and acid To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Katy Bishop wrote: > > I know G-Street fabrics in Rockville Maryland had > wonderful imported > silk French laces a couple of years ago. Might be > worth contacting > them. http://www.gstreetfabrics.com/ Thye don't do > online, used to do > mailorder. I hear they have scaled back of late > though. > Their website says they don't even do mailorder these days. :( __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 12:04:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G4Lqa007282 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:04:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G3JUw020895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 10:03:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G3Gp1004242; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:03:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h49G3Dp1004197 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:03:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 7939 invoked from network); 9 May 2003 16:03:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail1.inreach.com) (209.142.2.50) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 9 May 2003 16:03:11 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:03:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <48160.162.119.64.111.1052496191.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 09:03:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Directions to garment district from Costume College From: To: In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030508142740.02c574e0@127.0.0.1> References: <200305081801.h48I174d024479@net.indra.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030508142740.02c574e0@127.0.0.1> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Wow, thank Julie. I appreciate the advice on how to get in, other than > the main entry. I remember it took us a very long time just to get a > few blocks, so any shortcut is really appreciated. I also appreciate > you sharing your favorite stores. There are so many and I don't want to > waste time in stores that won't carry the right stuff. > > I found the LA Garment District web site > (http://www.fashiondistrict.org/), which lists all the stores and has a > map, but I am confused looking at the map (and normally I am very map > savvy). I appreciate you and Dawn's directions, and any advice on which > of the many many stores to get the good costume stuff. I wish I had > more than one day to wander that huge area. Thanks for posting that site!! I have been down there a few times and just had to "feel" my way. That site is nice because I can just print out all of the stores of a category that I like and go for it! Very appreciated! Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 12:06:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G6hqa007288 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:06:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G5hUw021201 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 10:05:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G5hp1005949; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:05:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h49G5ep1005927 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:05:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 8757 invoked from network); 9 May 2003 16:05:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail1.inreach.com) (209.142.2.50) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 9 May 2003 16:05:40 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:05:40 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <13956.162.119.64.111.1052496340.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 09:05:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Black, From: To: In-Reply-To: <094d01c315b9$1bb0a3c0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> References: <094d01c315b9$1bb0a3c0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Okay, While I see the point about black eating through the fibers, I still have a question. Why is there existing blackwork from the 1500's? Wouldn't it have disintegrated as well? Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 12:07:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G7uqa007291 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:07:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G6pUw021341 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 10:06:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G6op1006703; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:06:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G6lp1006638 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:06:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1AC447A774 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:06:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 33583-06 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:06:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-64-160-177-186.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [64.160.177.186]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D61387ABAA for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:05:58 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:04:50 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO How do you do your marking? there might be an easier way... On Wednesday, May 7, 2003, at 12:33 PM, Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > What I hate is not in the sewing part. I love hand sewing, and I don't > really have anything against machine sewing. What I hate is marking and > cutting. Preparing the fabric is fun, I don't mind ironing, I don't > even > mind zigzagging the edges, I just hate placing the fabric, pinning > pattern > pieces, marking (that has to be the very worst part) and cutting. > > I think the second thing I hate most is putting an insert such as a > gore > inside a slit. It comes second only because there's less of it than > cutting > :-) > > >> Bjarne og Leif Drews said: >>> I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it >>> monday, > so >>> it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i > realised >>> that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs >>> with > bias >>> tape. >>> What is your most hidious sewing job? > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 12:08:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G8Dqa007294 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:08:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G7AUw021390 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 10:07:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G79p1006918; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:07:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G6vp1006792 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:06:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AA267AD2A for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:06:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 33589-06 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:06:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-64-160-177-186.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [64.160.177.186]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A6DF7ABD3 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:06:01 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 17:23:23 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:Dioresque and hair Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EB883E8.7060608@comcast.net> Message-Id: <71F20034-81B4-11D7-9666-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO oh ok! When you said Eva Peron, that made sense. I'm so much more used to the 50's short curly do's... but my main exposure to 50's hairstyles is drooling over pattern illustrations... thanks! .heather. On Tuesday, May 6, 2003, at 08:56 PM, Cozit / Liz wrote: > Actually, no. Think of the Eva Peron pictures... hair done in much > the way that Janet's was done... sleeked back into one variation of > chignon or another. Simple yet elegant like the *lines* of the Dior > gowns. There are others who I can picture in my mind wearing "typical" > Dior who I can't place names to... also with the simple chignon. At > least one picture with the model turned to show most of the back of > the gown (low dropped, almost v-back)... same pose as some wedding > dress photos are taken in... but the gown was golden... also with the > model's hair slicked back into the bun. > > I'll admit that I wished I could have found some hairspray (no one was > over at the table when I went looking, and I didn't see any)... there > was one little wisp at the back that was just a tad to short to want > to stay exactly as it had been placed. But it doesn't show in the > pictures and I knew it wouldn't from the stage... and there was no way > in heck I was going to mention that to Janet and make her even more > stressed than she was if there was nothing I could do to help her out > about it...especially as it was only noticable up close and if you > were *looking* at the hair... rather than the gown and the bits that > she had found or made for the trimmings. BTW, some of those glitzier > bits were off gowns from that period... though I don't remember if she > said whether or not any of them had been Dior. *g* Have to admit that > whoever set up the dens did a good job in only putting two in that > one.... especially with me... who isn't really the greatest of den > mothers (I prefer to help out here and there... moreso when I have a > bit more of a clue of what's going on where and where I can find what > I'm searching for... holding papers in order and bellowing for the > next in the line for workmanship judging was much easier the night > before than trying to be a calming influence and a help when I really > didn't know what to do to do that best). > > -Elisabeth > >> From: Heather Meadows >> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College >> >> I must admit, I was confused by Janet hair in the photo. >> I thought the gown was lovely, but wouldn't it have had at >> least some decoration in the form of hair accessories? >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 12:09:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G9Iqa007298 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:09:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G84Uw021555 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 10:08:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G84p1007568; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:08:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49G7Tp1007153 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 10:07:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E7077ABAA for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 33583-10 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:06:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-64-160-177-186.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [64.160.177.186]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B7857ACCF for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 09:06:05 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 09:02:34 -0700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030507.121648.-78523177.4.Seamstrix@juno.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Subject: [h-cost] Documentation for Costume Contests X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO How does one present documentation for costume contests? I've never seen one before - does one hand over a binder of supporting materials to the judges..? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 14:47:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49IlPqa007765 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 14:47:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49IkYUw010019 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 12:46:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49IkQi7003124; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:46:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pop2a.ripco.com (pop2a.ripco.com [209.100.227.25]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49IiSi7001954 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:44:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ripco.com (tcr217.dynip.ripco.net [209.100.226.217]) by pop2a.ripco.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id h49Il9t29901 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 13:47:09 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3EBBF704.10803@ripco.com> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 13:44:20 -0500 From: zski User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200305091801.h49I1Yi9001881@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] re:documentation X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > How does one present documentation for costume contests? > > I've never seen one before - does one hand over a binder of supporting > materials to the judges..? > Think of it like writting a summary for a school report. Copies of some of your source materials (or at least citations from), photos of your work in progress. It's always hard to balance length with clarity - remember the judges have to read a lot of this stuff. I've never documented a historical recreation before, but I have submitted documentation for a "best recreation" and workmanship. A friend and I did The Trickster and Prank from CBS's 'The flash" TV show. They are sort of harlequin-y unitards pieced from multiple patterned fabrics. We ended up airbrush-stenciling each of the patterns onto cotton/lycra with Versatex Airbrusk Ink (thank you Dharma Trading Co) before assembly. We submitted stills of the originals we were trying to recreate, as well as a sort of "dress diary" of our process including photos. I think we just sumbitted it in those little report covers you used in school to keep it neat and all together. We did not win best recreation, but took the workmanship award. Photos are on my photogallery at http://pages.ripco.net/~zski/photogallery.htm bottom row left. Wendy Z 3/4 through with the paned cap sleeves in Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 14:48:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Imdqa007768 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 14:48:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49IlpUw010149 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 12:47:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Iloi7004074; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:47:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web40910.mail.yahoo.com (web40910.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.207]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h49Ijxi7002791 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 12:45:59 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030509184554.8407.qmail@web40910.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [12.104.32.34] by web40910.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 09 May 2003 11:45:54 PDT Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 11:45:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Tasha McGann To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305091801.h49I1Yi9001881@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Documentation for Costume Contests X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Heather wrote: > How does one present documentation for costume > contests? > > I've never seen one before - does one hand over a > binder of supporting > materials to the judges..? Wow, that question covers a lot of bases. :^) Here is a website I like to use for pointers in preparing documentation: http://www.geocities.com/anne_liese_w/ASComp/ASCompDoc.htm Each group's requirements/standards will be different. The burden is on you to find out what those requirements/standards are. Within the SCA, for example, there are widely varying rules for competition from kingdom to kingdom, at the very least. My best advice, no matter what organization is sponsoring the competition, would be to make sure you have carefully read any and all instructions available for entering the competition. If the rules on documentation are vague or absent (as they can be sometimes), do not be afraid to contact the point-person for the competition and ask for more specific information. Ask as many questions as you need to. People argue often about the relative merits or annoyances of very short and very long documentation presentations. Some feel that "a lot" of information adds up to padding, meandering, or otherwise unnecessary detail. Others feel that as long as the writing is concise and the organization of the information is clear and logical, "a lot" of information can enhance the item's overall impression in competition. Excessively short documentation (half a page mentioning the item with very little historical context and no sources, for instance) can also annoy judges, as it leaves them wondering, "How do I know what this person knows about the item they created?" -- among other things. You just don't want to leave the judges guessing. This _may_ be beyond the pale for most, but I like to parenthetically footnote my writing as I go. Most people I know who enter historical clothing competitions don't bother to do this, but I think it's an excellent exercise in maintaining accuracy and integrity in your source citations. A pointer I recently learned: If your clothing will be worn on a dress form and there is no table nearby to place your documentation upon, hang the doc from the neck of the dress form using some string or ribbon. If you must hand your documentation over to someone rather than leave it with the item being entered, then make the presentation neat and easily contained. Paper clips are probably not best. Neither are straggly bits of spiral-bound note paper ripped from the notebook. Again, though, it's always best to check with the folks running the competition to see what their expectations are. Good luck, and most of all HAVE FUN with it! -Tasha __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 15:19:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49JJpqa007848 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:19:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49JItUw013551 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 13:18:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49JILK9024531; Fri, 9 May 2003 13:18:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49JIFK9024391 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 13:18:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-064.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.64]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A53719FEE9 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 21:18:08 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EBBFF75.5050108@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 21:20:21 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Documentation for Costume Contests References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, These are the judgingcriterea for the SCA in Europe. http://www.student.oulu.fi/~ferron/sca/as/criteria/ I think that documentation makes it esear for the judges to decide. It is sometimes difficult to see how much work a costume costs to make. Because it is not only the making it self but also the research and designing. Greetings, Deredere Heather Meadows wrote: > How does one present documentation for costume contests? > > I've never seen one before - does one hand over a binder of supporting > materials to the judges..? > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 16:44:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Ki4qa008082 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 16:44:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49KhCUw023305 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 14:43:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49KhA8p026706; Fri, 9 May 2003 14:43:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r08.mx.aol.com (imo-r08.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.104]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Kh78p026621 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 14:43:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.1ee.88394f0 (3874) for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 16:42:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Kitsune242@aol.com Message-ID: <1ee.88394f0.2bed6cd1@aol.com> Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 16:42:57 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Kate & Leopold X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings All, While my computer was recouperating I caught up on some of my movie watching. One of the films I watched was Kate and Leopold. I thought it was really cute, and although I have some definate complaints about the costuming (ie the fact that Leopold was at a ball and wearing riding boots) but over all, I thought Hugh Jackman pulled off the clothing very well. Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 17:42:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LgOqa008214 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:42:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LfbUw029822 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 15:41:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LfaFi010696; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:41:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r06.mx.aol.com (imo-r06.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LfVFi010587 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:41:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.78.3efb09b0 (3874) for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:41:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Kitsune242@aol.com Message-ID: <78.3efb09b0.2bed7a82@aol.com> Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 17:41:22 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/5/2003 10:52:36 AM Pacific Standard Time, alice@wonderland.com writes: > Really? My main complaint with Costume College the last > two years is that all the information was really geared towards > beginners... I realize I am bit behind this conversation, but, I love attending Costume College. That being said, my biggest complaint was that so many of the classes are limited attendance, and last year, you could only take one limited class. Don't get me wrong, I think the classes are great. But I seem to remember adding how many limited classes were offered last year as opposed to non-limited classes, and found that limited outnumbered non-limited. It was very frustrating. Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 17:48:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LmCqa008236 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:48:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LlOUw000521 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 15:47:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LlNFi014527; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:47:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m03.mx.aol.com (imo-m03.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.6]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LlJFi014417 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:47:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.194.18e544dc (3874) for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:47:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Kitsune242@aol.com Message-ID: <194.18e544dc.2bed7bdc@aol.com> Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 17:47:08 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/6/2003 5:17:22 PM Pacific Standard Time, albrakat7@yahoo.com writes: > Red H's on our badges would be great! I put one on my badge last year, and , > alas!! only saw 1 other H costumner.The year before I saw 2.But then, I > usually end up teaching classes or prepping for same ,instead, of getting > to take classes, or wandering around the halls , socilaizing:(But if > someone wants to propose a rendezvous point friday or saturday evening > --I'd love to meet more of you---Albra You saw two, because you saw me. But I always forget my red H. :) Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 17:54:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LsOqa008248 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:54:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LraUw001310 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 15:53:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LrYFi019243; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:53:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r02.mx.aol.com (imo-r02.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.98]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LqLFi018260 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:52:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.138.1f7e9d2b (3874) for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:52:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Kitsune242@aol.com Message-ID: <138.1f7e9d2b.2bed7d0a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 17:52:10 EDT Subject: Re: what to wear at CC (was Re: [h-cost] non-period name tags To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/7/2003 5:37:42 PM Pacific Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: > >So, what do people wear at Costume College? Do you come in costume? Or > >do you wear streat clothes all day and at night wear costumes? I couldn't > > >really get this from the website. I have yet to go in costume. I wear jeans and a tee shirt because it is comfortable, I can sit for a long length of time in them and it is easy to take notes. That being said, i am hoping to get something made to wear this year. Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 17:54:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Lsjqa008252 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:54:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LrvUw001379 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 15:53:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LrvFi019546; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:53:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f36.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LrrFi019452 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:53:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 9 May 2003 14:53:48 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 09 May 2003 21:53:48 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Black, Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 14:53:48 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 May 2003 21:53:48.0820 (UTC) FILETIME=[78AE9D40:01C31675] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO perhaps the beeswax treating of the embroidery threads made a difference? Or is that newer? Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! >From: >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Black, >Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 09:05:40 -0700 (PDT) > >Okay, > >While I see the point about black eating through the fibers, I still have >a question. Why is there existing blackwork from the 1500's? Wouldn't it >have disintegrated as well? > >Diana > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 17:55:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LtSqa008255 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:55:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LsiUw001443 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 15:54:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LsiFi020154; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:54:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gw.retro.com (gw.retro.com [205.179.181.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LsfFi020117 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:54:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by gw.retro.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id h49Ls7A16130 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 9 May 2003 14:54:07 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 14:54:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Thompson-Herbert Message-Id: <200305092154.h49Ls7A16130@gw.retro.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Black, X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Diane wrote: > Okay, > > While I see the point about black eating through the fibers, I still have > a question. Why is there existing blackwork from the 1500's? Wouldn't it > have disintegrated as well? It depends on 1) the type of fibre being dyed. Silks tend to disintigrate after contact with some chemicals. And as some have noted, cottons and other cellulosics don't do well with acid dyeing. 2) the pH of the dye bath can ruin different fibres (see point 1 for examples). 3) the mordants and fixatives used for the dye can also cause damage. I've got an edwardian silk suit that started to shred apart the first time I got it wet (very carefully, lying flat in the bathtub so it didn't have to support the weight of the wet fabric). Katie, the late owner of Lacis, was of the opinion that the fabric had probably had tin used on it as a mordant, which eats the silk after a while (and yes, it's black). I tend to trust Katie's opinion on this one, as she was an extremely skilled conservator. She was the one who taught me to use oxalic acid to remove rust stains from cottons and linens. And a great many other skills she simply gave away for the asking over the years (damn, I miss her). Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 17:57:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Lvdqa008258 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:57:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49LurUw001652 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 15:56:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Luq2x021831; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:56:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe37.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.94]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49Luk2x021636 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:56:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 9 May 2003 14:56:41 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe37.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 09 May 2003 21:56:41 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 17:56:02 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 May 2003 21:56:41.0757 (UTC) FILETIME=[DFC2B4D0:01C31675] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Depends what I'm doing. Sometimes, the carbon-paper-type and roller, sometimes when it's just a hole I pierce through the pattern piece and just mark right through with a marking pencil. It's not so much that it takes time or that it's difficult, it's just having to do it :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Heather Meadows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs > How do you do your marking? there might be an easier way... > > > On Wednesday, May 7, 2003, at 12:33 PM, Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > > > What I hate is not in the sewing part. I love hand sewing, and I don't > > really have anything against machine sewing. What I hate is marking and > > cutting. Preparing the fabric is fun, I don't mind ironing, I don't > > even > > mind zigzagging the edges, I just hate placing the fabric, pinning > > pattern > > pieces, marking (that has to be the very worst part) and cutting. > > > > I think the second thing I hate most is putting an insert such as a > > gore > > inside a slit. It comes second only because there's less of it than > > cutting > > :-) > > > > > >> Bjarne og Leif Drews said: > >>> I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it > >>> monday, > > so > >>> it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i > > realised > >>> that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs > >>> with > > bias > >>> tape. > >>> What is your most hidious sewing job? > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 18:15:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49MF2qa008314 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 18:15:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49ME9Uw003492 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 16:14:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49ME82x004605; Fri, 9 May 2003 16:14:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49ME52x004574 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 16:14:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E98107ACB3 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:13:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 39990-05 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:13:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix, from userid 313) id 694307ACA1; Fri, 9 May 2003 15:13:26 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 15:13:26 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: from "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" at May 09, 2003 05:56:02 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20030509221326.694307ACA1@mail.wonderland.com> From: alice@wonderland.com (Heather Meadows) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO understandable ;) > > Depends what I'm doing. Sometimes, the carbon-paper-type and roller, > sometimes when it's just a hole I pierce through the pattern piece and just > mark right through with a marking pencil. It's not so much that it takes > time or that it's difficult, it's just having to do it :-) > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Heather Meadows" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 12:04 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs > > > > How do you do your marking? there might be an easier way... > > > > > > On Wednesday, May 7, 2003, at 12:33 PM, Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > > > > > What I hate is not in the sewing part. I love hand sewing, and I don't > > > really have anything against machine sewing. What I hate is marking and > > > cutting. Preparing the fabric is fun, I don't mind ironing, I don't > > > even > > > mind zigzagging the edges, I just hate placing the fabric, pinning > > > pattern > > > pieces, marking (that has to be the very worst part) and cutting. > > > > > > I think the second thing I hate most is putting an insert such as a > > > gore > > > inside a slit. It comes second only because there's less of it than > > > cutting > > > :-) > > > > > > > > >> Bjarne og Leif Drews said: > > >>> I am almost finishing the grey linen stays. I started making it > > >>> monday, > > > so > > >>> it has ben a succes, being home sewing. While making the stays, i > > > realised > > >>> that the most hidious hidious of all sewing jobs, is binding tabs > > >>> with > > > bias > > >>> tape. > > >>> What is your most hidious sewing job? > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 19:27:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49NRaqa008427 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 19:27:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49NQlUw011102 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 17:26:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49NQjCk021071; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:26:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d02.mx.aol.com (imo-d02.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h49NQgCk020958 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 17:26:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.1c2.9568ef8 (17526) for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 19:26:35 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1c2.9568ef8.2bed932a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 19:26:34 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/9/2003 6:14:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alice@wonderland.com writes: > I just hate placing the fabric, pinning > >>>pattern > >>>pieces, marking (that has to be the very worst part) and cutting. > Funny....that's just what I love. Well, actually, I'm sorta indifferent to it, but I know that this is how things are gonna match up and I love to cleverly place things so they do....or so some aspect of the fabric is enhanced. I love the results. Someone else can sew the thing up for me for all I care. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 21:50:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A1oHqa008667 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 21:50:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A1nPUw021283 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 19:49:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A1nOLs001869; Fri, 9 May 2003 19:49:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A1nMLs001848 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 19:49:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEN00G7CEE8XQ@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 09 May 2003 18:49:21 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 18:43:30 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] La Garment District In-reply-to: <109.235d528c.2bec37e4@aol.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030509184250.02c6b368@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/9/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you Loren for that link. It has some wonderful store suggestions that I want to check out. Kimiko At 06:44 PM 5/8/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Conveniently for those of you gearing up for Costume College the Washington >Post just did an article about the LA Garment District, the link is here: > >http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A5694-2003May2.html > >I'm jealous, when I lived in CA I didn't have the money to go, now I don't >have the time, oh well. Have fun! > >Cheers, > >Loren Dearborn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 9 21:58:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A1wmqa008677 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 21:58:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A1vxUw021793 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 19:57:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A1vvxl006233; Fri, 9 May 2003 19:57:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com (ns3.linuxwebnet.com [216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4A1vsxl006180 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 19:57:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 21968 invoked from network); 10 May 2003 02:39:01 -0000 Received: from 66-44-109-251.s2029.apx2.lnhdc.md.dialup.rcn.com (HELO oldwaylane.net) (66.44.109.251) by shada.com with SMTP; 10 May 2003 02:39:01 -0000 Message-ID: <3EBC517D.4020301@oldwaylane.net> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 21:10:21 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i586; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] re:documentation References: <200305091801.h49I1Yi9001881@net.indra.com> <3EBBF704.10803@ripco.com> In-Reply-To: <3EBBF704.10803@ripco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > How does one present documentation for costume contests? > > I've never seen one before - does one hand over a binder of supporting > materials to the judges..? It's going to vary from contest to contest. Usually there should be a format available for each one. The SCA competitions have their guidelines that I believe someone posted a link to, Costume Con also has guidelines which change slightly from convention to convention but usually they are posted on the website or you can email the Masquerade director themselves. I believe some people enter their costuming at County Fairs (I may try it this year!) which would likely have another format. No one style will fit all I'm afraid. But for Costume Con, usually you would want to present it in some sort of binder, a swatch page is a nice touch. Best is to go heavy on pictures with captions because you can usually have as many of those as you want and it's faster for the judges than reading the expose. I've seen some people use photo corners and tuck in photo prints that way, I've always scanned in my pics and used a fancy editor. Footnotes (whether at the bottom of the page, endnotes, or parenthetical) does tell a judge that you actually did the research and found the fact, you aren't making it up. I usually go heavy on these too, but then I'm obsessive. ;-) Hope this helps too. -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 00:47:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A4l9qa009157 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 00:47:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A4kFUw004525 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 22:46:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A4kDxW028451; Fri, 9 May 2003 22:46:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe56.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.191]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A4kBxW028400 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 22:46:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 9 May 2003 21:46:06 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe56.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Sat, 10 May 2003 04:46:05 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1c2.9568ef8.2bed932a@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 00:47:04 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 May 2003 04:46:06.0053 (UTC) FILETIME=[1138D150:01C316AF] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Gosh, if you lived close to here we would have to pair up :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 7:26 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs > In a message dated 5/9/2003 6:14:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > alice@wonderland.com writes: > > > I just hate placing the fabric, pinning > > >>>pattern > > >>>pieces, marking (that has to be the very worst part) and cutting. > > > > Funny....that's just what I love. Well, actually, I'm sorta indifferent to > it, but I know that this is how things are gonna match up and I love to > cleverly place things so they do....or so some aspect of the fabric is > enhanced. I love the results. > Someone else can sew the thing up for me for all I care. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 01:02:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A52Xqa009193 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 01:02:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A51iUw005280 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 23:01:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A51fYF004354; Fri, 9 May 2003 23:01:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from blount.mail.mindspring.net (blount.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.226]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A51cYF004333 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 23:01:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ar-008neomahp088.dialsprint.net ([63.178.246.176] helo=hppav.radiks.net) by blount.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19EMUL-0002Ei-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 10 May 2003 01:01:38 -0400 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20030509231715.00bce488@radiks.net> X-Sender: costumrs@radiks.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 23:27:48 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200305091607.h49G7Qp2007112@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] Re: Garment district X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A couple more observations (from a Nebraskan who's been there at College the last 3 years and made the pilgrimage): This building: >The most central lot to park > >is on top of the building that is on the northwest > >corner of 9th and Wall (Shannon Fabrics is on the > >Corner of 9th and Wall). Turn left on Wall, go up > >about 100 feet, and you'll see the entrance to the > >parking lot (inside the building, up a ramp). The last > >time I was there (about 3 weeks ago), it was $4 to > >park all day. contains several stores, and is one of only 2 or 3 places with a rest room. You have to ask for a key from one of the stores, but they're usually not too bad about providing one, especially if you are a serious shopper. Stop by Em-Be's - he's on an interior corner of the first floor, and is the usual HQ for the College district tour. Tell him you're attending College, just couldn't do the regular tour. There's a food court a couple of blocks away - can one of the locals post the location? The neighborhood isn't terrible during business hours, you need to exercise the caution you would in all major urban areas, but they do have a bicycle security patrol. Yes, Virginia, there really is a Fashion Police! Water, sunscreen, sunglasses, and a hat are a good idea. Sandy "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed To Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly-- Why They Are Simply Doomed." Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 01:04:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A54Zqa009212 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 01:04:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A53mUw005430 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 23:03:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A53mYF005209; Fri, 9 May 2003 23:03:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A53jYF005154 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 23:03:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m50.in-tch.com [216.166.191.50]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4A4jVD07454 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 22:45:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EBC8883.1492E1F0@in-tch.com> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 23:05:07 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs References: <1c2.9568ef8.2bed932a@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Why am I imagining most of the people on this list, in the afterlife, which turns out to be this giant costume shop...and it all works (heaven, right? ) Goodness, but we've got a little of everything! We all love clothes, but not the same clothes. Some of us design, some don't. History periods vary widely. Some of us hand sew, some don't. Some have loads of experience, some don't. We all do different things for different reasons, and somehow, it's all historical costuming. Aren't we all just the grandest bunch? --sue, imagining how nice it would be to work on costumes with someone who likes to do plain sewing (I loathe boring things like hems), but who wants *her* to do the embroidery! Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > > Gosh, if you lived close to here we would have to pair up :-) > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 7:26 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs > > > In a message dated 5/9/2003 6:14:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > > alice@wonderland.com writes: > > > > > I just hate placing the fabric, pinning > > > >>>pattern > > > >>>pieces, marking (that has to be the very worst part) and cutting. > > > > > > > Funny....that's just what I love. Well, actually, I'm sorta indifferent to > > it, but I know that this is how things are gonna match up and I love to > > cleverly place things so they do....or so some aspect of the fabric is > > enhanced. I love the results. > > Someone else can sew the thing up for me for all I care. > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 01:32:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A5W1qa009287 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 01:32:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A5VGUw007084 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 9 May 2003 23:31:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A5VEYF016575; Fri, 9 May 2003 23:31:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A5VCYF016566 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 23:31:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEN00MU4ONVMB@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 09 May 2003 22:31:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:25:18 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Garment district In-reply-to: <5.1.1.6.0.20030509231715.00bce488@radiks.net> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030509222233.02d00db8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/9/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <200305091607.h49G7Qp2007112@net.indra.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 11:27 PM 5/9/2003 -0500, you wrote: >Stop by Em-Be's - he's on an interior corner of the first floor, and is >the usual HQ for the College district tour. Tell him you're attending >College, just couldn't do the regular tour. Nice guy. I met the owner on my one and only trip there, when a friend introduced us. Really likes ren faire people, with lots of pics on his walls. I found a lovely piece of material I still have to make up from him. I didn't know he does the tour. Thanks for the info. Especially the reminders, and where the restrooms are. Most important. Any info on the food court would be very helpful. I didn't see any food places last time, but then I was staring at all the fabric. :-) Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 09:30:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ADUZqa013231 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:30:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ADSQUw002756 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 07:28:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ADSIY5018261; Sat, 10 May 2003 07:28:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ADSFY5018220 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 07:28:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.106] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB2C5090074; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:14:20 -0400 Message-ID: <002101c316f8$6f839260$6a5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <71F20034-81B4-11D7-9666-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:Dioresque and hair Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 09:31:15 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In my further 'reamings' this past week, I came across a box of about two dozen WH Journals and Harpers Bazaar'sall of the 50's decade and one thing that struck me for the first time in emersing my eyes and attention is that hair styles were quite sculptural...not the extremes of the 1830's , but as stylized as most of the new looks of high fashion of this time. "Not a hair out of place " would be a general way of describing it to one who did not have a picture in front of them. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Heather Meadows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 8:23 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:Dioresque and hair > oh ok! When you said Eva Peron, that made sense. I'm so much more > used to the 50's short curly do's... but my main exposure to 50's > hairstyles is drooling over pattern illustrations... > > thanks! > > .heather. > > On Tuesday, May 6, 2003, at 08:56 PM, Cozit / Liz wrote: > > > Actually, no. Think of the Eva Peron pictures... hair done in much > > the way that Janet's was done... sleeked back into one variation of > > chignon or another. Simple yet elegant like the *lines* of the Dior > > gowns. There are others who I can picture in my mind wearing "typical" > > Dior who I can't place names to... also with the simple chignon. At > > least one picture with the model turned to show most of the back of > > the gown (low dropped, almost v-back)... same pose as some wedding > > dress photos are taken in... but the gown was golden... also with the > > model's hair slicked back into the bun. > > > > I'll admit that I wished I could have found some hairspray (no one was > > over at the table when I went looking, and I didn't see any)... there > > was one little wisp at the back that was just a tad to short to want > > to stay exactly as it had been placed. But it doesn't show in the > > pictures and I knew it wouldn't from the stage... and there was no way > > in heck I was going to mention that to Janet and make her even more > > stressed than she was if there was nothing I could do to help her out > > about it...especially as it was only noticable up close and if you > > were *looking* at the hair... rather than the gown and the bits that > > she had found or made for the trimmings. BTW, some of those glitzier > > bits were off gowns from that period... though I don't remember if she > > said whether or not any of them had been Dior. *g* Have to admit that > > whoever set up the dens did a good job in only putting two in that > > one.... especially with me... who isn't really the greatest of den > > mothers (I prefer to help out here and there... moreso when I have a > > bit more of a clue of what's going on where and where I can find what > > I'm searching for... holding papers in order and bellowing for the > > next in the line for workmanship judging was much easier the night > > before than trying to be a calming influence and a help when I really > > didn't know what to do to do that best). > > > > -Elisabeth > > > >> From: Heather Meadows > >> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Costume College > >> > >> I must admit, I was confused by Janet hair in the photo. > >> I thought the gown was lovely, but wouldn't it have had at > >> least some decoration in the form of hair accessories? > >> > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 10:14:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AEEMqa013529 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 10:14:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AECLUw005113 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 08:12:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AECKoS003930; Sat, 10 May 2003 08:12:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from out003.verizon.net (out003pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.103]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AECGoS003863 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 08:12:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sharon ([141.151.116.160]) by out003.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.33 201-253-122-126-133-20030313) with ESMTP id <20030510141211.WBWP2239.out003.verizon.net@sharon> for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:12:11 -0500 Message-ID: <016301c31701$95d55c60$6501a8c0@sharon> From: "Sharon Saracino" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 10:36:46 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out003.verizon.net from [141.151.116.160] at Sat, 10 May 2003 09:12:11 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Balmoral Skirts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h4AEEMqa013529 Status: RO Regarding the previous thread on Balmoral skirts...thought someone might be interested in this ebay item http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2828046319&category=20297 Sharon Granny's Closet...a Peek into the Past http://www.grannyscloset.net The Costume Gallery (on staff) http://www.costumegallery.com/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 11:04:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AF4tqa013712 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 11:04:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AF2oUw007763 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 09:02:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AF2mrQ021100; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:02:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ohsmtp02.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp02.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.37]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AF2jrQ021082 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:02:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from duncan (dhcp024-209-059-119.neo.rr.com [24.209.59.119]) by ohsmtp02.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h4AF2iYU021813 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 11:02:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <000701c3163c$00a97420$773bd118@duncan> From: "Ailith Mackintosh" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 11:02:18 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] In light of the duct tape fashions... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I thought it might be appropriate to post this url regarding the origins of duct tape. http://ask.yahoo.com/ask/20030502.html Costume content? None, actually. It's just an interesting bit of information--though there is a link to some very neat duct tape fashions and accessories (this is not the official duct tape site). kate _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 11:21:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AFLkqa013782 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 11:21:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AFJgUw008652 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 09:19:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AFJfrQ026846; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:19:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80409.mail.yahoo.com (web80409.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.64]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4AFJcrQ026815 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:19:39 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030510151933.91852.qmail@web80409.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.205.185.216] by web80409.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 10 May 2003 08:19:33 PDT Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 08:19:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305100502.h4A525YG004527@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Garment District X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sandy asked: > There's a food court a couple of blocks away - can > one of the locals post > the location? Food court/places to eat: Almost all the places to eat are on the west side of Santee, in the 900 block. Selection includes an "International Food Court," Micky D's, and Subway. There's also an El Pollo Loco on the corner of 9th & Santee. ATM: There's an ATM in the little convenience market/liquor store on the corner of either 9th & Santee or 9th & Los Angeles. BRING CASH, and be ready to haggle, especially if you're buying large quantities (entire rolls or bolts). Almost everybody loves to do business in cash, and are willing to negotiate on a price, especially if you can say, "...but it's only _______ down the street at _________." As per any business where most of the buying/selling is for wholesale reasons, you get a better deal if you buy gigantic quantities. The last time I was down, I didn't spend more than $1/yd for any of the fabrics I bought more than 10 yards of (including undyed cotton denim for flat-lining). They also like to make a "lot deal" on unmeasured rolls, so if you're any good at estimating fabric amounts, you can pick up some good bargains. Stores to check out (everybody has their favorites): Berger's Beads: 8th Street, between Maple & Wall. Need I say more? Everything in the way of beads, gems, jewelry findings and supplies. Button Expo: 8th/Santee(?): The best price on buttons, especially metal ones. Linen, wool: Moon Fabrics, 842 Wall and L.A. Magic Fabrics (800 block of Wall). Last time I was in Moon's (4/15/03), linen was running for $2.50/yd for shirtweight in weird colors (anybody for periwinkle blue?), $4.50/yd for white in various weights. Wool was $8-$10/yd. Last year, a group of us was able to strike a deal at L.A. Magic for shirt weight linen at $3/yd, but we bought 150 yards. 9th Street between San Pedro and Los Angeles is now filled with little jobbers, including Venise Fabrics (high-quality silk dupioni for $6.50 yd), Gift Fabrics (everything either $1/yd or $2/yd), Manny's Fabrics, Manny's Fabric Outlet (everything $1/yd), Fabrics Fabrics (awesome selection of silks and linens, almost all under $6/yd), Fred L.A. Fabrics (upholstery fabrics and cotton velvet--go there if you can't find it cheaper elsewhere); Allen Textiles (upholstery fabrics and better prices than Fred), and about 100 other jobbers. Home Fabrics and Michael Levine's used to be terrific bargains, but no more. Most of the fabrics at Home Fabrics are available elsewhere for less, and Michael Levine's prices are even higher than JoAnn's (!). No list of stores and their contents can be complete, as the jobbers go in and out of business, and their stock changes as the market changes (last month everybody had Hawaiian prints; it will probably be winter fabrics in August). Fortunately, it's all pretty accessible by foot, as the stores are concentrated in the 10 blocks along both sides of 9th. I'm known as a "power-shopper," and I can cover the entire fabric area in about 7 hours. Note for wool lovers: B. Black & Sons is NOT in this area. They are up at 548 S. Los Angeles St., about 4 long blocks away. While they may not be the best bargain in the universe, you can still buy fine wool for less than you'll pay at Hancock's, JoAnn's or other local fabric stores (because they're buying it from B. Black's and marking it up), and it is the only place to get ultra-luxe fabrics like 100% cashmere and camelhair. Additional note: In checking their Web page, it seems that B. Black & Sons is now handling fine silks and woolens under the "Kings Road" name. Something else to check out. Thanks to whoever it was (I've forgotten--sorry!) that posted corrections to my directions. I've made the drive so many times the car is simply on auto-pilot, so I don't pay attention to the freeway name/number changes. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 12:04:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AG4bqa013907 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 12:04:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AG2IUw010819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 10:02:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AG2H1v012509; Sat, 10 May 2003 10:02:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net (grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AG2F1v012498 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 10:02:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-11-222.smf.jps.net ([216.119.11.222] helo=pavilion) by grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19EWnd-0001mG-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 10 May 2003 09:02:14 -0700 Message-ID: <000001c3170f$57576740$de0b77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 09:14:16 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h4AG4bqa013907 Status: RO Here's a quote from 16th century commentator Piers Plowman "unless a louse could have leapt a little she could never have walked on so thread-bare a weave" Stretching fabric before retail to increase its length and therefore price seems to have been a common practice and there are quite a number of regulations introduced in England to prohibit this. Just thought I'd share! Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 16:27:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AKR7qa014431 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 16:27:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AKOhUw028690 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 14:24:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AKObNj004239; Sat, 10 May 2003 14:24:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pop2b.ripco.com (pop2b.ripco.com [209.100.227.27]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AKOYNj004185 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 14:24:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ripco.com (tcr181.dynip.ripco.net [209.100.226.181]) by pop2b.ripco.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id h4AKRE615558 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:27:14 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3EBD5FF7.1040503@ripco.com> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 15:24:23 -0500 From: zski User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs References: <200305101800.h4AI0fBu002111@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >--sue, imagining how nice it would be to work on costumes with someone >who likes to do plain sewing (I loathe boring things like hems), but >whowants *her* to do the embroidery! ::waving:: That would be me! I've never been known for my patience, and I am in awe of those who can spend HOURS doing embroidery or lacemaking. I would get frustrated and toss the whole thing out the window in a very short time span if I had to embroider it. ('s why I specialize in peasant and low-middle class. If someone wants something spiffier, I send them to Karen!) Wendy Z ready to look like Snow White with my new paned cap sleeves in Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 17:18:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALHxqa014552 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 17:17:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALFtUw002301 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 15:15:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALFsYe026905; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:15:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALFpYe026874 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:15:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19Ebh8-000Mvy-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 10 May 2003 22:15:50 +0100 Message-ID: <6BJoWTFmkVv+Iw3h@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 20:55:18 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] manor house to warriors References: <005c01c3105c$ad4546e0$0b42a6d0@bookbusiness> In-Reply-To: <005c01c3105c$ad4546e0$0b42a6d0@bookbusiness> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This was really good. Not a lot of costume content, although they did get them all dressed right and they ate period food and lived the part for the weekend. But the combat/competition bit was excellent, and they all knew what they were in for - mostly military or police taking part. Jean Janet Davis wrote >PBS is coming out with another "History meets reality TV" series on >Warriors - knights, Vikings, Romans and gladiators. >http://www.pbs.org/wnet/warriorchallenge/index.html > >It looks like fun. > >Janet > >Janet Davis >Castle Furnishings >http://www.medievalbookstore.com >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 17:18:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALILqa014557 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 17:18:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALGHUw002328 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 15:16:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALGFYe027052; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:16:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALFpYe026872 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:15:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19Ebh8-000Mvw-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 10 May 2003 22:15:50 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 20:51:02 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs References: <1c2.9568ef8.2bed932a@aol.com> <3EBC8883.1492E1F0@in-tch.com> In-Reply-To: <3EBC8883.1492E1F0@in-tch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'll swap, Sue! I'm perfectly happy sewing seams and hems (in front of the TV), but I loathe anything that takes concentration like embroidery! Jean Sue Clemenger wrote >Why am I imagining most of the people on this list, in the afterlife, >which turns out to be this giant costume shop...and it all works >(heaven, right? ) >Goodness, but we've got a little of everything! We all love clothes, but >not the same clothes. Some of us design, some don't. History periods >vary widely. Some of us hand sew, some don't. Some have loads of >experience, some don't. We all do different things for different >reasons, and somehow, it's all historical costuming. >Aren't we all just the grandest bunch? >--sue, imagining how nice it would be to work on costumes with someone >who likes to do plain sewing (I loathe boring things like hems), but who >wants *her* to do the embroidery! > >Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: >> >> Gosh, if you lived close to here we would have to pair up :-) >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: >> Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 7:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hideous sewing jobs >> >> > In a message dated 5/9/2003 6:14:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, >> > alice@wonderland.com writes: >> > >> > > I just hate placing the fabric, pinning >> > > >>>pattern >> > > >>>pieces, marking (that has to be the very worst part) and cutting. >> > > >> > >> > Funny....that's just what I love. Well, actually, I'm sorta indifferent to >> > it, but I know that this is how things are gonna match up and I love to >> > cleverly place things so they do....or so some aspect of the fabric is >> > enhanced. I love the results. >> > Someone else can sew the thing up for me for all I care. >> > _______________________________________________ >> > h-costume mailing list >> > h-costume@mail.indra.com >> > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 17:18:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALIVqa014560 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 17:18:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALGWUw002357 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 15:16:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALGVYe027186; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:16:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALFpYe026873 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:15:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19Ebh8-000Mvx-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 10 May 2003 22:15:50 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 20:49:01 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] HELP?! Looking for sources for Viking/Valkyrie Images References: <20030507033918.64930.qmail@web12503.mail.yahoo.com> <3EB8FBD9.6070704@oldwaylane.net> In-Reply-To: <3EB8FBD9.6070704@oldwaylane.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Viking armour is all chainmail, it's too early for plate. So if you want the pointy breastplate, you're going to have to go for fantasy/operatic. Jean Judy Mitchell wrote >Lil Sorepaws wrote: >> I am trying to hunt down some images of viking armor and female garb, >> specifically any images pertaining to the Valkyries ... > > viking armor.. well if you want to see extant armor, you need to >look in some of the books. The Osprey series books (very thin, paper >covers) actually have some good photos in them. If you want to see pics >of general clothing and a lot of women's styles, you can look at my >group's site: http://www.ostvik.org and click on >- unless you want to see pics of us in garb with 12 parrots on our head >& shoulders! But none of us are in armor. There's a nice pic of some >guys who are at http://www.vikings.ndirect.co.uk/ > > As to images of valkyries. There you're going to have a problem. >Firstly, the concept of valkyries in winged hemlents and brass byrnies >is extremely victorian and largely Wagner. There is absolutely no proof >of any of this existing except in their minds. There are some small >silver figures of women that are commonly called "valkyries" basically >because they are jewelery, women, and some of them are offering >drinking horns. Their clothing isn't any different from basic upper >class women's clothing. If you want pics of these silver pendants, let >me know and I can forward them to you. > > > > A group of us are trying to design our combat armour to >> resemble a valkyrie's but so far few images have been found to >> substantiate or even give ideas .. any clue and points of interest would >> be most appreciated... THANK YOU!! > That's because the entire thing is very late period and >completely mythological. Whether or not women were ever even warriors >is a debated topic. If you want the classic concept - look at victorian >books and look at Wagner's Ring Cycle. If you want true historic..... >haven't seen any proof of it, which is why you're having so much trouble. > > >> - Lil (not a drop of scandinavian blood in me ... ;) > yeah, I know the feeling! > > -Judy Mitchell >(my heart is Scandinavian, even if the rest of me isn't) > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 17:41:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALfYqa014615 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 17:41:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALdWUw003884 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 15:39:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALdUYe006494; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:39:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20210.mail.yahoo.com (web20210.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4ALdSYe006469 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:39:29 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030510213928.33950.qmail@web20210.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [146.115.123.118] by web20210.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 10 May 2003 14:39:28 PDT Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 14:39:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000001c3170f$57576740$de0b77d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It was not so long ago that I was tickled to learn exactly what shoddy fabric is, but your message didn't reference that meaning. Is it so widely known that you just assumed the joke had been communicated? Since I can't believe I'm the only one who didn't know, I'll mention that "shoddy" refers to cloth made from old woolen rags pulled apart, respun, and rewoven into cloth, either alone or mixed with new wool or cotton. It's easy to see how the term could be expanded to include any inferior goods or material which pretends to be better than it is. (My source: "Household Textiles" copyright 1912) -Angela __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 18:00:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AM0Jqa014652 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 18:00:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALwGUw005058 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 15:58:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALwF1T014127; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:58:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from lakemtao07.cox.net (lakemtao07.cox.net [68.1.17.114]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ALwB1T014053 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:58:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from UNABOM ([68.1.234.199]) by lakemtao07.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with SMTP id <20030510215805.LAQM4514.lakemtao07.cox.net@UNABOM> for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 17:58:05 -0400 Message-ID: <06a301c317a2$f9734dd0$0200a8c0@UNABOM> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305101800.h4AI0fBu002111@net.indra.com> <3EBD5FF7.1040503@ripco.com> Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 04:52:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm working on an early 15th century cote, and I'm going to be finishing the seams in such a way that the stitching shows on the outside. Having grown tired of headaches from sewing dark blue thread onto dark blue fabric (and liking the effect of white stitching on dark blue) I'd like to do the seam finish in white thread. I've been going back through all the text I could find on extant garments, and darned if I could find a single mention of thread color--width, composition, frequency of stitches, sure, but no color, not even 'bog trash brown.' Has anyone found any mention, anywhere, ideally around the turn of the 15th century in the Lowlands, of white or contrasting thread color on seam finishes? E _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 18:16:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMGJqa014709 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 18:16:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMEFUw006155 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 16:14:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMEE1T021194; Sat, 10 May 2003 16:14:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMEC1T021166 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 16:14:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 537F17AC46 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:13:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 62842-06 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:13:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-207-103-202.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.207.103.202]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FDBA7A7DB for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:13:32 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 15:14:01 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030510213928.33950.qmail@web20210.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's still used that way (I can't tell if you are aware of that, or not) in reference to reused wools, at least, according to my current Textiles text! On Saturday, May 10, 2003, at 02:39 PM, Angela Kovatch wrote: > It was not so long ago that I was tickled to learn > exactly what shoddy fabric is, but your message didn't > reference that meaning. Is it so widely known that > you just assumed the joke had been communicated? > > Since I can't believe I'm the only one who didn't > know, I'll mention that "shoddy" refers to cloth made > from old woolen rags pulled apart, respun, and rewoven > into cloth, either alone or mixed with new wool or > cotton. It's easy to see how the term could be > expanded to include any inferior goods or material > which pretends to be better than it is. (My source: > "Household Textiles" copyright 1912) > > -Angela > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 18:24:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMOaqa014723 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 18:24:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMMZUw006758 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 16:22:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMMZ1T026013; Sat, 10 May 2003 16:22:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta3-svc.business.ntl.com (mta3-svc.business.ntl.com [62.253.164.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMMV1T025999 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 16:22:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from MESH ([80.1.18.56]) by mta3-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030510222230.YNPI23713.mta3-svc.business.ntl.com@MESH> for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 23:22:30 +0100 Message-ID: <005901c31742$a1ee3850$38120150@MESH> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <005c01c3105c$ad4546e0$0b42a6d0@bookbusiness> <6BJoWTFmkVv+Iw3h@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: [h-cost] manor house to warriors Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 23:22:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO They were taught by the master of Arms at the Royal Armouries museum in Leeds and head of the European Combat guild so the teaching is excellent. I should know I do their class each week and now am forming the biceps to go with it Dawn Ages of Elegance, makers of historical reproduction clothing , uniforms and bridalwear 0113 277 6716 http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk > Janet Davis wrote > >PBS is coming out with another "History meets reality TV" series on > >Warriors - knights, Vikings, Romans and gladiators. > >http://www.pbs.org/wnet/warriorchallenge/index.html > > > >It looks like fun. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 18:44:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMigqa014778 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 18:44:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMgdUw007927 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 16:42:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMgc1T005070; Sat, 10 May 2003 16:42:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net (hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4AMgZ1T005046 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 16:42:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-012-050.jps.net ([216.119.12.50] helo=pavilion) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Ed34-0002la-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 10 May 2003 15:42:35 -0700 Message-ID: <002501c31747$4b42ed20$320c77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030510213928.33950.qmail@web20210.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 15:55:45 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO No, I didn't know that definition at all. So thank you very much Angela. I was only aware of it meaning an inferior product. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela Kovatch" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 2:39 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! > It was not so long ago that I was tickled to learn > exactly what shoddy fabric is, but your message didn't > reference that meaning. Is it so widely known that > you just assumed the joke had been communicated? > > Since I can't believe I'm the only one who didn't > know, I'll mention that "shoddy" refers to cloth made > from old woolen rags pulled apart, respun, and rewoven > into cloth, either alone or mixed with new wool or > cotton. It's easy to see how the term could be > expanded to include any inferior goods or material > which pretends to be better than it is. (My source: > "Household Textiles" copyright 1912) > > -Angela > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 20:50:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B0oqqa015228 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 20:50:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B0mmUw015959 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 18:48:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B0mi85029779; Sat, 10 May 2003 18:48:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp2.pacifier.net (smtp2.pacifier.net [64.255.237.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B0me85029734 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 18:48:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from KatHouse (ip247.125-173-207.eli-du.nwlink.com [207.173.125.247]) by smtp2.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0B4C6A6E5 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 17:48:38 -0700 (PDT) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 17:49:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread Message-ID: <3EBD3B8F.21856.705EF0E@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <06a301c317a2$f9734dd0$0200a8c0@UNABOM> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I've been going back through all the text I could find on extant > garments, and darned if I could find a single mention of thread > color--width, composition, frequency of stitches, sure, but no color, > not even 'bog trash brown.' Has anyone found any mention, anywhere, > ideally around the turn of the 15th century in the Lowlands, of white > or contrasting thread color on seam finishes? While not pertaining to the Lowlands specifically, the Museum of London book "Clothing and Textile" discusses this in part. That's about as close as you'll likely find (except perhaps in textile archeology journals) right now. If you do find more, please let me know as I collect information on handsewing. Frankly, one of the problems with looking at thread color is the problem of color at all. So often the colors (except in carefully kept textiles) is all but lost. The only way to tell what color it was is to do chemical analysis on the remnant looking for residual dye material. And frankly, threads have very little volume on which to do this. For example, they used to think that most of the 19th century garments used undyed ("white") threads of a brown color. However, later analysis showed that they had actually been dyed dark blue but the dye had faded to the pale tan they found. It wasn't until they did the dye chemical analysis that they found this out. Look at paintings from the time period. There are several 15th C Lowlands painters (unless you are talking Scottish lowlands, then all bets are off to even find a painter from the time period). In that time period they often were quite accurate in their portrayal of seams and the like. Frankly, I've not seen anything contrasting that showed from the outside (unless it looked more like embroidery so I didn't notice it as being a "seam treatment".) You could probably get away with using a tan color more than a modern "white". I sincerely doubt they would have had the ultrawhitened thread and used it on a dark fabric. While I can see them using it on white fabric, I can't believe they'd go to that trouble for something which either wouldn't be seen or wasn't specifically meant to be decorative. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 21:19:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B1JUqa015340 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 21:19:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B1HQUw017745 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 19:17:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B1HPG0012175; Sat, 10 May 2003 19:17:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.232]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B1HOG0012161 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 19:17:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-005-226.jps.net ([216.119.5.226] helo=pavilion) by flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19EfSs-0003mh-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 10 May 2003 18:17:23 -0700 Message-ID: <000601c3175c$eb838140$e20577d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EBD3B8F.21856.705EF0E@localhost> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 18:30:32 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Drea sent me some info on inventories of tailor's shops and basic thread colours, black, white were mentioned. I'm a bit in a rush so I can't double check now, but I do not recall coloured threads being listed. I'll check later if no one else answers this question. It's only a circumstancial factoid and not your time period, but still....... Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 5:49 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread > > I've been going back through all the text I could find on extant > > garments, and darned if I could find a single mention of thread > > color--width, composition, frequency of stitches, sure, but no color, > > not even 'bog trash brown.' Has anyone found any mention, anywhere, > > ideally around the turn of the 15th century in the Lowlands, of white > > or contrasting thread color on seam finishes? > > While not pertaining to the Lowlands specifically, the Museum of > London book "Clothing and Textile" discusses this in part. That's > about as close as you'll likely find (except perhaps in textile > archeology journals) right now. If you do find more, please let me > know as I collect information on handsewing. > > Frankly, one of the problems with looking at thread color is the > problem of color at all. So often the colors (except in carefully > kept textiles) is all but lost. The only way to tell what color it > was is to do chemical analysis on the remnant looking for residual > dye material. And frankly, threads have very little volume on which > to do this. > > For example, they used to think that most of the 19th century > garments used undyed ("white") threads of a brown color. However, > later analysis showed that they had actually been dyed dark blue but > the dye had faded to the pale tan they found. It wasn't until they > did the dye chemical analysis that they found this out. > > Look at paintings from the time period. There are several 15th C > Lowlands painters (unless you are talking Scottish lowlands, then all > bets are off to even find a painter from the time period). In that > time period they often were quite accurate in their portrayal of > seams and the like. Frankly, I've not seen anything contrasting that > showed from the outside (unless it looked more like embroidery so I > didn't notice it as being a "seam treatment".) > > You could probably get away with using a tan color more than a modern > "white". I sincerely doubt they would have had the ultrawhitened > thread and used it on a dark fabric. While I can see them using it on > white fabric, I can't believe they'd go to that trouble for something > which either wouldn't be seen or wasn't specifically meant to be > decorative. > > Kat > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 10 22:01:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B21Qqa015454 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 22:01:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B1xNUw020159 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 19:59:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B1xLH9028527; Sat, 10 May 2003 19:59:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from lakemtao08.cox.net (lakemtao08.cox.net [68.1.17.113]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B1xJH9028488 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 19:59:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from UNABOM ([68.1.234.199]) by lakemtao08.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with SMTP id <20030511015912.OIHZ7627.lakemtao08.cox.net@UNABOM> for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 21:59:12 -0400 Message-ID: <06c801c317c4$a8b7ea00$0200a8c0@UNABOM> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EBD3B8F.21856.705EF0E@localhost> <000601c3175c$eb838140$e20577d8@pavilion> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 08:53:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Neither one is my time period, actually. =} For clothing, I stick pretty solidly with late 15thC/early 16thC Flemish, with some recent forays into 1480s Dutch. This particular gown is my idea of taking a break--there's so much more extant information for the late 14th/early 15th than for my era, and scads more (excellent!) research & articles out there. Let someone else do all the hard part for once! I wanna just cut it, fit it, and sew it--not spend years researching every single tiny thing. (Y'all heard that heart-felt cry, right? =}) But anyway, while late 15thC Flanders is great for its detailed paintings (they show SEAMS! Wonderful, glorious seams! And there are a few where if I stare long enough, I do start thinking I'm seeing the stitching...) I certainly haven't found anything from 1405-10 that has the level of detail where you'd expect to see stitches--even seams are scarce that early. Yeah, sigh, I realize that it's not exactly easy to deduce thread color from most extant garments (although I'd think maybe on the Uppsala...?), but there has been testing in some cases. I just don't know any of the results. Grumblegrumble. I don't have the MOL book and have no way of getting at it at the moment--is there any color information either way that sticks in anyone's head? Very nifty to know of the white thread/black thread records, but my instant thought is this: _I_ don't keep any colors of handsewing thread in stock, either--I always just dye it to match as I go! (For that matter, the idea of actually buying fabric in the color that I want it to end up is an alien concept to me. What if I change my mind about the color?! I can dye that white to navy, but that navy worsted ain't turning white anytime soon...) But at this point, the wrong date doesn't really bother me much at all. E has about 10 hours of inside seams left, and then she's just gonna do SOMETHING, cos this is supposed to be her no-brainer dress, darnitol. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 00:07:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B47Nqa015794 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 00:07:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B45NUw027897 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 22:05:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B45JiL018746; Sat, 10 May 2003 22:05:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m08.mx.aol.com (imo-m08.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.163]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B45FiL018672 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 22:05:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from MaddNancy@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.1c2.968fee9 (3842) for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 00:05:05 -0400 (EDT) From: MaddNancy@aol.com Message-ID: <1c2.968fee9.2bef25f0@aol.com> Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 00:05:04 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Renaissance Fans X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm trying to locate a web page that I thought I had bookmarked that details the making of several types of Renaissance fans. My recollection is that the person had taught a class in it for her SCA group. I've searched and can't find it. If any of you are familiar with the site, please post the address! Thanks, Nancy _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 00:26:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B4Q4qa015830 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 00:26:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B4O4Uw028886 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 22:24:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B4O4iL025879; Sat, 10 May 2003 22:24:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ix4.quiknet.com (ix4.mailcluster.quiknet.com [207.183.225.58]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4B4O1iL025860 for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 22:24:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 77090 invoked from network); 11 May 2003 04:24:00 -0000 Received: from 65.3-6.mcc.pmpool.quiknet.com (HELO joanjura) (207.183.248.65) by ix4.quiknet.com with SMTP; 11 May 2003 04:23:58 -0000 Message-Id: <4.2.2.20030510211411.01c566f0@mail2.quiknet.com> X-Sender: joanj@mail2.quiknet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.2 Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 21:23:01 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Joan M Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sutters Fort Dress In-Reply-To: <46FE4E7E-80D8-11D7-A981-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 03:07 PM 05/07/2003 -0700, you wrote: >A friend of a friend (she's a teacher) >needs a "Sutter's Fort Pioneer Dress" > kind of costume. > >I'm assuming that is 1850s or so? > I have no idea. I'm not going to be >making the dress, but the friend that >will (who is not a costumer) asked for >advice on patterns. Any suggestions? > >thanks! >.heather. Heather, Am I safe in assuming that this teacher is involved with the Sutter's Fort Environmental Living Program? If she is, then the Sutter's Fort ELP Wrapper Dress is appropriate (the Fort is targeted to just pre-Gold Rush, i.e., 1847 or so). I have made four (so far) for myself, and have taught two classes in how to construct it (I'm also one of the people that the pattern designer measured to help determine size ranges, though I've come down in size since last summer ). The Wrapper Dress pattern is available from the Sutter's Fort Trade Store (916-442-4966) or I know that it is carried by Smoke & Fire in their catalog. There are two versions, one for Women's sizes and one for Girl's sizes. Each pattern is multi-sized. If your friend the seamstress needs assistance, feel free to give her my email address, or send me a private email and I will send you my phone number to relay to her. Joan Jurancich Sacramento, CA joanj@quiknet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 01:24:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B5Oeqa016100 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 01:24:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B5MaUw002695 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 10 May 2003 23:22:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B5MZXb018955; Sat, 10 May 2003 23:22:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B5MWXc018943 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 10 May 2003 23:22:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4B5MaA2004292 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 01:22:36 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4B5MZZN004290 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 11 May 2003 01:22:35 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Renaissance Fans Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 01:22:35 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <1c2.968fee9.2bef25f0@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <1c2.968fee9.2bef25f0@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305110122.35563.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sunday 11 May 2003 12:05 am, MaddNancy@aol.com wrote: > I'm trying to locate a web page that I thought I had bookmarked that > details the making of several types of Renaissance fans. My recollection > is that the person had taught a class in it for her SCA group. I've > searched and can't find it. If any of you are familiar with the site, > please post the address! There is a page on the Renaissance Tailor site that excellently describes the making of fans--could this be what you had in mind? http://www.vertetsable.com/demos_fans.htm -- Cathy Raymond "Intelligence is the ultimate aphrodisiac." Timothy Leary _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 02:20:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B6K6qa016182 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 02:20:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B6I6Uw007901 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 00:18:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B6I4e1013303; Sun, 11 May 2003 00:18:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (mta5.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4B6I2e1013286 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 00:18:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([64.175.33.28]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HEP00C4JLI1B3@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 10 May 2003 23:18:02 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 23:17:56 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Kate & Leopold In-reply-to: <1ee.88394f0.2bed6cd1@aol.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030510231153.04bacba0@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Kate and Leopold. I thought it was really >cute, and although I have some definate complaints about the costuming (ie >the fact that Leopold was at a ball and wearing riding boots) but over all, I >thought Hugh Jackman pulled off the clothing very well. Pulled off: Yess! (one of the deleted scenes has him in a bathtub) Other than that, I agree about the costuming. But I thought Meg Ryan's modern dress was an especially good choice for something to fit in with late 1870s. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 10:03:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BE3c9a029375 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 10:03:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BE1XUw015395 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 08:01:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BE1S7o027217; Sun, 11 May 2003 08:01:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BE1Q7o027144 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 08:01:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m151.in-tch.com [216.166.191.151]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4BDhAD25734 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 07:43:11 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EBE5804.33A5AC42@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 08:02:44 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Kate & Leopold References: <4.3.1.2.20030510231153.04bacba0@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sacre-bleu! They *dared* delete a scene with Hugh Jackman in a bathtub? Oh, maaaann...... --sue Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > >Kate and Leopold. I thought it was really > >cute, and although I have some definate complaints about the costuming (ie > >the fact that Leopold was at a ball and wearing riding boots) but over all, I > >thought Hugh Jackman pulled off the clothing very well. > > Pulled off: Yess! (one of the deleted scenes has him in a bathtub) Other > than that, I agree about the costuming. But I thought Meg Ryan's modern > dress was an especially good choice for something to fit in with late 1870s. > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 10:14:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BEEkvu029713 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 10:14:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BECjUw016631 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 08:12:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BECi7o002601; Sun, 11 May 2003 08:12:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BECf7o002541 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 08:12:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m151.in-tch.com [216.166.191.151]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4BDsQD28721 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 07:54:26 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EBE5AA7.BE7BEEC8@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 08:13:59 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! References: <000001c3170f$57576740$de0b77d8@pavilion> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Uh....if I'm not mistaken, Piers Plowman's just a *wee* century or two earlier than the 16th c. The part of my brain that pretends to have been educated keeps poking me in the ribs and insisting that he (maybe?) pre-dated Chaucer? --sue, thinking ahead to a nice Mother's Day brunch with friends, and then....(OCC) dyeing with dandelions! (we're working on fabric for an undergown for one of us, who will be made a Peer [SCA reference] in a month or so) Lisa Sinervo wrote: > > Here's a quote from 16th century commentator Piers Plowman "unless a louse could have leapt a little she could never have walked on so thread-bare a weave" > Stretching fabric before retail to increase its length and therefore price seems to have been a common practice and there are quite a number of regulations introduced in England to prohibit this. Just thought I'd share! > > Lisa > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 10:51:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BEpGHP029980 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 10:51:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BEnHUw019749 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 08:49:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BEnF7o017184; Sun, 11 May 2003 08:49:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BEnC7o017129 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 08:49:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LoreleiMorte@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id r.171.1e6dc2ae (3699); Sun, 11 May 2003 10:49:00 -0400 (EDT) From: LoreleiMorte@aol.com Message-ID: <171.1e6dc2ae.2befbcdc@aol.com> Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 10:49:00 EDT To: sca-garb@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 cc: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Middle Class Dress Diary X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I started my middle class dress diary for the dress diary junkies out there (of which I am one) :) http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/midclass.html -Sarra Wryght http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 11:12:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFC5HP030015 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:12:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFA0Uw021889 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 09:10:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BF9xGc025786; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:09:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m08.mx.aol.com (imo-m08.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.163]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BF9uGc025710 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:09:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LLWatts@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.90.36dadf19 (3964) for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:09:46 -0400 (EDT) From: LLWatts@aol.com Message-ID: <90.36dadf19.2befc1b9@aol.com> Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 11:09:45 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >It was not so long ago that I was tickled to learn >exactly what shoddy fabric is, but your message didn't >reference that meaning. Is it so widely known that >you just assumed the joke had been communicated? > >Since I can't believe I'm the only one who didn't >know, I'll mention that "shoddy" refers to cloth made >from old woolen rags pulled apart, respun, and rewoven >into cloth, either alone or mixed with new wool or >cotton. It's easy to see how the term could be >expanded to include any inferior goods or material >which pretends to be better than it is. (My source: >"Household Textiles" copyright 1912) I believe the term's been dated back at least as far as the American Civil War (early-mid 1860's). Apparently several companies providing supplies for the newly-expanded Union Army charged the government for uniforms made of good solid cloth and delivered uniforms made of shoddy. Leah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 11:24:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFO0HP030036 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:24:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFLxUw022777 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 09:21:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFLwGc000701; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:21:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFLuGc000688 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:21:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f7b.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.123]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id D50F64801E9 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 17:21:54 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000701c317d1$768383c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <171.1e6dc2ae.2befbcdc@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Middle Class Dress Diary Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 17:24:49 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. This was nice to se, there is always so quiet on this list on sundays. What a clever way to use the fabric for the skirt. Ill follow your work! Thanks Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 4:49 PM Subject: [h-cost] Middle Class Dress Diary > I started my middle class dress diary for the dress diary junkies out there > (of which I am one) :) > > http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/midclass.html > > -Sarra Wryght > http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 11:29:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFT8HP030040 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:29:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFP1Ve022941 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 09:27:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFG3Gc028522; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:16:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.115]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFF2Gc027704 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:15:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.net (pcp03509979pcs.elictc01.md.comcast.net [68.54.185.111]) by mtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEQ00289ABIA9@mtaout02.icomcast.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:14:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 11:14:23 -0400 From: Cozit / Liz To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: <3EBE68CF.40402@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 References: <200305110424.h4B4ONiM026012@net.indra.com> Subject: [h-cost] Re: embroidery and patience X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Patience? Who said you had to be patient to do embroidery? Heck, it requires a lot more patience and stick-to-it-ness for me to get a hem finished (especially if we're talking long full skirt) than it does to work on embroidery. Though I'll admit with more patience, I'd probably get more embroidery actually *finished* and faster... People keep exclaiming that I have so much patience, because they see me embroidering... at the gyms waiting for my kids, in the car, in school, *g* believe it or not at the mall even a couple of times. And yes, I embroider with friends and in front of the tv, and occasionally with a book on tape (when I'm knitting or crocheting, sometimes I'm actually reading the book as well). In case you can't figure it out from that list... one of the reasons I embroider is becase I *don't* have much patience and in fact I get the fidgets and have trouble paying attention/staying awake in classes and such (the one think I don't look forward to working around when heading towards grad school soon). Of course it depends on what you're working on, too.... I prefer counted work even if it's on un-even cloth (I do lots of counting and figure out how to adjust for the most even), because I have a history of rather odd work happening when supposedly following lines... ever seen a very lopsided (one side almost twice as wide as the other) triangle nose on a raggedy ann doll? *On* the lines, but still I managed.... I am completely in awe of some of the "surface embroidery" I've seen worked by some of the folks on this list... but I'll stick to blackwork and a few other odds and ends of stitches for my costuming I think. Naw... you don't need patience to embroider...just a bit of practice... and enough free fidgit time to actually get some done :-) -Elisabeth Wendy said: >I've never been known for my patience, and I am in awe of those who can >spend HOURS doing embroidery or lacemaking. I would get frustrated and >toss the whole thing out the window in a very short time span if I had >to embroider it. > >('s why I specialize in peasant and low-middle class. If someone wants >something spiffier, I send them to Karen!) > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 11:29:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFT9HP030043 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:29:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFP1Vg022941 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 09:27:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFGDGc028574; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:16:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BFG5Gc028536 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:16:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-003-086.jps.net ([216.119.3.86] helo=pavilion) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19EsYV-0001RL-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 11 May 2003 08:16:04 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01c317d2$14fe7fa0$560377d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000001c3170f$57576740$de0b77d8@pavilion> <3EBE5AA7.BE7BEEC8@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 08:29:13 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Re: the Piers Plowman correction, thanks for that. I always appreciate fact checkers! The quote came out of a book called "The History of Shopping" by Dorothy Davis, quite fascinating, and Piers Plowman seemed to be included in 16th century affairs but it could easily have been earlier. It was from a chapter on Town Markets in the late Middle Ages, but the time span seemed to spread forwards a bit. If you come up with any better dates, please send them my way. I suspect you are right. I'm trying to get a grip on how one went about shopping for clothes 16th c, as you know. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 7:13 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! > Uh....if I'm not mistaken, Piers Plowman's just a *wee* century or two > earlier than the 16th c. The part of my brain that pretends to have been > educated keeps poking me in the ribs and insisting that he (maybe?) > pre-dated Chaucer? > --sue, thinking ahead to a nice Mother's Day brunch with friends, and > then....(OCC) dyeing with dandelions! (we're working on fabric for an > undergown for one of us, who will be made a Peer [SCA reference] in a > month or so) > > Lisa Sinervo wrote: > > > > Here's a quote from 16th century commentator Piers Plowman "unless a louse could have leapt a little she could never have walked on so thread-bare a weave" > > Stretching fabric before retail to increase its length and therefore price seems to have been a common practice and there are quite a number of regulations introduced in England to prohibit this. Just thought I'd share! > > > > Lisa > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 12:49:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BGnHHP030224 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 12:49:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BGlCUw028283 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 10:47:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BGlBuJ002779; Sun, 11 May 2003 10:47:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4BGl8uJ002729 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 10:47:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/OgOd5D3EOiGyES0Esfi3KXo=">; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:46:52 PDT Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HXWQXJZ7; Sun, 11 May 2003 09:46:52 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 09:39:07 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! Message-ID: <20030511.094601.276.4.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,5-11 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Piers Plowman (Langland, actually) is Chaucerian era. Arlys On Sun, 11 May 2003 08:13:59 -0600 Sue Clemenger writes: > Uh....if I'm not mistaken, Piers Plowman's just a *wee* century or > two > earlier than the 16th c. The part of my brain that pretends to have > been > educated keeps poking me in the ribs and insisting that he (maybe?) > pre-dated Chaucer? ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 13:14:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BHEUHP030261 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:14:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BHCNUw000310 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 11:12:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BHCMAB015749; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:12:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from apollo.gti.net (apollo.gti.net [199.171.27.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4A2F0xl015173 for ; Fri, 9 May 2003 20:15:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gti.net (ml.gti.net [208.216.122.98]) by apollo.gti.net (mail) with ESMTP id C37E9357DA; Fri, 9 May 2003 22:14:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EBC5FAD.C51D12C9@gti.net> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:10:53 -0400 From: martyr@gti.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: undisclosed-recipients:; X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 11 May 2003 11:12:21 -0600 Subject: [h-cost] Kyoto book on eBay X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Anyone looking for the Kyoto Museum "Revolution in Fashion" book, there's one on eBay right now: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2829816108&category=20297 Cheers, Lisa R. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 13:48:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BHm5HP030337 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:48:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BHjXUw002797 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 11:45:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BHjWAB000126; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:45:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BHjVAB000100 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:45:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4BHgBp7004061 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 10:42:12 -0700 Message-ID: <3EBE8BF9.8020900@misc.com> Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 10:44:25 -0700 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Middle Class Dress Diary References: <171.1e6dc2ae.2befbcdc@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO To Sarra- I _LOOOOVE_ your color combination - that is just so striking!!! The out fit is going to be so beautiful, thanks for posting this. Theresa Eacker LoreleiMorte@aol.com wrote: > I started my middle class dress diary for the dress diary junkies out there > (of which I am one) :) > > http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/midclass.html > > -Sarra Wryght > http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 14:59:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BIx4HP030573 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 14:59:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BInVUw007944 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 12:49:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BInUf9027629; Sun, 11 May 2003 12:49:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BInSf9027619 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 12:49:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-010-098.jps.net ([216.119.10.98] helo=pavilion) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Evt1-0005iD-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 11 May 2003 11:49:28 -0700 Message-ID: <001701c317ef$e323c260$620a77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <171.1e6dc2ae.2befbcdc@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Middle Class Dress Diary Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 12:02:34 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks for posting, it's always fun to see others work. The effigy corset looks immaculate! Perfect straight stitching from the photos. Look forward to the dress progress. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 7:49 AM Subject: [h-cost] Middle Class Dress Diary > I started my middle class dress diary for the dress diary junkies out there > (of which I am one) :) > > http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/midclass.html > > -Sarra Wryght > http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 15:29:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJTfHP030703 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 15:29:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJKBUw010219 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 13:20:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJKA8v012079; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:20:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJK98v012071 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:20:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1135A7ABF0 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 12:19:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 79032-08 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 12:19:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-202-186-159.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.202.186.159]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EA0C7ADB3 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 12:19:29 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 12:19:56 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] re:documentation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <3EBBF704.10803@ripco.com> Message-Id: <8D08B06F-83E5-11D7-ABC4-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks for all the answers to my questions. I personally have no plans to enter a costume contest, but I'm required to provide documentation for costumes for school, and I was curious how they differed. Thanks! On Friday, May 9, 2003, at 11:44 AM, zski wrote: > >> How does one present documentation for costume contests? >> I've never seen one before - does one hand over a binder of >> supporting materials to the judges..? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 15:45:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJj0HP030770 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 15:45:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJfnUw011755 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 13:41:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJfl8v021495; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:41:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80411.mail.yahoo.com (web80411.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.66]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4BJfi8v021459 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:41:45 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030511194139.33767.qmail@web80411.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.205.185.216] by web80411.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 11 May 2003 12:41:39 PDT Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 12:41:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305111800.h4BI0MfA006325@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Kate & Leopold X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sue wrote > Sacre-bleu! They *dared* delete a scene with Hugh > Jackman in a bathtub? > Oh, maaaann...... Fortunately, it's on the DVD (and quite tasty! Yum!) Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 15:55:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJtiHP030832 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 15:55:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJrNUw012871 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 13:53:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BJrH8v027207; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:53:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80406.mail.yahoo.com (web80406.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4BJrF8v027146 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:53:15 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030511195310.15938.qmail@web80406.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.205.185.216] by web80406.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 11 May 2003 12:53:10 PDT Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 12:53:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305111800.h4BI0MfA006325@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I can't believe this has happened...I appear to have killed my beloved Kenmore 158904. The clutch nut bushing appears to have finally given way; IOW, I can't keep the flywheel tightened down so that it sews. This is the same part that was fixed about a year ago, and I was warned at that time that the Kenmore wouldn't last forever, but it's not supposed to stop now in the middle of a job. This is what I get for bragging what a reliable old workhorse it is. 8-< OK, thanks for letting me whine. Thank heavens, I've still got my Viking. I've still got 15 costumes to build in the next 12 days (in addition to working as a full-time teacher), so it's back to work. Maybe I'll pop "Kate & Leopold" into the DVD player... Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 16:06:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BK6THP030865 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 16:06:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BK2cUw013792 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 14:02:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BK2XRL002345; Sun, 11 May 2003 14:02:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BK2URL002273 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 14:02:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEQ002BXNO18T@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 11 May 2003 13:02:26 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 12:56:46 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! In-reply-to: <20030511195310.15938.qmail@web80406.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030511125519.02c3c010@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/9/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <200305111800.h4BI0MfA006325@net.indra.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Dawn, I am sorry to hear your machine died. I know how frustrating that can be. Thank goodness for backup machines, yes? Will the Kenmore be repaired or buried with honors? Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 17:41:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BLetHP031145 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 17:40:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BLUIUw021266 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 15:30:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BLTauV012646; Sun, 11 May 2003 15:29:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (oe49.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BLTUuV012564 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 15:29:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 11 May 2003 14:29:19 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe49.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Sun, 11 May 2003 21:29:18 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EBC5FAD.C51D12C9@gti.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Kyoto book on eBay Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 17:28:42 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 May 2003 21:29:19.0102 (UTC) FILETIME=[617CF1E0:01C31804] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 51$ I think it would be a better deal to go out and buy a brand new "Fashion" book, from Kyoto Costume Institute. It has most, if not all, of the Revolution in Fashion pictures, plus a lot more! ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 10:10 PM Subject: [h-cost] Kyoto book on eBay > Anyone looking for the Kyoto Museum "Revolution in Fashion" book, > there's one on eBay right now: > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2829816108&category=20297 > > Cheers, > Lisa R. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 18:30:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMUgHP031234 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 18:30:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMQgUw025731 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 16:26:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMQT4l008771; Sun, 11 May 2003 16:26:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net (mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.48]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMQL4l008721 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 16:26:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19EzGs-00074U-00; Sun, 11 May 2003 15:26:18 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 15:26:18 -0700 Message-ID: <001d01c3180c$57ff01f0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 cc: GermanRenCostume@yahoogroups.com Subject: [h-cost] Picking an 'old' language to study for the purposes of researching costume.... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thought I'd get some opinions on this. I am returning to Grad school for bio-engineering and thought I would pick up a certificate in Medieval/Renaissance studies while I was at it since hubby offered to foot the bill. The curriculum is heavily language based and requires several semesters of Latin (for which I am covered) and then several semesters of an 'old' language. So the question is which one should I study? I am not really interested in 'olde' English so I was considering French (because it was used as 'the' court language for some time and I thought there might be a plethora of material), Italian, because maybe I could study something about the Medici (and it is very similar to modern Italian apparently), and German because I already speak it and those Germans sure do seem like they collected and preserved a lot of clothing. Anyway, I know there are a number of you who have done some research and wondered if you had any opinions.. Thanks, Sg "The root of education is bitter, the fruit sweet" Isocrates _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 18:47:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMlUHP031314 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 18:47:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMj6Uw028331 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 16:45:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMj54l019209; Sun, 11 May 2003 16:45:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from apollo.gti.net (apollo.gti.net [199.171.27.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMj04l019155 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 16:45:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gti.net (morr0615.gti.net [208.216.122.15]) by apollo.gti.net (mail) with ESMTP id D43403553A for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 18:44:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EBED26F.DD4E4A75@gti.net> Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 18:45:03 -0400 From: martyr@gti.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Kyoto book on eBay References: <3EBC5FAD.C51D12C9@gti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh sorry it was under $10 w/no reserve when I first sent the message. Lisa R. > At 51$ I think it would be a better deal to go out and buy a brand new > "Fashion" book, from Kyoto Costume Institute. It has most, if not all, of > the Revolution in Fashion pictures, plus a lot more! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 18:58:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMw8HP031336 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 18:58:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMtbUw029336 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 16:55:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMtX7h023816; Sun, 11 May 2003 16:55:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mclean.mail.mindspring.net (mclean.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.57]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BMtV7h023805 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 16:55:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ap-014caburbp0237.dialsprint.net ([63.191.8.237] helo=[0019381808]) by mclean.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Ezj8-00071r-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 11 May 2003 18:55:30 -0400 From: "Katherine" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 15:56:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [h-cost] Re: ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Message-ID: <3EBE7292.5592.59F059@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <200305051801.h45I1f5L020825@net.indra.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I hadn't really thought about the possibility of age discoloration being even. I think that I'm just used to it being uneven. And, in real life it's quite a nice creamy shade. Quite good to know though, and that's why I love these lists, you learn something new every day :) Katherine On 5 May 2003 at 12:01, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 10:25:02 -0700 > From: Lavolta Press > > This is not ecru, it is showing a yellowish white on my monitor. It looks > like age discoloration to me. That can be very even. Fran > > At 11:05 PM 5/4/2003 -0700, you wrote: > I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with > insertion. I have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it > was. The color is very even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it > doesn't look like it aged that way but was originally that way. I have a > page about it here: http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html No > pictures of the inside yet, I've been promising those for months :) Katherine "I really think that artists to-day try to see how far they can make fun of the public without its revolting." Marie, Queen of Roumania My Dress Site http://www.koshka-the-cat.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 19:08:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BN8MHP031444 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:08:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BN5ZUw000111 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 17:05:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BN5Y7h028211; Sun, 11 May 2003 17:05:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from barry.mail.mindspring.net (barry.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.25]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BN5V7h028186 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 17:05:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ap-014caburbp0237.dialsprint.net ([63.191.8.237] helo=[0019381808]) by barry.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Ezsm-0000GM-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:05:29 -0400 From: "Katherine" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 16:06:00 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [h-cost] Re: ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Message-ID: <3EBE74E8.31670.631302@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <200305050741.h457f5Jt011942@net.indra.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'd love to see the pattern! Is it on your site? I found a similar waist in the 1909 National Cloak and Suit Co. Catalog (republished by Dover as Women's Fashions of the Early 1900s), but it wasn't exact... Katherine, who's a little behind on her mail :) > From: "Penny Ladnier" > OMG, I was just running copies from my 1902 Delineators and I think I have > found this pattern... #6156. Everything is the same but the sleeves. > > > > > I have a page about it here: > > > > http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html Katherine "I go by-by." Alexandra Feodorovna, last empress of Russia, in a letter to her husband, Nicholas II _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 19:42:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BNgAHP031518 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:42:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BNdTUw002514 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 17:39:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4BNdL7h012884; Sun, 11 May 2003 17:39:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4BNdE7h012815 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 17:39:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 30089 invoked from network); 11 May 2003 23:39:10 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 11 May 2003 23:39:10 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-151.sonic.net [209.148.112.151]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4BNd9o20091 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 16:39:09 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030511163917.00af3f30@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 16:40:34 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress In-Reply-To: <3EBE7292.5592.59F059@localhost> References: <200305051801.h45I1f5L020825@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 03:56 PM 5/11/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I hadn't really thought about the possibility of age discoloration being >even. I think >that I'm just used to it being uneven. And, in real life it's quite a >nice creamy shade. Color shades online depend a lot on the monitor, so whether my monitor displays what yours does is anybody's guess. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 20:14:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C0EhHP031553 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 20:14:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C0BaUw005784 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 18:11:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C0BZWS029312; Sun, 11 May 2003 18:11:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net (smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net [206.210.69.156]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4C0BXWS029289 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 18:11:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 19615 invoked from network); 12 May 2003 00:11:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bookbusiness) (208.166.66.64) by smtp-int-02.mx.pitdc1.stargate.net with SMTP; 12 May 2003 00:11:31 -0000 Message-ID: <001e01c3181b$0d3708c0$4042a6d0@bookbusiness> From: "Janet Davis" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000001c3170f$57576740$de0b77d8@pavilion><3EBE5AA7.BE7BEEC8@in-tch.com> <000c01c317d2$14fe7fa0$560377d8@pavilion> Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 20:11:34 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Piers Plowman was written by William Langland who lived between 1330 and 1400 (approx.) The whole text of the poem can be accessed through The Medieval Sourcebook http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/sbook2.html#lit2 in Middle English. Janet Janet Davis Castle Furnishings http://www.medievalbookstore.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 21:21:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1LHHP031726 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 21:21:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1J8Uw013580 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 19:19:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1J5Ge008067; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:19:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1J2Ge008014 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:19:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.111] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A33F8F000B2; Sun, 11 May 2003 21:05:03 -0400 Message-ID: <002d01c31824$e6e718e0$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030511195310.15938.qmail@web80406.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 21:22:05 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO May I offer you my condolences. When my machine Doctor told me about five years ago that my beloved (work) horse was going to expire (Ken #1939) I thought that I would go out with it. In spite of the fact that the Head still had 10 years to go on the Warranty, parts were getting scarce! So I bought a Pfaff Jeans and Satin as a back up. The latter has sufficed for service but I do break out the Beloved for those special jobs that I know it can do blinded, and I know It appreciates the outings Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn Jacobson" To: Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 3:53 PM Subject: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! > > I can't believe this has happened...I appear to have > killed my beloved Kenmore 158904. The clutch nut > bushing appears to have finally given way; IOW, I > can't keep the flywheel tightened down so that it > sews. This is the same part that was fixed about a > year ago, and I was warned at that time that the > Kenmore wouldn't last forever, but it's not supposed > to stop now in the middle of a job. This is what I get > for bragging what a reliable old workhorse it is. 8-< > > > OK, thanks for letting me whine. Thank heavens, I've > still got my Viking. I've still got 15 costumes to > build in the next 12 days (in addition to working as a > full-time teacher), so it's back to work. > > Maybe I'll pop "Kate & Leopold" into the DVD player... > > Dawn > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 21:31:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1VTHP031754 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 21:31:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1TSUw014412 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 19:29:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1TRan012892; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:29:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1TQan012850 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:29:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.111] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A5AF93D00B2; Sun, 11 May 2003 21:15:27 -0400 Message-ID: <004401c31826$5b09d220$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EBC5FAD.C51D12C9@gti.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Kyoto book on eBay Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 21:32:29 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Except, the written material putting this period in historical context of the transition between the 18th and 19th Centuries is quite worth the difference; I found this volume about 5 years ago, and only got the 'whole volume' at Christmas this past year. There are some subtle differences in the illustrations, but the costume perspective and criticism is useful. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 5:28 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Kyoto book on eBay > At 51$ I think it would be a better deal to go out and buy a brand new > "Fashion" book, from Kyoto Costume Institute. It has most, if not all, of > the Revolution in Fashion pictures, plus a lot more! > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 10:10 PM > Subject: [h-cost] Kyoto book on eBay > > > > Anyone looking for the Kyoto Museum "Revolution in Fashion" book, > > there's one on eBay right now: > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2829816108&category=20297 > > > > Cheers, > > Lisa R. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 21:37:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1bdHP031764 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 21:37:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1ZcUw015025 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 19:35:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1Zban016244; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:35:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1ZZan016196 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:35:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.111] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A72096800B2; Sun, 11 May 2003 21:21:36 -0400 Message-ID: <004e01c31827$3700db20$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EBE7292.5592.59F059@localhost> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 21:38:38 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO By example, I have just finished the design and construction of a baptismal set for my grand-daughter of vintage voile and Val lace. On completion, I washed the set in Synthropol and both sets of fibers came nicely white..to the same degree as hoped for. All those laces are not going to be "dusty". Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Katherine" To: Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 6:56 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: ecru Edwardian 'lingerie' dress > I hadn't really thought about the possibility of age discoloration being even. I think > that I'm just used to it being uneven. And, in real life it's quite a nice creamy shade. > > Quite good to know though, and that's why I love these lists, you learn something > new every day :) > > Katherine > > On 5 May 2003 at 12:01, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 10:25:02 -0700 > > From: Lavolta Press > > > > > This is not ecru, it is showing a yellowish white on my monitor. It looks > > like age discoloration to me. That can be very even. Fran > > > > At 11:05 PM 5/4/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > I know it's not a dress, but I do have an off-white Edwardian waist with > > insertion. I have wondered if it was orignally white, but I don't think it > > was. The color is very even, in the lace, seam allowances, etc so it > > doesn't look like it aged that way but was originally that way. I have a > > page about it here: http://www.koshka-the-cat.com/edwardian_blouse.html No > > pictures of the inside yet, I've been promising those for months :) > > > > Katherine > > "I really think that artists to-day try to see how far they > can make fun of the public without its revolting." > > Marie, Queen of Roumania > > My Dress Site > http://www.koshka-the-cat.com > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 11 21:55:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1tvHP031813 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 21:55:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1rsUw016884 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 11 May 2003 19:53:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1rran025086; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:53:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f61.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C1rpan025030 for ; Sun, 11 May 2003 19:53:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 11 May 2003 18:53:45 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 12 May 2003 01:53:45 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 18:53:45 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 May 2003 01:53:45.0954 (UTC) FILETIME=[52DE6C20:01C31829] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >I can't believe this has happened...I appear to have >killed my beloved Kenmore 158904. Today was a bad day for Kenmores. My favorite croaked today too. I bought it used, and it may still be repairable, but I have no money to fix it just now. I feel lost in some weird sewing machineless void. Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 03:33:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C7XtHP032097 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 03:33:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C7VoUw016934 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 01:31:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C7VkgV002750; Mon, 12 May 2003 01:31:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C7VhgV002729 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 01:31:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AE0E4F00080; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:32:30 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ADDD20019C; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:31:41 -0500 Message-ID: <00c101c31858$5fd83760$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 03:30:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO We have a problem figuring out on an 1838 fashion plate description this hairstyle: "The hair dressed a la Sevigne." I have checked all my dictionaries and can not find the definition. Even though this is a British publication, a lot of French fashion terms are used. Does anyone know what this means? Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 04:07:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C87gHP015635 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 04:07:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C85gUw020112 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 02:05:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C85ejJ018677; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:05:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41508.mail.yahoo.com (web41508.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4C85cjJ018617 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:05:38 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030512080532.43456.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41508.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:05:32 BST Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:05:32 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <00c101c31858$5fd83760$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > We have a problem figuring out on an 1838 fashion plate description this > hairstyle: "The hair dressed a la Sevigne." I have checked all my > dictionaries and can not find the definition. Even though this is a British > publication, a lot of French fashion terms are used. Does anyone know what > this means? It might well be that Madame de Sevigne is meant, taking into consideration that the 19th century liked to borrow from the past, especially the 17th & 18th centuries, because they were so 'quaint'. I cannot tell you exactly what that hairstyle would be like nor if it even is what I think it is (however, Madame de Sevigne and her letters are very well known), here is a link to the most famous portrait of her: http://www.antiquites.com/antiques/sevignee/WelcomeE.html Nicole P.S. She was a great and loyal friend of the imprisoned Nicolas Fouquet, until his death. She was a rather strong, intelligent, interesting and courageous lady. ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 04:15:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8FPHP018206 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 04:15:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8DDUw020898 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 02:13:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8DCjJ022274; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:13:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8D9jJ022247 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:13:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4C8D8p11191.; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:13:08 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:13:07 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:12:36 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4C8D9jJ022247 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Madame de Sevigne (with acute accents on both 'e's) was a lady of the French court of Louis XIV, whose letters about court life survive. Presumably the 1838 style was their take on late 17th century hairstyles? Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> penny@costumegallery.com 05/12/03 08:30am >>> We have a problem figuring out on an 1838 fashion plate description this hairstyle: "The hair dressed a la Sevigne." I have checked all my dictionaries and can not find the definition. Even though this is a British publication, a lot of French fashion terms are used. Does anyone know what this means? Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information on a proactive email security service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.messagelabs.com ________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 04:21:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8LKHP020144 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 04:21:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8JKUw021499 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 02:19:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8JJjJ025334; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:19:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8JHjJ025316 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:19:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4C8JGp11639.; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:19:16 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:19:15 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:19:04 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] manor house to warriors Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4C8JHjJ025316 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Is this being shown in the UK? I assumed it was an American series. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk 05/10/03 08:55pm >>> This was really good. Not a lot of costume content, although they did get them all dressed right and they ate period food and lived the part for the weekend. But the combat/competition bit was excellent, and they all knew what they were in for - mostly military or police taking part. Jean Janet Davis wrote >PBS is coming out with another "History meets reality TV" series on >Warriors - knights, Vikings, Romans and gladiators. >http://www.pbs.org/wnet/warriorchallenge/index.html > >It looks like fun. > >Janet > >Janet Davis >Castle Furnishings >http://www.medievalbookstore.com >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information on a proactive email security service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.messagelabs.com ________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 04:29:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8TdHP027300 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 04:29:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8RdUw022204 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 02:27:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8RcjJ029291; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:27:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8RZjJ029249 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:27:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4C8RYp12375.; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:27:34 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:27:33 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:27:12 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4C8RZjJ029249 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I remember from school geography (and from my Yorkshire mother) that the towns of Dewsbury and Batley were famous for making shoddy (as opposed to places like Bradford and Halifax which made new woollen cloth). I believe it was used for Army blankets and the like. >Since I can't believe I'm the only one who didn't >know, I'll mention that "shoddy" refers to cloth made >from old woolen rags pulled apart, respun, and rewoven >into cloth, either alone or mixed with new wool or >cotton. It's easy to see how the term could be >expanded to include any inferior goods or material >which pretends to be better than it is. (My source: >"Household Textiles" copyright 1912) I believe the term's been dated back at least as far as the American Civil War (early-mid 1860's). Apparently several companies providing supplies for the newly-expanded Union Army charged the government for uniforms made of good solid cloth and delivered uniforms made of shoddy. Leah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information on a proactive email security service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.messagelabs.com ________________________________________________________________________ Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 04:51:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8psHP002321 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 04:51:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8nqUw023793 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 02:49:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8npjJ011692; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:49:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C8nmjJ011678 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 02:49:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A05B5240080; Mon, 12 May 2003 03:50:35 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A00EC30194; Mon, 12 May 2003 03:49:18 -0500 Message-ID: <00ea01c31863$34d4dc20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 04:48:05 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kate & Nicole, Was she known for being very fashionable at court? It seems like a lot of the plates we are working with have a lot of this same ringlets style. In this particular 1838 plate, the ringlets are gathered to one side. Was the ringlets style very fashionable during Louis XIV's reign? Nicole, two month's ago, I fixed my daughter's hair for her class photo very similar to the style in the portrait of Marquise de Sévigné. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 05:07:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C972HP002340 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 05:07:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C953Uw024554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 03:05:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C952Y5017045; Mon, 12 May 2003 03:05:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41510.mail.yahoo.com (web41510.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.93]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4C94xY5016997 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 03:04:59 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030512090454.88317.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41510.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 May 2003 10:04:54 BST Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 10:04:54 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <00ea01c31863$34d4dc20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > Kate & Nicole, > > Was she known for being very fashionable at court? It seems like a lot of > the plates we are working with have a lot of this same ringlets style. In > this particular 1838 plate, the ringlets are gathered to one side. Was the > ringlets style very fashionable during Louis XIV's reign? Yes it was very fashionable, but in different years in a different style, never though fashioned to only one side, always symmetrical. Madame de Sevigne describes the fashions at court in her letters to female relatives and friends (as did Lieselotte, La Palatine) and what they _might_ mean in the 19th c. could be the ringlet style of the 1660s and 70s, I cannot quite imagine they mean the Hurluberlu relatively short cut style of teh 1680s with the load of curls. I'd think it is the 1660s/70s style. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 05:24:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C9ONHP002443 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 05:24:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C9MNUw025966 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 03:22:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C9MMY5019801; Mon, 12 May 2003 03:22:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4C9MJY5019776 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 03:22:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7FB5540080; Mon, 12 May 2003 04:23:07 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7C1C00198; Mon, 12 May 2003 04:22:09 -0500 Message-ID: <00f101c31867$ca2ab340$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030512090454.88317.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 05:20:54 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you so much for the explanation. I am always interested in knowing where fashions are inspired from. The descriptions and fashion reports from this publication are so good at naming the inspiration/fashion icon but unfortunately my knowledge of French fashions during this time frame and before are very weak. It has really been a learning experience for me. I keep pulling out fashion dictionaries and books for explanations as to who was who or what a French word means. This 1838 British publication is really wonderful. It was published from July-Dec. about a year after Queen Victoria took the throne. You can really see her influence in fashion coming into play. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 08:51:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CCp3HP002831 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:51:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CCmwUw009456 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 06:48:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CCkGSl009028; Mon, 12 May 2003 06:46:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CCkDSl009010 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 06:46:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-15-113.o1.jps.net ([216.119.15.113] helo=pavilion) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19FCh2-0006UU-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 12 May 2003 05:46:13 -0700 Message-ID: <000901c31886$4ea18b80$710f77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 05:59:18 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO 1832 is the date Merriam Webster gives the word. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 1:27 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] talk about shoddy fabric!!! > I remember from school geography (and from my Yorkshire mother) that the towns of Dewsbury and Batley were famous for making shoddy (as opposed to places like Bradford and Halifax which made new woollen cloth). I believe it was used for Army blankets and the like. > > >Since I can't believe I'm the only one who didn't > >know, I'll mention that "shoddy" refers to cloth made > >from old woolen rags pulled apart, respun, and rewoven > >into cloth, either alone or mixed with new wool or > >cotton. It's easy to see how the term could be > >expanded to include any inferior goods or material > >which pretends to be better than it is. (My source: > >"Household Textiles" copyright 1912) > > > I believe the term's been dated back at least as far as the American Civil > War (early-mid 1860's). Apparently several companies providing supplies for > the newly-expanded Union Army charged the government for uniforms made of > good solid cloth and delivered uniforms made of shoddy. > > Leah > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email > Security System. For more information on a proactive email security > service working around the clock, around the globe, visit > http://www.messagelabs.com > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Kate Bunting > Library, University of Derby > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 10:09:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CE9UHP003096 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 10:09:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CE7KUw017440 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 08:07:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CE7JKN019762; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:07:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net (bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.218]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CE7GKN019718 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:07:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-9-108.smf.jps.net ([216.119.9.108] helo=w7m1l6) by bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19FDxU-0006fi-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 12 May 2003 07:07:16 -0700 Message-ID: <005d01c3188f$b9914080$6c0977d8@w7m1l6> From: "Stephen Bergdahl" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305110424.h4B4ONiM026012@net.indra.com> <3EBE68CF.40402@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: embroidery and patience Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 07:05:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-ELNK-Trace: 08dba192340bde6e1a6ab3b9b70940f894f5150ab1c16ac027907a4ca0ac1adf0d1f458c7e7ac00429891c3128e228bf350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cozit / Liz" To: Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 8:14 AM Subject: [h-cost] Re: embroidery and patience > People keep exclaiming that I have so much patience, because they see me > embroidering... at the gyms waiting for my kids, in the car, in school, > *g* believe it or not at the mall even a couple of times. I hear you, as I have told many a person who has commented that I must be very patience. It's not patience, I'm just stubborn! I refuse to let a piece of fabric win. I think it's a guy thing. Stephen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 10:20:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEK1HP003132 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 10:20:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEHxUw018323 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 08:17:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEHwKN025500; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:17:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net (bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.218]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEHuKN025481 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:17:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-9-108.smf.jps.net ([216.119.9.108] helo=w7m1l6) by bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19FE7n-0000YN-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 12 May 2003 07:17:55 -0700 Message-ID: <007b01c31891$36bd3540$6c0977d8@w7m1l6> From: "Stephen Bergdahl" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 07:17:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-ELNK-Trace: 08dba192340bde6e1a6ab3b9b70940f894f5150ab1c16ac027907a4ca0ac1adfcf3c32c49c1067c637b2926f047382d1350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO OK that does it! I am not taking any chances. My 1930's White is going in for a lube and tighten. Then it's off to be blessed! Good machines are getting hard to find. Stephen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jennifer Sena" To: Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 6:53 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! > > > > > >I can't believe this has happened...I appear to have > >killed my beloved Kenmore 158904. > > > Today was a bad day for Kenmores. My favorite croaked today too. I bought > it used, and it may still be repairable, but I have no money to fix it just > now. I feel lost in some weird sewing machineless void. > > > > Jennifer Sena > Distant Designs > http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi > > I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! > > _________________________________________________________________ > The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 10:40:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEebHP003158 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 10:40:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEcPUw020463 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 08:38:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEcOKN007731; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:38:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kumc-gateway-fs.kumc.edu (kumc-gateway-fs.kumc.edu [169.147.166.77]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEcLKN007676 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:38:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from KUMC-GATEWAY-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-gateway-fs.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:38:20 -0500 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:38:15 -0500 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [h-cost] Shoes on eBay X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The recent discussion on shoes helped me spot this: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2529464377&category=355 don't know if they are really Elizabethan but nice closeups. Also on this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2529483117&category=355 which is one of the Tudor fasteners/clips discussed awhile back. Just thought folks might be interested. Catherine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 10:59:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CExtHP003200 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 10:59:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEqaUw022357 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 08:52:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEqYQn017857; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:52:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc51.attbi.com (rwcrmhc51.attbi.com [204.127.198.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CEqVQn017763 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:52:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from c59303a (12-238-186-49.client.attbi.com[12.238.186.49]) by attbi.com (rwcrmhc51) with SMTP id <2003051214522505100ap8vce>; Mon, 12 May 2003 14:52:25 +0000 Message-ID: <024701c31896$1c4f83c0$31baee0c@c59303a> From: "chiara" To: "Historical Costume" References: Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 09:45:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [h-cost] Strange question ... was Shoes on eBay X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Strange question here. Has anyone see a flood of antiquities on Ebay since the war in Baghdad? Specifically things that were looted from the museum? Does anyone have a listing of the things that went missing there? Ches ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 9:38 AM Subject: [h-cost] Shoes on eBay : The recent discussion on shoes helped me spot this: : : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2529464377&category=355 : don't know if they are really Elizabethan but nice closeups. Also on : this one: : : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2529483117&category=355 : which is one of the Tudor fasteners/clips discussed awhile back. : : Just thought folks might be interested. : : Catherine : _______________________________________________ : h-costume mailing list : h-costume@mail.indra.com : http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 11:09:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CF98HP003226 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 11:09:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CF74Uw024457 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 09:07:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CF73CJ028414; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:07:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f126.sea1.hotmail.com [207.68.163.126]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CF6xCJ028319 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:06:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 12 May 2003 08:06:54 -0700 Received: from 151.199.152.141 by sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 12 May 2003 15:06:53 GMT X-Originating-IP: [151.199.152.141] X-Originating-Email: [nancy_kiel@hotmail.com] From: "Nancy Kiel" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 11:06:53 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 May 2003 15:06:54.0245 (UTC) FILETIME=[1FB35D50:01C31898] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Are there Janet Arnold-type analyses for that period anywhere? I'm looking at Elizabethan stuff and she mentions thread color when she can find it. Nancy Kiel nancy_kiel@hotmail.com Never tease a weasel! This is very good advice. For the weasel will not like it And teasing isn't nice. >From: kat@grendal.rain.com >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: Historical Costume >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread >Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 17:49:03 -0700 > > > I've been going back through all the text I could find on extant > > garments, and darned if I could find a single mention of thread > > color--width, composition, frequency of stitches, sure, but no color, > > not even 'bog trash brown.' Has anyone found any mention, anywhere, > > ideally around the turn of the 15th century in the Lowlands, of white > > or contrasting thread color on seam finishes? _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 11:36:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CFaOHP003346 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 11:36:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CFYGUw027887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 09:34:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CFYBCJ018345; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:34:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.siscom.net (mail2.siscom.net [209.251.18.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4CFY7CJ018256 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:34:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 10212 invoked by uid 1005); 12 May 2003 15:34:00 -0000 Received: from drea@nospam by uid 0 with qmail-scanner-1.14 (f-prot: 3.12. Clear:. Processed in 0.07968 secs); 12 May 2003 15:34:00 -0000 X-Qmail-Scanner-Mail-From: drea@nospam X-Qmail-Scanner: 1.14 (Clear:. Processed in 0.07968 secs) Received: from shell.siscom.net (209.251.2.80) by mail.siscom.net with SMTP; 12 May 2003 15:34:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 11:34:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Drea Leed To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030512113125.E81574-100000@shell.siscom.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have recipes for dying linen thread red, back to c. 1500, in dutch & german books. There are mentions of white, black, and colored thread in the mid 16th century as well. You're looking for stuff circa 1400? Try the Port Books that have been published (I don't know the specific title details, but if you search for "port books" on bookfinder.com, some should show up) that list items imported into England. You may find references to thread in them. Good luck, Drea On Mon, 12 May 2003, Nancy Kiel wrote: > Are there Janet Arnold-type analyses for that period anywhere? I'm looking > at Elizabethan stuff and she mentions thread color when she can find it. > > > > Nancy Kiel > nancy_kiel@hotmail.com > Never tease a weasel! > This is very good advice. > For the weasel will not like it > And teasing isn't nice. > > > > > > >From: kat@grendal.rain.com > >Reply-To: Historical Costume > >To: Historical Costume > >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Handsewing with white thread > >Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 17:49:03 -0700 > > > > > I've been going back through all the text I could find on extant > > > garments, and darned if I could find a single mention of thread > > > color--width, composition, frequency of stitches, sure, but no color, > > > not even 'bog trash brown.' Has anyone found any mention, anywhere, > > > ideally around the turn of the 15th century in the Lowlands, of white > > > or contrasting thread color on seam finishes? > > _________________________________________________________________ > Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 11:50:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CFoaHP003494 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 11:50:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CFmTUw029720 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 09:48:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CFmRCJ028887; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:48:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CFmNCJ028840 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 09:48:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA18621 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 11:48:22 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-158-63-12.asm.bellsouth.net [68.158.63.12]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id LAA29458 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 11:48:22 -0400 Message-ID: <051601c3189d$66470b90$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <024701c31896$1c4f83c0$31baee0c@c59303a> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Strange question ... was Shoes on eBay Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 11:44:39 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hard to tell as there have always been a ton of antiquities sold on ebay. ----- Original Message ----- From: "chiara" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 10:45 AM Subject: [h-cost] Strange question ... was Shoes on eBay > Strange question here. Has anyone see a flood of antiquities on Ebay since > the war in Baghdad? Specifically things that were looted from the museum? > > Does anyone have a listing of the things that went missing there? > > Ches > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Catherine Kinsey" > To: > Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 9:38 AM > Subject: [h-cost] Shoes on eBay > > > : The recent discussion on shoes helped me spot this: > : > : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2529464377&category=355 > : don't know if they are really Elizabethan but nice closeups. Also on > : this one: > : > : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2529483117&category=355 > : which is one of the Tudor fasteners/clips discussed awhile back. > : > : Just thought folks might be interested. > : > : Catherine > : _______________________________________________ > : h-costume mailing list > : h-costume@mail.indra.com > : http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 12:34:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CGYqHP003645 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 12:34:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CGWnUw006066 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 10:32:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CGWk4C002520; Mon, 12 May 2003 10:32:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CGWf4C002427 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 10:32:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.186] (pm5-186.eos.net [205.133.149.186]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA06226 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 12:32:37 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 12:27:09 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305121551.h4CFpMCK001045@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: warriors X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I didn't pay attention, I assumed it was a British show. The first one, on Roman techniques, was filmed at Hadrian's Wall and used British staff. The eight participants were split -- 4 Americans and 4 Brits. I thought it was very well done. They talked a lot about living conditions as well as about clothes, armor, and combat, and I thought it was a good layman's look at life for soldiers of the period. The poor guy squeezed into the chain mail was funny! The combat part was very interesting, but I was disappointed in the end contest, which didn't include any combat! But I guess that wouldn't have been practical -- apparently Roman combat was all jabbing at the face, so with authentic helmets they couldn't exactly do it and send all eight guys home in one piece! Also, because the eight men were policemen and Air Force, they gave a really good indication of how hard it was to march and fight in armor for people who were already in good, combat-ready shape, as opposed to anyone off the street. My two favorite parts were: 1) the historian being made to hold a shield and being shoved by one of the warriors -- talk about real life experience for an academic! and 2) the gentleman at the end who said charging the castle was one of the greatest experiences in his life. The show showed the "hows" of historic reenactment, but that was a great explanation for the "why." I hope that many people who see it learn that they can do this stuff, too! Gail Finke PS: My six-year-old son has been drawing Roman combatants since I showed him the tape. He very earnestly believed that the men might kill each other fighting! None of my "they wouldn't let that happen on TV" speeches made any impression. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 14:26:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CIQIHP004025 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 14:26:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CINqUw020063 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 12:23:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CINn7Q028123; Mon, 12 May 2003 12:23:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m06.mx.aol.com (imo-m06.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.161]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CINk7Q028050 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 12:23:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.14.1119122e (18251) for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 14:23:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Kitsune242@aol.com Message-ID: <14.1119122e.2bf140a4@aol.com> Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 14:23:32 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Kate & Leopold To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/10/2003 11:18:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: > Pulled off: Yess! (one of the deleted scenes has him in a bathtub) Other > than that, I agree about the costuming. But I thought Meg Ryan's modern > dress was an especially good choice for something to fit in with late > 1870s. After I posted my comments, I went back and watched the costuming featurette on the DVD. (All the extras are the 2nd best thing about DVD's. The first being perfect freeze frame) It was really interesting to see what they had to say about the dress and their choices for what Ms. Ryan wore in the Movie. Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 16:44:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CKipHP004630 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 16:44:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CKfOUw007187 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 14:41:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CKfG52012686; Mon, 12 May 2003 14:41:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CKfB52012611 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 14:41:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f36.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.54]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 1C9955EE47B for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 22:39:56 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000901c318c7$2a1ce0c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 22:43:37 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] pannier X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello. I have worked like a horse today, and i am totally exhausted. I made a panier with a new shape. I wanted to make something similar, but with a different shape than Jean Hunniset's pannier. It is for the embroidered floral dress i make with sky blue taffeta. Well and i am not satisfied. I have to star all over tomorrow because i am not pleased witht the angle of the top steels. Well the work is not in vain, i can start fresh tomorrow where i made the error.......................... Gues that is costuming, sometimes.......... Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 17:44:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CLiEHP005171 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:44:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CLg5Uw015339 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 15:42:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CLfwrJ002479; Mon, 12 May 2003 15:41:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80408.mail.yahoo.com (web80408.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.63]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4CLfsrJ002370 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 15:41:55 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030512214149.22699.qmail@web80408.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80408.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 May 2003 14:41:49 PDT Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 14:41:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305121803.h4CI3J7R013263@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Woohoo! The Kenmore lives! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hooray! I managed to luck out this time. It turns out that my local sewing machine/vacuum cleaner repair shop not only can fix my Kenmore, but they have the clutch assembly in stock, and I can pick my repaired Kenmore up in a couple hours! It wasn't even that expensive (less than $60), so I'm back in business, or will be as soon as I can get it back into its cabinet, and clear everything out of the livingroom. Thanks for the moral support. Dawn (doin' the happy dance) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 17:53:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CLrLHP005197 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:53:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CLp6Uw016555 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 15:51:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CLp5rJ009744; Mon, 12 May 2003 15:51:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80409.mail.yahoo.com (web80409.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.64]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4CLp1rJ009646 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 15:51:02 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030512215056.93160.qmail@web80409.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80409.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 May 2003 14:50:56 PDT Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 14:50:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305121803.h4CI3J7R013263@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] "Triumph of Love": Costumes any good? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My already full plate has just run over with a request for sketches for no less than 3 (!!!) shows: "The Miracle Worker," "I Remember Mama," and "Triumph of Love." The director said something about wanting costumes the same period as the film (18th Century? Georgian?). I haven't seen the film yet, so I'm guessing on this; he simply mentioned "Watteau and Fragonard." Has anybody on the list seen this film? How are the costumes? Any good? Is it worth watching, or should I simply rent it and fast forward before pulling out all my books on 18th C. clothing. Thanks! Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 19:25:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CNPjHP005963 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 19:25:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CNNVUw029773 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 17:23:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CNNTFE019800; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:23:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtpout.mac.com (A17-250-248-89.apple.com [17.250.248.89]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4CNNQFE019766 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:23:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mac.com (smtpin07-en2 [10.13.10.152]) by smtpout.mac.com (Xserve/MantshX 2.0) with ESMTP id h4CNNMUv007275 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 16:23:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [140.142.183.50] (cs203-49.fsmodem.washington.edu [140.142.183.50]) (authenticated bits=0) by mac.com (Xserve/MantshX 2.0) with ESMTP id h4CNLS94023801 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 16:21:29 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 16:21:27 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question From: Agnes Gawne To: Historical Costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00c101c31858$5fd83760$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4CNNQFE019766 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny - The Oxford English Dictionary has this for Sevigne:     A kind of bandeau, esp. one for the hair; a jewel or ornament of the kind used to decorate a head-dress. Also attrib.     [1817 LADY MORGAN France III. (1818) I. 364 The chignon à la Sevigné, or coiffure de Ninon, now triumph over la tête à l' Agrippina.] 1826 M. WILMOT Let. 29 Feb. (1935) 239 Black velvet stomacher..fastened to the top with a sevigné, garnett and pearl..and another garnett sevigné on her forehead. 1835 Court Mag. VI. p. vi/2 Some are ornamented with Sevignés of tulle, disposed in regular plaits. 1837 [MISS MAITLAND] Lett. fr. Madras (1843) 55 They were covered with gold and jewels,..bands round their heads, sévignés, and rings on all their fingers and all their toes. 1840 M. EDGEWORTH Let. 30 Dec. (1971) 574 Sevigné headdress of black velvet with Sevigné jewels in front. 1843 Commissioner 221 A..damsel with long black ringlets..and a sevigné on her forehead. ---- Although I always believed it to be the ringlets, equilateral, starting low on the head, about the ears. Agnes > From: "Penny Ladnier" > Reply-To: Historical Costume > Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 03:30:33 -0400 > To: "h-costume" > Subject: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question > > We have a problem figuring out on an 1838 fashion plate description this > hairstyle: "The hair dressed a la Sevigne." I have checked all my > dictionaries and can not find the definition. Even though this is a British > publication, a lot of French fashion terms are used. Does anyone know what > this means? > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 20:09:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D09qHP006086 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 20:09:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D08jUw007605 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 18:08:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D08h3g019417; Mon, 12 May 2003 18:08:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D08f3g019394 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 18:08:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19FNLU-00041F-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 12 May 2003 17:08:40 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 17:08:37 -0700 Message-ID: <000701c318e3$cf344d20$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-Reply-To: <007b01c31891$36bd3540$6c0977d8@w7m1l6> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Aack, you have burst my bubble! I am about ready to throw my Viking out a window. I was vowing to my husband to buy an old Kenmore 1969 vintage. It never occurred to me that parts would be hard to find! Now what will I do?? Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 20:47:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D0luHP006246 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 20:47:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D0kuUw010863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 18:46:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D0ks3g008854; Mon, 12 May 2003 18:46:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D0kq3g008835 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 18:46:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty2046.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.243.46]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4D0kwr1011362 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 20:47:04 -0400 Message-ID: <3EC03F75.3030903@dandy.net> Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 20:42:29 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Shoes on eBay References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. It is interesting to see an intact (well, mostly) shoe of this period going for so little money. The item, if it is what it is advertised as, has been somewhat restored, as the leather looks cleaned. The sole (at the back) looks, by the holes, to be stitched correctly, but the upper (front piece on top) looks strangely attached to the sole. I can't make out how the stitching is done, but neither turnshoe or rand/welt looks right in this case. The stitching is still intact, also, which is odd, as linen usually deteriorates in conditions where leather survives. It looks to me like a parts shoe, cobbled together from pieces of finds and improperly reassembled. The hook is different from any of the hooks I have seen, though very decorative. I have my doubts as to the dates posted on the finds listed, although my knowledge of such things is limited. Thanks for showing us the items. Mike T. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 21:32:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D1WDHP006415 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 21:32:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D1VKUw014585 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 19:31:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D1VJr9000367; Mon, 12 May 2003 19:31:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D1VFr9000342 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 19:31:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB10B00070; Mon, 12 May 2003 20:32:00 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AADE1AB0184; Mon, 12 May 2003 20:31:10 -0500 Message-ID: <00a201c318ef$29213b80$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 21:29:55 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I put a small image of the hairstyle at http://www.costumegallery.com/1838head.jpg I am sorry it is blurry but I tried to enlarge the head from the entire costume image. It doesn't seem to have a bandeau. The flower on the left is a large dahlia. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 12 23:10:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D3AvHP006703 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 23:10:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D38vUw022960 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 12 May 2003 21:08:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D38p86017765; Mon, 12 May 2003 21:08:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail03.powweb.com (mail03.powweb.com [63.251.216.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4D38m86017743 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 21:08:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from megan2 (216-164-48-211.c3-0.gth-ubr1.lnh-gth.md.cable.rcn.com [216.164.48.211]) by mail03.powweb.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9441B1C7E4 for ; Mon, 12 May 2003 20:09:01 -0700 (PDT) From: "Megan M." To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 23:08:42 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <007b01c31891$36bd3540$6c0977d8@w7m1l6> Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO So many sewing machines down.... might I suggest you all scour the flea markets and such for the really old Singers? Whites are great too. I mean, the old model 15s can sew tents! Pure straight stitch, nothing fancy, but nothing on the market today can beat them for ability to handle the tough stuff. -Megan who has way too many of these but cannot give them up......... -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Stephen Bergdahl Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 10:17 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! OK that does it! I am not taking any chances. My 1930's White is going in for a lube and tighten. Then it's off to be blessed! Good machines are getting hard to find. Stephen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jennifer Sena" To: Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 6:53 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Waa! I broke my sewing machine! > > > > > >I can't believe this has happened...I appear to have > >killed my beloved Kenmore 158904. > > > Today was a bad day for Kenmores. My favorite croaked today too. I bought > it used, and it may still be repairable, but I have no money to fix it just > now. I feel lost in some weird sewing machineless void. > > > > Jennifer Sena > Distant Designs > http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi > > I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! > > _________________________________________________________________ > The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 07:48:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DBmcHP010205 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 07:48:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DBkgUw025702 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 05:46:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DBkdYj027419; Tue, 13 May 2003 05:46:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DBkaYj027342 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 05:46:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.106] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7D061800D4; Tue, 13 May 2003 07:32:32 -0400 Message-ID: <002301c31945$bf465040$6a5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00a201c318ef$29213b80$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 07:49:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dahlia or Hydrangea? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 9:29 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question > I put a small image of the hairstyle at > http://www.costumegallery.com/1838head.jpg I am sorry it is blurry but I > tried to enlarge the head from the entire costume image. It doesn't seem to > have a bandeau. The flower on the left is a large dahlia. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 10:09:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DE9IHP010694 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 10:09:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DDuoUw006200 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 07:56:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DDunIA025769; Tue, 13 May 2003 07:56:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt29.cluster1.charter.net (remt29.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DDukIA025708 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 07:56:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [24.196.130.120] (HELO laptop) by remt29.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 13489440 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:56:40 -0400 Message-ID: <002901c31957$6a070540$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 08:56:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] Chicago Indian district X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am going to be in Chicago next Monday and Tuesday. Although I have been to Devon St. many times, it has always been in the evening for dinner. Since I'll be there with not much to do, I thought I would check out some of the sari stores everyone always raves about. Any particular recommendations? ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 10:32:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DEW6HP010786 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 10:32:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DEO3Uw008998 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 08:24:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DEO2IA010495; Tue, 13 May 2003 08:24:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DENwIA010446 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 08:23:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA03658 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:44:22 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 09:44:22 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] News on Greenland book X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm just back from Kalamazoo with a pile of deadlines awaiting me, session proposals for next year to prepare, and a to-do list as long as my arm. More general discussion of the Congress from my end will have to wait, but I didn't want to delay the following. David Brown Book Co. is offering a special pre-publication ordering price for Else Ostergaard's "Woven into the Earth: Textile Finds in Norse Greenland," the long-awaited re-analysis of the Herjolfsnes garment finds (first described in the 1920s by Poul Norlund, who dug them up). The book has been delayed for many reasons, but I have it on good authority (friends who have talked to the author) that we may see an English edition as soon as August. The list price for the book is $46. At the Congress, David Brown was offering a discount for pre-order, and I have permission to pass this along to those who get this message. The discounted price is $36.80 plus shipping. It is expected to be 256 pages, hardback, with illustrations. Pre-orders will be especially important for this book, because it's been rumored the planned print run will be quite small. A large pre-order number may change that. To order, contact Kristen Payne at David Brown Co. and mention that you heard this from Robin Netherton of DISTAFF. You can email your order to Include book price, tax of 6% if you live in Connecticut, and shipping ($4.50 for the first book and $1.50 for each additional book). If you're in Canada, it's 7% GST, and shipping is $7 for the first book and $2 for each additional book. Provide credit card info and shipping address (no USPO boxes, as the books come UPS). I'm not sure about European orders, but you can start with the websites: http://www.davidbrownbookco.com or http://www.oxbowbooks.com There are some other good-looking upcoming books listed at David Brown, but on those, I didn't think to ask Kristen about whether the discounts would be applicable to people not at the conference. Still, some of you might be interested in "Craft, Industry, and Everyday Life: Leather and Leatherworking in Anglo-Scandinavian and Medieval York," by Quita Mould, Ian Carlisle, and Esther Cameron; "Markets in Early Medieval Europe: Trading and 'Productive' Sites, 650-850," eds. Tim Pestell and Katharina Ulmschneider; or "Nonsuch Palace, Volume 2: The Domestic Material," by Martin Biddle. There are some upcoming food books too. I'd guess the details on all these are at the website. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 11:33:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFXYHP010985 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 11:33:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFWTUw016539 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 09:32:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFWRRO025045; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:32:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay2.primushost.com (relay2.primushost.com [207.244.125.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFWMRP024971 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Tue, 13 May 2003 09:32:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from (shell3.shore.net) [207.244.124.103] by relay2.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 19Fbo1-0000uR-00; Tue, 13 May 2003 11:35:05 -0400 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for id 19Fblb-0000mE-00; Tue, 13 May 2003 11:32:35 -0400 Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 11:32:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Katy Bishop To: historic costume , vintage costume Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] Victorian Day Ball Nahant, MA X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Place to wear mid-19th century clothing! The Victorian Day Ball is July 12 this year in Nahant, MA. It is sponsored by Vintage Victorian and The Commonwealth Vintage Dancers and is for the benefit of the Nahant Historical Society. I have just updated my website with costuming hints for the 1850's as well as the 1860's. 1860's dress is perfectly appropriate for this ball (as that is what many people have already), but I added some 1850's pics as this year is the 150th anniversary for Nahant, which seceeded from Lynn in 1853. To view the pages go to: www.vintagevictorian.com click on "Victorian Day ball" then "Suggestions for Period Attire" link at the top of the page. Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 11:38:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFc5HP011035 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 11:38:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFb6Uw017224 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 09:37:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFb4RO028909; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:37:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFb1RO028848 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:37:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7bed8.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.216]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 8DC0147FF8E for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:36:55 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002301c31966$13ee78a0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 17:41:10 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] angle of threads for embroidered tape X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. I just wanted your oppinion before i start. For the chenille embroidery i am making, i have to embroider a tape wich is sitting on a stomacher. The tape is going to be eased into a U-shape of the stomacher. I am to embroider this tape and wondered if i should let this tape be bias cut. Should i mark in on the cross grain of the fabric before i embroider? Many thanks for your inputs! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 11:54:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFsXHP011059 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 11:54:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFrfUw019260 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 09:53:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFreVI013081; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:53:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DFrbVI013036 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:53:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h4DFrbP4017765 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 13 May 2003 11:53:37 -0400 Message-Id: <200305131553.h4DFrbP4017765@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 15:50:22 -0000 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] angle of threads for embroidered tape From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Bjarne, Bias tape was generally not used in the 18th century. It was not an efficient use of material. Sometimes ribbon is ruched, which would make it easier to work into curved shapes. I don't kow if that works with your design. Maybe you need to ease the tape into shape before embroidering it - run a thread along the inside curve to draw it up, and steam it into shape. -Carol Bjarne og Leif Drews said: > Hi. > I just wanted your oppinion before i start. For the chenille embroidery i am > making, i have to embroider a tape wich is sitting on a stomacher. The tape > is going to be eased into a U-shape of the stomacher. I am to embroider this > tape and wondered if i should let this tape be bias cut. > Should i mark in on the cross grain of the fabric before i embroider? > Many thanks for your inputs! > > Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 12:09:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DG9MHP011081 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 12:09:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DG8XUw021127 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 10:08:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DG8Wfc025239; Tue, 13 May 2003 10:08:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4DG8Tfc025137 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 10:08:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/OiQqP48A+wZgd+0olnRH200=">; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:07:30 PDT Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HX3TGWH6; Tue, 13 May 2003 09:07:30 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 08:18:01 -0700 Message-ID: <20030513.090630.684.0.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley Subject: [h-cost] how do de-pill a carpet? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have a carpet with a lot of snags. Any ideas on how to de-pill it? Arlys ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 14:33:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DIXUHP011675 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 14:33:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DIUmUw008203 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 12:30:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DIUkNb012894; Tue, 13 May 2003 12:30:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4DIUgNb012787 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 12:30:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCj7Tsze3Y6oc4L4swucBwkd5ksL2tSnC2A==">; Tue, 13 May 2003 14:29:47 EDT Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HX33MFF4; Tue, 13 May 2003 14:29:47 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 12:54:02 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Chicago Indian district Message-ID: <20030513.125402.-242458211.1.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-9,12-14 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The key thing to remember is that most stuff is closed on Tuesday. I don't know why, but it is. Therefore, make sure that you go on Monday or you will be disappointed. Some of my favorites are: India Sari Palace Regal Traders Sahiba Exclusive Boutique They are all within a block or two of each other and pretty easy to find. My favorite restaurant down there is 'Viceroy of India'. They do a really good lunch buffet. Karen ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 15:32:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DJW5HP011911 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 15:32:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DJVAUw015393 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 13:31:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DJV8WT028887; Tue, 13 May 2003 13:31:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80407.mail.yahoo.com (web80407.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.62]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4DJV4WT028763 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 13:31:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030513193059.69078.qmail@web80407.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80407.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 13 May 2003 12:30:59 PDT Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 12:30:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305131800.h4DI0qNc020580@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing machine!") X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Saragrace wrote: > Aack, you have burst my bubble! I am about ready to > throw my Viking out > a window. I was vowing to my husband to buy an old > Kenmore 1969 > vintage. It never occurred to me that parts would > be hard to find! > > Now what will I do?? Buy the Kenmore. The parts are still available from Sears; the problem is finding a repairperson that will still work on mechanical machines. Last year, the local "Sew & Vac" didn't have anybody, but they've hired somebody that has the necessary skills. Megan wrote: > So many sewing machines down.... might I suggest you > all scour the flea > markets and such for the really old Singers? Whites > are great too. I mean, > the old model 15s can sew tents! Pure straight > stitch, nothing fancy, but > nothing on the market today can beat them for > ability to handle the tough > stuff. Aaaahhh, there's nothing like those old Singer heavy duty machines. 1 stitch (forward), and sews through anything, including 4 layers of canvas (great when you're building "corsets"). I wish I had the room for one, but it won't fit in the sewing/guest room. I'm to the point that I don't normally buy sewing machines at flea markets/yard sales any more, most of what is being sold now is either junk, or electronic, and I'm leery of buying an electronic machine without a warranty. I think the next machine is going to be a Pfaff 130; with all this work, and a husband who's learning to sew, we're going to need a good heavy-duty, semi-industrial machine for sewing things like tents, sails, and still more costumes. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 17:42:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DLgcHP012362 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:42:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DLfjUw001464 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 15:41:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DLffvj012406; Tue, 13 May 2003 15:41:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DLfUvj012265 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 15:41:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19FhWa-000EBn-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 13 May 2003 22:41:29 +0100 Message-ID: <1B7r2XCSaUw+Iwfn@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 20:25:06 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] manor house to warriors References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It was shown on Channel 4 last year, under the title Warrior School. Some of the groups were US military based in Britain, others were British military and emergency services. They were trained and helped by UK re-enactors, who lent them the clothes and equipment. There was the point when we recognised the tunic one of them was wearing, and then a few minutes later its owner appeared! Jean Kate M Bunting wrote >Is this being shown in the UK? I assumed it was an American series. > > >Kate Bunting >Library, University of Derby > >>>> anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk 05/10/03 08:55pm >>> >This was really good. Not a lot of costume content, although they did >get them all dressed right and they ate period food and lived the part >for the weekend. But the combat/competition bit was excellent, and they >all knew what they were in for - mostly military or police taking part. > >Jean > > >Janet Davis wrote >>PBS is coming out with another "History meets reality TV" series on >>Warriors - knights, Vikings, Romans and gladiators. >>http://www.pbs.org/wnet/warriorchallenge/index.html >> >>It looks like fun. >> >>Janet >> >>Janet Davis >>Castle Furnishings >>http://www.medievalbookstore.com >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 18:08:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DM8FHP012460 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:08:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DM7IUw004924 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 16:07:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DM7E6E003562; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:07:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay02.roc.ny.frontiernet.net (relay02.roc.ny.frontiernet.net [66.133.131.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DM7B6E003514 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:07:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 25668 invoked from network); 13 May 2003 22:07:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO computername) ([170.215.206.94]) (envelope-sender ) by relay02.roc.ny.frontiernet.net (FrontierMTA 2.3.5) with SMTP for ; 13 May 2003 22:07:10 -0000 Message-ID: <000801c3199b$fe88a860$03fea8c0@computername> From: "Home Ec" To: Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 18:07:07 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Greenland book X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h4DM8FHP012460 Status: RO Drat - I saw the posting about the new Greenland book, but hit the wrong button when I went to read it and DELETED it again. It's just been one of those long, long rainy days, complete with a fellow teacher bringing in her daughter and her BEADED prom dress, asking if I can take it in for this weekend's prom.... Please, someone send me the info on pre-ordering it again? Rowena _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 18:14:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMEOHP012485 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:14:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMG4Uw006033 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 16:16:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMG16E009925; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:16:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f38.sea1.hotmail.com [207.68.163.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMFs6E009783 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:15:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 13 May 2003 15:15:49 -0700 Received: from 162.83.118.49 by sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 13 May 2003 22:15:48 GMT X-Originating-IP: [162.83.118.49] X-Originating-Email: [nancy_kiel@hotmail.com] From: "Nancy Kiel" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Shoes /Fastener on eBay Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 18:15:48 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 May 2003 22:15:49.0251 (UTC) FILETIME=[355F6530:01C3199D] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Looking at this fastener up close, I can't figure out quite how it works. Obviously the hook part attaches to the belt, and the end of the partlet (thing to be fastened) goes through the horizontal bar, but what keeps it there? How is the partlet attached to the fastener? Any suggestions? Nancy Kiel nancy_kiel@hotmail.com Never tease a weasel! This is very good advice. For the weasel will not like it And teasing isn't nice. >----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Catherine Kinsey" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 9:38 AM > > Subject: [h-cost] Shoes on eBay > > >: >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2529483117&category=355 > > : which is one of the Tudor fasteners/clips discussed awhile back. > > : > > : Just thought folks might be interested. > > : > > : Catherine > > : _______________________________________________ > _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 18:28:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMSLHP012503 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:28:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMTuUw007617 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 16:29:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMTu6E019319; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:29:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.mackie.com (mail2.mackie.com [12.144.237.152]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMTs6E019286 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:29:54 -0600 (MDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Greenland book Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 15:12:35 -0700 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Greenland book Thread-Index: AcMZnJTNB+Gi+D0xSEGYZpbyRqWA0gAABJNw From: "Colleen McDonald" To: "Historical Costume" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4DMTs6E019286 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Replied to. -----Original Message----- From: Home Ec [mailto:sleepyunicorn@citlink.net] Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 3:07 PM To: h-costume@net.indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Greenland book Drat - I saw the posting about the new Greenland book, but hit the wrong button when I went to read it and DELETED it again. Please, someone send me the info on pre-ordering it again? Rowena __ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 18:31:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMV0HP012509 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:31:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMRiUw007328 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 16:27:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMRh6E017686; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:27:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMRe6E017646 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:27:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA06821 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:48:06 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 17:48:06 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Greenland book In-Reply-To: <000801c3199b$fe88a860$03fea8c0@computername> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tue, 13 May 2003, Home Ec wrote: > Drat - I saw the posting about the new Greenland book, but hit the > wrong button when I went to read it and DELETED it again. It's just > been one of those long, long rainy days, complete with a fellow > teacher bringing in her daughter and her BEADED prom dress, asking if > I can take it in for this weekend's prom.... Please, someone send me > the info on pre-ordering it again? Done. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 18:33:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMX7HP012523 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:33:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMYgUw008291 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 16:34:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMYb6E022685; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:34:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from lakemtao01.cox.net (lakemtao01.cox.net [68.1.17.244]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DMYV6E022556 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:34:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from VMAAHQ ([68.99.96.216]) by lakemtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030513223425.RETB8337.lakemtao01.cox.net@VMAAHQ> for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:34:25 -0400 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing machine!") Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 10:57:10 -0400 Message-ID: <000001c3195f$f11fb380$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20030513193059.69078.qmail@web80407.mail.yahoo.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO With all this talk of sewing machines, I am reminded of something I've been meaning to ask the list. Last winter I was driving through the neighborhood, and there was a sewing machine sitting on the curb waiting for the trash pickup. Even though it weighs a ton, I hefted it into the back of the van and took it home. It's an industrial Necchi, with the laminated table, knee lever and complete set up. I took a look at the plate and it says it was made in 1964 in Italy. I believe it could be Navy surplus, because it's painted battleship gray and of course this is a big Navy town. When I plugged it in, I found that the motor is bad, so it does not work as is. It does, however, turn freely by hand so I know that otherwise it seems to be ok. I think I can find a 1/2 hp motor from a local shop that does repairs for the Navy, but I was wondering where I might find other stuff for it, such as bobbins, a manual, etc. It only does a straight stitch, so I'm guessing it's designed for sewing canvas. Funny thing, I had been saying for a year that I needed to get an industrial machine for making new tents. Even with having to buy a new motor, I could never have afforded a machine this nice! Do you all think that it is salvageable, or are parts/accessories totally unavailable? Thanks for any suggestions~ Linda Virginia Beach, Va USA -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Dawn Jacobson Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 3:31 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing machine!") Saragrace wrote: > Aack, you have burst my bubble! I am about ready to > throw my Viking out > a window. I was vowing to my husband to buy an old > Kenmore 1969 > vintage. It never occurred to me that parts would > be hard to find! > > Now what will I do?? Buy the Kenmore. The parts are still available from Sears; the problem is finding a repairperson that will still work on mechanical machines. Last year, the local "Sew & Vac" didn't have anybody, but they've hired somebody that has the necessary skills. Megan wrote: > So many sewing machines down.... might I suggest you > all scour the flea > markets and such for the really old Singers? Whites > are great too. I mean, > the old model 15s can sew tents! Pure straight > stitch, nothing fancy, but > nothing on the market today can beat them for > ability to handle the tough > stuff. Aaaahhh, there's nothing like those old Singer heavy duty machines. 1 stitch (forward), and sews through anything, including 4 layers of canvas (great when you're building "corsets"). I wish I had the room for one, but it won't fit in the sewing/guest room. I'm to the point that I don't normally buy sewing machines at flea markets/yard sales any more, most of what is being sold now is either junk, or electronic, and I'm leery of buying an electronic machine without a warranty. I think the next machine is going to be a Pfaff 130; with all this work, and a husband who's learning to sew, we're going to need a good heavy-duty, semi-industrial machine for sewing things like tents, sails, and still more costumes. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 19:10:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNANHP012647 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 19:10:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNC4Uw012159 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 17:12:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNC3DA016936; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:12:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4DNC0DA016845 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:12:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWh0J9pQtzR6AOfkAi+n7Gq18lRJm3pYLeg==">; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:11:07 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HX4KQJ7V; Tue, 13 May 2003 16:11:07 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 19:09:49 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing machine!") Message-ID: <20030513.190950.-304233.4.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4-6 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Don't know about Necchis, but I can still get parts for my 1955 Singer. I think that there are a lot of interchangeable parts in most models of most machines too. Why not check a local dealer about parts. If there isn't a local dealer look in a sewing magazine for an ad with an address and write for info. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 19:27:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNRPHP012678 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 19:27:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNT3Uw013982 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 17:29:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNT2DA028067; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:29:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNSwDA028010 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:28:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AFE818560080; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:29:44 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AFB670500D2; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:28:54 -0500 Message-ID: <00b201c319a7$43d0dc20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 19:27:47 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] News article X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Just found this article online about museums struggling to make end's meat: http://fdncenter.org/pnd/news/story.jhtml?id=33100006 Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 19:41:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNfFHP012745 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 19:41:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNe5Wm015041 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 17:42:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNEJDA018555; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:14:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNDGDA017890 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:13:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AC394E7E0032; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:14:01 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AC0786100E8; Tue, 13 May 2003 18:13:11 -0500 Message-ID: <008b01c319a5$11f6efc0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00a201c318ef$29213b80$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <002301c31945$bf465040$6a5183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 19:12:05 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dahlia. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 7:49 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question > Dahlia or Hydrangea? > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Penny Ladnier" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 9:29 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hairstyle Question > > > > I put a small image of the hairstyle at > > http://www.costumegallery.com/1838head.jpg I am sorry it is blurry but I > > tried to enlarge the head from the entire costume image. It doesn't seem > to > > have a bandeau. The flower on the left is a large dahlia. > > > > Penny Ladnier > > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > > http://www.costumegallery.com > > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 13 20:24:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4E0OmHP012952 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 20:24:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNPLUw013715 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 13 May 2003 17:25:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNPKDA025658; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:25:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow053o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.96]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4DNPFDA025595 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 17:25:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Imedia5043 ([62.31.40.130]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Wed, 14 May 2003 00:28:11 +0100 From: "Dawn Wood" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] manor house to warriors Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 00:25:02 +0100 Message-ID: <006001c319a6$e4221410$6401a8c0@Imedia5043> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4024 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It was shown in the UK late last summer on channel 5. Don't think any more are in the pipeline as they haven't been doing any filming since with the Royal Armouries guys Dawn Makers of historical reproduction Clothing Uniforms and Bridal wear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 -----Original Message----- Is this being shown in the UK? I assumed it was an American series. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby a.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:08:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F78EHP010488 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:08:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F79UUw014262 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:09:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F79MMf009677; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:09:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4E19jN2006230 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 19:09:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.113] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A40B6F400B6; Tue, 13 May 2003 20:55:39 -0400 Message-ID: <001b01c319b5$f2f010a0$715183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030513193059.69078.qmail@web80407.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing machine!") Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 21:12:53 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Are you sure about that? My Sears repairman with 40 yrs of service spent nearly three weeks coming up with a new motor. He himself called service centers all over the country to solve what seemed to us a routine request. Also, when I required new templates for the button-holer, the ones sent weren't quite the right ones and I was told by the parts manager that the one made for my machine was no longer available. That the substitution would work just fine...well it didn't. Also , there were subtle changes in the clutch and tension assembly that will work, but they are not to original equipment regulation. This is why I opted for the Pfaff. At least it is all steel innards. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn Jacobson" To: Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 3:30 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing machine!") > Saragrace wrote: > > Aack, you have burst my bubble! I am about ready to > > throw my Viking out > > a window. I was vowing to my husband to buy an old > > Kenmore 1969 > > vintage. It never occurred to me that parts would > > be hard to find! > > > > Now what will I do?? > > Buy the Kenmore. The parts are still available from > Sears; the problem is finding a repairperson that will > still work on mechanical machines. Last year, the > local "Sew & Vac" didn't have anybody, but they've > hired somebody that has the necessary skills. > > Megan wrote: > > > So many sewing machines down.... might I suggest you > > all scour the flea > > markets and such for the really old Singers? Whites > > are great too. I mean, > > the old model 15s can sew tents! Pure straight > > stitch, nothing fancy, but > > nothing on the market today can beat them for > > ability to handle the tough > > stuff. > > Aaaahhh, there's nothing like those old Singer heavy > duty machines. 1 stitch (forward), and sews through > anything, including 4 layers of canvas (great when > you're building "corsets"). I wish I had the room for > one, but it won't fit in the sewing/guest room. > > I'm to the point that I don't normally buy sewing > machines at flea markets/yard sales any more, most of > what is being sold now is either junk, or electronic, > and I'm leery of buying an electronic machine without > a warranty. I think the next machine is going to be a > Pfaff 130; with all this work, and a husband who's > learning to sew, we're going to need a good > heavy-duty, semi-industrial machine for sewing things > like tents, sails, and still more costumes. > > Dawn > > ===== > Dawn Jacobson > Vallejo, CA, USA > > "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" > --Wicked Witch > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:09:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F79RHP011014 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:09:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7AvUw014360 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:10:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7AvMf010242; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:10:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay01.roc.ny.frontiernet.net (relay01.roc.ny.frontiernet.net [66.133.131.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4E1BQN2007335 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 19:11:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 27157 invoked from network); 14 May 2003 01:11:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO livingroom) ([209.63.51.162]) (envelope-sender ) by relay01.roc.ny.frontiernet.net (FrontierMTA 2.3.5) with SMTP for ; 14 May 2003 01:11:25 -0000 Message-ID: <005d01c319b5$b903b9f0$01fea8c0@livingroom> From: "Lyn Greaves- home" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000001c3195f$f11fb380$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 21:11:16 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [h-cost] industrial parts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Either Atlanta Thread Co. http://www.atlantathread.com/ may have things. Also, Arrow Merrow at 11th and Arch St. in Philadelphia. Both have supplied parts for my 1934 Singer straight stitch. Arrow Merrow also sells used bits. Lyn Greaves Lady Rosamund d'Alwareton COM, COTerpsichore, COSalamander ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 10:57 AM Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewingmachine!") > With all this talk of sewing machines, I am reminded of something I've > been meaning to ask the list. > > Last winter I was driving through the neighborhood, and there was a > sewing machine sitting on the curb waiting for the trash pickup. Even > though it weighs a ton, I hefted it into the back of the van and took it > home. It's an industrial Necchi, with the laminated table, knee lever > and complete set up. I took a look at the plate and it says it was made > in 1964 in Italy. I believe it could be Navy surplus, because it's > painted battleship gray and of course this is a big Navy town. When I > plugged it in, I found that the motor is bad, so it does not work as is. > It does, however, turn freely by hand so I know that otherwise it seems > to be ok. I think I can find a 1/2 hp motor from a local shop that does > repairs for the Navy, but I was wondering where I might find other stuff > for it, such as bobbins, a manual, etc. It only does a straight stitch, > so I'm guessing it's designed for sewing canvas. > > Funny thing, I had been saying for a year that I needed to get an > industrial machine for making new tents. Even with having to buy a new > motor, I could never have afforded a machine this nice! Do you all > think that it is salvageable, or are parts/accessories totally > unavailable? > > Thanks for any suggestions~ > > Linda > Virginia Beach, Va USA > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] > On Behalf Of Dawn Jacobson > Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 3:31 PM > To: h-costume@indra.com > Subject: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing > machine!") > > Saragrace wrote: > > Aack, you have burst my bubble! I am about ready to > > throw my Viking out > > a window. I was vowing to my husband to buy an old > > Kenmore 1969 > > vintage. It never occurred to me that parts would > > be hard to find! > > > > Now what will I do?? > > Buy the Kenmore. The parts are still available from > Sears; the problem is finding a repairperson that will > still work on mechanical machines. Last year, the > local "Sew & Vac" didn't have anybody, but they've > hired somebody that has the necessary skills. > > Megan wrote: > > > So many sewing machines down.... might I suggest you > > all scour the flea > > markets and such for the really old Singers? Whites > > are great too. I mean, > > the old model 15s can sew tents! Pure straight > > stitch, nothing fancy, but > > nothing on the market today can beat them for > > ability to handle the tough > > stuff. > > Aaaahhh, there's nothing like those old Singer heavy > duty machines. 1 stitch (forward), and sews through > anything, including 4 layers of canvas (great when > you're building "corsets"). I wish I had the room for > one, but it won't fit in the sewing/guest room. > > I'm to the point that I don't normally buy sewing > machines at flea markets/yard sales any more, most of > what is being sold now is either junk, or electronic, > and I'm leery of buying an electronic machine without > a warranty. I think the next machine is going to be a > Pfaff 130; with all this work, and a husband who's > learning to sew, we're going to need a good > heavy-duty, semi-industrial machine for sewing things > like tents, sails, and still more costumes. > > Dawn > > ===== > Dawn Jacobson > Vallejo, CA, USA > > "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those > socks?" > --Wicked Witch > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:11:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7BdHP012422 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:11:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7DDUw014610 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:13:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7DCMf011074; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:13:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hall.mail.mindspring.net (hall.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.60]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4E4ji7P017757 for ; Tue, 13 May 2003 22:45:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ar-008neomahp124.dialsprint.net ([63.178.246.188] helo=hppav.radiks.net) by hall.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Fo99-0005nG-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 14 May 2003 00:45:44 -0400 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20030513223708.036e29c8@radiks.net> X-Sender: costumrs@radiks.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 22:43:16 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200305131800.h4DI0qNc020580@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] Re: Devon St. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, from our recent experience at Costume-Con, we made a major killing at Regal. Not only did we get saris, I finally found two!! outfits that fit me and Pierre got an embroidered suit and turban as well. BTW, I'm 5'11" and a size 20 or so. My salwar kurta was size 52 full. I just wore it this past Sunday to the Mothers' Day brunch they have at the fancy hotel here in town. They also had some incredible fabric and lovely fuzzy throws (not historical, but cozy!) They have a jewelry store also. Pierre and Sandy >I am going to be in Chicago next Monday and Tuesday. Although I have been to >Devon St. many times, it has always been in the evening for dinner. Since >I'll be there with not much to do, I thought I would check out some of the >sari stores everyone always raves about. Any particular recommendations? > >********************** >Rebecca Schmitt "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed To Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly-- Why They Are Simply Doomed." Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:14:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7EOHP013552 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:14:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7FtUw015143 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:15:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7FtMf012738; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:15:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4E7tP9Y029298 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 01:55:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4E7tNp06416.; Wed, 14 May 2003 08:55:24 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 14 May 2003 08:55:21 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 08:55:03 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] manor house to warriors Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4E7tP9Y029298 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>> anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk 05/13/03 08:25pm >>> >It was shown on Channel 4 last year, under the title Warrior School. Oh, I missed it, then. I usually watch or video anything historical, but sometimes there isn't time to see everything I think I might enjoy. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:15:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7FpHP013949 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:15:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7HOUw015316 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:17:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7HOMf013544; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:17:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20704.mail.yahoo.com (web20704.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.177]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4EDbgtk007563 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 07:37:42 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030514133739.43589.qmail@web20704.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [207.179.148.57] by web20704.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 14 May 2003 09:37:39 EDT Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 09:37:39 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing machine!") To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000001c3195f$f11fb380$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There is a sewing machine warehouse/wholesale place somewhere in Vermont that deals with necchi I am at a loss for the name of it. All of my lit. is in boxes for moving maybe someone else can recall the name of it. They advertised in Threads so you may want to check there. My mom has a necchi circa 1976 that sews circles around most other machines iI have ever come across, though I am partial to my husky. Good luck with your machine liz Linda Rice wrote: With all this talk of sewing machines, I am reminded of something I've been meaning to ask the list. Last winter I was driving through the neighborhood, and there was a sewing machine sitting on the curb waiting for the trash pickup. Even though it weighs a ton, I hefted it into the back of the van and took it home. It's an industrial Necchi, with the laminated table, knee lever and complete set up. I took a look at the plate and it says it was made in 1964 in Italy. I believe it could be Navy surplus, because it's painted battleship gray and of course this is a big Navy town. When I plugged it in, I found that the motor is bad, so it does not work as is. It does, however, turn freely by hand so I know that otherwise it seems to be ok. I think I can find a 1/2 hp motor from a local shop that does repairs for the Navy, but I was wondering where I might find other stuff for it, such as bobbins, a manual, etc. It only does a straight stitch, so I'm guessing it's designed for sewing canvas. Funny thing, I had been saying for a year that I needed to get an industrial machine for making new tents. Even with having to buy a new motor, I could never have afforded a machine this nice! Do you all think that it is salvageable, or are parts/accessories totally unavailable? Thanks for any suggestions~ Linda Virginia Beach, Va USA -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Dawn Jacobson Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 3:31 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewing machine!") Saragrace wrote: > Aack, you have burst my bubble! I am about ready to > throw my Viking out > a window. I was vowing to my husband to buy an old > Kenmore 1969 > vintage. It never occurred to me that parts would > be hard to find! > > Now what will I do?? Buy the Kenmore. The parts are still available from Sears; the problem is finding a repairperson that will still work on mechanical machines. Last year, the local "Sew & Vac" didn't have anybody, but they've hired somebody that has the necessary skills. Megan wrote: > So many sewing machines down.... might I suggest you > all scour the flea > markets and such for the really old Singers? Whites > are great too. I mean, > the old model 15s can sew tents! Pure straight > stitch, nothing fancy, but > nothing on the market today can beat them for > ability to handle the tough > stuff. Aaaahhh, there's nothing like those old Singer heavy duty machines. 1 stitch (forward), and sews through anything, including 4 layers of canvas (great when you're building "corsets"). I wish I had the room for one, but it won't fit in the sewing/guest room. I'm to the point that I don't normally buy sewing machines at flea markets/yard sales any more, most of what is being sold now is either junk, or electronic, and I'm leery of buying an electronic machine without a warranty. I think the next machine is going to be a Pfaff 130; with all this work, and a husband who's learning to sew, we're going to need a good heavy-duty, semi-industrial machine for sewing things like tents, sails, and still more costumes. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:16:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7G7HP014030 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:16:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7HbUw015347 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:17:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7HbMf013630; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:17:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d06.mx.aol.com (imo-d06.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4EDiKtk010501 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 07:44:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ConstanceFairfax@cs.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.7e.38d2f89b (15874) for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 09:44:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cs.com (mow-m25.webmail.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by air-id07.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id MAILINID71-3e023ec2482b21b; Wed, 14 May 2003 09:44:12 -0400 Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 09:44:11 -0400 From: ConstanceFairfax@cs.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Shoes /Fastener on eBay MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <21775F95.304D6D92.349D0FDF@cs.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Nancy, I haven't seen any examples of these hooks being found with the fabric extant (anyone?)...but what *I* have done is pass the fabric through the bar & then stitch it to the bar. It sounds like you're looking at using this hook a la the typical Bruegel partlet...in that case, you'd probably just pop the hook right through the fabric (wool) as the partlet ends higher than the belt in the paintings which show the partlet hook in detail (Peasant Dance, Festival of St. Martin) I have one of these hooks (although not as fancy) and it's been a wonderful "touchstone" for me... Constance "Nancy Kiel" wrote: >Looking at this fastener up close, I can't figure out quite how it works.   >Obviously the hook part attaches to the belt, and the end of the partlet >(thing to be fastened) goes through the horizontal bar, but what keeps it >there?  How is the partlet attached to the fastener?  Any suggestions? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:16:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7GrHP014245 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:16:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7IBUw015475 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:18:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7IAMf013885; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:18:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4EG3V1O010651 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 10:03:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be4a.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.74]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B995447FF81 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 18:03:28 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000f01c31a32$714685c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 18:04:04 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] update with pannier, embroidery and stays. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi The progress is going on. I have updated the embroidery with miniature ribbon embroidery for the bodice: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary.html And the underpinnings is almost finished two: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary-underpinnings.htm It is very nice to sit and make this ribbon. It is only 1 inch wide, and i dont use the frame for this embroidery. So i can sit comfortable in my sofa to do it. The pannier went well. It is not finished entirely yeat, but i must confess that i have made a lot the last 3 days. Many greetings Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:17:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7GxHP014268 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:16:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7IQUw015526 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:18:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7IQMf014037; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:18:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (root@mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4EGaJ1O005244 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 10:36:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bently (dialport90.tukwila.eskimo.net [208.187.14.91]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA18655; Wed, 14 May 2003 09:36:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <01f501c31a36$c9ee4e20$5b0ebbd0@bently> From: "David" To: , References: <20030513195620.93283.qmail@web20809.mail.yahoo.com> <3EC1553E.2F68AB05@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 09:35:05 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Subject: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Since I never thought I'd actually ever wind up going to England, I never paid too much attention to which museums and the like people said interesting pieces were in. Now, as kind of a reward for getting through my lung cancer treatment, my parents are going to send me there, probably for most of August. I'll most likely spend the bulk of my time in London, but can go anywhere I want, if there's something worth going there for. Overall, I'm an all-things-fiber addict, with a strong bias towards anything over a thousand years old, and an unexpected weakness for Edwardian gowns. I'm the sort who would happily spend several hours in front of the same case, trying to trace thread paths, and making notes (heaven help me!). So, where would you recommend I go, and what should I see? And do you have any great advice as to where I should stay while I'm seeing it? Thank you for whatever help you can provide. This is a once-in-a-lifetime kind of thing for me, and I'd really like to do it well. Pam Dotson Everett, WA USA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:20:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7K8HP016904 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:20:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7LcUw016342 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:21:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7LbMf016610; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:21:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (root@mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4EHjC7v025661 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 11:45:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bently (dialport15.tukwila.eskimo.net [208.187.159.85]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA23645 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 10:45:07 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <023b01c31a40$6c977440$5b0ebbd0@bently> From: "David" To: Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 10:44:06 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-DCC-neonova-Metrics: net.indra.com 1127; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Subject: [h-cost] Advice wanted for big England trip X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Please forgive me if this shows up on the list twice. I tried to send it earlier, but it never came through, so I'm re-sending it. Since I never thought I'd actually ever wind up going to England, I never paid too much attention to which museums and the like people said interesting pieces were in. Now, as kind of a reward for getting through my lung cancer treatment, my parents are going to send me there, probably for most of August. I'll most likely spend the bulk of my time in London, but can go anywhere I want, if there's something worth going there for. Overall, I'm an all-things-fiber addict, with a strong bias towards anything over a thousand years old, and an unexpected weakness for Edwardian gowns. I'm the sort who would happily spend several hours in front of the same case, trying to trace thread paths, and making notes (heaven help me!). So, where would you recommend I go, and what should I see? And do you have any great advice as to where I should stay while I'm seeing it? Thank you for whatever help you can provide. This is a once-in-a-lifetime kind of thing for me, and I'd really like to do it well. Pam Dotson Everett, WA USA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:20:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7KmHP017038 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:20:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7MMUw016421 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:22:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7MLMf016961; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:22:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.siscom.net (mail2.siscom.net [209.251.18.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4EK2Xkc005230 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 14:02:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 68888 invoked by uid 1005); 14 May 2003 20:02:23 -0000 Received: from drea@nospam by uid 0 with qmail-scanner-1.14 (f-prot: 3.12. Clear:. Processed in 1.775946 secs); 14 May 2003 20:02:23 -0000 X-Qmail-Scanner-Mail-From: drea@nospam X-Qmail-Scanner: 1.14 (Clear:. Processed in 1.775946 secs) Received: from shell.siscom.net (209.251.2.80) by mail.siscom.net with SMTP; 14 May 2003 20:02:20 -0000 Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 16:02:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Drea Leed To: h-costume@indra.com Message-ID: <20030514160050.R30409-100000@shell.siscom.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-MessageCare-Metrics: net.indra.com 1108; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Subject: [h-cost] perugia towels? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Everyone, I'm currently looking for reproduction "perugian towels", those white linen cloths bordered with designs in blue that show up in italian & german paintings of the 16th century. I've scoured the web, to no avail; does anyone know of a place that sells them? Thanks, Drea _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:21:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7LMHP017152 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:21:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7MuUw016492 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:22:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7MtMf017242; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:22:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (root@mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ENVTLX002861 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 17:31:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bently (dialport99.tukwila.eskimo.net [208.187.15.162]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA19371 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 16:31:26 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <008301c31a70$cece6d00$a10fbbd0@bently> From: "David" To: Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 16:30:28 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-DCC-Etherboy-Metrics: net.indra.com 1002; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Subject: [h-cost] test X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Are there no messages coming through the h-cost list, or did I somehow get dropped off it, just when I asked something important? Pam Dotson _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:22:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7MAHP017305 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:22:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7NiUw016611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:23:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7NiMf017644; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:23:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net (albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.120]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F3Jjvj000462 for ; Wed, 14 May 2003 21:19:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19G9HU-0006Iz-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 14 May 2003 20:19:44 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 20:19:42 -0700 Message-ID: <000001c31a90$d517deb0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <000001c3195f$f11fb380$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-DCC-MessageCare-Metrics: net.indra.com 1108; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] One or two people in this Bruegel? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I was perusing Bruegels and started looking at this print.http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/pieter6.html Is the person(s) with the flat 'basket' on her head one or two people? It looks like only one neck, but doesn't it look like two people? Either way, the jacket does look very loose. Perhaps it is just a heavy set person, but the perspective seems odd. Whadda' ya think? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:28:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7SOHP018520 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:28:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7T9Uw017386 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:29:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7T8Mf020751; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:29:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f66.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.66]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F79hMf009756 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:09:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 15 May 2003 00:09:38 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:09:37 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: 19cWoman@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 00:09:37 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 May 2003 07:09:38.0181 (UTC) FILETIME=[F2840350:01C31AB0] cc: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Idea? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A friend and I were discussing the fabrics and patterns for an edwardian outfit I want to wear to a vintage carshow this summer. We both mentioned always wanting to have these gowns, but not having anywhere/why to wear them. I told her I'd happily wear mine out to lunch if there were two friends to go play with me. Are there any people in the western Portland OR area who might be interested in dressing for "tea" and getting together for lunch once a month just for fun? Too ambitious? What about just a lunch date this summer sometime to see how it goes? I live an hour west of downtown but there must be a couple of places with some vintage ambiance that wouldn't mind a tea party once in a while. I admit I'll dress up for almost any reason, but I like these gowns and am not dedicated enough to go full reinactment, and it might be a fun change of pace. Anyone vaguely interested?? Suggestions for where? Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 03:56:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7ufHP031737 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 03:56:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7wCUw019386 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 01:58:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7wBq7003304; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:58:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F7w6q7003241 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:58:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4F7w4p04043.; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:58:04 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:58:04 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 08:57:43 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] test Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4F7w6q7003241 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO No, you haven't been dropped off, Pam; there seems to be some kind of bottleneck. A message I posted yesterday took a whole day to appear on my own screen. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> someone@eskimo.com 05/15/03 12:30am >>> Are there no messages coming through the h-cost list, or did I somehow get dropped off it, just when I asked something important? Pam Dotson _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information on a proactive email security service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.messagelabs.com ________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 04:09:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F89AHP005217 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 04:09:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8AdUw020153 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 02:10:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8Acq7008374; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:10:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web40020.mail.yahoo.com (web40020.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.60]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4F8AZq7008303 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:10:35 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030515081030.66508.qmail@web40020.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [62.254.246.61] by web40020.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:10:30 BST Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 09:10:30 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Rachel?= To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305150758.h4F7wZqA003648@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: Advice wanted for an England trip X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Pam, Well there is lots you can do in August. Musuem wise there is the Victoria and Albert Museum, British Museum, Museum of London all in London as well as lots more smaller museums and the art galleries as well. Hampton Court Palace is well worth a visit and fairly easy to get to on the train from London (Waterloo Station every 30 mins to Hampton Court), Buckingham Palace should be open to the public and it's worth going to see the Royal Collection which is a separate bit in a building on the same site, they have an exhibition of sketches by da Vinci at the moment, may still be on in August but you should be able to check over the internet. Windsor Castle is another good place to visit. I don't know what period in history you are particularly interested in but if Elizabethan is up your street you can come and pay my group a visit (The Tudor Group) as we will be doing our week long inhabitation of a lower gentry house in August (see www.tudorgroup.co.uk) for more details. It's outside London but not too difficult to get to if you hire a car. You should probably take the opportunity of touring round the country a bit as there are some real treasures outside of London. Let me know if I can be any more help. Rachel > From: "David" > Subject: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip > To: , > Message-ID: <01f501c31a36$c9ee4e20$5b0ebbd0@bently> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Since I never thought I'd actually ever wind up going to England, I never > paid too much attention to which museums and the like people said > interesting pieces were in. Now, as kind of a reward for getting through my > lung cancer treatment, my parents are going to send me there, probably for > most of August. I'll most likely spend the bulk of my time in London, but > can go anywhere I want, if there's something worth going there for. > > Overall, I'm an all-things-fiber addict, with a strong bias towards anything > over a thousand years old, and an unexpected weakness for Edwardian gowns. > I'm the sort who would happily spend several hours in front of the same > case, trying to trace thread paths, and making notes (heaven help me!). So, > where would you recommend I go, and what should I see? And do you have any > great advice as to where I should stay while I'm seeing it? > > Thank you for whatever help you can provide. This is a once-in-a-lifetime > kind of thing for me, and I'd really like to do it well. > > Pam Dotson > Everett, WA USA > ===== Rachel Tudor Bibliography http://website.lineone.net/~reholliday/Tudor/ __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 04:17:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8HgHP007867 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 04:17:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8J9Uw020548 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 02:19:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8J8q7011486; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:19:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8J6q7011465 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:19:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEX00H935RS8W@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:19:05 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 01:04:55 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Idea? In-reply-to: X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515010122.02cce738@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/14/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 12:09 AM 5/15/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I admit I'll dress up for almost any reason, but I like these gowns and am >not dedicated enough to go full reinactment, and it might be a fun change >of pace. Anyone vaguely interested?? Suggestions for where? Have you tried a local museum house or Victorian styled restaurant? Our local Meux Home museum and Kearny Park museum offers Tea Parties sometimes. I know one of the docents dresses in a late Victorian or maybe it is Edwardian style. It is all part of our local Historical society. Maybe you might have a local historical society that can provide the location or even activity. Too bad I live in California. It sounds like a fun idea you have. Why not post a flyer or ask around your locality to see if others are similarly interested. Good luck! Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 04:17:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8HrHP007921 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 04:17:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8JQUw020568 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 02:19:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8JPq7011588; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:19:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8J6q9011465 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:19:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEX00H935RS8W@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 01:19:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 01:12:22 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] One or two people in this Bruegel? In-reply-to: <000001c31a90$d517deb0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515010704.02c4cd10@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/14/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <000001c3195f$f11fb380$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It looks like one person to me. Carrying two baskets, one in each hand. Left foot forward of the right, and head tilted down so you can see the goods in the head basket. Oddly, the red top reminds me of modern knit shirts with matching sweaters, that only have the button at the neck, and hang open from there. Too bad it is in a jpg format. Even at 200% viewing resolution, it is too blotchy to really see the details. my thoughts... fwiw. Kimiko At 08:19 PM 5/14/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I was perusing Bruegels and started looking at this >print.http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/pieter6.html >Is the person(s) with the flat 'basket' on her head one or two people? > >It looks like only one neck, but doesn't it look like two people? >Either way, the jacket does look very loose. Perhaps it is just a heavy >set person, but the perspective seems odd. > >Whadda' ya think? Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 04:43:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8hGHP023450 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 04:43:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8imUw021682 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 02:44:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8ilq7020528; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:44:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from decna.com (IDENT:fFbYc0khIWWBF1Fi7wxj96C4LTUn3nBh@decna.com [64.28.25.12]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4F8iiq7020511 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 02:44:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (ingridgs@localhost) by decna.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4F8tAa27630 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:55:10 +0200 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:55:10 +0200 (CEST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ingrid_G=2E_Storr=F8?= X-X-Sender: ingridgs@decna.com To: h-costume@indra.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] Indigo dyeing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A question for the dyers among us: I'm going to try my hand at out-of-doors and over an open fire natural dyeing this summer, at an event that's an 8 hour drive from my home and of a kind where I can't use plastic containers and the like. I was hoping to maybe take a crack at dyeing with indigo (in addition to madder and other stuff), but I see some potentially quite big problems with this considering the circumstances. As I understand it, the indigo has to reduce/ferment for about a week in warm conditions before it's suitable for dyeing, and introducing air into the vat at any time is inadvisable. Correct? Although the event lasts for a bit more than a week, waiting until the very end to do the dyeing isn't optimal, as I hope to overdye some of it to get greens and purples. Here's hoping someone on the list will know whether this is feasible or not: - I was hoping to maybe get the vat going in a plastic container (the kind used for water, so with a small opening) in my bathroom (with floor heating) about a week before I go to the event. Then transport the vat in the plastic container, and pour it into another container (wooden bucket with fabric covering or something like that) once I get there and let it sit for a couple more days before dyeing. Will this ruin the vat completely? - once at the event, I doubt if I will be able to give the vat stable warm conditions day and night. Will that ruin the vat? The event is in southern Sweden in July, so the chances of fairly warm weather are good, but in Scandinavia one never knows... Could it be an idea to put warm stones into the vat at intervals? - what if it rains while I'm dyeing? Is this something that should be done under some form of roof? - what kind of container is suitable? If I understand what I've read correctly, one dyes directly in the container that the stuff has reduced in. Is there a particular kind of metal that is better for the dye, or is wood best? And on another note: how much does this stuff actually stink, anyway? My deep gratitude to anyone with input on this. :) Ingrid _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 07:17:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FBHrHP024982 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:17:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FBJGUw029689 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 05:19:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FBJAlc015868; Thu, 15 May 2003 05:19:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from webwarren.com (65.18.ptr.worldaxxs.net [65.18.210.91] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FBJ7lc015858 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 05:19:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jessica.webwarren.com (bgp381063bgs.plnfld01.nj.comcast.net [68.36.17.255]) (authenticated (0 bits)) by webwarren.com (8.12.8/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4FB9rxJ003599 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:09:55 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: webwarren.com: webbwarren owned process doing -bs Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515071506.04d23a20@mail.earthlink.net> X-Sender: arachne@pop.webwarren.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 07:18:26 -0400 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Brenda Subject: Re: [h-cost] News article Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny Ladnier wrote: >Just found this article online about museums struggling to make end's meat: >http://fdncenter.org/pnd/news/story.jhtml?id=33100006 I have found some of these smaller museums to be absolute treasurehouses: not much in the way of sheer number of items in a collection, but usually displayed so you can examine them relatively closely; in addition, the volunteer managers/docents usually have a good understanding of the local history into which they fit. I like to make a point of visiting these small museums when I travel, and I always look for the donations box to drop in a couple of bucks (whatever I can afford at the time) to help keep them open and available. I don't know if any small-museum owners/operators/volunteers are on this list... but if you are, *thank you*. Brenda webwarren@earthlink.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 08:43:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FChAHP025280 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:43:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FCicUw004213 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 06:44:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FCibJA019956; Thu, 15 May 2003 06:44:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FCiUJA019873 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 06:44:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m216.in-tch.com [216.166.191.216]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4FCQCL08541 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 06:26:12 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EC38BEA.48B20E6E@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 06:45:30 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] One or two people in this Bruegel? References: <000001c31a90$d517deb0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh my goodness, it sure *does* look odd! I think it's one person, with a perspective/painted problem--a basket on either arm, plus the big, flat hat/basket thing on her head, and fairly full clothing. The odd green/grey lump below the basket on her left arm (that keeps wanting to look like someone else's shoulder) could easily be her left foot as she steps forward towards the center of the painting. Also, is she possibly pregnant (which might account for the looseness of the clothing)? There's one man, towards the center of the painting, who's carrying beverage jugs, and everyone else in view (except the woman with the baskets) is either actively working, or refreshing themselves while their tools sit nearby. The bulgy skirt could be an advanced pregnancy, which might mean she's relegated to a less physically active roll in the harvest.... Of course, I could be completely wrong, too! --sue Saragrace Knauf wrote: > > I was perusing Bruegels and started looking at this > print.http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/pieter6.html > Is the person(s) with the flat 'basket' on her head one or two people? > > It looks like only one neck, but doesn't it look like two people? > Either way, the jacket does look very loose. Perhaps it is just a heavy > set person, but the perspective seems odd. > > Whadda' ya think? > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 08:49:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FCnRHP025335 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:49:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FCoWUw004571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 06:50:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FCoWJA022437; Thu, 15 May 2003 06:50:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FCoSJA022351 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 06:50:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m216.in-tch.com [216.166.191.216]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4FCWAL10449 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 06:32:11 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EC38D63.C08CC53E@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 06:51:47 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] update with pannier, embroidery and stays. References: <000f01c31a32$714685c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wonderful looking stuff, as always, Bjarne! A question about the panniers--since this lady is of a larger size, did you have to fuss with the scale of the panniers? (i.e., make them bigger around the bottom than you would for someone Nicole-sized, in order to keep the same "look", the same degree of large-skirt-contrasted-with-the-waist?) Or did the circumference stay more or less the same? --sue Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > Hi > The progress is going on. I have updated the embroidery with miniature > ribbon embroidery for the bodice: > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary.html > And the underpinnings is almost finished two: > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary-underpinnings.htm > It is very nice to sit and make this ribbon. It is only 1 inch wide, and i > dont use the frame for this embroidery. > So i can sit comfortable in my sofa to do it. > The pannier went well. It is not finished entirely yeat, but i must confess > that i have made a lot the last 3 days. > > Many greetings > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 09:08:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FD8QHP025387 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:08:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FD9uUw005819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 07:09:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FD9tO2000592; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:09:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp809.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp809.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.188]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FD9pO2000563 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:09:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from adsl-66-124-153-210.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net (HELO JBrendlingerLT.sbcglobal.net) (joycebre@sbcglobal.net@66.124.153.210 with login) by smtp-sbc-v1.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 May 2003 13:09:51 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515060705.00b088b0@pop.sbcglobal.yahoo.com> X-Sender: joycebre@sbcglobal.net@pop.sbcglobal.yahoo.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 06:09:50 -0700 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Joyce In-Reply-To: <200305150758.h4F7wZq8003648@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] sewing machines - (sort of OT) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Speaking of sewing machines, I have a 1930's Singer machine that needs a good home. I don't want to ship it, but if there's anyone interested in the greater SF bay area who's interested, please contact me off list. -- Joyce _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 09:09:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FD9xHP025392 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:09:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FDBPUw005914 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 07:11:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FDBOO2001167; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:11:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.siscom.net (mail2.siscom.net [209.251.18.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FDBLO2001145 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:11:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 63029 invoked by uid 1005); 15 May 2003 13:11:17 -0000 Received: from drea@nospam by uid 0 with qmail-scanner-1.14 (f-prot: 3.12. Clear:. Processed in 0.099922 secs); 15 May 2003 13:11:17 -0000 X-Qmail-Scanner-Mail-From: drea@nospam X-Qmail-Scanner: 1.14 (Clear:. Processed in 0.099922 secs) Received: from shell.siscom.net (209.251.2.80) by mail.siscom.net with SMTP; 15 May 2003 13:11:16 -0000 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 09:11:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Drea Leed To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip In-Reply-To: <01f501c31a36$c9ee4e20$5b0ebbd0@bently> Message-ID: <20030515090943.T51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I definitely recommend scheduling at least two days for the V&A Museum. They have a very nice costume section, as well as a large textile study room on one of the upper stories, with over a thousand pieces of embroidery and fabrics from medieval times to the 20th century. Have fun! Drea On Wed, 14 May 2003, David wrote: > Since I never thought I'd actually ever wind up going to England, I never > paid too much attention to which museums and the like people said > interesting pieces were in. Now, as kind of a reward for getting through my > lung cancer treatment, my parents are going to send me there, probably for > most of August. I'll most likely spend the bulk of my time in London, but > can go anywhere I want, if there's something worth going there for. > > Overall, I'm an all-things-fiber addict, with a strong bias towards anything > over a thousand years old, and an unexpected weakness for Edwardian gowns. > I'm the sort who would happily spend several hours in front of the same > case, trying to trace thread paths, and making notes (heaven help me!). So, > where would you recommend I go, and what should I see? And do you have any > great advice as to where I should stay while I'm seeing it? > > Thank you for whatever help you can provide. This is a once-in-a-lifetime > kind of thing for me, and I'd really like to do it well. > > Pam Dotson > Everett, WA USA > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 09:33:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FDX6HP025540 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:33:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FDYVUw007293 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 07:34:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FDYUO2011314; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:34:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from post.its.mcw.edu (post.its.mcw.edu [141.106.32.10]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FDYPO2011249 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:34:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from post.its.mcw.edu (york.is.mcw.edu [141.106.12.17]) by post.its.mcw.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.4) with ESMTP id h4FDYOK25001 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:34:24 -0500 (CDT) Received: from post (net-60-70.dhcp.mcw.edu [141.106.60.70]) by post.its.mcw.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.4) with SMTP id h4FDYNG24987 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:34:23 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <005901c31ae6$89c81fa0$463c6a8d@its.mcw.edu.aghlab> From: "mls" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030514160050.R30409-100000@shell.siscom.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] perugia towels? Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 08:33:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Drea- Consider looking at this site. I've never ordered from them, but have it bookmarked from a food magazine article. From what I recall, they had pretty linen towels. http://www.esperya.com/usa/ Marie ----- Original Message ----- From: Drea Leed To: Sent: Wednesday, 14 May, 2003 3:02 PM Subject: [h-cost] perugia towels? > > Everyone, > > I'm currently looking for reproduction "perugian towels", those white > linen cloths bordered with designs in blue that show up in italian & > german paintings of the 16th century. > > I've scoured the web, to no avail; does anyone know of a place that sells > them? > > Thanks, > > Drea _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 09:59:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FDxfHP025743 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:59:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE0tUw009770 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:00:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE0tlw025764; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:00:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.siscom.net (mail2.siscom.net [209.251.18.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FE0qlw025735 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:00:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 13048 invoked by uid 1005); 15 May 2003 13:54:07 -0000 Received: from drea@nospam by uid 0 with qmail-scanner-1.14 (f-prot: 3.12. Clear:. Processed in 0.075984 secs); 15 May 2003 13:54:07 -0000 X-Qmail-Scanner-Mail-From: drea@nospam X-Qmail-Scanner: 1.14 (Clear:. Processed in 0.075984 secs) Received: from shell.siscom.net (209.251.2.80) by mail.siscom.net with SMTP; 15 May 2003 13:54:07 -0000 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 09:54:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Drea Leed To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] perugia towels? In-Reply-To: <005901c31ae6$89c81fa0$463c6a8d@its.mcw.edu.aghlab> Message-ID: <20030515095403.A51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks! Nice towels. Drea On Thu, 15 May 2003, mls wrote: > Drea- > > Consider looking at this site. I've never ordered from them, but have it > bookmarked from a food magazine article. From what I recall, they had > pretty linen towels. > http://www.esperya.com/usa/ > > Marie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Drea Leed > To: > Sent: Wednesday, 14 May, 2003 3:02 PM > Subject: [h-cost] perugia towels? > > > > > > Everyone, > > > > I'm currently looking for reproduction "perugian towels", those white > > linen cloths bordered with designs in blue that show up in italian & > > german paintings of the 16th century. > > > > I've scoured the web, to no avail; does anyone know of a place that sells > > them? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Drea > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:03:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE3eHP025761 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:03:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE4wUw010118 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:04:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE4wlw027914; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:04:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net (turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.126]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE4tlw027886 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:04:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-004-212.jps.net ([216.119.4.212] helo=elizabethanlady.com) by turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19GJLq-0006t7-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 07:04:54 -0700 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 07:01:12 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030515090943.T51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >> Since I never thought I'd actually ever wind up going to England, I >> never >> paid too much attention to which museums and the like people said >> interesting pieces were in. Now, as kind of a reward for getting >> through my >> lung cancer treatment, my parents are going to send me there, >> probably for >> most of August. I'll most likely spend the bulk of my time in >> London, but >> can go anywhere I want, if there's something worth going there for. You have enough time to contact the Victoria & Albert museum and apply to view their stored costume and textile pieces. Do it, do it, do it! You can contact them via their website: http://www.vam.ac.uk/ and mention that you're a historical costumer and are interested in knowing if they allow special access to stored textile and costume pieces. When I asked, they fell all over themselves to try to accomodate me, but it wound up that I didn't give them enough warning in advance so it fell through. They advised notifying them at least 6-8 weeks in advance. Plus, I agree with Drea about reserving 2 days in your schedule for the museum, particularly if you're like me and you erased your digital camera's files on the train to Bath the next day... People like me should book 3 days just to be sure. ;) The V&A is open late on Wednesdays, too. You might want to spend all day there. You can easily blow 4 hours on two rooms, alone. I wish I were going back! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:06:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE6VHP025772 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:06:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE7rUw010400 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:07:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE7qlw029382; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:07:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt25.cluster1.charter.net (remt25.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE7mlw029318 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:07:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [24.196.130.120] (HELO laptop) by remt25.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 28804935 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:07:43 -0400 Message-ID: <004801c31aeb$4972c180$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <000001c31a90$d517deb0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> Subject: Re: [h-cost] One or two people in this Bruegel? Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 09:07:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would think this is one person - I don't think I've ever seen two people standing next to each other in the *exact* same clothing. The skirt and jacket are both the same, so I would go with the one larger (or I liked the possible pregnancy idea) or just maybe because of the wierd angle to see the top of the basket. Not that I really know anything about this at all, but... ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2003 10:19 PM Subject: [h-cost] One or two people in this Bruegel? > I was perusing Bruegels and started looking at this > print.http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/pieter6.html > Is the person(s) with the flat 'basket' on her head one or two people? > > It looks like only one neck, but doesn't it look like two people? > Either way, the jacket does look very loose. Perhaps it is just a heavy > set person, but the perspective seems odd. > > Whadda' ya think? > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:09:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FE9dHP025783 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:09:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEB4Uw010788 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:11:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEB4lw001412; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:11:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt27.cluster1.charter.net (remt27.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.37]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEB1lw001335 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:11:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [24.196.130.120] (HELO laptop) by remt27.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 26793935 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:10:56 -0400 Message-ID: <004d01c31aeb$bc63ce00$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <000001c31a90$d517deb0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> Subject: Re: [h-cost] how does he do that? was One or two people in this Bruegel? Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 09:10:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO OK - here's a question I've had with Brueghel's men. Their breeches all have points on them, but they aren't tied to any sort of doublet. (ex: man drinking from jug at http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/pieter6.html ) Are they tied into the shirt? If so, how? It doesn't look like the shirt is bearing the weight of the breeches as I would imagine it would have to without a fitted waist. Any thoughts? ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:13:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEDlHP025791 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:13:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEFHUw011300 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:15:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEFGlw003979; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:15:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEFDlw003867 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:15:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-156.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.156]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id F01C119FBC2 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:15:06 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC3A178.2050804@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 16:17:28 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I was working on a new partlet and I realised that the material costs are going to be a bit high :-( . I am trieing to recreate the partlet of Elisabeth of Austria. Here you can find a picture of her. http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlet.html There are smal jewels with a black stone on the partlet and pearls. I was thinking of using 1 cm buttons for the jewels but I need aboud 250 of them. Does anyone knows a site were I can get cheep buttons wich look like the ones on the partlet? I tried www.cheeptrims.com but they don't have buttons I like. The buttons can be from plastik since the Fake pearls are also from plastik Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:19:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEJWHP025810 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:19:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEL2Uw011905 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:21:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEL1lw007794; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:21:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.siscom.net (mail2.siscom.net [209.251.18.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FEKvlw007740 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:20:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 6463 invoked by uid 1005); 15 May 2003 14:20:51 -0000 Received: from drea@nospam by uid 0 with qmail-scanner-1.14 (f-prot: 3.12. Clear:. Processed in 0.28893 secs); 15 May 2003 14:20:51 -0000 X-Qmail-Scanner-Mail-From: drea@nospam X-Qmail-Scanner: 1.14 (Clear:. Processed in 0.28893 secs) Received: from shell.siscom.net (209.251.2.80) by mail.siscom.net with SMTP; 15 May 2003 14:20:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:20:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Drea Leed To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] how does he do that? was One or two people in this Bruegel? In-Reply-To: <004d01c31aeb$bc63ce00$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> Message-ID: <20030515101817.R51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The breeches would be fastened to the doublet/jerkin that the man is wearing. If you look reeeeally close, you can see the lacing holes along the bottom. He untied his points so he could bend over and get more mobility, something which is a common sight in scenes of manual labor, fighting or other active occupations in the 15th & 16th centuries. Drea On Thu, 15 May 2003 lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: > OK - here's a question I've had with Brueghel's men. Their breeches all have > points on them, but they aren't tied to any sort of doublet. (ex: man > drinking from jug at http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/pieter6.html ) Are > they tied into the shirt? If so, how? It doesn't look like the shirt is > bearing the weight of the breeches as I would imagine it would have to > without a fitted waist. Any thoughts? > > ********************** > Rebecca Schmitt > aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot > BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence > > A room without books is like a body without a soul > ---Cicero > > lotsofteapots@charter.net > ********************** > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:29:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FETtHP025847 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:29:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEVCUw012949 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:31:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEVBlw014001; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:31:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEV8lw013971 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:31:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be58.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.88]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id F068A5EE146 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:31:06 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002401c31aee$cbb0dc10$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030515090943.T51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 16:32:21 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. I went to V&A last month, and nearly all the costumes was taken down. Only a few of them was exhibitted at the British History Exhibition, where you could se both furniture and textiles and the like + a few costumes. I was very dissapointed, and missed all the costumes. Dont know what they are going to do with them, perhaps they need to be cleaned. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Drea Leed" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 3:11 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip > I definitely recommend scheduling at least two days for the V&A Museum. > They have a very nice costume section, as well as a large textile study > room on one of the upper stories, with over a thousand pieces > of embroidery and fabrics from medieval times to the 20th century. > > Have fun! > > Drea > > On Wed, 14 May 2003, David wrote: > > > Since I never thought I'd actually ever wind up going to England, I never > > paid too much attention to which museums and the like people said > > interesting pieces were in. Now, as kind of a reward for getting through my > > lung cancer treatment, my parents are going to send me there, probably for > > most of August. I'll most likely spend the bulk of my time in London, but > > can go anywhere I want, if there's something worth going there for. > > > > Overall, I'm an all-things-fiber addict, with a strong bias towards anything > > over a thousand years old, and an unexpected weakness for Edwardian gowns. > > I'm the sort who would happily spend several hours in front of the same > > case, trying to trace thread paths, and making notes (heaven help me!). So, > > where would you recommend I go, and what should I see? And do you have any > > great advice as to where I should stay while I'm seeing it? > > > > Thank you for whatever help you can provide. This is a once-in-a-lifetime > > kind of thing for me, and I'd really like to do it well. > > > > Pam Dotson > > Everett, WA USA > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:31:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEVHHP025856 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:31:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEWkUw013138 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:32:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEWjlw014864; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:32:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc51.attbi.com (rwcrmhc51.attbi.com [204.127.198.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEWhlw014811 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:32:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fenris.net (12-246-237-231.client.attbi.com[12.246.237.231]) by attbi.com (rwcrmhc51) with SMTP id <20030515143237051007tv8be>; Thu, 15 May 2003 14:32:37 +0000 Message-ID: <3EC3A505.9030203@fenris.net> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 07:32:37 -0700 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] perugia towels? References: <20030515095403.A51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> In-Reply-To: <20030515095403.A51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is a long shot, as the towels don't actually appear on their web site, but when I order fabrics from www.fabrics-store.com I get a nice linen towel as a thank you gift. I, of course, can't find any of them right now, but IIRC they are white towels w/ woven designs in another color at each end. The ones I've gotten have been white w/ yellow or pink. Maybe worth a try. liz young >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: Drea Leed >> >> >>>I'm currently looking for reproduction "perugian towels", those white >>>linen cloths bordered with designs in blue that show up in italian & >>>german paintings of the 16th century. >>> >>>I've scoured the web, to no avail; does anyone know of a place that sells >>>them? >>> >>> _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:31:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEVxHP025860 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:31:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEXOUw013224 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:33:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEXOlw015230; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:33:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.kc.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEXKlw015202 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:33:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from karen ([24.31.233.125]) by mail5.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Thu, 15 May 2003 09:32:00 -0500 From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my sewingmachine!") Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 09:33:22 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <20030514133739.43589.qmail@web20704.mail.yahoo.com> Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Eww...I can't stand the Necchi that I have. It's never worked right from day one. Waste of money, it was. Talia > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of liz haines > Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2003 8:38 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: Sewing machine blues (was "Waa! I broke my > sewingmachine!") > My mom has a necchi circa 1976 that sews circles > around most other machines iI have ever come across, though I am > partial to my husky. Good luck with your machine > liz _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 10:39:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEd4HP025883 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:39:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEeVUw013863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 08:40:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEeUlw019442; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:40:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FEeQlw019393 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:40:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be58.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.88]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id CB8A55EE183 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:40:25 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003001c31af0$1ae47980$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000f01c31a32$714685c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3EC38D63.C08CC53E@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] update with pannier, embroidery and stays. Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 16:41:43 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Sue. My lady is quite big more than 100cm. waist, so i had to make the scaling of the pannier larger. But i kept the same width of the panier, because i didnt want to make her pannier as wide as i usually have done. But i was not pleased with the angle of the top bones. I had altered the angle, but then i realised, it was not as wide at the hips, as i wanted. Therefore i made those extended hoops wich gives the beautifull curve i want. I have sewed them in place by hand, and it works quite fine. It is really fun to make different panniers sometimes. The world was full of ladies with panniers, and only a few exists today. I am sure they had all kinds of shapes and kinds. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 2:51 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] update with pannier, embroidery and stays. > Wonderful looking stuff, as always, Bjarne! > A question about the panniers--since this lady is of a larger size, did > you have to fuss with the scale of the panniers? (i.e., make them bigger > around the bottom than you would for someone Nicole-sized, in order to > keep the same "look", the same degree of > large-skirt-contrasted-with-the-waist?) Or did the circumference stay > more or less the same? > --sue > > Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > > > Hi > > The progress is going on. I have updated the embroidery with miniature > > ribbon embroidery for the bodice: > > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary.html > > And the underpinnings is almost finished two: > > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/dressdiary-underpinnings.htm > > It is very nice to sit and make this ribbon. It is only 1 inch wide, and i > > dont use the frame for this embroidery. > > So i can sit comfortable in my sofa to do it. > > The pannier went well. It is not finished entirely yeat, but i must confess > > that i have made a lot the last 3 days. > > > > Many greetings > > > > Bjarne > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 11:13:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFDlHP025988 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:13:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFDEUw017667 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 09:13:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFDCNc019379; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:13:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt25.cluster1.charter.net (remt25.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFD9Nc019290 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:13:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [24.196.130.120] (HELO laptop) by remt25.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 28858282 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:13:03 -0400 Message-ID: <006401c31af4$69df7360$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030515101817.R51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] how does he do that? was One or two people in this Bruegel? Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:12:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Would dancing be included in "active occupations"? There is one picture in particular (the wedding dance?) where there are a lot of examples of points seemingly tying to nothing. ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** > The breeches would be fastened to the doublet/jerkin that the man is > wearing. If you look reeeeally close, you can see the lacing holes along > the bottom. He untied his points so he could bend over and get more > mobility, something which is a common sight in scenes of manual labor, > fighting or other active occupations in the 15th & 16th centuries. > > Drea > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 11:42:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFg6HP026102 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:42:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFhWUw020981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 09:43:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFhVNc010065; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:43:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f74.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFhRNc009996 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:43:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:43:22 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.226 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 15 May 2003 15:43:22 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.226] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 15:43:22 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 May 2003 15:43:22.0606 (UTC) FILETIME=[B74E00E0:01C31AF8] Subject: [h-cost] Necchi Industrial Sewing Machine & Old Sewing Machines X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I just did a search on the Internet for Necchi and came up with this link: http://www.allynint.com/ It looks like you can contact them for parts and to find a local repair facility. Wow! An industrial machine for the price of a new motor could turn out to be a FANTASTIC deal!!!!! They do not run cheap. Very cool. I wanted to tell a little story... I have a Viking/Husquvarna 1640 that I think was made in the early 80s. I kind of "inherited" the machine. I had been sewing on it with out getting a tune up for a couple of years and all of a sudden it just stopped going in reverse. I couldn't figure it out. But I decided that I really did need that feature, so I looked online at the Viking site and found an authorized repair shop in my neighborhood. So I took my little guy in and they looked it over and gave me an estimate of $230.00 to fix. I balked at that and said no thanks. My machine is so old, I'll just spend the money and get a more modern machine. Ha, ha, ha... It turned out that anything that was half as good as my old machine cost upward of $1000. So... I learned alot about what new features there are out on the market and also that I really want a machine that does embroidery (I've consented to the fact that I will probably never be able to embroider anything worth keeping) but I forked out the cash and got my old workhorse back. I just took it to a different shop last Saturday for a tune up (I've decided to keep up on this sort of thing - sort of proactively). It was a bit less pricey then the first shop, but my babys back and sewing as good as new! I'm a believer in the old mechanical machines! I think that because sewing machines and supplies are generally catered to the craft market, it's harder to find a good, strong machine at a paupers price range. But then, that's technology for you... :) jessica _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 11:51:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFpDHP026152 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:51:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFprUw021988 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 09:51:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFpqNc015438; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:51:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net (turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.126]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FFpnNc015413 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:51:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19GL1I-0002q6-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 08:51:49 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 08:51:48 -0700 Message-ID: <001301c31af9$e55c82d0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <004d01c31aeb$bc63ce00$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> Importance: Normal Subject: [h-cost] Speaking of Breeches-was: how does he do that? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have always thought that the breeches looked so weird because they were slung so low. But then I realized that men even now wear their pants on their 'hips' more than their real waist; especially those with love handles or pot bellies. For me it would drive me nuts-I would always feel like they were falling off; akin to those dresses with shoulders always falling down. Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:12:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGCZHP026281 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:12:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGCrUw024385 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:12:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGCqdS029555; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:12:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FGCndS029421 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:12:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWnJZdYkHfBDHDMywN9kV23o35N0jfZIzEg==">; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:12:11 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HX8YJWDR; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:12:11 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 11:46:24 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet Message-ID: <20030515.121047.-525269.2.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-3 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Are you sure those are solid black. They look like gold with a black square center to me. That might be easier to find or adapt. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:27:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGRCHP026355 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:27:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGSRUw026035 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:28:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGSQdS011479; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:28:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGSLdS011438 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:28:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be58.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.88]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 782EC5EE1D5 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 18:28:20 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000b01c31aff$2f9b5ec0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001301c31af9$e55c82d0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Speaking of Breeches-was: how does he do that? Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 18:29:40 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Saragrace. I hate low cut trousers! I am quite hysterrical with it. I want my pants on the waist, so i always wear a belt to my breeches. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 5:51 PM Subject: [h-cost] Speaking of Breeches-was: how does he do that? > I have always thought that the breeches looked so weird because they > were slung so low. But then I realized that men even now wear their > pants on their 'hips' more than their real waist; especially those with > love handles or pot bellies. > > For me it would drive me nuts-I would always feel like they were falling > off; akin to those dresses with shoulders always falling down. > > Sg > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:29:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGTdHP026362 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:29:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGUcUw026323 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:30:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGUcdS013060; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:30:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FGUYdS013007 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:30:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 29184 invoked from network); 15 May 2003 16:30:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail1.inreach.com) (209.142.2.50) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 15 May 2003 16:30:33 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Thu, 15 May 2003 09:30:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <33178.162.119.64.111.1053016233.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 09:30:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip From: To: In-Reply-To: <01f501c31a36$c9ee4e20$5b0ebbd0@bently> References: <20030513195620.93283.qmail@web20809.mail.yahoo.com> <3EC1553E.2F68AB05@earthlink.net> <01f501c31a36$c9ee4e20$5b0ebbd0@bently> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Overall, I'm an all-things-fiber addict, with a strong bias towards > anything over a thousand years old, and an unexpected weakness for > Edwardian gowns. I'm the sort who would happily spend several hours in > front of the same case, trying to trace thread paths, and making notes > (heaven help me!). So, where would you recommend I go, and what should > I see? And do you have any great advice as to where I should stay while > I'm seeing it? > If/when you go to the V & A, plan to spend a half a day in their textile room. Lots of woven fabrics (a few over 1000 years old) and lots of embroidery from at least the 1500's on forward. LOTS of great stuff. Also, I am surprised that nobody mentioned the Costume Museum at Bath. They have a website so that you can get an idea of what they have. Lots of cool stuff. And I think that you can write to see the costumes up-close (Iike you can for the V & A). Give it a shot, anyway. Have fun! Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:30:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGUXHP026371 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:30:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGVrUw026502 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:31:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGVqdS013896; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:31:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (IDENT:root@mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGVodS013865 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:31:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail23.ureach.com (mailout.ureach.com [172.16.2.83]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00735 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:31:50 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-19-44-102.asm.bellsouth.net [68.19.44.102]) by mail23.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id MAA09112 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:31:49 -0400 Message-ID: <076f01c31aff$0add8c20$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EC3A178.2050804@kabelfoon.nl> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 11:04:53 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Are you going to do a dress diary on this project? I hope you are!! I really want to make the Isabel de Valois dress but the partlet construction is somewhat of a mystery to me. Teena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deredere Galbraith" To: "H-Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 10:17 AM Subject: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet > Hi, > > I was working on a new partlet and I realised that the material costs > are going to be a bit high :-( . > I am trieing to recreate the partlet of Elisabeth of Austria. > Here you can find a picture of her. > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlet.html > > There are smal jewels with a black stone on the partlet and pearls. > I was thinking of using 1 cm buttons for the jewels but I need aboud 250 > of them. > Does anyone knows a site were I can get cheep buttons wich look like the > ones on the partlet? > I tried www.cheeptrims.com but they don't have buttons I like. > The buttons can be from plastik since the Fake pearls are also from plastik > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:31:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGV5HP026375 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:31:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGWRUw026556 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:32:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGWRdS014328; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:32:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGWOdS014254 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:32:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp01-204.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.120.204]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB96819FC45 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 18:32:17 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC3C19D.4020202@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 18:34:37 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet References: <20030515.121047.-525269.2.catpurson@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO They are indeed gold an black. I know that there are buttons that look like those on the partlet But I can't find them anymore. catpurson@juno.com wrote: > Are you sure those are solid black. They look like gold with a >black square center to me. That might be easier to find or adapt. > >Lalah >Never give up, Never surrender >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:36:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGaGHP026383 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:36:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGbWUw027094 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:37:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGbVdS017683; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:37:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGbRdS017604 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:37:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ConstanceFairfax@cs.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.10.30355c36 (16110) for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:37:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cs.com (mow-d16.webmail.aol.com [205.188.139.132]) by air-id12.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id MAILINID122-3eee3ec3c2322aa; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:37:06 -0400 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 12:37:06 -0400 From: ConstanceFairfax@cs.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) Subject: Re: [h-cost] how does he do that? was One or two people in thisBruegel? MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <13D2FF13.0F4D1701.349D0FDF@cs.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The vest that the man is wearing should have point holes in it...check out http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/bruegel163.html http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/bruegel117.html As you'll see, it's the period equivalent of plumber's pants and/or loosening your belt when you've eaten too much... especially check out http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/bruegel123.html - he's got his shirt untucked, and you can see his points hanging and the point holes in the doublet... I've been making these trousers by hand and it's SOOO satisfying. The only problem I've been having is keeping everything where it's supposed to be during the fitting (not going there)! I love Bruegel. :) Constance wrote: >OK - here's a question I've had with Brueghel's men. Their breeches all have >points on them, but they aren't tied to any sort of doublet. (ex: man >drinking from jug at http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/pieter6.html ) Are >they tied into the shirt? If so, how? It doesn't look like the shirt is >bearing the weight of the breeches as I would imagine it would have to >without a fitted waist. Any thoughts? > >********************** >Rebecca Schmitt _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:36:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGadHP026386 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:36:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGbtUw027151 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:37:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGbtdS017998; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:37:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (IDENT:root@mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGbfdS017800 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:37:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail22.ureach.com (mail22.ureach.com [172.16.2.82]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA02510 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:37:41 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-19-44-102.asm.bellsouth.net [68.19.44.102]) by mail22.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id MAA05653 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:37:41 -0400 Message-ID: <078601c31aff$dc332d70$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 12:34:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I forgot to put the link in for anyone unfamiliar with the dress I mentioned. http://mywebpage.netscape.com/Beteena/isabel+de+valois.jpg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 11:04 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet > Are you going to do a dress diary on this project? I hope you are!! I really > want to make the Isabel de Valois dress but the partlet construction is > somewhat of a mystery to me. > > Teena > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Deredere Galbraith" > To: "H-Costume" > Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 10:17 AM > Subject: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet > > > > Hi, > > > > I was working on a new partlet and I realised that the material costs > > are going to be a bit high :-( . > > I am trieing to recreate the partlet of Elisabeth of Austria. > > Here you can find a picture of her. > > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlet.html > > > > There are smal jewels with a black stone on the partlet and pearls. > > I was thinking of using 1 cm buttons for the jewels but I need aboud 250 > > of them. > > Does anyone knows a site were I can get cheep buttons wich look like the > > ones on the partlet? > > I tried www.cheeptrims.com but they don't have buttons I like. > > The buttons can be from plastik since the Fake pearls are also from > plastik > > > > Greetings, > > Deredere > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:40:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGdxHP026395 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:40:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGfBUw027569 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGfAdS020558; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r08.mx.aol.com (imo-r08.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.104]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGf1dS020329 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ConstanceFairfax@cs.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.126.2986cb4c (15888) for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:40:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cs.com (mow-d14.webmail.aol.com [205.188.139.130]) by air-id08.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id MAILINID83-3e103ec3c312312; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:40:50 -0400 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 12:40:50 -0400 From: ConstanceFairfax@cs.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <1B77CEC3.7951A4F1.349D0FDF@cs.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Weren't diamonds often painted as black stones? Could these be diamonds? Constance Deredere Galbraith wrote: >They are indeed gold an black. >I know that there are buttons that look like those on the partlet But I >can't find them anymore. > >catpurson@juno.com wrote: > >>        Are you sure those are solid black.  They look like gold with a >>black square center to me.  That might be easier to find or adapt. >> >>Lalah >>Never give up, Never surrender >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >>   >> > > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:42:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGgRHP026403 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:42:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGfcUw027637 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGfadS020884; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGf7dS020426 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:41:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp01-204.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.120.204]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 944791A0141 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 18:41:00 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC3C3A9.1040905@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 18:43:21 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet References: <3EC3A178.2050804@kabelfoon.nl> <076f01c31aff$0add8c20$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yes I will do that! And hopefully also from such a dress! Beteena Paradise wrote: >Are you going to do a dress diary on this project? I hope you are!! I really >want to make the Isabel de Valois dress but the partlet construction is >somewhat of a mystery to me. > >Teena > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Deredere Galbraith" >To: "H-Costume" >Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 10:17 AM >Subject: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet > > > > >>Hi, >> >>I was working on a new partlet and I realised that the material costs >>are going to be a bit high :-( . >>I am trieing to recreate the partlet of Elisabeth of Austria. >>Here you can find a picture of her. >>http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlet.html >> >>There are smal jewels with a black stone on the partlet and pearls. >>I was thinking of using 1 cm buttons for the jewels but I need aboud 250 >>of them. >>Does anyone knows a site were I can get cheep buttons wich look like the >>ones on the partlet? >>I tried www.cheeptrims.com but they don't have buttons I like. >>The buttons can be from plastik since the Fake pearls are also from >> >> >plastik > > >>Greetings, >> Deredere >> >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:57:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGvFHP026436 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:57:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGwRUw029466 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 10:58:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGwQNW002784; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:58:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGwNNW002665 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:58:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.109] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3DA36DE00CC; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:44:10 -0400 Message-ID: <003f01c31b03$9fe5df80$6d5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030515.121047.-525269.2.catpurson@juno.com> <3EC3C19D.4020202@kabelfoon.nl> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 13:01:26 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Deredere, I have antique earrings and buttons that are 'stacked' onyx with a gold bead on top. Why couldn't you make your jewels two part in that manner? I know (think) Fire Mountain has black glass in doughnut 'flats' of small size; these could be mated with square brass spacers that would give the look of the partlet. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deredere Galbraith" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 12:34 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet > They are indeed gold an black. > I know that there are buttons that look like those on the partlet But I > can't find them anymore. > > catpurson@juno.com wrote: > > > Are you sure those are solid black. They look like gold with a > >black square center to me. That might be easier to find or adapt. > > > >Lalah > >Never give up, Never surrender > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 12:59:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FGxhHP026439 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:59:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FH13Uw029738 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 11:01:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FH13NW004665; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:01:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FH0QNW004208 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:00:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA17983 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:21:00 -0500 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 12:21:00 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip In-Reply-To: <33178.162.119.64.111.1053016233.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 15 May 2003 dch@inreach.com wrote: > Also, I am surprised that nobody mentioned the Costume Museum at Bath. It's just far enough away to be an awkward trip from London. And there's so much in London to see and do on a first trip that dealing with a train trip can make you end up resenting the time you spent in transit. Bath has other things that would make you want to spend more time, too. If you do want to try a day out, though, it's worth considering a coach (bus) tour to any of several tourist sites. The advantage of these is that they get you there and back, with food stops and tour guides, and you spend minimal effort figuring out how to manage it. On my first trip to London, I took a day-out coach tour to Kent that included Canterbury Cathedral, Leeds Castle, and a pub stop for lunch. Just right for a first-timer. There might be coach tours to Bath, but I don't know how much time you're committing for bus riding. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 13:08:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FH8XHP026534 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 13:08:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FH9UUw000756 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 11:09:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FH9SNW011247; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:09:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.siscom.net (mail2.siscom.net [209.251.18.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FH9MNW011143 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:09:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 58332 invoked by uid 1005); 15 May 2003 17:09:12 -0000 Received: from drea@nospam by uid 0 with qmail-scanner-1.14 (f-prot: 3.12. Clear:. Processed in 0.068922 secs); 15 May 2003 17:09:12 -0000 X-Qmail-Scanner-Mail-From: drea@nospam X-Qmail-Scanner: 1.14 (Clear:. Processed in 0.068922 secs) Received: from shell.siscom.net (209.251.2.80) by mail.siscom.net with SMTP; 15 May 2003 17:09:12 -0000 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 13:09:17 -0400 (EDT) From: Drea Leed To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet In-Reply-To: <3EC3A178.2050804@kabelfoon.nl> Message-ID: <20030515130802.W53417-100000@shell.siscom.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Have you tried http://www.mjtrim.com ? They have bunches and bunches of buttons of every description. If you want replica buttons and are willing to pay a bit, Von Roessler Jewels makes great gold buttons with the jewel of your choice in the middle. You can contact them at rosamund99@hotmail.com Good luck on your project, Drea On Thu, 15 May 2003, Deredere Galbraith wrote: > Hi, > > I was working on a new partlet and I realised that the material costs > are going to be a bit high :-( . > I am trieing to recreate the partlet of Elisabeth of Austria. > Here you can find a picture of her. > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlet.html > > There are smal jewels with a black stone on the partlet and pearls. > I was thinking of using 1 cm buttons for the jewels but I need aboud 250 > of them. > Does anyone knows a site were I can get cheep buttons wich look like the > ones on the partlet? > I tried www.cheeptrims.com but they don't have buttons I like. > The buttons can be from plastik since the Fake pearls are also from plastik > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 13:21:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHLmHP026575 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 13:21:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHMtUw002268 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 11:22:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHMoNW022332; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:22:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (mta5.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHMlNW022275 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:22:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([64.175.34.254]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HEX00JEBUUR9M@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:20:53 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:20:12 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: "free" industrial machine (was Re: [h-cost] Necchi Industrial Sewing Machine & Old Sewing Machines In-reply-to: X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030515101535.00e02b60@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Wow! An industrial machine for the price of a new motor could turn out to >be a FANTASTIC deal!!!!! They do not run cheap. Very cool. Funny you should mention it. I have an industrial machine I'm trying to get rid of. It was offered to me, free, so I grabbed it, but it turns out I never use it. If anyone wants it, they could have it for the cost of shipping from where it is now to wherever you are. (It was given to me free and I hauled it home, so I give it to you free and you haul it home.) I was told it was running the day before I picked it up, but it has sat in storage for about a year since then. >I wanted to tell a little story... >I have a Viking/Husquvarna 1640 that I think was made in the early 80s. I >kind of "inherited" the machine. I had been sewing on it with out getting >a tune up for a couple of years and all of a sudden it just stopped going >in reverse. I couldn't figure it out. But I decided that I really did >need that feature, so I looked online at the Viking site and found an >authorized repair shop in my neighborhood. So I took my little guy in and >they looked it over and gave me an estimate of $230.00 to fix. > >I balked at that and said no thanks. My machine is so old, I'll just >spend the money and get a more modern machine. Ha, ha, ha... It turned >out that anything that was half as good as my old machine cost upward of $1000. > >So... I learned alot about what new features there are out on the market >and also that I really want a machine that does embroidery (I've consented >to the fact that I will probably never be able to embroider anything worth >keeping) but I forked out the cash and got my old workhorse back. > >I just took it to a different shop last Saturday for a tune up (I've >decided to keep up on this sort of thing - sort of proactively). It was a >bit less pricey then the first shop, but my babys back and sewing as good >as new! > >I'm a believer in the old mechanical machines! I think that because >sewing machines and supplies are generally catered to the craft market, >it's harder to find a good, strong machine at a paupers price range. But >then, that's technology for you... > >:) jessica > >_________________________________________________________________ >MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* >http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 13:45:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHjPHP026691 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 13:45:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHkVUw005087 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 11:46:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHkTNW009976; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:46:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHkQNW009932 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:46:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEX008OWW1CKJ@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:46:25 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:33:05 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet In-reply-to: <3EC3A178.2050804@kabelfoon.nl> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515102329.02cce738@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/14/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Deredere, I love that partlet, and want to re-create it myself (and maybe the whole dress, jewels included). I had planned on making my buttons from polymer clays, as I wanted it to look right and still not cost a fortune. That would be my suggestion for you as well. The only thing I had heard about making inset jewels with poly clay is to not fire them together, as the stone would break (unless you got the good hard CZ ones) as the clay shrinks. So allow for shrinkage of the clay around the stone area before firing. And I also agree that they may be diamonds, table cut. Some of her jewels are the same color, but larger. But I am no expert on paintings, by any means. I would love to see your dress diary as it proceeds. It will be a bit before I can get to make the partlet myself, as I have a few other projects I have to do first. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 13:49:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHnHHP026731 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 13:49:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHoVUw005443 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 11:50:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHoRNW012793; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:50:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FHkQNY009932 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 11:46:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HEX008OWW1CKJ@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 10:46:26 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 10:37:22 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Indigo dyeing In-reply-to: X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515103403.02c4cd10@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/14/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:55 AM 5/15/2003 +0200, you wrote: >And on another note: how much does this stuff actually stink, anyway? I wish I could answer your other questions, but I have yet to actually work with this dye myself. I did however sit with a lady at Valhalla faire years ago who was dying with indigo, and using her hands to work the stuff. It stank, quite a bit from my recall, but it was fascinating to watch her work with it, and seeing things go blue when it touched air. Magical in a way. Sorry I couldn't be more help. Have you tried a dyers list? Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 14:24:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FIOfHP026872 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 14:24:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FIPvUw009166 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 12:25:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FIPuTa008225; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:25:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FIPpTa008145 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:25:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp01-204.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.120.204]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02235BEC48 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:25:45 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC3DC35.5030901@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 20:28:05 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515102329.02cce738@127.0.0.1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, Here you can see the start of my dress diary http://www.deredere.dds.nl/16thcent dress/16thcent dress.html > > > I love that partlet, and want to re-create it myself (and maybe the > whole dress, jewels included). I had planned on making my buttons from > polymer clays, as I wanted it to look right and still not cost a > fortune. That would be my suggestion for you as well. The only thing I > had heard about making inset jewels with poly clay is to not fire them > together, as the stone would break (unless you got the good hard CZ > ones) as the clay shrinks. So allow for shrinkage of the clay around > the stone area before firing. I thought aboud that too. But I really don't like to work with clay. I tried to make some with glas stones but I never really liked them. They still look like painted clay. > > > And I also agree that they may be diamonds, table cut. Some of her > jewels are the same color, but larger. But I am no expert on > paintings, by any means. > > I would love to see your dress diary as it proceeds. It will be a bit > before I can get to make the partlet myself, as I have a few other > projects I have to do first. > > Kimiko Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 14:52:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FIqCHP026961 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 14:52:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FIrTUw012064 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 12:53:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FIrRTa027231; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:53:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from www19.networkshosting.com (www19.networkshosting.com [66.96.128.118]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FIrOTa027141 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 12:53:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 25501 invoked from network); 15 May 2003 18:46:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO costumepress.com) (67.31.130.219) by www19.fatcow.com with SMTP; 15 May 2003 18:46:06 -0000 Message-ID: <3EC3E21B.F535B7CB@costumepress.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 12:53:18 -0600 From: Mary Denise Smith X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-NSCPCD (Macintosh; U; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume , SCA Garb List , "sca-cooks@ansteorra.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] OOP, OT, Lunar Eclipse and International Space Station tonight X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings Listers, Since our ancestors were avid sky watchers, I do hope that this posting will not be as hopelessly off topic as it may otherwise seem. May your skies be clear tonight, MD/Marged Outlands > Space Weather News for May 15, 2003 > http://spaceweather.com > > Sky watchers in the Americas, Europe, Africa and parts of Asia can see a > sunset-red lunar eclipse tonight, May 15th and 16th. Today's edition of > spaceweather.com describes a few more things that will appear in the sky > around the time of the eclipse: Iridium flares and a transit of the Moon > by the International Space Station. > > IRIDIUM FLARES: Sky watchers in the western and central United States are > favored to see some pleasing Iridium flares during tonight's lunar > eclipse. "Some cities that will have decent flares are Phoenix, Salt Lake > City, El Paso, Minneapolis, Omaha and Missoula," says space scientist Rob > Matson of SAIC, who also forecasts Iridium flares for the International > Space Station. Most of tonight's flares will appear higher in the sky than > the moon. "With a wide field of view camera, however, it may be possible > to capture a flare and the moon in the same field of view," notes Matson. > > SPACE STATION TRANSIT: This is for advanced observers. Along a narrow path > stretching from Dallas through St. Louis to Chicago, sky watchers can see > the International Space Station pass in front of the eclipsed moon > tonight. Like the moon itself, the ISS will be inside Earth's shadow, so > it will be dark--a ghostly silhouette racing across the dimly-lit lunar > terrain in less than a second. You have to be at the right place at the > right time to see it. Forecaster Thomas Fly has prepared maps and > timetables for the central United States and other places where these > transits may be visible. > > Visit for more information.. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 16:20:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FKKkHP027395 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:20:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FKLtUw022062 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 14:21:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FKLqgE003257; Thu, 15 May 2003 14:21:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FKJ5gE000893 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 14:19:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h4FKJ5P4025449; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:19:05 -0400 Message-Id: <200305152019.h4FKJ5P4025449@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 20:15:50 -0000 To: h-costume@indra.com, HistoricKnit@yahoogroups.com From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 Subject: [h-cost] Re: Advice wanted for an England trip X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO HistoricKnit@yahoogroups.com Hi Pam, First, adjust your calling plan for cheaper calls to England or get a phone card. You'll be calling frequently to make arrangements, and also you may want a phone card to call home once you're there. Here's a good source: http://www.1st4phonecards.com/ They send the access numbers via e-mail - I print them out and make my own "card". :-) A coach can be much cheaper to get around than the train. I found that one route costs 88 pounds on the train, and 18 pounds on the coach! The trip takes a bit longer, and if you're there for a month you may have more time than cash to spare. http://www.nationalexpress.com/neh.cfm I spent a month in Nottingham a couple years ago, and for that amount of time it was nice to do ordinary things rather than run around sightseeing all the time. The costume museum in Nottingham is nice, and curator Jeremy Farrell is delightful. There is also a lace museum which operates some 19thC lace machinery for demonstrations. I can also give you the name of a great massage therapist in Nottingham if you like. There is a costume museum in Manchester, too, though I haven’t been there yet. Since you posted on Historic Knit, you should know that the museum of the city of London has some Tudor knit goods in the collection. They weren;t on display when I was there, but I had an appointment to look at stockings and was able to see them even though they were earlier than my period of concentration. Bath is lovely. Besides the costume museum, it's full of Jane Austen things and Roman ruins. One Roman site is in the basement of a pub, and you pay a pound at the bar to get in. If you do make appointments to view things in the back room, it's easier if you have something specific you want to see. They can't pull out everything! Also keep in mind that staff is often limited for appointments (and moreso as the economy gets tighter) so you may only get a couple of hours of their time. I often bring along a US published book as a gift for the staff, or baked goods although other researchers say it makes them look bad. :- ) Since you mentioned things over 1,000 years old, don't miss the Temple of Mithras in London. It's right out there near the sidewalk, in front of a bank, about two blocks from the Thames near Temple street. It was discovered when they were digging the foundation for the bank building, so they brought it up to street level and reassembled it. It's so cool to have something like that right out in the middle of everything! My favotrite store is Lush, which sells handmade soaps, bubbl;e baths, and other such lovely smelly things. There are locations all over London, as well as many other cities. You can smell them a block away! http://www.lush.com/ Besides fish & chips, there are many Indian and Pakistani restaurants. Have a proper English curry! Enjoy! -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 17:15:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FLF8HP027546 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:15:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FLGRUw029027 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 15:16:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FLGLwU015232; Thu, 15 May 2003 15:16:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FLGGwU015051 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 15:16:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-064.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.64]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4B1919FFEE for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:16:06 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC40423.2040207@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 23:18:27 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515102329.02cce738@127.0.0.1> <3EC3DC35.5030901@kabelfoon.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oops! http://www.deredere.dds.nl/16thcent_dress/16thcent_dress.html This wil work better. Deredere Galbraith wrote: > Hi, > > Here you can see the start of my dress diary > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/16thcent_dress/16thcent_dress.html > > >> >> >> I love that partlet, and want to re-create it myself (and maybe the >> whole dress, jewels included). I had planned on making my buttons >> from polymer clays, as I wanted it to look right and still not cost a >> fortune. That would be my suggestion for you as well. The only thing >> I had heard about making inset jewels with poly clay is to not fire >> them together, as the stone would break (unless you got the good hard >> CZ ones) as the clay shrinks. So allow for shrinkage of the clay >> around the stone area before firing. > > > I thought aboud that too. But I really don't like to work with clay. I > tried to make some with glas stones but I never really liked them. > They still look like painted clay. > >> >> >> And I also agree that they may be diamonds, table cut. Some of her >> jewels are the same color, but larger. But I am no expert on >> paintings, by any means. >> >> I would love to see your dress diary as it proceeds. It will be a bit >> before I can get to make the partlet myself, as I have a few other >> projects I have to do first. >> >> Kimiko > > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 17:15:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FLFkHP027551 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:15:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FLH8Uw029163 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 15:17:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FLH7wU015855; Thu, 15 May 2003 15:17:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4FLH0wU015774 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 15:17:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 11411 invoked from network); 15 May 2003 21:17:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail2.inreach.com) (209.142.2.51) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 15 May 2003 21:17:00 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Thu, 15 May 2003 14:17:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <24567.162.119.64.111.1053033420.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 14:17:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Advice wanted for an England trip From: To: In-Reply-To: <200305152019.h4FKJ5P4025449@jefferson.patriot.net> References: <200305152019.h4FKJ5P4025449@jefferson.patriot.net> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I almost forgot to talk about the cash machines!! If you have a 4-digit PIN number, you can use the ATM's there just like here!! You will get the prevailing exchange rate and you don't have to pay to change your money! The only downside to this is that you can't keep strict control of how much you are reducing your bank account. You likely won't get an account balance and you never know just how much you are taking out because the rates change daily. But it is much more convenient than carrying traveler's checks. Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 19:19:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNJIHP027963 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:19:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FMDfUw006180 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 16:13:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FMDeI4027736; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:13:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta03bw.bigpond.com (mta03bw.bigpond.com [139.134.6.86]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FMDYI4027455 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:13:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bigpond.com ([144.135.24.69]) by mta03bw.bigpond.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15 mta03bw Jul 16 2002 22:47:55) with SMTP id HEY8EF00.GDM for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 08:13:27 +1000 Received: from cvpp-p-144-138-156-186.prem.tmns.net.au ([144.138.156.186]) by bwmam01.bigpond.com(MAM V3.3.2 2/1338890); 16 May 2003 08:13:27 Message-ID: <3EC500C7.945F4392@bigpond.com> Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 08:16:23 -0700 From: Claire Clarke Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "h-costume@indra.com" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Buying fabric online X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all, just wondering if any other of the Australian (or other Antipodean) list-members have any experience with buying fabric online? Just wondering if the postage/import duties/whatever is more trouble than the cheaper prices and greater variety overseas. Do any of you know any good mail order sources that are closer than the US? Claire _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 19:25:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNPfHP027993 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:25:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNPlUw013195 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 17:25:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNPjp7017590; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:25:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow058o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.98]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNPfp7017556 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:25:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Imedia5043 ([80.194.94.100]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Fri, 16 May 2003 00:25:40 +0100 Message-ID: <00d701c31b39$48774e10$0401a8c0@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200305152019.h4FKJ5P4025449@jefferson.patriot.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Advice wanted for an England trip Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 00:25:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If planning to go to Nottingham please check first. They are in the process of reorganising the museums etc there and the Costume/lace museum was one of the places which was going to be closed down with items only viewable in storage by appointment. There has been a lot of controversy about this but not sure of the final outcome. Dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of Historical reproduction Clothing, Uniforms and Bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 ----- Original Message ----- > > I spent a month in Nottingham a couple years ago, and for that amount of > time it was nice to do ordinary things rather than run around sightseeing all > the time. The costume museum in Nottingham is nice, and curator Jeremy Farrell > is delightful. There is also a lace museum which operates some 19thC lace > machinery for demonstrations. I can also give you the name of a great massage > therapist in Nottingham if you like. There is a costume museum in Manchester, > too, though I haven't been there yet. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 19:35:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNZKHP028016 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:35:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNZRUw014053 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 17:35:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNZQp7023540; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:35:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNZOp7023508 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:35:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.7) with ESMTP id h4FNZNHL021248 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:35:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [136.152.197.39] (tnt-1-103.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.197.39]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNYlC7019961; Thu, 15 May 2003 16:35:20 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 11:59:08 -0700 To: Historical Costume , 19cWoman@yahoogroups.com From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Idea? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 12:09 AM -0700 5/15/03, Jennifer Sena wrote: >A friend and I were discussing the fabrics and patterns for an >edwardian outfit I want to wear to a vintage carshow this summer. >We both mentioned always wanting to have these gowns, but not having >anywhere/why to wear them. I told her I'd happily wear mine out to >lunch if there were two friends to go play with me. > >Are there any people in the western Portland OR area who might be >interested in dressing for "tea" and getting together for lunch once >a month just for fun? Too ambitious? What about just a lunch date >this summer sometime to see how it goes? I live an hour west of >downtown but there must be a couple of places with some vintage >ambiance that wouldn't mind a tea party once in a while. I'm nowhere near the area, but I just wanted to say I think it's a delightful idea and people should do this sort of thing more often! Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 20:04:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G04rHP028124 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:04:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G069Uw016834 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 18:06:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G068Zr011541; Thu, 15 May 2003 18:06:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G066Zr011452 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 18:06:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.183.1b09b4e9 (4459) for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:05:50 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <183.1b09b4e9.2bf5855e@aol.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 20:05:50 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Since no one seems to post over on the sci-fi/fantasy list, I figured I'd ask for help over here. I've a lovely idea for a costume, but it involves wings that are "skeletal" in nature: made of branches and draped with sheer fabric (think that Elven King painting from one of the more well-known Faerie artists). With something of this proposed weight, it seems unlikely that I could use the age-old idea of tying them to my back with 3" wide elastic around the arms, or something around the waist. Any ideas? "Night Hunt" at CC21 had some sort of tubular thing on one of the participant's backs, though I don't quite know how I'd attach *that*, either! Christine Who just keeps coming up with more costume ideas...oh dear. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 20:16:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G0GhHP028210 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:16:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNI1Uw012419 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 17:18:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNHwp7012602; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:17:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow058o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.98]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4FNHsp7012564 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 17:17:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Imedia5043 ([80.194.94.100]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Fri, 16 May 2003 00:17:53 +0100 Message-ID: <007401c31b38$325f97f0$0401a8c0@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030513195620.93283.qmail@web20809.mail.yahoo.com> <3EC1553E.2F68AB05@earthlink.net> <01f501c31a36$c9ee4e20$5b0ebbd0@bently> <33178.162.119.64.111.1053016233.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 00:17:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You could also visit Platt Hall in Manchester which is the other costume museum over here and then take a trip over the Pennines to the Royal Armouries in Leeds and Lotherton Hall Dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of Historical reproduction Clothing, Uniforms and Bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 > > Overall, I'm an all-things-fiber addict, with a strong bias towards > > anything over a thousand years old, and an unexpected weakness for > > Edwardian gowns. I'm the sort who would happily spend several hours in > > front of the same case, trying to trace thread paths, and making notes > > (heaven help me!). So, where would you recommend I go, and what should > > I see? And do you have any great advice as to where I should stay while > > I'm seeing it? > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 21:04:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G14YHP028360 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 21:04:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G15gUw022258 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 19:05:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G15eh2018479; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:05:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp2.pacifier.net (smtp2.pacifier.net [64.255.237.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G15bh2018454 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:05:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from KatHouse (ip193.13-173-207.eli-du.nwlink.com [207.173.13.193]) by smtp2.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD79D6A766 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 18:05:35 -0700 (PDT) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 18:05:20 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Advice wanted for an England trip Message-ID: <3EC3D6E0.26806.454EDB@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <24567.162.119.64.111.1053033420.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> References: <200305152019.h4FKJ5P4025449@jefferson.patriot.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I almost forgot to talk about the cash machines!! > > If you have a 4-digit PIN number, you can use the ATM's there just > like here!! You will get the prevailing exchange rate and you don't > have to pay to change your money! > > The only downside to this is that you can't keep strict control of how > much you are reducing your bank account. You likely won't get an > account balance and you never know just how much you are taking out > because the rates change daily. But it is much more convenient than > carrying traveler's checks. One more word of caution on that which I found when I used my ATM: most of them have charges for doing the banking and it was significantly higher than I've seen here in the US. (Most of the time it's free for us, but occasionally we'll get a 50 cent charge. The $5 charge on one of my ATM usages was a bit of a surprise. But it was a lot more convenient than traveler's checks so I wrote it off to "convenience cost.") Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 22:12:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2CSHP028539 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:12:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2DnUw027317 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 20:13:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2Dlj5024310; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:13:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay02.roc.ny.frontiernet.net (relay02.roc.ny.frontiernet.net [66.133.131.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2Dhj5024268 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:13:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 25908 invoked from network); 16 May 2003 02:13:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO livingroom) ([209.63.51.162]) (envelope-sender ) by relay02.roc.ny.frontiernet.net (FrontierMTA 2.3.5) with SMTP for ; 16 May 2003 02:13:42 -0000 Message-ID: <005801c31b50$c6a631e0$01fea8c0@livingroom> From: "Lyn Greaves- home" To: "Historical Costume" References: <183.1b09b4e9.2bf5855e@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:13:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Perhaps a nude leotard with a structure sewing into the back? I'm thinking metal tubing like a backpack support structure. Lyn Greaves Lady Rosamund d'Alwareton COM, COTerpsichore, COSalamander ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 8:05 PM Subject: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical > Since no one seems to post over on the sci-fi/fantasy list, I figured I'd ask > for help over here. I've a lovely idea for a costume, but it involves wings > that are "skeletal" in nature: made of branches and draped with sheer fabric > (think that Elven King painting from one of the more well-known Faerie > artists). With something of this proposed weight, it seems unlikely that I > could use the age-old idea of tying them to my back with 3" wide elastic > around the arms, or something around the waist. Any ideas? "Night Hunt" at > CC21 had some sort of tubular thing on one of the participant's backs, though > I don't quite know how I'd attach *that*, either! > > Christine > Who just keeps coming up with more costume ideas...oh dear. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 22:16:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2G9HP028549 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:16:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2HWUw027517 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 20:17:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2HWj5025965; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:17:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2HTj5025932 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:17:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 343D67AE81 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:16:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 75145-01 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:16:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-202-187-21.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.202.187.21]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FB257ACD9 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:16:46 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 19:17:17 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <183.1b09b4e9.2bf5855e@aol.com> Message-Id: <842DB1B0-8744-11D7-ABC4-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO a friend of mine did something similar, and built himself a matching 'corset' that was really a brace for the wings. it worked great, but of course it was quite visible. not sure if that would go with your costume or not. On Thursday, May 15, 2003, at 05:05 PM, IceGirlNIN@aol.com wrote: > Since no one seems to post over on the sci-fi/fantasy list, I figured > I'd ask > for help over here. I've a lovely idea for a costume, but it involves > wings > that are "skeletal" in nature: made of branches and draped with sheer > fabric > (think that Elven King painting from one of the more well-known Faerie > artists). With something of this proposed weight, it seems unlikely > that I > could use the age-old idea of tying them to my back with 3" wide > elastic > around the arms, or something around the waist. Any ideas? "Night > Hunt" at > CC21 had some sort of tubular thing on one of the participant's backs, > though > I don't quite know how I'd attach *that*, either! > > Christine > Who just keeps coming up with more costume ideas...oh dear. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 22:19:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2J8HP028584 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:19:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2KUUw027796 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 20:20:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2KTj5027471; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:20:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2KQj5027450 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:20:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 02-022.142.popsite.net ([66.248.121.22] helo=DDQ4NY11) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19GUpd-0005HP-00 for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:20:26 -0700 From: "Andrea Cesari" To: Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 19:20:25 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Subject: [h-cost] re: Perugia towels X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you care to do the embroidery, you could make reasonable facsimiles of Perugia towels. The originals were probably woven in a diaper (diamond) pattern linen. This may be a little hard to come by unless you have a friendly neighborhood handweaver (I have woven yards of the stuff in my time) But you could use a plain weave linen and then do pattern darning in silk floss. Designs from Le Pompe or Sibmacher would be fine, I think. I think you'll be happier if you buy fabric and hem your towels yourself. This will give you the length you need (and these towels can be very long, more like runners) and you can do some nice hemstitching on the ends. Good luck! Andrea Everyone, > > I'm currently looking for reproduction "perugian towels", those white > linen cloths bordered with designs in blue that show up in italian & > german paintings of the 16th century. > > I've scoured the web, to no avail; does anyone know of a place that sells > them? > > Thanks, > > Drea _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 22:24:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2OmHP028598 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:24:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2QBUw028230 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 20:26:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2QAj5000480; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:26:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2Q6j5000370 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:26:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.150.1f430216 (4459) for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:25:55 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <150.1f430216.2bf5a632@aol.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:25:54 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's a bell-sleeved A-line dress in an ombre design: dark blue at the top, fading to near-white. Maybe if I make (bound!) holes in the back of the dress, and a corset structure that the wings attach to that goes beneath the dress, but the wings attach when the dress is on? It needs to be able to hold the weight of tree branches, basically Picture big dark branch-things that reach about a foot above someone's head, basically. Oh, and trailing fabric. Christine In a message dated 5/15/03 10:21:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alice@wonderland.com writes: > > > > a friend of mine did something similar, and built himself a matching > 'corset' > that was really a brace for the wings. it worked great, but of course > it > was quite visible. not sure if that would go with your costume or not. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 22:25:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2PoHP028602 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:25:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2RCUw028352 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 20:27:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2RCj5001093; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:27:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt19.cluster1.charter.net (remt19.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2Qvj5000969 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:26:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [24.196.130.120] (HELO laptop) by remt19.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 30807025 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:26:51 -0400 Message-ID: <00cb01c31b52$8066e100$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <13D2FF13.0F4D1701.349D0FDF@cs.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] how does he do that? was One or two people inthisBruegel? Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 21:26:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ok - but if they aren't tied into a doublet, how are they staying up? That's my question! ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** > The vest that the man is wearing should have point holes in it...check out > http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/bruegel163.html > http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/bruegel117.html > > As you'll see, it's the period equivalent of plumber's pants and/or loosening your belt when you've eaten too much... > > especially check out http://www.abcgallery.com/B/bruegel/bruegel123.html - he's got his shirt untucked, and you can see his points hanging and the point holes in the doublet... > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 22:39:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2daHP028630 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:39:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2efUw029466 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 20:40:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2eej5007683; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:40:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2eaj5007663 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:40:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 02-022.142.popsite.net ([66.248.121.22] helo=DDQ4NY11) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19GV99-0001pM-00 for h-costume@net.indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:40:35 -0700 From: "Andrea Cesari" To: Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 19:40:34 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Subject: [h-cost] RE: Portland, OR Idea X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I haven't got a thing to wear from the Edwardian era, but this would be a perfect excuse to make something. (Particularly since my copy of "The Edwardian Modiste" arrived just yesterday...) If you're not already familiar with them, I highly recommend you check out the web site for the Greater Bay Area Costumers Guild. They have down pat this idea of dressing up and going out in public. This time of year, of course, picnics are popular. http://www.gbacg.org Andrea (in McMinnville) >Are there any people in the western Portland OR area who might be interested >in dressing for "tea" and getting together for lunch once a month just for >fun? Too ambitious? What about just a lunch date this summer sometime to >see how it goes? I live an hour west of downtown but there must be a couple >of places with some vintage ambiance that wouldn't mind a tea party once in >a while. >I admit I'll dress up for almost any reason, but I like these gowns and am >not dedicated enough to go full reinactment, and it might be a fun change of >pace. Anyone vaguely interested?? Suggestions for where? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 22:39:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2dgHP028633 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:39:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2f3Uw029525 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 20:41:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2f3j5007919; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:41:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gpvissmtpgw03.splitrock.net (gpvissmtpgw03.splitrock.net [63.254.138.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4G2erj5007825 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:40:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 21366 invoked from network); 16 May 2003 02:40:52 -0000 Received: from 207-191-202-36.cpe.ats.mcleodusa.net (HELO computer) (207.191.202.36) by gpvissmtpgw03.splitrock.net with SMTP; 16 May 2003 02:40:52 -0000 Message-ID: <020401c31b54$ea808580$24cabfcf@ats.mcleodusa.net> From: "Avien" To: "Historical Costume" References: <183.1b09b4e9.2bf5855e@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 21:43:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Don't know how much this would help but your request made me think of Victoria's Secret. Sounds silly but I remember that they did a fashion show on TV this past year (there were a TON of commercials for it) and I saw several of the models wearing these big wings. Obviously they're not wearing much. Maybe their website would have pictures on it or maybe a link to the maker of the wings. HTH, and if not, maybe it will at least make someone laugh. =) Avien ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 7:05 PM Subject: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical > Since no one seems to post over on the sci-fi/fantasy list, I figured I'd ask > for help over here. I've a lovely idea for a costume, but it involves wings > that are "skeletal" in nature: made of branches and draped with sheer fabric > (think that Elven King painting from one of the more well-known Faerie > artists). With something of this proposed weight, it seems unlikely that I > could use the age-old idea of tying them to my back with 3" wide elastic > around the arms, or something around the waist. Any ideas? "Night Hunt" at > CC21 had some sort of tubular thing on one of the participant's backs, though > I don't quite know how I'd attach *that*, either! > > Christine > Who just keeps coming up with more costume ideas...oh dear. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 22:55:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2tuHP028664 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:55:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2vGUw001010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 20:57:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2vFR1015913; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:57:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G2vDR1015879 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 20:57:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E5AF7ABA1 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:56:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 75749-01 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:56:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-202-187-21.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.202.187.21]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 604697A9F2 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 19:56:30 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 19:57:03 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <150.1f430216.2bf5a632@aol.com> Message-Id: <1200A013-874A-11D7-ABC4-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO yeah, you could build the wings so they slid down into a support piece, like hinge-pins into a hinge.... On Thursday, May 15, 2003, at 07:25 PM, IceGirlNIN@aol.com wrote: > It's a bell-sleeved A-line dress in an ombre design: dark blue at the > top, > fading to near-white. Maybe if I make (bound!) holes in the back of > the > dress, and a corset structure that the wings attach to that goes > beneath the > dress, but the wings attach when the dress is on? It needs to be able > to > hold the weight of tree branches, basically Picture big dark > branch-things that reach about a foot above someone's head, basically. > Oh, > and trailing fabric. > > Christine > > > In a message dated 5/15/03 10:21:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > alice@wonderland.com writes: > >> >> >> >> a friend of mine did something similar, and built himself a matching >> 'corset' >> that was really a brace for the wings. it worked great, but of course >> it >> was quite visible. not sure if that would go with your costume or >> not. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 23:02:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G32DHP028713 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:02:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G33ZUw001477 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 21:03:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G33YR1018534; Thu, 15 May 2003 21:03:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pop2b.ripco.com (root@pop2b.ripco.com [209.100.227.27]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G33UR1018505 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 21:03:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ripco.com (tcr233.dynip.ripco.net [209.100.226.233]) by pop2b.ripco.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id h4G33Vl20822 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:03:31 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3EC454F9.4000706@ripco.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:03:21 -0500 From: zski User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200305160226.h4G2QVj7000796@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] re: wings X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Message: 15 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:25:54 EDT From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical To: h-costume@indra.com Message-ID: <150.1f430216.2bf5a632@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" -It's a bell-sleeved A-line dress in an ombre design: dark blue at the -top, fading to near-white. Maybe if I make (bound!) holes in the back -of the dress, and a corset structure that the wings attach to that goes -beneath the dress, but the wings attach when the dress is on? It needs -to be able to hold the weight of tree branches, basically Picture -big dark branch-things that reach about a foot above someone's head, -basically. Oh, and trailing fabric. I made a Danse Macabre costume for the Bristol Faire a few years ago, and I had 11-foot trailing wings. The secret is to attach the wings, not to your back, but to your shoulders! If they are on your back, they look lovely but you have NO control over them. The frame was in two parts - one for each wing. They curved over my shoulders, and were tied together at the base of the supports. An elastic harness held them in place with a band around the chest that fastened under the bosom, and two "straps" coming up from the center bosom over the shoulders. The poles ran through two "tubes" of fabric atached to the straps. They curved down at my back, so they looked like they came off my back, but the weight actually rested squarely on my shoulders. (I can send you pics if this sounds confusing) With the wings being nearly 11 feet long, I was able to dance, pirouette, and go over picnic tables with no trouble - I drove the spotters crazy! "No one that big should be able to move that well!". Wendy Z baking biscuits in Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 15 23:07:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G37pHP028723 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:07:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G39DUw002030 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 21:09:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G39CR1021606; Thu, 15 May 2003 21:09:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G399R1021563 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 21:09:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail22.ureach.com (mail22.ureach.com [172.16.2.82]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA14489 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:09:08 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-33-125-88.asm.bellsouth.net [67.33.125.88]) by mail22.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id XAA08440 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:09:08 -0400 Message-ID: <081501c31b58$10a42250$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <150.1f430216.2bf5a632@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 23:05:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 10:25 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical > Picture big dark > branch-things that reach about a foot above someone's head, basically. Just remember..... It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye! And then it's just fun. Sorry I just couldn't resist! Teena _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 00:05:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G45cHP029375 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:05:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G46kUw006004 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 22:06:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G46dR6017148; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:06:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G46bR6017122 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:06:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA04472 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:06:36 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-33-125-88.asm.bellsouth.net [67.33.125.88]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id AAA13545 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:06:36 -0400 Message-ID: <081c01c31b60$1797caa0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <150.1f430216.2bf5a632@aol.com> Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 00:03:21 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [h-cost] York Castle Victorian Gown Images X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I found this listing on ebay and thought I would mention it in case anyone is interested. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=11801&item=2323279775 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 00:09:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G49FHP029382 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:09:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4AbUw006296 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 22:10:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4AbR6018919; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:10:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4AXR6018883 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:10:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA20608 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:31:09 -0500 Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 23:31:09 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Advice wanted for an England trip In-Reply-To: <3EC3D6E0.26806.454EDB@localhost> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 15 May 2003 kat@grendal.rain.com wrote: > One more word of caution on that which I found when I used my ATM: > most of them have charges for doing the banking and it was > significantly higher than I've seen here in the US. (Most of the time > it's free for us, but occasionally we'll get a 50 cent charge. The $5 > charge on one of my ATM usages was a bit of a surprise. But it was a > lot more convenient than traveler's checks so I wrote it off to > "convenience cost.") That's one reason you might want to use credit cards whenever possible, and when you do use an ATM, make it a sizable withdrawal to last you a good long time. When I was in Bruges for 10 days with a dozen British medievalists (long story), we developed a nice trick so that we didn't all have to keep changing money. Every evening, we ate out together at a restaurant. One person -- whoever needed cash the most -- charged the whole thing on a credit card, and everyone else paid that person in cash. The next night, the cash shuffled around to someone else. I think the same set of Belgian francs passed through the hands of our entire party. We all needed to do some moneychanging over the course of the visit, but none of us were stuck short -- as we would have been on some days, given that the local ATMs were unreliable and the banks not always accessible. Another trick I learned, some years ago when ATMs didn't always speak to one another, was to keep two bank accounts at home, on two different international networks. (You'll know these by the symbols on the backs of the cards; I think one was Plus, and I forget the other.) In Britain, I might find only one working ATM in whatever small town I had stopped in, and I would use the ATM card with the matching network. Things might be better now, though. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 00:29:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4TXHP029466 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:29:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4UrUw007940 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 22:30:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4UoR6028111; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:30:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4UlR6028045 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:30:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m92.in-tch.com [216.166.191.92]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4G4CTH13814 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:12:29 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EC46984.AE1FAC4A@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:31:00 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] perugia towels? References: <20030515095403.A51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> <3EC3A505.9030203@fenris.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Funny. I've gotten some of those, and I think I've got blue and green. They are pretty. --sue, who's eye keeps catching on the "perugia" part of the topic, because we have a fantastically nummy local restaurant by that name.... Elizabeth Young wrote: > > This is a long shot, as the towels don't actually appear on their web > site, but when I order fabrics from www.fabrics-store.com I get a nice > linen towel as a thank you gift. I, of course, can't find any of them > right now, but IIRC they are white towels w/ woven designs in another > color at each end. The ones I've gotten have been white w/ yellow or pink. > Maybe worth a try. > > liz young > > >>----- Original Message ----- > >>From: Drea Leed > >> > >> > >>>I'm currently looking for reproduction "perugian towels", those white > >>>linen cloths bordered with designs in blue that show up in italian & > >>>german paintings of the 16th century. > >>> > >>>I've scoured the web, to no avail; does anyone know of a place that sells > >>>them? > >>> > >>> > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 00:32:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4W3HP029477 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:32:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4XQUw008097 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 22:33:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4XPR6029380; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:33:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4XNR6029309 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:33:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m92.in-tch.com [216.166.191.92]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4G4F4H15054 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:15:05 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EC46A65.4EBDC61B@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:34:45 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet References: <078601c31aff$dc332d70$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ooooh...I've always liked that one! --sue, trying to stick to getting some middle-class stuff done for the summer tourney season..... Beteena Paradise wrote: > > I forgot to put the link in for anyone unfamiliar with the dress I > mentioned. > > http://mywebpage.netscape.com/Beteena/isabel+de+valois.jpg > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Beteena Paradise" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 11:04 AM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet > > > Are you going to do a dress diary on this project? I hope you are!! I > really > > want to make the Isabel de Valois dress but the partlet construction is > > somewhat of a mystery to me. > > > > Teena > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Deredere Galbraith" > > To: "H-Costume" > > Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 10:17 AM > > Subject: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I was working on a new partlet and I realised that the material costs > > > are going to be a bit high :-( . > > > I am trieing to recreate the partlet of Elisabeth of Austria. > > > Here you can find a picture of her. > > > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlet.html > > > > > > There are smal jewels with a black stone on the partlet and pearls. > > > I was thinking of using 1 cm buttons for the jewels but I need aboud 250 > > > of them. > > > Does anyone knows a site were I can get cheep buttons wich look like the > > > ones on the partlet? > > > I tried www.cheeptrims.com but they don't have buttons I like. > > > The buttons can be from plastik since the Fake pearls are also from > > plastik > > > > > > Greetings, > > > Deredere > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 00:40:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4e3HP029498 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:40:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4aRUw008294 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 22:36:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4aQR6000882; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:36:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4aNR6000824 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:36:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m92.in-tch.com [216.166.191.92]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4G4I5H16529 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:18:06 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EC46B1A.3313228@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:37:46 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical References: <183.1b09b4e9.2bf5855e@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Some sort of harness, maybe? The harness could be underneath your outer layer of costume, with access to the wing bits through slits in the back. I seem to recall seeing something similar in a journal article..... --sue IceGirlNIN@aol.com wrote: > > Since no one seems to post over on the sci-fi/fantasy list, I figured I'd ask > for help over here. I've a lovely idea for a costume, but it involves wings > that are "skeletal" in nature: made of branches and draped with sheer fabric > (think that Elven King painting from one of the more well-known Faerie > artists). With something of this proposed weight, it seems unlikely that I > could use the age-old idea of tying them to my back with 3" wide elastic > around the arms, or something around the waist. Any ideas? "Night Hunt" at > CC21 had some sort of tubular thing on one of the participant's backs, though > I don't quite know how I'd attach *that*, either! > > Christine > Who just keeps coming up with more costume ideas...oh dear. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 00:40:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4evHP029502 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:40:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4gKUw008687 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 22:42:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4gJR6003820; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:42:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4gGR6003757 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:42:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m92.in-tch.com [216.166.191.92]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4G4NwH19293 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:23:58 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EC46C7B.3B410446@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:43:39 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Advice wanted for an England trip References: <20030513195620.93283.qmail@web20809.mail.yahoo.com> <3EC1553E.2F68AB05@earthlink.net> <33178.162.119.64.111.1053016233.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I woulda mentioned Bath, but she said she was sticking to the London area, and Bath's a couple hours away by train, at least. It's a neat museum, though, although I was frustrated almost past tolerance at not being able to take a picture of "my" shirts (as I've thought of them for...oh...15? years now). I am not an artist like Bjarne, so my sketches that I tried to do *stink.* --Sue, who loved Bath almost as much as she liked Dublin (maybe it's all that great Georgian architecture??? ) dch@inreach.com wrote: > > > Overall, I'm an all-things-fiber addict, with a strong bias towards > > anything over a thousand years old, and an unexpected weakness for > > Edwardian gowns. I'm the sort who would happily spend several hours in > > front of the same case, trying to trace thread paths, and making notes > > (heaven help me!). So, where would you recommend I go, and what should > > I see? And do you have any great advice as to where I should stay while > > I'm seeing it? > > > > If/when you go to the V & A, plan to spend a half a day in their textile > room. Lots of woven fabrics (a few over 1000 years old) and lots of > embroidery from at least the 1500's on forward. LOTS of great stuff. > > Also, I am surprised that nobody mentioned the Costume Museum at Bath. > They have a website so that you can get an idea of what they have. Lots > of cool stuff. And I think that you can write to see the costumes > up-close (Iike you can for the V & A). Give it a shot, anyway. > > Have fun! > > Diana > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 00:46:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4kHHP029530 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 00:46:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4laUw009022 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 22:47:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4lZR6006175; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:47:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G4lXR6006134 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:47:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m92.in-tch.com [216.166.191.92]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4G4TFH21483 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:29:15 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EC46DB8.E64D7EF9@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:48:56 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Indigo dyeing References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You can buy pre-prepared indigo. We played with it some, last summer. No need to wait for a week or anything. In solution, it's a completely vile color (and odor!), but watching your stuff turn blue *after* you remove it from the indigo bath is just fascinating! Here in Montana, we have a limited ability to grow our own indigo or woad, as the dyer's woad, at least, is a prohibited plant (horribly invasive weed). I have some friends who are planting Japanese indigo, though, which *is* legal to grow. --sue, who likes playing with colors Ingrid G. Storrø wrote: > > A question for the dyers among us: > > I'm going to try my hand at out-of-doors and over an open fire natural > dyeing this summer, at an event that's an 8 hour drive from my home and > of a kind where I can't use plastic containers and the like. I was > hoping to maybe take a crack at dyeing with indigo (in addition to > madder and other stuff), but I see some potentially quite big problems > with this considering the circumstances. As I understand it, the indigo > has to reduce/ferment for about a week in warm conditions before it's > suitable for dyeing, and introducing air into the vat at any time is > inadvisable. Correct? Although the event lasts for a bit more than a > week, waiting until the very end to do the dyeing isn't optimal, as I > hope to overdye some of it to get greens and purples. Here's hoping > someone on the list will know whether this is feasible or not: > > - I was hoping to maybe get the vat going in a plastic container (the > kind used for water, so with a small opening) in my bathroom (with floor > heating) about a week before I go to the event. Then transport the vat > in the plastic container, and pour it into another container (wooden > bucket with fabric covering or something like that) once I get there and > let it sit for a couple more days before dyeing. Will this ruin the vat > completely? > > - once at the event, I doubt if I will be able to give the vat stable > warm conditions day and night. Will that ruin the vat? The event is in > southern Sweden in July, so the chances of fairly warm weather are good, > but in Scandinavia one never knows... Could it be an idea to put warm > stones into the vat at intervals? > > - what if it rains while I'm dyeing? Is this something that should be > done under some form of roof? > > - what kind of container is suitable? If I understand what I've read > correctly, one dyes directly in the container that the stuff has reduced > in. Is there a particular kind of metal that is better for the dye, or > is wood best? > > And on another note: how much does this stuff actually stink, anyway? > > My deep gratitude to anyone with input on this. :) > > Ingrid > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 01:41:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G5f4HP029649 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 01:41:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G5gLUw012406 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 23:42:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G5gFs2000549; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:42:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rwcrmhc52.attbi.com (rwcrmhc52.attbi.com [216.148.227.88]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G5gDs2000481 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:42:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fenris.net (12-246-237-231.client.attbi.com[12.246.237.231]) by attbi.com (rwcrmhc52) with SMTP id <2003051605420705200ld4vqe>; Fri, 16 May 2003 05:42:07 +0000 Message-ID: <3EC47A31.5080400@fenris.net> Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:42:09 -0700 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] perugia towels? References: <20030515095403.A51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> <3EC3A505.9030203@fenris.net> <3EC46984.AE1FAC4A@in-tch.com> In-Reply-To: <3EC46984.AE1FAC4A@in-tch.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Boy, do I have a bad memory! I just got a shipment from fabrics-store and the towel has stripes along the long edges, not the ends. This particular one is white w/ a greenish aqua pattern. Also, the towel itself is not a plain weave, but uh.... damask? or jaquard? (Don't know the difference). Whatever it is, the design is created by making long floats (uneven over and under) on the surface of the weave. So, I don't think this is what you were looking for, Drea. liz young Sue Clemenger wrote: >Funny. I've gotten some of those, and I think I've got blue and green. >They are pretty. >--sue, who's eye keeps catching on the "perugia" part of the topic, >because we have a fantastically nummy local restaurant by that name.... > >Elizabeth Young wrote: > > >>This is a long shot, as the towels don't actually appear on their web >>site, but when I order fabrics from www.fabrics-store.com I get a nice >>linen towel as a thank you gift. I, of course, can't find any of them >>right now, but IIRC they are white towels w/ woven designs in another >>color at each end. The ones I've gotten have been white w/ yellow or pink. >>Maybe worth a try. >> >> _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 01:49:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G5nJHP029671 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 01:49:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G5ogUw012815 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 15 May 2003 23:50:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G5ofs2003904; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:50:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (mta5.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G5ocs2003873 for ; Thu, 15 May 2003 23:50:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([64.175.34.254]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HEY0069WTKA72@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 15 May 2003 22:50:38 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:31:26 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: "free" industrial machine (was Re: [h-cost] Necchi Industrial Sewing Machine & Old Sewing Machines In-reply-to: <4.3.1.2.20030515101535.00e02b60@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030515222949.05069870@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>Wow! An industrial machine for the price of a new motor could turn out >>to be a FANTASTIC deal!!!!! They do not run cheap. Very cool. > >Funny you should mention it. I have an industrial machine I'm trying to >get rid of. It was offered to me, free, so I grabbed it, but it turns out >I never use it. If anyone wants it, they could have it for the cost of >shipping from where it is now to wherever you are. (It was given to me >free and I hauled it home, so I give it to you free and you haul it >home.) I was told it was running the day before I picked it up, but it >has sat in storage for about a year since then. Within three hours I got four respondents on this, and have e-mailed them all privately in the order I received their e-mails. Certainly one of them will get it, and I will be rid of it. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 04:02:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G82fHP012186 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 04:02:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G83lUw019899 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 02:03:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G83hjY024061; Fri, 16 May 2003 02:03:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G83djY024033 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 02:03:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4G83cp00875.; Fri, 16 May 2003 09:03:38 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 16 May 2003 09:03:38 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 09:03:27 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Advice wanted for an England trip Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4G83djY024033 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sadly, I think the Costume Museum in Nottingham has been closed, as they threatened to do. I looked for it a month or two ago and couldn't find it. I blush to say that I had never been there, despite living half an hour's drive from the city. I tried to go one Saturday last summer, after there had been discussion on this list of the threat of closure, but left it too late in the day and found it had closed at 4.00. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> dawn@agesofelegance.co.uk 05/16/03 12:25am >>> If planning to go to Nottingham please check first. They are in the process of reorganising the museums etc there and the Costume/lace museum was one of the places which was going to be closed down with items only viewable in storage by appointment. There has been a lot of controversy about this but not sure of the final outcome. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 05:41:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G9fNHP032337 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 05:41:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G9gkUw024924 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 03:42:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G9gi6R024974; Fri, 16 May 2003 03:42:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4G9gf6S024946 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 03:42:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty2112.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.243.112]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4G9gkPq012322 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 05:42:46 -0400 Message-ID: <3EC4B298.90102@dandy.net> Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 05:42:48 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] how does he do that? References: <000001c31a90$d517deb0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> <004d01c31aeb$bc63ce00$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. Regarding the hose and points thing, the hose would not have been attached to the singlet (shirt), but either to the sleeveless doublet they are wearing or to one that was worn over that one. The points are untrussed because of the manual labor involved. How the hose are staying up is anyone's guess, but at least one of the fellows appears to be wearing a belt. Also, the hose appear to be higher up the waist than in previous decades, and so may be better fitted. So long as the join in the hose is closed at the front with the codpiece, it exerts some tension on the waistband area, which is probably reinforced to take the stress of the points. This is all conjecture based on the pairs that I have worn (1470s/80s style). Hope this helps, Mike T. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 06:15:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GAF2HP032417 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 06:15:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GAGLUw026427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 04:16:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GAGJ76006599; Fri, 16 May 2003 04:16:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GAGH76006558 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 04:16:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-164.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.164]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC5131A0235 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 12:16:10 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC4BAF6.5080909@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 12:18:30 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Answes to bruegel questions X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO How to ceep the tights up without tieing it to doublet/jerkin. There are two points mostly hidden behind the codpiece when you tie these real thight it wil stay on. One or two woman in painting. I found a sketch were you can see the same women from a different angle. Look here for pictures http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Bruegel/Bruegel.html Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 07:55:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GBtrHP032752 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 07:55:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GBvAUw001486 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 05:57:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GBv9ms014432; Fri, 16 May 2003 05:57:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from moutvdom.kundenserver.de (moutvdom.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.249]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GBv5ms014373 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 05:57:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [212.227.126.224] (helo=mrvdomng.kundenserver.de) by moutvdom.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19Gdpg-0004IY-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:57:04 +0200 Received: from [208.252.48.163] (helo=5wal-lhiggins.bustles-and-bows.co.uk) by mrvdomng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19Gdpd-0006H6-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:57:02 +0200 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.2.20030516122739.0372c748@pop.oneandone.co.uk> X-Sender: pt7788416-2801@pop.oneandone.co.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 12:32:09 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: The Duchess In-Reply-To: <3EC4BAF6.5080909@kabelfoon.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] BBC Searching for New People X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi People, Anybody want to take a shot for auditions for talkers on various subjects? I gather the Beeb is looking for new programmes and subjects to replace the current crop of "doing the house and garden over" type shows. Here's an opportunity for someone to get on the TV talking about historic costume. Lissa ************************************************************* BBC TALENT SEARCHES FOR NEW TV EXPERTS -----Original Message----- From: Diversity Database [mailto:diversity.database@bbc.co.uk] Sent: 15 May 2003 15:58 Subject: BBC TALENT SEARCHES FOR NEW TV EXPERTS BBC TALENT SEARCHES FOR NEW TV EXPERTS BBC Television is on a nation-wide hunt for the next generation of TV Experts - people who absolutely know what they're talking about, are great storytellers, and who want to make programmes about their chosen subject. And there's the chance to audition nationwide over the next 10 weeks when taxis doubling as mobile audition booths tour the country. Areas of expertise could be in any one or more of a diverse range of subjects e.g.: architecture, anthropology, psychology, history, literature, advertising, design, nutrition, horticulture, the culinary arts.... All that's required is some kind of knowledge or passion, plus an ability to enlighten people with intelligence and charm. Each of ten finalists will have a taster tape made to be shown to controllers and commissioners of factual programming at the BBC, and one will be contracted to front a documentary on BBC Four. Auditions will be informal - people will have the chance to talk on camera for a couple of minutes in the back of the cab about something they're passionate about. Auditions on most days will be between 9.30 am and 6 pm on a first come first served basis, though there will be a chance during the first hour of auditions each morning to register for a slot later in the day. For more information on the exact locations the taxis will be visiting log onto http://www.bbc.co.uk/talent/newtvexpert/index.shtml or call the BBC Talent Hotline on 08700 106060 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 12:29:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GGTUHP001139 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 12:29:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GGUlUw027074 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 10:30:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GGUasl014076; Fri, 16 May 2003 10:30:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GGUXsl013956 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 10:30:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-185.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.185]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BE95BE698 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 18:30:27 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC512AF.7050802@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 18:32:47 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Finally, I have finished my "weddingdress" sleeves!! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It is slightly more than a year later but they are finished!!!!! Pictures of them on the bottem of this page. http://home.kabelfoon.nl/~triade/Weddingdress/weddingdress.html Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 12:48:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GGmlHP001764 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 12:48:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GGneUw028930 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 10:49:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GGncsl028454; Fri, 16 May 2003 10:49:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80402.mail.yahoo.com (web80402.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.57]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4GGnXsl028318 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 10:49:33 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030516164927.12686.qmail@web80402.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80402.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 16 May 2003 09:49:27 PDT Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 09:49:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305160226.h4G2QVj6000796@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 2, Issue 244 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Christine wrote: > Since no one seems to post over on the > sci-fi/fantasy list, I figured I'd ask > for help over here. I've a lovely idea for a > costume, but it involves wings > that are "skeletal" in nature: made of branches and > draped with sheer fabric > (think that Elven King painting from one of the more > well-known Faerie > artists). With something of this proposed weight, > it seems unlikely that I > could use the age-old idea of tying them to my back > with 3" wide elastic > around the arms, or something around the waist. Any > ideas? "Night Hunt" at > CC21 had some sort of tubular thing on one of the > participant's backs, though > I don't quite know how I'd attach *that*, either! and also: > > It's a bell-sleeved A-line dress in an ombre design: > dark blue at the top, > fading to near-white. Maybe if I make (bound!) > holes in the back of the > dress, and a corset structure that the wings attach > to that goes beneath the > dress, but the wings attach when the dress is on? > It needs to be able to > hold the weight of tree branches, basically > Picture big dark > branch-things that reach about a foot above > someone's head, basically. Oh, > and trailing fabric. OK, I don't know if this will help, but IIRC, this is how Victoria Ridenour designed and constructed the wings for the Titania and Oberon costumes for the 1984 WorldCon Masquerade. Victoria built a very small (less than 12x12) box out of mat board, tape, and rivets, with 2" wide straps of heavy canvas webbing that fit over the wearer's shoulders. The wings themselves were constructed out of fishing pole blanks--very long but very light--bent over at the tip and secured with a piece of monofilament fishing line. Tulle was then laid over each of the wings, hot-glued into place, and the excess along the top of each "wing" trimmed off to leave 1 layer of tulle; the tulle was cut very long and dagged at the ends to create trailing edges. H-glue was then used to attach palaittes (those really big sequins) and she drew lines with Sobo, then hit them with aurora-borealis glitter (aka "disco dust"). The costumes Victoria designed were based loosely on Elizabethan costumes, and both her bodice and Adrian's doublet laced up the back, with openings and a center panel to allow the wings to come through, but cover the apparatus holding it. The wings were very light and comfortable for them to wear, but extremely fragile--I personally wouldn't recommend these for anything but a one-time, "knock 'em dead" exhibition. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 14:49:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GInMHP002282 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:49:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GIohUw012686 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 12:50:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GIodCT025179; Fri, 16 May 2003 12:50:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web40013.mail.yahoo.com (web40013.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.53]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4GIoaCT025068 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 12:50:36 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030516185030.7591.qmail@web40013.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [195.8.92.218] by web40013.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 16 May 2003 19:50:30 BST Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:50:30 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Rachel?= To: H-costume list , HNW MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] My embroidery website X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well I finally managed to get my embroidery online. Although this is only a small portion of my work, I thought I'd make a start with what I have here. As I try and track down more photographs of projects done in the past I'll hope to add to them. I'd love to hear any comments people might have or suggestions of things that need improving. Take a look at: http://www.threadsofhistory.co.uk If anyone will be at the V&A for the first weekend in July come and say hello as I will be talking and demonstrating again in gallery 123 (new British Galleries second floor). This time it's a solo affair and I won't be in costume. Rachel ===== Rachel Tudor Bibliography http://website.lineone.net/~reholliday/Tudor/ __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 14:54:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GIsSHP002301 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:54:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GItnUw013202 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 12:55:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GItmXI028830; Fri, 16 May 2003 12:55:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from lakemtao01.cox.net (lakemtao01.cox.net [68.1.17.244]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GIthXI028663 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 12:55:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from VMAAHQ ([68.99.96.216]) by lakemtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030516185538.YVMB8337.lakemtao01.cox.net@VMAAHQ> for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:55:38 -0400 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] re: Perugia towels Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 07:18:19 -0400 Message-ID: <000001c31b9c$db477f90$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I just received a catalog today from the Sovietski (sp?) Collection, and in it are beautiful linen tablecloths and napkins such as you are looking for. They are on clearance, so you should probably not wait too long. Pax, ::Linda:: Everyone, > > I'm currently looking for reproduction "perugian towels", those white > linen cloths bordered with designs in blue that show up in italian & > german paintings of the 16th century. > > I've scoured the web, to no avail; does anyone know of a place that sells > them? > > Thanks, > > Drea _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 14:59:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GIxdHP002320 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:59:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ17Uw014035 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 13:01:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ16XI003470; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:01:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d04.mx.aol.com (imo-d04.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ12XI003345 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:01:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.f6.2c2044ed (4116) for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 15:00:39 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 15:00:39 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Costuming but not historical (wings) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/15/03 11:21:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time, bkessinger@ureach.com writes: > Just remember..... It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye! And > then it's just fun. > *Cackles* Perhaps I should wrap the sharp edges in cotton balls? Then anyone in my way will get a warning, rather than a hospital bill! > Sorry I just couldn't resist! Resistance is futile. Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 15:02:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ2BHP002335 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 15:02:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ3ZUw014386 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 13:03:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ3YXI005439; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:03:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m06.mx.aol.com (imo-m06.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.161]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ3VXI005344 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:03:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.10f.21ffe268 (4116) for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 15:03:19 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <10f.21ffe268.2bf68ff7@aol.com> Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 15:03:19 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: wings To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/15/03 11:14:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, zski@ripco.com writes: > I can send you pics if this sounds confusing) > Yeep! Show me! This sounds like a good idea. Especially being that I'd like to bring this to a convention and compete it....and therefore need to be able to move. I'm 18, I shouldn't be movement impaired quite *yet*! > With the wings being nearly 11 feet long, I was able to dance, > pirouette, and go over picnic tables with no trouble - I drove the > spotters crazy! "No one that big should be able to move that well!". > > Eleven...feet. Maybe I should be thinking on a larger scale. Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 15:02:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ2gHP002338 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 15:02:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ3wUw014440 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 13:03:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ3vXI005748; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:03:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from lakemtao04.cox.net (lakemtao04.cox.net [68.1.17.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJ3sXI005646 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:03:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from VMAAHQ ([68.99.96.216]) by lakemtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030516190349.DTLS13930.lakemtao04.cox.net@VMAAHQ> for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 15:03:49 -0400 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Necchi Industrial Sewing Machine & Old Sewing Machines Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 07:26:32 -0400 Message-ID: <000101c31b9e$03a2ced0$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Esteemed List, I would like to thank all of you who have offered suggestions on finding parts for my 'treasure'. (As in "one woman's trash is another woman's treasure"!) At least no one said that they thought it is a lost cause, so I'll go ahead and invest the money in getting a new motor for it. I did do a Google search, but I never found a picture of a model that is anything like it, or even a matching model number, so I'm guessing it's a pretty specialized and rare item. The closest thing I could find to it was priced in the neighborhood of $3000+, which is way out of my budget! Thanks again for your help! ::Linda:: -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of jessica stier Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 11:43 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Necchi Industrial Sewing Machine & Old Sewing Machines I just did a search on the Internet for Necchi and came up with this link: http://www.allynint.com/ It looks like you can contact them for parts and to find a local repair facility. Wow! An industrial machine for the price of a new motor could turn out to be a FANTASTIC deal!!!!! They do not run cheap. Very cool. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 15:27:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJRQHP002377 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 15:27:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJSrUw017795 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 13:28:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJSpXI024155; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:28:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from post.its.mcw.edu (post.its.mcw.edu [141.106.32.10]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJSmXI024115 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:28:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from post.its.mcw.edu (york.is.mcw.edu [141.106.12.17]) by post.its.mcw.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.4) with ESMTP id h4GJSlK17796 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:28:47 -0500 (CDT) Received: from post (net-60-70.dhcp.mcw.edu [141.106.60.70]) by post.its.mcw.edu (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.4) with SMTP id h4GJSkG17782 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:28:46 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004301c31be1$34ac3b40$463c6a8d@its.mcw.edu.aghlab> From: "mls" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030516185030.7591.qmail@web40013.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] My embroidery website Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 14:27:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Rachel- I'm sure everyone, including me, is dying to see your work. Can you post photos on your website? Marie ----- Original Message ----- From: Rachel Subject: [h-cost] My embroidery website > Well I finally managed to get my embroidery online. Although this is only a small portion of my > work, I thought I'd make a start with what I have here. As I try and track down more photographs > of projects done in the past I'll hope to add to them. > > I'd love to hear any comments people might have or suggestions of things that need improving. > > Take a look at: http://www.threadsofhistory.co.uk > > If anyone will be at the V&A for the first weekend in July come and say hello as I will be talking > and demonstrating again in gallery 123 (new British Galleries second floor). This time it's a > solo affair and I won't be in costume. > > Rachel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 15:59:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GJx1HP002489 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 15:59:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GK0IUw022295 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 14:00:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GK0CHx017052; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:00:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net (turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.126]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GK09Hx016968 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:00:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19GlNA-0000LS-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:00:08 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] My embroidery website Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 13:00:07 -0700 Message-ID: <000701c31be5$c046c4f0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <004301c31be1$34ac3b40$463c6a8d@its.mcw.edu.aghlab> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ditto, none of the links I tried worked! More pictures...we want pictures!! :) Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 16:17:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GKH3HP002578 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 16:17:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GKISUw025634 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 14:18:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GKIQHx001360; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:18:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4GKINHx001256 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 14:18:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/On1IQkmtgD9YgIfhT/QDn7o=">; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:17:46 PDT Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HYBYZBGD; Fri, 16 May 2003 13:17:46 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 13:12:08 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Finally, I have finished my "weddingdress" sleeves!! Message-ID: <20030516.131712.1588.0.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,5-18 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh, very pretty! :D Arlys On Fri, 16 May 2003 18:32:47 +0200 Deredere Galbraith writes: > It is slightly more than a year later but they are finished!!!!! > Pictures of them on the bottem of this page. > http://home.kabelfoon.nl/~triade/Weddingdress/weddingdress.html > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 18:58:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GMwUHP003123 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 18:58:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GMwiUw024701 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 16:58:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GMwhOY026027; Fri, 16 May 2003 16:58:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.kc.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4GMwdOY025983 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 16:58:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail5.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Fri, 16 May 2003 17:57:18 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030516175229.00a01500@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 18:04:08 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515102329.02cce738@127.0.0.1> References: <3EC3A178.2050804@kabelfoon.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:33 AM 5/15/03 -0700, you wrote: >Hi Deredere, > >I love that partlet, and want to re-create it myself (and maybe the whole >dress, jewels included). I had planned on making my buttons from polymer >clays, as I wanted it to look right and still not cost a fortune. That >would be my suggestion for you as well. The only thing I had heard about >making inset jewels with poly clay is to not fire them together, as the >stone would break (unless you got the good hard CZ ones) as the clay >shrinks. So allow for shrinkage of the clay around the stone area before >firing. > >Kimiko Kimiko, Polymer clay doesn't shrink like that. Even if it did, the clay is not hard enough to crack stone. I think whoever told you that was thinking of PMC clay (Precious Metal Clay). A lot of polymer clay artists use it as well. It fires at VERY high temps and has the shrinkage problem you just described. Polymer clay is only baked at 275 degrees (Fahrenheit), so glass and most agates and other stones work just fine with it. I make renaissance-looking jewelry all the time out of polymer clay. I use either glass or stone cabochons. I use those a lot of those flat-back colored marbles that you can find in the floral aisle of craft stores. Polymer clay really doesn't shrink as it bakes so you can just make the piece and bake the whole thing. Just be sure not to use heat-sensitive stones like opals. If you want to use acrylic stones, you just press them into the clay before you bake it to make an impression, then remove the acrylic stone and bake the piece. When it is cool, you just glue the stone into the impressed area with superglue. For anyone wanting to make renaissance or medieval-looking pieces with polymer clay, I would heartily recommend a book called "Creating Your Own Antique Jewelry" by Cris Dupouy. Sheryl Nance-Durst _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 21:20:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H1KLHP003393 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 21:20:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H1KZUw005076 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 19:20:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H1KXFZ002044; Fri, 16 May 2003 19:20:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.traknet.com (host-216-153-194-11.syr.choiceone.net [216.153.194.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H1KUFZ002017 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 19:20:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from WorkingGirl ([216.153.194.159]) by mail.traknet.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-58579U2500L250S0V35) with ESMTP id com for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 21:29:25 -0400 From: "Margaret Baird " To: Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 21:20:26 -0400 Message-ID: <000501c31c12$7fb73cd0$9fc299d8@WorkingGirl> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4024 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] partlet X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Deredere, Have you considered Sculpty? Then you could decide how you need the holes aligned and there are some good looking metallics that would mimic the gold base. Margaret _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 22:31:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2VcHP003606 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 22:31:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2VnUw009907 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 20:31:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2VenA001616; Fri, 16 May 2003 20:31:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2VbnA001607 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 20:31:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AF3D1735006A; Fri, 16 May 2003 21:32:29 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AF096F80112; Fri, 16 May 2003 21:31:37 -0500 Message-ID: <001701c31c1c$a63bba20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:33:02 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] Painting??? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Does anyone know the name of this painting and its artist, www.costumegallery.com/1902/del/July/Coronation/image4.jpg I am working on an article about coronations of the British throne and this painting was one of its images. Love old magazines... the caption said, "An Old Painting". The article was printed around the time Edward took the throne. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 22:40:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2egHP003845 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 22:40:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2eTUw010411 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 20:40:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2eSnA005166; Fri, 16 May 2003 20:40:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2ePnA005136 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 20:40:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A14D1746006A; Fri, 16 May 2003 21:41:17 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A11970E0112; Fri, 16 May 2003 21:40:25 -0500 Message-ID: <002001c31c1d$d22e8800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001701c31c1c$a63bba20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:41:29 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Darn, there is another *old painting.* If you know this painting please let me know the title and artist, www.costumegallery.com/1902/del/July/Coronation/image3.jpg Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 22:49:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2nvHP004015 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 22:49:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2oDUw010961 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 20:50:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2oDnA008877; Fri, 16 May 2003 20:50:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H2oAnA008859 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 20:50:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HF000I3ZFVKW7@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 16 May 2003 19:50:09 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:32:20 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030516175229.00a01500@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030516192633.02cc6a50@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/14/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515102329.02cce738@127.0.0.1> <3EC3A178.2050804@kabelfoon.nl> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sheryl Thanks so much for the correction, and the book recommendation. I haven't gotten out the clays and made anything yet, so it was comments from others I had heard, and probably gotten them mixed up in my head on PMC clay. Would PMC clay then be fired in a kiln, such as pottery is fired in? I have only heard it was fired, not baked, and fired to me means in a kiln. And I am getting that book, as I have wanted to make jewelry and such for my costumes just like the book (as viewed on Amazon.com) talks about. Thanks again, Kimiko At 06:04 PM 5/16/2003 -0500, you wrote: >Kimiko, >Polymer clay doesn't shrink like that. Even if it did, the clay is not >hard enough >to crack stone. I think whoever told you that was thinking of PMC clay >(Precious Metal Clay). A lot of polymer clay artists use it as well. It >fires at VERY >high temps and has the shrinkage problem you just described. >> > >For anyone wanting to make renaissance or medieval-looking pieces with >polymer clay, I would heartily recommend a book called "Creating Your Own >Antique Jewelry" by Cris Dupouy. > >Sheryl Nance-Durst Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 16 23:38:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H3cmHP004167 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 23:38:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H3d0Uw013805 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 21:39:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H3cwim028588; Fri, 16 May 2003 21:38:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net (grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H3cuim028562 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 21:38:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-28-15.o1.jps.net ([216.119.28.15] helo=pavilion) by grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19GsX9-0000vN-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 16 May 2003 20:38:55 -0700 Message-ID: <001301c31c27$b921acc0$0f1c77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001701c31c1c$a63bba20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 20:52:18 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO "Love?", you are very generous Penny. I was trying to track down a 16th century Starch receipe and found the following line in Gerard's Herbal under a specific variety of wheat grown for starch. "If any be defirous to learne the making of starch let them read Dodoneus last edition where they shall be fully taught, my felfe not willing to spend time about so vaine a thing". Pissed me off!!! I eventually found a 17th century receipe but it's not the same! I also found out that artichokes were a 16th early 17th century deodorant though. No, you don't rub them under your arms, but eat them! This causes the rank armpit smell to exit through your smelly urine instead. Handy to know these things!!! Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 7:33 PM Subject: [h-cost] Painting??? > Does anyone know the name of this painting and its artist, > www.costumegallery.com/1902/del/July/Coronation/image4.jpg > > I am working on an article about coronations of the British throne and this > painting was one of its images. Love old magazines... the caption said, "An > Old Painting". The article was printed around the time Edward took the > throne. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 01:51:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H5prHP004453 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:51:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H5q9Uw022089 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 May 2003 23:52:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H5q1jB001183; Fri, 16 May 2003 23:52:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (mta6.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H5pxjB001154 for ; Fri, 16 May 2003 23:51:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.116.239.137]) by mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HF000KDWOAMZO@mta6.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 16 May 2003 22:51:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:51:52 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? In-reply-to: <002001c31c1d$d22e8800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030516224515.05153930@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: <001701c31c1c$a63bba20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Darn, there is another *old painting.* If you know this painting please let >me know the title and artist, >www.costumegallery.com/1902/del/July/Coronation/image3.jpg I have a bw repro of it in a book called 'How The Rich Lived', a 1976 book of paintings of the rich lifestyle. They list it as 'The Lord Mayor's Procession', by William Logsdale, 1888. In the back of the book it also says London, Guildhall Art Gallery/photo Cooper-Bridgeman library but I don't know if this is any help to you. My picture is the mirror image of the one you have, so we'd have to look at things like buttons to see which one of us has it the right way round. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 02:16:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6GDHP009679 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 02:16:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6GUUw023570 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 00:16:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6GTrW013134; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:16:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6GSrW013123 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:16:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3EF1800006A; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:17:19 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3BC158800DE; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:16:28 -0500 Message-ID: <005701c31c3a$b6d81040$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001701c31c1c$a63bba20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <4.3.1.2.20030516224515.05153930@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 02:08:18 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta, How bazaar, I just found this image by the same artist using the same setting but different people on the street. http://cgfa.sunsite.dk/l/p-logsdail1.htm You info really does help. I like to give credits in captions. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 1:51 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? > > >Darn, there is another *old painting.* If you know this painting please let > >me know the title and artist, > >www.costumegallery.com/1902/del/July/Coronation/image3.jpg > > I have a bw repro of it in a book called 'How The Rich Lived', a 1976 book > of paintings of the rich lifestyle. They list it as 'The Lord Mayor's > Procession', by William Logsdale, 1888. In the back of the book it also says > > London, Guildhall Art Gallery/photo > Cooper-Bridgeman library > > but I don't know if this is any help to you. > > My picture is the mirror image of the one you have, so we'd have to look at > things like buttons to see which one of us has it the right way round. > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 02:20:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6KVHP011049 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 02:20:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6KmUw023954 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 00:20:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6KlrW015209; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:20:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6KjrW015174 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:20:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A4F0180B006A; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:21:36 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A4BC159100DE; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:20:44 -0500 Message-ID: <006601c31c3b$3deb8800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001701c31c1c$a63bba20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <4.3.1.2.20030516224515.05153930@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 02:12:05 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta, Alright, this artist must have loved this Greek looking building... check this out http://www.artunframed.com/images/artmis21/logsdai99.jpg Susan says it looks like the front of the opera house in My Fair Lady. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 1:51 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? > > >Darn, there is another *old painting.* If you know this painting please let > >me know the title and artist, > >www.costumegallery.com/1902/del/July/Coronation/image3.jpg > > I have a bw repro of it in a book called 'How The Rich Lived', a 1976 book > of paintings of the rich lifestyle. They list it as 'The Lord Mayor's > Procession', by William Logsdale, 1888. In the back of the book it also says > > London, Guildhall Art Gallery/photo > Cooper-Bridgeman library > > but I don't know if this is any help to you. > > My picture is the mirror image of the one you have, so we'd have to look at > things like buttons to see which one of us has it the right way round. > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 02:26:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6QMHP013042 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 02:26:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6QhUw024411 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 00:26:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6QgrW018270; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:26:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6QdrW018209 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:26:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A653181A006A; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:27:31 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A620E4600A0; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:26:40 -0500 Message-ID: <007901c31c3b$f5e0bb60$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001701c31c1c$a63bba20$0400a8c0@comcast.net><4.3.1.2.20030516224515.05153930@mail.frys.com> <006601c31c3b$3deb8800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 02:17:14 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta, I found the painting in color..... you print must be a reverse image. http://www.allposters.com/gallery.asp?aid=133547&item=149530 Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 02:35:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6Z7HP015372 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 02:35:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6ZOUw024904 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 00:35:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6ZNrW022204; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:35:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6ZJrW022128 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:35:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pavilion (213-78-102-49.friaco.onetel.net.uk [213.78.102.49]) 3.2.2-GA) with SMTP id ADD69801; Sat, 17 May 2003 07:35:16 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <019601c31c3e$f0fbf4e0$c0674ed5@pavilion> From: "Melanie Wilson" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Advice wanted for an England trip Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 07:38:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Sadly, I think the Costume Museum in Nottingham has been closed, as they threatened to do. I looked for it a month or two ago and couldn't find it. Definatly the lace museum has closed and I think the costume too. Most public funds have been poured into the new ice arena. Much as I have the closure given limited funds the stadiu is used by far more youngsters and families than the museums were. Sad but true. It also has a higher repeat visit value Mel This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the Company, unless specifically stated. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 02:51:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6pMHP020665 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 02:51:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6pdUw026171 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 00:51:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6pcrW000967; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:51:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6pZrW000942 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:51:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AC2A61140032; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:52:26 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ABF723F20108; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:51:35 -0500 Message-ID: <008801c31c3e$ac165280$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 02:36:39 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] Got side tracked X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well while looking for the paintings... Susan got me side-tracked, go check out the fan museum, http://www.fan-museum.org/ Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 02:53:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6reHP021450 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 02:53:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6s0Uw026278 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 00:54:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6rxrW002027; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:53:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gw.retro.com (gw.retro.com [205.179.181.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6rvrW002015 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:53:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from lee@localhost) by gw.retro.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id h4H6rSr18945 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 16 May 2003 23:53:28 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 23:53:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Thompson-Herbert Message-Id: <200305170653.h4H6rSr18945@gw.retro.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sheryl Nance-Durst wrote: [about using stones in polymer clays] > If you want to use acrylic stones, you just press them into the clay before > you > bake it to make an impression, then remove the acrylic stone and bake the > piece. > When it is cool, you just glue the stone into the impressed area with > superglue. Beware that some brands of polymer clay shrink more than others. Premo and Liquid Scupley shink the most, but they're also the strongest (use a cheap brass finding as the mold for Liquid Scupley and Translucent Liquid Scupley). Fimo seems to shrink the least, but I haven't used Fimo in 6-7 years now and they've changed the formula some since then. For the properties of the various polymer clay brands, I suggest browsing through the archives at The Glass Attic: http://www.glassattic.com/ Among other things, there are several methods of making faux gemstones that are documented there. Part of the secret is in how you finish the clay. Premo and TLS are hard enough that they can be gently buffed on a bench grinder, which gives a high polish finish. At also avoids that "clay" look. The other things many artists do is seal their buffed pieces with either Flecto Diamond Elite varnish (this is a water-based acrylic varnish made by the same company that puts out Varathane), or Future floor finish (a softer acrylic finish). Doing both of those things will give you much more realistic looking faux gemstones. Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 02:54:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6s2HP021579 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 02:54:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6sLUw026301 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 00:54:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6sKrW002153; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:54:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4H6s7rW002068 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 00:54:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ACC361200032; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:54:59 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AC8F13C3013A; Sat, 17 May 2003 01:54:07 -0500 Message-ID: <008d01c31c3e$f00deb60$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001701c31c1c$a63bba20$0400a8c0@comcast.net><4.3.1.2.20030516224515.05153930@mail.frys.com> <006601c31c3b$3deb8800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 02:38:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have found out that painting #4 is called the Water Pageant of Westminster. Still have not found the image or artist name online. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 08:10:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HCAEHP007616 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 08:10:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HCAGUw012456 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 06:10:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HCA8dd003735; Sat, 17 May 2003 06:10:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web40017.mail.yahoo.com (web40017.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.57]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4HCA6dd003701 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 06:10:06 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030517121001.66341.qmail@web40017.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [212.126.133.226] by web40017.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:10:00 BST Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 13:10:00 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Rachel?= To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305170621.h4H6L6rZ015376@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: My embroidery website X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ok it was working when I loaded it up last night. I have now reloaded the site again and it seems to be working fine to me. The few images I have should be in the Commissions bit of the site. Rachel ===== Rachel Tudor Bibliography http://website.lineone.net/~reholliday/Tudor/ __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus For a better Internet experience http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 09:23:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HDNAHP007759 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 09:23:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HDNSUw016629 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 07:23:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HDNR73006081; Sat, 17 May 2003 07:23:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4HDNO73006009 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 07:23:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCuEBK28R+sbTprpirUFgjZopogK8I4AZsw==">; Sat, 17 May 2003 09:22:40 EDT Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HYDTMYD3; Sat, 17 May 2003 09:22:40 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 07:22:20 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? Message-ID: <20030517.072220.-239897151.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-12,14-23 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My money is on it being a picture of St. Martin-In-The-Fields. It faces onto Trafalgar Square. I have a picture of it and it matches the architectureal details of the painting almost perfectly. http://www.stmartin-in-the-fields.org/jserv/belief/index.jsp Karen On Sat, 17 May 2003 02:12:05 -0400 "Penny Ladnier" writes: > Kayta, > > Alright, this artist must have loved this Greek looking building... > check this out > http://www.artunframed.com/images/artmis21/logsdai99.jpg > > Susan says it looks like the front of the opera house in My Fair > Lady. > > Penny Ladnier ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 10:33:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEXTHP007983 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 10:33:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEXjUw021055 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 08:33:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEXfNM008144; Sat, 17 May 2003 08:33:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEXdNM008121 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 08:33:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19H2kk-000M2V-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:33:38 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 23:46:35 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] how does he do that? was One or two people in this Bruegel? References: <20030515101817.R51982-100000@shell.siscom.net> <006401c31af4$69df7360$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> In-Reply-To: <006401c31af4$69df7360$7882c418@mad.chartermi.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I should think so - Breughel's dancers seem to lift their knees a lot, which needs the hose to pull down from the back waist - think of measuring your sleeve round a bent elbow Jean lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote >Would dancing be included in "active occupations"? There is one picture in >particular (the wedding dance?) where there are a lot of examples of points >seemingly tying to nothing. > >********************** >Rebecca Schmitt >aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot >BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence > >A room without books is like a body without a soul >---Cicero > >lotsofteapots@charter.net >********************** > > >> The breeches would be fastened to the doublet/jerkin that the man is >> wearing. If you look reeeeally close, you can see the lacing holes along >> the bottom. He untied his points so he could bend over and get more >> mobility, something which is a common sight in scenes of manual labor, >> fighting or other active occupations in the 15th & 16th centuries. >> >> Drea >> > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 10:42:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEgYHP007997 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 10:42:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEgrUw021505 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 08:42:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEgqNM012543; Sat, 17 May 2003 08:42:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEgmNM012476 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 08:42:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.netmtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 17 May 2003 10:42:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 09:42:22 -0500 From: Allison Pace In-reply-to: <200305170621.h4H6L6rX015376@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO When PMC clay first came out, my jewelry-making teacher went to a workshop and came back with all sorts of info and techniques about this wonderful new product. But after several experiments we discovered that there's no substitute for the real thing (actual metal.) After it's fired (yes, at very high temps, but still not as high as other metals and clays - it requires a special kiln - of course!) PMC becomes brittle. We determined that it needs to be used for 1) Items that are small (smaller than a quarter) so they won't have so much surface area and 2) Items that won't get much handling. Rings are not good candidates for PMC, as they tend to crack and break when they are banged against hard surfaces. That said, PMC is great for beads and charms and small embellishments. You can also fire stones in place, if you use CZ-hardness stones - and don't forget to allow for about 20% shrinkage of the clay during firing. Look in the Rio Grande catalogue for more information. I have fired Sculpey in my toaster oven with plastic stones in place and had no trouble at all! I did, however, stand there the whole time prepared to yank them out in case they ignited... The small plastic (4mm?) stones melted just a tiny bit - I had actually hoped they would melt more, to fill in the space. I wanted them to look more like old cabochon-cut stones instead of cheap plastic facets. But even firing in place, I found the stones still needed to be glued down afterward. I'd be interested to see how the button-making turns out. I have wanted to do some of that as well. So go ahead, Kimiko! (or was it Sheryl?) You go first and then the rest of us can learn from YOUR mistakes!!! Allison P. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 10:44:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEiuHP008003 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 10:44:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEjFUw021617 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 08:45:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEjFNM013656; Sat, 17 May 2003 08:45:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net (albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.120]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HEjCNM013630 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 08:45:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19H2vv-00044Q-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 17 May 2003 07:45:11 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 07:45:10 -0700 Message-ID: <000001c31c82$eb996250$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200305170653.h4H6rSr18945@gw.retro.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [h-cost] Making Gems/Jewelry with polymr clay:was Looking for buttons for partlet X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am enjoying the heck out of reading about the faux jewelry and gem stones. Thanks so much for the link to the archives. Wow, I can feel the urge to create coming on!! Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 11:17:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HFHNHP008120 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 11:17:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HFHYUw023533 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 09:17:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HFHXWh029987; Sat, 17 May 2003 09:17:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.kc.rr.com (fe2.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HFHVWh029977 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 09:17:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from karen ([24.31.233.125]) by mail2.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 17 May 2003 10:17:30 -0500 From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 10:17:32 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of them out here: http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to updating the site. Talia > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Allison Pace > Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 9:42 AM > To: h-costume@indra.com > Subject: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey > > > When PMC clay first came out, my jewelry-making teacher went to a > workshop and came back with all sorts of info and techniques about this > wonderful new product. But after several experiments we discovered > that there's no substitute for the real thing (actual metal.) After > it's fired (yes, at very high temps, but still not as high as other > metals and clays - it requires a special kiln - of course!) PMC becomes > brittle. We determined that it needs to be used for 1) Items that are > small (smaller than a quarter) so they won't have so much surface area > and 2) Items that won't get much handling. Rings are not good > candidates for PMC, as they tend to crack and break when they are > banged against hard surfaces. That said, PMC is great for beads and > charms and small embellishments. You can also fire stones in place, if > you use CZ-hardness stones - and don't forget to allow for about 20% > shrinkage of the clay during firing. Look in the Rio Grande catalogue > for more information. > > I have fired Sculpey in my toaster oven with plastic stones in place > and had no trouble at all! I did, however, stand there the whole time > prepared to yank them out in case they ignited... The small plastic > (4mm?) stones melted just a tiny bit - I had actually hoped they would > melt more, to fill in the space. I wanted them to look more like old > cabochon-cut stones instead of cheap plastic facets. But even firing > in place, I found the stones still needed to be glued down afterward. > > I'd be interested to see how the button-making turns out. I have > wanted to do some of that as well. So go ahead, Kimiko! (or was it > Sheryl?) You go first and then the rest of us can learn from YOUR > mistakes!!! > > Allison P. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 12:45:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HGjKHP008659 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 12:45:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HGjXUw028669 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 10:45:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HGjVgI008257; Sat, 17 May 2003 10:45:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HGjTgI008197 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 10:45:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp01-179.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.120.179]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECDB7BE85F for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 18:45:21 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC667AF.6050905@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 18:47:43 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO They are beautiful! Could you make those buttons that are on the partlet? The problem I have with clay is that even working with the softest clay my hands start to hurt. I think there maby more people on this list who would like to have them :-) . http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlet.html I just need 225 the same buttons.... Greetings, Deredere Talia wrote: >I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of them out here: > >http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm > >I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to updating the >site. > >Talia > > > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On >>Behalf Of Allison Pace >>Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 9:42 AM >>To: h-costume@indra.com >>Subject: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey >> >> >>When PMC clay first came out, my jewelry-making teacher went to a >>workshop and came back with all sorts of info and techniques about this >>wonderful new product. But after several experiments we discovered >>that there's no substitute for the real thing (actual metal.) After >>it's fired (yes, at very high temps, but still not as high as other >>metals and clays - it requires a special kiln - of course!) PMC becomes >>brittle. We determined that it needs to be used for 1) Items that are >>small (smaller than a quarter) so they won't have so much surface area >>and 2) Items that won't get much handling. Rings are not good >>candidates for PMC, as they tend to crack and break when they are >>banged against hard surfaces. That said, PMC is great for beads and >>charms and small embellishments. You can also fire stones in place, if >>you use CZ-hardness stones - and don't forget to allow for about 20% >>shrinkage of the clay during firing. Look in the Rio Grande catalogue >>for more information. >> >>I have fired Sculpey in my toaster oven with plastic stones in place >>and had no trouble at all! I did, however, stand there the whole time >>prepared to yank them out in case they ignited... The small plastic >>(4mm?) stones melted just a tiny bit - I had actually hoped they would >>melt more, to fill in the space. I wanted them to look more like old >>cabochon-cut stones instead of cheap plastic facets. But even firing >>in place, I found the stones still needed to be glued down afterward. >> >>I'd be interested to see how the button-making turns out. I have >>wanted to do some of that as well. So go ahead, Kimiko! (or was it >>Sheryl?) You go first and then the rest of us can learn from YOUR >>mistakes!!! >> >>Allison P. >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 15:12:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJCqHP009097 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:12:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJCoUw008882 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 13:12:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJCk8E026290; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:12:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJCh8E026266 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:12:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pavilion (213-78-96-3.friaco.onetel.net.uk [213.78.96.3]) 3.2.2-GA) with SMTP id ADE14617; Sat, 17 May 2003 20:12:41 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <007f01c31ca8$c5dbb6a0$88794ed5@pavilion> From: "Melanie Wilson" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 20:16:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Two tips use PMC 2 or 3 for better results and fire using a small butane torch (the type one uses for creme brulee) Mel This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the Company, unless specifically stated. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 15:19:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJJ5HP009114 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:19:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJJCUw009345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 13:19:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJJB8E029282; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:19:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJJ98E029249 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:19:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4HJHUne022419 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 12:17:30 -0700 Message-ID: <3EC68ADE.9030108@misc.com> Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 12:17:50 -0700 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO To Talia- Very pretty work on your site!! Yet another bookmark in my overflowing list. Thanks for posting!! Theresa Eacker Talia wrote: > I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of them out here: > > http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm > > I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to updating the > site. > > Talia _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 15:31:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJVxHP009244 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:31:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJW7Uw010145 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 13:32:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJW58E005477; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:32:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.kc.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJW38E005460 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:32:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail5.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 17 May 2003 14:30:41 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030517143501.009efe10@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 14:37:37 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030516192633.02cc6a50@127.0.0.1> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030516175229.00a01500@pop3.norton.antivirus> <5.1.0.14.0.20030515102329.02cce738@127.0.0.1> <3EC3A178.2050804@kabelfoon.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 07:32 PM 5/16/03 -0700, you wrote: >Sheryl > >Thanks so much for the correction, and the book recommendation. I haven't >gotten out the clays and made anything yet, so it was comments from others >I had heard, and probably gotten them mixed up in my head on PMC clay. >Would PMC clay then be fired in a kiln, such as pottery is fired in? I >have only heard it was fired, not baked, and fired to me means in a kiln. > >Kimiko Yes, PMC clay is "fired" in a kiln (or with a butane torch). What you end up with after the clay is fired off is almost pure silver (the most common) or gold, depending on which clay you bought. Polymer clay is a plastic polymer that bakes in the oven for about 1/2 hour to harden it. You can make some really cool looking faux stones and faux wood finishes with it. Sheryl N-D _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 15:32:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJWMHP009251 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:32:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJWcUw010173 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 13:32:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJWc8E005732; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:32:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJWY8E005708 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:32:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fd0.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.208]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 6144F262963 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 21:32:33 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000701c31cab$712632e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 21:35:15 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] Leloir again. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am sitting here with some old photocopy of costumes i had made many years ago at the Museum of Fine Arts Library. Some are from Maurice Leloirs: Histoire du Costume. One of the copyes is a ladys outfit from 1630. With a reconstrukted french farthingale ( Vertugadin en bourrelet) The Dress looks authentic, made of brocade over a petticoat with trimmings, and the wired standing Collar looks pretty authentic two, with matching cuffs. Are there any of you costume folks out there, who ever visited the Museums of Paris, who has seen this dress? What has become of it? It is a very rare Dress from 1630 and i wondered why there is not made other publications about this dress. I also wonder why french museums dont have made any english publications about their collektions. Is this a french thing, that they dont want to public english, to keep it for themselves? Acording to these photocopyes i have from Leloir's book, there seems to be many rare treassures wich apparantly not many knows about. Any? Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 15:34:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJYJHP009296 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:34:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJYbUw010291 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 13:34:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJYb8E006615; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:34:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJYZ8E006584 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:34:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fd0.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.208]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 54E87262A20 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 21:34:34 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000d01c31cab$ba46bfd0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030516.131712.1588.0.Cley@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Finally, I have finished my "weddingdress" sleeves!! Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 21:37:18 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Deredere. Very beautifull weddingdress. I enjoyed to look at it. Thanks for posting! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cynthia J Ley" To: Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 10:12 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Finally, I have finished my "weddingdress" sleeves!! > Oh, very pretty! :D > > Arlys > > On Fri, 16 May 2003 18:32:47 +0200 Deredere Galbraith > writes: > > It is slightly more than a year later but they are finished!!!!! > > Pictures of them on the bottem of this page. > > http://home.kabelfoon.nl/~triade/Weddingdress/weddingdress.html > > > > Greetings, > > Deredere > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 15:37:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJbaHP009335 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:37:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJbpUw010810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 13:37:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJboAG009069; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:37:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJblAG009003 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:37:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fd0.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.208]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id E148826298C for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 21:37:45 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001901c31cac$2c9b1720$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030516185030.7591.qmail@web40013.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] My embroidery website Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 21:40:30 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Rachel. The only pictures i get are two of the long blackwork cussion. But that looks wonderfull. I am looking forwards to the other things.............. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rachel" To: "H-costume list" ; "HNW" Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 8:50 PM Subject: [h-cost] My embroidery website > Well I finally managed to get my embroidery online. Although this is only a small portion of my > work, I thought I'd make a start with what I have here. As I try and track down more photographs > of projects done in the past I'll hope to add to them. > > I'd love to hear any comments people might have or suggestions of things that need improving. > > Take a look at: http://www.threadsofhistory.co.uk > > If anyone will be at the V&A for the first weekend in July come and say hello as I will be talking > and demonstrating again in gallery 123 (new British Galleries second floor). This time it's a > solo affair and I won't be in costume. > > Rachel > > ===== > Rachel > > Tudor Bibliography > http://website.lineone.net/~reholliday/Tudor/ > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus > For a better Internet experience > http://www.yahoo.co.uk/btoffer > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 15:46:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJkkHP009356 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:46:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJl4Uw011361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 13:47:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJl3AG013045; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:47:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.kc.rr.com (fe1.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.48]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJl1AG013032 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:47:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail1.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 17 May 2003 14:47:00 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030517143742.009ec870@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 14:52:34 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Looking for buttons for partlet In-Reply-To: <200305170653.h4H6rSr18945@gw.retro.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 11:53 PM 5/16/03 -0700, you wrote: >Sheryl Nance-Durst wrote: >[about using stones in polymer clays] > > If you want to use acrylic stones, you just press them into the clay > before > > you > > bake it to make an impression, then remove the acrylic stone and bake the > > piece. > > When it is cool, you just glue the stone into the impressed area with > > superglue. > >Beware that some brands of polymer clay shrink more than others. Premo >and Liquid Scupley shink the most, but they're also the strongest (use a >cheap brass finding as the mold for Liquid Scupley and Translucent Liquid >Scupley). Fimo seems to shrink the least, but I haven't used Fimo in 6-7 >years now and they've changed the formula some since then. For the properties >of the various polymer clay brands, I suggest browsing through the archives >at The Glass Attic: I use mostly Premo and haven't had any problem setting stones in it before baking. The shrinkage on small jewelry pieces doesn't seem to be a big factor. For beginners, just don't use the white Super Sculpey you can buy by the pound. Yes, it's cheaper. It's also extremely brittle when baked, so things break easily. >http://www.glassattic.com/ Great site! I always learn tons of stuff when I browse there. >Among other things, there are several methods of making faux gemstones that >are documented there. Part of the secret is in how you finish the clay. >Premo and TLS are hard enough that they can be gently buffed on a bench >grinder, which gives a high polish finish. At also avoids that "clay" look. >The other things many artists do is seal their buffed pieces with either >Flecto Diamond Elite varnish (this is a water-based acrylic varnish made >by the same company that puts out Varathane), or Future floor finish (a >softer acrylic finish). Doing both of those things will give you much more >realistic looking faux gemstones. >Lee M.Thompson-Herbert I usually use Future floor polish, since I don't really like messing with varnishes. I also just recently started using clear embossing powder to glaze my simulated opals. It works pretty well, gives it some depth. (I read about it at glassattic.com!) Sheryl N-D _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 15:51:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJpIHP009366 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 15:51:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJpcUw011587 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 13:51:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJpcAG015034; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:51:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail8.kc.rr.com (mail8.kc.rr.com [24.94.162.176]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HJpaAG015020 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 13:51:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail8.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 17 May 2003 14:52:07 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030517145631.009f97e0@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 14:57:09 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:17 AM 5/17/03 -0500, you wrote: >I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of them out here: > >http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm > >I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to updating the >site. > >Talia That's a really good faux ivory! Sheryl N-D _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 16:42:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HKgtHP009540 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 16:42:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HKh8Uw014809 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 14:43:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HKh5u9010126; Sat, 17 May 2003 14:43:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail3.kc.rr.com (fe3.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.50]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4HKh3u9010113 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 14:43:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from karen ([24.31.233.125]) by mail3.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sat, 17 May 2003 15:43:03 -0500 From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 15:43:04 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3EC667AF.6050905@kabelfoon.nl> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you're referring to the buttons with the dark square stones, yes they could be made using polymer clay. Email me privately if you're interesting in hashing out details. talia@kc.rr.com or talia@medieval-treasures.com Talia > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Deredere Galbraith > Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 11:48 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey > > > They are beautiful! > Could you make those buttons that are on the partlet? > The problem I have with clay is that even working with the softest clay > my hands start to hurt. > I think there maby more people on this list who would like to have them > :-) . > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlet.html > I just need 225 the same buttons.... > > Greetings, > Deredere > > Talia wrote: > > >I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of > them out here: > > > >http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm > > > >I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to > updating the > >site. > > > >Talia > > > > > > > >>-----Original Message----- > >>From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > >>Behalf Of Allison Pace > >>Sent: Saturday, May 17, 2003 9:42 AM > >>To: h-costume@indra.com > >>Subject: [h-cost] Re: PMC and Sculpey > >> > >> > >>When PMC clay first came out, my jewelry-making teacher went to a > >>workshop and came back with all sorts of info and techniques about this > >>wonderful new product. But after several experiments we discovered > >>that there's no substitute for the real thing (actual metal.) After > >>it's fired (yes, at very high temps, but still not as high as other > >>metals and clays - it requires a special kiln - of course!) PMC becomes > >>brittle. We determined that it needs to be used for 1) Items that are > >>small (smaller than a quarter) so they won't have so much surface area > >>and 2) Items that won't get much handling. Rings are not good > >>candidates for PMC, as they tend to crack and break when they are > >>banged against hard surfaces. That said, PMC is great for beads and > >>charms and small embellishments. You can also fire stones in place, if > >>you use CZ-hardness stones - and don't forget to allow for about 20% > >>shrinkage of the clay during firing. Look in the Rio Grande catalogue > >>for more information. > >> > >>I have fired Sculpey in my toaster oven with plastic stones in place > >>and had no trouble at all! I did, however, stand there the whole time > >>prepared to yank them out in case they ignited... The small plastic > >>(4mm?) stones melted just a tiny bit - I had actually hoped they would > >>melt more, to fill in the space. I wanted them to look more like old > >>cabochon-cut stones instead of cheap plastic facets. But even firing > >>in place, I found the stones still needed to be glued down afterward. > >> > >>I'd be interested to see how the button-making turns out. I have > >>wanted to do some of that as well. So go ahead, Kimiko! (or was it > >>Sheryl?) You go first and then the rest of us can learn from YOUR > >>mistakes!!! > >> > >>Allison P. > >> > >>_______________________________________________ > >>h-costume mailing list > >>h-costume@mail.indra.com > >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >> > >> > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 20:16:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I0GAHP010190 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 20:16:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I0GEUw028721 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 18:16:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I0G8UX022806; Sat, 17 May 2003 18:16:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.115]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I0G5UX022738 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 18:16:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.netmtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 17 May 2003 20:14:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 19:14:48 -0500 From: Allison Pace In-reply-to: <200305171800.h4HI0h4P015952@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: [h-cost] Re: polymer clay and buttons X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Talia, your buttons are stunning! What an inspiration! And Lee, thanks so much for the link to The Glass Attic. I am anxious to wade through my email and get back to that site! Dadgummit, you guys have got to stop with all the cool stuff. I am barely able to hang on to the projects I started last year!!! Allison P. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 17 20:33:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I0XdHP010221 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 20:33:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I0XwUw029955 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 18:33:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I0XvUX003047; Sat, 17 May 2003 18:33:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I0XrUX002962 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 18:33:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.netmtaout05.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 17 May 2003 20:32:29 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 19:32:26 -0500 From: Allison Pace To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: <32F1DA76-88C8-11D7-920D-000393D446D6@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: [h-cost] A new costume interest X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I went to the annual Greek Food Festival today, where pretty much what you do is eat fabulous food prepared by the little old Greek ladies of the church and watch local people dance and perform in the styles of their ancestral countries. (The little girls doing Middle Eastern were charming...the Middle Eastern women were gorgeous and luscious and riveting. ) There was a group who wore costume from different regions of Greece and Macedonia and other Mediterranean countries, and some of them were quite nice! One woman wore garments handed down from her grandmother. The bottom layer was very full, flowy pantaloons, then a sort of an A-line tabard skirt in a beautiful shiny brocade. She had a (scarf/panel/shawl ?) triangular shaped piece of yet another fabric tied around her waist with the point reaching her knees in back, and from which a large tassel hung. And her jacket was very similar to the others' - sort of bolero style, with almost military-looking linear/geometric braid trim. I couldn't find her later to get a better look, but if anyone knows the style I'm talking about, can you point me in the right direction? I'm thinking it's a good excuse to order fabric from Istok! Allison P. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 01:37:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I5bUHP010925 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 01:37:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I5beUw017884 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 17 May 2003 23:37:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I5bbvd012022; Sat, 17 May 2003 23:37:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4I5bYvd012004 for ; Sat, 17 May 2003 23:37:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-116-239-137.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.116.239.137])h4I5bLWm022303 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 00:37:33 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030517223015.00d4bba0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 22:32:10 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest In-Reply-To: <32F1DA76-88C8-11D7-920D-000393D446D6@comcast.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I couldn't find her later to get a better look, but if anyone knows the >style I'm talking about, can you point me in the right direction? Folk dancers? Go back to the same church on Monday and ask them? Some hypothetical web page put out by the Greek tourist board? Braun and Schneider's book Historic Costume in Pictures (Dover reprinted it)? Max Tilke's book of ethnic costumes? CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 10:28:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IESsHP024647 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 10:28:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IET5Uw013764 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 08:29:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IET2rO008405; Sun, 18 May 2003 08:29:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IESxrO008388 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 08:28:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19HP9m-0004VS-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 18 May 2003 07:28:58 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] A new costume interest Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 07:28:56 -0700 Message-ID: <000701c31d49$d1f77720$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <32F1DA76-88C8-11D7-920D-000393D446D6@comcast.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I can't help you with your interest, but it sounds lovely. I have always wanted to dress like the middle eastern professional women I saw in D.C. I saw a lady attending a Nuclear Regulatory meeting once who had a complete outfit in a sea green crepe and chiffon to die for! Even her veil matched. I would love to walk around incognito like that! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 10:48:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IEmHHP024704 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 10:48:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IEmYUw015060 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 08:48:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IEmXrO016309; Sun, 18 May 2003 08:48:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m03.mx.aol.com (imo-m03.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.6]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IEmVrO016265 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 08:48:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Marionetta@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.18c.1a832f10 (3842) for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 10:48:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Marionetta@aol.com Message-ID: <18c.1a832f10.2bf8f735@aol.com> Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 10:48:21 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] polymer clay X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've been following the polymer clay thread with great interest. I've played around with it for horns for fantasy costumes and drawer pulls for my cupboards but have never seen jewelry that looked as realistic as some of the recent examples. Talia's buttons are especially amazing. Do you all have hints as to how to get the very fine detail that some of these pieces have? I've got a dremel tool and am not afraid to use it... Cheers, Loren > I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of them out here: > > http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm > > I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to updating > the > site. > > Talia > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 10:48:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IEmhHP024707 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 10:48:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IEn3Uw015089 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 08:49:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IEn2rO016471; Sun, 18 May 2003 08:49:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r06.mx.aol.com (imo-r06.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IEn0rO016422 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 08:49:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Marionetta@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.50.1ce8b2b2 (3842) for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 10:48:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Marionetta@aol.com Message-ID: <50.1ce8b2b2.2bf8f74f@aol.com> Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 10:48:47 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] fabric storage question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all, as part of my continuing efforts to organize my sewing room I was looking for something like the large wire baskets on wheels I see at the fabric store to put my big rolls of fabric in. I haven't been able to find these things anywhere, does anyone have any leads? Thanks, Loren _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 11:01:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IF15HP024742 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 11:01:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IF1OUw015801 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 09:01:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IF1NUH021029; Sun, 18 May 2003 09:01:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r02.mx.aol.com (imo-r02.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.98]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IF1KUH020991 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 09:01:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.e6.396c27a2 (4459) for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 11:01:09 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 11:01:09 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric storage question To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Loren, Have you tried the Container Store? They have pretty much everything you could ever concieve of needing in the way of containers, as well as a few things that I'm not sure what to use for. I don't know how large their wire baskets run, but last time I went, they had some. Oh, and they're online at www.containerstore.com, in case you're not near one. Christine In a message dated 5/18/03 10:50:20 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Marionetta@aol.com writes: > as part of my continuing efforts to organize my sewing room I was looking > for > something like the large wire baskets on wheels I see at the fabric store > to > put my big rolls of fabric in. I haven't been able to find these things > anywhere, does anyone have any leads? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 11:03:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IF3mHP024757 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 11:03:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IF47Uw015960 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 09:04:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IF46UH021902; Sun, 18 May 2003 09:04:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail7.kc.rr.com (fe7.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.162.160]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IF44UH021891 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 09:04:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from karen ([24.31.233.125]) by mail7.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sun, 18 May 2003 10:03:08 -0500 From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] polymer clay Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 10:04:05 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <18c.1a832f10.2bf8f735@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've done a lot of cast sterling and gold jewelry, which usually starts with a hard wax master carving which is then cast and molded to reproduce however many you want of an object. When I discovered polymer clay three months ago, I just naturally proceeded the same way I would have if I were making a metal piece of jewelry, with the exception that the carved model IS the master, rather than having to cast it and then reproduce it. So, I carve whatever object I want in hard wax, mold it with RTV compound and press my PC directly into the RTV mold when it has cured. Most of the buttons are my own original carvings. There are a couple where I have taken buttons from the late 1800s or early 1900s and molded them. I wouldn't do modern buttons because of copyright issues. Talia > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Marionetta@aol.com > Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 9:48 AM > To: h-costume@indra.com > Subject: [h-cost] polymer clay > > > > I've been following the polymer clay thread with great interest. I've > played around with it for horns for fantasy costumes and drawer > pulls for my > cupboards but have never seen jewelry that looked as realistic as > some of the > recent examples. Talia's buttons are especially amazing. Do > you all have > hints as to how to get the very fine detail that some of these > pieces have? > I've got a dremel tool and am not afraid to use it... > > Cheers, > Loren > > > I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of > them out here: > > > > http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm > > > > I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to > updating > > the > > site. > > > > Talia > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 12:45:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IGjEHP025163 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 12:45:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IGjPUw022092 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 10:45:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IGgg97002915; Sun, 18 May 2003 10:42:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law8-oe52.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.41]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IGge97002879 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 10:42:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 18 May 2003 09:42:34 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe52.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:42:34 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <50.1ce8b2b2.2bf8f74f@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric storage question Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 12:42:10 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 May 2003 16:42:34.0843 (UTC) FILETIME=[7BD79AB0:01C31D5C] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hmm... IKEA? ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 10:48 AM Subject: [h-cost] fabric storage question > > Hi all, > as part of my continuing efforts to organize my sewing room I was looking for > something like the large wire baskets on wheels I see at the fabric store to > put my big rolls of fabric in. I haven't been able to find these things > anywhere, does anyone have any leads? > > Thanks, > > Loren > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 14:09:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4II9MHP025461 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 14:09:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4II9WUw027196 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 12:09:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4II7e2N004235; Sun, 18 May 2003 12:07:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4II7c2N004179 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 12:07:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from PallasAMK@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.15f.2090cc77 (18251) for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 14:07:27 -0400 (EDT) From: PallasAMK@aol.com Message-ID: <15f.2090cc77.2bf925df@aol.com> Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 14:07:27 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Re: A new costume interest X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/18/03 8:05:16 AM Pacific Daylight Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: > A new costume interest Umm, speaking as a Greek, using the term "Middle Eastern" to refer to Greeks is incorrect, and might even get you into some trouble--we have loooooong memories--hundreds,even thousands, of years. Old feuds die hard, and lots of them are with countries in the Middle East. Greeks are Europeans, and consider themselves (ourselves) Europeans for many, many reasons, not least of all because ancient Greece was one of the bases for the development of European culture and language. Middle Eastern refers to an entirely different part of the world, with different customs, music, food and dominant religion. Whatever you do, don't go to a Greek festival and mention how much you like Middle Eastern food--the ya-yas (grandmas) who did all the cooking will have a thing or two to say about it! As for the costumes--I am betting that those are all folk dance costumes, that arose sometime during the great folk revival of the 19th century, mostly fantasy, but swell nonetheless. To be frank, the real ethnic dress of the region--not so much in Athens any more, since it is a cosmopolitan city, but certainly on some of the smaller islands--is the frumpy black dress, donned as mourning and once put on, just seems to stay on. Pallas _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 15:50:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IJoxHP025794 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 15:50:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IJpDUw004298 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 13:51:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IJpCEe014580; Sun, 18 May 2003 13:51:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IJp9Ee014526 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 13:51:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-223.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.223]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E18F0BEB18 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:51:02 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC7E4B5.6030603@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 21:53:25 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] polymer clay References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, What is RTV?? Greetings, Deredere >So, I carve whatever object I want in hard wax, mold it with RTV compound >and press my PC directly into the RTV mold when it has cured. Most of the >buttons are my own original carvings. There are a couple where I have taken >buttons from the late 1800s or early 1900s and molded them. I wouldn't do >modern buttons because of copyright issues. > >Talia > > > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On >>Behalf Of Marionetta@aol.com >>Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 9:48 AM >>To: h-costume@indra.com >>Subject: [h-cost] polymer clay >> >> >> >>I've been following the polymer clay thread with great interest. I've >>played around with it for horns for fantasy costumes and drawer >>pulls for my >>cupboards but have never seen jewelry that looked as realistic as >>some of the >>recent examples. Talia's buttons are especially amazing. Do >>you all have >>hints as to how to get the very fine detail that some of these >>pieces have? >>I've got a dremel tool and am not afraid to use it... >> >>Cheers, >>Loren >> >> >> >>>I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of >>> >>> >>them out here: >> >> >>>http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm >>> >>>I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to >>> >>> >>updating >> >> >>>the >>>site. >>> >>>Talia >>> >>> >>> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 15:54:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IJsWHP025812 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 15:54:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IJslUw004576 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 13:54:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IJskEe015915; Sun, 18 May 2003 13:54:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.kc.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IJsjEe015901 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 13:54:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from karen ([24.31.233.125]) by mail5.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sun, 18 May 2003 14:53:22 -0500 From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] polymer clay Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 14:54:46 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3EC7E4B5.6030603@kabelfoon.nl> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ah, sorry...Room Temperature Vulcanizing mold compound. Basically you can make a mold of a wax master without fear of the wax melting as it would if you tried to make a traditional vulcanized rubber mold of it. Talia > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Deredere Galbraith > Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 2:53 PM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost] polymer clay > > > Hi, > > What is RTV?? > > Greetings, > Deredere > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 16:18:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IKI7HP025905 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:18:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IKINUw006501 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 14:18:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IKIMgM025646; Sun, 18 May 2003 14:18:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IKIJgM025600 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 14:18:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host-66-81-240-215.rev.o1.com ([66.81.240.215] helo=[66.81.241.100]) by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19HUbp-0007kJ-00 for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:18:17 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: claning@pop.igc.org Message-Id: Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 11:15:56 -0700 To: h-costume@net.indra.com From: Chris Laning Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Subject: [h-cost] Thread winders X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO For anyone putting together a period sewing-basket, I was amazed to find yesterday that there is someone selling small bone thread winders for an incredibly low price. On the Web, go to http://www.dabeadbabe.com/ Click on "Bone beads" and then on "Bone Specialties" There are two kinds: NK-968 -- round 32mm "bone bobbins" -- 10 for $4.41 ME-836 -- cross-shaped 30mm "bone bobbins" -- 15 for $4.46 The last time I bought these from someone else, they were $1 apiece, and since I haven't seen them *anywhere* for about four years, I'm very happy to see this. For anyone who doesn't know what I'm talking about, "thread winders" were what you used to hold your (silk) embroidery thread after you unwound it from the skein it came in. While I've seen pictures of ordinary sewing thread wound on a short piece of wooden dowel, for silk you need something that can be polished so it doesn't snag the thread. From the hints I've been able to get from research (too many books think that life only became interesting _after_ 1600) it seems to me that spools, of the type we know today, were very uncommon, and that essentially all thread came in hanks or skeins. Having tried to deal with silk thread that comes in a skein, I can testify that you do indeed need something to wind it onto, once you open the skein -- otherwise it will tangle if you so much as look at it cross-eyed. -- _________________________________________________________ O Chris Laning | + Davis, California _________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 18:01:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IM1IHP026441 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 18:01:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IM1ZUw014483 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 16:01:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IM1XWv009350; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:01:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IM1UWv009300 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:01:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Marionetta@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.180.1a6e4a14 (4328) for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 18:01:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Marionetta@aol.com Message-ID: <180.1a6e4a14.2bf95caf@aol.com> Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 18:01:19 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Thunderbird - Mac OS X sub 25 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] fabric storage question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks for the suggestions, unfortunately I haven't found the carts I'm looking for at Ikea or the Container Store. I need something large and very sturdy, preferably with casters, to hold a multitude of rolled fabric (a la calico corners). I see steel metal baskets on casters like this all the time at JoAnns, etc., but can't seem to find a source for them for the home sewer...any clues? Cheers, Loren _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 18:02:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IM2oHP026458 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 18:02:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IM37Uw014618 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 16:03:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IM36Wv010117; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:03:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailrelay.mebtel.net (spambuster4.mebtel.net [64.40.67.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IM35Wv010107 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:03:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grics.net (66-79-58-72.dsl.dixnil.grics.net [66.79.58.72]) by mailrelay.mebtel.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DBBD283EF for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 17:56:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EC811BE.3050405@grics.net> Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 18:05:34 -0500 From: "H. Law" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] RTV (was polymer clay) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO would that be different from the kind you get at the auto parts store? edwinna the Out-Of-It Talia wrote: >Ah, sorry...Room Temperature Vulcanizing mold compound. Basically you can >make a mold of a wax master without fear of the wax melting as it would if >you tried to make a traditional vulcanized rubber mold of it. > >Talia > > > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On >>Behalf Of Deredere Galbraith >>Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 2:53 PM >>To: Historical Costume >>Subject: Re: [h-cost] polymer clay >> >> >>Hi, >> >>What is RTV?? >> >>Greetings, >> Deredere >> >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 18:10:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IMACHP026494 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 18:10:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IMAVUw015337 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 16:10:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IMAUWv014069; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:10:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailrelay.mebtel.net (spambuster4.mebtel.net [64.40.67.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IMATWv014048 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:10:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grics.net (66-79-58-72.dsl.dixnil.grics.net [66.79.58.72]) by mailrelay.mebtel.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D134628991 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 18:03:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EC81379.5020006@grics.net> Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 18:12:57 -0500 From: "H. Law" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric storage question References: <180.1a6e4a14.2bf95caf@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <180.1a6e4a14.2bf95caf@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO seems to me I've seen large cardboard drums at lumber yards and woodworking shops, but can't remember if those have casters. They are fairly heavy, so they wouldn't be too likely to tip over. There are also big outdoor garbage cans that either have them or are set on a small platforms that do. is there a home depot or menards, or a lumber yard near you? edwinna Marionetta@aol.com wrote: >Thanks for the suggestions, unfortunately I haven't found the carts I'm >looking for at Ikea or the Container Store. I need something large and very >sturdy, preferably with casters, to hold a multitude of rolled fabric (a la >calico corners). I see steel metal baskets on casters like this all the >time at JoAnns, etc., but can't seem to find a source for them for the home >sewer...any clues? > >Cheers, > >Loren > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 19:02:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IN2DHP026696 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 19:02:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IN2TUw019087 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 17:02:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IN2SRk009482; Sun, 18 May 2003 17:02:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from puffin.mail.pas.earthlink.net (puffin.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.139]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4IN2QRk009462 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 17:02:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-003-115.jps.net ([216.119.3.115] helo=w7m1l6) by puffin.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19HXAe-0004B4-00; Sun, 18 May 2003 16:02:24 -0700 Message-ID: <002601c31d91$7615a7e0$730377d8@w7m1l6> From: "Stephen Bergdahl" To: , , , , , , Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 16:01:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-ELNK-Trace: 08dba192340bde6e1a6ab3b9b70940f894f5150ab1c16ac027907a4ca0ac1adfd4fdf591230c997ee3ec63d2a656c3e3350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Subject: [h-cost] Bay Con Membership - Maybe OT X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello This will be of interest to only a few, but this is the best way to get this information out. So, sorry to the other 99% of you. I have an extra membership for Bay Con 2003, which is the Bay Areas Science fiction Convention. Held in San Jose, over the Memorial Day weekend May 23th - 26th. The membership is for all days and is priced at $60. If you are interested please contact me at: madlystitching@earthlink.net It's first come first served. Stephen Bergdahl - Lord Vich "I don't suffer from insanity! I fact I rather enjoy it!" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 23:17:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3HkHP027453 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 23:17:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3I1Uw007544 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 21:18:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3Hxp1005849; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:17:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3Hup1005835 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:17:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5221C7AE65 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 20:17:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 40857-03 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 20:17:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-207-102-211.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.207.102.211]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CF8A7AA95 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 20:17:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 20:08:22 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric storage question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <180.1a6e4a14.2bf95caf@aol.com> Message-Id: <2617FB00-89A7-11D7-AF3D-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would look around for a commercial laundry supplier. The only other places I've seen carts like that are in hospital laundries and dry cleaners. On Sunday, May 18, 2003, at 03:01 PM, Marionetta@aol.com wrote: > > Thanks for the suggestions, unfortunately I haven't found the carts I'm > looking for at Ikea or the Container Store. I need something large > and very > sturdy, preferably with casters, to hold a multitude of rolled fabric > (a la > calico corners). I see steel metal baskets on casters like this all > the > time at JoAnns, etc., but can't seem to find a source for them for the > home > sewer...any clues? > > Cheers, > > Loren > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 23:33:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3XRHP027483 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 23:33:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3XgUw008416 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 21:33:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3Xdp1012062; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:33:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net (conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.54]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3Xbp1012048 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:33:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19HbP6-0004uQ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 18 May 2003 20:33:36 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Thread winders Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 20:33:36 -0700 Message-ID: <000f01c31db7$6edcf160$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks, those are very cool! "The root of education is bitter, the fruit sweet" Isocrates _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 23:40:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3etHP027505 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 23:40:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3f5Uw008988 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 21:41:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3f4p1015106; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:41:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net (conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.54]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3f0p1015061 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:41:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19HbWG-0005XY-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 18 May 2003 20:41:00 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] fabric storage question Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 20:41:00 -0700 Message-ID: <001001c31db8$77493420$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-Reply-To: <180.1a6e4a14.2bf95caf@aol.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I know this is not exactly what you are looking for, but it may be an inexpensive alternative. You can buy used (or even find for free sometimes) sturdy plastic 55 gallon drums cut in half (look at feed stores-they make horse feeders out of them or dairies may also have used ones.) Look for the ones that have a ridge around the top. You can attach casters to these. I use one all the time for costume 'shows' for my rolls of fabric. They fit nicely in the corner too! When they collect enough stuff to warrant cleaning, you can just hose 'em out and bleach them if necessary! (You probably won't have to do that, mine just doubled as a watering tank for awhile :) ) Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 18 23:43:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3hZHP027513 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 23:43:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3hqUw009162 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 18 May 2003 21:43:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3hqp1016309; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:43:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net (conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.54]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J3g2p1015613 for ; Sun, 18 May 2003 21:42:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by conure.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19HbXF-0006fg-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 18 May 2003 20:42:01 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: A new costume interest Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 20:42:01 -0700 Message-ID: <001301c31db8$9bc7dae0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-Reply-To: <15f.2090cc77.2bf925df@aol.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you for the education...I am glad to have this information. And thank you also for a great sense of humor! Sg "The root of education is bitter, the fruit sweet" Isocrates ~-----Original Message----- ~From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On ~Behalf Of PallasAMK@aol.com ~Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 11:07 AM ~To: h-costume@indra.com ~Subject: [h-cost] Re: A new costume interest ~ ~In a message dated 5/18/03 8:05:16 AM Pacific Daylight Time, ~h-costume-request@indra.com writes: ~ ~ ~> A new costume interest ~ ~Umm, speaking as a Greek, using the term "Middle Eastern" to refer to Greeks ~is incorrect, and might even get you into some trouble--we have loooooong ~memories--hundreds,even thousands, of years. Old feuds die hard, and lots of ~them are with countries in the Middle East. Greeks are Europeans, and ~consider themselves (ourselves) Europeans for many, many reasons, not least ~of all because ancient Greece was one of the bases for the development of ~European culture and language. Middle Eastern refers to an entirely ~different part of the world, with different customs, music, food and dominant ~religion. ~ ~Whatever you do, don't go to a Greek festival and mention how much you like ~Middle Eastern food--the ya-yas (grandmas) who did all the cooking will have ~a thing or two to say about it! ~ ~As for the costumes--I am betting that those are all folk dance costumes, ~that arose sometime during the great folk revival of the 19th century, mostly ~fantasy, but swell nonetheless. To be frank, the real ethnic dress of the ~region--not so much in Athens any more, since it is a cosmopolitan city, but ~certainly on some of the smaller islands--is the frumpy black dress, donned ~as mourning and once put on, just seems to stay on. ~ ~Pallas ~_______________________________________________ ~h-costume mailing list ~h-costume@mail.indra.com ~http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 04:08:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J883HP011041 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 04:08:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J884Uw024421 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 02:08:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J880HN029156; Mon, 19 May 2003 02:08:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J87vHN029144 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 02:07:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19Hfgb-0001t5-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:07:57 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 18:38:30 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest References: <32F1DA76-88C8-11D7-920D-000393D446D6@comcast.net> <000701c31d49$d1f77720$6401a8c0@mycomputer> In-Reply-To: <000701c31d49$d1f77720$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's so unfair that people from Middle Eastern / Indian / Far Eastern cultures can get away with wearing silks and glowing colours for important work-type meetings. Why can't I wear a bliaut to a working group? Jean Saragrace Knauf wrote > >I can't help you with your interest, but it sounds lovely. I have >always wanted to dress like the middle eastern professional women I saw >in D.C. I saw a lady attending a Nuclear Regulatory meeting once who >had a complete outfit in a sea green crepe and chiffon to die for! Even >her veil matched. I would love to walk around incognito like that! > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 05:20:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J9KhHP030533 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 05:20:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J9L1Uw029624 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 03:21:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J9L0ZB021732; Mon, 19 May 2003 03:21:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (mta5.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4J9KvZB021712 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 03:20:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.116.236.20]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HF4004I0NAWEB@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 19 May 2003 02:20:56 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 02:17:41 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] RTV (was polymer clay) In-reply-to: <3EC811BE.3050405@grics.net> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030519021628.00d4a650@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yes. It's that goopy red gasket sealer. >would that be different from the kind you get at the auto parts store? >> >>Ah, sorry...Room Temperature Vulcanizing mold compound. Basically you can >>make a mold of a wax master without fear of the wax melting as it would if >>you tried to make a traditional vulcanized rubber mold of it. >> >>What is RTV?? CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 06:22:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JAMtHP030714 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 06:22:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JAN8Uw002810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 04:23:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JAN74b011799; Mon, 19 May 2003 04:23:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp2.suscom.net (smtp.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JAN54b011734 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 04:23:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id DDE9B112360 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 06:22:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <020301c31df0$9f5a2ef0$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <32F1DA76-88C8-11D7-920D-000393D446D6@comcast.net> <000701c31d49$d1f77720$6401a8c0@mycomputer> Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 06:22:59 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Who says you can't? Dianne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Waddie" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 1:38 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest > It's so unfair that people from Middle Eastern / Indian / Far Eastern > cultures can get away with wearing silks and glowing colours for > important work-type meetings. Why can't I wear a bliaut to a working > group? > > Jean > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 06:52:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JAqFHP030783 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 06:52:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JAqXUw005795 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 04:52:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JAqW4b024554; Mon, 19 May 2003 04:52:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41811.mail.yahoo.com (web41811.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.145]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4JAqU4b024514 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 04:52:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030519105225.59144.qmail@web41811.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [202.129.95.21] by web41811.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 19 May 2003 20:52:25 EST Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 20:52:25 +1000 (EST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Michelle=20Munzone?= To: h-costume@net.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO please take (UN-SUBSCRIBE) me off this mailing list, thank you my email is- michelledolls@yahoo.com.au Michelle Munzone --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mobile - Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 09:04:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JD45HP031160 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:04:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JD48Uw018036 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 07:04:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JD4671021936; Mon, 19 May 2003 07:04:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JD4371021910 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 07:04:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4JD3Tp04024.; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:03:29 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:03:05 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 14:02:48 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Painting??? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4JD4371021910 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Not the same building! The painting with the flower-girl is St Martin-in-the-Fields, the other says it is the Royal Exchange; you can see that the surrounding buildings are different. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> penny@costumegallery.com 05/17/03 07:12am >>> Kayta, Alright, this artist must have loved this Greek looking building... check this out http://www.artunframed.com/images/artmis21/logsdai99.jpg Susan says it looks like the front of the opera house in My Fair Lady. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 09:10:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JDAtHP031182 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:10:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JDB7Uw018610 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 07:11:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JDB671024930; Mon, 19 May 2003 07:11:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JDB371024858 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 07:11:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-166.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.166]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF5DF19FB23 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 15:10:57 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC8D871.6080302@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 15:13:21 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Thanks!!!! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I just want to say thank you for all the kind words and anwsers to my sometymes silly questions. And for all the inspirations that make me go just a little further than I normally would. Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 09:19:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JDJAHP031216 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:19:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JDJLUw019312 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 07:19:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JDJK71028385; Mon, 19 May 2003 07:19:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JDJG71028318 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 07:19:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-166.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.166]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC10EBED08 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 15:19:10 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3EC8DA5F.3020303@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 15:21:35 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Partlet update X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, My husband offered me his help with making the buttons for the partlet :-) :-) . Hopefully I will be able to finish the partlet before 19 June. Then we will go to an SCA event where we wil celebrate the 10 years existence of the kindom of Drachenwald(Europe). Good reason tho wear our best clothes. I made the master, mould and four test buttons. You can find pictures on my website http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlettest.jpg Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 10:55:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JEtxHP031593 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:55:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JEu2Uw029783 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 08:56:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JEtxBe020120; Mon, 19 May 2003 08:55:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JEtuBe020036 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 08:55:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.101] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD1B186100C4; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:41:31 -0400 Message-ID: <001b01c31e17$349ea880$655183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <50.1ce8b2b2.2bf8f74f@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric storage question Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 10:59:06 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On the subject, another source might be industrial supply items that you might get your local hardware store or office supply store to special order. I am amazed with the catalogue offerings of the local college book store can show me. (But then, my husband is a faculty member...) Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 12:42 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric storage question > Hmm... IKEA? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 10:48 AM > Subject: [h-cost] fabric storage question > > > > > > Hi all, > > as part of my continuing efforts to organize my sewing room I was looking > for > > something like the large wire baskets on wheels I see at the fabric store > to > > put my big rolls of fabric in. I haven't been able to find these things > > anywhere, does anyone have any leads? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Loren > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 11:20:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFKbHP031653 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:20:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFKoUw002982 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 09:20:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFKlBe007780; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:20:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4JFK8Be007018 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:20:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWuRmlx78eq1XJxIW7bCqg++3POO0qmX0VQ==">; Mon, 19 May 2003 08:19:47 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HYJ65T6G; Mon, 19 May 2003 08:19:47 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 10:51:47 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric storage question Message-ID: <20030519.110257.-188783.1.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-3 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Why not ask the manager of JoAnn's or Calico Corners if she/he will order you one? Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 11:26:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFQNHP031677 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:26:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFQcUw003852 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 09:26:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFQbBe012264; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:26:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4JFQWBe012132 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:26:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWuRmlx78eq1Xb5kwUO/+mXaQ3qAiEYFtYA==">; Mon, 19 May 2003 08:26:16 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HYJ7HPUK; Mon, 19 May 2003 08:26:16 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 11:07:08 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest Message-ID: <20030519.110846.-188783.3.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,3-5 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO <<>> You could, but you would probably be asked to resign or at least asked to go home and get dressed. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 11:42:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFgBHP031715 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:42:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFgUUw005919 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 09:42:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFgSBe023758; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:42:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f36.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JFgNBe023656 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:42:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 19 May 2003 08:42:18 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.226 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 19 May 2003 15:42:18 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.226] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 15:42:18 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 May 2003 15:42:18.0646 (UTC) FILETIME=[3AD57B60:01C31E1D] Subject: [h-cost] New Costume Interest X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's not that we can't, it's that we don't... I agree. I would love to wear sari's and billowing silks, especially living in Southern California, it's often hard to dress for the hot weather without taking off all my clothes and becoming completely immodest (by my standards, not by the mainstream fashion standards). It would be so much cooler to wrap myself in silk. However, I think it's my own fear that keep me from wearing them. I have this irrational fear that people from these cultures will feel like I am making fun of them or something equally ridiculous! We live in the "melting pot of the world," but I sometimes think that that doesn't apply to everyone. It doesn't seem to apply to those of european ancestry as much as to other, more "exotic" people. I know I might be bridging onto a sensitive subject. I don't mean to make this sound like a flame. It's just a silly little thought. But back to the Greek costume interest... I think you are starting a really exciting new avenue of interest. There is so much history in that area of the world. And with that history, comes all the wonderful clothing that people wore! :) jessica "It's so unfair that people from Middle Eastern / Indian / Far Eastern cultures can get away with wearing silks and glowing colours for important work-type meetings. Why can't I wear a bliaut to a working group? Jean" _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 12:30:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGUkHP031856 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:30:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGVAUw011798 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 10:31:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGV2xJ028055; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:31:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f59.sea1.hotmail.com [207.68.163.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGUxxJ027930 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:31:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 19 May 2003 09:30:54 -0700 Received: from 207.68.51.125 by sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 19 May 2003 16:30:54 GMT X-Originating-IP: [207.68.51.125] X-Originating-Email: [nancy_kiel@hotmail.com] From: "Nancy Kiel" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 12:30:54 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 May 2003 16:30:54.0465 (UTC) FILETIME=[04CC2710:01C31E24] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Out of curiosity, do these people wear saris etc. on normal days? And isn't their clothing part of their current culture, whereas a bliaut is part of our past culture? However, if saris meet the dress code in your office, you should be able to wear one as well. Nancy Kiel nancy_kiel@hotmail.com Never tease a weasel! This is very good advice. For the weasel will not like it And teasing isn't nice. >From: Jean Waddie >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: Historical Costume >Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest >Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 18:38:30 +0100 > >It's so unfair that people from Middle Eastern / Indian / Far Eastern >cultures can get away with wearing silks and glowing colours for important >work-type meetings. Why can't I wear a bliaut to a working group? > >Jean > > >Saragrace Knauf wrote >> >>I can't help you with your interest, but it sounds lovely. I have >>always wanted to dress like the middle eastern professional women I saw >>in D.C. I saw a lady attending a Nuclear Regulatory meeting once who >>had a complete outfit in a sea green crepe and chiffon to die for! Even >>her veil matched. I would love to walk around incognito like that! >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >-- >Jean Waddie >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 12:50:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGosHP032008 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:50:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGoiUw014258 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 10:50:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGofxJ012572; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:50:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGoaxJ012475 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:50:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.95] (pm4-095.eos.net [205.133.149.95]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA25386 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:50:34 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 12:45:39 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305191304.h4JD4s72022283@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: baskets with wheels X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Maybe your best bet is whoever makes the baskets sold at fabric stores. The manager could tell you who that is. Lots of manufacturers of commercial goods, though not all of them, sell to consumers too. What about the people who make Metro shelving? Do they have a web site or anything? They might make similar things. Or a commercial restaurant supply store? Around here, anyway, they sell to the general public. Restaurants might use similar wheeled carts. Just some ideas! Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 12:51:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGpQHP032014 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:51:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGpkUw014426 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 10:51:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGpixJ013373; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:51:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JGpfxJ013238 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:51:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.netmtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:49:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 11:49:33 -0500 From: Allison Pace In-reply-to: <200305191304.h4JD4s72022283@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: [h-cost] Re: culture clashes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday, May 19, 2003, at 08:04 AM, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: > In a message dated 5/18/03 8:05:16 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > h-costume-request@indra.com writes: > >> A new costume interest > > Umm, speaking as a Greek, using the term "Middle Eastern" to refer to > Greeks > is incorrect, and might even get you into some trouble--we have > loooooong Heaven forfend! I didn't refer to Greeks as Middle Eastern. I know that's a big fat no-no! I said this: "I went to the annual Greek Food Festival today, where pretty much what you do is eat fabulous food prepared by the little old Greek ladies of the church and watch local people dance and perform in the styles of their ancestral countries. (The little girls doing Middle Eastern were charming...the Middle Eastern women were gorgeous and luscious and riveting. ) There was a group who wore costume from different regions of Greece and Macedonia and other Mediterranean countries..." I guess I should've said that the Greek ladies and their food, there were also Middle Eastern dancers. (and Ukranian, and Indian...) Maybe it doesn't happen in larger, more politically aware regions, but here in Little Rock, where I have lived for 15 years, this particular festival has evolved into many cultures presenting their arts to the general public. And yes, I know it's odd to have Greeks and Arabs in the same venue, but it really does happen!!! (Ask me about my Jewish boyfriend who went with me to spend the weekend with my cousin and her Palestinian husband...) And now for the obligatory costume content: Y'know, if we could just get people of feuding cultures to forget the ugly parts of our past and look at the pretty parts - like costumes - maybe then we could solve all the world's political problems! ;-) (And, no, I don't intend to make these centuries-old issues sound frivolous...I just think politics belongs on another list.) Allison P. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 13:29:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHTeHP032411 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 13:29:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHU4Uw019032 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 11:30:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHTxOg015251; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:29:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80408.mail.yahoo.com (web80408.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.63]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4JHTsOg015092 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:29:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030519172949.69224.qmail@web80408.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80408.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 19 May 2003 10:29:49 PDT Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 10:29:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305191304.h4JD4s72022283@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: fabric storage question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The following places carry what you're looking for: http://www.warehousehog.com/ It's called a "Wire Mesh Pallet Container"; may not have wheels http://www.advancedhandling.com/images/page144.pdf It's a "Wiresided w/4 wire side and end panels" ($362-$422, depending on size) http://www.factorysupply.net/carts4.htm Check the wire-sided cart ($430-$570, depending on size and type of wheels). A cheaper solution: A shopping cart ($135). HTH Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 13:46:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHkdHP032542 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 13:46:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHl4Uw021305 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 11:47:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHl3Og028461; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:47:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pd4mo3so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHkxOg028408 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:46:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pd4mr2so.prod.shaw.ca (pd4mr2so-qfe3.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.213]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HF500JHSAJNUV@l-daemon> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:42:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pn2ml3so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml3so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.147]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HF500IE0AJNUO@l-daemon> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:42:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b1o4r1 (h24-77-135-173.ok.shawcable.net [24.77.135.173]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with SMTP id <0HF500NS1AJL33@l-daemon> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:42:59 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 10:41:12 -0700 From: Jennifer Potts To: h-costume@net.indra.com Message-id: <000c01c31e2d$d76fdd20$ad874d18@ok.shawcable.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Duct Tape Dress Forms X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi - I'm coming out of lurking. I know that this has been covered before, but I have lost my information somewhere. Can anyone tell me how to make a duct tape dress form? I have been looking at Saragrace's "How to make an Elizabethan Shoulder Roll" and I love how the costuming looks like it fits so much better with one. (Love your sewing room in the background - it's my dream room!) Thanks, Jennifer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 13:59:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHxEHP032583 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 13:59:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHxjUw023093 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 11:59:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHxiSl008756; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:59:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m05.mx.aol.com (imo-m05.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JHxfSl008681 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:59:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.179.1a8810f3 (4539) for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 13:59:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Kitsune242@aol.com Message-ID: <179.1a8810f3.2bfa7583@aol.com> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 13:59:31 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Buying fabric online To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/15/2003 3:14:26 PM Pacific Standard Time, Lady_Angharad@bigpond.com writes: > Antipodean I realize this is a stupid question, but what does Antipodean mean? Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 14:13:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIDxHP032651 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:13:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIESUw024896 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 12:14:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIEQqD019703; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:14:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20206.mail.yahoo.com (web20206.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4JIEMqD019668 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:14:22 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030519181422.90614.qmail@web20206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:14:22 PDT Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 11:14:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] fabric storage question To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <50.1ce8b2b2.2bf8f74f@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A word of caution about fabric storage: light fades fabrics, and a wire basket would of course not protect against that. Of course, if you're talking only about rolls, and not bolts, you would only have fading on the end bit and along the selvages, which wouldn't be as bad. But you may want to think about it when you're considering "long-term" storage solutions. -Angela --- Marionetta@aol.com wrote: > > Hi all, > as part of my continuing efforts to organize my > sewing room I was looking for > something like the large wire baskets on wheels I > see at the fabric store to > put my big rolls of fabric in. I haven't been able > to find these things > anywhere, does anyone have any leads? > > Thanks, > > Loren > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 14:31:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIVeHP032743 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:31:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIW0Uw026970 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 12:32:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIVxqD003738; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:31:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIVqqD003651 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:31:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4JIVpp21766.; Mon, 19 May 2003 19:31:51 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 19 May 2003 19:31:51 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 19:31:31 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Buying fabric online Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4JIVqqD003651 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kit wrote: >I realize this is a stupid question, but what does Antipodean mean? Not stupid if you're American - we Brits traditionally call Australia and New Zealand the Antipodes, meaning thay they're at the opposite end of the globe from us. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 14:47:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIlxHP000377 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:47:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JImAUw028757 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 12:48:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIm9qD016094; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:48:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIm5qD016049 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:48:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be81.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.129]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 841095EE27E for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 20:48:03 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001601c31e37$c24aea70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EC8DA5F.3020303@kabelfoon.nl> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Partlet update Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 20:52:12 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Deredere That looks great! I love it when people dont let themselves stop by impossible solutions. This is fabulous. Cant waite to se the partlet finished. Congratulations Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deredere Galbraith" To: "H-Costume" Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 3:21 PM Subject: [h-cost] Partlet update > Hi, > > My husband offered me his help with making the buttons for the partlet > :-) :-) . > Hopefully I will be able to finish the partlet before 19 June. > Then we will go to an SCA event where we wil celebrate the 10 years > existence of the kindom of Drachenwald(Europe). > Good reason tho wear our best clothes. > > I made the master, mould and four test buttons. You can find pictures on > my website > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlettest.jpg > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 14:50:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIooHP000399 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:50:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIpIUw029115 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 12:51:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIpHqD018372; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:51:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JIpDqD018325 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 12:51:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-116-236-20.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.116.236.20]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h4JIpCa6024395 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:51:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 11:39:21 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >However, I think it's my own fear that keep me from wearing them. I have >this irrational fear that people from these cultures will feel like I am >making fun of them or something equally ridiculous! We live in the >"melting pot of the world," but I sometimes think that that doesn't apply >to everyone. It doesn't seem to apply to those of european ancestry as >much as to other, more "exotic" people. The San Francisco Bay Area has many people from India living/working here, and many saree stores because of that. I discovered sarees when I was pregnant the first time, as they are the only garment in the world that makes a pregnant woman look elegant. (I now have two kids and many sarees.) Every time I would wear them in public I would be asked if my husband was from India (even when I no longer had one after the divorce). That was the worst of it. BTW, I used to work in a fabric store here, and got permission to wear sarees to work by reminding the manager that they required six yards of fabric, which some customer might want to buy if they saw me wearing one. She asked if they would get in my way at work, and I informed her that in India female construction workers and housewives wore them, and I showed her how these women tucked the hanging end out of the way for that. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 15:02:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JJ2MHP000486 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 15:02:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JJ2lUw000596 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 13:02:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JJ2jMd026385; Mon, 19 May 2003 13:02:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JJ2gMd026349 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 13:02:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be81.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.129]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 373FB5EE36E for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 21:02:41 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003201c31e39$ce3c8df0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 21:06:51 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At my last travel to London, not the one in april, but about a year ago, there was a great window exhibition at Selfridges at Oxford Street with saris from India. I think it was something about Bollywood they showed. Those Saris were drop dead beautifull, with lots and lots of embroidery in silk and gold. My friend Leif couldnt drag me away from those windows, i could have standed there for hours........................And yes you are so right, pregnant women looks great in them!!! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 8:39 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest > > >However, I think it's my own fear that keep me from wearing them. I have > >this irrational fear that people from these cultures will feel like I am > >making fun of them or something equally ridiculous! We live in the > >"melting pot of the world," but I sometimes think that that doesn't apply > >to everyone. It doesn't seem to apply to those of european ancestry as > >much as to other, more "exotic" people. > > The San Francisco Bay Area has many people from India living/working here, > and many saree stores because of that. I discovered sarees when I was > pregnant the first time, as they are the only garment in the world that > makes a pregnant woman look elegant. (I now have two kids and many > sarees.) Every time I would wear them in public I would be asked if my > husband was from India (even when I no longer had one after the > divorce). That was the worst of it. > > BTW, I used to work in a fabric store here, and got permission to wear > sarees to work by reminding the manager that they required six yards of > fabric, which some customer might want to buy if they saw me wearing > one. She asked if they would get in my way at work, and I informed her > that in India female construction workers and housewives wore them, and I > showed her how these women tucked the hanging end out of the way for that. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 15:07:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JJ7iHP000515 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 15:07:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JJ8DUw001199 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 13:08:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JJ8CMd000741; Mon, 19 May 2003 13:08:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JJ88Md000691 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 13:08:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be81.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.129]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 2A37E5EE27F for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 21:08:07 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003801c31e3a$90b25a90$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 21:12:17 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] update again with embroidery X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. Again i have updated the website with the embroidery. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/robealafrancaise.htm In stead of making a straight tape to sew to the curved line at the stomacher, i desided to embroider a shaped curve. I think it is the best solution. It is only going to be partly seen, as the bodice clotses diagonally from the middle of the top bodice and down to the place where the overskirts starts. The stomacher also has a center piece ribbon. And then there is going to be 2 tapes in each side of the diagonally bodice closings. These two will be mirrored. Now i can hardly waite to make the toille!!! Bjarne. Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 17:10:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JLA2HP000819 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 17:10:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JKt3XA014531 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 15:10:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JKYFTi005914; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:34:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailhost.softwareinnovation.com (w002.z064000176.dfw-tx.dsl.cnc.net [64.0.176.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JKY4Ti005700 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 14:34:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from theforce [64.0.176.2] by mailhost.softwareinnovation.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id AFB8480538; Mon, 19 May 2003 15:34:00 -0500 From: "Betsy Marshall" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Buying fabric online Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 15:33:58 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c31e45$fb673e90$02b00040@softwareinnovation.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO "and though this Grecian scenery looks more like the Antipodes, you'll say I'm twice the heroine of any in Euripides!" here is the complete filk: http://www.math.uchicago.edu/~wald/lit/heroine_barbarian.html (I hope you enjoy as much as I) Betsy -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Kate M Bunting Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 1:32 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Buying fabric online Kit wrote: >I realize this is a stupid question, but what does Antipodean mean? Not stupid if you're American - we Brits traditionally call Australia and New Zealand the Antipodes, meaning thay they're at the opposite end of the globe from us. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 18:11:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JMB0HP001053 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 18:11:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JMCWUw024866 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 16:12:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JMCUci022084; Mon, 19 May 2003 16:12:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta05bw.bigpond.com (mta05bw.bigpond.com [139.134.6.95]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4JMCNci021921 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 16:12:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from clarke ([144.135.24.69]) by mta05bw.bigpond.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15 mta05bw Jul 16 2002 22:47:55) with SMTP id HF5N0F00.76H for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 08:12:15 +1000 Received: from CWPP-p-203-54-206-164.prem.tmns.net.au ([203.54.206.164]) by bwmam01.bigpond.com(MAM V3.3.2 2/228302); 20 May 2003 08:12:15 Message-ID: <004b01c31e53$b0e0d7b0$a4ce36cb@clarke> From: "Claire Clarke" To: "Historical Costume" References: <179.1a8810f3.2bfa7583@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Buying fabric online Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 08:12:07 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > In a message dated 5/15/2003 3:14:26 PM Pacific Standard Time, > Lady_Angharad@bigpond.com writes: > > > > Antipodean > > I realize this is a stupid question, but what does Antipodean mean? > Strictly speaking if you drop a line straight down through the centre of the earth and out the other side that spot is the antipodes of your location. Australia and New Zealand are often referred to as the Antipodes for being on the other side of the world from the rest of Western civilisation. However the true antipodes of NZ is Spain. There are also the Antipodes Islands which are the true antipodes of England I think. Claire _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 20:41:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K0fGHP001499 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 20:41:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K0ghUw014606 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 18:42:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K0gds3029735; Mon, 19 May 2003 18:42:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K0gas4029711 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 18:42:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty3203.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.248.203]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4K0gbYx029834 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 20:42:38 -0400 Message-ID: <3EC979F3.2020803@dandy.net> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 20:42:27 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Thread winders References: <000f01c31db7$6edcf160$6401a8c0@mycomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, All. I am curious about the very subject that you have brought up. I have only seen two pre-18th Cent. items that are considered to be "spools", or "thread winders". One is of bone, and shown in the Museum of London series, and the other comes from the Mary Rose finds. I have not seen any evidence of the squarish kind with the 4 or more notches that allow you to wind thread crosswise before the 18th Cent. Can someone cite evidence of such things from a painting or engraving, or even an archaeological find? Thanks in advance, Mike T. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 21:15:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K1FAHP001577 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 21:15:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K1GuUw017183 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 19:16:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K1GsoK016458; Mon, 19 May 2003 19:16:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K1GpoL016433 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 19:16:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty3203.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.248.203]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4K1GrYx017820 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 21:16:54 -0400 Message-ID: <3EC981FF.9070608@dandy.net> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 21:16:47 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Leloir again. References: <000701c31cab$712632e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, All. Bjarne, what page is the dress on? I was looking through my Leloir but I couldn't find the picture. Thanks, Mike T. Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: >I am sitting here with some old photocopy of costumes i had made many years >ago at the Museum of Fine Arts Library. Some are from Maurice Leloirs: >Histoire du Costume. >One of the copyes is a ladys outfit from 1630. With a reconstrukted french >farthingale ( Vertugadin en bourrelet) The Dress looks authentic, made of >brocade over a petticoat with trimmings, and the wired standing Collar looks >pretty authentic two, with matching cuffs. > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 22:07:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K27oHP001746 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:07:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K29OUw021428 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 20:09:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K29MJL015001; Mon, 19 May 2003 20:09:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net (harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.12]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K29LJL014986 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 20:09:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ap-022scfairp0489.dialsprint.net ([65.179.33.235] helo=faucet.net) by harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19HwZ5-0006Yb-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 19 May 2003 19:09:19 -0700 Message-ID: <3EC99C1E.7040803@faucet.net> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 22:08:14 -0500 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200201301423.GAA09074@gw.retro.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] academic hood question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ok, this isn't precisely historical, but I suppose these things are loosely based on historical costume. I need to make some academic regalia for myself, and I have all the standards that are published online. Apparently the Master's Hood is supposed to be 3 1/2 feet long, but is that from the front point (when the thing is laying flat) or from the shoulder (when it's on the body)? Does anyone have one they could go measure? To add a little historical content: since the Master's robe sleeve is a really awkward vestigial version of a 16th-century hanging sleeve, I plan to make actual hanging sleeves of the same shape, which I think will be far lovelier. I also intend to make a 16th-century cap to match the gown (no tassel), as I detest mortarboards. Apparently, this little-used style _is_ one of the choices, known as a "beefeater cap." As long as I don't make it in velvet or add a gold tassel, no one should think I'm masquerading as a PhD. Hey, I'm the costume professor--I should have something interesting, right? ;) Melanie Schuessler (Coastal Carolina University) http://www.faucet.net/costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 19 22:11:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K2BlHP001755 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:11:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K2DZUw021747 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 20:13:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K2DYJL017250; Mon, 19 May 2003 20:13:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K2DUJL017151 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 20:13:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a237.in-tch.com [66.62.107.37]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4K1t8H03823 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 19:55:08 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3EC98F9E.910F5A60@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 20:14:54 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Partlet update References: <3EC8DA5F.3020303@kabelfoon.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO They look great! With all the possible materials tossed around in discussion, what did you end up using? --sue Deredere Galbraith wrote: > > Hi, > > My husband offered me his help with making the buttons for the partlet > :-) :-) . > Hopefully I will be able to finish the partlet before 19 June. > Then we will go to an SCA event where we wil celebrate the 10 years > existence of the kindom of Drachenwald(Europe). > Good reason tho wear our best clothes. > > I made the master, mould and four test buttons. You can find pictures on > my website > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlettest.jpg > > Greetings, > Deredere > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 00:19:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4JHHP002159 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 00:19:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4KfUw002440 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 22:20:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4KZla000468; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:20:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from granger.mail.mindspring.net (granger.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4KVla000412 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:20:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ar-007neomahp309.dialsprint.net ([63.178.237.175] helo=hppav.radiks.net) by granger.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Hyc2-00001R-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 20 May 2003 00:20:30 -0400 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20030519231524.00bca5e8@radiks.net> X-Sender: costumrs@radiks.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 23:20:22 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200305191801.h4JI1ASm010001@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] Re: fabric container X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO FWIW, I like the garbage can on wheels idea, personally. Also, I think they sell just the dollies (the wheeled thing it sits on) separately - you could put just about any container on one of those. There are also dollies made for large planters so you can roll your large trees, etc. around - these might also work. I personally have 3 of the large cardboard barrels and they are great. Haven't gotten dollies for them yet though. HTH, Sandy "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed To Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly-- Why They Are Simply Doomed." Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 00:48:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4mdHP002245 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 00:48:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4oQUw004831 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 22:50:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4oPla019172; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:50:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net (turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.126]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4oLla019143 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:50:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from user-12hc5uh.cable.mindspring.com ([69.22.23.209] helo=earthlink.net) by turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Hz4v-0000iC-00; Mon, 19 May 2003 21:50:21 -0700 Message-ID: <3EC9B3CC.6030107@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 23:49:16 -0500 From: Charlene Charette User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume List , h-needlework list Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm looking for information on what differentiates a Norman from a Saxon. I'm especially interested in clothing and decorative arts. Can anyone recommend any sources? Thanks, --Charlene -- Correction does much, but encouragement does more. -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 01:39:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K5d6HP002385 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 01:39:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4ULUw003115 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 22:30:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4UKla006331; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:30:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law8-oe60.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.195]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4UIla006246 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:30:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 19 May 2003 21:30:11 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe60.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 20 May 2003 04:30:11 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Buying fabric online Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 00:29:39 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 May 2003 04:30:11.0874 (UTC) FILETIME=[809E2820:01C31E88] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, Canadians (or at least ppl from Quebec) do too, so I don't know why people from the U.S. wouldn't do it :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 2:31 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Buying fabric online > Kit wrote: > > >I realize this is a stupid question, but what does Antipodean mean? > > Not stupid if you're American - we Brits traditionally call Australia and New Zealand the Antipodes, meaning thay they're at the opposite end of the globe from us. > > Kate Bunting > Library, University of Derby > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 01:39:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K5d6HR002385 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 01:39:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4V4Uw003176 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 19 May 2003 22:31:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4V3la006770; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:31:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law8-oe60.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.195]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K4V2la006723 for ; Mon, 19 May 2003 22:31:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 19 May 2003 21:30:57 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by oe60.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 20 May 2003 04:30:57 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EC8DA5F.3020303@kabelfoon.nl> <001601c31e37$c24aea70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Partlet update Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 00:30:28 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 May 2003 04:30:57.0281 (UTC) FILETIME=[9BAEB710:01C31E88] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ow... this is very cool! I can't wait to see it finished :-) > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Deredere Galbraith" > To: "H-Costume" > Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 3:21 PM > Subject: [h-cost] Partlet update > > > > Hi, > > > > My husband offered me his help with making the buttons for the partlet > > :-) :-) . > > Hopefully I will be able to finish the partlet before 19 June. > > Then we will go to an SCA event where we wil celebrate the 10 years > > existence of the kindom of Drachenwald(Europe). > > Good reason tho wear our best clothes. > > > > I made the master, mould and four test buttons. You can find pictures on > > my website > > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlettest.jpg > > > > Greetings, > > Deredere > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 05:25:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K9PMHP005363 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 05:25:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K9R6Uw024154 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 03:27:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K9R3fP027033; Tue, 20 May 2003 03:27:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K9QwfP026999 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 03:26:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7befc.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.252]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 615A95EE422 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 11:26:57 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001501c31eb2$96367870$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000701c31cab$712632e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3EC981FF.9070608@dandy.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Leloir again. Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 11:31:26 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello I actually dont know wich page it was, because it is an old photocopy i have. But i have uploaded it here for you to see. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/leloir1 There is also a picture of a cavalier man. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/leloir2 I am very exited to hear if anybody knows what happened to these costumes. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "michael tartaglio" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 3:16 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Leloir again. > Hi, All. Bjarne, what page is the dress on? I was looking through my > Leloir but I couldn't find the picture. Thanks, Mike T. > > Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > >I am sitting here with some old photocopy of costumes i had made many years > >ago at the Museum of Fine Arts Library. Some are from Maurice Leloirs: > >Histoire du Costume. > >One of the copyes is a ladys outfit from 1630. With a reconstrukted french > >farthingale ( Vertugadin en bourrelet) The Dress looks authentic, made of > >brocade over a petticoat with trimmings, and the wired standing Collar looks > >pretty authentic two, with matching cuffs. > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 05:39:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K9d6HP005432 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 05:39:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K9e6Uw024895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 03:40:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K9e5fP002534; Tue, 20 May 2003 03:40:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4K9e2fP002516 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 03:40:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7befc.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.252]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 24E9C5EE2B5 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 11:40:02 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001e01c31eb4$6c3205b0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000701c31cab$712632e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711><3EC981FF.9070608@dandy.net> <001501c31eb2$96367870$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Leloir again. Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 11:44:35 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh sorry i forgot to add, very interresting with the top sleave, it has whalebone slits in bonecasings to hold it out! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 11:31 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Leloir again. > Hello > I actually dont know wich page it was, because it is an old photocopy i > have. > But i have uploaded it here for you to see. > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/leloir1 > There is also a picture of a cavalier man. > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/leloir2 > I am very exited to hear if anybody knows what happened to these costumes. > > Bjarne > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "michael tartaglio" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 3:16 AM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Leloir again. > > > > Hi, All. Bjarne, what page is the dress on? I was looking through my > > Leloir but I couldn't find the picture. Thanks, Mike T. > > > > Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > > > >I am sitting here with some old photocopy of costumes i had made many > years > > >ago at the Museum of Fine Arts Library. Some are from Maurice Leloirs: > > >Histoire du Costume. > > >One of the copyes is a ladys outfit from 1630. With a reconstrukted > french > > >farthingale ( Vertugadin en bourrelet) The Dress looks authentic, made of > > >brocade over a petticoat with trimmings, and the wired standing Collar > looks > > >pretty authentic two, with matching cuffs. > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 08:16:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KCGeHP006385 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 08:16:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KCGMUw006929 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 06:16:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KCGKfu017564; Tue, 20 May 2003 06:16:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KCGHfu017484 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 06:16:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.104] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A92D1D4300C4; Tue, 20 May 2003 08:01:49 -0400 Message-ID: <009001c31eca$0f0ad0e0$685183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030519172949.69224.qmail@web80408.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: fabric storage question Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 08:19:26 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My own solution: EXL plastic garbage cans with wheels at about $25. Go for the 'deluxe', they last longer. Depending on the size of the bolts, they will hold about a dozen...or more. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn Jacobson" To: Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 1:29 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: fabric storage question > The following places carry what you're looking for: > > http://www.warehousehog.com/ > It's called a "Wire Mesh Pallet Container"; may not > have wheels > > http://www.advancedhandling.com/images/page144.pdf > It's a "Wiresided w/4 wire side and end panels" > ($362-$422, depending on size) > > http://www.factorysupply.net/carts4.htm > Check the wire-sided cart ($430-$570, depending on > size and type of wheels). > > A cheaper solution: > > A shopping cart ($135). > > HTH > > Dawn > > ===== > Dawn Jacobson > Vallejo, CA, USA > > "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" > --Wicked Witch > "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 09:23:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KDNgHP006752 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 09:23:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KDPIUw011975 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 07:25:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KDPD4G020403; Tue, 20 May 2003 07:25:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KDPB4G020342 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 07:25:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-063.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.63]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 372EABECF7 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:25:05 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3ECA2D42.1090400@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 15:27:30 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] update again with embroidery References: <003801c31e3a$90b25a90$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am really looking foreward to see the wole dress! With all the embroidery it must look goreous. I friend of mine told me that she bought a pattern for a robe a la francaise and that I may borrow it. Mmmm tempting. Greetings, Deredere Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: >Hi. >Again i have updated the website with the embroidery. >http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/robealafrancaise.htm >In stead of making a straight tape to sew to the curved line at the >stomacher, i desided to embroider a shaped curve. I think it is the best >solution. >It is only going to be partly seen, as the bodice clotses diagonally from >the middle of the top bodice and down to the place where the overskirts >starts. The stomacher also has a center piece ribbon. And then there is >going to be 2 tapes in each side of the diagonally bodice closings. >These two will be mirrored. >Now i can hardly waite to make the toille!!! > > >Bjarne. > > > >Leif og Bjarne Drews >www.my-drewscostumes.dk > >http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 09:58:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KDwJHP006884 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 09:58:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KE02Uw016161 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 08:00:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KE00Ih011380; Tue, 20 May 2003 08:00:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4KDxuIh011306 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 07:59:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCt08IRKY8xGKBJlEI40NNsaGM/1MAgs5Ig==">; Tue, 20 May 2003 09:59:45 EDT Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HYMLX2BG; Tue, 20 May 2003 09:59:45 EDT To: bawsews@aol.com, cc2003@onelist.com, h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 08:55:56 -0500 Message-ID: <20030520.085556.-239601311.4.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-33,35-47 From: seamstrix@juno.com Subject: [h-cost] Fw: [st-george] RIP Jean Hunnisett X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "ladygarter1574" To: st-george@yahoogroups.com Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 13:53:42 -0000 Subject: [st-george] RIP Jean Hunnisett Message-ID: Sorry for the blunt subject line but the news came from my other list. She will be missed. Please pass it on. Christina Neitz Lady Garter ~ BRF ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From: "Suzi Clarke" Date: Tue May 20, 2003 8:38 am Subject: Jean Hunnisett It is with great sadness that I am notifying the list of the death of my dear friend and teacher, Jean Hunnisett, from cancer on Monday 19th May. Jean, a lifelong non-smoker, was in hospital, in no pain, and a friend was with her. I know she will be much missed by many who have benefitted from her books, her expertise, and her generosity in sharing it. Suzi ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/uetFAA/PJ_qlB/TM ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/st-george To change your address or preferences: http://groups.yahoo.com/mygroups To contact the list moderators: st-george-owner@yahoogroups.com Guild of St. George website: http://www.guildofstgeorge.com/ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + H O N I . S O I T . Q U I . M A L . Y . P E N S E Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 10:34:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KEYIHP007031 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 10:34:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KEZwUw020113 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 08:35:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KEZuIh003904; Tue, 20 May 2003 08:35:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KEZpIh003841 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 08:35:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA13313; Tue, 20 May 2003 09:56:46 -0500 Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 09:56:46 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII; X-MAC-TYPE=54455854; X-MAC-CREATOR=4D4F5353 Content-ID: cc: Susan Carroll-Clark Subject: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A fellow researcher has run into the term "St. Thomas's worsted" and is looking for further detail as to what this is. The context is material culture of religious women, and the reference may be medieval, but I'm not sure where she found it (the query came to me secondhand). Has anyone else ever heard this term, historically or modernly? --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 10:52:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KEq1HP007224 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 10:52:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KErcUw022015 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 08:53:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KErbIh014928; Tue, 20 May 2003 08:53:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KErVIh014821 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 08:53:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ConstanceFairfax@cs.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.149.118e772f (15864); Tue, 20 May 2003 10:53:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cs.com (mow-d13.webmail.aol.com [205.188.139.129]) by air-id06.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id MAILINID63-3df83eca4161204; Tue, 20 May 2003 10:53:21 -0400 Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 10:53:21 -0400 From: ConstanceFairfax@cs.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) Subject: RE: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <01012F94.0FEE1725.349D0FDF@cs.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit cc: Susan Carroll-Clark X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Robin, I've seen it in context of the costumes/props for St. George's day celebration in Norwich mid-16c - It[e]m twoo cootes of St Thomas worsted for the henchemen - Twolman - iiij s iiij d Constance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 14:08:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KI8KHP008384 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 14:08:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KI9hUw016657 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 12:09:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KI9ZKX016794; Tue, 20 May 2003 12:09:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20208.mail.yahoo.com (web20208.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.63]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4KI9VKX016745 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 12:09:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030520180930.79190.qmail@web20208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 20 May 2003 11:09:30 PDT Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 11:09:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030516185030.7591.qmail@web40013.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] book suggestions? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A friend of mine who has never sewn anything wants to learn how. She has a gift-giving occasion coming up soon, and I would like to give her a book on sewing (to be followed up this summer by a supervised project or two). Does anybody have any suggestions on a basic technique book for complete beginners? (Please tell me what you like and/or don't like about a particular book in addition to telling me the title.) Thanks- Angela __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 14:30:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KIUMHP008701 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 14:30:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KIVqUw019014 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 12:31:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KIVpKX003760; Tue, 20 May 2003 12:31:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KIVmKX003733 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 12:31:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D92727B092 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 11:31:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 75182-06 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 11:31:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-63-207-102-44.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.207.102.44]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 355687B05E for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 11:31:02 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 11:31:37 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] book suggestions? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030520180930.79190.qmail@web20208.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <4AC334D9-8AF1-11D7-9895-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My favorite, that I always give to beginners, is the Reader's Digest guide to sewing. It's got good illustrations, it cross references related issues, and it's really comprehensive. On Tuesday, May 20, 2003, at 11:09 AM, Angela Kovatch wrote: > A friend of mine who has never sewn anything wants to > learn how. She has a gift-giving occasion coming up > soon, and I would like to give her a book on sewing > (to be followed up this summer by a supervised project > or two). Does anybody have any suggestions on a basic > technique book for complete beginners? (Please tell > me what you like and/or don't like about a particular > book in addition to telling me the title.) > > Thanks- > Angela > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 15:24:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJOkHP009087 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:24:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJQPUw025083 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 13:26:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJQJKr013963; Tue, 20 May 2003 13:26:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJQFKr013882 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 13:26:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f77.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.119]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 6C5C05EE486 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:26:13 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000b01c31f05$ad94bf10$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030520180930.79190.qmail@web20208.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] book suggestions? Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 21:26:13 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Angela. Well i am an european, and i dont know all those american books on the subjekt. A book that has ben very usefull for me is "Neue Mode's" Sewing from A - Z It is a german sewing magazine who has made it, and my copy is in danish :-) It has ritch illustrations and very easy to understand how to. Another good thing to give her would be "A lady's guide to plain sewing" wich is a book that shows you all the historical seamings. Hedgehog Handworks has it. It has learned me many good things i had no idea existed. I think it is a very good idea, that you want to give her such a present, she will be very greatfull for it, when she has learned a few things. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela Kovatch" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 8:09 PM Subject: [h-cost] book suggestions? > A friend of mine who has never sewn anything wants to > learn how. She has a gift-giving occasion coming up > soon, and I would like to give her a book on sewing > (to be followed up this summer by a supervised project > or two). Does anybody have any suggestions on a basic > technique book for complete beginners? (Please tell > me what you like and/or don't like about a particular > book in addition to telling me the title.) > > Thanks- > Angela > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 15:25:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJPIHP009094 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:25:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJR1Uw025160 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 13:27:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJR1Kr014510; Tue, 20 May 2003 13:27:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJQeKr014140 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 13:26:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LoreleiMorte@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id r.1eb.9375b73 (4426); Tue, 20 May 2003 15:26:13 -0400 (EDT) From: LoreleiMorte@aol.com Message-ID: <1eb.9375b73.2bfbdb54@aol.com> Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 15:26:12 EDT To: elizabethanclothing@yahoogroups.com, SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com, h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Dress Diary Updated X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I updated my Middle Class dress diary, lotsa new pics...for folks who dig dress diaries. Just keep hitting "Next"...and forgive my web-design suckage. http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/midclass.html -Sarra Wryght Elizabethan Dress Journals: http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/index.html Live Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 15:34:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJYXHP009149 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:34:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJaGUw026346 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 13:36:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJaFKr022432; Tue, 20 May 2003 13:36:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KJZWKr021858 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 13:35:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f77.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.119]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 53FB05EE4E2 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:35:31 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001a01c31f06$fb1666c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 21:35:33 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] Jean Hunniset. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello. I was very sad to hear that Jean Hunniset has passed away. How old did she get? I had the impression that she was not that old. I have ben very greatfull for her books. They have taught me many good things. Especially her panier pattern i have used several times. Very usefull and ideal. I hope not that her next book about outdoor wear will be delayed. I am looking forwards to this! I send her many thoaghts, i hope she had a pleassant death without pains. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 17:03:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KL31HP009557 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 17:03:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KL4eUw006948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 15:04:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KL4c6h001175; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:04:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KL4Y6h001117 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:04:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h4KL4YPR016822 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 20 May 2003 17:04:34 -0400 Message-Id: <200305202104.h4KL4YPR016822@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 21:01:17 -0000 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Jean Hunniset. From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I had the pleasure of being Jean Hunnisett's driver & flatmate for a few days during her lecture tour of the US in 2001. She was delightful and the lectures and workshops were interesting and informative. Thanks to Mary Denise Smith who gave me the opportunity! Jean will be missed, and I also hope there is no delay in publishing her work. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 17:08:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KL86HP009572 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 17:08:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KL9hUw007474 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 15:09:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KL9c6h004608; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:09:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80411.mail.yahoo.com (web80411.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.66]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4KL9X6h004489 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:09:33 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030520210927.62064.qmail@web80411.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80411.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 20 May 2003 14:09:27 PDT Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 14:09:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305201801.h4KI1FKY010309@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Jean Hunnisett X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh my. 8-( My deepest sympathies to her family, friends, and many students around the world. Dawn > From: seamstrix@juno.com > Subject: [h-cost] Fw: [st-george] RIP Jean Hunnisett > To: bawsews@aol.com, cc2003@onelist.com, > h-costume@indra.com > Message-ID: > <20030520.085556.-239601311.4.Seamstrix@juno.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > --------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: "ladygarter1574" > To: st-george@yahoogroups.com > Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 13:53:42 -0000 > Subject: [st-george] RIP Jean Hunnisett > Message-ID: > > Sorry for the blunt subject line but the news came > from my other > list. She will be missed. Please pass it on. > > Christina Neitz > Lady Garter ~ BRF > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > From: "Suzi Clarke" > Date: Tue May 20, 2003 8:38 am > Subject: Jean Hunnisett > > > It is with great sadness that I am notifying the > list of the death > of my dear friend and teacher, Jean Hunnisett, from > cancer on Monday > 19th May. Jean, a lifelong non-smoker, was in > hospital, in no pain, > and a friend was with her. I know she will be much > missed by many > who have benefitted from her books, her expertise, > and her > generosity in sharing it. > > Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 17:19:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLJtHP009643 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 17:19:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLLdUw009020 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 15:21:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLLb6h013446; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:21:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLLW6h013363 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:21:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19IEY7-000GRY-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 20 May 2003 22:21:31 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 22:11:01 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I feel just like Jessica, and Carolyn, I admire you. I would just be too shy - a lot of people on this list seem to dress flamboyantly or unusually in everyday life, but I don't feel confident that way, and I would be worried what other people might think. I feel I could wear my medieval costumes to work less self-consciously - but I really don't think it would work in my office! Jean Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote > >>However, I think it's my own fear that keep me from wearing them. I >>have this irrational fear that people from these cultures will feel >>like I am making fun of them or something equally ridiculous! We live >>in the "melting pot of the world," but I sometimes think that that >>doesn't apply to everyone. It doesn't seem to apply to those of >>european ancestry as much as to other, more "exotic" people. > >The San Francisco Bay Area has many people from India living/working >here, and many saree stores because of that. I discovered sarees when >I was pregnant the first time, as they are the only garment in the >world that makes a pregnant woman look elegant. (I now have two kids >and many sarees.) Every time I would wear them in public I would be >asked if my husband was from India (even when I no longer had one after >the divorce). That was the worst of it. > >BTW, I used to work in a fabric store here, and got permission to wear >sarees to work by reminding the manager that they required six yards of >fabric, which some customer might want to buy if they saw me wearing >one. She asked if they would get in my way at work, and I informed her >that in India female construction workers and housewives wore them, and >I showed her how these women tucked the hanging end out of the way for that. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows >dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 17:23:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLNkHP009658 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 17:23:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLPUUw009503 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 15:25:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLPU6h016436; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:25:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from janus.directcon.net (janus.directcon.net [206.170.184.16]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLPR6h016405 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:25:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dnyeaqvf (net15sp13.directcon.net [209.79.209.13] (may be forged)) by janus.directcon.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4KLTQl10037; Tue, 20 May 2003 14:29:26 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20030520142737.00d35d30@pop.directcon.net> X-Sender: margospatterns@pop.directcon.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 14:27:37 -0700 To: Historical Costume , From: Margo Anderson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Jean Hunniset. In-Reply-To: <001a01c31f06$fb1666c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:35 PM 05/20/2003 +0200, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: >Hello. >I was very sad to hear that Jean Hunniset has passed away. How old did she >get? I had the impression that she was not that old. >I have ben very greatfull for her books. They have taught me many good >things. Especially her panier pattern i have used several times. Very >usefull and ideal. >I hope not that her next book about outdoor wear will be delayed. I am >looking forwards to this! I believe she was in her 60's. She must have been close to that at least, since she did her monumental work on the BBC's Elizabeth R in the very early 70's. The book on outerwear is out! I saw it at the Alteryears table at CostumeCon. It doesn't cover my period, so I didn't look too closely, but it looked quite detailed and worthwhile. Margo "One Tough Costumer" www.margospatterns.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 17:33:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLXqHP009677 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 17:33:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLZYUw010863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 15:35:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLZW6h024917; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:35:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4KLZR6h024839 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 15:35:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19IElZ-000J9D-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 20 May 2003 22:35:25 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 22:34:10 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] book suggestions? References: <20030520180930.79190.qmail@web20208.mail.yahoo.com> <4AC334D9-8AF1-11D7-9895-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> In-Reply-To: <4AC334D9-8AF1-11D7-9895-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have the Simplicity Sewing Book, a really old edition my mother gave me but maybe they still publish it. It's great, it covers everything, I still turn to it when I need to put a zip in. It's like a good basic cookbook - whenever you think "how do I do that", it's there, under the heading you expect it to be under, and you just follow the instructions and it works. Jean Heather Meadows wrote >My favorite, that I always give to beginners, is the Reader's Digest >guide to sewing. > >It's got good illustrations, it cross references related issues, and >it's >really comprehensive. > > >On Tuesday, May 20, 2003, at 11:09 AM, Angela Kovatch wrote: > >> A friend of mine who has never sewn anything wants to >> learn how. She has a gift-giving occasion coming up >> soon, and I would like to give her a book on sewing >> (to be followed up this summer by a supervised project >> or two). Does anybody have any suggestions on a basic >> technique book for complete beginners? (Please tell >> me what you like and/or don't like about a particular >> book in addition to telling me the title.) >> >> Thanks- >> Angela >> >> __________________________________ >> Do you Yahoo!? >> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. >> http://search.yahoo.com >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 20:08:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L08RHP010274 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 20:08:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L0A5Uw027441 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 18:10:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L09lL0004384; Tue, 20 May 2003 18:09:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m05.mx.aol.com (imo-m05.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L09fL0004260 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 18:09:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.f.11ad5f95 (4568) for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 20:09:34 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 20:09:33 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] book suggestions? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10630 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/20/2003 5:36:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk writes: > A friend of mine who has never sewn anything wants to > >> learn how. Hurray for her! I wish more people would follow her lead. I concur with both the Reader's Digest and Simplicity sewing books. Not sure if they are available in the UK, though. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 20:26:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L0Q0HP010311 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 20:26:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L0RfUw028836 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 18:27:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L0ReL0016680; Tue, 20 May 2003 18:27:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L0RbL0016597 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 18:27:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.11e.21d2911d (4426) for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 20:27:29 -0400 (EDT) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <11e.21d2911d.2bfc21f1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 20:27:29 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] book suggestions? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO When I first learned to sew, I purchased Coats and Clark's "Garments For Beginners". It's fairly comprehensive- teaches you the basics of the sewing machine, how to balance tension, and then includes several clothing projects: shells, t-shirts, sweatshirts, pull-on skirts, pull-on pants, vests, wrap skirts, and unlined jackets. It assumes that you're working alone, rather than in a classroom setting, so it goes over pretty much everything. Granted I went off and took four lessons, and then went straight to much more complicated outfits, but it's definitely a good start. Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 21:08:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L18BHP010507 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:08:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L19lUw002810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 19:09:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L19k4R012925; Tue, 20 May 2003 19:09:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.kc.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L19h4R012893 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 19:09:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail5.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Tue, 20 May 2003 20:08:13 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030520201127.009fd790@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 20:15:13 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have worn saris to work before. Nobody said a word. It wasn't prohibited in our dress code so when I got a new sari I wanted to show off, I wore it. But there's no way anyone is going to mistake me for Indian. Red hair. Very pale skin. Of course, I'm known for my "artistic" dress at times. ;-) (BTW, I'm a librarian at a public library.) Sheryl Nance-Durst At 12:30 PM 5/19/03 -0400, you wrote: >Out of curiosity, do these people wear saris etc. on normal days? And >isn't their clothing part of their current culture, whereas a bliaut is >part of our past culture? However, if saris meet the dress code in your >office, you should be able to wear one as well. > >Nancy Kiel >nancy_kiel@hotmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 21:10:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1AVHP010518 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:10:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1C9Uw003026 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 19:12:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1C94R014212; Tue, 20 May 2003 19:12:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.kc.rr.com (fe1.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.48]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1C64R014187 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 19:12:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail1.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Tue, 20 May 2003 20:12:06 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030520201649.00a05490@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 20:17:42 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] book suggestions? In-Reply-To: <4AC334D9-8AF1-11D7-9895-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> References: <20030520180930.79190.qmail@web20208.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 11:31 AM 5/20/03 -0700, you wrote: >My favorite, that I always give to beginners, is the Reader's Digest guide >to sewing. > >It's got good illustrations, it cross references related issues, and it's >really comprehensive. This was the main one I had when I was learning to sew. I liked it then. Haven't looked at in a while, though. Sheryl Nance-Durst _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 21:13:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1DoHP010529 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:13:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1FSUw003284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 19:15:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1FS4R016300; Tue, 20 May 2003 19:15:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail3.kc.rr.com (fe3.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.50]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1FQ4R016286 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 19:15:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com ([65.30.107.115]) by mail3.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Tue, 20 May 2003 20:15:17 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030520201840.009e9160@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: sherylnd/pop-server.kc.rr.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 20:20:53 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fw: [st-george] RIP Jean Hunnisett In-Reply-To: <20030520.085556.-239601311.4.Seamstrix@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, darn it! First Janet Arnold and now Jean Hunnisett! The costuming world is losing too many great ones.... Sheryl N-D >It is with great sadness that I am notifying the list of the death >of my dear friend and teacher, Jean Hunnisett, from cancer on Monday >19th May. Jean, a lifelong non-smoker, was in hospital, in no pain, >and a friend was with her. I know she will be much missed by many >who have benefitted from her books, her expertise, and her >generosity in sharing it. > >Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 21:57:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1vJHP010679 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:57:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1wtUw006155 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 19:58:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1ws7v010516; Tue, 20 May 2003 19:58:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L1wq7v010505 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 19:58:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-010-086.jps.net ([216.119.10.86] helo=pavilion) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19IIsV-000344-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 20 May 2003 18:58:52 -0700 Message-ID: <001601c31f3e$7135f1e0$560a77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 19:12:32 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO No haven't seen that one Robin, but I will add that to the Catherine's Wheel farthingale list of items to look out for. I'm kind of stuck on that one at the moment. You know, maybe I could have a webpage with missing references on them like the missing kids milk carton ads. Or pop up ads "got references?.........St. Thomas's worsted" ........seriously ;) Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historic Costume List" Cc: "Susan Carroll-Clark" Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 7:56 AM Subject: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? > > A fellow researcher has run into the term "St. Thomas's worsted" and is > looking for further detail as to what this is. The context is material > culture of religious women, and the reference may be medieval, but I'm not > sure where she found it (the query came to me secondhand). Has anyone else > ever heard this term, historically or modernly? > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 23:10:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3AcHP010949 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 23:10:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3CKUw012538 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 21:12:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3CI21026119; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:12:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mxout3.cac.washington.edu (mxout3.cac.washington.edu [140.142.32.166]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3CG22026092 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:12:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailhost1.u.washington.edu (mailhost1.u.washington.edu [140.142.32.141])ESMTP id h4L3CFSL032377 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 20:12:15 -0700 Received: from [128.95.177.85] (gawne.urol.washington.edu [128.95.177.85]) ESMTP id h4L3CFu6014221 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 20:12:15 -0700 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.1.2418 Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 20:10:28 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? From: Agnes Gawne To: H-costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001601c31f3e$7135f1e0$560a77d8@pavilion> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4L3CG22026092 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I never heard of St. Thomas' Worsted so I looked it up in the OED online here at the university. They have a tiny listing for it under Saint as follows: c. Many objects are called after a place-name or a surname beginning with ŒSaint¹ (ŒSt.¹); the following are some of the more important. ...They then list a lot of things that start with St. and finish with this one: St. Omer's (corruptly St. Thomas) Worsted, a kind of worsted manufactured at St. Omer's ... So that means St. Thomas' is actually wrong, it should be St. Omer's according to the OED. Then under the citations this is the listing: 1530 PALSGR. 269/1 *Seynt Homer's worstedde, demy ostade. 1552 Inv. Church Goods (Surtees) II. 61 A cope of read Saint Thomas worsted. So in 1530 St. Omer was St. Homer. Anyway - it's definitely an old term if that helps. Agnes ------------------------------------------------------------------------ on 5/20/03 19:12, Lisa Sinervo at lisa-list@threadneedlest.com wrote: > No haven't seen that one Robin, but I will add that to the Catherine's Wheel > farthingale list of items to look out for. I'm kind of stuck on that one at > the moment. You know, maybe I could have a webpage with missing references > on them like the missing kids milk carton ads. Or pop up ads "got > references?.........St. Thomas's worsted" ........seriously ;) > > Lisa > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robin Netherton" > To: "Historic Costume List" > Cc: "Susan Carroll-Clark" > Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 7:56 AM > Subject: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? > > >> >> A fellow researcher has run into the term "St. Thomas's worsted" and is >> looking for further detail as to what this is. The context is material >> culture of religious women, and the reference may be medieval, but I'm not >> sure where she found it (the query came to me secondhand). Has anyone else >> ever heard this term, historically or modernly? >> >> --Robin >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 23:24:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3OZHP011011 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 23:24:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3QKUw013595 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 21:26:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3QJ21005389; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:26:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3QF21005301 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:26:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a210.in-tch.com [66.62.107.10]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4L37qH05843 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:07:52 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECAF22C.3DD9B4F0@in-tch.com> Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 21:27:40 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon References: <3EC9B3CC.6030107@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The Normans won? --sue, unhelpfully, running away *fast*....... Charlene Charette wrote: > > I'm looking for information on what differentiates a Norman from a > Saxon. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 20 23:32:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3WOHP011026 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 23:32:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3Y9Uw014360 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 21:34:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3Y821010057; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:34:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L3Y621009974 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:34:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a210.in-tch.com [66.62.107.10]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4L3FhH09118 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:15:43 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECAF403.7A215214@in-tch.com> Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 21:35:31 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? References: <01012F94.0FEE1725.349D0FDF@cs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Could it be worsted from a certain area or town, much like we'd say "Egyptian cotton?" It might imply a certain quality (or lack of same).... --sue's two euro worth ConstanceFairfax@cs.com wrote: > > Hi Robin, > > I've seen it in context of the costumes/props for St. George's day celebration in Norwich mid-16c - > It[e]m twoo cootes of St Thomas worsted for the henchemen > - Twolman - iiij s iiij d > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 00:47:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L4lQHP011297 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:47:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L4nCUw021777 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 22:49:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L4nALa020880; Tue, 20 May 2003 22:49:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mxout4.cac.washington.edu (mxout4.cac.washington.edu [140.142.33.19]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L4n8Lb020853 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 22:49:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailhost1.u.washington.edu (mailhost1.u.washington.edu [140.142.32.141])ESMTP id h4L4n7Tc003918 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:49:08 -0700 Received: from [128.95.177.85] (gawne.urol.washington.edu [128.95.177.85]) ESMTP id h4L4n7u6018541 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 21:49:07 -0700 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.1.2418 Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 21:49:08 -0700 From: Agnes Gawne To: H-costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001601c31f3e$7135f1e0$560a77d8@pavilion> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4L4n8Lb020853 Subject: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Catherine Wheel is in the OED... Here's the listing and citations:   1. The figure of a wheel with spikes projecting from its circumference (in reference to the legend of St. Catherine's martyrdom). esp. in Heraldry.     [a1225 Leg. Kath. 1942 Hat arkin fowr hweoles, ant let urhdriuen refter e spaken ant te felien mid irnene gadien.] 1584 R. SCOT Discov. Witchcr. XII. xv. 206 Others likewise have (as they brag) a Katharine wheel upon their bodies. 1650 B. Discolliminium 17 Though they turn their Rowels into Katherine-wheeles till they have over-taken their Ends. 1703 Lond. Gaz. No. 3906/4 The Coat 2 Spread Eagles quarter'd with Catharine Wheels. 1864 BOUTELL Heraldry Hist. & Pop. xxi. (ed. 3) 360 A Catherine wheel or.     attrib. 1607 WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, A short Dutch waist, with a round Catherine-Wheel Fardingale. on 5/20/03 19:12, Lisa Sinervo at lisa-list@threadneedlest.com wrote: > No haven't seen that one Robin, but I will add that to the Catherine's Wheel > farthingale list of items to look out for. I'm kind of stuck on that one at > the moment. You know, maybe I could have a webpage with missing references > on them like the missing kids milk carton ads. Or pop up ads "got > references?.........St. Thomas's worsted" ........seriously ;) > > Lisa > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robin Netherton" > To: "Historic Costume List" > Cc: "Susan Carroll-Clark" > Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 7:56 AM > Subject: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? > > >> >> A fellow researcher has run into the term "St. Thomas's worsted" and is >> looking for further detail as to what this is. The context is material >> culture of religious women, and the reference may be medieval, but I'm not >> sure where she found it (the query came to me secondhand). Has anyone else >> ever heard this term, historically or modernly? >> >> --Robin >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 01:08:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L58BHP011348 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 01:08:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L59uUw022871 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 23:09:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L59tjC000252; Tue, 20 May 2003 23:09:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L59rjC000192 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 23:09:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA17703 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:30:51 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 00:30:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tue, 20 May 2003, Agnes Gawne wrote: > I never heard of St. Thomas' Worsted so I looked it up in the OED > online here at the university. They have a tiny listing for it under > Saint as follows: Thanks. I didn't even bother with the OED because it's usually so unreliable for costume terms, but the citations are useful. I'll pass them along to the person asking! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 01:22:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L5MoHP011385 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 01:22:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L5OXUw023687 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 20 May 2003 23:24:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L5OWjC006820; Tue, 20 May 2003 23:24:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L5OTjC006801 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 23:24:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA17748 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:45:28 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 00:45:28 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4L5OTjC006801 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tue, 20 May 2003, Agnes Gawne wrote: > Catherine Wheel is in the OED... Here's the listing and citations: "Catherine wheel" itself is an iconographic staple and, I think was not in question. I believe Lisa was referring specifically to references to "Catherine wheel farthingale," which is named in a couple of modern costume books as a period term, but not cited. This particular citation of the ones you listed will be useful to me: >   attrib. 1607 WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, A short Dutch waist, with a > round Catherine-Wheel Fardingale. That's the first use I've seen of "wheel farthingale" in the period in which it was worn, and the first use I've ever seen of "Catherine wheel farthingale." (I checked OED long ago under farthingale for such references, but didn't think to look under Catherine-wheel.) Now I have to track down the play and see who is wearing it, and who is describing it. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 02:39:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L6dHHP023020 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 02:39:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L6ePUw028955 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 00:40:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L6eKuB016560; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:40:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L6eIuB016519 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:40:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7bed6.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.214]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id A392C262A0C for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:40:16 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000e01c31f63$dd7a50b0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 08:40:27 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh Robin i am delighted. Cant waite for the rest of the story! Whow!!!! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 7:45 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? > > On Tue, 20 May 2003, Agnes Gawne wrote: > > > Catherine Wheel is in the OED... Here's the listing and citations: > > "Catherine wheel" itself is an iconographic staple and, I think was not in > question. I believe Lisa was referring specifically to references to > "Catherine wheel farthingale," which is named in a couple of modern > costume books as a period term, but not cited. This particular citation of > the ones you listed will be useful to me: > > > attrib. 1607 WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, A short Dutch waist, with a > > round Catherine-Wheel Fardingale. > > That's the first use I've seen of "wheel farthingale" in the period in > which it was worn, and the first use I've ever seen of "Catherine wheel > farthingale." (I checked OED long ago under farthingale for such > references, but didn't think to look under Catherine-wheel.) Now I have to > track down the play and see who is wearing it, and who is describing it. > > --Robin > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 02:41:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L6fRHP023610 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 02:41:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L6h7Uw029271 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 00:43:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L6h7uB018396; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:43:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4L6h4uB018335 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 00:43:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7bed6.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.214]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 935C826296A for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:43:02 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001401c31f64$40f89750$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 08:43:13 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO That is why i love you people so much. You dont give up untill you find out. This is wonderfull news! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Agnes Gawne" To: "H-costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 6:49 AM Subject: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? > Catherine Wheel is in the OED... Here's the listing and citations: > > 1. The figure of a wheel with spikes projecting from its circumference (in > reference to the legend of St. Catherine's martyrdom). esp. in Heraldry. > > [a1225 Leg. Kath. 1942 Hat arkin fowr hweoles, ant let urhdriuen refter e > spaken ant te felien mid irnene gadien.] 1584 R. SCOT Discov. Witchcr. XII. > xv. 206 Others likewise have (as they brag) a Katharine wheel upon their > bodies. 1650 B. Discolliminium 17 Though they turn their Rowels into > Katherine-wheeles till they have over-taken their Ends. 1703 Lond. Gaz. No. > 3906/4 The Coat 2 Spread Eagles quarter'd with Catharine Wheels. 1864 > BOUTELL Heraldry Hist. & Pop. xxi. (ed. 3) 360 A Catherine wheel or. > > attrib. 1607 WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, A short Dutch waist, with a round > Catherine-Wheel Fardingale. > > > > on 5/20/03 19:12, Lisa Sinervo at lisa-list@threadneedlest.com wrote: > > > No haven't seen that one Robin, but I will add that to the Catherine's Wheel > > farthingale list of items to look out for. I'm kind of stuck on that one at > > the moment. You know, maybe I could have a webpage with missing references > > on them like the missing kids milk carton ads. Or pop up ads "got > > references?.........St. Thomas's worsted" ........seriously ;) > > > > Lisa > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Robin Netherton" > > To: "Historic Costume List" > > Cc: "Susan Carroll-Clark" > > Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 7:56 AM > > Subject: [h-cost] St. Thomas' worsted? > > > > > >> > >> A fellow researcher has run into the term "St. Thomas's worsted" and is > >> looking for further detail as to what this is. The context is material > >> culture of religious women, and the reference may be medieval, but I'm not > >> sure where she found it (the query came to me secondhand). Has anyone else > >> ever heard this term, historically or modernly? > >> > >> --Robin > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> h-costume mailing list > >> h-costume@mail.indra.com > >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 07:21:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LBLEHP014968 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 07:21:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LBMSUw018223 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 05:22:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LBMNVv021431; Wed, 21 May 2003 05:22:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LBMKVv021364 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 05:22:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from your1p37d9kihs (213-78-111-85.friaco.onetel.net.uk [213.78.111.85])3.2.2-GA) with SMTP id ADG97781; Wed, 21 May 2003 12:22:11 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <217e01c31f8b$349326c0$55654ed5@your1p37d9kihs> From: "Melanie Wilson" To: Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 12:22:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] Sprang help needed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi I'm looking for details on Sprang finds and clothing in Prehistoric Europe. Particularly reports and technical works rather that how to make Sprang type stuff. Can anyone help please ? Mel This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the Company, unless specifically stated _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 07:47:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LBlXHP015024 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 07:47:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LBnBUw020063 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 05:49:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LBnAVv002124; Wed, 21 May 2003 05:49:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LBn8Vv002076 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 05:49:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a221.in-tch.com [66.62.107.21]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4LBUiH06273 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 05:30:44 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECB6809.9942605@in-tch.com> Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 05:50:33 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sprang help needed References: <217e01c31f8b$349326c0$55654ed5@your1p37d9kihs> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've got some bits on early medieval sprang (8th c. and earlier) sprang hats (turned up in a new book), but not prehistorical..... --sue Melanie Wilson wrote: > > Hi I'm looking for details on Sprang finds and clothing in Prehistoric > Europe. Particularly reports and technical works rather that how to make > Sprang type stuff. Can anyone help please ? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 08:14:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LCEtHP015111 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:14:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LCGeUw022059 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 06:16:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LCGdQK014316; Wed, 21 May 2003 06:16:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LCGZQK014283 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 06:16:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA19162 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 07:37:35 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 07:37:35 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: <000e01c31f63$dd7a50b0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wed, 21 May 2003, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Oh Robin i am delighted. Cant waite for the rest of the story! It may be a few weeks before I get to the library! And finding an edition that has that particular play ... I have a handful of citations for "bum rolls" I also need to look up. Gotta read practically the whole play to put each one in context (e.g. to find out class level of the characters). I especially want to know who is doing the talking. If it's a man describing a woman, than it tells us that at least some observers of the time looked at the visual shape of a style of dress and equated it to a wheel, as many have done today. ("Catherine wheel" would have been an easy descriptive term for someone in the period, much more than today.) But it doesn't tell us whether that's a name for the farthingale itself. If it's a woman speaking -- particularly in a case where she's calling for her clothes, or ordering something at a shop -- it's more likely to suggest a term for an item rather than a description of a total look. All this being confounded by the fact that the playwright was a man, writing for a general audience. :-P I do see that the quote is dated from the period in which the skirt arrangement moved from "puffy" to "pleated," the latter being more "spokelike" and flatter in shape, and possibly something worth calling attention to in a description as a distinguishing point (e.g. "she was wearing this type of dress, not that other type of dress"). Any idea what a "short Dutch waist" might be? Possibly a descriptive term for the woman's build, but possibly also a costume item. --Robin > > > attrib. 1607 WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, A short Dutch waist, with a > > > round Catherine-Wheel Fardingale. > > > > That's the first use I've seen of "wheel farthingale" in the period in > > which it was worn, and the first use I've ever seen of "Catherine wheel > > farthingale." (I checked OED long ago under farthingale for such > > references, but didn't think to look under Catherine-wheel.) Now I have to > > track down the play and see who is wearing it, and who is describing it. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 10:11:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LEBWHP015555 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 10:11:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LECpUw003101 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 08:12:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LECm5N014507; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:12:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net (hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LECk5N014488 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:12:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-002-230.jps.net ([216.119.2.230] helo=pavilion) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19IUKk-0006ie-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 21 May 2003 07:12:46 -0700 Message-ID: <000601c31fa4$f97b2280$e60277d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 07:26:29 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Robin Wrote: > I especially want to know who is doing the talking. If it's a man > describing a woman, than it tells us that at least some observers of the > time looked at the visual shape of a style of dress and equated it to a > wheel, as many have done today. ("Catherine wheel" would have been an easy > descriptive term for someone in the period, much more than today.) But it > doesn't tell us whether that's a name for the farthingale itself. If it's > a woman speaking -- particularly in a case where she's calling for her > clothes, or ordering something at a shop -- it's more likely to suggest a > term for an item rather than a description of a total look. > As a follow on, I suppose this means "pumpkin pants" aren't actually made of pumpkins, nor are they constructed of pumpkin like components! Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 10:13:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LEDaHP015576 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 10:13:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LEFIUw003297 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 08:15:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LEFI5N015903; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:15:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net (hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LEFF5N015879 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:15:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-002-230.jps.net ([216.119.2.230] helo=pavilion) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19IUN8-0002E6-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 21 May 2003 07:15:15 -0700 Message-ID: <000d01c31fa5$52c960e0$e60277d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 07:29:00 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ......still those bents in the french farthingales had to be used for something, somewhere????? Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? > > Robin Wrote: > > > I especially want to know who is doing the talking. If it's a man > > describing a woman, than it tells us that at least some observers of the > > time looked at the visual shape of a style of dress and equated it to a > > wheel, as many have done today. ("Catherine wheel" would have been an easy > > descriptive term for someone in the period, much more than today.) But it > > doesn't tell us whether that's a name for the farthingale itself. If it's > > a woman speaking -- particularly in a case where she's calling for her > > clothes, or ordering something at a shop -- it's more likely to suggest a > > term for an item rather than a description of a total look. > > > As a follow on, I suppose this means "pumpkin pants" aren't actually made of > pumpkins, nor are they constructed of pumpkin like components! > > Lisa > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 10:23:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LENkHP015613 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 10:23:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LEP4Uw004188 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 08:25:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LEP25N021259; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:25:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LEOu5N021208 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 08:25:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7bed6.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.214]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id A68062629A1 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:24:54 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000d01c31fa4$d924a1a0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 16:25:36 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] dutch short waist X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello Robin. I have not a clue what a short dutch waist would be, but could it not just be the new style they used in the netherlands? Dutch style was going to be very fashionable, at this early date. I have some scans. The printed ones, is actually a dutch plate. It shows a merry company dansing and having a good time. If you look at the waistlines, they are higher than Elizabethan was. In England they used much lower waistlines, and particular the stomachers was much lower. This dutch style was adapted to Denmark two, and you can se the portrait of Anne Munk, the kings second wife. She is dressed in this dutch style. Queen Anne of Denmark, adapted this style two! So my guess would be, that they just refer to this higher waistline, where the ladies can rest their elbows on the wheels. Perhaps Holland was the origin of this fashion, and so they called it a Dutch short waist. Anyway, the prints are here: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/duchshortwaist This list should have much more of this kind of disgussions Bravo! Robin Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 14:22:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LIMgHP016554 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 14:22:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LIO2Uw029981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 12:24:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LIO0jc010974; Wed, 21 May 2003 12:24:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LINujc010890 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 12:23:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA20799 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 12:49:35 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 12:49:34 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] dutch short waist In-Reply-To: <000d01c31fa4$d924a1a0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wed, 21 May 2003, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > I have not a clue what a short dutch waist would be, but could it not > just be the new style they used in the netherlands? Dutch style was > going to be very fashionable, at this early date. I have some scans. > The printed ones, is actually a dutch plate. It shows a merry company > dansing and having a good time. If you look at the waistlines, they > are higher than Elizabethan was. In England they used much lower > waistlines, and particular the stomachers was much lower. This makes a lot of sense to me. If the shorter waist was seen as a "Dutch" style, the quote could be saying "she had a dress with a shorter waistline, like the Dutch style," rather than the other possibility -- that there was a garment called a "Dutch waist." I think the obvious short waist is clearest in the first of the three images you posted, particularly with the sash she's wearing that defines a waistline. The third image still has the long pointed stomacher you see in late Elizabethan. But what strikes me about both of these is that the farthingale protrudes more in the front than it did at this time in England, where it tapered down in front so that it was almost nonexistent at center front. That extra protrusion in front makes the stomacher on your third example bend outwards noticeably. In England the stomacher tends to dive straight down (with a straight busk), and the farthingale begins swelling out on either side of the point of the stomacher. This "bend" may be part of the "short waist" distinction. And it would also make sense with the quote, that pairs a mention of a Dutch short waist with a "Catherine-wheel farthingale" -- which may describe a farthingale that makes a clear full circle of protrusion around the body instead of the crescent-shape that's so typical of England. (Which then raises the question of whether it would be right to apply "wheel" as a descriptor for the English style of farthingale. Modern books do it, but frankly, I've never seen a modern book make the distinction we're seeing here -- between the English crescent and the Dutch round shape. And I haven't found "wheel" used as a farthingale descriptor in *any* English contexts of this period.) > So my guess would be, that they just refer to this higher waistline, > where the ladies can rest their elbows on the wheels. Perhaps Holland > was the origin of this fashion, and so they called it a Dutch short > waist. Just FYI, resting the elbows on the farthingale at the side was something the Elizabethans did too -- you can see it in pictures, and it's actually mentioned in at least one document. The farthingale protrusion was about the same height (waist level) at the side. But the fronts are distinctive, with the English having the straighter, deeper point. I do think you have it right that this was a style seen as different, and called "Dutch." Thanks for the insight. I am so thankful to have so many nationalities represented on this list, and people who are familiar with sources we don't get to see over here very often! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 15:46:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LJkHHP016940 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 15:46:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LIA5Wk028398 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 12:17:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LHWnde028406; Wed, 21 May 2003 11:32:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LHWkI5028359 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 11:32:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA20812 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 12:53:46 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 12:53:46 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: <000d01c31fa5$52c960e0$e60277d8@pavilion> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wed, 21 May 2003, Lisa Sinervo wrote: > > Robin Wrote: > > > I especially want to know who is doing the talking. If it's a man > > describing a woman, than it tells us that at least some observers of the > > time looked at the visual shape of a style of dress and equated it to a > > wheel, as many have done today ... a description of a total look. > > > As a follow on, I suppose this means "pumpkin pants" aren't actually made of > pumpkins, nor are they constructed of pumpkin like components! Bingo :-) > ......still those bents in the french farthingales had to be used for > something, somewhere????? In mine (which is a very large, stuffed, structured roll), I use the bents around the outer edge. An earlier version tried the bents vertically, the way the "stripes" run in smaller rolls in pictures, but this was counterproductive -- distended the smooth surface, forced the bents to wrap around too tight a curve, and didn't accomplish anything useful. I wonder how well those rolls stood up under daily wear. I haven't had the opportunity to test one in use, day after day after day. So it may be that adding a little structure with bents kept the thing from looking like a lumpy, misshapen pillow after X number of wearings. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 16:33:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LKXPHP017093 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:33:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LKYsUw015576 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 14:34:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LKYmpC022845; Wed, 21 May 2003 14:34:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtpout.mac.com (A17-250-248-85.apple.com [17.250.248.85]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LKYhpC022783 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 14:34:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mac.com (smtpin08-en2 [10.13.10.153]) by smtpout.mac.com (Xserve/MantshX 2.0) with ESMTP id h4LKYd1g025430 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 13:34:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [140.142.183.82] (cs203-81.fsmodem.washington.edu [140.142.183.82]) (authenticated bits=0) by mac.com (Xserve/MantshX 2.0) with ESMTP id h4L6mWNN017550 for ; Tue, 20 May 2003 23:48:46 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 23:48:37 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? From: Agnes Gawne To: Historical Costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4LKYhpC022783 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Right - o that's why I included that citation. I thought it was also useful to see the alternate spelling - Fardingale. Agnes > From: Robin Netherton > Reply-To: Historical Costume > Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 00:45:28 -0500 (CDT) > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? > > > On Tue, 20 May 2003, Agnes Gawne wrote: > >> Catherine Wheel is in the OED... Here's the listing and citations: > > "Catherine wheel" itself is an iconographic staple and, I think was not in > question. I believe Lisa was referring specifically to references to > "Catherine wheel farthingale," which is named in a couple of modern > costume books as a period term, but not cited. This particular citation of > the ones you listed will be useful to me: > >>   attrib. 1607 WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, A short Dutch waist, with a >> round Catherine-Wheel Fardingale. > > That's the first use I've seen of "wheel farthingale" in the period in > which it was worn, and the first use I've ever seen of "Catherine wheel > farthingale." (I checked OED long ago under farthingale for such > references, but didn't think to look under Catherine-wheel.) Now I have to > track down the play and see who is wearing it, and who is describing it. > > --Robin > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 16:41:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LKfVHP017152 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:41:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LKh7Uw016836 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 14:43:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LKh6pC029613; Wed, 21 May 2003 14:43:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LKh2pC029526 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 14:43:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA21883 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:04:02 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 16:04:02 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tue, 20 May 2003, Agnes Gawne wrote: > that's why I included that citation. I thought it was also useful to > see the alternate spelling - Fardingale. Another one that pops up in period texts is vertingale and variants thereof (vardingale, verdingale, etc.) --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 17:01:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LL1MHP017218 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:01:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LL1bUw019027 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 15:01:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LL1aZ7017750; Wed, 21 May 2003 15:01:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LL1XZ7017697 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 15:01:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fd9.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.217]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 50D8E47FF8C for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 23:01:31 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001901c31fdc$4c1051f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 23:02:32 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi again. Apropos these continental wheel farthingales, i shall look for a painting i have of Anna Cathrine, Christian IV's queen wearing same type of "Catherine Wheel" as the dutch ones. I shall post a link to the painting tomorrow when i get home from work. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 11:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? > > On Tue, 20 May 2003, Agnes Gawne wrote: > > > that's why I included that citation. I thought it was also useful to > > see the alternate spelling - Fardingale. > > Another one that pops up in period texts is vertingale and variants > thereof (vardingale, verdingale, etc.) > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 17:48:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LLmeHP017398 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:48:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LLmsUw024516 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 15:48:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LLmqN7024320; Wed, 21 May 2003 15:48:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LLmnN7024267 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 15:48:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19IbS5-000Nqr-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 21 May 2003 22:48:49 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 17:39:32 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? References: <000e01c31f63$dd7a50b0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A "short Dutch waist", in this sort of period, instantly makes me think of the high-waisted look in Rembrandt paintings, also the short, loose cavalier-style of women's jackets. Worth looking in that direction? Jean Robin Netherton wrote > >On Wed, 21 May 2003, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > >> Oh Robin i am delighted. Cant waite for the rest of the story! > >It may be a few weeks before I get to the library! And finding an edition >that has that particular play ... I have a handful of citations for "bum >rolls" I also need to look up. Gotta read practically the whole play to >put each one in context (e.g. to find out class level of the characters). > >I especially want to know who is doing the talking. If it's a man >describing a woman, than it tells us that at least some observers of the >time looked at the visual shape of a style of dress and equated it to a >wheel, as many have done today. ("Catherine wheel" would have been an easy >descriptive term for someone in the period, much more than today.) But it >doesn't tell us whether that's a name for the farthingale itself. If it's >a woman speaking -- particularly in a case where she's calling for her >clothes, or ordering something at a shop -- it's more likely to suggest a >term for an item rather than a description of a total look. > >All this being confounded by the fact that the playwright was a man, >writing for a general audience. :-P > >I do see that the quote is dated from the period in which the skirt >arrangement moved from "puffy" to "pleated," the latter being more >"spokelike" and flatter in shape, and possibly something worth calling >attention to in a description as a distinguishing point (e.g. "she was >wearing this type of dress, not that other type of dress"). > >Any idea what a "short Dutch waist" might be? Possibly a descriptive term >for the woman's build, but possibly also a costume item. > >--Robin > > >> > > attrib. 1607 WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, A short Dutch waist, with a >> > > round Catherine-Wheel Fardingale. >> > >> > That's the first use I've seen of "wheel farthingale" in the period in >> > which it was worn, and the first use I've ever seen of "Catherine wheel >> > farthingale." (I checked OED long ago under farthingale for such >> > references, but didn't think to look under Catherine-wheel.) Now I have to >> > track down the play and see who is wearing it, and who is describing it. > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 18:04:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LM4EHP017442 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:04:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LM5KUw026202 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 16:05:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LM5H7t006905; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:05:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailhost.softwareinnovation.com (w002.z064000176.dfw-tx.dsl.cnc.net [64.0.176.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LM5D7t006860 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:05:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from theforce [64.0.176.2] by mailhost.softwareinnovation.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-6.00) id A8188E04AC; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:05:12 -0500 From: "Betsy Marshall" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 17:05:11 -0500 Message-ID: <000201c31fe5$0cedf8c0$02b00040@softwareinnovation.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-reply-to: Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Is this another case of that linguistic drift -cf Pater/vater/father? Just trying to make some connections.. Betsy -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Robin Netherton Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 4:04 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? On Tue, 20 May 2003, Agnes Gawne wrote: > that's why I included that citation. I thought it was also useful to > see the alternate spelling - Fardingale. Another one that pops up in period texts is vertingale and variants thereof (vardingale, verdingale, etc.) --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 18:13:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMD6HP017483 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:13:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMCvUw027091 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 16:12:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMCu7t012296; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:12:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from www19.networkshosting.com (www19.networkshosting.com [66.96.128.118]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4LMCs7t012230 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:12:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 22444 invoked from network); 21 May 2003 22:05:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO costumepress.com) (67.31.160.103) by www19.fatcow.com with SMTP; 21 May 2003 22:05:26 -0000 Message-ID: <3ECBF9DD.233B9096@costumepress.com> Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 16:12:51 -0600 From: Mary Denise Smith X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-NSCPCD (Macintosh; U; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Creative spelling References: <000201c31fe5$0cedf8c0$02b00040@softwareinnovation.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think it is a case of creative "phonetic" spelling. All those words have similar sounds, and (English) spelling was not standardized until after the middle of the 19th Century. MD/Marged who learned to spell phonetically and makes some hilarious mistakes . . . Betsy Marshall wrote: > > Is this another case of that linguistic drift -cf Pater/vater/father? > Just trying to make some connections.. > Betsye _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 18:13:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMDsHP017486 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:13:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMFMUw027348 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 16:15:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMFL7t013821; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:15:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mxout1.cac.washington.edu (mxout1.cac.washington.edu [140.142.32.134]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMFJ7u013800 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:15:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailhost1.u.washington.edu (mailhost1.u.washington.edu [140.142.32.141])ESMTP id h4LMFIRG016759 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 15:15:18 -0700 Received: from [128.95.177.85] (gawne.urol.washington.edu [128.95.177.85]) ESMTP id h4LMFIu6012498 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 15:15:18 -0700 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.1.2418 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 15:15:17 -0700 From: Agnes Gawne To: H-costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4LMFJ7u013800 Subject: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel and short Dutch Waist X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO So - I know you are probably sick of this but I looked up "Short Dutch Waist" in the online Oxford English dictionary and I got this listing under Waist. There is more reference to the Cathern wheel with a little more of the quotation and who is actually speaking. I hope this helps your research. Let me know if you guys don't want any more of these OED quotations, email purges out the italics but I think the citations are still useful. (part 1 is the normal definition of waist, part 2 has the clothing references)   2a. A girdle. Obs.     2b. The part of a garment that covers the waist; the narrowed part of a garment corresponding to the narrowing of the body at the waist (but sometimes, in accordance with fashion, worn higher or lower than the position of this); the place in a woman's dress where the bodice and skirt meet.     1650 BULWER Anthropomet. App. (1653) 539 The waste (as one notes) is now come to the knee; for, the Points that were used to be about the middle, are now dangling there. 1711 STEELE Spect. No. 109 4 The Modern [petticoat] is gather'd at the Waste. 1836 MARRYAT Midsh. Easy xix, They loaded the pistols, took a pair each and put them in their waists. 1871 Figure Training 25 Ladies of fashion in England might be said to have at that period [c1806] abandoned waists altogether. 1885 Fairholt's Costume Engl. I. 405 In 1794 short waists became fashionable. Ibid. 408 Open gowns were discarded, and waists about 1798 became longer, until at the end of the century they regained their proper shape.       2c. The part of a garment between the shoulders and the Œwaist¹ or narrowed part (see 2b).     1607 DEKKER & WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, What fashion will make a woman haue the best bodie Taylor? Tay. A short dutch wast with a round cathern-wheele fardingale. 1837 DICKENS Pickw. ii, ŒRather short in the waist, an't it?¹ said the stranger, screwing himself round to catch a glimpse in the glass of the waist buttons which were half way up his back. 1853 Bleak Ho. vi, Ladies haymaking, in short waists, and large hats tied under the chin.   _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 18:30:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMUfHP017555 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:30:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMWEUw029562 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 16:32:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMWC7t025686; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:32:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LMW77t025610 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:32:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32faf.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.175]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id D0DDA5EE159 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 00:32:05 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000f01c31fe8$f1ad3540$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel and short Dutch Waist Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 00:33:03 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO 1607 DEKKER & WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, What fashion will make a woman haue the best bodie Taylor? Tay. A short dutch wast with a round cathern-wheele fardingale. Dear Agnes. You dont know how happy you have made me with this! I am most greatfull. Thanks for that lovely quote. Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 19:09:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LN9XHP017701 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 19:09:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LN9qUw003672 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 17:09:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LN9olQ021458; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:09:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LN9klQ021410 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:09:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA22755 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:30:48 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 18:30:48 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel and short Dutch Waist In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wed, 21 May 2003, Agnes Gawne wrote: > So - I know you are probably sick of this but I looked up "Short Dutch > Waist" in the online Oxford English dictionary and I got this listing > under Waist. There is more reference to the Cathern wheel with a > little more of the quotation and who is actually speaking. I hope > this helps your research. Yes, it does! I really need to check out the whole scene. With luck, the tailor may also discuss the merits of some other styles for comparison, and we can see what he points out as something that contrasts with his recommendation. (It would probably be too much to ask that he might indicate what the darn things are made of, rather than just the shape they present.) Bjarne, it does sound as though the tailor is recommending a certain fashionable style, as you suggested -- e.g. a short Dutch waist as opposed to the standard English long-waisted look, and a Catherine-wheel farthingale as opposed to ... what? I would guess, as opposed to the English style of farthingale that doesn't protrude in the front. I'll have to look over some Dutch fashions of 1607 to see if that distinction holds true. > Let me know if you guys don't want any more of these OED quotations, > email purges out the italics but I think the citations are still > useful. That full-text search is nice. I looked in my hardcopy OED ages ago for farthingale references, but who would have thought to find them under "Catherine-wheel" or "waist"? I think my local public library may offer a searchable OED... In general the OED is not terribly useful for costume definitions. It relies a lot on Strutt, Planche, and Fairholt, for instance, who were leading costume scholars of their time, but citing their work just perpetuates their assumptions about the dress of previous eras. But the citations from the period consistent with the clothing at hand is *very* useful. The OED has more than once pointed me to places to look, and then I make my own interpretations about the definitions. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 19:45:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNjuHP017856 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 19:45:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNlWUw007306 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 17:47:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNlTlQ013798; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:47:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNlQlQ013767 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:47:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.7) with ESMTP id h4LNlP4r026179 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:47:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [136.152.196.41] (as3-4-55.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.196.41]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNlFuI025862 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:47:22 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 10:56:52 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I feel just like Jessica, and Carolyn, I admire you. I would just >be too shy - a lot of people on this list seem to dress flamboyantly >or unusually in everyday life, but I don't feel confident that way, >and I would be worried what other people might think. I feel I >could wear my medieval costumes to work less self-consciously - but >I really don't think it would work in my office! > >Jean I would wear a medieval costume for everyday use, but I have a lot of fun making things that are intended as everyday clothing that have historic resonances. Most of my coats are based on historic designs -- often very directly. I have a raincoat made from the turn of the century raincoat pattern in Blanche Payne, and my heavy wool coat is an adaptation of a multi-caped redingote. My gray flannel business suit is adapted heavily from a late 18th c. man's suit pattern. And I really go wild with historic-based vests (which seem to be a place one is allowed to be more flamboyant). Some of it is just practical -- I've been trying for years to find a nice comfortable but stylish pants style to sew, and finally hit on one in a Victorian tailor's book. I'm currently finishing up a light jacket made of sari fabric that is based on the cut of Queen Bathilde's coat from 7th century France. Very few of these items are ones that the average person would point to and think "that's a costume, not clothing", but part of it is in using fabrics that distract the mind from the original historic context, or by "softening" some of the more obviously non-modern aspects of the silhouette. I don't think that anyone should dress in things that make them uncomfortable. On the other hand, you can gradually develop your own personal style by gradually adding things that you enjoy and that flatter you that don't on an individual basis, scream "COSTUME!" Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 19:47:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNlcHP017861 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 19:47:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNm1Uw007399 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 17:48:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNm0lQ014043; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:48:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNlTlQ013802 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:47:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.7) with ESMTP id h4LNlT4r026300 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:47:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [136.152.196.41] (as3-4-55.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.196.41]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4LNlFuK025862 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 16:47:26 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <217e01c31f8b$349326c0$55654ed5@your1p37d9kihs> References: <217e01c31f8b$349326c0$55654ed5@your1p37d9kihs> X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 11:08:12 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sprang help needed Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 12:22 PM +0100 5/21/03, Melanie Wilson wrote: >Hi I'm looking for details on Sprang finds and clothing in Prehistoric >Europe. Particularly reports and technical works rather that how to make >Sprang type stuff. Can anyone help please ? Should we assume that you already have Margaret Hald's book on Danish textiles which has such wonderful descriptions and discussions of the early sprang caps from that area? And also Peter Collingwood's book on Sprang? (I wavered between assuming that of _course_ you know about these already and that you might be insulted to be told about them, and figuring that it's safer not to assume anything, and besides which other people will be reading the thread.) I also have references to a few articles: Riegl, Alois. 1889. Aegyptischen Textilfunde im K.K. Oesterreich Museum. (includes a section on sprang) Jenkins, Ian & Dyfri Williams. 1985. "Sprang Hair Nets: Their manufacture and Use in Ancient Greece" in Am J of Archaeology: 89:411-418. (the article title was cut off in my database, but I think this is the gist of it -- more based on pictorial evidence than actual archaeological finds) Wilson, Lillian M.. 1933. Ancient Textiles from Egypt in the University of Michigan Collection.: Univ. of Michigan Press, 1933. (This article is actually an excellent Awful Example of how museum curators can get textile techniques grossly wrong if they aren't familiar with them. The article explains how the sprang items must have been carefully and delicately created by sewing each new thread into the loops of the previous row!) Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 20:41:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M0fQHP018037 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 20:41:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M0gtUw012302 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 18:42:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M0grJC014976; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:42:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mxout3.cac.washington.edu (mxout3.cac.washington.edu [140.142.32.166]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M0goJD014949 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:42:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailhost2.u.washington.edu (mailhost2.u.washington.edu [140.142.33.2])ESMTP id h4M0gnSL013547 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:42:49 -0700 Received: from [128.95.177.85] (gawne.urol.washington.edu [128.95.177.85]) ESMTP id h4M0gnQN028000 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:42:49 -0700 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.1.2418 Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 17:42:48 -0700 From: Agnes Gawne To: H-costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4M0goJD014949 Subject: [h-cost] Blanche Payne X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO When I saw Blanche Payne mentioned in Heather Rose Jones' last email I had to share with you that I was at the University of Washington Henry Art Gallery today and saw some of the Eastern European Folk/ethnic garments that Blanche Payne collected on her travels to Yugoslavia in 1930 and 1937. They also had on show some of the water colors she had made and some pen and ink sketches of garments. She was apparently interested in details like embroidery, seam finishes, etc. I don't think these illustrations were ever published I have her history of costume text which has nice patterns in the back so it was nice to see some of her other work, illustrations and her personally collected garments. The Henry Art Museum is attempting to catalog and photograph (or digitize old photographs) of everything in Blanche Payne's collection (that collection actually belongs to the UW libraries) as well as the new "Margaret Hord" collection of Eastern European ethnic/folk dress (they were just given this year and are in the midst of cataloging) for online access. They expect the project to take 2 years. A portion of Blanche Payne's fashion plate collection (there were 1050 or so fashion plates in the collection, there are 417 online) is online at: http://content-dev.lib.washington.edu/costumeweb/index.html It was sort of fun to see garments collected by the author of a book that seems like an old friend. \\ This is the information about the talk that was today: Do Clothes Talk? Diana Ryesky, Ph.D., former UW assistant professor and Irene Joshi, M.L.S., UW Libraries, retired Wednesday, May 21, 2003, 12:30 pm Ryesky and Joshi are volunteering to catalog and research the Henry¹s recently acquired gift of the Margaret Hord Collection of Eastern European Costumes. Using this collection for illustration, the speakers discuss how to critically examine, research, and document textile and costume artifacts. Here's another one in 2 weeks if any of you are in Seattle - they say it will cover specifically textiles and garments: Caring for Your Art Work Judy Sourakli, Curator of Collections, Henry Art Gallery Wednesday, June 4, 2003, 12:30 pm Sourakli provides strategies and guidelines on how to preserve your private art objects and how light and environmental conditions affect the longevity and integrity of your art. Judy will discuss archival materials and how to properly store and display your collection. on 5/21/03 10:56, Heather Rose Jones at hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu wrote: >> I feel just like Jessica, and Carolyn, I admire you. I would just >> be too shy - a lot of people on this list seem to dress flamboyantly >> or unusually in everyday life, but I don't feel confident that way, >> and I would be worried what other people might think. I feel I >> could wear my medieval costumes to work less self-consciously - but >> I really don't think it would work in my office! >> >> Jean > > I would wear a medieval costume for everyday use, but I have a lot of > fun making things that are intended as everyday clothing that have > historic resonances. Most of my coats are based on historic designs > -- often very directly. I have a raincoat made from the turn of the > century raincoat pattern in Blanche Payne, and my heavy wool coat is > an adaptation of a multi-caped redingote. My gray flannel business > suit is adapted heavily from a late 18th c. man's suit pattern. And > I really go wild with historic-based vests (which seem to be a place > one is allowed to be more flamboyant). Some of it is just practical > -- I've been trying for years to find a nice comfortable but stylish > pants style to sew, and finally hit on one in a Victorian tailor's > book. I'm currently finishing up a light jacket made of sari fabric > that is based on the cut of Queen Bathilde's coat from 7th century > France. > > Very few of these items are ones that the average person would point > to and think "that's a costume, not clothing", but part of it is in > using fabrics that distract the mind from the original historic > context, or by "softening" some of the more obviously non-modern > aspects of the silhouette. > > I don't think that anyone should dress in things that make them > uncomfortable. On the other hand, you can gradually develop your own > personal style by gradually adding things that you enjoy and that > flatter you that don't on an individual basis, scream "COSTUME!" > > Heather _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 20:50:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M0oCHP018051 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 20:50:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M0mVUw012819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 18:48:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M0mUJC018653; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:48:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net (grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M0mSJC018633 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 18:48:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-005-245.jps.net ([216.119.5.245] helo=pavilion) by grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19IeFu-0001YJ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 21 May 2003 17:48:27 -0700 Message-ID: <002601c31ffd$c7a25f40$f50577d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EC7E4B5.6030603@kabelfoon.nl> Subject: Re: [h-cost] polymer clay-making period buttons Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 18:02:11 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Talia, I don't think you would run into copyright issues copying buttons as they are "useful objects" and are therefore not copyrightable at least not in the US, it would be a personal conscious thing. I haven't been paying too much attention to the list lately, busy learning web programs, but this button stuff sounds very interesting. How do these buttons of yours hold up? I'm asking as I have a handful of 16th and 17th century buttons now, that I am thinking about reproducing, (after I finish scanning stubbes, and get my website up) No doubt the 200 plus hand cast buttons would be too costly to most. But perhaps people might be interested in purchasing a mold based upon an actual period button and then making the buttons themselves. How many times can a mold be used? Your buttons are gorgeous. I'm glad this subject came up. Lisa Sinervo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deredere Galbraith" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 12:53 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] polymer clay > Hi, > > What is RTV?? > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > >So, I carve whatever object I want in hard wax, mold it with RTV compound > >and press my PC directly into the RTV mold when it has cured. Most of the > >buttons are my own original carvings. There are a couple where I have taken > >buttons from the late 1800s or early 1900s and molded them. I wouldn't do > >modern buttons because of copyright issues. > > > >Talia > > > > > > > >>-----Original Message----- > >>From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > >>Behalf Of Marionetta@aol.com > >>Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 9:48 AM > >>To: h-costume@indra.com > >>Subject: [h-cost] polymer clay > >> > >> > >> > >>I've been following the polymer clay thread with great interest. I've > >>played around with it for horns for fantasy costumes and drawer > >>pulls for my > >>cupboards but have never seen jewelry that looked as realistic as > >>some of the > >>recent examples. Talia's buttons are especially amazing. Do > >>you all have > >>hints as to how to get the very fine detail that some of these > >>pieces have? > >>I've got a dremel tool and am not afraid to use it... > >> > >>Cheers, > >>Loren > >> > >> > >> > >>>I've made a lot of buttons using polymer clay. Check some of > >>> > >>> > >>them out here: > >> > >> > >>>http://www.medieval-treasures.com/id91.htm > >>> > >>>I've got more than are pictured, but just need to get around to > >>> > >>> > >>updating > >> > >> > >>>the > >>>site. > >>> > >>>Talia > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>_______________________________________________ > >>h-costume mailing list > >>h-costume@mail.indra.com > >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >> > >> > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 23:32:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M3WZHP018814 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 23:32:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M229Uw019188 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 20:02:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M227jp029995; Wed, 21 May 2003 20:02:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M225jp029932 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 20:02:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.15f.20bb3d5b (4214) for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 22:01:57 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <15f.20bb3d5b.2bfd8995@aol.com> Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 22:01:57 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Blanche Payne To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10630 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/21/2003 8:44:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, gawne@mac.com writes: > A portion of Blanche Payne's fashion plate collection (there were 1050 or so > fashion plates in the collection, there are 417 online) is online at: > > Thanks so much for this information. I'm always glad to find more color versions of the early 19th century fashion plates. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 21 23:47:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M3lRHP018861 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 23:47:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M27HUw019704 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 20:07:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M27Gjp002928; Wed, 21 May 2003 20:07:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.kc.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M27Ejp002916 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 20:07:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from karen ([24.31.233.125]) by mail5.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Wed, 21 May 2003 21:05:49 -0500 From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] polymer clay-making period buttons Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 21:07:17 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <002601c31ffd$c7a25f40$f50577d8@pavilion> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The molding compounds that I have tried have worked very well, and last a long time -- many hundreds of uses, I'd guess. As far as how the polymer buttons themselves hold up, it depends on how they are made. I make mine with metal backs so that they are quite sturdy. They can be made without using metal backs, but then I wouldn't recommend heavy use. When someone purchases mine, I advise the following treatment: 1: Machine washing cold is okay, but the garment should be turned inside out. 2: No bleach 3: No dry cleaning 4: If you must tumble dry, do so on cool with the garment inside out. If these instructions are followed, the polymer buttons should last better/longer the counterparts they mimic (ie wood, bone, ivory...) Talia > button stuff sounds very interesting. How do these buttons of yours hold > up? I'm asking as I have a handful of 16th and 17th century buttons now, > that I am thinking about reproducing, (after I finish scanning > stubbes, and > get my website up) No doubt the 200 plus hand cast buttons would be too > costly to most. But perhaps people might be interested in > purchasing a mold > based upon an actual period button and then making the buttons themselves. > How many times can a mold be used? Your buttons are gorgeous. I'm glad > this subject came up. > > Lisa Sinervo _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 00:01:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M41oHP018999 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 00:01:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M420Uw027639 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 22:02:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M41wIM007018; Wed, 21 May 2003 22:01:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M41tIM006925 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 22:01:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m140.in-tch.com [216.166.191.140]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4M3gXH10311 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 21:42:33 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECC4BCF.BCD8A5A8@in-tch.com> Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 22:02:24 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Creative spelling References: <000201c31fe5$0cedf8c0$02b00040@softwareinnovation.com> <3ECBF9DD.233B9096@costumepress.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Also, I believe it was actually a Spanish word when it first appeared in use, so you can add the "moving from one language to another" warping factor. --sue Mary Denise Smith wrote: > > I think it is a case of creative "phonetic" spelling. All those words > have similar sounds, and (English) spelling was not standardized until > after the middle of the 19th Century. > > MD/Marged > who learned to spell phonetically and makes some hilarious mistakes . . . > > Betsy Marshall wrote: > > > > Is this another case of that linguistic drift -cf Pater/vater/father? > > Just trying to make some connections.. > > Betsye > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 00:57:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M4v7HP019169 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 00:57:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M4wbUw003689 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 22:58:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M4waKZ011403; Wed, 21 May 2003 22:58:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M4wXKZ011392 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 22:58:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.7) with ESMTP id h4M4wW4r023829 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 21:58:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [136.152.196.220] (tnt-1-28.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.196.220]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M4wNuI023755 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 21:58:30 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 21:49:53 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:56 AM -0700 5/21/03, Heather Rose Jones wrote: >>I feel just like Jessica, and Carolyn, I admire you. I would just >>be too shy - a lot of people on this list seem to dress >>flamboyantly or unusually in everyday life, but I don't feel >>confident that way, and I would be worried what other people might >>think. I feel I could wear my medieval costumes to work less >>self-consciously - but I really don't think it would work in my >>office! >> >>Jean > >I would wear a medieval costume for everyday use, but I have a lot >of fun making things that are Eeeep! "wouldn't", not "would". I _wouldn't_ wear a medieavl costume for everyday use. Pesky negatives. Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 01:06:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M56vHP019190 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:06:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M56dUw004202 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 21 May 2003 23:06:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M56cKZ015207; Wed, 21 May 2003 23:06:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sccrmhc01.attbi.com (sccrmhc01.attbi.com [204.127.202.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M56YKZ015155 for ; Wed, 21 May 2003 23:06:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hopperflop2 (c-24-130-252-190.we.client2.attbi.com[24.130.252.190]) by attbi.com (sccrmhc01) with SMTP id <2003052205062800100s1rd1e>; Thu, 22 May 2003 05:06:28 +0000 Message-ID: <005301c3201f$e5981450$befc8218@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 22:06:25 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [h-cost] 'Goddess' exhibit/book at the Met? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Has anyone had a chance to either see the exhibit "Goddess" -- or take a look at the accompanying book -- at the Met's Costume Institute? Any reviews? I'd particularly like to know whether there's much historic (pre-20th century) costume in the book... - Kendra http://demode.tweedlebop.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 02:26:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M6QhHP028020 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 02:26:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M6SJUw010602 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 00:28:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M6SIwa028271; Thu, 22 May 2003 00:28:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M6SGwa028253 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 00:28:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AE371DE0070; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:29:11 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AE008F10100; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:28:16 -0500 Message-ID: <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 02:30:11 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I often wonder why individuals care what people worry about what others think about what you wear. Those of you who do care please shed some light. I am interested in knowing as a dresser. Dress is a reflection of your personality and mood. Some people dress conservative, some casual, some artsy, some innovative. Sometimes when your life changes, your fashion taste or style changes. When you go fashion shopping, take a very honest friend with you. Kim and our interns have been discussing a change in her style. She has had a change in her lifestyle to a new mother. It has been really fun with all the different suggestions from everyone. Generally, when someone is not happy with their fashion style, it is because of a change in their life. You need to make yourself happy first and forget everyone else. If you are happy with your style, you really won't care what everyone else thinks. I only make fashion suggestions if it is a dressing job OR if a person asks. I always tell the truth but in a helpful way. This past weekend I dressed three girls for prom. Two of the girls were wearing strapless gowns. When they bent over or sat down their bras showed in the back. Instead of saying, "Oh my God, your bra is showing!", I told them in a gentle way about the problem and pinned their bras to the gowns. I also suggested to watch one another's backs during the prom for the problem. I gave them extra pins to put in their purses in cause of an accident. People really appreciate when you let them know about a problem opposed to being embarrassed in front of others... who will talk about these problems, like teenage guys. I fix people's clothing all the time, in church, elevators, stores. I have a discrete way of doing so. Tags do hang out, slips show, threads hang when you least expect it. Those are things that embarrass people. Wearing the wrong outfit is not something to be embarrassed about. A really important thing I have found about fashion is how one carries themselves. If you feel good about your fashion choice of the day, it shows in your stature. The only time I pick what I am going to wear in advance is when going to the Balls. Otherwise, I pick clothing for the day, by what mood I am in. If I don't want to be noticed, I dress down. If it is an average day, I dress so that people will approach me but not bombard me. If I want to be noticed, I can dress that way too. I also like for people to feel free to ask about what I am wearing... its the old model in me. For some reason people feel free to ask questions about an ensemble, touch and feel the fabric, etc. My male othro doctor went nuts over these bungie-cord sandals I was wearing during my last visit. For some reason people love these shoes and when I tell them the shoes are bungie-cords, they have to pull on one of the straps to believe it. Now I was dressed really casual and feeling like crap that day, but one fashion item can change people's whole opinion by what you are dressed like. When dressing you can cover any flaw. Two weeks ago, my son was making his confirmation. We had an accident at my home (husband got chorine poisoning) and couldn't get my hair roots dyed. Cure: wear a hat. Everyone at church commented on how lovely I looked and how much they loved my hat. I dress down a lot when I go around town. The reason, I don't want my former school students to recognize me. I like my privacy when running around town. My students only recognize me when I am dressed up, because I dressed up when I taught classes. I got this idea from Sissy Spacek, who comes into Richmond frequently. People didn't recognize her because she dresses down when she comes to town. I'm not a movie star by far, but anyone who has been a teacher knows you run into students all the time. Sometimes you just don't want to be bothered. Dress is such a wonderful tool! It says so much... don't mess with me, talk with me, your friendly, etc. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 03:02:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M72SHP007441 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 03:02:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M744Uw012619 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 01:04:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7427L011699; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:04:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M73x7L011600 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:04:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pavilion ([213.78.121.245])3.2.2-GA) with SMTP id ADH79734; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:03:48 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <036a01c32030$b0edcf40$3b764ed5@pavilion> From: "Melanie Wilson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <217e01c31f8b$349326c0$55654ed5@your1p37d9kihs> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sprang help needed Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 08:06:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Should we assume that you already have Margaret Hald's book on Danish textiles which has such wonderful descriptions and discussions of the early sprang caps from that area? And also Peter Collingwood's book on Sprang? (I wavered between assuming that of _course_ you know about these already and that you might be insulted to be told about them, and figuring that it's safer not to assume anything, and besides which other people will be reading the thread.) Yes your assumption is correct :) I also have Barbers Prehistoric textiles and a couple of Ciba reviews. What I'm struggling with is more recent publications say post 1970/80s ? >I also have references to a few articles: Thanks OK here is my Bibiography so far of either read or would like to read the "would like to read" have a XX next to them if anyone happens to have access to them ? Barber, E.J.W. Prehistoric Textiles: The Development of Cloth in the Neolithic and Bronze Ages wtih Special Reference to the Aegean. Princeton: Princeton University Press, 1991. Ciba Review Bronze Age and Basic textile techniques 63 Collingwood, Peter. The Techniques of Sprang. London/New York: Faber & Faber/Watson-Guptill, 1974. Geijer, Agnes. Die Textilfunde aus den Grääbern. Birka: Untersuchungen und Studien, III. Uppsala: Almqvist & Wiksells, 1938. XX Hald, Margrethe. Ancient Danish Textiles from Bogs and Burials: A Comparative Study of Costume and Iron Age Textiles, translated by Jean Olsen. Publications of the National Museum, Archaeological-Historical Series, Vol. XXI. Copenhagen: National Museum of Denmark, 1980. Hoffmann, Marta, and Træætteberg, Ragnhild. "Teglefunnet," Stavanger Museum's ÅÅrbok, 1959, pp. 41-60. XX . Munksgaard, Elisabeth. Oldtidsdragter. Køøbenhavn: Nationalmuseet, 1974. XX Schlabow, Karl. Textilfunde der Eisenzeit in Norddeutschland. Neumüünster: Karl Wachholtz Verlag, 1976. XX Riegl, Alois. 1889. Aegyptischen Textilfunde im K.K. Oesterreich Museum. NEW info & therefore XX Wild, John Peter. Textiles in Archaeology. Shire Archaeology 56. Aylesbury, UK: Shire Publications Ltd., 1988 This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the Company, unless specifically stated. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 03:07:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M77OHP009869 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 03:07:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M77kUw012833 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 01:07:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M77k7L013399; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:07:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from apollo.gti.net (apollo.gti.net [199.171.27.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M77h7L013371 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:07:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gti.net (ts6m-pool0-116.gti.net [208.216.115.116]) by apollo.gti.net (mail) with ESMTP id E335E35843 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 03:06:36 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3ECC7707.7CC67426@gti.net> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 03:06:47 -0400 From: martyr@gti.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 'Goddess' exhibit/book at the Met? References: <005301c3201f$e5981450$befc8218@hopperflop2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kendra- I haven't seen the exhibiyt yet, but the book is beautiful-nice, big plates, all in color & very interesting text. It compares & contrasts the classical Greek & Roman dress (the chiton, peplos, & himation) seen in ancient art to the "modern" clothing inspired by the classical mode. Ancient Greek & Roman statues, reliefs & vases, and of classical dress in paintings such as 'Birth of Venus' are juxtaposed with "modern" draped & pleated, classical-inspired fashions from various eras. I don't know what pre-20th century period you are looking for Kendra, but aside from the pics of the ancient statues & stuff, the fashion seems to begin with the Directoire period (1800s). It's about half ancient stuff & half 'modern' fashion-a few pages on Directoire muslin gowns, an 1880s Liberty bustle gown, 1910s-20s Poiret, Fortuny & such, & just about every decade up to the present. One of the points the book makes is the timelessness of the classical mode in dress & how it virtually transends era, often making it difficult to guess the era the clothing is from. I am guessing the writers underscored this fact by choosing not to present the clothing chronologically in the book. Some of the designers are: Fortuny, Poiret, Claire McCardell, Edward Molyneux, Balmain, Adrian, Christian Dior, Prada. Definitely worth the $33.00 IMHO. ~Lisa > Has anyone had a chance to either see the exhibit "Goddess" -- or take a > look at the accompanying book -- at the Met's Costume Institute? Any > reviews? I'd particularly like to know whether there's much historic > (pre-20th century) costume in the book... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 03:28:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7SEHP016929 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 03:28:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7RZUw013904 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 01:27:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7RY7L020876; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:27:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7RW7L020812 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:27:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp01-207.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.120.207]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D965BE9C4 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:27:25 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3ECC7C70.6050007@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:29:52 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate victorian dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO We had a discussion about this pattern. About the colours and how it looks. I found a new picture with the probably the original of this dress. http://content-dev.lib.washington.edu/cgi-bin/pview.exe?CISOROOT=/costumehist&CISOPTR=160&CISORESTMP=/search-templates/costume-results.html&CISOVIEWTMP=/search-templates/costume-view.html&CISOROWS=3&CISOCOLS=5 Ore look here http://content-dev.lib.washington.edu/costumeweb/index.html And its the second picture under victorian 1837- 1859. Only the bodice is slightly different. Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 03:59:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7xOHP001150 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 03:59:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7wlUw015969 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 01:58:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7wjfA004205; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:58:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4M7wgfA004164 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 01:58:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4M7wfp07619.; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:58:41 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:58:41 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 08:58:19 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4M7wgfA004164 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Jean wrote: Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk 05/21/03 05:39pm >>> >A "short Dutch waist", in this sort of period, instantly makes me think >of the high-waisted look in Rembrandt paintings, also the short, loose >cavalier-style of women's jackets. Worth looking in that direction? Short waists were pretty much universal for both sexes by the 1630s, but that was a generation later, after farthingales had gone out of fashion. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 06:20:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MAK6HP022057 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:20:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MAKVUw026365 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 04:20:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MAKTlX002709; Thu, 22 May 2003 04:20:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MAKRlX002660 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 04:20:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.114] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1001E1400B2; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:05:52 -0400 Message-ID: <003301c3204c$1c0b1ec0$725183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030520201127.009fd790@pop3.norton.antivirus> Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 06:22:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My own artistic style is re the compliments of Market Place. These are the designs of distinctive clothing made by textile guilds in India. They are quality work and the people who make them get the money! What a concept. Most of the pieces are 100% cotton, tie-dyed or block printed with embroidered accents and embellishment. Not exactly cheap, but quite my style! Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sheryl Nance-Durst" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 9:15 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest > I have worn saris to work before. Nobody said a word. > It wasn't prohibited in our dress code so when I got > a new sari I wanted to show off, I wore it. > But there's no way anyone is going to mistake me for > Indian. > Red hair. Very pale skin. > Of course, I'm known for my "artistic" dress at times. ;-) > (BTW, I'm a librarian at a public library.) > > Sheryl Nance-Durst > > At 12:30 PM 5/19/03 -0400, you wrote: > >Out of curiosity, do these people wear saris etc. on normal days? And > >isn't their clothing part of their current culture, whereas a bliaut is > >part of our past culture? However, if saris meet the dress code in your > >office, you should be able to wear one as well. > > > >Nancy Kiel > >nancy_kiel@hotmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 07:54:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MBsrHP022289 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:54:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MBqoUw005040 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 05:52:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MBqnZw015848; Thu, 22 May 2003 05:52:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from einsteinium.btinternet.com (einsteinium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.147]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MBqjZw015776 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 05:52:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host217-39-0-129.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.39.0.129] helo=dan) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19Iocl-0000hW-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:52:43 +0100 Message-ID: <004101c32058$9e65fa00$810027d9@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel and short Dutch Waist Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 12:52:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin wrote: > > In general the OED is not terribly useful for costume definitions. It > relies a lot on Strutt, Planche, and Fairholt, for instance, who were > leading costume scholars of their time, but citing their work just > perpetuates their assumptions about the dress of previous eras. But the > citations from the period consistent with the clothing at hand is *very* > useful. The OED has more than once pointed me to places to look, and then > I make my own interpretations about the definitions. May I add a further note of caution? You can't rely on an apparent reference in any edition without checking all editions of the play in question. You see, the editors of the play may also have been relying on Strutt, Plance and Fairholt... Faced with an apparently incomprehensible passage editors will try and make sense of it, and will cheerfully put in terms which they think are authorititively supported. References in dramatic texts are a minefield for the unwary... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 08:08:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MC8EHP022307 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:08:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MC6oUw006127 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 06:06:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MC6nV4022556; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:06:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MC6kV4022501 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:06:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a29.in-tch.com [66.62.107.9]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4MBmLH10556 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 05:48:22 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECCBDAB.30C9716E@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 06:08:11 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate victorian dress References: <3ECC7C70.6050007@kabelfoon.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I like the original a lot better than the Simplicity pattern's version! I noticed (in the first link) that the young girl's skirt, although not floor length, has the same huge bell-shape as those of the adults. Is this common in the 19th c? --sue Deredere Galbraith wrote: > > We had a discussion about this pattern. About the colours and how it looks. > I found a new picture with the probably the original of this dress. > http://content-dev.lib.washington.edu/cgi-bin/pview.exe?CISOROOT=/costumehist&CISOPTR=160&CISORESTMP=/search-templates/costume-results.html&CISOVIEWTMP=/search-templates/costume-view.html&CISOROWS=3&CISOCOLS=5 > > Ore look here > http://content-dev.lib.washington.edu/costumeweb/index.html > And its the second picture under victorian 1837- 1859. > Only the bodice is slightly different. > > Greetings, > Deredere > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 08:14:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCEiHP022329 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:14:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCDWUw006791 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 06:13:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCDWV4026363; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:13:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCDTV4026280 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:13:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a29.in-tch.com [66.62.107.9]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4MBt4H12845 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 05:55:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECCBF3F.A617279E@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 06:14:55 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "h-costume@indra.com" Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------0F923ECE20EBB75834E3F667" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Linen outer garment... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------0F923ECE20EBB75834E3F667 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I know we've talked in the past about the use of linen for outer wear. Well, here's an early 17th c. doublet made out of linen--I noticed from the description that it appears not to be dyed, as well.... It looks to be in rather poor shape, but still worth viewing. --sue http://search.concealedgarments.org:8167/results.jsp?view=detail&id=1482&pos=1 --------------0F923ECE20EBB75834E3F667 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------0F923ECE20EBB75834E3F667-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 08:15:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCFIHP022333 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:15:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCGsUw006979 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 06:16:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCGrV4027748; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:16:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCGpV4027697 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:16:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp01-207.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.120.207]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2D3019FA01 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:16:44 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3ECCC040.4090708@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 14:19:12 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Janet Arnold question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, Somewere I've read that there will be a Patterns of fashion book fron Janet Arnold with medieval clothing. Is this book released yet? Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 08:15:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCFaHP022337 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:15:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCHAUw006998 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 06:17:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCHAV4027876; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:17:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scanmail2.cableone.net (scanmail2.cableone.net [24.116.0.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCH2V4027835 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:17:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from scanmail2.cableone.net ([10.116.0.122]) by scanmail2.cableone.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Thu, 22 May 2003 05:10:56 -0700 Received: from scanmail2.cableone.net [24.116.0.122] by scanmail2.cableone.net (SMTPD32-7.04) id AE4FAB0012E; Thu, 22 May 2003 05:10:55 -0700 Received: from kimathlon (24-116-185-234.cpe.cableone.net [24.116.185.234]) by mail.cableone.net with SMTP (MailShield v2.04 - WIN32 Jul 17 2001 17:12:42); Thu, 22 May 2003 05:10:55 -0600 From: "Kim Baird" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 07:17:15 -0500 Message-ID: <000201c3205c$160d8250$0301a8c0@kimathlon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 In-Reply-To: <3ECCBDAB.30C9716E@in-tch.com> Importance: Normal X-SMTP-HELO: kimathlon X-SMTP-MAIL-FROM: kbaird@cableone.net X-SMTP-PEER-INFO: 24-116-185-234.cpe.cableone.net [24.116.185.234] Subject: [h-cost] skirt length X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Sue Clemenger Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 7:08 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate victorian dress I like the original a lot better than the Simplicity pattern's version! I noticed (in the first link) that the young girl's skirt, although not floor length, has the same huge bell-shape as those of the adults. Is this common in the 19th c? --sue Victorian children wore shorter skirts. The younger the child, the shorter the skirt. Young teens wore skirts almost as long as their mothers. Two signs of adulthood for women--wearing your hair up and wearing floor length skirts. Kim _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 08:20:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCKXHP022349 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:20:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCLwUw007388 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 06:21:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCLvV4029834; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:21:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from relay2.primushost.com (relay2.primushost.com [207.244.125.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCLsV5029813 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:21:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from (shell3.shore.net) [207.244.124.103] by relay2.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 19Ip7n-0006jy-00; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:24:47 -0400 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for id 19Ip5F-0007R8-00; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:22:09 -0400 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 08:22:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Katy Bishop To: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] book suggestions? In-Reply-To: <20030520180930.79190.qmail@web20208.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: Historical Costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I liked my Readers' Digest "Complete Book of Sewing" for basic modern dewing lessons. I saw that they have a new updeted version available now. Katy On Tue, 20 May 2003, Angela Kovatch wrote: >A friend of mine who has never sewn anything wants to >learn how. She has a gift-giving occasion coming up >soon, and I would like to give her a book on sewing >(to be followed up this summer by a supervised project >or two). Does anybody have any suggestions on a basic >technique book for complete beginners? (Please tell >me what you like and/or don't like about a particular >book in addition to telling me the title.) > >Thanks- >Angela > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. >http://search.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 08:27:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCRYHP022365 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:27:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCT8Uw007910 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 06:29:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCT6V4003171; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:29:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (f1phy.netins.net [167.142.228.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MCT4V4003143 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:29:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [167.142.10.34] (HELO herselftifhj9g) by cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9) with SMTP id 359111115 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:29:03 -0500 Message-ID: <00d501c3205d$c1409b70$220a8ea7@herselftifhj9g> From: "Land of Oz" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3ECC7C70.6050007@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 07:29:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [h-cost] 20th cent. patterns X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I found some women and children's patterns from the 60's and early 70's at a local thrift shop. One looked like the classic "go-go" dress! :-) They seem to be neatly handled and in good shape, but of course I can't guarantee that all the pieces are there. A few had writing on them ("made for _____"). I don't have details like pattern numbers, sizes etc because I didn't buy them. Yet. If anyone is interested in purchasing these, they averaged about a dollar per pattern. I'd be happy to go back and pick them up. Postage additional from Iowa, USA . Be sure to reply privately. Denise landofoz@netins.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 09:09:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MD9tHP022480 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:09:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MD9LUw011428 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 07:09:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MD9KnO022477; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:09:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web12502.mail.yahoo.com (web12502.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MD9HnO022454 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:09:17 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522130916.6291.qmail@web12502.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.41.38.39] by web12502.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:09:16 PDT Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 06:09:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Lil Sorepaws To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305220043.h4M0hgJE015500@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Needlecraft/needlepoint books/patterns etc OT X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi there Just ran across a bunch of needlecraft and needlepoint books (a few from 60's & 70's ;) that I was planning to toss out for the garage sale we're having next month ... holler if anyone is interested .. one is the encyclopedia of needlecraft ? - Lil (packrat - neither bald nor strangled ;) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 09:17:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDHaHP022503 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:17:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDJBUw012842 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 07:19:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDJ9nO028496; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:19:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20209.mail.yahoo.com (web20209.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.64]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MDJ6nO028431 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:19:06 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522131904.6432.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20209.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:19:04 PDT Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 06:19:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] book suggestions? To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030520201649.00a05490@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks to all who responded - this gives me some better direction in my decision. -Angela __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 09:21:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDLEHP022524 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:21:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDMVUw013263 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 07:22:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDMUnO000590; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:22:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d06.mx.aol.com (imo-d06.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDMSnO000521 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:22:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.12c.2ab728f2 (4320) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:22:18 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <12c.2ab728f2.2bfe2909@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:22:17 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate victorian dress To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/22/2003 8:07:29 AM Eastern Daylight Time, mooncat@in-tch.com writes: > I noticed (in the first link) that the young girl's skirt, although not > floor length, has the same huge bell-shape as those of the adults. Is > this common in the 19th c? > The skirt is not technically "Bell shaped". That implies to me a skirt with shaped gores like the 1890s or a little later....where the skirt fits at the hips but flares at the hem. The skirts of the period depicted in the fashion plate are straight pieces, sewn selvage to selvage, and pleated into the waist. The top is the same yardage as the hem. It's the underpinning that give it its shape. Same for the little girl. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 09:24:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDObHP022531 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:24:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDQ0Uw013675 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 07:26:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDPxnO002561; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:25:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net (mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.48]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDPvnO002545 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:25:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dialup-67.73.140.130.dial1.chicago1.level3.net ([67.73.140.130] helo=earthlink.net) by mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Iq4y-00063d-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:25:57 -0700 Message-ID: <3ECCCFAA.4C56A3E7@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 08:24:58 -0500 From: Ms Berard X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en]C-CCK-MCD (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You mean other than having your boss, or worse your bosses boss send you home to change? Where I work, despite being a back office and *nobody* ever *seeing* us we can't wear denim *cloth* of any kind. Not even dresses, among other non obvious things. Just easier and safer (I do need the job and I rather like it actually) to dress very boring and not have any problems. Onaree Penny Ladnier wrote: > > I often wonder why individuals care what people worry about what others > think about what you wear. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > -- Proud list mom of Irish Crochet Lovers http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Irish_Crochet_Lovers/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 09:30:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDUoHP022558 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:30:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDWNUw014525 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 07:32:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDWLnO006408; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:32:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDWInO006374 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:32:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-14-180.o1.jps.net ([216.119.14.180] helo=pavilion) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19IqB7-0005ut-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 06:32:18 -0700 Message-ID: <002c01c32068$7e88fba0$b40e77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] polymer clay-making period buttons Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 06:46:04 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks Talia, your an inspiration! Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 7:07 PM Subject: RE: [h-cost] polymer clay-making period buttons > The molding compounds that I have tried have worked very well, and last a > long time -- many hundreds of uses, I'd guess. > > As far as how the polymer buttons themselves hold up, it depends on how they > are made. I make mine with metal backs so that they are quite sturdy. They > can be made without using metal backs, but then I wouldn't recommend heavy > use. > > When someone purchases mine, I advise the following treatment: > > 1: Machine washing cold is okay, but the garment should be turned inside > out. > 2: No bleach > 3: No dry cleaning > 4: If you must tumble dry, do so on cool with the garment inside out. > > If these instructions are followed, the polymer buttons should last > better/longer the counterparts they mimic (ie wood, bone, ivory...) > > Talia > > > > button stuff sounds very interesting. How do these buttons of yours hold > > up? I'm asking as I have a handful of 16th and 17th century buttons now, > > that I am thinking about reproducing, (after I finish scanning > > stubbes, and > > get my website up) No doubt the 200 plus hand cast buttons would be too > > costly to most. But perhaps people might be interested in > > purchasing a mold > > based upon an actual period button and then making the buttons themselves. > > How many times can a mold be used? Your buttons are gorgeous. I'm glad > > this subject came up. > > > > Lisa Sinervo > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 09:35:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDZ9HP022563 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:35:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDaQUw015052 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 07:36:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDaPnO008545; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:36:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDaLnO008515 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:36:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4MDaJp00334.; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:36:20 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:36:19 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 14:35:52 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] skirt length Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4MDaLnO008515 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think Sue meant "was it common for little girls to wear bell-shaped skirts?" Yes, I've seen this in Victorian photos and illustrations, including a photo of my great-grandmother as a child. Did they have a miniature crinoline? Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> kbaird@cableone.net 05/22/03 01:17pm >>> >-----Original Message----- >From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume->bounces@indra.com] ..On Behalf Of Sue Clemenger >Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 7:08 AM >To: Historical Costume >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate >victorian dress >I like the original a lot better than the Simplicity pattern's version! >I noticed (in the first link) that the young girl's skirt, although not >floor length, has the same huge bell-shape as those of the adults. Is >this common in the 19th c? >--sue >Victorian children wore shorter skirts. The younger the child, the >shorter the skirt. Young teens wore skirts almost as long as their >mothers. Two signs of adulthood for women--wearing your hair up and >wearing floor length skirts. >Kim _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information on a proactive email security service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.messagelabs.com ________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 09:37:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDbPHP022568 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:37:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDcxUw015196 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 07:38:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDcwnO009746; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:38:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r07.mx.aol.com (imo-r07.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.103]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MDcunO009712 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:38:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id 6.29.407f50f9 (4568) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:38:39 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <29.407f50f9.2bfe2cdf@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:38:39 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10630 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/22/2003 9:26:44 AM Eastern Daylight Time, msberard@earthlink.net writes: > Where I work, despite being a back office and *nobody* ever *seeing* us > we can't wear denim *cloth* of any kind. > > On a recent visit to Williamsburg, I noticed that the Williamsburg Inn includes in its rules, no denim in the dining room after 6:00. So I can't even show up in a denim evening gown? But seriously, it's a shame that businesses have to make such sweeping rules because some people have no notion of appropriate dress for different occasions. I guess they figure that just saying "no jeans" would not preclude someone from (shudder) wearing overalls, for example. Same with your bosses, I guess. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 10:01:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ME1uHP022622 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:01:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ME3RUw017681 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 08:03:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ME3Qle023038; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:03:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ME3Ole022983 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:03:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-231.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.231]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2688CBE925 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:03:18 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3ECCD93A.8020200@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 16:05:46 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Partlet update References: <3EC8DA5F.3020303@kabelfoon.nl> <3EC98F9E.910F5A60@in-tch.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I made an other update to my website with how I did it and wat I used. http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlettest.jpg Greetings, Deredere Sue Clemenger wrote: >They look great! >With all the possible materials tossed around in discussion, what did >you end up using? >--sue > >Deredere Galbraith wrote: > > >>Hi, >> >>My husband offered me his help with making the buttons for the partlet >>:-) :-) . >>Hopefully I will be able to finish the partlet before 19 June. >>Then we will go to an SCA event where we wil celebrate the 10 years >>existence of the kindom of Drachenwald(Europe). >>Good reason tho wear our best clothes. >> >>I made the master, mould and four test buttons. You can find pictures on >>my website >>http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Partlet/Partlettest.jpg >> >>Greetings, >> Deredere >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 10:03:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ME3UHP022626 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:03:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ME3mUw017731 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 08:03:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ME3mle023203; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:03:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ME3Tle023064 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:03:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-14-180.o1.jps.net ([216.119.14.180] helo=pavilion) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19IqfI-00045r-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 07:03:28 -0700 Message-ID: <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 07:17:15 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Individuals care and worry about what other people think about what they wear because we are judged constantly by our outward appearance and treated positively or negatively based upon the assumptions people make about us. One has to "fit in" within certain parameters to get promoted, to be considered a "team player". Sometimes, in the case of hermaphrodites (people born with both male and female genitalia) wearing a dress when you look more like a man leaves you open to getting beat up or killed. There is a huge dissonance between my outward appearance and personality type. I like classic clothes, good wools, linens in a conservative style, and most people make the assumption that I am a conservative, Christian republican, but I am really more of a radical, spiritual, liberal democrat. So people who have pegged in into to the conservative side by my appearance think we'll just click and be great friends, but that generally doesn't happen. I'm often told racist jokes by people who think I share their viewpoint and I end up telling them off much to their shock and dismay. I really had more in common with neo-gothic medievalists in Brisbane, but I was the only one in the living history group who wore pearls and pink loafers. It took those people quite awhile to see if I was going to stay. And really, I was far more radical in my philosophical viewpoints than they were. I just had nothing to rebel against, so I needn't look like a rebel. Won't go into telling you the assumptions people made about me when I was married to a Muslim and didn't wear western style dresses in order to accommodate my husband's cultural ideas about women. (Marriage didn't last long). People made the assumption I dressed the way I did because of my own religious beliefs, wanna be a Muslim in America???? I worked with a beautiful young woman once who dressed impeccably and was very sought after by men, but her "relationships" only lasted a few weeks. Problem, she dressed upper class, but came from a lower class background and wasn't very refined. So upper-class men dumped her quickly as she did things like share wine glasses at wine tasting events as to not have the staff wash so many glasses and that didn't go down well. Lower class men didn't ask her out as they didn't picture her as fitting in with them. She eventually met an old childhood friend and because he saw her as who she really was, they ended up very happy together. There was a guy I rather liked, who was quite smitten with me. The problem was, he did the lower class thing and overdressed all the time with me. He would get dressed up in a suit when we went out for coffee, in the afternoon, in the hot summer. It was very very sweet of him, but I felt really uncomfortable, because from my social group status, it was a casual thing, a jeans and knit shirt sort of affair. Didn't work out. I could go on and on, but have to get dressed, for work and I am dumping the hose as this land development office doesn't require them and I am the oddball here for wearing them, but the law office I temped in a few months ago the fact that I wore hose gave me a higher ranking with management than the girls who went bare legged!! Some thoughts for you, Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 11:30 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest > I often wonder why individuals care what people worry about what others > think about what you wear. Those of you who do care please shed some light. > I am interested in knowing as a dresser. Dress is a reflection of your > personality and mood. Some people dress conservative, some casual, some > artsy, some innovative. Sometimes when your life changes, your fashion > taste or style changes. When you go fashion shopping, take a very honest > friend with you. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 10:17:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEHIHP022659 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:17:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEGTUw018921 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 08:16:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEGSle029848; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:16:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEGOle029793 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:16:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be09.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.9]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id DEA2C262AA8 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:16:22 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002101c3206c$f3b1d2e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000e01c31f63$dd7a50b0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 16:18:01 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Jean. This quote is from 1607 so it is long before the waist raised to cavalier style! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Waddie" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 6:39 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? > A "short Dutch waist", in this sort of period, instantly makes me think > of the high-waisted look in Rembrandt paintings, also the short, loose > cavalier-style of women's jackets. Worth looking in that direction? > > Jean > > > Robin Netherton wrote > > > >On Wed, 21 May 2003, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > > >> Oh Robin i am delighted. Cant waite for the rest of the story! > > > >It may be a few weeks before I get to the library! And finding an edition > >that has that particular play ... I have a handful of citations for "bum > >rolls" I also need to look up. Gotta read practically the whole play to > >put each one in context (e.g. to find out class level of the characters). > > > >I especially want to know who is doing the talking. If it's a man > >describing a woman, than it tells us that at least some observers of the > >time looked at the visual shape of a style of dress and equated it to a > >wheel, as many have done today. ("Catherine wheel" would have been an easy > >descriptive term for someone in the period, much more than today.) But it > >doesn't tell us whether that's a name for the farthingale itself. If it's > >a woman speaking -- particularly in a case where she's calling for her > >clothes, or ordering something at a shop -- it's more likely to suggest a > >term for an item rather than a description of a total look. > > > >All this being confounded by the fact that the playwright was a man, > >writing for a general audience. :-P > > > >I do see that the quote is dated from the period in which the skirt > >arrangement moved from "puffy" to "pleated," the latter being more > >"spokelike" and flatter in shape, and possibly something worth calling > >attention to in a description as a distinguishing point (e.g. "she was > >wearing this type of dress, not that other type of dress"). > > > >Any idea what a "short Dutch waist" might be? Possibly a descriptive term > >for the woman's build, but possibly also a costume item. > > > >--Robin > > > > > >> > > attrib. 1607 WEBSTER Northw. Hoe III. i, A short Dutch waist, with a > >> > > round Catherine-Wheel Fardingale. > >> > > >> > That's the first use I've seen of "wheel farthingale" in the period in > >> > which it was worn, and the first use I've ever seen of "Catherine wheel > >> > farthingale." (I checked OED long ago under farthingale for such > >> > references, but didn't think to look under Catherine-wheel.) Now I have to > >> > track down the play and see who is wearing it, and who is describing it. > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > -- > Jean Waddie > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 10:33:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEXdHP022704 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:33:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEXvUw020663 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 08:33:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEXule010548; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:33:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sccrmhc03.attbi.com (sccrmhc03.attbi.com [204.127.202.63]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEXrle010493 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:33:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fenris.net (12-246-237-231.client.attbi.com[12.246.237.231]) by attbi.com (sccrmhc03) with SMTP id <20030522143347003000iou6e>; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:33:47 +0000 Message-ID: <3ECCDFDE.9060107@fenris.net> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 07:34:06 -0700 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Changing styles, was Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny Ladnier wrote: >Sometimes when your life changes, your fashion >taste or style changes. > That is so true! I realized a few months ago that I wear very boring clothes now. I used to wear a lot of ethnic pieces, or unusual fabrics. That was when I lived in Ann Arbor MI. Now that I live in conservative, semi-rural El Dorado Co. California, I just dress like every one else. I believe the change came when I moved from MI to CA. So, I've decided to fix this. I have a stack of sewing to do once today's final is over and this weekend's camping is over. The funny thing is, I hadn't realized I'd changed so much in my clothing until I went back to Ann Arbor for a visit. liz young _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 10:56:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEuSHP022751 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:56:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEvSUw023070 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 08:57:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEvSW9024311; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:57:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from carbon.btinternet.com (carbon.btinternet.com [194.73.73.92]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MEvPW9024285 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:57:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host217-36-18-118.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.36.18.118] helo=dan) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19IrVU-0000m3-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:57:24 +0100 Message-ID: <000e01c32072$6aed4100$761224d9@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000e01c31f63$dd7a50b0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <002101c3206c$f3b1d2e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:56:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne wrote: > Hi Jean. > This quote is from 1607 so it is long before the waist raised to cavalier > style! Well, I wrote a post on the dangers of citing dramatic texts but it hasn't shown up yet, so forgive me repeating myself before everyone rushes off crying Calloo, calley, oh frabjous day: You can't rely on an apparent reference in any edition without checking all editions of the play in question. You see, the editors of the play may also have been relying on Strutt, Plance and Fairholt... Faced with an apparently incomprehensible passage editors will try and make sense of it, and will cheerfully put in terms which they think are authorititively supported. References in dramatic texts are a minefield for the unwary... You don't know that the text in question actually said that in 1607. Northward Ho is usually dated around 1605, so I'm guessing that the text referred to in the OED was published in 1607 but I haven't read it and corrupt texts and indeed, lost texts are a commonplace of the period. I must declare a special interest here; my supervisor, Martin Wiggins, is a Webster specialist, and is also presently compliling a database of all plays written during the period. Quite a few of them are known only by their title, others only by a reference in another play or text. So alas, St Catherine's wheel farthingale is far from established, then, or now... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 11:24:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFOfHP022816 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:24:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFIeUw026036 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 09:18:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFIdW9011011; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:18:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFIZW9010954 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:18:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be09.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.9]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id AAB605EE17B for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:18:33 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000f01c32075$a5cc2db0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 17:20:15 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Robin You wrote:The third image still has the long pointed stomacher you see in late Elizabethan. But what strikes me about both of these is that the farthingale protrudes more in the front than it did at this time in England, where it tapered down in front so that it was almost nonexistent at center front. That extra protrusion in front makes the stomacher on your third example bend outwards noticeably. In England the stomacher tends to dive straight down (with a straight busk), and the farthingale begins swelling out on either side of the point of the stomacher. This "bend" may be part of the "short waist" distinction. And it would also make sense with the quote, that pairs a mention of a Dutch short waist with a "Catherine-wheel farthingale" -- which may describe a farthingale that makes a clear full circle of protrusion around the body instead of the crescent-shape that's so typical of England. (Which then raises the question of whether it would be right to apply "wheel" as a descriptor for the English style of farthingale. Modern books do it, but frankly, I've never seen a modern book make the distinction we're seeing here -- between the English crescent and the Dutch round shape. And I haven't found "wheel" used as a farthingale descriptor in *any* English contexts of this period.) > So my guess would be, that they just refer to this higher waistline, > where the ladies can rest their elbows on the wheels. Perhaps Holland > was the origin of this fashion, and so they called it a Dutch short > waist. Just FYI, resting the elbows on the farthingale at the side was something the Elizabethans did too -- you can see it in pictures, and it's actually mentioned in at least one document. The farthingale protrusion was about the same height (waist level) at the side. But the fronts are distinctive, with the English having the straighter, deeper point. I do think you have it right that this was a style seen as different, and called "Dutch." Thanks for the insight. I am so thankful to have so many nationalities represented on this list, and people who are familiar with sources we don't get to see over here very often! --Robin Just my note, if you look at the picture (i have just stolen from National Maritime Museum) of Anne of Denmark, she has this pronounced wheelfarthingale two. And i suppose this could be something she took with her, when she travelled to England from Denmark. Anyway, i uploaded the pictures here: And dont worry, i am just borrowing this picture a day or two, then i shall take it down again. I am sure they wont mind, when we are having this interresting disgussion. For me it looks very likely that she could have a Catherine wheel farthingale under this dress. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/duchshortwaist Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 11:58:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFwwHP022890 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:58:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFnCUw000797 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 09:49:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFnAW9006603; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:49:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFn6W9006501 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:49:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA26994 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:10:10 -0500 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 11:10:10 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: <000e01c32072$6aed4100$761224d9@dan> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 22 May 2003, Stevie Gamble wrote: > You don't know that the text in question actually said that in 1607. > Northward Ho is usually dated around 1605, so I'm guessing that the > text referred to in the OED was published in 1607 but I haven't read > it and corrupt texts and indeed, lost texts are a commonplace of the > period. I must declare a special interest here; my supervisor, Martin > Wiggins, is a Webster specialist, and is also presently compliling a > database of all plays written during the period. Quite a few of them > are known only by their title, others only by a reference in another > play or text. In this case, though, there's obviously more than just title existing. So, since I'll be off soon to find a library edition, can you ask your supervisor whether there's a particular modern edition of Northward Hoe that he considers more reliable than others? (For that matter, I need Westward hoe, too, if he has any recommendations. And Michaelmas Term and Women Beware Women.) Frankly, even if the text was cobbled together from actors' imperfect memories for a printing a couple years after the play's performance -- which I know was done in some cases of plays now considered "corrupt" for purposes of studying an author's work -- such an edition, if from the 1600-1620 period, would be sufficient for our purposes of establishing the use of the term in the period. That is, someone from the period in question would have come up with the phrase, even if it wasn't Webster himself. What I worry about is what an editor in 1680 or 1750 or 1840 or 1950 might have done to clean up an incomplete or incomprehensible text. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 12:02:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MG2BHP022905 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:02:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFriUw001366 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 09:53:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFriW9010392; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:53:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20207.mail.yahoo.com (web20207.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.62]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MFreW9010351 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:53:41 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522155340.6013.qmail@web20207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:53:40 PDT Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 08:53:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: Changing styles, was Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <3ECCDFDE.9060107@fenris.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I caught myself being happy with my "look" yesterday dressed all in shades of beige, and thought back to earlier days when I wore lots of intense colors and big necklaces and such. Maybe it's because I'm so stressed these days with the impending wedding and buying a house that I was using my own non-exciting appearance to actually become calmer? Interesting thought. -Angela --- Elizabeth Young wrote: > Penny Ladnier wrote: > > >Sometimes when your life changes, your fashion > >taste or style changes. > > > That is so true! > I realized a few months ago that I wear very boring > clothes now. I used > to wear a lot of ethnic pieces, or unusual fabrics. > That was when I > lived in Ann Arbor MI. Now that I live in > conservative, semi-rural El > Dorado Co. California, I just dress like every one > else. I believe the > change came when I moved from MI to CA. > So, I've decided to fix this. I have a stack of > sewing to do once > today's final is over and this weekend's camping is > over. > The funny thing is, I hadn't realized I'd changed so > much in my clothing > until I went back to Ann Arbor for a visit. > > liz young > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 12:07:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MG7gHP022917 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:07:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFxEUw002020 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 09:59:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MFxDYO014478; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:59:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20203.mail.yahoo.com (web20203.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.58]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MFxBYO014450 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:59:11 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522155910.37922.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 08:59:10 PDT Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 08:59:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030522131904.6432.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] pearls and dry cleaning X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Next wedding dress-related question for you folks: what happens to freshwater pearls when you send them through the drycleaner? I will be using some pearls as accent on my dress, and I am wondering about how extensively and permanently to put them on, and whether I should plan on removing them before I have it cleaned. Since this is a wedding dress, I will probably only have to have it cleaned once or twice (second reception planned for non-local relatives who can't travel), so it's probably not a huge deal either way, but I would rather hear from someone who's tried it. Thanks- Angela P.S. for the tea-dying lace question, I ordered another "off-white" lace, & when it came it was darker than I'd hoped, and I was unimpressed with the quality, but I discovered that layering the two gives a nice overall color, as well as working with the "more is more" ethos of the dress, so I don't have to dye at all. Thanks for all the advice. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 12:15:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGFmHP022928 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:15:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MG6HUw002879 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 10:06:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MG6FYO020126; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:06:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20202.mail.yahoo.com (web20202.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.57]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MG6CYO020076 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:06:12 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522160612.80887.qmail@web20202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:06:12 PDT Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:06:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030522131904.6432.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] ethics question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The design I am using for my wedding dress is basically my interpretation of the picture for the Richard the Thread "Restoration Woman" pattern http://www.richardthethread.com/patterns.html but made to fit over an 1890s foundation. Another list I am on is having an extensive discussion about copyright and ethics, which brings up a bit of nagging guilt I've had. Should I feel like I'm ripping them off, since I didn't buy the pattern? I figured there wasn't much point, since I would have to re-shape the pieces for a different silhouette anyway, but I am using their drawing. The thought crossed my mind that I could voluntarily send them part of the cost of the pattern for the use of the design, but I don't know whether it might be worse to alert them to it, because then they might be insulted I didn't buy the pattern in the first place. Out of curiosity, has anyone on this list ever bought this pattern? What did you think of it? Any pictures of the finished garment? -Angela __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 12:17:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGHPHP022942 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:17:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MG91Uw003238 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 10:09:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MG91YO022292; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:09:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MG8wYO022234 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:08:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA27104 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:30:03 -0500 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 11:30:03 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel In-Reply-To: <000f01c32075$a5cc2db0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 22 May 2003, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Just my note, if you look at the picture (i have just stolen from > National Maritime Museum) of Anne of Denmark, she has this pronounced > wheelfarthingale two. And i suppose this could be something she took > with her, when she travelled to England from Denmark. That makes sense to me. I know this picture, and I've noticed the front protrusions on occasional other images, but since I mostly look at English portraits, I haven't seen many. I hadn't connected that it was probably a national difference. It's useful to see evidence, too, that it was apparently recognized as a national difference at the time. > For me it looks very likely that she could have a Catherine wheel > farthingale under this dress. Oh, she certainly has a farthingale. And apparently there were at least a few people who called the style a Catherine wheel farthingale. I think it's still just as likely as ever that the term was based on the visual impression of the complete outfit. It doesn't tell us anything about how the skirt supporter was made, alas. Just FYI, the image of Anna Cathrine (second row, first picture, in your pictures at http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/duchshortwaist ) has the pronounced pillowy look at the hips that I find comes automatically with a large structured roll-style farthingale. Queen Anne's look is also easily done with a roll; the flatness of the upper surface is just a matter of the way the skirt frounce is pleated. Both ladies are resting their arms comfortably on their farthingale as I do on my roll (which fills the space between forearm surface and hip, so no chance of the weight of your arm unbalancing or tipping it). I know you've had more luck with frames than I have, but till I find some solid reason supporting the development of a new construction (e.g. a flat frame/cage) at this time, I'm going to stick with assuming the "wheel farthingale" is a roll, based on the documentary references to roll construction and the ease of achieving the look with a roll in practice. But it's fine if we disagree on that! The discussions are productive, and I'm *really* glad to have the Northward Hoe quote and the insight into the Dutch distinctive styles. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 12:39:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGdOHP022990 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:39:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGcXUw006819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 10:38:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGcUYO016000; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:38:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grouse.mail.pas.earthlink.net (grouse.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGcPYO015935 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:38:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misspiggy.psp.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.78.246]) by grouse.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19It5F-0004nD-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:38:25 -0700 Received: from [207.217.78.205] by EarthlinkWAM via HTTP; Thu May 22 09:38:25 PDT 2003 Message-ID: <4817814.1053621505032.JavaMail.nobody@misspiggy.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:38:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Saragrace Knauf To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Linen outer garment... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Earthlink Web Access Mail version 3.0 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yes, and there is a painting in QEWU in which Arnold says the woman is wearing a linen doublet. (Not sure how she can tell....) Sorry, I don't have my book with me to say which painting it is. ____ Well, here's an early 17th c. doublet made out of linen--I noticed from the description that it appears not to be dyed, as well.... It looks to be in rather poor shape, but still worth viewing. --sue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 12:56:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGuhHP023036 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:56:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGuwUw009162 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 10:56:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MGuv6e029916; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:56:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MGur6e029833 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:56:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWlAk1sjbpTAI+42A1tzicmuxPjAhbE31hw==">; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:56:33 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HYS3U7FJ; Thu, 22 May 2003 09:56:33 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 12:30:56 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Message-ID: <20030522.130004.-152593.2.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 5-7 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lisa, I think you have hit the nail directly on the head with your observations. I tend to dress down around the house (jeans and T-shirt) but try to put on something closer to my age (68) when I go out and about. I think that is one of the reasons I like SCA (and liked the SciFi clubs and cons). People can't judge you by your clothing because none of us are what we seem. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 13:24:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MHOGHP023145 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:24:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MHPpUw012293 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 11:25:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MHPo6e023651; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:25:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from janus.directcon.net (janus.directcon.net [206.170.184.16]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MHPk6e023588 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:25:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dnyeaqvf (r14b120.directcon.net [209.79.208.120]) by janus.directcon.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4MHTsk20403 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:29:54 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20030522102757.00c23600@pop.directcon.net> X-Sender: margospatterns@pop.directcon.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 10:27:57 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Margo Anderson Subject: Re: [h-cost] ethics question In-Reply-To: <20030522160612.80887.qmail@web20202.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030522131904.6432.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:06 AM 05/22/2003 -0700, you wrote: >The design I am using for my wedding dress is >basically my interpretation of the picture for the >Richard the Thread "Restoration Woman" pattern >http://www.richardthethread.com/patterns.html >but made to fit over an 1890s foundation. Another >list I am on is having an extensive discussion about >copyright and ethics, which brings up a bit of nagging >guilt I've had. Should I feel like I'm ripping them >off, since I didn't buy the pattern? Heavens, no! You were inspired by a picture, and did your own interpretation. You don't owe them a thing. Best wishes, by the way! Margo "One Tough Costumer" www.margospatterns.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 13:39:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MHdlHP023190 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:39:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MHdSUw014147 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 11:39:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MHdRvP007143; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:39:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MHdJvP007003 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:39:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB96C7AAD2 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:38:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 17769-08 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:38:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix, from userid 313) id 5A7297AACF; Thu, 22 May 2003 10:37:41 -0700 (PDT) To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 10:37:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20030522173741.5A7297AACF@mail.wonderland.com> From: alice@wonderland.com (Heather Meadows) Subject: [h-cost] contact for Costume College? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi -- does anyone have accurate contact information for Costume College? I still haven't received my packet from them, and I tried to email Darla about it, but the email bounced as the account was closed. I'm a bit ticked off, since I registered for it *last year* so that I could finally actually get into to the limited attendence classes... and now it's the last day (I didnt' realize) and I still don't have the schedule! .heather. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 14:30:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIURHP023434 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:30:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIVvUw020144 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 12:31:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIVqb4019646; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:31:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MIVlb4019572 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:31:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 23585 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 18:31:47 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 18:31:47 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-116.sonic.net [209.148.112.116]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MIVix12864 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:31:44 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 11:33:12 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO No offense, but I think you're speaking for first, yourself, and second, women. Rather than for society as a whole. And what I am speaking of below is modern industrialized society, not any historic period. Preoccupation with dress, and deriving an image of personality from it, is now more a female than a male preoccupation, and even so is not true for all women. Preoccupation with "fitting in" is also more a female trait. Women who think in traditional female terms often try to control each other by setting up parameters of dress and behavior, then try to insist that others follow them. And by trying to make others feel insecure (and feel superior themselves) by thinking up "flaws" in other people and pointing them out. Such people want to have a clearly defined in-group/clique and make sure some other people are always defined as outsiders who they can put down. This is as true in the reenactment world as well as "real life." It's largely what all the nitpicking about other people's historic costumes is about. It's what the game of pointing out ugly merchandise on eBay is about. In "real life," the parallel is to go around pointing out all the other women are wearing outdated styles, have fuzz on their sweaters, or are not wearing expensive "name brand" designer clothes. I wasn't brought up in the traditional female pattern, but in something closer to a male one.(Both my parents are geeks; before their retirement my father was a physicist/engineer and my mother was a college mathematics professor.) I was taught to think in terms of who I was and what I could achieve, rather than how I looked or what other people thought of me. I was very lucky in that. I early learned that there's no real advantage to "fitting in" to an in-group. Who wants to hang around with a bunch of insecure people who spend their time being catty and putting everyone down? Who wants to have to deal with their constantly trying to erect barriers to others' successwhen those barriers are unreal, invented by themselves? Why bother trying to please people when they're not going to do anything for you anyway, even if you do "fit in"? You can just dismiss this kind of group pressure and competition for the unrewarding nonsense it is. And go off and do something worthwhile yourself. If you're secure in yourself, who cares if someone criticizes you? It's just an expression of their problemsnot yours. And, it's an equal waste of time to go around judging what other people wear and the niceties of their manners. While I'm not saying employers don't care what you weareven the most geeky computer research institutes I've worked for required employees to meet legal decency lawsthey realize that clothes are superficial. You may be told to dress to please whatever "public" you see. As a senior book editor in publishing houses, I had to dress to meet with authors. But, any good employer realizes dress is not your whole job performance. Or even a major part of it, unless you work in the fashion industry or something similar. And, any reasonable person in a social situation realizes that your dress and appearance are not the whole "you." If a man thinks your body and clothes are really "you"well, I've lived with my husband all my adult life, so I'm hardly into the dating scene. But if I were dating a man like that I'd give him the heave-ho straightaway. If you ever lived with him, he'd probably be criticizing you every time you wore a color he didn't like, didn't look great before breakfast, or in general, weren't dressing to please him. Who needs that? You want to be accepted for who you really are by people who are mature enough to do that, and ignore those who aren't. Fran Individuals care and worry about what other people think about what they wear because we are judged constantly by our outward appearance and treated positively or negatively based upon the assumptions people make about us. One has to "fit in" within certain parameters to get promoted, to be considered a "team player". Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 14:35:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIZvHP023451 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:35:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIbUUw020753 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 12:37:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIbSb4023542; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:37:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web9403.mail.yahoo.com (web9403.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MIbPb4023500 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:37:25 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522183724.80768.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.78.208.191] by web9403.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:37:24 PDT Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 11:37:24 -0700 (PDT) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS To: h-costume-request@indra.com, h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] I need to unsubscribe X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --as I wil be away ----for awhile--- cheers and Best--- Albra --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 14:36:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIaQHP023456 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:36:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIZVUw020521 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 12:35:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIZUb4022054; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:35:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MIZSb4022030 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:35:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be09.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.9]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id D43E55EE193 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:35:26 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <004201c32091$2d0a1c90$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <15f.20bb3d5b.2bfd8995@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Blanche Payne Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 20:37:19 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. Would someone please send the URL again for this place with the fashionplates online! I must have ben sleeping :-( Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 4:01 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Blanche Payne > In a message dated 5/21/2003 8:44:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, gawne@mac.com > writes: > > > > A portion of Blanche Payne's fashion plate collection (there were 1050 or so > > fashion plates in the collection, there are 417 online) is online at: > > > > > > Thanks so much for this information. I'm always glad to find more color > versions of the early 19th century fashion plates. > Ann Wass > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 14:48:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MImtHP023483 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:48:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MInGUw022074 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 12:49:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MInEb4003582; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:49:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MInCb4003486 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:49:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWlAk1sjbpTAIie8bXSCFMYs0xQg20eI9Kw==">; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:48:50 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HYTAASM3; Thu, 22 May 2003 11:48:50 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 14:47:24 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Message-ID: <20030522.144725.-838533.2.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 7-6,8-9,15-16,25-29,30-32767 From: catpurson@juno.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fran, I think you have an ideal view of how people should behave. However, unfortunately, they do not all do it. Sorry, I think men are as guilty of misjudging others by their clothes as women are. Just ask a group of guys what they think a young lady is like when she is dressed in a mini skirt that practically shows her butt and a tight, skimpy tank top. And ask the same group what they think another young lady is like who is wearing a nicely fitted pants suit or calf length dress. It is not right to judge people by what they wear, but a lot of people do it so we should all be ready to accept an erroneous view of ourselves or dress so that the world knows exactly what we are like. Personally, I think a little mystery is fine, but I don't like sales people or waiters to ignore me or act like I am not worth bothering with, so I tend to dress in a style that will get me decent service when I am out and about. It is no fun to have some jerk of a security person follow you all over the store because you fit the profile of a shoplifter. Just my two cents worth. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 15:01:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJ1CHP023543 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:01:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJ2fUw023488 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 13:02:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJ2ewk014383; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:02:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJ2bwk014280 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:02:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.106] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB6118E800E6; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:48:01 -0400 Message-ID: <002f01c32095$0181b700$6a5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030522160612.80887.qmail@web20202.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ethics question Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:04:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It seems to me that this gown has a basic look of several in the big company pattern books seen during the last decade and if you have interpreted the design to conform to an 1890's corset already, I can't see how RT might have any inkling that you are attempting their particular version. Wedding gowns in particular are often interpretations of past romantic finery and I am sure that there are several present patterns that will reflect the Restoration Period. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela Kovatch" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 12:06 PM Subject: [h-cost] ethics question > The design I am using for my wedding dress is > basically my interpretation of the picture for the > Richard the Thread "Restoration Woman" pattern > http://www.richardthethread.com/patterns.html > but made to fit over an 1890s foundation. Another > list I am on is having an extensive discussion about > copyright and ethics, which brings up a bit of nagging > guilt I've had. Should I feel like I'm ripping them > off, since I didn't buy the pattern? I figured there > wasn't much point, since I would have to re-shape the > pieces for a different silhouette anyway, but I am > using their drawing. The thought crossed my mind that > I could voluntarily send them part of the cost of the > pattern for the use of the design, but I don't know > whether it might be worse to alert them to it, because > then they might be insulted I didn't buy the pattern > in the first place. > > Out of curiosity, has anyone on this list ever bought > this pattern? What did you think of it? Any pictures > of the finished garment? > > -Angela > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 15:07:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJ7wHP023578 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:07:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJ7mUw024027 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 13:07:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJ7lwk018536; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:07:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MJ7gwk018439 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:07:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 5913 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 19:07:42 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 19:07:42 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-116.sonic.net [209.148.112.116]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MJ7fw17262 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 12:07:41 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 12:09:09 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <20030522.144725.-838533.2.catpurson@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 02:47 PM 5/22/2003 -0400, you wrote: > Fran, I think you have an ideal view of how people should behave. > However, unfortunately, they do not all do it. > > Sorry, I think men are as guilty of misjudging others by their >clothes as women are. Just ask a group of guys what they think a young >lady is like when she is dressed in a mini skirt that practically shows >her butt and a tight, skimpy tank top. And ask the same group what they >think another young lady is like who is wearing a nicely fitted pants >suit or calf length dress. What you're talking about is not the female clothes/appearance competition I was talking about. Men don't tend to judge themselves by their clothes as women do, nor other men by their clothes. What you're talking about is sex attraction. This depends on the man, and also on whether he is single. Many men I know don't notice what a woman is wearing at all. What I'm saying is that in modern society women place _more_ importance on clothes/appearance, especially their own, than men do. And consider appearance as part of identity in a way that men do not, > It is not right to judge people by what they wear, but a lot of >people do it so we should all be ready to accept an erroneous view of >ourselves or dress so that the world knows exactly what we are like. There is no need to _internalize_ other people's view of yourself based on what you wear. >Personally, I think a little mystery is fine, but I don't like sales >people or waiters to ignore me or act like I am not worth bothering with, >so I tend to dress in a style that will get me decent service when I am >out and about. I don't tend to worry about this, nor do I tend to receive what I consider an inadequate level of customer service. If a salesperson doesn't do their job well, that's their failing--not mine for how I'm dressed. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 15:43:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJhxHP024455 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:43:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJieUw027735 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 13:44:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJiVBX018577; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:44:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pop015.verizon.net (pop015pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MJiQBX018475 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:44:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sharon ([141.151.113.129]) by pop015.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.33 201-253-122-126-133-20030313) with ESMTP id <20030522194421.LLBR20810.pop015.verizon.net@sharon> for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:44:21 -0500 Message-ID: <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> From: "Sharon Saracino" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 16:09:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at pop015.verizon.net from [141.151.113.129] at Thu, 22 May 2003 14:44:21 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h4MJhxHP024455 Status: RO >I was taught to think in terms of who I was and what I could achieve, rather than how I looked or what other people thought of me. I was very lucky in that. Fran, You were indeed lucky in that. Your parents gave you a great gift. Sadly, I think that your experience was probably the exception rather than the rule. I agree with Lalah that it is probably idealistic to believe that the majority of persons in society will not form some impression of you based on appearance or dress. I'm not for a minute saying that it is the way it SHOULD be...just sadly, the way it is. Sharon Granny's Closet...a Peek into the Past http://www.grannyscloset.net The Costume Gallery (on staff) http://www.costumegallery.com/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 16:06:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MK66HP025055 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:06:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MK5FUw000110 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 14:05:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MK5EAu004415; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:05:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f60.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.60]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MK58Au004299 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:05:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:05:03 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.226 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:05:02 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.226] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 20:05:02 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 May 2003 20:05:03.0770 (UTC) FILETIME=[6ED1BFA0:01C3209D] Subject: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >------------------------------ Lalah said: People can't judge you by your clothing because >none of us are what we seem. ***** I think this is why I love costumeing so much!!! Now, while I have an unfulfilled desire to wear sari's, I don't have any problem dressing different styles of western dressing. I can dress punk-rock, business, 1960's vintage, cowgirl and many more... But I don't dress punk-rock in my business casual daily work environment. I might if I were going to a club or something where it would be more appropriate. I might get sent home to change and it actually might not be comfortable. I believe my clients would be less apt to trust me with their money if I didn't wear the "costume" of the accountant. My costume is determined by my environment and more importantly my mood. I bet most everyone here are the types of people who are not defined by their clothes. It just fun to be able to express our interests and silly moods by the clothes we have on. I really like the idea that Heather brought up. Adapting historical garment designs into the daily modern wardrobe. It sounds like such a fun thing to do. More "costumes" to create!!! more silly thoughts... :) jessica _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 16:28:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKS7HP025452 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:28:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKRHUw002969 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 14:27:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKREAu020916; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:27:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MKR3Au020796 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:27:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 22674 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 20:27:02 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 20:27:02 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-116.sonic.net [209.148.112.116]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MKR1h31363 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:27:01 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:28:29 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My parents did indeed give me a great gift in teaching me not to judge myself either by my appearance, or by what other people thought of my appearance or any other aspect of me. And you are right that not everybody is my parents. However, I've been out in the world a long time now. I've met a wide variety of people. What I've discovered is that much of the pressure on women to judge themselves by appearance is internalized, and therefore, self-imposed. When other people try to get me to conform or put me down, I just ignore them and do whatever I want. Women often think there's some penalty to pay for not pleasing everyone. Usually there isn't. In modern society, you don't have to please everyone. It usually doesn't really matter what strangers think. You can usually choose to join or not join a social group, often even a professional group. If a group wants to judge you and try to make you conform to something that is not comfortable for you--don't join them. You don't need these people. And, people don't judge you by your appearance as much as you think. For example, if a sales clerk gives you bad service, why blame it on your clothes? It's more likely to be store policy, or their bad mood that day. If a clerk ignores me, and I need their help, I just go up to them and ask my question or get the article shown to me. I may have to be assertive, but I don't have to please them. If someone you must deal with judges you negatively by appearance, you don't have to accept their view. You can turn it around by presenting other aspects of yourself. I'm very small, and when I was dating, in my late teens, guys used to start out looking at me as a "fluffy little female" on the basis of that. Then there'd be a point a few minutes into the conversation when their jaws would drop. My view was, a guy either accepts that I have brains and a personality, or I don't need him. As for sex attraction--sure, it's a natural biological urge. But I really didn't need some guy whose primary purpose was to get laid. I wanted a lot more out of a relationship than that. I soon became happily involved with a man who valued me for having brains and a personality. While I obviously haven't dated since, I've had many male friends and colleagues who valued me for the same reasons. What I'm saying is that you can define your own self-image instead of going around worrying about how you look all the time, thereby letting other people define it for you. This is real. And, you can choose not to deal with people who want to deal with you negatively. There's not only no penalty for not pleasing them, there are many advantages to not letting them define your reality. When someone wants to make you play their game, put you down, or make you conform--that is all for their own advantage, not yours. You can't win if you play by their rules. But you can win if you define your own. It's not like I grew up, left my parents, and then discovered the world was different than they told me. They told me what it was like when I was very young. They also taught me how to deal with it. And their lessons worked and still do. I'm not living in a different world than everyone else. I just learned different ways of dealing with it than many women did. Fran ------------------------------------------------ Fran, You were indeed lucky in that. Your parents gave you a great gift. Sadly, I think that your experience was probably the exception rather than the rule. I agree with Lalah that it is probably idealistic to believe that the majority of persons in society will not form some impression of you based on appearance or dress. I'm not for a minute saying that it is the way it SHOULD be...just sadly, the way it is. Sharon Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 16:29:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKTSHP025456 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:29:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKTZUw003323 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 14:29:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKTZAu022749; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:29:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f8.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKTVAu022639 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:29:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:29:26 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:29:26 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:29:26 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 May 2003 20:29:26.0568 (UTC) FILETIME=[D6B70280:01C320A0] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO none of us are what we seem. *seam*? > >***** > >>I really like the idea that Heather brought up. Adapting historical >garment designs into the daily modern wardrobe. It sounds like such a fun >thing to do. >More "costumes" to create!!! >more silly thoughts... >:) jessica When I was 14 or 15 there was a pattern that looked very Edwardian to me. Jacket style top with Leg o'mutton sleeves and tucks along the bottom third of the calf to ankle length skirt. I made it in a narrow wale corduroy(sp?) of wedgewood blue and wore it til it died. Recently I came across a picture of me in the brownies(age7 or so)in a Costume performing in the park. It was a Marie Antoinette look in the pic. I guess I've been into costumes forever!! I do like to make historical styles for modern wear. Afterall, anything that was possible up to my time is still acceptable as my period. :) !! Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 16:32:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKWmHP025465 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:32:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKX9Uw003799 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 14:33:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKX7Au025489; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:33:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKX4Au025443 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:33:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A43885D0066; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:34:00 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3FF99A00BE; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:33:03 -0500 Message-ID: <009401c320a1$9d5ac160$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com><009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <3ECCCFAA.4C56A3E7@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 16:34:59 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I remember when I was teaching being the fashion cop. I was the one in charge of catching kids wearing inappropriate clothing and reporting them to the principal. 6-8th grade girls dressing like sluts... unreal but true. I also had to report boys for extremely baggy pants and those wallets on chains like bikers. The chains were a safety issue. When I taught was the year of Columbine... but before that even happened, kids were not allowed to wear coats in school. They had to take them off as they entered the building and put them in their locker... again a safety issue. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 16:36:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKZrHP025477 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:36:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKbHUw004345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 14:37:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKbCAu028792; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:37:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80401.mail.yahoo.com (web80401.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MKb9Au028701 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:37:09 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522203704.99781.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80401.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:37:04 PDT Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:37:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO OK, time to jump in. My comments set off by asterisks (*****): --- Lavolta Press wrote: > No offense, but I think you're speaking for first, > yourself, and second, > women. Rather than for society as a whole. And what > I am speaking of below > is modern industrialized society, not any historic > period. > > Preoccupation with dress, and deriving an image of > personality from it, is > now more a female than a male preoccupation, and > even so is not true for > all women. Preoccupation with "fitting in" is also > more a female trait. > Women who think in traditional female terms often > try to control each other > by setting up parameters of dress and behavior, then > try to insist that > others follow them. And by trying to make others > feel insecure (and feel > superior themselves) by thinking up "flaws" in other > people and pointing > them out. Such people want to have a clearly defined > in-group/clique and > make sure some other people are always defined as > outsiders who they can > put down. ***** Unfortunately, Fran, this is not an accurate statement regarding our industrialized society. I have to deal with this five days a week, both as a high school teacher and as the school's Work Experience Education Program Coordinator, supervising high school students in the workplace. I have a chance to observe some of the most appearance-conscious segments of our population (teenagers), and their employers, and while it's true that in some cases it is cliques of girls "setting the rules," frequently it is the boys they are interacting with, and employers that also play a role in establishing perceptions. ***** > This is as true in the reenactment world as well as > "real life." It's > largely what all the nitpicking about other people's > historic costumes is > about. It's what the game of pointing out ugly > merchandise on eBay is > about. In "real life," the parallel is to go around > pointing out all the > other women are wearing outdated styles, have fuzz > on their sweaters, or > are not wearing expensive "name brand" designer > clothes. > > I wasn't brought up in the traditional female > pattern, but in something > closer to a male one.(Both my parents are geeks; > before their retirement my > father was a physicist/engineer and my mother was a > college mathematics > professor.) I was taught to think in terms of who I > was and what I could > achieve, rather than how I looked or what other > people thought of me. I was > very lucky in that. I early learned that there's no > real advantage to > "fitting in" to an in-group. Who wants to hang > around with a bunch of > insecure people who spend their time being catty and > putting everyone down? > Who wants to have to deal with their constantly > trying to erect barriers to > others' successwhen those barriers are unreal, > invented by themselves? Why > bother trying to please people when they're not > going to do anything for > you anyway, even if you do "fit in"? > > You can just dismiss this kind of group pressure and > competition for the > unrewarding nonsense it is. And go off and do > something worthwhile > yourself. If you're secure in yourself, who cares if > someone criticizes > you? It's just an expression of their problemsnot > yours. ***** I can only assume from this that you a) have forgotten what it was like to be a teenager in a large high school (or never had that experience); and b) do not spend time around "average American teenagers." Many of our perceptions about ourselves and our appearance are established while we are in middle and high school; these are tough years, and some of the cruelest people are between the ages of 13 and 18. Anything that makes you stand out from the accepted norms, whatever they are, identifies you as an outsider, subject to ostracization and/or ridicule. Try telling a 16-year-old who's just been labeled "queer" by his classmates because of his dress that "it's their problem, not yours." (My apologies for our gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender members for the use of that word--I'm describing a situation that has happened more than once to my students). Even a rhino doesn't have a thick enough skin to put up with constant abuse for 3-5 years. ***** > And, it's an equal waste of time to go around > judging what other people > wear and the niceties of their manners. > > While I'm not saying employers don't care what you > weareven the most geeky > computer research institutes I've worked for > required employees to meet > legal decency lawsthey realize that clothes are > superficial. You may be > told to dress to please whatever "public" you see. > As a senior book editor > in publishing houses, I had to dress to meet with > authors. But, any good > employer realizes dress is not your whole job > performance. Or even a major > part of it, unless you work in the fashion industry > or something similar. ***** Wrong. Many employers do have dress standards, even if they are not specifically spelled out in the employee handbook, and one of the biggest complaints I receive from employers is that students come to work inappropriately dressed for the workplace. This can range from too much jewelry/too many piercings to skirts too short, tops too skimpy, jeans in the workplace, and too much facial hair. Our largest private employer, 6 Flags Marine World theme park, has very specific requirements: employees shall always be in uniform, short hair (above the collar), no beards, and no earrings for males, only 1 pair of simple earrings for girls, etc. These rules extend to everyone that works for the corporation (the Disney Corporation has similar rules for their theme parks); they recognize that anyone working for the Corporation may come in contact with the public, and they are trying to maintain a family-oriented, wholesome atmosphere for their park guests. Many of our other local employers do not allow jeans to be worn at any time, while some employers are a bit more flexible regarding dress. To help students deal with appearance issues, students in all business classes (and this includes the Careers class all high school freshmen are required to take) include time spent on how to dress properly for a job interview and for the workplace. ***** To combat this, > And, any reasonable person in a social situation > realizes that your dress > and appearance are not the whole "you." If a man > thinks your body and > clothes are really "you"well, I've lived with my > husband all my adult life, > so I'm hardly into the dating scene. But if I were > dating a man like that > I'd give him the heave-ho straightaway. If you ever > lived with him, he'd > probably be criticizing you every time you wore a > color he didn't like, > didn't look great before breakfast, or in general, > weren't dressing to > please him. Who needs that? > > You want to be accepted for who you really are by > people who are mature > enough to do that, and ignore those who aren't. > > Fran ***** Again, this is making assumptions that people in general are: a) reasonable; and b) mature enough to recognize the person you are beyond your appearance. If this were the case, the slew of "reality-based" TV shows ("Extreme Makeover"; "Are You Hot?") would not have the ratings they do. Human beings make value judgments based on appearance. We can't help it--we're hard-wired that way, as part of the "fight-or-flight" response. Our primitive emotional brain processes a message as either positive, negative, or neutral long before our reasoning brain processes the actual message content. Here's a simple experiment you can try: The next time you're in a shopping mall, stop and look at what for many middle-aged Americans is one of the most threatening things in the world: a group of young black men. Hair in cornrow braids, baseball caps on backwards, baggy jeans with the waist half-way to their knees. They're probably talking slang and unintelligible to everyone but themselves. It's enough to give a mature, reasonable person the willies. Now really take a look at them. I've just described the appearance of our Senior Class president, one of our leading track stars, and our #1-ranked (academically) junior. Sorry for this turning into a long rant. I deal with this every day (clothes: the ultimate costume), and I have strong opinions on the matter. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 16:43:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKhDHP025499 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:43:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKcQUw004529 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 14:38:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKcPAu029785; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:38:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MKcMAu029665 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:38:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCh/rsu0mtUeY4XLS5GL4xwL/flT/FSRtUA==">; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:37:32 EDT Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HYTGHTXJ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:37:32 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:16:09 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Message-ID: <20030522.151610.-102111519.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 7-9 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My friend Marie (yes, that's Big Pink Marie to those of you who were at CostumeCon) has decided that she just doesn't like modern 'business' clothing, so she has been making her own 'business suits' based on 1890's styles. All she has done is shorten the skirts and the rest of the outfits are made from period patterns. Apparently this is no problem where she works (she is a computer systems manager and software developer for a LARGE bank) as no one has told her to stop and she's been at it for 2 or 3 years now. Karen ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 16:52:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKq7HP025527 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:52:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKplUw006028 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 14:51:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKpjAu009878; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:51:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f101.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKpgAu009756 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:51:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 22 May 2003 13:51:37 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:51:36 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Simp. 5724 original plate ?? Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:51:36 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 May 2003 20:51:37.0218 (UTC) FILETIME=[EFD81620:01C320A3] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > Ore look here > > http://content-dev.lib.washington.edu/costumeweb/index.html > > And its the second picture under victorian 1837- 1859. > > Only the bodice is slightly different. > > > > Greetings, > > Deredere > > > > This was one of the patterns I considered for my dream dress pattern. When I looked at this pic again, it seems to me like the overskirt may be one large drape and the swags are only in the front. Any confirmation or rebuttal? It kills me that I can't see the backs when I want to on these. Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 16:57:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKvNHP025548 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:57:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKwvUw006863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 14:58:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKwuuv014840; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:58:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MKwouv014757 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:58:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA4223E80030; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:59:46 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA09104A0138; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:58:49 -0500 Message-ID: <00b001c320a5$37193f40$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030522.151610.-102111519.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 17:00:45 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Karen, WOW!!!!!!! To your friend!!! I have been working in the 1890s lately and thought the jackets would make nice business suits! BRAVO to your friend! Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 17:13:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLDuHP025592 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:13:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLFUUw008864 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 15:15:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLFPuv027134; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:15:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp02-2.wlv.untd.com (smtp02.wlv.untd.com [209.247.163.58]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MLFHuv026952 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:15:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 18611 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 21:15:11 -0000 Received: from dialup-67.30.119.114.dial1.sanjose1.level3.net (HELO elizabethanlady.com) (67.30.119.114) by smtp02-2.wlv.untd.com with SMTP; 22 May 2003 21:15:11 -0000 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 14:11:20 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20030522203704.99781.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Many employers do have dress standards, even if > they are not specifically spelled out in the employee > handbook My biggest peeve is getting called into the boss' office because you wore something "inappropriate" the first day of the job, after everyone failed to go over that part of the company policy *before* starting work, therefore setting you up for failure from day one. The one time that happened I was wearing a very nice sleeveless blouse (not a tank top, but with the wide straps, modest scoop neck and made of a thick cotton knit that was not revealing and very elegant) and being informed not 15 minutes into the first day on the job that "tank tops" are not allowed in the office. It wasn't in the rule book. It was just an agreed upon thing that no one apparently thought to mention. Being young and female and working in the professional sector, I've been subjected to all kinds of strange rules about what is/isn't acceptable dress for work. Like the instance above, I think a lot of it has to do more with my age and gender than the clothes I was actually wearing. I dress very modestly, but being a "hot young thang" is something that is near impossible to cover up. In every instance, the most humiliating experiences of being chastised for my clothing have come from higher ranking middle aged females. One woman at my last job (student assistant for the legal office of one of the departments of the EPA) went out of her way to constantly harangue me for my appearance. Anything she could comment on, my weight, my height, my clothing, my hair, my make-up, my lack of make-up... Thankfully the boss liked me, so her nasty remarks were unable to do much damage, but it just underscored the phenomenon of being young, single, female professional. No one trusts you, because you're either out there to scam on everyone's spouses, or you're supposedly sleeping with the boss, or you're going to get promoted because you look better in a short skirt... But again, this isn't from men (who seem to be utterly oblivious to it, from my experience). This is from older women who should know better, but who feel threatened by the presence of a younger woman in their office. Sad, but true. Sarah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 17:16:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLGkHP025600 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:16:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLILUw009206 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 15:18:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLIKuv029214; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:18:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MLIGuv029126 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:18:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 18519 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 21:18:14 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 21:18:14 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-163.sonic.net [209.148.112.163]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MLICb09187 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:18:12 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522134831.00a9d4d8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 14:19:40 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <20030522203704.99781.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >I can only assume from this that you a) have forgotten >what it was like to be a teenager in a large high >school (or never had that experience); and b) do not >spend time around "average American teenagers." Sure, I went to high school (as well as grade school, junior high, and college). A lot of people didn't like my appearance. I'm very small, though not medically abnormal or unhealthy in any way; it's because all my relatives are small. So I was different. Some students, who wanted to feel superior, tried to convince me I was inferior because I was small. My parents told me there was nothing wrong with being small, they were small themselves and it had had had no negative effects on them. I believed my parents, and ignored people who tried to dump on me for it. Not that it's something I could change anyway, but I didn't let it bother me. > Many >of our perceptions about ourselves and our appearance >are established while we are in middle and high >school; these are tough years, and some of the >cruelest people are between the ages of 13 and 18. There are a lot of middle-aged people who still act like they're 13. But this is their problem, not mine. >Anything that makes you stand out from the accepted >norms, whatever they are, identifies you as an >outsider, subject to ostracization and/or ridicule. True. My experience when I was young is that other people didn't want me to be intelligent, assertive, or creative, because those things were "different." This included some of my teachers. (One of my early grade school memories is being told to "slow down because you learn faster than the other children." My parents said, "Ignore that teacher and learn as fast as you can.") On the other hand, I've benefited much more in life by going ahead and being intelligent, etc. than by conforming. >Try telling a 16-year-old who's just been labeled >"queer" by his classmates because of his dress that >"it's their problem, not yours." (My apologies for our >gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender members for the >use of that word--I'm describing a situation that has >happened more than once to my students). Even a rhino >doesn't have a thick enough skin to put up with >constant abuse for 3-5 years. I'm not gay, but I had junior high and high school friends who were. I tried to be supportive to them, but many people weren't. I'm not saying they were treated fairly in school--they had a tough time. The other students should have been told by parents and teachers not to abuse gays. But my gay friends did "withstand" being treated unfairly. They grew up and went on to find groups who would accept them and became successful adults. Frankly, if you canvassed h-costume you'd probably find a fair number of members who were considered oddballs because they were creative or "different." But isn't it better that they still are? >***** > >Wrong. Many employers do have dress standards, even if >they are not specifically spelled out in the employee >handbook, and one of the biggest complaints I receive >from employers is that students come to work >inappropriately dressed for the workplace. In fact I said myself earlier that all employers have dress standards, but that you don't want work for one who judges your work _primarily_ by your appearance. Unless you're in some field such as the fashion industry where your appearance _is_ your work. >***** >Again, this is making assumptions that people in >general are: a) reasonable; and b) mature enough to >recognize the person you are beyond your appearance. I'm not saying everyone is reasonable and mature. What I'm saying is that many people are, and I associate with those rather than trying to please those who are unreasonable and immature. > The next time >you're in a shopping mall, stop and look at what for >many middle-aged Americans is one of the most >threatening things in the world: a group of young >black men. I would consider them as simply young men. It would be very prejudiced to think that they are inferior or threatening because they are black, or wear their hair in corn rows. Furthermore, where I live black people in a mall don't strike terror in anyone. Fran _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 17:23:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLNYHP025608 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:23:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLMqUw009779 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 15:22:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLMpuv003035; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:22:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pop015.verizon.net (pop015pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLMnuv002931 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:22:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sharon ([141.151.113.129]) by pop015.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.33 201-253-122-126-133-20030313) with ESMTP id <20030522212243.MFHX20810.pop015.verizon.net@sharon> for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:22:43 -0500 Message-ID: <024801c320ab$c3fadd00$6501a8c0@sharon> From: "Sharon Saracino" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030522.151610.-102111519.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 17:47:38 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at pop015.verizon.net from [141.151.113.129] at Thu, 22 May 2003 16:22:43 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h4MLNYHP025608 Status: RO >making her own 'business suits' based on 1890's styles. All she has done is shorten the skirts In my sister's wedding several years ago we wore 2 piece suits with a victorian style bodice top...afterwards we all shortened the skirts and did the same thing....they are very dressy looking too! Sharon Granny's Closet...a Peek into the Past http://www.grannyscloset.net The Costume Gallery (on staff) http://www.costumegallery.com/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 17:25:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLP0HP025612 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:25:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLQVUw010165 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 15:26:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLQTuv005917; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:26:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MLQMuv005825 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:26:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 21276 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 21:26:22 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 21:26:22 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-163.sonic.net [209.148.112.163]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MLQLb16090 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:26:21 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522142602.032009c0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 14:27:50 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: References: <20030522203704.99781.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >But again, this isn't from men (who seem to be utterly oblivious to it, >from my experience). This is from older women who should know better, but >who feel threatened by the presence of a younger woman in their >office. Sad, but true. And how do these insecure people treat you if you're super-competent at your job? Or is that the reason they criticize your appearance? Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 17:35:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLZeHP025627 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:35:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLZnUw011383 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 15:35:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLZluv013124; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:35:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLZiuv013088 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:35:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFB00LKF5BE58@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:35:44 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 14:28:37 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] contact for Costume College? In-reply-to: <20030522173741.5A7297AACF@mail.wonderland.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030522142628.02c9dbc8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/22/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Heather, That really sucks. I tried looking at my pamphlet of info, but other than giving names it doesnt have any e-mail or phone numbers for contacts. Looking at the website, there is a page of contact info you might try. http://www.costumecollege.org/Staff.htm Laura Rico is listed as the Dean for this year. I would try her. Good luck, and sorry I wasn't any more help. Kimiko At 10:37 AM 5/22/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Hi -- does anyone have accurate contact information for Costume College? > >I still haven't received my packet from them, and I tried to email >Darla about it, but the email bounced as the account was closed. > >I'm a bit ticked off, since I registered for it *last year* so that I could >finally actually get into to the limited attendence classes... and now it's >the last day (I didnt' realize) and I still don't have the schedule! > >.heather. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 17:43:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLheHP025650 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:43:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLhSUw012324 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 15:43:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLhQuv018791; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:43:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41507.mail.yahoo.com (web41507.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MLhMuv018660 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:43:22 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522214317.27638.qmail@web41507.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41507.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:43:17 BST Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:43:17 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Lisa Sinervo wrote: > Individuals care and worry about what other people think about what they > wear because we are judged constantly by our outward appearance and treated > positively or negatively based upon the assumptions people make about us. > One has to "fit in" within certain parameters to get promoted, to be > considered a "team player". True, but personally I think this is bollocks. I wear what I want in certain VERY wide parameters, so people stare at me. And? Sheesh, I couldn't care less. It's all about self confidence. If I were not confident enough I wouldn't wear big silk things if I wanted to, or used to wear thigh length boots to Uni when I was younger, or pirate costumes to work, etc. Is that a challenging viewpoint? Okay, let's be really radical: I know so many people who look invisible, boring and non-descriptive, because they tell me, they don't dare to be visible. Not because they really like those styles of invisiblibilty beige, but because they feel they have to 'fit in' and quite simply lack the confidence to not give a doodah about others. I chose my workplace for its freedom and accept happily that Unis don't pay much money, so don't come to me and tell me that you 'have to' wear this or that, choose another work place or different friends! *tongue just a tad in cheek, perhaps* ;-) Nicole - finally back from Germany where the engine of the car had blown up. Oh dear... no more fancy Indian silk creations for me for a while. ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 17:45:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLjBHP025664 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:45:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLkpUw012947 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 15:46:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLkouv021596; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:46:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f68.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLkluv021487 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:46:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 22 May 2003 14:46:42 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.226 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:46:39 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.226] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:46:39 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 May 2003 21:46:42.0720 (UTC) FILETIME=[A213AA00:01C320AB] Subject: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I can't add anything to Dawn's thoughts, but I just wanted to say how much I enjoyed reading and agree with the things she is saying. What a great group we have here. It's so much fun to have such diverse and knowledgable people on this list. I just love it!!! :) jessica _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 17:49:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLnIHP025680 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:49:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLk5Uw012807 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 15:46:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MLk4uv020996; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:46:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp02-2.wlv.untd.com (smtp02.wlv.untd.com [209.247.163.58]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MLjwuv020810 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:45:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 25082 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 21:45:52 -0000 Received: from dialup-67.30.119.114.dial1.sanjose1.level3.net (HELO elizabethanlady.com) (67.30.119.114) by smtp02-2.wlv.untd.com with SMTP; 22 May 2003 21:45:52 -0000 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 14:42:01 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522142602.032009c0@pop.sonic.net> Message-Id: <38BA7722-8C9E-11D7-9F4C-0003934DD4B0@elizabethanlady.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > And how do these insecure people treat you if you're super-competent > at your job? Or is that the reason they criticize your appearance? In my experience, it's been a tactic that some women resort to when someone with a bit of talent comes in and upsets the balance of power within an office (the legal office is a good example: Of the 8 attorneys, five were women, including the chief counsel, who was my boss. The ratio of women to men in that office was higher than anywhere else in the building and there was *quite* an interesting power struggle between the women that the men were completely oblivious to). Near as I can tell, it's because they can't criticize me for my work, so they'll go after something else. I do run into this mentality quite a bit, but I've adjusted to it. I don't play those stupid games and have learned that making a good impression on the right people is more important than trying to impress the wrong people. Sarah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 18:03:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MM3gHP025778 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:03:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MM5PUw023940 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 16:05:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MM5NFn006288; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:05:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MM5KFn006246 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:05:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 1879 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 22:05:19 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 22:05:19 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-126.sonic.net [209.148.112.126]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MM5Io04909 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:05:18 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522145402.00a9cd98@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:06:47 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO All I'm saying is that women can make their own choices in appearance and behavior rather than trying to please everyone. I've done it successfully, so have many others. Most men do it without even thinking about it. And I don't believe you can't change yourself. If you're the same person in middle age as you were in high school, you've been wasting your years instead of learning from them. Saying "the world is thus and so and you can't change it, therefore you have to do what everyone else wants," is also making a choice. It's not inevitable. Furthermore, the more you let other people control you the more they will try to do it. But--I'm happy living my life my way. It's always worked for me. If other people want to spend their time and energy worrying about what other people think of them, conforming, etc.--to repeat what's becoming a mantra--that's their problem. I don't have to be like them, but they don't have to be like me. I've offered my advice for the benefit of those who can benefit from it. For those who are happier letting others define them--I don't understand why, but if you want to, go ahead. Fran At 09:46 PM 5/22/2003 +0000, you wrote: >I can't add anything to Dawn's thoughts, but I just wanted to say how much >I enjoyed reading and agree with the things she is saying. > >What a great group we have here. It's so much fun to have such diverse >and knowledgable people on this list. I just love it!!! > >:) jessica > >_________________________________________________________________ >Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* >http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 18:09:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MM9gHP025815 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:09:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMA4Uw025063 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 16:10:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMA3Fn010410; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:10:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MMA0Fn010376 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:10:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 27796 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 22:10:00 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 22:10:00 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-126.sonic.net [209.148.112.126]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MM9xo08530 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:09:59 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522150728.03231c68@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:11:27 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <38BA7722-8C9E-11D7-9F4C-0003934DD4B0@elizabethanlady.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522142602.032009c0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 02:42 PM 5/22/2003 -0700, you wrote: >>And how do these insecure people treat you if you're super-competent at >>your job? Or is that the reason they criticize your appearance? > >In my experience, it's been a tactic that some women resort to when >someone with a bit of talent comes in and upsets the balance of power >within an office. Near as I can tell, it's because they can't >criticize me for my work, so they'll go after something else. That's what I figured--the issue was really something other than appearance. It often is. I don't play those stupid games and have learned that making a good impression on the right people is more important than trying to impress the wrong people. Obviously I agree with you. BTW, I've worked in a shark tank or two. If the company atmosphere is that most people spend more time playing political games than working, the only real solution is to get out of tank. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 18:14:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMEAHP025819 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:14:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMFsUw003256 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 16:15:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMFmFn014764; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:15:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMFeFn014627 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:15:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFB007F476002@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:15:38 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:08:50 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030522143539.02c63c58@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/22/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 01:28 PM 5/22/2003 -0700, you wrote: >And, people don't judge you by your appearance as much as you think. For >example, if a sales clerk gives you bad service, why blame it on your >clothes? It's more likely to be store policy, or their bad mood that day. >If a clerk ignores me, and I need their help, I just go up to them and ask >my question or get the article shown to me. I may have to be assertive, >but I don't have to please them. Just want to comment on this one paragraph, which may take it out of context, but is not intended to skew anything Fran wrote. I just want to relay something I had learned. In my business classes while I was going for my accounting degree, we spoke of "expert systems", where people's many years of experience was put into a computer system, to help junior whatevers learn how to work at a higher level of experience than they actually had. There were many examples from different fields, from computer programmers, to engineers, to bank loan officers. The loan officer actually had a criteria of "what kind of shoes are the customer wearing, and how new are the shoes." The idea for the expert was that the experienced loan officer had learned over time that people who wore newer and cleaner shoes often had better risk levels for loans. It stuck in my mind that the expert systems designers would support something so superficial as the quality and newness of shoes, but there it was and is. You could be Joe Millionaire, and if you wear bad shoes to that bank, don't expect on getting the best rates. I also learned in business classes, especially in the Beta Alpha Psi, an honorary accounting fraternity I was in, that how one dresses for interviews was VERY important. Black or Navy blue suits was expected. Granted that is a job interview, and one should dress the part... but it is still an aspect of how you dress affects how others view you. As they harped so often, you only get one chance to make a good first impression. And Fran, I hated being in that fraternity. The maturity level of most students and recruiters was low. They didn't care who you were, they only cared what position you held or formerly held in the organization. And clothing was a big part of the game. Thankfully, I too had parents who raised me to believe in me, not my clothing or anything else that is superficial. But society in general still needs to raise the bar. And it seemed to be a level of age maturity, as well as emotional ones. My friends and I were older, returning students, and we realized the games that were going on were bad ones. I don't think any one of us actually joined a Big Six firm after graduation. We didn't like the emotional baggage we were perceiving, and almost all of us were tops in our classes. Otherwise, I pretty much agree with you Fran. It is frustrating however to know many women, and younger women and girls just learning about life, just don't realize how superficial it all is. But it comes with maturity or at least acceptance of yourself. I cheer when I hear of a woman who finally opens her eyes to the empowering reality of being sure of yourself. The confidence of wearing what you want and not worrying about what others think of you is what I hope all young teens learn (but that is doubtful, sadly). Like Penny mentioned, I am just looking to find something to wear that reflects me, which isn't a power suit anymore (thank goodness). I just am not sure what to wear that isn't a t-shirt and really baggy pants from weight loss. I almost trip over the pant legs now. I need something better! Anyway, just a few thoughts. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 18:15:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMFaHP025825 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:15:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMHJUw003685 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 16:17:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMHIFn015811; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:17:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMFeFp014627 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:15:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFB007F476002@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:15:42 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:04:01 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest In-reply-to: <003301c3204c$1c0b1ec0$725183d1@rmitchellras> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030522150329.02c9dbc8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/22/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030520201127.009fd790@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 06:22 AM 5/22/2003 -0400, you wrote: >My own artistic style is re the compliments of Market Place. These are the >designs of distinctive clothing made by textile guilds in India. They are >quality work and the people who make them get the money! What a concept. >Most of the pieces are 100% cotton, tie-dyed or block printed with >embroidered accents and embellishment. Not exactly cheap, but quite my >style! >Kathleen Hi Kathleen, Where do you find "Market Place" clothing? They sound interesting. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 18:17:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMHiHP025835 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:17:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMJQUw006045 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 16:19:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMJPFn019839; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:19:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gadolinium.btinternet.com (gadolinium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.111]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMJHFn019707 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:19:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host217-36-18-118.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.36.18.118] helo=dan) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19IyP6-00068u-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:19:16 +0100 Message-ID: <000401c320b0$252c50a0$761224d9@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030522155910.37922.qmail@web20203.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] pearls and dry cleaning Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 23:19:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Angela wrote: > Next wedding dress-related question for you folks: > what happens to freshwater pearls when you send them > through the drycleaner? They die. Seriously, pearls are extremely sensitive to chemicals, starting with those found in human sweat and working up from there. Dry cleaning is not a good idea, even once. best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 18:24:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMOlHP025860 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:24:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMLRUw009679 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 16:21:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMLPFn021872; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:21:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80401.mail.yahoo.com (web80401.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MMLNFn021771 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:21:23 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030522222118.19626.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80401.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 22 May 2003 15:21:18 PDT Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:21:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Sarah wrote: > > Many employers do have dress standards, even if > > they are not specifically spelled out in the > employee > > handbook > > My biggest peeve is getting called into the boss' > office because you > wore something "inappropriate" the first day of the > job, after everyone > failed to go over that part of the company policy > *before* starting > work, therefore setting you up for failure from day > one. The one time > that happened I was wearing a very nice sleeveless > blouse (not a tank > top, but with the wide straps, modest scoop neck and > made of a thick > cotton knit that was not revealing and very elegant) > and being informed > not 15 minutes into the first day on the job that > "tank tops" are not > allowed in the office. It wasn't in the rule book. > It was just an > agreed upon thing that no one apparently thought to > mention. ***** This is one of the reasons I tell my students to wear something only very slightly less dressy than what they wore to the interview. I also suggest that they ask one of the people they work with if there are any little "dress code quirks" that they should know about; I once worked as a temp for Safeco Insurance, and had a fellow employee tell me enviously, "Gee, you're lucky you're a temp, because you can get away with wearing boots to work, while we're not allowed to." Mind you, these weren't Docs, they were a pair of high-heeled black leather boots, and I had on a skirt, blouse and blazer, but it was still considered "too casual" for regular employees. I also tell them: "No bare arms, shoulders, backs, or midriffs." While it might be OK at school, I've yet to see any workplace, outside of a lifeguard job, allow that much skin. ***** > > Being young and female and working in the > professional sector, I've > been subjected to all kinds of strange rules about > what is/isn't > acceptable dress for work. Like the instance above, > I think a lot of > it has to do more with my age and gender than the > clothes I was > actually wearing. I dress very modestly, but being > a "hot young thang" > is something that is near impossible to cover up. > In every instance, > the most humiliating experiences of being chastised > for my clothing > have come from higher ranking middle aged females. > One woman at my > last job (student assistant for the legal office of > one of the > departments of the EPA) went out of her way to > constantly harangue me > for my appearance. Anything she could comment on, > my weight, my > height, my clothing, my hair, my make-up, my lack of > make-up... > Thankfully the boss liked me, so her nasty remarks > were unable to do > much damage, but it just underscored the phenomenon > of being young, > single, female professional. No one trusts you, > because you're either > out there to scam on everyone's spouses, or you're > supposedly sleeping > with the boss, or you're going to get promoted > because you look better > in a short skirt... > > But again, this isn't from men (who seem to be > utterly oblivious to it, > from my experience). This is from older women who > should know better, > but who feel threatened by the presence of a younger > woman in their > office. Sad, but true. > > Sarah ***** At that point, I would have had a chat with someone in Personnel/Human Resources, particularly if she was commenting on my weight. Comments such as that can be construed as "creating a hostile work environment," one of the litmus tests for claiming sexual harrassment. While it is true that many sexual harrassment claims are against males, it is not unheard of for claims to be made against women, or for the claimant to be the same sex as the alleged harrasser. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 18:28:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMSdHP025871 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:28:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMSfUw015018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 16:28:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMSdFn027683; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:28:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MMSaFn027645 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:28:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (00217146@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.11.5/8.11.5) with ESMTP id h4MMSan33589 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:28:36 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 17:28:36 -0500 (CDT) From: Emma Elizabeth Lehman <00217146@bigred.unl.edu> To: In-Reply-To: <3ECCDFDE.9060107@fenris.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] Re: Changing styles X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > That is so true! > I realized a few months ago that I wear very boring clothes now. I used > to wear a lot of ethnic pieces, or unusual fabrics. That was when I > lived in Ann Arbor MI. Now that I live in conservative, semi-rural El > Dorado Co. California, I just dress like every one else. I believe the > change came when I moved from MI to CA. Oddly enough (or, not very...) the same thing happened to me when I moved from Ann Arbor to Lincoln, NE. I'm aware of my changes, though. I still have all the old clothing that I have no real interest in wearing anymore. It isn't that I don't like them, it's just that it takes too much effort to wear them now. People don't understand. Emma _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 19:09:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MN9EHP026004 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:09:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNAtUw007382 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 17:10:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNApdg026582; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:10:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNAldg026550 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:10:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA29596 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:31:53 -0500 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 18:31:53 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] A new costume interest In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030522150329.02c9dbc8@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 22 May 2003, Kimiko Small wrote: Kathleen wrote: > >My own artistic style is re the compliments of Market Place. These are the > >designs of distinctive clothing made by textile guilds in India. They are > >quality work and the people who make them get the money! What a concept. > >Most of the pieces are 100% cotton, tie-dyed or block printed with > >embroidered accents and embellishment. Not exactly cheap, but quite my > >style! > > Where do you find "Market Place" clothing? They sound interesting. I'm guessing this is http://www.marketplaceindia.org And folks, these items are really gorgeous. The fabrics are lovely, and each piece I've seen has a bit of quirky spot embroidery somewhere on it. One of our presenters this year at Kalamazoo (Sandy Straabhaur) was wearing Market Place dresses every day I saw her, which is where I first saw it. The images on the website don't do justice to the real thing. The prices aren't out of line with department store clothing, and there are some things in the sale section that have me musing. Alas, most standard sizes just don't fit me, and I have very bad luck with mail order because of that. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 19:24:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNO3HP026072 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:24:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNPgUw011683 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 17:25:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNPedg005282; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:25:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MNPbdg005250 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:25:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 28650 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 23:25:37 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 23:25:37 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-163.sonic.net [209.148.112.163]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MNPaH15797 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:25:36 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522161042.00b04e98@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 16:23:51 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030522143539.02c63c58@127.0.0.1> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think we basically agree that although there are those who play appearance games, they may well not be anyone you need or want to deal with. As for the expert systems--my husband's career is designing them, including systems for banks. Also, when I was a technical writer I documented expert systems for several companies. Expert systems are used for many purposes other than helping people do their jobs. Anyway, the knowledge engineer (programmer who interviews the subject expert(s) gathers considerable data for the system. Expert systems have numerical "certainty factors" that express how much a piece of evidence should influence the judgement. (There are several other schemes in addition to CFs to weigh and compare evidence, too complicated to describe here.) The loan applicant''s clothes might be a minor factor considered--but only a minor one. It would hardly outweigh the applicant's credit rating. Fran >In my business classes while I was going for my accounting degree, we >spoke of "expert systems", >There were many examples from different fields, from computer programmers, >to engineers, to bank loan officers. The loan officer actually had a >criteria of "what kind of shoes are the customer wearing, and how new are >the shoes." >Otherwise, I pretty much agree with you Fran. It is frustrating however to >know many women, and younger women and girls just learning about life, >just don't realize how superficial it all is. But it comes with maturity >or at least acceptance of yourself. >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 19:24:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNOOHP026075 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:24:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNQ7Uw011741 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 17:26:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNQ6dg005518; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:26:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4MNPadg005236 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:25:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 28640 invoked from network); 22 May 2003 23:25:36 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 22 May 2003 23:25:36 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-163.sonic.net [209.148.112.163]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4MNPYH15785 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 16:25:34 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522160018.00b10e18@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 16:11:30 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030522143539.02c63c58@127.0.0.1> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >In my business classes while I was going for my accounting degree, we >spoke of "expert systems", where people's many years of experience was put >into a computer system, My husband's career is in designing expert systems. Including systems for banks. (Expert systems are not all for business use, for example he has worked on systems to give medical information to the "average person.") I've also documented a number of such systems as a technical writer for various companies. Usually the process is for the knowledge engineer to intensively interview one or more "experts" in the field. Many factors would be >to help junior whatevers learn how to work at a higher level of experience >than they actually had. There were many examples from different fields, >from computer programmers, to engineers, to bank loan officers. The loan >officer actually had a criteria of "what kind of shoes are the customer >wearing, and how new are the shoes." The idea for the expert was that the >experienced loan officer had learned over time that people who wore newer >and cleaner shoes often had better risk levels for loans. It stuck in my >mind that the expert systems designers would support something so >superficial as the quality and newness of shoes, but there it was and is. >You could be Joe Millionaire, and if you wear bad shoes to that bank, >don't expect on getting the best rates. > >I also learned in business classes, especially in the Beta Alpha Psi, an >honorary accounting fraternity I was in, that how one dresses for >interviews was VERY important. Black or Navy blue suits was expected. >Granted that is a job interview, and one should dress the part... but it >is still an aspect of how you dress affects how others view you. As they >harped so often, you only get one chance to make a good first impression. > >And Fran, I hated being in that fraternity. The maturity level of most >students and recruiters was low. They didn't care who you were, they only >cared what position you held or formerly held in the organization. And >clothing was a big part of the game. Thankfully, I too had parents who >raised me to believe in me, not my clothing or anything else that is >superficial. But society in general still needs to raise the bar. And it >seemed to be a level of age maturity, as well as emotional ones. My >friends and I were older, returning students, and we realized the games >that were going on were bad ones. I don't think any one of us actually >joined a Big Six firm after graduation. We didn't like the emotional >baggage we were perceiving, and almost all of us were tops in our classes. > >Otherwise, I pretty much agree with you Fran. It is frustrating however to >know many women, and younger women and girls just learning about life, >just don't realize how superficial it all is. But it comes with maturity >or at least acceptance of yourself. I cheer when I hear of a woman who >finally opens her eyes to the empowering reality of being sure of >yourself. The confidence of wearing what you want and not worrying about >what others think of you is what I hope all young teens learn (but that is >doubtful, sadly). > >Like Penny mentioned, I am just looking to find something to wear that >reflects me, which isn't a power suit anymore (thank goodness). I just am >not sure what to wear that isn't a t-shirt and really baggy pants from >weight loss. I almost trip over the pant legs now. I need something better! > >Anyway, just a few thoughts. > >Kimiko > > > > >Kimiko Small >Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother >kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com > >Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery >http://www.costumegallery.com > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 19:37:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNbNHP026107 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:37:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNbsUw012952 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 17:37:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNbrdg012132; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:37:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.117]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4MNbpdg012073 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 17:37:51 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <200305222337.h4MNbpdg012073@net.indra.com> Received: from mtiwebc19 (mtiwebc19.worldnet.att.net[204.127.135.58]) by mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc13) with SMTP id <200305222337451130057huie>; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:37:45 +0000 Received: from [24.92.179.136] by mtiwebc19; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:37:45 +0000 From: sewinggoddess@att.net To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] pearls and dry cleaning Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 23:37:45 +0000 X-Mailer: AT&T Message Center Version 1 (Apr 30 2003) X-Authenticated-Sender: c2V3aW5nZ29kZGVzc0BhdHQubmV0 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Remember the scene in Wizard of Oz when the Wicked Witch of the West melts away under a bucket of water? Very similar. You probably won't get a single pearl back on your dress. Crissy > Angela wrote: > > > Next wedding dress-related question for you folks: > > what happens to freshwater pearls when you send them > > through the drycleaner? > > They die. Seriously, pearls are extremely sensitive to chemicals, > starting with those found in human sweat and working up from there. > Dry cleaning is not a good idea, even once. > > best wishes > Stevie > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 20:43:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N0hoHP026293 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:43:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N0jXUw008512 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 18:45:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N0jWVH017091; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:45:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N0jSVI017067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:45:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4N0jpC2002742 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:45:51 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4N0joMV002740 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:45:50 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 20:45:50 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305222045.50058.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4N0jSVI017067 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 22 May 2003 05:11 pm, Sarah wrote: > > Many employers do have dress standards, even if > > they are not specifically spelled out in the employee > > handbook > > My biggest peeve is getting called into the boss' office because you > wore something "inappropriate" the first day of the job, after everyone > failed to go over that part of the company policy *before* starting > work, therefore setting you up for failure from day one. The one time > that happened I was wearing a very nice sleeveless blouse (not a tank > top, but with the wide straps, modest scoop neck and made of a thick > cotton knit that was not revealing and very elegant) I know the type you mean. I agree with you. >and being informed > not 15 minutes into the first day on the job that "tank tops" are not > allowed in the office. It wasn't in the rule book. It was just an > agreed upon thing that no one apparently thought to mention. At least my office had the decency to put that rule in writing. If you ever have to wear such a blouse to work again, I have a suggestion. Blazers are your friend. :-) -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 21:26:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1QtHP026398 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:26:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1SdUw025831 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 19:28:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1ScNT008694; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:28:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1SZNT008648 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:28:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m136.in-tch.com [216.166.191.136]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4N1AAH21055 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:10:10 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECD7999.C8EC11A7@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 19:30:01 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate victoriandress References: <12c.2ab728f2.2bfe2909@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO *sigh* I'm not looking at their underpinnings. And I'm not, in this case, particularly concerned about the construction and cut of the fabric bits. I'm just noticing that the girl has a shape below her waist that quite closely mimics the shapes below the waists of the adults, even though the child's hem is shorter. And finding that interesting. --sue AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 5/22/2003 8:07:29 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > mooncat@in-tch.com writes: > > > I noticed (in the first link) that the young girl's skirt, although not > > floor length, has the same huge bell-shape as those of the adults. Is > > this common in the 19th c? > > > > The skirt is not technically "Bell shaped". That implies to me a skirt with > shaped gores like the 1890s or a little later....where the skirt fits at the > hips but flares at the hem. The skirts of the period depicted in the fashion > plate are straight pieces, sewn selvage to selvage, and pleated into the > waist. The top is the same yardage as the hem. It's the underpinning that > give it its shape. Same for the little girl. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 21:34:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1YCHP026418 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:34:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1XTUw026354 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 19:33:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1XSNT010715; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:33:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1XQNT010665 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:33:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m136.in-tch.com [216.166.191.136]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4N1F1H23080 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:15:01 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECD7ABC.AF2A964F@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 19:34:52 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] skirt length References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yes, thank you, Kate, that *is* what I was referring to! Most of the pictures I've seen (photos) from this time period have children sitting down, so any skirt poofiness would not be so obvious. I also come from a part of the US that was largely settled by non-Native Americans *after* the time during which such a full dress would have been common, so I have very little historical context, personally, for such a style. --sue Kate M Bunting wrote: > > I think Sue meant "was it common for little girls to wear bell-shaped skirts?" > Yes, I've seen this in Victorian photos and illustrations, including a photo of my great-grandmother as a child. Did they have a miniature crinoline? > > Kate Bunting > Library, University of Derby > > >>> kbaird@cableone.net 05/22/03 01:17pm >>> > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume->bounces@indra.com] > ..On Behalf Of Sue Clemenger > >Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 7:08 AM > >To: Historical Costume > >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate > >victorian dress > > >I like the original a lot better than the Simplicity pattern's version! > >I noticed (in the first link) that the young girl's skirt, although not > >floor length, has the same huge bell-shape as those of the adults. Is > >this common in the 19th c? > >--sue > > >Victorian children wore shorter skirts. The younger the child, the > >shorter the skirt. Young teens wore skirts almost as long as their > >mothers. Two signs of adulthood for women--wearing your hair up and > >wearing floor length skirts. > > >Kim > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email > Security System. For more information on a proactive email security > service working around the clock, around the globe, visit > http://www.messagelabs.com > ________________________________________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 21:37:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1b0HP026425 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:37:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1bXUw026724 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 19:37:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1bVNT012424; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:37:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1bTNT012368 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:37:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m136.in-tch.com [216.166.191.136]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4N1J3H24821 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:19:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ECD7BAE.FD81A5E7@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 19:38:54 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Linen outer garment... References: <4817814.1053621505032.JavaMail.nobody@misspiggy.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh, great! Now I'm going to be forced to spend my evening pawing through my own copy! I know that there were those embroidered jackets that I think of a so typically Stuart--all the ones I can think of are made from linen, but in that case, it's more just there to hold the embroidery together (not that there's anything wrong with that in the least! ;o). This doublet looked fairly plain, which is what caught my eye...I wonder if it was a lower-class garment?? --sue, musing Saragrace Knauf wrote: > > Yes, and there is a painting in QEWU in which Arnold says the woman is wearing a linen doublet. (Not sure how she can tell....) Sorry, I don't have my book with me to say which painting it is. > ____ > Well, here's an early 17th c. doublet made out of linen--I noticed from > the description that it appears not to be dyed, as well.... > It looks to be in rather poor shape, but still worth viewing. > --sue > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 21:55:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1t7HP026571 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:55:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1unUw028127 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 19:56:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1ul90021202; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:56:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1uj90021183 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:56:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-9-194.smf.jps.net ([216.119.9.194] helo=pavilion) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19J1nX-0000Ee-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 18:56:44 -0700 Message-ID: <005201c320d0$7dfb1840$c20977d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522161042.00b04e98@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 19:07:53 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I play an appearance game all the time, because when in Rome, one does as the Romans. But I only consider it a game. When I moved from New York City where I had a job at a luxury hotel and settled in Collinsville, a small coal mining town in northern Queensland Australia I instantly changed my look to fit the surroundings, otherwise I would have been a remake of Ava Gabor in "Green Acres". If the context of this conversation is, does it matter which shop at the local mall you buy your clothes from when you live and work in California? the matter is a little less urgent, but not at all unimportant. Once you start mixing up social class, religious beliefs and gender issues, and MONEY then people have a hard time coping, myself included. I usually adapt within the parameters of my wardrobe to the social situation I encounter because its easier that way. But I do use clothes for my own devious purposes occasionally. Like once when I was at a new workplace, someone anonymously complained about the espresso machine I had on my desk to upper management instead of mentioning to me directly that the coffee aroma was bothering them. So the next day, I came to work dressed head to toe in black, my hair in a black snood with a big black ribbon.and big dark sunglasses which I wore all day, Jackie O mourning style, Throughout the day a few people asked me what was wrong, and I said, only if asked, that I was very sad about the loss of my espresso machine and was in mourning and it bothered me that no one spoke directly in the first instance. I did this totally deadpanned too which was all the more fun because people didn't know if I was serious or not. By the end of the day I was told who the culprit was and was able to have a word with the person about my willingness to be approached directly when problems arose. In that petty office place of nitpicking, I was never picked on again. It was a game of office politics and clothing was the tool, but was still a silly game, but sometimes because the world isn't full of mature and enlightened people, one has to play. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 4:23 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest > I think we basically agree that although there are those who play > appearance games, they may well not be anyone you need or want to deal with. > > As for the expert systems--my husband's career is designing them, including > systems for banks. Also, when I was a technical writer I documented expert > systems for several companies. > > Expert systems are used for many purposes other than helping people do > their jobs. Anyway, the knowledge engineer (programmer who interviews the > subject expert(s) gathers considerable data for the system. Expert systems > have numerical "certainty factors" that express how much a piece of > evidence should influence the judgement. (There are several other schemes > in addition to CFs to weigh and compare evidence, too complicated to > describe here.) The loan applicant''s clothes might be a minor factor > considered--but only a minor one. It would hardly outweigh the applicant's > credit rating. > > Fran > > > > >In my business classes while I was going for my accounting degree, we > >spoke of "expert systems", > > > > > > >There were many examples from different fields, from computer programmers, > >to engineers, to bank loan officers. The loan officer actually had a > >criteria of "what kind of shoes are the customer wearing, and how new are > >the shoes." > > > > >Otherwise, I pretty much agree with you Fran. It is frustrating however to > >know many women, and younger women and girls just learning about life, > >just don't realize how superficial it all is. But it comes with maturity > >or at least acceptance of yourself. > > > > > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:09:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N29OHP026623 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:09:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N29rUw029055 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:09:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N29q90027393; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:09:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N29n90027352 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:09:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-9-194.smf.jps.net ([216.119.9.194] helo=pavilion) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19J20B-0002qh-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:09:47 -0700 Message-ID: <008901c320d2$518382a0$c20977d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net><021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon><4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com><009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030522161042.00b04e98@pop.sonic.net> <005201c320d0$7dfb1840$c20977d8@pavilion> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 19:23:36 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO BTW - I tend not to get promoted! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 7:07 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest > I play an appearance game all the time, because when in Rome, one does as > the Romans. But I only consider it a game. When I moved from New York City > where I had a job at a luxury hotel and settled in Collinsville, a small > coal mining town in northern Queensland Australia I instantly changed my > look to fit the surroundings, otherwise I would have been a remake of Ava > Gabor in "Green Acres". > > If the context of this conversation is, does it matter which shop at the > local mall you buy your clothes from when you live and work in California? > the matter is a little less urgent, but not at all unimportant. Once you > start mixing up social class, religious beliefs and gender issues, and MONEY > then people have a hard time coping, myself included. > > I usually adapt within the parameters of my wardrobe to the social situation > I encounter because its easier that way. But I do use clothes for my own > devious purposes occasionally. Like once when I was at a new workplace, > someone anonymously complained about the espresso machine I had on my desk > to upper management instead of mentioning to me directly that the coffee > aroma was bothering them. So the next day, I came to work dressed head to > toe in black, my hair in a black snood with a big black ribbon.and big dark > sunglasses which I wore all day, Jackie O mourning style, Throughout the > day a few people asked me what was wrong, and I said, only if asked, that I > was very sad about the loss of my espresso machine and was in mourning and > it bothered me that no one spoke directly in the first instance. I did this > totally deadpanned too which was all the more fun because people didn't know > if I was serious or not. By the end of the day I was told who the culprit > was and was able to have a word with the person about my willingness to be > approached directly when problems arose. In that petty office place of > nitpicking, I was never picked on again. It was a game of office politics > and clothing was the tool, but was still a silly game, but sometimes because > the world isn't full of mature and enlightened people, one has to play. > > Lisa > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lavolta Press" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 4:23 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest > > > > I think we basically agree that although there are those who play > > appearance games, they may well not be anyone you need or want to deal > with. > > > > As for the expert systems--my husband's career is designing them, > including > > systems for banks. Also, when I was a technical writer I documented expert > > systems for several companies. > > > > Expert systems are used for many purposes other than helping people do > > their jobs. Anyway, the knowledge engineer (programmer who interviews the > > subject expert(s) gathers considerable data for the system. Expert > systems > > have numerical "certainty factors" that express how much a piece of > > evidence should influence the judgement. (There are several other schemes > > in addition to CFs to weigh and compare evidence, too complicated to > > describe here.) The loan applicant''s clothes might be a minor factor > > considered--but only a minor one. It would hardly outweigh the > applicant's > > credit rating. > > > > Fran > > > > > > > > >In my business classes while I was going for my accounting degree, we > > >spoke of "expert systems", > > > > > > > > > > > > >There were many examples from different fields, from computer > programmers, > > >to engineers, to bank loan officers. The loan officer actually had a > > >criteria of "what kind of shoes are the customer wearing, and how new are > > >the shoes." > > > > > > > > >Otherwise, I pretty much agree with you Fran. It is frustrating however > to > > >know many women, and younger women and girls just learning about life, > > >just don't realize how superficial it all is. But it comes with maturity > > >or at least acceptance of yourself. > > > > > > > > > > >h-costume mailing list > > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:11:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2BFHP026630 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:11:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1JjUw023851 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 19:19:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1JiNT004804; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:19:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N1JfNT004749 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:19:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LLWatts@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.164.20bab681 (3972) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:19:28 -0400 (EDT) From: LLWatts@aol.com Message-ID: <164.20bab681.2bfed11f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:19:27 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] pearls and dry cleaning To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>>>>>> Next wedding dress-related question for you folks: > what happens to freshwater pearls when you send them > through the drycleaner? I will be using some pearls > as accent on my dress, and I am wondering about how > extensively and permanently to put them on, and > whether I should plan on removing them before I have > it cleaned. >>>>>>> Most of the "pearls" I've seen on wedding dresses have been plastic, and I know those are a headache for the cleaner. I don't have any experience with real pearls and dry cleaning. However, I would suggest not gluing them on, a lot of fabric glues will dissolve in cleaning solvent. I don't know how much the pearls are costing you, but if you have some extra fabric and a few spare pearls you might make up a test swatch -- attach the pearls the way they're attached on the dress, then take the swatch to your local cleaner and ask them to test it. Leah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:12:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2CWHP026637 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:12:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2EEUw029464 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:14:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2ED90029706; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:14:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4N2EB90029678 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:14:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 19494 invoked from network); 23 May 2003 02:14:10 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 23 May 2003 02:14:10 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-233.sonic.net [209.148.112.233]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4N2E9902000 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:14:10 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522191218.00ac2ea8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 19:15:39 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <005201c320d0$7dfb1840$c20977d8@pavilion> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522161042.00b04e98@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's not like I've never lived in a small town. (I've lived in a number of places/states over the years.) While I'd prefer to avoid ever living in one again--because people do tend to be busybodies and narrow-minded--I am clear on the fact that it's them, not me. As for money/class--I have the middle-class attitude that it's distasteful to discuss money, except when necessary on matters of business. Fran >If the context of this conversation is, does it matter which shop at the >local mall you buy your clothes from when you live and work in California? >the matter is a little less urgent, but not at all unimportant. Once you >start mixing up social class, religious beliefs and gender issues, and MONEY >then people have a hard time coping, myself included. > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:13:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2DCHP026640 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:13:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2EtUw029511 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:14:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2Es90000131; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:14:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (mta5.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2Ep90000102 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:14:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.124.38.47]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HFB0006GI8OQD@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:14:51 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 19:14:42 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-reply-to: <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > I often wonder why individuals care what people worry about what others > > think about what you wear. Those of you who do care please shed some >light. Here in California, if I dress too casual, or if my naturally frizzy hair gets too frizzy, I am mistaken for homeless, and get treated with much disrespect, often outright rudeness. If I dress like the mothers of younger acquaintances of mine, I get excluded from much of what the group is doing, the assumption being that I'm too old to relate. If I wear any tie-dye, the black leather crowd counts two strikes against me as an old Hippie fossil. If I wear sandals and a flowing Rayon skirt with batik, I am mistaken for a New Age old Hippie, or a neo-Pagan. If I wear any of my fibre art garments, the fashionable one of my daughters asks me to change into 'normal' clothes. If I dress up and wear slacks and a blazer, my friends think I have been to an interview. Given people's tendency to judge by what people wear, I have found, as a costumer, that I can use this to my advantage: Janet Wilson-Anderson, owner of Alter Years, always dresses impeccably, in subtle colours, matching shoes and handbag, tasteful jewelry, and carefully styled hair. I only carry a purse on interviews, relying instead on my jeans pockets. One day we were at a flea market together, and we realized that if the dealer thought I just looking, I should send in Janet, dressed like money, to get him to show her the item in the glass case; and if the dealer thought Janet was a rich collector, she should send me in, dressed like the dealer in the next row, to bargain with him. This worked famously, and the dealers never figured it out, because we weren't dressed like we even knew each other. I often get mistaken for someone who works in the shop I'm in, since I don't carry a purse. I often get asked where something is because they don't see a purse and assume I'm an employee. My basic outfit is a plain t-shirt plus jeans. Dressing up a little means a long-sleeved button-front shirt instead of the t-shirt, and dressing up a lot means I iron my one mundane dress. I pick what I wear pretty carefully, depending on the impression I want to make and the people I expect to see, because it's all costume to me. If I'm going to a quilt show or shop, I wear a fibre art costume. If I'm going to the bank, like inside to ask them a question, I wear a solvent client costume. If I'm going to the flea market, I wear a flea market dealer costume. If I have to take the car to a mechanic, I wear a non-fluffy-female costume. If I'm going to my kid's school, out come the slacks and blazer. This weekend I am going to a science fiction convention as a panelist, and I will dress up a little, in a convention panelist costume. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:33:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2XKHP026678 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:33:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2XdUw000917 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:33:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2Xc90008868; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:33:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r07.mx.aol.com (imo-r07.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.103]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2Xa90008807 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:33:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.24.3ebbb9da (3940) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:33:29 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <24.3ebbb9da.2bfee279@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:33:29 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate victoriandress To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/22/2003 9:29:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mooncat@in-tch.com writes: > I'm not looking at their underpinnings. And I'm not, in this case, > particularly concerned about the construction and cut of the fabric > bits. > I'm just noticing that the girl has a shape below her waist that quite > closely mimics the shapes below the waists of the adults, even though > the child's hem is shorter. And finding that interesting. > --sue > But, Honey, the cut and underpinnings DETERMINE the shape of the skirt! One of my favorite costume details: In "Gone With The Wind", Carreen, Scarlet's little sister, is 1st seen running down the stairs to ask Mother if she can stay up for the ball at 12 Oaks. She is wearing a blue and black plaid bolero and matching skirt. The skirt is short and over a hoop with her pantalets showing underneath [like in the fashion plate we were discussing]. You only get to see it for an instant....then it's all table shots of her. Later, during recontruction....in the scene where Ashley returns, Melanie who fled from Atlanta in her bed clothes having just had a baby, is wearing Carreen's short skirt with a piece of fabric sewn to the bottom to make it long. What a great detail! Anyway, short versions of adult clothes, including their underpinnings, for children were the norm for almost all the 19th century. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:35:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2ZLHP026681 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:35:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2ZpUw001129 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:35:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2Zo90010003; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:35:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2Zm90009978 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:35:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-9-194.smf.jps.net ([216.119.9.194] helo=pavilion) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19J2PK-0006vm-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:35:47 -0700 Message-ID: <00bc01c320d5$f3370ce0$c20977d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 19:49:36 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta wrote > My basic outfit is a plain t-shirt plus jeans. Dressing up a little means > a long-sleeved button-front shirt instead of the t-shirt, and dressing up a > lot means I iron my one mundane dress. I pick what I wear pretty > carefully, depending on the impression I want to make and the people I > expect to see, because it's all costume to me. If I'm going to a quilt > show or shop, I wear a fibre art costume. If I'm going to the bank, like > inside to ask them a question, I wear a solvent client costume. If I'm > going to the flea market, I wear a flea market dealer costume. If I have > to take the car to a mechanic, I wear a non-fluffy-female costume. If I'm > going to my kid's school, out come the slacks and blazer. This weekend I > am going to a science fiction convention as a panelist, and I will dress up > a little, in a convention panelist costume. > I've got a tape of an interview I had with my grandmother when she was in her seventies made just for the sake of family history. She was a fashion model in Finland and had her own dress shop when she was a young married woman in her 20's. She told a story of how because she came from a wealth family the butcher would always charge her and her mother more for ham. So they came up with this clever idea of dressing down to go to the markets, so they would get cheaper prices, and it worked. But the big arguement came when my greatgrand mother wanted to wear "babushkas", some sort of peasant cloth over their heads, not sure of the spelling, and at that my grandmother put her foot down. For no amount of monetary savings was she about to show up in public wearing a "babushka", she would rather pay more for the ham. It's quite a hoot. As someone with yo yo weight, I can tell you life is easier when your thin. When I am thin and wearing even the slightest short skirt, buses with male drivers wait for me, if I was running to catch it before it left. When heavier, bad luck!!! It's astonishing the difference. Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:38:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2c1HP026687 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:38:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2cJUw001309 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:38:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2cI90011124; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:38:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2cG90011065 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:38:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.1d4.a2b2162 (3940) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:38:07 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1d4.a2b2162.2bfee38f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:38:07 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] skirt length To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/22/2003 9:34:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mooncat@in-tch.com writes: > I think Sue meant "was it common for little girls to wear bell-shaped > skirts?" > Sure...if the CUT and UNDERPINNINGS make a bell shaped skirt....which they DO NOT in the period of the fashion plate. It is a dome shaped or more conical shape, because of the straight pieces over a hoop, not a bell shape, which is achieved by cutting gores and butting them over a shaped petticoat. Why all the sighing and grinning. Is this beyond your comprehension? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:40:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2evHP026694 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:40:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2gjUw001588 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:42:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2gi90013126; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:42:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2gf90013056 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:42:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.54.11d640eb (3940) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:42:32 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <54.11d640eb.2bfee497@aol.com> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:42:31 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] skirt length To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/22/2003 9:34:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mooncat@in-tch.com writes: > I think Sue meant "was it common for little girls to wear bell-shaped > skirts?" > I would also like to add that the thrust at the back of this dome shaped skirt is due to either a bustle pad [underpinnings] and /or a stiff or padded innerlining at the back panels of the skirt [a la 1840s] plus some heavy duty gathering into the CB waist. So you can add pleating to the cut and underpinnings as to what shape the skirt, long or short, will take. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:48:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2m3HP026703 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:48:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2maUw001947 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:48:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2mY90015778; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:48:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail6.mn.rr.com (fe6.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.53]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2mW90015757 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:48:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.mn.rr.com ([24.163.202.87]) by mail6.mn.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Thu, 22 May 2003 21:48:59 -0500 Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.2.20030522214444.03376670@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: dannw@smtp-server.mn.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:53:28 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg In-Reply-To: <20030522.130004.-152593.2.catpurson@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings, Would a *bright* (rather electric) royal blue silk satin work for a gown at any time during the 18th century (England or France)? Or would a very bright royal blue be too aniline? Any suggestions for colours to over-dye it if the blue is incorrect? It looks somewhat like http://www.dharmatrading.com/html/eng/1344-AA.shtml "#623 brilliant blue" only brighter and with the soft sheen of silk. I just bought a whole bunch of royal blue "duchesse" silk satin for $3 a yard and want to make something truly decadent out of it. : ) Cheers, Danielle _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:48:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2mRHP026706 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:48:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2oDUw002073 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:50:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2oB90016852; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:50:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2o990016825 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:50:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from user-33qtk16.dialup.mindspring.com ([199.174.208.38] helo=pavilion) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19J2dE-0003IH-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:50:09 -0700 Message-ID: <00e001c320d7$f4cf7540$c20977d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522161042.00b04e98@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522191218.00ac2ea8@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 20:03:58 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO . > > As for money/class--I have the middle-class attitude that it's distasteful > to discuss money, except when necessary on matters of business. > > Fran > I've done too many courses in social anthropology not to notice class segregation and behaviour unfortunately, and yes, it is middle class not to discuss class. :) Discussing class, as a middle class person myself, is probably another reason I tend not to get promoted or invited to meetings. Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 22:55:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2tAHP026713 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:55:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2utUw002756 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 20:56:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2upvw021784; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:56:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net (hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N2ulvw021706 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 20:56:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dialup-67.28.31.234.dial1.chicago1.level3.net ([67.28.31.234] helo=earthlink.net) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19J2je-00009k-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 19:56:46 -0700 Message-ID: <3ECD8DB3.EA0A8B01@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:55:47 -0500 From: Ms Berard X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en]C-CCK-MCD (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I guess I don't work for a *good employer*. Apparently he saw a different dept that was allowed to wear jeans and he didn't think they were "productive". Of course they *only* took inbound customer service calls. So if no one was calling they were supposed to do silent things so that they wouldn't be heard by anyone who was on the phone. This part of the business was eventually sold. But it wasn't the jeans fault, it was the fact that we were too small to compete. Onaree Lavolta Press wrote: > > But, any good employer realizes dress is not your whole job performance. Or even a major > part of it, unless you work in the fashion industry or something similar. -- Proud list mom of Irish Crochet Lovers http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Irish_Crochet_Lovers/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 23:22:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3MuHP026784 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:22:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3OgUw004801 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 21:24:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3Odvw005636; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:24:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3OZvx005599 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:24:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty1001.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.242.1]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4N3ObtO032214 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:24:38 -0400 Message-ID: <3ECD9464.2030907@dandy.net> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 23:24:20 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, All. The reference in Reginald Scot was meant to be some sort of a mark on the body to indicate that the person doing the conjuring, or magic (that is what the Scot book is about), is kin to the saint, and therefore has some of their attributes. The whole quote is "Others likewise have (as they brag) a Katherine wheele upon their bodies, and they saie they are kin to S. Katherine, and that they can carrie burning coles in their bare hands, and dip their said hands in skalding liquor, and also go into hot ovens". I am looking for my Dekker and Middleton to see if I can find the other quote to see what context it is in. Cheers, Mike T. Agnes Gawne wrote: >Catherine Wheel is in the OED... Here's the listing and citations: > > > 1584 R. SCOT Discov. Witchcr. XII. >xv. 206 Others likewise have (as they brag) a Katharine wheel upon their >bodies. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 23:25:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3PkHP026788 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:25:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3QHUw004931 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 21:26:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3QHvw006406; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:26:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3QDvx006387 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:26:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4N3QaC2003162 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:26:36 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4N3QZxU003160 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:26:35 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 23:26:35 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> <00bc01c320d5$f3370ce0$c20977d8@pavilion> In-Reply-To: <00bc01c320d5$f3370ce0$c20977d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305222326.35419.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4N3QDvx006387 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 22 May 2003 10:49 pm, Lisa Sinervo wrote: > Kayta wrote > My basic outfit is a plain t-shirt plus jeans. Dressing up a > little means > > > a long-sleeved button-front shirt instead of the t-shirt, and dressing up > > a lot means I iron my one mundane dress. I pick what I wear pretty > > carefully, depending on the impression I want to make and the people I > > expect to see, because it's all costume to me. If I'm going to a quilt > > show or shop, I wear a fibre art costume. If I'm going to the bank, like > > inside to ask them a question, I wear a solvent client costume. If I'm > > going to the flea market, I wear a flea market dealer costume. If I have > > to take the car to a mechanic, I wear a non-fluffy-female costume. If > > I'm going to my kid's school, out come the slacks and blazer. This > > weekend I am going to a science fiction convention as a panelist, and I > > will dress up a little, in a convention panelist costume. I can relate to this. And I have a cute story to illustrate the importance of dressing for the role you want people to accept you in. In Pennsylvania, where I went to college and where I still live, the legal age for drinking alcohol and for purchasing alcoholic beverages is 21 years. Also, Pennsylvania does not permit private vendors to sell liquor or wine; those have to be purchased in special stores run by the state. Clerks at these stores make a routine practice of demanding driver's licenses or other proofs of age from anyone they suspect to be underage. When I was a rather young-looking 20-year-old, a friend of mine and I wanted to buy a bottle of wine for our debate coach (for reasons not relevant to this story). Aware that what I was doing was illegal, I did what I could to make myself look a bit older. I dressed in a nice pants suit, with good pumps, and wore a bit of tasteful, business-like jewelry. Thus armed (or armored) I visited the State Store located down the block from my dorm. The clerk sold me the wine with no questions--and without even asking me to present identification or proof of age. About 6 months later, I turned 21. Shortly after my birthday, I visited the same State Store to make another wine purchase for a different occasion. This time, armored in the certainty that what I was doing was legal, I visited the same store wearing what I customarily wore in warm weather--namely, a tank top, shorts, and sandals. The clerk immediately asked for my driver's license as proof of age. Unfortunately, I did not yet have a driver's license at that time, and I had no other identification he would accept as proof of age. So I went away empty handed. Moral: No matter how stupid it may seem, never discount the power of costume.... -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 22 23:34:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3Y3HP026803 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:34:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3ZmUw005769 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 21:35:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3Zkvw010798; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:35:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N3Zgvx010744 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 21:35:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4N3a5C2003227 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:36:05 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4N3a52P003225 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:36:05 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 23:36:04 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030522214444.03376670@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.2.20030522214444.03376670@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305222336.04636.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4N3Zgvx010744 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 22 May 2003 10:53 pm, Danielle Nunn-Weinberg wrote: > Greetings, > > Would a *bright* (rather electric) royal blue silk satin work for a gown at > any time during the 18th century (England or France)? Or would a very > bright royal blue be too aniline? Any suggestions for colours to over-dye > it if the blue is incorrect? It looks somewhat like > http://www.dharmatrading.com/html/eng/1344-AA.shtml "#623 brilliant blue" > only brighter and with the soft sheen of silk. > > I just bought a whole bunch of royal blue "duchesse" silk satin for $3 a > yard and want to make something truly decadent out of it. : ) Sounds lovely. 18thc isn't my period, but my impression is that a very bright royal blue doesn't work. The bright blue would be perfect for mid-19thc (1850-1860s) though, and would be justifiable for many decades after 1870. -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 00:02:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N42mHP026894 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:02:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N43KUw008477 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 22:03:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N43JjR024941; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:03:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r03.mx.aol.com (imo-r03.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N43FjR024891 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:03:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.125.2205da4a (2168) for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:03:07 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <125.2205da4a.2bfef77b@aol.com> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 00:03:07 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/22/2003 11:36:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, cathy@thyrsus.com writes: > Would a *bright* (rather electric) royal blue silk satin work for a gown at > >any time during the 18th century (England or France)? It sounds more 19th century to me....and you seem to agree. But, y'know, there are some electric pinks and yellows in the 18th century, so a bright color is not the issue. But blue.... There's that bright yellow dress in Williamsburg with electric blue embroidery all over it. I've seen some bright blue in men's coats late in the century. Most of these bright colors are patterned somehow though....like a jacquard or it's covered with embroidery [there's an idea!] Those plain "lustring" silk dresses of the 70s and 80s are pale colors, no? Usually to kill a color you mix it with it's complimentary color....in this case orange. If you overdyed it with a pale peach or pink you'd still get blue, royal blue, just not so electric [the pink of course would take it towards purple...but I'm talking pale overdye here]. You could also go green by over dying it with some kind of yellow....like ochre [a bright yellow will only give you electric green]. A lot of black dyes have purple in them, but a black overdye, depending on what color the black really is, might get you an indigo color. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 01:06:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N56iHP026999 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:06:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N55uUw013361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 23:05:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N55rc3024935; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:05:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4N55nc3024882 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:05:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 9770 invoked from network); 23 May 2003 05:05:48 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 23 May 2003 05:05:48 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-213.sonic.net [209.148.112.213]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4N55l604528 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 22:05:47 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522220351.00ac7a48@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:07:16 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> References: <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >Here in California, if I dress too casual, or if my naturally frizzy hair >gets too frizzy, I am mistaken for homeless, and get treated with much >disrespect, often outright rudeness. If I dress like the mothers of >younger acquaintances of mine, I get excluded from much of what the group >is doing, the assumption being that I'm too old to relate. If I wear any >tie-dye, the black leather crowd counts two strikes against me as an old >Hippie fossil. If I wear sandals and a flowing Rayon skirt with batik, I >am mistaken for a New Age old Hippie, or a neo-Pagan. If I wear any of my >fibre art garments, the fashionable one of my daughters asks me to change >into 'normal' clothes. If I dress up and wear slacks and a blazer, my >friends think I have been to an interview. Sure, people try to put you into boxes. But you don't have to believe in/stay in those boxes. >tle colours, matching shoes and handbag, tasteful jewelry, and carefully >styled hair. I only carry a purse on interviews, relying instead on my >jeans pockets. One day we were at a flea market together, and we realized >that if the dealer thought I just looking, I should send in Janet, dressed >like money, to get him to show her the item in the glass case; and if the >dealer thought Janet was a rich collector, she should send me in, dressed >like the dealer in the next row, to bargain with him. This worked >famously, and the dealers never figured it out, because we weren't dressed >like we even knew each other. But I can bargain no matter what I'm wearing. >I pick what I wear pretty carefully, depending on the impression I want to >make and the people I expect to see, because it's all costume to me. If >I'm going to a quilt show or shop, I wear a fibre art costume. If I'm >going to the bank, like inside to ask them a question, I wear a solvent >client costume. If I'm going to the flea market, I wear a flea market >dealer costume. If I have to take the car to a mechanic, I wear a >non-fluffy-female costume. If I'm going to my kid's school, out come the >slacks and blazer. This weekend I am going to a science fiction >convention as a panelist, and I will dress up a little, in a convention >panelist costume. OK, if you enjoy playing these games. But you don't have to. I can browse or buy whatever I want at a fiber arts show or flea market no matter what I'm wearing. I can get answers from my bank no matter what I'm wearing. Etc. This is really all your choice. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 01:55:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N5tiHP027076 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:55:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N5uBUw017234 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 22 May 2003 23:56:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N5u9SB019722; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:56:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N5u6SB019701 for ; Thu, 22 May 2003 23:56:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A82E28AF0030; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:57:02 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7F6B1900B8; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:56:06 -0500 Message-ID: <007601c320f0$45b474c0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Changing styles Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 01:58:02 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Emma, I think you made a very valid point. Living in different locations there can be socially accepted fashions. Some areas are more laid back than others. Same for artsy, business oriented, etc. When I lived in New Mexico, the fashions were geared towards art & the different cultures in the area. In Mississippi, it was comfort from the heat and humidity. It was also a tourist area near the beach. When I lived on an Air Force base for a long hard winter in Illinois... anything went as long as you kept warm. Here in Richmond, VA, it is more casual/business casual. The only time I see anyone in suits is in the financial district/state capital areas downtown. Suits are worn to formal occasions. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 02:16:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N6GRHP030593 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 02:16:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N6GvUw018905 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 00:16:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N6GtSB029012; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:16:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N6GqSB028995 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:16:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD0DC910066; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:17:49 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ACD51B52011E; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:16:53 -0500 Message-ID: <007d01c320f3$2ca294a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> <021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522160018.00b10e18@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 02:18:48 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The funniest thing happened tonight... My son and I were going to his theater banquet/awards. Last year it was a picnic. This year was a mystery dinner playhouse. I asked my son what was dress style for the night. He said black something... he really wasn't sure. I asked "Black Tie." He said, "I guess. I am wearing my black suit, shirt and tie." His nickname at school is "the man in black." He wears black all the time because techies at not to be seen in the theater... where he is every day. So I wore a maroon dressy pants ensemble with colorful masks on it. I thought it would be nice with a theater theme. I walked in the banquet hall door, and his teacher said, "Looks like Pat forgot to tell you that this is a black and white banquet." We were some of the first people to arrive. I sat at the table waiting for someone to come in wearing something besides black and white. I couldn't help but think of this thread on h-costume. As more people came in.... Yea!!!! About 10 other people came into the banquet hall wearing colors!!!! Seems I don't have the only child who doesn't understand dressing for the occasion. When the waiter/actor was serving the meals to our table, the actor said, "I will remember you as the colorful one!" When the next act of the play started, guess who the actors decided to interact with... the colorful people in the room. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 02:20:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N6KEHP031472 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 02:20:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N6KkUw019256 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 00:20:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N6KkSB000982; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:20:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N6KhSB000965 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:20:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ADF428EA0030; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:21:40 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ADBC14410150; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:20:44 -0500 Message-ID: <008801c320f3$b66dd960$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net><021301c3209e$068f92e0$6501a8c0@sharon><4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com><009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030522161042.00b04e98@pop.sonic.net> <005201c320d0$7dfb1840$c20977d8@pavilion> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 02:22:39 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lisa, Your Jackie O was a hoot! Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 03:13:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7D2HP013438 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 03:13:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7EhUw023004 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 01:14:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7Eg5j024329; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:14:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7Eb5j024255 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:14:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp01-249.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.120.249]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BAF3BE93A for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 09:14:31 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3ECDCAEB.8020406@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 09:16:59 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simp. 5724 original plate ?? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Good question. It looks like the last one ends lower then the front ones. But I don't know anything from this period. Greetings, Deredere Jennifer Sena wrote: > > >> > Ore look here >> > http://content-dev.lib.washington.edu/costumeweb/index.html >> > And its the second picture under victorian 1837- 1859. >> > Only the bodice is slightly different. >> > >> > Greetings, >> > Deredere >> > >> > > > This was one of the patterns I considered for my dream dress pattern. > When I looked at this pic again, it seems to me like the overskirt may > be one large drape and the swags are only in the front. Any > confirmation or rebuttal? It kills me that I can't see the backs when > I want to on these. > > > > Jennifer Sena > Distant Designs > http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi > > I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 03:18:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7I3HP014626 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 03:18:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7JoUw023230 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 01:19:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7Jn5j026354; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:19:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7Jk5j026329 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:19:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ABCA29800030; Fri, 23 May 2003 02:20:42 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB938EE0142; Fri, 23 May 2003 02:19:47 -0500 Message-ID: <00c601c320fb$f62b0340$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522104031.00b01ea0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522125220.03208ea8@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 03:21:43 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dress does say so much about people without the wearer ever saying a word. It might say if you are conservative, liberal, a moderate, creative, religion, color preference, age, music tastes, introvert, extrovert...Just so many things. I fashion watch all day long... my sister calls me the fashion cop. She is one too! It is my favorite thing to do. I could watch Style TV all day long. The key to being a good fashion watcher, don't condemn people for what they are wearing... except if it is your responsibility like I was when teaching school. The worse thing you could ever tell someone is that something they are wearing looks bad. If you TRULY like something a person is wearing, say so. Don't give out false compliments... sucking up... big NO, NO. I study what people are wearing... at concerts, parties, parking lots while waiting for my kids to get off work, in stores, just about anywhere. It is fun to talk with people to see if their personality matches up with the mental fashion profile I have given them. Very few people have disappointed me. This is part of my personality. I like to talk with all types of people and if they want to talk fashion we can but it is not necessary. I have a broad area of interests... we can talk about anything, but I will find out if my mental fashion profile is correct or not. When I sold clothing, this was a great gift to have... especially when I sold menswear. If you sell something that doesn't fit with a man's personality, IT will be returned. When women were the purchaser, the first thing I would ask is to tell me about the man's likes and dislikes. Personality plays so much into what they will or will not wear. Men hate to admit it but they can be more picky about clothing than women. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 03:23:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7NOHP015772 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 03:23:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7NuUw023426 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 01:23:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7Nu5j027881; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:23:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (mta5.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7Nr5j027863 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:23:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.124.37.167]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HFB00GOJWJRK5@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 00:23:53 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 00:22:27 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522220351.00ac7a48@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030523001333.00dfcac0@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>I pick what I wear pretty carefully, depending on the impression I want >>to make and the people I expect to see, because it's all costume to >>me. If I'm going to a quilt show or shop, I wear a fibre art >>costume. If I'm going to the bank, like inside to ask them a question, I >>wear a solvent client costume. If I'm going to the flea market, I wear a >>flea market dealer costume. If I have to take the car to a mechanic, I >>wear a non-fluffy-female costume. If I'm going to my kid's school, out >>come the slacks and blazer. This weekend I am going to a science fiction >>convention as a panelist, and I will dress up a little, in a convention >>panelist costume. > >OK, if you enjoy playing these games. But you don't have to. I can browse >or buy whatever I want at a fiber arts show or flea market no matter what >I'm wearing. I can get answers from my bank no matter what I'm wearing. >Etc. This is really all your choice. It's not like I enjoy it, and I realize it is a choice. I have ADD, and it's sometimes difficult for me to concentrate on the words I want, to convey what I want to say. So I found I could let the costume do much of the talking for me, and let it help me keep focused on what I came to do. It's the old theatre trick of using a "green umbrella" to help one stay in character. I get really distracted by the bad treatment I sometimes get when I am not dressed to expectation, so a good costume helps me a lot. But I play costume games much better than I play social games, the rules of which always change, always mystify me, and always seem pretty stupid. And, unlike you, my parents were part of the problem, not part of the solution. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 03:49:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7nsHP025265 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 03:49:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7peUw025730 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 01:51:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N7pd5j010498; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:51:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41505.mail.yahoo.com (web41505.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.88]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4N7pb5j010449 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 01:51:37 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523075131.4547.qmail@web41505.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41505.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:51:31 BST Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 08:51:31 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030522203704.99781.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO *huge snippage* > Sorry for this turning into a long rant. I deal with > this every day (clothes: the ultimate costume), and I > have strong opinions on the matter. > > Dawn I do have to say that I feel very sorry for you Americans (and the English too, those school uniforms I find appalling). The German world I grew up in let me wear what I wanted, as long as I was good in school and I certainly was, same with University, I went in swathed in a black and gold sari or big costumes, and never had a problem in any exams. Yes I chose my environments according to the amount of freedom I need, but from all the mails I read and remembering things I read and saw about the USA, I really do feel sorry for you lot. I don't want to sound nasty, coz I don't mean it nasty, but it seems that there really is no freedom of personal expression and development and all of that in America. You either fit in, or the so-called land of the free is not free at all. Poor you!!!! Is it just that YOU lot have all those experiences of having to fit in that strongly, or is it really like that??? How do you lot cope with these restrictions? Nicole - really not meaning the above nasty at all ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 04:57:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N8vCHP026678 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 04:57:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N8vnUw002187 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 02:57:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N8vkpG017057; Fri, 23 May 2003 02:57:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N8vgpG017023 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 02:57:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4N8vep08290.; Fri, 23 May 2003 09:57:41 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 23 May 2003 09:57:38 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 09:57:25 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4N8vgpG017023 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole wrote: >I do have to say that I feel very sorry for you Americans (and the English >too, those school uniforms I find appalling). Well, at least young people who have to wear school uniform are spared the worry of deciding what to wear to school and competing as to who is the most fashionable! Interesting to read of all these strict dress codes at work. We don't have one at all. As a middle-aged professional I try to dress reasonably smartly, at least in term-time, as do some of my colleagues, but others get away with living in jeans and T shirts. I wear jeans at home, but I'm old-fashioned enough to like to dress smartly on Sundays (unless there's a reason for not doing so). This is how I was brought up; my late father, although not a churchgoer, always wore a suit on Sunday. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 05:14:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N9ECHP030152 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 05:14:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N9FwUw003993 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 03:15:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N9FvpG000815; Fri, 23 May 2003 03:15:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4N9FspG000447 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 03:15:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7022A110030; Fri, 23 May 2003 04:16:50 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A6CBD0100C0; Fri, 23 May 2003 04:15:55 -0500 Message-ID: <001101c3210c$2eb5dae0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030523075131.4547.qmail@web41505.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 05:17:49 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole, Only private schools and a few public schools have uniforms. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 06:44:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NAiCHP030421 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:44:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NAijUw010124 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 04:44:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NAihYQ029539; Fri, 23 May 2003 04:44:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (mta5.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NAifYQ029523 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 04:44:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.124.37.167]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HFC00GOY5M3JV@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 03:39:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 03:33:47 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-reply-to: X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030523033153.05184170@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Well, at least young people who have to wear school uniform are spared the >worry of deciding what to wear to school and competing as to who is the >most fashionable! Not true. The fashion victims, and fashion snobs, do it all with accessories, brand names, etc. All uniforms really do is add expense. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 06:53:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NArpHP030444 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:53:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NAtbUw010909 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 04:55:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NAtab2004337; Fri, 23 May 2003 04:55:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from decna.com (IDENT:8bioqRNAFsjXJHw4ntea9Qhs9UsVpOru@decna.com [64.28.25.12]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NAtXb2004318 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 04:55:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (ingridgs@localhost) by decna.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NB8D607972 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:08:13 +0200 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:08:12 +0200 (CEST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ingrid_G=2E_Storr=F8?= X-X-Sender: ingridgs@decna.com To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] skirt length In-Reply-To: <1d4.a2b2162.2bfee38f@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 22 May 2003 AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 5/22/2003 9:34:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > mooncat@in-tch.com writes: > > I think Sue meant "was it common for little girls to wear bell-shaped > > skirts?" > > Sure...if the CUT and UNDERPINNINGS make a bell shaped skirt....which they DO > NOT in the period of the fashion plate. It is a dome shaped or more conical > shape, because of the straight pieces over a hoop, not a bell shape, which is > achieved by cutting gores and butting them over a shaped petticoat. I think you're all talking past each other here, because you're both using the word "bell-shaped" to describe two different looks. :) If I read Sue's question correctly, she's wondering if it was common for little girls to wear skirts with the same underpinnings as adults, only shorter, so that girls' skirts also stood out from the body like we see in the picture mentioned. Now I'm intrigued too; does anyone know if this was usual or just a fashion plate exaggeration? It seems to me to have enormous potential for, um, flashing. But that may not have been a consideration where little girls are concerned? :) Ingrid _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 07:53:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBrVHP030606 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:53:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBtFUw014016 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 05:55:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBtDZE028990; Fri, 23 May 2003 05:55:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41508.mail.yahoo.com (web41508.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NBtBZE028944 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 05:55:11 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523115506.42215.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41508.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:55:06 BST Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 12:55:06 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030523033153.05184170@mail.frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > >Well, at least young people who have to wear school uniform are spared the > >worry of deciding what to wear to school and competing as to who is the > >most fashionable! > > Not true. The fashion victims, and fashion snobs, do it all with > accessories, brand names, etc. All uniforms really do is add expense. Yep, Kayta's right. I heard from pupils and parents here that they still get picked on just as much, because on the shoe brands it can be seen, and also if the uniform is always brand new, etc etc. All it does in my (never humble *LOL*) opinion is possibly preventing creativity and personality from an early age on. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 07:53:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBrdHP030612 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:53:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBsBUw013898 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 05:54:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBs9b2028433; Fri, 23 May 2003 05:54:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20710.mail.yahoo.com (web20710.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.183]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NBs7b2028415 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 05:54:07 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523115406.44513.qmail@web20710.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [198.164.201.81] by web20710.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:54:06 EDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 07:54:06 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: Re: [h-cost] pearls and dry cleaning To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <200305222337.h4MNbpdg012073@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Pretty good analogy. remember that perfumes too are particularly evil when in cotact with pearls. sewinggoddess@att.net wrote:Remember the scene in Wizard of Oz when the Wicked Witch of the West melts away under a bucket of water? Very similar. You probably won't get a single pearl back on your dress. Crissy > Angela wrote: > > > Next wedding dress-related question for you folks: > > what happens to freshwater pearls when you send them > > through the drycleaner? > > They die. Seriously, pearls are extremely sensitive to chemicals, > starting with those found in human sweat and working up from there. > Dry cleaning is not a good idea, even once. > > best wishes > Stevie > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 07:54:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBsDHP030616 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:54:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBtxUw014065 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 05:56:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NBtxZE029374; Fri, 23 May 2003 05:55:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41510.mail.yahoo.com (web41510.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.93]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NBtuZE029290 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 05:55:56 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523115550.92434.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41510.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:55:50 BST Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 12:55:50 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <001101c3210c$2eb5dae0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > Nicole, > > Only private schools and a few public schools have uniforms. No, no, not in England. You mean the US? Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 08:06:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NC62HP030658 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:06:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NC4rUw014730 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 06:04:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NC4pZE003562; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:04:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20709.mail.yahoo.com (web20709.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.182]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NC4mZE003536 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:04:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523120448.49600.qmail@web20709.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [198.164.201.81] by web20709.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:04:48 EDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 08:04:48 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030523115506.42215.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I agree that the school uniform does not make the kids equal. I know of some private schools who have had to make policies to ban certain types of footwear because of this very problem. Kids were wearing different styles of a certain brand to differentiate between the different groups in the schools. This is the life of 13 year olds in the upper middle class in Canadian cities.It is not a new phenomenon, this has been going on for at least 10 years in the case that I am familiar with. Kipar wrote:--- Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > >Well, at least young people who have to wear school uniform are spared the > >worry of deciding what to wear to school and competing as to who is the > >most fashionable! > > Not true. The fashion victims, and fashion snobs, do it all with > accessories, brand names, etc. All uniforms really do is add expense. Yep, Kayta's right. I heard from pupils and parents here that they still get picked on just as much, because on the shoe brands it can be seen, and also if the uniform is always brand new, etc etc. All it does in my (never humble *LOL*) opinion is possibly preventing creativity and personality from an early age on. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 08:17:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCHWHP030688 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:17:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCJHUw015632 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 06:19:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCJGZE010028; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:19:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from decna.com (IDENT:5ySPjt5n9Yy40Z+jgGoMEf+60iQIQKVw@decna.com [64.28.25.12]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCJCZE010001 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:19:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (ingridgs@localhost) by decna.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NCVsQ11368 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:31:54 +0200 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 14:31:54 +0200 (CEST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ingrid_G=2E_Storr=F8?= X-X-Sender: ingridgs@decna.com To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Indigo dyeing In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515103403.02c4cd10@127.0.0.1> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 15 May 2003, Kimiko Small wrote: > I wish I could answer your other questions, but I have yet to actually work > with this dye myself. I did however sit with a lady at Valhalla faire years > ago who was dying with indigo, and using her hands to work the stuff. It > stank, quite a bit from my recall, but it was fascinating to watch her work > with it, and seeing things go blue when it touched air. Magical in a way. Yes, it sounds really cool! :D I've never worked with it or even been near it, though. Does it stink so bad that I shoud keep it far away from the rest of the camp? How far would you estimate? > Sorry I couldn't be more help. Have you tried a dyers list? D'oh, good idea! Somehow I just defaulted to h-cost since it is the list I follow most closely. Thanks for the pointer. :) Ingrid _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 08:21:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCLjHP030699 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:21:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCLmUw015829 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 06:21:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCLkZE011347; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:21:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from decna.com (IDENT:Vxf0f/s7N7NbMzxEuh+GGMom3rYzjRYd@decna.com [64.28.25.12]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCLhZE011299 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:21:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (ingridgs@localhost) by decna.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4NCYOC11446 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:34:24 +0200 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 14:34:24 +0200 (CEST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ingrid_G=2E_Storr=F8?= X-X-Sender: ingridgs@decna.com To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Indigo dyeing In-Reply-To: <3EC46DB8.E64D7EF9@in-tch.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 15 May 2003, Sue Clemenger wrote: > You can buy pre-prepared indigo. We played with it some, last summer. > No need to wait for a week or anything. Hi, Sue! How is the pre-prepared indigo different from "normal" indigo? Are there any places online that sell this and ship to Europe, do you know? Ingrid _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 08:22:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCMXHP030704 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:22:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCN3Uw015954 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 06:23:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCN2ZE011935; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:23:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCMwZE011891 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:22:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4NCMvp21294.; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:22:57 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:22:57 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:22:51 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4NCMwZE011891 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO All right, all right! I stand corrected. Things must have changed since my schooldays in the 60s. I didn't have an easy time at school, being shy, but I don't remember any rivalries over clothing or footwear. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> nicolas_fouquet@yahoo.com 05/23/03 12:55pm >>> --- Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > >Well, at least young people who have to wear school uniform are spared the > >worry of deciding what to wear to school and competing as to who is the > >most fashionable! > > Not true. The fashion victims, and fashion snobs, do it all with > accessories, brand names, etc. All uniforms really do is add expense. Yep, Kayta's right. I heard from pupils and parents here that they still get picked on just as much, because on the shoe brands it can be seen, and also if the uniform is always brand new, etc etc. All it does in my (never humble *LOL*) opinion is possibly preventing creativity and personality from an early age on. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information on a proactive email security service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.messagelabs.com ________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 08:24:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCOdHP030712 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:24:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCQOUw016277 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 06:26:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NCQMZE013650; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:26:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20709.mail.yahoo.com (web20709.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.182]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NCQKZE013623 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:26:20 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523122620.58018.qmail@web20709.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [198.164.201.81] by web20709.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:26:20 EDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 08:26:20 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have to admit that it has been so warm in my office lately that I have been tempted to wear linen t-tunics to work. Although technically I would be working in early period underwear, who at work would know? to the world it is just a white linen dress, no? cheers, liz Jennifer Sena wrote: none of us are what we seem. *seam*? > >***** > >>I really like the idea that Heather brought up. Adapting historical >garment designs into the daily modern wardrobe. It sounds like such a fun >thing to do. >More "costumes" to create!!! >more silly thoughts... >:) jessica When I was 14 or 15 there was a pattern that looked very Edwardian to me. Jacket style top with Leg o'mutton sleeves and tucks along the bottom third of the calf to ankle length skirt. I made it in a narrow wale corduroy(sp?) of wedgewood blue and wore it til it died. Recently I came across a picture of me in the brownies(age7 or so)in a Costume performing in the park. It was a Marie Antoinette look in the pic. I guess I've been into costumes forever!! I do like to make historical styles for modern wear. Afterall, anything that was possible up to my time is still acceptable as my period. :) !! Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 09:30:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDUKHP030891 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 09:30:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDKpUw020762 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 07:20:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDKneM010350; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:20:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20209.mail.yahoo.com (web20209.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.64]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NDKkeM010328 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:20:46 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523132045.23858.qmail@web20209.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [168.103.60.157] by web20209.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:20:45 PDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 06:20:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Kovatch Subject: Re: [h-cost] pearls and dry cleaning To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030523115406.44513.qmail@web20710.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Okay, so I'll only use the pearls in easily-removed strands, and I won't bead accents on the embroidery sections. Probably won't have time for that, anyway. Thanks for saving me a bad experience. -Angela --- liz haines wrote: > Pretty good analogy. remember that perfumes too are > particularly evil when in cotact with pearls. > > sewinggoddess@att.net wrote:Remember the scene in > Wizard of Oz when the Wicked Witch of the West melts > away > under a bucket of water? Very similar. You probably > won't get a single pearl > back on your dress. > > Crissy > > Angela wrote: > > > > > Next wedding dress-related question for you > folks: > > > what happens to freshwater pearls when you send > them > > > through the drycleaner? > > > > They die. Seriously, pearls are extremely > sensitive to chemicals, > > starting with those found in human sweat and > working up from there. > > Dry cleaning is not a good idea, even once. > > > > best wishes > > Stevie > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > --------------------------------- > Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 09:48:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDmSHP030948 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 09:48:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDoBUw022673 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 07:50:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDo9eM024221; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:50:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from protactinium.btinternet.com (protactinium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.176]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDo6eM024187 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:50:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host217-36-18-251.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.36.18.251] helo=dan) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19JCvt-0006Um-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:50:05 +0100 Message-ID: <006401c32132$2e5e01a0$fb1224d9@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 14:49:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin wrote: > > On Thu, 22 May 2003, Stevie Gamble wrote: > > > You don't know that the text in question actually said that in 1607. > > Northward Ho is usually dated around 1605, so I'm guessing that the > > text referred to in the OED was published in 1607 but I haven't read > > it and corrupt texts and indeed, lost texts are a commonplace of the > > period. I must declare a special interest here; my supervisor, Martin > > Wiggins, is a Webster specialist, and is also presently compliling a > > database of all plays written during the period. Quite a few of them > > are known only by their title, others only by a reference in another > > play or text. > > In this case, though, there's obviously more than just title existing. So, > since I'll be off soon to find a library edition, can you ask your > supervisor whether there's a particular modern edition of Northward Hoe > that he considers more reliable than others? (For that matter, I need > Westward hoe, too, if he has any recommendations. And Michaelmas Term and > Women Beware Women.) Um, once he emerges from the delights of Finals I'll try; he's rather busy at the moment. But as far as I know there are no modern editions of Northward Ho in print, much less good ones... > Frankly, even if the text was cobbled together from actors' imperfect > memories for a printing a couple years after the play's performance -- > which I know was done in some cases of plays now considered "corrupt" for > purposes of studying an author's work -- such an edition, if from the > 1600-1620 period, would be sufficient for our purposes of establishing the > use of the term in the period. That is, someone from the period in > question would have come up with the phrase, even if it wasn't Webster > himself. What I worry about is what an editor in 1680 or 1750 or 1840 or > 1950 might have done to clean up an incomplete or incomprehensible text. Ok, I haven't got my explanation across here, so I'll try again. Even if we inhabit a fantasy world in which Webster and Dekker (who co-wrote Northward Hoe) created perfectly accurate and legible texts which were then delivered to perfect compositors, who created a perfectly accurate printed text, you could still not assume that "A short dutch wast with a round cathern-wheele fardingale" was a factual description in use at the time. Dekker was fascinated by Dutch culture, and there are large numbers of references to it in his works, so Dutch wasts are fine. But he was also fascinated by religion. It may be going a bit far to describe him as being in the vanguard of militant Protestantism, as some have argued, but he wrote 'The Whore of Babylon' in 1606, which gives you a good idea of his sentiments on the subject around the time he was co-writing NH. 'cathern-wheele' is, of course, a reference to St Catherine, tortured on her wheel, and Dekker was not into Saints. Nor was he into witchcraft, which he didn't believe existed, and he and others following Reginald Scot's Discoverie of Witchcraft (1584) attributed the belief in witchcraft to superstition promulgated by the Roman Catholic religion. He was most certainly not into withcraft trials, and and one of the most notorious featured a young girl yearning for a fardingale... So even in the highly improbable event of the text not being altered or glossed by later editors you still cannot treat it as a simple descriptive reference to a clothing style. Nothing involving religion is ever simple... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 09:56:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDu1HP030980 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 09:56:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDvdUw023288 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 07:57:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDvbVX028014; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:57:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NDvWVX027959 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 07:57:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-003-019.jps.net ([216.119.3.19] helo=pavilion) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JD35-0004AY-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 06:57:31 -0700 Message-ID: <002601c32135$309ec280$130377d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030523075131.4547.qmail@web41505.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 07:11:20 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole wrote: Yes I chose my environments according to > the amount of freedom I need, but from all the mails I read and remembering > things I read and saw about the USA, I really do feel sorry for you lot. I > don't want to sound nasty, coz I don't mean it nasty, but it seems that there > really is no freedom of personal expression and development and all of that in > America. You either fit in, or the so-called land of the free is not free at > all. Poor you!!!! > > Is it just that YOU lot have all those experiences of having to fit in that > strongly, or is it really like that??? > > How do you lot cope with these restrictions? > Your original comment was correct Nicole, confidence makes all the difference about what you can wear and what you can't. The "self-improvement" movement here is huge, and although it has its positive aspects, its used also to make people feel bad for being who they are so they have to spend money to become better, including buying the right clothes. For those with confidence this is a land of great freedom, but if you're insecure its rough. On the other hand, there are oodles of sub cultures here, so even though there is often pressure to "get the look", you have a largre number of looks to choose from so you can get support from at least one sub culture even though the rest of the community might not be pleased. Also, you can wear what you want and ignore snide comments or bad service, also, many people don't care one way or another. The homeless look has no support though, so I would feel sorry for Katya on that one. President Bush's comment about John Walker Linde, the "American Taliban" was that his punishment should be that he would have to live in America looking like he did. He had a homeless look, it's a fate worse than the electric chair. I watched "Bend it Like Beckham" (beautiful saris!!!! and exotic women!!!) not long ago and laughed at the line where the young Indian women stated that at least the Indian males weren't wearing polyester pants anymore. That is so true. My ex-husband wore polyester pants thinking it was a nice look, uuuhhhggggg.........eventually he fell in love with Levi's 501's but he thought it was lower class to wear them and coming from an upper class society he didn't want to dress down. Unfortunately it didn't translate that way here in America. Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 10:16:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NEGPHP031094 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:16:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NEI8Uw025103 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 08:18:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NEI7VX009723; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:18:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NEI1VX009671 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 08:18:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA00814 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 09:39:09 -0500 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 09:39:09 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: <006401c32132$2e5e01a0$fb1224d9@dan> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Fri, 23 May 2003, Stevie Gamble wrote: > Um, once he emerges from the delights of Finals I'll try; he's rather > busy at the moment. But as far as I know there are no modern editions > of Northward Ho in print, much less good ones... Usually I find this sort of thing in a library edition from the late 19th or early 20th century. That may be my only choice, but if he has a recommendation, I'm all ears. Interestingly, the texts of some of these plays have been webbed by academics, for accessibility (though, last time I checked, not the ones I'm looking for). > Ok, I haven't got my explanation across here, so I'll try again. Even > if we inhabit a fantasy world in which Webster and Dekker (who > co-wrote Northward Hoe) created perfectly accurate and legible texts > which were then delivered to perfect compositors, who created a > perfectly accurate printed text, you could still not assume that > > "A short dutch wast with a round cathern-wheele fardingale" > > was a factual description in use at the time. ... So even in the > highly improbable event of the text not being altered or glossed by > later editors you still cannot treat it as a simple descriptive > reference to a clothing style. OK, since I obviously haven't gotten my point across either, I'll try again. I've got a paper in edit stage in which (among other things) I track references of the uses of certain terms for farthingale shape. Till now, the earliest use I had of anything resembling the a comparison of a farthingale to a "wheel," using that word, was 1617, and the first use of the actual phrase "wheel farthingale" was 1664 (in a play, in a passage describing long-past fashions). Now, this reference to Webster's 1607 play allows me to back up my "earliest use of the term" statement, and also is the first reference I've seen that uses "Catherine-wheel" in conjunction with a description of a farthingale. I'm not suggesting that everyone at the time was calling it that. What this does show us, though, is that at least one person (the playwright) made that visual connection, and used that phrase. He may have invented it, it may never have been used again, and it may have nothing to do with what was actually under the skirt, but the point is, the combination of words did appear, and that's what I'm trying to track down. Yes, it's likely that the playwright intended there to be implications in his exact wording choice, but if the conversation is a discussion of dress in a tailor's shop (which seems likely from what little I know of the quote now), there's a good chance it's meant to be a term that would have some recognizable meaning as a costume description for the audience -- that is, even if the audience hadn't heard this particular term, even if it was an invention of the playwright, they would be able to recognize the style being discussed ("oh, yeah, that would be one of those farthingales shaped like a circle all around, with the pleats on top that look like spokes"). The chances of it being a known term would be less the case if the setting were a preacher denouncing fashions, in which case it would more likely be a colorful description unique to that speaker. I'm no stranger to lit crit (I have a degree in English), and anyone who's heard me talk long enough knows I'm the first to point out the importance of seeing art and literature references to dress in terms of the layers of cultural and symbolic meanings -- especially in literature, where the very decision to describe someone's dress more often than not has rhetorical significance and so the description is therefore likely to be *non*-typical. People also know I warn against taking terms that are likely to be unique or "loaded" (say, from sermons) as face-value costume terms (don't get me started on "gates of hell"). That's why my first concern on this quote was to find out who was speaking and in what context, and why I want to find a good edition of the text. The context of a tailor's description of a dress style is much more likely to have a resemblance to actual dress styles than a lover's description of his lady, or a woman's description of her rival, or anyone's description of a queen. But my primary purpose here was to track references in which someone -- anyone, including a playwright -- thought to use the word "wheel" to describe a farthingale. And in this case, I think that's pretty clearly happened. Interpreting it is another matter, and one that I do address in the paper. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 12:14:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NGELHP031389 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:14:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NGCPUw007107 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 10:12:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NGCNKf023008; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:12:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80405.mail.yahoo.com (web80405.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.60]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NGCIKf022898 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:12:18 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523161212.97186.qmail@web80405.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80405.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 09:12:12 PDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 09:12:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Simplicity 5724 found original fashion plate victoriandress To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <24.3ebbb9da.2bfee279@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > Later, during recontruction....in the scene where > Ashley returns, Melanie who > fled from Atlanta in her bed clothes having just had > a baby, is wearing > Carreen's short skirt with a piece of fabric sewn to > the bottom to make it long. > What a great detail! I suspect that that tiny detail was the clever idea of someone working in the MGM costume shop (Walter Plunkett, while a great designer, is not particularly known for his historic costuming), and it appears onscreen because Olivia de Haviland is known for being a "costumer's actress"; someone who will adapt the movements of her character and part to display a costume to its best advantage. Oh, that more actors did that. It would make our lives a little easier. 8-) Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 12:38:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NGcsHP031431 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:38:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NGeGUw009933 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 10:40:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NGdxKf011602; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:40:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r03.mx.aol.com (imo-r03.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NGdhKf011260 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:39:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Cheryldee@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.47.2e25e87f (4552) for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:39:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Cheryldee@aol.com Message-ID: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 12:39:25 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10634 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have really enjoyed this thread and have related in many ways to the many observations about being judged by what we wear. My father was a construction worker with a 4th grade education. I spent my childhood living in trailer parks. This was in California during the '60's on the Central Coast. Need I tell you how painful middle school and high school was for me? I wanted so desperate to be accepted and maybe have just one friend, but I was the butt of many jokes especially by the "popular girls", so no one had enough courage to get to know me. They were terrified that they would be ostracized as well. My clothes came from Sears or Penny's. The only place acceptable to buy clothes in San Luis Obispo was the "Smarte Shoppe" (really) and Riley's department store. Neither of these stores were in my family's price range. I remember thinking along about the 8th grade that I would probably spend the rest of my life as a social pariah, never marry, have children, etc. Those things were for normal people. This was California in the 60's. My parents weren't wonderfully supportive so I didn't get the message at home that it was OK to be different. If I hadn't discovered theatre in high school, I may have continued on this sad path. In my high school, all of the disenfranchised students gravitated into the the theatre program. We were all odd or different for various reasons and made a wonderful eclectic community. It's probably no surprise that I have continued in theatre as a costume designer. What else do costume designers do that tell the audience who the people are onstage that they're watching? Age, profession, personality, nationality, social status, etc. It's really a lot of fun to "try on" each character as I design and create the appropriate costume for them. I worked for several years in Los Angeles as a free-lance designer and found the dress requirements to be as stringent as they were in middle school. To stay employed in L. A. in the entertainment industry (this was in the '70's) required that you wear the right clothes, drive the right car, live in the right neighborhood, eat at the right restaurants, attend the right parties, ad nauseum in order to secure employment. At least this was my experience. And I never got it right. I always felt like the trailer girl. My gay roommate, who was a social butterfly got work all of the time. Again, I found myself trying to be something I wasn't. I wound up in Santa Fe, NM. I now wear whatever I want and no one seems to notice. I teach and design at a small liberal art college and am loving every single day being myself. I wear comfortable clothes most of the time (because most of the time I'm covered with thread) and save the dress-up for opening night. My colleagues don't seem to make judgment about the way I dress, although I know this is not always the case in the academic setting. Maybe it's something that comes with maturity, the self-acceptance thing. I envy those who figured it out at a young age. I feel comfortable as me. This hasn't always been the case. I have a costume design student who comes to class wearing Elizabethan one day, faerie wings and purple hair the next. She's totally happy with her image. And a joy to be around, not to mention a visual feast. Maybe things are easier than they used to be or maybe she had wonderful parents who let her know very clearly how wonderful it was to be different than anyone else. And the folks from my high school? The popular girls married the football players and settled down in San Luis Obispo and raised families. I hear from one of them every few years wanting an update on my life for some sort of reunion publication. I really don't care. The kids that dressed different, didn't fit in for whatever reason became lawyers, doctors, heads of corporations, peace corps workers, college professors and myriad other very interesting things. Just a few more thoughts in an interesting thread. Cheryl, College of Santa Fe _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 13:04:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NH44HP031496 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:04:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NH5iUw012940 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 11:05:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NH5gFf029537; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:05:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80411.mail.yahoo.com (web80411.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.66]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NH5bFf029376 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:05:37 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523170531.65293.qmail@web80411.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80411.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:05:31 PDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:05:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <007d01c320f3$2ca294a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny-- LOL! Some husbands (mine in particular), also forget to pass along dress information. I've learned to call people if I don't have a clue from the invitation, just to double-check. Dawn --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > The funniest thing happened tonight... > > My son and I were going to his theater > banquet/awards. Last year it was a > picnic. This year was a mystery dinner playhouse. > I asked my son what was > dress style for the night. He said black > something... he really wasn't > sure. > > I asked "Black Tie." > > He said, "I guess. I am wearing my black suit, > shirt and tie." His > nickname at school is "the man in black." He wears > black all the time > because techies at not to be seen in the theater... > where he is every day. > > So I wore a maroon dressy pants ensemble with > colorful masks on it. I > thought it would be nice with a theater theme. I > walked in the banquet hall > door, and his teacher said, "Looks like Pat forgot > to tell you that this is > a black and white banquet." > > We were some of the first people to arrive. I sat > at the table waiting for > someone to come in wearing something besides black > and white. I couldn't > help but think of this thread on h-costume. As more > people came in.... > Yea!!!! About 10 other people came into the banquet > hall wearing colors!!!! > Seems I don't have the only child who doesn't > understand dressing for the > occasion. > > When the waiter/actor was serving the meals to our > table, the actor said, "I > will remember you as the colorful one!" When the > next act of the play > started, guess who the actors decided to interact > with... the colorful > people in the room. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com > Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 13:07:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NH7wHP031512 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:07:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NH8FUw013205 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 11:08:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NH8EFf001423; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:08:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web20702.mail.yahoo.com (web20702.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.175]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NH8BFf001391 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:08:11 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523170810.334.qmail@web20702.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [142.166.244.110] by web20702.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:08:10 EDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:08:10 -0400 (EDT) From: liz haines Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO bravo! i too have a friend(Former student) who has great self image. She wears prom dresses to the video store--if that is her mood that day.she is a fashion design student and a fantastic person to be around. I wish I had had her confidence at her age. Of course it is not unlike me to head to the beer store in medieval garb/ armour if needs be at an event. Strikes some strange looks in New Brunswick let me tell you. liz Cheryldee@aol.com wrote: I have really enjoyed this thread and have related in many ways to the many observations about being judged by what we wear. My father was a construction worker with a 4th grade education. I spent my childhood living in trailer parks. This was in California during the '60's on the Central Coast. Need I tell you how painful middle school and high school was for me? I wanted so desperate to be accepted and maybe have just one friend, but I was the butt of many jokes especially by the "popular girls", so no one had enough courage to get to know me. They were terrified that they would be ostracized as well. My clothes came from Sears or Penny's. The only place acceptable to buy clothes in San Luis Obispo was the "Smarte Shoppe" (really) and Riley's department store. Neither of these stores were in my family's price range. I remember thinking along about the 8th grade that I would probably spend the rest of my life as a social pariah, never marry, have children, etc. Those things were for normal people. This was California in the 60's. My parents weren't wonderfully supportive so I didn't get the message at home that it was OK to be different. If I hadn't discovered theatre in high school, I may have continued on this sad path. In my high school, all of the disenfranchised students gravitated into the the theatre program. We were all odd or different for various reasons and made a wonderful eclectic community. It's probably no surprise that I have continued in theatre as a costume designer. What else do costume designers do that tell the audience who the people are onstage that they're watching? Age, profession, personality, nationality, social status, etc. It's really a lot of fun to "try on" each character as I design and create the appropriate costume for them. I worked for several years in Los Angeles as a free-lance designer and found the dress requirements to be as stringent as they were in middle school. To stay employed in L. A. in the entertainment industry (this was in the '70's) required that you wear the right clothes, drive the right car, live in the right neighborhood, eat at the right restaurants, attend the right parties, ad nauseum in order to secure employment. At least this was my experience. And I never got it right. I always felt like the trailer girl. My gay roommate, who was a social butterfly got work all of the time. Again, I found myself trying to be something I wasn't. I wound up in Santa Fe, NM. I now wear whatever I want and no one seems to notice. I teach and design at a small liberal art college and am loving every single day being myself. I wear comfortable clothes most of the time (because most of the time I'm covered with thread) and save the dress-up for opening night. My colleagues don't seem to make judgment about the way I dress, although I know this is not always the case in the academic setting. Maybe it's something that comes with maturity, the self-acceptance thing. I envy those who figured it out at a young age. I feel comfortable as me. This hasn't always been the case. I have a costume design student who comes to class wearing Elizabethan one day, faerie wings and purple hair the next. She's totally happy with her image. And a joy to be around, not to mention a visual feast. Maybe things are easier than they used to be or maybe she had wonderful parents who let her know very clearly how wonderful it was to be different than anyone else. And the folks from my high school? The popular girls married the football players and settled down in San Luis Obispo and raised families. I hear from one of them every few years wanting an update on my life for some sort of reunion publication. I really don't care. The kids that dressed different, didn't fit in for whatever reason became lawyers, doctors, heads of corporations, peace corps workers, college professors and myriad other very interesting things. Just a few more thoughts in an interesting thread. Cheryl, College of Santa Fe _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 13:25:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHPuHP031556 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:25:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHRaUw015266 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 11:27:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHRZFf015040; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:27:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHRWFf014972 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:27:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.1dc.a33dc0e (17526) for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:27:14 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1dc.a33dc0e.2bffb3f1@aol.com> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:27:13 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] skirt length To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/23/2003 6:56:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time, ingridgs@techarea.net writes: > Now I'm intrigued too; does anyone know if > this was usual or just a fashion plate exaggeration? It seems to me to > have enormous potential for, um, flashing. But that may not have been a > consideration where little girls are concerned? :) > It IS usual....probably more for wealthy people or if the children are at some public function. Flashing is not a problem with pantalets that come almost to the ankle....and can be seen anyway. I mean women wore hoops when mountain climbing too. [you've seen that famous photo, right?] Why not put 'em on little girls? It is my guess that however, at home, doing chores, many women left the hoops off....though this creates a hem problem so.....they probably had outfits just for those day when they "didn't get dressed". I'm sure children had outfits to "play" in and outfits to "be seen" in as well. But short hoops and bustles on little girls is not unusual. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 13:27:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHRfHP031566 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:27:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHTQUw015470 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 11:29:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHTOFf016359; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:29:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHTIFf016254 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:29:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.154] (pm5-154.eos.net [205.133.149.154]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA03557 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:29:16 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:24:12 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305221800.h4MI0gb5026053@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: st. catherine's wheel farthingale X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Besides Stevie's excellent comment that later editions of plays may have been "corrected," everyone should also read the complete original MS, not just the paragraph or speech quoted, to see the context. For instance, in this case the character may have been a stupid person who always got terms wrong, or a satirical sort trying to make a point about women's clothes by calling them something funny. Looking at the passage, that's my first guess. St. Catherine, remember, was tortured on a wheel. It wasn't supposed to be pretty! So was the speaker calling the farthingale a torture device? Was he mocking women for wearing something extra big and round? In either case, it would be a figure of speech, and not an actual name for an accessory. Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 13:31:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHVBHP031589 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:31:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHVeUw015773 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 11:31:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHVeFf018045; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:31:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHVSFf017922 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:31:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19JGO7-000Jak-0W; Fri, 23 May 2003 18:31:27 +0100 Message-ID: <8Ao5GvFStUz+IwmS@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 23:12:34 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon References: <3EC9B3CC.6030107@earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <3EC9B3CC.6030107@earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) cc: h-needlework list X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I don't know of any sources that actually compare the two. I'm not sure if you can really say Saxon style continues to exist in England after the Conquest, so you're either looking for sources from England and Normandy pre-1066, or England in different periods. Look for books on Romanesque art and architecture (Romanesque is usually used as the term for the decorative style, rather than Norman) In clothing terms, the most distinctive thing is that the Normans, certainly post-Conquest, use very little decoration. A lot of the clothes are plain, no decorative edgings, although kings do get some fabulous embroidered and jewelled facings. Very little jewellery too - the Normans seem to have completely left behind that Viking love of adornment. Another basic distinction - Saxon tunics tend to be skirted, Norman ones are split front and back because they ride a lot more. And, as Sue says, the Norman is in charge. How many Normans does it take to change an oil lamp? None, that's a job for Saxons :-) Jean Charlene Charette wrote >I'm looking for information on what differentiates a Norman from a >Saxon. I'm especially interested in clothing and decorative arts. Can >anyone recommend any sources? > >Thanks, >--Charlene > -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 13:31:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHVYHP031592 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:31:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHW7Uw015826 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 11:32:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHW6Ff018314; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:32:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHVSFf017919 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:31:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19JGO7-000Jai-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 18:31:27 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:59:46 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: [h-cost]Other people's opinion WAS New Costume Interest References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny Ladnier wrote >I often wonder why individuals care what people worry about what others >think about what you wear. Those of you who do care please shed some light. >I am interested in knowing as a dresser. Dress is a reflection of your >personality and mood. Some people dress conservative, some casual, some >artsy, some innovative. Sometimes when your life changes, your fashion >taste or style changes. When you go fashion shopping, take a very honest >friend with you. > >Kim and our interns have been discussing a change in her style. She has had >a change in her lifestyle to a new mother. It has been really fun with all >the different suggestions from everyone. Generally, when someone is not >happy with their fashion style, it is because of a change in their life. > >You need to make yourself happy first and forget everyone else. If you are >happy with your style, you really won't care what everyone else thinks. > "Dress is a reflection of your personality and mood". Exactly. So people make judgements about you based on your appearance, before they get the chance to speak to you. Obviously, if you get into conversation with someone maybe you can change that judgement, but you don't always get that opportunity, or you are starting from a disadvantage. At work, going to meetings etc, that's particularly important, and I work in a very conservative sector. And with regard to ethnic clothing, even just around town, I don't want to offend people or make them feel uncomfortable - I want admiring glances, not disapproving ones. Jean -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 13:38:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHcRHP031607 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:38:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHcXUw016591 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 11:38:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHcUFf022643; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:38:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80410.mail.yahoo.com (web80410.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NHcQFf022485 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:38:27 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523173821.43838.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80410.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:38:21 PDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:38:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030523075131.4547.qmail@web41505.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole-- Boy, Germany must have changed a bunch in the past 40 years! A friend of mine went to elementary school in Darmstadt, and wore uniforms. It's really not as bad as it sounds from the e-mails. ;-) If you go to London, Paris, or Berlin, and see what most people working at regular "white collar" jobs are wearing, and then go to New York, San Francisco, Los Angeles, or another large city and see what those people are wearing, it's pretty-much similar throughout the world. And actually, uniforms are pretty nice, especially if it's something you can enjoy wearing. It saves having to try to figure out what to wear every morning. ;-) Dawn --- N Kipar wrote: > *huge snippage* > > > Sorry for this turning into a long rant. I deal > with > > this every day (clothes: the ultimate costume), > and I > > have strong opinions on the matter. > > > > Dawn > > I do have to say that I feel very sorry for you > Americans (and the English too, > those school uniforms I find appalling). The German > world I grew up in let me > wear what I wanted, as long as I was good in school > and I certainly was, same > with University, I went in swathed in a black and > gold sari or big costumes, > and never had a problem in any exams. Yes I chose my > environments according to > the amount of freedom I need, but from all the mails > I read and remembering > things I read and saw about the USA, I really do > feel sorry for you lot. I > don't want to sound nasty, coz I don't mean it > nasty, but it seems that there > really is no freedom of personal expression and > development and all of that in > America. You either fit in, or the so-called land of > the free is not free at > all. Poor you!!!! > > Is it just that YOU lot have all those experiences > of having to fit in that > strongly, or is it really like that??? > > How do you lot cope with these restrictions? > > Nicole - really not meaning the above nasty at all > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die > deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not > be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ > J.R.R. Tolkien > > Email: nicole@kipar.org > URL: http://www.kipar.org > > __________________________________________________ > It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. > Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at > http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 13:59:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHw1HP031665 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:59:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHxaUw019020 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 11:59:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NHxZQH008769; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:59:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41104.mail.yahoo.com (web41104.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NHxUQH008577 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:59:30 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030523175923.64617.qmail@web41104.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [146.145.104.203] by web41104.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 10:59:23 PDT Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:59:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Stacey To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Sarah, Your post: My biggest peeve is getting called into the boss' office because you wore something "inappropriate" the first day of the job, after everyone failed to go over that part of the company policy *before* starting work, therefore setting you up for failure from day one. rang so true to me! I remember freelancing at an African-American oriented business magazine (and here I am, with a complexion that would make David Duke lust over) and being told by my agency that their dress code was "business casual." So, I show up in chinos and a button down shirt and find out it's business formal, even in the art department. Not only that, but there no "Afro-centric" styles were allowed: no dreadlocks or cornrows, no matter how neat, no African fabrics. I found out later that the founder was impressed with some of Malcom X's ethics, i.e.: if you want to get respect, you have to look respectible. As much as I love to just be a schlep every day, I still tend to be neat even at my most casual jobs. I just miss working in Manhattan where I can show off a little - working out in the 'burbs gives me a "why bother" mood. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 14:22:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NIMLHP031763 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:22:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NIO1Uw022300 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 12:24:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NINxQH027361; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:23:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NINqQH027266 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:23:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 30126 invoked from network); 23 May 2003 18:23:51 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 23 May 2003 18:23:51 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-58.sonic.net [209.148.115.58]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4NINoB25790 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:23:50 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523111817.00ab7d50@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 11:25:15 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030523001333.00dfcac0@mail.frys.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522220351.00ac7a48@pop.sonic.net> <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > But I play costume games much better than I play social games, the rules > of which always change, always mystify me, and always seem pretty > stupid. And, unlike you, my parents were part of the problem, not part > of the solution. I feel exactly the same way about social games. On the other hand, there is seldom any need to play them. Women, in particular, tend to make things much more complicated than they really are. I just use the straightforward approach, and say what I want to directly. As for looking homeless--I've never met you but I still feel you don't need to worry about being mistaken for a homeless person. The homeless tend to look as though they seldom wash themselves or their clothes. I'm sure this is not their fault. Having once walked into a large bus station ladies' room where a homeless woman was taking a sponge bath in the nude in full view of everyone passing by, I understand the difficulties. However, I'm sure you bathe. The homeless also tend to look very weather-beaten from being outside all the time, much more even than most people with outdoor jobs. So, you're probably OK there. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 14:41:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NIffHP031858 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:41:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NIh9Uw024465 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 12:43:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NIh3QH010968; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:43:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NIgwQH010927 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 12:42:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 4701 invoked from network); 23 May 2003 18:42:58 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 23 May 2003 18:42:58 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-58.sonic.net [209.148.115.58]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4NIgvB11626 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 11:42:57 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523112622.02bd0e88@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 11:44:25 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <20030523075131.4547.qmail@web41505.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030522203704.99781.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > This is largely how people perceive the world. Katya and Dawn and I all live in California, whose cities are among the most liberal and tolerant in the US. I've seen many people wear truly amazing things in San Francisco, without an eyebrow being raised. It's also like most urban areas in that people tend to mind their own business. They may not know their neighbors, but they're not trying to supervise their neighbors' lives either. I've always felt free to wear and do whatever I wanted. I've never felt any pressure to "fit in" or needed to find groups that would "support" me. The problem is, that for women appearance is a double-sided coin. The "good side," to some women, is that they believe looking a certain way will get other people to do what they want. This is not only "look beautiful and men will pay attention to you" but "wear the right clothes and everyone, even social cliques and surly salespeople, will do what you want." They think they can influence the world by how they dress, and don't want to give that up. I think a lot of this influence is imaginary. Not all, but quite a lot of it. And there are many other ways to achieve what you want. Yes, your employer probably has some sort dress code--I've never denied that they all do--although in many companies this is quite liberal. But doing a good job will usually get you further than spending lots of extra effort on your clothes. To get service from your local department store or bank, just ask for it. So, in short, I don't think the US is particularly repressive. It's just that some people see an advantage to playing clothing "games" more than is really required. Fran >I do have to say that I feel very sorry for you Americans >but from all the mails I read and remembering >things I read and saw about the USA, I really do feel sorry for you lot. I >don't want to sound nasty, coz I don't mean it nasty, but it seems that there >really is no freedom of personal expression and development and all of that in >America. You either fit in, or the so-called land of the free is not free at >all. Poor you!!!! Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 15:41:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NJfoHP032062 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:41:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NJhQUw001308 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 13:43:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NJhCME025798; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:43:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NJghME025334 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 13:42:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19JI3s-000827-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:18:40 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 19:42:30 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest References: <29.407f50f9.2bfe2cdf@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <29.407f50f9.2bfe2cdf@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At my school, we wore uniform until the last two years, when we were expected to wear reasonably smart, "office-type" clothing. They had this rule, you could wear "smart denim trousers" but not "jeans". Never did figure out the difference! Jean AnnBWass@aol.com wrote >In a message dated 5/22/2003 9:26:44 AM Eastern Daylight Time, >msberard@earthlink.net writes: > > >> Where I work, despite being a back office and *nobody* ever *seeing* us >> we can't wear denim *cloth* of any kind. >> >> > >On a recent visit to Williamsburg, I noticed that the Williamsburg Inn >includes in its rules, no denim in the dining room after 6:00. So I can't >even show up in a denim evening gown? But seriously, it's a shame that >businesses have to make such sweeping rules because some people have no >notion of appropriate dress for different occasions. I guess they figure >that just saying "no jeans" would not preclude someone from (shudder) wearing >overalls, for example. Same with your bosses, I guess. > >Ann Wass >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 16:09:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NK9BHP032109 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:09:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NK9cUw004452 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 14:09:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NK9b0n015559; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:09:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NK9Y0n015526 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:09:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A03738A0068; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:10:31 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AFFDD58008C; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:09:33 -0500 Message-ID: <008201c32167$7f60bc20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030523115550.92434.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 16:11:29 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole, Yes, I meant in the U.S. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 16:14:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NKE4HP032119 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:14:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NKFjUw005096 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 14:15:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NKFi0n020664; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:15:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NKFf0n020630 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:15:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.153] (pm5-153.eos.net [205.133.149.153]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA04851 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:15:39 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 16:09:54 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305230858.h4N8wPpH017328@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: uniforms, etc. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO We had this discussion before, and at the time I posted for the minority. I never wore a school uniform, and neither do my children. But many women I know who went to Catholic high school (recently, not in my high school days) have told me how great it was never to have to worry about what they wore to school. One told me how the senior girls never bought new skirts, no matter how short they got, because they were seniors. They had kind of a contest to see whose would be the most threadbare by the end of the year. And indeed, that high school is only a couple of blocks from where I live and in the winter one common sight is a lot of girls going in the school wearing printed flannel pajama bottoms under their short plaid skirts, to keep their legs warm until they get inside. So some people do not find it confining to their person expression, which they have plenty of outside of school. I think it must depend on the school and the population. As to Nicole's comment about how sad we all must be in America with our lack of permission to express ourselves -- HA HA HA HA HA!!!! Oh, were you serious? Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 16:42:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NKg9HP032233 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:42:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NKhmUw008808 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 14:43:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NKhi0n015062; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:43:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from gadolinium.btinternet.com (gadolinium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.111]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NKhc0n014944 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:43:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host217-36-18-251.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.36.18.251] helo=dan) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19JJO4-0007DO-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:43:36 +0100 Message-ID: <000d01c3216b$f2f0f200$fb1224d9@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: st. catherine's wheel farthingale Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:43:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Gail wrote: >everyone should also read the complete original MS, not > just the paragraph or speech quoted, to see the context. > > For instance, in this case the character may have been a stupid person who > always got terms wrong, or a satirical sort trying to make a point about > women's clothes by calling them something funny. Looking at the passage, > that's my first guess. St. Catherine, remember, was tortured on a wheel. It > wasn't supposed to be pretty! So was the speaker calling the farthingale a > torture device? Was he mocking women for wearing something extra big and > round? In either case, it would be a figure of speech, and not an actual > name for an accessory. That's absolutely brilliant! As far as I can tell the character speaking those lines is a tailor, and well placed to voice the mockery of what women will put themselves through in pursuit of fashion, or a man. Those sentiments would fit perfectly into the genre of the City sex comedies of that period. And only this afternoon my daughter told me that you have to suffer to be beautiful.... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 17:04:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NL4uHP032328 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 17:04:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NL6cUw011944 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 15:06:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NL6aGU003688; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:06:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NL6WGU003629 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:06:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD9146B0068; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:07:29 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD5718000070; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:06:31 -0500 Message-ID: <00a701c3216f$75011ec0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 17:08:27 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Cheryl, You are so lucky to be in Santa Fe... what a beautiful artsy town. I loved all the little artsy clothing stores when we were there for Costume Society's National Symposium, a few years ago. What a wonderful historic place. The folk art museum is to die for. I could have stayed in there for a year. I lived in Albuquerque for five years when my husband was in the Air Force. Such a wonderful cultural experience. I also went to University of New Mexico under the Home Ec. Ed. track. We hope to go back to the Land of Enchantment during the next year for our 25th Anniversary. I am so inspired artistically by the mountains west of Santa Fe. I would love to go back in Oct. for the balloon festival... we'll see if the $$$ appears by then. You are one lucky girl to live in such a wonderfully cultural place. As for growing up poor... I think it is a matter of how our parents approach the family income, if you think you are poor or not. We never thought we were poor... mom always said the best wealth anyone could have is the love in your family. My father had to quit school in 2nd grade and become a water boy in an electric company. Mom dropped out of school in 11th grade. It doesn't mean they weren't smart or had a wonderful adventuresome life. My husband's father dropped out of school when he was in third grade because his father died. Papa had to go to work to help support his family. This was not uncommon during the 1910-the depression. Families did what they could to survive. One thing that both our parents made as a priority was education for their children. My dad was an electrician and was handicapped in an accident at NASA shortly after I was born. Then he became a fisherman, then a farmer. My husband's father was a carpenter. Both these jobs were seasonal work... which leads to lean times. Both of our mothers were wonderful seamstresses and made all of their children's clothing. Our mothers could make the most beautiful clothes our of anything. The love that went into making these clothes was such a blessing. I always cry when I hear Dolly Parton's song, "Coat of Many Colors." Not because of the kids picking on her at school... but because of the love her mother put into making the coat for her. My mother put this kind of love into making our clothes. I think the most wonderful gift my mother ever gave to me was teaching me how to sew. I had wonderful clothes that didn't look like anyone else's. I still keep that with me today. I don't want to have clothing that looks like some one else's. I think this up-bringing that is what makes me special and what I am today. I really don't look for clothing labels. As a matter of fact, I cut them out. I do the majority of my clothing purchases at thrift stores and embellish them to make them have my own special look. The whole point of my Cyber Cinderella stories is that you can have a beautiful gown, go play with the upper class, and no one knows that you probably have the cheapest dress there. Miss America contestants have written me who have read the Cyber Cindy story and ask how can they make an inexpensive gown look wonderful. Yes, even some of these contestants don't have a lot of money to play with. Of all the ball gowns I have worn to the Balls, the one that received the most attention was the one I paid $60 for at an antique show. Even David Emanual, the fashion designer, was blown away by this gown. The dress my daughter wore to the last ball that the press was going crazy over, cost me $5 at a thrift store... I just embellished it with straps and ribbons. Wealth is a state of mind not what other people tell you. You can be wealthy in experiences, your family's love, your education (formal or informal). Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 17:08:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NL8vHP032340 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 17:08:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NLAeUw012464 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 15:10:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NLAdGU006709; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:10:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (f8.sea1.hotmail.com [207.68.163.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NLAbGU006602 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:10:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:10:32 -0700 Received: from 162.83.118.240 by sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:10:31 GMT X-Originating-IP: [162.83.118.240] X-Originating-Email: [nancy_kiel@hotmail.com] From: "Nancy Kiel" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 17:10:31 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 May 2003 21:10:32.0263 (UTC) FILETIME=[BECBF570:01C3216F] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO "400 Years of Fashion" (Victoria & Albert) says in the 1770s, pastels colours were the fashion. Revolution in Kyoto showed light shades or non-electric deeper shades. You might want to check the 18th century Cunnington book with the year-by-year description of fashions. Nancy Kiel nancy_kiel@hotmail.com Never tease a weasel! This is very good advice. For the weasel will not like it And teasing isn't nice. >From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: Historical Costume >Subject: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) >Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:53:28 -0500 > >Greetings, > >Would a *bright* (rather electric) royal blue silk satin work for a gown at >any time during the 18th century (England or France)? Or would a very >bright royal blue be too aniline? Any suggestions for colours to over-dye >it if the blue is incorrect? It looks somewhat like >http://www.dharmatrading.com/html/eng/1344-AA.shtml "#623 brilliant blue" >only brighter and with the soft sheen of silk. > >I just bought a whole bunch of royal blue "duchesse" silk satin for $3 a >yard and want to make something truly decadent out of it. : ) > >Cheers, >Danielle > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 17:41:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NLfJHP032399 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 17:41:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NLe1WW015624 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 15:43:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NLZ3GU025607; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:35:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4NLYuGU025464 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:34:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 32329 invoked from network); 23 May 2003 21:34:56 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 23 May 2003 21:34:56 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-39.sonic.net [209.148.115.39]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4NLYsG27846 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 14:34:54 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 14:36:23 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <00a701c3216f$75011ec0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> References: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What's such a big deal about "playing with the upper class"? Surely they don't have more fun than the middle class? Fran >The whole point of my >Cyber Cinderella stories is that you can have a beautiful gown, go play with >the upper class, and no one knows that you probably have the cheapest dress >there. Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 18:11:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NMBpHP032496 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 18:11:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NMDWUw019293 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 16:13:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NMDUCY022361; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:13:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NMDQCY022271 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:13:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bently (dialport14.tukwila.eskimo.net [208.187.159.84]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA13752 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 15:13:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <002201c32178$6f72ea20$549fbbd0@bently> From: "David" To: "Historical Costume" References: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> <00a701c3216f$75011ec0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 15:12:41 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > As for growing up poor... I think it is a matter of how our parents > approach the family income, if you think you are poor or not. As one of the best friends I've ever had loved to say, "Broke is a temporary condition, poor is a state of mind." Pam Dotson Everett, WA USA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 18:53:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NMrrHP032585 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 18:53:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NMsGUw023550 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 16:54:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NMs8CY020053; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:54:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4NMs1CY019971 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 16:54:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A6C25550068; Fri, 23 May 2003 17:54:58 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A689F5500BA; Fri, 23 May 2003 17:54:01 -0500 Message-ID: <00f401c3217e$79502fc0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com><00a701c3216f$75011ec0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <002201c32178$6f72ea20$549fbbd0@bently> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 18:55:57 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What a really good statement Pam. Thank you for sending it... that is a keeper! Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "David" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 6:12 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... > As one of the best friends I've ever had loved to say, "Broke is a temporary > condition, poor is a state of mind." > > Pam Dotson > Everett, WA USA [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 21:22:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1MHHP000419 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:22:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1LLUw007484 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 19:21:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1LJ3L019195; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:21:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1LH3L019181 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:21:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-002-134.jps.net ([216.119.2.134] helo=pavilion) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JNim-0002fp-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 18:21:16 -0700 Message-ID: <008801c32194$b0852ca0$130377d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 18:34:58 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin Netherton wrote: > >("oh, yeah, that would be one of those farthingales > shaped like a circle all around, with the pleats on top that look like > spokes"). I think the seams on each join of the trapezoids also create a spoke like image. Lisa P.S. I'm quite pleased for you that this reference has surfaced! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 21:55:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1taHP000473 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:55:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1tKUw009594 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 19:55:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1tEQk007623; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:55:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1tBQl007589 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:55:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty5037.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.250.37]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4O1tMN2014152 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:55:23 -0400 Message-ID: <3ECED0DC.2090100@dandy.net> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:54:36 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >> Hi, All. I didn't really want to get into this discussion, but I find >> that I disagree with the statements below. Men do in fact judge both >> themselves and other men by their clothes. I have seen it in my job >> with co-workers and with supervisors, both men and women (of both >> sexual persuasions), and out in the world as a whole. I think that we >> do notice both our clothing and the clothing of women. Perhaps the >> difference is how we communicate it to ourselves (the men) and how we >> communicate it to women. There is also bearing on social class, >> standing and the positions which each person finds themselves in. It >> is, IMO, too complex an issue to make such final statements. Not >> meaning to offend, just offering an alternative viewpoint, Mike T. > > Men don't tend to judge themselves by their clothes as women do, nor > other men by their clothes. What you're talking about is sex > attraction. This depends on the man, and also on whether he is > single. Many men I know don't notice what a woman is wearing at all. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 21:58:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1wFHP000479 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:58:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1vXUw009739 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 19:57:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1vWQk008712; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:57:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O1vUQk008685 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:57:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA04387 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:18:41 -0500 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:18:41 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: <008801c32194$b0852ca0$130377d8@pavilion> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Fri, 23 May 2003, Lisa Sinervo wrote: > >("oh, yeah, that would be one of those farthingales > > shaped like a circle all around, with the pleats on top that look like > > spokes"). > > I think the seams on each join of the trapezoids also create a spoke like > image. When you look at just the roll, though, "wheel" is not what comes to mind; it looks more like a donut or a fat innertube. The seams on the joins curve around the surface, like bands. Even if you flatten the top, the "wheel" or "spoke" impression isn't really there. But once you put the skirt over it in in the pleated frounce style (post 1600), which creates a flat surface rather than the earlier puffy frounce, then you get the "dinner-plate" or "lazy Susan" image that might be seen as wheel-like, and would also be distinctive from the earlier fashion. I think it's no coincidence that the "wheel" references don't show up till this point, and always in descriptions of the style as a whole, rather than the understructure. The farthingale itself, if it's a roll, wouldn't be likely to be called a wheel (and in written descriptions, the only descriptive term I've seen for the understructure itself is, in fact, "roll"). But to the viewer of the finished product, the pleated style could easily suggest a wheel, or plate, or drum. I'm liking more and more the idea of the "wheel" term referring to the later visual variation of the finished skirt arrangement, as an all-around circle with pleated top and front protrusion. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 22:01:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O211HP000494 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 22:01:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O20JUw009981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 20:00:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O20IQk010320; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:00:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O20GQk010293 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:00:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-14-47.o1.jps.net ([216.119.14.47] helo=pavilion) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JOKU-0003TS-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:00:15 -0700 Message-ID: <009a01c3219a$1fda8280$130377d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 19:13:20 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think they know about the dress Penny, or at least your social status, but are polite enough not to mention it, or maybe they don't care in one way or another and just like your company. There are mannerism that one develops from one's class and that are dead give a ways to one's background. The movie "Six Degrees of Separation" with Will Smith and Stockard Channing was all about this and based upon a true story too. The author, a con artist, was on Phil Donahue at the time "Six Degrees of Separation" was a Broadway Play, if my memory serves me correctly, and was a most interesting guest. It's true though, not too many people aspire to being able to play with the lower class without anyone knowing they rank higher on the social scale. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 2:36 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... > What's such a big deal about "playing with the upper class"? Surely they > don't have more fun than the middle class? > > Fran > > > >The whole point of my > >Cyber Cinderella stories is that you can have a beautiful gown, go play with > >the upper class, and no one knows that you probably have the cheapest dress > >there. > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 22:12:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2CSHP000534 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 22:12:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2CuUw010950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 20:12:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2CsQk018441; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:12:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2CqQk018382 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:12:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFD00NXNCT42T@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:12:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 17:15:30 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest In-reply-to: X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030523171257.02d311c8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/23/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:56 AM 5/21/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Very few of these items are ones that the average person would point to >and think "that's a costume, not clothing", but part of it is in using >fabrics that distract the mind from the original historic context, or by >"softening" some of the more obviously non-modern aspects of the silhouette. > >I don't think that anyone should dress in things that make them >uncomfortable. On the other hand, you can gradually develop your own >personal style by gradually adding things that you enjoy and that flatter >you that don't on an individual basis, scream "COSTUME!" > >Heather Finally catching up on my e-mail after finishing off a client's costume... Heather, I love that idea. It is something a male friend and I have tossed around, but not considered it seriously for myself. But it clicks with my personal search for wearing clothing that reflects who I am. Thanks so much for posting, especially what you have created already. I would love to see pics, if you have any. But the ideas from your words are already starting to perk in my mind. Thanks! Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 22:12:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2CpHP000537 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 22:12:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2DIUw011015 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 20:13:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2DIQk018759; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:13:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2CqQm018382 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:12:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFD00NXNCT42T@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:12:51 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 17:38:44 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Indigo dyeing In-reply-to: X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030523173713.00b01da0@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/23/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030515103403.02c4cd10@127.0.0.1> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 02:31 PM 5/23/2003 +0200, you wrote: >Yes, it sounds really cool! :D I've never worked with it or even been >near it, though. Does it stink so bad that I shoud keep it far away from >the rest of the camp? How far would you estimate? Hi Ingrid It stank up close, but not that far away. But then it was summer and a bit of a mountain breeze, so I don't recall it being smelly too far from where she was working, which was in the middle of faire. And my sense of smell is rather acute. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 22:54:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2swHP000637 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 22:54:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2sBUw015435 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 20:54:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O2sAQk015133; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:54:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4O2s3Qk015066 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:54:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 20529 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 02:54:03 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 02:54:03 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-14.sonic.net [209.148.115.14]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4O2s2K07202 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 19:54:02 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523193406.00ab82c8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 19:55:31 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <009a01c3219a$1fda8280$130377d8@pavilion> References: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It would certainly be rude of anyone to say, "Did you buy your evening dress at a thrift shop?" As for the mannerisms--I really do have a middle-class queasiness about this. I'm aware that social classes exist in America, but the idea of pointing out that someone belongs to a lower or higher class seems very tasteless in a social setting. It seems like something to tactfully ignore as much as possible. I've met a few members of the lower class who seemed determined to make anyone they perceived as richer feel uncomfortable, which was certainly tasteless. I don't think I've ever met a member of the Old Rich. But why should I want to? It would be tacky in the extreme for me to expect anything from their money--not that I'd get it anyway--and I really can't see that a lavish party is more fun. I have been to a handful of quite lavish parties hosted by New Rich, if you want to so term a few Silicon Valley coworkers who actually made lots of money in stocks (as opposed to the majority who tried to and didn't). It was nice of them to invite me. And I may never again eat and drink through the full set of courses in a fancy French restaurant rented for the occasion, or wade through an inch of champagne on someone's floor. But all in all, I've had more fun at a folk dance with pizza afterward. Fran At 07:13 PM 5/23/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I think they know about the dress Penny, or at least your social status, but >are polite enough not to mention it, or maybe they don't care in one way or >another and just like your company. Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 23:04:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O34lHP000673 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 23:04:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O33FUw016579 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 21:03:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O33Esh021365; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:03:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4O33Csh021336 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:03:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 16070 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 03:03:11 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 03:03:11 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-14.sonic.net [209.148.115.14]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4O33AK12550 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:03:10 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 20:04:40 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <3ECED0DC.2090100@dandy.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Being female, it's hard for me to tell. I have heard men express sex attraction (or revulsion), with varying degrees of candor, toward women they saw walking by. When asked whether they care about their own clothes, most men have told me that they don't care very much. Obviously they're not naked, but they claim not to base their identities on their appearance. I don't know how you guys act among yourselves. Do you hang around and make snide remarks about how so-and-so gained five pounds, so-and-so's clothes are out of style, and so-and-so has a crummy haircut? Or about how insecure you feel all day if you're not dressed exactly right, or because you gained five pounds? Because a lot of traditionally oriented women do given half a chance. Fran At 09:54 PM 5/23/2003 -0400, you wrote: >>>Hi, All. I didn't really want to get into this discussion, but I find >>>that I disagree with the statements below. Men do in fact judge both >>>themselves and other men by their clothes. I have seen it in my job with >>>co-workers and with supervisors, both men and women (of both sexual >>>persuasions), and out in the world as a whole. I think that we do notice >>>both our clothing and the clothing of women. >> >>Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming >>http://www.lavoltapress.com >>Historic and Vintage Dance >>http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 23 23:49:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O3n3HP000822 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 23:49:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O3lVUw020816 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 21:47:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O3lUsh016338; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:47:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O3lSsh016329 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:47:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-003-157.jps.net ([216.119.3.157] helo=pavilion) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JQ0F-0007RX-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 20:47:28 -0700 Message-ID: <00cc01c321a9$11ede9a0$130377d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523193406.00ab82c8@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:00:51 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've mixed with a few Old Rich in New York, mostly in the role of getting theatre tickets for members of the Colony and Colonial Club members but also on an Outward Bound course. You get jokes like, Q- Why can't Ethiopia ever win the America's Cup? A - Because their ribs are always showing. Yachting humour. Middle class people aren't the only fun people around, some rich and poor folk can be good company too. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 7:55 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... > > I don't think I've ever met a member of the Old Rich. But why should I > want to? It would be tacky in the extreme for me to expect anything from > their money--not that I'd get it anyway--and I really can't see that a > lavish party is more fun. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 00:33:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O4XdHP000977 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 00:33:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O4ZMUw025081 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 22:35:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O4ZKql011605; Fri, 23 May 2003 22:35:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4O4ZIql011596 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 22:35:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 16603 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 04:35:18 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 04:35:18 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-14.sonic.net [209.148.115.14]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4O4ZHZ19086 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:35:17 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523213221.00b18e40@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:36:46 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <00cc01c321a9$11ede9a0$130377d8@pavilion> References: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523193406.00ab82c8@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Logically, I'd assume so. The fact is, though, the Old Rich simply don't show up at any parties I go to or anyplace I've worked. Ever. I suppose I could take specific steps to meet some if I felt inclined, but why bother? That would just be social climbing. Fran Middle class people aren't the only fun people around, some rich >and poor folk can be good company too. > >Lisa Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 01:00:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O50MHP001057 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 01:00:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O3GAUw018415 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 23 May 2003 21:16:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O3G9sh000689; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:16:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from einsteinium.btinternet.com (einsteinium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.147]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O3G5si000613 for ; Fri, 23 May 2003 21:16:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host217-36-18-251.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.36.18.251] helo=dan) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19JGDh-0000qR-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 23 May 2003 18:20:41 +0100 Message-ID: <000401c3214f$99f04820$fb1224d9@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 18:20:25 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin wrote: > On Fri, 23 May 2003, Stevie Gamble wrote: > > > Um, once he emerges from the delights of Finals I'll try; he's rather > > busy at the moment. But as far as I know there are no modern editions > > of Northward Ho in print, much less good ones... > > Usually I find this sort of thing in a library edition from the late 19th > or early 20th century. That may be my only choice, but if he has a > recommendation, I'm all ears. Indeed; but going back to a point I made in an earlier post, a library edition of the late 19th century or early 20th century may have the 'a round cathern-wheele fardingale' inserted by a 19th century editor seeking to make sense of an apparently incomprehensible passage and looking to the 19th century costume historians (using that term loosely) for their explanation. Which would be proffered in terms of their own beliefs as to the existence of a wheel farthingale, hence my insistence that you cannot rely on any citing of this kind without going back over all the editions of a play still in existence. The fact that the play in question was a sex comedy makes editorial alteration in the 19th century more, rather than less, likely. > Interestingly, the texts of some of these plays have been webbed by > academics, for accessibility (though, last time I checked, not the ones > I'm looking for). They never are... > > Ok, I haven't got my explanation across here, so I'll try again. Even > > if we inhabit a fantasy world in which Webster and Dekker (who > > co-wrote Northward Hoe) created perfectly accurate and legible texts > > which were then delivered to perfect compositors, who created a > > perfectly accurate printed text, you could still not assume that > > > > "A short dutch wast with a round cathern-wheele fardingale" > > > > was a factual description in use at the time. ... So even in the > > highly improbable event of the text not being altered or glossed by > > later editors you still cannot treat it as a simple descriptive > > reference to a clothing style. > > OK, since I obviously haven't gotten my point across either, I'll try > again. I've got a paper in edit stage in which (among other things) I > track references of the uses of certain terms for farthingale shape. Till > now, the earliest use I had of anything resembling the a comparison of a > farthingale to a "wheel," using that word, was 1617, and the first use of > the actual phrase "wheel farthingale" was 1664 (in a play, in a passage > describing long-past fashions) Which play is it? I may have come across it... > Now, this reference to Webster's 1607 play > allows me to back up my "earliest use of the term" statement, and also is > the first reference I've seen that uses "Catherine-wheel" in conjunction > with a description of a farthingale. For reference, the play was apparently written in 1605 by Dekker and Webster, and performed around then, with a printing apparently in 1607. We have Falstaff's reference to 'semi-circled farthingale' in The Merry Wives of Windsor, Act III, scene III, (dated between 1597-1601). The notorious witchcraft allegations of the young girl who wanted a farthingale were published in Harrisons in 1597. > I'm not suggesting that everyone at the time was calling it that. What > this does show us, though, is that at least one person (the playwright) > made that visual connection, and used that phrase. He may have invented > it, it may never have been used again, and it may have nothing to do with > what was actually under the skirt, but the point is, the combination of > words did appear, and that's what I'm trying to track down. Indeed, if the authors did use the phrase than it would be of interest. > Yes, it's likely that the playwright intended there to be implications in > his exact wording choice, but if the conversation is a discussion of dress > in a tailor's shop (which seems likely from what little I know of the > quote now), there's a good chance it's meant to be a term that would have > some recognizable meaning as a costume description for the audience -- > that is, even if the audience hadn't heard this particular term, even if > it was an invention of the playwright, they would be able to recognize the > style being discussed ("oh, yeah, that would be one of those farthingales > shaped like a circle all around, with the pleats on top that look like > spokes"). The problem with this argument is that even if the authors did use those words they then disappear from sight apparently for ever. In short, it appears not to have been a successful coining, leading one to believe that the audience didn't know what the authors were talking about... >The chances of it being a known term would be less the case if > the setting were a preacher denouncing fashions, in which case it would > more likely be a colorful description unique to that speaker. I think that that is a rather sweeping assertion. > I'm no stranger to lit crit (I have a degree in English), I forgive you:-) People who read Drama, as I did, tend to be much more critical about attempting to analyse plays as if they are useful bits of historical text, rather than an artform which lived in performance. A prime example was the generation of English scholars who triumphantly found vast amounts of evidence of the conflicts which led inevitably to the Civil War in the plays of the early 17th century, only to discover that historians now regard the Civil War as very far from inevitable. I consider that studying the life and work of the playwrights may help us to better understand their dramatic choices. But that brings me back to Dekker's love of Dutch culture and his hatred of the witchcraft trials, on which I have already said enough. best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 02:53:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O6rvHP013320 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 02:53:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O6tTUw003118 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 00:55:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O6tNeU008821; Sat, 24 May 2003 00:55:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from fep01-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com (fep01-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com [66.185.86.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O6tJeU008789 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 00:55:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from VALINOR ([65.50.96.88]) by fep01-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.comESMTP <20030524065501.JDQC203383.fep01-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com@VALINOR> for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 02:55:01 -0400 Message-ID: <002701c321c1$6c0111c0$6401a8c0@VALINOR> From: "Herself-the-Elf" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 02:55:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH LOGIN at fep01-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com from [65.50.96.88] using ID at Sat, 24 May 2003 02:55:00 -0400 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ugh, possibly why I have a lot more male friends than female friends. I have *zero* patience for petty, pointless gossip. I'm quite careful with my appearance, mind you--I like to look good whenever possible--but I don't obsess over what's in fashion, or whether somebody gained a few pounds. -- Maral the den of sarcasm http://sarcasm.fanfic.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 11:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest > Being female, it's hard for me to tell. > > I have heard men express sex attraction (or revulsion), with varying > degrees of candor, toward women they saw walking by. When asked whether > they care about their own clothes, most men have told me that they don't > care very much. Obviously they're not naked, but they claim not to base > their identities on their appearance. I don't know how you guys act among > yourselves. Do you hang around and make snide remarks about how so-and-so > gained five pounds, so-and-so's clothes are out of style, and so-and-so has > a crummy haircut? Or about how insecure you feel all day if you're not > dressed exactly right, or because you gained five pounds? Because a lot of > traditionally oriented women do given half a chance. > > Fran > > At 09:54 PM 5/23/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > >>>Hi, All. I didn't really want to get into this discussion, but I find > >>>that I disagree with the statements below. Men do in fact judge both > >>>themselves and other men by their clothes. I have seen it in my job with > >>>co-workers and with supervisors, both men and women (of both sexual > >>>persuasions), and out in the world as a whole. I think that we do notice > >>>both our clothing and the clothing of women. > >> > >>Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > >>http://www.lavoltapress.com > >>Historic and Vintage Dance > >>http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 05:19:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O9JqHP004023 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 05:19:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O9JhUw010963 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 03:19:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O9JfdS019666; Sat, 24 May 2003 03:19:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41501.mail.yahoo.com (web41501.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4O9JcdS018834 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 03:19:38 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030524091933.23691.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41501.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 24 May 2003 10:19:33 BST Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 10:19:33 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: uniforms, etc. To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Gail & Scott Finke wrote: > > As to Nicole's comment about how sad we all must be in America with our lack > of permission to express ourselves -- HA HA HA HA HA!!!! I never said 'sad'. > Oh, were you serious? Actually, yes. This is why I asked if it is REALLY like that or if it only seemed to be like that from the comments by the people on the list. Please read the entire mail next time. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 05:26:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O9QeHP004035 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 05:26:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O9PuUw011391 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 03:25:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4O9PsdS004362; Sat, 24 May 2003 03:25:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41508.mail.yahoo.com (web41508.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4O9PpdS004290 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 03:25:51 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030524092545.45703.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41508.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 24 May 2003 10:25:45 BST Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 10:25:45 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030523173821.43838.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Dawn Jacobson wrote: > Nicole-- > > Boy, Germany must have changed a bunch in the past 40 > years! A friend of mine went to elementary school in > Darmstadt, and wore uniforms. A) Dramstadt is one of the really boring and conservative towns :-) and I come from a huge melting pot of a former industrial area with cultures and culture from all over the world (Stuttgart is worse! *L*) and B) oh boy has it changed since 40 years ago!!!!!!!! > It's really not as bad as it sounds from the e-mails. > ;-) Thanks for clarifying this! That's what I wondered, judging from some emails is difficult, because it cannot be clear if they are representative for the majority. If you go to London, Paris, or Berlin, and see > what most people working at regular "white collar" > jobs are wearing, and then go to New York, San > Francisco, Los Angeles, or another large city and see > what those people are wearing, it's pretty-much > similar throughout the world. That's what I think too, and that's why I would never work in such a city ;-) I can't stand London *blech* except for its specialist shops, but all the poor commuters I know (lotsa neighbours) never really get to them, far too stressed. > And actually, uniforms are pretty nice, especially if > it's something you can enjoy wearing. It saves having > to try to figure out what to wear every morning. ;-) Yuck, yuck, yuck, I disagree! *laughs* I can't stand uniforms unless they are fantasy ones and have lotsa metallic bits ;-) Well.. okay, so the nice firm bums and long legs of all those Royal Engineers all around me in that simple camouflage green are NOT bad, but hey, that's different. *grins* Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 07:46:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OBkjHP004280 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:46:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OBjDUw018550 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 05:45:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OBjAEX029204; Sat, 24 May 2003 05:45:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OBj8EX029138 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 05:45:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-123.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.123]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EA6ABECBC for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:45:01 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3ECF5BD3.4070805@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 13:47:31 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Fabric question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I bought a cream and gold damast. I would like to make a dress out of it. But I am not sure of wich era. Would the pattern be appropriate for a robe a la francaise? http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Fabric/Fabric.html Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 08:50:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OCokHP004415 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 08:50:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OCqUUw022041 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 06:52:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OCqTWS024449; Sat, 24 May 2003 06:52:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from lakemtao02.cox.net (lakemtao02.cox.net [68.1.17.243]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OCnaWS022241 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 06:49:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from VMAAHQ ([68.99.96.216]) by lakemtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030524124919.EPRS24359.lakemtao02.cox.net@VMAAHQ>; Sat, 24 May 2003 08:49:19 -0400 From: "Linda Rice" To: , "'Lydia K Koeller'" Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 02:38:40 -0400 Message-ID: <000001c321bf$1f1c89e0$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] shocking new fashion X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Here's something new~! http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,58914,00.html I like it, for the 'shock value' of course! ::Linda:: _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 09:32:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODWiHP004494 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 09:32:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODYTUw024364 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 07:34:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODYRG8009934; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:34:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net (mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.48]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODYPG8009919 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:34:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-15-146.o1.jps.net ([216.119.15.146] helo=pavilion) by mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JZAG-0001PF-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 24 May 2003 06:34:25 -0700 Message-ID: <001c01c321fb$22088f00$920f77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030523171257.02d311c8@127.0.0.1> Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 06:48:16 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO When a new fashion season features 40's styles, 50's etc, this is exactly what the designers do.. Modern fashion is rarely an exact reproduction of another era, although this current 70's look seems to be pretty close. A fifties shell top might be made today, but it probably would have a small percentage of lycra in the fabric so the stiff look of the fifties can be worn by a woman of today who is used to knits and a lack of feeling bound. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kimiko Small" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 5:15 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest > At 10:56 AM 5/21/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >Very few of these items are ones that the average person would point to > >and think "that's a costume, not clothing", but part of it is in using > >fabrics that distract the mind from the original historic context, or by > >"softening" some of the more obviously non-modern aspects of the silhouette. > > > >I don't think that anyone should dress in things that make them > >uncomfortable. On the other hand, you can gradually develop your own > >personal style by gradually adding things that you enjoy and that flatter > >you that don't on an individual basis, scream "COSTUME!" > > > >Heather > > > Finally catching up on my e-mail after finishing off a client's costume... > > Heather, I love that idea. It is something a male friend and I have tossed > around, but not considered it seriously for myself. But it clicks with my > personal search for wearing clothing that reflects who I am. > > Thanks so much for posting, especially what you have created already. I > would love to see pics, if you have any. But the ideas from your words are > already starting to perk in my mind. > > Thanks! > > Kimiko > > > > Kimiko Small > Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother > kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com > > Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery > http://www.costumegallery.com > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 09:57:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODviHP004526 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 09:57:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODxSUw025926 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 07:59:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODxRGH018445; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:59:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODxPGH018416 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:59:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f87.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.135]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 560635EE20F for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:59:24 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001e01c321fd$1fa18f30$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 16:02:33 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Danielle. I am afraid, that i would not say, it would be accurate to use this colour. Is there any ways you could bleach it somehow? Pale blue, would be a lovely colour to use. In all i must say, that it was very popular to use pastel colours. But if you look at the side below and click on the link to the Bath Ball, there was a lady dressed in a robe francaise, who wore this colour you are referering two. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > >From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg > >Reply-To: Historical Costume > >To: Historical Costume > >Subject: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) > >Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:53:28 -0500 > > > >Greetings, > > > >Would a *bright* (rather electric) royal blue silk satin work for a gown at > >any time during the 18th century (England or France)? Or would a very > >bright royal blue be too aniline? Any suggestions for colours to over-dye > >it if the blue is incorrect? It looks somewhat like > >http://www.dharmatrading.com/html/eng/1344-AA.shtml "#623 brilliant blue" > >only brighter and with the soft sheen of silk. > > > >I just bought a whole bunch of royal blue "duchesse" silk satin for $3 a > >yard and want to make something truly decadent out of it. : ) > > > >Cheers, > >Danielle > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 09:59:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODxgHP004530 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 09:59:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODvpUw025724 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 07:57:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODvoGH017869; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:57:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ODtPGH017042 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:55:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f87.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.135]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 8C39B5EE181 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:55:24 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001801c321fc$8f896fd0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3ECF5BD3.4070805@kabelfoon.nl> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric question Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 15:58:31 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Deredere Oh yes, definately it would be suitable for a Robe Francaise, go for it! And remember to post pictures two :-) Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deredere Galbraith" To: "H-Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 24, 2003 1:47 PM Subject: [h-cost] Fabric question > Hi, > > I bought a cream and gold damast. I would like to make a dress out of it. > But I am not sure of wich era. Would the pattern be appropriate for a > robe a la francaise? > > http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Fabric/Fabric.html > > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 10:06:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OE68HP004561 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 10:06:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OE7qUw026390 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 08:07:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OE7pGH021192; Sat, 24 May 2003 08:07:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OE7mGH021129 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 08:07:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.netmtaout05.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 24 May 2003 10:07:08 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 09:06:55 -0500 From: Allison Pace In-reply-to: <200305241252.h4OCq0WT024256@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 2, Issue 269 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Saturday, May 24, 2003, at 07:52 AM, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: > Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 19:55:31 -0700 > From: Lavolta Press > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... > To: Historical Costume > Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523193406.00ab82c8@pop.sonic.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > > It would certainly be rude of anyone to say, "Did you buy your evening > dress at a thrift shop?" > > As for the mannerisms--I really do have a middle-class queasiness about > this. I'm aware that social classes exist in America, but the idea of > pointing out that someone belongs to a lower or higher class seems very > tasteless in a social setting. It seems like something to tactfully > ignore > as much as possible. I've met a few members of the lower class who > seemed > determined to make anyone they perceived as richer feel uncomfortable, > which was certainly tasteless. > > I don't think I've ever met a member of the Old Rich. But why should I > want to? It would be tacky in the extreme for me to expect anything > from > their money--not that I'd get it anyway--and I really can't see that a > lavish party is more fun. > > I have been to a handful of quite lavish parties hosted by New Rich, > if you > want to so term a few Silicon Valley coworkers who actually made lots > of > money in stocks (as opposed to the majority who tried to and didn't). > It > was nice of them to invite me. And I may never again eat and drink > through > the full set of courses in a fancy French restaurant rented for the > occasion, or wade through an inch of champagne on someone's floor. > But all > in all, I've had more fun at a folk dance with pizza afterward. > > Fran > Somewhere in the foggy past I read something comparing classes thusly: Those with old money and "good" pedigrees are strereotypically frugal, plain and discrete. It's the nouveau riche who are flamboyant and vulgar with their money and power. I have been around members of the Old Rich and the New Rich, and in my (limited) experiance, I can say that's true. But this squarely middle-class girl says: if you want to dish someone, come sit by me!!! Especially when it comes to fancy gowns and other peacockian displays of wealth. Allison _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 10:35:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OEZ1HP004636 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 10:35:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OEZSUw027779 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 08:35:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OEZRGH001362; Sat, 24 May 2003 08:35:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80410.mail.yahoo.com (web80410.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OEZOGH001317 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 08:35:24 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030524143519.96862.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.205.185.216] by web80410.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:35:19 PDT Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 07:35:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Actually, they do, 'cause usually they aren't hung up on this whole "class" thing the way the middle class seems to be, so they can relax and enjoy themselves. Dawn --- Lavolta Press wrote: > What's such a big deal about "playing with the upper > class"? Surely they > don't have more fun than the middle class? > > Fran > > > >The whole point of my > >Cyber Cinderella stories is that you can have a > beautiful gown, go play with > >the upper class, and no one knows that you probably > have the cheapest dress > >there. > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 10:46:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OEkIHP004679 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 10:46:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OEklUw028554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 08:46:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OEkkGH006126; Sat, 24 May 2003 08:46:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80402.mail.yahoo.com (web80402.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.57]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OEkiGH006075 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 08:46:45 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030524144639.82382.qmail@web80402.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.205.185.216] by web80402.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 24 May 2003 07:46:39 PDT Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 07:46:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] shocking new fashion To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000001c321bf$1f1c89e0$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It brings a whole new meaning to "shock and awe"! ;-D Dawn --- Linda Rice wrote: > Here's something new~! > > http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,58914,00.html > > I like it, for the 'shock value' of course! > > ::Linda:: > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 11:12:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OFCHHP004734 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 11:12:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OFDxUw029887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 09:13:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OFDvYu016175; Sat, 24 May 2003 09:13:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OFDsYu016128 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 09:13:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-fp03-123.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.122.123]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A50619FB43 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:13:48 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3ECF8CC3.6050701@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 17:16:19 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric question References: <3ECF5BD3.4070805@kabelfoon.nl> <001801c321fc$8f896fd0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ippie!! It wasn't my plan to buy fabric but this fabric was just screaming " buy me" to me :-) . But fhist I will finish my partlet. 30 buttons are backed and 40 buttons are redy to be backed. Greetings, Deredere Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: >Dear Deredere >Oh yes, definately it would be suitable for a Robe Francaise, go for it! And >remember to post pictures two :-) > >Bjarne > >Leif og Bjarne Drews >www.my-drewscostumes.dk > >http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Deredere Galbraith" >To: "H-Costume" >Sent: Saturday, May 24, 2003 1:47 PM >Subject: [h-cost] Fabric question > > > > >>Hi, >> >>I bought a cream and gold damast. I would like to make a dress out of it. >>But I am not sure of wich era. Would the pattern be appropriate for a >>robe a la francaise? >> >>http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Fabric/Fabric.html >> >> >>Greetings, >> Deredere >> >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> >> > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 11:17:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OFHCHP004748 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 11:17:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OFIpUw000370 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 09:18:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OFIpYu017974; Sat, 24 May 2003 09:18:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OFImYu017931 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 09:18:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.14.11ee5706 (17526) for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 11:18:37 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 11:18:37 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/24/2003 10:00:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: > In all i must say, that it was very popular to use pastel colours. > But then there IS that portrait of De Pompador in a dark teal blue [or green....I've only seen reproductions of the painting and the colors vary a lot] with pink roses and ribbons all over it. James Acheson reproduces it for Glenn Close in "Dangerous Liaisons"...the scene in the salon with the castrate singing Handel. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 13:00:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OH0HHP005066 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:00:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OH1sUw006850 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 11:01:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OH1qvw002024; Sat, 24 May 2003 11:01:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OH1ovw001998 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 11:01:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA07896 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:23:04 -0500 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 12:23:04 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Catherine Wheel was St. Thomas' worsted? In-Reply-To: <000401c3214f$99f04820$fb1224d9@dan> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin wrote: > > Usually I find this sort of thing in a library edition from the late > 19th > > or early 20th century. That may be my only choice, but if he has a > > recommendation, I'm all ears. Stevie wrote: > Indeed; but going back to a point I made in an earlier post, a library > edition of the late 19th century or early 20th century may have the 'a > round cathern-wheele fardingale' inserted by a 19th century editor > seeking to make sense of an apparently incomprehensible passage and > looking to the 19th century costume historians (using that term > loosely) for their explanation.... I recognize that, and I believe I said as much earlier. All I was saying above was that I'll take what editions I can find, and of course I'd prefer to have a more authoritative one, but if all that's out there is a 19th/early 20th century edition, I'm stuck with using that. > ... hence my insistence that you cannot rely on any citing of this > kind without going back over all the editions of a play still in > existence. I'm certainly not going to give up investigating the quote because of the small possibility that a later editor may have chosen that particular line to invent a phrase out of whole cloth. It really sounds as though you're saying that if I can't look at the original 1607 edition and every other in existence, I might as well not bother and should throw out this piece of evidence entirely. I understand what sort of research would be ideal, but if that's not possible, I don't think that means I should ignore it completely ... just take into account a certain level of uncertainty. We have to do that with all historical sources, to some extent, in ways specific to the media; it's the same when you account for the possibility of restorations in art works. I think people who have read my posts over time will verify that I am not blind to this. I think I should also point out that my paper is not about the analysis of a play, or even the use of a term, which would require intensive direct research on the original primary manuscripts and editions. It is about the likely form of the farthingale that creates the visual shape known today as the "wheel." I bring in the issue of period terminology as one small part of a much larger overview of our evidence of how people who were wearing the items perceived them, as opposed to how later historians did. My point of bringing up the "wheel" term in the first place is to show that the term was *not* used widely or universally as a garment term in the period, but may have been used as a casual descriptive term by one or more laymen. However, it was adopted by later historians as a standard term, and this contributed to the ease with which later historians assumed "wheel" was a description for the structure of the underpinning. To build this case, I need to be aware of whether and how the term "wheel" may have been used in the period. I'm not going to get into a protracted discussion of techniques of literary analysis with you, since I think at base we are in fierce agreement. You're admonishing the wrong person -- I am already quite aware of the uncertainties of texts and the caution with which one must approach them. Yes, I have background in reading drama, and I recognize the special problems of using plays as compared with other types of documents and writings (each of which, also, has its own problems). All I'm saying is that if the term appears in a text of the period, I'd damn well better acknowledge its existence and do my best to understand its context, and raise for consideration whatever interpretations seem reasonable. I am *extremely* conservative about interpretation; I would in no way point to this quote or any other and said "Aha, that means women in general were wearing X, or calling it Y, or it was made like Z." In my last couple of posts, I've raised possibilities as examples primarily to illustrate the degree to which some types of sources or contexts might be more or less likely than others to have some relation to reality, with the understanding that none can be absolute. One of our best tools, though, is to gather as many references as possible and to examine them in combination -- to see where a single term might be used in multiple ways in different types of writings and different contexts. Today's "cathern-wheel" may take on new meaning at some later date if I find the term somewhere else. In the meantime, it goes in the hopper with the rest, along with the many possible readings and implications it may have. I may have some preferences among readings, and I may find some to be more likely than others, or more consistent with the larger pool of references, but I don't think you need to worry about me pointing to something like this and saying definitively "It means X." The nature of the definitive statement I *can* make (now) is that the earliest case I've found for a "wheel" reference in relation to a "farthingale" is a citation of a 1607 edition of a certain play. If we can reasonably deduce from this that there was a style that someone at the time thought looked like a wheel, I think that's relevant. The fact that the inventories never refer to these items as "wheels" (but only as "French farthingales"), and that the dictionaries of that period call the "French farthingale" a "roll" is also relevant, because it reinforces that the "wheel" term was probably not a standard garment term, and may have been a casual reference by laymen, or just one person's description, or a witty play on words to draw audience reaction (e.g. by using "Catherine wheel" instead of a more prosaic "wheel" image to evoke the idea of martyrdom, torture, or expanse). I can't deduce or extrapolate from one quote how widely the "wheel" phrase might have been used, and I don't think anything I've said indicated that I would try to do so. I also mentioned: > ... the first use of the actual phrase "wheel farthingale" was 1664 > (in a play, in a passage describing long-past fashions) And Stevie asked: > Which play is it? I may have come across it... Thomas Killegrew, "The Parson's Wedding." I have more comprehensive notes somewhere in my files, but the note I have ready to hand is that the speaker was evoking an image of a time long past, way back when "yellow starch and wheel vardingales were cried down." (I've got this classed for now in my list of "casual references by laymen" in contrast to specific garment terms as used in tailor's accounts, inventories, etc.) --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 14:02:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OI2AHP005314 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:02:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OI1HUw011177 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 12:01:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OI1FQp027257; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:01:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OI0sQp027072 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:00:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 1963 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 18:00:54 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 18:00:54 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-208.sonic.net [209.148.112.208]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4OI0ra29222 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 11:00:53 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 11:02:23 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <20030524143519.96862.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Actually I very seldom hear anyone discuss class anywhere outside of academic books and courses. I always thought the middle-class standard of at least pretending to be unaware that someone else you know socially has less or more money, was quite tactful. How do the upper classes discuss (or not discuss) money (which in America is about teh same thing as social class) differently in your experience with them? Fran At 07:35 AM 5/24/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Actually, they do, 'cause usually they aren't hung up >on this whole "class" thing the way the middle class >seems to be, so they can relax and enjoy themselves. > >Dawn > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 14:11:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OIBRHP005343 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:11:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OICWUw012027 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 12:12:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OICVQp002447; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:12:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OICSQp002425 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:12:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 12437 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 18:12:28 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 18:12:28 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-208.sonic.net [209.148.112.208]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4OICRa03207 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 11:12:27 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524111213.00abef80@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 11:13:57 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] shocking new fashion In-Reply-To: <000001c321bf$1f1c89e0$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The Victorians advertised a number of "electric garments" that were supposed to give health benefits to the wearer. I recently ran across (I forget where) a recipe for making your own electric boots at home. It was like concocting a low-grade battery to put in them. Fran At 02:38 AM 5/24/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Here's something new~! > >http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,58914,00.html > >I like it, for the 'shock value' of course! > >::Linda:: > > > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 14:15:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OIF7HP005353 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:15:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OIEMUw012147 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 12:14:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OIELQp003145; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:14:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OIEJQp003121 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:14:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 12944 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 18:14:19 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 18:14:19 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-208.sonic.net [209.148.112.208]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4OIEIa04063 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 11:14:18 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524111512.00ac0d98@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 11:15:48 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <002701c321c1$6c0111c0$6401a8c0@VALINOR> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Exactly. Fran At 02:55 AM 5/24/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Ugh, possibly why I have a lot more male friends than female friends. I >have *zero* patience for petty, pointless gossip. I'm quite careful with my >appearance, mind you--I like to look good whenever possible--but I don't >obsess over what's in fashion, or whether somebody gained a few pounds. > >-- Maral > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 14:56:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OIugHP005418 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:56:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OIv5Uw015301 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 12:57:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OIv3hs022619; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:57:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OIv0hs022601 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:57:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be77.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.119]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 3E151262985 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 20:56:59 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <006d01c32226$b716c410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 21:00:16 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello. You are right, yes, and there are also many other dark coloured fabrics. But most of them are printed or floral and i was talking about solid colours. I have a lot of troubble two when my costumers already has chosen a colour. One of my largest mistakes, was the orange large panier dress. When i se it today, i say HORRORS, how could you do it!!!! You learn a lot, all the time! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, May 24, 2003 5:18 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) > In a message dated 5/24/2003 10:00:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: > > > In all i must say, that it was very popular to use pastel colours. > > > > But then there IS that portrait of De Pompador in a dark teal blue [or > green....I've only seen reproductions of the painting and the colors vary a lot] > with pink roses and ribbons all over it. James Acheson reproduces it for Glenn > Close in "Dangerous Liaisons"...the scene in the salon with the castrate singing > Handel. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 15:18:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJHxHP005512 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:18:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJHEUw016557 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 13:17:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJHDhs001049; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:17:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJHAhs001031 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:17:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be77.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.119]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id DD65C262960 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 21:17:09 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <007f01c32229$8a0bd2a0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 21:20:29 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] catherine wheel farthingale X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, again. I was just thinking about, did Arnold ever go to france, to find any references for a french term of wheel farthingale. Or is this topic only in interrest for England? I mean was she only interrested in the fashions of England? How about the inventories of Queen Anne. The "wheel" was very used by her? As i read a danish book about the fashion in Renaissance nordic countries, a book written in 1930ies, there was referenses for the french word "Fessus" wich meens "bum rolls" and then there were referenses for " stuffed stomachs, not stomachers, but stomachs, and i have never seen a picture with a lady with a stuffed stomach. And i thoaght if this could be a small cussion or something, wich is taken under the pointed bodice, to make it rest on the farthingale? Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 15:24:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJODHP005538 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:24:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJPuUw017108 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 13:25:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJPths004717; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:25:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.232]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJPqhs004702 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:25:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-005-020.jps.net ([216.119.5.20] helo=pavilion) by flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JeeN-0000R0-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:25:52 -0700 Message-ID: <001201c3222c$397cee20$140577d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 12:39:41 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The upper class doesn't worry about money because they have it! It's us middle class folks who are in the "don't talk about money" because some of us have it and some of us don't, despite outward appearances and all of us want it and no one is really sure who has what and we might not want others to know what we have or that our nicely dressed friends would be bankrupt in three months if they lost their great jobs and the bills kept coming in. Okay, a generalisation but generally true. In fact, some old moneyed kids don't understand the question, "How does your family make it's money", as the situation for them is, they don't MAKE money, they HAVE money. Because of that is can be more relaxing to be around rich people if you're not concerned about measuring up financially yourself and if they're not snotty. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 24, 2003 11:02 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... > Actually I very seldom hear anyone discuss class anywhere outside of > academic books and courses. I always thought the middle-class standard of > at least pretending to be unaware that someone else you know socially has > less or more money, was quite tactful. > > How do the upper classes discuss (or not discuss) money (which in America > is about teh same thing as social class) differently in your experience > with them? > > Fran > > At 07:35 AM 5/24/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >Actually, they do, 'cause usually they aren't hung up > >on this whole "class" thing the way the middle class > >seems to be, so they can relax and enjoy themselves. > > > >Dawn > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 15:36:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJacHP005572 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:36:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJb8Uw017891 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 13:37:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJb7hs009880; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:37:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJb4hs009856 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:37:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA1968D006A; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:38:01 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7D0826012A; Sun, 24 Jun 2007 14:36:48 -0500 Message-ID: <007a01c3222c$180fcd20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030524092545.45703.qmail@web41508.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 15:20:25 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole, Where do you live in England? Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 15:37:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJbXHP005578 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:37:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJdGUw018004 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 13:39:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJdFhs010812; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:39:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OJdDhs010802 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:39:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 10213 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 19:39:12 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 19:39:12 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-208.sonic.net [209.148.112.208]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4OJdBa07968 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:39:12 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 12:40:42 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <001201c3222c$397cee20$140577d8@pavilion> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ? I not only don't have a clue how much money my acquaintances and friends make, I don't want to know. And I have zero concern about "measuring up financially." Fran Because >of that is can be more relaxing to be around rich people if you're not >concerned about measuring up financially yourself and if they're not snotty. > >Lisa Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 15:45:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJjQHP005600 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:45:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJjvUw018399 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 13:45:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJjuhs013970; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:45:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OJjshs013945 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:45:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4OJikne030832 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 12:44:47 -0700 Message-ID: <3ECFCB8D.5030005@misc.com> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 12:44:13 -0700 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) References: <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> <006d01c32226$b716c410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO To Bjarne- Was that the dress you made for a client going to a Venetian Carnivale event a few years back??? I thought it was fabulous - it made my heart just jump in a huge lurch of envy - of, course, one of my favorite colors is orange (pumpkin, persimmon, vermillion, tangerine...you name it and I'll wear it)!!!! That gown was just beautiful and your artistry shone everywhere in it. Theresa Eacker Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote:(Snipped) > One of my largest mistakes, was the orange large panier dress. When i se it > today, i say HORRORS, how could you do it!!!! > You learn a lot, all the time! > > Bjarne > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 16:07:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OK7mHP005643 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 16:07:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OK6uUw020191 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 14:06:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OK6t97024637; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:06:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net (turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.126]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OK6r97024613 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:06:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-14-90.o1.jps.net ([216.119.14.90] helo=pavilion) by turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JfI3-0000Xb-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:06:52 -0700 Message-ID: <001201c32231$f5fc4b40$5a0e77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 13:20:45 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's the "I don't want to know" part that's middle class. Wouldn't it be nice to know that you have everything you need and your friends have everything they need at least financially? Old money circles are like that. It would be of a concern to know your friend or acquaintance might have more financial struggles than outward appearances suggest, so we don't talk about it, when we're middle class. The poor, well they know they're poor and everyone else knows too, so they have nothing to hide either. People in lower classes can also be very relaxing to be with for that reason. It's a lack of pretence. I have had some of the most genuine hospitality offered to me by people scratching to make ends meet for the most basic necessities. It may not apply to you Fran, but in general terms I have observed these traits as have others who have studied class structures in America. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 24, 2003 12:40 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... > ? I not only don't have a clue how much money my acquaintances and friends > make, I don't want to know. And I have zero concern about "measuring up > financially." > > Fran > > Because > >of that is can be more relaxing to be around rich people if you're not > >concerned about measuring up financially yourself and if they're not snotty. > > > >Lisa > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 16:29:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OKTQHP005690 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 16:29:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OKQfUw021681 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 14:26:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OKQd97003727; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:26:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OKQb97003702 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:26:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 24034 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 20:26:37 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 20:26:37 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-208.sonic.net [209.148.112.208]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4OKQal20226 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 13:26:36 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524131729.00b15390@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 13:28:06 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <001201c32231$f5fc4b40$5a0e77d8@pavilion> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >It's the "I don't want to know" part that's middle class. Wouldn't it be >nice to know that you have everything you need and your friends have >everything they need at least financially? I do have everything I need. I'm sure if I had a higher income my "needs" might change, but since I graduated from college I've always felt happy with whatever I had at the time. As for my friends, I help someone find a job, if I can provide such help, but it's not my responsibility to give them money. People in >lower classes can also be very relaxing to be with for that reason. I've known a number of people from the lower classes who were not relaxing to be with at all. They harbored resentment toward anyone they perceived as having more money than they did--very much an attitude that I owed them something. Which I don't. I don't see that not discussing money (except when necessary for business) is a "pretence." There are some aspects of personal life that are not other peoples' business, and money is one of them. I've never even known what my parents', my brother's, or my in-laws' incomes are. As for judging people's income by their clothes--I've worked with enough very affluent (I think) technical people who wore jeans every day to consider that impossible. Even for non-geeks--what with mass market production, department stores, and discount outlets, many people dress at pretty much the same level regardless of income. Fran >Lisa > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 17:00:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OL0gHP005775 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:00:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OL2RUw024589 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 15:02:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OL2N9i020536; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:02:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m06.mx.aol.com (imo-m06.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.161]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OL2L9i020473 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:02:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.107.234b3dc9 (17526) for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:02:05 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <107.234b3dc9.2c0137cd@aol.com> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 17:02:05 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/24/2003 3:46:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time, theresa@misc.com writes: > One of my largest mistakes, was the orange large panier dress. When i se it > >today, i say HORRORS, how could you do it!!!! > I like that one too. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 17:09:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OL9IHP005813 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:09:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OL6lUw024820 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 15:06:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OL6k9i022335; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:06:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41509.mail.yahoo.com (web41509.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.92]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OL6i9i022276 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:06:44 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030524210638.76781.qmail@web41509.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41509.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:06:38 BST Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:06:38 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <007a01c3222c$180fcd20$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > Nicole, > > Where do you live in England? I once lived in Yorkshire for a while and now live in Kent. N. ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 17:09:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OL9rHP005817 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:09:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLBbUw025137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 15:11:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLBa9i024464; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:11:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net (snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLBY9i024454 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:11:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-9-250.smf.jps.net ([216.119.9.250] helo=pavilion) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JgIf-0002UZ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:11:34 -0700 Message-ID: <000801c3223b$00369da0$fa0977d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524131729.00b15390@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:25:27 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well obviously Fran, you're an exception to my generalizations! :) Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 24, 2003 1:28 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... > > >It's the "I don't want to know" part that's middle class. Wouldn't it be > >nice to know that you have everything you need and your friends have > >everything they need at least financially? > > I do have everything I need. I'm sure if I had a higher income my "needs" > might change, but since I graduated from college I've always felt happy > with whatever I had at the time. As for my friends, I help someone find a > job, if I can provide such help, but it's not my responsibility to give > them money. > > People in > >lower classes can also be very relaxing to be with for that reason. > > I've known a number of people from the lower classes who were not relaxing > to be with at all. They harbored resentment toward anyone they perceived as > having more money than they did--very much an attitude that I owed them > something. Which I don't. > > I don't see that not discussing money (except when necessary for business) > is a "pretence." There are some aspects of personal life that are not > other peoples' business, and money is one of them. I've never even known > what my parents', my brother's, or my in-laws' incomes are. > > As for judging people's income by their clothes--I've worked with enough > very affluent (I think) technical people who wore jeans every day to > consider that impossible. Even for non-geeks--what with mass market > production, department stores, and discount outlets, many people dress at > pretty much the same level regardless of income. > > Fran > > > > > >Lisa > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 17:11:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLBkHP005834 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:11:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLDBUw025231 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 15:13:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLDB9i025191; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:13:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLD89i025177 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:13:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38FBA7AB1F for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:12:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 67708-07 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:12:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-64-160-177-54.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [64.160.177.54]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74F737A9F2 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:12:20 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:12:57 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <006d01c32226$b716c410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Message-Id: <7E11042C-8E2C-11D7-86D2-00039369A97A@wonderland.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO But Bjarne, that dress was gorgeous, even if the color is more modern in taste. I loved it, still do! On Saturday, May 24, 2003, at 12:00 PM, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Hello. > You are right, yes, and there are also many other dark coloured > fabrics. But > most of them are printed or floral and i was talking about solid > colours. > I have a lot of troubble two when my costumers already has chosen a > colour. > One of my largest mistakes, was the orange large panier dress. When i > se it > today, i say HORRORS, how could you do it!!!! > You learn a lot, all the time! > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Saturday, May 24, 2003 5:18 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) > > >> In a message dated 5/24/2003 10:00:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, >> drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: >> >>> In all i must say, that it was very popular to use pastel colours. >>> >> >> But then there IS that portrait of De Pompador in a dark teal blue [or >> green....I've only seen reproductions of the painting and the colors >> vary > a lot] >> with pink roses and ribbons all over it. James Acheson reproduces it >> for > Glenn >> Close in "Dangerous Liaisons"...the scene in the salon with the >> castrate > singing >> Handel. >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 17:21:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLLYHP005859 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:21:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLM0Uw025837 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 15:22:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLLx9i000432; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:21:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OLLt9i000386 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:21:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 8602 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 21:21:55 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 21:21:55 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-65.sonic.net [209.148.112.65]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4OLLsL03508 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:21:54 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524141845.00af8598@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:23:25 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <000801c3223b$00369da0$fa0977d8@pavilion> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524131729.00b15390@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I doubt I'm that much of an exception, as most of the people I know who belong to my part of the middle class, at least, are the same way. If you have money you don't brag about it. If you don't, you don't whine about it. If you don't like your income, it's your responsibility to go out and get a better job, or whatever--no one else owes you. You don't ask anyone else what they make or spend because it might make them uncomfortable. My parents and in-laws won't even provide information to my husband and I for estate planning and other business purposes. They just say it's none of our business. Fran At 02:25 PM 5/24/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Well obviously Fran, you're an exception to my generalizations! :) > >Lisa > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 17:32:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLW6HP005882 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:32:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLXoUw026912 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 15:33:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLXm9i006863; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:33:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net (albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.120]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLXj9i006827 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:33:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-9-90.smf.jps.net ([216.119.9.90] helo=pavilion) by albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Jge8-0001NR-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:33:44 -0700 Message-ID: <000e01c3223e$1943db20$5a0977d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524131729.00b15390@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524141845.00af8598@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:47:36 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO So how much money have you got Fran?? Just kidding! Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 24, 2003 2:23 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... > I doubt I'm that much of an exception, as most of the people I know who > belong to my part of the middle class, at least, are the same way. If you > have money you don't brag about it. If you don't, you don't whine about > it. If you don't like your income, it's your responsibility to go out and > get a better job, or whatever--no one else owes you. You don't ask anyone > else what they make or spend because it might make them uncomfortable. My > parents and in-laws won't even provide information to my husband and I for > estate planning and other business purposes. They just say it's none of > our business. > > Fran > > > At 02:25 PM 5/24/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >Well obviously Fran, you're an exception to my generalizations! :) > > > >Lisa > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 17:52:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLpxHP005924 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:52:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLqVUw028340 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 15:52:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OLqT9i015874; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:52:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4OLqP9i015841 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:52:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 17351 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 21:52:25 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 21:52:25 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-177.sonic.net [209.148.112.177]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4OLqOf15394 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 14:52:24 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:53:54 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <000e01c3223e$1943db20$5a0977d8@pavilion> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524131729.00b15390@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524141845.00af8598@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Of course, I wouldn't tell you! The other part is, if someone insists on telling you what they make or spend (or don't make or can't spend), you forbear telling them they are crass, but you change the subject as soon as possible. But to get back to clothes--really, with the modern mass market, how can you tell someone's income from their clothes? I've read magazine articles where pictures of some current style are shown at different prices and the garments look almost exactly the same. I remember _Vogue_ had an article, a few years ago when sheath minidresses were new again, that had pictures of about 30 with brand names and at prices from over $2,000 to $200, if I recall. Aside from minor variations in things like neckline shape and color, the dresses looked almost identical. And I could easily have found one for under $200, probably a lot less at a discount store. (I've never bought a sheath minidress, as I think it's a silly style, but I've certainly seen them in stores.) A hair salon I used to go to subscribed to a magazine that had a column titled something like "Under $100." They'd show a designer garment costing several thousand dollars, or a picture of something very expensive on a celebrity at the Oscars and suchlike--then next to it some off-the-rack version for under $100. I noticed the knockoffs tended to be made of synthetics, but you could still buy a natural-fiber version of the style for way less than several thousand dollars. And anyone who sews well can make a couture quality garment pretty cheap. Although, admittedly, most modern women (and men) don't sew. Fran At 02:47 PM 5/24/2003 -0700, you wrote: >So how much money have you got Fran?? > >Just kidding! > >Lisa > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 18:42:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OMfpHP006036 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 18:42:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OMg5Uw002131 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 16:42:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OMg4lI010791; Sat, 24 May 2003 16:42:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net (albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.120]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4OMg2lI010736 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 16:42:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-008-001.jps.net ([216.119.8.1] helo=pavilion) by albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19JhiD-0002qJ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 24 May 2003 15:42:01 -0700 Message-ID: <000601c32247$a2f9ad00$010877d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524131729.00b15390@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524141845.00af8598@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net> Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 15:55:54 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] Couture clothing......was Clothes make the (wo)man... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > And anyone who sews well can make a couture quality garment pretty > cheap. Although, admittedly, most modern women (and men) don't sew. > > Fran > That's it. Good quality clothes fit properly. You might get the same style of clothing from Sears, but a more upmarket brand will fit better. Mass produced clothes have many more layers of fabric rolled on top of each other before cutting so the potential for becoming off grain is greater. Quality manufactures lay fewer layers of fabric down but that takes more time and therefore costs more money. Sometimes these sorts of differences don't show up until you wear the garment a few times. If you sew yourself, you can produce couture quality if you know how. Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 19:08:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ON88HP006098 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 19:08:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ON9qUw004090 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 17:09:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ON9oYZ023190; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:09:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4ON9mYZ023168 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 17:09:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 14952 invoked from network); 24 May 2003 23:09:47 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 24 May 2003 23:09:47 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-52.sonic.net [209.148.115.52]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4ON9kH13959 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 16:09:46 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524160619.00ab89f0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 16:11:17 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Couture clothing......was Clothes make the (wo)man... In-Reply-To: <000601c32247$a2f9ad00$010877d8@pavilion> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524131729.00b15390@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524141845.00af8598@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think all the sleeveless sheath minidresses in the _Vogue_layout were off the rack, standard sizes, meaning there were people they would not fit. (Probably me, for one.) Also, I just can't conceive that anyone who bought the $2,000 minidress would get 10 times more value than the person who bought the $200 minidress. Of course, the pictures didn't show the insides. Unfortunately most people don't know the difference anyway. It's the sewers you see looking at the threads hanging off mass-market seams and saying "I can do better." Fran At 03:55 PM 5/24/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > > > And anyone who sews well can make a couture quality garment pretty > > cheap. Although, admittedly, most modern women (and men) don't sew. > > > > Fran > > >That's it. Good quality clothes fit properly. You might get the same style >of clothing from Sears, but a more upmarket brand will fit better. Mass >produced clothes have many more layers of fabric rolled on top of each other >before cutting so the potential for becoming off grain is greater. Quality >manufactures lay fewer layers of fabric down but that takes more time and >therefore costs more money. Sometimes these sorts of differences don't show >up until you wear the garment a few times. If you sew yourself, you can >produce couture quality if you know how. > >Lisa > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 24 23:13:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P3D9HP007072 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 23:13:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P3DFUw022808 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 24 May 2003 21:13:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P3DDsn008815; Sat, 24 May 2003 21:13:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.atl.registeredsite.com (nobody@mail1.atl.registeredsite.com [64.224.219.75]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P3DBso008794 verify=FAIL) for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 21:13:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from libra.hosting4u.net (libra.hosting4u.net [209.35.191.113]) h4P3DAJs026854 for ; Sat, 24 May 2003 23:13:11 -0400 Received: from ctrlalt ([68.49.214.150]) by libra.hosting4u.net ; Sat, 24 May 2003 22:13:07 -0500 From: "A.Thurman" To: "Historic Costume List \(E-mail\)" Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 23:12:52 -0400 Message-ID: <054101c3226b$8873ee90$336f6f6f@systemsfirm.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal X-Rcpt-To: Subject: [h-cost] Judging by the clothes you wear, etc. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I finally caught up on my digests, and am loving this conversation! I'm probably hitting a lot of threads at once here, so bear with me: 1) Uniforms in schools - I'm actually in favor of them, on the grounds that it can decrease fashion competition and simply make things easier. Kids should be allowed to be creative, but let them do that in their after school/weekend clothes - that way they're not subject to any arbitrary school dress codes when they choose things for themselves. 2) Variations of historic dress for the workplace: My favorite suit is a 1940's fitted jacket that fits like a dream, combined with a pair of pants I made to match. I often dress VERY blandly for work (for comfort as well as ease of getting dressed in the morning), but I've been thinking that a fitted doublet or an 18th c. women's waistcoat could make very nice cover ups for the office (I'm cold year round because of either weather or air conditioning so I'm always looking for something other than yet another cardigan!) 3) Clothing as personal expression in the workplace: I am on the more conservative side; I can see the argument of a business that insists that you follow their dress code - when you're at work, you're on THEIR time, representing that company and they have the right to control their corporate image. Having said this, I think that people who don't deal with the customer DO have a right to dress as comfortably as possible - telling network techs that they can't wear jeans is BARBARIC! And - if a workplace has a dress code THAT restrictive, you should ask yourself if you want to be working there anyway! 4) Dressing really flashy for whatever occasion (ex: prom dress to the video store): I admire folks like this for their outrageous confidence and creativity! I subscribe to a magazine called "Street Fashion" that simply profiles what club kids and other "alternative" types wear everyday, and it is often more inspiring than seeing what famous designers come up with twice a year! I wish I could dress like that more often - regrettably I don't have the energy or wardrobe to come up with something innovative every day. I tend to be either extremely basic (black and white for the office, jeans and tees for at home) or go all out (sci-fi or historical costumes, funky club gear, big boots), with extremely basic being the default because it requires less thought. Will probably post more if/as I think of it...this is a fascinating topic! Allison T. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 02:39:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6dMHP008144 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 02:39:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6aWUw006068 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 00:36:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6aQYP026884; Sun, 25 May 2003 00:36:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail5.mn.rr.com (fe5.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6aIYP026765 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 00:36:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.mn.rr.com ([24.26.188.145]) by mail5.mn.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:34:49 -0500 Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: dannw@smtp-server.mn.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 01:36:54 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) In-Reply-To: <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 11:18 AM 5/24/2003 -0400, you wrote: >In a message dated 5/24/2003 10:00:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, >drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: > > > In all i must say, that it was very popular to use pastel colours. > > > >But then there IS that portrait of De Pompador in a dark teal blue [or >green....I've only seen reproductions of the painting and the colors vary >a lot] >with pink roses and ribbons all over it. James Acheson reproduces it for >Glenn >Close in "Dangerous Liaisons"...the scene in the salon with the castrate >singing >Handel. Thanks for everyone's opinions - I had a feeling that the blue would be wrong for the 18th century. However, I was thinking of "La Declaration d'Amour" by J.-F. de Troy from 1731. (Fig.25 of Ribeiro's Dress in Eighteenth Century Europe 1715-1789) There is a woman wearing a dark greenish-blue saque with large coral pink roses which I thought might be perfect if I overdyed the blue silk with a dark green. Opinions? There is a slightly lighter shade of blue worn in C. Phillips "A Tea-Party at Lord Harrington's" 1730 (fig 20 in Ribeiro) but almost the same shade as my silk is worn by "Charles, Prince of the Asturias, later King of Naples and Sicily; and then Charles II of Spain" 1724. (fig 9 Ribeiro). However, I've noticed that a lot of the figures wearing blue are wearing a softer shade of blue. Does anyone know what colour remover does to silk? I would like to achieve a shade like: http://cgfa.sunsite.dk/m/p-meyer1.htm Cheers, Danielle _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 02:42:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6g1HP008149 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 02:42:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6gXUw006596 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 00:42:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6gWYP000118; Sun, 25 May 2003 00:42:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6gUYP000101 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 00:42:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A60F96F006A; Sun, 25 May 2003 01:43:27 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A5CD655013C; Sun, 25 May 2003 01:42:21 -0500 Message-ID: <002f01c32289$12ca0800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 02:44:21 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] OT: Computer help needed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Saturday afternoon, I downloaded my email in Outlook Express. I really didn't pay to much attention. Saturday evening, I downloaded my mail and noticed everything that I downloaded in the afternoon was date 6/24/07... June 24, 2007. The mail I downloaded in the evening was the correct date and year. Has anyone had this happen before? If so, what was the problem. We checked the date on my computer and it is correct. I ran Norton's Anti-virus and came up clean. I have no idea what is going on. If you can help me, please write personally at penny@costumegallery.com . Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 03:51:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P7phHP008277 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 03:51:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6iDUw006681 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 00:44:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6iCYP000790; Sun, 25 May 2003 00:44:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail7.mn.rr.com (fe7.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.162.160]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4P6iAYP000783 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 00:44:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.mn.rr.com ([24.26.188.145]) by mail7.mn.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sun, 25 May 2003 01:43:10 -0500 Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525014404.02d73d80@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: dannw@smtp-server.mn.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 01:49:13 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) In-Reply-To: <006d01c32226$b716c410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> References: <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:00 PM 5/24/2003 +0200, you wrote: >Hello. >You are right, yes, and there are also many other dark coloured fabrics. But >most of them are printed or floral and i was talking about solid colours. >I have a lot of troubble two when my costumers already has chosen a colour. >One of my largest mistakes, was the orange large panier dress. When i se it >today, i say HORRORS, how could you do it!!!! >You learn a lot, all the time! > >Bjarne Yes but, I love orange and would happily wear it anyway. : ) That and your wonderful orange with black detail Regency gown that was in that castle display. : ) Cheers, Danielle _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 09:41:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PDexHP021172 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 09:41:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PDfPUw007883 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 07:41:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PDfJGC010080; Sun, 25 May 2003 07:41:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r08.mx.aol.com (imo-r08.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.104]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PDfGGC010048 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 07:41:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Miscmal@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 7.9c.31987868 (18251) for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 09:41:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Miscmal@aol.com Message-ID: <9c.31987868.2c0221f1@aol.com> Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 09:41:05 EDT To: h-costume@net.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Cheeptrims X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Delurking here: Cheeptrims.com has just added new items and jacquards to their website. There are some yummy new things to see and buy. Just in case some of you need something to spend money on. Lyonet mka Mischele _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 10:58:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PEwWHP021421 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 10:58:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PEx2Uw014934 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 08:59:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PEx02Q013465; Sun, 25 May 2003 08:59:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PEww2Q013454 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 08:58:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (00217146@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.11.5/8.11.5) with ESMTP id h4PEwwj152654 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 09:58:58 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 09:58:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Emma Elizabeth Lehman <00217146@bigred.unl.edu> To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] sewing for self, revisited. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would like to thank all of you who read and/or responded to my rant on how I can't sew for myself. In the two (three?) weeks since then, I got one complete outfit for myself completed and one partial one: my take on the GFD, including gown, load-bearing underdress (I elected to separate the layers instead of having one lined layer) and veil, and an Elizabethan kirtle (which will eventually have a new corset, new farthingale, and a doublet) and adorable little linen caul. By setting myself concrete goals (renfest one weekend, crown tourney the next) and drafting friends to help I got past some of the worst of my hang-ups! Thank you all! Emma _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 13:05:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PH5EHP021742 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 13:05:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PH6tUw023669 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 11:06:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PH6raV004368; Sun, 25 May 2003 11:06:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4PH6faV004241 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 11:06:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 2381 invoked from network); 25 May 2003 17:06:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail1.inreach.com) (209.142.2.50) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 25 May 2003 17:06:41 -0000 Received: from 209.209.19.85 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Sun, 25 May 2003 10:06:41 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1107.209.209.19.85.1053882401.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 10:06:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] shocking new fashion From: To: In-Reply-To: <000001c321bf$1f1c89e0$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> References: <000001c321bf$1f1c89e0$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Here's something new~! > > http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,58914,00.html > > I like it, for the 'shock value' of course! Not a bad little invention if you live some place like New York or another big city! Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 13:05:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PH5mHP021747 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 13:05:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PH7XUw023729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 11:07:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PH7WaV004715; Sun, 25 May 2003 11:07:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law8-oe44.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.16]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PH6xaV004389 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 11:07:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 25 May 2003 10:06:54 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by law8-oe44.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Sun, 25 May 2003 17:06:54 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002f01c32289$12ca0800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Computer help needed Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 13:06:40 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 May 2003 17:06:54.0842 (UTC) FILETIME=[0AF605A0:01C322E0] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Might be the server, might be a weird glitch. Frankly, it could be about anything. If it doesn't show up again, just forget about it, it most likely isn't your fault or related to a serious problem. It's just a windows gnome doing its job :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 2:44 AM Subject: [h-cost] OT: Computer help needed > Saturday afternoon, I downloaded my email in Outlook Express. I really > didn't pay to much attention. Saturday evening, I downloaded my mail and > noticed > everything that I downloaded in the afternoon was date 6/24/07... June 24, > 2007. The mail I downloaded in the evening was the correct date and year. > Has > anyone had this happen before? If so, what was the problem. > > We checked the date on my computer and it is correct. I ran Norton's > Anti-virus and came up clean. I have no idea what is going on. > > If you can help me, please write personally at penny@costumegallery.com . > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 14:22:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIMrHP021897 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 14:22:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIOaUw001095 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 12:24:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIOXAU011063; Sun, 25 May 2003 12:24:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIOUAU011047 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 12:24:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.186] (pm5-186.eos.net [205.133.149.186]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA03319 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 14:24:28 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 14:18:47 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305251801.h4PI0tAV000515@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] clarification X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Especially for Nicole: That dratted humor problem strikes again! I did read your whole post, Nicole darling. I just thought the idea that Americans weren't free to express themselves through their clothes was funny. Our country is huge. People from state to state, not to mention city to city and county to county, have completely different standards of dress. Some places are very rigid, some are completely flexible. And of course some people are naturally more timid than others. You, I think, are the sort of person who would wear whatever she wanted even if she lived in Maoist China. Or at least, if the thought of prison worried you, you would wear something cool under your Mao jacket. Am I right? Anyway, the idea of being rigidly controlled in my clothing choices is certainly not my reality. And I am not as bold as you are. Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 14:29:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PITTHP021909 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 14:29:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIVAUw001564 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 12:31:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIV9AU013891; Sun, 25 May 2003 12:31:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cgpf2.cgp.netins.net (f2phy.netins.net [167.142.229.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIV6AU013868 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 12:31:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [167.142.12.51] (HELO herselftifhj9g) by cgpf2.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9) with SMTP id 342317269 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 25 May 2003 13:31:05 -0500 Message-ID: <022901c322eb$e69836e0$330c8ea7@herselftifhj9g> From: "Land of Oz" To: "Historical Costume" References: <29.407f50f9.2bfe2cdf@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Costume Interest Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 13:31:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > At my school, we wore uniform until the last two years, when we were > expected to wear reasonably smart, "office-type" clothing. They had > this rule, you could wear "smart denim trousers" but not "jeans". Never > did figure out the difference! > I'd say "jeans" would be constructed with patch pockets, rivets on stress points and those thick top-stitched seams; "denim trousers" would be constructed like men's or women's dress pants---no patch pockets, rivets, heavy seams or top stitching. My tailoring terms are lacking, but I see a big difference in the front pockets too, horizontal vs. vertical openings. It's actually an interesting point in terms of "dress codes" --- drawing the line at "denim" could be a tad vague, depending on the definition used. I think most dress codes are supposed to encourage a Certain Look, and it *is* possible to make a classic tailored garment from lighter weights of denim fabric. But, I suppose if you are going out of your way to question the nuances of a dress code, you'd probably be happier working (or attending) some place else, eh? Denise landofoz@netins.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 14:35:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIZnHP021933 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 14:35:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIaIUw001942 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 12:36:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIaHAU016438; Sun, 25 May 2003 12:36:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bigred.unl.edu (bigred.unl.edu [129.93.1.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIaEAU016409 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 12:36:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (00217146@localhost) by bigred.unl.edu (8.11.5/8.11.5) with ESMTP id h4PIaE2190672 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 13:36:14 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 13:36:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Emma Elizabeth Lehman <00217146@bigred.unl.edu> To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030523175923.64617.qmail@web41104.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] being judged/class X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO does anybody ever admit to being *other* than middle class? Aside from the obvious extremeties, with Bill Gates on one end and the homeless on the other. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 14:51:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIpiHP021963 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 14:51:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIoqUw002954 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 12:50:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIopAU022395; Sun, 25 May 2003 12:50:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PIolAU022360 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 12:50:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f16.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.22]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id AAB285EE105 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 20:50:45 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000701c322ef$1ce3b8c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 20:54:46 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Danielle. I have tryed to help you as best as i can, and i have run trough all my books. Then i found a solid blue dress. L.A County Museum of Art has catalog nr. 41 Frehch Robe a la Francaise in Blue Moiré c. 1750 -60. It is very beautifull with a full pleated back over panier. I would call the blue colour something like Delft Blue, not electric royal blue, but nearly. If you would like, i would gladly scan a full colour picture of the back of the dress. I also looked in Barbara Johnsons Album of Fashions, and found some blue colours, and a printed one where the motifs was almost electric blue. If i were you, i would do the dress, if you have a dream of making one. But if you want to be perfect, i would stick to your plans of either try to bleach the colour a little, or overdye it with green. That green you are talking about was very fashionable. But if you could bleach the colour, i am sure it would end up being a stunning beautifull blue, i have that feeling. When Barry Lyndon was made, Ulla Britt Söderlund was making costumes for it, and she told me, she had boiled some of the silk fabrics, to get the right colours........... Anyway, what ever you do, please let us hear how it goes, i am very interrested in your projekt. Good luck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Danielle Nunn-Weinberg" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 8:36 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) > At 11:18 AM 5/24/2003 -0400, you wrote: > >In a message dated 5/24/2003 10:00:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > >drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: > > > > > In all i must say, that it was very popular to use pastel colours. > > > > > > >But then there IS that portrait of De Pompador in a dark teal blue [or > >green....I've only seen reproductions of the painting and the colors vary > >a lot] > >with pink roses and ribbons all over it. James Acheson reproduces it for > >Glenn > >Close in "Dangerous Liaisons"...the scene in the salon with the castrate > >singing > >Handel. > > Thanks for everyone's opinions - I had a feeling that the blue would be > wrong for the 18th century. > > However, I was thinking of "La Declaration d'Amour" by J.-F. de Troy from > 1731. (Fig.25 of Ribeiro's Dress in Eighteenth Century Europe > 1715-1789) There is a woman wearing a dark greenish-blue saque with large > coral pink roses which I thought might be perfect if I overdyed the blue > silk with a dark green. Opinions? > > There is a slightly lighter shade of blue worn in C. Phillips "A Tea-Party > at Lord Harrington's" 1730 (fig 20 in Ribeiro) but almost the same shade as > my silk is worn by "Charles, Prince of the Asturias, later King of Naples > and Sicily; and then Charles II of Spain" 1724. (fig 9 Ribeiro). However, > I've noticed that a lot of the figures wearing blue are wearing a softer > shade of blue. Does anyone know what colour remover does to silk? I would > like to achieve a shade like: http://cgfa.sunsite.dk/m/p-meyer1.htm > > Cheers, > Danielle > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 18:51:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PMp7HP022550 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 18:51:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PMqRUw022615 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 16:52:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PMqMj9010993; Sun, 25 May 2003 16:52:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp1.pacifier.net (smtp1.pacifier.net [64.255.237.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PMqKj9010977 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 16:52:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from KatHouse (ip43.125-173-207.eli-du.nwlink.com [207.173.125.43]) by smtp1.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A41076F290 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 15:52:18 -0700 (PDT) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 15:51:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged/class Message-ID: <3ED0E68F.19909.20923E83@localhost> Priority: normal References: <20030523175923.64617.qmail@web41104.mail.yahoo.com> In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > does anybody ever admit to being *other* than middle class? Aside > from the obvious extremeties, with Bill Gates on one end and the > homeless on the other. I'm definitely middle class. I grew up lower middle class and now am firmly in the middle of the middle class with a time when I was upper middle class. So, yes people do admit to being middle class. ;) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 18:57:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PMvmHP022561 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 18:57:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PMxYUw023324 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 16:59:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PMxXJf014695; Sun, 25 May 2003 16:59:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp2.pacifier.net (smtp2.pacifier.net [64.255.237.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4PMxVJf014666 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 16:59:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from KatHouse (ip43.125-173-207.eli-du.nwlink.com [207.173.125.43]) by smtp2.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 701D46A6F3 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 15:59:29 -0700 (PDT) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 15:59:31 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged/class Message-ID: <3ED0E863.21032.20996217@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3ED0E68F.19909.20923E83@localhost> References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > does anybody ever admit to being *other* than middle class? Aside > > from the obvious extremeties, with Bill Gates on one end and the > > homeless on the other. > > I'm definitely middle class. I grew up lower middle class and now am > firmly in the middle of the middle class with a time when I was upper > middle class. > > So, yes people do admit to being middle class. ;) Oops. I guess I misread that entirely. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 21:11:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q1BlHP022820 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:11:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q1DVUw004992 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 19:13:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q1DTw7018950; Sun, 25 May 2003 19:13:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m08.mx.aol.com (imo-m08.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.163]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q1DRw7018916 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 19:13:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from LoreleiMorte@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id r.113.23d2c6c2 (3924); Sun, 25 May 2003 21:13:18 -0400 (EDT) From: LoreleiMorte@aol.com Message-ID: <113.23d2c6c2.2c02c42e@aol.com> Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 21:13:18 EDT To: SCA-Garb@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 cc: elizabethanclothing@yahoogroups.com cc: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Dress Pics X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My wool middle class is all done. I put pictures up on the ol' dress diary. They aren't the best quality in the world, but, well, there they are :) http://members.aol.com/loreleimorte/middone.html -Sarra Wryght Elizabethan Dress Journals: http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/index.html Live Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 21:34:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q1YpHP022889 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:34:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q1a3Uw006439 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 19:36:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q1a2w7029552; Sun, 25 May 2003 19:36:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q1Zxw7029480 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 19:35:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a260.in-tch.com [66.62.107.60]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4Q1HWH27471 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 19:17:33 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED16FD7.F4009B4D@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 19:37:27 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Pics References: <113.23d2c6c2.2c02c42e@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It looks very nice--looks like it fits well, etc., etc. Congratulations on a job well done. --Sue LoreleiMorte@aol.com wrote: > > My wool middle class is all done. I put pictures up on the ol' dress diary. > They aren't the best quality in the world, but, well, there they are :) > > http://members.aol.com/loreleimorte/middone.html > > -Sarra Wryght > Elizabethan Dress Journals: http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/index.html > Live Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 22:01:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q21nHP022998 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 22:01:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q23TUw008440 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 20:03:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q23NAc014092; Sun, 25 May 2003 20:03:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q23LAd014071 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 20:03:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty5211.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.250.211]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4Q1t2N2008441 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:55:02 -0400 Message-ID: <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 21:54:02 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, All. OK, you got me hooked on this thread, darn ya ;) Regarding guys versions of what you describe, we do make comments about each other's clothing, depending on the situation. One single guy I work with, who is in good shape considering his age (mid 40s), usually dresses in clothing that emphasizes his physique (tight shirts, tight jeans, etc.). We will sometimes tease him about his "hunting" attire, and some women, who would have been otherwise interested in him, thought him too flashy or fastidiously dressed to have been straight (which opens up another can-o-worms, the topic of which can best be discussed elsewhere). We will also occasionally note out loud if someone of us is gaining weight ("Hey, how many months along are you?"). I have an obvious lack of hair on top of my head, which will occasion commentary (sad to say, nothing unique or original). Maybe it is me (I don't think so), but I think that a lot of guys "bust b***s" with each other. I think that men take the criticism less seriously, especially as we get older. At the root of it is perhaps the socialogical need (created by our society but rooted in physiological causes) for women to remain attractive as they get older, since it is they that attract and, inevitably choose or reject men from a group of possible suitors, which is physiologically wierd, since men remain able to reproduce much longer than women. Modern men's suitability as they get older is less rooted in looks and more in wealth and stability. "Power-suits" aside, women have more variance (note that I didn't say "flexibility", something altogether different) in their attire, both professionally and socially. I don't ever remember feeling "insecure" about weight gain (I have perfect weight for my height, it's just not distributed exactly where I want it ;) ), but I have felt, or been made to feel out of place wearing certain things at certain times. Males seem to deal with that differently, though. We size up the "opposition", and unless the scales are tipped massively in the other guy's favor (either physically or socially, think Arnold S. or a company VP) we usually snarl and growl (in a socially acceptable way, sarcastically, homorously or some such) and go on about our biz. It is a lot different when you are young, though. The world is different. You are untried, untested, all you have is your outward show. You have no scars (or for that matter, snappy comebacks). You need the comfort that clothing and status gives. Wierd animals, us, but then.... Mike T. PS, regarding the "identity" thing, and whether guys base theirs on their appearance, if they say "no" they are bulls****ers of the first order. If you can identify a guy's interests in music, sports, leisure activities, etc. by the clothing that they wear, or how they wear their hair, jewelry (or not), etc. , then they are identifying themselves. Think of any stereotype male, and you can ID them by their dress, unless they are required by the job to wear something else. Just as a drill, think of these buzzwords; "jock", "redneck", "surfer", "college kid", "Gen-Xer", "Goth", "yuppie". If an image comes to mind that includes clothing, and someone you know fits the profile, they are "identifying" MJT > Being female, it's hard for me to tell. > > When asked whether they care about their own clothes, most men have > told me that they don't care very much. Obviously they're not naked, > but they claim not to base their identities on their appearance. I > don't know how you guys act among yourselves. Do you hang around and > make snide remarks about how so-and-so gained five pounds, so-and-so's > clothes are out of style, and so-and-so has a crummy haircut? Or > about how insecure you feel all day if you're not dressed exactly > right, or because you gained five pounds? > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 22:57:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q2viHP023354 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 22:57:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q2uRUw012340 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 20:56:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q2uQwB010501; Sun, 25 May 2003 20:56:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q2uNwC010488 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 20:56:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty5211.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.250.211]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4Q2uON2001802 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 22:56:26 -0400 Message-ID: <3ED18211.1090602@dandy.net> Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 22:55:13 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] catherine wheel farthingale References: <007f01c32229$8a0bd2a0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, All. Bjarne, is it possible that the reference in your book meant stuffed stomachs on men's garments? Doublets towards the end of the 16th Cent. had bombasted panels in front that gave men an exaggerated silhouette. Incidentally, though, I found an engraving on pg 107 of "Le costume des Tudors a Louis XIII" by James Laver that shows a man and a woman standing together. It is labelled "Giacomo Franco vers 1580". The woman is facing the man, and her waist seems to be slightly bombasted. Her gown is structured similarly to the loose gown shown in Arnold (Nu. 45, pg 112), except that the sleeves are long and split down the outside. Her waist seems to be girdled with some sort of braided cord, but whether it helps cause the shaping or not is unknown. The text about the plate says "Giacomo Franco, couple de danseurs (Gravure. Paris, Cab. d'est. du Louvre) Gravure tir'ee d'un ouvrage venitien paru en 1581 et intitule' Il Ballarino. Les costumes des danses Italiennes, ont ete imites en France. Chez la femme, des manches collantes recouvertes par d' autres fendues. L'homme porte une casaque en forme de cuirasse et un collet court. Le haut-de-chausses est trousse". They talk about the shape of the man's clothing, but there is no note regarding the woman's, besides that of the sleeves (unless my poor French is poorer than I thought...). She does not seem to be wearing a farthingale under this gown, though. I would be glad to post the illo to you if you have a place to put it up for examination. Cheers, Mike T. >As i read a danish book about the fashion in Renaissance nordic countries, a >book written in 1930ies, there was referenses for the french word "Fessus" >wich meens "bum rolls" and then there were referenses for " stuffed >stomachs, not stomachers, but stomachs, and i have never seen a picture with >a lady with a stuffed stomach. And i thoaght if this could be a small >cussion or something, wich is taken under the pointed bodice, to make it >rest on the farthingale? > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 23:25:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q3PQHP023649 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 23:25:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q3R7Uw014874 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 21:27:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q3R6wB026773; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:27:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.vaxxine.com (alpha.vaxxine.com [209.5.212.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q3R3wB026736 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:27:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alderweb.vaxxine.com (ppp155.digi-t3.st-cath.niagara.net [209.5.215.155]) by alpha.vaxxine.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4Q3PcfK020948 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 23:25:39 -0400 (EDT) X-RCPT-To: Message-Id: <4.3.0.20030525225648.00e58940@pop.vaxxine.com> X-Sender: alderweb@pop.vaxxine.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3 Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 23:34:09 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: David Webb Subject: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> References: <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings: Lone dissenting voice - I disagree that the royal blue wouldn't be appropriate for an 18 c. gown. I seem to remember seeing many examples of strong blues in both actual gowns, fabric samples and art of the period.My problem is that all my books and notes are in storage while we put an addition on our house, so it's difficult for me to prove it right now. I have been keeping an eye for examples of strong blues in order to justify my own purchase of a bright blue-green shot-silk (influenced by a friend) a few years ago, yet to be completed, sigh! Off the top of my head, Copley painted three portraits of ladies in the same, presumably "studio" gown which was a strong, deep blue. I'm also positive that in the textile history book that came out in the mid- 90's - (hardcover, colour reproductions of period sample books, book to die for, textile bible,etc.- someone on the list must reccognize my description!) anyways, I remember at least one or more brilliant blue lutestring sample in that one. There was also that reproduction of that 18th c. Scandinavian book - Norst-something that was published about 2000 that included dozens of fabric samples. When we were cruising the British art galleries and museums, I often noted by the strong colours used in the depictions of the gowns for some eras of the eighteenth century, including a flaming red gown in a Hogarth portrait. Besides, IF I ever finish this gown, and IF we ever get to another French & Indian War event, then I might not be the only blindingly brilliant sacque there, and that would be such a comfort. "Curulean"-ly yours, Sheridan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 23:41:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q3fiHP023705 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 23:41:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q3hTUw016545 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 21:43:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q3hSwB005587; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:43:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4Q3hNwB005540 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:43:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 25226 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 03:43:23 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 03:43:23 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-230.sonic.net [209.148.112.230]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4Q3hMg11535 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 20:43:22 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030525204432.00af9bf0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 20:44:53 -0700 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Lavolta Press Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] Check out these Italian silk brocades X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.hyenaproductions.com/store+dupioni+stripes+plaids2.htm Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun May 25 23:59:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q3xJHP023729 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 23:59:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q40tUw018102 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 22:00:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q40s1h014021; Sun, 25 May 2003 22:00:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q40p1h014005 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 22:00:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFH005GJ75EB7@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:00:51 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 20:52:18 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Check out these Italian silk brocades In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030525204432.00af9bf0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030525205204.02cebd60@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/23/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 08:44 PM 5/25/2003 -0700, you wrote: >http://www.hyenaproductions.com/store+dupioni+stripes+plaids2.htm Yummy... thanks for the link. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 00:08:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q483HP023747 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 00:08:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q48SUw018569 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 22:08:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q48R1h016827; Sun, 25 May 2003 22:08:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q48P1h016809 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 22:08:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFH00MQQ7HY48@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 25 May 2003 21:08:23 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 21:00:54 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Pics In-reply-to: <113.23d2c6c2.2c02c42e@aol.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030525205829.02cebd60@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/23/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:13 PM 5/25/2003 -0400, you wrote: >My wool middle class is all done. I put pictures up on the ol' dress diary. >They aren't the best quality in the world, but, well, there they are :) > >http://members.aol.com/loreleimorte/middone.html > >-Sarra Wryght Sarra The dress is lovely. It looks very good on you. Congratulations on a job well done. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 01:46:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q5krHP023999 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 01:46:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q5mZUw024799 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sun, 25 May 2003 23:48:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q5mXP0028883; Sun, 25 May 2003 23:48:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80408.mail.yahoo.com (web80408.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.63]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4Q5mUP0028857 for ; Sun, 25 May 2003 23:48:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030526054825.63967.qmail@web80408.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.205.185.216] by web80408.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 25 May 2003 22:48:25 PDT Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 22:48:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Check out these Italian silk brocades To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030525204432.00af9bf0@pop.sonic.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yowza! I particularly like the blue and fuschia stripe. Something to keep an eye open for the next time I'm digging through the shops in L.A. Thanks for the link. Dawn ("Bad taste costs no more.") --- Lavolta Press wrote: > http://www.hyenaproductions.com/store+dupioni+stripes+plaids2.htm > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 02:06:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q665HP025745 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 02:06:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q66bUw026170 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 00:06:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q66aEj006931; Mon, 26 May 2003 00:06:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80410.mail.yahoo.com (web80410.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4Q66WEj006828 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 00:06:33 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030526060627.48313.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.205.185.216] by web80410.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 25 May 2003 23:06:27 PDT Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 23:06:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <4.3.0.20030525225648.00e58940@pop.vaxxine.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO No longer alone. Your comment about your books being packed jogged my memory, and I checked my copy of "An Elegant Art: Fashion and Fantasy in the 18th Century" (Maeder, 1983). Page 121 is Plate 47, of a sack-back gown with the following description: DRESS, France, c.1750-1760 Blue silk moire; padded and puckered robings with fly fringe tgrim; double sleeve rufffles; linen lined bodice. cb: 65 3/8" (165.5 cm) Mrjs. Alice F. Schott Bequest M.67.8.71 The dress is a very strong blue. In the same book are also two corsets that are bright blue, and bright blue with yellow ribbon trim. All of these items are in the costume collection of the Los Angeles County Museum of Art. This is especially helpful, because Elegant Art only has a photo of the back of the blue gown. However, if you contact LACMA, they may have photos of the front available. Dawn --- David Webb wrote: > Greetings: > > Lone dissenting voice - I disagree that the royal > blue wouldn't be > appropriate > for an 18 c. gown. I seem to remember seeing many > examples of strong blues > in both actual gowns, fabric samples and art of the > period.My problem is that > all my books and notes are in storage while we put > an addition on our house, > so it's difficult for me to prove it right now. > > I have been keeping an eye for examples of strong > blues in order to > justify my own purchase of a bright blue-green > shot-silk (influenced by > a friend) a few years ago, yet to be completed, > sigh! > > Off the top of my head, Copley painted three > portraits of ladies in the same, > presumably "studio" gown which was a strong, deep > blue. I'm also positive > that in the textile history book that came out in > the mid- 90's - (hardcover, > colour reproductions of period sample books, book to > die for, textile > bible,etc.- > someone on the list must reccognize my description!) > anyways, I remember > at least one or more brilliant blue lutestring > sample in that one. There was > also that reproduction of that 18th c. Scandinavian > book - Norst-something > that was published about 2000 that included dozens > of fabric samples. > > When we were cruising the British art galleries and > museums, I often noted > by the strong colours used in the depictions of the > gowns for some eras of > the eighteenth century, including a flaming red gown > in a Hogarth portrait. > > Besides, IF I ever finish this gown, and IF we ever > get to another French & > Indian War event, then I might not be the only > blindingly brilliant sacque > there, and that would be such a comfort. > > "Curulean"-ly yours, > > Sheridan > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 04:13:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q8DqHP008514 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 04:13:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q8FXUw004406 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 02:15:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q8FVdU001814; Mon, 26 May 2003 02:15:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4Q8FSdU001793 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 02:15:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD5A8D70072; Mon, 26 May 2003 03:16:26 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD1F10A01B8; Mon, 26 May 2003 03:15:27 -0500 Message-ID: <00f701c3235f$3cbd2580$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002f01c32289$12ca0800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Computer help needed Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 04:17:24 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks Audrey. I hope it is just a glitch. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 1:06 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Computer help needed > Might be the server, might be a weird glitch. > Frankly, it could be about anything. If it doesn't show up again, just > forget about it, it most likely isn't your fault or related to a serious > problem. It's just a windows gnome doing its job :-) > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Penny Ladnier" > To: "h-costume" > Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 2:44 AM > Subject: [h-cost] OT: Computer help needed > > > > Saturday afternoon, I downloaded my email in Outlook Express. I really > > didn't pay to much attention. Saturday evening, I downloaded my mail and > > noticed > > everything that I downloaded in the afternoon was date 6/24/07... June 24, > > 2007. The mail I downloaded in the evening was the correct date and year. > > Has > > anyone had this happen before? If so, what was the problem. > > > > We checked the date on my computer and it is correct. I ran Norton's > > Anti-virus and came up clean. I have no idea what is going on. > > > > If you can help me, please write personally at penny@costumegallery.com . > > > > Penny Ladnier > > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > > http://www.costumegallery.com > > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 06:37:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QAbGHP026785 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 06:37:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QAcwUw015748 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 04:38:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QAcuqi028776; Mon, 26 May 2003 04:38:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (mta7-svc.business.ntl.com [62.253.164.47]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QAcrqi028727 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 04:38:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Imedia5043 ([80.1.29.69]) by mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030526103851.VTFP13147.mta7-svc.business.ntl.com@Imedia5043> for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 11:38:51 +0100 Message-ID: <00a101c32372$f8c30480$451d0150@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> <4.3.0.20030525225648.00e58940@pop.vaxxine.com> Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 11:38:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I agree Just checking through the V&A silk book turns up some very strong blues both in plain and in pattern. I think as a rule we are far too safe in our fabric choices as most of these are pretty wild inc cheetah print, mad polka dot and something that can only be described as 1970's caravan furnishing fabrics Dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of Historical reproduction Clothing, Uniforms and Bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 > > > Lone dissenting voice - I disagree that the royal blue wouldn't be > appropriate > for an 18 c. gown. I seem to remember seeing many examples of strong blues > in both actual gowns, fabric samples and art of the period.My problem is that _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 12:33:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QGXgHP028259 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:33:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QGVbUw012298 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 10:31:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QGVUMc029787; Mon, 26 May 2003 10:31:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QGVQMc029724 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 10:31:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be6c.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.108]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 89B975EE1A9 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:31:24 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <005d01c323a4$e5f89c70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 18:36:03 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] being judged by clothes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > When asked whether they care about their own clothes, most men have > told me that they don't care very much. Obviously they're not naked, > but they claim not to base their identities on their appearance. I > don't know how you guys act among yourselves. Do you hang around and > make snide remarks about how so-and-so gained five pounds, so-and-so's > clothes are out of style, and so-and-so has a crummy haircut? Or > about how insecure you feel all day if you're not dressed exactly > right, or because you gained five pounds? > > > Sorry i had missed this two, and i have not followed who asked that question above. But, I must say, that i think women are very hush to eachother. I have noticed this, because at my work, we are only 3 men and the rest is women. And sometimes my fellow women workers forget that i am listening! Many of the women speak unwell of others while they are not there, and i dont think that we men do that. It is not that i want to be a saint or something, but i hate to speak ill of others, and especially when they are not there. At my work, we dont have much competition in clothing, because our job is to take care of old people and we have to change their diapers and wash them and so on, so our clothes must be used for frequently washing. Therefore we wear casual clothing, and only when we have a party, we can see wich style each of us uses. Perhaps because i have this job, and i am forsed to wear casual clothes, i particular like to dress well, when i have the oportunity to it. But i dont own a suit (modern :-)) and i dont have a tie. I like to wear nice pants and a nice belt, and some nice shirts. Perhaps a waistcoat. When i go to theater, i usually wear a silk shirt, black pants and a black waistcoat. About weight and people who gain weight, i dont make any remarks. You should have a look at Leif. He is a large man, and i love it as he is. I dont like to make any remarks about people who weight more than some of us, because i think it is up to each individual to have the right to have a look. We are all earth people, and all of us are unique individual persons. And have you noticed that some big people has the most charming manners and some have the most beautifull faces. But back to the question. Yes i think women can be very rude to eachother, and i know because i have worked with them for many years. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 12:43:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QGh6HP028284 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:43:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QGhcUw013685 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 10:43:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QGhbMc006897; Mon, 26 May 2003 10:43:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QGhYMc006856 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 10:43:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a245.in-tch.com [66.62.107.45]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4QGP6H25911 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 10:25:07 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED2448E.2E74458F@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 10:45:02 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Check out these Italian silk brocades References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030525204432.00af9bf0@pop.sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh, drooool! You are just *awful*, tempting us like that! To the list: would any of those dupionis be "okay" for a sacque dress? --sue Lavolta Press wrote: > > http://www.hyenaproductions.com/store+dupioni+stripes+plaids2.htm > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 14:09:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QI9dHP028833 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:09:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QI7eUw019824 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 12:07:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QI7cpi014955; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:07:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QI7Ypi014920 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:07:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.7) with ESMTP id h4QI7X4r000164 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 11:07:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [136.152.196.224] (tnt-1-32.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.196.224]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QI6auK028300 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 11:07:16 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 10:05:27 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 9:54 PM -0400 5/25/03, michael tartaglio wrote: >Hi, All. OK, you got me hooked on this thread, darn ya ;) Regarding >guys versions of what you describe, we do make comments about each >other's clothing, depending on the situation. One Thank you for holding up the male side in the clothing-gossip competition! :) I was quite certain that there were male equivalents for most of the behaviors being discussed previously, but it's much more useful to hear the specifics from the trenches, as it were, than for someone like me to speculate. Another thing, in general, to filter this whole thread through, is that the people telling the stories are going to be likely to be the people who have had the most memorable experiences in this area. So especially when looking cross-culturally, nobody's going to get a sense of what's "typical" in attitudes and behavior from the contents of this thread. Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 14:45:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QIjHHP028935 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:45:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QIjdUw022634 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 12:45:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QIjbpi002562; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:45:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QIjZpi002530 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:45:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 7460 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 18:45:34 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 18:45:34 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-170.sonic.net [209.148.112.170]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QIjXA05327 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 11:45:34 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526113743.00b16d30@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 11:47:05 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If someone points out that your hair or waistline is not what it used to be, does it make you feel genuinely insecure? If your hair or waistline or clothes look better than those of other men you know, do you feel superior? I mean, if you look just a little bit better, not that you're a movie star and they're really ugly. If you can point out some other guy is losing a bit of hair and yours is all there, do you feel you've scored a hit? If you feel you're just average looking, do you worry that women will not be attracted to you (assuming you're heterosexual and single)? Or instead, if you're successful, smart, or have other good qualities, do you feel that more than makes up for any deficiency in your looks? If you feel insecure about another guy being more successful or richer or smarter, does it make you feel better to point out some little flaw in his looks? If you and several other guys feel that you're all just average, and you know someone who's so wonderful in every respect that he makes you all feel inferior, do you feel better if you all gang up on him? Maybe you all feel less powerful as individuals, but if you can pick on him as a group you feel you've "won"? And do you gossip about the weight, hair, and clothes of other men who are not present? Or even utter strangers whose pictures you've seen? Women do all of that. Fran >We will also occasionally note out loud if someone of us is gaining weight >("Hey, how many months along are you?"). I have an obvious lack of hair on >top of my head, which will occasion commentary (sad to say, nothing unique >or original). Maybe it is me (I don't think so), but I think that a lot of >guys "bust b***s" with each other. I think that men take the criticism >less seriously, especially as we get older. Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QIrnHP028968 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:53:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QIr2Uw023083 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 12:53:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QIr1pi005649; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:53:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QIqvpi005611 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:52:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 9949 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 18:52:56 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 18:52:56 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-170.sonic.net [209.148.112.170]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QIquT17368 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 11:52:56 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526115201.02a5d8b8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 11:54:27 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: References: <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO However, when people get together for a clothes-bashing session on the net, whether it's what some vendor is selling on ebay or elsewhere, or what other people are wearing, note that the majority of the participants are women. Fran >Thank you for holding up the male side in the clothing-gossip competition! :) > >I was quite certain that there were male equivalents for most of the >behaviors being discussed previously, but it's much more useful to hear >the specifics from the trenches, as it were, than for someone like me to >speculate. Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 15:12:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJCmHP029066 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:12:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJC2Uw024333 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 13:12:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJC0UM013524; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:12:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QJBwUM013490 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:11:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 23491 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 19:11:58 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 19:11:58 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-170.sonic.net [209.148.112.170]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QJBvA27902 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:11:57 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526121219.00b16388@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 12:13:28 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I have an obvious lack of hair on top of my head, which will occasion > commentary (sad to say, nothing unique or original). "Watch your wives, you men of Rome, we bring the bald-headed lecher [Julius Caesar] home." Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 15:23:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJMuHP030173 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:22:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJM0Uw025174 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 13:22:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJLsUM017978; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:21:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net (albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.120]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJJwUM016928 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:20:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-28-138.o1.jps.net ([216.119.28.138] helo=pavilion) by albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19KNVl-0005Vu-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:19:57 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01c323bd$bff680a0$8a1c77d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526115201.02a5d8b8@pop.sonic.net> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 12:33:55 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] bashing listed ebay items X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I often wonder when I read the clothes bashing threads if the person who listed the garment on ebay might not just be a lurker on this list. :) People posting their creations to h-costume to share seem to be given a much more gentle hand and much more support. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 11:54 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest > However, when people get together for a clothes-bashing session on the net, > whether it's what some vendor is selling on ebay or elsewhere, or what > other people are wearing, note that the majority of the participants are > women. > > Fran > > > > >Thank you for holding up the male side in the clothing-gossip competition! :) > > > >I was quite certain that there were male equivalents for most of the > >behaviors being discussed previously, but it's much more useful to hear > >the specifics from the trenches, as it were, than for someone like me to > >speculate. > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 15:46:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJkeHP030481 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:46:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJhUUw027147 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 13:43:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJhTUM028575; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:43:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QJhQUM028560 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:43:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 27391 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 19:43:26 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 19:43:26 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-204.sonic.net [209.148.112.204]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QJhPA18662 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 12:43:25 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526123624.00ac3c88@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 12:44:56 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] bashing listed ebay items In-Reply-To: <000c01c323bd$bff680a0$8a1c77d8@pavilion> References: <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526115201.02a5d8b8@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Usually the bashers assume the seller isn't on the list where the items are being bashed. The game seems to depend on that. I've noticed that sellers who are openly on lists (they post) get bashed less often. Sometimes it turns out that they are on whichever list, though, or some friend tell them, and then they usually get upset. I admit I'm thoroughly sick of the female mode of competing by putting other people down (often ganging up to do so). And unlike achieving something themselves, it doesn't actually get them anywhere. I don't think I've suffered from female put-down myself any more than anyone else. Probably less, as I usually just tell whoever does it to me to buzz off. I don't see nearly as much of it in real life as on the net, I think because I don't associate with traditionally oriented women if I can avoid it. But on the net, I see so much of it, it makes some lists a major turnoff. Fran At 12:33 PM 5/26/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I often wonder when I read the clothes bashing threads if the person who >listed the garment on ebay might not just be a lurker on this list. :) >People posting their creations to h-costume to share seem to be given a much >more gentle hand and much more support. > >Lisa > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Lavolta Press" >To: "Historical Costume" >Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 11:54 AM >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest > > > > However, when people get together for a clothes-bashing session on the >net, > > whether it's what some vendor is selling on ebay or elsewhere, or what > > other people are wearing, note that the majority of the participants are > > women. > > > > Fran > > > > > > > > >Thank you for holding up the male side in the clothing-gossip >competition! :) > > > > > >I was quite certain that there were male equivalents for most of the > > >behaviors being discussed previously, but it's much more useful to hear > > >the specifics from the trenches, as it were, than for someone like me to > > >speculate. > > > > > > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 15:58:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJw5HP030502 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:58:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJt4Uw028038 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 13:55:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJt2Mi003897; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:55:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QJswUM003851 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:54:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h4QJswT4028803 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:54:58 -0400 Message-Id: <200305261954.h4QJswT4028803@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 19:51:39 -0000 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] bashing listed ebay items From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fran said, > However, when people get together for a clothes-bashing session on the > net, whether it's what some vendor is selling on ebay or elsewhere, or > what other people are wearing, note that the majority of the > participants are women. As far as I know, the majority of members of h-costume are women! Any idea of the proportion of male-to-female bashing wersus the demographics of the group? I belong to the Revlist, where there seems to be a majority of men. Products are discussed, but generally not to the point of bashing. On the other hand, comments have been harsh in the past and we've been guided by the list moderators to be kinder and to resolve our disputes directly. Comments on a well-subscribed list can very quickly affect a merchant's reputation. Lisa said: > People posting their creations to h-costume to share seem to be given a much > more gentle hand and much more support. Yes, as well as someone who posts a link and asks what others think of the quality or appropriateness of the item. And there's a difference between e-Bay (usually unique items) and a vendor who is making and selling multiples of a product. Some e-Bay items are not described correctly due to the seller not knowing what they have, and information is shared as buyer beware. Other things are just too funny to be missed, like the repro 18thC gown worn backwards by the model. Comments to a vendor can be about as welcome as unsolicited advice to another person at an event. If the vendor has a market, they'll keep selling and may not care about the opinions. Sometimes the best we can do is have written standards for our groups, mentor the new members, support costume symposia, and remind people to research for themselves. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 16:48:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKmNHP030685 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:48:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKkXUw003176 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 14:46:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKkVMi004821; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:46:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKkQMi004752 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:46:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA18703 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:07:49 -0500 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 16:07:49 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526113743.00b16d30@pop.sonic.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Mon, 26 May 2003, Lavolta Press wrote: > Women do all of that. Um, wait. Some women do all of that. Some women do some of that. Some women have done some of that and don't now, or never used to but do now. Some women don't do any of that, and some never have. And, I daresay, the same holds true for men. And presumably the proportions of people doing these behaviors to various degrees vary also by age, income level, region, nationality, ethnic group, etc. Do gross generalizations about behavior really get us anywhere? --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 16:55:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKtSHP030699 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:55:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKrcUw003856 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 14:53:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKrbMi008791; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:53:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QKrZMi008761 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:53:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 16739 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 20:53:34 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 20:53:34 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-25.sonic.net [209.148.115.25]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QKrXA08371 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:53:33 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526135401.00ab6318@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 13:55:05 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526113743.00b16d30@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Do _you_ see men doing it as much as women? I see women doing much more of it, which is what I was saying. Fran >Some women do all of that. Some women do some of that. Some women have >done some of that and don't now, or never used to but do now. Some women >don't do any of that, and some never have. > >And, I daresay, the same holds true for men. > >And presumably the proportions of people doing these behaviors to various >degrees vary also by age, income level, region, nationality, ethnic group, >etc. > >Do gross generalizations about behavior really get us anywhere? > >--Robin > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 17:00:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QL0EHP030709 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:00:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKopUw003634 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 14:50:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKopMi007178; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:50:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QKomMi007145 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:50:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 22675 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 20:50:47 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 20:50:47 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-25.sonic.net [209.148.115.25]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QKokT25807 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 13:50:47 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526135009.00abb858@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 13:52:18 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] bashing listed ebay items In-Reply-To: <200305261954.h4QJswT4028803@jefferson.patriot.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > Yes, as well as someone who posts a link and asks what others think > of the >quality or appropriateness of the item. Of course, this is sometimes an invitation to open a group bashing session, rather than a real question. > Comments to a vendor can be about as welcome as unsolicited advice to >another person at an event. If the vendor has a market, they'll keep selling >and may not care about the opinions. This is true. If they keep selling the item, _someone_ likes it. Not wanting to buy an item yourself doesn't mean it's undesirable per se. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 17:12:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLCKHP030743 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:12:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLAXUw006244 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 15:10:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLAVSw023492; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:10:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLARSw023433 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:10:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA18814 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:31:51 -0500 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 16:31:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526135401.00ab6318@pop.sonic.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Mon, 26 May 2003, Lavolta Press wrote: > Do _you_ see men doing it as much as women? I see women doing much > more of it, which is what I was saying. Ah. But that's not what you actually said. You made a generalization about women, and apparently requested a generalization about men for comparison. I don't think those sort of generalizations are useful. Personally, since you ask: I do see certain behaviors more among women than men, and other behaviors more among men then women. That's not news, I think. Both sexes, taken as a group, have some "typical" behaviors that do them no honor. And both have some "typical" behaviors that do them proud. I wouldn't necessarily say any one complete set of behaviors is "better" than the other, though it's easy to point to individual behaviors as being reprehensible or honorable. More important, individual people's behavior varies greatly, with some people falling into what might be perceived as "typical" male or female behavior and most or all counts, but many (perhaps most) people not. (Deborah Tannen's books can be useful reading for those who wish to pursue the issue of the "typical" male and female behavior, particularly as it comes to how we communicate and identify.) And what *I* see, or what anyone else sees, depends far more on social circles, income level, region, age group, and other factors than on sex alone, though I grant that sex is a significant part of that. I might be able to generalize about the women and men in a certain subset of the population from my personal experience, but I'd be cautious about applying those generalizations the further I move from the subculture in which I made the observations. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 17:23:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLNAHP030784 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:23:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLLLUw007252 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 15:21:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLLKSw029657; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:21:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.nameserver.tv (mail.nameserver.tv [209.144.109.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLLJSw029648 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:21:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from TEENALAPTOP ([66.156.88.137]) by mail.nameserver.tv (Merak 5.8.6) with SMTP id ABG74101 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:21:04 -0700 Message-ID: <003001c323cc$4a4f08e0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526113743.00b16d30@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526135401.00ab6318@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 17:18:01 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO But it isn't what you said. Furthermore, I wholeheartedly agree with Robin (and several other of the posters throughout this thread). It depends on the person. I have known women so sweet that butter wouldn't melt in their mouths and I have known men who were incredibly catty! Generalizations are bad. For example, some people think that men's big fault is saying exactly what is on their mind regardless of tact or who they might offend/hurt, however, I know women with that trait as well. Teena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 4:55 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest > Do _you_ see men doing it as much as women? I see women doing much more of > it, which is what I was saying. > > Fran > > > > >Some women do all of that. Some women do some of that. Some women have > >done some of that and don't now, or never used to but do now. Some women > >don't do any of that, and some never have. > > > >And, I daresay, the same holds true for men. > > > >And presumably the proportions of people doing these behaviors to various > >degrees vary also by age, income level, region, nationality, ethnic group, > >etc. > > > >Do gross generalizations about behavior really get us anywhere? > > > >--Robin > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 17:49:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLn9HP030863 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:49:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLlOUw009694 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 15:47:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLlNSw014901; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:47:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41504.mail.yahoo.com (web41504.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.87]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QLlKSw014825 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:47:20 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030526214715.51485.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41504.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:47:15 BST Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 22:47:15 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <005d01c323a4$e5f89c70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > theater, i usually wear a silk shirt, black pants and a black waistcoat. > About weight and people who gain weight, i dont make any remarks. You should > have a look at Leif. He is a large man, and i love it as he is. I dont like > to make any remarks about people who weight more than some of us, because i > think it is up to each individual to have the right to have a look. We are > all earth people, and all of us are unique individual persons. And have you > noticed that some big people has the most charming manners and some have the > most beautifull faces. Bjarne, you are just lovely, and I do love you lots for your words, that come from my heart too. I call myself a bitch, and I laugh, but guess what, I never ever bitch behind peoples' backs, make snide remarks about their weight or looks or whatever. I tell it to their faces, or not. I rather not. I don't like my body since I gained weight between 29 and 30 and probably never really will, but thank goodness I have enough self confidence to shrug about it, one should never forget that confidence is usually a very hard earned thing, and many don't have that: escpecially girls and women. Why the heck can't we just live and let live, men and women, and if we 'want to' dress transgendered, then why not, that's fine too. Why all of these little drawers in cupboards we are supposed to fit in: sod it! Let me wear/be/look who and what I am, and in return you lot can do what you want: that's my credo. > But back to the question. Yes i think women can be very rude to eachother, > and i know because i have worked with them for many years. I never am in this respect, but then I'm not a 'real' or 'normal' woman according to some. *snort!* I know, Bjarne, what you mean though, been at the receiving end of that, but nasty remarks pearl off velvets and silks and leathers and vinyl, is what I always say. *grins* Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 17:57:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLv7HP030878 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:57:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLtHUw010277 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 15:55:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLtGE6019238; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:55:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (root@mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QLtCE6019193 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:55:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bently (dialport100.tukwila.eskimo.net [208.187.15.163]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA28601 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:55:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <007901c323d1$6a0a41e0$a30fbbd0@bently> From: "David" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030526214715.51485.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 14:54:41 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Let me wear/be/look who and what I am, and in return you lot can do what you want: that's > my credo. But what if I want to be *someone else* for the day? Isn't that what *costume* is about? Pam Dotson _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 18:12:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMCXHP030926 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:12:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMAcUw012155 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 16:10:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMAbE6027501; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:10:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41502.mail.yahoo.com (web41502.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.85]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QMAYE6027417 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:10:34 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030526221028.2877.qmail@web41502.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41502.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:10:28 BST Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 23:10:28 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <007901c323d1$6a0a41e0$a30fbbd0@bently> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- David wrote: > > Let me wear/be/look who and what I am, and in return you lot can do what > you want: that's > my credo. > > But what if I want to be *someone else* for the day? Isn't that what > *costume* is about? That's included! :-) If you want to be someone else for the day, then that means that this is who/what you are: this 'someone else wanting to be'. Uhm, makes sense? However, trying to bring such thoughts over in email is a tad almost-impossible. I bet no one is quite like they come over on this list via email. Then again, that's me, and I don't really like email and forums, for they are dangerous places for misunderstandings - but without them we couldn't communicate. Darn... what a dilemma *grins* Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 18:15:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMFpHP030930 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:15:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QME4Uw012412 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 16:14:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QME3E6029289; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:14:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QME0E6029228 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:14:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 11299 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 22:14:00 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 22:14:00 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-91.sonic.net [209.148.112.91]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QMDxT17295 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:13:59 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526151320.00aae9a8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 15:15:30 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526135401.00ab6318@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, I'm not writing an academic paper, neither is anyone else on the list, and apparently none of us have the resources (grant funding for large controlled national surveys, etc.) to do it anyway. >Personally, since you ask: I do see certain behaviors more among women >than men, and other behaviors more among men then women. That's not news, >I think. Both sexes, taken as a group, have some "typical" behaviors that >do them no honor. And both have some "typical" behaviors that do them >proud. I agree. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 18:19:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMJFHP030940 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:19:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMHQUw012800 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 16:17:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMHPE6001296; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:17:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QMHNE6001273 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:17:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 12365 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 22:17:23 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 22:17:23 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-91.sonic.net [209.148.112.91]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QMHMA03246 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:17:22 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526151553.00aa8b50@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 15:18:54 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes In-Reply-To: <20030526214715.51485.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> References: <005d01c323a4$e5f89c70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Why the heck >can't we just live and let live, men and women, and if we 'want to' dress >transgendered, then why not, that's fine too. I agree. >I never am in this respect, but then I'm not a 'real' or 'normal' woman >according to some. *snort!* I know, Bjarne, what you mean though, been at the >receiving end of that, but nasty remarks pearl off velvets and silks and >leathers and vinyl, is what I always say. *grins* > I just remember that a nasty remark doesn't mean the person has achieved one bit more than before they made it. Regardless of whether it makes them feel more secure, and regardless of how many people agree with them, it doesn't change a thing in either them or the person who is the subject of the remark. That's why I don't understand put-downs as a mode of competition--they achieve nothing real. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 18:23:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMNhHP030958 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:23:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMLxUw013146 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 16:22:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMLxE6003591; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:21:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMLtE6003524 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:21:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m1.in-tch.com [216.166.191.1]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4QM3RH20259 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:03:28 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED293D9.4C69DBE4@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 16:23:21 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes References: <20030526221028.2877.qmail@web41502.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole, how 'bout if I win the lottery (not that I *play* the lottery, but....), and I have all those multi-millions sitting around, we (the members of the list) have a grand, all-expenses-paid vacation somewhere over on your side of the pond? This week-long excursion to museums and bookstores and fabric stores (like that silk store in London that Bjarne's mentioned), and maybe a couple of workshops, and lots of time to talk and exchange ideas and show off our latest projects..... *sigh* --sue, always willing to dream..... N Kipar wrote: > > However, trying to bring such thoughts over in email is a tad > almost-impossible. I bet no one is quite like they come over on this list via > email. Then again, that's me, and I don't really like email and forums, for > they are dangerous places for misunderstandings - but without them we couldn't > communicate. Darn... what a dilemma *grins* _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 18:28:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMSoHP030975 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:28:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMOYUw013342 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 16:24:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMOVE6004951; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:24:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QMOTE6004917 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:24:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 14524 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 22:24:29 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 22:24:29 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-91.sonic.net [209.148.112.91]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QMOSA07766 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:24:28 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526152032.00b075b0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 15:26:00 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <003001c323cc$4a4f08e0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526113743.00b16d30@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526135401.00ab6318@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >Furthermore, I wholeheartedly agree with Robin (and several other of the >posters throughout this thread). It depends on the person. I have known >women so sweet that butter wouldn't melt in their mouths and I have known >men who were incredibly catty! I've certainly known a few catty men, but most don't seem to be. >For example, some >people think that men's big fault is saying exactly what is on their mind >regardless of tact or who they might offend/hurt, however, I know women with >that trait as well. I think honesty is a virtue for both genders. Not that everyone should say everything that is on their minds (who's even interested in hearing all of it?) but that if you're willing to say something you should be willing to say it to the person's face, rather than behind their back. You have, however, indirectly brought to my mind (I know you are not doing this) what I see as another female pattern of behavior--feeling "hurt" as a form of aggression. Someone is as nasty as they feel like for a while, but if the person they are attacking retaliates, suddenly they claim to feel "hurt" and demand public sympathy. This is just another form of attack--an accusation that the other person/people are "nasty." Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 18:30:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMUNHP030982 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:30:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMRNUw013558 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 16:27:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMRME6006505; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:27:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QMRKE6006474 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:27:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 19685 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 22:27:19 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 22:27:19 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-91.sonic.net [209.148.112.91]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QMRIA09623 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 15:27:19 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526152728.00b0fb68@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 15:28:50 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes In-Reply-To: <20030526221028.2877.qmail@web41502.mail.yahoo.com> References: <007901c323d1$6a0a41e0$a30fbbd0@bently> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >hen again, that's me, and I don't really like email and forums, for >they are dangerous places for misunderstandings - but without them we couldn't >communicate. All forms of communication are dangerous places for misunderstandings. I don't think email is any better or worse than any other written media. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 18:50:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QMoIHP031020 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:50:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKm5Uw003367 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 14:48:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKm4Mi005741; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:48:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QKm2Mi005702 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 14:48:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA18725 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:09:25 -0500 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 16:09:25 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526115201.02a5d8b8@pop.sonic.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Mon, 26 May 2003, Lavolta Press wrote: > However, when people get together for a clothes-bashing session on the > net, whether it's what some vendor is selling on ebay or elsewhere, or > what other people are wearing, note that the majority of the > participants are women. I think you can say that about every single thread on this list, no doubt because our male posting participation rate hovers around, what, a single-digit percentage? --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 19:09:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QN9bHP031054 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:09:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QN5HUw016204 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 17:05:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QN5DBS024544; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:05:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grunt4.ihug.co.nz (grunt4.ihug.co.nz [203.109.254.44]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QN59BS024498 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:05:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from p11-nas15.akl.ihug.co.nz (ihug.co.nz) [203.173.206.139] by grunt4.ihug.co.nz with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19KR1e-0002ho-00; Tue, 27 May 2003 11:05:07 +1200 Message-ID: <3ED29DA1.4000105@ihug.co.nz> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 11:05:05 +1200 From: michaela User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] bashing listed ebay items References: <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526115201.02a5d8b8@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526123624.00ac3c88@pop.sonic.net> In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526123624.00ac3c88@pop.sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I admit I'm thoroughly sick of the female mode of competing by putting > other people down (often ganging up to do so). And unlike achieving > something themselves, it doesn't actually get them anywhere. Whoa.. this came a tad out of field. Yes most of us on H-cost are women. Yes there is female cattiness (and as others have mentioned male cattiness- ever been near some men catching up on news? Some men I mean;) Not genralising here at all. I don't know if bashing a truely hiddeous piece of work is about female comepteitiveness. Certainly not always. I've never seen a piece of work 'dissected' by a costume group where I thought, oh hang on it's not that bad. The person obviously went to trouble. It's generally about someone listing say a hot pink short ballgown as everything from Titanic era to SCA! Or being historically accurate. I dunno, have there been times when something where any sort of effort to be truthful in their listing as well as some care taken in the garmen has been bashed? Refresh my memory if it has. The only one I can think of as being close to this was a late 19thC style gown (2 piece?) with very very modern appliques, in a fabric that couldn't have been produced at the time being listed as historically correct. And as far as I can rememebr things didn't get to the point where I felt like saying, back off. Maybe I deleted posts that did before reading them. We've also I'm sure absolutely praised to the moon some items. And if it really was all about being competitive surely those would have fared as badly? But no. People were not jealous and behaved in a bitchy manner. See, a truly awful piece of work will generate as much disccussion as a truly beatiful. Though both generate one liners: "That's hideous!" "That's gorgeous!" Which I don't find particularly helpful. But it also generates some reasoning as to what could be done to improve, or what makes something work. I suppose I just spend more time reading the helpful rather than the one liner replies:) I generally don't comment on people's work. Usually if it is something from my favourite eras/movies yes I will as I perhaps feel more able to say anything due to some experience in the research. I'm like that on all my lists. And so feel very guilty when I get big responses to my own work. I do usually perk up when someone gives some advice I can use, or store away for future reference. michaela http://glittersweet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 19:15:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QNFhHP031060 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:15:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QNDtUw016892 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 17:13:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QNDrBS028883; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:13:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (IDENT:root@mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QNDoBS028837 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:13:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA18475 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:13:49 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA01547 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:13:49 -0400 Message-ID: <007f01c323dc$01ee2f30$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526113743.00b16d30@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526135401.00ab6318@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526152032.00b075b0@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 19:10:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest > I think honesty is a virtue for both genders. Not that everyone should say > everything that is on their minds (who's even interested in hearing all of > it?) but that if you're willing to say something you should be willing to > say it to the person's face, rather than behind their back. > > You have, however, indirectly brought to my mind (I know you are not doing > this) what I see as another female pattern of behavior--feeling "hurt" as a > form of aggression. Someone is as nasty as they feel like for a while, but > if the person they are attacking retaliates, suddenly they claim to feel > "hurt" and demand public sympathy. This is just another form of attack--an > accusation that the other person/people are "nasty." > > > Fran Unfortunately, I think some people are equally as hurtful or offensive as those deemed "catty" but they hide behind the fact that they are being "honest". One thing that is very important to remember.... no matter how strongly one feels about their opinion, it is still ONLY an opinion. And we all have one. In discussions such as those which often occur on threads such as this where many people offer differing opinions, one person does not have the "right answer" regardless of how much they believe it to be so. Of course, this is only my opinion. Teena _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 19:52:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QNqhHP031126 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:52:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QNohUw019554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 17:50:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4QNogw4015297; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:50:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4QNoew4015270 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:50:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 13425 invoked from network); 26 May 2003 23:50:39 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 26 May 2003 23:50:39 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-92.sonic.net [209.148.112.92]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4QNocT12681 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 16:50:38 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526164600.00ab52d8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 16:52:10 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <007f01c323dc$01ee2f30$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526113743.00b16d30@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526135401.00ab6318@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526152032.00b075b0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > >Unfortunately, I think some people are equally as hurtful or offensive as >those deemed "catty" but they hide behind the fact that they are being >"honest". Whether you say something directly or indirectly, you're saying the same thing. So I figure it's better to say it directly, so can be responded to directly. >One thing that is very important to remember.... no matter how >strongly one feels about their opinion, it is still ONLY an opinion. And we >all have one. Of course we all have opinions. >In discussions such as those which often occur on threads such >as this where many people offer differing opinions, one person does not have >the "right answer" regardless of how much they believe it to be so. > >Of course, this is only my opinion. Of course, if you're saying it, it's your opinion, or your knowledge of some fact, or your viewpoint, or your feelings, or your experience, or your whatever. Who else's opinion, knowledge, viewpoint, etc. would it be? There's no need to repeatedly say, "it's my opinion," "IMHO," etc. I mean, if you want to, go ahead, but it's not like there's any requirement to. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 20:09:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R09cHP031174 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:09:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R07qUw020744 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 18:07:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R07piC022645; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:07:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R07miC022616 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:07:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 19665 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 00:07:48 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 00:07:48 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-92.sonic.net [209.148.112.92]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4R07lT18745 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:07:47 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526165308.00ab10f8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 17:09:19 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] bashing listed ebay items In-Reply-To: <3ED29DA1.4000105@ihug.co.nz> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526123624.00ac3c88@pop.sonic.net> <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> <3ED173BA.6070500@dandy.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526115201.02a5d8b8@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526123624.00ac3c88@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Yes most of us on H-cost are women. Yes there is female cattiness (and as >others have mentioned male cattiness- ever been near some men catching up >on news? Some men I mean;) Not genralising here at all. I'm not, actually, speaking specifically of h-costume. I've been on much cattier lists. Sorry, I just get very frustrated with certain social groups. >I don't know if bashing a truely hiddeous piece of work is about female >comepteitiveness. Certainly not always. I've never seen a piece of work >'dissected' by a costume group where I thought, oh hang on it's not that >bad. The person obviously went to trouble. I think it often is. If you don't want to buy something, don't buy it! There's usually no need to go on and on about how awful the merchandise is, send emails to the seller, etc.--except the feeling of power people get from bashing something as a group. >It's generally about someone listing say a hot pink short ballgown as >everything from Titanic era to SCA! Or being historically accurate. The world of the used, and the world of on-line auctions, are not by and large worlds of neat, accurate labels. They never will be. Then again, I've bought items on eBay, at on-line stores, and in brick-and-mortar stores that were major bargains because they were mislabeled. There was a local vintage clothing store where the owner had labeled a gorgeous 1820s silk evening dress and a silk 1810s dress, both in great condition, as "1860s." I snapped them right up. I recently bought a rare 1840s book (which I could date from a bibliography that listed it), which was very expensive elsewhere, for only a few dollars. The bookseller was used to dealing with newer used books, and there was no copyright date printed on it. He slapped a date of "1890s" on it at a guess (I asked him how he dated it and that's what he told me). And I've made many other such purchases. I figure it's both buyer beware and seller beware. I use these purchasing systems to my advantage, as much as I can, and look at the good side. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 20:14:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R0EwHP031193 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:14:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R0AgUw020934 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 18:10:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R0AfiC023958; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:10:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R0AdiC023941 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:10:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 20527 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 00:10:39 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 00:10:39 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-92.sonic.net [209.148.112.92]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4R0AcA16454 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 17:10:38 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526171031.00aae3b0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 17:12:10 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526115201.02a5d8b8@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If women are not encouraged to place more importance on clothes and appearance than men, why do costume-related lists have so many more female than male members and participants? Fran >I think you can say that about every single thread on this list, no doubt >because our male posting participation rate hovers around, what, a >single-digit percentage? > >--Robin > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 21:03:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R13uHP031814 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:03:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R127Uw024439 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 19:02:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R125Qk015543; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:02:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net (stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.188]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R123Qk015530 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:02:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-003-025.jps.net ([216.119.3.25] helo=pavilion) by stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19KSqo-00026h-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:02:02 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01c323ed$89c7cd60$190377d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 18:15:59 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-ELNK-Trace: 9c05c41117f01b301aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79c231b2c0333f7cb02a01722ae26fcb89350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] men and clothing selection X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h4R13uHP031814 Status: RO This whole question of men and their clothes has crossed my mind on a couple of occasions, especially one day when 5 out of seven men in the office I was working at were wearing khaki green pants and a blue chambray, shirt. Almost a uniform and we could wear pretty much anything we wanted there. One day, a woman even wore her silk pajamas in, the kind with shorts and a button up top, actual pajamas. So I asked one of the guys I was quite close to, why he chose to wear what he did. He said, because he didn't care at all and that was what was available at the shops. Like, that was ALL you could buy, which obviously wasn't true. He also had the greenie, push biker look outside of work and so was pretty conformist in the sub culture he moved in. So, I said, if it didn't matter all that much to you, why don't you wear a stripped rugby shirt tomorrow, which he could borrow from his roommate. NO WAY, and it was not a matter of borrowed clothes. So, to him at least, it mattered very very much what he wore but he wouldn't acknowledge it. It didn't even have to be a rugby shirt, just something not normally his style. I'd be interested in reading any in-depth studies of men's use of clothing so see what this is all about. Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 21:29:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1SxHP031926 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:28:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1P2Wc026358 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 19:26:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1MJQk025407; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:22:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1MFQk025337 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:22:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 208-58-253-100.s608.tnt1.nwhv.ct.dialup.rcn.com ([208.58.253.100] helo=rcn.com) by smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19KTAL-0006v8-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:22:13 -0400 Message-ID: <3ED2BDCF.7000405@rcn.com> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 21:22:23 -0400 From: Catelli User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200305262148.h4QLltT0015216@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: Being judged by clothes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > >I admit I'm thoroughly sick of the female mode of competing by putting >other people down (often ganging up to do so). And unlike achieving >something themselves, it doesn't actually get them anywhere. > >it makes some lists a major turnoff. > >Fran > Then, kindly _stop_ displaying the behavoir that is allegedly so unattractive to you. "Pots & kettles" is going through my head and it has for the better part of a week. Ann Catelli _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 21:34:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1YMHP031938 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:34:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1VAUw027050 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 19:31:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1V9Qk029369; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:31:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R1V6Qk029352 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:31:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 10811 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 01:31:06 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 01:31:06 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-110.sonic.net [209.148.112.110]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4R1V5d12224 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:31:05 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526182406.00ab5240@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 18:32:37 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] men and clothing selection In-Reply-To: <000c01c323ed$89c7cd60$190377d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In my experience most men do say they don't care what they wear. In daily life (as opposed to costumed occasions) I'm used to geeks, who "dress down," at times to extremes. (I once worked with a programmer who, judging by his body odor, seldom bathed. He always wore a plaid flannel shirt and jeans, which he may or may not have changed periodically. Well, maybe it wasn't always the same shirt but it smelled like it. Nice guy, but . . . ) Suits are something put on occasionally under duress, generally for some special marketing purpose, and complained about. Not surprisingly, in the costuming and reenactment worlds men express more active interest in clothes. Generally it seems to be interest in what they are wearing rather than what others are wearing. Fran At 06:15 PM 5/26/2003 -0700, you wrote: >This whole question of men and their clothes has crossed my mind on a >couple of occasions, especially one day when 5 out of seven men in the >office I was working at were wearing khaki green pants and a blue >chambray, shirt. >So, to him at least, it mattered very very much what he wore but he >wouldn't acknowledge it. It didn't even have to be a rugby shirt, just >something not normally his style. I'd be interested in reading any >in-depth studies of men's use of clothing so see what this is all about. > > >Lisa >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 21:36:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1a5HP031944 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:36:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1YMUw027395 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 19:34:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1YLQk000736; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:34:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R1YIQk000712 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:34:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 11747 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 01:34:17 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 01:34:17 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-110.sonic.net [209.148.112.110]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4R1YHd13885 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 18:34:17 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526183515.00af2b30@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 18:35:49 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Being judged by clothes In-Reply-To: <3ED2BDCF.7000405@rcn.com> References: <200305262148.h4QLltT0015216@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sorry, I don't care if you like me or not. Fran >Then, kindly _stop_ displaying the behavoir that is allegedly so >unattractive to you. > >"Pots & kettles" is going through my head and it has for the better part >of a week. > >Ann Catelli > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 21:39:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1dRHP031955 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:39:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1baUw027590 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 19:37:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1bZQk001836; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:37:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp02-2.wlv.untd.com (smtp02.wlv.untd.com [209.247.163.58]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R1bXQk001806 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:37:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 11827 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 01:37:27 -0000 Received: from dialup-67.30.119.59.dial1.sanjose1.level3.net (HELO elizabethanlady.com) (67.30.119.59) by smtp02-2.wlv.untd.com with SMTP; 27 May 2003 01:37:27 -0000 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 18:33:27 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] men and clothing selection Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <000c01c323ed$89c7cd60$190377d8@pavilion> Message-Id: <373F3F5A-8FE3-11D7-AA9A-0003934DD4B0@elizabethanlady.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'll bite. My fiance is very fashion conscious. He loves fashionable clothing, loves shopping, loves trying different styles on, etc. I joke about it being like living with a girl with all the perks of a guy's body. He loves playing around with his "style", too. One day he'll go "western" (snap front Western style shirt, Wranglers and cowboy boots) and the next he'll look like he stepped from the pages of a Structure catalog. His mom tells me he was like this, even as a kid, being the one that always was up to date on the latest fashion trend. I don't know if my fiance is the exception to the rule, considering that each of the guys I've dated in the past have been fashion conscious in their own way, whether they admitted it or not. My first boyfriend was very image-conscious; everything he wore had to proclaim to the world his affinity for heavy metal music and his Irish heritage. He would refuse to wear anything vaguely "normal" looking. He was definitely using his wardrobe to express what was important to him. Another boyfriend of mine opted for casual clothing, usually khaki pants, form fitting tee shirt and Doc Martins. He wanted to set an image of being laid back and chose his clothing for comfort and clean lines. A guy friend of mine from middle school wore nothing but Stussi (remember Stussi?) and Mossimo. Brand names were extremely important to him as a young teenage male. I could go on and on. The fact is (and I have an anthropology degree to back me up on this) that human beings, whether they are male or female, gravitate towards clothing (or some form of body adornment) as a means for expression. Early on, I wrote a thesis arguing that clothing is a form of art for this very reason. I don't argue with the fact that men and women in America are socialized to think about clothing differently, with the emphasis in the fashion industry being placed almost completely upon the female. Negative stereotyping tends to keep men from obsessing outwardly about fashion in the same way that women are allowed to do so, but this isn't true of all human societies, just the so-called "western" ones (and even then, there's quite a bit of difference between how American men perceive fashion and how, say, Italian men do). I do firmly believe, however, that males internalize concepts about fashion in relation to their own appearance. Saying that men don't care about their appearance or what clothes they wear is inaccurate. Anyone looking for proof needs look no further than a group of high school boys. Sarah On Monday, May 26, 2003, at 06:15 PM, Lisa Sinervo wrote: > This whole question of men and their clothes has crossed my mind on a > couple of occasions, especially one day when 5 out of seven men in the > office I was working at were wearing khaki green pants and a blue > chambray, shirt. Almost a uniform and we could wear pretty much > anything we wanted there. One day, a woman even wore her silk pajamas > in, the kind with shorts and a button up top, actual pajamas. So I > asked one of the guys I was quite close to, why he chose to wear what > he did. He said, because he didn't care at all and that was what was > available at the shops. Like, that was ALL you could buy, which > obviously wasn't true. He also had the greenie, push biker look > outside of work and so was pretty conformist in the sub culture he > moved in. So, I said, if it didn't matter all that much to you, why > don't you wear a stripped rugby shirt tomorrow, which he could borrow > from his roommate. NO WAY, and it was not a matter of borrowed > clothes. So, to him at least, it mattered very very much what he wore > but he wouldn't acknowledge it. It didn't even have to be a rugby > shirt, just something not normally his style. I'd be interested in > reading any in-depth studies of men's use of clothing so see what this > is all about. > > > Lisa > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 21:41:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1fBHP031967 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:41:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1cFUw027654 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 19:38:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1cFQk002111; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:38:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1cCQk002062 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:38:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA19873 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:59:36 -0500 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 20:59:36 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526171031.00aae3b0@pop.sonic.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Mon, 26 May 2003, Lavolta Press wrote: > If women are not encouraged to place more importance on clothes and > appearance than men, why do costume-related lists have so many more > female than male members and participants? I think there's no doubt that women are "encouraged" to place more importance on clothes and appearance than men -- or rather, girls more than boys, in Western culture at least. However, I think that the gender imbalance on costume-related lists has even more to do with the fact that girls are more likely to be taught to sew and to see sewing as a viable means of creating objects of self-expression. Boys are rarely taught to sew (though I am gratified to hear of the handful of sons of listmembers who are proving exceptions to that). Many men who want costumes don't even consider the option of making one themselves because they don't see sewing as a viable skill to add to their personal skill set; they would no more consider sewing their own clothes than they would consider making their own paper -- it's not even on the radar screen. Some of them, of course, might build their own computer, or their own car, or their own furniture. But when it comes to clothes, they are more likely to buy something ready-made or hunt up a woman friend who sews ... regardless of whether she is interested in costume herself. I sense that the gender gap of sewing skill is narrowing among younger people (compared with my own generation), but not in a good way -- it's becoming less and less likely that girls will reach maturity having learned the basics of sewing. I have a great deal of admiration for men who have learned how to sew because they're interested in making costumes, because they have an extra hurdle to overcome compared with the average woman who decides she wants to learn to sew. Few people think it's odd for a woman to take a sewing class, or go into a fabric store with a how-to book in hand, but people take notice of men who do this, and recognize that it's unusual, which itself can be a deterrent. By "unusual" I don't necessarily mean that people disapprove of men sewing (though some people, I know, do think it's odd) -- but even those who heartily approve of men learning to sew are going to take notice of those who do, when we might not take any notice of women doing so. Oh, as a footnote regarding list populations ... I have noticed at least one costume list -- where the emphasis is as much on the *wearing* of costume and on costume display/performance, rather than the methods of making costume -- in which the active posters seem about evenly divided in gender. But that list does not focus on *historic* costume specifically. Some types of costuming place a great emphasis on skills involving hardware/construction (wings, non-human bodies), masks or makeup (monsters, aliens), or special effects (lighting, fire, moving parts); the clothing elements may often be bought, modified, or remade with minimal sewing knowledge. By contrast, historic costume by its nature involves a greater degree of emphasis on sewing technique and sewing methods. That factor, too, may bias interest in historic costume even more toward people with sewing skill ... and thus more toward women. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 21:58:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1w8HP032030 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:58:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1uIUw029820 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 19:56:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1uGFD012839; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:56:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R1uBFE012765 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:56:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4R1unC2020609 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:56:49 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4R1ujnE020607 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:56:45 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Couture clothing......was Clothes make the (wo)man... Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 21:56:44 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net> <000601c32247$a2f9ad00$010877d8@pavilion> In-Reply-To: <000601c32247$a2f9ad00$010877d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305262156.44997.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4R1uBFE012765 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Saturday 24 May 2003 06:55 pm, Lisa Sinervo wrote: [text cut here] > That's it. Good quality clothes fit properly. You might get the same > style of clothing from Sears, but a more upmarket brand will fit better. > Mass produced clothes have many more layers of fabric rolled on top of each > other before cutting so the potential for becoming off grain is greater. > Quality manufactures lay fewer layers of fabric down but that takes more > time and therefore costs more money. Sometimes these sorts of differences > don't show up until you wear the garment a few times. If you sew yourself, > you can produce couture quality if you know how. In addition, more expensive clothes are usually made of better-looking, more long-lasting fabrics. -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 22:09:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R29fHP032074 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:09:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R25PUw000693 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 20:05:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R25IFD017714; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:05:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R25EFD017651 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:05:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 20661 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 02:05:14 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 02:05:14 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-110.sonic.net [209.148.112.110]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4R25C612829 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 19:05:13 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526185059.00af6048@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 19:06:45 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526171031.00aae3b0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >However, I think that the gender >imbalance on costume-related lists has even more to do with the fact that >girls are more likely to be taught to sew and to see sewing as a viable >means of creating objects of self-expression. Boys are rarely taught to >sew (though I am gratified to hear of the handful of sons of listmembers >who are proving exceptions to that). It's been a long time since I browsed a Home Ec course catalog, but my impression is the availability of cheap ready-to-wear means that even most women don't learn to sew any more. Up into the 1950s, in America, it was considered a way to get a larger, nicer wardrobe for less money. Discounted clothing is now so available most people don't need to sew to get less expensive clothes. Not that you can't save money by sewing your own clothes, and not that most RTW is great quality, but it's faster to buy and few people recognize quality any more. Many people who sew seem to be those who have trouble buying what they want RTW. Costumes are one type of item it's hard (and often expensive) to buy ready made. I think sewing mainstream clothes is especially popular with those who are hard to fit RTW. Anyway, what I'm getting at is that sewing is no longer an essential female skill or considered to be one. Especially since most women now work outside the home and have trouble finding as much time for what has become a hobby. While I don't think unwilling women should be slaves to the needle, it's a pity sewing is not a more popular means of self-expression. >Many men who want costumes don't even >consider the option of making one themselves because they don't see sewing >as a viable skill to add to their personal skill set; they would no more >consider sewing their own clothes than they would consider making their >own paper -- it's not even on the radar screen. Most men I know who sew learned because they wanted to make costumes. Oh, there was one guy in one of my college courses in clothing design. He was a constant center of female attention and I did wonder if that was why he was there, as he was not an outstanding student in the course. Yes, there are prominent male designers, etc., but you're right, it's not a mainstream male hobby. >Some types of costuming place a great emphasis on skills involving >hardware/construction (wings, non-human bodies), masks or makeup >(monsters, aliens), or special effects (lighting, fire, moving parts); the >clothing elements may often be bought, modified, or remade with minimal >sewing knowledge. By contrast, historic costume by its nature involves a >greater degree of emphasis on sewing technique and sewing methods. That >factor, too, may bias interest in historic costume even more toward people >with sewing skill ... and thus more toward women. I could see that. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 22:17:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2H3HP032100 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:17:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2E4Uw001487 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 20:14:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2E3FD022212; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:14:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2DxFE022168 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:13:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4R2EXC2020678 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:14:37 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4R2ENl3020676 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:14:23 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 22:14:23 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305262214.23288.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4R2DxFE022168 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sunday 25 May 2003 02:36 am, Danielle Nunn-Weinberg wrote: > At 11:18 AM 5/24/2003 -0400, you wrote: > >In a message dated 5/24/2003 10:00:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > > > >drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: [text cut here] > Thanks for everyone's opinions - I had a feeling that the blue would be > wrong for the 18th century. > > However, I was thinking of "La Declaration d'Amour" by J.-F. de Troy from > 1731. (Fig.25 of Ribeiro's Dress in Eighteenth Century Europe > 1715-1789) There is a woman wearing a dark greenish-blue saque with large > coral pink roses which I thought might be perfect if I overdyed the blue > silk with a dark green. Opinions? It was the fact that you said the fabric you had in mind was an "electric" (i.e., a very intense royal) blue, not the fact that it was a dark color, that led me to recommend against it for 18th C. (for a woman's gown, anyway). If you could turn the color a bit greener, that might work for 18thC. I personally have little knowledge of overdyeing silk, and I'm inclined to believe that it's a crime to risk ruining a gorgeous fabric, that's so right for one period, just to try to fit it into a different period. > > There is a slightly lighter shade of blue worn in C. Phillips "A Tea-Party > at Lord Harrington's" 1730 (fig 20 in Ribeiro) but almost the same shade as > my silk is worn by "Charles, Prince of the Asturias, later King of Naples > and Sicily; and then Charles II of Spain" 1724. (fig 9 Ribeiro). However, > I've noticed that a lot of the figures wearing blue are wearing a softer > shade of blue. Does anyone know what colour remover does to silk? I would > like to achieve a shade like: http://cgfa.sunsite.dk/m/p-meyer1.htm The shade is very nice. Again, my personal experience of dyeing is limited to cottons, but the dye remover I've used on cotton does not evenly soften the shade; it removes most of the color, sometimes unevenly. That's because the usual purpose of dye remover is to prepare the fabric to be dyed a new color. Although I don't know this for sure, I suspect any dye remover you could find to use on silk would work the same way. And as I said above, I would hate to risk damage to the fabric. If you really want to try changing the color, I think you should get expert advice. -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 22:33:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2XoHP032185 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:33:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2UoUw002987 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 20:30:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2UnFD001586; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:30:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2UlFD001571 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:30:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from duncan (dhcp024-209-059-119.neo.rr.com [24.209.59.119]) by ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h4R2Uknp016279 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:30:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <000f01c323f7$f5577670$773bd118@duncan> From: "Ailith Mackintosh" To: "Historical Costume" References: <113.23d2c6c2.2c02c42e@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Pics Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 22:30:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Alys Katharine is a countess now. And you looked quite lovely in your gown! You did a bang-up job on it and your accessories! Loved your caul! I'm sorry that I missed meeting Dierdre. kate :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: ; Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 9:13 PM Subject: [h-cost] Dress Pics > My wool middle class is all done. I put pictures up on the ol' dress diary. > They aren't the best quality in the world, but, well, there they are :) > > http://members.aol.com/loreleimorte/middone.html > > -Sarra Wryght > Elizabethan Dress Journals: http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/index.html > Live Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 22:35:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2ZDHP032188 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:35:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2XTUw003217 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 20:33:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2XTFD002812; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:33:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com (ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com [65.24.7.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2XQFD002785 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:33:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from duncan (dhcp024-209-059-119.neo.rr.com [24.209.59.119]) by ohsmtp01.ogw.rr.com (8.12.5/8.12.2) with SMTP id h4R2XQnp017695 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:33:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <001901c323f8$5450aa20$773bd118@duncan> From: "Ailith Mackintosh" To: "Historical Costume" References: <113.23d2c6c2.2c02c42e@aol.com> <000f01c323f7$f5577670$773bd118@duncan> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 22:33:15 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] Re: Dress Pics X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oops--sorry. I meant that to go directly to Sarra... kate ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ailith Mackintosh" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 10:30 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Dress Pics > Alys Katharine is a countess now. And you looked quite lovely in your > gown! You did a bang-up job on it and your accessories! Loved your > caul! > > I'm sorry that I missed meeting Dierdre. > > kate :-) > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Cc: ; > Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 9:13 PM > Subject: [h-cost] Dress Pics > > > > My wool middle class is all done. I put pictures up on the ol' dress > diary. > > They aren't the best quality in the world, but, well, there they are > :) > > > > http://members.aol.com/loreleimorte/middone.html > > > > -Sarra Wryght > > Elizabethan Dress Journals: > http://hometown.aol.com/loreleimorte/index.html > > Live Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/loreleisedai/ > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 22:45:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2jfHP032201 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:45:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2f4Uw003885 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 20:41:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2f2FD006731; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:41:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R2f0FD006683 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:41:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.netmtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:40:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 21:40:29 -0500 From: Allison Pace In-reply-to: <200305270122.h4R1MiQl025777@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: <9453E61C-8FEC-11D7-9FBB-000393D446D6@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 2, Issue 276 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday, May 26, 2003, at 08:22 PM, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: >> I admit I'm thoroughly sick of the female mode of competing by putting >> >> Fran >> > Then, kindly _stop_ displaying the behavoir that is allegedly so > unattractive to you. > > "Pots & kettles" is going through my head and it has for the better > part > of a week. > > Ann Catelli Thank you, Ann! And let me add my request that we move back to the usual topics, which are (more or less) about costumes, not (more or less!) human behavior. This thread has not been particularly lurk-worthy...;-) Allison _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 23:08:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R38qHP032237 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:08:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R37AUw005667 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 21:07:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R378xM019911; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:07:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R375xN019882 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:07:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4R37eC2020782 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:07:44 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4R37dm7020780 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:07:39 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 23:07:39 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <20030526214715.51485.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> <007901c323d1$6a0a41e0$a30fbbd0@bently> In-Reply-To: <007901c323d1$6a0a41e0$a30fbbd0@bently> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305262307.39513.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4R375xN019882 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday 26 May 2003 05:54 pm, David wrote: > > Let me wear/be/look who and what I am, and in return you lot can do what > > you want: that's > my credo. > > But what if I want to be *someone else* for the day? Isn't that what > *costume* is about? I'm with you, Pam. I think that's exactly what costume is all about-- and I'm not afraid to use it. :-) -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 23:15:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3FJHP032250 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:15:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3CIUw005976 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 21:12:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3CExM022061; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:12:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3CBxM022042 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:12:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACF197AE4B for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:11:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.wonderland.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (jabberwock.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1:10024]) (amavisd-new) with ESMTP id 12007-10 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:11:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wonderland.com (adsl-64-160-176-161.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [64.160.176.161]) by mail.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E02767AEB1 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:11:21 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 20:11:59 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Being judged by clothes Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v552) From: Heather Meadows To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526183515.00af2b30@pop.sonic.net> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO She didn't say she didn't like you. She said you were being hypocritical. I'd add "boring and repetitive" to that, and be done with it. On Monday, May 26, 2003, at 06:35 PM, Lavolta Press wrote: > Sorry, I don't care if you like me or not. > > Fran > > > >> Then, kindly _stop_ displaying the behavoir that is allegedly so >> unattractive to you. >> >> "Pots & kettles" is going through my head and it has for the better >> part of a week. >> >> Ann Catelli >> > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon May 26 23:20:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3KrHP032264 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:20:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3HtUw006376 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 21:17:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3HsxM024568; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:17:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (IDENT:root@mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3HpxM024536 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:17:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA14112 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:17:51 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id XAA29736 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:17:51 -0400 Message-ID: <00d001c323fe$1885c0b0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <9453E61C-8FEC-11D7-9FBB-000393D446D6@comcast.net> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 23:14:33 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: [h-cost] Giornea X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you Allison! I could not agree more so here goes.... I have a giornea that I made recently of a damask in a lovely dark brick red color... not quite a burgundy. It is the style that is not split up the front, but has a deep V. I have seen them in paintings where they have a little belt just under the bustline (though usually on the open front style) and have seen them with beading and other embellishments along the edges. I would really like to add some pearl/bead accents in sort of an all-over pattern. I don't think I have seen this and wondered if anyone else had. I may do it anyway as I think it would look cool ;-) but it would be nice to be able to document doing it. Thanks! Teena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Allison Pace" To: Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 10:40 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 2, Issue 276 > > On Monday, May 26, 2003, at 08:22 PM, h-costume-request@indra.com > wrote: > > >> I admit I'm thoroughly sick of the female mode of competing by putting > >> > >> Fran > >> > > Then, kindly _stop_ displaying the behavoir that is allegedly so > > unattractive to you. > > > > "Pots & kettles" is going through my head and it has for the better > > part > > of a week. > > > > Ann Catelli > > Thank you, Ann! And let me add my request that we move back to the > usual topics, which are (more or less) about costumes, not (more or > less!) human behavior. This thread has not been particularly > lurk-worthy...;-) > > Allison > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:05:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R45QHP032353 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:05:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R42QUw009881 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 22:02:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R42Qs2014043; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:02:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R42Ns3014015 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:02:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty2107.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.243.107]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4R42NN2004354 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:02:26 -0400 Message-ID: <3ED2E326.2070906@dandy.net> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 00:01:42 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526121219.00b16388@pop.sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Now *that* is a great quote! Thanks, Mike T. Lavolta Press wrote: > >> I have an obvious lack of hair on top of my head, which will >> occasion commentary (sad to say, nothing unique or original). > > > > "Watch your wives, you men of Rome, we bring the bald-headed lecher > [Julius Caesar] home." > > Fran > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:05:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R45nHP032357 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:05:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3xQUw009558 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 21:59:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3xOs2012569; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:59:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R3vDs2010843 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:57:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 25031 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 03:56:58 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 03:56:58 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-155.sonic.net [209.148.112.155]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4R3uww30606 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 20:56:58 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526205303.00aafad0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 20:58:30 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Being judged by clothes In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526183515.00af2b30@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you or she want to express differing views about how people, male or female, are judged on their clothes, judge others on their clothes, or use appearance for interaction, feel free to do so. Other people are. If you just want to call names, I think expressing dislike is all you are doing. And not any more worthwhile a contribution to the discussion than anything I say. If all you want to do is not listen to what I say, may I suggest your delete key, email filters, or, if you have a digest, your scroll bar? Fran At 08:11 PM 5/26/2003 -0700, you wrote: >She didn't say she didn't like you. > >She said you were being hypocritical. > >I'd add "boring and repetitive" to that, and be done with it. > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:14:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4EWHP032372 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:14:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4BPUw010627 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 22:11:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4BOs2018397; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:11:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4BMs2018318 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:11:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m168.in-tch.com [216.166.191.168]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4R3qsH21202 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:52:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED2E5C1.725D4374@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 22:12:49 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Germanic hats 1500 to 1530's (kinda long) References: <5.2.0.9.2.20030227084252.03492eb8@blue.ucdavis.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm going through old emails, and came across this one. Way cool, Gwyn, but some of the links aren't working (the gcarnegie ones). Did you just put them up temporarily, or have you moved your website? I'd love to be able to look at these hats, even though I'm a few months late.... --sue Gwyn Carnegie wrote: > > I looked and looked for my copy of the Triumph of Max and I'm pretty sure I > loaned it someone along with my copy of the 2 vol. 16th c woodcut books. > When I get them back I can scan more whole brim styles with much more > detail then what I have above. > > The brims do change a bit but the crowns or cap pieces are pretty > consistent. The brim is often either slashed repeatedly and folded or not, > bisected and flipped up or left down, or left whole. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:15:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4FRHP032378 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:15:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4A4Wa010421 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 22:13:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3w4s2011359; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:58:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R3uvs2010582 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:57:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m168.in-tch.com [216.166.191.168]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4R3c3H15048 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:38:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED2E247.B2E9733C@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 21:57:59 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Giornea References: <9453E61C-8FEC-11D7-9FBB-000393D446D6@comcast.net> <00d001c323fe$1885c0b0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Your idea sounds really pretty, but I don't (off the top of my head) recall seeing an all-over beaded or pearled giornea. I'll sure keep my eyes open, though! (hey, it's a good excuse to go re-check out all my ItalianRen bookmarks) I had a proto-giornea, many years ago, but had a lot of problems controlling the front panels--they tended to make a dive for the -uh- center of my chest. It might, I think now, be due to the softness of the fabric I was using at that time. I'd like to do another one some day soon. And speaking of outer garments for ItalianRen (uhoh, I'm on a roll here!), do you, Teena, or anyone else know anything about cloak equivalents for ItalianRen clothing (for women)? Some parts of Italy can be quite cold, seasonally, so I'm thinking they must have had something, but I don't recall seeing anything. The only historical clothing I've got, these days, is all ItalianRen, and I need some sort of cloak or outer layer. I'd prefer it be more appropriate than the ubiquitous hooded cloaks so prevalent at SCA events in my neck of the woods.... --sue Beteena Paradise wrote: > > Thank you Allison! I could not agree more so here goes.... > > I have a giornea that I made recently of a damask in a lovely dark brick red > color... not quite a burgundy. It is the style that is not split up the > front, but has a deep V. I have seen them in paintings where they have a > little belt just under the bustline (though usually on the open front style) > and have seen them with beading and other embellishments along the edges. I > would really like to add some pearl/bead accents in sort of an all-over > pattern. I don't think I have seen this and wondered if anyone else had. I > may do it anyway as I think it would look cool ;-) but it would be nice to > be able to document doing it. Thanks! > > Teena > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Allison Pace" > To: > Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 10:40 PM > Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 2, Issue 276 > > > > > On Monday, May 26, 2003, at 08:22 PM, h-costume-request@indra.com > > wrote: > > > > >> I admit I'm thoroughly sick of the female mode of competing by putting > > >> > > >> Fran > > >> > > > Then, kindly _stop_ displaying the behavoir that is allegedly so > > > unattractive to you. > > > > > > "Pots & kettles" is going through my head and it has for the better > > > part > > > of a week. > > > > > > Ann Catelli > > > > Thank you, Ann! And let me add my request that we move back to the > > usual topics, which are (more or less) about costumes, not (more or > > less!) human behavior. This thread has not been particularly > > lurk-worthy...;-) > > > > Allison > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:26:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4QSHP032422 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:26:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4NRUw011357 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 22:23:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4NQs2023413; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:23:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4NOs2023397 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:23:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail23.ureach.com (mailout.ureach.com [172.16.2.83]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA07150 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:23:23 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail23.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id AAA13389 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:23:23 -0400 Message-ID: <00f901c32407$40234490$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <9453E61C-8FEC-11D7-9FBB-000393D446D6@comcast.net><00d001c323fe$1885c0b0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> <3ED2E247.B2E9733C@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Giornea Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 00:20:05 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I don't have to worry about it um... "diving"... as the damask is pretty substantial and I lined it in raw silk. It stays very well in shape and is very comfortable to wear. It is interesting that you ask about the outer garments as I had already noticed that there doesn't seem to be any in all of the paintings I have seen. As I generally freeze rather than ruin my "look" it hasn't been much of an issue! I am looking through all of my stuff now and will let you know if I find anything! Teena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 11:57 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Giornea > Your idea sounds really pretty, but I don't (off the top of my head) > recall seeing an all-over beaded or pearled giornea. I'll sure keep my > eyes open, though! (hey, it's a good excuse to go re-check out all my > ItalianRen bookmarks) > I had a proto-giornea, many years ago, but had a lot of problems > controlling the front panels--they tended to make a dive for the -uh- > center of my chest. It might, I think now, be due to the softness of the > fabric I was using at that time. I'd like to do another one some day > soon. > And speaking of outer garments for ItalianRen (uhoh, I'm on a roll > here!), do you, Teena, or anyone else know anything about cloak > equivalents for ItalianRen clothing (for women)? Some parts of Italy can > be quite cold, seasonally, so I'm thinking they must have had something, > but I don't recall seeing anything. > The only historical clothing I've got, these days, is all ItalianRen, > and I need some sort of cloak or outer layer. I'd prefer it be more > appropriate than the ubiquitous hooded cloaks so prevalent at SCA events > in my neck of the woods.... > --sue > > Beteena Paradise wrote: > > > > Thank you Allison! I could not agree more so here goes.... > > > > I have a giornea that I made recently of a damask in a lovely dark brick red > > color... not quite a burgundy. It is the style that is not split up the > > front, but has a deep V. I have seen them in paintings where they have a > > little belt just under the bustline (though usually on the open front style) > > and have seen them with beading and other embellishments along the edges. I > > would really like to add some pearl/bead accents in sort of an all-over > > pattern. I don't think I have seen this and wondered if anyone else had. I > > may do it anyway as I think it would look cool ;-) but it would be nice to > > be able to document doing it. Thanks! > > > > Teena _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:38:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4crHP032485 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:38:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4YSUw012118 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 22:34:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4YQs2028573; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:34:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4YOs2028562 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:34:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail20.ureach.com (mail20.ureach.com [172.16.2.80]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA09562 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:34:24 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail20.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id AAA09558 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:34:23 -0400 Message-ID: <00fe01c32408$c9996f00$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <9453E61C-8FEC-11D7-9FBB-000393D446D6@comcast.net><00d001c323fe$1885c0b0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> <3ED2E247.B2E9733C@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Giornea Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 00:31:05 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wow... I found some overgarments right away! And on one of my favorite websites too! I went there first before pulling out the big stack o' books. Look at the figure in the top left. It looks as if there is some sort of cape/cloak held by a chain or rope across the chest: http://homepage.mac.com/festive_attyre/research/florentine/flor11.html In this one they are wearing capes that have slits for the arms: http://homepage.mac.com/festive_attyre/research/florentine/flor25.html One thing I had previously noted was that though the women would wear 3 or 4 gowns, they only wore one set of sleeves (over the chemise sleeves). Look at the sleeves on the standing figure in red... don't they look warm with all of that fur lining: http://homepage.mac.com/festive_attyre/research/florentine/flor6.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 11:57 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Giornea > Your idea sounds really pretty, but I don't (off the top of my head) > recall seeing an all-over beaded or pearled giornea. I'll sure keep my > eyes open, though! (hey, it's a good excuse to go re-check out all my > ItalianRen bookmarks) > I had a proto-giornea, many years ago, but had a lot of problems > controlling the front panels--they tended to make a dive for the -uh- > center of my chest. It might, I think now, be due to the softness of the > fabric I was using at that time. I'd like to do another one some day > soon. > And speaking of outer garments for ItalianRen (uhoh, I'm on a roll > here!), do you, Teena, or anyone else know anything about cloak > equivalents for ItalianRen clothing (for women)? Some parts of Italy can > be quite cold, seasonally, so I'm thinking they must have had something, > but I don't recall seeing anything. > The only historical clothing I've got, these days, is all ItalianRen, > and I need some sort of cloak or outer layer. I'd prefer it be more > appropriate than the ubiquitous hooded cloaks so prevalent at SCA events > in my neck of the woods.... > --sue > > Beteena Paradise wrote: > > > > Thank you Allison! I could not agree more so here goes.... > > > > I have a giornea that I made recently of a damask in a lovely dark brick red > > color... not quite a burgundy. It is the style that is not split up the > > front, but has a deep V. I have seen them in paintings where they have a > > little belt just under the bustline (though usually on the open front style) > > and have seen them with beading and other embellishments along the edges. I > > would really like to add some pearl/bead accents in sort of an all-over > > pattern. I don't think I have seen this and wondered if anyone else had. I > > may do it anyway as I think it would look cool ;-) but it would be nice to > > be able to document doing it. Thanks! > > > > Teena > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Allison Pace" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 10:40 PM > > Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 2, Issue 276 > > > > > > > > On Monday, May 26, 2003, at 08:22 PM, h-costume-request@indra.com > > > wrote: > > > > > > >> I admit I'm thoroughly sick of the female mode of competing by putting > > > >> > > > >> Fran > > > >> > > > > Then, kindly _stop_ displaying the behavoir that is allegedly so > > > > unattractive to you. > > > > > > > > "Pots & kettles" is going through my head and it has for the better > > > > part > > > > of a week. > > > > > > > > Ann Catelli > > > > > > Thank you, Ann! And let me add my request that we move back to the > > > usual topics, which are (more or less) about costumes, not (more or > > > less!) human behavior. This thread has not been particularly > > > lurk-worthy...;-) > > > > > > Allison > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:47:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4lkHP032557 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:47:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4k1Uw012841 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 22:46:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4k0s2003834; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:46:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4jvs3003810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:45:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4R4kZC2020974 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:46:36 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4R4kYls020972 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:46:34 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 00:46:33 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522220351.00ac7a48@pop.sonic.net> In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522220351.00ac7a48@pop.sonic.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305270046.33764.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4R4jvs3003810 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Friday 23 May 2003 01:07 am, Lavolta Press wrote: > >Here in California, if I dress too casual, or if my naturally frizzy hair > >gets too frizzy, I am mistaken for homeless, and get treated with much > >disrespect, often outright rudeness. If I dress like the mothers of > >younger acquaintances of mine, I get excluded from much of what the group > >is doing, the assumption being that I'm too old to relate. If I wear any > >tie-dye, the black leather crowd counts two strikes against me as an old > >Hippie fossil. If I wear sandals and a flowing Rayon skirt with batik, I > >am mistaken for a New Age old Hippie, or a neo-Pagan. If I wear any of my > >fibre art garments, the fashionable one of my daughters asks me to change > >into 'normal' clothes. If I dress up and wear slacks and a blazer, my > >friends think I have been to an interview. > > Sure, people try to put you into boxes. But you don't have to believe > in/stay in those boxes. No, you don't have to believe in those boxes. But those boxes *will* affect the way some people will treat you, and you need to be aware that that is what is going on so that you can decide whether, and how, to counteract it. -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:51:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4pXHP032572 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:51:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4mXUw012963 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 22:48:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4mWs2004877; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:48:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R4mTs2004840 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:48:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 6446 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 04:48:28 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 04:48:28 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-147.sonic.net [209.148.112.147]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4R4mOw01410 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 21:48:24 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526214853.00af63e8@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 21:49:55 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <3ED2E326.2070906@dandy.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030522120030.00ab03d0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523195756.00abb518@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526121219.00b16388@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It was a song Caesar's soldiers sung. Originally in Latin, of course. Fran At 12:01 AM 5/27/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Now *that* is a great quote! Thanks, Mike T. > >Lavolta Press wrote: > >> >>> I have an obvious lack of hair on top of my head, which will occasion >>> commentary (sad to say, nothing unique or original). >> >> >> >>"Watch your wives, you men of Rome, we bring the bald-headed lecher >>[Julius Caesar] home." >> >>Fran >> >> >>Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming >>http://www.lavoltapress.com >>Historic and Vintage Dance >>http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 00:55:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4tiHP032581 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:55:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4pUUw013196 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 22:51:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4pTs2006050; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:51:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R4pRs3006029 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:51:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4R4q5C2021016 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:52:05 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4R4q4Dk021014 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:52:04 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Check out these Italian silk brocades Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 00:52:04 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030525204432.00af9bf0@pop.sonic.net> In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030525204432.00af9bf0@pop.sonic.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305270052.04398.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4R4pRs3006029 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sunday 25 May 2003 11:44 pm, Lavolta Press wrote: > http://www.hyenaproductions.com/store+dupioni+stripes+plaids2.htm Mmmmm. I don't even *do* Italian Ren (or much of anything else for which these fabrics would be period) and I'm tempted. :-) -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 01:39:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R5dMHP032696 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 01:39:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R5ZXUw016201 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 23:35:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R5ZT6W025957; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:35:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailrelay.mebtel.net (spambuster1.mebtel.net [64.40.67.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R5ZM6W025912 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:35:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grics.net (66-79-58-72.dsl.dixnil.grics.net [66.79.58.72]) by mailrelay.mebtel.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C08901FC8E for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 01:23:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3ED307B5.10107@grics.net> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 01:37:41 -0500 From: "H. Law" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] shocking new fashion References: <000001c321bf$1f1c89e0$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> <1107.209.209.19.85.1053882401.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> In-Reply-To: <1107.209.209.19.85.1053882401.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And you could fairly easily get it to pass as a victorian "waist" of some sort... don't mess with *these* tea ladies!! Heather L dch@inreach.com wrote: >>Here's something new~! >> >>http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,58914,00.html >> >>I like it, for the 'shock value' of course! >> >> > >Not a bad little invention if you live some place like New York or another >big city! > >Diana > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 02:00:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R602HP032724 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 02:00:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R5wHUw017807 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Mon, 26 May 2003 23:58:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R5wGtA008689; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:58:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R5wDtA008652 for ; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:58:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFJ0047678YKI@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 26 May 2003 22:58:11 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 22:26:09 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes In-reply-to: <005d01c323a4$e5f89c70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030526222534.00af9600@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/23/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 06:36 PM 5/26/2003 +0200, you wrote: >I dont like >to make any remarks about people who weight more than some of us, because i >think it is up to each individual to have the right to have a look. We are >all earth people, and all of us are unique individual persons. And have you >noticed that some big people has the most charming manners and some have the >most beautifull faces. Thank you Bjarne for this comment. It brightened up my day. Kimiko A large woman. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 02:17:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R6HTHP005898 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 02:17:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R6DgUw019171 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 00:13:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R6DftA016536; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:13:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R6DctA016454 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 00:13:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWlRIx9rCefTYhyCT5c7gCBl/J0r4m+DBtQ==">; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:12:40 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HY6SZS2E; Mon, 26 May 2003 23:12:40 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 02:08:40 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] bashing listed ebay items Message-ID: <20030527.020840.-853513.0.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-3,7-9 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO <<>> I wasn't going to get back into this fray but I don't think this is strictly a female trait. My ex-husband did exactly that (note the ex) and I have known a lot of men who behave just as badly. I think that is an insecurity trait - not a female one. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 03:47:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R7lWHP006236 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:47:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R7jgUw024408 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 01:45:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R7jfH6024291; Tue, 27 May 2003 01:45:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41501.mail.yahoo.com (web41501.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4R7jcH6024226 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 01:45:38 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030527074532.32970.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41501.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:45:32 BST Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:45:32 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Sue's Lottery win, was Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <3ED293D9.4C69DBE4@in-tch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > Nicole, how 'bout if I win the lottery (not that I *play* the lottery, > but....), and I have all those multi-millions sitting around, we (the > members of the list) have a grand, all-expenses-paid vacation somewhere > over on your side of the pond? This week-long excursion to museums and > bookstores and fabric stores (like that silk store in London that > Bjarne's mentioned), and maybe a couple of workshops, and lots of time > to talk and exchange ideas and show off our latest projects..... > *sigh* > --sue, always willing to dream..... Hehe, Sue, that sounds like a VERY good idea. We should nip over to Copenhagen too, I just love the National museum, oh, and don't forget Ireland! The National museum in Dublin (are they open again?) is gorgeous. Lots of cuppas of tea and coffee in nice cafe's, and chatting with a glass of red wine till the wee hours of the morning. *siiiigh* Oh I miss my best friend so much! ;-) Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ It's Samaritans' Week. Help Samaritans help others. Call 08709 000032 to give or donate online now at http://www.samaritans.org/support/donations.shtm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 04:31:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R8VfHP027164 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 04:31:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R8R6Uw026629 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 02:27:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R8R4OD011208; Tue, 27 May 2003 02:27:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R8R2OD011196 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 02:27:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1911AF00070; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:28:01 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1577140092; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:27:03 -0500 Message-ID: <013c01c3242a$0613e7a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net><000601c32247$a2f9ad00$010877d8@pavilion> <200305262156.44997.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Couture clothing Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 04:29:00 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you all knew the markup of so called better clothing or designer clothing you might think differently. The people who makes the money off of these brands are the retailers. Markups can be as high as 400% on designer wear. Generally, when an item goes to 50% off, a dept. or specialty store is still making a profit. When a seasonal item makes it to a clearance item, under 50% the item seller is breaking even or taking a lose. A new trend in the retail industry is to box up classic seasonal items like for Christmas that did not sell, put them in storage, and bring them back out next year. These items may never take a markdown in a year or two. Sears, Penneys, etc. pay the better clothing manufacturers to just put their name logo on designer/high end dealer products. A good example of this is their jeans... one of the store's brand jeans are Wranglers and the other is Levi. I always mix up which store sells which brand. Off clothing topic but pertains... The same goes for their appliances. The funny thing with the Sears brand appliances, Kenmore, is that you can purchase parts for it, that may come from a variety of name brand manufacturers. My brother owns an appliance repair business and this is his best joke. People pay a lot of money for a certain brand refrigerator and it is the same as a Kenmore. People get so hung up on brand names. If someone was really interested in having a good fit, quality workmanship, etc., I always suggest a private seamstress/tailor/couture. So many people today seem to think just because something has a big name designer label on it that it was made special. Hundreds of thousands of one garment can not have been made with the special care that a private individual can. A while back, I interviewed a once designer in London, who played the manufacturing game with five season a year shows in several fashion capitals. She went into back to couture wear. She stated that she wanted to control the quality and workmanship in her garments. The only way she could do that was to quit manufacturing and go back to couture. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 05:10:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9AdHP002912 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:10:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R98rUw028796 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 03:08:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R98oAq026298; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:08:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.mn.rr.com (fe2.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R98mAq026282 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:08:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.mn.rr.com ([24.26.188.145]) by mail2.mn.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Tue, 27 May 2003 04:08:47 -0500 Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527040418.0379a530@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: dannw@smtp-server.mn.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 04:06:38 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg Subject: funny was Re: [h-cost] Re: Being judged by clothes In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526205303.00aafad0@pop.sonic.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526183515.00af2b30@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've been studiously ignoring this thread but, while deleting them by subject line, I had this sudden image of an array of various outfits (of clothing) sitting at a table, displaying judging numbers as people walked by... : ) Cheers, Danielle (can you tell I should have been in bed ages ago?) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 05:11:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9BEHP002915 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:11:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R99SUw028889 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 03:09:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R99SAq026584; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:09:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.mn.rr.com (fe2.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R98mAq026283 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:08:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.mn.rr.com ([24.26.188.145]) by mail2.mn.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Tue, 27 May 2003 04:08:47 -0500 Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527040647.0379c0f0@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: dannw@smtp-server.mn.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 04:09:56 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) In-Reply-To: <000701c322ef$1ce3b8c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4R98mAq026283 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you Bjarne. I do appreciate your advice, you have much more experience with this period than I do. I would love it if you could scan a picture of the gown from the LA County Museum. I will also check in the Barbara Johnsons Album... Do you know if the boiling of the silks (by Ulla Britt Söderlund) was during the dying process or was of pre-dyed yard goods? I love green so I might try that, I have lots of this silk so I have some room to play. Cheers, Danielle At 08:54 PM 5/25/2003 +0200, you wrote: >Dear Danielle. >I have tryed to help you as best as i can, and i have run trough all my >books. >Then i found a solid blue dress. L.A County Museum of Art has catalog nr. 41 >Frehch Robe a la Francaise in Blue Moiré c. 1750 -60. It is very beautifull >with a full pleated back over panier. I would call the blue colour something >like Delft Blue, not electric royal blue, but nearly. >If you would like, i would gladly scan a full colour picture of the back of >the dress. >I also looked in Barbara Johnsons Album of Fashions, and found some blue >colours, and a printed one where the motifs was almost electric blue. >If i were you, i would do the dress, if you have a dream of making one. >But if you want to be perfect, i would stick to your plans of either try to >bleach the colour a little, or overdye it with green. That green you are >talking about was very fashionable. >But if you could bleach the colour, i am sure it would end up being a >stunning beautifull blue, i have that feeling. >When Barry Lyndon was made, Ulla Britt Söderlund was making costumes for it, >and she told me, she had boiled some of the silk fabrics, to get the right >colours........... >Anyway, what ever you do, please let us hear how it goes, i am very >interrested in your projekt. >Good luck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > >Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 05:21:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9LEHP002926 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:21:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9H8Uw029752 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 03:17:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9H7Aq013112; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:17:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (mta4-svc.business.ntl.com [62.253.164.44]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9H3Aq013084 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:17:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Imedia5043 ([80.1.12.18]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030527091702.MTZP18420.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@Imedia5043> for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:17:02 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c32430$b4581f10$120c0150@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net><000601c32247$a2f9ad00$010877d8@pavilion><200305262156.44997.cathy@thyrsus.com> <013c01c3242a$0613e7a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Couture clothing Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 10:16:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I couldn't agree more. I decided to pop back into the fashion world a couple of years ago temping and pattern cut and production managed several up and coming designers as I was interested in selling some of my things wholesale. Many are having clothing made abroad for pennies at the same places that stores such as mark one etc use. The ones I worked with decided to use UK factories but in order to compete these companies could only charge £10 to make trousers etc which sold for over £200 both in the uk and overseas, There was no faulting the quality of the goods, for the price but we couldn't expect any better from them, the designers weren't making a profit either and I spent many hours hunting around for cheaper versions of the fabrics. The shops also took forever to pay, wanted a further discount if they paid within 60 days and wouldn't pay deposits and don't even get me started on Liberty's and Selfridges delivery procedure!!!!! Dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of Historical reproduction Clothing, Uniforms and Bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 > > If someone was really interested in having a good fit, quality workmanship, > etc., I always suggest a private seamstress/tailor/couture. So many people > today seem to think just because something has a big name designer label on > it that it was made special. Hundreds of thousands of one garment can not > have been made with the special care that a private individual can. > > A while back, I interviewed a once designer in London, who played the > manufacturing game with five season a year shows in several fashion > capitals. She went into back to couture wear. She stated that she wanted > to control the quality and workmanship in her garments. The only way she > could do that was to quit manufacturing and go back to couture. > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 05:23:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9N2HP002932 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:23:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9LEUw000281 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 03:21:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9L7Aq027262; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:21:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9L3Aq027182 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:21:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pavilion (213-78-121-111.friaco.onetel.net.uk [213.78.121.111]) 3.2.2-GA) with SMTP id ADM57095; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:20:54 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <026301c32431$ca5e9720$6f794ed5@pavilion> From: "Melanie Wilson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3EC9B3CC.6030107@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 10:24:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I'm looking for information on what differentiates a Norman from a Saxon. I'm especially interested in clothing and decorative arts. Can anyone recommend any sources? Do you mean the nobles or the peasentry ? Nobles may be easier to source in general although there is probably a little, the English were famed for their embroidery so looking at sources of this might help. The cut of the hair & beard is a big differance between the menfolk, not many Norman women came over so I doubt female fashion was so heavily influenced, at least no more than the interchange of ideas usually is. Again when you mean differences from Normans & Saxons do you mean whilst they were both in England or in their homelands ? Mel This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the Company, unless specifically stated. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 05:24:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9OsHP002936 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:24:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9NAUw000445 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9N9Aq028061; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.mn.rr.com (fe2.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9N0Aq028021 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.mn.rr.com ([24.26.188.145]) by mail2.mn.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Tue, 27 May 2003 04:22:59 -0500 Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527041756.03758d90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: dannw@smtp-server.mn.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 04:19:42 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) In-Reply-To: <20030526060627.48313.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> References: <4.3.0.20030525225648.00e58940@pop.vaxxine.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks. The more opinions the better. Yippee. I've just ordered a copy of "An Elegant Art: Fashion and Fantasy in the 18th Century" and am waiting for it to appear. I will check out their website and see what is there... Cheers, Danielle At 11:06 PM 5/25/2003 -0700, you wrote: >No longer alone. > >Your comment about your books being packed jogged my >memory, and I checked my copy of "An Elegant Art: >Fashion and Fantasy in the 18th Century" (Maeder, >1983). > >Page 121 is Plate 47, of a sack-back gown with the >following description: > >DRESS, France, c.1750-1760 >Blue silk moire; padded and puckered robings with fly >fringe tgrim; double sleeve rufffles; linen lined >bodice. >cb: 65 3/8" (165.5 cm) >Mrjs. Alice F. Schott Bequest >M.67.8.71 > >The dress is a very strong blue. In the same book are >also two corsets that are bright blue, and bright blue >with yellow ribbon trim. > >All of these items are in the costume collection of >the Los Angeles County Museum of Art. This is >especially helpful, because Elegant Art only has a >photo of the back of the blue gown. However, if you >contact LACMA, they may have photos of the front >available. > >Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 05:25:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9PEHP002942 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:25:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9NUUw000469 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9NUAq028176; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.mn.rr.com (fe2.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9MxAq028019 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.mn.rr.com ([24.26.188.145]) by mail2.mn.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Tue, 27 May 2003 04:22:59 -0500 Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527041259.0379d340@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: dannw@smtp-server.mn.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 04:17:48 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) In-Reply-To: <4.3.0.20030525225648.00e58940@pop.vaxxine.com> References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings, Thank you. I've done some further looking at 18th century portraits and found some really bright colours. Including this portrait of Madam de Pompador (which is much bluer in my book) http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/b/boucher/2/pompado3.jpg This portrait (by Rosalba CARRIERA, "Self-Portrait as Winter"1731) is almost the same shade as the silk I have http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/c/carriera/selfport.jpg I would love to track down those fabric sample books. they sound perfect. What is lutestring? I keep seeing references to it and realized I don't think I've ever actually seen any. Thanks again. Cheers, Danielle At 11:34 PM 5/25/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Greetings: > >Lone dissenting voice - I disagree that the royal blue wouldn't be >appropriate >for an 18 c. gown. I seem to remember seeing many examples of strong blues >in both actual gowns, fabric samples and art of the period.My problem is that >all my books and notes are in storage while we put an addition on our house, >so it's difficult for me to prove it right now. > >I have been keeping an eye for examples of strong blues in order to >justify my own purchase of a bright blue-green shot-silk (influenced by >a friend) a few years ago, yet to be completed, sigh! > >Off the top of my head, Copley painted three portraits of ladies in the same, >presumably "studio" gown which was a strong, deep blue. I'm also positive >that in the textile history book that came out in the mid- 90's - (hardcover, >colour reproductions of period sample books, book to die for, textile >bible,etc.- >someone on the list must reccognize my description!) anyways, I remember >at least one or more brilliant blue lutestring sample in that one. There was >also that reproduction of that 18th c. Scandinavian book - Norst-something >that was published about 2000 that included dozens of fabric samples. > >When we were cruising the British art galleries and museums, I often noted >by the strong colours used in the depictions of the gowns for some eras of >the eighteenth century, including a flaming red gown in a Hogarth portrait. > >Besides, IF I ever finish this gown, and IF we ever get to another French & >Indian War event, then I might not be the only blindingly brilliant sacque >there, and that would be such a comfort. > >"Curulean"-ly yours, > >Sheridan > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 05:27:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9RUHP002947 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:27:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9NnUw000518 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9NmAq028271; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.mn.rr.com (fe2.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4R9N1Aq028022 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 03:23:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from oemcomputer.mn.rr.com ([24.26.188.145]) by mail2.mn.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Tue, 27 May 2003 04:23:00 -0500 Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527042008.0375c750@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: dannw@smtp-server.mn.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 04:27:35 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) In-Reply-To: <200305262214.23288.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:14 PM 5/26/2003 -0400, you wrote: >On Sunday 25 May 2003 02:36 am, Danielle Nunn-Weinberg wrote: > > At 11:18 AM 5/24/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > >In a message dated 5/24/2003 10:00:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > > > > > >drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: >[text cut here] > > > Thanks for everyone's opinions - I had a feeling that the blue would be > > wrong for the 18th century. > > > > However, I was thinking of "La Declaration d'Amour" by J.-F. de Troy from > > 1731. (Fig.25 of Ribeiro's Dress in Eighteenth Century Europe > > 1715-1789) There is a woman wearing a dark greenish-blue saque with large > > coral pink roses which I thought might be perfect if I overdyed the blue > > silk with a dark green. Opinions? > >It was the fact that you said the fabric you had in mind was an "electric" >(i.e., a very intense royal) blue, not the fact that it was a dark color, >that led me to recommend against it for 18th C. (for a woman's gown, anyway). That makes sense. Believe it or not, I've just found some miniatures which are painted even brighter blue than my silk!!! I realize one has to be careful translating painted images into actual garments since dyes and pigments differ between various media but, I amazed! The portrait miniature of John Manners, 2nd Duke of Rutland (1676-1721) by Charles Boit is in a mind-blowing shade of blue! So are the miniatures of "Unknown Man" and "Unknown Lady" by Gervase Spencer. They are even brighter than this: http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/p/perronne/coudray.jpg >If you could turn the color a bit greener, that might work for 18thC. I >personally have little knowledge of overdyeing silk, and I'm inclined to >believe that it's a crime to risk ruining a gorgeous fabric, that's so right >for one period, just to try to fit it into a different period. So, you're thinking mid-to-late 19th century? > > There is a slightly lighter shade of blue worn in C. Phillips "A Tea-Party > > at Lord Harrington's" 1730 (fig 20 in Ribeiro) but almost the same shade as > > my silk is worn by "Charles, Prince of the Asturias, later King of Naples > > and Sicily; and then Charles II of Spain" 1724. (fig 9 Ribeiro). However, > > I've noticed that a lot of the figures wearing blue are wearing a softer > > shade of blue. Does anyone know what colour remover does to silk? I would > > like to achieve a shade like: http://cgfa.sunsite.dk/m/p-meyer1.htm > >The shade is very nice. > >Again, my personal experience of dyeing is limited to cottons, but the dye >remover I've used on cotton does not evenly soften the shade; it removes most >of the color, sometimes unevenly. That's because the usual purpose of dye >remover is to prepare the fabric to be dyed a new color. > >Although I don't know this for sure, I suspect any dye remover you could find >to use on silk would work the same way. And as I said above, I would hate to >risk damage to the fabric. If you really want to try changing the color, I >think you should get expert advice. Good idea. I will email Dharma and see what they suggest... Thanks for your advice. Cheers, Danielle _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 06:11:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RAB2HP003054 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 06:11:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RA84Uw003475 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 04:08:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RA83YH015470; Tue, 27 May 2003 04:08:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RA80YH015448 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 04:08:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A93BB6E0074; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:08:59 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A901140114; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:08:01 -0500 Message-ID: <018601c32438$216bfe80$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net><000601c32247$a2f9ad00$010877d8@pavilion><200305262156.44997.cathy@thyrsus.com><013c01c3242a$0613e7a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <001201c32430$b4581f10$120c0150@Imedia5043> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Couture clothing Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 06:09:58 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dawn, I am glad you mentioned your real world experience. I started to mention the import/export process and decided not to. I find the whole product development process in the clothing industry fascinating when taking these classes. Fashion Import/Export were some of my favorite classes. I took these classes when so many U.S. clothing manufacturers made the big move to 2nd & 3rd world countries. Although we did not like that these industries moved, it is understandable from the business world. It is a lot cheaper to purchase the fabrics in one country, have them assembled in another, and shipped back to the U.S. or Europe than to pay the labor. The demands from the retailers' end became so high, that the manufacturers had to find another solution to manufacturing and making a profit. Now before I get mobbed for saying that... the reason it is cheaper is not only the labor and materials in these countries. The import/export duties/fees are so cheap because of trade agreements we have with these countries. The sad side was that so many people who had previously worked in these factories had to learn a new job skill. I can see all viewpoints... designers, labor, manufacturers, retailers, and consumers. I have friends in all these areas and have heard their stories. A career choice was actually a very hard decision when coming upon graduation with my second degree in fashion merchandising and marketing. All I could think of was, "I have to live with my choice." That's why I am not in the goods industry. I think the main part that bothers me is the retailers. I refuse to go into high end dept. stores and pay to prices they want. My thoughts about high-end merchandising changed one day when working, opened a shipping box and got the packing slip. The box contained designer robes with each costing of $25 and retailing for $300. BTW, the robes sold like hotcakes at Christmas. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 07:20:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBK6HP003244 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:20:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBEbUw007166 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 05:14:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBEYuX009986; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:14:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBEVuY009948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:14:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4RBFBC2021813 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:15:11 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4RBFAwI021811 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:15:10 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 07:15:10 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> <5.0.0.25.2.20030527041259.0379d340@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527041259.0379d340@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305270715.10345.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4RBEVuY009948 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 27 May 2003 05:17 am, Danielle Nunn-Weinberg wrote: > Greetings, > > Thank you. I've done some further looking at 18th century portraits and > found some really bright colours. Including this portrait of Madam de > Pompador (which is much bluer in my book) > http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/b/boucher/2/pompado3.jpg > Interesting. On my monitor, the gown in this portrait looks dark green to me. > This portrait (by Rosalba CARRIERA, "Self-Portrait as Winter"1731) is > almost the same shade as the silk I have > http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/c/carriera/selfport.jpg This is definitely in the target shade range, though.... -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 07:39:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBdWHP003311 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:39:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBZ8Uw008492 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 05:35:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBZ7uX017609; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:35:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail3.atl.registeredsite.com (nobody@mail3.atl.registeredsite.com [64.224.219.77]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBZ2uY017572 verify=FAIL) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:35:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from libra.hosting4u.net (libra.hosting4u.net [209.35.191.113]) h4RBYx1l012031 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:35:02 -0400 Received: from ctrlalt ([68.49.214.150]) by libra.hosting4u.net ; Tue, 27 May 2003 06:34:57 -0500 From: "A.Thurman" To: "Historic Costume List \(E-mail\)" Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 07:34:36 -0400 Message-ID: <05bb01c32443$ffd31c20$336f6f6f@systemsfirm.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal X-Rcpt-To: Subject: [h-cost] Men and costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin Netherton wrote: "I have a great deal of admiration for men who have learned how to sew because they're interested in making costumes, because they have an extra hurdle to overcome compared with the average woman who decides she wants to learn to sew. Few people think it's odd for a woman to take a sewing class, or go into a fabric store with a how-to book in hand, but people take notice of men who do this, and recognize that it's unusual, which itself can be a deterrent. By "unusual" I don't necessarily mean that people disapprove of men sewing (though some people, I know, do think it's odd) -- but even those who heartily approve of men learning to sew are going to take notice of those who do, when we might not take any notice of women doing so." Seconded - I've had this debate with my friends lately, and have come to the conclusion: gender stereotyping is MUCH crueler for men (or, straight men, at any rate), than it is for women. Think about it - a woman can lift weights one day and turn around and sew the next, and nothing odd is really thought about it. If anything, she might be pegged as a "tomboy", but in my culture (USA) and age group (late 20s-early 30s), this is no big deal. Now watch a guy take up, oh, say, sewing. Or ballet. Or knitting. Or some other stereotypically female activity. He will NEVER hear the end of it! So I give massive respect to guys who buck the trend and sew. Allison _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 07:57:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBvnHP003395 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:57:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBrYUw009962 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 05:53:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBrWuX024115; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:53:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grunt5.ihug.co.nz (grunt5.ihug.co.nz [203.109.254.45]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RBrUuX024095 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 05:53:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from p965-apx1.akl.ihug.co.nz (ihug.co.nz) [203.173.195.203] by grunt5.ihug.co.nz with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19Kd1C-0002zS-00; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:53:27 +1200 Message-ID: <3ED351B9.50207@ihug.co.nz> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 23:53:29 +1200 From: michaela User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> <14.11ee5706.2c00e74d@aol.com> <5.0.0.25.2.20030527041259.0379d340@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> <200305270715.10345.cathy@thyrsus.com> In-Reply-To: <200305270715.10345.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/b/boucher/2/pompado3.jpg > Interesting. On my monitor, the gown in this portrait looks dark green to me. Yes this is the problem with using the web for colours:) There are so many steps where colours can change: The conditions the initial photo of the painting was taken under. The original print. Scanning the print. Monitor. This image is very green on my monitor too, but I do recall seeing a better scan http://www.marquise.de/ Though even this image is quite green. With the caveat in place, and pehaps to see if you can find prints in books: http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1743_2a.shtml http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1746_2.shtml http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1756_3.shtml http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1760_1.shtml check out the blue gown here! http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/nbg/index.shtml extant, 6th row, solid dark blue. Pretty bright too. Wonder how the colour might have dulled over time? OT but i may have found a next project;) http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1757_1.shtml or maybe http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1760_5.shtml michaela http://glittersweet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 08:32:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RCWYHP003509 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:32:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RCTRUw012243 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 06:29:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RCTPuE007763; Tue, 27 May 2003 06:29:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RCQquE006713 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 06:26:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.1ed.9af974c (30970) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:26:45 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1ed.9af974c.2c04b384@aol.com> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:26:44 EDT Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/27/2003 5:24:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time, dannw@mn.rr.com writes: > http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/b/boucher/2/pompado3.jpg > > This is the very portrait I was referring to....being reproduced in "Dangerous Liaisons". Again, the color is different in every reproduction I've seen. Sometime much more blue than in this one. [the "DL" gown is teal] And if you are going to dye the blue to green, you don't over dye it in green. Green is a mixture of blue and yellow, so dyeing it green just adds more blue! All you need is the yellow overdye. If the blue is electric, pick a yellow that isn't true....like an ochre. The more towards the orange the yellow is, the more it will "kill" the blue. Don't ruin the fabric. Test, test and then test again before committing to a color and dumping the whole bolt in. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 08:41:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RCexHP003523 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:40:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RCbxUw012745 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 06:38:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RCbwuE011291; Tue, 27 May 2003 06:37:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RCbtuE011248 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 06:37:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m110.in-tch.com [216.166.191.110]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4RCJQH25779 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 06:19:26 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED35C7A.AF83C4E8@in-tch.com> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 06:39:22 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: funny was Re: [h-cost] Re: Being judged by clothes References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527040418.0379a530@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yes. Adds new meaning to "stuffed shirts," though, doesn't it? --sue Danielle Nunn-Weinberg wrote: > > I've been studiously ignoring this thread but, while deleting them by > subject line, I had this sudden image of an array of various outfits (of > clothing) sitting at a table, displaying judging numbers as people walked > by... : ) > > Cheers, > Danielle (can you tell I should have been in bed ages ago?) > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 09:16:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RDGAHP003663 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 09:16:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RDBSUw015048 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 07:11:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RDBLD5024690; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:11:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RDBFD5024582 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:11:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA22800 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:32:42 -0500 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:32:42 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon In-Reply-To: <026301c32431$ca5e9720$6f794ed5@pavilion> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tue, 27 May 2003, Melanie Wilson wrote: > ... not many Norman women came over so I doubt female fashion was so > heavily influenced, at least no more than the interchange of ideas > usually is. Can you give us a little more detail on that statement, or a good source? Since the Normans received British land as payment from William and came over to establish new lives on that land, I assumed they would have brought their families. Surely they weren't all single men looking for Saxon brides? Fashion-wise, it's customary to date the appearance of the more fitted female silhouette of the 11th century to the arrival of the Normans. By this I refer to the gowns with narrower midriffs; this was taken to more of an extreme in the 12th century, ultimately with side lacings, in both England and France. There are some other details that are typically pegged to "Norman" style, including long pendant cuffs, but are probably more of a question of "upper-class" style, something that in turn was associated with the Normans. It may be that the preference for narrower torsos is also simply an upper-class thing, but I don't recall seeing it much in Saxon art. Gale Owen-Crocker's book on "Dress in Anglo-Saxon England" might offer some clues, or at least establish a baseline for you of the "Saxon" norm that you might then compare to the "Norman" style described in other sources. Good news for costumers: Gale has finally completed the expanded and revised edition of "Dress in Anglo-Saxon England" and is now just working out technicalities of the publishing. Perhaps we'll have it in hand soon -- I hope within the year. It's got a *lot* of new information in it. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 09:28:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RDS3HP003689 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 09:28:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RDQFUw016139 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 07:26:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RDQED5001956; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:26:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.149]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RDQ3D5001820 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 07:26:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pavilion (213-78-98-49.friaco.onetel.net.uk [213.78.98.49]) 3.2.2-GA) with SMTP id ADN72943; Tue, 27 May 2003 14:25:55 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <005501c32454$0435e6c0$31624ed5@pavilion> From: "Melanie Wilson" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 14:29:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Can you give us a little more detail on that statement, or a good source? Not to hand but there are contempory ref saying that the Norman women refused to come over and a lot of ,men married saxons, those with wives already didn't need the land in the same way (ie to establish a marriage) Normans around the time equally divided land between all male sons so land holdings got smaller & smaller (obviously) So you see rampaging Normans going off to find land elsewhere (eg Italy Lombady etc) A man is not likely to be married witghout land (I'm talking minor noble etc here) And why would any woman go to a cold land ? So you see men marrying into AS families to ligitamise their claim (in part it is very complex but can also be seen in other Norman invaded areas) and this whole what nationality are the offspring thing starts, this is thought to be one of the reasons English survived over Norman French (think Mother tongue) >Since the Normans received British land as payment from William and came over to establish new lives on that land, I assumed they would have brought their families. General medieval theme goes no land no marriage, who would want their daughter to marry a landless person ? Unless you had land to pass on in which case you could make a better marriage than that for her. It differs depending on time & this is incredibily potted and simplistic, but show (I hope ) the trend > Surely they weren't all single men looking for Saxon brides? Looking for land certainly, a bride was perhaps the bonus :) Seriously Saxon ladies tended to remain with the land as I understand it. Gareth could probably give you more info on the historical side. I'm just a simple archaeologist ;) Terribily un costume related so I don't want to go on too much Mel This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the Company, unless specifically stated. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 10:23:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4REN0HP003884 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:23:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4REKpUw020413 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 08:20:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4REKljD029152; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:20:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4REKhjD029016 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:20:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from MaddNancy@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.7d.38fa504f (3850) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:20:30 -0400 (EDT) From: MaddNancy@aol.com Message-ID: <7d.38fa504f.2c04ce2d@aol.com> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 10:20:29 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6011 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Italian lucco catalano (was Giornea) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I just finished making an Italian cloak with the slit on one side. Based on my research it was called the lucco catalano as the style came in from Spain. I haven't worn it outside yet (it's May in North Carolina), but when wearing it to show people the fit, it's been very comfortable. I plan to make another one for nasty weather since this one is lined in silk, and I'm feeling very protective of the garment in general! I'm trying to learn webpaging so that I can post my research as well as pictures of it. Is it possible to send attachments to this list (I don't remember). Nancy Ulmer (Maddalena Salutati) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 10:32:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4REWUHP003930 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:32:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4REUVUw021553 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 08:30:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4REUTjD005127; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:30:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4REUQjE005103 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:30:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty3194.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.248.194]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4REUXN2003594 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:30:33 -0400 Message-ID: <3ED37661.8080706@dandy.net> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 10:29:53 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Check out these Italian silk brocades References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030525204432.00af9bf0@pop.sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, All. I looked at the fabric, and it seems nice, but I have a few thoughts on it that I wanted to bounce off of y'all before I made any decisions. First, I seem to remember a discussion regarding the percentage of silk in a fabric that is labelled that way. If anyone orders a swatch of this stuff, can you test it and let us know? Second, since I usually do pre-18th Cent. clothing, I would probably shy away from the stripes and plaids, but the way that the fabric is scutched up in the photos of the patterned materials doesn't allow mo to see the layout of the pattern. This is then a question for all of the Renaissance buffs out there... the pattern doesn't appear to be symmetrical on the brocades. I was always under the impression that symmetry was standard on that type of stuff (with the exception of smaller elements, such as things in escutcheons like lions, eagles, etc.), but, from what I can see, on their fabric, it isn't. Does anyone have examples of non-symmetrical damask material from Ren paintings? I am not including woodcuts or engravings, unless they can be shown to be an accurate representation. Let me know of any examples, and whether they are the exception rather than the rule in your opinion. Thanks, Mike T. Lavolta Press wrote: > http://www.hyenaproductions.com/store+dupioni+stripes+plaids2.htm > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 11:09:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RF93HP004037 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 11:09:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RF67Uw025645 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 09:06:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RF62oN028485; Tue, 27 May 2003 09:06:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (root@mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RF5voN028412 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 09:05:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bently (dialport85.tukwila.eskimo.net [208.187.14.86]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA16976 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 08:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <00b001c32461$68f7be00$560ebbd0@bently> From: "David" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030527074532.32970.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Sue's Lottery win, was Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:05:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > > >This week-long excursion to museums and > > bookstores and fabric stores (like that silk store in London that > > Bjarne's mentioned) Yes, I had forgotten about the silk store! Tell me more (like an address, an area to look in, etc.) since I'll be in London for most of August! Pam Dotson Everett, WA USA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 12:12:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGCFHP004232 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:12:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RG7hUw004488 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 10:07:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RG7dQR019011; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:07:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RG7YQR018931 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:07:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 8855 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 16:07:34 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 16:07:34 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-41.sonic.net [209.148.115.41]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4RG7WR25962 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 09:07:32 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527085411.00ab0520@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 09:09:03 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Check out these Italian silk brocades In-Reply-To: <3ED37661.8080706@dandy.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030525204432.00af9bf0@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:29 AM 5/27/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Hi, All. I looked at the fabric, and it seems nice, but I have a few >thoughts on it that I wanted to bounce off of y'all before I made any >decisions. First, I seem to remember a discussion regarding the percentage >of silk in a fabric that is labelled that way. If anyone orders a swatch >of this stuff, can you test it and let us know? I asked (via email) for swatches of two colors of the brocade. No reply from the seller yet, but for a small business on a holiday weekend that's not surprising. If they tell me it's pure silk, I'm inclined to believe them. They probably bought it direct from the manufacturer (once fabrics get into a discount store they can have gone through more hands and the IDs lost somehow, though not always). And I see no reason to believe they are disreputable. As for a burn test, sure, though I don't tend to get a lot of info out of those. But I can often tell silk and polyester contents (roughly) by smelling the fabric. > Second, since I usually do pre-18th Cent. clothing, I would probably shy > away from the stripes and plaids, but the way that the fabric is scutched > up in the photos of the patterned materials doesn't allow mo to see the > layout of the pattern. Yes, their photos are not the clearest. They don't show the pattern very well. I was having problems judging symmetry or what the motifs really looked like. As for colors, those never look true on a monitor, but I still liked them. >This is then a question for all of the Renaissance buffs out there... the >pattern doesn't appear to be symmetrical on the brocades. My immediate reaction was, "This is beautiful fabric, I need an excuse to buy some." Considering how much fabric I already have. I figured if I liked the swatches, then I'd start working on the excuse. I really like the fact that the prices of silks have lowered so much in recent years, probably due to trade agreements though I've never looked into that. Do you know any other online sources for pure silk brocades? I was looking at the Silk Trading Company also, but their site is being redesigned and all they have up is a placeholder page. There is one in SF but their hours have changed and are not that convenient for me. I do have some of the heavyish Oriental rayon/silk blends that are so widely available, and they are very nice, but I was interested in pure silk. The other type of fabric I'm seeing more of and really like, is embroidered silks. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 12:13:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGDpHP004238 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:13:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGBxUw005028 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 10:11:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGBvQR022268; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:11:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGBsQR022233 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:11:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFJ00BUKZNSSL@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 09:11:53 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:29:39 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: funny was Re: [h-cost] Re: Being judged by clothes In-reply-to: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527040418.0379a530@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030527082921.00af9600@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/23/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030526205303.00aafad0@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030526183515.00af2b30@pop.sonic.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 04:06 AM 5/27/2003 -0500, you wrote: >I've been studiously ignoring this thread but, while deleting them by >subject line, I had this sudden image of an array of various outfits (of >clothing) sitting at a table, displaying judging numbers as people walked >by... : ) > >Cheers, >Danielle (can you tell I should have been in bed ages ago?) Thanks for the great laugh! I needed it. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 12:33:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGX4HP004273 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:33:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGVFUw007388 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 10:31:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGVDQR008924; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:31:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RGV6QR008835 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:31:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 19187 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 16:31:06 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 16:31:06 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-147.sonic.net [209.148.112.147]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4RGV5n20351 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 09:31:05 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527091644.00aba568@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 09:32:37 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men and costume In-Reply-To: <05bb01c32443$ffd31c20$336f6f6f@systemsfirm.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >Now watch a guy take up, oh, say, sewing. Or ballet. Or knitting. Or some >other stereotypically female activity. He will NEVER hear the end of it! Although men do suffer from gender stereotyping, I think in the past few decades the pressure to be macho (as in football, beer, and babes) has let up as much for men as women. I've known a number of professional and serious male dancers, and a number of amateur male costumers, who did not complain of social problems from it. In fact, I have often seen a gender imbalance work in favor of men in largely female environments such as a sewing or dance class, or even an email list, with mostly female members. When a gender rarity, a man seems more likely to be helped, praised, and at times flirted with by the women. This can certainly also be true for a woman in a largely male environment, as I can testify from working in computer companies that had only a handful of women. But, I assume the males on this list know their own experiences as to whether they experience prejudice for sewing, etc. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 12:36:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGavHP004276 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:36:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGXnUw007812 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 10:33:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGXmQR011209; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:33:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RGXjQS011171 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:33:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from eliz@localhost) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.8/Submit) id h4RGXiZR011165 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:33:44 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 10:33:44 -0600 From: Elizabeth Lear To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Italian lucco catalano (was Giornea) Message-ID: <20030527163344.GG21155@net.indra.com> References: <7d.38fa504f.2c04ce2d@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <7d.38fa504f.2c04ce2d@aol.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tue, May 27, 2003 at 10:20:29AM -0400, MaddNancy@aol.com wrote: >Is it possible to send attachments to this list (I don't remember). Nope. They will be automatically stripped out. ...eliz, list admin -- Please allow 2-6 weeks for delivery. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 13:21:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RHLsHP004409 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:21:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RHJqUw013964 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 11:19:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RHJnY3017114; Tue, 27 May 2003 11:19:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RHJgY3017030 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 11:19:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 27587 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 17:19:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail2.inreach.com) (209.142.2.51) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 27 May 2003 17:19:40 -0000 Received: from 162.119.64.111 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Tue, 27 May 2003 10:19:40 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <34828.162.119.64.111.1054055980.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 10:19:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Giornea From: To: In-Reply-To: <00d001c323fe$1885c0b0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> References: <9453E61C-8FEC-11D7-9FBB-000393D446D6@comcast.net> <00d001c323fe$1885c0b0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.9) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Thank you Allison! I could not agree more so here goes.... > > I have a giornea that I made recently of a damask in a lovely dark brick > red color... not quite a burgundy. It is the style that is not split up > the front, but has a deep V. I have seen them in paintings where they > have a little belt just under the bustline (though usually on the open > front style) and have seen them with beading and other embellishments > along the edges. I would really like to add some pearl/bead accents in > sort of an all-over pattern. I don't think I have seen this and wondered > if anyone else had. I may do it anyway as I think it would look cool > ;-) but it would be nice to be able to document doing it. Thanks! Teena, Contrary to popular belief, Italian Renn very rarely had beading done on it. Most often you see rich fabrics with simple & elegant styles. And as far as Giorneas go, I have not seen any beading. But how about some little fabric leaf-shapes on the edge like this: http://btr0xw.rz.uni-bayreuth.de/cjackson/ghirlandaio/p-ghirlandaio2.htm I wouldn't personally pick pink but the leaf-shapes are alot of fun. Good luck! Diana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 14:53:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3] (may be forged)) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RIraHP004712 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 14:53:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RImgUw025788 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 12:48:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RImeHd029057; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:48:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80410.mail.yahoo.com (web80410.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RImbHd028927 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:48:37 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030527184832.12603.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80410.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 27 May 2003 11:48:32 PDT Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 11:48:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] men and clothing selection To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000c01c323ed$89c7cd60$190377d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I asked my hairdresser about this "Men aren't concerned about their appearance" thing (he has about 1,000 clients, both male and female). According to him, 1) Men are MUCH fussier than women about their appearance. 2) If they don't like something, they immediately tell you. 3) If they're really bugged, they won't pay and/or they won't come back. 4) Women will not only pay for something they don't like, but they'll give a large tip. Dawn (currently with fire-engine red hair, and loving it!) --- Lisa Sinervo wrote: > This whole question of men and their clothes has > crossed my mind on a couple of occasions, especially > one day when 5 out of seven men in the office I was > working at were wearing khaki green pants and a blue > chambray, shirt. Almost a uniform and we could wear > pretty much anything we wanted there. One day, a > woman even wore her silk pajamas in, the kind with > shorts and a button up top, actual pajamas. So I > asked one of the guys I was quite close to, why he > chose to wear what he did. He said, because he > didn't care at all and that was what was available > at the shops. Like, that was ALL you could buy, > which obviously wasn't true. He also had the > greenie, push biker look outside of work and so was > pretty conformist in the sub culture he moved in. > So, I said, if it didn't matter all that much to > you, why don't you wear a stripped rugby shirt > tomorrow, which he could borrow from his roommate. > NO WAY, and it was not a matter of borrowed clothes. > So, to him at least, it mattered very very much > what he wore but he wouldn't acknowledge it. It > didn't even have to be a rugby shirt, just something > not normally his style. I'd be interested in > reading any in-depth studies of men's use of > clothing so see what this is all about. > > > Lisa > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:03:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJ3kHP004748 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:03:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJ1gUw027380 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:01:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJ1e6d009453; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:01:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (IDENT:root@mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJ1Z6d009360 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:01:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail23.ureach.com (mailout.ureach.com [172.16.2.83]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA03124 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:01:34 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail23.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id PAA21256 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:01:34 -0400 Message-ID: <01ae01c32481$ebedfed0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <9453E61C-8FEC-11D7-9FBB-000393D446D6@comcast.net> <00d001c323fe$1885c0b0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> <34828.162.119.64.111.1054055980.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Giornea Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 14:58:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Giornea > Contrary to popular belief, Italian Renn very rarely had beading done on > it. Most often you see rich fabrics with simple & elegant styles. And as > far as Giorneas go, I have not seen any beading. But how about some > little fabric leaf-shapes on the edge like this: > > http://btr0xw.rz.uni-bayreuth.de/cjackson/ghirlandaio/p-ghirlandaio2.htm > > I wouldn't personally pick pink but the leaf-shapes are alot of fun. Good > luck! > > Diana > Oh I know of this one! In fact, I was thinking of doing the leaf shapes on another one I have been planning to make. Of course, it is on a very long to-sew list so it could be awhile! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:16:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJG9HP004771 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:16:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJC0Uw028716 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:12:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJBt6d017700; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:11:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJBm6d017575 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:11:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f2f.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.47]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 904AD262A18 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:11:47 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002501c32484$9721e5d0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527091644.00aba568@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men and costume Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 21:17:18 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I must say that i have never had a strange word about my sewing, nor my lace making or embroidery. On the contrary, i think most people has just wondered, and admired me for it. When i have met new people at parties, and told them about my "hobby" they all have said oooooooooh and myyyyyyyyy. I once worked at a factory, where it was real straight men, all of them, and even they, have never said anything bad about me. I guess it was because i was totally honest with them, and they new my sexual orientation. People can always tell that, when they get to know me. I dont think i am particular feminin, but it must be the way i talk, and perhaps some of my movements. I have noticed, being a member of the danish textile history society, wich all are ladies, that they admirer me that i have the guts to be the only man in the company, and i think also, because i respect their trade in sewing and embroidery, and the like. Not many real straight men, have any idears about the skills it takes to be a good sewer, embroiderer, cutter, etc.......... Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 6:32 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men and costume > > > > >Now watch a guy take up, oh, say, sewing. Or ballet. Or knitting. Or some > >other stereotypically female activity. He will NEVER hear the end of it! > > Although men do suffer from gender stereotyping, I think in the past few > decades the pressure to be macho (as in football, beer, and babes) has let > up as much for men as women. > > I've known a number of professional and serious male dancers, and a number > of amateur male costumers, who did not complain of social problems from it. > In fact, I have often seen a gender imbalance work in favor of men in > largely female environments such as a sewing or dance class, or even an > email list, with mostly female members. When a gender rarity, a man seems > more likely to be helped, praised, and at times flirted with by the > women. This can certainly also be true for a woman in a largely male > environment, as I can testify from working in computer companies that had > only a handful of women. > > But, I assume the males on this list know their own experiences as to > whether they experience prejudice for sewing, etc. > > Fran > > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:25:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJPJHP004803 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:25:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNIUw000114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNG6d026194; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (mta6.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNB6f026130 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.121.126.134]) by mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HFK0005O8G10W@mta6.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:21:39 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 11:13:22 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-reply-to: <20030523173821.43838.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030527111012.04f6f590@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: <20030523075131.4547.qmail@web41505.mail.yahoo.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >And actually, uniforms are pretty nice, especially if >it's something you can enjoy wearing. It saves having >to try to figure out what to wear every morning. ;-) But imagine the financial impact to the family with several children, who can hardly afford one set of clothes for their kids. And they don't actually lessen any problem I have ever heard them proposed as a cure for - gang violence, drugs, etc. And them why did my kids have to wear them in middle school and not in high school - which was right across the street from it? CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:25:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJPdHP004808 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:25:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNkUw000186 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNk6d026595; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (mta6.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNB6d026130 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.121.126.134]) by mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HFK0005O8G10W@mta6.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:21:39 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 11:09:02 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-reply-to: <47.2e25e87f.2bffa8bd@aol.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030527110206.04f65b40@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >And the folks from my high school? The popular girls married the football >players and settled down in San Luis Obispo and raised families. I hear from >one of them every few years wanting an update on my life for some sort of >reunion publication. I really don't care. The kids that dressed >different, didn't >fit in for whatever reason became lawyers, doctors, heads of corporations, >peace corps workers, college professors and myriad other very interesting >things. I went to my ten year reunion (in 1977) wearing a leather jacket, patched Levis, the most hideous pair of platform shoes I could find (I wish I still had those shoes), and my Buck knife (folding) prominently on my belt. The snobby ones from ten years previous had fossilized in place, and the few who had been on speaking terms with me, had found themselves and become even nicer. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:26:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJQ1HP004812 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:26:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJO9Uw000246 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:24:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJO86d026860; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:24:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (mta6.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNB6h026130 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.121.126.134]) by mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HFK0005O8G10W@mta6.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:21:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 11:29:20 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523111817.00ab7d50@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030527111503.04f776c0@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: <4.3.1.2.20030523001333.00dfcac0@mail.frys.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522220351.00ac7a48@pop.sonic.net> <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >As for looking homeless--I've never met you but I still feel you don't >need to worry about being mistaken for a homeless person. The homeless >tend to look as though they seldom wash themselves or their clothes. I'm >sure this is not their fault. Having once walked into a large bus station >ladies' room where a homeless woman was taking a sponge bath in the nude >in full view of everyone passing by, I understand the >difficulties. However, I'm sure you bathe. The homeless also tend to look >very weather-beaten from being outside all the time, much more even than >most people with outdoor jobs. So, you're probably OK there. You don't feel I need to worry, but it has happened on more than one occasion. It may be my fluffy hair, wisps of which escape any tie I ever put it in, or it may be the worn look many of my clothes have even when they are clean, or the fact that I don't carry a purse. I certainly know what homeless folks look like, having lived in San Jose and San Francisco in their neighborhoods. I know the 'costume' and avoid it, but some squeaky-clean folks don't know the 'costume' as well as I do, and seem to have a thing about less fortunate folks being like lepers or something. The last time I was mistaken for homeless I had been painting, and had stopped at a bookstore still wearing paint-spattered shoes and an older t-shirt. None of the management said anything, but some customer objected that I took a chair maybe ten feet away from him. The fact that the rest of me was clean didn't occur to him, and he was so rude I left in tears without thinking to complain to the management. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:26:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJQbHP004815 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:26:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJORUw000300 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:24:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJOQ6d027080; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:24:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (mta6.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNB6j026130 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.121.126.134]) by mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HFK0005O8G10W@mta6.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:21:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 11:45:36 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Clothes make the (wo)man... In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030527114409.04fb5a80@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: <000e01c3223e$1943db20$5a0977d8@pavilion> <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524105606.00b00d80@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524123837.00abb900@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524131729.00b15390@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030524141845.00af8598@pop.sonic.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >But to get back to clothes--really, with the modern mass market, how can >you tell someone's income from their clothes? Unless they make as little as I do, in which case it becomes easier to tell that I only wear thrift store clothes anymore. That may have been part of why I was mistaken as homeless. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:26:38 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJQcHP004818 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:26:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJOiUw000329 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:24:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJOh6d027276; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:24:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (mta6.snfc21.pbi.net [206.13.28.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJNB6l026130 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com ([67.121.126.134]) by mta6.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 1.6 (built Oct 18 2002)) with ESMTP id <0HFK0005O8G10W@mta6.snfc21.pbi.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:21:42 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 11:57:55 -0700 From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged/class In-reply-to: X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com To: Historical Costume Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20030527114753.04fbec50@mail.frys.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii References: <20030523175923.64617.qmail@web41104.mail.yahoo.com> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >does anybody ever admit to being *other* than middle class? Aside from >the obvious extremeties, with Bill Gates on one end and the homeless on >the other. I do, and I'm not quite homeless this month. But my Sweetie lives in his van, using the kitchen, bathroom, washing machine/dryer, and electricity of the place I am staying to supplement this. I am kind-of forced to admit my financial situation when any group of my friends suggest we all go out to get a meal at a restaurant, where one meal at a Denny's represents about one week of my regular food budget. I also mention my situation whenever an affluent friend of mine suggests I buy some piece of electronics, saying "it's really cheap" where the price is more than the sum total of what I made last year. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:28:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJSiHP004824 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:28:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJP4Uw000385 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:25:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJP36d027540; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:25:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RJNY6d026453 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:23:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 17758 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 19:23:34 -0000 Received: from tempest.sonic.net (208.201.224.25) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 19:23:34 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-218.sonic.net [209.148.112.218]) by tempest.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4RJNXu09122 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:23:33 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527122310.00ab3178@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 12:25:05 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] men and clothing selection In-Reply-To: <20030527184832.12603.qmail@web80410.mail.yahoo.com> References: <000c01c323ed$89c7cd60$190377d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >2) If they don't like something, they immediately tell >you. Makes sense--so would I. >4) Women will not only pay for something they don't >like, but they'll give a large tip. Doesn't make sense. If they don't complain and they tip him, well how does he know whether they like the job or not? And if they don't like it, why do they tip so well? Fran _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:33:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJXHHP004836 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:33:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJU8Uw000992 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:30:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJU76d001797; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:30:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RJU16d001723 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:30:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 19908 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 19:30:01 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 19:30:01 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-218.sonic.net [209.148.112.218]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4RJU0J13942 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:30:00 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527123041.00b04598@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 12:31:32 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: Sue's Lottery win, was Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes In-Reply-To: <001f01c32482$57e6ae70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> References: <20030527074532.32970.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> <00b001c32461$68f7be00$560ebbd0@bently> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:01 PM 5/27/2003 +0200, you wrote: >The shop i baught my silk from is called: CLOTH HOUSE. They have a website "in development" at: http://www.clothhouse.com/ Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:35:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJZ4HP004843 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:35:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJWfUw001342 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:32:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJWf6d003869; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:32:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RJWc6d003820 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:32:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 20773 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 19:32:37 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 19:32:37 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-218.sonic.net [209.148.112.218]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4RJWbJ16298 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:32:37 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527123249.00a04540@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 12:34:09 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged/class In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030527114753.04fbec50@mail.frys.com> References: <20030523175923.64617.qmail@web41104.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 11:57 AM 5/27/2003 -0700, you wrote: >>does anybody ever admit to being *other* than middle class? Aside from >>the obvious extremeties, with Bill Gates on one end and the homeless on >>the other. > >I do, and I'm not quite homeless this month. The thing is, is money the only indicator of social class? How about education, the income level you grew up with, and the better income you will hopefully have in the future? Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:49:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJnJHP004885 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:49:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJjcUw002909 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:45:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJja6d014634; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:45:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RJjX6d014535 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:45:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWlRIx9rCefTY18zg3/Rt8AtQlFfN4thG4A==">; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:45:05 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HY79HDFQ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:45:05 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 15:43:27 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men and costume Message-ID: <20030527.154328.-243921.0.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-3 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, anyone in their right mind would admire you and your work. You are the Rembrandt of the modern costume/lace world. Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:49:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJnSHP004889 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:49:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJlaUw003178 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:47:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJlZ6d016378; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:47:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80402.mail.yahoo.com (web80402.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.57]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RJlS6d016187 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:47:28 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030527194722.6488.qmail@web80402.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80402.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:47:22 PDT Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 12:47:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030527111012.04f6f590@mail.frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > >And actually, uniforms are pretty nice, especially > if > >it's something you can enjoy wearing. It saves > having > >to try to figure out what to wear every morning. > ;-) > > But imagine the financial impact to the family with > several children, who > can hardly afford one set of clothes for their kids. > And they don't > actually lessen any problem I have ever heard them > proposed as a cure for - > gang violence, drugs, etc. And them why did my kids > have to wear them in > middle school and not in high school - which was > right across the street > from it? > I was thinking of uniforms for adults. I'm wearing the standard "teach/work in the theater" uniform: black sport/polo shirt with school logo and the word "STAFF" over the left breast, black jeans, black tennis shoes. The regular uniform tends to be the same, but with either blue or white shirts (our school's colors) and either jeans or khakis, depending on what I'm doing that day. Dawn ===== Dawn Jacobson Vallejo, CA, USA "Of course I recognize her. Who else would wear ruby slippers with those socks?" --Wicked Witch "Wizard of Oz", Act 1, Scene 7 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:54:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJsGHP004906 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:54:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJosUw003571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:50:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJoq6d018952; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:50:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web.antekhou.com (adsl-66-136-30-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net [66.136.30.169]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJom6d018868 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:50:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web.antekhou.com [192.168.0.250] by web.antekhou.com (SMTPD32-8.00) id A1941A02A2; Tue, 27 May 2003 14:50:44 -0500 Received: From 74w0d01 ([65.45.18.250]) by web.antekhou.com (WebShield SMTP v4.5 MR1a); id 1054065042973; Tue, 27 May 2003 14:50:42 -0500 Message-ID: <028101c32485$799712a0$0764a8c0@algx> From: "Cyn Bucheger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000c01c323ed$89c7cd60$190377d8@pavilion> <5.2.0.9.0.20030527122310.00ab3178@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] men and clothing selection Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 14:23:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It would be rude not to tip, and most women are conditioned to not make a scene, be polite, whereas most men are expected to stand up for themselves. Cyn > >2) If they don't like something, they immediately tell > >you. > > Makes sense--so would I. > > > >4) Women will not only pay for something they don't > >like, but they'll give a large tip. > > Doesn't make sense. If they don't complain and they tip him, well how does > he know whether they like the job or not? And if they don't like it, why > do they tip so well? > > Fran > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 15:57:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJvHHP004916 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:57:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJt9Uw004231 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 13:55:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RJt70B022423; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:55:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4RJt20B022336 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 13:55:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 15979 invoked from network); 27 May 2003 19:55:02 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 27 May 2003 19:55:02 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-218.sonic.net [209.148.112.218]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4RJt1n07380 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:55:01 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527125524.00b1de98@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 12:56:33 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030527111503.04f776c0@mail.frys.com> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523111817.00ab7d50@pop.sonic.net> <4.3.1.2.20030523001333.00dfcac0@mail.frys.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522220351.00ac7a48@pop.sonic.net> <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <009b01c3202b$98f54800$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >ok a chair maybe ten feet away from him. The fact that the rest of me was >clean didn't occur to him, and he was so rude I left in tears without >thinking to complain to the management. > What a jerk. I hope things go better for you. BTW, this may be no consolation, but I really like frizzy hair. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 16:53:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RKrqHP005067 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:53:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RItpUw026702 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 12:55:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RItn6d004951; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:55:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RItk6d004890 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 12:55:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f2f.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.47]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id CAFEF2629D2 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 20:55:44 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001f01c32482$57e6ae70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030527074532.32970.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> <00b001c32461$68f7be00$560ebbd0@bently> Subject: Re: Sue's Lottery win, was Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 21:01:13 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. Oh yes, definately you must go to BERWICK STREET not long from Oxford Street and Picadilly Cirkus. There are 4-5 fabric stores there, who all has a large selection of wonderfull silks. I found some wonderfull ones there. A dark blue very narrow striped one very usefull for a new suit, and a wonderfull light blue colour wich is made in ribbed silk. For a matching waistcoat, and another mouse grey one for another waistcoat :-) It would be a pair of fall front breeches in dark blue, Matching Jacket, and 2 waistcoats to go with the suit. The man who sold me the fabrics gave me 10 % off, maybe because i had a glims in the eyes :-) But i had all that silk for about 90 pounds. Had i not baught a lot of books two, i should have baught much more silk, but i had to take care of the weights for the flight back. The shop i baught my silk from is called: CLOTH HOUSE. Bjarne. Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "David" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 5:05 PM Subject: Re: Sue's Lottery win, was Re: [h-cost] being judged by clothes > > --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > > > >This week-long excursion to museums and > > > bookstores and fabric stores (like that silk store in London that > > > Bjarne's mentioned) > > Yes, I had forgotten about the silk store! Tell me more (like an address, > an area to look in, etc.) since I'll be in London for most of August! > > Pam Dotson > Everett, WA USA > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 17:53:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RLrtHP005323 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 17:53:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RLptUw019872 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 15:51:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RLprKj028204; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:51:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RLpnKj028160 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:51:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA26493 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 17:13:17 -0500 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 17:13:17 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] Seeking info on Saracen almspurses X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO (If anyone here is also on h-needlework, I'd appreciate your forwarding this message there as well.) I just received an inquiry from an historian whose specialty is medieval Paris. She's researching the importation of oriental goods into 13th and 14th century Paris and the production of these goods in Paris itself. She's become interested in "Saracen almspurses," which she says were the very highly prized silk and gold embroidered almspurses that were made in Paris and consumed all over western Europe. She says they were called "aumonieres sarracinoises" in documents. She's trying to locate any scholarship by anyone who has worked on such almspurses, and is particularly interested in finding out why these items were identified with the Muslims. If you have any leads (sources, papers, or people) for her, or if you know someone who might, please email me, and I'll pass the information on to her. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 18:13:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMDEHP005390 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:13:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMBSUw022105 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 16:11:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMBQdK012544; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:11:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.vaxxine.com (alpha.vaxxine.com [209.5.212.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMBNdK012498 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:11:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alderweb.vaxxine.com (ppp375.digi-t3.st-cath.niagara.net [209.5.218.121]) by alpha.vaxxine.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4RM9uOj003398 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:09:57 -0400 (EDT) X-RCPT-To: Message-Id: <4.3.0.20030527180514.0233c2b0@pop.vaxxine.com> X-Sender: alderweb@pop.vaxxine.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 18:18:46 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: David Webb In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527123249.00a04540@pop.sonic.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20030527114753.04fbec50@mail.frys.com> <20030523175923.64617.qmail@web41104.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4RMBNdK012498 Subject: [h-cost] Royal blue silk- remembered one title! source for colours X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Aha! remembered checking this out at the library of the Royal Ontario Museum! Lovely collection and helpful staff, if I might make a plug for fellow librarians. Might be hard to locate local copies. Anders Berchs scarfed fabric samples in England in the 18th century and brought them to Sweden for reference for Swedish industry, if I recall correctly. Pages and pages of reproduced samples! Wished I'd bought it then, but didn't want to get obsessive. (But I ENJOY obsessing!) Still working on the others... Sheridan > Call number NK 8909.65 .N67 1990 ROMU >Corporate Author Nordiska museet (Stockholm, Sweden) >Title 1700-tals textil : Anders Berchs samling i Nordiska museet / >redigerad av Elisabet Stavenow-Hidemark = 18th century textiles : the >Anders Berch collection at the Nordiska museet / edited by Elisabet >Stavenow-Hidemark. -- >Published Stockholm : Nordiska museets förlag, c1990. >Physical descrip. 280 p. : ill. (some col.), maps, port. ; 34 cm. >General Note Swedish and English. Bibliography note Includes >bibliographical references (p. 277-279) and index. >ISBN 9171082980 >Subject Berch, Anders, 1711-1774--Art >collections--Catalogs. Corporate subject Nordiska museet >(Stockholm, Sweden)--Catalogs. >Subject Textile fabrics--History--18th century--Catalogs. >Subject Textile fabrics--Private >collections--Sweden--Stockholm--Catalogs. >Subject Textile fabrics--Sweden--Stockholm--Catalogs. >Added author Stavenow-Hidemark, Elisabet. >Other title Sjuttonhundra-tals textil. >Other title 18th century textiles. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 18:16:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMGPHP005395 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:16:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMA2XC021869 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 16:12:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RM1wdK005929; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:01:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (mta2-svc.business.ntl.com [62.253.164.42]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RM1sdK005876 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:01:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Imedia5043 ([80.1.16.220]) by mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030527220152.IZMR18309.mta2-svc.business.ntl.com@Imedia5043> for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:01:52 +0100 Message-ID: <007c01c3249b$8cbad090$dc100150@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523143523.00b04610@pop.sonic.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030524144048.00ac0138@pop.sonic.net><000601c32247$a2f9ad00$010877d8@pavilion><200305262156.44997.cathy@thyrsus.com><013c01c3242a$0613e7a0$0400a8c0@comcast.net><001201c32430$b4581f10$120c0150@Imedia5043> <018601c32438$216bfe80$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Couture clothing Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 23:01:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Don't even get me started on the economic problems of whole towns etc due the use of 3rd world countries. Whilst doing my job I had some wool cloth produced in the mill my mum used to work in Yorkshire, there were now 5 mills on the site just using it as offices. 3 knitting wool companies closed down as I was talking to them about buying yarn form them and all but one of the factories I used in London are now closed all had been passed down through generations and just couldn't compete. If this was an important male dominated industry then there would be something done to save the industry but as it isn't despite being the 4th largest in the uk then there isn't The irony is that a lot of the smaller designers/companies are now wanting to produce again in the uk to get better quality and to be able to oversee the process more closely and the factories just don't exist and school leavers aren't taking over the jobs that do from those retiring and as the shops only buy a couple of each style from the designers then it really isn't viable to help them survive. without fail all the clothes sent back from overseas had to be altered and staff brought in to do this so it wasn't cost effective. That's really why clothes don't fit!!. Dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of Historical reproduction Clothing, Uniforms and Bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 > > only the labor and materials in these countries. The import/export > duties/fees are so cheap because of trade agreements we have with these > countries. > > The sad side was that so many people who had previously worked in these > factories had to learn a new job skill. I can see all viewpoints... > designers, labor, manufacturers, retailers, and consumers. I have friends > in all these areas and have heard their stories. A career choice was > actually a very hard decision when coming upon graduation with my second > degree in fashion merchandising and marketing. All I could think of was, "I > have to live with my choice." That's why I am not in the goods industry. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 18:51:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMpaHP005509 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:51:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMnkUw027591 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 16:49:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMnhdK010689; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:49:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from janus.directcon.net (janus.directcon.net [206.170.184.16]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RMnbdK010589 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:49:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dnyeaqvf (r14a155.directcon.net [207.215.72.155]) by janus.directcon.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h4RMs7k07797; Tue, 27 May 2003 15:54:07 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.20030527155145.00fd6650@pop.directcon.net> X-Sender: margospatterns@pop.directcon.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 15:51:45 -0700 To: Historical Costume , Historical Costume From: Margo Anderson Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged/class In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527123249.00a04540@pop.sonic.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20030527114753.04fbec50@mail.frys.com> <20030523175923.64617.qmail@web41104.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>>does anybody ever admit to being *other* than middle class? Aside from >>>the obvious extremeties, with Bill Gates on one end and the homeless on >>>the other. >> >>I do, and I'm not quite homeless this month. > I've BEEN homeless (some of you who've been on this list for a while may remember the several months my family and I spent sleeping on a friend's living room floor) and it still never occurred to me to think of myself as lower class. Yes, I was poor, but I still had my talents, my education, and my social background, all of which helped me pull back out of it again. As Fran points out, class is not entirely about money. To bring this back to history, if not costume, one of the marks of a truly upperclass person used to be how well they maintained standards in the face of adversity. Think Little Women: Mrs March and her daughters are upper class ladies, no matter how poor, and vulgar Mrs. Gardiner and her daughters are not quite fine, no matter how much money they have. Margo "One Tough Costumer" www.margospatterns.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 19:09:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RN96HP005563 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:09:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RN67Uw001588 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 17:06:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RN5t6h023650; Tue, 27 May 2003 17:05:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mxout5.cac.washington.edu (mxout5.cac.washington.edu [140.142.32.135]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4RN5o6i023555 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 17:05:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp.washington.edu (smtp.washington.edu [140.142.33.9]) ESMTP id h4RN5nt7013491 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:05:49 -0700 Received: from UROPORTABLE ([140.107.243.104])h4RN5ncv020402 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 16:05:49 -0700 Message-ID: <01bb01c324a4$8329ff70$68f36b8c@UROPORTABLE> From: "Agnes Gawne" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20030527114753.04fbec50@mail.frys.com> <20030523175923.64617.qmail@web41104.mail.yahoo.com> <3.0.6.32.20030527155145.00fd6650@pop.directcon.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] being judged/class Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 16:05:48 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I consider myself working class > >>>does anybody ever admit to being *other* than middle class? Aside from the obvious extremeties, with Bill Gates on one end and the homeless on the other. > >> _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 20:47:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S0loHP005938 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 20:47:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S0iNUw013839 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 18:44:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S0iKfF024351; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:44:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S0iFfG024298 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:44:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4S0ivC2022748 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 20:44:57 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4S0iu3S022746 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 20:44:56 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 20:44:56 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305272044.56229.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4S0iFfG024298 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 27 May 2003 09:32 am, Robin Netherton wrote: [text cut] > > Good news for costumers: Gale has finally completed the expanded and > revised edition of "Dress in Anglo-Saxon England" and is now just working > out technicalities of the publishing. Perhaps we'll have it in hand soon > -- I hope within the year. It's got a *lot* of new information in it. Sounds *wonderful*. I recently managed, after years of looking, to obtain a copy of the first edition and was very very impressed. I'm looking forward to seeing an updated version with more information (and, I hope, more and better illustrations). -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 21:02:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S12eHP005989 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:02:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S10lUw015130 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 19:00:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S10kL7003047; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:00:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S10hL7002971 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:00:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m47.in-tch.com [216.166.191.47]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4S0gEH28795 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:42:14 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED40A93.8DAFA55A@in-tch.com> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 19:02:11 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030523111817.00ab7d50@pop.sonic.net> <4.3.1.2.20030523001333.00dfcac0@mail.frys.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030522220351.00ac7a48@pop.sonic.net> <4.3.1.2.20030522181639.04ff8250@mail.frys.com> <003301c3206c$d9c307a0$b40e77d8@pavilion> <4.3.1.2.20030519113201.00d4a3a0@mail.frys.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030527125524.00b1de98@pop.sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO *snort* good thing it wasn't me...I probably woulda turned around and slugged the jerk! --sue Lavolta Press wrote: > > >ok a chair maybe ten feet away from him. The fact that the rest of me was > >clean didn't occur to him, and he was so rude I left in tears without > >thinking to complain to the management. > > > > What a jerk. > > I hope things go better for you. BTW, this may be no consolation, but I > really like frizzy hair. > > Fran > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 21:14:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1DqHP006032 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:14:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1BpUw016139 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 19:11:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1BkL7008993; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:11:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1BhL7008923 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:11:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m47.in-tch.com [216.166.191.47]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4S0rDH03338 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 18:53:13 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED40D26.AE0C0715@in-tch.com> Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 19:13:10 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men and costume References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030527091644.00aba568@pop.sonic.net> <002501c32484$9721e5d0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It may also have something to do with being Danish and living in Denmark, Bjarne. Y'all are a *whole* lot more ahead of the US in some things. I live in probably the most liberal city in Montana, but there is, most unfortunately, both covert and overt prejudice against people (both men and women) who are gay, bi, transgendered, anything except basic white-bread, Christian, heterosexual. --sue Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > Hi, > I must say that i have never had a strange word about my sewing, nor my lace > making or embroidery. On the contrary, i think most people has just > wondered, and admired me for it. > When i have met new people at parties, and told them about my "hobby" they > all have said oooooooooh and myyyyyyyyy. > I once worked at a factory, where it was real straight men, all of them, and > even they, have never said anything bad about me. > I guess it was because i was totally honest with them, and they new my > sexual orientation. People can always tell that, when they get to know me. I > dont think i am particular feminin, but it must be the way i talk, and > perhaps some of my movements. > I have noticed, being a member of the danish textile history society, wich > all are ladies, that they admirer me that i have the guts to be the only man > in the company, and i think also, because i respect their trade in sewing > and embroidery, and the like. Not many real straight men, have any idears > about the skills it takes to be a good sewer, embroiderer, cutter, > etc.......... > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lavolta Press" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 6:32 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men and costume > > > > > > > > >Now watch a guy take up, oh, say, sewing. Or ballet. Or knitting. Or some > > >other stereotypically female activity. He will NEVER hear the end of it! > > > > Although men do suffer from gender stereotyping, I think in the past few > > decades the pressure to be macho (as in football, beer, and babes) has let > > up as much for men as women. > > > > I've known a number of professional and serious male dancers, and a number > > of amateur male costumers, who did not complain of social problems from > it. > > In fact, I have often seen a gender imbalance work in favor of men in > > largely female environments such as a sewing or dance class, or even an > > email list, with mostly female members. When a gender rarity, a man seems > > more likely to be helped, praised, and at times flirted with by the > > women. This can certainly also be true for a woman in a largely male > > environment, as I can testify from working in computer companies that had > > only a handful of women. > > > > But, I assume the males on this list know their own experiences as to > > whether they experience prejudice for sewing, etc. > > > > Fran > > > > > > > > > > > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > Historic and Vintage Dance > > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 21:33:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1XoHP006121 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:33:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1UiUw017709 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 19:30:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1UeL7018798; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:30:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1UbL8018775 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:30:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4S1VJC2022846 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:31:19 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4S1VJmf022844 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:31:19 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 21:31:18 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> <5.0.0.25.2.20030527042008.0375c750@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527042008.0375c750@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305272131.18759.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4S1UbL8018775 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 27 May 2003 05:27 am, Danielle Nunn-Weinberg wrote: > At 10:14 PM 5/26/2003 -0400, you wrote: > >On Sunday 25 May 2003 02:36 am, Danielle Nunn-Weinberg wrote: > > > At 11:18 AM 5/24/2003 -0400, you wrote: > > > >In a message dated 5/24/2003 10:00:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > > > > > > > >drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: > > > >[text cut here] > >It was the fact that you said the fabric you had in mind was an "electric" > >(i.e., a very intense royal) blue, not the fact that it was a dark color, > >that led me to recommend against it for 18th C. (for a woman's gown, > > anyway). > > That makes sense. Believe it or not, I've just found some miniatures which > are painted even brighter blue than my silk!!! I realize one has to be > careful translating painted images into actual garments since dyes and > pigments differ between various media but, I amazed! > > The portrait miniature of John Manners, 2nd Duke of Rutland (1676-1721) by > Charles Boit is in a mind-blowing shade of blue! So are the miniatures of > "Unknown Man" and "Unknown Lady" by Gervase Spencer. They are even > brighter than this: > http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/p/perronne/coudray.jpg That certainly is an electric blue. I have no idea how closely fashionable colors for men's banyans tracked the fashionable colors for women's gowns, but that certainly is an electric blue--and definitely silk. Does the cloth of the Duke's garment look a lot like the fabric you have in mind, per chance? > > >If you could turn the color a bit greener, that might work for 18thC. I > >personally have little knowledge of overdyeing silk, and I'm inclined to > >believe that it's a crime to risk ruining a gorgeous fabric, that's so > > right for one period, just to try to fit it into a different period. > > So, you're thinking mid-to-late 19th century? Yes, I was. Particularly the 1860's, but I think you could justify it virtually anytime from about 1855 to 1900. [more text cut] > >Again, my personal experience of dyeing is limited to cottons, but the dye > >remover I've used on cotton does not evenly soften the shade; it removes > > most of the color, sometimes unevenly. That's because the usual purpose > > of dye remover is to prepare the fabric to be dyed a new color. > > > >Although I don't know this for sure, I suspect any dye remover you could > > find to use on silk would work the same way. And as I said above, I > > would hate to risk damage to the fabric. If you really want to try > > changing the color, I think you should get expert advice. > > Good idea. I will email Dharma and see what they suggest... That's a good start. Good luck! -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 21:41:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1f0HP006131 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:41:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1dDUw018234 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 19:39:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1dCL7023452; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:39:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S1d9L7023399 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 19:39:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-164-238-216.s216.tnt4.frdb.va.dialup.rcn.com ([216.164.238.216] helo=ashley) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19KpuG-0000kx-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:39:08 -0400 From: "Ashley Wells" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 21:39:09 -0400 Message-ID: <000f01c324b9$f3eea980$d8eea4d8@ashley> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.3416 In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.2.20030527041259.0379d340@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Just put a nice piece of silk into a really good indigo vat, and you'll see that "royal" (almost "cobalt") blue isn't out of the question. Wool also dyes beautifully with indigo. Cotton dyes well, but not as intense and bright (but good dark navy blue works well), then linen - which dyes a lovely, but not intensely bright or deep navy. Regards, Ashley (the dyer) -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Danielle Nunn-Weinberg Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 5:18 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Greetings, Thank you. I've done some further looking at 18th century portraits and found some really bright colours. Including this portrait of Madam de Pompador (which is much bluer in my book) http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/b/boucher/2/pompado3.jpg This portrait (by Rosalba CARRIERA, "Self-Portrait as Winter"1731) is almost the same shade as the silk I have http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/c/carriera/selfport.jpg I would love to track down those fabric sample books. they sound perfect. What is lutestring? I keep seeing references to it and realized I don't think I've ever actually seen any. Thanks again. Cheers, Danielle At 11:34 PM 5/25/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Greetings: > >Lone dissenting voice - I disagree that the royal blue wouldn't be >appropriate >for an 18 c. gown. I seem to remember seeing many examples of strong blues >in both actual gowns, fabric samples and art of the period.My problem is that >all my books and notes are in storage while we put an addition on our house, >so it's difficult for me to prove it right now. > >I have been keeping an eye for examples of strong blues in order to >justify my own purchase of a bright blue-green shot-silk (influenced by >a friend) a few years ago, yet to be completed, sigh! > >Off the top of my head, Copley painted three portraits of ladies in the same, >presumably "studio" gown which was a strong, deep blue. I'm also positive >that in the textile history book that came out in the mid- 90's - (hardcover, >colour reproductions of period sample books, book to die for, textile >bible,etc.- >someone on the list must reccognize my description!) anyways, I remember >at least one or more brilliant blue lutestring sample in that one. There was >also that reproduction of that 18th c. Scandinavian book - Norst-something >that was published about 2000 that included dozens of fabric samples. > >When we were cruising the British art galleries and museums, I often noted >by the strong colours used in the depictions of the gowns for some eras of >the eighteenth century, including a flaming red gown in a Hogarth portrait. > >Besides, IF I ever finish this gown, and IF we ever get to another French & >Indian War event, then I might not be the only blindingly brilliant sacque >there, and that would be such a comfort. > >"Curulean"-ly yours, > >Sheridan > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 23:39:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3d4HP006557 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:39:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3ZuUw028292 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 21:35:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3Zs4w023303; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:35:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3Zp4w023272 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:35:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA28233 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 22:57:20 -0500 Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 22:57:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon In-Reply-To: <200305272044.56229.cathy@thyrsus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tue, 27 May 2003, Catherine Olanich Raymond wrote: > > Good news for costumers: Gale has finally completed the expanded and > > revised edition of "Dress in Anglo-Saxon England" and is now just working > > out technicalities of the publishing. Perhaps we'll have it in hand soon > > -- I hope within the year. It's got a *lot* of new information in it. > > Sounds *wonderful*. I recently managed, after years of looking, to > obtain a copy of the first edition and was very very impressed. I'm > looking forward to seeing an updated version with more information > (and, I hope, more and better illustrations). >From what she has told me, it will have all of that and more. She's been working on the revision for years ... I remember she kept rewriting one of the chapters to keep up with new archaeological finds! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 23:49:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3nDHP006652 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:49:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3j0Uw029001 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 21:45:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3ix4w027682; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:44:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3it4x027644 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:44:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4S3jZC2023043 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:45:36 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4S3jYiN023041 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:45:34 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 23:45:34 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <000f01c324b9$f3eea980$d8eea4d8@ashley> In-Reply-To: <000f01c324b9$f3eea980$d8eea4d8@ashley> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305272345.34283.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4S3it4x027644 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 27 May 2003 09:39 pm, Ashley Wells wrote: > Just put a nice piece of silk into a really good indigo vat, and you'll > see that "royal" (almost "cobalt") blue isn't out of the question. I do not doubt you. I never saw whether it was possible to get a vivid royal blue in the 18th c as the issue. The issue was whether that option was pursued by women for gowns. There are plenty of costume related things that are "possible" for any given period that aren't, in fact, "period" because they weren't done for other reasons... -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue May 27 23:54:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3s7HP006667 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:54:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3qLUw029696 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 21:52:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3qK4w001712; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:52:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S3qH4x001685 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:52:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4S3qvC2023087 for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:52:58 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4S3qvEA023085 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 23:52:57 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabric deal. :) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 23:52:56 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <5.0.0.25.2.20030525011604.02d66b90@smtp-server.mn.rr.com> <200305270715.10345.cathy@thyrsus.com> <3ED351B9.50207@ihug.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <3ED351B9.50207@ihug.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305272352.56798.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4S3qH4x001685 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 27 May 2003 07:53 am, michaela wrote: > >>http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/b/boucher/2/pompado3.jpg > > > > Interesting. On my monitor, the gown in this portrait looks dark green to > > me. > > Yes this is the problem with using the web for colours:) There are so > many steps where colours can change: > The conditions the initial photo of the painting was taken under. > The original print. > Scanning the print. > Monitor. > This image is very green on my monitor too, but I do recall seeing a > better scan > http://www.marquise.de/ > Though even this image is quite green. > > With the caveat in place, and pehaps to see if you can find prints in > books: http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1743_2a.shtml > http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1746_2.shtml > http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1756_3.shtml > http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/pics/1760_1.shtml > > check out the blue gown here! > http://www.marquise.de/en/1700/nbg/index.shtml extant, 6th row, solid > dark blue. Pretty bright too. Wonder how the colour might have dulled > over time? > At least some of these pictures show gowns that are clearly royal blue, even on my monitor. :-) Depending on how closely Danielle's fabric matches some of these images, I'd say we've made a case that at least a few women would have worn that shade in the 18th c. (If you want to use the fabric, I'd rather see you document it as an unusual usage than attempt to dye it a more period-popular shade). :-) -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 00:05:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S45XHP006712 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 00:05:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S42YUw000887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Tue, 27 May 2003 22:02:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S42WDx007402; Tue, 27 May 2003 22:02:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S42QE0007330 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 27 May 2003 22:02:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4S438C2023145 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 00:03:09 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4S437gC023143 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 28 May 2003 00:03:07 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norman vs Saxon Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 00:03:07 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305280003.07563.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4S42QE0007330 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 27 May 2003 11:57 pm, Robin Netherton wrote: > On Tue, 27 May 2003, Catherine Olanich Raymond wrote: > > > Good news for costumers: Gale has finally completed the expanded and > > > revised edition of "Dress in Anglo-Saxon England" and is now just > > > working out technicalities of the publishing. Perhaps we'll have it in > > > hand soon -- I hope within the year. It's got a *lot* of new > > > information in it. > > > > Sounds *wonderful*. I recently managed, after years of looking, to > > obtain a copy of the first edition and was very very impressed. I'm > > looking forward to seeing an updated version with more information > > (and, I hope, more and better illustrations). > > From what she has told me, it will have all of that and more. > > She's been working on the revision for years ... I remember she kept > rewriting one of the chapters to keep up with new archaeological finds! Ah. A wonderful problem to have.... I'll look forward to it. Thanks for the info. -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 03:58:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S7wWHP004000 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 03:58:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S7sCUw019825 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 01:54:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S7sBiU001894; Wed, 28 May 2003 01:54:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hekili.k12.hi.us (hekili.k12.hi.us [165.248.1.200]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4S7s8iU001878 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 01:54:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from makani by hekili.k12.hi.us (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.2000.03.23.18.03.p10) with ESMTP id <0HFL002FM7A6D1@hekili.k12.hi.us> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 27 May 2003 21:54:06 -1000 (HST) Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 21:53:45 -1000 (HST) From: annora Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking info on Saracen almspurses In-reply-to: To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-X-Sender: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > She's become interested in "Saracen almspurses," which she says were the > very highly prized silk and gold embroidered almspurses that were made in > Paris and consumed all over western Europe. She says they were called > "aumonieres sarracinoises" in documents. She's trying to locate any > scholarship by anyone who has worked on such almspurses, and is > particularly interested in finding out why these items were identified > with the Muslims. A tiny bit I have in one of my books: "Aumonieres, or aumosnieres as they were spelled in contemporary documents*, had the same function as did pockets later; small purses, they were suspended from a cord wrapped around the waist and contained precious goods. Originally they were used to carry alms, but by the fourteenth century they were filled with gems, money, books of hours, and religious artifacts. Adapted from the Arabs, they were first referred to as "bourses sarrasinoises" or "sarrasinoises." There was a trade guild in Paris set up to make copies of the Asian bags, and statutes governing their manufacture exist from 1266-1299." There's a bit more about them but nothing in reference to their Arabic origins. The above is from a chapter on Embroidery written by Marianne Carlano in the book French Textiles, From the Middle Ages through the Second Empire, edited by Marianne Carlano and Larry Salmon. Wadsworth Atheneum, Hartford, CN 1985. ISBN 0-918333-02-4 *footnote is Laborde, Glossaire francais du Moyen Age a l'usage de l'archeologue et de l'amateur des arts (1874), p, 144. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 06:10:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SAASHP010282 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 06:10:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SA7PUw027015 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 04:07:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SA7Ofe017961; Wed, 28 May 2003 04:07:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from webwarren.com (65.18.210.ptr [65.18.210.91] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SA7Lfe017932 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 04:07:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jessica.webwarren.com (bgp381063bgs.plnfld01.nj.comcast.net [68.36.17.255]) (authenticated (0 bits)) by webwarren.com (8.12.8/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4S9u5mI020352 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 05:56:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: webwarren.com: webbwarren owned process doing -bs Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030528013950.077eaf70@mail.earthlink.net> X-Sender: arachne@pop.webwarren.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 06:07:07 -0400 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Brenda Subject: Relevance of sewing skills and economics of home-sewing (WAS: Re: [h-cost] Being judged by clothes, was new interest) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Mon, 26 May 2003 19:06:45 -0700, Fran wrote: >It's been a long time since I browsed a Home Ec course catalog, but my >impression is the availability of cheap ready-to-wear means that even most >women don't learn to sew any more. Also, Home Ec is one of the subject areas deemed less essential and therefore more apt to be cut when school budgets are slashed, or expenses rise. >Not that you can't save money by sewing your own clothes, Huh? Almost any garment you can point me at, with the exception of those that come from the designer-boutique sections of Bloomingdale's Flagship store ($500+ per garment), Bergdorf's, and stores/departments of similar ilk, or from the couturier houses themselves, I can purchase more cheaply at retail than the cost of the *materials* from which to make that garment myself. Granted, the fit may not be as exacting, and the room for personalization is limited, but if I can buy a pair of jeans for $25 or $30 yet denim costs $7 or $8 the yard (times 2.5 yards for the pair), plus $2 for the zipper, $2 for the denim-colored thread, and $4 for the contrast topstitching thread... where's my savings? The same thing for silk blouses: $25 for a ready-made short-sleeved crepe-de-chine shell versus $12-20/yd for the fabric (times at least 1.5 yd for the shell), and we haven't counted in the cost of notions (much less the cost of labor). OK, things start to break even when we talk brand-name women's wool suits ($20-30/yd retail for the wool fabric, 3-5 yd for the suit depending on pieces and styling, $3-4/yd lining, $2.50/button, etc. versus $200 and up for the ready-to-wear) and high-end designer clothes. Also, the economics in favor of home-sewn improve if the fabric is available at discount ($6/yd crepe de chine, $10-15/yd wool gabardine, etc.). But then again, as Fran says, much ready-to-wear is available at discount as well, and so any advantage of home-sewn disappears there as well. >and not that most RTW is great quality, but it's faster to buy and few >people recognize quality any more. Quality depends on the brands and the price-points. Some of my RTW is cheap crap that I want for knock-around, knowing that it's highly faddish and/or it's going to get messed up quickly, so I don't care about the quality as long as it's cheap. Other RTW in my wardrobe is name-brand stuff that I get either at outlets or at discount houses, or at end-of-season sales. (I rarely purchase anything for more than half the price the store originally sold it for, and usually I get it for 1/4 of the original asking price or less.) The name-brand stuff I buy usually comes from houses that have reasonable workmanship and that are known for classic lines and styles that will last several years (or longer) before looking dated... Brenda webwarren@earthlink.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 09:41:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SDfZHP010745 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 09:41:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SDcbUw010584 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 07:38:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SDcZRX019445; Wed, 28 May 2003 07:38:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SDPXRY012450 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 28 May 2003 07:25:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from eliz@localhost) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.8/Submit) id h4SDPXHk012446; Wed, 28 May 2003 07:25:33 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 07:25:33 -0600 From: Elizabeth Lear To: h-costume@net.indra.com, sca-east-announce@net.indra.com, sca-east@net.indra.com, f-costume@net.indra.com, vintage@net.indra.com Message-ID: <20030528132533.GC21655@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 28 May 2003 07:38:33 -0600 Subject: [h-cost] note from list admin re: spam problem X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello all, I apologize for the recent spam flood. There appears to be a problem within the Mailman software that allowed these postings to go through when they should have been caught and automatically rejected by the spam filters instead (or at the very least, caught in the filters so I could manually handle them). This may or may not have been connected to some work I was doing with my sysadmin regarding one of my mailing lists that has become a 'black hole', ie all of my mailing lists have been fine except this one we're working on that isn't passing any mail. I have set the list(s) to "emergency moderation" which I hope will prevent further messages from going out while I work with my sysadmin to figure out what has happened. On an administrative note, I will say that approximately 150-175 messages went through to 5 or 6 mailing lists I run. While feeling like quite a bit, that number actually represents less than 24 hours worth of the spam that is normally either caught and rejected by the Mailman software or manually rejected by me. I am sorry it happened, but no software is perfect and on the whole, I feel Mailman has been doing an excellent job in keeping us spam-free until this glitch. Hopefully, we will be back up and running cleanly again shortly, and your patience is appreciated. Thanks, ...eliz, list admin -- Please allow 2-6 weeks for delivery. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 11:04:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SF4FHP011015 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 11:04:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SExpUw018424 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 08:59:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SExnfr006730; Wed, 28 May 2003 08:59:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SE1Thw002414 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 08:01:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f26.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.38]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id AE1B55EE21C for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:01:27 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000701c32521$adfa33f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 16:01:47 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 28 May 2003 08:59:48 -0600 Subject: [h-cost] old embroidery patterns X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello. I am now the happy owner of some beautifull old embroidery patterns from Museum of Fine Arts in Copenhagen. Margaretha Helm edited her embroidery patterns in 1720. Then i have manipulated with her patterns, taken some fragments from here and there, and then i have made my own pattern for an embroidered stomacher. I have used my watercolours and i think i want to embroider it in those colours you see i have made. In all i have taken 40 photos of those wonderfull patterns, and there is stuff here for making anything you would like. I have signed an agreement with the museum, not to publish any of them, and not give away to others, so you cant have them from me. But you can have an idea of the quality of those patterns, they are so wonderfull. If you would be interrested in old patterns, you should try to search your museum libraries, they have some i think. Anyway, here is my design: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/helmspatterns Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 13:44:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHi0HP011593 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:44:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHgAUw008372 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 11:42:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHg6a0010895; Wed, 28 May 2003 11:42:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SFdNfr006911 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 09:39:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m104.in-tch.com [216.166.191.104]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4SFKrH26517 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 09:20:53 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED4D882.D8D72206@in-tch.com> Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 09:40:50 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] old embroidery patterns References: <000701c32521$adfa33f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-MessageCare-Metrics: net.indra.com 1108; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 28 May 2003 11:42:04 -0600 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO *sigh* Beautiful as always, Bjarne! Is this stomacher design for your client from Denver? What kind of embroidery stitches are you using for it? --sue, who wants to be rich enough to afford "a Bjarne" someday, since she sure doesn't have the talent to do her own! ;o) Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > Hello. > I am now the happy owner of some beautifull old embroidery patterns from > Museum of Fine Arts in Copenhagen. Margaretha Helm edited her embroidery > patterns in 1720. > Then i have manipulated with her patterns, taken some fragments from here > and there, and then i have made my own pattern for an embroidered stomacher. > I have used my watercolours and i think i want to embroider it in those > colours you see i have made. > In all i have taken 40 photos of those wonderfull patterns, and there is > stuff here for making anything you would like. > I have signed an agreement with the museum, not to publish any of them, and > not give away to others, so you cant have them from me. But you can have an > idea of the quality of those patterns, they are so wonderfull. > If you would be interrested in old patterns, you should try to search your > museum libraries, they have some i think. > Anyway, here is my design: > > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/helmspatterns > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 13:44:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHijHP011600 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:44:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHguUw008469 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 11:42:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHgta0011466; Wed, 28 May 2003 11:42:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SGtEa0005808 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 10:55:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09167 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 12:55:14 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id MAA25315 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 12:55:14 -0400 Message-ID: <02c701c32539$7a772ca0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000701c32521$adfa33f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] old embroidery patterns Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 12:52:09 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-DCC-servers-Metrics: net.indra.com 1049; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 28 May 2003 11:42:04 -0600 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am always amazed at the beauty of your work! The women who get to wear your creations are truly fortunate! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 10:01 AM Subject: [h-cost] old embroidery patterns > Hello. > I am now the happy owner of some beautifull old embroidery patterns from > Museum of Fine Arts in Copenhagen. Margaretha Helm edited her embroidery > patterns in 1720. > Then i have manipulated with her patterns, taken some fragments from here > and there, and then i have made my own pattern for an embroidered stomacher. > I have used my watercolours and i think i want to embroider it in those > colours you see i have made. > In all i have taken 40 photos of those wonderfull patterns, and there is > stuff here for making anything you would like. > I have signed an agreement with the museum, not to publish any of them, and > not give away to others, so you cant have them from me. But you can have an > idea of the quality of those patterns, they are so wonderfull. > If you would be interrested in old patterns, you should try to search your > museum libraries, they have some i think. > Anyway, here is my design: > > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/helmspatterns > > Bjarne > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 14:01:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SI1QHP011711 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 14:01:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHwOUw010292 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 11:58:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHwN82022351; Wed, 28 May 2003 11:58:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SHwI82022298 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 11:58:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f26.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.38]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 8C26A480016 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 19:58:16 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000d01c32542$cb7ad580$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000701c32521$adfa33f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3ED4D882.D8D72206@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] old embroidery patterns Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 19:58:50 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Sue. It is not for the Denver lady, her dress has embroidered ribbon on the bodice. No it is actually not for any one. I have desided i want to make some stomachers, and try to sell them on ebay. For this design i am going to use long and short stitches. Do you know this? it is a kind of satin stitches. I have looked at many stomachers lately, and many of them, most of them, are made on ivory or light cream fabric. So they would go to any dress, It is also because i have had a lot of beautifull colours of silk floss from Eterna Silk. I ordered more than 380 skeins in a vast variety of colours............... Long and short stitches.................. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 5:40 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] old embroidery patterns > *sigh* > Beautiful as always, Bjarne! Is this stomacher design for your client > from Denver? What kind of embroidery stitches are you using for it? > --sue, who wants to be rich enough to afford "a Bjarne" someday, since > she sure doesn't have the talent to do her own! ;o) > > Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > > > Hello. > > I am now the happy owner of some beautifull old embroidery patterns from > > Museum of Fine Arts in Copenhagen. Margaretha Helm edited her embroidery > > patterns in 1720. > > Then i have manipulated with her patterns, taken some fragments from here > > and there, and then i have made my own pattern for an embroidered stomacher. > > I have used my watercolours and i think i want to embroider it in those > > colours you see i have made. > > In all i have taken 40 photos of those wonderfull patterns, and there is > > stuff here for making anything you would like. > > I have signed an agreement with the museum, not to publish any of them, and > > not give away to others, so you cant have them from me. But you can have an > > idea of the quality of those patterns, they are so wonderfull. > > If you would be interrested in old patterns, you should try to search your > > museum libraries, they have some i think. > > Anyway, here is my design: > > > > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/helmspatterns > > > > Bjarne > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 15:11:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJBBHP012695 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:11:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJ85Uw018029 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 13:08:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJ7w1H014342; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:07:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web10008.mail.yahoo.com (web10008.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.130.44]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4SJ7o1H014205 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:07:50 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030528190750.26965.qmail@web10008.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.86.222.42] by web10008.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 28 May 2003 12:07:50 PDT Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 12:07:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Kay Shelton To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200305281803.h4SI3A84026085@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] Re: Old embroidery patterns and Bjarne's beautiful work X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, I know I am not the only one on this list who has enviously sighed over your work. Please let us know when you are have something on Ebay in plenty of time for us to place bids. And be sure to place a reasonable minimum price. Do you know how much you want to make on each? Would you consider taking orders from people on this list? I would love to own a "Bjarne." Kay <> __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). http://calendar.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 15:21:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJLAHP012853 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:21:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJJMUw019290 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 13:19:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJJK1H023181; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:19:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJJF1H023087 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:19:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f26.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.38]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id D03762629AB for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 21:19:13 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000501c3254e$1e3173a0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030528190750.26965.qmail@web10008.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Old embroidery patterns and Bjarne's beautiful work Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 21:19:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello. Off cause i would make for people on this list. That is what i do, take orders from people. When i have set up the embroidery on my frame, and i have worked some of the motifs, i could calculate, how much time and thread i am using, and then i could find out how much i would charge, and off cause i like to earn something, but mostly i do it for the passion of it, i earn my bread in other ways, by taking care of old people. I am sure you would all faint if i told you how much i get for the embroidered robe francaise. As i say, i do it for passion, not for living........... Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kay Shelton" To: Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 9:07 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: Old embroidery patterns and Bjarne's beautiful work > Bjarne, I know I am not the only one on this list who > has enviously sighed over your work. Please let us > know when you are have something on Ebay in plenty of > time for us to place bids. And be sure to place a > reasonable minimum price. Do you know how much you > want to make on each? > > Would you consider taking orders from people on this > list? I would love to own a "Bjarne." Kay > > < want to make some > stomachers, and try to sell them on ebay. > For this design i am going to use long and short > stitches. > > Bjarne > >> > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). > http://calendar.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 15:30:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJUAHP013008 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:30:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJSLUw020265 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 13:28:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJSK1H029850; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:28:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJSG1H029799 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:28:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f26.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.38]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B913B2628DF for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 21:28:15 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001401c3254f$61938dd0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 21:28:56 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] embroidered stomachers X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. I forgot to say, that actually when it comes to it, i am more fond of embroidering, than sewing costumes, and lately i thoaght about making a small hobby buisines in embroidering such stomachers. Putting it on ebay has the edvantage, that if more people like my work, the price gets higher, and i am not a buisinesman. Such a stomacher dont have to be for a costume, i am sure many people would like to have such a one hanging on the wall, framed. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 15:43:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJh3HP013329 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:43:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJeEUw021639 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 13:40:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJe51H009231; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:40:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from lakemtao02.cox.net (lakemtao02.cox.net [68.1.17.243]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJds1H008986 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:39:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from VMAAHQ ([68.99.96.216]) by lakemtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030528193949.UXED24359.lakemtao02.cox.net@VMAAHQ> for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:39:49 -0400 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] note from list admin re: spam problem Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 15:39:33 -0400 Message-ID: <000001c32550$e0894610$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <20030528132533.GC21655@net.indra.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Elizabeth, Thank you for your untiring efforts to give all of us a 'safe' place to talk about and do what we love. Glitches happen, no way around it. The fact that we so seldom have to deal with such things is a mark of your dedication and professionalism. I just wanted to let you know that your hard work is very much appreciated! Regards, :Linda: -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Elizabeth Lear Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 9:26 AM To: h-costume@net.indra.com; sca-east-announce@net.indra.com; sca-east@net.indra.com; f-costume@net.indra.com; vintage@net.indra.com Subject: [h-cost] note from list admin re: spam problem Hello all, I apologize for the recent spam flood. There appears to be a problem within the Mailman software that allowed these postings to go through when they should have been caught and automatically rejected by the spam filters instead (or at the very least, caught in the filters so I could manually handle them). This may or may not have been connected to some work I was doing with my sysadmin regarding one of my mailing lists that has become a 'black hole', ie all of my mailing lists have been fine except this one we're working on that isn't passing any mail. I have set the list(s) to "emergency moderation" which I hope will prevent further messages from going out while I work with my sysadmin to figure out what has happened. On an administrative note, I will say that approximately 150-175 messages went through to 5 or 6 mailing lists I run. While feeling like quite a bit, that number actually represents less than 24 hours worth of the spam that is normally either caught and rejected by the Mailman software or manually rejected by me. I am sorry it happened, but no software is perfect and on the whole, I feel Mailman has been doing an excellent job in keeping us spam-free until this glitch. Hopefully, we will be back up and running cleanly again shortly, and your patience is appreciated. Thanks, ...eliz, list admin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 15:46:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJkTHP013481 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:46:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJhgUw022080 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 13:43:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJhf1H012349; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:43:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net (bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.218]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJhc1H012313 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:43:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-16-138.o1.jps.net ([216.119.16.138] helo=pavilion) by bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19L6pl-0005bi-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 28 May 2003 12:43:37 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01c32553$68f66f80$8a1077d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 12:57:38 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-ELNK-Trace: 9c05c41117f01b301aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec791eb5ae8391aed28df07a103d1c7c7714350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] seeking bespoke association address X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id h4SJkTHP013481 Status: RO I ran across a professional association for bespoke clotheirs sometime back but can't seem to find it now. Does anyone know of such an organization? Would you have the site address? Any comments as to the quality of the group? Thanks, Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 16:00:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SK0gHP013881 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:00:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJwoUw023951 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 13:58:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJwm6H024049; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:58:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SJwh6H023866 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:58:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-cb01-0343.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.81.88]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2291BE915 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 21:58:37 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3ED51589.9010208@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:01:13 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] embroidered stomachers References: <001401c3254f$61938dd0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO MMMM... I like sewing costumes more than embroidering. I do embroidery because it makes the costumes look so much better. Can't we trade or someting? Greetings, Deredere Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: >Hi. >I forgot to say, that actually when it comes to it, i am more fond of >embroidering, than sewing costumes, and lately i thoaght about making a >small hobby buisines in embroidering such stomachers. Putting it on ebay has >the edvantage, that if more people like my work, the price gets higher, and >i am not a buisinesman. >Such a stomacher dont have to be for a costume, i am sure many people would >like to have such a one hanging on the wall, framed. > >Bjarne > > >Leif og Bjarne Drews >www.my-drewscostumes.dk > >http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 16:12:24 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SKCOHP014070 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:12:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SK9HUw025136 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 14:09:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SK9G6H002487; Wed, 28 May 2003 14:09:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SK9B6H002438 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 14:09:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f26.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.38]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id E36EA262958 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:09:09 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003101c32555$1a84e230$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001401c3254f$61938dd0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3ED51589.9010208@kabelfoon.nl> Subject: Re: [h-cost] embroidered stomachers Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:09:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, yes, that would be a good idea, but how do we do it? But i must say, that i love the feeling, when i have finished a successely made costume. Nothing is better........... Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deredere Galbraith" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 10:01 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] embroidered stomachers > MMMM... > > I like sewing costumes more than embroidering. > I do embroidery because it makes the costumes look so much better. > Can't we trade or someting? > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > >Hi. > >I forgot to say, that actually when it comes to it, i am more fond of > >embroidering, than sewing costumes, and lately i thoaght about making a > >small hobby buisines in embroidering such stomachers. Putting it on ebay has > >the edvantage, that if more people like my work, the price gets higher, and > >i am not a buisinesman. > >Such a stomacher dont have to be for a costume, i am sure many people would > >like to have such a one hanging on the wall, framed. > > > >Bjarne > > > > > >Leif og Bjarne Drews > >www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > > >http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 16:40:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SKeGHP014220 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:40:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SKcHUw028796 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 14:38:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SKcF6H025048; Wed, 28 May 2003 14:38:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4SKc96H024981 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 14:38:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 4716 invoked from network); 28 May 2003 20:38:09 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 28 May 2003 20:38:09 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-115-62.sonic.net [209.148.115.62]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4SKc8W02136 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:38:08 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030528133717.00abc1a0@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 13:39:41 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] seeking bespoke association address In-Reply-To: <000c01c32553$68f66f80$8a1077d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If it's an American association, it may be: The Professional Association of Custom Clothiers http://www.paccprofessionals.org/ I also found: The Custom Tailors & Designers Association http://www.ctda.com/ I've never belonged to either organization, though. Fran At 12:57 PM 5/28/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I ran across a professional association for bespoke clotheirs sometime >back but can't seem to find it now. Does anyone know of such an >organization? Would you have the site address? Any comments as to the >quality of the group? > >Thanks, > > >Lisa Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 16:59:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SKxSHP014375 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:59:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SKuLUw001049 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 14:56:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SKuJRl008857; Wed, 28 May 2003 14:56:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f12.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.12]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SKuFRl008757 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 14:56:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 28 May 2003 13:56:09 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 28 May 2003 20:56:09 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 13:56:09 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 May 2003 20:56:09.0850 (UTC) FILETIME=[90D2EDA0:01C3255B] Subject: [h-cost] Art vs. economy was Old embroidery X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Hello. >Off cause i would make for people on this list. That is what i do, take >orders from people. >When i have set up the embroidery on my frame, and i have worked some of >the >motifs, i could calculate, how much time and thread i am using, and then i >could find out how much i would charge, and off cause i like to earn >something, but mostly i do it for the passion of it, i earn my bread in >other ways, by taking care of old people. >I am sure you would all faint if i told you how much i get for the >embroidered robe francaise. >As i say, i do it for passion, not for living........... > >Bjarne > >Leif og Bjarne Drews >www.my-drewscostumes.dk I have to agree that I make things for the passion of it. From making a custom order where cost of materials is not a problem, to my summer "buy nothing new" project I really just love to make beautiful things. I learned that I can't turn enough of a profit to make it a business, but I can still make wonderful garments to sell to a few people who really appreciate it. Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 17:17:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SLHDHP014501 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 17:17:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SLA1Yu002579 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 15:15:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SL47Rl015311; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:04:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SL43Rm015249 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:04:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from dandy.net (acty3175.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.248.175]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h4SL43N2010227 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 17:04:04 -0400 Message-ID: <3ED52400.7070804@dandy.net> Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 17:02:56 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking info on Saracen almspurses References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi,All. I will have to look for references, but I believe the reason for "Saracen" would have been not only their source, but the material that they were made of, silk damask (originally from Damascus). There are some examples in the MoL textile book, one on pg. 88 (a seal bag), and the other on 114 (a purse). However, both are lampas weave, although they are probably of Middle Eastern origin (the first one is said to be from Iran). I'll post other sources as I can get to them. Mike T. >I just received an inquiry from an historian whose specialty is medieval >Paris. She's researching the importation of oriental goods into 13th and >14th century Paris and the production of these goods in Paris itself. > >She's become interested in "Saracen almspurses," > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 18:38:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SMcmHP015013 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 18:38:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SMZgUw012161 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 16:35:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SMZcbm020542; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:35:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law8-oe37.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.94]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SMZYbm020424 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:35:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 28 May 2003 15:35:29 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by law8-oe37.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:35:29 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030528132533.GC21655@net.indra.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] note from list admin re: spam problem Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 18:35:14 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 May 2003 22:35:29.0525 (UTC) FILETIME=[71112A50:01C32569] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Don't worry, I think everyone here understands that kind of thing happens, and is very grateful for the great job you're doing every day for us. We're just glad that you can confirm that it was officially a glitch, and not some other kind of problem :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth Lear" To: ; ; ; ; Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 9:25 AM Subject: [h-cost] note from list admin re: spam problem > Hello all, > > I apologize for the recent spam flood. There appears to be a problem > within the Mailman software that allowed these postings to go through > when they should have been caught and automatically rejected by the > spam filters instead (or at the very least, caught in the filters so I > could manually handle them). This may or may not have been connected > to some work I was doing with my sysadmin regarding one of my mailing > lists that has become a 'black hole', ie all of my mailing lists have > been fine except this one we're working on that isn't passing any mail. > > I have set the list(s) to "emergency moderation" which I hope will > prevent further messages from going out while I work with my sysadmin > to figure out what has happened. > > On an administrative note, I will say that approximately 150-175 > messages went through to 5 or 6 mailing lists I run. While feeling > like quite a bit, that number actually represents less than 24 hours > worth of the spam that is normally either caught and rejected by the > Mailman software or manually rejected by me. I am sorry it happened, > but no software is perfect and on the whole, I feel Mailman has been > doing an excellent job in keeping us spam-free until this glitch. > Hopefully, we will be back up and running cleanly again shortly, and > your patience is appreciated. > > Thanks, > ...eliz, list admin > > > -- > Please allow 2-6 weeks for delivery. > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 19:30:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SNUdHP015260 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 19:30:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SNSHUw017442 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 17:28:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4SNSCNq024623; Wed, 28 May 2003 17:28:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4SNS8Nq024545 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 17:28:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/On8uoeSlTDDL0O75xha+FjE=">; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:27:37 PDT Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HZA8MKP3; Wed, 28 May 2003 16:27:37 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 16:16:57 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] note from list admin re: spam problem Message-ID: <20030528.162735.120.1.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What she said. :-) Arlys On Wed, 28 May 2003 15:39:33 -0400 "Linda Rice" writes: > Elizabeth, > > Thank you for your untiring efforts to give all of us a 'safe' place > to > talk about and do what we love. Glitches happen, no way around it. > The > fact that we so seldom have to deal with such things is a mark of > your > dedication and professionalism. I just wanted to let you know that > your > hard work is very much appreciated! > > Regards, > > :Linda: ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 20:32:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0WMHP015488 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 20:32:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0UYUw022744 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 18:30:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0UWlF027155; Wed, 28 May 2003 18:30:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0UMlG027032 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 18:30:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4T0UDGx001772 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 20:30:16 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4T0U60h001770 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 28 May 2003 20:30:06 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] old embroidery patterns Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 20:30:06 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <000701c32521$adfa33f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> <3ED4D882.D8D72206@in-tch.com> <000d01c32542$cb7ad580$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <000d01c32542$cb7ad580$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305282030.06583.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4T0UMlG027032 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wednesday 28 May 2003 01:58 pm, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Dear Sue. > It is not for the Denver lady, her dress has embroidered ribbon on the > bodice. > No it is actually not for any one. I have desided i want to make some > stomachers, and try to sell them on ebay. > For this design i am going to use long and short stitches. > Do you know this? it is a kind of satin stitches. > I have looked at many stomachers lately, and many of them, most of them, > are made on ivory or light cream fabric. So they would go to any dress, It > is also because i have had a lot of beautifull colours of silk floss from > Eterna Silk. I ordered more than 380 skeins in a vast variety of > colours............... > Long and short stitches.................. Lovely. I can scarcely wait to see one completed. -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 20:40:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0eNHP015539 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 20:40:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0cbUw023302 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 18:38:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0calF001566; Wed, 28 May 2003 18:38:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0cYlF001526 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 18:38:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-29-44.o1.jps.net ([216.119.29.44] helo=pavilion) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19LBRB-0004aU-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 28 May 2003 17:38:33 -0700 Message-ID: <001c01c3257c$9c4efae0$8a1077d8@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030528133717.00abc1a0@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] seeking bespoke association address Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 17:52:39 -0700 Organization: Threadneedlest.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you very much! Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 1:39 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] seeking bespoke association address > If it's an American association, it may be: > > The Professional Association of Custom Clothiers > http://www.paccprofessionals.org/ > > I also found: > The Custom Tailors & Designers Association > http://www.ctda.com/ > > I've never belonged to either organization, though. > > Fran > > At 12:57 PM 5/28/2003 -0700, you wrote: > >I ran across a professional association for bespoke clotheirs sometime > >back but can't seem to find it now. Does anyone know of such an > >organization? Would you have the site address? Any comments as to the > >quality of the group? > > > >Thanks, > > > > > >Lisa > > Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > Historic and Vintage Dance > http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 22:09:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T29BHP016065 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:09:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0xqUw025208 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 18:59:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0xovG013356; Wed, 28 May 2003 18:59:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T0xmvG013248 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 18:59:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a223.in-tch.com [66.62.107.23]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4T0fHH10897 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 18:41:18 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED55BDC.714BEF6E@in-tch.com> Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 19:01:16 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Art vs. economy was Old embroidery References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Do you do that every summer? What a cool idea.... --sue Jennifer Sena wrote: > >From making a > custom order where cost of materials is not a problem, to my summer "buy > nothing new" project I really just love to make beautiful things. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed May 28 22:43:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T2heHP016265 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:43:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T2frUw002210 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 20:41:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T2fldH028691; Wed, 28 May 2003 20:41:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.vaxxine.com (alpha.vaxxine.com [209.5.212.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T2fidH028661 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 20:41:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alderweb.vaxxine.com (ppp386.digi-t3.st-cath.niagara.net [209.5.218.132]) by alpha.vaxxine.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4T2eE3c005603 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:40:14 -0400 (EDT) X-RCPT-To: Message-Id: <4.3.0.20030528224612.00c26cd0@pop.vaxxine.com> X-Sender: alderweb@pop.vaxxine.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3 Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:49:11 -0400 To: Historical Costume From: David Webb In-Reply-To: <3ED4D882.D8D72206@in-tch.com> References: <000701c32521$adfa33f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] Textile book remembered X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO So it's a decade earlier than I remembered it...Sheridan Author Montgomery, Florence M. Title Textiles in America, 1650-1870 : a dictionary based on original documents : prints and paintings, commercial records, American merchants' papers, shopkeepers' advertisements, and pattern books with original swatches of cloth / Florence M. Montgomery. -- Edition 1st ed. -- Published New York : Norton, 1984. Physical descrip. xviii, 412 p. : ill. (some col.) ; 26 cm. -- Series (A Winterthur book) Bibliography note Bibliography: p. 388-412. ISBN 0393017036 Subject Textile fabrics--United States--History. Subject Textile fabrics--United States--Dictionaries. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 00:00:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T40KHP016764 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 00:00:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T3wWUw007238 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 21:58:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T3wVUn005819; Wed, 28 May 2003 21:58:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt21.cluster1.charter.net (remt21.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.31]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T3sIaL004026 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 21:54:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [68.185.167.6] (HELO laptop) by remt21.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 43303636 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 28 May 2003 23:54:12 -0400 Message-ID: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:53:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] paper tape dummy help! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My hubby and I just tried to make a paper tape dummy tonight. We had some issues and will be trying again tomorrow. I thought I would ask here to see if anyone could help out with our glitches. 1) The tape wouldn't stick and kept peeling/rolling off when drying. How do we get the ends to *stay* glued? Hubby used fairly short (4-5") pieces to get around curves, and wetted them down under running water so they were quite wet when first applied. 2) How dry/hard is hard enough? When I took the thing off, it really wasn't going to hold its shape at all (thus the 2nd try tomorrow). I found it especially difficult to tell how stiff it was because I was wearing my Eliz corset underneath. How many layers should be done? We had three layers, alternating horizontal and vertical. Any other tips, hints, or suggestions to make the 2nd round a bit more successful? ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 00:37:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T4beHP016964 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 00:37:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T4ZpUw009802 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 22:35:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T4ZnUn022814; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:35:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailrelay.mebtel.net (spambuster4.mebtel.net [64.40.67.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T4OiUn017356 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:24:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grics.net (66-79-58-71.dsl.dixnil.grics.net [66.79.58.71]) by mailrelay.mebtel.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10AA9278C4 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 00:17:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3ED599CA.8030307@grics.net> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 00:25:30 -0500 From: "H. Law" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] paper tape dummy help! References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> In-Reply-To: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-Etherboy-Metrics: net.indra.com 1002; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Duct tape? Here's the Threads Magazine page for several different methods of "cloning yourself" a dress form http://www.taunton.com/threads/pages/t00002_p4.asp HTH edwinna lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: >My hubby and I just tried to make a paper tape dummy tonight. We had some >issues and will be trying again tomorrow. I thought I would ask here to see >if anyone could help out with our glitches. > >1) The tape wouldn't stick and kept peeling/rolling off when drying. How do >we get the ends to *stay* glued? Hubby used fairly short (4-5") pieces to >get around curves, and wetted them down under running water so they were >quite wet when first applied. > >2) How dry/hard is hard enough? When I took the thing off, it really wasn't >going to hold its shape at all (thus the 2nd try tomorrow). I found it >especially difficult to tell how stiff it was because I was wearing my Eliz >corset underneath. How many layers should be done? We had three layers, >alternating horizontal and vertical. > >Any other tips, hints, or suggestions to make the 2nd round a bit more >successful? > >********************** >Rebecca Schmitt >aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot >BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence > >A room without books is like a body without a soul >---Cicero > >lotsofteapots@charter.net >********************** > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 01:40:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T5ebHP017196 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 01:40:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T5c1Uw013729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Wed, 28 May 2003 23:38:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T5bvuR021539; Wed, 28 May 2003 23:37:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f3.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T5bsuR021476 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 23:37:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:37:48 -0700 Received: from 12.231.218.121 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 29 May 2003 05:37:48 GMT X-Originating-IP: [12.231.218.121] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Art vs. economy was Old embroidery Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:37:48 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 May 2003 05:37:48.0780 (UTC) FILETIME=[7070A2C0:01C325A4] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >From: Sue Clemenger >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: Historical Costume >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Art vs. economy was Old embroidery >Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 19:01:16 -0600 > >Do you do that every summer? >What a cool idea.... >--sue > No, Summers when I have money or a job I just buy more fabric!! ;) >Jennifer Sena wrote: > > > >From making a > > custom order where cost of materials is not a problem, to my summer "buy > > nothing new" project I really just love to make beautiful things. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 02:17:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T6HlHP022559 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 02:17:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T6FrUw015929 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 00:15:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T6Fqa8006869; Thu, 29 May 2003 00:15:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from tisch.mail.mindspring.net (tisch.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.157]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T6Fma8006847 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 00:15:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from host-66-81-241-149.rev.o1.com ([66.81.241.149]) by tisch.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19LGhX-0005Rr-00 for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 02:15:47 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: claning@pop.igc.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 23:15:29 -0700 To: h-costume@net.indra.com From: Chris Laning Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Subject: [h-cost] St. Jerome in a Landscape X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is me, eeping pitifully for help in finding a good reproduction of a painting detail again :) There is a painting of "St. Jerome in a Landscape" by a 15th-century painter named Bono da Ferrara in the National Gallery in London. It's this one: http://www.nationalgallery.org.uk/cgi-bin/WebObjects.dll/CollectionPublisher.woa/wa/work?workNumber=NG771 I have a very _bad_ black and white photo of this painting, and I would really like to see a lot more detail of whatever it is he is holding in his hands. I _think_ that it is a type of prayer counter or rosary, using small disks or rings, like these: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Paternosters/files/CdH/images/Ringcounters.jpg (ObCostume: it is, of course, a costume accessory :)) If that's what it is, the painting is at least 400 years earlier than the surviving examples, and so far it's just about my only evidence that this type of prayer counter is indeed medieval. The surviving examples I've been able to turn up are either 19th century or came without a dating context. As you will notice, the National Gallery site's picture is about the size of a small postcard. I haven't found this image anywhere else on the Web. Is my only choice to write to them and ask if they have anything more detailed that I could get a copy of? That sounds like it could get expen$$ive. Alternatively, I have been scratching my head, trying to figure out _how_ you find out whether one of the zillion Big Art Books in my local university library might have a bigger (and better photographed) reproduction of the painting. Any clues, guys? Are there indexes somewhere of what paintings are reproduced in which books, or do I get to spend lots of time in the library looking at picture books? (Gosh, what an awful fate !) Nonetheless, I'd rather not do more work than I have to...... TIA. -- _________________________________________________________ O Chris Laning | + Davis, California _________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 02:29:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T6TbHP026352 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 02:29:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T6RqUw016528 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 00:27:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T6Rpa8010496; Thu, 29 May 2003 00:27:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net (bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.218]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T6Rma8010483 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 00:27:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-119-005-164.jps.net ([216.119.5.164] helo=w7m1l6) by bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19LGt9-0000Tc-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 28 May 2003 23:27:47 -0700 Message-ID: <004801c325ab$4f97f560$a40577d8@w7m1l6> From: "Stephen Bergdahl" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] paper tape dummy help! Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 23:26:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-ELNK-Trace: 08dba192340bde6e1a6ab3b9b70940f894f5150ab1c16ac027907a4ca0ac1adfc57564fed1a125d74afb73d602db1049350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 8:53 PM Subject: [h-cost] paper tape dummy help! > Any other tips, hints, or suggestions to make the 2nd round a bit more > successful? > > ********************** > Rebecca Schmitt Sure Rebecca. Take my class on Paper tape dummys at the Costume Classroom. Stephen Bergdahl www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 03:11:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T7BOHP006205 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 03:11:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T79fUw018506 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 01:09:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T79dKA025486; Thu, 29 May 2003 01:09:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from app5.nasc.inter.net (nasc-out-1.nasc.inter.net [203.176.60.253]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T79aKA025407 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 01:09:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 1cust70.tnt23.toronto.on.da.uu.net ([64.10.99.70] helo=vienna.localdomain) by app5.nasc.inter.net with esmtp (Exim 3.34 #1) id 19LHXW-0002z9-00 for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 03:09:30 -0400 Received: from cedar by vienna.localdomain with local (Exim 3.36 #5 (Red Hat Linux)) id 19LCpn-0007J9-00 for ; Wed, 28 May 2003 22:08:03 -0400 Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:08:03 -0400 From: Christine Robb To: h-costume@net.indra.com Message-ID: <20030529020803.GN3635@vienna.bellnexxia.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Subject: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My darling cat had a bunch of "accidents" near my wool cloak, which absorbed the smell very nicely, particularly since it wasn't discovered for a long time. I have had the cloak dry-cleaned and can now stand to be in the same room as it, but it still smells. The cloak is pure wool, but I did not wash it before making it, and it is the perfect length, so I really don't want to risk shrinking it. (The hood is made with two different weaves of wool.) Does anyone have any suggestions for what I can do to remove the smell? Thanks, Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 04:26:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T8Q8HP005353 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 04:26:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T8N8Uw025647 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 02:23:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4T8N66O026823; Thu, 29 May 2003 02:23:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41504.mail.yahoo.com (web41504.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.87]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4T8N46O026782 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 02:23:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030529082259.7632.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41504.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:22:59 BST Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:22:59 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= To: H-Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] My Godchild photo (and applique question) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've been talking a bit about her, so I thought I'd show a piccy of little Eli. My friend calls her 'hamstercheeks' *grins* for she has the biggest cheeks ever. ;-) http://arts-humanities.cant.ac.uk/Temp/eli.jpg Not completely OT, because I have an applique question. As mentioned I am making the Eward III flag as her blanket. The fleur-de-lys are quite easy to applique, but the lions are so complicated with all those fiddley bits. Anyone having some tips for doing applique? I've never done it before. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 08:10:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCAeHP026737 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:10:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TC8pUw008653 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 06:08:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TC8kcM015287; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:08:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TC8icM015243 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:08:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a212.in-tch.com [66.62.107.12]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4TBoDH18043 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 05:50:14 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED5F8A4.5E15FD4@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 06:10:13 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool References: <20030529020803.GN3635@vienna.bellnexxia.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Febreeze? --sue Christine Robb wrote: > > My darling cat had a bunch of "accidents" near my wool cloak, which > absorbed the smell very nicely, particularly since it wasn't discovered > for a long time. I have had the cloak dry-cleaned and can now stand to > be in the same room as it, but it still smells. > > The cloak is pure wool, but I did not wash it before making it, and it > is the perfect length, so I really don't want to risk shrinking it. > (The hood is made with two different weaves of wool.) > > Does anyone have any suggestions for what I can do to remove the smell? > > Thanks, > > Christine > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 08:15:03 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCF3HP026879 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:15:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCCiUw009351 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 06:12:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCCicM016751; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:12:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCCgcM016723 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:12:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a212.in-tch.com [66.62.107.12]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4TBsBH19487 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 05:54:11 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED5F993.CB73166@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 06:14:11 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Art vs. economy was Old embroidery References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, that's a cool idea, too! --sue Jennifer Sena wrote: > > >From: Sue Clemenger > >Reply-To: Historical Costume > >To: Historical Costume > >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Art vs. economy was Old embroidery > >Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 19:01:16 -0600 > > > >Do you do that every summer? > >What a cool idea.... > >--sue > > > > No, Summers when I have money or a job I just buy more fabric!! ;) > > >Jennifer Sena wrote: > > > > > >From making a > > > custom order where cost of materials is not a problem, to my summer "buy > > > nothing new" project I really just love to make beautiful things. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 08:18:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCIDHP026908 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:18:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCGSUw009503 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 06:16:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCGRcM017990; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:16:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCGOcM017936 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:16:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a212.in-tch.com [66.62.107.12]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4TBvrH20716 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 05:57:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED5FA71.CD3C685D@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 06:17:53 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] St. Jerome in a Landscape References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey, Chris....can't help you with an online source, but, IIRC, the bookstore at the National Gallery sells slides of a lot of the works there. It might be worth a shot. And also, you'll never know how much it would be, unless you ask them. A friend of mine contacted a priory in England regarding a portrait, and they not only sent her this nice color postcard, but a 5x7 b/w of the painting. Don't know that it cost her anything except postage..... --sue Chris Laning wrote: > > This is me, eeping pitifully for help in finding a good reproduction > of a painting detail again :) > > There is a painting of "St. Jerome in a Landscape" by a 15th-century > painter named Bono da Ferrara in the National Gallery in London. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 08:21:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCLaHP026944 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:21:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCJoUw009706 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 06:19:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCJocM019248; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:19:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCJlcM019205 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:19:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a212.in-tch.com [66.62.107.12]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4TC1GH21960 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:01:16 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED5FB38.E47CA856@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 06:21:12 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] My Godchild photo (and applique question) References: <20030529082259.7632.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Cheeky, indeed--lord, but she's adorable! (and such a great name, too!) What kind of fabrics are you using for the applique? There are things you can do to make the process easier, depending on what you're doing it with, and whether it's hand- or machine-applique. --sue N Kipar wrote: > > I've been talking a bit about her, so I thought I'd show a piccy of little Eli. > My friend calls her 'hamstercheeks' *grins* for she has the biggest cheeks > ever. ;-) > > http://arts-humanities.cant.ac.uk/Temp/eli.jpg > > Not completely OT, because I have an applique question. As mentioned I am > making the Eward III flag as her blanket. The fleur-de-lys are quite easy to > applique, but the lions are so complicated with all those fiddley bits. Anyone > having some tips for doing applique? I've never done it before. > > Nicole > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > Email: nicole@kipar.org > URL: http://www.kipar.org > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience > http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 08:31:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCVhHP027003 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:31:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCTvUw010348 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 06:29:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TCTucM022722; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:29:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41501.mail.yahoo.com (web41501.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4TCTscM022663 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:29:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030529122949.94228.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41501.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 29 May 2003 13:29:49 BST Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 13:29:49 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] My Godchild photo (and applique question) To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <3ED5FB38.E47CA856@in-tch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > Cheeky, indeed--lord, but she's adorable! (and such a great name, too!) Well.. I did choose the most flattering photo of the lot ;-) > What kind of fabrics are you using for the applique? There are things > you can do to make the process easier, depending on what you're doing it > with, and whether it's hand- or machine-applique. I use a fleece for the blanket and simple cotton for the applique. I do have the iron on sticky stuff. Do I understand correctly taht I have to iron the stuff onto the applique fabric, then cut it all out, the iron it onto the blanket fabric and then zig zag around it? I meant to do machining, but the lions have soooooo many curves and bits. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 09:53:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TDrkHP028649 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:53:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TDohUw016133 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 07:50:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TDofqk027747; Thu, 29 May 2003 07:50:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net (pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TDocqk027714 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 07:50:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ap-003scfairp0021.dialsprint.net ([63.184.208.21] helo=faucet.net) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19LNnh-0000GL-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 06:50:37 -0700 Message-ID: <3ED61DF2.2060501@faucet.net> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:49:22 -0500 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] My Godchild photo (and applique question) References: <20030529122949.94228.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO N Kipar wrote: > I use a fleece for the blanket and simple cotton for the applique. I do have > the iron on sticky stuff. Do I understand correctly taht I have to iron the > stuff onto the applique fabric, then cut it all out, the iron it onto the > blanket fabric and then zig zag around it? I meant to do machining, but the > lions have soooooo many curves and bits. That is the proper way to use the sticky stuff. For the curves and bits, if your machine has a darning feature, and you have a darning foot, and you're really steady with your hands, you can do it more easily. The darning feature is basically that the machine will sew with the feed in a "down" position, so it's not moving the fabric through for you. When the presser foot lever is down, a darning foot sits just above the throat plate, so it's not pressing the fabric tight from above. The result is that you have complete control of which direction the fabric moves and how fast. I've used this technique with a zigzag stitch both for fiddly bits of applique and for doing scallop edges on organza for 18th-century sleeve ruffles. If you're not sure whether you have a darning foot, look for one that just has an open circle on the end (which will be parallel to the throat plate when down). It takes a while to get used to, so I recommend several practice sessions. I'm also not sure if the loft of the fleece will cause problems with this method, as I've never tried this on anything fluffy. Good luck! Melanie Schuessler http://www.faucet.net/costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 10:21:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TELMHP029234 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:21:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEJXUw018553 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 08:19:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEJW8c013834; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:19:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt29.cluster1.charter.net (remt29.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEJU8c013759 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:19:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [68.185.167.6] (HELO laptop) by remt29.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 30306158 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:19:25 -0400 Message-ID: <000801c325ed$3799a980$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> <3ED599CA.8030307@grics.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] paper tape dummy help! Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:18:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would like to use the paper tape as it then is supposed to dry hard and be able to pinned through. And, yeah, I used the Threads instructions for the paper tape. :-P > Duct tape? > Here's the Threads Magazine page for several different methods of > "cloning yourself" a dress form > > http://www.taunton.com/threads/pages/t00002_p4.asp > > HTH > edwinna > > lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: > > >My hubby and I just tried to make a paper tape dummy tonight. We had some > >issues and will be trying again tomorrow. I thought I would ask here to see > >if anyone could help out with our glitches. > > > >1) The tape wouldn't stick and kept peeling/rolling off when drying. How do > >we get the ends to *stay* glued? Hubby used fairly short (4-5") pieces to > >get around curves, and wetted them down under running water so they were > >quite wet when first applied. > > > >2) How dry/hard is hard enough? When I took the thing off, it really wasn't > >going to hold its shape at all (thus the 2nd try tomorrow). I found it > >especially difficult to tell how stiff it was because I was wearing my Eliz > >corset underneath. How many layers should be done? We had three layers, > >alternating horizontal and vertical. > > > >Any other tips, hints, or suggestions to make the 2nd round a bit more > >successful? > > > >********************** > >Rebecca Schmitt > >aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot > >BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence > > > >A room without books is like a body without a soul > >---Cicero > > > >lotsofteapots@charter.net > >********************** > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 10:22:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEMdHP029243 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:22:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEKdUw018668 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 08:20:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEKb8c014461; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:20:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt28.cluster1.charter.net (remt28.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEKX8c014327 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:20:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [68.185.167.6] (HELO laptop) by remt28.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 41097433 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:20:27 -0400 Message-ID: <000d01c325ed$5cc1fdc0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> <004801c325ab$4f97f560$a40577d8@w7m1l6> Subject: Re: [h-cost] paper tape dummy help! Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:19:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stephen, believe me I would love to, but the finances make it a little difficult at the moment (thus the cheap attempt at a dress form!) > > Any other tips, hints, or suggestions to make the 2nd round a bit more > > successful? > > > > ********************** > > Rebecca Schmitt > > Sure Rebecca. > > Take my class on Paper tape dummys at the Costume Classroom. > > Stephen Bergdahl _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 10:52:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEqlHP029663 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:52:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEovUw021986 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 08:50:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEou8c002804; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:50:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt20.cluster1.charter.net (remt20.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TEor8c002715 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:50:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [68.185.167.6] (HELO laptop) by remt20.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 43848765 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:50:48 -0400 Message-ID: <003d01c325f1$99b30c20$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:49:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [h-cost] archives? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I was trying to take a look at the recent archives, but when I tried the link from the http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume site I got the following error: Not Found The requested URL /pipermail/h-costume/ was not found on this server. How do I get to there from here? ********************** Rebecca Schmitt aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence A room without books is like a body without a soul ---Cicero lotsofteapots@charter.net ********************** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 11:02:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF2NHP029862 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:02:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TExKUw023012 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 08:59:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TExJeg008233; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:59:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TExHeh008208 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:59:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from eliz@localhost) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.8/Submit) id h4TExHuX008207 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:59:17 -0600 (MDT) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:59:17 -0600 From: Elizabeth Lear To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] archives? Message-ID: <20030529145917.GB4065@net.indra.com> References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> <003d01c325f1$99b30c20$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <003d01c325f1$99b30c20$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you go to: http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume You will see the following: ARCHIVES: To search by keyword, use Eric Praetzel's searchable archive at: http://sca.uwaterloo.ca/~fashion/archives Eric made some changes to the search method a few months ago that speed the search but reduce your ability to search to just the name and subject line ... not much use for many questions. I use the "old" search function, which I believe is still available from his main search page, and I hope it stays that way. Be as specific as you can in your search term (you can pick only one), and you'll get faster searches if you do only one year's worth of posts at a time. The results are grouped by month, so when you click on one of the search results, you'll get that whole month's worth of postings -- a big download, but useful for reading whole threads. -- Method 2: For older archives (1993-1996), go to Franchesca Havas' site at http://www.io.com/~ches/h-costume/ . You can ftp or download zipped files. I'm not sure if Ches has later archives too. I hope *someone* is keeping them. -- Please allow 2-6 weeks for delivery. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 11:08:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF8rHP030104 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:08:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF5sUw023887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 09:05:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF5reg013040; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:05:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF5beg012894 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:05:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA07014 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:27:13 -0500 Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 10:27:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] archives? In-Reply-To: <003d01c325f1$99b30c20$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 29 May 2003 lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: > I was trying to take a look at the recent archives, but when I tried > the link from the http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > site I got the following error: As far as I know, we've never had functional archives at indra. Eric Praetzel independently maintains a searchable archive. He recently posted about a move; his post is reproduced below. (I haven't checked myself to see how the new search engine works. The old one had some significant limitations, but hey, it's better than no archives at all.) --Robin Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:01:20 -0400 (EDT) From: fashion@sca.uwaterloo.ca To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] H-Costume archive moved - errr fixed Those of you using my h-costume search engine will have noticed that it's been broken for about 2 weeks. I've recently upgraded it from it's 3+ year old Linux to something new; but lots of things changed. As a result I've had to move the search engine. If you get to it from the following them all is well: http://sca.uwaterloo.ca/~fashion Or you can use the shortcut to the new search engine: http://sca.uwaterloo.ca/Fashion _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 11:11:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TFBRHP030164 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:11:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF98Uw024245 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 09:09:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF95eg015052; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:09:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41510.mail.yahoo.com (web41510.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.93]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4TF93eg014993 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:09:03 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030529150858.7113.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41510.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 29 May 2003 16:08:58 BST Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 16:08:58 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] My Godchild photo (and applique question) To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <3ED61DF2.2060501@faucet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks Melanie! I don't have a darning foot but I'm always happy to buy in useful accessories. The teflon no sticky foot I got last time I brilliant. I never knew one could/should do it lke that. Guess I could baste some cotton _under_ the fleece as well. It will be doubled (lined) with another layer of fleece, so it wouldn't show but probably stop the fluffy stuff from puckering. Great tips. Nicole > That is the proper way to use the sticky stuff. For the curves and > bits, if your machine has a darning feature, and you have a darning > foot, and you're really steady with your hands, you can do it more > easily. The darning feature is basically that the machine will sew with > the feed in a "down" position, so it's not moving the fabric through for > you. When the presser foot lever is down, a darning foot sits just > above the throat plate, so it's not pressing the fabric tight from > above. The result is that you have complete control of which direction > the fabric moves and how fast. I've used this technique with a zigzag > stitch both for fiddly bits of applique and for doing scallop edges on > organza for 18th-century sleeve ruffles. > > If you're not sure whether you have a darning foot, look for one that > just has an open circle on the end (which will be parallel to the throat > plate when down). > > It takes a while to get used to, so I recommend several practice > sessions. I'm also not sure if the loft of the fleece will cause > problems with this method, as I've never tried this on anything fluffy. > > Good luck! > Melanie Schuessler > http://www.faucet.net/costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 11:13:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TFDEHP030209 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:13:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF6QUw023963 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 09:06:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF6Qeg013343; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:06:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TF6Neg013276 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:06:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.net (pcp03486178pcs.indpnd01.mo.comcast.net [68.86.79.197]) by mtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFN00A4NLU1UT@mtaout01.icomcast.net> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:03:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 10:04:42 -0500 From: "Linda J. Thompson" To: h-costume@net.indra.com Message-id: <3ED6218A.2060903@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 Subject: [h-cost] Paper Tape and cat smell... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have never made a paper tape body form. (Duct tape I have done and that is another story for another time) I have however used paper tape to build other large 3 dimensional objects. I have wrapped the form in cheese cloth and then started draping tape. I think the cheese cloth helps to give body to the first layer somehow. And my experience has been that you need to make sure each layer is not drippy wet before adding the next. I use a towel to blot the first layer to get the extra water out of it. I then apply an additional layer. I have used a hair dryer to dry things. And unless the tape is crisp dry it will not hold a shape well at all. Cat urine smell. I do not know if you can do this with wool or not, but I have used plain old Tomato Juice to get the smell out. In my youth I had bean bag furniture, and for some reason I had a cat that thought it was great fun to mark my vinyl bean bags, and the stitched seams held the odor. I tried about everything and a friend came up with the idea of trying tomato juice since it worked to get skunk smell out. ( I think it is the acid in the tomato or something, that cuts the oily liquid that actually holds the smell).... And it worked. I would soak the item for a few hours maybe and see?... -- Linda Thompson Attitude Is Everything http://corsetsandcostumes.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 11:30:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TFUoHP030829 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:30:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TFSGUw026211 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 09:28:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TFSEeg027312; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:28:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m28.lax.untd.com (m28.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4TFSBeg027223 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:28:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"IEJtIXEoMt9Fq70fgd9pWihpoO5O7eb620DIrXJ+oEgTt6fPMWJqeg==">; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:27:24 PDT Received: (from catpurson@juno.com) by m28.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HZCXJYR8; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:27:24 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:25:45 -0400 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool Message-ID: <20030529.112546.-166799.1.catpurson@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 7-11 From: catpurson@juno.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Been there - done that. I have lots of cats and accidents will happen. I use Febreze on light spots, but found that a nice long soaking in cold water and Boraxo does a better job on old or heavy accidents. Try soaking a scrap of the fabric in cold water and see if it shrinks first. I believe there is a Febreze rinse that can be used in the laundry too. I don't mind the temporary smell of Febreze but some people hate it. Boraxo has no odor, removes the smell, and will help to fireproof the garment if you use enough. Good Luck! Lalah Never give up, Never surrender _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 12:06:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TG61HP031576 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:06:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TG4AUw000384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 10:04:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TG4819021763; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:04:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4TG4419021655 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:04:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/OioYZe5ug3XoxzrlAI9y5FE=">; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:56:57 PDT Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HZCY84BK; Thu, 29 May 2003 08:56:57 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 07:47:09 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool Message-ID: <20030529.085554.404.2.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 3-5 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There are a number of smell removing products available from pet stores, most of these functioning at the enzyme level to break down the noxiousness. They are designed for use on furniture and carpets, and should be fine on your wool cloak. Spray and let dry. Check around. Arlys ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 12:20:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGKWHP032035 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:20:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGIUUw002054 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 10:18:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGIR19001694; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:18:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGGf19000667 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:16:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail21.ureach.com (mail21.ureach.com [172.16.2.81]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA11415 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:16:40 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail21.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id MAA23283 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:16:40 -0400 Message-ID: <03a001c325fd$3e1b0e60$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> <003d01c325f1$99b30c20$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] archives? Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 12:13:29 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have been unable to view the archives for quite a while. I always get that error. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 10:49 AM Subject: [h-cost] archives? > I was trying to take a look at the recent archives, but when I tried the > link from the http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume site I got > the following error: > > Not Found > The requested URL /pipermail/h-costume/ was not found on this server. > > How do I get to there from here? > > ********************** > Rebecca Schmitt > aka Agnes Cabot, wife of Master Peter Cabot > BRF FOF; Guilde of St. Lawrence > > A room without books is like a body without a soul > ---Cicero > > lotsofteapots@charter.net > ********************** > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 12:33:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGXwHP032351 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:33:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGUuUw003636 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 10:30:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGUs19011260; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:30:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGUo19011122 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:30:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ConstanceFairfax@cs.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.20.123c6089 (16098) for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:29:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cs.com (mow-d17.webmail.aol.com [205.188.139.133]) by air-id11.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id MAILINID112-3ee23ed635591ec; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:29:13 -0400 Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 12:29:13 -0400 From: ConstanceFairfax@cs.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <5E7507E0.3CA57781.349D0FDF@cs.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have had success getting icky smells out of wool by soaking them in water with ammonia (see label for details, especially good for wool blankets). You may want to check the fabric first as some dyes are ph-sensitive & can shift with an ammonia bath. Constance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 12:35:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGZiHP032392 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:35:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGWiUw003846 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 10:32:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGWh19012568; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:32:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80405.mail.yahoo.com (web80405.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.60]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4TGVI19011496 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:31:19 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030529163113.94310.qmail@web80405.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80405.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:31:13 PDT Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:31:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20030529.085554.404.2.Cley@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nature's Miracle, available at Petco and other pet supply stores. I've used it on 100% wool carpets to clean up after the cat and 2 dogs, and it's a lifesaver. You just wet the area with NM, blot up the excess, and let it dry. One note for non-colorfast wools: don't rub. My husband made that mistake, and I now have some pink "running" around a red motif in a wool carpet. Dawn --- Cynthia J Ley wrote: > There are a number of smell removing products > available from pet stores, > most of these functioning at the enzyme level to > break down the > noxiousness. They are designed for use on furniture > and carpets, and > should be fine on your wool cloak. Spray and let > dry. Check around. > > Arlys > > > ________________________________________________________________ > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno > SpeedBand! > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up > today! > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 12:46:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGk4HP032640 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:46:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGi9Uw004942 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 10:44:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGi819021310; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:44:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from remt22.cluster1.charter.net (remt22.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.8.32]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGi419021195 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:44:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [68.185.167.6] (HELO laptop) by remt22.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 43763908 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:43:59 -0400 Message-ID: <001a01c32601$68e3fae0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> From: To: "Historical Costume" References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net><003d01c325f1$99b30c20$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> <20030529145917.GB4065@net.indra.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] archives? Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:43:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hmmm...Eric doesn't seem to have anything past Jan 03 as far as I can tell...oh well. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth Lear" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:59 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] archives? > If you go to: http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > You will see the following: > > ARCHIVES: > To search by keyword, use Eric Praetzel's searchable archive at: > http://sca.uwaterloo.ca/~fashion/archives > Eric made some changes to the search method a few months ago that speed > the search but reduce your ability to search to just the name and subject > line ... not much use for many questions. I use the "old" search function, > which I believe is still available from his main search page, and I hope > it stays that way. Be as specific as you can in your search term (you can > pick only one), and you'll get faster searches if you do only one year's > worth of posts at a time. > The results are grouped by month, so when you click on one of the > search results, you'll get that whole month's worth of postings -- a big > download, but useful for reading whole threads. > > -- Method 2: > For older archives (1993-1996), go to Franchesca Havas' site at > http://www.io.com/~ches/h-costume/ . You can ftp or download zipped files. > I'm not sure if Ches has later archives too. I hope *someone* is keeping > them. > > > -- > Please allow 2-6 weeks for delivery. > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 12:48:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGmFHP032683 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:48:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGkPUw005263 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 10:46:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGkO19023261; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:46:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGkL19023207 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:46:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFN00EWGQL6WV@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:46:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:24:11 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool In-reply-to: <20030529020803.GN3635@vienna.bellnexxia.net> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030529091249.00af9e08@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/29/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:08 PM 5/28/2003 -0400, you wrote: >The cloak is pure wool, but I did not wash it before making it, and it >is the perfect length, so I really don't want to risk shrinking it. >(The hood is made with two different weaves of wool.) Hi Christine, Washing in Borax, as suggested, is good. Febreeze is ok on light smells, but things like urine and moth balls will just find itself coated in a smell of perfume, which just reeks even worse. I know, I tried Febreeze on such items before. To minimize shrinking of the wool, use cold water and minimal to no agitation (movement). Wool will shrink and felt when it is in warm to hot water and agitated. If the cloak fits comfortably in your washer or even a bathtub, fill up the tub with cold water and the soap, agitate the mix, THEN put in the wool cape and stuff it into the tub and allow that to soak for awhile. When you are ready to drain, set the cycle to drain (which is after the agitation cycle) and allow it to spin off the water. You can then set it for rinse, and again allow it to soak and as little agitation as possible. You may want to rinse a couple of times. It is all in knowing where your cycles start on your machine, to prevent the agitation. You may get some shrinkage, depending on the weave of the wool. The looser the more it may shrink. If you really absolutely don't want it to be anywhere near water, then I suggest putting it in a box with a bag of activated charcoal (the kind you BBQ with) and allow that to sit for awhile. I don't know if it will pull out the smell of urine, but it did wonders for a fridge that was allowed to have nasty growth and smells in it from rotting food (I was an apartment manager. That came from a tenant who left.) Good luck in this. I have several cats, and I keep them out of my sewing room and my closets for this very reason. Too many problems in the past. My cats don't like me when I get upset at them (and no, I don't harm them at all... just a lot of growling from me). Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 12:48:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGmaHP032686 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:48:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGkpUw005369 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 10:46:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGko19023621; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:46:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TGkL1B023207 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:46:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFN00EWGQL6WV@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 09:46:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:37:35 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] My Godchild photo (and applique question) In-reply-to: <20030529082259.7632.qmail@web41504.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030529092429.02ab4520@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/29/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Nicole, At 09:22 AM 5/29/2003 +0100, you wrote: >I've been talking a bit about her, so I thought I'd show a piccy of little >Eli. >My friend calls her 'hamstercheeks' *grins* for she has the biggest cheeks >ever. ;-) > >http://arts-humanities.cant.ac.uk/Temp/eli.jpg She is sooo adorable! I love little babies like that... my little boy is no longer in that small and adorable, sleeping all the time phase. I sometimes wish they could stay that small for much longer. >Not completely OT, because I have an applique question. As mentioned I am >making the Eward III flag as her blanket. The fleur-de-lys are quite easy to >applique, but the lions are so complicated with all those fiddley bits. Anyone >having some tips for doing applique? I've never done it before. > >Nicole I bought a great book on appliques. It's a part of a quilting library Rodale's Successful Quilting Library (tm) Applique Made Easy Karen Costello Soltys, Ed. ISBN 0-87596-813-9 I really like the book. About $20, and it has many many photos that show things step by step. There are a lot of different ways to do applique, and this covers all the little details. I don't do quilting, but I have been learning how to applique for my costumes. I have found using Steam-A-Seam 2 is wonderful. You draw what you want on one side (the one that isn't coming off), peal off the other side, stick it onto the applique fabric, then cut out the fabric following the design, then stick it all onto the base material. You can move it around however you want, and when you are happy, then you iron it on high with steam. The directions are on the paper. After ironing you then sew it down in whatever format you want. I tried other applique papers that require ironing twice, and it wouldn't stick to the cotton velveteen backside I was using for the applique material. If you are concerned with the fuzzy base material getting in the way while you are sewing, you can put down a clear washable stabilizer on top of the material. That will allow you to see what you are sewing, yet keep the feed dogs from getting fuzzy. You can even use a spray on washable temp adhesive to keep the stabilizer from shifting. hth and good luck with your project! She is one lucky godchild to be receiving such a wonderful gift from your heart. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 13:26:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4THQWHP001078 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 13:26:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4THNrUw009340 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 11:23:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4THNqrW019115; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:23:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jabberwock.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [205.179.178.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4THNkrX019071 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:23:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jabberwock.wonderland.com (localhost.wonderland.com [127.0.0.1])h4THP7Ae048559 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:25:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from alice@jabberwock.wonderland.com) Received: (from alice@localhost) by jabberwock.wonderland.com (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id h4THP7Y1048558 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 10:25:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Heather Meadows Message-Id: <200305291725.h4THP7Y1048558@jabberwock.wonderland.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 10:25:07 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: from "Sue Clemenger" at May 29, 2003 06:10:13 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would recommend spraying with Nature's Miracle, which you can get in most pet stores. Or cheap vodka. But the Nature's Miracle does the best job. > > Febreeze? > --sue > > Christine Robb wrote: > > > > My darling cat had a bunch of "accidents" near my wool cloak, which > > absorbed the smell very nicely, particularly since it wasn't discovered > > for a long time. I have had the cloak dry-cleaned and can now stand to > > be in the same room as it, but it still smells. > > > > The cloak is pure wool, but I did not wash it before making it, and it > > is the perfect length, so I really don't want to risk shrinking it. > > (The hood is made with two different weaves of wool.) > > > > Does anyone have any suggestions for what I can do to remove the smell? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Christine > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 14:15:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIFYHP001345 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 14:15:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIDSUw015771 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 12:13:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIDQLN023045; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:13:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIDMLN022983 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:13:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA08318 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 13:34:58 -0500 Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 13:34:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] archives? In-Reply-To: <001a01c32601$68e3fae0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 29 May 2003 lotsofteapots@charter.net wrote: > Hmmm...Eric doesn't seem to have anything past Jan 03 as far as I can > tell...oh well. I just spot-checked, using the URL he provided in the post I just quoted: http://sca.uwaterloo.ca/Fashion/ ...and I found threads from February, March, and April. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 14:18:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIIIHP001354 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 14:18:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIEJUw015916 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 12:14:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIEJLN023621; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:14:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIEFLN023570 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:14:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA08335 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 13:35:52 -0500 Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 13:35:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] archives? In-Reply-To: <048301c32607$ce46aa30$31baee0c@c59303a> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: ROr On Thu, 29 May 2003, chiara wrote: > Well, I have them in email format. If someone can tell me how to convert > them in mass into something downloadable I will put them on my site with the > others. :) That would be wonderful. We really need a proper archive with a full-text search; Eric's is helpful, but not as good as it could be. There are huge volumes of valuable information in those years of postings, and I would hate for them to be lost. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 14:56:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIuMHP001724 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 14:56:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIsSUw020203 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 12:54:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TIsQLN020615; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:54:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web80401.mail.yahoo.com (web80401.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.79.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4TIsNLN020532 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:54:24 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030529185418.50997.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.199.42.4] by web80401.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 29 May 2003 11:54:18 PDT Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:54:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Dawn Jacobson To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030529091249.00af9e08@127.0.0.1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [h-cost] ...and now, back to our regularly scheduled costuming X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO 100 costumes. 5 weeks. I can't believe it's ready. The "Wizard of Oz" opens tonight. Now that "Oz" is done, on to the next task: a gown and sideless surcoat that was commissioned before the play. Dawn (too tired to celebrate--I just want to sleep...zzzzzzz) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 15:59:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TJxHHP002789 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 15:59:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TJu8Uw026990 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 13:56:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TJu6k1007167; Thu, 29 May 2003 13:56:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TJtpk1006962 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 13:55:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFN007DRZD0SS@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 12:55:49 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 12:48:00 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] ...and now, back to our regularly scheduled costuming In-reply-to: <20030529185418.50997.qmail@web80401.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030529124619.02e20f68@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/29/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030529091249.00af9e08@127.0.0.1> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 11:54 AM 5/29/2003 -0700, you wrote: >100 costumes. 5 weeks. I can't believe it's ready. > >The "Wizard of Oz" opens tonight. Congratulations!! My goodness, that's a lot of costumes. I have tried to follow your comments on it, but I wasn't sure if it was just you working on the costumes, or if you did get some people to help on that Super Costuming Saturday (I think you said Saturday, my memory gets hazy). And get some much deserved rest. You did great! Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 17:48:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TLmLHP005234 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 17:48:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TLkPUw011027 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 15:46:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TLkN3W028180; Thu, 29 May 2003 15:46:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4TLkJ3W028128 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 15:46:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-164-238-28.s28.tnt4.frdb.va.dialup.rcn.com ([216.164.238.28] helo=ashley) by smtp02.mrf.mail.rcn.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19LVE2-0007G8-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 17:46:18 -0400 From: "Ashley Wells" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabricdeal. :) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 17:46:10 -0400 Message-ID: <000001c3262b$bb619690$1ceea4d8@ashley> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.3416 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200305272345.34283.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO No problem - there are a number of portraits of upper class women (in America, even) in the mid-3rd qtr. Of the 18th century wearing royal blue gowns - one is at Kenmore, and is notable because the same gown (color, trim, and all) appears in multiple portraits by the artist, all in the same pose, with different "heads" - I can't remember where I stashed the documentation for that little bit, but if lots of upper class Virginia ladies had their portraits painted in the "same" royal blue gown, it might not be too outrageous to assume that royal blue silk gowns were not only possible and acceptable, but even desirable. Hope this helps. Regards, Ashley I never saw whether it was possible to get a vivid royal blue in the 18th c as the issue. The issue was whether that option was pursued by women for gowns. There are plenty of costume related things that are "possible" for any given period that aren't, in fact, "period" because they weren't done for other reasons... -- Cathy Raymond _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 20:01:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U01BHP008087 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:01:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U00IUw025490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 18:00:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U00FxB024143; Thu, 29 May 2003 18:00:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grunt6.ihug.co.nz (grunt6.ihug.co.nz [203.109.254.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U007xB023992 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 18:00:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from p141-apx1.akl.ihug.co.nz (ihug.co.nz) [203.173.192.141] by grunt6.ihug.co.nz with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19LXJU-0000NR-00; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:00:04 +1200 Message-ID: <3ED69EFE.70200@ihug.co.nz> Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:59:58 +1200 From: michaela User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting smells out of wool References: <20030529.112546.-166799.1.catpurson@juno.com> In-Reply-To: <20030529.112546.-166799.1.catpurson@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ahhh.. silly me deleted the initial thread... Cat piddle... got a 7 month old cat with a fetish for piddling on plastic bags. Unfortunatly "sometimes" on the carpet.. A booklet on caring for a cat has the best advice. Basically any cleaner with enzymes in it is going to be the best. It breaks down the particles that cause the smell that they can smell, which also prevents them returning to piddle again. For getting out of carpet though I find drizzling disinfectant onto it and pressing an old towel to draw out the liquids. By pressing I mean standing and releasing, and standing etc etc as it's the best way to get right to the bottom. So basically washing with normal powder is going to be the best. But probably you'll want to coak it for a while in something like freind. If you wash it in cold water with a detergent meant for cold water it really shouldn't shrink. I have washed two wools and had no shrinkage. And I'm making a houppelande for soemone else who has prewashed his wool and it didn't shrink even on warm-cold setting. You could aslo just spot wash it, leaving it to soak in the detergent then rinsing out by hand. You'd only have a small area to work with that way. michaela http://glittersweet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 20:05:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U05SHP008153 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:05:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U03xUw026002 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 18:03:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U03wxB026207; Thu, 29 May 2003 18:03:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grunt2.ihug.co.nz (grunt2.ihug.co.nz [203.109.254.42]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U02GxB025253 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 18:02:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from p141-apx1.akl.ihug.co.nz (ihug.co.nz) [203.173.192.141] by grunt2.ihug.co.nz with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19LXLa-0003fN-00; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:02:14 +1200 Message-ID: <3ED69F82.6060200@ihug.co.nz> Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:02:10 +1200 From: michaela User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] paper tape dummy help! References: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> In-Reply-To: <008601c32595$d4f840e0$06a7b944@mad.chartermi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > 1) The tape wouldn't stick and kept peeling/rolling off when drying. How do > we get the ends to *stay* glued? Hubby used fairly short (4-5") pieces to > get around curves, and wetted them down under running water so they were > quite wet when first applied. I'm pretty sure the instructions on a site, where the instructions were taken down so people would have to buy a disc with the info on it (fair enough) mentioned using long strips and clipping them to go around curves, much like you do with duct tape. I wanted to make the paper tape, but can't get it anywhere here, so duct tape wound up being cheaper for me;) Hope all the tips have helped, they've helped me and I'm not even making one;) michaela http://glittersweet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 20:18:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U0IKHP008212 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 20:18:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U0HkUw026828 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 18:17:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U0HixB002117; Thu, 29 May 2003 18:17:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grunt6.ihug.co.nz (grunt6.ihug.co.nz [203.109.254.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U0HfxB002096 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 18:17:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from p141-apx1.akl.ihug.co.nz (ihug.co.nz) [203.173.192.141] by grunt6.ihug.co.nz with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 19LXaV-0006OU-00; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:17:40 +1200 Message-ID: <3ED6A31F.3030804@ihug.co.nz> Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:17:35 +1200 From: michaela User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] St. Jerome in a Landscape References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Alternatively, I have been scratching my head, trying to figure out > _how_ you find out whether one of the zillion Big Art Books in my local > university library might have a bigger (and better photographed) > reproduction of the painting. Any clues, guys? Are there indexes > somewhere of what paintings are reproduced in which books, or do I get > to spend lots of time in the library looking at picture books? (Gosh, > what an awful fate !) I have a book from a school library called Early Netherlandish and German Paintings from The National Galelry Schools Painting, which suggests there are others in the series (only lists the first six, but more were supposed to be published after). I'd suggest looking for the early italian paintings book, it may be avaiable in a library near you, even if you aren't a member you could look at the book. And if you find it really helpful maybe get it out on InterLibrary Loan? The book i've got out is fantastic. Really really wonderful for full page colour plates. michaela http://glittersweet.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 21:09:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U19lHP009401 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 21:09:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U146Uw001987 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 19:04:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U142Hd028879; Thu, 29 May 2003 19:04:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U13xHe028850 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 19:04:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id h4U143Gx004222 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 21:04:03 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id h4U1434i004220 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 29 May 2003 21:04:03 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabricdeal. :) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 21:04:03 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.5 References: <000001c3262b$bb619690$1ceea4d8@ashley> In-Reply-To: <000001c3262b$bb619690$1ceea4d8@ashley> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200305292104.03294.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4U13xHe028850 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 29 May 2003 05:46 pm, Ashley Wells wrote: > No problem - there are a number of portraits of upper class women (in > America, even) in the mid-3rd qtr. Of the 18th century wearing royal > blue gowns - one is at Kenmore, and is notable because the same gown > (color, trim, and all) appears in multiple portraits by the artist, all > in the same pose, with different "heads" - I can't remember where I > stashed the documentation for that little bit, but if lots of upper > class Virginia ladies had their portraits painted in the "same" royal > blue gown, it might not be too outrageous to assume that royal blue silk > gowns were not only possible and acceptable, but even desirable. Or, it may mean that the ladies had a hard time laying their hands on a nicer gown, so they were all willing to borrow the same one for portrait purposes no matter what color it was. :-) -- Cathy Raymond “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 21:42:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U1gWHP010330 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 21:42:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U1etUw004721 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 19:40:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U1esHd014585; Thu, 29 May 2003 19:40:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from tecoma.mccc.edu (tecoma.mccc.edu [198.133.170.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U1eoHd014532 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 19:40:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Kate ([198.133.170.246]) by tecoma.mccc.edu (8.12.9/8.11.4) with SMTP id h4U1eg2f001256 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 21:40:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <030b01c3264c$7db1a530$51a810ac@Kate> From: "Kate Pinner" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000001c3262b$bb619690$1ceea4d8@ashley> <200305292104.03294.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabricdeal.:) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 21:40:45 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Having worked in an art museum once, I think I remember that the American "primative" portrait painters of that time did a lot of 'prep' work. They would paint a lot of canvases with "stock" bodies and take them on the road, stopping at towns and homes, get a commission, pull out the 'little boy A', 'adult male B', 'adult female A', etc. (perhaps giving the sitter a choice if the artist carried more than one 'stock' pose) and paint the sitter's portrairt. Took a shorter length of time -- artist could finish and be on to the next house. Since boys wore dresses, the artist could have a 'stock child' and quickly add the rose or doll for a girl, etc. (I've forgotten the identifing items for boys - a dog? some type of toy?) Not all artists did this, but many did. Kate ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:04 PM Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabricdeal.:) > On Thursday 29 May 2003 05:46 pm, Ashley Wells wrote: > > No problem - there are a number of portraits of upper class women (in > > America, even) in the mid-3rd qtr. Of the 18th century wearing royal > > blue gowns - one is at Kenmore, and is notable because the same gown > > (color, trim, and all) appears in multiple portraits by the artist, all > > in the same pose, with different "heads" - I can't remember where I > > stashed the documentation for that little bit, but if lots of upper > > class Virginia ladies had their portraits painted in the "same" royal > > blue gown, it might not be too outrageous to assume that royal blue silk > > gowns were not only possible and acceptable, but even desirable. > > > Or, it may mean that the ladies had a hard time laying their hands on a nicer > gown, so they were all willing to borrow the same one for portrait purposes > no matter what color it was. :-) > > > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler.” > Albert Einstein > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu May 29 23:54:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U3s0HP013917 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 23:54:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U3q2Uw016866 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 21:52:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U3q08c013874; Thu, 29 May 2003 21:52:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from imo-m08.mx.aol.com (imo-m08.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.163]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U3pt8c013781 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 21:51:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36.3.) id 6.7e.3959ec49 (17526) for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 23:51:44 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <7e.3959ec49.2c082f4f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 23:51:43 EDT Subject: Re: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabricdeal.:) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 5/29/2003 9:48:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time, pinner@mccc.edu writes: > I think I remember that the American > "primative" portrait painters of that time did a lot of 'prep' work. I remember some Copley [not a primitive of course] portraits that feature blue gowns. Let's see. There's: Collection Tours - John Singleton Copley Exhibition and Collection Tours - John Singleton Copley Exhibition2 Neither are "electric" blue, but it's plain, blue silk. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 00:22:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U4M0HP014684 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 00:22:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U4LPUw019534 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 22:21:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U4LLmF026389; Thu, 29 May 2003 22:21:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from tisch.mail.mindspring.net (tisch.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.157]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U4LJmF026363 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 22:21:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from sdn-ar-007neomahp020.dialsprint.net ([63.178.246.28] helo=hppav.radiks.net) by tisch.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19LbOI-0000Ol-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 00:21:19 -0400 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20030529231505.019be598@radiks.net> X-Sender: costumrs@radiks.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 23:21:10 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200305291801.h4TI1PLO015030@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] Re: Applique' and cat smell X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Applique - If you're using the fusible paper stuff, test your fleece first - some of them are not heat-tolerant at all. You wouldn't want to melt your nice blanket all over your iron!! Also use a tear-away type stabilizer (like for machine embroidery) on the bottom side instead of plain cotton - then when you're done, you can carefully remove it and there won't be a difference in the hand of the fleece because there's an extra layer of fabric there. Cats - have 5 of them - one of them prefers the carpet to his litterbox sometimes. I agree that Nature's Miracle is great - Simple Solution is another brand name for the same type of product. What's really neat is you can add a cup of either of these to the water tank of a carpet cleaning machine along with the detergent, and it will get out the really-imbedded smells (reminding me I need to do this again soon). HTH, Sandy "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed To Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly-- Why They Are Simply Doomed." Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 01:22:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U5MAHP016249 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 01:22:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U5FGUw024422 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Thu, 29 May 2003 23:15:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U5FEDI018626; Thu, 29 May 2003 23:15:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41813.mail.yahoo.com (web41813.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.147]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4U5FBDI018573 for ; Thu, 29 May 2003 23:15:12 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030530051506.22370.qmail@web41813.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [202.129.95.21] by web41813.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:15:06 EST Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 15:15:06 +1000 (EST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Michelle=20Munzone?= To: h-costume@net.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.1 Subject: [h-cost] Re:Un-subscribing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Michelle Munzone wrote:please take (UN-SUBSCRIBE) me off this mailing list, thank you my email is- michelledolls@yahoo.com.au Michelle Munzone --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mobile - Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mobile - Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 04:02:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U825HP032174 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 04:02:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U81EUw002970 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 02:01:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U81Cqq013900; Fri, 30 May 2003 02:01:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4U819qq013871 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 02:01:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id h4U817p18214.; Fri, 30 May 2003 09:01:07 +0100 (BST) Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 30 May 2003 09:01:07 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0.2 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 09:00:30 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: [h-cost] Re:Un-subscribing Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4U819qq013871 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Michelle, don't send messages to the list, but go to the URL at the bottom of every message and follow the instructions for un-subscribing there. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby >>> michelledolls2000@yahoo.com.au 05/30/03 06:15am >>> Michelle Munzone wrote:please take (UN-SUBSCRIBE) me off this mailing list, thank you my email is- michelledolls@yahoo.com.au Michelle Munzone --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mobile - Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mobile - Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information on a proactive email security service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.messagelabs.com ________________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 06:36:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UAanHP024121 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:36:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UAYuUw011027 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 04:34:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UAYsXU000363; Fri, 30 May 2003 04:34:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UAYqXU000317 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 04:34:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A40A2B2E001E; Fri, 30 May 2003 05:35:54 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3CC131F010C; Fri, 30 May 2003 05:34:52 -0500 Message-ID: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 06:36:38 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] Possible problem X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Has anyone else had a problem with a Trojan virus since that spam went across the list the other night? Susan, Sharon, and I have. It is the dickens to get rid of. It attaches to email signatures... sometimes deleting the signatures out of Outlook. Instead it will attach an image with the virus. It messes with the settings in Outlooks. It also resets your homepage, and puts porn sites in your favorites. Sometimes they will pop up on their own when on the web. One way to check if you have the virus is in Outlook to go to Tools>OPTIONS>SIGNATURE and your signature is not there. A box is checked saying there is an image attachment. Sharon said the only virus software that is picking up the virus is an online scan at: http://housecall.antivirus.com/housecall/start_corp.asp This doesn't get right of it, but lets you know if you have it. The program states that it can't clean the virus. My husband stayed up until 2AM getting the virus off my computer for the second time. He finally went and updated my windows at Microsoft. He said there is a patch for the virus on their site. Oh, yes, even though we ran Nortons and it said that there was no virus... there is a fix on McAfee, but it doesn't get rid of the virus all together. Susan had a long talk with their tech service last night. Yes, you lucky Mac people... you can't get the virus. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 06:55:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UAtuHP024466 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:55:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UAtPUw011867 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 04:55:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UAtOYA006650; Fri, 30 May 2003 04:55:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41511.mail.yahoo.com (web41511.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.94]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4UAtLYA006612 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 04:55:22 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030530105516.1637.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41511.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:55:16 BST Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:55:16 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nope, coz I don't use Outlook nor IE. However, Penny, may I suggest you use Norton Antivirus? Personally I must say it seems to have caught just about everything I downloaded at home. I use Norton SystemWorks, and it isn't that expensive. Hope this helps a bit and that you get rid of all the nasties soon, I'd give Norton a go! Nicole --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > Has anyone else had a problem with a Trojan virus since that spam went > across the list the other night? Susan, Sharon, and I have. It is the > dickens to get rid of. It attaches to email signatures... sometimes > deleting the signatures out of Outlook. Instead it will attach an image > with the virus. It messes with the settings in Outlooks. It also resets > your homepage, and puts porn sites in your favorites. Sometimes they will > pop up on their own when on the web. One way to check if you have the virus > is in Outlook to go to Tools>OPTIONS>SIGNATURE and your signature is not > there. A box is checked saying there is an image attachment. > > Sharon said the only virus software that is picking up the virus is an > online scan at: > http://housecall.antivirus.com/housecall/start_corp.asp This doesn't get > right of it, but lets you know if you have it. The program states that it > can't clean the virus. My husband stayed up until 2AM getting the virus off > my computer for the second time. He finally went and updated my windows at > Microsoft. He said there is a patch for the virus on their site. > > Oh, yes, even though we ran Nortons and it said that there was no virus... > there is a fix on McAfee, but it doesn't get rid of the virus all together. > Susan had a long talk with their tech service last night. > > Yes, you lucky Mac people... you can't get the virus. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 08:22:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCMDHP026790 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 08:22:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCKJUw016463 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 06:20:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCKINL005852; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:20:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCKFNL005835 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:20:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ACBD3D570070; Fri, 30 May 2003 07:21:17 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AC7D172E0100; Fri, 30 May 2003 07:20:13 -0500 Message-ID: <000601c326a6$030fce60$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030530105516.1637.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 08:21:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Nicole, I am glad you don't have it. I have used Norton's for years and it didn't catch this one. Also my website host scan my mail and didn't catch it either. Susan uses McAfee and they didn't catch it either. The only one that catch it was the online scan of MicroTrend. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 08:24:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCOFHP026829 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 08:24:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCNkUw016669 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 06:23:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCNjNL007228; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:23:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCNgNL007162 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:23:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m238.in-tch.com [216.166.191.238]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4UC5AH03853 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:05:10 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED74DA7.A0C538B3@in-tch.com> Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 06:25:11 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Us lucky Netscape people aren't getting it, either. I also have a fairly decent filter that snags virii at the ISP level before they even try to get to me. They get quarantined, along with about 98% of the spam aimed at me, and I can visit the website and approve or delete them as I choose. The only virus that I've been sent recently is that "Microsoft Support" one--comes through a couple of times a week. And I'm safe at work, too--we have absolutely draconian protection in place there. Good luck keeping yourself scrubbed clean... --sue Penny Ladnier wrote: > > Has anyone else had a problem with a Trojan virus since that spam went > across the list the other night? Susan, Sharon, and I have. It is the > dickens to get rid of. It attaches to email signatures... sometimes > deleting the signatures out of Outlook. Instead it will attach an image > with the virus. It messes with the settings in Outlooks. It also resets > your homepage, and puts porn sites in your favorites. Sometimes they will > pop up on their own when on the web. One way to check if you have the virus > is in Outlook to go to Tools>OPTIONS>SIGNATURE and your signature is not > there. A box is checked saying there is an image attachment. > > Sharon said the only virus software that is picking up the virus is an > online scan at: > http://housecall.antivirus.com/housecall/start_corp.asp This doesn't get > right of it, but lets you know if you have it. The program states that it > can't clean the virus. My husband stayed up until 2AM getting the virus off > my computer for the second time. He finally went and updated my windows at > Microsoft. He said there is a patch for the virus on their site. > > Oh, yes, even though we ran Nortons and it said that there was no virus... > there is a fix on McAfee, but it doesn't get rid of the virus all together. > Susan had a long talk with their tech service last night. > > Yes, you lucky Mac people... you can't get the virus. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 09:00:33 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UD0XHP027359 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 09:00:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCxvUw018916 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 06:59:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCxuLM020401; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:59:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCxsLM020387 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:59:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail22.ureach.com (mail22.ureach.com [172.16.2.82]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA08851 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 08:59:53 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail22.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA24031 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 08:59:53 -0400 Message-ID: <042201c326aa$e75fd8e0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20030530105516.1637.qmail@web41511.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 08:56:35 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yes, Norton has been a godsend for me. It checks the attachments before it allows you to open it. It isn't expensive either. I got the free trial period version with my computer but the subscription is about $19 or $20 a year I think. It is very important to keep the virus software up to date! Good luck and much sympathy! ----- Original Message ----- From: "N Kipar" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 6:55 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem > Nope, coz I don't use Outlook nor IE. However, Penny, may I suggest you use > Norton Antivirus? Personally I must say it seems to have caught just about > everything I downloaded at home. I use Norton SystemWorks, and it isn't that > expensive. > > Hope this helps a bit and that you get rid of all the nasties soon, I'd give > Norton a go! > > Nicole > > --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > Has anyone else had a > problem with a Trojan virus since that spam went > > across the list the other night? Susan, Sharon, and I have. It is the > > dickens to get rid of. It attaches to email signatures... sometimes > > deleting the signatures out of Outlook. Instead it will attach an image > > with the virus. It messes with the settings in Outlooks. It also resets > > your homepage, and puts porn sites in your favorites. Sometimes they will > > pop up on their own when on the web. One way to check if you have the virus > > is in Outlook to go to Tools>OPTIONS>SIGNATURE and your signature is not > > there. A box is checked saying there is an image attachment. > > > > Sharon said the only virus software that is picking up the virus is an > > online scan at: > > http://housecall.antivirus.com/housecall/start_corp.asp This doesn't get > > right of it, but lets you know if you have it. The program states that it > > can't clean the virus. My husband stayed up until 2AM getting the virus off > > my computer for the second time. He finally went and updated my windows at > > Microsoft. He said there is a patch for the virus on their site. > > > > Oh, yes, even though we ran Nortons and it said that there was no virus... > > there is a fix on McAfee, but it doesn't get rid of the virus all together. > > Susan had a long talk with their tech service last night. > > > > Yes, you lucky Mac people... you can't get the virus. > > > > Penny Ladnier > > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > > www.costumegallery.com > > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ===== > Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > > Email: nicole@kipar.org > URL: http://www.kipar.org > > __________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience > http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 09:48:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UDmjHP028233 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 09:48:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCZPUw017470 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 06:35:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UCZNNL011568; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:35:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41501.mail.yahoo.com (web41501.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4UCZLNL011521 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 06:35:22 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030530123516.27457.qmail@web41501.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [194.66.208.11] by web41501.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:35:16 BST Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:35:16 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000601c326a6$030fce60$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh dear! I am glad then, that it was apparently caught at home. Nicole > I am glad you don't have it. I have used Norton's for years and it didn't > catch this one. Also my website host scan my mail and didn't catch it > either. Susan uses McAfee and they didn't catch it either. The only one > that catch it was the online scan of MicroTrend. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 09:57:50 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UDvnHP028428 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 09:57:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UDEDUw020049 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 07:14:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UDECLM026743; Fri, 30 May 2003 07:14:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UDE9LM026681 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 07:14:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.net (pcp03486178pcs.indpnd01.mo.comcast.net [68.86.79.197]) by mtaout05.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFP0051EBE1B8@mtaout05.icomcast.net> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 09:13:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 08:14:16 -0500 From: "Linda J. Thompson" To: h-costume@net.indra.com Message-id: <3ED75928.8040204@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 Subject: [h-cost] No virus here... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO But then I use Netscape, simply because it keeps me from getting so many of those nasty spammed viruses... -- Linda Thompson Attitude Is Everything http://corsetsandcostumes.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 10:29:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UEThHP029216 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 10:29:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UETFUw026936 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 08:29:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UETDUs002311; Fri, 30 May 2003 08:29:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UETAUs002248 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 08:29:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.netmtaout05.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 10:28:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 09:28:27 -0500 From: Allison Pace In-reply-to: <200305301055.h4UAtjYB006739@net.indra.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.552) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 2, Issue 295 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO From my days as a living history actress, I recall (but do not have the documentation) that in the early 19C, traveling artists went to remote areas that were just being explored and settled as America moved westward. In addition to documenting the flora, fauna, and indigenous folk, these artists also painted portraits. They carried a supply of pre-painted canvasses, with competed torsos, to which they added face of the subject. Hence the same dress in many portraits. Allison On Friday, May 30, 2003, at 05:55 AM, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: > No problem - there are a number of portraits of upper class women (in > America, even) in the mid-3rd qtr. Of the 18th century wearing royal > blue gowns - one is at Kenmore, and is notable because the same gown > (color, trim, and all) appears in multiple portraits by the artist, all > in the same pose, with different "heads" - I can't remember where I _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 11:14:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UFEMHP030086 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:14:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UEIWUw025801 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 08:18:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UEIUUs026489; Fri, 30 May 2003 08:18:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.kc.rr.com (fe2.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.163.49]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UEIRUs026452 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 08:18:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from karen ([24.31.233.125]) by mail2.kc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Fri, 30 May 2003 09:18:27 -0500 From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 09:18:24 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO No virus here, and I use Outlook, IE, and McAfee. However, from what you describe about the problem it doesn't sound like a virus to me. What it does sound like is some sort of dataminer, parasite, scumware, or malware. For these types of nasties, I would suggest downloading Ad-Aware from www.lavasoft.com It is a free program which will clean these sorts of things from your system. It will comprehensively scan your entire system and remove them so that you don't get changed homepages, popups, et cetera. Talia > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Penny Ladnier > Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 5:37 AM > To: h-costume > Subject: [h-cost] Possible problem > > > Has anyone else had a problem with a Trojan virus since that spam went > across the list the other night? Susan, Sharon, and I have. It is the > dickens to get rid of. It attaches to email signatures... sometimes > deleting the signatures out of Outlook. Instead it will attach an image > with the virus. It messes with the settings in Outlooks. It also resets > your homepage, and puts porn sites in your favorites. Sometimes they will > pop up on their own when on the web. One way to check if you > have the virus > is in Outlook to go to Tools>OPTIONS>SIGNATURE and your signature is not > there. A box is checked saying there is an image attachment. > > Sharon said the only virus software that is picking up the virus is an > online scan at: > http://housecall.antivirus.com/housecall/start_corp.asp This doesn't get > right of it, but lets you know if you have it. The program states that it > can't clean the virus. My husband stayed up until 2AM getting > the virus off > my computer for the second time. He finally went and updated my > windows at > Microsoft. He said there is a patch for the virus on their site. > > Oh, yes, even though we ran Nortons and it said that there was no virus... > there is a fix on McAfee, but it doesn't get rid of the virus all > together. > Susan had a long talk with their tech service last night. > > Yes, you lucky Mac people... you can't get the virus. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 13:01:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UH1dHP032029 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:01:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UH16Uw012991 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 11:01:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UH15gv008454; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:01:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UH11gv008388 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:01:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFP00CRKLXMW1@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 10:00:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 09:52:46 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530085336.00afea30@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530094601.02e07fc8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/30/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:05 AM 5/30/2003 -0700, you wrote: >But again, I think one of the most important virus protections is to use >any email program other than Outlook. > >Fran I heartily agree with this advice. I use Eudora, and I don't open any attachment I see unless I am expecting it. Outlook as a default opens the attachment when you open the e-mail, Eudora does not. Eudora keeps the attachment as a separate component, and shows an icon for you to click to open. I think you can shut automatic openings off on Outlook, but not sure where. Eudora is also free, if you want to try it out. I am also using Avast virus scanner on all my e-mail, so while I got the spam, I have not gotten infected. Then again, none of the spam I got had any attachments as I was looking before dumping them. It may have been my ISP removing those with attachment viruses, they just upgraded their stuff. Sorry you got infected, Penny. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 13:19:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UHJtHP032061 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:19:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UG46Uw007090 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 10:04:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UG44J0000887; Fri, 30 May 2003 10:04:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4UG40J0000840 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 10:04:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 30672 invoked from network); 30 May 2003 16:04:00 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 30 May 2003 16:04:00 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-88.sonic.net [209.148.112.88]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4UG3xl01239 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 09:03:59 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530085336.00afea30@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 09:05:32 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem In-Reply-To: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 06:36 AM 5/30/2003 -0400, you wrote: >Has anyone else had a problem with a Trojan virus since that spam went >across the list the other night? No. For one thing, I never got the spam email, because the Spam Assassin software my ISP uses stopped the spam before I downloaded my mail. You can also run Spam Assassin software directly on your machine. While this is certainly not 100% virus protection, since many viruses are not transmitted by spam, I've found it to be a 99% or better spam filter. >It attaches to email signatures... sometimes >deleting the signatures out of Outlook. Another important virus protection for PC users is to use any email program except Outlook. I've never gotten an email virus and I'm sure this is a major reason. I used to use Netscape, and switched to Mozilla, later to Eudora. at >Microsoft. He said there is a patch for the virus on their site. > >Oh, yes, even though we ran Nortons and it said that there was no virus... >there is a fix on McAfee, but it doesn't get rid of the virus all together. >Susan had a long talk with their tech service last night. > We run Norton Utilities with "live updates"--when the machine is on the net Norton periodically downloads any new irus protections from the Norton site. We also have the Zone Alarm firewall which is some help. Finally, we download Microsoft patches regularly. But again, I think one of the most important virus protections is to use any email program other than Outlook. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 13:54:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UHslHP032146 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:54:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UHsCUw019041 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 11:54:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UHs8gv012376; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:54:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4UHs1gv012234 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:54:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/Oj8sIRKagwgdfa0Z8AmbOYo=">; Fri, 30 May 2003 10:53:42 PDT Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HZFSBKTH; Fri, 30 May 2003 10:53:42 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 10:53:35 -0700 Message-ID: <20030530.105336.816.6.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 3-6 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley Subject: [h-cost] sealing cord ends X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi everyone. Got a question. I have a beautiful cord that I need to seal the ends of so they won't fray. The cord is real metal mixed with threads. I could use FrayChek I suppose but I am wondering if there might be a better way. Would melting work? Thank you for your help. Arlys ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:13:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIDpHP032416 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:13:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UICnUw021050 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:12:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIClJf024738; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:12:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UICiJf024678 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:12:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA15767 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:34:24 -0500 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:34:24 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I need some brainstorming help from the list. If you were publicizing the availability of an academic publication on medieval dress and textiles, what organizations would you approach to send notices to members? For example: the Costume Society (UK), The Costume Society of America, MEDATS, DISTAFF, the SCA. What groups am I missing that focus on historic dress/textiles or whose members have a strong buying interest in historic dress/textile information? I don't know the historic textile community, so I feel sure I'm missing some organization there. Also, is there a museum organization, or another major living history organization (as opposed to individual living history companies), or an organization for performers of early music/dance? (For purposes of this question, I'm looking for names of established organizations only, not e-mail lists, conferences, or general categories of interest groups.) With luck, this will *not* be a rhetorical question. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:23:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIN1HP032527 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:23:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIMPUw021976 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:22:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIMOJf001269; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:22:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIM9Jf001134 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:22:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFP00B36POVW2@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:22:08 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:14:23 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] sealing cord ends In-reply-to: <20030530.105336.816.6.Cley@juno.com> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530111150.02e07fc8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/30/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Arlys, Only a couple of suggestions from me. Dipping the ends in hot wax or a glue, or sewing the ends shut. The last one I tried once, but it didn't work out as neatly as I would have liked. But I really do like Fray Check. Why not try a few ideas with a spare piece and see what you like best. my two pesos worth, Kimiko At 10:53 AM 5/30/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Hi everyone. Got a question. I have a beautiful cord that I need to seal >the ends of so they won't fray. The cord is real metal mixed with >threads. I could use FrayChek I suppose but I am wondering if there might >be a better way. Would melting work? > >Thank you for your help. > >Arlys Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:25:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIPmHP032556 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:25:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIPBUw022269 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:25:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIPAJf003239; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:25:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (f1phy.netins.net [167.142.228.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIP1Jf003141 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:25:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [167.142.16.168] (HELO herselftifhj9g) by cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9) with SMTP id 366100210 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:25:00 -0500 Message-ID: <027801c326d8$c8f9c770$a8108ea7@herselftifhj9g> From: "Land of Oz" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:25:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > I need some brainstorming help from the list. > I'd include any university with a textile program. Grad students and profs may be interested, even if there isn't a specific "historical" department. Denise landofoz@netins.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:30:06 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIU5HP032613 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:30:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UITXUw022787 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:29:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UITWJf006082; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:29:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail.mackie.com (mail1.mackie.com [12.144.237.151]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UITNJf005961 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:29:24 -0600 (MDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:28:28 -0700 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? Thread-Index: AcMm138hpwFFCxG8S+GEGi5ozUI5FgAAKSKA From: "Colleen McDonald" To: "Historical Costume" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id h4UITNJf005961 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO << What groups am I missing that focus on historic dress/textiles or whose members have a strong buying interest in historic dress/textile information?>> There's the Textile Society of America: http://textilesociety.org/about_about.htm The North American Textile Conservation Conference: http://palimpsest.stanford.edu/byform/mailing-lists/framecon/1999/12/msg00000.html The Group for Costume and Textile Staff in Museums: "This group produce a newsletter and hold an annual conference on topics relevant to the conservation, exhibition and documentation of costumes and textiles. For information contact the Secretary: Christine Rew, Aberdeen Art Gallery, Schoolhill, Aberdeen AB10 1FQ E-mail: chrisr_aberdeen@yahoo.com" The Textile Conservation Center at the University of Southampton: http://www.wsa.soton.ac.uk/tcc/tccstaff.htm Hope those help. Colleen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:31:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIViHP032631 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:31:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIT9Uw022729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:29:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIT8Jf005808; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:29:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.232]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIT5Jf005768 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:29:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Loci-0003pd-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:29:04 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] sealing cord ends Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:29:04 -0700 Message-ID: <000701c326d9$5984a5d0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-reply-to: <20030530.105336.816.6.Cley@juno.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Melting might work depending on the content, but I would recommend the clear lacing tip (shrink tube) available from Lacis (and a few other places). Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:40:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIe1HP032719 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:40:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIdUUw023823 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:39:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIdTJf012659; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:39:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cgpf2.cgp.netins.net (f2phy.netins.net [167.142.229.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIdPJf012602 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:39:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [167.142.16.168] (HELO herselftifhj9g) by cgpf2.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9) with SMTP id 346667864 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:39:24 -0500 Message-ID: <02cb01c326da$cbce5950$a8108ea7@herselftifhj9g> From: "Land of Oz" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030528013950.077eaf70@mail.earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:39:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [h-cost] Re: Relevance of sewing skills and economics of home-sewing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >Not that you can't save money by sewing your own clothes, > > Huh? Almost any garment you can point me at, I can purchase more cheaply > at retail than the cost of the *materials* from which to make that garment > myself. It's not couture clothing, but I can make two pair of kids shorts from one dollar's worth of cheap cotton. You can't buy shorts for that, even at Wal-Mart, and the quality is about the same (low). For the short period of time they need shorts in that size, it's worth my time. The way I see it, there is only one real reason to sew clothing. Because you like to. Denise landofoz@netins.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:46:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIkCHP000336 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:46:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIiGUw024248 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:44:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIiEJf015449; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:44:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law10-f55.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.55]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIiBJf015371 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:44:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:44:05 -0700 Received: from 66.237.9.226 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:44:05 GMT X-Originating-IP: [66.237.9.226] X-Originating-Email: [jessicastier@hotmail.com] From: "jessica stier" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 18:44:05 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 May 2003 18:44:05.0799 (UTC) FILETIME=[728C3370:01C326DB] Subject: [h-cost] Re: sealing cord ends X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Any idea what kind of metal it is? That may make a difference if you're thinking about melting it. :) jessica For viris protection, I sugest reading this in the digest format... _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:46:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIkKHP000342 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:46:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIjjUw024382 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:45:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIjiJf016349; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:45:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from b.smtp-out.sonic.net (b.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4UIjgJf016329 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:45:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 9580 invoked from network); 30 May 2003 18:45:41 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by b.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 30 May 2003 18:45:41 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-108.sonic.net [209.148.112.108]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4UIjew18784 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:45:40 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530112713.00b00798@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:47:14 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There is also a Costume Society of Ontario: http://www.costumesociety.ca/ and a Costume Society of Scotland: http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/CEC/Recreation/Libraries/Local_Organisations/local_The_Costume_Society_of_Scotland.html There is the International Costumer's Guild: http://www.costume.org/ and its many regional branches. There are numerous regional early music societies. There is an international one at: http://www.earlymusic.net/home.html There is no "authentic" medieval dance society that I know of. There is not enough surviving information to reconstruct medieval dance (as opposed to Renaissance and later dance) to perform it. I know of a couple of American living-history type museum organizations. However, they focus on American history, so of course the European Middle Ages is not relevant to them. I assume this information is for the marketing department of Gale Owen-Crocker's publisher. What do you envision as your own next costume-related project? Fran At 01:34 PM 5/30/2003 -0500, you wrote: >I need some brainstorming help from the list. > >If you were publicizing the availability of an academic publication on >medieval dress and textiles, what organizations would you approach to send >notices to members? For example: the Costume Society (UK), The Costume >Society of America, MEDATS, DISTAFF, the SCA. What groups am I missing >that focus on historic dress/textiles or whose members have a strong >buying interest in historic dress/textile information? I don't know the >historic textile community, so I feel sure I'm missing some organization >there. Also, is there a museum organization, or another major living >history organization (as opposed to individual living history companies), >or an organization for performers of early music/dance? > >(For purposes of this question, I'm looking for names of established >organizations only, not e-mail lists, conferences, or general categories >of interest groups.) > >With luck, this will *not* be a rhetorical question. > >--Robin > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 14:52:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIqxHP000401 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:52:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIoaUw024819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 12:50:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIoZJf019232; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:50:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net (swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.123]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UIoVJf019208 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:50:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19LoxO-0007F4-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 11:50:31 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] sealing cord ends Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:50:25 -0700 Message-ID: <000001c326dc$5536a110$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-reply-to: <000701c326d9$5984a5d0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO After reading other's response I realized I needed to have asked clarifying questions: What is the application? Is the end hanging freely in the application? If not, then sewing is a great way to end it. You can wrap the thread 'round it several times and then secure it, tucking the end under something if possible. If it is a free hanging end then I still recommend the shrink tube. I have only seen the clear stuff in smaller diameters, but your hardware store will have it in black in several more diameters. "The root of education is bitter, the fruit sweet" Isocrates ~-----Original Message----- ~From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On ~Behalf Of Saragrace Knauf ~Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 11:29 AM ~To: 'Historical Costume' ~Subject: RE: [h-cost] sealing cord ends ~ ~Melting might work depending on the content, but I would recommend the ~clear lacing tip (shrink tube) available from Lacis (and a few other ~places). ~ ~Sg ~ ~ ~ ~_______________________________________________ ~h-costume mailing list ~h-costume@mail.indra.com ~http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 15:24:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJORHP000666 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:24:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJNoUw027905 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 13:23:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJNfhM009857; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:23:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shadow.csufresno.edu (relay-1.csufresno.edu [129.8.57.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJNahM009790 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:23:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by shadow.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFP0022CSJA1D@shadow.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:23:35 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:15:13 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Relevance of sewing skills and economics of home-sewing In-reply-to: <02cb01c326da$cbce5950$a8108ea7@herselftifhj9g> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530121042.02e07fc8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/30/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030528013950.077eaf70@mail.earthlink.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 01:39 PM 5/30/2003 -0500, you wrote: >The way I see it, there is only one real reason to sew clothing. Because you >like to. May I add another reason. To make clothes that fit you better than RTW. That is why I sew my own clothes now. I know the cut and fit will fit me better than anything I can find, and that was doubly true when I was pregnant. I am a larger woman, and when I was pregnant, I could not find any maternity clothing for my size. The only advice I got was to get larger plus sized clothing. I ended up making my own wedding dress (at seven months), because I could find nothing, even online. My friend suggested to me yesterday that I should make maternity wear for plus sized women. She is looking in vain for some herself. Who knows, I just might... and I am not a fashion person at all. There just has to be something for us larger gals, especially when we are pregnant. my thoughts anyway... Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 15:39:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJddHP000820 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:39:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJd7Uw029637 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 13:39:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJd6eH020548; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:39:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJd2eH020493 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:39:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA16279 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:00:43 -0500 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 15:00:42 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530112713.00b00798@pop.sonic.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Fri, 30 May 2003, Lavolta Press wrote: Thanks! A few of these were new to me. > There is no "authentic" medieval dance society that I know of. There > is not enough surviving information to reconstruct medieval dance (as > opposed to Renaissance and later dance) to perform it. Do you know of a Renaissance dance organization, or other organizations with special interest in material culture of the 16th c. period (which, I hear tell, is now being called "early modern" in some circles, to the great dismay of people in some other circles...)? > I assume this information is for the marketing department of Gale > Owen-Crocker's publisher. What do you envision as your own next > costume-related project? This is not for Gale's book. This is for a different project which, if successful, will take a large part of my own energies in coming months. I am not free to say more at this point, but I promise the list will be among the first to know when/if I do have news. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 15:49:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJncHP000921 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:49:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJe6Y4029760 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 13:49:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJQQeH012072; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:26:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJO7hM010237 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:24:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA16176 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:45:46 -0500 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 14:45:46 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-Reply-To: <027801c326d8$c8f9c770$a8108ea7@herselftifhj9g> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC-Etherboy-Metrics: net.indra.com 1002; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Fri, 30 May 2003, Land of Oz wrote: > I'd include any university with a textile program. Grad students and > profs may be interested, even if there isn't a specific "historical" > department. Thanks, got that covered -- right now I'm looking for names of organizations, not universities/departments or other individual institutions. So, if there's a professional society for people in textile programs at many different universities, that's what I want to find out. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 15:50:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJo3HP000930 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:50:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJn6Uw000993 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 13:49:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UJn2eH028049; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:49:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4UJmweH027988 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:48:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 17988 invoked from network); 30 May 2003 19:48:58 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 30 May 2003 19:48:58 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-169.sonic.net [209.148.112.169]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4UJmv224450 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 12:48:57 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530124329.00ac5408@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:50:30 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530112713.00b00798@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >Do you know of a Renaissance dance organization, or other organizations >with special interest in material culture of the 16th c. period (which, I >hear tell, is now being called "early modern" in some circles, to the >great dismay of people in some other circles...)? There is the Society of Dance History Scholars: http://www.sdhs.org/ I assume you know there are a number of Renaissance theme fairs in the US, but I know of no umbrella organization for same. >This is for a different project which, if >successful, will take a large part of my own energies in coming months. Thanks for the update, Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 16:10:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKAHHP001156 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:10:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UK8PUw003254 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 14:08:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UK8NE2011485; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:08:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from keaton.its.csufresno.edu (keaton.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UK8LE2011458 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:08:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by keaton.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFP00BRDULUW5@keaton.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:08:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:00:38 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530124329.00ac5408@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530125549.02e5f8c0@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/30/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530112713.00b00798@pop.sonic.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 12:50 PM 5/30/2003 -0700, you wrote: >I assume you know there are a number of Renaissance theme fairs in the US, >but I know of no umbrella organization for same. No really umbrella organization for it all, but there are a few organizations that represent a large number of groups or guilds. The one I used to be involved in for California small faires is CIRGA (California Independent Renaissance Guilds Association), and their web site is www.cirga.org . There may be other organizations, and a number of web sites, for Renaissance actors and such in general. And I was also involved in a Scottish country dance group (renaissance time based), and we were involved in the larger Clan MacLeod dance organization for a time. I am not sure of any large scale organizations for dancers, but I can ask around. I am familiar with a few localized groups, like the Barleycorn Dancers (Central Coast area), and one from Sacramento (whose name is escaping me right now). hth the search. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 16:23:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKNTHP001393 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:23:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKMrUw005137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 14:22:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKMpE2021982; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:22:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from a.smtp-out.sonic.net (a.smtp-out.sonic.net [208.201.224.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4UKMmE2021961 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:22:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: (qmail 32718 invoked from network); 30 May 2003 20:22:48 -0000 Received: from sub.sonic.net (208.201.224.8) by a.smtp-out.sonic.net with SMTP; 30 May 2003 20:22:48 -0000 Received: from LAVOLTA2.lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-148.sonic.net [209.148.112.148]) by sub.sonic.net (8.11.6p2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id h4UKMl912168 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:22:47 -0700 X-envelope-info: Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530131955.00ac0368@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: lavolta@pop.sonic.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:24:20 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Lavolta Press Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530125549.02e5f8c0@127.0.0.1> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530124329.00ac5408@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030530112713.00b00798@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > >And I was also involved in a Scottish country dance group (renaissance >time based), and we were involved in the larger Clan MacLeod dance >organization for a time. I am not sure of any large scale organizations >for dancers, but I can ask around. I am familiar with a few localized >groups, like the Barleycorn Dancers (Central Coast area), and one from >Sacramento (whose name is escaping me right now). > My question would be whether these are the type of groups that would be useful to Robin. If someone wants to do Renaissance dance, contact data for a performing group local to them might be just the thing. If someone wants to locate an organization that will publish a book, article, or paper, it might not be. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Historic and Vintage Dance http://www.lavoltapress.com/dance _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 16:31:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKVrHP001505 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:31:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKT3Uw005915 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 14:29:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKT2E2025743; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:29:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from draco.its.csufresno.edu (draco.its.csufresno.edu [129.8.52.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKSwE2025709 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:28:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from earthlink.kimiko1.com ([129.8.206.192]) by draco.its.csufresno.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.14 (built Mar 18 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFP0093NVK79Q@draco.its.csufresno.edu> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 13:28:56 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:21:15 -0700 From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530131955.00ac0368@pop.sonic.net> X-Sender: kimiko@64.87.54.245 To: Historical Costume Message-id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530131953.00af9cd8@127.0.0.1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 5/30/2003), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530125549.02e5f8c0@127.0.0.1> <5.2.0.9.0.20030530124329.00ac5408@pop.sonic.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030530112713.00b00798@pop.sonic.net> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 01:24 PM 5/30/2003 -0700, you wrote: >My question would be whether these are the type of groups that would be >useful to Robin. If someone wants to do Renaissance dance, contact data >for a performing group local to them might be just the thing. If someone >wants to locate an organization that will publish a book, article, or >paper, it might not be. > >Fran Very true, but those smaller organizations might know of a larger organization that they may belong to, that we are currently not aware of. That is why I mentioned them. It was only a suggestion. If Robin is interested in looking further in this avenue, I am willing to ask around on Robin's behalf. Kimiko Kimiko Small Costumer, Fiber Artist, Web Designer, Wife and Mother kimiko@kimiko1.com; http://www.kimiko1.com Graphic Intern at Costume Gallery http://www.costumegallery.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 16:34:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKYjHP001533 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:34:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKY7Uw006530 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 14:34:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKY6E2028741; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:34:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp-out.comcast.net (smtp-out.comcast.net [24.153.64.115]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UKUJE2026457 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:30:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from comcast.net (pcp03509979pcs.elictc01.md.comcast.net [68.54.185.111]) by mtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HFP000V8VJZ1G@mtaout02.icomcast.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:28:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 16:28:51 -0400 From: Cozit / Liz To: h-costume@indra.com Message-id: <3ED7BF03.9060800@comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 References: <200305301802.h4UI24Jg018005@net.indra.com> Subject: [h-cost] Re: attatchment viruses X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO One easy way of avoiding them is to get your groups of various sorts in digest form. Both my indra groups and my yahoogroups that I get that way cut off any and all attachments before sending off the digests. -Elisabeth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 17:02:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UL2GHP001862 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:02:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UL1kUw009066 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 15:01:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UL1jKK015273; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:01:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41510.mail.yahoo.com (web41510.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.93]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4UL1hKK015210 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:01:44 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030530210138.44619.qmail@web41510.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41510.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 30 May 2003 22:01:38 BST Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 22:01:38 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= To: H-Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [h-cost] Heeeeelp! Lost all 'blue in 18th c.' messages X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I found the recent thread on the colour 'electric blue' very interesting and saved all the mails into a special folder.... but deleted the folder by accident! I know there were quite a few messages, but did anybody archive them too and is there a way that I could get to them? Thanks in advance Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 17:55:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULtFHP002470 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:55:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULrRUw014250 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 15:53:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULrRKK017186; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:53:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law8-oe28.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.85]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULrPKK017104 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:53:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:53:20 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by law8-oe28.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 30 May 2003 21:53:19 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530085336.00afea30@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 17:53:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 May 2003 21:53:20.0063 (UTC) FILETIME=[E23764F0:01C326F5] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > at > >Microsoft. He said there is a patch for the virus on their site. Actually, I think what the patch does is enforce asking you for confirmation before downloading/installing stuff on your computer. So if you see something popping up that you didn't ask for, you can cancel it. Those ad programs just didn't ask before installing themselves! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 17:57:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULv5HP002476 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:57:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULuPV0014468 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 15:56:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULmrKK014506; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:48:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (law8-oe50.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULmpKK014402 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:48:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 30 May 2003 14:48:46 -0700 Received: from 24.201.196.91 by law8-oe50.law8.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 30 May 2003 21:48:45 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.201.196.91] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 17:48:40 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 May 2003 21:48:46.0257 (UTC) FILETIME=[3F03EA10:01C326F5] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What you're describing is not really a virus... well... it's similar, but it won't damage your system, just be **** annoying. Most of the times their kind are used for advertising purposes. Not something that would make ME buy from them!! I had trouble with one called Xupiter, that started changing my home page, putting in new bookmarks, changing my search options, etc. Luckily it wasn't a porn ad, just a gateway. I got rid of it with a program called Ad-Aware. It's free. http://www.webattack.com/get/adaware.shtml ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 6:36 AM Subject: [h-cost] Possible problem > Has anyone else had a problem with a Trojan virus since that spam went > across the list the other night? Susan, Sharon, and I have. It is the > dickens to get rid of. It attaches to email signatures... sometimes > deleting the signatures out of Outlook. Instead it will attach an image > with the virus. It messes with the settings in Outlooks. It also resets > your homepage, and puts porn sites in your favorites. Sometimes they will > pop up on their own when on the web. One way to check if you have the virus > is in Outlook to go to Tools>OPTIONS>SIGNATURE and your signature is not > there. A box is checked saying there is an image attachment. > > Sharon said the only virus software that is picking up the virus is an > online scan at: > http://housecall.antivirus.com/housecall/start_corp.asp This doesn't get > right of it, but lets you know if you have it. The program states that it > can't clean the virus. My husband stayed up until 2AM getting the virus off > my computer for the second time. He finally went and updated my windows at > Microsoft. He said there is a patch for the virus on their site. > > Oh, yes, even though we ran Nortons and it said that there was no virus... > there is a fix on McAfee, but it doesn't get rid of the virus all together. > Susan had a long talk with their tech service last night. > > Yes, you lucky Mac people... you can't get the virus. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 17:58:17 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULwHHP002483 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:58:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULvmUw014580 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 15:57:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULvlFu019952; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:57:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp2.suscom.net (smtp.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4ULvjFu019899 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:57:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A964C1116F7 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:57:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <038901c326f6$7fbae170$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 17:57:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I had trouble with one called Xupiter, that started changing my > home page, putting in new bookmarks, changing my search options, etc. > I had the same problems with Xupiter. P***** me off royally. Dianne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 18:25:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMP9HP002672 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:25:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMMnUw017007 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 16:22:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMMlFu004083; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:22:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMMhFu004040 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:22:44 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-38-102.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.38.102])h4UMMUhl029466 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:22:39 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030530150910.00d4d940@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 15:11:06 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Relevance of sewing skills and economics of home-sewing In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530121042.02e07fc8@127.0.0.1> References: <02cb01c326da$cbce5950$a8108ea7@herselftifhj9g> <5.1.0.14.0.20030528013950.077eaf70@mail.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>The way I see it, there is only one real reason to sew clothing. Because you >>like to. > > >May I add another reason. To make clothes that fit you better than RTW. How nice that you folks like to sew. I sew because I can't afford to hire the best to make historical costumes to my picky standards. I can't even afford to hire an inadequate seamstress to sew from a commercial pattern for me. I'm lucky if I can hire one to make buttonholes for me. I sew because I "have to", not because I like it. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 18:27:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMR1HP002685 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:27:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMQVUw017299 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 16:26:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMQUFu005967; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:26:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMQRFv005939 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:26:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: (from eliz@localhost) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.8/Submit) id h4UMQRNl005936 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:26:27 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 16:26:27 -0600 From: Elizabeth Lear To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Relevance of sewing skills and economics of home-sewing Message-ID: <20030530222627.GH21199@net.indra.com> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030528013950.077eaf70@mail.earthlink.net> <5.1.0.14.0.20030530121042.02e07fc8@127.0.0.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030530121042.02e07fc8@127.0.0.1> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I am a larger woman, and when I was pregnant, I could not find > any maternity clothing for my size. The only advice I got was to get larger > plus sized clothing. > Kimiko Amen! I found a few nice plus-size maternity tops at Motherhood Maternity, but other than that I've been wearing 2X t-shirts and my husband's old 2X polo shirts. I also was passed some nice plus-size nursing shirts from two friends. But there's one shirt I like that doesn't fit across my shoulders - that one I'm going to copy slightly larger for next time (I am just about out of time to copy it for this time ...) ...eliz -- Please allow 2-6 weeks for delivery. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 18:30:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMUlHP002722 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:30:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMTvUw017704 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 16:29:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMTuFu007987; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:29:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UMTrFu007967 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 16:29:54 -0600 (MDT) Received: from casamai (adsl-65-69-52-155.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net [65.69.52.155]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.9/8.12.3) with SMTP id h4UMTpc3019129 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 15:29:52 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <004601c326fb$1a4ff3c0$3ce3fea9@sbcglobal.net> From: "Bruce & Nora Mai" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.1.0.14.0.20030530094601.02e07fc8@127.0.0.1> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 17:29:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Outlook as a default opens the attachment when you open the e-mail Actually, no, it doesn't. Only if you have your preferences are set for auto-preview will it "automatically" open anything. Check under 'View'. Default settings in both Outlook and Outlook Express show Attachments as icons. Don't open the attachment and you're pretty safe. NKM _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 19:03:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UN3fHP003161 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:03:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UN37Uw020706 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 17:03:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UN36Lw025379; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:03:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from lakemtao03.cox.net (lakemtao03.cox.net [68.1.17.242]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UN33Lw025331 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:03:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from VMAAHQ ([68.99.96.216]) by lakemtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030530230257.RVVJ23518.lakemtao03.cox.net@VMAAHQ> for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:02:57 -0400 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 15:04:53 -0400 Message-ID: <000501c326de$5c6c6a30$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 In-Reply-To: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin~ I'm sure you already know about this one, but I offer it up anyway: http://www.medievaltextiles.org/ ::Linda:: -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Robin Netherton Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 2:34 PM To: Historic Costume List Subject: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? I need some brainstorming help from the list. If you were publicizing the availability of an academic publication on medieval dress and textiles, what organizations would you approach to send notices to members? For example: the Costume Society (UK), The Costume Society of America, MEDATS, DISTAFF, the SCA. What groups am I missing that focus on historic dress/textiles or whose members have a strong buying interest in historic dress/textile information? I don't know the historic textile community, so I feel sure I'm missing some organization there. Also, is there a museum organization, or another major living history organization (as opposed to individual living history companies), or an organization for performers of early music/dance? (For purposes of this question, I'm looking for names of established organizations only, not e-mail lists, conferences, or general categories of interest groups.) With luck, this will *not* be a rhetorical question. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 19:12:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UNCiHP003179 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:12:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UNCDUw021391 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 17:12:14 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UNCCLw029735; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:12:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (f1phy.netins.net [167.142.228.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UNCALw029720 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:12:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [167.142.13.198] (HELO herselftifhj9g) by cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9) with SMTP id 366291593 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:12:09 -0500 Message-ID: <010c01c32700$e75ab2b0$c60d8ea7@herselftifhj9g> From: "Land of Oz" To: "Historical Costume" References: <02cb01c326da$cbce5950$a8108ea7@herselftifhj9g> <5.1.0.14.0.20030528013950.077eaf70@mail.earthlink.net> <4.3.1.2.20030530150910.00d4d940@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Relevance of sewing skills and economics of home-sewing Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 18:12:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > >>The way I see it, there is only one real reason to sew clothing. Because you > >>like to. > > > > > >May I add another reason. To make clothes that fit you better than RTW. > Well, that is a good reason, but technically---you *could* hire it done. If you are a hard to fit size and hate sewing you either pay for high-end RTW or you pay for custom work. Or you sew even though you hate it, I guess. Not many people would do that, I think. I am plus sized as well, and I know that if I had an unlimited budget, I could find anything I wanted in any size. Either in a specialty catalog/shop or custom made. I'd rather make my own, even if it isn't fancy. I made several maternity items because I didn't like the yellow ducks and pink bows on everything. Earth tones anyone? :-) Denise landofoz@netins.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 19:58:28 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UNwSHP003736 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:58:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UNuUUw024588 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 17:56:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UNuTNe019591; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:56:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4UNuPNe019556 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 17:56:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail23.ureach.com (mailout.ureach.com [172.16.2.83]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA26380 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:56:25 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail23.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA05695 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:56:24 -0400 Message-ID: <04a101c32706$9ca5bb60$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 19:53:04 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There is an organization in San Francisco called PEERS that does dance of various periods, sometimes the 16th century... and oh how I miss them now that I live in Atlanta! Here is their website: www.peers.org Good luck! Teena ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 4:00 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? > Do you know of a Renaissance dance organization, or other organizations > with special interest in material culture of the 16th c. period (which, I > hear tell, is now being called "early modern" in some circles, to the > great dismay of people in some other circles...)? > > --Robin > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 20:33:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V0XVHP004168 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 20:33:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V0VgUw026912 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 18:31:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V0VbNe004631; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:31:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.60]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V0VVNe004579 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:31:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 216-164-238-125.s125.tnt4.frdb.va.dialup.rcn.com ([216.164.238.125] helo=ashley) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 19LuHS-0007av-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 30 May 2003 20:31:31 -0400 From: "Ashley Wells" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: Dissenting voice! Re: [h-cost] royal blue for 18th c? fabricdeal.:) Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 20:31:23 -0400 Message-ID: <000601c3270b$fa9e0790$7deea4d8@ashley> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.3416 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <200305292104.03294.cathy@thyrsus.com> Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Given the social class of the particular ladies involved, as well as some portrait painters' production techniques (apprentices painting parts other than the subject's face, and so on), the curator at Kenmore was of the opinion that the well known painter did the actual subject's face, hair, etc., and "stock" gown and pose was painted by the student to fit the outline for body proportion sketched in by the master. The ladies that were painted in the identical gown were highly unlikely to be able to borrow the gown from each other with anything approaching convenience - things like ladies from Fredericksburg, VA; Philadelphia, PA; and Boston, MA in the same gown (floral corsage and all). Regards, Ashley On Thursday 29 May 2003 05:46 pm, Ashley Wells wrote: > No problem - there are a number of portraits of upper class women (in > America, even) in the mid-3rd qtr. Of the 18th century wearing royal > blue gowns - one is at Kenmore, and is notable because the same gown > (color, trim, and all) appears in multiple portraits by the artist, all > in the same pose, with different "heads" - I can't remember where I > stashed the documentation for that little bit, but if lots of upper > class Virginia ladies had their portraits painted in the "same" royal > blue gown, it might not be too outrageous to assume that royal blue silk > gowns were not only possible and acceptable, but even desirable. Or, it may mean that the ladies had a hard time laying their hands on a nicer gown, so they were all willing to borrow the same one for portrait purposes no matter what color it was. :-) -- Cathy Raymond "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." Albert Einstein _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 20:56:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V0ukHP004519 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 20:56:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V0tTUw028154 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 18:55:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V0tRCu014201; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:55:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from ureach.com (mail.ureach.com [63.150.151.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V0tHCu014148 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:55:17 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail20.ureach.com (mail20.ureach.com [172.16.2.80]) by ureach.com (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA07924 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 20:55:17 -0400 Received: from TEENALAPTOP (adsl-156-88-137.asm.bellsouth.net [66.156.88.137]) by mail20.ureach.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id UAA07920 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 20:55:16 -0400 Message-ID: <04da01c3270e$d5b721c0$210110ac@TEENALAPTOP> From: "Beteena Paradise" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530085336.00afea30@pop.sonic.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 20:51:56 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 5:53 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem > Those ad > programs just didn't ask before installing themselves! Actually that did happen to me once!!! I was trying to get to a well known website (the cnn site, if I recall correctly) and typo-ed the address. Apparently the adult sites buy up typos of popular sites. Well..... I got sent to this porn site and suddenly there were pop ups coming so fast that I couldn't close them fast enough. I actually had a scroll bar on my task bar!! Finally there were so many pop ups that my computer crashed. When I rebooted, there was an icon to the site with a rather nasty slogan on it. I quickly deleted it and thought that was the last of my problem. A couple of days later I went to my start menu and there was the icon on the shortcuts plus a listing under the programs menu. I deleted them quickly, of course. About a month or so went by and I was looking at my favorites trying to find a website I had saved.... there at the end of my list.... was a bookmark to this same adult site! I was absolutely mortified!! Thank heavens no one else uses my computer! My point is... There was no box to click "ok" AND.... I was using Netscape. Teena _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 21:16:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V1GpHP005010 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 21:16:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V1GOUw029834 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 19:16:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V1GMCu023930; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:16:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V1GKCu023883 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:16:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a253.in-tch.com [66.62.107.53]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4V0vnH03708 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 18:57:49 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED802BD.F96A4364@in-tch.com> Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 19:17:49 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] sealing cord ends References: <20030530.105336.816.6.Cley@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Melting would depend on what the threads were made of--poly and nylon melt beautifully, for instance. How thick is your cord? And what are you using it for? --sue Cynthia J Ley wrote: > > Hi everyone. Got a question. I have a beautiful cord that I need to seal > the ends of so they won't fray. The cord is real metal mixed with > threads. I could use FrayChek I suppose but I am wondering if there might > be a better way. Would melting work? > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri May 30 21:32:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V1WPHP005557 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 21:32:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V1V5Uw000928 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Fri, 30 May 2003 19:31:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V1V3Cu029125; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:31:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from alpha.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V1V0Cu029099 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 19:31:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [205.133.149.178] (pm5-178.eos.net [205.133.149.178]) by alpha.eos.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA06124 for ; Fri, 30 May 2003 21:30:58 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 21:25:53 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200305301055.h4UAtjYB006739@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] Re: royal blue X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If the same gown appeared in a bunch of portraits by the same artist, in any century, I would assume that I was looking at one gown owned by the artist, who painted a model in it and did different heads from life. And especially if it were a distinctive color -- maybe the artist had the gown made in an unusual color so his (or sometimes her) clients would have a portrait of herself in something really stunning. It's obvious to us that the gown is the same, but at the time how many people would really see more than one of the paintings? Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 02:24:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V6OFHP022248 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 02:24:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V6NJUw018721 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 00:23:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V6ND8v018665; Sat, 31 May 2003 00:23:13 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V6Lv8v018338 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 00:21:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA4430D4001E; Sat, 31 May 2003 01:23:00 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA0514DE0150; Sat, 31 May 2003 01:21:57 -0500 Message-ID: <010b01c3273d$34c01e00$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <038901c326f6$7fbae170$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 02:23:50 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Subject: [h-cost] Getting rid of Xupiter X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I save my messages when these we figure out how to get rid of viruses and spyware... we figured out how to get rid of xupiter a while back. Here is the message I wrote way back when: ************************************************************* Watch out for some websites at geocities... they putting Xupiter spyware on your computer and it is hell to get off your computer. I spent three hours last night trying to get this off my computer... I thought I finally got it off and here it is back again this morning. It is called Xupiter and it will change IE toolbars, add popups at anytime on your computer, (a browser doesn't need to be open for the pop up to appear out of the blue) and when you click on webpage links, it will send you to Xupiter's website. I clicked on links on my website that I knew were working and it popped up the error message and then sent me to Xupiter's site. I did some searching this morning and found out that you have to manually remove it from DOS. I'll leave that to the DOS gurus in my house to get rid of it now. So here is the link on how to get it off your computer: http://and.doxdesk.com/parasite/Xupiter.html I quit and will go to sleep until my gurus get home. All wasn't lost, I finally got that stupid Yahoo Companion off of my IE toolbar. Please feel free to post this message to other email lists. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom http://www.costumegallery.com http://www.costumeclassroom.com http://www.onlinecostumeball.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 03:21:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7LpHP010799 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 03:21:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7LJUw021448 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 01:21:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7LI82005391; Sat, 31 May 2003 01:21:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgdirector1.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7LG82005328 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 01:21:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pavilion (213-78-124-111.friaco.onetel.net.uk [213.78.124.111]) 3.2.2-GA) with SMTP id ADQ58998; Sat, 31 May 2003 08:21:04 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <027801c32745$ab5f92e0$3d6e4ed5@pavilion> From: "Melanie Wilson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000501c326de$5c6c6a30$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 08:24:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Association of researchers into Dyes in History & Archaeology ? Mel This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the Company, unless specifically stated. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 03:35:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7ZEHP015297 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 03:35:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7YgUw022177 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 01:34:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7Yf82009876; Sat, 31 May 2003 01:34:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7Yc82009858 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 01:34:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB4C478007E; Sat, 31 May 2003 02:35:40 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB0E1C01010A; Sat, 31 May 2003 02:34:38 -0500 Message-ID: <000601c32747$56661dc0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 03:36:22 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ad-aware hasn't updated their software in a long time. So it is missing a lot of spyware that has been recently developed. The best software on the market is Spybot. Just do a search in google and you will find. It is freeware. When you install it make sure to click on options, and set it to update frequently. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 03:51:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7pqHP022597 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 03:51:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7n4Uw022795 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 01:49:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7n382014301; Sat, 31 May 2003 01:49:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail2.plugit.com (wsip-66-210-79-2.pn.at.cox.net [66.210.79.2] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V7n082014288 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 01:49:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by mail2.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AEAA493007E; Sat, 31 May 2003 02:50:02 -0500 Received: from penny [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AE6C1C21010A; Sat, 31 May 2003 02:49:00 -0500 Message-ID: <001701c32749$577fe040$0400a8c0@comcast.net> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net> <5.1.0.14.0.20030530094601.02e07fc8@127.0.0.1> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 03:50:44 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO GOOD NEWS!!! Susan finally got all of the virus files off of my computer. She has been heavily researching this virus. We also set my computer to not open I-frames... which is what activates this virus. The name of it is js.fortnight and it is a Trojan worm, not really a virus. It is really hard to get off your computer because it puts it into so many locations. Penny Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 04:35:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V8ZfHP011021 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 04:35:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V8Z7Uw024686 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 02:35:07 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V8Z2Vi028519; Sat, 31 May 2003 02:35:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4V8YwVi028504 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 02:34:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-38-102.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.38.102])h4V8Yehj001645 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 03:34:41 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20030531013205.00dff3c0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 01:33:30 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530124329.00ac5408@pop.sonic.net> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030530112713.00b00798@pop.sonic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>Do you know of a Renaissance dance organization, or other organizations >>with special interest in material culture of the 16th c. period (which, I >>hear tell, is now being called "early modern" in some circles, to the >>great dismay of people in some other circles...)? The SCA, while probably not what you're looking for, has some Ren. dance enthusiasts/scholars within it. I don't know how to get in touch with those in your area, but it's a place to start. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 07:53:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VBraHP025356 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 07:53:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VBr3Uw003944 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 05:53:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VBr1Y2026380; Sat, 31 May 2003 05:53:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav21.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.125]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VBqwY2026324 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 05:52:58 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 31 May 2003 04:52:53 -0700 Received: from 172.174.27.182 by bay1-dav21.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Sat, 31 May 2003 11:52:53 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [172.174.27.182] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e701c32697$5a5a7260$0400a8c0@comcast.net><038901c326f6$7fbae170$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> <010b01c3273d$34c01e00$0400a8c0@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Getting rid of Xupiter Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 07:52:50 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 May 2003 11:52:53.0293 (UTC) FILETIME=[2B004DD0:01C3276B] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Also my two cents FWIW...there is two programs out there one is by Lava Soft called "Ad Aware" and is free and removes spyware from your computer including deep cleaning the registry. It can also remove Xupiter. The second program is called Find Junk Files and is also free. This program cleans your system in a few different ways with a few progrmas. It does really well. First time I ran it I took over 512MB of crap files off my computer. Both programs are free and can be found at ZDnet. Bice not affiliated with just a huge fan of both programs. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2003 2:23 AM Subject: [h-cost] Getting rid of Xupiter > I save my messages when these we figure out how to get rid of viruses and > spyware... we figured out how to get rid of xupiter a while back. Here is > the message I wrote way back when: > ************************************************************* > Watch out for some websites at geocities... they putting Xupiter spyware on > your > computer and it is hell to get off your computer. I spent three hours last > night trying to get this off my computer... I thought I finally got it off > and here it is back again this morning. > > It is called Xupiter and it will change IE toolbars, add popups at anytime > on your computer, (a browser doesn't need to be open for the pop up to > appear out of the blue) and when you click on webpage links, it will send > you to Xupiter's website. I clicked on links on my website that I knew were > working and it popped up the error message and then sent me to Xupiter's > site. > > I did some searching this morning and found out that you have to manually > remove it from DOS. I'll leave that to the DOS gurus in my house to get rid > of it now. So here is the link on how to get it off your computer: > http://and.doxdesk.com/parasite/Xupiter.html > > I quit and will go to sleep until my gurus get home. All wasn't lost, I > finally got that stupid Yahoo Companion off of my IE toolbar. > > Please feel free to post this message to other email lists. > > Penny Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > http://www.costumegallery.com > http://www.costumeclassroom.com > http://www.onlinecostumeball.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 09:24:49 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VDOmHP026650 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 09:24:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VDNZUw008494 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 07:23:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VDNXrh025235; Sat, 31 May 2003 07:23:33 -0600 (MDT) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@jost.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VDNTrh025212 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 07:23:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA21235 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 08:45:13 -0500 Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 08:45:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Organizations with interest in medieval dress/textiles? In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20030531013205.00dff3c0@mail.frys.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sat, 31 May 2003, Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > >>Do you know of a Renaissance dance organization, or other organizations > >>with special interest in material culture of the 16th c. period (which, I > >>hear tell, is now being called "early modern" in some circles, to the > >>great dismay of people in some other circles...)? > > The SCA, while probably not what you're looking for, has some Ren. dance > enthusiasts/scholars within it. I don't know how to get in touch with > those in your area, but it's a place to start. Sorry, my original question seems to have been lost over the course of the thread. I'm not looking for dancers, nor a dance group in any particular area. I'm wondering if there's a professional or academic association that links researchers and/or performance groups of historical dance. (Or performers of early music or theater, for instance.) I've noted the Medieval and Renaissance Drama Society, for instance (an academic society for researchers). Ditto other fields that involve an interest in medieval material culture. One such academic organization is AVISTA, but I want to overlook specific associations or societies for people who work in historic textiles, dyes, jewelry, and similar areas. Thanks all, Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 09:34:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VDY5HP026948 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 09:34:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VDVUUw008969 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 07:31:31 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VDVTrh028113; Sat, 31 May 2003 07:31:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from web41502.mail.yahoo.com (web41502.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.85]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4VDVRrh028079 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 07:31:27 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <20030531133122.14444.qmail@web41502.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [193.237.15.43] by web41502.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 31 May 2003 14:31:22 BST Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 14:31:22 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?N=20Kipar?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000601c32747$56661dc0$0400a8c0@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > Ad-aware hasn't updated their software in a long time. That is not true. I downloaded the new version the other day and got signature file updates for it every time I checked. The last one a couple of days ago. So it is missing a > lot of spyware that has been recently developed. Nope. The best software on the > market is Spybot. Just do a search in google and you will find. It is > freeware. When you install it make sure to click on options, and set it to > update frequently. It is good, and I have and use both, it seems that adaware finds those that spybot does not find and vice versa. Nicole ===== Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien Email: nicole@kipar.org URL: http://www.kipar.org __________________________________________________ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 10:37:20 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VEbJHP028698 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 10:37:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VEaoUw012697 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 08:36:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VEanBx020537; Sat, 31 May 2003 08:36:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from webwarren.com (65.18.210.ptr [65.18.210.91] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VEakBx020493 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 08:36:46 -0600 (MDT) Received: from jessica.webwarren.com (bgp381063bgs.plnfld01.nj.comcast.net [68.36.17.255]) (authenticated (0 bits)) by webwarren.com (8.12.8/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h4VEOt7Q015258 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 10:24:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: webwarren.com: webbwarren owned process doing -bs Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030531103408.04910578@mail.earthlink.net> X-Sender: arachne@pop.webwarren.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 10:36:24 -0400 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Brenda Subject: MS Outhouse (WAS: Re: [h-cost] Possible problem) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO "Bruce & Nora Mai" wrote: >Actually, no, it doesn't. Only if you have your preferences are set for >auto-preview will it "automatically" open anything. Check under 'View'. >Default settings in both Outlook and Outlook Express show Attachments as >icons. Don't open the attachment and you're pretty safe. Note: you need to do this separately for every Inbox folder you have. Brenda, whose employer has standardized on Outhouse and who's had to do this for all her co-workers' systems. webwarren@earthlink.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 11:21:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VFLGHP030221 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 11:21:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VFKdUw015467 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 09:20:39 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VFKbY9005862; Sat, 31 May 2003 09:20:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4VFKZY9005834 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 09:20:35 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/OnvoP2ZTdM2uBJbNeLJpkJM=">; Sat, 31 May 2003 08:20:11 PDT Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HZH3W7A2; Sat, 31 May 2003 08:20:11 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 07:50:01 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] sealing cord ends Message-ID: <20030531.081932.1928.9.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-5,7-26 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's being used as a pouch cord. I'm trying Fray-Check for now, but there's enough of it to do another experiment if that doesn't work. :) I have no idea what that threads are. Arlys On Fri, 30 May 2003 19:17:49 -0600 Sue Clemenger writes: > Melting would depend on what the threads were made of--poly and nylon > melt beautifully, for instance. > How thick is your cord? And what are you using it for? > --sue > > Cynthia J Ley wrote: > > > > Hi everyone. Got a question. I have a beautiful cord that I need > to seal > > the ends of so they won't fray. The cord is real metal mixed with > > threads. I could use FrayChek I suppose but I am wondering if > there might > > be a better way. Would melting work? > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 15:14:15 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJEEHP003588 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 15:14:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJCxUw000297 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 13:13:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJCvMd027648; Sat, 31 May 2003 13:12:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJCtMd027625 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 13:12:55 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f45.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.69]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 94684262925 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 21:12:53 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003401c327a8$f7906410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 21:15:15 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Subject: [h-cost] ot history at your dorstep X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello. Just wanted to tell you an o.t. story. Guess what, we have had a new young man in the house. He mooved into the flat under us. His name is Gyldenløve. Golden Lion. It was a name the kings back in time gave their bastards. I thoaght they were instinked, but no............. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 15:23:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJNLHP003737 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 15:23:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJMnUw001029 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 13:22:50 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJK8Md000386; Sat, 31 May 2003 13:20:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJK6Md000353 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 13:20:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f45.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.69]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 27EA2262885 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 21:20:05 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003a01c327a9$f9a4a8a0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <003401c327a8$f7906410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ot history at your dorstep Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 21:22:28 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO That should have ben exstinkt. Sorry :-( Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2003 9:15 PM Subject: [h-cost] ot history at your dorstep > Hello. > Just wanted to tell you an o.t. story. > Guess what, we have had a new young man in the house. > He mooved into the flat under us. His name is Gyldenløve. Golden Lion. It > was a name the kings back in time gave their bastards. > I thoaght they were instinked, but no............. > > Bjarne > > > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 16:00:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VK0BHP004723 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 16:00:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJxcUw003521 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 13:59:38 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJuuDi013689; Sat, 31 May 2003 13:56:56 -0600 (MDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VJuqDi013631 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 13:56:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cpe-24-221-49-58.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.49.58] helo=mycomputer) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19MCTD-0003mQ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 31 May 2003 12:56:52 -0700 From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] ot history at your dorstep Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 12:56:51 -0700 Message-ID: <000001c327ae$c77c49f0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <003401c327a8$f7906410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What a cool story Bjarne. Is it his first or last name? I understand that Fitzroy was a common name for English kings to name their bastard sons. (Don't remember where I heard that). I think the word you are looking for is extinct? Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 16:18:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VKIgHP005234 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 16:18:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VKIAUw004764 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 14:18:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VKFTDi020575; Sat, 31 May 2003 14:15:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtp802.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp802.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.181]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with SMTP id h4VKFPDi020554 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 14:15:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from adsl-67-122-68-253.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net (HELO angelap3a8d978) (angelalazear@sbcglobal.net@67.122.68.253 with login) by smtp-sbc-v1.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 May 2003 20:15:25 -0000 Message-ID: <007301c327b1$98624ea0$fd447a43@angelap3a8d978> From: "Angela F. Lazear" To: Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 13:17:01 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 cc: BenLoeb@aol.com Subject: [h-cost] Paid costuming job in Virginia-URGENT response needed X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear list Here is an URGENT listing sent me by an opera/musical theater company in Charlottesville, VA. I am unable to go to Virginia, but the job sounds like fun. Please respond to Ben Loeb, off list if you are interested. angela +++++ Angela F. Lazear Cabbage Rose Costumes http://www.cabbagerosecostumes.com Theatrical Costume Design "What fates impose, that men must needs abide; It boots not to resist both wind and tide." King Henry VI, Part III, IV, iii - W. Shakespeare +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Position: Costume Designer and Shop manager Dates of residence: June 21 through July 26 Singers arrive June 27 South Pacific techs on July 7 and opens on July 12 Magic Flute techs on July 21 and opens on July 26 Two shows: South Pacific and Magic Flute Full cast with chorus Each show goes up in sequence and then runs in repertory Housing provided Paid position ($3000) June 15-July 26 (after opening night) Costume shop on site. Many costumes already available from past productions Also possible to borrow from Univ. of VA Must be willing to stitch and drape Must be able to run and organize the shop Design the costumes Work with the entire production team Should be able to help in the hiring of Assistants Manage shop with two staff interns who can also stitch, drape and dress. 2 Positions: Assistant costume interns/dressers Dates of residence: June 15 - August 22 (appr.) Paid position ($1500) Housing provided Must be able to stitch and dress During season, serve as dressers At the end of the season, interns will organize shop, clean and return costumes to rental companies. For more information or to apply please contact: Benjamin Loeb, Production Coordinator Ashlawn Opera mailto:ben@benloeb.com p/f (212) 281-7588 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 17:48:57 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VLmuHP007456 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 17:48:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VLmPUw011293 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 15:48:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VLmNT4026958; Sat, 31 May 2003 15:48:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h4VLmLT4026942 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 15:48:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7beeb.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.235]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 8CBC647FF93 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 23:48:19 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000701c327be$b15e1b70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000001c327ae$c77c49f0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ot history at your dorstep Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 23:50:46 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Saragrace, It is his last name, sirname. Che how quiet it is to night. Has everybody gone to the countryside ? I was just looking closer on my pattern i got from Livrustkammaren last year of the wedding suit pattern of Gustavus III. I noticed that there is a tape sewed into the waistcoat, to hold up the breeches. It is tied to a button on the breeches. Never saw that before. I really would like to make this, it fits me very well. The king was 165 cm. high, and i am 168 cm. But i have noticed that the coat goes under my knees, about 3 cm. It is from 1766 and it is a little more oldfashioned than my 1775 suit. It has full very large pleats at the tails and the cuffs are much larger. I cant use my "London silk" because there is not enough. I baught it for a suit similar to the one i already made. Hmmmmmmmmmm. i think i have to order some silk from James Hare again. I was thinking of making it in a very light shade of green called Water Lily, or perhaps a petal pink. Always difficult to deside for a colour. I want to embroider it! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2003 9:56 PM Subject: RE: [h-cost] ot history at your dorstep > What a cool story Bjarne. Is it his first or last name? I understand > that Fitzroy was a common name for English kings to name their bastard > sons. (Don't remember where I heard that). I think the word you are > looking for is extinct? > > Sg > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 21:02:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5112pHP016621 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 21:02:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5112EUw023378 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 19:02:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5112A2I005151; Sat, 31 May 2003 19:02:10 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h511282I005107 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 19:02:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m231.in-tch.com [216.166.191.231]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h510haH29150 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 18:43:37 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED950EA.F5646D54@in-tch.com> Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 19:03:38 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] ot history at your dorstep References: <000001c327ae$c77c49f0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> <000701c327be$b15e1b70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, you want to embroider *everything!* Admit it! --sue Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > Hmmmmmmmmmm. i think i have to order some silk from James Hare again. I was > thinking of making it in a very light shade of green called Water Lily, or > perhaps a petal pink. > Always difficult to deside for a colour. > I want to embroider it! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 21:04:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5114wHP016740 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 21:04:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5114TUw023557 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 19:04:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5114T2I005915; Sat, 31 May 2003 19:04:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5114R2I005880 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 19:04:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m231.in-tch.com [216.166.191.231]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h510jtH29698 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 18:45:56 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3ED95175.966DEF24@in-tch.com> Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 19:05:57 -0600 From: Sue Clemenger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Montage;Touch America} (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] ot history at your dorstep References: <000001c327ae$c77c49f0$6401a8c0@mycomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO "Fitz" is Norman French? for "son" (or something like that). It's where you get names like Fitzpatrick and Fitzgerald and such. I always took it to refer to those bastard children that were, in some way, acknowledged. --sue Saragrace Knauf wrote: > > What a cool story Bjarne. Is it his first or last name? I understand > that Fitzroy was a common name for English kings to name their bastard > sons. (Don't remember where I heard that). I think the word you are > looking for is extinct? > > Sg > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat May 31 23:10:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h513A0HP019738 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 23:10:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h51372Uw000810 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL); Sat, 31 May 2003 21:07:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost.indra.com [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h51371wq019705; Sat, 31 May 2003 21:07:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from mailrelay.mebtel.net (spambuster4.mebtel.net [64.40.67.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h5136wwq019693 for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 21:06:59 -0600 (MDT) Received: from grics.net (66-79-58-71.dsl.dixnil.grics.net [66.79.58.71]) by mailrelay.mebtel.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BBCA2802A for ; Sat, 31 May 2003 22:59:53 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3ED97C77.5070400@grics.net> Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 23:09:27 -0500 From: "H. Law" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.3) Gecko/20030312 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume References: <20030531133122.14444.qmail@web41502.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20030531133122.14444.qmail@web41502.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [h-cost] TESTING and Possible problem X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO First... Am I getting thru to this list at all? (Everyone who doesn't receive this please raise your hand :-P Second (presuming I am getting thru at all) How many folks who have gotten these "Possible Problems" are running McAfee and/or Netscape? Edwinna the Already Easily Confused N Kipar wrote: > --- Penny Ladnier wrote: > Ad-aware hasn't updated >their software in a long time. > >That is not true. I downloaded the new version the other day and got signature >file updates for it every time I checked. The last one a couple of days ago. > > So it is missing a > > >>lot of spyware that has been recently developed. >> >> > >Nope. > > The best software on the > > >>market is Spybot. Just do a search in google and you will find. It is >>freeware. When you install it make sure to click on options, and set it to >>update frequently. >> >> > >It is good, and I have and use both, it seems that adaware finds those that >spybot does not find and vice versa. > >Nicole > >===== >Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. ~ J.R.R. Tolkien > >Email: nicole@kipar.org >URL: http://www.kipar.org > >__________________________________________________ >Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience >http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume