From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 09:42:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i11EgLSd004901 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 09:42:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11EeMcP026461; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 07:40:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11EeHXD048122; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 07:40:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d07.mx.aol.com (imo-d07.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11EeDXD048069 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 07:40:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id RELAYIN3-4401d0e8629b; Sun, 01 Feb 2004 09:34:46 -0500 Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.117.2e64a0da (3890) for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 09:29:31 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <117.2e64a0da.2d4e674b@aol.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 09:29:31 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: self sufficiency To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 1/31/2004 7:39:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, gailscott@eos.net writes: the idea of self-sufficiency is pretty powerful in the USA, and quite romanticized Laurel Thatcher Ulrich writes about the "myth of homespun" in her "Age of Homespun." Yes, it is pretty pervasive, and of long standing. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 13:35:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i11IZ5Sd005659 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:35:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11IYJcP009342; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 11:34:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11IYCXD053102; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 11:34:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from blondie.gower.net (blondie.gower.net [205.230.30.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11IY7XE053052 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 11:34:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vbetts@gower.net) Received: from gower.net (user-37.annex-04.tyler.tx.gower.net [208.218.191.180]) by blondie.gower.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i11IXwu61816 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 12:33:59 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from vbetts@gower.net) Message-ID: <401D467F.1914D60@gower.net> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 12:33:35 -0600 From: Vicki Betts X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: self sufficiency References: <117.2e64a0da.2d4e674b@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO AnnBWass@aol.com wrote: > Laurel Thatcher Ulrich writes about the "myth of homespun" in her "Age of > Homespun." Yes, it is pretty pervasive, and of long standing. > > Ann Wass Homespun as political symbol has an interesting history, from Revolutionary War to War of 1812 to Nullification Crisis to Civil War South. It gets picked back up as a counter-culture symbol in the 1960s, and there are probably other uses that I'm not familiar with. I've researched homespun as a political symbol for the South in late 1860 through 1861, and then as a matter of practicality and necessity for some from the winter of 1862/1863 through the end of the war. At that point it was not a matter of fad or even choice for many who were unable to purchase factory-woven fabrics from Southern mills or those that had come through the coastal or land blockades. Still, most grown-ups of poor to moderate means managed to keep their prewar "good silk dress" even if it had begun to fade or had to be patched, even if they resorted to purchased/bartered/made themselves homespun for the hard working day to day wear. If anyone is interested in how common homewoven fabrics were just before the war in the South, take a look at the introduction to the manufacturing census of 1860 and the category of "home manufactures" in the agriculture census. Also flip through the Tennessee veterans questionnaire for answers to the question "what were the duties of your mother." One of my favorite quotes comes from Frederick Law Olmsted in his _The Cotton Kingdom_ (1861)--"How is it that while in Ohio the spinning-wheel and hand-loom are curiosities, and homespun would be a conspicuous and noticeable material of clothing, half the white population of Mississippi still dress in homespun, and at every second house the wheel and loom are found in operation." If anyone is interested in Civil War era newspaper articles about textile production in the South, I have a file at: http://www.uttyl.edu/vbetts/homespun_intro.htm My bibliography is also there. Please note that I'm NOT claiming that every household was self-sufficient, nor that the South was self-sufficient. This is just a side angle off of the homespun topic. Vicki Betts vbetts@gower.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 15:22:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i11KMZSd006115 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 15:22:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11KJ6cP014404; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:19:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11KIwMl002066; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:18:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.gssf.org (root@smtp.gssf.org [209.102.124.32]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11KImMl001979 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:18:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from roscelin@pcez.com) Received: from pcez.com (pdx-ppp453.pop1.net [209.102.126.53]) by smtp.gssf.org (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id MAA14917 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 12:20:54 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: smtp.gssf.org: Host pdx-ppp453.pop1.net [209.102.126.53] claimed to be pcez.com Message-ID: <401D5F22.1000907@pcez.com> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 12:18:42 -0800 From: Roscelin User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: H-Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Seeking glas X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings to one and all, I hope someone can help me out. I have bought some brass findings that can hold glass cabachons or cameos or even natural stone cabs. I know where I can get cameos and the natural stone cabs, but I can't find the glass, flatback cabs. I have hunted on Ebay and even on the net. Does anyone know of a good source for these glass cabs? Roscelin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 15:45:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i11KjASd006213 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 15:45:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11Kg0cP015642; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:42:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11KfsMl011755; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:41:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m01.mx.aol.com (imo-m01.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11KfqMl011699 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:41:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m01.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.89.25761c0 (4584) for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 15:41:39 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <89.25761c0.2d4ebe83@aol.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 15:41:39 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Cyrano X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In case anyone is interested, The "Cyrano de Bergerac" with Gerard Depardieu...that won the Oscar for best costume [they are yummy] is due to be released on DVD in February. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 15:58:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i11KwTSd006242 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 15:58:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11KtGcP016308; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:55:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11KtBMl018111; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:55:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11Kt8Ml018075 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 13:55:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA17561 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:24:13 -0600 Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:24:13 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking glas In-Reply-To: <401D5F22.1000907@pcez.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Roscelin wrote: > I hope someone can help me out. I have bought some brass findings > that can hold glass cabachons or cameos or even natural stone cabs. > I know where I can get cameos and the natural stone cabs, but I can't > find the glass, flatback cabs. I have hunted on Ebay and even on the > net. Does anyone know of a good source for these glass cabs? I used to get these in sizable packages in craft stores such as Michael's or MJ Designs, maybe even Jo-Anns. They're sold as "glue-on jewels" or something like that, and they typically hang on the wall with other jewelry findings. I probably have a bunch of packages somewhere in my stash; I remember having to buy several packages just so I could pick out the red ones to use in a particular costume. If you need a color other than red, and not huge quantities, email me and I'll dig them up. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 18:04:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i11N4MSd006549 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:04:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11N2CcP022552; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:02:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11N2BMl073022; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:02:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11N29Ml073010 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:02:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a26.in-tch.com [66.62.107.6]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i11Mdsc12818 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 15:39:54 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <401D8626.7080806@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 16:05:10 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cyrano References: <89.25761c0.2d4ebe83@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <89.25761c0.2d4ebe83@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Score! I loved that one...it and "Restoration" are my two favorite 17th c. costume flicks. --sue AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > In case anyone is interested, The "Cyrano de Bergerac" with Gerard > Depardieu...that won the Oscar for best costume [they are yummy] is due to be released > on DVD in February. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 18:04:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i11N4MSd006552 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:04:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11N14cP022412; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:01:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11N0vMl072492; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:00:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11N0sMl072454 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:00:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a26.in-tch.com [66.62.107.6]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i11McZc12257 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 15:38:35 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <401D85D6.9050908@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 16:03:50 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking glas References: <401D5F22.1000907@pcez.com> In-Reply-To: <401D5F22.1000907@pcez.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO FireMountain, maybe? I know they at least have the natural stone cabs, but I also seem to recall some composite and others as well.... --sue Roscelin wrote: > Greetings to one and all, > I hope someone can help me out. I have bought some brass findings > that can hold glass cabachons or cameos or even natural stone cabs. I > know where I can get cameos and the natural stone cabs, but I can't find > the glass, flatback cabs. I have hunted on Ebay and even on the net. > Does anyone know of a good source for these glass cabs? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 18:16:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i11NGVSd006590 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:16:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11NFncP023592; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:15:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11NFjMl078995; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:15:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out002.verizon.net (out002pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.141]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11NFhMl078974 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:15:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from marytaran@verizon.net) Received: from mobox.verizon.net ([4.41.71.41]) by out002.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040201230550.NFQT23576.out002.verizon.net@mobox.verizon.net> for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 17:05:50 -0600 Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.0.20040201145552.03140a80@incoming.verizon.net> X-Sender: marytaran@incoming.verizon.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 14:57:52 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Mary Taran Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking glas In-Reply-To: References: <401D5F22.1000907@pcez.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out002.verizon.net from [4.41.71.41] at Sun, 1 Feb 2004 17:05:50 -0600 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 02:24 PM 2/1/04, you wrote: >On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Roscelin wrote: > > > I hope someone can help me out. I have bought some brass findings > > that can hold glass cabachons or cameos or even natural stone cabs. > > I know where I can get cameos and the natural stone cabs, but I can't > > find the glass, flatback cabs. I have hunted on Ebay and even on the > > net. Does anyone know of a good source for these glass cabs? > >I used to get these in sizable packages in craft stores such as Michael's >or MJ Designs, maybe even Jo-Anns. They're sold as "glue-on jewels" or >something like that, and they typically hang on the wall with other >jewelry findings. I probably have a bunch of packages somewhere in my >stash; I remember having to buy several packages just so I could pick out >the red ones to use in a particular costume. If you need a color other >than red, and not huge quantities, email me and I'll dig them up. > >--Robin www.firemountain.com has cabs in both glass and real stones. You don't have to buy them in assorted colors. Mary _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 19:03:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1203LSd006693 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 19:03:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1202ncP026114; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 17:02:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1202kMl099550; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 17:02:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i11NwmMm097451 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 16:58:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i11NtMPp002702 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:55:22 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sun, 01 Feb 2004 18:55:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <401D92B5.4030001@thibault.org> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 18:58:45 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking glas References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin Netherton wrote: > I used to get these in sizable packages in craft stores such as Michael's > or MJ Designs, maybe even Jo-Anns. They're sold as "glue-on jewels" Alas, these days they're some sort of plastic, usually. There's an odd place in Providence RI where you can get glass cabs and very nice cab sets with multiple prongs (not just the 3/4/5 sort) but they aren't on the web in any useful way. -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - B. Franklin, 1759 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 19:28:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i120SNSd006744 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 19:28:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i120RgcP027224; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 17:27:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i120RdMl010285; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 17:27:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i120RcMl010201 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 17:27:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.de.4392a848 (4116) for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 19:27:27 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 19:27:26 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: self sufficiency To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/1/2004 1:34:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, vbetts@gower.net writes: Frederick Law Olmsted I'm not familiar with this work, but I have read some of his others. He was hardly an unbiased observer--definitely had his point of view, and seems to have looked for evidence to support it. Then again, that could be an accurate observation of Mississippi. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 21:00:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1220fSd006996 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:00:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i121xXcP002338; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:59:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i121xSMl049484; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:59:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from blondie.gower.net (blondie.gower.net [205.230.30.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i121xLMm049406 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:59:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vbetts@gower.net) Received: from gower.net (user-37.annex-04.tyler.tx.gower.net [208.218.191.180]) by blondie.gower.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i121xBu67699 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 19:59:12 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from vbetts@gower.net) Message-ID: <401DAED5.7C86B5DB@gower.net> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 19:58:45 -0600 From: Vicki Betts X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: self sufficiency References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO AnnBWass@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 2/1/2004 1:34:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, > vbetts@gower.net writes: > Frederick Law Olmsted > I'm not familiar with this work, but I have read some of his others. He was > hardly an unbiased observer--definitely had his point of view, and seems to > have looked for evidence to support it. Then again, that could be an accurate > observation of Mississippi. Yes, Olmsted certainly had an agenda. I sometimes wish I could have been in his pocket as he traveled across the South in the 1850s, just to see if I saw the same things he did. Well, here's another quote--different person, different state: "I found the East Tennesseans a plain, honest, industrious, old-fashioned people. . . . They are dressed, almost without exception, in coarse, strong "domestic," as the home-manufactured cloth of the country is called. It is woven on hand-looms, which are to be found in nearly every farm-house. Domestic is, in fact, an institution, not of Tennessee alone, but of the entire Southern country. In the absence of manufacturing establishments, the interest in this primitive private industry has not been suffered to decline. It stood the South in good stead during the war. All classes wore it. Even at the time of my visit, I found many proprietors of large estates, the aristocrats of the country, wearing garments which had been spun, colored, and woven by their own slaves. --Trowbridge, J. T. A Picture of the Desolated States; and the Work of Restoration, 1865-1868. Hartford, CT: L. Stebbins, 1868, p. 243. When it came to the Agriculture Census of 1860, I took the figure for home manufactures, which, according to Tryon's _Household Manufactures in the United States, 1640-1860_ is mostly textiles, and figured the per capita production for every Southern county in 1860, and compared each with the national average. I marked maps for only those counties that produced at least four times the national average, and large sections of the mountains and wiregrass were colored in (some counties went over 10x). Looking at the Tennessee Veterans Questionnaires, out of the first 200 former Confederates who responded (who would have been born mostly 1838-1845 and so remembering the late 1850s and early 1860s), 69% remembered their mothers weaving. Some specifically talk about clothing; some don't say. The former federal soldiers, mostly from East Tennessee, had slightly higher figures. That's been the challenge in this particular project--how do we quantify home textile production. Newspaper articles are easy to discount as so much rah-rah. Reminiscences may be over-glorified. Letters and diaries are great, but are slanted to the literate with time and paper on their hands. So the problem remains--how much homespun for clothing was produced? how much was storebought? My opinion is that there was a mix in large sections of the antebellum South, particularly the mountains and wiregrass, with Sunday best being storebought. The war caused a temporary upsurge in homespun production with those who knew how (rural, often older) teaching those who didn't (younger). Urban folk, a relatively low percentage of Southerners, especially after the quick fall of Nashville, Memphis, New Orleans, Alexandria, and Norfolk, seemed to perhaps have more clothing and recycled it more, plus very expensive blockade goods seemed to gravitate to the urban areas. I'm sure the Renaisannace, Restoration, and Regency folks have their eyes glazed over by now ;-), so I'll quit. It's just that after being told that homespun was basically dead in America after 1840, I kept running into it and it caught my interest. Vicki Betts vbetts@gower.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 21:35:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i122ZkSd007129 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:35:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i122XgcP003773; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 19:33:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i122XZMl063860; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 19:33:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav40.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.97]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i122XXMl063788 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 19:33:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:16:12 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav40.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 02:16:12 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <89.25761c0.2d4ebe83@aol.com> <401D8626.7080806@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cyrano Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:16:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2004 02:16:12.0908 (UTC) FILETIME=[8798CAC0:01C3E932] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Just keep in mind that Cyrano was written at the very end of the 19th century. Yes, it takes place in the 17th C, but it's firmly in the Romantic period and style, not at all written like a 17th C play. Though costume-wise, that really doesn't matter at all :-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 6:05 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cyrano > Score! I loved that one...it and "Restoration" are my two favorite 17th > c. costume flicks. > --sue > > AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > > In case anyone is interested, The "Cyrano de Bergerac" with Gerard > > Depardieu...that won the Oscar for best costume [they are yummy] is due to be released > > on DVD in February. > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 22:13:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i123DCSd007269 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:13:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i123BpcP005324; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 20:11:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i123BlMl080409; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 20:11:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i123BeMl080366 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 20:11:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA19687 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:40:46 -0600 Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:40:46 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 15th/16th cent. Transition Gown In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Pursuant to a discussion about sleeve styles, Janet wrote: > I don't know whether anyone answered this because I was without e-mail > for the past 2 weeks, but just a couple days ago, I came across a > donor portrait in a book I have. Fortunately, the Met has it on line: > http://www.metmuseum.org/collections/view1.asp?dep=11&item=49%2E7%2E20a%96c > > I'd seen this style on saints and in tapestries, but this is the first > time in a portrait. It's worth noting that the woman in this case is being presented as St. Catherine. I say "being presented as" because she didn't start out that way. The painting has a bizarre history. (It's so interesting that I use it as an example of odd cases in my lecture on using religious figures as costume sources.) On the left panel, the standing figure is Saint Jerome, whom we know by his lion and his cardinal's vestments. The standing figure on the right is ... hmm, the website says Saint Leonard, which makes no sense as far as I can tell, but my Met catalog has him as Saint Vincent, who is typically represented as a deacon holding a book. OK, leave that one up for grabs, but a saint either way. Now look at the kneeling figures -- the ones that look like donors. If you look closely, you see that near the man's knees there's a pig, and the lady has a crown, a wheel, and a sword -- identifying them as Saint Anthony and Saint Catherine. But they *do* look like donors, and the Met site even labels them that way. Here's the rest of the story, from my Met catalog: The figures were originally painted as donors, and the saints' attributes were added after the painting was finished -- and not long after, maybe only a few years later. There are a lot of possibilities for how this might have happened. Maybe it was done at the request of the donors themselves, or their heirs. Maybe the original donors didn't pay, or the painting was sold, and the new owner had the now-meaningless donor portraits redone as saints. Obviously, though, the transformation was not very successful, because they do *look* like donors, in part because they're kneeling, and in part because their clothing is not right for the saints they've been turned into. Anthony was a monk and a hermit, and is almost always shown in a monk's robe. This man's robe is dark, but it's quite lush, with fur trim and full, slit sleeves -- not at all a monk's robe. Catherine is a royal virgin martyr, and normally portrayed as a young princess (flowing hair, royal robes). This woman has a headdress suitable for a married Flemish woman. I also am inclined to think that her outfit, which is not at all Catherine-like, is original to the donor portrait, but it may have been gussied up in some way, perhaps by the addition of the sleeves. I'd have to spend a lot more time with David's work to get a sense of whether he might have reasonably included sleeves of that style in a donor portrait -- or whether they're more likely to have been added with the other attributes. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 1 23:41:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i124fRSd007525 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:41:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i124eacP008999; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:40:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i124eWMl017895; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:40:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i124eUMl017845 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:40:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.174.257365d4 (657) for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:40:21 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <174.257365d4.2d4f2eb5@aol.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:40:21 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cyrano To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/1/2004 9:34:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, audreybmorin2@hotmail.com writes: > Yes, it takes place in the 17th C, but it's firmly in the Romantic > period and style, not at all written like a 17th C play. > I think the film treats it almost like opera. Big and beautiful. Hundreds of well dressed extras in the rain....armor and horses and cannon...and fire. Streets full of people and animals....thunderstorms...and of course sword play. And the period is pushed a bit late so that 14 years later Roxanne can wear a mantua. I find all this to work quite well on film. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 00:35:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i125Z8Sd007615 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 00:35:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125YRcP011519; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:34:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125YNMl040022; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:34:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from email.accessus.net (email.accessus.net [209.145.128.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125YJMl039976 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:34:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from axejudge@accessus.net) X-RAV-Header: Scanned Received: from [207.206.136.115] (HELO accessus.net) by email.accessus.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1) with ESMTP id 210684783 for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Sun, 01 Feb 2004 23:04:08 -0600 Message-ID: <401DDA10.90602@accessus.net> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 23:03:12 -0600 From: Karen Heim User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020318 Netscape6/6.2.2 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@net.indra.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] fan handles X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Does anyone know of a source for purchasing fan handles? I am working on a dress for Costume Con, and I need a handle that approximates the 17th century so that I can make a feather fan. Karen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 00:37:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i125bgSd007623 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 00:37:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125ZocP011626; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:35:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125ZnMl040614; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:35:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125ZkMl040599 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:35:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-34-70.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.34.70]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10 550 close/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125ZbSn015082 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:35:44 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040201212349.05b7f7d0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 21:35:33 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] "Self Sufficiency" In-Reply-To: <401BC28B.9FCEA906@gower.net> References: <20040130144154.81524.qmail@web14005.mail.yahoo.com> <401B2F14.AE3ED275@gower.net> <401B881D.1060502@thibault.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Here in California one can still (January, 2004) find flour in printed cotton sacks, mostly in Mexican grocery stores. The sacks are not so coarse that the flour leaks out but not that fine either. The prints aren't very complicated or (IMHO) very pretty. >Argh! I mis-remembered. It *was* chicken feed sack clothing that she >was researching. I knew that printed cotton feed bags used for clothing >was common in the South from the Depression era on into the War (at >least), but I hadn't realized that it was also common that far North. >The grad student didn't mention when it ended, or at least I assume it >ended. All I see nowadays are 50 lb. paper bags. > >Vicki Betts >vbetts@gower.net > >Cynthia Virtue wrote: > > > During the war, my mother's family kept chickens, and chicken feed also > > came in patterned fabrics which were made into blouses, etc, for > > everyday use. My mother recalls her mother sending my grandfather back > > to the store to return a sack with a print she didn't like. > > > > This was suburban Maine, more or less. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 00:38:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i125cKSd007626 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 00:38:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125ZEcP011599; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:35:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125ZBMl040364; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:35:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125Z9Ml040335 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:35:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m139.in-tch.com [216.166.191.139]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i125Crc01362 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:12:53 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <401DE244.6020808@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 22:38:12 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: self sufficiency References: <401DAED5.7C86B5DB@gower.net> In-Reply-To: <401DAED5.7C86B5DB@gower.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This mostly-medieval & renaissance person has actually found it fascinating, but then the variety of topics is one of the things I like best about this list.... --sue, fiber geek for any century..... Vicki Betts wrote: > I'm sure the Renaisannace, Restoration, and Regency folks have their > eyes glazed over by now ;-), so I'll quit. It's just that after being > told that homespun was basically dead in America after 1840, I kept > running into it and it caught my interest. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 00:39:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i125dZSd007631 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 00:39:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125becP011722; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:37:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125beMl041461; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:37:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125bNMl041342 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 22:37:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-34-70.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.34.70]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10 550 close/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i125bHSl016739 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:37:19 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040201213610.04c0a6b0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 21:37:13 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] fan handles In-Reply-To: <401DDA10.90602@accessus.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Does anyone know of a source for purchasing fan handles? I am working on >a dress for Costume Con, and I need a handle that approximates the 17th >century so that I can make a feather fan. Glue wooden beads onto a dowel, and paint the result? CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 01:09:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1269SSd007653 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 01:09:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1266GcP012673; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:06:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1266EMl051447; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:06:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from BAY0-HMR07.adinternal.hotmail.com (bay0-hmr07.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.241.206]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12669Ml051373 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:06:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.244.198]) by BAY0-HMR07.adinternal.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:48:48 -0800 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:48:48 -0800 Received: from 24.58.108.69 by bay1-dav63.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 05:48:48 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.108.69] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20040201213610.04c0a6b0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fan handles Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 00:49:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2004 05:48:48.0696 (UTC) FILETIME=[3AA39380:01C3E950] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Paint brush handles. remove the bristles. Have you seen http://www.vertetsable.com/demos_fans.htm ? ============================= On Ebay http://snipurl.com/3csb http://my.lulu.com/kristalori Elizabethan Ladies Calendar Rolled Florentine Cap Pattern www.swapking.com/hats ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, February 02, 2004 12:37 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] fan handles > > >Does anyone know of a source for purchasing fan handles? I am working on > >a dress for Costume Con, and I need a handle that approximates the 17th > >century so that I can make a feather fan. > > Glue wooden beads onto a dowel, and paint the result? > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 01:11:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i126BLSd007656 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 01:11:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1268FcP012752; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:08:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1268EMl052226; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:08:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1268CMl052172 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:08:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Georgeren2@aol.com) Received: from Georgeren2@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1e5.1894c59c (4222) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 01:02:57 -0500 (EST) From: Georgeren2@aol.com Message-ID: <1e5.1894c59c.2d4f4211@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 01:02:57 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] fan handles To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5007 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello This is my first time responding to this group. My husband turns fan handles. Price is depending on the detailing and wood used. They start at $10.00. Regards, Patrice Betancur Jeronimo's Cross _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 03:04:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1284nSd001306 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 03:04:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1281acP016016; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 01:01:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1281RMl000705; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 01:01:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1281NMl000630 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 01:01:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3EC331E009A; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 02:01:48 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3E8761021A; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 02:01:44 -0600 Message-ID: <013301c3e962$b31ec1b0$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20040201213610.04c0a6b0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] fan handles Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 03:01:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bice, These fans are so beautiful!!!!!!!!! Thank you for sharing! Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, February 02, 2004 12:49 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] fan handles > Paint brush handles. remove the bristles. Have you seen > http://www.vertetsable.com/demos_fans.htm ? [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 05:00:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12A0iSd001960 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 05:00:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12A05cP019074; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 03:00:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i129xxMl052991; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 02:59:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from gw.retro.com (gw.retro.com [205.179.181.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i129xqMl052958 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 02:59:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lee@gw.retro.com) Received: (from lee@localhost) by gw.retro.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id i12A3EO19819 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 02:03:14 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 02:03:14 -0800 (PST) From: Lee Thompson-Herbert Message-Id: <200402021003.i12A3EO19819@gw.retro.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking glas Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Roscelin wrote: > > I hope someone can help me out. I have bought some brass findings > that can hold glass cabachons or cameos or even natural stone cabs. I > know where I can get cameos and the natural stone cabs, but I can't find > the glass, flatback cabs. I have hunted on Ebay and even on the net. > Does anyone know of a good source for these glass cabs? I was about to suggest General Bead, but their online catalogue doesn't show any in stock right now. The SF store usually has loads of them. I see Swarovski cabochons in crystal, emerald, sapphire, crystal AB, and siam in sizes 3mm, 4mm, 5mm, 6mm, and 8mm from Rio Grande. Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 05:10:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12AA1Sd001987 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 05:10:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12A9RcP019468; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 03:09:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12A9PMl057477; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 03:09:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from gw.retro.com (gw.retro.com [205.179.181.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12A9KMl057452 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 03:09:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lee@gw.retro.com) Received: (from lee@localhost) by gw.retro.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id i12ACiB19918 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 02:12:44 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 02:12:44 -0800 (PST) From: Lee Thompson-Herbert Message-Id: <200402021012.i12ACiB19918@gw.retro.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking glas Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Cynthia Virtue wrote: > Robin Netherton wrote: > > I used to get these in sizable packages in craft stores such as Michael's > > or MJ Designs, maybe even Jo-Anns. They're sold as "glue-on jewels" > > Alas, these days they're some sort of plastic, usually. There's an odd > place in Providence RI where you can get glass cabs and very nice cab > sets with multiple prongs (not just the 3/4/5 sort) but they aren't on > the web in any useful way. D'oh. I should've thought of this. Look in the floral department. There should be bags of of half-round pebbles. You can usually get them in different colors, including iris and aurora borealis finishes. They're not quite as uniform as the glass cabs I more normally buy, but if I need a whole lot of that particular size, you bet I go buy a big bag for $3. Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 08:17:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12DH4Sd002371 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:17:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12DG8cP026101; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 06:16:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12DFhMl032153; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 06:15:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12DFaMl032104 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 06:15:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hrjones@socrates.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i122hBmg000489 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:43:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from [136.152.197.100] (tnt-1-164.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.197.100]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i122gwk8000166 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:43:09 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 18:40:39 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 9:25 PM -0600 1/31/04, Robin Netherton wrote: >A friend who is stranded without reference books asks for some help. I >have bits and pieces of answers, but none that I feel confident enough >about, or can source well enough. I'm much better with art than with >terminology! If anyone can shed light on any of this, please post or >email. Thanks. >3. Do you know what the following are? > > -- vert "Green" -- the heraldic term for the color (taken from the French word). > -- silk palis Is it possible that "palis" is a variant or derivative of "paile" mentioned above? (My mind jumps to the possibility because Medieval Welsh borrowed "paile" as "pali".) Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 08:44:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12DiESd002496 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:44:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12DgMcP026903; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 06:42:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12DgJMl042673; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 06:42:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp2.primushost.com (smtp2.primushost.com [209.58.220.66]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12DgGMm042622 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 06:42:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vintage@primushost.com) Received: from shell3.shore.net [207.244.124.103] by smtp2.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 1Andro-00050z-NW; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 08:11:56 -0500 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for id 1AndY2-0007Kh-00; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 07:51:30 -0500 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 07:51:30 -0500 (EST) From: Katy Bishop To: Bjarne og Leif Drews Subject: Re: [h-cost] gentlemans embroidered waistcoat 1766 In-Reply-To: <000b01c3e0d5$66884b90$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: historic costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Your work is inspiring! I need to make the time to do an embroidered dress one of these days. I am currently repairing a dress from 1911, pale cream and blue chiffon embroidered with roses in about 6 shades of pink and green leaves. The dress is so pretty and ethereal, I don't want to send it back to its owner. Katy Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 10:05:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12F58Sd002840 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:05:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12F2scP001238; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:02:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12F2oMl082907; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:02:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web14003.mail.yahoo.com (web14003.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.175.94]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12F2kMl082891 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:02:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyforbeys@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [24.242.152.154] by web14003.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 15:02:45 GMT Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:02:45 +0000 (GMT) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Catalina=20Saravia=20Quicedo?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Some lists I am on recommend regular roll calls with your name, general location and area/time of interest. I am in the SCA in the Barony of the Steppes. Senora Catalina Saravia Quicedo lives was born in Spain in 1501. Her best friend is a widow from France who works with her in sewing. Her friend is trying to teach her some basic embroidery. She occasionally enjoys illuminations. And is usually found working side by side with her husband, the Baron's Exchequer. > > On Fri, 30 Jan 2004, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > > I would like to know who is on the list at > pressent time. > ===== Seńora Catalina Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit ___________________________________________________________ BT Yahoo! Broadband - Free modem offer, sign up online today and save Ł80 http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 10:05:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12F5BSd002843 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:05:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12F4RcP001365; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:04:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12F4PMl083800; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:04:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu [132.236.56.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12F4LMl083766 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:04:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from arkham.cornell.edu ([128.253.111.234]) by postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i12F4KKI006434 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:04:20 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202095458.01935928@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 10:04:23 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: M Stewart Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey Robin... Can you give me a date to work with? I'll have to check through my Dutch and Italian references for this one... but I think... you're on the right track... I'll have to get back to you on this >1. Porpre / purpre / pupre : these are variants for a term that is often >translated as purple, implying the color. But, if I remember correctly, >it's usually a term for a fabric instead of a color (much like scarlet). >Do you know what kind of fabric? I'm thinking it's a kind of silk, but I >know the term is probably a specific kind. Also, would you have a >reference (just one I can footnote--it can be a secondary source) for it? >3. Do you know what the following are? > > -- vert -- yeup... green... > -- silk palis - new term to me... I'll be interested to hear what > other folks have to say. The draps de grana... as you stated grana is the Italian, and Spanish too (I think) for grain dyed cloth. Grain, kermes and cochineal were all scarlets. Kermes gave the deepest scarlet and was the most expensive, grana (grain) was a common scarlet color not quite as pricey as kermes, and close in depth. Later on came the introduction of cochineal, from N. America. It was sometimes called "false Kermes" - it gave a deep red/scarlet color, and strangely enough was cheaper... I can't remember if that was because the bug was larger or if it just produced more chemical and therefore required fewer bugs/vat. However... if you are talking "scarlet cloth"... then you start talking a class of cloth and not purely a color. Can you clarify as to which your friend needs... > -- draps de grana (cloth of grana); could this be scarlet? [Robin adds: I >presume that's grain, or kermes, but I have no idea where I might have >picked that tidbit up.] Let me know a bit more and I'll see If I can dig out my resources on the medeival cloth industry/scarlet trade. Bridgette Mari Stewart Cornell University _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 10:22:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12FMESd002904 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:22:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FIscP002399; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:18:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FIpMl092141; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:18:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FIjMl092068 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:18:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i12FIfT01067.; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:18:41 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 15:18:41 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 15:18:12 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO OK - here goes. Kate Bunting in Derby, England. Long-time member of the Sealed Knot, currently portraying the widow of a Gentleman of the Chapel Royal supporting herself as a musician during the "English" Civil War. Also member of the Generalls Musick, a 1630s/40s band. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 10:36:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12Fa6Sd003281 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:36:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FZMcP003830; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:35:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FZIMl003246; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:35:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FZCMl003179 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:35:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA23989 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:04:20 -0600 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:04:20 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202095458.01935928@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, M Stewart wrote: > Hey Robin... Can you give me a date to work with? The text involved is a French romance, 12th century. There may be some overlap with other cultures in language use, but I wouldn't ask anyone to go doing deep research in other languages. I was hoping there might be a few people who could say off the top of their head, "Oh, yeah, I've heard of that... The text lists a long series of fabrics, in a scenario in which the tailors bring in piles of fabrics for the king to examine. I believe she said that "verts" is included in this list (as in X bolts of verts) as though it were a fabric type, but there's also a reference to "vert purpre," which makes you wonder which of the words is the color name and which is the fabric name. > > -- silk palis - new term to me... I'll be interested to hear what > > other folks have to say. That's turning out to be the hard one. > The draps de grana... as you stated grana is the Italian, and Spanish > too (I think) for grain dyed cloth. That one was more straightforward -- I think we have that nailed. > Let me know a bit more and I'll see If I can dig out my resources on the > medeival cloth industry/scarlet trade. No, please don't go to that trouble! Though I'll forward your note to her, and if she finds herself in need of further info, she can contact you directly. I truly appreciate the help. My friend is a professor revising a paper that has been accepted for publication. She was asked to provide a more detailed translation of this particular medieval French passage, which is hard to do when all you can say about some terms is "We know it's a fabric, but Lord knows what kind..." --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 10:48:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12FmgSd003345 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:48:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FlpcP004711; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:47:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FlmMl011736; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:47:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Fi7Ml009358 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:44:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA24054 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:13:14 -0600 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:13:14 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL In-Reply-To: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, [iso-8859-1] Catalina Saravia Quicedo wrote: > Some lists I am on recommend regular roll calls with your name, > general location and area/time of interest. On the other hand, we have over 500 addresses on this list... that would make a pretty long roll call, if everyone answered! Though I suspect most would not. Only a small proportion of those readers are active posters. Some are occasional posters or once-in-a-blue-moon posters. Some never post, just read. Once or twice we've had a "lurker day" where we've encouraged people who don't normally post to step forward and let us know who they are, what they do, what they're interested in. --Robin researcher/lecturer on medieval Western European dress _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 10:54:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12FsXSd003362 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:54:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FrRcP005209; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:53:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12FrOMl015643; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:53:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web12905.mail.yahoo.com (web12905.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.72]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12FrJMl015598 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:53:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Message-ID: <20040202154639.828.qmail@web12905.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.48.41.31] by web12905.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 10:46:39 EST Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:46:39 -0500 (EST) From: Kathy Page To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200402020538.i125cFMl041773@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Fans and cabs X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Roscelin, Try going to a local jeweller's shop and ask for paste jewels. I am lucky in that I have a friend who owns a shop, so can get anything I am willing to pay for. I do know that glass and paste jewels of all sizes shapes and colours can be found without trouble through a jeweller. If they won't, then they might be able to at least direct you to the right place. Karen, When I made my feather fan, I used an old spindle from a chair arm or back, cut it off the length I wanted and took a dremel to it to make a loop on the end to hang it, then cut a mortice and tenon like joint in the other end (if you don't know what that is it looks like this: http://www.eximcorp.org/Resources/Resources/GlossaryM/Morticetenon/20.gif ) then fitted a pair of shaped, thin craft plywood pieces to it, drilled holes for the feathers then glued them in. If you'd like to take a look at the finished product, I'll upload the pics to my site. (it will give me motivation to actually *get around* to updating my site o_O) Wasn't all that hard, and produced a spiffy bit of work. Frankly though, the fan handle took very little time to make, it was those infernal feathers! Ostrich feathers are very thick, so in order to make them thinner but still retain their fullness (I was not prepared to pay for the $20/feather feminas) I had to hand fletch each feather, pair it with a s! econd to really fluff it up then hand wire each pair together to give it strength and flexibility. Then I gave the feathers a "perm" by curling them with a pair of scissors, just like you would with ribbons. Messy process, but it was worth it. I have this fan that could produce a breeze for five people now. :-) Kathy Subject: [h-cost] Seeking glas Does anyone know of a good source for these glass cabs? Roscelin Subject: [h-cost] fan handles Does anyone know of a source for purchasing fan handles? Karen --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 11:05:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12G58Sd003411 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:05:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12G1ocP006013; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:01:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12G1nMl021605; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:01:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web.antekhou.com (adsl-66-136-30-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net [66.136.30.169]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12G1bMl021478 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:01:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cbucheger@paclp.com) Received: from escom.antek [192.168.0.151] by web.antekhou.com (SMTPD32-8.00) id A3267500FE; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 09:56:22 -0600 Received: From PACws22 ([65.45.18.250]) by escom.antek (WebShield SMTP v4.5 MR1a); id 107573738293; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:56:22 -0600 Message-ID: <007701c3e9a3$c55aa920$1d64a8c0@algx> From: "Cyn Bucheger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:46:48 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > The text lists a long series of fabrics, in a scenario in which the > tailors bring in piles of fabrics for the king to examine. I believe she > said that "verts" is included in this list (as in X bolts of verts) as > though it were a fabric type, but there's also a reference to "vert > purpre," which makes you wonder which of the words is the color name and > which is the fabric name. > > Is there a possibility that the vert is referring to a fur? I had a friend doing some research in the heraldic terms recently and she indicated that gules for red was based upon a fur that was red in color. No, I have nothing to point anyone to, just a comment made in a discussion on what she'd learn as she was getting ready to teach her high school class about medieval heraldry... Cyn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 11:09:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12G9pSd003438 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:09:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12G97cP006791; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:09:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12G94Ml027028; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:09:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu [132.236.56.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12G90Ml026971 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:09:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from arkham.cornell.edu ([128.253.111.234]) by postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i12G8wKI019685 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:08:58 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202110606.019263d0@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 11:09:01 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: M Stewart Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms In-Reply-To: <007701c3e9a3$c55aa920$1d64a8c0@algx> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey Cyn, I'd be more inclined to say fur if it was 'vair' - which is based on squirrel. But vert - as far as I know heraldically (?) is simply green. The "gules for red was based upon a fur that was red in color" is a new idea to me. Do you happen to know where your friend found this? I'd be interested to look into that. Thanks, Bridgette Mari Stewart Cornell University _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 11:15:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12GFmSd003466 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:15:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GCTcP007190; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:12:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GCQMl029579; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:12:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12GCOMl029494 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:12:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCl3wdFhxlcQQEH9zIa2W5ObzdPL/IWQ5ug==">; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 08:05:01 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JMD6NTYD; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 08:05:01 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:03:11 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Message-ID: <20040202.100311.-7456857.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,3-4,9-12 From: seamstrix@juno.com Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I'm Karen and I'm a costumer. (Group says 'Hi Karen!') I live outside Chicago and have a garage full of fabric.....but I can stop anytime...... ;-) My Periods Of Special Interest (POSI?) include the late 18th century, Anglo-Saxon, Late Victorian, and what is probably the area I know most about- Elizabethan. I like just about any period tho, and a really vivid description or an excellent picture can be very inspirational. What can I say, I'm easy! Karen ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 11:22:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12GMvSd003478 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:22:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GHvcP007730; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:17:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GHqMl033767; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:17:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav54.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.47]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GHpMl033715 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:17:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 08:00:28 -0800 Received: from 24.58.108.69 by bay1-dav54.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 16:00:28 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.108.69] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202154639.828.qmail@web12905.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Fans and cabs Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:00:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2004 16:00:28.0408 (UTC) FILETIME=[AD5F3780:01C3E9A5] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is my stone dealer try her also: http://stores.ebay.com/gemstonesjewelrycoinsandmore/plistings/list/all/dept10/index.html?dir=1&col=4&sotimedisplay=2 Up on ebay and really REALLY cheap. ============================= On Ebay http://snipurl.com/3csb http://my.lulu.com/kristalori Elizabethan Ladies Calendar Rolled Florentine Cap Pattern www.swapking.com/hats ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kathy Page" To: Sent: Monday, February 02, 2004 10:46 AM Subject: [h-cost] Re: Fans and cabs > Roscelin, > Try going to a local jeweller's shop and ask for paste jewels. I am lucky in that I have a friend who owns a shop, so can get anything I am willing to pay for. I do know that glass and paste jewels of all sizes shapes and colours can be found without trouble through a jeweller. If they won't, then they might be able to at least direct you to the right place. > > > Karen, > > When I made my feather fan, I used an old spindle from a chair arm or back, cut it off the length I wanted and took a dremel to it to make a loop on the end to hang it, then cut a mortice and tenon like joint in the other end (if you don't know what that is it looks like this: http://www.eximcorp.org/Resources/Resources/GlossaryM/Morticetenon/20.gif ) then fitted a pair of shaped, thin craft plywood pieces to it, drilled holes for the feathers then glued them in. If you'd like to take a look at the finished product, I'll upload the pics to my site. (it will give me motivation to actually *get around* to updating my site o_O) Wasn't all that hard, and produced a spiffy bit of work. Frankly though, the fan handle took very little time to make, it was those infernal feathers! Ostrich feathers are very thick, so in order to make them thinner but still retain their fullness (I was not prepared to pay for the $20/feather feminas) I had to hand fletch each feather, pair it with a s! > econd to > really fluff it up then hand wire each pair together to give it strength and flexibility. Then I gave the feathers a "perm" by curling them with a pair of scissors, just like you would with ribbons. Messy process, but it was worth it. I have this fan that could produce a breeze for five people now. :-) > > Kathy > > > Subject: [h-cost] Seeking glas > Does anyone know of a good source for these glass cabs? > > Roscelin > > > Subject: [h-cost] fan handles > Does anyone know of a source for purchasing fan handles? > > Karen > > > > --------------------------------- > Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 11:42:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12GgKSd003594 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:42:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GX0cP010313; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:33:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GWvMl046231; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:32:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from jalapeno.cc.columbia.edu (IDENT:cu41754@jalapeno.cc.columbia.edu [128.59.59.238]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GWqMm046194 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:32:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from asj2001@columbia.edu) Received: from VAIO (dyn-shp-225-220.dyn.columbia.edu [160.39.225.220]) (user=asj2001 mech=LOGIN bits=0) by jalapeno.cc.columbia.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GWnEh011660 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:32:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <000a01c3e9a9$6d575290$9865fea9@VAIO> From: "Alexia S. Jacobs" To: References: <200402021612.i12GCpMl029840@net.indra.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:27:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-No-Spam-Score: Local X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: who is here X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My name is Alexia. I'm from New York City and am a junior at Columbia University. I have always loved costume history and fashion in general, and am planning to study costume history and museum studies (I am a comp. lit. major doing Medieval Latin and English right now, although I did recently write a long research paper about Turkish influences on eighteenth-century dress for a class called Theories of Culture: Middle East and South Asia). I don't sew very well. My stitches are uneven and I have never actually seen a working sewing machine in person. In fact, I have only met two people who have used them! I commission all my clothing. I am also teaching myself to make lace (very slowly because I don't have the time or space during the school year) and I like to knit and do petit point when I am very bored. I love clothing from many eras but my favorite is the eighteenth century, pretty much from beginning to end. Unfortunately, I have never met anyone who lives near me who does as well. Are there any of you who are on this list? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 11:47:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12GlxSd003607 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:47:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GjgcP012915; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:45:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GjcsM057043; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:45:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.istop.com (dci.doncaster.on.ca [66.11.168.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12GjWsM056949 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:45:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from skud@infotrope.net) Received: from eggnog (skud.ott.istop.com [66.11.173.11]) by smtp.istop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 501FD17C339 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:45:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from skud by eggnog with local (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1AnhCV-0001eK-00 for ; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 11:45:31 -0500 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:45:31 -0500 Message-Id: From: Kirrily Robert Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > The only one I can help with: >> -- vert > Green, but it is usually used for the heraldic color. I don't know if it as > used to describe the real color too. But "vert" is simply French for "green", and the reason it's used in heraldry is simply that the first heralds were Anglo-Norman and all the ones since then have been big of tradition and kept the old language. In the first few centuries after the Norman conquest, all the nobility of England, not just their heralds, were speaking something much closer to French than our modern tongue. K. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 13:01:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12I1ESd003856 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:01:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12HvucP021801; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:57:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12HvqsM017420; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:57:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.suscom.net (smtp.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12HvlsM017351 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:57:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from goofy1@suscom.net) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 591651B2689 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:36:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.suscom.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with SMTP id 11626-06 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:36:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id EB7E81B3107 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:36:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <03bb01c3e9b3$a1df0030$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:40:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at suscom.net Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catalina Saravia Quicedo" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, February 02, 2004 10:02 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL > Some lists I am on recommend regular roll calls with > your name, general location and area/time of interest. I am Dianne Stucki, in York Pennsylvania. Sometimes I'm Lady Laurensa de Chambord in the SCA, living in England during the reign of Gloriana, Elizabeth Regina. Dianne > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 13:09:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12I9BSd003886 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:09:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12I7BcP022984; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:07:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12I7AsM024852; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:07:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu [132.236.56.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12I72sM024739 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:07:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from arkham.cornell.edu ([128.253.111.234]) by postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i12I6xKI015352 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:06:59 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202130101.0197ff10@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 13:07:01 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: M Stewart Subject: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL In-Reply-To: <03bb01c3e9b3$a1df0030$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> References: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Might as well.... ; > Mari Stewart here... living in Ithaca NY, working at Cornell University. Interests in just about anything... specific areas of interest in the Elizabethan knitting industry, textile trade and the "tailoring revolution." among others... current project is preparing for a local event called Ice Dragon. And yes, I do play some SCA, as Bridgette. Mari Stewart Cornell University _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 13:09:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12I9bSd003889 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:09:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12I8fcP023170; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:08:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12I8csM026097; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:08:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (law9-f97.law9.hotmail.com [64.4.9.97]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12I8XsM025995 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:08:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from marccarlson20@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:51:09 -0800 Received: from 129.244.6.78 by lw9fd.law9.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 17:51:09 GMT X-Originating-IP: [129.244.6.78] X-Originating-Email: [marccarlson20@hotmail.com] X-Sender: marccarlson20@hotmail.com From: "Marc Carlson" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 11:51:09 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2004 17:51:09.0333 (UTC) FILETIME=[23ABF450:01C3E9B5] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm somewhat intermittant, but I -am- here. Marc Carlson, Tulsa, Oklahoma, and I research a lot of medieval and early post-medieval stuff. Sometimes I even get it right :) Marc _________________________________________________________________ Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 13:30:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12IUFSd003957 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:30:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12ITNcP025611; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:29:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12ITMsM043186; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:29:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc12.comcast.net (rwcrmhc12.comcast.net [216.148.227.85]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IT1sM042857 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:29:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from someone@eskimo.com) Received: from bently (c-67-161-103-121.client.comcast.net[67.161.103.121]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc12) with SMTP id <2004020218202401400jqvo8e>; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:20:24 +0000 Message-ID: <012901c3e9b9$c8d30500$2a02a8c0@Belkin> From: "Pam and David" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:24:23 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Pam Dotson, Everett, Washington USA (home of the USS Abraham Lincoln, and where they build all the big Boeing jets). I do a lot of reading and study, but the more garment construction I do, the more I realize I hate it, so I don't know where that leaves me. I love everything I've learned from each one of you (and Bjarne, you've caused me to short out at least one keyboard, drooling over your work), but feel I never have anything worthy of sharing. I'm so glad y'all let me hang out and learn, though, and it has been a wonderful distraction for me over the last year and a half, as I lost my younger daughter, and had health crisis after health crisis. You've saved my mental health, giving me something fascinating way beyond myself to think about. Thank you. Pam _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 13:35:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12IZXSd003981 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:35:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IYicP026267; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:34:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IYhsM047964; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:34:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IYcsN047866 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:34:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i12IPOLP013354 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:25:25 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040202101847.00b494d0@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 10:21:16 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202130101.0197ff10@postoffice8.mail.cornell .edu> References: <03bb01c3e9b3$a1df0030$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Katie Pleasance, looking for SCA-era (especially Renaissance) costume-sewing contacts in the San Francisco Bay Area. Experienced in sewing; not experienced in costume design. Katie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 13:36:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12IadSd003997 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:36:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IWwcP026051; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:32:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IWvsM046340; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:32:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav51.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.40]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IWpsM046193 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:32:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:15:27 -0800 Received: from 24.58.108.69 by bay1-dav51.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:15:27 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.108.69] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> <5.2.1.1.2.20040202130101.0197ff10@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:15:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2004 18:15:27.0295 (UTC) FILETIME=[88AF4CF0:01C3E9B8] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well if it's a big deal I'm here as well...... MKA Jacqueline J. Bump Oswego NY and I run a local chapter of the Adrian. I don't tend to play to much within the SCA although I do on occasion. Making an orange gown from the Countess Lividia portrait some bodices an elizabethan hat and some other hats. Have on patternout for sale currently and have three more in progress ranging from hats to personal items. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 13:46:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12Ik7Sd004036 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:46:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Ij8cP027434; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:45:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Ij7sM056348; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:45:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Ij3sN056312 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:45:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i12J5qWm009777 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:05:52 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.119] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A8303EB00136; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 13:34:24 -0500 Message-ID: <003201c3e9bd$5ba90480$775183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "H-Costume" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:49:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Roll call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i12Ik7Sd004036 Status: RO Kathleen Mitchell, Washington,Pa.,Designer and maid of all work involved with costuming. Retiring from general costuming , after 40 years more or less on the boards. I am focussing on doing it 'right' when it comes to historical costuming. I have two"Houses" to worry-wort for, am becoming a doll maker and costumer. I love this 'window on the world'! It has sometimes been a little lonely on my pond. but less so when I hear and see all the wonderful things people on this list are doing. Kathleen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 14:01:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12J1eSd004118 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:01:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Iw5cP028831; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:58:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Iw2sM066706; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:58:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.pacifier.net (smtp1.pacifier.net [64.255.237.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IvvsM066669 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:57:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.131.201]) by smtp1.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E575A6FC06 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:38:00 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 10:38:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking glas Message-ID: <401E288A.19640.26E1BD88@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: <401D5F22.1000907@pcez.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Roscelin wrote: > > > I hope someone can help me out. I have bought some brass > > findings > > that can hold glass cabachons or cameos or even natural stone cabs. > > I know where I can get cameos and the natural stone cabs, but I > > can't find the glass, flatback cabs. I have hunted on Ebay and even > > on the net. Does anyone know of a good source for these glass cabs? > > I used to get these in sizable packages in craft stores such as > Michael's or MJ Designs, maybe even Jo-Anns. They're sold as "glue-on > jewels" or something like that, and they typically hang on the wall > with other jewelry findings. I probably have a bunch of packages > somewhere in my stash; I remember having to buy several packages just > so I could pick out the red ones to use in a particular costume. If > you need a color other than red, and not huge quantities, email me and > I'll dig them up. > > --Robin They are a lot less common than in the past. There was a great factory in Germany which was producing the majority of them which burned down many years ago. Now most of them are plastic unless you buy them from places like Fire Mountain Gems and Shipwreck Beads. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 14:01:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12J1nSd004121 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:01:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IwOcP028903; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:58:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IwOsM066999; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:58:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.pacifier.net (smtp1.pacifier.net [64.255.237.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IwFsM066899 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:58:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.131.201]) by smtp1.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CABA6FB61 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:38:02 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 10:38:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms Message-ID: <401E288A.12578.26E1BEA1@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202095458.01935928@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Later on came the > introduction of cochineal, from N. America. It was sometimes called > "false Kermes" - it gave a deep red/scarlet color, and strangely > enough was cheaper... I can't remember if that was because the bug > was larger or if it just produced more chemical and therefore required > fewer bugs/vat. The cochineal bug produces more of dye per bug (a type of shield louse, just like kermes) and the bug is more prolific than the one which makes kermes (and more prolific than the one which makes lac, which is also a shield louse which makes red.) So, they could get bugs more easily and each bug was more concentrated with dye. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 14:02:06 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12J25Sd004125 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:02:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IwfcP028976; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:58:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12IwfsM067236; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:58:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9406.mail.yahoo.com (web9406.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12IwVsM067106 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:58:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040202185830.71885.qmail@web9406.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9406.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 10:58:30 PST Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:58:30 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And here I am ---Kathryn Wolters in Ventura,California--also known in the SCA as Comptesse Albra Katerine Marie Isabel Bautise--OL,OP, from the Shire of Darach, Caid. Newly retired from Verizon after 30 odd years chasing down 'cases of missing dial tones and DSL signals, building special circuits--and now enjoying parttime work as costumner, ,jewelry-maker(need to accessorize one's garb, right??)My actual persona is 16th cent french/spanish.My persona is supposed to have been daughter to an ambassador from the French court, with a Spanish mother--living in the Spain of Phillip II. Since I get to meet and study with Sophonisba Anquissola for awhile, some of my favorite styles are Italian influenced , as well:) Otherwise I've played with 14th century French, Spanish costumning--and periodically make forays into the Directoire, 1840's, and Edwardian. Drea's wonderful look at Flemish styles has me all fired up lately---and Bjarnes' beautiful work has been tempting me to branch out into another period----------sigh!! I need more hours in the day, as well as to win the Lottery!!! Other passions are metal thread embroidery, gardening(over 150 roses and a collection of thymes and scented geraniums),medieval/modern astrology, cordials and cooking from different time periods--life will never be boring:) Albra Marc Carlson wrote: I'm somewhat intermittant, but I -am- here. Marc Carlson, Tulsa, Oklahoma, and I research a lot of medieval and early post-medieval stuff. Sometimes I even get it right :) Marc _________________________________________________________________ Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 14:18:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12JIsSd004164 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:18:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JCmcP000899; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:12:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JCisM078311; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:12:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu [132.236.56.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JCbsM078198 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:12:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from arkham.cornell.edu ([128.253.111.234]) by postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i12JCZKI020748 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:12:36 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202141119.019816e8@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 14:12:38 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: M Stewart Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms In-Reply-To: <401E288A.12578.26E1BEA1@localhost> References: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202095458.01935928@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks Kat! see, I knew someone here would be able to fill in that little piece of information. Y'all are so cool. Bridgette >The cochineal bug produces more of dye per bug (a type of shield >louse, just like kermes) and the bug is more prolific than the one >which makes kermes (and more prolific than the one which makes lac, >which is also a shield louse which makes red.) So, they could get >bugs more easily and each bug was more concentrated with dye. > >Kat > Mari Stewart Cornell University _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 14:19:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12JJoSd004171 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:19:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JGQcP001306; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:16:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JGPsM081292; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:16:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web.antekhou.com (adsl-66-136-30-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net [66.136.30.169]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JGKsM081202 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:16:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cbucheger@paclp.com) Received: from escom.antek [192.168.0.151] by web.antekhou.com (SMTPD32-8.00) id A2012380138; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 13:16:17 -0600 Received: From PACws22 ([65.45.18.250]) by escom.antek (WebShield SMTP v4.5 MR1a); id 107574937712; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:16:17 -0600 Message-ID: <00bc01c3e9bf$b3b1b8a0$1d64a8c0@algx> From: "Cyn Bucheger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202185830.71885.qmail@web9406.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:06:45 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm Cynthia, San Antonio Texas. I inherited a compulsion to create from my mother and a desire to make things that are practical from my father. I prefer to work with things involving needle and thread, though I'll try just about anything once. I love studying and making garments from a wide range of eras and locations, both for myself and for friends, though mostly my work is for SCA periods 600-1600. If I had some place to wear or a request to make something from another period I'd be there. Elizabethan is my favorite, as well as turn of the century 15/16th c Venetian and there's the mid 16 c Flortines, and I'm plotting a 14/15th c cotte and I just finished a German Ren for a friend and not off to make those braes, hosen and tunic for another friend. This is so much fun, isn't it! Cyn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 14:51:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12JpoSd004481 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:51:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JmLcP004658; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:48:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JlnsM005518; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:47:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp2.pacifier.net (smtp2.pacifier.net [64.255.237.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12JlNsM005200 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:47:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.131.201]) by smtp2.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A5A46AE6B for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 11:47:20 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 11:47:16 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL Message-ID: <401E38C4.31374.27211EC0@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <012901c3e9b9$c8d30500$2a02a8c0@Belkin> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I'm Kat Russell and I've been costuming since I was a little girl. About 20 years ago I found the SCA and finally had an outlet for all the costuming I'd been doing before. (Although I still have to use other outlets for my 18th C and 20th C stuff, as well as my "out of my own imagination stuff.") In the SCA I'm Baroness Kateryne of Hindscroft, and am a member of the Order of the Laurel. I used to live in Greensboro, North Carolina (where I first found the SCA in my final year of my pediatric residency at Moses Cone Memorial.) I then moved to Seattle, Washington and now live in Vancouver, Washington. I've only traveled around the US (for medical conferences, but only those with museums nearby. I *love* Williamsburg and they have one of the best Pediatric conferences around put on by the AAP) and once in England (where I had the pleasure of getting to spend some time with our dear Teddy.) I'm a rather general costumer. I love to research. But my favorite area is c1540 England. My most current project is a late 16th C Ottoman outfit for a friend of mine. I've only got the 2 side seams and the front closure decorations to do on the last of the caftans. I believe I can see a light at the end of the tunnel! Then it's off to Estrella where I'm teaching 2 classes (practical handsewing and cartridge pleating.) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 15:19:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12KJdSd004819 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:19:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KBKcP007116; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:11:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KBGsM024025; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:11:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web61107.mail.yahoo.com (web61107.mail.yahoo.com [216.155.196.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12KB7sM023821 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:11:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dragonwolfcat@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040202200357.42164.qmail@web61107.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [146.82.36.102] by web61107.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 12:03:57 PST Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:03:57 -0800 (PST) From: "Angharad ver' Reynulf" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roll call To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <003201c3e9bd$5ba90480$775183d1@rmitchellras> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Jonnalyhn Wolfcat Hall, known as Angharat ver' Reynulf in the SCA. I'll sign posts either way, depending upon what I've been writing or asking about. I simply like to sew and do handwork. My primary outlet for historical costume right now is the SCA, where I play 14th Century Welsh Border Brat, and wearing non-SCA period stuff at science fiction conventions along with purely fantastical creations. Right now my focus is on getting together a very "High Court" formal type 14th Century outfit for myself and my fiance for our wedding, along with the simpler outfits for 3 attendants each and all of the trappings. Then I've got an Elizabethan and a Victorian gown on the wish list. :-) Jonnalyhn Wolfcat Tacoma, WA or Blatha an Oir (BAO), An Tir __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 15:22:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12KMISd004869 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:22:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KCscP007259; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:12:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KCssM025274; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:12:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from natsmtp00.webmailer.de (natsmtp00.rzone.de [81.169.145.165]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KB6sM023734 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:11:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sabine@filmkostueme.de) Received: from hatchling (pD9E3063A.dip.t-dialin.net [217.227.6.58]) by post.webmailer.de (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12JXFK4017321 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:15 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <10b101c3e9c3$66b2e340$7103e3d9@hatchling> From: "Sabine Pothmann" To: References: <200402021901.i12J0usP069112@net.indra.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:29:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am more somewhat a lurker, but I am also here :-) Sabine Pothmann, Germany, specialized in historic movie costumes reproductions. 27 years of sewing experience (I started when I was six), 20 years of reproducing costumes from pictures and movies - and in business as a professional since 1997. But I will never, ever stop studying and each day, I learn something new ;-) Best wishes, Sabine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 15:33:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12KXRSd004960 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:33:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KTecP008991; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:29:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KTYsM037639; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:29:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9405.mail.yahoo.com (web9405.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.111]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12KResM036155 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:27:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040202202739.18684.qmail@web9405.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9405.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 12:27:39 PST Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:27:39 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <401E38C4.31374.27211EC0@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO whoooooo----Kat--I'll be at Estrella, also----teaching---Beginning Metal Thread Embroidery--I'll look for you! Shall we contrive to wear some sort of red H' with our site favors(broad grin)? Albra kat@grendal.rain.com wrote: Hi, I'm Kat Russell and I've been costuming since I was a little girl. About 20 years ago I found the SCA and finally had an outlet for all the costuming I'd been doing before. (Although I still have to use other outlets for my 18th C and 20th C stuff, as well as my "out of my own imagination stuff.") In the SCA I'm Baroness Kateryne of Hindscroft, and am a member of the Order of the Laurel. I used to live in Greensboro, North Carolina (where I first found the SCA in my final year of my pediatric residency at Moses Cone Memorial.) I then moved to Seattle, Washington and now live in Vancouver, Washington. I've only traveled around the US (for medical conferences, but only those with museums nearby. I *love* Williamsburg and they have one of the best Pediatric conferences around put on by the AAP) and once in England (where I had the pleasure of getting to spend some time with our dear Teddy.) I'm a rather general costumer. I love to research. But my favorite area is c1540 England. My most current project is a late 16th C Ottoman outfit for a friend of mine. I've only got the 2 side seams and the front closure decorations to do on the last of the caftans. I believe I can see a light at the end of the tunnel! Then it's off to Estrella where I'm teaching 2 classes (practical handsewing and cartridge pleating.) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 15:44:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12KiYSd004980 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:44:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KfEcP010083; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:41:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12KfAsM045890; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:41:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Kf8sM045848 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:41:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from theresa@misc.com) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i12KgQq1026193 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:42:26 -0800 Message-ID: <401EB589.1030307@misc.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 12:39:37 -0800 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Theresa Eacker member of Greater Bay Area Costumer's Guild (San Francisco USA) also belong/attend any events that are dance related with a costume emphasis: Bay Area Regency Society, PEERS, what-have-you I'm a garb/costume generalist right now (only been period garb-creating/costuming about 3 1/2 years), so I "focus" on whatever period an upcoming event is in!!! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 16:25:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12LPuSd009268 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:25:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12LH4cP013939; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:17:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12LH1sM072518; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:17:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay12-f52.bay12.hotmail.com [64.4.35.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12LGxsM072436 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:17:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from scorpiangirl3@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:59:37 -0800 Received: from 68.166.54.178 by by12fd.bay12.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 20:59:37 GMT X-Originating-IP: [68.166.54.178] X-Originating-Email: [scorpiangirl3@hotmail.com] X-Sender: scorpiangirl3@hotmail.com From: "Lori Edwards" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 20:59:37 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2004 20:59:37.0293 (UTC) FILETIME=[77BDB7D0:01C3E9CF] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all - My name is Lori Edwards. I am usually a lurker, although I post occasionally. I live in the Seattle area. I am active in science fiction/fantasy and historical costuming as well as in SCA -- Kingdom of AnTir. I Really enjoy the information posted on this list. Cheers! Lori "An idle mind is the devil's twirly ride!" >From: "Marc Carlson" >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: h-costume@indra.com >Subject: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL >Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 11:51:09 -0600 > >I'm somewhat intermittant, but I -am- here. > >Marc Carlson, Tulsa, Oklahoma, and I research a lot of medieval and early >post-medieval stuff. Sometimes I even get it right :) > >Marc > >_________________________________________________________________ >Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed >experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _________________________________________________________________ Check out the new MSN 9 Dial-up — fast & reliable Internet access with prime features! http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=dialup/home&ST=1 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 16:33:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12LXOSd009298 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:33:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12LTCcP014976; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:29:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12LTAsM081475; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:29:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12LT4sM081398 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:29:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-34-70.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.34.70]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10 550 close/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12LSgSp015548 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:29:02 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040202125413.05b5c6b0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 13:18:36 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL In-Reply-To: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i12LT4sM081398 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Some lists I am on recommend regular roll calls with >your name, general location and area/time of interest. > > > I would like to know who is on the list at > > pressent time. Käthe Willig von Mainz, OL, OP, etc, (SCA) 1490-1560, well-off middle-class German from Nuremburg Georg Willig/Käthe Willig, (SCA) 1535-1600, Landsknecht/Kampfrau Molly Stone, honest seamstress/George "Ballast" Ballard, landsman (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BayPrivateer/) 1740-1760, America, somewhere with boats Cleora Foote, late 1840s, Cockney cook to Mr. and Mrs. Fezziwig, from Christmas Carol by Charles Dickens Mrs. Josiah P. Creesy (Eleanor), 1851-54, navigator of the clipper ship Flying Cloud Dickens' Fair in Northern California (no character name yet), 1890s, Ardenwood Historic Farm docent (no character name yet), 1901, San Francisco Maritime National Historical Park (http://www.nps.gov/safr/local/top.html) docent Carolyn Kayta Barrows, dollmaker, (www.FunStuft.com) fibre artist, textillian, historical costumer, fantasy/science fiction costumer, unemployed CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 17:31:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12MVVSd009522 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:31:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12MT7cP021080; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:29:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12MT32v027311; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:29:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail03.powweb.com (mail03.powweb.com [66.152.97.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12MSw2v027260 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:28:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from megan@benchite.com) Received: from megan2 (pcp06940299pcs.nrockv01.md.comcast.net [69.138.19.18]) by mail03.powweb.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F030C15FC9 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:58:47 -0800 (PST) From: "Megan M." To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:01:50 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <03bb01c3e9b3$a1df0030$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> Importance: Normal Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Megge de Northwode, interested in most clothing within the SCA period but currently doing medieval scandinavian, 14th century, and sometimes a bit of working-class Elizabethan. I sew, sometimes crochet, knit, nalbind, embroider, and weave, although I mostly sew and repair machines and just dabble in all the rest. I reside in Maryland, USA. -Megan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 17:54:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12MsdSd009568 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:54:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12MrgcP023165; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:53:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Mra2v044992; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:53:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web61107.mail.yahoo.com (web61107.mail.yahoo.com [216.155.196.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12MrW2v044877 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:53:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dragonwolfcat@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040202225325.6633.qmail@web61107.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [146.82.36.102] by web61107.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 14:53:25 PST Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:53:25 -0800 (PST) From: "Angharad ver' Reynulf" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Lori! Didn't know you were on this list too! Lori does *really* pretty stuff, it's always fun to see what she will be wearing at cons or at SCA. Jonnalyhn __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 18:03:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12N3qSd009592 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:03:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12N1ccP023856; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:01:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12N1a2v051371; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:01:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au (adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au [143.216.236.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12N1X2v051269 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:01:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from tonkin.rebecca@saugov.sa.gov.au) Received: from adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au OUTGOING (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i12N1KSc020036 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:31:20 +1030 (CST)' Received: from sagemsbb006.saugov.sa.gov.au (sagemsbb006.sagemsmrd01.sa.gov.au [143.216.59.14]) by adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au INCOMING (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i12N1CZ6019901 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:31:12 +1030 (CST)' Received: by sagemsbb006.sagemsmrd01.sa.gov.au with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id <1C351BZ6>; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:31:02 +1030 Message-ID: <1016FD8698B3F14DB829819C6B856EC7598E48@sagemsg0005.sagemsmrd01.sa.gov.au> From: "Tonkin, Rebecca (PIRSA-SARDI)" To: "'h-costume@indra.com'" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:31:00 +1030 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: text/plain Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: Need help on medieval fabric terms X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Message: 5 Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 21:25:47 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton Subject: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms -- sendal (cendal) = a kind of silk like our modern taffeta, often in a red color Yes, also in green, see Fashion in the Age of the Black Prince Rebecca _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 18:11:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12NBJSd009605 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:11:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12N7XcP024315; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:07:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12N7T2v055922; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:07:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web41301.mail.yahoo.com (web41301.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.186]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12N7M2v055793 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:07:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aureliarufinia@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040202230036.32204.qmail@web41301.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [192.80.65.234] by web41301.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 15:00:36 PST Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:00:36 -0800 (PST) From: Aurelia Rufinia To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200402021901.i12J0usO069112@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Baroness Aurelia Rufinia, currently of the Barony of Carolingia in the East Kingdom (Boston Mass), lately of the Barony of Nordskogen in the Principality of Northshield (Minneapolis, MN). I do primarly ROman costuming, and dabble in Byzantine (I finished the first stages of beading for a green and gold byz for Birka last weekend, and looked VERY good, ifIdosaysomyself.) I once did Renaissance-ish, but I decided I liked ROman better. I'm on this list cause I saw RObin lecture in Bostn a few months ago, and got a LOT out of her research methods, and am learning lots more stuff I'm tucking away for later use. Aurelia ===== Baroness Aurelia Rufinia House Iron Maiden, Barony of Carolingia, East Kingdom, Northshield Ex-Pat "And was there a lesson in all this? Huh? What did we learn about beer?" "Foamy!" "Good. Just as long as that's clear." __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 18:20:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12NKrSd009668 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:20:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NIqcP025359; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:18:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NIp2v063807; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:18:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web14805.mail.yahoo.com (web14805.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.224.221]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i12NIm2v063792 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:18:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lorijaneleppink@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040202231207.8427.qmail@web14805.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.65.146.151] by web14805.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 15:12:07 PST Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:12:07 -0800 (PST) From: Lori Leppink To: h-costume@net.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello! My SCA name is Giovanna Vernaccia, and I live in Seattle, WA, and while I am new to the SCA and to historical clothing, I have sewed all my life. I do Italian Renaissance, mostly late 15th century, but I also like some 16th century styles as well. I like to be as historically accurate as possible, and I am learning as many period techniques as I can. I love this list, and I get a lot of good information from it! Giovanna --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 18:24:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12NOhSd009677 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:24:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NNhcP025716; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:23:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NNh2v066936; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:23:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com (mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com [66.218.85.42]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NNg2v066860 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:23:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TheTailor@renaissancetailor.com) Received: from [66.135.149.195] by mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:10:19 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:10:19 -0800 Message-ID: <3FF954AF000119D5@mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: From: "The Renaissance Tailor" Subject: RE: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL To: "Historical Costume" , "Historical Costume" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i12NNg2v066860 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello, I am Tammie L. Dupuis aka in the SCA as Laurellen de Brandevin Consistently engaged in late 16th and early 17th century clothing, exploring American Colonial period clothing currently. I sew, knit, embroider (especially Central Asian stuff), try to keep up with my website (www.veretsable.com or www.renaissancetailor.com), do other odd bits of things in metal, wood, and paper. I've just recently signed back on to this elist. I reside in South Park (seriously) - a suburb of Seattle, WA. Tammie "The only man who behaved sensibly was my tailor; he took my measurement anew every time he saw me, while all the rest went on with their old measurements and expected them to fit me." - George Bernard Shaw _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 18:46:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12Nk7Sd009776 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:46:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Ni5cP027425; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:44:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Ni22v080205; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:44:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay12-f104.bay12.hotmail.com [64.4.35.104]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Nhx2v080142 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:43:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from scorpiangirl3@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:26:36 -0800 Received: from 68.166.54.178 by by12fd.bay12.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 23:26:36 GMT X-Originating-IP: [68.166.54.178] X-Originating-Email: [scorpiangirl3@hotmail.com] X-Sender: scorpiangirl3@hotmail.com From: "Lori Edwards" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 23:26:36 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2004 23:26:36.0695 (UTC) FILETIME=[0083AA70:01C3E9E4] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey girlie (jonna) It always fun to see you at events and cons! Always trying to come up with fun stuff to wear. Getting ready to compete at Norwes after taking last year off. Keep up the beautiful costuming! Lori "An idle mind is the devil's twirly ride!" >From: "Angharad ver' Reynulf" >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: Historical Costume >Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL >Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 14:53:25 -0800 (PST) > >Hi Lori! > >Didn't know you were on this list too! > >Lori does *really* pretty stuff, it's always fun to >see what she will be wearing at cons or at SCA. > >Jonnalyhn > > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! >http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _________________________________________________________________ Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 18:48:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12NmSSd009785 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:48:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NixcP027513; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:44:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Niw2v080754; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:44:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.compassnet.com.au [203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12Niq2w080584 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:44:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from glendar@compassnet.com.au) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.143]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.10/linuxconf) with SMTP id i12Nq18H007351 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:52:02 +1100 Message-ID: <020901c3e9e6$a6b2ee40$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <3FF954AF000119D5@mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:45:15 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Glenda Robinson, from slightly west of Sydney, Australia. Am currently involved in just-pre-ECW London reenactment with the Pike and Musket Society, where I am also part of a smaller group who Playford Dance. Am also interested, but not in a current 'group' for, 7th-8th Anglo-Saxon in Lincoln/York - NE England, and 70ishAD Roman-British. I reenact with my husband and two boys. My sewing-related interests are: handsewing techniques, embroidery, making my own patterns, braids and cords. I've started knitting again for reenactment purposes, and will start some nallbinding shortly. I'd post more, but often find that being asleep when most are awake, what I would have said has already been posted. Glenda. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 18:53:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i12NrCSd009797 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:53:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NqUcP028167; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:52:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NqS2v085326; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:52:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp3.pacifier.net (smtp3.pacifier.net [64.255.237.173]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i12NqP2v085293 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:52:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.131.53]) by smtp3.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27E856DBA0 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:52:24 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 15:52:27 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Message-ID: <401E723B.8344.2801999C@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3FF954AF000119D5@mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com> References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I sew, knit, embroider (especially Central Asian stuff), try to keep > up with my website (www.veretsable.com or www.renaissancetailor.com), > do other odd bits of things in metal, wood, and paper. I've just > recently signed back on to this elist. Hmmm. Got tired of me forwarding stuff to you, huh. ;) Good to know. By the way, this lady is the site owner (see above) which many of you keep referring to for information. It's got loads of cool stuff on it. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 19:07:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1307SSd009849 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:07:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1305LcP029242; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:05:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1305J2v092780; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:05:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web12904.mail.yahoo.com (web12904.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1305H2v092768 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:05:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Message-ID: <20040202235836.72319.qmail@web12904.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.48.41.31] by web12904.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:58:36 EST Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:58:36 -0500 (EST) From: Kathy Page To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200402021900.i12J0usM069112@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] who is here- ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm Kathy Page, known in the SCA as either Caitlin inghean Tomais ui Duibhir or Signora Salvatrice D'este, honourate cortigiane e veleno. I began sewing at 11, got into french heirloom sewing and corsetmaking entirely by accident several years ago, which quickly graduated me into Victorian and Edwardian, leaving me with an entire closet filled with every frilly confection known to womankind, was invited to a Butlers Rangers weekend and ended up with a completely over the top 1776 gown, took a couple years off to have a baby then plunged into the renaissance with a vengance. As my names suggest, I do both Irish and Venetian in particular but am easily swayed into other places that seem interesting. I have expanded considerably and at a scary rate into other interests, mostly in order to feed my costuming habit, since I consider a costume complete once it has its' accessories and shoes. I'll try to make anything once, twice if I like it. :-) Kathy --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 19:12:06 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i130C6Sd009858 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:12:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130BQcP029716; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:11:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130BP2v096393; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:11:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com (mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com [66.218.85.42]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130BL2v096324 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:11:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TheTailor@renaissancetailor.com) Received: from [66.135.149.195] by mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:11:15 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:11:15 -0800 Message-ID: <3FF954AF00011A83@mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <401E723B.8344.2801999C@localhost> From: "The Renaissance Tailor" Subject: RE: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL To: "Historical Costume" , "Historical Costume" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i130BL2v096324 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kat wrote: >Hmmm. Got tired of me forwarding stuff to you, huh. ;) > >Good to know. You just made me horribly curious. I can't handle that... Regards, Tammie L. Dupuis www.renaissancetailor.com/www.vertetsable.com "The only man who behaved sensibly was my tailor; he took my measurement anew every time he saw me, while all the rest went on with their old measurements and expected them to fit me." - George Bernard Shaw _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 19:19:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i130JXSd009897 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:19:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130FmcP000169; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:15:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130Fl2v098835; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:15:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lioness.futureautomation.com (c-24-17-76-68.client.comcast.net [24.17.76.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130Fh2w098744 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:15:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from colleen.mcdonald@comcast.net) Received: from cognospc (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lioness.futureautomation.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id i12NrEhZ017601 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:53:14 -0800 Message-ID: <0e5201c3e9e7$580d7520$1b03010a@mackie.com> From: "Colleen McDonald" To: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 15:50:31 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i130JXSd009897 Status: RO Hello everyone, I'm Colleen McDonald (aka Cainder nic Sheanlaoich in the SCA). I'm currently researching women's clothing in Florence (1350-1365) and have an interest in the clothing in the other Italian city-states of the 14th century, along with the cloth trade and shoes from the era throughout Europe. I'm also researching chemises during this period, especially the sleeveless versus long sleeve issue, and I've been studying goldwork (embroidery) during this period as well. I live in Edmonds - a suburb of Seattle, WA. Colleen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 19:38:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i130ckSd009957 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:38:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130bZcP001733; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:37:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130bU2v010566; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:37:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-dav53.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.10.46]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130bQ2v010482 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:37:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:20:05 -0800 Received: from 216.111.133.208 by bay7-dav53.bay7.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 00:20:05 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.111.133.208] X-Originating-Email: [robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com] X-Sender: robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com From: "Kelly Dorman" To: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:19:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2004 00:20:05.0659 (UTC) FILETIME=[7934B6B0:01C3E9EB] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i130ckSd009957 Status: RO Kelly Dorman on historic Mackinac Island where the horse is King! My main time periods of interest are 1850-1865 and 1910-1919. I make reproduction clothing mainly for myself and my husband, although I am currently making 1860's baby clothes for a dear friend who is expecting. My current obsession is with all things beaded - clothing, bags and other accessories. I am attempting to start a small business making reproduction and original Edwardian style beaded evening bags. I was fortunate enough to be asked to have my first show at Grand Hotel this past fall, which went very well. I desperately need to create a website, but am having a great deal of trouble writing the accompanying text to the photos of my bags. Most of my work has sold by word of mouth and has generally been a custom commissioned situation. Wish me luck! Kelly _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 19:40:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i130esSd009962 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:40:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130cfcP001802; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:38:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130ce2v011351; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:38:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mx03.supplyguys.net (mx03.supplyguys.net [65.115.27.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130ca2w011325 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:38:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wendyc@vivid.net) Received: (qmail 21932 invoked by uid 89); 3 Feb 2004 00:29:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO localhost) (65.115.27.31) by 0 with SMTP; 3 Feb 2004 00:29:13 -0000 Received: from c-66-56-95-30.atl.client2.attbi.com (c-66-56-95-30.atl.client2.attbi.com [66.56.95.30]) by secure.supplyguys.net (IMP) with HTTP for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:31:56 -0500 Message-ID: <1075768316.401eebfc64b7a@secure.supplyguys.net> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:31:56 -0500 From: wendyc@vivid.net To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL References: <0e5201c3e9e7$580d7520$1b03010a@mackie.com> In-Reply-To: <0e5201c3e9e7$580d7520$1b03010a@mackie.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am Wendy Colbert I currently live in Atlanta Georgia. I too am in the SCA. I discovered I was interested in sewing for different eras than the SCA when my daughter had a dress up day in school after reading Little House on the Prairie. I looked at patterns, looked for the correct fabric, made a dress, apron and hat, we agonised over the shoes she would wear.... and when the day came, most of the kids were in generic skirts or commercial overalls. :-) It was after that that I had an ah-ha moment about why my son was so picky about the details the year he was a fireman for Halloween. He wanted the tank to be the correct color with a hose and mask, the boots had to be right, etc, etc etc.... I am also a spinner and a knitter and have redacted patterns for a Monmouth cap and scoggers. Wendy _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 19:57:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i130vJSd009999 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:57:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130uKcP002837; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:56:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130uG2v020241; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:56:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp4.pacifier.net (smtp4.pacifier.net [64.255.237.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i130uE2v020213 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:56:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.131.53]) by smtp4.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18DCE6B578 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 16:56:10 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 16:56:09 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Message-ID: <401E8129.5762.283BEBC9@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3FF954AF00011A83@mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com> References: <401E723B.8344.2801999C@localhost> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > You just made me horribly curious. I can't handle that... > Tammie L. Dupuis > www.renaissancetailor.com/www.vertetsable.com ;) Big Cheshire Cat grin. ;) Lots of good stuff here, plus a lot of *really* nice, talented people. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 21:10:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i132AuSd010201 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:10:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1328NcP006891; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:08:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1328I2v054333; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:08:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1328G2v054310 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:08:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nomadmt@pacbell.net) Received: from nomad (adsl-63-195-131-242.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net [63.195.131.242]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.10 550 close/8.12.10) with SMTP id i131Q13O017631 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:26:01 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <04cd01c3e9f4$4c7da2e0$6b02a8c0@OpalSun> From: "Margo Glenn-Lewis" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:23:15 -0800 Organization: Home for the Incurably Strange MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My name is Margo. Some other Margo. I live in northern California, and I lurk a lot. Margo Glenn-Lewis "Don't forget your bucket" Ice Machine in the Desert - Brave Combo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catalina Saravia Quicedo" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, February 02, 2004 7:02 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL > Some lists I am on recommend regular roll calls with > your name, general location and area/time of interest. > > I am in the SCA in the Barony of the Steppes. > Senora Catalina Saravia Quicedo lives was born in > Spain in 1501. Her best friend is a widow from France > who works with her in sewing. Her friend is trying to > teach her some basic embroidery. She occasionally > enjoys illuminations. And is usually found working > side by side with her husband, the Baron's Exchequer. > > > > > > > > On Fri, 30 Jan 2004, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > > > > > I would like to know who is on the list at > > pressent time. > > > > > ===== > Seńora Catalina > Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > BT Yahoo! Broadband - Free modem offer, sign up online today and save Ł80 http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 21:24:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i132OVSd010225 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:24:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132NYcP007633; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:23:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132NW2v061895; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:23:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-02-eri0.ohiordc.rr.com (ms-smtp-02-smtplb.ohiordc.rr.com [65.24.5.136]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132NS2v061867 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:23:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ailith@neo.rr.com) Received: from duncan (dhcp024-209-056-164.neo.rr.com [24.209.56.164]) by ms-smtp-02-eri0.ohiordc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with SMTP id i131PKaa022309 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:25:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <017d01c3e9f4$8beaaa90$1902a8c0@duncan> From: "ailith" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> <5.2.1.1.2.20040202130101.0197ff10@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:25:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re:who is here-ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings! My name is Kate and my passion is 16th century Italian clothing--specifically Florentine clothing. I've been interested in it since I went to my first SCA event in Germany in 1990. I've also created several bridal gowns (I keep swearing "Never again...") and some prom gowns. Been sewing since I got my first Barbie 45 years ago. I live in NE Ohio, not far from the Football Hall of Fame. I'm a non-traditional college student studying graphic design at a community college. My current project is getting our SCA Baron and Baroness ready for their investiture and for the creation of our brand spankin' new barony! :-) I'm known in the SCA as Ailith Mackintosh. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 21:55:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i132teSd010337 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:55:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132pxcP009154; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:51:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132pv2v074742; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:51:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc13.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.117]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132ps2v074690 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:51:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from philnstine@worldnet.att.net) Received: from worldnet.att.net (64.newark-08rh16rt.nj.dial-access.att.net[12.75.207.64]) by worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc13) with SMTP id <2004020302464111300f6re3e>; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:46:41 +0000 Message-ID: <401F0B8F.8090902@worldnet.att.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 21:46:39 -0500 From: Justine Magill User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roll call References: <20040202200357.42164.qmail@web61107.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, lots of folk are doing it, may as well join in! I am Justine Magill known as Jenne McGill in the SCA. I mainly sew for everyone else. I have worked on a variety of eras, such as viking, pseudo gfd's for the ladies of my house and cotehardies for the men, italian, various tabards for more than one household, sheetwalls and such, german renn and the ubiquitous t-tunic done at request of the wearers to match various manuscripts and such. Oddly enough, my favored era is elizabethan which I started out wearing, but have not made or worn any of that in some time. Right now I wear a series of tired old t-tunics... I really need to ignore my shire and household for a while and do for myself. I do have a properly fitted gfd for myself in the works which just needs finishing of the eyelets, and plans for two more done in the style of my household's livery gowns, but time is not available right now for much other than eating working and sleeping. I also cook, embroider, am usually the shire's head troll aka gate keeper or money taker, I have been known to do the odd illuminated manuscript from time to time, and was singing with the local shire's choir. I have an interest in warp weighted looms and I want one to go with the inkle loom I have. I do have a drop spindle as well and I know how to use it! One of these days I want to try to weave some cloth and make a completely 'from scratch' viking outfit.... complete with embroidery and woven trim. I am working on bobbin lace for ruffs for some elizabethans I have in mind for myself in the future. I also have a gown for one of my sis's in the works - the Elenora de Toledo gown in the Janet Arnold PoF. I am still collecting the materials for it, but once I get all the stuff I need, I will start on it.... Embroidery heaven! Mundanely, I am a para-professional accounting geek, on the level of a jr accountant. As you can imagine, I don't have much time right now at this time of the year - long hours and long weeks. Seeing as I am working towards my accounting degree, I have even less time than that! So for the time being, I am mostly collecting books, images, info, patterns and the odd snippet of knowledge that comes along while occasionally getting a little sewing done. Lady Jenne McGill House Bloodguard Shire of Rusted Woodlands East Kingdom MKA Justine Magill Northern NJ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 22:01:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1331KSd010360 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:01:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132wwcP009497; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:58:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132wv2v077592; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:58:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132wt2w077572 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:58:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i132x88v026305 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:59:08 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i132x8JR026303 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:59:08 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:59:08 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402022159.08174.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday 02 February 2004 12:13 pm, Robin Netherton wrote: > On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, [iso-8859-1] Catalina Saravia Quicedo wrote: > > Some lists I am on recommend regular roll calls with your name, > > general location and area/time of interest. > > On the other hand, we have over 500 addresses on this list... that would > make a pretty long roll call, if everyone answered! I agree with that, Robin. However, since I decided to pipe up, I may as well introduce myself. My name is Cathy Raymond. I have never been in the SCA, though I've been to a few SCA events courtesy of friends. I'm a lawyer who reads history, particularly the history of costume, for fun, and occasionally attempts to fashion an approximation of period costume in order to get a better understanding of what it was like to live in the days when that was fashion. Maybe someday, when I retire, I will have the funds/energy/time to delve more deeply.... -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 22:08:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1338SSd010374 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:08:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13343cP009797; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:04:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133422v079871; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:04:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1333w2w079841 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:04:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1334C8v026368 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:04:12 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1334CBw026366 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:04:12 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:04:11 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <012901c3e9b9$c8d30500$2a02a8c0@Belkin> In-Reply-To: <012901c3e9b9$c8d30500$2a02a8c0@Belkin> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402022204.11783.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday 02 February 2004 01:24 pm, Pam and David wrote: > Pam Dotson, Everett, Washington USA (home of the USS Abraham Lincoln, and > where they build all the big Boeing jets). I do a lot of reading and > study, but the more garment construction I do, the more I realize I hate > it, so I don't know where that leaves me. About where I am, apparently. I keep acquiring more books and more ideas for projects, while spending less and less time actually sewing. :-) -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 22:21:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i133LoSd010402 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:21:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133INcP010578; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:18:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133IK2v085904; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:18:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133IH2v085861 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:18:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a21.in-tch.com [66.62.107.1]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i132tvc11631 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:55:57 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <401F13AD.5000305@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 20:21:17 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL References: <012901c3e9b9$c8d30500$2a02a8c0@Belkin> In-Reply-To: <012901c3e9b9$c8d30500$2a02a8c0@Belkin> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm over here in the NW corner of the US (sue waves wildly)....Missoula, MT, smack in the middle of the Rocky Mountains. Missoula, for those of you who are into movies, was the "location" for the movie _A River Runs Through It_. Days, I work for a software company to pay my fabric and textile and book jones. I've sewn a little since I was small, but it was mostly quilting, and I didn't get into costuming, let alone *historical* costuming until I was in my 20s. I have worked at a couple of university costume shops, done professional sewing for a living a couple of times (once, doing alterations and repairs, and one awful 7-year stretch making custom tents, tipis, awnings, and outfitters' products). I live with 4 cats (one of whom is named after Sophonisba Anguissola), waaay too many books, and an ever-burgeoning stash of needlework tools, yarns, threads, fabric, and half-finished projects. My primary outlet for historical costuming comes through my involvement in the SCA, where I am known as Mistress Maire NiNuanain (OL and OP). Most of my experience in costuming and needlework is 16th century English/French, although recently I've been branching out into earlier styles. My current projects are mostly pre-costuming related--I'm working on spinning enough yarn to weave my own clothing (at least once!), learning to knit and naalbind and weave on a horizontal loom. I've been lucky enough to meet a few of the folk on this list--Robin and Teddy, and, I think, Albra (many years ago at Estrella). I'm interested in clothing from many different time periods, and would love to explore 18th century stuff, especially, but do not have any groups near me that do anything like that. I like to do a lot of research, but I also enjoying the making of something, being a more process-oriented person than anything.... --sue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 22:22:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i133MQSd010405 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:22:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133LacP010728; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:21:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133LZ2v087409; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:21:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133LV2v087373 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:21:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a21.in-tch.com [66.62.107.1]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i132xEc13317 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:59:14 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <401F1473.5080702@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 20:24:35 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL References: <3FF954AF000119D5@mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <3FF954AF000119D5@mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey, Laurellen! I didn't know you lurked on this list! How cool! (guys, she's a costuming *goddess*!) --sue The Renaissance Tailor wrote: > Hello, > > I am Tammie L. Dupuis > aka in the SCA as Laurellen de Brandevin > Consistently engaged in late 16th and early 17th century clothing, exploring > American Colonial period clothing currently. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 22:36:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i133abSd010467 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:36:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133XCcP011268; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133XA2v092893; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from obsidian.spiritone.com (obsidian.spiritone.com [216.99.193.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133X82w092879 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:33:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by obsidian.spiritone.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i133QRLK017923 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:26:27 -0800 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:26:05 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 In-Reply-To: Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Regina Romsey, Old Used Drachenwald Viscountess (tm). Currently portraying a Lady born at various times in Romsey, Hampshire, England. Concentrating between 1465 and 1600. Supporting myself as the Lady Wife of a Viscount with wanderlust and a patent from the Crown to act as Ambassador to _fill in the blank_. Daddy is also an Ambassador so I get to run the lands while the boys are off making themselves feel important. I'm very interested in clothing of whatever time period, and the lives of the people who wear it and to a certain extent make it. I'm a noblewoman because I'm middle class peasantry today and see no reason why I should play such a position in my fantasies! Regina Romsey "Make not the best, foe to the good, But ask, "Did I the best I could?" Not angels' best, nor other men's, Nor what thou mayst a season hence, But at each day's end, seek to say, 'I did the best I could today.'" Gweyrvyl/Andrea Huwydd Lycsenbwrg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 22:55:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i133tMSd010544 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:55:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133pvcP012261; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:51:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133pr2v001844; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:51:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.130]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i133pp2v001832 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:51:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1320R919911 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:00:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from 209-165-40-007.jps.net ([209.165.40.7] helo=pavilion) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AnprV-0005WM-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:00:26 -0800 Message-ID: <006d01c3e9fa$d27e6360$0728a5d1@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roll Call Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:09:20 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lisa Sinervo, not in the SCA or any group because I really like the costuming and research side more than actually dressing up and I can't act. I am however working on a starch house (one day tailors shop) and have spent the last several weeks developing tinted starches using cochineal, ultramarine, saffron, indigo, turmeric and anything else period I could get my hands on, I had 50 pounds of wheat starch to work with. It's a strange sight to see a bright blue ruff. I'm also busy webbing an organizing info on the 16th century clothing industry, mostly because I can never remember where I read what and its fun to do, plus I can then read it at work ;-) Lisa Sinervo see www.thrednedlestrete.com/cfblog/experiments.htm (for a really blue ruff ) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 23:27:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i134RVSd010624 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:27:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i134OZcP014223; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:24:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i134OU2v016597; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:24:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lakemtao08.cox.net (lakemtao08.cox.net [68.1.17.113]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i134OR2v016537 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:24:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from magdlena@cox.net) Received: from ox1.cox.net ([68.12.243.73]) by lakemtao08.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.05 201-253-122-130-105-20030824) with ESMTP id <20040203021021.PGWF2412.lakemtao08.cox.net@ox1.cox.net> for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:10:21 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040202200831.00a6d718@pop.central.cox.net> X-Sender: magdlena@pop.central.cox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 20:12:46 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Magdalena Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL In-Reply-To: <20040202185830.71885.qmail@web9406.mail.yahoo.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Christina Biles, Stillwater, Oklahoma. Sometimes known as Magdalena da Cadamosto, or Maggie, in the SCA. My current obsessions are 8th century Anglian costume and 1530-1630ish shirts and smocks. By day I am a mild mannered librarian, by night a wild-eyed hoarder of fabric. -Christina _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 2 23:29:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i134TOSd010629 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:29:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i134PqcP014297; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:25:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i134Pq2v017193; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:25:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta10.wss.scd.yahoo.com (mta10.wss.scd.yahoo.com [66.218.85.41]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i134Pn2v017142 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:25:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from TheTailor@renaissancetailor.com) Received: from [207.220.159.98] by mta10.wss.scd.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:18:16 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:18:16 -0800 Message-ID: <3F615C4900055FCE@mta10.wss.scd.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <401F1473.5080702@in-tch.com> From: "The Renaissance Tailor" Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL To: "Historical Costume" , "Historical Costume" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i134Pn2v017142 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Marie! I was wondering if you were still on this list. How cool indeed! > >Hey, Laurellen! I didn't know you lurked on this list! How cool! >(guys, she's a costuming *goddess*!) >--sue > >The Renaissance Tailor wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I am Tammie L. Dupuis >> aka in the SCA as Laurellen de Brandevin >> Consistently engaged in late 16th and early 17th century clothing, exploring >> American Colonial period clothing currently. "The only man who behaved sensibly was my tailor; he took my measurement anew every time he saw me, while all the rest went on with their old measurements and expected them to fit me." - George Bernard Shaw _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 00:16:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i135GMSd011034 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:16:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i135F4cP016882; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:15:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i135F22v040640; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:15:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i135EC2v040173 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:15:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hrjones@socrates.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i135DqV6016649 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:13:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from [136.152.197.7] (tnt-1-71.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.197.7]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i135Dacb016446 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:13:44 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202110606.019263d0@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> References: <5.2.1.1.2.20040202110606.019263d0@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:24:22 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Need help on medieval fabric terms Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 11:09 AM -0500 2/2/04, M Stewart wrote: >Hey Cyn, I'd be more inclined to say fur if it was 'vair' - which >is based on squirrel. But vert - as far as I know heraldically (?) >is simply green. The "gules for red was based upon a fur that was >red in color" is a new idea to me. Do you happen to know where >your friend found this? I'd be interested to look into that. It's mentioned among a wide variety of other possibilities in the discussion at , but I don't believe that any specific etymology has overwhelming support. Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 00:20:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i135KmSd011049 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:20:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i135I3cP017021; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:18:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i135I22v042029; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:18:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pop2a.ripco.com (root@pop2a.ripco.com [209.100.227.25]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i135I02v042012 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:18:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zski@ripco.com) Received: from ripco.com (tcr50.dynip.ripco.net [209.100.226.50]) by pop2a.ripco.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i134rQQs010393 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:53:28 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <401F28F0.70300@ripco.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 22:52:00 -0600 From: zski User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL References: <200402030352.i133qA2x002011@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm Wendy Zdrodowski from Chicago. Got into costuming through Ren-Faires, where I now perform as a musician (www.minstrosity.com). We perform throughout the midwest region, and are working on our third CD. I do primarily Elizabethan, modified in a few places for convenience (larger armholes for example, so I can set up stages easily), but I am also a recent convert to Flemish working dress. I also just made a new set of nobles, partially using Margo Anderson's pattern set. First try at extensive beading and padded pleats, among other things. I also have a history in comic-book costuming and improvisation - I was CC21's "Magic Cloak (made of 343 'Magic-The Gathering' cards) and the model for Iron Costumer's "Dodo of the Internet". I used to retail out of a boutique and do more commission work, but as the band has gotten more successful I have cut back to only a few regular clients - and myself, of course. I have a "day job" as the receptionist/admin for the local American Cancer Society office. I share a tiny studio apartment with 2 sewing machines, a serger, an extensive research library, and a hamster. WZ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 00:28:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i135SbSd011072 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:28:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1357kcP016448; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:07:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1357h2v037122; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:07:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc13.comcast.net (sccrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.202.64]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1357e2w037068 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:07:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from ches (c-24-1-46-34.client.comcast.net[24.1.46.34]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc13) with SMTP id <2004020304584501600adttue>; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 04:58:45 +0000 Message-ID: <00a201c3ea11$fdcbee90$222e0118@ches> From: "Chiara" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202150245.45730.qmail@web14003.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:55:30 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Franchesca V. Havas, glove maker, mommy of three, wife to one, friend to a very sweet kitty that the whole family is allergic to except me. SCA: Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio Amtgard: Contessa Francesca d'Pisa bella note dolce vita Vecchio Havas Grande Corleon, sir (what can I say, I love my name *smile*) And no, hubby does not play at all, he is a tolerant sweet man. :) I like and make Elizabethan. I like starting most of my creations by hand sewing them together to make sure of fit then reinforce them with machine stitching cause I have 3 kids that like to hang off my costumes, make me chase them, and men keep stepping on my train in hopes that I will pinch their butts (long story). I do not trust my hand sewing THAT much. My newest project, well three new projects, 1) recreating the phoenix dress by August, 2) sewing every Wednesday this year until all my fabric is gone, and 3) making armor to be a standard bearer at Gulf Wars (SCA) Chiara : > : > On Fri, 30 Jan 2004, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: : > : > > I would like to know who is on the list at : > pressent time. : > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 01:25:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i136PESd011166 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:25:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i136LfcP019580; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:21:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i136LW2v069320; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:21:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mprdmxin.myway.com (nn7.excitenetwork.com [207.159.120.61]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i136LV2v069269 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:21:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from emmajean@myway.com) Received: by mprdmxin.myway.com (Postfix, from userid 110) id 5BE85397D; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:57:53 -0500 (EST) To: h-costume@indra.com Received: from [142.161.158.39] by mprdmailfe1.nwk.myway.com via HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 00:57:53 EST X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: ID = 61418691ebf51f5cd09ed027997ac7c5 From: "Wendy" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: emmajean@myway.com X-Mailer: PHP Message-Id: <20040203055753.5BE85397D@mprdmxin.myway.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:57:53 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I'm a lurker, Wendy Speary and I live in the Great White North, Winnipeg Manitoba where on Wed it was -39C! (-38.2F). My family recently returned to the SCA, where I am known as Emma deVos and live in the Barony of Castel Rouge. I am married to Pedro, AKA Pedro Ramirez, AKA Shingen and have the best, almost 4 year old boy, Leo. I make garb for my family, including rapier armour, mainly from 16th and 17th C. (shameless plug, www.hecate.ca/emma/ ) but will be making cottes and gambeson for a Pas d'Arm event we are doing in June. After June I will be making my son's first breeches. He has chosen a pierced leather doublet with stripey pants from a Dutch painting by Ketel.In the real world, I do custom work for a cool vintage/costume shop called Ragpicker's Antifashion Emporium, and I work at a sex shop called the Love Nest. _______________________________________________ No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding. Introducing My Way - http://www.myway.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 01:35:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i136ZTSd011224 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:35:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i136YRcP020054; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:34:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i136YQ2v074547; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:34:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay11-dav8.bay11.hotmail.com [64.4.38.112]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i136YN2v074472 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:34:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bear_janet@msn.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:17:02 -0800 Received: from 4.10.36.229 by bay11-dav8.bay11.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 06:17:02 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [4.10.36.229] X-Originating-Email: [bear_janet@msn.com] X-Sender: bear_janet@msn.com From: "JAMES OGILVIE" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202154639.828.qmail@web12905.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:16:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 8.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202 Seal-Send-Time: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:16:59 -0500 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2004 06:17:02.0659 (UTC) FILETIME=[56BB9130:01C3EA1D] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i136ZTSd011224 Status: RO It is a long list, especially since so many of us have more than 1 name and persona. My real name is Janet Davis and my SCA name is Leah Janette, also known as the Book Lady. I have learned a lot from this list, although I am not actually sewing these days. (I love designing clothes, love buying fabric even more and like wearing costumes - it's the part in the middle that's too much work.) After the KWCS in Denver this fall, I got inspired to take the big collection of clothing images I've been saving on the computer and do a presentation of artworks depicting styles that are seldom worn in the SCA. I live in Erie,PA in a drafty Victorian house with 5 cats and a significant other. Janet Janet Davis Castle Furnishings www.medievalbookstore.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 02:25:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i137OxSd031139 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:25:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i137O0cP021619; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:24:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i137Nt2v095256; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:23:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i137Ns2v095244 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:23:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cabbagerose@sbcglobal.net) Received: from unknown (HELO angelap3a8d978) (cabbagerose@sbcglobal.net@67.118.230.145 with login) by smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2004 07:17:12 -0000 Message-ID: <009e01c3ea26$cc695da0$91e67643@angelap3a8d978> From: "Cabbage Rose" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040202235836.72319.qmail@web12904.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here- ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:24:45 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Angela Lazear, Newark, CA - Theatrical Costumer. Got hooked on the list eons ago when Mara talked me through a production of Brigadoon. So many folks with so much wonderful knowledge. Freakishly obsessed with the 20s, "anything by Bjarne", and pretty much everything y'all make and put pics up of. Oh yeah, Italian Renn! angela Angela F. Lazear Cabbage Rose Costumes http://www.cabbagerosecostumes.com Theatrical Costume Design "O, what a world of vile ill-favored faults looks handsome in three hundred pounds a year!..." The Merry Wives of Windsor, III, iv - W. Shakespeare _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 03:03:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1383RSd004685 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 03:03:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1380gcP022449; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:00:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1380e2v010001; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:00:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1380T2v009846 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:00:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A52C397B008A; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 02:00:44 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A52CC26029E; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 02:00:44 -0600 Message-ID: <000f01c3ea2b$b8c075e0$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040203055753.5BE85397D@mprdmxin.myway.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:59:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Welcome, welcome! It is so nice to see the lurkers coming on the list! I know there are more of you out there. It is so much fun reading about all of you. I have been on h-costume since I was a college student in 1996. I have made several wonderful friends on the list... also had the wonderful pleasure of meeting several of them. If you are bored and want to read my bio, it is at: http://www.costumegallery.com/classroom/Penny/bio.htm Currently I am working on putting several new articles about the ladies and children's fashions during the American Civil War AND the carnival/masquerade season history up in our online Library. My latest creative outlets are 1970s crocheting and quilting. In other spare time (LOL) we are working on finding the perfect college for my 4th son to go for theater technology. I hope the newbies enjoy the list as much as all the old-timers have. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 03:15:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i138FDSd004747 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 03:15:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i138EKcP022824; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:14:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i138EI2v015087; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:14:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from cmsrelay02.mx.net (cmsrelay02.mx.net [165.212.11.111]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i138EG2v015049 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:14:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from younganne@usa.net) Received: from cmsapps01.cms.usa.net (165.212.11.136) by cmsoutbound.mx.net with SMTP; 3 Feb 2004 08:07:29 -0000 Received: from cmsweb10.cms.usa.net [165.212.8.26] by cmsapps01.cms.usa.net (ASMTP/) via mtad (C8.MAIN.3.13N) with ESMTP id 276iBciHA0490M36; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:07:26 GMT X-USANET-Auth: 165.212.8.26 AUTO younganne@usa.net cmsweb10.cms.usa.net Received: from 63.187.201.0 [63.187.201.0] by cmsweb10.cms.usa.net (USANET web-mailer CM.0402.7.03); Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:07:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 00:07:25 -0800 From: Shea Young To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL] X-Mailer: USANET web-mailer (CM.0402.7.03) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <106iBciHZ4176S10.1075795645@cmsweb10.cms.usa.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i138EG2v015049 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin Netherton wrote: > Once or twice we've had a "lurker day" where we've encouraged people who > don't normally post to step forward and let us know who they are, what > they do, what they're interested in. Well Robin, here is a lurker responding to your suggestion. I'm Shea Young, formerly Munroe. I have been a list member on and off for 10 years or so. My occasional posts have usually been about books because that's my business! I have worn vintage clothes and sewn for about 40 years - sometimes professionally. I too am a fabriholic with a houseful of round-to-it projects. I've always been fixated on the Aesthetic Movement and love the idea of the Edwardians reinventing medieval clothing. I can have much more artist freedom with fabrics and embellishments in recreating a William Morris tapestry gown than a simple kirtle, though the challenge to fit the kirtle correctly is on my to-do list - along with a million other things... Currently living in Portland, Oregon where I joined my husband, Tim, in reenacting the Hudson Bay Company fur trading period (1790-1850). I was converted from portraying a member of the Sanitary Commission during the American Civil War! We are now focusing on mid-late 18th century. My stays are about half finished and I did Sharon's repo quilted waistcoat. Next up is a Mill Farm gown, then a J.P. Ryan jacket and petticoat - possibly a waistcoat for Tim. I often say that the main reason I married him 6 years ago is because his fabric stash was almost as big as mine, and he had the Montgomery book! Good man.... That's it for me. Shea Young ~ ~ ~ ~ "As you go the way of life, you will see a great chasm. JUMP! It is not as wide as you think." ~ Joesph Campbell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 03:30:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i138UjSd004876 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 03:30:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i138TkcP023096; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:29:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i138Tc2v020010; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:29:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.130]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i138Ta2v019993 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:29:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) Received: from firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net (firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.121.247]) by soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i135Zq908919 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:35:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from user-12l20lu.cable.mindspring.com ([69.81.2.190] helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AntDx-0004LL-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 21:35:49 -0800 Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040202231508.0217bec0@pop.radiks.net> X-Sender: costumrs@radiks.net@pop.radiks.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 23:21:56 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e5332a50e9c2fbc553c3c2be2292b8ec044fb527c66d86e6dbe350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Roll call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Pierre Pettinger, Sandy Pettinger (who does most of the posting here): Primarily science fiction/fantasy costumers; but as you all know, there are NO original designs, so historical and ethnic info comes in really handy when designing fantasy costumes. Have done stuff based on many different eras and cultures. Pierre is stockroom coordinator and jack-of-all-jobs for a retail store (and sews his own stuff, besides doing the patterns), I program mainframe computers for an international corporation. We live in Lincoln, NE, and are members of the St. Louis Costumers' Guild (a really fun bunch!!) Hope to see some of you in Atlanta for Costume Con 22 (shameless plug). Sandy "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 03:33:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i138X0Sd004887 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 03:33:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i138WCcP023170; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:32:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i138WC2v020972; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:32:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i138WA2v020959 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:32:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from hall.mail.mindspring.net (hall.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.60]) by fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i12MvDn25224 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 17:57:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from sdn-ap-009masprip0099.dialsprint.net ([63.186.144.99]) by hall.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AnmyH-0007vs-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 17:55:13 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 17:55:47 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL From: ruthanne baumgartner To: Historical Costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20040202202739.18684.qmail@web9405.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi everybody. I'm Ruth Anne Baumgartner, and the closest I've come to a period name is a quickie Queen Ruthanna at a Medieval Banquet last Saturday evening. I've been lurking on the list for a couple of months and am wild with admiration and envy. I was a college professor of English specializing (well, my training specialized) in Elizabethan and Jacobean drama. I'm now part-time in a couple of college English depts (the result of a forced strike, permanent replacement of striking tenured faculty, and then a Rev. Moon take-over at the University of Bridgeport, my former employers). The "up" side of that is that seeking a creative outlet (part-time teaching:teaching = baby-sitting:parenting, i.e. none of the long-range planning and development!) I stumbled into theatrical directing. I've directed at a few community theaters and one professional theater in Connecticut, where I live. I now chair the Board of Directors at one of the community theaters (Town Players, Newtown), and there I've been directing a classic production every summer, usually a !!!Shakespeare!!! or other Eliz or Jac drama (way to use that training, girl!). That is, 6 Shakespeares so far, Beaumont's Knight of the Burning Pestle, Jonson's Bartholomew Fair, and a parody I wrote called The Revenge Tragedy: A Comedy. And because it's a community theater with virtually no budget, I costume my own shows. I think that although taking Shakespeare into other time periods or places can once in a while produce something interesting, nothing fits the text and preserves the timelessness better than Eliz/Jac costuming. Similarly, my few excursions into later times (The Country Wife, The Rivals) cried out for Restoration and Eighteenth-century costuming. Give the audience the world of the play, not just the text. (We also add period songs and dances, thanks to my own music background and a friend who teaches historical dance.) Alas, budget and time constraints force a lot of compromises. I suppose it's just as well, since neither the size of our stage nor the level of awareness of our particular audience is really appropriate for full accuracy of style, construction, and materials. My costumes (you can see some of them at www.newtownplayers.org) go for the line rather than the detail, harmony of color rather than authenticity of color, and "yore" rather than a precise year or location. And, following the dictum of my own college theater director that if the text is rich the production should be plain and if the text is plain the production should be rich, I leave most of the ornamentation for Shakespeare rather than trying to put it on the clothing. With two and once in a while three sewing assistants and substantial help from Simplicity, Butterick, McCalls, et al., I costume fifteen to twenty-five actors in the space of five weeks. (The last few years have been a little easier since I've built a collection that is becoming more and more presentable and so can re-use a number of things from year to year.) BUT I wish I had the knowledge, the skill, the patience, the budget, the time, and the focus to mount, just once, an "authentic" production. Maybe someday I'll be able to put to use some of the knowledge I'm gleaning from you. My cap (of whatever period you choose) is off to you all! Ruth Anne Baumgartner _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 04:40:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i139eQSd005444 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 04:40:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i139b3cP025825; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:37:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i139b02v042144; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:37:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i139av2v042099 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:36:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ABD44860026; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 03:37:24 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ABD5A5300B4; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 03:37:25 -0600 Message-ID: <002401c3ea39$3a282210$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> <6.0.1.1.2.20040202231508.0217bec0@pop.radiks.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 04:36:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sandy, What are the dates for Costume Con in Atlanta? Do you have the URL for their site? Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 04:58:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i139wHSd005473 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 04:58:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i139sxcP026280; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:54:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i139sw2v049081; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:54:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com (fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com [66.185.86.73]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i139st2v049042 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 02:54:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nicolaa@rogers.com) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com (InterMail vM.5.01.05.12 201-253-122-126-112-20020820) with ESMTP id <20040203031326.QDJQ429433.fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com@localhost> for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:13:26 -0500 X-Mailer: Openwave WebEngine, version 2.8.10 (webedge20-101-191-20030113) From: To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:13:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH LOGIN at fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com from [127.0.0.1] using ID at Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:13:26 -0500 Message-Id: <20040203031326.QDJQ429433.fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com@localhost> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings-- I'm Susan Carroll-Clark, and my main interest is 12th-14th century English costume, with the focus right smack in the middle in the 13th century, although if it's medieval or Renaissance, I've probably tried it or thought about it or researched it. Clerical and academic clothing is a sub-interest, and I hope to have a paper published soon that came from a session I did two years ago at Kalamazoo. (I run with that DISTAFF crowd :-) This is actually what I'm "doing" with my doctorate (in history) these days, since I have a day job with a bank. I'm an SCA member, where I'm known as Nicolaa de Bracton. I just stepped down as editor of Tournaments Illuminated and am enjoying my rocking chair and afghan :-) I live in Toronto, which is Eoforwic in the Kingdom of Ealdormere, and am a member of the Order of the Laurel for research and the Order of the Pelican for editing stuff (more or less :-)My current project is to learn tablet weaving. I'm also back to doing commission work for members of my group, and am just finishing up a nice quilted jupon. Susan 1 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 06:14:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13BEESd005608 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 06:14:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13BAlcP028679; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 04:10:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13BAf2v076303; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 04:10:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from gold.wightman.on.ca (gold.wightman.ca [216.249.0.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13BAd2v076292 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 04:10:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by gold.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id E57A44774B for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 05:48:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from d7k7b6 (unknown [142.46.141.52]) by gold.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with SMTP id 619A247747 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 05:48:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <003501c3ea43$69846aa0$348d2e8e@wightman.ca> From: "Five Rivers" To: References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 05:48:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS snapshot-20010714 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yep, I'm on the bandwagon too. I'm a costumer by default. Embroidery is truly my passion, but one runs out of things on which to put embroidery, and historically embroidery is so much a part of garments. I do 100 Years War, specifically 15th century, Georgian, Regency and Victorian. Infrequent part of the SCA, known as Leonora up here in Ealdormere. Much of my embroidery involves either historical reproduction garments or art textiles, mostly worked on silk, silk/wool blends, linen, primarily in filament silk and gold bullion thread. At the moment I'm working on a series of wall hangings I've designed, based on the Celtic theme of Earth, Wind, Fire, Water. Earth and Fire are done. Wind is on the frame with Water begging to go on as soon as possible. I also run Five Rivers Chapmanry with my husband, Gary, who is the cooper. I take care of the pattern and textile division and oversee the administration of the business. Oh, and high, Kathy Page! I can certainly attest the fact Kathy has a closet full of Victorian frillies! Remember that fashion show? Regards Lorina Five Rivers Chapmanry ~ purveyors of quality hand-crafted cooperage fine hand-sewn embroidered garments, historical sewing patterns & embroidery supplies (519) 799-5577, http://www.5rivers.org email: info@5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 09:03:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13E32Sd006195 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:03:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13E20cP003474; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:02:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13E1r2v040493; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:01:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web12906.mail.yahoo.com (web12906.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.73]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i13E1a2v040338 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:01:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Message-ID: <20040203135454.87580.qmail@web12906.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.48.41.31] by web12906.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:54:54 EST Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:54:54 -0500 (EST) From: Kathy Page To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200402031111.i13BBG2v076544@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] The goodies in Kathy's closet - was Roll call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO YES! *LOL* I do! Can't forget it! I pulled together that show in a month and a bit, with only one item not making it from planning to finished product. I did not only one of those fashion shows, but 2!! I have 13-14 odd items (above and beyond the items that were made for me) of decadent lace, silk and cotton combinations in storage in my closet, ranging from US Confed to flapper era. For the second year fashion show, I even pulled off a second completely over the top 1776 gown, complete with all the proper undergarments for a friend (who, frustratingly, never took it home with her as she intended. I have since sold the corset and underskirt, and will likely rip apart the gown and make a late period Venetian with it. Black/pink shot taffeta isn't necessarily my first choice, but I have YARDS and YARDS of the stuff hanging around - I am thinking a really wild fencing frock.) These projects are what started my well hidden obsession with vintage black lace - that stuff is HARD to find! Although what I have done with it is... wow. I just like running my fingers over the ruffly layers of black lace....Not to disparage what I have done in the past with white lace either. :-) There is an Edwardian lingerie dress made of voile and countless yards of french lace in that closet with over 60 hours of lace-joining time invested in it - ah, the things I did B.B. (before baby). My personal favourite is the Edwardian petticoat that swooshes and rustles so nice! I really need to get rid of a lot of it though. Not even a third of it would fit me (never did since it was made for fashion show models - REAL people, not human coat hangers with arms!), and I am not doing that period right now. Hubby is nagging me to auction it off on Ebay. Hey.. any takers on a bunch of Vic and Ed period underfrillies? Kathy Oh, and high, Kathy Page! I can certainly attest the fact Kathy has a closet full of Victorian frillies! Remember that fashion show? Regards Lorina --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 09:29:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13ETHSd006255 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:29:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13ESLcP004733; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:28:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13ESJ2v053140; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:28:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m08.mx.aol.com (imo-m08.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.163]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13ESH2v053088 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:28:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from IceGirlNIN@aol.com) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.24.4e872899 (3972) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:22:52 -0500 (EST) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <24.4e872899.2d5108bc@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:22:52 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5006 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bandwagon time! Christine Gorman, from New York, though I'm currently attending college at Carnegie Mellon in Pittsburgh (love the college, hate the fact that it hasn't stopped snowing/raining/generally being gray out since I got back in mid-January *g*). Currently a first year psychology major, though I'm going to try and switch or double-major in CMU's school of drama costume design major (didn't even know about it until I went and saw one of the drama school's plays, it's that small!). Anyhow, I've been sewing for almost two years, and my main area of study and creation is c.1560 Elizabethan, though I've been commissioned for that civil war ballgown that I asked about a week or so ago, and I've done faux Fortuny and two Star Wars costumes. I'll probably be dabbling in Italian Ren and possibly Flemish working class/peasant, and quite possibly earlier period things. I inherited my need to sew from my grandmother (it was just latent until recently, that's all!), though if she were alive today she'd likely be shaking her head over my "workspace" and telling me to organize things better. Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 09:49:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13EnMSd006367 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:49:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Em3cP005795; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:48:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Em12v062289; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:48:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9402.mail.yahoo.com (web9402.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.108]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i13Elw2v062263 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:47:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040203144117.4838.qmail@web9402.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9402.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 06:41:17 PST Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 06:41:17 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO WOW--and my cap off to you, Ruth Ann--for doing so much in theater--! That's a pretty impressive list of accomplishments---associated with being directer. It's now your turn to be the object of other's 'admiration and envy':) Cheers and Best! Albra ruthanne baumgartner wrote: Hi everybody. I'm Ruth Anne Baumgartner, and the closest I've come to a period name is a quickie Queen Ruthanna at a Medieval Banquet last Saturday evening. I've been lurking on the list for a couple of months and am wild with admiration and envy. I was a college professor of English specializing (well, my training specialized) in Elizabethan and Jacobean drama. I'm now part-time in a couple of college English depts (the result of a forced strike, permanent replacement of striking tenured faculty, and then a Rev. Moon take-over at the University of Bridgeport, my former employers). The "up" side of that is that seeking a creative outlet (part-time teaching:teaching = baby-sitting:parenting, i.e. none of the long-range planning and development!) I stumbled into theatrical directing. I've directed at a few community theaters and one professional theater in Connecticut, where I live. I now chair the Board of Directors at one of the community theaters (Town Players, Newtown), and there I've been directing a classic production every summer, usually a !!!Shakespeare!!! or other Eliz or Jac drama (way to use that training, girl!). That is, 6 Shakespeares so far, Beaumont's Knight of the Burning Pestle, Jonson's Bartholomew Fair, and a parody I wrote called The Revenge Tragedy: A Comedy. And because it's a community theater with virtually no budget, I costume my own shows. I think that although taking Shakespeare into other time periods or places can once in a while produce something interesting, nothing fits the text and preserves the timelessness better than Eliz/Jac costuming. Similarly, my few excursions into later times (The Country Wife, The Rivals) cried out for Restoration and Eighteenth-century costuming. Give the audience the world of the play, not just the text. (We also add period songs and dances, thanks to my own music background and a friend who teaches historical dance.) Alas, budget and time constraints force a lot of compromises. I suppose it's just as well, since neither the size of our stage nor the level of awareness of our particular audience is really appropriate for full accuracy of style, construction, and materials. My costumes (you can see some of them at www.newtownplayers.org) go for the line rather than the detail, harmony of color rather than authenticity of color, and "yore" rather than a precise year or location. And, following the dictum of my own college theater director that if the text is rich the production should be plain and if the text is plain the production should be rich, I leave most of the ornamentation for Shakespeare rather than trying to put it on the clothing. With two and once in a while three sewing assistants and substantial help from Simplicity, Butterick, McCalls, et al., I costume fifteen to twenty-five actors in the space of five weeks. (The last few years have been a little easier since I've built a collection that is becoming more and more presentable and so can re-use a number of things from year to year.) BUT I wish I had the knowledge, the skill, the patience, the budget, the time, and the focus to mount, just once, an "authentic" production. Maybe someday I'll be able to put to use some of the knowledge I'm gleaning from you. My cap (of whatever period you choose) is off to you all! Ruth Anne Baumgartner _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 10:30:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13FUhSd006508 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:30:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13FQhcP008234; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:26:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13FQe2v082821; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:26:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13FQZ2v082786 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:26:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kerowyn@mindspring.com) Received: from mclean.mail.mindspring.net (mclean.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.57]) by fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i13EGie07602 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:16:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from dialup-171.75.220.15.dial1.saintlouis1.level3.net ([171.75.220.15] helo=Dan) by mclean.mail.mindspring.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Ao1M2-0001Eo-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 09:16:42 -0500 Message-ID: <00f001c3ea60$a9446e20$0fdc4bab@Dan> From: "Genie" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:18:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] re:roll call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i13FUhSd006508 Status: RO Genie here, also a member of St Louis Costumer's Guild. Strictly an amateur compared to most of the folks on this list. Trying to complete an outfit for myself and my daughter for CC while recovering from CTS surgery. Yes i should have started much sooner... Snow fallen on snow, and this evening, the full moon of November Basho _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 10:48:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13FmCSd006603 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:48:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13FkEcP009893; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:46:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13FkD2v095090; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:46:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu (kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu [169.147.4.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13FkB2v095035 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:46:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ckinsey@kumc.edu) Received: from KUMC-SMTPOUT-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 09:46:05 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 09:45:49 -0600 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Costume event in KC X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Since I noticed that some many folks on the list were in the midwest I thought some of you might be interested in an SCA event this weekend. The Walk Through History is always my favorite :). http://www2.kumc.edu/itc/staff/rknight/CS.htm Catherine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 10:54:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13FsUSd006620 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:54:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13FjBcP009793; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:45:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Fj62v094376; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:45:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu (kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu [169.147.4.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Fj22v094276 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:45:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ckinsey@kumc.edu) Received: from KUMC-SMTPOUT-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 09:44:56 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 09:44:39 -0600 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ok, another semi-lurker delurks :). My name is Catherine Kinsey. I have been an occasional poster on this list for several years. I learned to sew at my mother's knee, which came in handy as I got involved in SF cons, Renfaires (KCRF, 25 years and counting) and the SCA (Calontir), pretty much in that order. I tend to time travel with my wardrobe and since hubby is a performer at faire I get to try a lot of styles (altho *3* Henry VIII outfits in a row was enough!!!). I also do a lot of embroidery and more recently have been pulled into lacemaking. I prefer the medieval, renaissance and Elizabethan eras but love to scratch my historical costume itch with information on just about any era, which makes me a natural for this list :). You folks are a wonderful inspiration! Catherine/Liriel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 11:39:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13Gd2Sd006817 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:39:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13GaxcP014505; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:36:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Gat2v029888; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:36:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web20301.mail.yahoo.com (web20301.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.82]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i13Gas2v029871 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:36:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from queensno2000@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040203163012.26240.qmail@web20301.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [207.43.195.202] by web20301.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:30:12 PST Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:30:12 -0800 (PST) From: Sharon Greany To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello, I'm Sharon Greany. I live in Poulsbo, WA. Which is about 30 miles west of Seattle as the crow flies. I'm mostly a lurker. I have been sewing since I was 12 years old. In College I started sewing for the Theater groups and have never stopped. My first love was the Victorian but have since moved on. I've sewing for theater companies for the pass 20 years but I found that the local theater groups didn't do enough period pieces to keep my imagination happy. Although last spring I did '1776' ( the musical) Which was huge. I think I went blind sewing on all those buttons. A friend got me interested in the SCA. about 5 years ago and I have been having a blast ever since. The SCA knows me as Altaliana de Segna, (Talia) and I hail in the Barony of Dragon's Laire. Although, between work, theater, (if I'm not costuming, I 'm on the stage acting silly) and family, I have little time to make myself things until just recently. I just finished a a 1560 Mourning Gown. Which I love ! Thanks to Kat's help, I bashed out the pattern quite well and have several people wanting me to help them make one. Of course at the time she was helping me, I had no Idea she was on this list. Small world. After the success of the Mourning Gown, I now have two more in the planning stages. All based on the late 16th century loose gown. (ropa) but I need to do more research before I can continue. The fun news is i just moved my sewing room from a 10 x 10 room to a 12 x 20 room and it's already full. I had no idea that I had stuff throw all over the house until I moved it into one room. Now the tuff part is making sure it stays in the room. Sharon --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 11:42:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13GgQSd006846 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:42:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13GbYcP014604; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:37:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13GbY2v030365; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:37:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail.cableone.net (scanmail2.cableone.net [24.116.0.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13GbB2v030069 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:37:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rsewellb@cableone.net) Received: from RebeccaBrown (unverified [24.119.18.41]) by smail2.cableone.net (SurgeMail 1.5d2) with ESMTP id 4978424 for ; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:28:53 -0700 Message-ID: <000e01c3ea6b$8f570170$0200a8c0@RebeccaBrown> From: "Rebecca Brown" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roll Call Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:36:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Server: High Performance Mail Server - http://surgemail.com Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My name is Rebecca Brown, I live in Prescott, Arizona. I have been costuming for20 years but this is my first year selling through our website and catalog. Kind of scary, but liberating also. My emphasis is Medieval, but I have been working on some early Mongol and Turkish lately. I don't think I could ever just choose one area and stick to it. My Andorian costumes even won first prize at a Pasadena Star Trek convention a few years ago and they are pictured in one of William Shatner's books. No one could accuse me of a lack of diversity! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 12:15:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13HFPSd007081 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:15:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13HEFcP017903; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:14:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13HE92v056761; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:14:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13HE02v056499 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:14:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i13HDfT24574.; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:13:41 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 17:13:41 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 17:13:18 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>> wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com 2/2/04 6:15:54 PM >>> >Well if it's a big deal I'm here as well...... >MKA Jacqueline J. Bump Oswego NY >and I run a local chapter of the Adrian. What is "the Adrian" please? Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 13:03:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13I3pSd007381 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:03:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13HwrcP022088; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:58:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Hwq2v090409; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:58:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav40.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.97]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13HwD2v089865 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:58:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:40:51 -0800 Received: from 24.58.108.69 by bay1-dav40.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 17:40:50 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.108.69] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:41:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2004 17:40:51.0256 (UTC) FILETIME=[DDAEA380:01C3EA7C] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.adrianempire.org/ Bice ============================= On Ebay http://snipurl.com/3csb http://my.lulu.com/kristalori Elizabethan Ladies Calendar Rolled Florentine Cap Pattern www.swapking.com/hats ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 12:13 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL > > >>> wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com 2/2/04 6:15:54 PM >>> > >Well if it's a big deal I'm here as well...... > > >MKA Jacqueline J. Bump Oswego NY > >and I run a local chapter of the Adrian. > > What is "the Adrian" please? > > > > Kate Bunting > Library, University of Derby > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 13:04:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13I48Sd007385 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:04:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Hw7cP021995; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:58:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Hw22v089809; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:58:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Hvu2v089680 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:57:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from allivox@comcast.net) Received: from comcast.net (pcp456740pcs.shklfd01.ar.comcast.net[68.51.39.191](misconfigured sender)) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <2004020317524401500dlgv7e>; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:52:44 +0000 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:48:11 -0600 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Allison To: h-costume@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200402030352.i133q92w001997@net.indra.com> Message-Id: <221C2FB0-5671-11D8-A866-000393D446D6@comcast.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Cc: Subject: [h-cost] (no subject) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm Allison Pace, mostly a lurker. I live in Little Rock, AR, and am a voice-over actress by day. I've been an actress and a sewer for many years, and I also like most types of craft work, whether it's props or hatmaking or jewelry. My downfall is that I seem to want to do so much, I never quite finish anything. I've got the requisite tonnage of fabric and supplies and books and plans to complete things, and I have trouble focusing! Been doing mostly Renaissance (English/French/Spanish) stuff, but want to do some Italian Ren, am planning an 1870's Victorian, and would love an excuse to do a full-out 18C set, complete with wig! When I'm working for a theatre with low-budget costuming (or, in many unfortunate cases, a costumer who doesn't *get* it) I have been known to make/find my own costumes, or at the very least, take them home and alter them so they fit me. Two or three years ago I discovered Renaissance Faires, and now I consider myself a historic costume geek. I haven't found many like-minded folks with the time and interest to play with here, so I've been known to travel to other places for a fix. (hint hint) I'm always open to joining someone at a Ren Faire for the weekend! I've been to one Costume Con, with no knowledge of just what to expect, but this year am drooling with anticipation. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 14:35:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13JZKSd007733 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:35:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13JX1cP001663; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:33:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13JWc2v060560; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:32:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from email.iwon.com (nn3.excitenetwork.com [207.159.120.57]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13JWY2v060459 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:32:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from leofsige@iwon.com) Received: by email.iwon.com (Postfix, from userid 110) id D6E4A1C779; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:00:28 -0500 (EST) To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Received: from [208.205.225.66] by prdmailfe8.nwk.iwon.com via HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 14:00:28 EST X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: ID = be614050baf7e9cdbe26fdc091890f95 From: "leofsige@iwon.com" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: leofsige@iwon.com X-Mailer: PHP Message-Id: <20040203190028.D6E4A1C779@email.iwon.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:00:28 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Maggie Griggs - I do costuming, glove making, nalbinding and pretty much anything that strikes my fancy at the moment. Still working to get the shoulder fit on Robin's fitted gothic pattern to come out just right. In the SCA I'm known as Lyssa or The Honorable Lady Leofsige O Caoimh. I live in Colorado or the Outlands depending to which list I'm posting. Currently all the works in progress are on hold except one set of gloves that must be finished before Estrella. Everything else will have to wait until I finish my final level of the VisionWorks International series, Horizons. I generally lurk on the list and appreciate all the wonderful info that is shared. I'm usually too far behind on a topic to contribute though.Maggie / Lyssa--- On Tue 02/03, < h-costume-request@indra.com > wrote:Franchesca V. Havas, glove maker, mommy of three, wife to one, friend to avery sweet kitty that the whole family is allergic to except me.SCA: Chiara Francesca Arianna d'OnofrioAm! tgard: Contessa Francesca d'Pisa bella note dolce vita Vecchio HavasGrande Corleon, sir(what can I say, I love my name *smile*)And no, hubby does not play at all, he is a tolerant sweet man. :)I like and make Elizabethan. I like starting most of my creations by handsewing them together to make sure of fit then reinforce them with machinestitching cause I have 3 kids that like to hang off my costumes, make mechase them, and men keep stepping on my train in hopes that I will pinchtheir butts (long story). I do not trust my hand sewing THAT much.My newest project, well three new projects, 1) recreating the phoenix dressby August, 2) sewing every Wednesday this year until all my fabric is gone,and 3) making armor to be a standard bearer at Gulf Wars (SCA)Chiara: >: > On Fri, 30 Jan 2004, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote:: >: > > I would like to know who is on the list at: > pressent time.: > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 14:48:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13Jm5Sd007762 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:48:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13JiccP002863; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:44:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13JiZ2v069414; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:44:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web40110.mail.yahoo.com (web40110.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.44]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i13JiB2v069015 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:44:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ivycircle@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040203193724.92309.qmail@web40110.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [171.75.6.37] by web40110.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 11:37:24 PST Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:37:24 -0800 (PST) From: me To: h-costume@net.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] roll call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm angelique. We live in the most southwestern part of Arizona. We are members of the SCA and do mostly tudor- to-baroque. I would really enjoy doing some historical costuming 1830's t0 1890's. I have three lovely children who don't mind mommy's historical clothing and in fact, wear most of it as everyday wear,lol. My husband is game for anything, as long as I made it. I loooooooooove this list. I have found more costuming info here than any other list period. Thanks for being here, Angelique --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 14:52:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13Jq4Sd007781 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:52:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Jp6cP003440; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:51:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Jp42v073961; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:51:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc12.comcast.net (rwcrmhc12.comcast.net [216.148.227.85]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Jp02v073864 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:51:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from skskaw@comcast.net) Received: from mom1 (c-24-21-122-88.client.comcast.net[24.21.122.88]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc12) with SMTP id <2004020319454601400ip38qe>; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:45:46 +0000 Message-ID: <00d101c3ea8e$51a3c9d0$6501a8c0@mom1> From: "Sidne Kneeland" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040203055753.5BE85397D@mprdmxin.myway.com> <000f01c3ea2b$b8c075e0$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:45:45 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Boy, lots of Northwest folks! Sidne Kneeland. In the SCA Estrelda named after a street I used to live on Estrellita (little star), Saxon. Does anybody have any ideas about last names for Saxons? Daughter of _occupation name male_ or from_someplace cool_? Mundanely, Vancouver WA. Husband, three boys Viking. Husband's motto, if you have a picture, I can build it - includes metal, wood, boats, furniture, fire pits, trailers, etc. Three cats, one Siamese (who is not JUST cat thanks), one dog, one ferret. Not much time to do costuming. By the time I get the boys simple tunics made for the hottest-day0of the summer event, they outgrow them, sigh. Got to meet Teddy in the UK though. Is Teddy still with us? Sidne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 14:58:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13JwLSd007823 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:58:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13JvScP003952; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:57:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13JvQ2v078663; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:57:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i13JvJ2v078603 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:57:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 12037 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2004 19:57:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail.inreach.com) (209.142.2.163) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2004 19:57:18 -0000 Received: from 24.4.69.40 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:57:18 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1273.24.4.69.40.1075838238.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:57:18 -0800 (PST) From: "Diana Habra" To: h-costume@indra.com User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Serious virus going around X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sorry for the off-topic folks but I need to warn you all.... PLEASE update your virus filters as soon as you can! The new virus going around is called Mydoom and it IS NOT a hoax. There is an article in my local paper about it today (The Contra Costa Times) and I called my internet provider because I was having some weird e-mails being sent to me. It was like I was sending out spam mail and it was being returned as undeliverable. I think I got at least 40 e-mails that I had to delete due to this problem. The technician at Inreach Internet said that what the virus does is attach to one or more addresses in your address book and send spam messages using that e-mail. The worst part (for me and others) is that my computer has nothing wrong with it but I still have to deal with all of the stupid messages. So please urge your family and friends to update their virus definitions so that you and others will be better protected from going through this. Diana -- Diana Habra www.renaissancefabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 15:12:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13KC4Sd007889 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:12:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13K8ccP004957; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:08:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13K8a2v086391; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:08:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13K8S2v086260 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:08:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.1) with ESMTP id 578949 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 12:08:23 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 12:08:23 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] roll call From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20040203193724.92309.qmail@web40110.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm Lynn Downward, from Oakland California. I came to sewing very young, taught myself to crochet in high school at about the time I went to my first renaissance fair. After visiting for a while, I joined in 1977 and finally found my niche in the queens' court in 1980, where I learned to bead, research and have lots of fun. I quit that faire after almost 25 years; we didn't like where the company was taking the history part of the faire. We still participate in the small fair at San Luis Obispo, and we hope to attend the fair at Lake Tahoe this spring. We also participate in the Dickens Christmas fair in San Francisco every November/December. I played in SCA for almost a year in the '70s and decided it wasn't for me at the time. I'm a member of Greater Bay Area Costumers Guild and CSA and have attended Costume College in Van Nuys every July for the past four or five years. My two main interests have always been Elizabethan England and Victorian England from 1860-65, but I've been working on a bustle dress recently and have just decided I have to make myself a middle-class German outfit of the 1560s after spending a day with the women of the Renaissance Military Society. My husband and I met at faire, and our two daughters have been raised participating in costume events all their lives, so there's lots of encouragement to sew costumes in my house. I only make outfits for my family. Even then, I have a full page of projects I want/need to complete in 2004. We could never find the hats we wanted for whatever outfit we wore, so I took millinery classes from several different teachers and discovered another passion. LynnD in rainy California (but at least we don't have snow here) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 15:18:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13KIMSd007907 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:18:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KBEcP005197; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:11:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KBE2v088206; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:11:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mattdrury.net (adslct226.cofs.net [66.77.170.226]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KBC2v088182 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:11:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from widowweeds@cs.com) Received: from Spooler by mattdrury.net (Mercury/32 v3.32) ID MO003132; 3 Feb 04 15:11:08 -0500 Received: from spooler by mattdrury.net (Mercury/32 v3.32); 3 Feb 04 14:40:58 -0500 Received: from mjd (66.77.170.226) by mattdrury.net (Mercury/32 v3.32) with ESMTP ID MG003131; 3 Feb 04 14:40:47 -0500 Message-ID: <14f301c3ea8d$a0f624c0$13fea8c0@mjd> From: "Widow Weeds" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040203190028.D6E4A1C779@email.iwon.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:40:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm here. ;) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 15:22:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13KM4Sd007915 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:22:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KJMcP006041; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:19:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KJL2v094409; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:19:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KJG2v094098 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:19:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i13KJ8T07296.; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:19:08 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 20:19:08 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 20:18:55 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] ROLL CALL Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>> skskaw@comcast.net 2/3/04 7:45:45 PM >>> wrote: >Boy, lots of Northwest folks! Sidne Kneeland. In the SCA Estrelda >named after a street I used to live on Estrellita (little star), Saxon. Does >anybody have any ideas about last names for Saxons? Daughter of >_occupation name male_ or from_someplace cool_? According to "A dictionary of British surnames", Anglo-Saxons had only one name, but sometimes acquired "by-names" from their occupation or place of residence. > Got to meet Teddy in the UK though. Is Teddy still with us? I believe Teddy had to unsubscribe because his employer stopped him from using his work computer for contacting the list. (I've got away with it so far, touch wood!) Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 15:44:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13KilSd007990 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:44:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Kg6cP008296; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:42:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Kg22v013625; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:42:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Kfv2v013481 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:42:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC85F42615 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:53:26 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <402008BA.6030504@reddawn.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 14:46:50 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume event in KC References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Catherine Kinsey wrote: > Since I noticed that some many folks on the list were in the midwest I > thought some of you might be interested in an SCA event this weekend. > The Walk Through History is always my favorite :). > > http://www2.kumc.edu/itc/staff/rknight/CS.htm > Catherine, Is this in the same location as it was last year? Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 16:07:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13L7TSd008091 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:07:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KwTcP010051; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:58:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KwQ2v026071; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:58:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-f55.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.245.55]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13KwJ2v025964 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:58:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from elizabethstewartclark@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:40:45 -0800 Received: from 63.228.184.130 by by1fd.bay1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 20:40:45 GMT X-Originating-IP: [63.228.184.130] X-Originating-Email: [elizabethstewartclark@hotmail.com] X-Sender: elizabethstewartclark@hotmail.com From: "Elizabeth Clark" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 13:40:45 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2004 20:40:45.0582 (UTC) FILETIME=[FF9A12E0:01C3EA95] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Another Lurker, mostly! Elizabeth Clark from Idaho Falls, Idaho, USA, in the foothills of the Rocky Mountains. My chief era of interest is 1840-1865 for infants, children, and women. I teach dressmaking, enjoy research, and really love whitework embroidery. (My era is a bit late for most of this list, but I really enjoy the research aspect of the members!!) Regards, Elizabeth http://www.elizabethstewartclark.com _________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE online virus check for your PC here, from McAfee. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 16:23:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13LNNSd008180 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:23:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13LMAcP012256; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:22:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13LM92v043347; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:22:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav37.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.94]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13LM42v043213 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:22:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:04:44 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav37.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 21:04:43 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> <6.0.1.1.2.20040202231508.0217bec0@pop.radiks.net> Subject: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:05:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2004 21:04:44.0129 (UTC) FILETIME=[590AED10:01C3EA99] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Primarily science fiction/fantasy costumers; but as you all know, there are > NO original designs, so historical and ethnic info comes in really handy > when designing fantasy costumes. I wonder if they shouldn't start by teaching us the squares-and-rectangles way of constructing clothing, and when that's well assimilated, move to "modern" construction. That would follow more or less the evolution of tailoring techniques. Building T-tunics really is useful in some way! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 16:38:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13LcmSd008274 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:38:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Lakcf014929; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:37:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13LIq2v040999; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:18:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav63.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.198]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13LIm2v040905 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:18:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:01:26 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav63.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 21:01:26 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040203055753.5BE85397D@mprdmxin.myway.com> <000f01c3ea2b$b8c075e0$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:01:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2004 21:01:26.0755 (UTC) FILETIME=[E3660B30:01C3EA98] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, I wasn't going to answer because I thought it would turn out being an insanely long list, but since so many people seem to think it not so insane, I'll give it a shot. My real name is Audrey and I'm 23. I live in Montreal, Canada. I'm known in the SCA as Lady Alix de Minerve, and my bf is known in the SCA as Lothaire Villon de Vézelay. I was to play an early 13th century French persona, but I'm interested in too many time periods to stay there. Right now I'm building a couple of Elizabethans, but I also want a burgundian houppelande one day, and some 15th cent Italian, and some Cranach-style stuff, and then a lot of later stuff: early 1800s France, King and I period, etc., even though I have nowhere to wear those. I discovered the SCA 3 1/2 years ago. That's when I began to sew on my own, so you can see that my experience is very recent :-) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 17:01:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13M1BSd008378 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:01:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13LwccP017122; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:58:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13LwX2v070535; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:58:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.pacifier.net (smtp1.pacifier.net [64.255.237.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13LwP2v070429 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:58:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.132.249]) by smtp1.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8986B6FAB8 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 13:58:22 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 13:58:26 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roll Call Message-ID: <401FA902.29785.7EA989@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Elizabeth Clark from Idaho Falls, Idaho, USA, in the foothills of the > Rocky Mountains. My chief era of interest is 1840-1865 for infants, > children, and women. I teach dressmaking, enjoy research, and really > love whitework embroidery. (My era is a bit late for most of this > list, but I really enjoy the research aspect of the members!!) I'd say that you were probably about dead center regarding Era. While we end up talking about clothes from all time periods, there's a lot of interest in the pre-Civil War/Civil War period. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 17:01:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13M1OSd008384 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:01:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13M03cP017294; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:00:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13M022v071625; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:00:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smapp01.siteprotect.com (smapp01.siteprotect.com [66.113.136.12]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Lxu2v071512 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:59:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from smapp01.siteprotect.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smapp01.siteprotect.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i13L5OZ02391; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:05:24 -0600 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:05:24 -0600 Message-Id: <200402032105.i13L5OZ02391@smapp01.siteprotect.com> From: cschmitt@genteelarts.com To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Roll Call Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolann Schmitt from historic Gettysburg, PA. My main area of interest is mid-19th century: men's and women's civilian clothing, needlework, knitting and some embroidery. I'm in my 16th year of teaching hands-on classes on clothing and needlework from 1850-1870, and am the organizer and sponsor of an annual conference on Civil War era civilian clothing and culture. My mother says I never outgrew playing dress-up, and I believe you can never have too much fabric or too many books. Carolann Schmitt www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 5-7, 2004 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 17:18:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13MIiSd008533 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:18:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13MAVcP019105; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:10:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13MAU2v080441; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:10:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9404.mail.yahoo.com (web9404.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.110]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i13MAQ2v080388 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:10:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040203221024.60644.qmail@web9404.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9404.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 14:10:24 PST Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:10:24 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20040203190028.D6E4A1C779@email.iwon.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lyssa--is this the same Lyssa that I met thru Kelvin of Tyndale at Estrella ---Many moons ago??? Albra "leofsige@iwon.com" wrote: Maggie Griggs - I do costuming, glove making, nalbinding and pretty much anything that strikes my fancy at the moment. Still working to get the shoulder fit on Robin's fitted gothic pattern to come out just right. In the SCA I'm known as Lyssa or The Honorable Lady Leofsige O Caoimh. I live in Colorado or the Outlands depending to which list I'm posting. Currently all the works in progress are on hold except one set of gloves that must be finished before Estrella. Everything else will have to wait until I finish my final level of the VisionWorks International series, Horizons. I generally lurk on the list and appreciate all the wonderful info that is shared. I'm usually too far behind on a topic to contribute though.Maggie / Lyssa--- On Tue 02/03, < h-costume-request@indra.com > wrote:Franchesca V. Havas, glove maker, mommy of three, wife to one, friend to avery sweet kitty that the whole family is allergic to except me.SCA: Chiara Francesca Arianna d'OnofrioAm! tgard: Contessa Francesca d'Pisa bella note dolce vita Vecchio HavasGrande Corleon, sir(what can I say, I love my name *smile*)And no, hubby does not play at all, he is a tolerant sweet man. :)I like and make Elizabethan. I like starting most of my creations by handsewing them together to make sure of fit then reinforce them with machinestitching cause I have 3 kids that like to hang off my costumes, make mechase them, and men keep stepping on my train in hopes that I will pinchtheir butts (long story). I do not trust my hand sewing THAT much.My newest project, well three new projects, 1) recreating the phoenix dressby August, 2) sewing every Wednesday this year until all my fabric is gone,and 3) making armor to be a standard bearer at Gulf Wars (SCA)Chiara: >: > On Fri, 30 Jan 2004, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote:: >: > > I would like to know who is on the list at: > pressent time.: > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 17:35:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13MZqSd008743 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:35:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13MXfcP021447; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:33:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13MXZ2v008938; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:33:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13MXV2v008834 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:33:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.118.2e79b2ec (14374) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:33:22 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <118.2e79b2ec.2d517bb2@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:33:22 EST Subject: Re: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/3/2004 4:22:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, audreybmorin2@hotmail.com writes: > Building T-tunics really is useful in some way! > Besides, they can be beautiful. And what do you think a surgical scrub is? A short T-shaped tunic with a V neck. There will always be a head, a torso, two arms and 2 legs. The rest is just a matter of how fitted or full one wants parts and where, top, bottom, all over, nowhere. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 17:53:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13MriSd008902 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:53:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13MqqcP023055; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:52:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Mqn2v022346; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:52:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Mql2v022210 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:52:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Kitsune242@aol.com) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1ad.1f350e4a (16109) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:47:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from aol.com (mow-m05.webmail.aol.com [64.12.184.133]) by air-id12.mx.aol.com (v97.18) with ESMTP id MAILINID121-3eed402024fd3da; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 17:47:25 -0500 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 17:47:20 -0500 From: Kitsune242@aol.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <3FA0F83A.45CD369C.0BD9917F@aol.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 X-AOL-IP: 169.237.109.158 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am a bit late... Sorry. My real name is Shannon McSmith, although I don't like it much, so I use my nickname, which is Kit. I am an active member of the SCA. I have done American Civil War Re-Enactment, Regency and Victorian stuff as well. I am a brunette of medium height who loves quiet evenings in front of the fire, fabric stores and a man who isn't afraid to cook. I am an aries... (Come on, I couldn't resist. Although, I am sure someone else has done it already.) Although, my mother will tell you that she despaired of my ever learning to actually sew. I loved to design and cut out projects, but her machine hated me, so I never finished anything. (Honest to God, that machine would tangle when I walked into the room.) But I started out making horse blankets for my Breyer horses. I started costuming for the Costume-Nazi Drama Teacher I had in High School. She loved really period looking costumes, so that was what I started doing and just never stopped. That being said, my hobbies have always revolved around getting to dress in "funny" or different clothing. Although, I have recently started making my own clothes for the real world as well. I work at UC Davis, and make extensive use of their library for my own personal research on the late Middle Ages, Renaissance & Elizabethan Eras, and the Napoleonic Era through the end of the 2nd World War. Although, I am not very interested in it, I am learning a new appreciation for the English Civil War clothing. I teach classes within the SCA on costuming and embroidery as well, as other items and am working on teaching in other forums as well. Along with being interested in historical clothing, I love fashion and completely believe in the line "The only thing that separates us from the animals is our ability to accessorize." Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cola _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 17:57:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13MvMSd008948 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:57:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Ms3cP023206; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:54:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Ms32v023217; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:54:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m08.mx.aol.com (imo-m08.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.163]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13Mqs2v022321 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:52:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Kitsune242@aol.com) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.9b.438aa38c (16112) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:47:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from aol.com (mow-m03.webmail.aol.com [64.12.184.131]) by air-id12.mx.aol.com (v97.18) with ESMTP id MAILINID124-3ef040202500234; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 17:47:28 -0500 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 17:47:28 -0500 From: Kitsune242@aol.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <3B5491EE.174D6040.0BD9917F@aol.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 X-AOL-IP: 169.237.109.158 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am a bit late... Sorry. My real name is Shannon McSmith, although I don't like it much, so I use my nickname, which is Kit. I am an active member of the SCA. I have done American Civil War Re-Enactment, Regency and Victorian stuff as well. I am a brunette of medium height who loves quiet evenings in front of the fire, fabric stores and a man who isn't afraid to cook. I am an aries... (Come on, I couldn't resist. Although, I am sure someone else has done it already.) Although, my mother will tell you that she despaired of my ever learning to actually sew. I loved to design and cut out projects, but her machine hated me, so I never finished anything. (Honest to God, that machine would tangle when I walked into the room.) But I started out making horse blankets for my Breyer horses. I started costuming for the Costume-Nazi Drama Teacher I had in High School. She loved really period looking costumes, so that was what I started doing and just never stopped. That being said, my hobbies have always revolved around getting to dress in "funny" or different clothing. Although, I have recently started making my own clothes for the real world as well. I work at UC Davis, and make extensive use of their library for my own personal research on the late Middle Ages, Renaissance & Elizabethan Eras, and the Napoleonic Era through the end of the 2nd World War. Although, I am not very interested in it, I am learning a new appreciation for the English Civil War clothing. I teach classes within the SCA on costuming and embroidery as well, as other items and am working on teaching in other forums as well. Along with being interested in historical clothing, I love fashion and completely believe in the line "The only thing that separates us from the animals is our ability to accessorize." Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cola _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 18:21:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13NL8Sd009230 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:21:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13NJ0cP025310; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:19:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13NIr2v041084; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:18:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (IDENT:br0BvzDAGA2gD2UTDvN9M84Q1LnKM+/D@jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13NIp2v041048 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:18:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.10/8.12.3) with SMTP id i13NInj7007766 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:18:49 -0500 Message-Id: <200402032318.i13NInj7007766@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 23:18:47 -0000 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kitsune242@aol.com said: > But I started out making horse blankets for my Breyer horses. Oh, too funny - I used to make blankets & little costumes for my Breyer horses, too! Hello, my name is Carol and I'm a fabriholic. I've been fabric-purchase free for three weeks now, and that was polyester so it's not like it really counts anyway. I think I started my costume activities dressing Barbies & also learned to sew for myself, went through the frustration of home-ec classes until I figured out I didn't have to listen to absolutely everything the teacher said, and did better from there on. In college I played with the Markland Medieval Mercenary Militia, and also enjoyed the Rocky Horror Picture Show which allowed me the fun of trying to make corsets. I also played in the SCA and eventually made my way into the American Revolution, with a bit of French & Indian War era and a little Civil War thrown in. I've also been to a few Costume Cons, but found I preferred events where I could do things in historic dress. Somewhere in there I started researching 18thC hosiery, have visited several collections in the US and England, and have developed a slide lecture on the topic. I actually got to give it at the Smithsonian, for one of their Thursday afternoon programs! That was lots of fun. I spent a month in England learning to use a knitting frame (the machine that Lee invented, not a peg board). Lots of grease, lots of adjustments with pliers, not many stitches actually knit! I marvel that some people could turn out knit goods at a good rate with the frames. I'm in Maryland, the suburbs of Washington, DC. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 18:42:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i13Ng3Sd009411 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:42:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13NdPcP027008; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:39:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13NdN2v056194; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:39:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (law9-f68.law9.hotmail.com [64.4.9.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i13NdJ2v056103 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 16:39:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rharperny@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 15:21:58 -0800 Received: from 24.11.124.234 by lw9fd.law9.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:21:58 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.11.124.234] X-Originating-Email: [rharperny@hotmail.com] X-Sender: rharperny@hotmail.com From: "R Harper" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 18:21:58 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2004 23:21:58.0503 (UTC) FILETIME=[851CAF70:01C3EAAC] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO After seeing so many members chime in, I thought I'd join the group. My name is Richard Harper, and I live in Grand Rapids, MI, a recent transfer from New York City. My costuming interests are varied, but I'm probably most skilled at Elizabethan men's tailored garments. I'm Master Henry Kersey of Devon in the SCA and I love doing late Renaissance, but have developed an interest in 18th century and late Victorian clothing. I have been sewing since I was a kid and was first taught by my grandmother. Later I took classes and studied at the Fashion Institute of Technology in NYC for awhile, in the incipient haute couture certificate program. I would love to find some folks around my area who share an interest in Victorian/18th century -- but as far as costuming is concerned, it's all good! Richard "A positive attitude may not solve all of your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort" - Herm Albright _________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE online virus check for your PC here, from McAfee. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 19:06:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1406TSd009485 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:06:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14038cP028974; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:03:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i140352v087481; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:03:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from eurus.primus.ca (mail.tor.primus.ca [216.254.136.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i140332w087459 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:03:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jhobbi2@po-box.mcgill.ca) Received: from dsl-207-112-125-214.tor.primus.ca ([207.112.125.214] helo=pheonix) by eurus.primus.ca with smtp (Exim 3.36 #3) id 1AoAVQ-0007eX-0A for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 00:03:00 +0000 Message-ID: <003001c3eab2$11e38eb0$3901a8c0@pheonix> From: "Joanna Hobbins" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Fw: [h-cost] ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:01:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Hi all, > > I'm Joanna Hobbins, full time lurker, occasional poster (when my emails > don't bounce back ). I'm a full time student at McGill in Montreal, Quebec > (geophysics). I'm pretty much a Jack-of-all-trades. I do some costuming - > mostly 12th century, weaving, crochet, lace-making (needle and bobbin), > tatting, cross-stitch, jewellry-making, carpentry, armour-smithing, > leatherwork, and that's when the weather is not nice enought to go rock > climbing or hiking or kayaking or cycling or ... > > I'm peripherally involved in a 10th-12th century group called Les guerriers > du montagne a branch of Bicolline which is the francophone quebec version of > the SCA. > > cheers, > > Joanna > take 2 - I was serious about bouncing emails _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 19:40:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i140eQSd009574 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:40:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i140PdcP000734; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:25:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i140Pb2v001836; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:25:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mx6.wvu.edu (mx6.wvu.edu [157.182.140.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i140PX2v001782 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:25:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from khoover@wvu.edu) Received: from WVUGW01.wvu.edu (wvugw01.wvu.edu [157.182.215.110]) by mx6.wvu.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i140HhjG006144 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:17:44 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khoover@wvu.edu) Received: from WVUDOM1-MTA by WVUGW01.wvu.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 19:17:43 -0500 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 19:17:14 -0500 From: "Kathy Hoover" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here- ROLL CALL Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i140PX2v001782 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO OK, you've convinced me to add to this. I may be the lurker who's lurked the longest. Like Penny, I think I've been here since '96 * it's so long ago, I can't remember. I lurk because keeping up with reading this list is about all I can do and because everyone else has so much more knowledge than I do. I live in Morgantown, West Virginia, and I've been sewing since I was 11. My mother taught me to sew, embroider, and crochet. I have a BS in Home Economics Education from (ahem) a long time ago. I spent the 80's as Costume Mistress for a semi-professional ballet company. This inspired me to spend the 90's working on a Masters in Theatre-Costume Design (I finished in May 2002, taking 12 years to do so). But I am not currently working in the field, I work full time in West Virginia University Library. I am somewhat of a generalist as it comes to study, but my absolute favorite periods are from 1885 to 1935, especially Aesthetic and Reform, World War I, and the Twenties. I have studied all periods of corsets a good bit, and you all have helped me so much, but I haven't actually gotten around to building one yet with my own two hands. I am currently researching the Hungarian Szur, hoping to make one for myself using a piece of Wool/Cashmere that I bought from Fabric.com, and filling it up with embroidery. In future I hope to work more on methods of fabric dyeing, historic and fantasy dolls, and stumpwork embroidery--along with some heavy-duty home remodeling that is long, long overdue. At WVU our theses are online and, if anyone is interested, mine can be seen and read at: http://oldetd.wvu.edu/templates/showETD.cfm?recnum=2482 Or search by Kathleen Hoover and "Costume Design for 'The Emperor's New Clothes' by Charlotte Chorpenning" I hope this link works - they are changing the site around... It was done for children's theatre, or course, and was set in Ancient China. I will slink back into my cave now......bye...... Kathy _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 20:11:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i141B9Sd009635 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:11:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1414QcP003079; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:04:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1414O2v024260; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:04:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1414L2v024193 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:04:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.92.27e63ca (25914) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:04:14 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <92.27e63ca.2d519f0e@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:04:14 EST Subject: Re: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/3/2004 4:22:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, audreybmorin2@hotmail.com writes: I wonder if they shouldn't start by teaching us the squares-and-rectangles way of constructing clothing Don't know about anyone else, but this is how I first made doll clothes. Take a length of fabric, double it over, and cut a hole for the head! Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 20:42:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i141gqSd009684 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:42:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141c6cP005214; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:38:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141bv2v043044; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:37:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m04.mx.aol.com (imo-m04.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141bp2v042964 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:37:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LLWatts@aol.com) Received: from LLWatts@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1df.18b6440f (3850) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:32:30 -0500 (EST) From: LLWatts@aol.com Message-ID: <1df.18b6440f.2d51a5ae@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:32:30 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Seeking glas To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6024 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > D'oh. I should've thought of this. Look in the floral department. > There should be bags of of half-round pebbles. You can usually get > them in different colors, including iris and aurora borealis finishes. > They're not quite as uniform as the glass cabs I more normally buy, > but if I need a whole lot of that particular size, you bet I go buy > a big bag for $3. I had assumed glass nuggets would be too big, but if they'll work I buy a lot of my stained glass supplies from http://www.whittemoredurgin.com . Head to the online catalog and click on "Preformed Glass". They have quantity discounts, so see if you can get a friend to order with you :) . They also have glass jewels in the same section, but the only thing I've used those for was the eyes on a glass dragon music box, and the two I needed came with the supplies package, so I can't really judge their selection. Leah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 20:44:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i141inSd009699 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:44:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141fbcP005434; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:41:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141fZ2v045073; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:41:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pecan.cc.columbia.edu (IDENT:cu41754@pecan.cc.columbia.edu [128.59.59.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141fX2w045040 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:41:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from asj2001@columbia.edu) Received: from VAIO (dyn-shp-225-220.dyn.columbia.edu [160.39.225.220]) (user=asj2001 mech=LOGIN bits=0) by pecan.cc.columbia.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141CKIV003199 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:12:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <006a01c3eabb$2a6e4700$9865fea9@VAIO> From: "Alexia S. Jacobs" To: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:06:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-No-Spam-Score: Local X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] regency underclothes? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i141inSd009699 Status: RO I have been taking Regency dance classes for seven months but it occurred to me only last Sunday that I'm going to need a ballgown. I've found a very good corset-maker who lives near me and am planning to have my dressmaker make my other underthings, but I am having trouble figuring out exactly what these should be. I know drawers (and I am opting for them) come first, then either a shift or (my dressmaker tells me) a sort of bodiced petticoat, then the corset. Were bodiced petticoats commonly worn under corsets? I have very few of my books here (in my dormitory room) and I am having trouble finding images online. I do see what seem to be ankle-length chemises, but it does not look like they have seperate bodices. Is this about right? I also see normal thigh-length shifts. I do think I would like to have a petticoat to go over my corset. Do these have fitted bodices or are these garments a more modern invention. I know that such a layer was generally worn under filmy dresses at least, but what did it look like? In general, do you think it is preferable to go with a short or long chemise, and what should I do for a petticoat. I have not done much research in this era. Thank you for any help Alexia _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 20:46:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i141krSd009706 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:46:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141kBcP005706; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:46:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141kA2v047460; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:46:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav45.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i141k82v047406 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:46:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 17:46:01 -0800 Received: from 24.58.108.69 by bay1-dav45.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 01:46:01 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.108.69] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <006a01c3eabb$2a6e4700$9865fea9@VAIO> Subject: Re: [h-cost] regency underclothes? Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:46:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Feb 2004 01:46:01.0471 (UTC) FILETIME=[A4B8F0F0:01C3EAC0] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wasn't this one of those eras that they wore very few undies? Was this the wetting gowns period in our glorious fashion history? I think a simple shift is your best bet. B~ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alexia S. Jacobs" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 8:06 PM Subject: [h-cost] regency underclothes? I have been taking Regency dance classes for seven months but it occurred to me only last Sunday that I'm going to need a ballgown. I've found a very good corset-maker who lives near me and am planning to have my dressmaker make my other underthings, but I am having trouble figuring out exactly what these should be. I know drawers (and I am opting for them) come first, then either a shift or (my dressmaker tells me) a sort of bodiced petticoat, then the corset. Were bodiced petticoats commonly worn under corsets? I have very few of my books here (in my dormitory room) and I am having trouble finding images online. I do see what seem to be ankle-length chemises, but it does not look like they have seperate bodices. Is this about right? I also see normal thigh-length shifts. I do think I would like to have a petticoat to go over my corset. Do these have fitted bodices or are these garments a more modern invention. I know that such a layer was generally worn under filmy dresses at least, but what did it look like? In general, do you think it is preferable to go with a short or long chemise, and what should I do for a petticoat. I have not done much research in this era. Thank you for any help Alexia _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 21:08:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1428tSd009747 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:08:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1426lcx006623; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:06:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1424U2v056989; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:04:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1424S2w056966 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:04:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i142PcWm022670 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:25:38 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.101] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A0AA8B70154; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 20:53:46 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c3eac3$e7b18900$655183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com><6.0.1.1.2.20040202231508.0217bec0@pop.radiks.net> Subject: Re: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:09:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And not exactly a propos of nothing, how many of you remember basic geometry in calculating the circumference of a circle from knowing the diameter. Best formula that I ever memorized! Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 4:05 PM Subject: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call > > Primarily science fiction/fantasy costumers; but as you all know, there > are > > NO original designs, so historical and ethnic info comes in really handy > > when designing fantasy costumes. > > I wonder if they shouldn't start by teaching us the squares-and-rectangles > way of constructing clothing, and when that's well assimilated, move to > "modern" construction. That would follow more or less the evolution of > tailoring techniques. Building T-tunics really is useful in some way! > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 21:10:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i142AiSd009755 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:10:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1428lcP006783; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:08:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1428k2v059089; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:08:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1428h2w059056 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:08:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i142TsWm022679 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:29:55 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.101] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1AAEF1D0146; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 20:58:02 -0500 Message-ID: <001b01c3eac4$80a51d20$655183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402032318.i13NInj7007766@jefferson.patriot.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:13:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And after a hard day of designing and sewing up Ren costumes, I too have done horse blankets..in the mode of emergency service for a mundane customer. I have a great sewing machine!! Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 6:18 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL > Kitsune242@aol.com said: > > But I started out making horse blankets for my Breyer horses. > > Oh, too funny - I used to make blankets & little costumes for my Breyer > horses, too! > > Hello, my name is Carol and I'm a fabriholic. I've been fabric-purchase > free for three weeks now, and that was polyester so it's not like it really > counts anyway. > > I think I started my costume activities dressing Barbies & also learned to > sew for myself, went through the frustration of home-ec classes until I figured > out I didn't have to listen to absolutely everything the teacher said, and did > better from there on. > > In college I played with the Markland Medieval Mercenary Militia, and also > enjoyed the Rocky Horror Picture Show which allowed me the fun of trying to > make corsets. I also played in the SCA and eventually made my way into the > American Revolution, with a bit of French & Indian War era and a little Civil > War thrown in. I've also been to a few Costume Cons, but found I preferred > events where I could do things in historic dress. > > Somewhere in there I started researching 18thC hosiery, have visited > several collections in the US and England, and have developed a slide lecture > on the topic. I actually got to give it at the Smithsonian, for one of their > Thursday afternoon programs! That was lots of fun. I spent a month in England > learning to use a knitting frame (the machine that Lee invented, not a peg > board). Lots of grease, lots of adjustments with pliers, not many stitches > actually knit! I marvel that some people could turn out knit goods at a good > rate with the frames. > > I'm in Maryland, the suburbs of Washington, DC. > > -Carol > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 21:12:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i142CcSd009759 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:12:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1429IcP006818; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:09:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1429H2v059371; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:09:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r01.mx.aol.com (imo-r01.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.97]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1429C2v059289 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:09:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r01.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.162.2b346773 (4206) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:03:43 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <162.2b346773.2d51acff@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:03:43 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I suspected there were a great many SCA types on this list, and I was right. But I'm impressed at the number of you who dabble in many different eras. I'm firmly fixed in the early 19th century and prefer the 1810s, and I want LOTS of clothes for that one period. I work at a historic house museum, Riversdale, in Riverdale Park, Maryland, where we do occasional costumed interpretation. I also volunteer at Ft. McHenry in Baltimore. I was a washer woman there a couple of years but now prefer gentry. At Riversdale, I'm usually Anne Llowndes, friend of Rosalie Calvert, the mistress of Riversdale. I also had great fun two years ago portraying a milliner every Sunday for 5 weeks during the run of our costume exhibit. I try to do something a little different with each project to keep it interesting. I really enjoy making hats and reticules and collecting other accessories--I have a drawer full of thrift store gloves. (I stocked the milliner's shop almost single-handedly.) My husband occasionally interprets, too, and I've finally stopped being upset when he says I'm his Ken doll. After I got my Ph.D. in historic costume and textiles from the University of Maryland, I tuaght part time, worked at Hancock Fabrics as a district home economist and then management trainee (quit that because the pay isn't worth the aggravation) and was a stitcher in area costume shops (quit that because it's a young person's gig--besides, I would rather wear what I make.) I also sew square dance dresses--my husband is a caller--but these are quick and easy projects where I just play with fabrics and trims. And now I have two granddaughters to sew for, too. Made the older a princess outfit last year. I am truly trying to limit my fabric purchases and am doing pretty well. I try to use what I have and usually need to go to the fabric store only for thread, buttons, or something else small. Ann _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 21:16:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i142GBSd009767 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:16:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142FNcP007139; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:15:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142FM2v062355; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:15:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142FL2v062276 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:15:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from alfalfapress.com (c-24-21-157-61.client.comcast.net [24.21.157.61]) by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i142FDQ17372 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:15:13 -0500 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:22:53 -0800 Subject: Re: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Althea Turner To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <000701c3eac3$e7b18900$655183d1@rmitchellras> Message-Id: <094736EC-56B9-11D8-A7FA-000393C0A652@alfalfapress.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Is that Pie 'R Squared? Even though pies are well, pie shaped, and not square .... :D Althea On Tuesday, February 3, 2004, at 06:09 PM, Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > And not exactly a propos of nothing, how many of you remember basic > geometry > in calculating the circumference of a circle from knowing the > diameter. Best > formula that I ever memorized! > > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 4:05 PM > Subject: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call > > >>> Primarily science fiction/fantasy costumers; but as you all know, >>> there >> are >>> NO original designs, so historical and ethnic info comes in really >>> handy >>> when designing fantasy costumes. >> >> I wonder if they shouldn't start by teaching us the >> squares-and-rectangles >> way of constructing clothing, and when that's well assimilated, move >> to >> "modern" construction. That would follow more or less the evolution of >> tailoring techniques. Building T-tunics really is useful in some way! >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > Althea Turner *** althea@alfalfapress.com *** http://www.alfalfapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 21:21:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i142L1Sd009797 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:21:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142IscP007414; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:18:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142Ir2v064169; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:18:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142Ip2v064109 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:18:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.112.2e2c9380 (4206) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:18:41 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <112.2e2c9380.2d51b080@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:18:40 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] regency underclothes? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/3/2004 8:46:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com writes: Was this the wetting gowns period in our glorious fashion history? I think a simple shift is your best bet. The wetting of gowns seems to have been a myth, based on very little evidence. Some very daring French women evidently went with minimal underclothing, but most wore several layers. The book republished as "Regency Etiquette," originally "The Mirror of Graces," has info on underwear, as does the Cunningtons' book, "History of Underclothes." >From the skin out, a Regency woman wore a shift, usually with shorter, more narrow sleeves than the 18th century model, then a corset, then some style of petticoat (but usually NOT drawers--women were just beginning to wear drawers and some ladies seem to have regarded them with some trepidation--but I'm not that authentic). The Cunningtons owned a bodiced petticoat that is photographed in their book. I have also seen examples with simple tape shoulder straps--something is almost a necessity to keep the petticoat at the high waist. Some of the very sheer dresses evidently had their own "slips" (more what we would call an underdress) of a peach or pink tone to suggest a nude look. The Lady of Distinction, author of "Mirror of Graces," recommended a flannel (that is, wool) petticoat for English winters, in addition to the linen or cotton one. I could have used one in New Orleans last January--it was so cold and damp! Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 21:24:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i142OWSd009814 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:24:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142LKcP007619; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:21:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142LI2v065438; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:21:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m05.mx.aol.com (imo-m05.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142LG2v065383 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:21:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.f6.36315107 (4206) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:21:06 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:21:06 EST Subject: Re: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/3/2004 9:16:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, althea@alfalfapress.com writes: Pie 'R Squared? That's the area of a circle--c=pi*d. But twice I confused the radius and diameter and ended up with a circle twice as big as it should have been! Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 22:02:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14328Sd009881 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:02:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142sjcP009365; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:54:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142se2v082603; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:54:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc13.comcast.net (sccrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.202.64]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i142sb2v082550 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 19:54:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from gia_gavino@comcast.net) Received: from archaesoft1 (c-24-16-253-206.client.comcast.net[24.16.253.206]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc13) with SMTP id <200402040246500160011s5ae>; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 02:46:51 +0000 Message-ID: <002101c3eac9$25f51290$cefd1018@archaesoft1> From: "Gia" To: "Historical Costume" References: <003001c3eab2$11e38eb0$3901a8c0@pheonix> Subject: Re: [h-cost] ROLL CALL Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 18:46:53 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings! A roll call, huh? I've been so frantically busy regarding work issues I've been pretty much just not even lurking, been basically deleting anything that did not pertain directly to work. But now, I think, I'll raise my hand for roll call. I am Gia Gavino, live currently in Renton, WA. Currently I work at the UW, College of Architecture and Urban Planning and on medical leave...indefinitely. Right now I'm trying to recover from mental and emotional issues (regarding employment) so you might not hear from me again for awhile. I love sewing and textile arts of most kinds. I love to knit, but don't expect me to make anything knitted! My paternal grandmother taught me how to do the basics, but apparently she taught me the 'old german' (as my disgusted mother told me) method. I never did get beyond those basics. My grandma also taught me how to crochet and embroider. Both of which I still do occassionally. I taught myself how to sew on my mom's old black singer at about 8 yrs old. Forwards, backwards and a klunky bulcky attachment for buttonholes. But that ol' buttonholer made the *best* buttonhoes. Sure miss that old machine! I've got a nice Pfaff sewing machine, and and a serger. I use the Pfaff alot. I used to use the serger alot, but it needs some 'tweaking'... At about 11 I taught myself how to read a pattern and made a princess seamed aline sleeveless dress (in america called a jumper) with a long zipper in the back. It was fully lined pale pink wool. The apron I made in home ec was anticlimatic, and the teacher kept on making me rip out things and do things her way. My mom washed my pink jumper and ruined it. Anyhow, now I play in the SCA, Kingdom of An Tir. I've just changed name, persona and everything. I used to be called HLGiacinta da Venezia with an Italian persona, but now I'm Bantiarna Emer O' Tighearnigh 'Atha An Ri, with an Irish Persona. Costuming and textiles, research and construction, are my passion. Every period, every geographically known area. I love to hand stitch garments I make, but time constraints often make that impossible. Embroidery and weaving and spinning are wonderful stress reducers, and my hand speciallist doctor has finally allowed me to start doing "modern" needle point again. A friend is teaching me card weaving, but that's on hold (along with the embroidery, weaving and spinning) until my doc says I can do that again. My absolute favorite garment I've ever made is my Green and Gold Italian Ren, completely hand stitched; even the linen chemise! Working on that just *rocked*! I've got another gown (gray wool) that I've made completely hand stitched...even the yards and yards of trim that I applied. I've got a farthingale that I machine sewn the side seams and waist-band, but I hand stitched in the 'boning' around the skirt, top to bottom. And I love the 'pair of bodies' silk and linen corset I made, also hand stitched with the boning hand stitched. My experiences of handsewing the the boning in makes the chanels 'tighter' and thus the boning is 'firmer'. But that is only my personal experience; I tend to stitch a fairly small backstitch when I do this. Anyhow, I'm looking forward to more research and garment making as I change to an earlier and different geographical locale. Happy stitches everyone! Gia/Emer _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 3 22:16:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i143GCSd009918 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:16:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i143EHcP010577; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:14:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i143EE2v092412; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:14:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m08.mx.aol.com (imo-m08.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.163]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i143EC2v092356 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:14:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.c0.4587379 (4312) for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:08:59 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:08:59 EST Subject: Re: Costume design was: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/3/2004 9:21:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, AnnBWass@aol.com writes: > That's the area of a circle Indeed! --c=pi*d. Or as we learned it...2pr _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 00:02:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1452rSd011288 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:02:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i144xncP016081; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:59:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i144xe2v043641; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:59:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i144xb2v043615 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:59:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hrjones@socrates.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i144xaV6006881 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:59:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from [136.152.196.233] (tnt-1-41.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.196.233]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i144xOcf006587 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:59:35 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 20:12:03 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] ROLL CALL Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i144xb2v043615 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 8:18 PM +0000 2/3/04, Kate M Bunting wrote: > >>> skskaw@comcast.net 2/3/04 7:45:45 PM >>> wrote: > >>Boy, lots of Northwest folks! Sidne Kneeland. In the SCA Estrelda >>named after a street I used to live on Estrellita (little star), Saxon. > Does >>anybody have any ideas about last names for Saxons? Daughter of >>_occupation name male_ or from_someplace cool_?  > >According to "A dictionary of British surnames", Anglo-Saxons had only >one name, but sometimes acquired "by-names" from their occupation or >place of residence. There's a delightfully exhaustive work on the topic: Tengvik, Goesta. 1938. Old English Bynames. Almqvist & Wiksells Boktr, Uppsala. Not exactly the easiest book to get one's hands on, but pretty much the definitive word. Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 00:11:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i145BsSd011313 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:11:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145BIcP016725; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:11:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145BH2v048668; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:11:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from email.accessus.net (email.accessus.net [209.145.128.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145BF2v048617 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:11:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from axejudge@accessus.net) X-RAV-Header: Scanned Received: from [207.206.136.87] (HELO accessus.net) by email.accessus.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1) with ESMTP id 211096582 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 22:41:03 -0600 Message-ID: <402077A8.3020603@accessus.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 22:40:08 -0600 From: Karen Heim User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020318 Netscape6/6.2.2 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll call References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> <6.0.1.1.2.20040202231508.0217bec0@pop.radiks.net> <002401c3ea39$3a282210$0500a8c0@MOM> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The dates are April 2-5, 2004. Their site is www.cc22.org Karen another lurker, who is working with Genie (and *many* others) on outfits for the Historical masquerade Penny Ladnier wrote: >Sandy, > >What are the dates for Costume Con in Atlanta? Do you have the URL for >their site? > >Penny E. Ladnier > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 00:30:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i145UlSd011355 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:30:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145RZcP017364; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:27:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145RX2v055690; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:27:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145RV2v055653 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:27:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A2DEFF5006C; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:27:58 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A2DCA240056; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:27:56 -0600 Message-ID: <00e301c3eadf$8c76d330$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> <6.0.1.1.2.20040202231508.0217bec0@pop.radiks.net><002401c3ea39$3a282210$0500a8c0@MOM> <402077A8.3020603@accessus.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: masquerade Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:27:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Karen, What are you working on? I am working tonight to put online the Butterick pattern catalogs from 1897 & 1900. I am getting ready to put online the descriptions of different types of masquerade balls. I never realized there were so many different types of masquerade parties. The first part of the party descriptions should be up in the Library tomorrow. Bless Kimiko's heart, she emailed me immediately when these catalogs came up for auction last summer. The fantasy costumes in the catalog are so fun! There are several historic costume patterns in the catalog. I would love to know how historically accurate they are. We also have another article in the working process about a masquerade ball that Queen Victoria gave in 1845. The illustrations are beautiful!!! This long article was in a London newspaper. The newspaper article is two LARGE pages long. It has wonderful detailed descriptions of all the society people's costumes, listed by name. The font type size is so small it is driving us crazy. But the illustrations are large. The Mardi Gras season was where I got my first love for costuming. I miss Mardi Gras so much every year. The only time I wished I lived back on the Gulf Coast again... well, shrimping season is another reason. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 00:38:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i145cuSd011369 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:38:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145and7017800; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:37:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145U92v056813; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:30:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i145U72v056760 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:30:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3783DB3008A; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:30:32 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A377904008E; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:30:31 -0600 Message-ID: <00ef01c3eadf$e894d360$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> <6.0.1.1.2.20040202231508.0217bec0@pop.radiks.net><002401c3ea39$3a282210$0500a8c0@MOM><402077A8.3020603@accessus.net> <00e301c3eadf$8c76d330$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: masquerade Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:29:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, Are you working on any costumes for carnivale this year? Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 05:41:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14Af4Sd005772 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 05:41:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14AckcP028853; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 03:38:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Acc2v076438; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 03:38:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from gold.wightman.on.ca (gold.wightman.ca [216.249.0.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Aca2v076423 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 03:38:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by gold.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18BBA4772B for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 05:38:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from d7k7b6 (unknown [142.46.141.52]) by gold.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with SMTP id 5B2AD47714 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 05:38:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <003601c3eb0b$2d594aa0$348d2e8e@wightman.ca> From: "Five Rivers" To: References: <200402040219.i142J32w064279@net.indra.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 05:34:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS snapshot-20010714 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: regency underclothes? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The correct undergarments for Regency is either no drawers or the two legs on a string type. (I recommend The Mantua-Maker Regency drawers.) Stockings, over the knee, white, tied with a garter. Chemise is different from the Georgian chemise, with short cap sleeves, large square neck. (I recommend the Kannik's Korner chemise.) Followed then by a corset, which is long, creates that cylindrical overall shape with a very definite lift and separate to the bust. (I recommend The Mantua Maker Regency corset.) You can take a gander at all the patterns through our website if you wish. There then is debate as to whether a slip was worn over the corset. Seems sometimes yes, sometimes no. Suppose it depended on the woman and the occasion. There is some evidence a bodiced chemise was used (as in the La Mode Bagatelle pattern), but it seems to have been as rare as hen's teeth. There is also some evidence a short bra-like version of long corset was worn, but, again, it's as rare as hen's teeth. There is also even more scant evidence a very soft construction bra-like thing (think of two pennants wrapped around you) was used, but again, those hen's teeth come into play. The supposition that scant or no underclothes were worn is myth. We have little hard evidence such was the case. Regards Lorina Five Rivers Chapmanry ~ purveyors of quality hand-crafted cooperage fine hand-sewn embroidered garments, historical sewing patterns & embroidery supplies (519) 799-5577, http://www.5rivers.org email: info@5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 08:56:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14DuiSd014411 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:56:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Du5cP005644; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 06:56:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Dtw2v060279; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 06:56:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Dtu2v060231 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 06:55:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1a9.1fb27919 (18251) for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:55:43 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <1a9.1fb27919.2d5253df@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:55:43 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] ROLL CALL To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/3/2004 9:56:51 PM Eastern Standard Time, gia_gavino@comcast.net writes: Forwards, backwards and a klunky bulcky attachment for buttonholes. But that ol' buttonholer made the *best* buttonhoes. The buttonhole attachments do make nice buttonholes--my mom finally got one for her old White Rotary. But I finally got a Bernina, and it makes wonderful buttonholes, too. Most machines sew down one side and then backwards up the other, which means the two sides don't really look the same. The Bernina, though, straight stitches backwards up the second side and then zigzags back down to give an attractive result. It also has the "finger" on the bobbin case so you can get more tension on the bobbin thread and it won't show on the right side (which feature I forgot last time I made buttonholes). And my favorite feature of all--the optional "optical" buttonholer--you make one buttonhole the size you want and then it makes all the rest identical. Of course, the old buttonhole attachments with templates did this, too, but you were limited to the size of the templates. A confession--I always say I am going to handstitch over the buttonholes on my husband's Regency-era coats, but haven't gotten around to it yet. I have difficulty making buttonholes by hand as the thread always twists and tangles. I finally figured out that it must be because I am left-handed, and the twist in the thread is the wrong way for me. And of course it is fatal if the thread knots up in the middle of a buttonhole--not much choice but to rip out and start over, so that may be part of my reluctance. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 10:05:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14F5oSd019625 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:05:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14F55cP009115; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:05:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14F4x2v094293; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:04:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu (kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu [169.147.4.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14F4v2v094232 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:04:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ckinsey@kumc.edu) Received: from KUMC-SMTPOUT-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 09:04:51 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 09:04:35 -0600 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Costume event in KC X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yup, Center of Grace in Olathe, KS. This is a suburb a little SW of the greater Kansas City area. Site is pretty easy to get to off of I-35, I think it is near the Great Mall of the Plains (Or as some of us call it; BAMOOOO (Big A$$ed Mall of Olathe :) ). I am teaching a class on lace (pray for me Bjarne!). Catherine >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Since I noticed that some many folks on the list were in the midwest I > thought some of you might be interested in an SCA event this weekend. > The Walk Through History is always my favorite :). > > http://www2.kumc.edu/itc/staff/rknight/CS.htm > Catherine, Is this in the same location as it was last year? Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 11:21:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14GLUSd023521 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:21:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14GIwcP014823; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:19:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14GIs2v043794; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:18:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web14009.mail.yahoo.com (web14009.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i14GIo2v043750 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:18:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyforbeys@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040204161847.3682.qmail@web14009.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [24.242.152.154] by web14009.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 16:18:47 GMT Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 16:18:47 +0000 (GMT) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Catalina=20Saravia=20Quicedo?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Renfaire season To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <221C2FB0-5671-11D8-A866-000393D446D6@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.scarboroughrenfest.com/ Open April 10 just 45 miles So of Dallas. http://www.ntif.org March 6-7 downtown Dallas at Fair Park. --- Allison wrote: > I'm Allison Pace, mostly a lurker. I live in Little > Rock, AR, and am a > voice-over actress by day. I haven't found > many like-minded folks > with the time and interest to play with here, so > I've been known to > travel to other places for a fix. (hint hint) I'm > always open to > joining someone at a Ren Faire for the weekend! > I've been to one > Costume Con, with no knowledge of just what to > expect, but this year am > drooling with anticipation. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costumeme@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ===== Seńora Catalina Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit ___________________________________________________________ BT Yahoo! Broadband - Free modem offer, sign up online today and save Ł80 http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 11:36:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14GaWSd024645 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:36:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14GYEcP016271; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:34:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14GYC2v055469; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:34:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14GY72v055355 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:34:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C92B542615 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:45:41 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <4021202B.4020906@reddawn.net> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 10:39:07 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume event in KC References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Catherine Kinsey wrote: > Yup, Center of Grace in Olathe, KS. This is a suburb a little SW of the > greater Kansas City area. Site is pretty easy to get to off of I-35, I > think it is near the Great Mall of the Plains (Or as some of us call it; > BAMOOOO (Big A$$ed Mall of Olathe :) ). I am teaching a class on lace > (pray for me Bjarne!). > > Catherine I will be there, weather permitting, with a load of costume and SCA related books for sale. I am dragging some friends down and though I don't know which classes I'll take yet, I think between the three of us we can cover most of them. :) Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 12:05:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14H5KSd026654 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:05:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14H4KcP019242; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:04:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14H4B2v079546; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:04:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from webwarren.com (65.18.210.ptr [65.18.210.91] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14H472v079453 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:04:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from webwarren@earthlink.net) Received: from jessie2.webwarren.com (pcp03026555pcs.plnfld01.nj.comcast.net [68.37.232.18]) by webwarren.com (8.12.10/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i14GNbxH008773 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:23:49 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: webwarren.com: webbwarren owned process doing -bs Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20040204112309.05daaf60@pop.webwarren.com> X-Sender: n2kye@mail.webwarren.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 11:23:12 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Brenda Bell Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: formulas X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 09:19 PM 2/3/2004, Kathleen Mitchell ("Lloyd Mitchell" ) wrote: >And not exactly a propos of nothing, how many of you remember basic geometry >in calculating the circumference of a circle from knowing the diameter. Best >formula that I ever memorized! Remember, pi r ROUND. CORNBREAD r square (or at least rectangular)! Brenda webwarren@earthlink.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 12:37:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14Hb0Sd028996 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:37:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14HYlcP022525; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:34:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14HYI2v004657; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:34:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14HYD2w004612 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:34:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i14HtYWm028218 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:55:35 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.114] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA911A70272; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 12:23:29 -0500 Message-ID: <002601c3eb45$cb2cfda0$725183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "H-Costume" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:39:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] More good books X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i14Hb0Sd028996 Status: RO Just got my latest fashion/needlework gleanings from E.Hamilton, bookseller. These were great picks. Fashion Mode 1500-1954,l'Aventurine.published 2002 in Italy, Paris, and Russe. It is quad lingual. Lots of picture sources that I haven't seen elsewhere. Medieval and Tudor Needlecraft by Sandra whitehead.2002, Guild of master craft. This is really a doll book with knights and ladies in 1/12 scale.However the needlecraft patterns and instructions are for real! Wonderful patterns. Braided cross Stitch by Art Salemme,Sterling Pub. Co. NY.1989. After the discussion a couple of weeks ago here on the list, I was intrigued by the concept. To my somewhat experienced eye re embroidery, this book has great directions for the various stitch configurations. It is filed with not very great projects for the costumer, but marvelous for technique . _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 13:43:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14IhkSd001244 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:43:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Ib1cP028556; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:37:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Iav2v054652; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:36:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Iap2v054548 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:36:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 920F042615 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:48:24 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <40213CEE.1050405@reddawn.net> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 12:41:50 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] More good books References: <002601c3eb45$cb2cfda0$725183d1@rmitchellras> In-Reply-To: <002601c3eb45$cb2cfda0$725183d1@rmitchellras> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > > Fashion Mode 1500-1954,l'Aventurine.published 2002 in Italy, Paris, and Russe. It is quad lingual. Lots of picture sources that I haven't seen elsewhere. Agree that the pics are great, and fresh. However many are clearly mis-labelled as to the year, so be careful and check your images against other sources. BTW, the title is simply "Fashion", the French title is "Mode", and it is on the cover with the Russian title, in Cyrillic, which has resulted in confusion by a lot of booksellers. Minor rant: why can't this industry come up with better titles? Can you imagine what technical research would be like if 90% of the books in that field were called "Computers"? Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 14:12:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14JCJSd002932 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:12:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14J4McP001541; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:04:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14J4K2v076739; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:04:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14J4F2w076687 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:04:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i14JPcWm002795 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:25:38 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.109] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AFAB1CE10072; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 13:53:31 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01c3eb52$5f7ed8a0$6d5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002601c3eb45$cb2cfda0$725183d1@rmitchellras> <40213CEE.1050405@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] More good books Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:09:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks for the reminder. I have only glanced at the contents at present. This strikes me as being a lot like its ' sisters' published in this time period. I suspect the mis-dating is the result of sending the whole off to press in order to get in on the band wagon of apt-to-be popular topics of that year(2002) There were a couple of Deutch origin published at the same time that also have mislabeled items by more than a decade. ( And I have seen the results of that, in a couple of small museums that use such a volume as proof for dating items in their collections.) However, having a fair library of magazines from the 19th C, I am always looking for additional illustrations that I might miss otherwise. Thus,' Modes' will add some good stuff to my list. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 1:41 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] More good books > Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > > > > Fashion Mode 1500-1954,l'Aventurine.published 2002 in Italy, Paris, and Russe. It is quad lingual. Lots of picture sources that I haven't seen elsewhere. > > Agree that the pics are great, and fresh. However many are clearly > mis-labelled as to the year, so be careful and check your images against > other sources. > > BTW, the title is simply "Fashion", the French title is "Mode", and it > is on the cover with the Russian title, in Cyrillic, which has resulted > in confusion by a lot of booksellers. > > Minor rant: why can't this industry come up with better titles? Can you > imagine what technical research would be like if 90% of the books in > that field were called "Computers"? > > > > Dawn > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 14:50:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14JokSd004948 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:50:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14JjqcP005297; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:45:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Jjm2v008345; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:45:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14Jji2v008305 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:45:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from hall.mail.mindspring.net (hall.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.60]) by fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i14JYnD07294 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:34:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from dialup-65.58.145.28.dial1.pittsburgh1.level3.net ([65.58.145.28] helo=4gxif) by hall.mail.mindspring.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AoSnQ-0006G7-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 14:34:48 -0500 Message-ID: <01f701c3eb56$1e6d4be0$1c913a41@4gxif> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Fw: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:35:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm Helen Pinto, and mostly lurk, occasionally surfacing to post pictures, tools, and resources. I was a scenery/costume design major at uni a long time ago (30+ years) and got to do everything from Roman to Baroque. I fell into the SCA around the same (known as Aidan ni Leir) and worked my way through Kohler back in the old days. It's great how many more (and better) resources there are out there now. I left the academic theatre world for the warmer, more nurturing environment of the business community... Costuming is not my main focus, but I still do a bit, mostly early, and will go off chasing any topic that catches my interest. These days I'm a bookbinder and C&I; currently obsessed with writing implements (want to know all about Renaissance pencils?...) Then there's the early woodwinds, jewelry, hand-weaving (mostly narrow-wares), and too many other hobbies, all of which now compete for my time with the joys of home ownership... I am finally sorting through the fabric that was mostly in storage and trying to get it under control. Or at least into one room. And stop getting more. And finish the interview wardrobe. Thanks to everyone who posts links to their work; it's lovely to look at and much of it is masterful. But looking at all that corsetry just makes me want to go and make another hangerrock. -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 15:05:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14K59Sd005458 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:05:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14JwGcP006555; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:58:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14JwE2v017364; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:58:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from morgoth.tuug.fi (morgoth.tuug.fi [130.232.72.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14JvZ2v016853 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 12:57:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynoure@tuug.fi) Received: by morgoth.tuug.fi (Postfix, from userid 15211) id 1F030652A4; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:24:25 +0200 (EET) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 21:24:25 +0200 (EET) From: Ella Lynoure Rajamaki To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL In-Reply-To: <24.4e872899.2d5108bc@aol.com> Message-ID: References: <24.4e872899.2d5108bc@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm Lynoure. I'm located in Helsinki, Finland and make all sorts of costumes historic and not, for fun and food. :) My periods of most interest at the moment are Elizabethan and Edwardian. -- Lynoure Rajamaki lynoure@tuug.fi http://www.lynoure.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 15:06:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14K6jSd005470 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:06:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14K0XcP006781; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:00:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14K0X2v019283; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:00:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from berlinr.sprint.ca (berlinr.sprint.ca [209.5.194.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14K0R2v019243 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:00:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from shooie@sprint.ca) Received: from shooie ([149.99.69.108]) by berlinr.sprint.ca (InterMail vM.5.01.02.00 201-253-122-103-101-20001108) with SMTP id <20040204192930.SXIA5715.berlinr.sprint.ca@shooie> for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:29:30 -0500 Message-ID: <007501c3eb55$cedf6400$cb6afea9@shooie> From: "Sheridan & Shane" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:33:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello! My name is Sheridan (aka Maiwen), and I am also a member of the SCA (9 years and counting...) . Although I also have interest in other periods, I have no other outlet to wear those outfits. :-( My Grandma used to let me play with her black iron Singer and I inherited a love of vintage clothing and sewing from her and my Mother. As well as enjoying playing dress-up in historical clothing I also dance semi-professionally - Middle Eastern. This helps to feed my magpie love of sparkly shiny fabrics, beads and jewels. :-) My closet has more costumes than 'real' clothes; I have almost always had jobs that require a uniform, so any chance to wear something fancy is a good thing. I recently moved from Saskatoon Saskatchewan (Canada) to Sudbury Ontario, and am in the process of finding suppliers to keep me in materials for my addiction, er, hobby. When I moved I managed to whittle down the fabric pile to a mere four large tupperware tubs, with another two in storage with the in-laws. That was a tough job, lemme tell you! :-) My hubby prefers early British/Roman styles, and I have never really focused on one thing, although I'm generally interested in outfits that aren't too common or well understood where we play;Turkish, German Ren, mid-late 15th C, late Period Elizabethan, as examples. Very slowly but surely over the years I have been making full outfits from the skin out in all of my areas of interest, eventually I hope to have enough finished that I can post them on a web-page. I find I get too easily distracted, having such a wide range of interest, that I never really seem to finish anything, but I'm working on it... :-) This list has been immensely helpful to me, library resources are very scant where I have been living, and the wealth of knowlege of the folks on this list very much helps me find the information I need. Thanks guys! Sheridan (working on a hand embroidered wool tunic and hand sewn trews for hubby, a grey wool ten gore dress, a hip length padded Turkish jacket in strawberry red velvet, and a new purple accent skirt with electric blue sequins for dancing, for me.) *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* You are only young once, but you can stay immature indefinitely. Ogden Nash _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 15:51:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14KptSd007790 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:51:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14KmccP011353; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:48:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14KmS2v057637; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:48:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from scc074.its.state.nc.us (scc074.its.state.nc.us [207.4.22.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14KmP2v057553 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:48:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Ellen.Dappert@ncmail.net) Received: from scc074.its.state.nc.us (127.0.0.1) by scc074.its.state.nc.us (6.5.029) id 401CD58300032C21 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:25:54 -0500 Received: from ncmail.net (207.4.90.6) by scc074.its.state.nc.us (6.5.029) id 401CD58000032CF1 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:25:54 -0500 Message-ID: <40215567.60DB2DB7@ncmail.net> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 15:26:15 -0500 From: Ellen Dappert Organization: NC-DJJDP / District 26 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200402041901.i14J1i2w074729@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Roll call and a long winded lurker X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Mia Dappert in Charlotte, coming out of lurk mode owner of the blown up Bernina Former worker at G Street Fabrics in Wash DC, and a shopper when it actually WAS on G Street, in that little old funky building, with the horrible elevator Costume crazy since the mid 1970's, (now that was a time ago), and still learning. I started just collecting patterns and fabric and pictures and tracings, and then moved on to doing, in a costume sense. I'm now starting toward what I call " a real thing" philosophy. I want some of the things I do to look like "real things". An illustration--- one time someone said to me " I love your costume" when I was in Rev war clothing. and I thought...”This is not a costume, these are my clothes.” Periods of interest - every time. I love to read the research that so many of you put into the time that I don't or haven't yet sewn for. Much of my sewing goes towards the support of my husband’s powder burning reenactor roles, Rev war, ca.1800, Mex-American war, Civil war, Span-Amer war WWII US Navy and Brit Infantry. Actual sewing: Rev war. I am Dappert, ladies maid of all work in His majesties 64th of foot. I sew everything, but I love the stays and men’s shirts, just did stockings to fit around my large calves. Not frame knitted, but not bad, and they don’t cut off circulation or rub me raw. The 64th is going to England next year for the 250th ann. of the regiment a truely big deal and hope to see a royal. ca.1800, we volunteer at a site outside of Charlotte, the home place for James Knox Polk in his childhood., We frequently are a ca. 1795-1805 local judge and his wife at the Christmas illumination and militia and court day Mex-American war, We are some of the few people that do this in North Carolina. James K. Polk was president during this one. I love to do bonnets Civil war, been out a few years, much seems to be happening research-wise. I’ll have to redo much of what I have. Span-Amer war – just window dressing on this WWII US Navy and Brit Infantry. I hate looking like Eleanor Roosevelt. We volunteer on the Battleship NC in Wilmington NC. I want to do a calash and it’s grand-daughter, a mid 19th cent drawn bonnet. Woolen stays, a ca.1800 riding habit for the judges wife to wear, real late 1840’s stuff instead of converted civil war close enoughs. Thank you all for letting me learn from you. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 4 15:55:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i14Kt9Sd007827 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:55:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14KpGcP011582; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:51:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14KpG2v059812; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:51:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i14KpA2v059783 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 13:51:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from hall.mail.mindspring.net (hall.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.60]) by fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i14K9ND19615 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:09:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from dialup-65.58.145.28.dial1.pittsburgh1.level3.net ([65.58.145.28] helo=4gxif) by hall.mail.mindspring.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AoTKr-00068p-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 15:09:22 -0500 Message-ID: <030d01c3eb5a$e9172ce0$1c913a41@4gxif> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Fw: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 15:10:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And forgot to mention that I'm now in the Greater Pittsburgh, PA, area, having moved a year and a half ago from NYC. > I'm Helen Pinto, and mostly lurk, occasionally surfacing to post pictures, > tools, and resources. I was a scenery/costume design major at uni a long > time ago (30+ years) and got to do everything from Roman to Baroque. I fell > into the SCA around the same (known as Aidan ni Leir) and worked my way > through Kohler back in the old days. It's great how many more (and better) > resources there are out there now. I left the academic theatre world for > the warmer, more nurturing environment of the business community... > > Costuming is not my main focus, but I still do a bit, mostly early, and will > go off chasing any topic that catches my interest. These days I'm a > bookbinder and C&I; currently obsessed with writing implements (want to know > all about Renaissance pencils?...) Then there's the early woodwinds, > jewelry, hand-weaving (mostly narrow-wares), and too many other hobbies, all > of which now compete for my time with the joys of home ownership... I am > finally sorting through the fabric that was mostly in storage and trying to > get it under control. Or at least into one room. And stop getting more. > And finish the interview wardrobe. > > Thanks to everyone who posts links to their work; it's lovely to look at and > much of it is masterful. But looking at all that corsetry just makes me > want to go and make another hangerrock. > -Helen/Aidan > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 00:09:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1559iSd016007 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 00:09:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1555icP016095; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 22:05:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1555b2v053572; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 22:05:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f64.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.64]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1555Y2v053527 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 22:05:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from distantdesigns@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 20:48:12 -0800 Received: from 24.21.37.141 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 04:48:12 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.21.37.141] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] X-Sender: distantdesigns@hotmail.com From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 20:48:12 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Feb 2004 04:48:12.0689 (UTC) FILETIME=[42A63010:01C3EBA3] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm looking into a whole new era for me, both for personna reasons and health. My husband is an 11th cent. saxon and in order for me to time synch with him I need to learn what Norman women around William the Conqueror wore. I mean if they wanted to knock out some handsome squire's eyeballs, how would she dress and adorn? I also am allergic/reactive to wool so have to make everything without the holy fiber. I looked at the links for linen and silks, but I think I'll have to add to my wardrobe sparingly. Trying to do the "era" correctly instead of passably I'm looking for all kinds of info. that a Norman woman of 1066-ish would need to know. I've chosen early in William's reign because I read that the tunic style clothing had a looser fit until later during the reign. Thus comes in health. I need to make things that can easily be gotten into and out of without too much work for my shoulders. I have fibromyalgia and it is causing my tendons to tighten and my shoulders don't move back or up verywell. I can put on my old "camp" tunic and as long as the fit is loose I can get in and out of them, but I really need to find out if there was a "right way" to make tunic style gowns and overdresses besides the two fold then cut method. If that is how gowns and tunics were cut at that time then I'm already ahead of the game. I also want to know what kind of trims were appropriate and how the nobles were distinguished from the rabble. Sometimes it's good to be rabble. *gr* I know this has been discussed before but I always have trouble with archives. Not that there's anything wrong with it, I'm computer illiterate and am happy I can handle my own emails. :) If anyone has done this research already please email me off list to save space. Thanks in advance, Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm?siteid=CBMSN3006&sc_extcmp=JS_wi08_dec03_hotmail1 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 01:26:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i156QOSd016179 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 01:26:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i156OScP019456; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 23:24:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i156OP2v085845; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 23:24:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i156ON2v085782 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 23:24:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/OjTulXmAeY9a+/ksf3ol27s=">; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 22:23:27 PST Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JMLUK4DA; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 22:23:27 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 22:20:12 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish Message-ID: <20040204.222252.828.0.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-6,10-13,16-20 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley Cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Jennifer writes: > I also am allergic/reactive to wool so have to make everything > without the > holy fiber. I looked at the links for linen and silks, but I think > I'll > have to add to my wardrobe sparingly. Can't help you with the costume but maybe can with the fabrics. I too have a wool allergy. Have you looked into brush denims? Lovely, warm, have that "fuzzy" look some wools have, ultra easy care although you will need to wash it first on hot for dye-fastness. And it's durable. Another option--try cotton twills. See above. :) Cloaks--try using fake fur, and then line it with some nice fabric. Ditto on hoods. Mine are sable, lined with a gorgeous midweight unlined blue upholstery fabric. Hope this helps. Arlys ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 03:04:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1584cSd010819 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 03:04:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1582dcP022601; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 01:02:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1582b2v024174; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 01:02:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1582T2v024085 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 01:02:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A8ACD84008A; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 02:02:52 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A8A8A7200F4; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 02:02:48 -0600 Message-ID: <01bf01c3ebbe$5b3b4370$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 03:02:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Off-topic: Spam X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1584cSd010819 Status: RO I know this is off topic, but I wanted to help people who are running into this same problem. Yahoogroups installed in all their email lists a software program called SpamGuard. Last night, I had posted a message to our Gallery Newsletter and my Film Costume email list and the message disappeared for a while. Then I got a message from yahoogroups telling me that I was a spamming my own email lists. It took us over two hours to figure out how to turn off this junky software. BEWARE, it is not good for you to download that software... they are offering for you to install it on your computer to use in Outlook. I had not downloaded it. They installed it on my lists, and didn't think it was important to let me know. If you know an owner of a yahoogroups email list and wants to turn off their SpamGuard, please ask them to email me privately, penny@costumegallery.com and I will be glad to send the directions of how to get rid of it. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 09:21:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15EL9Sd012406 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:21:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15EJ9cP005553; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 07:19:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15EJ22v064277; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 07:19:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (law9-f73.law9.hotmail.com [64.4.9.73]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15EJ02v064228 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 07:19:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rharperny@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 06:01:21 -0800 Received: from 206.114.49.34 by lw9fd.law9.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 14:01:21 GMT X-Originating-IP: [206.114.49.34] X-Originating-Email: [rharperny@hotmail.com] X-Sender: rharperny@hotmail.com From: "R Harper" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 09:01:21 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Feb 2004 14:01:21.0372 (UTC) FILETIME=[88A551C0:01C3EBF0] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I tried to send this before, but I never saw it post to the list. My apologies if it shows up twice. I'm a lurker checking in....my name is Richard Harper and I live in Grand Rapids, Michigan, having just moved here from New York City last summer. I have many costume interests (including theatrical), but am probably most skilled in Elizabethan men's tailored garments. I am a member of the SCA and there am known as Master Henry Kersey of Devon. I've been sewing since I was a kid; my very talented grandmother was my first teacher. I took classes and built theatrical costumes in high school (the only boy, of course) and more recently studied at the Fashion Institute of Technology in New York as part of their incipient Haute Couture certificate program. I am now in Michigan to be closer to my family (my mom and sister-in-law have some health issues, but are doing well) and would like to find folks nearby who are interested in Victorian and 18th century clothing, strong interests of mine. Before I moved from the East Coast, I was part of a fledgling group starting to delve into Victorian culture, social gatherings and clothing (Hail Udria!) and I'm sad not to be close enough to play now. I'd be very interested in getting something like that going here. But costuming? As far as I'm concerned, it's all good. Richard "A positive attitude may not solve all of your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort" - Herm Albright _________________________________________________________________ Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 10:43:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15FhmSd012737 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:43:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15FeScP010827; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:40:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15FeE2v007936; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:40:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from falkor.neei.com (dsl092-211-099.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.211.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15Fe92v007868 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:40:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladybug@neei.com) Received: from localhost (ladybug@localhost) by falkor.neei.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i15F65020141 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:06:15 -0500 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:06:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Carol E. Newby" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish In-Reply-To: <20040204.222252.828.0.Cley@juno.com> Message-ID: References: <20040204.222252.828.0.Cley@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Jennifer writes: > > I also am allergic/reactive to wool so have to make everything without > > the holy fiber. I looked at the links for linen and silks, but I > > think I'll have to add to my wardrobe sparingly. You might also try cotton flannel. I have a friend who can't wear wool due to a lanolin allergy and flannel is one of her staples for her Norman costumes. Elspeth ~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~ Carol E. Newby Elspeth the Semstress of Dunkeld, OP ladybug@neei.com http://www.neei.com/~ladybug "Act well your part, there all honor lies." ~ William Shakespeare _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 14:57:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15JvASd013719 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 14:57:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15JrVcP005690; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 12:53:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15JrI2v004156; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 12:53:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web40902.mail.yahoo.com (web40902.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.199]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i15JrA2v004008 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 12:53:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from demontsegur@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040205194623.56826.qmail@web40902.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [66.167.44.116] by web40902.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 11:46:23 PST Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 11:46:23 -0800 (PST) From: Tasha McGann To: Classes List , Costume list , aotc list , Bhakail list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Philadelphia-area Robin Netherton lectures -- update X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings! I wanted to let folks know that there are still some spaces left for the day of Medieval Dress lectures by Robin Netherton, happening at Bryn Mawr College (Southeastern PA) on Saturday, February 28th. The web flier has more details: http://www.cottesimple.com/robin_netherton/lecture_info.htm PLEASE NOTE: Advance registration is available until February 21st or until it sells out, whichever comes first. (Unfortunately, there will be no at-door/cash admission.) I look forward to seeing folks there! Tasha McGann __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 16:06:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15L60Sd014072 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:06:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15L4AcP011919; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 14:04:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15L472v058676; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 14:04:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from queue1-svc.ntlworld.com (queue1-win.server.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.221]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15L3x2x058584 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 14:04:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynneconnolly@ntlworld.com) Received: from acer-zncxxrqauo.ntlworld.com ([81.109.62.241]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with ESMTP id <20040203084717.QSNH10476.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@acer-zncxxrqauo.ntlworld.com> for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:47:17 +0000 Message-Id: <6.0.0.14.0.20040203084436.023671c0@pop.ntlworld.com> X-Sender: lynneconnolly@pop.ntlworld.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.14 (Beta) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:47:25 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Lynne Connolly Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL In-Reply-To: <020901c3e9e6$a6b2ee40$eaf4fea9@glendaii> References: <3FF954AF000119D5@mta11.wss.scd.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-63713263; boundary="=======35C96080=======" Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --=======35C96080======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-63713263; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I'm here! I don't post much but I really enjoy this group. I make miniature dolls (1/12th scale) dressed as accurately as I can manage it. I've been taught by Hazel Dowd (wonderful dolls! Check out her website!). Some of the dolls go into my doll's houses, some of which you can see on my website. Currently not too well, so no projects in hand, but at the end of the month I'm going to the British Miniaturists' Weekend at Ribby Hall, to do some workshops and meet nice people. I also write books about Georgian and Regency England, so the costume information is doubly useful! Lynne Connolly, GSOLFOT Best selling Historical Romance. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/lynneconnolly/ The Richard and Rose books from Novelbooks Inc. Coming soon; HARLEY STREET. VANESSA from Awe-Struck --=======35C96080======= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --=======35C96080=======-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 17:52:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15Mq1Sd014617 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:52:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15MkecP021805; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:46:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15MkV2v038191; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:46:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15MkT2v038158 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:46:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AosGQ-000HzY-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 22:46:27 +0000 Message-ID: <0RrvkDD1esIAJwkK@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:46:13 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well now, you've got yourself a challenge there! There are two women on the Bayeux Tapestry, and they're both Saxon. I have a database of 40 images of women between 1050 and 1250, and only 2 of them are before 1115. Basically, the fancy fitted stuff seems to come in around mid-to-late 1100's. As far as I can tell, 1066 is a plain unfitted t-tunic style, with a keyhole neckline. Nobles might be distinguished from rabble by unfeasibly wide sleeves - relatively tight to the elbow or below, then they just plunge. If you hold your hands at your waist, they can reach almost to the floor (in the pictures). Not much evidence for decoration, maybe just a contrasting facing round the neck. Later they have geometric patterns, generally alternating circles and lines, round the neck and the cuffs of more bell-shaped sleeves. If you could do that as a jewelled border it would be very flashy. I'm not sure whether it's real or just stylistic, but the pictures show an enveloping mantle, which looks to me like a rectangle reaching from head to foot on the short side - if you could cope with handling it, that also would be impressive. This is in addition to a similarly draped headrail - that only reaches to your hips. I don't know what the "two fold then cut" method" is, but, again AFAIK, for 1066 it's just a simple t-tunic shape, no fitted sleeves or curved seams or anything complicated. Jean Jennifer Sena wrote >I'm looking into a whole new era for me, both for personna reasons and >health. > >My husband is an 11th cent. saxon and in order for me to time synch >with him I need to learn what Norman women around William the Conqueror >wore. I mean if they wanted to knock out some handsome squire's >eyeballs, how would she dress and adorn? > >I also am allergic/reactive to wool so have to make everything without >the holy fiber. I looked at the links for linen and silks, but I think >I'll have to add to my wardrobe sparingly. Trying to do the "era" >correctly instead of passably I'm looking for all kinds of info. that a >Norman woman of 1066-ish would need to know. I've chosen early in >William's reign because I read that the tunic style clothing had a >looser fit until later during the reign. > >Thus comes in health. I need to make things that can easily be gotten >into and out of without too much work for my shoulders. I have >fibromyalgia and it is causing my tendons to tighten and my shoulders >don't move back or up verywell. I can put on my old "camp" tunic and >as long as the fit is loose I can get in and out of them, but I really >need to find out if there was a "right way" to make tunic style gowns >and overdresses besides the two fold then cut method. If that is how >gowns and tunics were cut at that time then I'm already ahead of the game. > >I also want to know what kind of trims were appropriate and how the >nobles were distinguished from the rabble. Sometimes it's good to be >rabble. *gr* > >I know this has been discussed before but I always have trouble with >archives. Not that there's anything wrong with it, I'm computer >illiterate and am happy I can handle my own emails. :) If anyone has >done this research already please email me off list to save space. > >Thanks in advance, > >Jennifer Sena >Distant Designs >http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi > >I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! > >_________________________________________________________________ >What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. >http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFind >JobsIn2004.htm?siteid=CBMSN3006&sc_extcmp=JS_wi08_dec03_hotmail1 > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 18:06:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15N6uSd014707 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:06:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15N4ZcP023461; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:04:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15N4T2v052352; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:04:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk (fmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.218]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15N4Q2v052310 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:04:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynn@close-hainsworth.fslife.co.uk) Received: from [195.92.193.21] (helo=cmailm5.svr.pol.co.uk) by fmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1AorkP-0002g5-Mr for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 22:13:21 +0000 Received: from modem-2015.leopard.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.151.223] helo=lance3) by cmailm5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Aorjh-0007Jx-UK for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 22:12:38 +0000 Message-ID: <000c01c3ec35$86ff3580$addefea9@lance3> From: "Lynn Close-Hainsworth" To: References: <200402051902.i15J1U30063617@net.indra.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:15:10 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm Freyalyn and live in West Yorkshire, England. I'm a frustrated costumer and a list-lurker. I make most of my own clothes, and usually wear stuff that's a little out of ordinary and influenced by historical stuff. I'd love to make proper costumes, almost anything from the Eighteenth Century backwards, but as there's no opportunity to wear any of it round here I can't really justify the time and expense. I am a member of the British Costume Guild but most of their events are based in the south of England and I can't get to them. So I spin, knit, weave narrow wares and sew, and vicariously enjoy what the rest of you get up to. Freyalyn, spinning green stuff. NB - wool allergies are mostly allergies to the modern harsh chemical techniques of processing wool these days, and also the careless mixing of coarse and fine wool in commercial fabrics. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 18:27:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15NRCSd014764 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:27:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15NNncP025222; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:23:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15NNk2v066718; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:23:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15NNT2v066468 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:23:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A08328C009A; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 17:23:47 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A08119C016A; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 17:23:45 -0600 Message-ID: <00fe01c3ec3f$07247370$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402051902.i15J1U30063617@net.indra.com> <000c01c3ec35$86ff3580$addefea9@lance3> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:23:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Freyalyn, spinning green stuff. NB - wool allergies are mostly allergies to the modern harsh chemical techniques of processing wool these days, and also the careless mixing of coarse and fine wool in commercial fabrics. ******************** Thank you for the tip. My son and I both have this type of reaction and it probably the chemicals. Do you have any suggestions for getting rid of the chemicals, other than spinning my own yard. I found a nice brand of yarn called Wool-Ease that doesn't itch me. I know it must not be the wool, because we were at an exhibit of sheep shearing and they let everyone feel their wool. It didn't bother us at all. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 18:35:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15NZiSd014929 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:35:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15NVZcP025795; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:31:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15NVY2v072448; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:31:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail03.powweb.com (mail03.powweb.com [66.152.97.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15NVS2v072382 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:31:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from megan@benchite.com) Received: from megan2 (pcp06940299pcs.nrockv01.md.comcast.net [69.138.19.18]) by mail03.powweb.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D47815CB3 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:31:33 -0800 (PST) From: "Megan M." To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Wool Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:39:37 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <00fe01c3ec3f$07247370$0500a8c0@MOM> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Try washing it. -Megan -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Penny Ladnier Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 6:23 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool Freyalyn, spinning green stuff. NB - wool allergies are mostly allergies to the modern harsh chemical techniques of processing wool these days, and also the careless mixing of coarse and fine wool in commercial fabrics. ******************** Thank you for the tip. My son and I both have this type of reaction and it probably the chemicals. Do you have any suggestions for getting rid of the chemicals, other than spinning my own yard. I found a nice brand of yarn called Wool-Ease that doesn't itch me. I know it must not be the wool, because we were at an exhibit of sheep shearing and they let everyone feel their wool. It didn't bother us at all. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 18:53:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i15NraSd014991 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:53:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15No7cP027409; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:50:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15Nnw2v084884; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:49:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au (adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au [143.216.236.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i15Nnt2v084804 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:49:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from tonkin.rebecca@saugov.sa.gov.au) Received: from adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au OUTGOING (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i15NnlSc004965 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:19:47 +1030 (CST)' Received: from sagemsbb006.saugov.sa.gov.au (sagemsbb006.sagemsmrd01.sa.gov.au [143.216.59.14]) by adl0133.systems.sa.gov.au INCOMING (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i15NnkZ6004933 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:19:46 +1030 (CST)' Received: by sagemsbb006.sagemsmrd01.sa.gov.au with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id <1C35JJRQ>; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:19:45 +1030 Message-ID: <1016FD8698B3F14DB829819C6B856EC7598E4B@sagemsg0005.sagemsmrd01.sa.gov.au> From: "Tonkin, Rebecca (PIRSA-SARDI)" To: "'h-costume@indra.com'" Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:19:43 +1030 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: text/plain Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: 11th cent. stunning (tunic links) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Jennifer: Try these sites for more on how to cut out T-tunics: http://www.forest.gen.nz/Medieval/articles/Tunics/TUNICS.HTML http://www.virtue.to/articles/tunic_worksheet.html http://www.reconstructinghistory.com/beginners/FirstGarb.html HTH, Rebecca Message: 7 Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 20:48:12 -0800 From: "Jennifer Sena" Subject: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish My husband is an 11th cent. saxon and in order for me to time synch with him I need to learn what Norman women around William the Conqueror wore. I mean if they wanted to knock out some handsome squire's eyeballs, how would she dress and adorn? I can put on my old "camp" tunic and as long as the fit is loose I can get in and out of them, but I really need to find out if there was a "right way" to make tunic style gowns and overdresses besides the two fold then cut method. If that is how gowns and tunics were cut at that time then I'm already ahead of the game. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 19:17:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i160HmSd015101 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:17:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i160FFcP029445; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:15:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i160FB2v001126; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:15:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i160F52w001070 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:15:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i160BWPp005177 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:11:32 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 19:11:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4022DC87.7040304@thibault.org> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 19:15:03 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool References: <200402051902.i15J1U30063617@net.indra.com> <000c01c3ec35$86ff3580$addefea9@lance3> <00fe01c3ec3f$07247370$0500a8c0@MOM> In-Reply-To: <00fe01c3ec3f$07247370$0500a8c0@MOM> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Another culprit may be (so I have heard) that some wool fibers are cut shorter than they would be naturally, producing a cut end at both ends of a single fiber. This doubles the pokiest bits (ie, it's all a bit like beard stubble.) I think there are probably some folks who are truly allergic to wool, but like percieved food allergies, there are things that can be tried to see if it's a true allergy. Another thing to do is to add lanolin to the yardage, although I don't recall how you add it gradually so as not to get large greasy spots! -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent It's rather ironic that ritualized violence (football) can be called family-oriented but not someone's boob seen for a moment. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 19:49:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i160neSd015391 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:49:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i160mTcP001619; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:48:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i160mQ2v019932; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:48:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i160mO2v019912 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:48:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kerowyn@mindspring.com) Received: from tisch.mail.mindspring.net (tisch.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.157]) by fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i160aee24864 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:36:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from dialup-171.75.196.112.dial1.saintlouis1.level3.net ([171.75.196.112] helo=Dan) by tisch.mail.mindspring.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Aotz4-0002sX-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 19:36:39 -0500 Message-ID: <018f01c3ec49$9b14b860$70c44bab@Dan> From: "Genie" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402030352.i133qA2w002011@net.indra.com> <6.0.1.1.2.20040202231508.0217bec0@pop.radiks.net><002401c3ea39$3a282210$0500a8c0@MOM><402077A8.3020603@accessus.net> <00e301c3eadf$8c76d330$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: masquerade Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:38:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny, we're working on the 17th century(be afraid, be very afraid). The CC is Palm Sunday weekend, I think that's April 3rd thru the 5th (Friday to Monday). Snow fallen on snow, and this evening, the full moon of November Basho ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 11:27 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: masquerade > Karen, > > What are you working on? I am working tonight to put online the Butterick > pattern catalogs from 1897 & 1900. I am getting ready to put online the > descriptions of different types of masquerade balls. I never realized there > were so many different types of masquerade parties. The first part of the > party descriptions should be up in the Library tomorrow. Bless Kimiko's > heart, she emailed me immediately when these catalogs came up for auction > last summer. The fantasy costumes in the catalog are so fun! There are > several historic costume patterns in the catalog. I would love to know how > historically accurate they are. > > We also have another article in the working process about a masquerade ball > that Queen Victoria gave in 1845. The illustrations are beautiful!!! This > long article was in a London newspaper. The newspaper article is two LARGE > pages long. It has wonderful detailed descriptions of all the society > people's costumes, listed by name. The font type size is so small it is > driving us crazy. But the illustrations are large. > > The Mardi Gras season was where I got my first love for costuming. I miss > Mardi Gras so much every year. The only time I wished I lived back on the > Gulf Coast again... well, shrimping season is another reason. > > Penny E. Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 20:07:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1617FSd015442 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:07:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1613QcP002472; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:03:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1613P2v027842; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:03:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pd5mo1so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1613N2v027823 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:03:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jacyntha@shaw.ca) Received: from pd3mr2so.prod.shaw.ca (pd3mr2so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.178]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HSM006CHY8BD1@l-daemon> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:50:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from shaw.ca (pd5ms1so-con.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.122.91]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HSM00H10Y8B1H@l-daemon> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:50:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.0.144.81] by pd5ims1.prod.shaw.ca (mshttpd); Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:50:35 -0800 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:50:35 -0800 From: jacyntha@shaw.ca Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool To: Historical Costume Message-id: <261c6df2620391.2620391261c6df@shaw.ca> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And yet some allergies are really from the wool, as is mine. Can't pet a sheep without getting itchy afterwards. :) Connie ----- Original Message ----- From: Penny Ladnier Date: Thursday, February 5, 2004 3:23 pm Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool > > Freyalyn, spinning green stuff. > > NB - wool allergies are mostly allergies to the modern harsh chemical > techniques of processing wool these days, and also the careless > mixing of > coarse and fine wool in commercial fabrics. > ******************** > Thank you for the tip. My son and I both have this type of > reaction and it > probably the chemicals. Do you have any suggestions for getting > rid of the > chemicals, other than spinning my own yard. I found a nice brand > of yarn > called Wool-Ease that doesn't itch me. I know it must not be the > wool,because we were at an exhibit of sheep shearing and they let > everyone feel > their wool. It didn't bother us at all. > > Penny E. Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 20:21:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i161LuSd015615 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:21:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i161ILcP003520; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:18:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i161II2v035720; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:18:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i161IF2v035660 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 18:18:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/OuPJ6kzv+nEqLtpvzk58Ttg=">; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 17:17:34 PST Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JMNVGQWW; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 17:17:34 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:16:33 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool Message-ID: <20040205.171634.580.0.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,7-9,11-18,23-24 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I think there are probably some folks who are truly allergic to > wool, but like percieved food allergies, there are things that can be > tried to see if it's a true allergy. As one of them, trust me, there are. That stuff so much as touches my skin and within about 5 seconds it starts to feel like an acid burn. Fortunately a few minutes of holding the affected area under running water takes care of the vast majority of the problem. > Another thing to do is to add lanolin to the yardage, although I > don't recall how you add it gradually so as not to get large greasy spots! I've tried handling wool in the grease. Doesn't work. Same result. > -- > Cynthia Virtue and/or > Cynthia du Pré Argent There are true fiber allergies just as there are true food allergies. I never had a speck of trouble with wool until I came down a number of years ago with some particularly vile form of Asian flu, and haven't been able to handle it since. Possibly some sort of auto-immune response--who knows? Arlys ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 21:50:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i162oaSd015898 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:50:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i162kicP008239; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:46:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i162kc2v076014; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:46:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i162kZ2w075989 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:46:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i162ki8v006763 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:46:44 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i162kiIK006761 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:46:44 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:46:44 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <0RrvkDD1esIAJwkK@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <0RrvkDD1esIAJwkK@montgomerie.demon.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402052146.44441.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 05 February 2004 05:46 pm, Jean Waddie wrote: [snip] > I don't know what the "two fold then cut" method" is, but, again AFAIK, > for 1066 it's just a simple t-tunic shape, no fitted sleeves or curved > seams or anything complicated. If Jennifer meant this by "two fold then cut" method -(i.e., you lay a shirt that fits you on folded fabric and use it as a cutting pattern, extending sleeve length and body length as necessary), as described, for example, at this site: http://aneala.sca.org.au/Resources/newcomers/Garb/garb.html that is not a period method; wastes too much fabric. For a similar result in a more period manner, try this method: http://www.virtue.to/articles/tunic_worksheet.html -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 5 23:41:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i164fASd016349 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 23:41:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i164XWcP013103; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:33:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i164XR2v020957; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:33:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from citrine.spiritone.com (citrine.spiritone.com [216.99.193.133]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i164XP2w020939 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:33:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by citrine.spiritone.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i164YBOE002452 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:34:17 -0800 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "H-Costume" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 20:34:16 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Costume Books Available of Possible Interest (long) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have been browsing the Ayer Company Publisher website ayerpub.com because that's where I found my Progresses and Public Processions of Queen Elizabeth. I've found a couple of other things that I wanted that are not costume as well. Since they deal mostly in re-prints of older scholarship, I wasn't hopeful of finding anything much. However, here is what costume things I did find. Note that a couple are Colonial America, and one Regency I did find: Earle, Alice Morse TWO CENTURIES OF COSTUME IN AMERICA Volume 1 treats of colonial costume; volume 2, mid 18th century through 1820. Two vols. 850 pp. text plus scores of plates (1903) volume one LC 68-56468 ISBN: 0405084781 $27.95 Hiler, Hilaire, & Meyer Hiler BIBLIOGRAPHY OF COSTUME Includes roughly 8400 books in all languages on costume, armor, and accessories. 951 pp. (1939) LC 66-12285 ISBN: 0405086148 $38.95 NOTE FROM Regina - this might be something worth ILLing Boehn, Max Von MODES AND MANNERS: From the Middle Ages to the End of the Eighteenth Century Fashions and costume against a background of social customs, political change, and manners among upper-class Europeans. Volume I LC 68-56493 ISBN: 0405190174 $29.95 Note: This is Volume I of the II volume set. They also have volume II listed but... Brummell, Beau [George Bryan Brummell] MALE AND FEMALE COSTUME Edited by Eleanor Parker The evolution of dress from the Greeks to the end of the 18th century. 334 pp. Profusely illustrated (1932) LC 71-177521 ISBN: 0405083149 $29.95 Gummere, Amelia Mott THE QUAKER: A STUDY IN COSTUME The moral and social climate of Quakerism as revealed in the Quakers' distinctive dress. 232 pp. Profusely illustrated (1901) LC 68-56494 ISBN: 0405085850 $25.95 Kelly, Francis M., & Randolph Schwabe HISTORIC COSTUME: A Chronicle of Fashion in Western Europe 1490-1790 A highly praised volume based entirely on contemporary evidence and illustrations. 322 pp. text plus 77 plates and 90 drawings in the text (1929) LC 67-13332 ISBN: 0405181760 $18.95 Another copy for $35.95 - I don't know what the difference is. NOTE: I have it on my shelves - I've seen worse overviews. It helps to know what you should be looking at, but ... McCIellan, Elisabeth Historic Dress In America This work, in two volumes, chronicles the dress of the American colonists. "Before the Revolution many a shipload of immogramts, wearing the costume of the country of their birth, landed in our ports lending a variety and contrast to the appearance of the people. McClellan believed that she could learn about these people and their lives by studying the various forms of dress. The set contains over 700 illustrations. Volume one covers the years 1607-1800 while volume two covers the period between 1800 and 1870. Volume one: hard cover, 402 pp. Volume two: hard cover, 458 pp. Each volume contains a glossary, index and 385 black and white illustrations. First published 1904. 1969 edition. Volume 1 - 0843461640 Volume 2 - 0843461659 LC 70-81515 ISBN: 0881430773 $82.95 Regina Romsey "The work of our Laurels will astonish people a century from now; the deeds of our knights will be forgotten in five years; and nobody knows what the Pelicans have done." Sir Alan Culross _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 00:10:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i165AVSd016441 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:10:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1658GcP014913; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:08:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1658C2v035312; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:08:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from alpha.vaxxine.com (alpha.vaxxine.com [209.5.212.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1658A2v035295 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:08:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from alderweb@vaxxine.com) Received: from alderweb.vaxxine.com (ppp185.digi-t3.st-cath.niagara.net [209.5.232.185]) by alpha.vaxxine.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i163JAkv019224 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:19:11 -0500 (EST) X-RCPT-To: Message-Id: <4.3.0.20040205222300.00d72b30@pop.vaxxine.com> X-Sender: alderweb@pop.vaxxine.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 22:27:38 -0500 To: h-costume@net.indra.com From: David Webb Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Subject: [h-cost] New book on men's dress - anyone seen? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.press.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/hfs.cgi/00/15805.ctl Zakim, Michael Ready-Made Democracy: A History of Men's Dress in the American Republic, 1760-1860. x, 296 p., 36 halftones, 1 map. 2003 Cloth $30.00sp 0-226-97793-5 Fall 2003 Ready-Made Democracy explores the history of men's dress in America to consider how capitalism and democracy emerged at the center of American life during the century between the Revolution and the Civil War. Michael Zakim demonstrates how clothing initially attained a significant place in the American political imagination on the eve of Independence. In a time when homespun attire was a popular expression of civic virtue, homemade clothing was widely regarded as a reflection of America's most cherished republican values: simplicity, industriousness, frugality, and independence. But as early as the nineteenth century, homespun clothing began to disappear from the American cultural landscape. Exhortations of industry and modesty, however, remained a common fixture of the public imagination, and began to express themselves during this time in the form of the business suit. Here, Zakim traces the evolution of homespun clothing into its ostensible opposite--the woolen coats, vests, and pantaloons that were "ready-made" for sale and wear in cities across the country. In doing so, he brilliantly demonstrates how traditional notions of work and property actually helped give birth to an industrial revolution. For Zakim, the evolution of men's dress in America mirrored profound changes in the nation's social and material landscape: profit-seeking in newly expanded markets, organizing waged labor in the city, shopping for clothes at cut-rate prices, and standardizing a business persona. In illuminating the critical links among politics, economics, and fashion in antebellum America, Ready-Made Democracy will prove essential to anyone interested in the history of the United States and in the rise of modern culture in general. Table of Contents Acknowledgments Introduction: Sartorial Politics 1. A Homespun Ideology 2. A Clothing Business 3. The Reinvention of Tailoring 4. Dressing for Work 5. Ready-Made Labor 6. The Seamstress 7. A Fashion Regime Conclusion Notes Index Subjects: * History: American History * Culture Studies * Political Science: American Government and Politics * Economics and Business: Business--Industry and Labor _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 00:41:18 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i165fHSd016542 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:41:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165aHcP016003; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:36:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165aF2v046476; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:36:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165aC2v046423 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:36:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45C9F42615 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:47:53 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <402328F4.9000105@reddawn.net> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 23:41:08 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Books Available of Possible Interest (long) References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wanda Pease wrote: > Earle, Alice Morse > TWO CENTURIES OF COSTUME IN AMERICA > Volume 1 treats of colonial costume; volume 2, mid 18th century through > 1820. > Two vols. 850 pp. text plus scores of plates (1903) > volume one > LC 68-56468 > ISBN: 0405084781 $27.95 I have this one, it comes up on Ebay from time to time, I know I didn't pay anywhere near $27 for it, but mine is from a different publisher. Two volumes, sleeved, each about the size of a paperback novel. Lots of B+W pics, photos, engravings, paintings, unfortunately a lot are dark and not always clearly reproduced. Still, there is a pic on nearly every page and they are captioned so you know what it is even if very few dates are given. I have not used the book very much, not doing anything with the periods it covers, but I did look through it when I first got them and I noticed the author makes a lot of comments about the character and personality of people in the paintings she discusses, and goes off in strange directions that have nothing to do with costuming. On the other hand, sometimes she comments on the paintings in such detail, rings and fans and hatbands and the way knots are tied. It almost reads like a social history in places. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 00:52:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i165qqSd016583 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:52:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165l0cP016505; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:47:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165kt2v050623; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:46:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp3.pacifier.net (smtp3.pacifier.net [64.255.237.173]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165kq2v050594 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:46:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from scourney@nwlink.com) Received: from susan (ip157.usw235.dsl-acs2.sea.iinet.com [207.202.235.157]) by smtp3.pacifier.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 1AE1B6E026 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:25:21 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <04e901c3ec71$fef19290$0200a8c0@susan> From: "Susan" To: "Historical Costume" References: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:28:04 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Oriental surcoat X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I was doing some reading and ran across a 11th/12th cent garment called a Oriental (or persian) surcoat. Since this was in Norris, I was wondering if there was any other information about it. Was it really known to be a transparent silk coat worn over brightly colored bliauts? Susan in Bellevue Rollcall: known in the SCA as Susan Paraventur lives in the seattle area and am active in SCA, Beyond Reality, Cons, and sometimes Somewhere in Time. I make a wide variety of costumes, from fairly accurate historical to fantasy outfits. Historical ranges from Greek (I did start an egyptian, but didn't finish it) to the 30s (of last century) Historical ranges from I make it up cause I think it'll look cool to media reproductions (usually movie/tv, but I have done books). I love glittery costumes and can often be seen at cons in really really glittery dresses, the last one was Orange. Teddy would have been happy. I've been on this list pretty steadily for the past ten years. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 00:59:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i165xPSd016600 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:59:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165qccP016720; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:52:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165qZ2v052713; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:52:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165qX2v052693 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:52:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a250.in-tch.com [66.62.107.50]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i165UCH13786 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:30:12 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <40232C56.2020100@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 22:55:34 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll Call References: <200402051902.i15J1U30063617@net.indra.com> <000c01c3ec35$86ff3580$addefea9@lance3> In-Reply-To: <000c01c3ec35$86ff3580$addefea9@lance3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, Freyalyn! I think I've been on the train through your area (geez, England's beautiful!) when heading from York down to Shrewsbury and Bath. *sigh* I really wish I could visit again! What kind of narrow wares are you making? I've been interested in learning more about them since I found out about the Soper Lane group.... --sue, many miles from anywhere interesting (at least in February! ) Lynn Close-Hainsworth wrote: > I'm Freyalyn and live in West Yorkshire, England. I'm a frustrated costumer > and a list-lurker. > > I make most of my own clothes, and usually wear stuff that's a little out of > ordinary and influenced by historical stuff. I'd love to make proper > costumes, almost anything from the Eighteenth Century backwards, but as > there's no opportunity to wear any of it round here I can't really justify > the time and expense. I am a member of the British Costume Guild but most > of their events are based in the south of England and I can't get to them. > > So I spin, knit, weave narrow wares and sew, and vicariously enjoy what the > rest of you get up to. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 00:59:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i165xxSd016603 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 00:59:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165tWcP016818; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:55:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165tW2v053631; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:55:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i165tT2v053593 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:55:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a250.in-tch.com [66.62.107.50]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i165X8H15096 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:33:08 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <40232D07.5050707@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 22:58:31 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool References: <261c6df2620391.2620391261c6df@shaw.ca> In-Reply-To: <261c6df2620391.2620391261c6df@shaw.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Or from the lanolin. I had a friend, years ago, who reacted to lanolin in any form, even when it showed up in cosmetics, etc. Me, on the other hand, I always thought I had a wool allergy, but it turns out I'm just sensitive to the scratchy cr@p, whether it's wool or acrylic! I've been spinning merino for a while, and don't have any problems with it.... --sue jacyntha@shaw.ca wrote: > And yet some allergies are really from the wool, as is mine. Can't pet a sheep without getting itchy afterwards. :) > > Connie > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Penny Ladnier > Date: Thursday, February 5, 2004 3:23 pm > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool > > >>Freyalyn, spinning green stuff. >> >>NB - wool allergies are mostly allergies to the modern harsh chemical >>techniques of processing wool these days, and also the careless >>mixing of >>coarse and fine wool in commercial fabrics. >>******************** >>Thank you for the tip. My son and I both have this type of >>reaction and it >>probably the chemicals. Do you have any suggestions for getting >>rid of the >>chemicals, other than spinning my own yard. I found a nice brand >>of yarn >>called Wool-Ease that doesn't itch me. I know it must not be the >>wool,because we were at an exhibit of sheep shearing and they let >>everyone feel >>their wool. It didn't bother us at all. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 01:58:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i166wRSd016728 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 01:58:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i166qZcP018885; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 23:52:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i166qW2v073434; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 23:52:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i166qU2v073389 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 23:52:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A9BEB550092; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 00:52:46 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A9BC1E700E0; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 00:52:44 -0600 Message-ID: <000f01c3ec7d$c258ea20$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <261c6df2620391.2620391261c6df@shaw.ca> <40232D07.5050707@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 01:52:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Can anyone suggest brands of wool yarn to purchase that is not real expensive? Any websites to purchase? Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 05:26:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16AQZSd011522 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 05:26:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16AKXcP026009; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 03:20:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16AKM2v052196; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 03:20:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lion.rbgkew.org.uk (lion.rbgkew.org.uk [193.128.240.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16AKK2v052181 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 03:20:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from a.wilson@kew.org) Received: from lion.rbgkew.org.uk ([193.128.240.22] helo=rbgkew.org.uk) by lion.rbgkew.org.uk with smtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1Ap2qF-00078k-00; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 10:04:07 +0000 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:04:07 -0000 To: From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.7.5 X-Client-IP: 193.128.242.117 Message-Id: Cc: AnnBWass@aol.com Subject: [h-cost] left-handed stitching of buttonholes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ann Wass wrote> I always say I am going to handstitch over the buttonholes on my husband's Regency-era coats, but haven't gotten around to it yet. I have difficulty making buttonholes by hand as the thread always twists and tangles. I finally figured out that it must be because I am left-handed, and the twist in the thread is the wrong way for me. And of course it is fatal if the thread knots up in the middle of a buttonhole--not much choice but to rip out and start over, so that may be part of my reluctance. Ann Don't despair because you are left-handed. I am also left-handed, and the thread twists for me as well. A few things that may help are: 1. Don't use too long a thread - you can finish off the short thread by running it along the edge of the buttonhole and then start a new one the same way. The time you "waste" finishing off and starting new threads is repaid by not having to untangle your thread so often. 2. Be conscious that the thread twists for you and let the tension out by letting the needle go every so often and running your fingers up the thread towards the needle. I finally noticed (after 20 years of handsewing :-) that the reason the thread twisted was because I was rotating the needle slightly every time I pushed it through the material, let it go, and grasped it again on the other side. Noticing this didn't stop me doing it, just helped me understand what was happening so I stopped cursing so much and looked for a solution. 3. Know that some threads have a definite direction. When you cut a length of thread off a spool do you thread the needle with the end that was newly cut, or the "older" cut? Try to be consistent in this, and if a particular thread is constantly causing problems, try threading it through the needle the other way. (This is particularly true of metallic threads and silk, but often also with thicker threads like buttonhole twist.) cheers Annette -- Annette Wilson Australian Botanical Liaison Officer Royal Botanic Gardens Kew Richmond Surrey TW9 3AB UK Voice 44 (0)20 8332 5270 Fax 44 (0)20 8332 5278 Email ablo@rbgkew.org.uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 05:55:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16AtCSd011597 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 05:55:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Aq1cP026942; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 03:52:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Aq02v063133; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 03:52:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Apw2v063001 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 03:51:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i16ApeT25358.; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:51:40 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 10:51:40 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 10:51:06 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] left-handed stitching of buttonholes Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Annette wrote : >>[snip] 3. Know that some threads have a definite direction. When you cut a length of thread off a spool do you thread the needle with the end that was newly cut, or the "older" cut? Try to be consistent in this, and if a particular thread is constantly causing problems, try threading it through the needle the other way. (This is particularly true of metallic threads and silk, but often also with thicker threads like buttonhole twist.) This is interesting. I'm right-handed, but my aunt once told me that you should always thread the needle with the existing cut end, not the newly cut one, to avoid the thread knotting as you sew. I've found that this doesn't always work, so obviously I should try the other end when it doesn't. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 07:01:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16C13Sd011982 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:01:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Bx3cP028339; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:59:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Bww2v086179; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:58:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m01.mx.aol.com (imo-m01.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Bwu2v086119 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 04:58:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m01.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.d.21a52169 (18707) for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 06:53:39 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 06:53:39 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume Books Available of Possible Interest (long) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/6/2004 12:37:15 AM Eastern Standard Time, dawn@reddawn.net writes: I have not used the book very much, not doing anything with the periods it covers, but I did look through it when I first got them and I noticed the author makes a lot of comments about the character and personality of people in the paintings she discusses, and goes off in strange directions that have nothing to do with costuming. On the other hand, sometimes she comments on the paintings in such detail, rings and fans and hatbands and the way knots are tied. It almost reads like a social history in places. And some of what she said is just totally off the mark--well, it was 1903 after all--but people still sometimes quote her as gospel. Acquire it as a classic, but don't rely on the information. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 07:05:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16C5jSd011991 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:05:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16C2OcP028442; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 05:02:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16C2O2v087434; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 05:02:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r06.mx.aol.com (imo-r06.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16C2K2v087368 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 05:02:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1ad.1f515e74 (18707) for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 06:56:55 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <1ad.1f515e74.2d54db07@aol.com> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 06:56:55 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] left-handed stitching of buttonholes To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you so much for the suggestions. I have thought about paying attention to which end I thread through the needle, but then usually forget to! And I will try the relaxing the thread idea. I never have this problem with any handsewing but buttonholes, and I think you are correct--I definitely twist the needle when I'm making the loops. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 08:50:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16DoXSd012515 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:50:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16DmfcP002235; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 06:48:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16DmY2v025679; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 06:48:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16DmW2v025666 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 06:48:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA21953 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:17:29 -0600 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:17:29 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] left-handed stitching of buttonholes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Fri, 6 Feb 2004, Kate M Bunting wrote: > Annette wrote : > > 3. Know that some threads have a definite direction. When you cut a > length of thread off a spool do you thread the needle with the end that > was newly cut, or the "older" cut? Try to be consistent in this, and if > a particular thread is constantly causing problems, try threading it > through the needle the other way. (This is particularly true of metallic > threads and silk, but often also with thicker threads like buttonhole > twist.) > > This is interesting. I'm right-handed, but my aunt once told me that > you should always thread the needle with the existing cut end, not the > newly cut one, to avoid the thread knotting as you sew. I've found that > this doesn't always work, so obviously I should try the other end when > it doesn't. OK, now I'm confused. The twist will be the same regardless of which end goes through the needle, right? So it shouldn't matter which end of the thread goes through the needle first. If that doesn't make sense, draw a picture of thread with a twist: _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ Look at it right side up and upside down. The twist is still the same. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 09:04:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16E4YSd012562 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:04:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16E1ZcP002866; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:01:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16E1Y2v030810; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:01:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16E1V2w030784 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:01:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i16DvwPp009155 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:57:58 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 08:57:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40239E36.5050409@thibault.org> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 09:01:26 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] left-handed stitching of buttonholes References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin Netherton wrote: > OK, now I'm confused. The twist will be the same regardless of which end > goes through the needle, right? So it shouldn't matter which end of the > thread goes through the needle first. I think it has something to do with the processing machinery and how it smooths the thread -- as if the thread has a nap to it. If you go with the nap, it slides through more smoothly than against the nap. And the micro-nap might help the thread's twist stay in place somehow, but if you're against the nap, it might not. -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent It's rather ironic that ritualized violence (football) can be called family-oriented but not someone's boob seen for a moment. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 09:18:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16EIuSd012642 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:18:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16EIAcP003805; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:18:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16EI92v038023; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:18:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16EI72v038000 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:18:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m52.in-tch.com [216.166.191.52]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i16DtmH09769 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 06:55:49 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <4023A2D7.8000607@in-tch.com> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 07:21:11 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool References: <261c6df2620391.2620391261c6df@shaw.ca> <40232D07.5050707@in-tch.com> <000f01c3ec7d$c258ea20$0500a8c0@MOM> In-Reply-To: <000f01c3ec7d$c258ea20$0500a8c0@MOM> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The stuff I've seen online can get pretty pricey. Absolutely glorious, but.... If you're looking for less expensive wools and wool blends, I'd try your local Michael's or Ben Franklin's. I found inexpensive wool blends at both of them, which were just perfect for my "I wanna learn how to make scarves but I don't want to do it with the expensive stuff" project. (I'm making a couple of inexpensive "Harry Potter" scarves, and when I've got this knitting in the round thing down, I've got a couple of cowl/hoods to make with the $16-a-skein stuff....;o) --sue Penny Ladnier wrote: > Can anyone suggest brands of wool yarn to purchase that is not real > expensive? Any websites to purchase? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 10:18:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16FIPSd012936 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:18:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16FDrcP006746; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:13:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16FDn2v063881; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:13:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail03.powweb.com (mail03.powweb.com [66.152.97.36]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16FDl2v063867 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:13:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from megan@benchite.com) Received: from megan2 (pcp06940299pcs.nrockv01.md.comcast.net [69.138.19.18]) by mail03.powweb.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AC6A15FD2 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:13:48 -0800 (PST) From: "Megan M." To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Wool- for Penny Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:21:57 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <000f01c3ec7d$c258ea20$0500a8c0@MOM> Importance: Normal Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Brown Sheep Company's Lamb's Pride is the stuff that made me realize that wool was not the problem, but something to do with the processing thereof. I make socks out of this stuff with no problem, and can even buy the expensive hiking socks from the outdoors stores without trouble now. Here is a link: http://www.yarn.com/yarns/yarn_main.html enter Brown Sheep in the Manufacturer box, and it will list what they have by them. Apparently now they make some cotton stuff too. This company, Webs, is my favorite supplier these days, for needlework and weaving. -Megan -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Penny Ladnier Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 1:52 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool Can anyone suggest brands of wool yarn to purchase that is not real expensive? Any websites to purchase? Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 11:04:18 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16G4ISd013090 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:04:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16G3EcP010466; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:03:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16G2r2v093767; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:02:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp-out4.blueyonder.co.uk (smtp-out4.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.213.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16G2m2v093715 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:02:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@agesofelegance.co.uk) Received: from Imedia5043 ([82.44.203.167]) by smtp-out4.blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5600); Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:45:35 +0000 Message-ID: <007401c3ecc8$415ffd50$1810a8c0@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402051902.i15J1U30063617@net.indra.com> <000c01c3ec35$86ff3580$addefea9@lance3> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll Call Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:45:32 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Feb 2004 15:45:35.0532 (UTC) FILETIME=[42D426C0:01C3ECC8] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO where abouts in W yorks are you. I moved back to god's own country, after too long in london, a couple of years ago and am now based in Leeds dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of historical clothing, uniforms and bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 ----- Original Message ----- > I'm Freyalyn and live in West Yorkshire, England. I'm a frustrated costumer > and a list-lurker. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 11:07:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16G7SSd013105 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:07:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16G6PcP010747; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:06:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16G6O2v096080; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:06:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web41003.mail.yahoo.com (web41003.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i16G5Y2v095463 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:05:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from tania_gr17@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040206155849.27689.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [62.79.63.35] by web41003.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 07:58:49 PST Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:58:49 -0800 (PST) From: Tania Gruning Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll Call To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000c01c3ec35$86ff3580$addefea9@lance3> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Freyalyn There is a chapter of the SCA in York, the Shire of Pont Alarc, they are really nice people. Their website is http://www.pontalarch.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ Contact the chatelaine and they will welcome you with open arms. I used to play with them when i did a term at Loughborough university Tania (Tatiana Alexandrova) Lynn Close-Hainsworth wrote: I'm Freyalyn and live in West Yorkshire, England. I'm a frustrated costumer and a list-lurker. I make most of my own clothes, and usually wear stuff that's a little out of ordinary and influenced by historical stuff. I'd love to make proper costumes, almost anything from the Eighteenth Century backwards, but as there's no opportunity to wear any of it round here I can't really justify the time and expense. I am a member of the British Costume Guild but most of their events are based in the south of England and I can't get to them. So I spin, knit, weave narrow wares and sew, and vicariously enjoy what the rest of you get up to. Freyalyn, spinning green stuff. NB - wool allergies are mostly allergies to the modern harsh chemical techniques of processing wool these days, and also the careless mixing of coarse and fine wool in commercial fabrics. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 11:43:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16GhCSd013210 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:43:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Ga2cP013380; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:36:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Ga02v017439; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:36:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lion.rbgkew.org.uk (lion.rbgkew.org.uk [193.128.240.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16GZu2v017327 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:35:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from a.wilson@kew.org) Received: from ns.rbgkew.org.uk ([193.128.240.7] helo=unicorn) by lion.rbgkew.org.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1Ap8xG-0007gu-00; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 16:35:46 +0000 Received: from lion ([193.128.240.22] helo=rbgkew.org.uk) by unicorn with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1Ap8xG-0001nf-00; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 16:35:46 +0000 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 16:35:46 -0000 To: From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.7.5 X-Client-IP: 193.128.242.117 Message-Id: Cc: robin@shell.nightowl.net Subject: [h-cost] thread direction X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin Netherton wrote: > OK, now I'm confused. The twist will be the same regardless of which en= d > goes through the needle, right? So it shouldn't matter which end of the > thread goes through the needle first. Then Cythia wrote: >I think it has something to do with the processing machinery and how it smooths the thread -- as if the thread has a nap to it. If you go with the nap, it slides through more smoothly than against the nap. And the micro-nap might help the thread's twist stay in place somehow, but if you're against the nap, it might not. I think Cynthia is right regarding machine processed thread - that somehow the processing produces a 'nap': however, with wool, if the fleece was combed, not carded, then the microscopic scales on the fibres all lie the same way, and the cut ends face the same way. The effect is also extreme on metal threads like jap gold (and imitations like Maderia and DMC) where a thin spiral of gold on paper is wound round a fibre (silk or cotton) core. I find with the DMC thread, if I get it the wrong way round the gold foil will shred off within 2 inches, the correct orientation allows me to use an 18 inch long thread (which for me is a very long piece). Incidentally, the metallic machine embroidery thread suffers a similar shredding problem which is caused by the eye of the machine needle heating up as the metal runs through it. Annette -- Annette Wilson Australian Botanical Liaison Officer Royal Botanic Gardens Kew Richmond Surrey TW9 3AB UK Voice 44 (0)20 8332 5270 Fax 44 (0)20 8332 5278 Email ablo@rbgkew.org.uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 11:49:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16GneSd013261 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:49:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16GmTcP014570; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:48:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16GmR2v026625; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:48:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (law9-f95.law9.hotmail.com [64.4.9.95]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16GmN2v026555 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:48:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from marccarlson20@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:30:27 -0800 Received: from 129.244.6.78 by lw9fd.law9.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 16:30:27 GMT X-Originating-IP: [129.244.6.78] X-Originating-Email: [marccarlson20@hotmail.com] X-Sender: marccarlson20@hotmail.com From: "Marc Carlson" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 10:30:27 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Feb 2004 16:30:27.0580 (UTC) FILETIME=[876A13C0:01C3ECCE] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Costuming mythology (was:New book on men's dress - anyone seen? ) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO David Webb quoted from the following review: >...the American political imagination on the eve of Independence. In a time >when homespun attire was a popular expression of civic virtue, homemade >clothing was widely regarded as a reflection of America's most cherished >republican values: simplicity, industriousness, frugality, and >independence. Whether this was actually true or not, I'm seeing a connection here between this perception of the colonial era, and the (seemingly) commonly held misperceptions of earlier clothing - for example "Medieval clothing should be homespun and look really rustic." Marc _________________________________________________________________ Get some great ideas here for your sweetheart on Valentine's Day - and beyond. http://special.msn.com/network/celebrateromance.armx _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 12:12:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16HCsSd013370 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:12:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16GvqcP015505; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:57:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Gvo2v033589; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:57:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Gvn2v033578 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:57:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cahuff@mindspring.com) Received: from mclean.mail.mindspring.net (mclean.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.57]) by fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i16GnwD04963 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:49:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from user-38lcj2b.dialup.mindspring.com ([209.86.76.75] helo=[209.86.74.206]) by mclean.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Ap9Ay-00057x-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:49:58 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200402061605.i16G592x095244@net.indra.com> References: <200402061605.i16G592x095244@net.indra.com> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:49:49 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: fastusminimus Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 87 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 9:05 AM -0700 2/6/04, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: >Can anyone suggest brands of wool yarn to purchase that is not real >expensive? Any websites to purchase? Try Webs, think they are webs.com, they have mill ends and some of their own brands. Or check down in the Carolinas, there used to be some mill end folks down there... Ta Carol -- Jan 7 1792: Farenheit's thermometer 23 degrees below.I rub silk gowns with flannel to see the beautiful streams of fire which are emitted with a crackling noise during the cold weather. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 12:46:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16Hk8Sd013506 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:46:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16HiucP019976; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:44:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Hit2v069272; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:44:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from wapgw.hccnet.nl (wapgw.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.19]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Hij2v069177 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:44:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Gelfling@dds.nl) Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl by wapgw.hccnet.nl via smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13] with ESMTP for id i15KYJCN005174 (8.12.10/1.200); Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:34:19 +0100 (MET) Received: from Gelfling.dds.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia19-74-100.dsl.hccnet.nl [80.100.74.19] with ESMTP for id i15KYHKI003442 (8.12.10/2.03); Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:34:18 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20040203174148.01a47008@pop.dds.nl> X-Sender: Gelfling@pop.dds.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 21:34:18 +0100 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Esther Stouten In-Reply-To: <200402031111.i13BBF30076534@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Roll Call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello All, I am one of the many lurkers. My name is Esther Stouten and my medieval name is Morwenna of Morwenstow. Occupation: full time mommy of a 2 year old boy. My obession is making a decent piece of costume for every medieval period, curently I am working on a 10/11th century anglo-saxon dress and a tudor dress. I am making the tudor dress with Josiene van Maarseveen aka Deredere Galbraith, my friend and fellow costume nut, who has more experience in such advanced dresses, usually I do not dare to make anything beyond the 14th century, which is my main obession. I have a websites with my medieval outfits http://www.gelfling.dds.nl/wardrobe.html but I have to be honest and say that I am not satified with most of the dresses. My husband makes his own medieval clothes too, the most of his costumes are sewn by hand, by him! You can see his work here http://home.hccnet.nl/r.vhallem/Dugald'sWorkshop/costume.html We are currently in the dutch branch of the SCA, but we are looking for a reanactorsgroup to join or thinking of setting up one of our own (14th century -16th century), because we start to strive for more authenticity,and there is not much out here for us lovers of later (upper class) period costume. It was so nice to read all the emails in reply to Roll Call that I decided to surface and reply myself. Best Wishes, Esther Stouten _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 12:55:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16HtbSd013534 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:55:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16HfRcP019667; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:41:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16HfL2v066635; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:41:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from wapgw.hccnet.nl (wapgw.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.19]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Hek2v066150 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:40:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Gelfling@dds.nl) Received: from smtp.hccnet.nl by wapgw.hccnet.nl via smtp.hccnet.nl [62.251.0.13] with ESMTP for id i1686xCN004469 (8.12.10/1.200); Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:06:59 +0100 (MET) Received: from Gelfling.dds.nl by smtp.hccnet.nl via fia19-74-100.dsl.hccnet.nl [80.100.74.19] with ESMTP for id i1686xKI006469 (8.12.10/2.03); Fri, 6 Feb 2004 09:07:01 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20040206085846.00b87038@pop.dds.nl> X-Sender: Gelfling@pop.dds.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 09:07:01 +0100 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Esther Stouten In-Reply-To: <200402051901.i15J1S30063598@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: 11th cent. stunning!Longish X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello Jennifer, You might want to look in The book of costume by Milla Davenport. She has interesting pictures, in the Dark Ages section, but most of it is Anglo-Saxon though. I am currently researching the same style/period costume for myself. If you can't get a hold of a copy of that book, I will be glad to email pictures tou you. Good Luck, Esther aka Morwenna >From: "Jennifer Sena" >Precedence: list >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Cc: >To: h-costume@indra.com >Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 20:48:12 -0800 >Reply-To: Historical Costume >Message-ID: >Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >Subject: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish >Message: 7 > >I'm looking into a whole new era for me, both for personna reasons and health. > >My husband is an 11th cent. saxon and in order for me to time synch with >him I need to learn what Norman women around William the Conqueror >wore. I mean if they wanted to knock out some handsome squire's eyeballs, >how would she dress and adorn? > >I also am allergic/reactive to wool so have to make everything without the >holy fiber. I looked at the links for linen and silks, but I think I'll >have to add to my wardrobe sparingly. Trying to do the "era" correctly >instead of passably I'm looking for all kinds of info. that a Norman woman >of 1066-ish would need to know. I've chosen early in William's reign >because I read that the tunic style clothing had a looser fit until later >during the reign. > >Thus comes in health. I need to make things that can easily be gotten >into and out of without too much work for my shoulders. I have >fibromyalgia and it is causing my tendons to tighten and my shoulders >don't move back or up verywell. I can put on my old "camp" tunic and as >long as the fit is loose I can get in and out of them, but I really need >to find out if there was a "right way" to make tunic style gowns and >overdresses besides the two fold then cut method. If that is how gowns >and tunics were cut at that time then I'm already ahead of the game. > >I also want to know what kind of trims were appropriate and how the nobles >were distinguished from the rabble. Sometimes it's good to be rabble. *gr* > >I know this has been discussed before but I always have trouble with >archives. Not that there's anything wrong with it, I'm computer >illiterate and am happy I can handle my own emails. :) If anyone has >done this research already please email me off list to save space. > >Thanks in advance, > >Jennifer Sena >Distant Designs >http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi > >I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! > >_________________________________________________________________ >What are the 5 hot job markets for 2004? Click here to find out. >http://msn.careerbuilder.com/Custom/MSN/CareerAdvice/WPI_WhereWillWeFindJobsIn2004.htm?siteid=CBMSN3006&sc_extcmp=JS_wi08_dec03_hotmail1 > > > > >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >From: Cynthia J Ley >Precedence: list >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Cc: h-costume@indra.com >To: h-costume@indra.com >Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 22:20:12 -0800 >Reply-To: Historical Costume >Message-ID: <20040204.222252.828.0.Cley@juno.com> >Content-Type: text/plain >Subject: Re: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish >Message: 8 > >Jennifer writes: > > I also am allergic/reactive to wool so have to make everything > > without the > > holy fiber. I looked at the links for linen and silks, but I think > > I'll > > have to add to my wardrobe sparingly. > >Can't help you with the costume but maybe can with the fabrics. I too >have a wool allergy. Have you looked into brush denims? Lovely, warm, >have that "fuzzy" look some wools have, ultra easy care although you will >need to wash it first on hot for dye-fastness. And it's durable. > >Another option--try cotton twills. See above. :) > >Cloaks--try using fake fur, and then line it with some nice fabric. Ditto >on hoods. Mine are sable, lined with a gorgeous midweight unlined blue >upholstery fabric. > >Hope this helps. > >Arlys > > >________________________________________________________________ >The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! >Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! >Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > > >From: "Penny Ladnier" >Precedence: list >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Cc: >To: "h-costume" >Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 03:02:09 -0500 >Reply-To: Historical Costume >Message-ID: <01bf01c3ebbe$5b3b4370$0500a8c0@MOM> >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" >Subject: [h-cost] Off-topic: Spam >Message: 9 > >I know this is off topic, but I wanted to help people who are running into >this same problem. > >Yahoogroups installed in all their email lists a software program called >SpamGuard. Last night, I had posted a message to our Gallery Newsletter >and my Film Costume email list and the message disappeared for a >while. Then I got a message from yahoogroups telling me that I was a >spamming my own email lists. It took us over two hours to figure out how >to turn off this junky software. BEWARE, it is not good for you to >download that software... they are offering for you to install it on your >computer to use in Outlook. I had not downloaded it. They installed it on >my lists, and didn't think it was important to let me know. > >If you know an owner of a yahoogroups email list and wants to turn off >their SpamGuard, please ask them to email me privately, >penny@costumegallery.com and I will be glad to send the directions of how >to get rid of it. > >Penny E. Ladnier >Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom >www.costumegallery.com >www.costumeclassroom.com >From: "R Harper" >Precedence: list >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Cc: >To: h-costume@indra.com >Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 09:01:21 -0500 >Reply-To: Historical Costume >Message-ID: >Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >Subject: [h-cost] Roll Call >Message: 10 > >I tried to send this before, but I never saw it post to the list. My >apologies if it shows up twice. > >I'm a lurker checking in....my name is Richard Harper and I live in Grand >Rapids, Michigan, having just moved here from New York City last >summer. I have many costume interests (including theatrical), but am >probably most skilled in Elizabethan men's tailored garments. I am a >member of the SCA and there am known as Master Henry Kersey of Devon. > >I've been sewing since I was a kid; my very talented grandmother was my >first teacher. I took classes and built theatrical costumes in high >school (the only boy, of course) and more recently studied at the Fashion >Institute of Technology in New York as part of their incipient Haute >Couture certificate program. > >I am now in Michigan to be closer to my family (my mom and sister-in-law >have some health issues, but are doing well) and would like to find folks >nearby who are interested in Victorian and 18th century clothing, strong >interests of mine. Before I moved from the East Coast, I was part of a >fledgling group starting to delve into Victorian culture, social >gatherings and clothing (Hail Udria!) and I'm sad not to be close enough >to play now. >I'd be very interested in getting something like that going here. > >But costuming? As far as I'm concerned, it's all good. > >Richard > >"A positive attitude may not solve all of your problems, but it will annoy >enough people to make it worth the effort" - Herm Albright > >_________________________________________________________________ >Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed >experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 > > > > >From: "Carol E. Newby" >Precedence: list >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Cc: >To: Historical Costume >References: <20040204.222252.828.0.Cley@juno.com> >In-Reply-To: <20040204.222252.828.0.Cley@juno.com> >Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:06:04 -0500 (EST) >Reply-To: Historical Costume >Message-ID: >Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII >Subject: Re: [h-cost] 11th cent. stunning!Longish >Message: 11 > > > Jennifer writes: > > > I also am allergic/reactive to wool so have to make everything without > > > the holy fiber. I looked at the links for linen and silks, but I > > > think I'll have to add to my wardrobe sparingly. > >You might also try cotton flannel. I have a friend who can't wear wool due >to a lanolin allergy and flannel is one of her staples for her Norman >costumes. > >Elspeth > >~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~~~*~ >Carol E. Newby Elspeth the Semstress of Dunkeld, OP >ladybug@neei.com http://www.neei.com/~ladybug > > "Act well your part, there all honor lies." > ~ William Shakespeare > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 13:10:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16IAVSd013601 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:10:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16I9UcP022512; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:09:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16I9Q2v088004; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:09:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16I9L2v087872 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:09:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from eirenetz@comcast.net) Received: from 204.127.197.114 ([204.127.197.114]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with SMTP id <200402061800090130077ok9e>; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:00:09 +0000 Received: from [198.178.8.81] by 204.127.197.114; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 18:00:09 +0000 From: eirenetz@comcast.net To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] Wool- for Penny Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 18:00:09 +0000 Message-Id: <020620041800.12393.4738@comcast.net> X-Mailer: AT&T Message Center Version 1 (Oct 27 2003) X-Authenticated-Sender: ZWlyZW5ldHpAY29tY2FzdC5uZXQ= Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I picked up some of the Lamb's Pride for what I can only describe as a "Swiss fringe" - a fringe of wool worn at the nape of the neck under/below the wrapped headdress. Although I found it a little itchy after awhile, it wasn't bad - not intolerable or distracting against my neck. I don't consider myself to be particularly sensitive to wool, but I do notice it being itchy. I try to keep linen between myself and the wool when I'm wearing it. Robin tells me that worsted is the way to go - I'm still looking for worsted in a color and price I like. The Lamb's Pride says it's "worsted", but I'm getting the impression that in yarn, it's something different than yardage. All the acrylic yarn I looked at at JoAnn's *said* it was worsted, but I though that applied to the length of the wool staple. Anyone with insight? I'm not at all familiar with yarn terms. BTW, in the Denver area, you'll not find wool yarn at JoAnn's or Michael's - you have to go to a knitting store. It was $6.50 for the skein, of which I used maybe 10 yards. Melanie > Brown Sheep Company's Lamb's Pride is the stuff that made me realize that > wool was not the problem, but something to do with the processing thereof. > I make socks out of this stuff with no problem, and can even buy the > expensive hiking socks from the outdoors stores without trouble now. Here is > a link: > http://www.yarn.com/yarns/yarn_main.html > enter Brown Sheep in the Manufacturer box, and it will list what they have > by them. Apparently now they make some cotton stuff too. This company, > Webs, is my favorite supplier these days, for needlework and weaving. > -Megan > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Penny Ladnier > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 1:52 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool > > > Can anyone suggest brands of wool yarn to purchase that is not real > expensive? Any websites to purchase? > > Penny E. Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners > (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 13:29:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16ITeSd013682 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:29:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16IRXcP024065; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:27:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16IRV2v002457; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:27:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk (fmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16IRN2v002372 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:27:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynn@close-hainsworth.fslife.co.uk) Received: from [195.92.195.176] (helo=cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk) by fmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Ap9oZ-0004Pk-H9 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 17:30:51 +0000 Received: from modem-3305.lemur.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.140.233] helo=lance3) by cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Ap9nz-0001bH-S9 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 17:30:16 +0000 Message-ID: <000001c3ecd7$3a73d7a0$161efea9@lance3> From: "Lynn Close-Hainsworth" To: References: <200402061606.i16G5930095244@net.indra.com> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 17:09:42 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Wool and West Yorkshire X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny and others searching... For decent, next-to-the-skin type wool yarns, try a search for Green Mountain Spinnery, which uses organic fine wools and doesn't process them harshly. Also Koigu merino yarns, and Morehouse Farm yarns. All should turn up on an internet search. The trouble with the harsh processing is that they use chemicals to remove all vegetable matter from the wool before it's combed or carded. The chemicals open up all the scales in the fibres, which they don't close up. So instead of a smooth fibre it's all scratchy for those of us with sensitive skin, and of course it's exacerbated by the further carding/spinning/dyeing. All the above suppliers don't use harsh processes. One of the reasons I started handspinning was to control the quality of the yarn I produced, as well as design it for what I wanted. The green stuff I'm spinning at the moment is Polwarth, from which I'm knitting a long-sleeved T-shirt (with bobbles round the edges) for wearing as a bottom layer. And I've got sensitive dry skin prone to eczema, and for years thought I couldn't wear wool at all. Dawn I live in Baildon, Bradford, and work in Roundhay. Where in Leeds are you? Are you the one with the costuming business that includes Napoleonic-era uniforms (vague memory itching at back of head). I'd love to come and visit. Freyalyn, trying to be useful. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 13:43:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16IhYSd013729 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:43:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16IeGcP025247; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:40:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16IeE2v013337; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:40:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Ie82v013182 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 11:40:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from alfalfapress.com (c-24-21-157-61.client.comcast.net [24.21.157.61]) by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i16Ie3g05708 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:40:03 -0500 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:47:44 -0800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Althea Turner To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <01bf01c3ebbe$5b3b4370$0500a8c0@MOM> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Living History Groups in UK and France X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey all, I am traveling to Europe this summer to study merovingian textiles (France June 15-July 5, UK July 5- July 19) and am interested in learning the locations of any really good living history groups. I know Jorvik, and I think there is one in York, but I'm not sure. Does anyone know some good places to visit? I'm interested in time period 400-800 AD, and late Roman provincial. I'm also interested in finding a traveling partner and/or inexpensive places to stay in Paris and London, as well as a few small towns (Sens, Chelles, Lyon, Dordogne region, Loire region, and areas north of London). I'm an easy traveling partner, honest. :D Thanks! Althea Turner *** althea@alfalfapress.com *** http://www.alfalfapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 14:12:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16JChSd013877 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:12:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JBqcP028234; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:11:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JBq2v038322; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:11:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JB42v037702 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:11:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32ff5.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.245]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 7A38847FFDD for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:10:54 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <001001c3ece4$fd8757f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:11:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] roll call X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i16JChSd013877 Status: RO Hi, I am Bjarne Drews, male costumer (mostly 18th century) 49 years old :-( and i also make bobbin lace and embroidery. I was educated from "Skolen for Brugskunst" (art and craft school, where i studyed historical costume 4 years. I was the only pupil who did that, my fellow students wanted to become fashion designers. I learned everything here, drawing painting, tailoring, cutting, sewing, draping - you name it, all that has something to do with clothing. For many years, i made costumes with my imagination, and did not take any considerations about wich fibers was used in the period i made for. For instance i made late elizabethan costumes with appliqued lace motifs sewed with sparkling palliettes, (laughs) and i thoaght it was beautifull and very historically. But i did make the right undergarments though........... The last few years, i have become more and more aware of what not to use, and why. Until a few years ago, i mostly made for females, but lately i have become quite fund of making male costumes also, so i am still learning and willing to make sacrifices to be more authentic. I love this group, and it is one of my first to do things when i get home from work, to see if there are any interresting topics, perhaps this is one of the reasons i asked who was here, because i missed the old days when this group was very buisy. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 14:24:57 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16JOvSd013941 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:24:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JGAcP028632; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:16:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JG92v041710; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:16:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JG22w041654 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:16:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i16JbwWm010887 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:37:58 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.117] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A56820A028E; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 14:05:12 -0500 Message-ID: <001901c3ece6$58ad6e20$755183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costuming mythology (was:New book on men's dress - anyoneseen? ) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:20:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Having grown up in New England in the last century, there sure was a carry over of the idea of not showing your wealth 'on your back'. Simplicity was supposed to be the way to present yourself to the world abroad...perhaps even to the extent of passing that 'simplicity' off as homespun. We do remember do we not that Boston IS the hub of the Universe! Kathleen----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Carlson" To: Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 11:30 AM Subject: [h-cost] Costuming mythology (was:New book on men's dress - anyoneseen? ) > David Webb quoted from the following review: > >...the American political imagination on the eve of Independence. In a time > >when homespun attire was a popular expression of civic virtue, homemade > >clothing was widely regarded as a reflection of America's most cherished > >republican values: simplicity, industriousness, frugality, and > >independence. > > Whether this was actually true or not, I'm seeing a connection here between > this perception of the colonial era, and the (seemingly) commonly held > misperceptions of earlier clothing - for example "Medieval clothing should > be homespun and look really rustic." > > Marc > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get some great ideas here for your sweetheart on Valentine's Day - and > beyond. http://special.msn.com/network/celebrateromance.armx > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 14:26:57 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16JQvSd013950 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:26:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JHtcP028844; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:17:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JHt2v043069; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:17:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JHp2v043041 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:17:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32ff5.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.245]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B1CA9480039 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:17:49 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <002c01c3ece5$f5e753f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:18:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] chenille embroidery on justaucorps X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i16JQvSd013950 Status: RO Hi again. For some days i had hoped for better weather with a little sunsshine, but no It is dull and dark as always. Well i used a bright lamp to light up my embroidery and took some photos for you to see. Mind you, the colours are not right, but it could give you an idea. When the sun comes, ill promise to take some better ones. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 14:40:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16JeVSd013982 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:40:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JYxcP000730; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:34:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JYv2v056617; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:34:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JYp2v056508 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:34:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.8) with ESMTP id 621635 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:34:45 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 11:34:44 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] chenille embroidery on justaucorps From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002c01c3ece5$f5e753f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This work is incredible!! Bjarne, you only get better and better. I'm so impressed. Thank you for not waiting for good weather and lighting to share this wonderful work with us. LynnD On 2/6/04 11:18 AM, "Bjarne og Leif Drews" wrote: > Hi again. > For some days i had hoped for better weather with a little sunsshine, but no > It is dull and dark as always. Well i used a bright lamp to light up my > embroidery and took some photos for you to see. Mind you, the colours are not > right, but it could give you an idea. > When the sun comes, ill promise to take some better ones. > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm > > Bjarne > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 15:12:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16KCPSd014081 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:12:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JBEcP028161; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:11:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JB82v037784; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:11:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp-out1.blueyonder.co.uk (smtp-out1.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.213.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16JB12v037691 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:11:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@agesofelegance.co.uk) Received: from Imedia5043 ([82.44.203.167]) by smtp-out1.blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5600); Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:53:45 +0000 Message-ID: <00fc01c3ece2$8a8b39d0$1810a8c0@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Living History Groups in UK and France Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:53:42 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Feb 2004 18:53:45.0263 (UTC) FILETIME=[8C0863F0:01C3ECE2] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Regia Anglorium are the main dark ages group over here in teh uk they have a website which should list all their events. The Roman groups are the Ermine Street Guard and Legion Augusta again details on eh web as far as I know English Heritage special events dept run many events over the year of various periods at historic houses so check them out as well Dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of historical clothing, uniforms and bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Althea Turner" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 6:47 PM Subject: [h-cost] Living History Groups in UK and France > Hey all, > > I am traveling to Europe this summer to study merovingian textiles > (France June 15-July 5, UK July 5- July 19) and am interested in > learning the locations of any really good living history groups. I > know Jorvik, and I think there is one in York, but I'm not sure. Does > anyone know some good places to visit? I'm interested in time period > 400-800 AD, and late Roman provincial. > > I'm also interested in finding a traveling partner and/or inexpensive > places to stay in Paris and London, as well as a few small towns (Sens, > Chelles, Lyon, Dordogne region, Loire region, and areas north of > London). I'm an easy traveling partner, honest. :D > > Thanks! > > Althea Turner > *** althea@alfalfapress.com > *** http://www.alfalfapress.com > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 15:48:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16KmhSd014262 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:48:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16KjAcP006617; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:45:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Kj32v011867; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:45:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Kit2w011770 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:44:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i16L6qWm012168 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 16:06:52 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.123] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA35394023C; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 15:33:57 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c3ecf2$bec61840$7b5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002c01c3ece5$f5e753f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] chenille embroidery on justaucorps Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:49:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Since the design of the embroidery has changed motifs, are you making another suit at the same time as the one above, sporting primroses? The flowers all look pickable. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 2:18 PM Subject: [h-cost] chenille embroidery on justaucorps Hi again. For some days i had hoped for better weather with a little sunsshine, but no It is dull and dark as always. Well i used a bright lamp to light up my embroidery and took some photos for you to see. Mind you, the colours are not right, but it could give you an idea. When the sun comes, ill promise to take some better ones. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 16:10:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16LAtSd014341 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 16:10:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16L8EcP008502; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:08:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16L872v029865; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:08:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay7-f82.bay7.hotmail.com [64.4.11.82]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16L7l2v029570 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:07:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from distantdesigns@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:50:12 -0800 Received: from 24.21.37.141 by by7fd.bay7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 20:50:12 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.21.37.141] X-Originating-Email: [distantdesigns@hotmail.com] X-Sender: distantdesigns@hotmail.com From: "Jennifer Sena" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 12:50:12 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Feb 2004 20:50:12.0750 (UTC) FILETIME=[D0E64AE0:01C3ECF2] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Thanks and another question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks for the great links everyone. They gave me plenty of info on the proper cut, etc. and I may try some washed wool tests to see if I might be able to wear it on the outside. I see the difference between what I was doing and what I should be doing. Now, does anyone have an online putting in gussets/gores "for dummies"? I've done them before but I'd like to visually refresh my memory before I launch into something and get frazzled. Jennifer Sena Distant Designs http://home.teleport.com/~cedric/distdesi I wont hurt you, I just want to dress you up!! _________________________________________________________________ Find great local high-speed Internet access value at the MSN High-Speed Marketplace. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200360ave/direct/01/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 16:16:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16LGWSd014364 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 16:16:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16LATcP008731; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:10:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16LATl6031743; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:10:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16LAOl6031693 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:10:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-33-226.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.33.226]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.10 close 1msg/rcpt/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16LAKqb018712 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 13:10:21 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040206123349.05b70a60@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 12:34:32 -0800 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Subject: [h-cost] AngloSaxon burial newly found X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.museumoflondon.org.uk/MOLsite/exhibits/prittlewell/index.htm You can click on 'objects' to see more. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 17:26:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16MQESd015026 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 17:26:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16MPRcP020181; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:25:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16MPHl6093211; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:25:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp4.pacifier.net (smtp4.pacifier.net [64.255.237.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16MOxl6092960 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:25:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.133.143]) by smtp4.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 503FE6A96E for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:24:56 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 14:24:58 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] left-handed stitching of buttonholes Message-ID: <4023A3BA.10644.626380F@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > Annette wrote : > > 3. Know that some threads have a definite direction. When you cut a > > length of thread off a spool do you thread the needle with the end > > that was newly cut, or the "older" cut? Try to be consistent in > > this, and if a particular thread is constantly causing problems, try > > threading it through the needle the other way. (This is particularly > > true of metallic threads and silk, but often also with thicker > > threads like buttonhole twist.) > OK, now I'm confused. The twist will be the same regardless of which > end goes through the needle, right? So it shouldn't matter which end > of the thread goes through the needle first. > > If that doesn't make sense, draw a picture of thread with a twist: _ > _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ > \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ \_ > > Look at it right side up and upside down. The twist is still the same. > > --Robin The twist is the same, but the processing of the fibres makes a big difference. This is especially important in embroidery flosses, but I've found the same to be true with regular threads. (I notice that when I use thread off a bobbin it tends to knot up more easily than when I use it off the spool. But that's because the thread is essentially "turned around" on a bobbin.) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 17:42:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16Mg9Sd015076 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 17:42:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16MfLcP023192; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:41:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16MfIl6006216; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:41:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk (smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.213.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16MfEl6006166 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:41:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@agesofelegance.co.uk) Received: from Imedia5043 ([82.44.203.167]) by smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5600); Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:32:39 +0000 Message-ID: <001d01c3ecf0$5b68b200$1810a8c0@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402061606.i16G5930095244@net.indra.com> <000001c3ecd7$3a73d7a0$161efea9@lance3> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool and West Yorkshire Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:32:36 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Feb 2004 20:32:39.0375 (UTC) FILETIME=[5D0A05F0:01C3ECF0] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yep that's me I live 2 mins from teh white Rose Centre and planning a town centre studio very soon I'm in london atm but let's meet up when I'm back :-) Dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of historical clothing, uniforms and bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 > Dawn > I live in Baildon, Bradford, and work in Roundhay. Where in Leeds are you? > Are you the one with the costuming business that includes Napoleonic-era > uniforms (vague memory itching at back of head). I'd love to come and > visit. > > Freyalyn, trying to be useful. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 18:01:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16N1ASd015157 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:01:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Mu9cP025447; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:56:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Mu6l6017449; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:56:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp3.pacifier.net (smtp3.pacifier.net [64.255.237.173]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16Mu5l6017428 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:56:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.133.143]) by smtp3.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 904356D7ED for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 14:56:03 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2004 14:56:05 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] thread direction Message-ID: <4023AB05.8677.642B611@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Incidentally, the metallic > machine embroidery thread suffers a similar shredding problem which is > caused by the eye of the machine needle heating up as the metal runs > through it. Using a Microtec (or is it Microtex) needle instead of a regular one can help with this. These needles are specially made to work better for machine use with metallics/mylar. They also work better when you are sewing on fabrics with some metallic (or mylar) content. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 18:10:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i16NAXSd015190 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:10:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16N9QcP026464; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 16:09:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16N9Hl6026260; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 16:09:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk (fmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.183]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i16N9Dl6026228 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 16:09:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynn@close-hainsworth.fslife.co.uk) Received: from [195.92.195.171] (helo=cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk) by fmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1ApELN-000709-Ds for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 22:21:01 +0000 Received: from modem-1861.leopard.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.151.69] helo=lance3) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1ApELN-0000eD-HM for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 22:21:01 +0000 Message-ID: <001d01c3ecff$c3e3aec0$161efea9@lance3> From: "Lynn Close-Hainsworth" To: References: <200402061901.i16J0o30029584@net.indra.com> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:22:53 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 'Worsted' yarn X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Robin tells me that worsted is the way to go - I'm still looking for worsted in a color and price I like. The Lamb's Pride says it's "worsted", but >Im getting the impression that in yarn, it's something different than yardage. All the acrylic yarn I looked at at JoAnn's *said* it was worsted, >but I though that applied to the length of the wool staple. Anyone with insight? I'm not at all familiar with yarn terms. > Now this is one of those terms which causes all sorts of confusion. Traditionally, 'worsted' was a form of fibre preparation and yarn spinning which keeps all the fibres arranged along the length of the yarn, keeping the yarn smooth, dense, and supposedly less itchy as there are less bits sticking out. The opposite is a 'woollen' preparation in which the fibres go any which way within the yarn, making a much fluffier and airier yarn. Worsted fabric is smooth, eg men's suiting, and woollen fabric is bulkier and more likely to full and felt, ie tweed. Worsted yarn/fabric is usually made from a longwoolled lustre sheep (such as Wensleydale or Teeswater) and woollen from something shorter and bouncier, like Shetland or Southdown. Now, in American knitting yarn parlance, 'worsted' is a yarn weight, somewhere between British double-knitting and aran thickness. So if you'd asked for worsted knitting yarn, you'd have got a certain thickness of yarn, not a certain type of preparation. (See why I now spin my own yarn?) Possibly more information than you wanted, but hope it helps. Freyalyn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 20:29:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i171TiSd015672 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:29:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i171RjcP006170; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:27:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i171Ral6005572; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:27:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i171RYl6005513 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 18:27:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AF10197E008A; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 19:27:44 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AF0D990208; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 19:27:41 -0600 Message-ID: <004b01c3ed19$892933d0$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <020620041800.12393.4738@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool- for Penny Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:27:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am wanting to make a 1970s crocheted long vest for my daughter and the pattern calls for 16 skeins. So I need to order it from somewhere to get the correct dye lot. The yarn lady at Ben Franklin's told me to avoid all acrylic yarn because it can be stiff. She said Red Heart brands are the worst. She suggested a wool or cotton blend, the higher percentage the better. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 22:23:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i173N2Sd015947 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:23:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173D3cP010713; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:13:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173Cvl6054121; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:12:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173Csl7054104 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:12:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i173YvWm029009 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:34:57 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.106] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A5286428014A; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 22:02:00 -0500 Message-ID: <001b01c3ed28$f5d8b280$6a5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <020620041800.12393.4738@comcast.net> <004b01c3ed19$892933d0$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool- for Penny Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:17:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If this vest is the same that my mom made me then, she used orlon. The fiber has the weight and 'feel' of wool but is a synthetic yarn. it washes well and keeps its shape over time. (I still have and wear mine as a tabard over silk pants and shirt. Kathleen Wow, 34 years!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 8:27 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool- for Penny > I am wanting to make a 1970s crocheted long vest for my daughter and the > pattern calls for 16 skeins. So I need to order it from somewhere to get > the correct dye lot. The yarn lady at Ben Franklin's told me to avoid all > acrylic yarn because it can be stiff. She said Red Heart brands are the > worst. She suggested a wool or cotton blend, the higher percentage the > better. > > Penny E. Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 22:29:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i173TTSd015969 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:29:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173Q5cP011277; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:26:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173Q3l6060069; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:26:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173Q0l6060053 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:26:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.48]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AotSa-0006qX-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:03:04 -0800 Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AotSZ-0001Cy-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:03:04 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: "H-Costume@Indra. Com" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:03:06 -0700 Message-ID: <000a01c3ec44$9951ec00$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] List problem? Or is it just me. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am finding lately that none of my messages are posting if they have links in them..anyone else having this problem? Thanks, Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 6 22:44:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i173iHSd015988 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:44:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173hScP012266; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:43:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173hOl6068282; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:43:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from softwareinnovation.com (w002.z064000176.dfw-tx.dsl.cnc.net [64.0.176.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i173hNl6068231 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:43:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from betsy@softwareinnovation.com) Received: from theforce ([64.0.176.13]) by softwareinnovation.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.0); Fri, 6 Feb 2004 21:42:58 -0600 From: "Betsy Marshall" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 21:43:21 -0600 Message-ID: <004501c3ed2c$88aae170$0db00040@softwareinnovation.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <001d01c3ecf0$5b68b200$1810a8c0@Imedia5043> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Feb 2004 03:42:58.0170 (UTC) FILETIME=[7A3D7DA0:01C3ED2C] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Museums upcoming X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http://www.southendmuseums.co.uk/ then scroll down some- this might interest all you Victorian enthusiasts.... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 00:21:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i175KxSd016333 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 00:20:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i175IscP016712; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:18:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i175Iml6007930; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:18:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay11-dav8.bay11.hotmail.com [64.4.38.112]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i175Ihl6007878 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:18:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bear_janet@msn.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 21:18:38 -0800 Received: from 4.10.36.229 by bay11-dav8.bay11.hotmail.com with DAV; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 05:18:38 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [4.10.36.229] X-Originating-Email: [bear_janet@msn.com] X-Sender: bear_janet@msn.com From: "JAMES OGILVIE" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20040206123349.05b70a60@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] AngloSaxon burial newly found Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 00:18:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 8.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202 Seal-Send-Time: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 00:18:20 -0500 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Feb 2004 05:18:38.0256 (UTC) FILETIME=[D7991B00:01C3ED39] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i175KxSd016333 Status: RO But what kind of clothes was he wearing? Why don't they tell us about the important stuff? (The artist's recreation at the Southend Museums site seems to show him wearing clothes, but I guess most people are excited by the gold jewelry.) Thanks for the link! Janet Janet Davis Castle Furnishings www.medievalbookstore.com http://www.museumoflondon.org.uk/MOLsite/exhibits/prittlewell/index.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 01:50:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i176oUSd016529 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 01:50:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i176ntcP019753; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 23:49:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i176nsl6041326; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 23:49:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from gw.retro.com (gw.retro.com [205.179.181.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i176nbl6041166 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 23:49:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lee@gw.retro.com) Received: (from lee@localhost) by gw.retro.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id i176qr907147 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:52:53 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:52:53 -0800 (PST) From: Lee Thompson-Herbert Message-Id: <200402070652.i176qr907147@gw.retro.com> To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] AngloSaxon burial newly found Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > But what kind of clothes was he wearing? Why don't they tell us about the important stuff? (The artist's recreation at the Southend Museums site seems to show him wearing clothes, but I guess most people are excited by the gold jewelry.) Thanks for the link! Almost nothing organic survived from this burial. The soil is way too acidic for anything like a body to have been preserved. I'm not sure there was even a sand casting in this case. Lee M.Thompson-Herbert lee@retro.com KoX 1995, SP4 Head Muso, White Rats Morris, Faultline Morris Member, Knights of Xenu (1995). Chaos Monger and Jill of All Trades. "A head-on collision between Morticia Adams and Martha Stewart" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 01:52:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i176qeSd016534 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 01:52:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i176n0cP019706; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 23:49:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i176mtl6040826; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 23:48:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9401.mail.yahoo.com (web9401.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.107]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i176mfl6040712 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 23:48:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040207064158.52985.qmail@web9401.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9401.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 22:41:58 PST Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:41:58 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] List problem? Or is it just me. To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000a01c3ec44$9951ec00$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO No, not, that I've noticed anyway---- Albra "Saragrace T. Knauf" wrote: I am finding lately that none of my messages are posting if they have links in them..anyone else having this problem? Thanks, Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 03:21:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i178LUSd010205 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 03:21:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i178HvcP022228; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 01:17:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i178Hrl6072363; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 01:17:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i178Hol6072329 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 01:17:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AF363C9008E; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 02:17:58 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AF3411B0208; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 02:17:56 -0600 Message-ID: <00b901c3ed52$da797540$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402061901.i16J0o30029584@net.indra.com> <001d01c3ecff$c3e3aec0$161efea9@lance3> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 'Worsted' yarn Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 03:17:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Freyalyn, Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. My mother always bought my yarn when I learned to crochet. Ben Franklin's really has a limited supply. When I went to Michael's they had a large supply and it was confusing. Susan and I strolled into a yard store in the French Quarter of New Orleans. The prices were VERY expensive and not in a skein. I didn't look at it much... when I know I can't afford something I stay away. I have some more questions: What are the different yarn plys for and their uses? Also what types of yarn are good for certain uses? Meaning, wool, cotton, acrylic. What is a good percentage of mix of fibers? Are they certain yarns better to use for knitting and not crocheting and vice versa? I know the small cotton thread (a little thicker than kite-string) is good for lace, tablecloths, bedspreads, and doilies. Lastly, I am left-handed. Are there any websites that will show the crochet stitches for a left-handed person. All I have found are for right-handed people. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 04:18:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i179I4Sd010991 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 04:18:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i179GBcP023512; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 02:16:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i179G7l6092364; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 02:16:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i179G5l7092345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL) for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 02:16:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-206.sonic.net [209.148.112.206]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i15LHdts013975 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 13:17:41 -0800 Message-ID: <4022B3D0.3040801@lavoltapress.com> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:21:20 -0800 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume References: <20040205194623.56826.qmail@web40902.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20040205194623.56826.qmail@web40902.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] OT--for those who are into old cosmetics and medicines X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Does anyone have any idea what an herb, chemical, or commercial preparation called "vigo" would have been in the early 19th century? I am reading an old book of cosmetic recipes where it is mentioned. All I can find out about "vigo" is that it is the name of a place in Spain, and also a personal name. The recipe is for a plaster for taking off corns, as follows: Mix equal parts of hemlock, vigo, and diachylon. Make of them a sort of thick soup; place it on the corn; cover it with a small circle of plaster, and cover it well with a narrow bandage. After eight days or so, lift the plaster. The corn will be so much softened that you may cut it off without resistance and without pain. Thanks for any help. Fran Grimble Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 08:20:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17DKjSd011830 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:20:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DGQcP001485; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:16:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DGDl6073733; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:16:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DGBl7073724 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:16:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i17DcKWm027163 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:38:20 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.106] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A29083C50150; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 08:05:20 -0500 Message-ID: <002d01c3ed7d$3fdabaa0$6a5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402061901.i16J0o30029584@net.indra.com><001d01c3ecff$c3e3aec0$161efea9@lance3> <00b901c3ed52$da797540$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 'Worsted' yarn Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:21:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 3:17 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] 'Worsted' yarn > Freyalyn, > > Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. My mother always bought > my yarn when I learned to crochet. Ben Franklin's really has a limited > supply. When I went to Michael's they had a large supply and it was > confusing. Susan and I strolled into a yard store in the French Quarter of > New Orleans. The prices were VERY expensive and not in a skein. I didn't > look at it much... when I know I can't afford something I stay away. > > I have some more questions: > > What are the different yarn plys for and their uses? > > Also what types of yarn are good for certain uses? Meaning, wool, cotton, > acrylic. What is a good percentage of mix of fibers? > > Are they certain yarns better to use for knitting and not crocheting and > vice versa? I know the small cotton thread (a little thicker than > kite-string) is good for lace, tablecloths, bedspreads, and doilies. > > Lastly, I am left-handed. Are there any websites that will show the > crochet stitches for a left-handed person. All I have found are for > right-handed people. > > Penny E. Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 08:21:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17DLJSd011834 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:21:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DICcP001618; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:18:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DICl6074402; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:18:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DHol6074307 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:17:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-39-192.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.39.192]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.10 close 1msg/rcpt/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DHn9D010409 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 05:17:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040207051639.04f644d0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 05:17:05 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] AngloSaxon burial newly found In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20040206123349.05b70a60@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >But what kind of clothes was he wearing? Well, there was this buckle... >Why don't they tell us about the important stuff? (The artist's >recreation at the Southend Museums site seems to show him wearing clothes, >but I guess most people are excited by the gold jewelry.) Thanks for the link! CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 08:56:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17Du4Sd011933 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:56:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DqFcP002775; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:52:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DqEl6087174; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:52:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17DqCl7087169 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 06:52:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i17EEMWm030150 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 09:14:22 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.101] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB02C0C6012E; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 08:41:22 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c3ed82$487eb260$655183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040205194623.56826.qmail@web40902.mail.yahoo.com> <4022B3D0.3040801@lavoltapress.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT--for those who are into old cosmetics and medicines Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:57:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fran I hope that the recipe following 'might'help. >From The Family Doctor, by Henry S. Taylor,Keystone Pub. Co....(Plainly 19th C)no date: Two oz. of yellow wax Two oz. gum ammoniac Six drachms of verdigris (could this be perhaps shortened to vigo?) another recipe from the same book lists white wax, spermaceti and almond oil. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lavolta Press" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 4:21 PM Subject: [h-cost] OT--for those who are into old cosmetics and medicines > Does anyone have any idea what an herb, chemical, or commercial > preparation called "vigo" would have been in the early 19th century? I > am reading an old book of cosmetic recipes where it is mentioned. All I > can find out about "vigo" is that it is the name of a place in Spain, > and also a personal name. The recipe is for a plaster for taking off > corns, as follows: > > Mix equal parts of hemlock, vigo, and diachylon. Make of them a sort of > thick soup; place it on the corn; cover it with a small circle of > plaster, and cover it well with a narrow bandage. After eight days or > so, lift the plaster. The corn will be so much softened that you may cut > it off without resistance and without pain. > > Thanks for any help. > > Fran Grimble > Books on Historic Costuming > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 10:00:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17F0NSd012116 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 10:00:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17EurcP004641; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 07:56:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Eunl6010565; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 07:56:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Eukl7010546 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 07:56:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i17FIuWm007013 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 10:18:57 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.124] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA2019CD002E; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 09:45:52 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c3ed8b$4bd82780$7c5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040205194623.56826.qmail@web40902.mail.yahoo.com><4022B3D0.3040801@lavoltapress.com> <000901c3ed82$487eb260$655183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT--for those who are into old cosmetics and medicines Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 10:01:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fran here are a couple more references: >From a F&W 1922 Dictionary, "Vigonian" (obsolete), a certain salve(?) for treating pox. Named after Joanne de Vigo And from the OED: under an article on 'vigour', "Active force...drugs and medicaments; borage and buglosse. 1599, Dr. Gabehouer"s Bk "Physicke","A salve prepared that doth posset and curd....a laudable way of trying the vigor of Cider by its promptness to burn." Another amusing cure for a corn, from DR Chase's receipts, "Knick a lemon and put over the offending toe, bind and leave it over night. The corn will lift off easily in the morning" Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT--for those who are into old cosmetics and medicines > Fran I hope that the recipe following 'might'help. > >From The Family Doctor, by Henry S. Taylor,Keystone Pub. Co....(Plainly 19th > C)no date: > Two oz. of yellow wax > Two oz. gum ammoniac > Six drachms of verdigris (could this be perhaps shortened to vigo?) > another recipe from the same book lists white wax, spermaceti and almond > oil. > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lavolta Press" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 4:21 PM > Subject: [h-cost] OT--for those who are into old cosmetics and medicines > > > > Does anyone have any idea what an herb, chemical, or commercial > > preparation called "vigo" would have been in the early 19th century? I > > am reading an old book of cosmetic recipes where it is mentioned. All I > > can find out about "vigo" is that it is the name of a place in Spain, > > and also a personal name. The recipe is for a plaster for taking off > > corns, as follows: > > > > Mix equal parts of hemlock, vigo, and diachylon. Make of them a sort of > > thick soup; place it on the corn; cover it with a small circle of > > plaster, and cover it well with a narrow bandage. After eight days or > > so, lift the plaster. The corn will be so much softened that you may cut > > it off without resistance and without pain. > > > > Thanks for any help. > > > > Fran Grimble > > Books on Historic Costuming > > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 10:24:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17FOlSd012266 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 10:24:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17FMKcP005527; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:22:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17FMIl6020540; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:22:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lanthanum.btinternet.com (lanthanum.btinternet.com [194.73.73.177]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17FMEl6020519 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:22:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.21.148] (helo=dan) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1ApRJg-00073e-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 12:12:08 +0000 Message-ID: <001101c3ed73$d9c69d00$94158151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 12:13:51 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all, I have come across an item at Lacma which is baffling me. It's described as: England Costume Drawings of Tudor Nobility with Manuscript Additions circa 1511 Ink and gouache on paper M.85.81a-d Drawing; Costume/textile works on paper The Url is tricky, since it doesn't seem to reflect internal site changes, but for what it's worth: http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/mwebcgi/mweb.exe?request=ks&direct= yes The problem is that it really looks much earlier. That and the vast amounts of ermine on the outside.... What does the team think? best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 10:55:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17FtLSd012442 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 10:55:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17FsecP006898; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:54:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Fscl6034487; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:54:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mprdmxin.myway.com (nn8.excitenetwork.com [207.159.120.62]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Fsal6034432 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 08:54:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from emmajean@myway.com) Received: by mprdmxin.myway.com (Postfix, from userid 110) id 601A03967; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 10:36:51 -0500 (EST) To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] List problem? Or is it just me. Received: from [207.161.59.79] by mprdmailfe2.nwk.myway.com via HTTP; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 10:36:51 EST X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: ID = 55433e6ba2cfbd0adfc5eeb9a6ba921b From: "Wendy" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: emmajean@myway.com X-Mailer: PHP Message-Id: <20040207153651.601A03967@mprdmxin.myway.com> Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 10:36:51 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I haven't seen that, but my messages show up without any spaces...annoying......................................Wendy.......................................--- On Sat 02/07, KATHRYN WOLTERS < albrakat7@yahoo.com > wrote: From: KATHRYN WOLTERS [mailto: albrakat7@yahoo.com]To: h-costume@indra.comDate: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:41:58 -0800 (PST)Subject: Re: [h-cost] List problem? Or is it just me.No, not, that I've noticed anyway----Albra"Saragrace T. Knauf" wrote:I am finding lately that none of my messages are posting if they have linksin them..anyone else having this problem?Thanks,Sg_______________________________________________h-costume mailing listh-costume@mail.indra.comhttp://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume---------------------------------Do you Yahoo!?Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online_______________________________________________h-costume mailing listh-costume@mail.indra.comhttp://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding. Introducing My Way - http://www.myway.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 11:53:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17GrdSd012710 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 11:53:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17GoPcP009605; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 09:50:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17GoGl6057817; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 09:50:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17GoCl6057778 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 09:50:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA32734 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 12:19:14 -0600 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 12:19:14 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? In-Reply-To: <001101c3ed73$d9c69d00$94158151@dan> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sat, 7 Feb 2004, Stevie Gamble wrote: > I have come across an item at Lacma which is baffling me. It's > described as: > England > Costume Drawings of Tudor Nobility with Manuscript Additions > circa 1511 > Ink and gouache on paper > M.85.81a-d > Drawing; Costume/textile works on paper > > The Url is tricky, since it doesn't seem to reflect internal site > changes, but for what it's worth: > > http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/mwebcgi/mweb.exe?request=ks&direct= > yes > > The problem is that it really looks much earlier. That and the vast > amounts of ermine on the outside.... >From the left-hand page, it looks like this is intended to show various traditional ways of rendering "ermine" in drawings. For the costumes, it looks like the artist picked styles, mostly from the past, that traditionally use large quantities of ermine. It is not unlikely that the images were copied out of historic sources -- other manuscripts, etc. -- as examples of the various means of renderings. The image is too small for me to read enough of the left-hand page to tell what the distinctions are between ermine examples; I can make out only a few words. However, if I had to guess, I think it's a key to where the types of ermine spots were found -- I think I made out "bonnet" and "gown" in some of the labels, and the rest of the phrases appear possibly to be references to which source (or what type of image) they were found in. All but the last of the images are of some version of a ceremonial sideless surcote, which was used for symbolic renderings of the Queen in State through at least 1500 and occasionally thereafter -- long after the dress would ever have been worn in life. I've seen similar images in heraldic manuscripts and in a couple of Tudor/Elizabethan manuscripts in which the sideless surcote is pretty clearly meant to have an iconographic function. In particular, the upper right and lower left images (with the mantles) are dead ringers for images from a particular roll of arms I have somewhere in my file, and I wouldn't be surprised if they were copied right out of it. In all of the first four images, the rendering of the lines of the clothing looks as though the artist was was copying without any sense of what the lines were supposed to mean (many generations of renderings earlier, when they had some connection to real clothing). The lower right image (labeled "Lady") looks more realistic, around 1490 perhaps, and may have been copied from a manuscript of that time. This is much earlier than the books we traditionally think of as compilations of historic costume. From the sparse information on the site, I gather these pages are loose sheets, not part of a surviving book. I wonder if it was really intended to be "costume drawings," or if that's a modern cataloger's guess. I'd speculate that it was in fact part of a model-book for heraldic renderings or similar manuscript functions. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 11:56:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17GurSd012721 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 11:56:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Gr1cP009741; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 09:53:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Gr1l6059096; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 09:53:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Gqwl6059046 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 09:52:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a22.in-tch.com [66.62.107.2]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i17GUXT11725 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 09:30:34 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <4025189E.3090207@in-tch.com> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 09:55:58 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool- for Penny References: <020620041800.12393.4738@comcast.net> In-Reply-To: <020620041800.12393.4738@comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Our Michael's has some pretty inexpensive wool blends. Don't recall, off-hand, if they have 100% wools. On the other hand, they're pretty bad about keeping things like knitting needles in stock! --sue eirenetz@comcast.net wrote: > BTW, in the Denver area, you'll not find wool yarn at JoAnn's or Michael's - you have to go to a knitting store. It was $6.50 for the skein, of which I used maybe 10 yards. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 16:45:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17Lj3Sd013924 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 16:45:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17LiIcP024290; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 14:44:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Lgvl6093606; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 14:42:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m3.nyc.untd.com (m3.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.66]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i17Lgul6093551 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 14:42:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from btana@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"MW/ewWa+Q2FG65sHxVDc3Ue5IO3HnzFnFLG8sajrrhon7/GaR1Vkzg==">; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 13:36:08 PST Received: (from btana@juno.com) by m3.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JMTMLPZJ; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 13:36:08 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 14:43:46 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: who is here-ROLL CALL Message-ID: <20040207.144401.1332.4.btana@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 12-15,17-19 From: btana@juno.com Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yup, I'm here... Pat/Astrid from Colorado, primarily lurker. Don't do alot of truly historical clothing, but I do use it as a bit of an influence in the costuming that I do. Currently, my love and passion is the barbarian horde that I am a member of. Mostly working on the leather armor that came from a couple characters from the series of Hercules: The Legendary Journeys. Really gotta get that Xena thing done too for some other things. (Leather SOOOOO fits me! ) Also taking some inspiration for leather wear for winter barbarian activities so that I can stay warmer than my current things allow. If interested, I believe I have the costumes all shown except for a couple on my costume page... the link is in my sig. Anyhow, that's about it. I've found some very useful information here, as well as quite knowledgable people. This is a wonderful list. Astrid Never argue with a dragon, for thou art crunchy and go well with Brie. http://www.geocities.com/tul_juriss - for links to ALL my current sites http://www.geocities.com/astridofthehorde - costumes I've made http://www.geocities.com/house_qul_mupwi - The noble Klingon House http://www.geocities.com/klingon_pirates_guild - The Klingon Pirate's Guild ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 17:05:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17M5BSd014049 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:05:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17M36cP025222; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:03:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17M35l6002449; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:03:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17M30l6002412 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:03:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) Received: from stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.188]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1ApM0n-0003mh-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 22:32:17 -0800 Received: from user-12l20lu.cable.mindspring.com ([69.81.2.190] helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1ApM0m-0000vp-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 22:32:16 -0800 Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040207002718.021cb950@pop.radiks.net> X-Sender: costumrs@radiks.net@pop.radiks.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 00:32:09 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200402070326.i173QJl7060196@net.indra.com> References: <200402070326.i173QJl7060196@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e533b867b2c1bf6d1f2bce5431ddc7bf766dc269a42faf3455c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: needles X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's actually Metallica (NOT the band!!) needles for sewing/machine embroidery with metallic threads. Microtex needles are for sewing on microfiber fabrics. They would probably be good for woven metallic fabrics as well - they have a thinner and sharper point than regular needles. I used microfiber once for a costume - the Microtex needles definitely made a difference! Sandy >From: kat@grendal.rain.com > > > Incidentally, the metallic > > machine embroidery thread suffers a similar shredding problem which is > > caused by the eye of the machine needle heating up as the metal runs > > through it. > >Using a Microtec (or is it Microtex) needle instead of a regular one >can help with this. These needles are specially made to work better >for machine use with metallics/mylar. They also work better when you >are sewing on fabrics with some metallic (or mylar) content. > >Kat > "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 17:10:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17MAoSd014064 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:10:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17M7RcP025473; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:07:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17M7Rl6004409; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:07:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17M7Pl6004359 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:07:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A1A0D9B0082; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 16:07:28 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A19EC401F4; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 16:07:26 -0600 Message-ID: <001501c3edc6$beb6bba0$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402061901.i16J0o30029584@net.indra.com><001d01c3ecff$c3e3aec0$161efea9@lance3><00b901c3ed52$da797540$0500a8c0@MOM> <002d01c3ed7d$3fdabaa0$6a5183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 'Worsted' yarn Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:07:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Your message didn't show up. Can you please send it again. See below. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 8:21 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] 'Worsted' yarn > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 17:48:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17MmTSd014343 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:48:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17MjEcP027349; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:45:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17MjBl6019798; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:45:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from webwarren.com (65.18.210.ptr [65.18.210.91] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Mj5l6019701 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:45:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from webwarren@earthlink.net) Received: from jessie2.webwarren.com (pcp03026555pcs.plnfld01.nj.comcast.net [68.37.232.18]) by webwarren.com (8.12.10/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i17MilOS028801 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:44:59 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: webwarren.com: webbwarren owned process doing -bs Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20040207153617.075b9008@earthlink.net> X-Sender: n2kye@mail.webwarren.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 15:44:51 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Brenda Bell In-Reply-To: <200402070326.i173QIl7060184@net.indra.com> References: <200402070326.i173QIl7060184@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 89 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:27:22 -0500, "Penny Ladnier" wrote: >I am wanting to make a 1970s crocheted long vest for my daughter and the >pattern calls for 16 skeins. So I need to order it from somewhere to get >the correct dye lot. The yarn lady at Ben Franklin's told me to avoid all >acrylic yarn because it can be stiff. If you're looking for historical accuracy... acrylic is all my mom and most of her friends ever used at the time, and of course all I used (either Mom's leftovers or what I could afford from my allowance). If you're doing a granny-square vest or a filet-type vest, the softness is built in by the openness (shell stitch on the granny squares, the open squares of the "filet"). In the early '70's, when the vests were still hip length, we'd also have matching skirts -- either crocheted in a solid stitch (single- or double-crochet the whole length and width), or lined in a matching (acetate) lining, or solid-stitched-AND-lined. At Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:17:46 -0500, "Lloyd Mitchell" wrote: >If this vest is the same that my mom made me then, she used orlon. Maybe that was it. But isn't orlon an acrylic? >The fiber has the weight and 'feel' of wool but is a synthetic yarn. >it washes well and keeps its shape over time. (I still have and wear mine >as a tabard over silk pants and shirt. >Kathleen >Wow, 34 years!!! Brenda, onetime-owner of Mom-crocheted purple and yellow skirt-and-vest sets webwarren@earthlink.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 17:58:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i17MwISd014414 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:58:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17MsvcP027826; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:54:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Msul6023772; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:54:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i17Msrl6023719 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 15:54:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ACC08FE007C; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 16:54:56 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ACBD50E01FE; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 16:54:53 -0600 Message-ID: <003801c3edcd$600a4430$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402070326.i173QIl7060184@net.indra.com> <6.0.0.22.0.20040207153617.075b9008@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 89 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:54:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Brenda, The pattern was free from Coats & Clark at Ben Franklins. The weave is very loose, and looks like its using double trebles. There are no shells. Since Coats & Clark put out the pattern and they product Red Heart yarn, maybe it would be best to use. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 19:36:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i180afSd014937 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 19:36:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i180ZfcP002574; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:35:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i180XGl6070178; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:33:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i180XEl6070169 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:33:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sherylnd@KC.RR.COM) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com (CPE-65-30-107-115.kc.rr.com [65.30.107.115]) by ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i17NG8DA023785 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:16:14 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20040207172443.00a09840@pop-server.kc.rr.com> X-Sender: sherylnd@pop-server.kc.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2004 17:32:27 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <221C2FB0-5671-11D8-A866-000393D446D6@comcast.net> References: <200402030352.i133q92w001997@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Okay, I'm a little late replying to this (been sick this week). I don't know how far you like to travel for Ren Faires, but the Kansas City faire is an 8-hour drive. Or 6 hours if you drive like me. ;-) It starts labor day weekend and runs 7 weekends. There are a couple of us on this list that have it as our home faire. It's a pretty fun one (although it does tend to be more "fantasy" based than historically accurate). I know how you feel about Costume-Cons! Since I like fantasy costuming just as much as historical, they are great places to learn. And lots of eye-candy. I went to the one in Chicago last year (only my second con) and can't wait for the one in Des Moines in a couple of years. Only 3 hours away from me! Sheryl Nance-Durst At 11:48 AM 2/3/04 -0600, you wrote: >I'm Allison Pace, mostly a lurker. I live in Little Rock, AR, and am a >voice-over actress by day. I've been an actress and a sewer for many >years, and I also like most types of craft work, whether it's props or >hatmaking or jewelry. My downfall is that I seem to want to do so much, I >never quite finish anything. I've got the requisite tonnage of fabric and >supplies and books and plans to complete things, and I have trouble >focusing! Been doing mostly Renaissance (English/French/Spanish) stuff, >but want to do some Italian Ren, am planning an 1870's Victorian, and >would love an excuse to do a full-out 18C set, complete with wig! When >I'm working for a theatre with low-budget costuming (or, in many >unfortunate cases, a costumer who doesn't *get* it) I have been known to >make/find my own costumes, or at the very least, take them home and alter >them so they fit me. Two or three years ago I discovered Renaissance >Faires, and now I consider myself a historic costume geek. I haven't >found many like-minded folks with the time and interest to play with here, >so I've been known to travel to other places for a fix. (hint hint) I'm >always open to joining someone at a Ren Faire for the weekend! I've been >to one Costume Con, with no knowledge of just what to expect, but this >year am drooling with anticipation. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 19:50:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i180oiSd014973 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 19:50:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i180mocP003135; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:48:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i180kRl6076612; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:46:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i180kMl7076583 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 17:46:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i180kc8v014920 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 19:46:38 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i180kcpA014918 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 19:46:38 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 89 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 19:46:38 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200402070326.i173QIl7060184@net.indra.com> <6.0.0.22.0.20040207153617.075b9008@earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.0.20040207153617.075b9008@earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402071946.38242.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Saturday 07 February 2004 03:44 pm, Brenda Bell wrote: > At Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:27:22 -0500, "Penny Ladnier" > > wrote: > >I am wanting to make a 1970s crocheted long vest for my daughter and the > >pattern calls for 16 skeins. So I need to order it from somewhere to get > >the correct dye lot. The yarn lady at Ben Franklin's told me to avoid all > >acrylic yarn because it can be stiff. I'm surprised the clerk said that. All the acrylic yarn and yarn products I've seen have been *softer* than most other synthetic fibers. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 20:17:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i181H8Sd015056 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:17:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i181GXcP004475; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 18:16:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i181EBl6090255; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 18:14:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i181E7l6090195 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 18:14:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from IceGirlNIN@aol.com) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1c7.14d3150a (4410) for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:08:46 -0500 (EST) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <1c7.14d3150a.2d56e61d@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:08:45 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5006 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Semi-OT: JoAnn's Sale X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On the off chance that there are costumers in the Pittsburgh area, Jo-Ann's Fabrics at the Robinson Town Center is having a "moving sale". EVERYTHING, apparently, has to be gotten rid of, because they're moving into a larger JoAnn's. Patterns are going for $.99, Vogue at $1.99 (best I've ever seen that brand at). Fabric is basically half off literally everything in the store. Trims are 40% off, and they still have tons of the good stuff left (including 100% cotton cluny lace in a couple widths, and lots of yummy Europa trims). Things are ranging from 40% to 70% off. Unfortunately they won't honor flyer coupons as well, but I bought seven patterns and five yards of cluny, and spent under $20. I would have bought more, but I had a non-sewing friend with me, who had already been incredibly patient ;) Anyhow, just a heads-up to those in the area! Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 22:14:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i183EgSd015462 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 22:14:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i183CtcP008655; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:12:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i183Bjl6036828; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:11:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav31.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.88]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1838vl6035867 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:08:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 18:51:30 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav31.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 02:51:30 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001101c3ed73$d9c69d00$94158151@dan> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:52:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Feb 2004 02:51:30.0964 (UTC) FILETIME=[7488FD40:01C3EDEE] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm no expert on the matter, but that style of sideless surcote was kept in use for ceremonial occasions (coronations, burials, etc) way, way after it went out of fashion. I didn't think it went so late as the 1500's, but I wouldn't be surprised either if it was the case. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stevie Gamble" To: Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 7:13 AM Subject: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? > Hi all, > > I have come across an item at Lacma which is baffling me. It's > described as: > England > Costume Drawings of Tudor Nobility with Manuscript Additions > circa 1511 > Ink and gouache on paper > M.85.81a-d > Drawing; Costume/textile works on paper > > The Url is tricky, since it doesn't seem to reflect internal site > changes, but for what it's worth: > > http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/mwebcgi/mweb.exe?request=ks&direct= > yes > > The problem is that it really looks much earlier. That and the vast > amounts of ermine on the outside.... > > What does the team think? > > best wishes > Stevie > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 22:15:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i183FrSd015468 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 22:15:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1839IcP008492; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:09:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18383l6035646; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:08:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay11-dav71.bay11.hotmail.com [64.4.39.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18380l6035619 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 20:08:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bear_janet@msn.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 18:50:40 -0800 Received: from 4.10.36.229 by bay11-dav71.bay11.hotmail.com with DAV; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 02:50:40 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [4.10.36.229] X-Originating-Email: [bear_janet@msn.com] X-Sender: bear_janet@msn.com From: "JAMES OGILVIE" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1c7.14d3150a.2d56e61d@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:50:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 8.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202 Seal-Send-Time: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:50:17 -0500 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Feb 2004 02:50:40.0299 (UTC) FILETIME=[56561FB0:01C3EDEE] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Cleveland X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i183FrSd015468 Status: RO For anyone who is going to or through Cleveland in the near future, the Cleveland Museum of Art has a small special exhibit of mostly Renaissance textiles (a few earlier). I think everything was from their collection but some of it is not usually on display. Unfortunately, there is no book available. Janet Janet Davis Castle Furnishings www.medievalbookstore.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 23:18:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i184IjSd015674 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:18:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i184I6cP011216; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:18:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i184Gol6059961; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:16:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from siscom.net (counterstrike.siscom.net [209.251.2.97]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i184Gjl6059931 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:16:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drea@nospam) Received: from shell.siscom.net (unverified [209.251.2.80]) by siscom.net (BoogerMAIL) with ESMTP id 16200349 for ; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 22:48:46 -0500 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 22:51:26 -0500 (EST) From: Drea Leed To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20040207225043.P19178@shell.siscom.net> References: <001101c3ed73$d9c69d00$94158151@dan> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've seen references to a "Circoate" furred with Ermine as part of Queen Elizabeth's coronation robes...dunno if it's the same thing as what we consider a sideless surcote, but interesting. Drea On Sat, 7 Feb 2004, Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > I'm no expert on the matter, but that style of sideless surcote was kept in > use for ceremonial occasions (coronations, burials, etc) way, way after it > went out of fashion. I didn't think it went so late as the 1500's, but I > wouldn't be surprised either if it was the case. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Stevie Gamble" > To: > Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 7:13 AM > Subject: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? > > > > Hi all, > > > > I have come across an item at Lacma which is baffling me. It's > > described as: > > England > > Costume Drawings of Tudor Nobility with Manuscript Additions > > circa 1511 > > Ink and gouache on paper > > M.85.81a-d > > Drawing; Costume/textile works on paper > > > > The Url is tricky, since it doesn't seem to reflect internal site > > changes, but for what it's worth: > > > > http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/mwebcgi/mweb.exe?request=ks&direct= > > yes > > > > The problem is that it really looks much earlier. That and the vast > > amounts of ermine on the outside.... > > > > What does the team think? > > > > best wishes > > Stevie > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 7 23:29:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i184TNSd015711 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:29:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i184RNcP011517; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:27:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i184QCl6064647; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:26:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i184QAl6064633 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:26:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.128.231.121] (helo=dan) by zinc.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1Apa1d-0003Y8-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 21:30:06 +0000 Message-ID: <003201c3edc1$cc7e34c0$79e78051@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 21:31:49 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin wrote, in response to my note of Sat, 7 Feb 2004, > > I have come across an item at Lacma which is baffling me. It's > > described as: > > England > > Costume Drawings of Tudor Nobility with Manuscript Additions > > circa 1511 > > Ink and gouache on paper > > M.85.81a-d > > Drawing; Costume/textile works on paper > > > > The Url is tricky, since it doesn't seem to reflect internal site > > changes, but for what it's worth: > > > > http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/mwebcgi/mweb.exe?request=ks&direct= > > yes > > > > The problem is that it really looks much earlier. That and the vast > > amounts of ermine on the outside.... >From the left-hand page, it looks like this is intended to show various > traditional ways of rendering "ermine" in drawings. My glasses are not up to the task of following the text, but what struck me was that there seem to be a lot more groups of annotations than there are actual examples; can anyone 'break the code' of the references? >For the costumes, it > looks like the artist picked styles, mostly from the past, that > traditionally use large quantities of ermine. It is not unlikely that the > images were copied out of historic sources -- other manuscripts, etc. -- > as examples of the various means of renderings. The image is too small for > me to read enough of the left-hand page to tell what the distinctions are > between ermine examples; I can make out only a few words. However, if I > had to guess, I think it's a key to where the types of ermine spots were > found -- I think I made out "bonnet" and "gown" in some of the labels, and > the rest of the phrases appear possibly to be references to which source > (or what type of image) they were found in. > All but the last of the images are of some version of a ceremonial > sideless surcote, which was used for symbolic renderings of the Queen in > State through at least 1500 and occasionally thereafter -- long after the > dress would ever have been worn in life. I've seen similar images in > heraldic manuscripts and in a couple of Tudor/Elizabethan manuscripts in > which the sideless surcote is pretty clearly meant to have an iconographic > function. In particular, the upper right and lower left images (with the > mantles) are dead ringers for images from a particular roll of arms I have > somewhere in my file, and I wouldn't be surprised if they were copied > right out of it. In all of the first four images, the rendering of the > lines of the clothing looks as though the artist was was copying without > any sense of what the lines were supposed to mean (many generations of > renderings earlier, when they had some connection to real clothing). > I wondered about the dating; if they have it right then it is relatively soon after Henry VIII's coronation, and that of his wife. That would be the most obvious ocasion upon which people would be breaking out the signatures of rank, ermine being a primary one, and coronation garb was not noted for being up to the minute. The rather strange picture on the top left makes sense as a very bad reproduction of long flowing hair; icon of virginity as well as queenship, and Catherine of Aragon was undoubtedly in need of both. Her marriage to Henry took place in the same year of course. The only referenced image that I have been able to turn up quickly is apparently in Cambridge University Library: http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/images/HenryVIII03coronation.jpg and though she undoubtedly has loose hair she seems to be bereft of ermine. There's another Coronation image of Henry at the same site: http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/images/HenryVIII04coronation2.jpg though with no indication of source, and it doesn't look much like the Cambridge one. There are some heraldic indications, though. The top right and bottom left image appear to be the same one, differing only in scale; again, I can't understand this in the context of these papers; anyone any clues on this? > The lower right image (labeled "Lady") looks more realistic, around 1490 > perhaps, and may have been copied from a manuscript of that time. > > This is much earlier than the books we traditionally think of as > compilations of historic costume. From the sparse information on the site, > I gather these pages are loose sheets, not part of a surviving book. I > wonder if it was really intended to be "costume drawings," or if that's a > modern cataloger's guess. I'd speculate that it was in fact part of a > model-book for heraldic renderings or similar manuscript functions. I'm sure that the attribution is far from iron-clad; I started out hoping it was an aide-memoire for workers in the fur trade lumbered with the infinitely tedious job of 'powdering' the ermine for a range of nobility. We all look for things we find interesting... A more likely hypothesis, if the dating is correct, is some link to the new monarch and the Tudor PR machine. But I can just see someone proudly reproducing one of these as an authentic 1511 English noblewoman's outfit, and pointing to the magnificent evidence of this document:-) best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 01:16:57 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i186GuSd016003 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 01:16:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i186DJcP014795; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:13:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i186Bxl6099727; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:11:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i186Btl6099683 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:11:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA04972 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 01:40:59 -0600 Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 01:40:59 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? In-Reply-To: <003201c3edc1$cc7e34c0$79e78051@dan> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sat, 7 Feb 2004, Stevie Gamble wrote: > My glasses are not up to the task of following the text, but what > struck me was that there seem to be a lot more groups of annotations > than there are actual examples; can anyone 'break the code' of the > references? I don't think the examples on the left need necessarily line up with the pictures on the right. The examples on the left differ in density, and most of the labels seem to end with a fraction -- 3/4, 1/4, 1/2 -- that may correspond to the density of ermine spots. This may well be instructions to an artist rather than to a furrier, though; that is, telling how to paint different types rather than how to actually make them. However, I do catch some words on the left that indicate some refer to a "gowne," others to (possibly?) "bonnet," and others to I'm not sure what. I had hoped to see "mantell" as well, but it's not there. It might simply be saying "Here are some ways ermine spots have been shown in various drawings." It could be an artist's notes of designs he'd seen elsewhere and wanted to keep a record of as reference. I'd know more if I could see the paper itself. I'd particularly like to see the labels on the figures in more detail; I can make out only the last. (It's not your glasses -- the scan is not detailed enough in enlargement.) > I wondered about the dating; if they have it right then it is > relatively soon after Henry VIII's coronation, and that of his wife. I think it might be too much of a stretch to assume that these images show actual current clothing, even coronation dress. If these are simply examples of ermine representation copied out of older manuscripts, the styles of the clothing would be no more relevant to current wear than, say, the images in a modern costume overview would be relevant to the time the book was published. And not all of the images are coronation clothing -- the last one is simply labeled "Lady." If the other labels are equally generic, then they may just indicate "Here's how to represent X type of person" or something similar. > ... The top right and bottom left image appear to be the same one, > differing only in scale; again, I can't understand this in the context > of these papers; anyone any clues on this? Perhaps they're two examples taken from the same source, such as the roll of arms I mentioned earlier -- which includes many repeated figures that are identical except for the names or heraldry. In these, the number, type, or distribution of ermine spots may be different in some crucial way, which might be the relevant point here. Now I want to go down to L.A. and see for myself! And it's not even my period... I do wonder about the dating. The handwriting could easily be mid-15th-century, but it's been a long time since I did any solid work in dating of handwriting, and even if I were in practice, I can't see enough details to get a good clue. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 01:24:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i186ODSd016016 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 01:24:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i186NIcP015106; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:23:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i186M7l6004204; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:22:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i186M6l6004167 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:22:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA05019 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 01:51:10 -0600 Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 01:51:10 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sat, 7 Feb 2004, Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > I'm no expert on the matter, but that style of sideless surcote was > kept in use for ceremonial occasions (coronations, burials, etc) way, > way after it went out of fashion. I didn't think it went so late as > the 1500's, but I wouldn't be surprised either if it was the case. You're correct that the style remained in fossilized use as ceremonial clothing long after it ceased to be worn in life, but I'd put actual ceremonial use in the early/mid 15th c. The artistic usage went on even later. It drops way off by 1500 or so, but I've seen it (very rarely) in visual images through Elizabeth's reign, always in highly iconographic contexts (and often depicted in a physically unlikely manner that shows no understanding on the artist's part of how the garments would have been worn in reality). I am 99.9% certain the later (16th-c.) images did not represent actual clothing, even coronation clothing, but simply were iconographic shorthand. (This is a special interest of mine. Some years ago I did a content analysis of a couple hundred surcote images, correlating date with such features as style, amount of fur, wearer's identity/rank, and situation/context. The movement was quite clear, starting with realistic use, to realistic use by royalty, to ceremonial use by royalty, and finally to iconographic use primarily to denote dead royalty and certain religious figures. At some point I'm going to re-do the whole analysis in more detail with the additional images I've been collecting over the years.) --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 02:23:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i187NrSd016160 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 02:23:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i187KjcP016745; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 00:20:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i187IHl6027317; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 00:18:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i187IFl6027300 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 00:18:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.122]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1ApT3Q-0006YB-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 06:03:28 -0800 Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1ApT3P-0005EP-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 07 Feb 2004 06:03:27 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Oriental surcoat Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 07:03:34 -0700 Message-ID: <002a01c3ed83$2cf8afe0$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: <04e901c3ec71$fef19290$0200a8c0@susan> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i187IFl6027300 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO That is really interesting. I can't answer your questions, but it wouldn't surprise me. There were certainly trade routes established by then...and they were weaving very fine products (lots of very sheer veils etc.) There was a lot Norris gets a bad rap in my opinion......its like every source...you can't believe everything you read or see. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Susan Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 10:28 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Oriental surcoat Hi, I was doing some reading and ran across a 11th/12th cent garment called a Oriental (or persian) surcoat. Since this was in Norris, I was wondering if there was any other information about it. Was it really known to be a transparent silk coat worn over brightly colored bliauts? Susan in Bellevue Rollcall: known in the SCA as Susan Paraventur lives in the seattle area and am active in SCA, Beyond Reality, Cons, and sometimes Somewhere in Time. I make a wide variety of costumes, from fairly accurate historical to fantasy outfits. Historical ranges from Greek (I did start an egyptian, but didn't finish it) to the 30s (of last century) Historical ranges from I make it up cause I think it'll look cool to media reproductions (usually movie/tv, but I have done books). I love glittery costumes and can often be seen at cons in really really glittery dresses, the last one was Orange. Teddy would have been happy. I've been on this list pretty steadily for the past ten years. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 07:43:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18ChrSd029294 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 07:43:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18CcWcP024457; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 05:38:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18CbGl6027474; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 05:37:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lanthanum.btinternet.com (lanthanum.btinternet.com [194.73.73.177]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Catl6027314 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 05:36:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.128.235.235] (helo=dan) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1Apo2K-00071P-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 12:27:44 +0000 Message-ID: <001801c3ee3f$331880a0$ebeb8051@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:29:29 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin wrote, on Sunday, February 08, 2004 , Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? > > I wondered about the dating; if they have it right then it is > > relatively soon after Henry VIII's coronation, and that of his wife. > > I think it might be too much of a stretch to assume that these images show > actual current clothing, even coronation dress. I agree; I didn't express myself clearly. My thought was that if this was an aide-memoire for representations of the coronation to feed the PR machine then there would be strong reasons to represent figures in what amounted to archaic dress. The Tudors were, after all, parvenus whose origins did not bear scrutiny; the more links with ancient majesty the better, from their perspective. > Now I want to go down to L.A. and see for myself! And it's not even my > period... > I do wonder about the dating. The handwriting could easily be > mid-15th-century Indeed. I think you should go, too:-) The only thing which troubles me about a dating 60 years earlier is that 'Holbeinesque' head covering on one of the ladies. Perhaps our headress/hats specialists could comment on the headgear? best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 08:47:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18DlUSd029623 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 08:47:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18DjacP025997; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 06:45:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18DiOl6046199; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 06:44:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18DiMl7046183 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 06:44:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i18E6mWm027586 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 09:06:48 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.119] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AAA762DF004A; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 08:33:27 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c3ee4a$5ba5f7e0$775183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402070326.i173QIl7060184@net.indra.com> <6.0.0.22.0.20040207153617.075b9008@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 89 Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 08:49:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO orlon may be an acrylic. Perhaps that particular fiber denoted the 'hand' of wool which it was replacing. Kathleen, who has a trunk full of Irish sweaters, and 'granny goods' made by her mother. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brenda Bell" To: Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 3:44 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 89 > At Fri, 6 Feb 2004 20:27:22 -0500, "Penny Ladnier" > wrote: > > >I am wanting to make a 1970s crocheted long vest for my daughter and the > >pattern calls for 16 skeins. So I need to order it from somewhere to get > >the correct dye lot. The yarn lady at Ben Franklin's told me to avoid all > >acrylic yarn because it can be stiff. > > If you're looking for historical accuracy... acrylic is all my mom and most > of her friends ever used at the time, and of course all I used (either > Mom's leftovers or what I could afford from my allowance). If you're doing > a granny-square vest or a filet-type vest, the softness is built in by the > openness (shell stitch on the granny squares, the open squares of the > "filet"). In the early '70's, when the vests were still hip length, we'd > also have matching skirts -- either crocheted in a solid stitch (single- or > double-crochet the whole length and width), or lined in a matching > (acetate) lining, or solid-stitched-AND-lined. > > At Fri, 6 Feb 2004 22:17:46 -0500, "Lloyd Mitchell" > wrote: > > >If this vest is the same that my mom made me then, she used orlon. > > Maybe that was it. But isn't orlon an acrylic? > > >The fiber has the weight and 'feel' of wool but is a synthetic yarn. > > >it washes well and keeps its shape over time. (I still have and wear mine > >as a tabard over silk pants and shirt. > >Kathleen > >Wow, 34 years!!! > > > Brenda, onetime-owner of Mom-crocheted purple and yellow skirt-and-vest sets > webwarren@earthlink.net > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 08:50:18 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18DoHSd029636 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 08:50:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18DnCcP026063; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 06:49:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Dm1l6047282; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 06:48:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18DkKl7046827 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 06:46:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i18E8lWm027920 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 09:08:47 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.119] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB1F63A6004A; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 08:35:27 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01c3ee4a$a2ec6da0$775183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402070326.i173QIl7060184@net.indra.com><6.0.0.22.0.20040207153617.075b9008@earthlink.net> <003801c3edcd$600a4430$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 89 Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 08:51:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Red Hart was the brand that my mother used...because it was the best price for a wool substitute. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 5:54 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 89 > Brenda, > > The pattern was free from Coats & Clark at Ben Franklins. The weave is very > loose, and looks like its using double trebles. There are no shells. Since > Coats & Clark put out the pattern and they product Red Heart yarn, maybe it > would be best to use. > > Penny E. Ladnier > Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com > www.costumeclassroom.com > > > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 09:57:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18Ev5Sd030091 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 09:57:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18ErucP027985; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 07:53:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18EpWl6065296; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 07:51:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18EpTl6065276 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 07:51:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA07799 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:20:34 -0600 Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:20:34 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? In-Reply-To: <001801c3ee3f$331880a0$ebeb8051@dan> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sun, 8 Feb 2004, Stevie Gamble wrote: > I agree; I didn't express myself clearly. My thought was that if this > was an aide-memoire for representations of the coronation to feed the > PR machine then there would be strong reasons to represent figures in > what amounted to archaic dress. The Tudors were, after all, parvenus > whose origins did not bear scrutiny; the more links with ancient > majesty the better, from their perspective. Good point, and I see what you mean now. In this case, though, the significance is maybe lessened because the custom of using that particular archaic costume for coronations was well-established before the Tudors, so that could simply be a continuation of existing iconographic tradition (on the part of the artists if not also on the part of those paying the artists). > Indeed. I think you should go, too:-) The only thing which troubles me > about a dating 60 years earlier is that 'Holbeinesque' head covering > on one of the ladies. That's what stopped me too, and I wouldn't push the date back that far myself (I only meant to note that the handwriting style had been around a long time already). But clearly there's a lot of room for variation -- forward as well as backward, if we buy the possibility that the drawings don't have to represent contemporary dress! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 11:03:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18G3eSd030487 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 11:03:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18G1dcP000567; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 09:01:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18FxAl6086104; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 08:59:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk (fmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Fx8l6086083 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 08:59:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lynn@close-hainsworth.fslife.co.uk) Received: from [195.92.193.19] (helo=cmailm3.svr.pol.co.uk) by fmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1AprKp-0005R4-DQ for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 15:59:03 +0000 Received: from modem-295.zebra.dialup.pol.co.uk ([81.76.145.39] helo=lance3) by cmailm3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1AprKo-0005Fu-Qm for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 15:59:03 +0000 Message-ID: <000401c3ee5c$ba6e5260$7bd9fea9@lance3> From: "Lynn Close-Hainsworth" To: References: <200402071901.i17J0ql9020120@net.indra.com> Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 16:00:49 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Worsted again X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Penny, I shall try to answer as below: > What are the different yarn plys for and their uses? Originally and technically, a 'ply' is a single thread, one or several of which can make up a yarn. So originally a two-ply yarn had two single threads plyed together, and four-ply yarn had four, etc. However, these have since been used as descriptions of thicknesses, mainly in the UK and Australia. So a British four-ply yarn is a bit thinner than double-knitting yarn, and in Australia an eight-ply yarn will be very thick even if it only has two or three single yarns twisted into it. > Also what types of yarn are good for certain uses? Meaning, wool, cotton, acrylic. What is a good percentage of mix of fibers? As far as I'm concerned, the only justification for use of non-natural fibres is for machine-washability. Wool yarn generally has bounce and stretchiness, cotton is as a rule firmer, and doesn't bounce back when stretched. But you can really use what you want when you want to use it, just do swatches first and see if you like the fabric you produce. Does it drape/stretch/rebound/feel like you want it to do? > Are they certain yarns better to use for knitting and not crocheting and vice versa? I know the small cotton thread (a little thicker than > kite-string) is good for lace, tablecloths, bedspreads, and doilies. If you're crocheting, it's usually better to use a firmer, more tightly twisted yarn. Crocheting usually creates more twist running back down the yarn than knitting. > Lastly, I am left-handed. Are there any websites that will show the crochet stitches for a left-handed person. All I have found are for > right-handed people. Can't think of anything, I'm afraid. I'd just recommend the old trick - look at it in a mirror. Or repeat the instructions out loud to yourself, replacing left with right and vice versa. But it's perfectly possible to knit and crochet backwards and forwards with either hand, and practice does help. Have you actually tried doing it as shown - you can adjust the movements so that although the right hand is holding the hook, your left hand is manipulating the yarn and fabric arount it? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 12:26:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18HQ3Sd030838 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:26:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18HMpcP004079; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:22:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18HMgl6014352; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:22:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mx03.supplyguys.net (mx03.supplyguys.net [65.115.27.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18HMdl7014324 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:22:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wendyc@vivid.net) Received: (qmail 19829 invoked by uid 89); 8 Feb 2004 17:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO localhost) (65.115.27.21) by 0 with SMTP; 8 Feb 2004 17:06:00 -0000 Received: from c-66-56-95-30.atl.client2.attbi.com (c-66-56-95-30.atl.client2.attbi.com [66.56.95.30]) by secure.supplyguys.net (IMP) with HTTP for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:08:56 -0500 Message-ID: <1076260136.40266d2874330@secure.supplyguys.net> Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:08:56 -0500 From: wendyc@vivid.net To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 'Worsted' yarn References: <200402061901.i16J0o30029584@net.indra.com> <001d01c3ecff$c3e3aec0$161efea9@lance3> <00b901c3ed52$da797540$0500a8c0@MOM> In-Reply-To: <00b901c3ed52$da797540$0500a8c0@MOM> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Quoting Penny Ladnier : As a spinner and knitter I will take a crack at this one but these are some pretty broad questions. > I have some more questions: > > What are the different yarn plys for and their uses? Yarn comes in a variety of sizes and there are a vareity of ways of looking at it. Most often spinners will look at the size of the yarn based either on wpi (wraps per inch) or yards per pound. Wraps per inch is measured by wrapping the yarn evenly and covering the measuring device and counting the number of wraps to cover an linear inch. Yards per pound is usually figured using a McMoran balance where the balance is set up so you can use a short piece of yarn to figure out yardage per pound. There are a variety of sizes of yarn: laceweight,fingering,sport,worsted,DK (Doubleknit) and bulky. lacewieght might be used to knit a lace shawl, like the orenburgs tht can go through a wedding ring, fingering is good for socks, babywear, lightweight items sport- heavier socks, lightweight sweaters, and so on up the scale. you probably wouln't make an outdoor type sweater or jacket from lace weight nor make a baby garment from a bulky. The differentweights can be made by adding more plys or by spinning thicker plys. Weavers usually use a different measurements for their yarns and I think use singles more often than knitters and crocheters who need a balanced yarn so the item doesn't bias. > > Also what types of yarn are good for certain uses? Meaning, wool, cotton, > acrylic. What is a good percentage of mix of fibers? Different fibers have different qualities and you want to watch that with the item you are making, also taking into account the stitch you are using. Wools tend to be more elastic. But also has the ability to felt. Superwash wools don't felt and can be washed in the washer and dryer. It is often used to socks and childrens clothing. Cotton and linen yarns can "grow"- stretch out in use if not knitted or crocheted with a tight stitch. But they are much easier to clean than wool. Acrylics are better today and can be used for a variety of purposes but really doesn't feel as nice as natural fibers. Silk can be difficult to work with and expensive. Blends can cross the lines > > Are they certain yarns better to use for knitting and not crocheting and > vice versa? Yarns are so different that you can have 2 cotton yarns or 2 wool yarns, etc... that are very different and one may be appropriate for a given project while the other isn't. I know the small cotton thread (a little thicker than > kite-string) is good for lace, tablecloths, bedspreads, and doilies. And can be used to knitting lace probably on 000 or 0000 needles depending on the size of the thread. Evne the same yarn can give very different looks and handle when knit on different size needles. > > Lastly, I am left-handed. Are there any websites that will show the > crochet stitches for a left-handed person. All I have found are for > right-handed people. Let me ask my stepmother , I am a knitter while she crochets. Wendy _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 12:52:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18HqiSd030999 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:52:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18HnZcP005181; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:49:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18HnUl6023535; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:49:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Hmsl6023224 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:48:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1Apt36-0004dz-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 17:48:52 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:13:06 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Living History Groups in UK and France References: <00fc01c3ece2$8a8b39d0$1810a8c0@Imedia5043> In-Reply-To: <00fc01c3ece2$8a8b39d0$1810a8c0@Imedia5043> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There are very few sites over here with permanent re-enactment groups - the Saxon village at West Stow is the only one I know of that's earlier than Tudor. Your best bet is probably to surf for groups' websites and then see where they are doing events - http://www.the-reenactor.co.uk/ is a good place to start, or Call to Arms (http://www.calltoarms.com ) - or look at castles and historic sites in the areas you are going to be and see what they are hosting. Englsh Heritage are doing far less re-enactment these days and more interpretation through drama type things, but there are many private sites that still do battle and living history events. Jean Dawn Wood wrote >Regia Anglorium are the main dark ages group over here in teh uk they have a >website which should list all their events. >The Roman groups are the Ermine Street Guard and Legion Augusta again >details on eh web as far as I know >English Heritage special events dept run many events over the year of >various periods at historic houses so check them out as well > >Dawn >Ages Of Elegance makers of historical clothing, uniforms and bridalwear >http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Althea Turner" >To: "Historical Costume" >Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 6:47 PM >Subject: [h-cost] Living History Groups in UK and France > > >> Hey all, >> >> I am traveling to Europe this summer to study merovingian textiles >> (France June 15-July 5, UK July 5- July 19) and am interested in >> learning the locations of any really good living history groups. I >> know Jorvik, and I think there is one in York, but I'm not sure. Does >> anyone know some good places to visit? I'm interested in time period >> 400-800 AD, and late Roman provincial. >> >> I'm also interested in finding a traveling partner and/or inexpensive >> places to stay in Paris and London, as well as a few small towns (Sens, >> Chelles, Lyon, Dordogne region, Loire region, and areas north of >> London). I'm an easy traveling partner, honest. :D >> >> Thanks! >> >> Althea Turner >> *** althea@alfalfapress.com >> *** http://www.alfalfapress.com >> >> > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 12:53:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18HrdSd031007 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 12:53:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18HnhcP005200; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:49:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Hngl6023603; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:49:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Hmsl6023225 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 10:48:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1Apt36-0004e0-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 17:48:52 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2004 23:23:26 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Oriental surcoat References: <04e901c3ec71$fef19290$0200a8c0@susan> In-Reply-To: <04e901c3ec71$fef19290$0200a8c0@susan> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sounds deeply unlikely to me. Does Norris give any clues as to what he is describing as a bliaut? Or to where he has seen evidence of this oriental surcoat? If we knew what he was looking at, we might be able to give another interpretation. Jean Susan wrote >Hi, > >I was doing some reading and ran across a 11th/12th cent garment called a >Oriental (or persian) surcoat. Since this was in Norris, I was wondering if >there was any other information about it. > >Was it really known to be a transparent silk coat worn over brightly colored >bliauts? > >Susan in Bellevue >Rollcall: >known in the SCA as Susan Paraventur >lives in the seattle area and am active in SCA, Beyond Reality, Cons, and >sometimes Somewhere in Time. I make a wide variety of costumes, from fairly >accurate historical to fantasy outfits. Historical ranges from Greek (I did >start an egyptian, but didn't finish it) to the 30s (of last century) >Historical ranges from I make it up cause I think it'll look cool to media >reproductions (usually movie/tv, but I have done books). I love glittery >costumes and can often be seen at cons in really really glittery dresses, >the last one was Orange. Teddy would have been happy. I've been on this >list pretty steadily for the past ten years. > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 15:36:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18KaiSd032072 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:36:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18KZrcP012475; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 13:35:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18KZil6080996; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 13:35:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.130]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18KZfl6080975 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 13:35:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net (falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.74]) by soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i15GKC925425; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:20:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AomEc-0003Pl-00; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 08:20:10 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: "H-Costume@Indra. Com" , , Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:20:07 -0700 Message-ID: <000b01c3ec03$ee9adf50$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Those Rats at the fashion fabric club! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i18KaiSd032072 Status: RO There are some REALLY nice fabrics here. If you have never played with the silk/linen blends you are missing a treat! Sg (who can resist if you can..:)) -----Original Message----- From: Fashion Fabrics Club [mailto:customerservice@fashionfabricsclub.com] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 9:09 AM To: SARAGRACE@EARTHLINK.NET Subject: Italian Linen & Corduroy, New Fashion Fabrics * European Linen * Italian Stretch Corduroy * New Fashion Fabrics * Use the SEARCH Dear Sewing Enthusiast, As the new season approaches, linen becomes ever more popular. We just added more and now have 100% linen from EUROPE, 97% Linen/3% Lycra from ITALY, and a hundred more linen and linen blends. http://www.fashionfabricsclub.com/home/catalog_items.cfm?TypID=4 &Viewby=Types Don't miss our fantastic buy of corduroy imported from ITALY. These seven designer colors are from the workrooms of ANN TAYLOR. They are 21 wale and extra soft and sumptuous. 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It should help speed your experience. http://www.fashionfabricsclub.com/index.cfm Sincerely, Camille Samson Vice President Fashion Fabrics Club manually maintains this e-mail list and we carefully strive to only include e-mail addresses of individuals who have requested this information. If you do not wish to receive these emails, please send a blank email to leave-fashionfabricsclub-13064367U@atomic.sparklist.com. You are currently subscribed to fashionfabricsclub as: SARAGRACE@EARTHLINK.NET. We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this message might have caused. If you would like to change your e-mail address in our database, please send a note with your old and new addresses to ffcemail@ironjelly.com. If you need to contact us, our address is 10490 Baur Blvd., St. Louis, MO 63132 and our phone number is 314-993-4919. Thank you. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 17:45:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18MjVSd032701 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:45:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Mg3cP018371; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:42:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Mfwl6024106; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:41:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Mful6024092 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:41:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.126]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1ApqOL-0000Ea-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 06:58:37 -0800 Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by turkey.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1ApqOK-0001bs-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 06:58:36 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 07:59:10 -0700 Message-ID: <000601c3ee54$1baa3930$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.0.20040207153617.075b9008@earthlink.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i18Mful6024092 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Historical Accuracy-Yipes! Was: Digest, Vol 3, Issue 89-Acrylic Yarn X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wow, it is SO weird to see someone talk about historical accuracy in the 1970's. Okay, now that I have dated myself...I will go back to lurking. Sg -----Original Message----- If you're looking for historical accuracy... acrylic is all my mom and most of her friends ever used at the time, and of course all I used (either Mom's leftovers or what I could afford from my allowance). If you're doing a granny-square vest or a filet-type vest, the softness is built in by the openness (shell stitch on the granny squares, the open squares of the "filet"). In the early '70's, when the vests were still hip length, we'd also have matching skirts -- either crocheted in a solid stitch (single- or double-crochet the whole length and width), or lined in a matching (acetate) lining, or solid-stitched-AND-lined. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 17:47:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18MloSd032714 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:47:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18MkfcP018614; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:46:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Mkel6025821; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:46:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu [132.236.56.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Mkdl6025811 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:46:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from bridgett.cornell.edu (syr-24-58-121-78.twcny.rr.com [24.58.121.78]) by postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i18MkdUZ014591 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:46:39 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040208174629.00bbf820@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 17:47:28 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Mari Stewart Subject: Re: [h-cost] AngloSaxon burial newly found In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040206123349.05b70a60@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-PMX-Version: 4.1.1.86173 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you Carolyn! What an amazing site. I wish more archeological sites would post such information. Hooray for the MOL. \ Bridgette >http://www.museumoflondon.org.uk/MOLsite/exhibits/prittlewell/index.htm > >You can click on 'objects' to see more. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 17:48:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18MmvSd032725 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:48:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18MlqcP018673; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:47:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Mlpl6026228; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:47:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-f90.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.245.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18Mlol6026181 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:47:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from elizabethstewartclark@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 14:41:15 -0800 Received: from 63.228.184.161 by by1fd.bay1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 19:37:52 GMT X-Originating-IP: [63.228.184.161] X-Originating-Email: [elizabethstewartclark@hotmail.com] X-Sender: elizabethstewartclark@hotmail.com From: "Elizabeth Clark" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 12:37:52 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Feb 2004 22:41:15.0882 (UTC) FILETIME=[A9430CA0:01C3EE94] Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Historic Clothing Workshops X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Please forgive the cross-posting! The Sewing Academy session for Wichita, Kansas is now open for registration. The workshops focus on historic clothing for the mid-19th century. You’ll find a printable registration form as well as on-line registration and details on all the classes in the Academy section at: http://www.thesewingacademy.org Regards, Elizabeth Clark www.thesewingacademy.org _________________________________________________________________ Get some great ideas here for your sweetheart on Valentine's Day - and beyond. http://special.msn.com/network/celebrateromance.armx _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 18:13:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18NDxSd000366 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 18:13:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18NDMcP019678; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 16:13:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18NDIl6034718; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 16:13:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18ND8l6034654 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 16:13:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a212.in-tch.com [66.62.107.12]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i18MojT18334 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:50:46 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <4026C33C.5070302@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 16:16:12 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "h-costume@indra.com" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] OT food question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It might seem really weird to be asking this question on a costuming list, but some of the folk on this list are the only 18th and 19th c. reenactors I know, so I hope you'll pardon the bandwidth usage! A friend of mine is trying to find information on what sorts of nibbles/appetizers and drinks would have been served at early 19th c. gatherings (balls, receptions, etc). If anyone has any info for me to pass on, I'd love to hear from you! Thanks for your patience, Sue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 18:19:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i18NJkSd000411 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 18:19:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18NIfcP019962; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 16:18:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18NIel6036731; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 16:18:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i18NIcl6036719 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 16:18:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a212.in-tch.com [66.62.107.12]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i18MuHT20777 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 15:56:17 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <4026C488.2020802@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 16:21:44 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] left-handed stitching of buttonholes References: <4023A3BA.10644.626380F@localhost> In-Reply-To: <4023A3BA.10644.626380F@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Also, winding the thread onto the bobbin might have introduced extra twist to the thread...I know how careful you have to be, when you wind thread onto bobbins for lacemaking. I'm lefthanded, and have threads twisting up on me all the time when I do handsewing or embroidery--I just let the thread dangle and untwist itself. A light coating of beeswax (on the thread) also seems to help when usable (i.e., for general-purpose sewing, but not embroidery) --sue's two pence worth kat@grendal.rain.com wrote: > The twist is the same, but the processing of the fibres makes a big > difference. > > This is especially important in embroidery flosses, but I've found > the same to be true with regular threads. (I notice that when I use > thread off a bobbin it tends to knot up more easily than when I use > it off the spool. But that's because the thread is essentially > "turned around" on a bobbin.) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 19:02:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1902jSd000618 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 19:02:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1901lcP021974; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:01:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1901cl6051162; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:01:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from providenceday.org (treebeard.providenceday.org [66.193.73.82]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1901al6051107 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:01:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from grace.morris@providenceday.org) Received: from [172.20.1.3] (HELO providenceday.org) by providenceday.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.5) with ESMTP id 1000985 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 18:32:17 -0500 Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 19:29:36 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Oriental surcoat Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Grace Morris To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would advise anyone who really wants to know about this garment to join <12thcenturygarb@yahoogroups.com>, where this garment (and bliauts, etc.) are extensively discussed. There's a lot of controversy, and loads of theories. Grace/Jessamyn who thinks every copy of Norris should be thrown into the sea.... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 19:48:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i190m8Sd000794 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 19:48:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i190lPcP023921; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:47:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i190lLl6067648; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:47:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i190lJl6067639 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 17:47:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from theresa@misc.com) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i190n4q1015944 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 16:49:05 -0800 Message-ID: <4026D81A.4070608@misc.com> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 16:45:14 -0800 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT food question References: <4026C33C.5070302@in-tch.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have no idea of the veracity of these recipes but they look very attractive: http://www.erasofelegance.com/regencyrecipes.html This site also has recipes for other historical periods, if people are interested: http://www.erasofelegance.com/recipemain.html So, now _I_ have a question: is gazpacho really something Colonial/18c folks would have eaten? Thanks, and good luck, Sue, Theresa Eacker Sue Clemenger wrote: > It might seem really weird to be asking this question on a costuming > list, but some of the folk on this list are the only 18th and 19th c. > reenactors I know, so I hope you'll pardon the bandwidth usage! > A friend of mine is trying to find information on what sorts of > nibbles/appetizers and drinks would have been served at early 19th c. > gatherings (balls, receptions, etc). If anyone has any info for me to > pass on, I'd love to hear from you! > Thanks for your patience, > Sue > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 20:38:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i191cJSd000938 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 20:38:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i191Z2cP026379; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 18:35:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i191Ywl6084206; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 18:34:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk (smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.213.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i191Yul6084181 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 18:34:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@agesofelegance.co.uk) Received: from Imedia5043 ([82.44.203.167]) by smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5600); Mon, 9 Feb 2004 01:34:53 +0000 Message-ID: <000601c3eeac$e6f7a200$1810a8c0@Imedia5043> From: "Dawn Wood" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4026C33C.5070302@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT food question Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 01:34:47 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Feb 2004 01:34:53.0055 (UTC) FILETIME=[EA6180F0:01C3EEAC] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO For drinks fruit punches and wines for nibbles devilled chicken, sallets, petit patties ( a cross between vol au vents and proper mince pies), syllabub, sorbets, icecreams and jellies (all new and very fashionable), macaroni pudding, rice moulds Dawn Ages Of Elegance makers of historical clothing, uniforms and bridalwear http://www.agesofelegance.co.uk 0113 277 6716 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 21:43:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i192hkSd001120 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 21:43:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i192dccP029303; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 19:39:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i192dZl6007329; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 19:39:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from badboy.mail.pas.earthlink.net (badboy.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i192dXl6007318 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 19:39:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) Received: from heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net (heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.189]) by badboy.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i145ErO17217 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 21:14:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from user-12l20lu.cable.mindspring.com ([69.81.2.190] helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AoFNF-0006ZR-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 21:14:53 -0800 Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040203230316.021685f8@pop.radiks.net> X-Sender: costumrs@radiks.net@pop.radiks.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:05:13 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200402040219.i142J32w064279@net.indra.com> References: <200402040219.i142J32w064279@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-ELNK-Trace: 4dc586d4c2c509b54091741908ea4e5332a50e9c2fbc553c4e137287ccede93197fa80f02dafa2c8350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume Con 22 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Because Penny asked, and others are probably interested: www.cc22.org/ April 2 - 5, 2004 in Atlanta, GA (Palm Sunday weekend) Sandy "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 8 23:56:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i194uESd001513 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 23:56:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i194r4cP005145; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 21:53:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i194qvl6055232; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 21:52:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail.donet.com (mail.donet.com [64.56.118.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i194qtl7055208 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL) for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2004 21:52:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mjh@pearlandplume.com) Received: (qmail 15106 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2004 04:46:15 -0000 X-Sender: mjh@pearlandplume.com X-Recipient: h-costume@indra.com Received: from unknown (HELO ?65.24.120.65?) (65.24.120.65) by mail.donet.com for h-costume@indra.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2004 04:46:15 -0000 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2004 23:43:11 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Roll Call From: Marsha J Hamilton To: Historical Costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20040203174148.01a47008@pop.dds.nl> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello, My name is Marsha Hamilton, 52, widowed with a teenager daughter, a librarian at the Ohio State University Libraries, never met a fiber or textile craft I didn't start buying books about and getting supplies for---and accumulating many half-finished projects along the way. I've got closets of fabric and finished costumes, some not very good, some I'm proud of. I started making costumes and jewelry as a child and kept going, although I've changed over the years and upped my standards. (Thank you to Bjarne and others for inspiring us all!) I belong to The Cavalier Association, a small early 17th c. group here in Columbus, OH. I look forward to retiring someday so I can finish projects in quilting, spinning, dying, knitting, cross-stitch, embroidery, smocking, bead crochet, metal-working, jewelry making, designing and sewing, and of course, more costumes! I've sewn Tudor to Titanic over the years. I think the next project is going to be Regency from La Mode Bagatelle's pattern I bought this year. Another goal is a website, so I can post pictures of my jewelry. I enjoy listening to everyone and have learned a lot from the list. Marsha _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 09:27:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19ERRSd029221 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:27:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19EN9cP023109; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 07:23:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19EMwl6053077; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 07:22:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp3.primushost.com (smtp3.primushost.com [209.58.220.67]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19EMtl7053000 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 07:22:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vintage@primushost.com) Received: from shell3.shore.net [207.244.124.103] by smtp3.primushost.com with esmtp (Exim) id 1AqCJF-00069d-5g; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 09:22:49 -0500 Received: from vintage by shell3.shore.net with local (Exim) for h-costume@indra.com id 1AqCIF-0000zb-00; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 09:21:47 -0500 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:21:47 -0500 (EST) From: Katy Bishop To: historic costume Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: Subject: [h-cost] wedding in Georgia X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I got a request from my website asking if I knew of anyone in Georgia who makes vintage style wedding dresses or sells actual vintage gowns. Any one here who matches that description? Thanks. Katy Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 12:54:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19HsUSd032265 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 12:54:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19Ho8cP010848; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 10:50:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19Hndl6079880; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 10:49:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from scc075.its.state.nc.us (scc075.its.state.nc.us [207.4.22.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19Hncl6079791 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 10:49:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Ellen.Dappert@ncmail.net) Received: from scc075.its.state.nc.us (127.0.0.1) by scc075.its.state.nc.us (6.5.029) id 401CD43E0005D23D for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 12:27:47 -0500 Received: from ncmail.net (207.4.90.6) by scc075.its.state.nc.us (6.5.029) id 401CD43B0005EE7E for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 12:27:46 -0500 Message-ID: <4027C328.A17848E1@ncmail.net> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 12:28:09 -0500 From: Ellen Dappert Organization: NC-DJJDP / District 26 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200402070326.i173QJl7060196@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] This and that Bjarne and 70'2 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO 70's vest. ..But that funky 70's vest cries out for acrylic. Acrylic must be period for the 70's. I know I made and wore one when it was in style the first time. and it absolutely wasn't real cotton or wool. It was probably Red Heart too. The cheapest you could find. Bjarne all your things are wonderful and an inspiration to us all. I like to think of you in the dark of winter, making such beautiful things. It's like looking at a star in the night sky, or the first crocus or snowdrop coming through the snow. It makes a warm place in my heart that helps me keep on with whatever I'm doing. Mia in Charlotte, NC who gets cabin fever when she iced in for a day or two every ice storm, yes, even this far south. and there is a nice little exhibit in the Charlotte Mint museum of mid-19 cent womens and childrens clothes if anyone is interested, _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 13:14:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19IEJSd032355 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:14:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19ICAcP013372; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 11:12:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19IC8l6098358; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 11:12:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19IC0l6098263 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 11:12:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from afairburn@kc.rr.com) Received: from kc.rr.com (CPE-65-28-73-36.kc.rr.com [65.28.73.36]) by ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i19Gxxpk022060 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 10:59:59 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <4027BF04.2090600@kc.rr.com> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 11:10:28 -0600 From: A Fairburn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Robin Netherton wrote: >It might simply be saying "Here are some ways ermine spots have been shown >in various drawings." It could be an artist's notes of designs he'd seen >elsewhere and wanted to keep a record of as reference. I'd know more if I >could see the paper itself. I'd particularly like to see the labels on the >figures in more detail; I can make out only the last. (It's not your >glasses -- the scan is not detailed enough in enlargement.) > > > >Perhaps they're two examples taken from the same source, such as the roll >of arms I mentioned earlier -- which includes many repeated figures that >are identical except for the names or heraldry. In these, the number, >type, or distribution of ermine spots may be different in some crucial >way, which might be the relevant point here. > Could this be a heraldic key to what amount of ermine was allowed to be worn by the different ranks at a ceremonial occasion (or in their artistic representations)? At the top of the left hand page, I pick out the words prince (or princess) . The bottom square in the left column looks like "The duches gown 5 something something" . On the bottom right column is " The marqu(is) ?? ..." and the spots get less dense. This also is true on the right hand page as well. The generic lady only having a single row of spots on her cuffs and the figure to the left having a double row. Richenda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 14:38:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19JcrSd032675 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:38:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19JWlcP023876; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 12:32:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19JWfl6062457; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 12:32:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19JWdl7062441 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 12:32:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i19JtQWm002018 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:55:27 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.103] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id ADC474F00126; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 14:21:40 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01c3ef44$2f94c780$675183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] wedding in Georgia Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:37:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am not in Ga., but I do have some nice vintage wedding gowns for sale. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Katy Bishop" To: "historic costume" Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 9:21 AM Subject: [h-cost] wedding in Georgia > > I got a request from my website asking if I knew of anyone in Georgia > who makes vintage style wedding dresses or sells actual vintage gowns. > Any one here who matches that description? Thanks. > > Katy > > Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian > vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com > Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. > Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 15:12:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19KCPSd000371 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 15:12:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19K5kcP027362; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:05:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19K5gl6087426; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:05:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19K5cl6087321 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:05:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fb9.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.185]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 5F63B5EE489 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 21:05:32 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <001c01c3ef48$21243290$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 21:05:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] this and that Bjarne and X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i19KCPSd000371 Status: RO Dear Mia. This was a very kind thing to say about me. Thanks Mia. ;-) Bjarne all your things are wonderful and an inspiration to us all. I like to think of you in the dark of winter, making such beautiful things. It's like looking at a star in the night sky, or the first crocus or snowdrop coming through the snow. It makes a warm place in my heart that helps me keep on with whatever I'm doing. Mia in Charlotte, NC Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 15:39:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19KdPSd000561 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 15:39:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KW1cP000220; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:32:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KVrl6008657; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:31:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mx6.wvu.edu (mx6.wvu.edu [157.182.140.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KVml6008496 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:31:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from khoover@wvu.edu) Received: from WVUGW01.wvu.edu (wvugw01.wvu.edu [157.182.215.110]) by mx6.wvu.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KVfid022571 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 15:31:41 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khoover@wvu.edu) Received: from WVUDOM1-MTA by WVUGW01.wvu.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 15:31:40 -0500 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 15:31:06 -0500 From: "Kathy Hoover" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: Subject: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dress, but not Costume. Modern, but Historic in their Inspiration..... Kathy >>> New York Times >>> DO REAL MEN WEAR SKIRTS? TRY DISPUTING A 340-POUNDER >>> By ALAN FEUER >>> Published: February 8, 2004 >>> >>> Consider the plight of the man who wears a skirt. >>> >>> Schoolchildren snicker as he passes. Construction workers give him grief. >>> Perfect strangers assume the right to criticize his wardrobe. He might be >>> fired. He might be beaten up. His wife might leave him for a man in slacks. >>> >>> Yesterday, in what future generations may look back on as the birth of the >>> Male Unbifurcated Garment movement, some 100 men in skirts marched from the >>> Guggenheim Museum to the Metropolitan Museum of Art to proclaim their rights >>> to women's clothing. >>> >>> "We're not transvestites, homosexuals or cross-dressers," said one marcher, >>> David Johnson. "We don't want you to call us Jean or Sally." >>> >>> "We're men," said Mr. Johnson, a retired global studies teacher from >>> Poughkeepsie. "Men who want the right to wear a skirt." >>> >>> If the cause of men in skirts has yet to take its place beside the gay >>> rights or women's movements, one could hardly fault the marchers who >>> assembled yesterday to make their case on a nippy February morning. They >>> came from small towns and large cities all across this country. They came in >>> minis, tutus, kilts and, in one case, a fluorescent orange number with >>> matching orange shoes and orange vest. >>> >>> Chris Taylor, 27, came from Levittown, on Long Island, in a full-length >>> crimson dress. In the natural world, he said, the clothes horse of the >>> species is invariably the male. >>> >>> "The male bird is always the pretty one, not the female," said Mr. Taylor, >>> who is difficult to disagree with at 6'3" and 340 pounds. "Why can't the >>> male human being dress with style and color?" >>> >>> Before the march began, there was much talk of the movement's history. Men, >>> it was said, have been wearing skirts much longer than women. There were >>> glowing mentions of the Highlanders of Scotland, for example. It was noted >>> with pride that European nobles of the 16th century wore skirtlike outfits >>> accompanied by heels. >>> >>> It was the French Revolution that turned the tide, said Ingemar Johnsson, >>> 39, who flew from Sweden to attend the march. The French peasant, he said, >>> wore pantaloons. As the monarchy was overthrown, pants became the fashion. >>> The modern men in skirts movement can be traced to another Swede, he said, a >>> man named Roger Lewau. In the early 1990s', Mr. Lewau built a Web site, now >>> defunct, known, he said, as the Skirts Lover Nest. >>> >>> "But that was long before I joined the movement," Mr. Johnsson said. >>> >>> These days, the movement finds its guiding spirits in Tom Manuel, 48, a >>> computer consultant from Virginia, and Larrie James, who is 55 and from >>> Wisconsin. >>> >>> As he rallied his troops yesterday, Mr. Manuel explained that the movement >>> had recently experienced a schism between the freestylers, who believe that >>> all skirts should be worn, and the bravehearts, who tend to dress >>> exclusively in kilts. >>> >>> "There was almost a war, if you will, on the Internet," he said. >>> >>> The term "unbifurcated garment" was created to address this rift. Kilts and >>> skirts are both unbifurcated garments. Mr. Manuel is hopeful that with this >>> new inclusive term, the tension will be finally laid to rest. >>> >>> At a march of men in skirts, it is only natural that conversation would turn >>> toward clothing. The following is fairly typical: >>> >>>> MARCHER 1: Who does that skirt? >>>> >>>> MARCHER 2: Bear Kilt. You know them? >>>> >>>> MARCHER 1: Yeah, but their tailoring doesn't work for me. >>>> >>>> MARCHER 2: Really? They always fit me fine. >>> >>> You would think that a hundred men in skirts with a bagpipe band marching on >>> the streets at 10 a.m. would attract some real attention. But reaction was >>> fairly tame. A couple of doormen came to watch, and the morning poodle >>> walkers seemed a bit confused. The officers on escort duty all had smiles, >>> but there was not a single a heckler. >>> >>> In a matter of minutes, the marchers arrived at the Met where they planned >>> to visit an exhibition called "Bravehearts: Men in Skirts." They were >>> gathered in the plaza near the fountains when a double-decker tourist bus >>> pulled up. >>> >>> The sightseers gazed in awe at the crowd of men in unbifurcated garments. >>> Someone in the crowd called up to ask the tourists what they thought. >>> >>> "What I think?" said one young man with a clearly foreign accent. "I think I >>> love New York." _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 15:42:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19KgeSd000593 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 15:42:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KaNcP000780; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:36:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KaJl6012120; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:36:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from uranium.btinternet.com (uranium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.89]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KaGl6012090 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:36:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.128.235.29] (helo=dan) by uranium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AqI8d-0002nH-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 20:36:15 +0000 Message-ID: <005501c3ef4c$9ad7e920$1deb8051@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4027BF04.2090600@kc.rr.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:37:35 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Richenda wrote on Monday, February 09, 2004 5:10 PM Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? > Could this be a heraldic key to what amount of ermine was allowed to be > worn by the different ranks at a ceremonial occasion (or in their > artistic representations)? At the top of the left hand page, I pick out > the words prince (or princess) . The bottom square in the left column > looks like "The duches gown 5 something something" . On the bottom right > column is " The marqu(is) ?? ..." and the spots get less dense. This > also is true on the right hand page as well. The generic lady only > having a single row of spots on her cuffs and the figure to the left > having a double row. Alas, I fear not in relation to real garments. This was my first hope; an aide memoire for the fur trade but I can find no reference anywhere to this possibility. It is, of course, *physically* possible, since ermine 'tails' were not actually parts of the ermine at all; usually small pieces of bougie were used, and they could be placed anywhere you liked. 'Powdering' ermine was one of the most backbreakingly boring jobs in an industry noted for them, and anyone doing it would have been thrilled at the possibility of doing as few as possible... The rules for rank in representations are, I think, much more likely candidates, and it would fit with these archaic dress styles. But I will go and have a look at Burkes Peerage and see if there are any rules for ermine wear in peers and peeresses attending State functions. The English monarchy is rather good at inventing ancient traditions, as a quick look at 19th century coronations will confirm; George IV went rather further and did the whole lot in pseudo elizabethan/renaissance. Aileen Ribeiro suggests that he wore the genuinely traditional 'supertunica of cloth of gold and a matching dalmatic lined with ermine' only for the actual coronation service itself. It is, I hope, impossible that Lacma has got its dating wrong by 300 years... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 15:45:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19KjrSd000623 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 15:45:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KevcP001230; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:40:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19Ketl6015821; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:40:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail10.mdx.safepages.com (mail10.mdx.safepages.com [216.127.133.25]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19Keol6015774 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:40:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: by mail10.mdx.safepages.com (Postfix, from userid 1012) id D3B5F6E6C3; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:40:44 +0000 (GMT) Received: from compaqub (1Cust254.tnt3.ofallon.mo.da.uu.net [65.239.197.254]) by mail10.mdx.safepages.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3B7E56DFA8 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:40:43 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <006501c3ef4d$238ded50$0400a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4027BF04.2090600@kc.rr.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:41:46 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- > Could this be a heraldic key to what amount of ermine was allowed to be > worn by the different ranks at a ceremonial occasion (or in their > artistic representations)? I think you've hit the nail on the head! I've been perplexed by this particular image for a while, too. On the left hand page, the only real difference I could see was the density of the ermine spots; what would be the point if not to assign certain spot densities to certain things? I mean, there's no 'practice factor' there; that would look different and likely not be preserved anyway. The gowns get less ceremonial as the rank decreases, and more in line with late 15th C fashion; with the 'Lady' the only real ceremonial indicator I see is the red/ermine combination (and perhaps the lack of train, which one would expect to see at a fancy occasion). In other words, the sketches not only show how much ermine to use, but also where, and how close to contemporary fashion standards the gowns could be made. (You may have to be shown wearing that fusty old surcoat, but it's ok to put a fashionable square neckline on it. No, not you, you're a duchess so you have to wear a down-curved neckline.) It still seems a little earlier than 1511 to me, but maybe not by more than a decade; the dress of the Lady with folded back cuffs and square-but-arching-up neckline wouldn't be out of place c1500. However, I don't know much about headwear, and I'm wishing I did now, because that's the main thing that's making me think it's before 1500 rather than after. Anyway, I hope this is the answer, because it settles all the puzzlement I had and now I no longer have to scratch my head. =} E _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 16:24:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19LOXSd000836 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:24:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LNdcP005337; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:23:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LNVl6048300; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:23:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from incoming.SIGENETICS.com ([209.172.110.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LNUl6048223 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:23:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sbuchler@silicongenetics.com) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:11:04 -0800 Message-ID: <0D3431E0FD777844A4ED9507E4D698D90D2666@incoming.sigenetics.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 93 Thread-Index: AcPvP+zeAW3fMuKPSk+3jGIiSWVuFgAEIOYA From: "Sunny Buchler" To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i19LNUl6048223 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Bayoux Tapestry Headgear X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello all! I've been using Robin's article on pendant sleeves (I'm blanking on the title of the article at the moment -- so sorry! -- It was re-published in _Tournaments Illuminated_ in the last couple years) to make a Bayoux Tapestry-style woman's gown. Does anyone have any theories on the headgear for the standing woman (the one running away with a boy in tow)? At first I thought it might be a wimple, but it doesn't really drape like one... Is it a hood? Thanks! -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 16:44:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19LiRSd000915 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:44:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LhTcP007400; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:43:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LhPl6063796; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:43:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LhNl6063764 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:43:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-50.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.50]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10 close 1msg/rcpt/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19KwUqP022409 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:58:31 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040209125557.05bddb60@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 12:57:23 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] wedding in Georgia In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I got a request from my website asking if I knew of anyone in Georgia >who makes vintage style wedding dresses or sells actual vintage gowns. >Any one here who matches that description? Thanks. Is Virginia close enough? A good friend of mine, who will (eventually) be working on a historical dress for me, lives in VA and has a pro costuming business. E-mail me privately for the contact info if you need it. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 16:50:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19LoCSd000934 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:50:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LkOcP007776; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:46:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LkOl6065970; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:46:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m10.mx.aol.com (imo-m10.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.165]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19LkMl6065885 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:46:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from imo-d04.mx.aol.com (imo-d04.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.228]) by imo-m10.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/AOL-5.0.0) with ESMTP id QAA28066 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:36:07 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.de.43e20e14 (16335) for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:30:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:30:52 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/9/2004 3:32:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, khoover@wvu.edu writes: > Chris Taylor, 27, came from Levittown, on Long Island, in a > full-length > >>>crimson dress. In the natural world, he said, the clothes horse of > the > >>>species is invariably the male. > This is true, but a 3 piece suit is way more of a deal than the average crimson dress. Women's clothes are easy compared to men's! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 18:25:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i19NPQSd001503 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:25:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19NOicP016665; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:24:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19NOdl6061759; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:24:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i19NOYl6061696 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:24:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA19395 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:53:43 -0600 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:53:43 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bayoux Tapestry Headgear In-Reply-To: <0D3431E0FD777844A4ED9507E4D698D90D2666@incoming.sigenetics.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Mon, 9 Feb 2004, Sunny Buchler wrote: > Hello all! I've been using Robin's article on pendant sleeves (I'm > blanking on the title of the article at the moment -- so sorry! -- It > was re-published in _Tournaments Illuminated_ in the last couple > years) to make a Bayoux Tapestry-style woman's gown. Does anyone have > any theories on the headgear for the standing woman (the one running > away with a boy in tow)? At first I thought it might be a wimple, but > it doesn't really drape like one... Is it a hood? Best I've been able to do is take a length of linen and play around with draping and wrapping. I think that's what I did for my model in the picture with that article. But the Bayeux image is ambiguous enough to be a hood or cowl, at least to my eye. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 19:51:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1A0p5Sd001915 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:51:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A0mtcP023053; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 17:48:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A0mgl6013189; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 17:48:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from badger.uvm.edu (badger.uvm.edu [132.198.101.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A0mdl6013158 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 17:48:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hope.greenberg@uvm.edu) Received: from uvm.edu (ip095115.uvm.edu [132.198.95.115]) by badger.uvm.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A0g4ZE026440 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:42:05 -0500 Message-ID: <402828DB.5090404@uvm.edu> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 19:42:03 -0500 From: Hope Greenberg User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Drawings of Tudor Nobility Costume manuscript? References: <4027BF04.2090600@kc.rr.com> <005501c3ef4c$9ad7e920$1deb8051@dan> In-Reply-To: <005501c3ef4c$9ad7e920$1deb8051@dan> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stevie Gamble wrote: > It is, I hope, impossible that Lacma has got its dating wrong by 300 > years... This is exactly what I was hoping. The images look too much like a redrawing or recreation of Tudor-like garments. The headdresses are all mixed up (hair flowing from a gable headdress? and one with a rounded top at that? henin-type veils on a gable--not really like the Holbein sketch...) and the ermine is placed in ways that is really strange. Even the fantasy designs for Mary's (Henry's sister) entry into Paris were not this weird. And the way the figures are posed and the faces sketched--just not quite "right." Very strange. Unless this is an original that was "improved" somewhere along the way. - Hope _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 20:09:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1A19PSd002012 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:09:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A16GcP024123; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:06:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A154l6022056; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:05:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A150l6021959 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:05:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from skskaw@comcast.net) Received: from mom1 (c-24-21-122-88.client.comcast.net[24.21.122.88]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <2004021000583501500k3287e>; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 00:58:35 +0000 Message-ID: <004401c3ef71$02fb9190$6501a8c0@mom1> From: "Sidne Kneeland" To: Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:58:34 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Wizard of Oz X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1A19PSd002012 Status: RO Greetings, If any one has any experience and/or ideas for Wizard of Oz (the main costumes), could you please contact me off list. It is for little people, i.e. gradeschool play. Sidne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 20:40:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1A1eCSd002142 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:40:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A1b0cP026248; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:37:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A1Znl6037375; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:35:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail.netspace.net.au (cumulus.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.72]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A1Zll6037350 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:35:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stilskin@netspace.net.au) Received: from chris (dialup-a2-230.Melbourne.netspace.net.au [203.113.248.230]) by mail.netspace.net.au (Postfix) with SMTP id 64A716AB6F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:17:04 +1100 (EST) From: "Christopher Ballis" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:20:50 +1100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Bayoux Tapestry Headgear X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Don't you dare chop that thing up to make a hat. It's too big, use it for a full suit instead, -C. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 20:46:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1A1kASd002281 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:46:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A1jFcP026655; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:45:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A1i4l6041163; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:44:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A1i2l7041143 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 18:44:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A1iQ8v000841 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:44:26 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1A1iQKF000839 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:44:26 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:44:25 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402092044.25910.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday 09 February 2004 03:31 pm, Kathy Hoover wrote: > Dress, but not Costume. Modern, but Historic in their Inspiration..... > > Kathy > > >>> New York Times > >>> DO REAL MEN WEAR SKIRTS? TRY DISPUTING A 340-POUNDER > >>> By ALAN FEUER > >>> Published: February 8, 2004 > >>> > >>> Consider the plight of the man who wears a skirt. On the other hand, there is some momentum about changing this way of thinking. Utilikilts is making a business of selling kilts--"skirts", if you will, to ordinary guys for everyday wear. http://www.utilikilts.com/ Most of the ones I've seen actually worn were basic black. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 9 21:24:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1A2OXSd002470 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 21:24:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A2HscP028333; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:17:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A2Hql6057065; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:17:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r10.mx.aol.com (imo-r10.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.106]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A2Hpl6057027 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 19:17:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from imo-d06.mx.aol.com (imo-d06.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.230]) by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (v92.15) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-0209211741; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 21:17:41 -0500 Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.f6.366d68ec (3940) for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 21:12:31 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 21:12:31 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wizard of Oz To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/9/2004 8:06:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, skskaw@comcast.net writes: If any one has any experience and/or ideas for Wizard of Oz (the main costumes), could you please contact me off list. It is for little people, i.e. gradeschool play. One of the commercial pattern companies has a pattern--you can check their websites. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 00:11:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1A5BDSd002887 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 00:11:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A57WcP007432; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 22:07:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A57Pl6034544; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 22:07:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A57Nl6034528 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 22:07:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-50.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.50]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.10 close 1msg/rcpt/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1A57L9D016707 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 21:07:22 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040209210129.05be3c80@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 21:07:19 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue In-Reply-To: <200402092044.25910.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Utilikilts is making a business of selling kilts--"skirts", if you will, to >ordinary guys for everyday wear. > >http://www.utilikilts.com/ > >Most of the ones I've seen actually worn were basic black. These also come in cammo and a yellowish-beige. I know several men, and one woman, who own these and wear them regularly here in Northern CA. Utilikilts come with cargo pockets, and are otherwise built like work overalls. Hey - if I can dress top to toe in men's clothes (t-shirt, jeans, and Nikes) then why can't men wear skirts? Greek men wear skirts too, and in the Middle East caftans (=dresses) are normal menswear. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 07:31:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ACVcSd030454 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:31:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ACUMcP022539; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 05:30:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ACUFl6003338; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 05:30:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ACUEl6003324 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 05:30:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from badboy.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.20]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1Aq1lr-00072r-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 08 Feb 2004 19:07:39 -0800 Received: from grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net (grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.46]) by badboy.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i132DPO05216 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 18:13:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Anq43-0000Bd-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 02 Feb 2004 18:13:23 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: "H-Costume@Indra. Com" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 19:13:38 -0700 Message-ID: <001f01c3e9fb$561b03e0$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Anyone else going to Estrella? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I just happened to read Kat's and Albra's notes that they will be at Estrella teaching. I will also (Gollar and Puff and Slash again). Anyone else? I'll wear a red H if you will! Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 08:42:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ADgFSd030819 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:42:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ADeCcP024833; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 06:40:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ADeAl6029852; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 06:40:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ADe8l6029678 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 06:40:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i1ADdlT03887.; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:39:47 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:39:47 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:39:19 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>> kayta@frys.com 2/10/04 5:07:19 AM >>> wrote: >Hey - if I can dress top to toe in men's clothes (t-shirt, jeans, and >Nikes) then why can't men wear skirts? Greek men wear skirts too, and >in the Middle East caftans (=dresses) are normal menswear. What about sarongs in Southeast Asia? Agreed, it does seem illogical that women can wear masculine clothes but men can't wear skirts. I'd dispute the assertion that you can't be a peacock in male attire, though. As for the Swedish gentleman who says that trousers came in with the French Revolution - well, yes, but they replaced knee-breeches, not skirts! Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 09:31:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AEVgSd031050 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:31:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AEUvcP027402; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:30:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AEUul6052308; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:30:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web14004.mail.yahoo.com (web14004.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.175.120]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1AEUql6052278 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 07:30:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyforbeys@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040210142411.87555.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [24.242.152.154] by web14004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:24:11 GMT Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:24:11 +0000 (GMT) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Catalina=20Saravia=20Quicedo?= To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Fwd: Re:OT food question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > --- rasodergren@aol.com wrote: > To: > From: > rasodergren@aol.com > > Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 10:48:08 -0500 > > Subject: Re: Fwd: OT food question > > > > I would reccomend a book by Lydia Marie Child (the > > 19th century Martha Stewart, even with the > > scandals...though hers pertained to being an > > abolitionist, and were popular in some parts of > the > > country, not others). It's title is The American > > Frugal Housewife. It was first published in 1826, > > and was published in several editions until 1860. > > Dover has a nice paperback version of it out for a > > relatively low cost ($7.95). It not only contains > > information on food (with recipes), but also on > > medicine and health care, beauty tips, and > household > > information (think Good Housekeeping, in the 19th > > century). > > > > Rebecca Sodergren > > Saint Louis, Missouri > > > > > > ===== > Seńora Catalina > Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > BT Yahoo! Broadband - Free modem offer, sign up > online today and save Ł80 http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk > ===== Seńora Catalina Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit ___________________________________________________________ BT Yahoo! Broadband - Free modem offer, sign up online today and save Ł80 http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 10:20:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AFKSSd000683 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:20:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AFJacP000533; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:19:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AFJHl6076496; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:19:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AFJCl6076403 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:19:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be32.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.50]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 89225262CDD for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:19:06 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000a01c3efe9$3f2c9290$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:19:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] cloak and muff X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1AFKSSd000683 Status: RO Hi, Today i made a lot. Almost finished the cloak and the muff wich i am going to use in cold Sweden next months. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/cloakandmuff.htm Made of black wool and fake persian goatskin. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 10:25:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AFPqSd000715 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:25:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AFMNcP000755; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:22:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AFMMl6078455; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:22:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d20.mx.aol.com (imo-d20.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.136]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AFKHl6077045 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:20:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.e4.463ae196 (4340) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:14:57 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:14:56 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 8:42:15 AM Eastern Standard Time, K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk writes: > then why can't men wear skirts? Greek men wear skirts too, and > >in the Middle East caftans (=dresses) are normal menswear. > I saw the exhibit at the MET. Not geat. They did not display the backs of one of the 4 kilts in the show. I think that's a little weird since the back is the thing. Still there were some Middle Eastern garments that looked great and I'd wear them. One from Morocco that is like a caftan but more loose and with a hood. It could be either long or short and was traditionally made from yummy light cotton dyed in some incredible fashion and embroidered around the CF opening. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 11:04:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AG4tSd001026 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:04:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AG4CcP004483; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:04:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AG2xl6004498; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:02:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9406.mail.yahoo.com (web9406.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.22]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1AG2vl6004483 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:02:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040210160256.81191.qmail@web9406.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9406.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:02:56 PST Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:02:56 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] cloak and muff To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000a01c3efe9$3f2c9290$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, it looks wonderful! thanks for sharing---I always enjoy looking at your projects! Albra Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: Hi, Today i made a lot. Almost finished the cloak and the muff wich i am going to use in cold Sweden next months. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/cloakandmuff.htm Made of black wool and fake persian goatskin. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 11:10:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AGAkSd001064 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:10:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AG8LcP004814; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:08:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AG8Jl6007954; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:08:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AG8Gl7007923 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:08:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1AGVHWm028639 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:31:17 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.111] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AF5BB06C0106; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:57:15 -0500 Message-ID: <001a01c3eff0$ce833280$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000a01c3efe9$3f2c9290$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] cloak and muff Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:13:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, that is one classy ensemble. It should be smashing with you beautiful suit. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 10:19 AM Subject: [h-cost] cloak and muff Hi, Today i made a lot. Almost finished the cloak and the muff wich i am going to use in cold Sweden next months. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/cloakandmuff.htm Made of black wool and fake persian goatskin. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 11:12:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AGCmSd001075 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:12:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AG8rcP004871; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:08:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AG8ql6008319; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:08:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AG8nl7008288 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:08:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1AGVoWm030780 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:31:51 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.111] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AF7EB0AB0106; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:57:50 -0500 Message-ID: <001b01c3eff0$e302b1e0$6f5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "H-Costume" Subject: Fw: [h-cost] cloak and muff Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:13:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 10:19 AM Subject: [h-cost] cloak and muff Hi, Today i made a lot. Almost finished the cloak and the muff wich i am going to use in cold Sweden next months. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/cloakandmuff.htm Made of black wool and fake persian goatskin. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 11:43:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AGhLSd001227 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:43:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AGdgcP007995; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:39:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AGdcl6030460; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:39:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.81]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1AGdMl6030258 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:39:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.119.195.170 with login) by smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2004 16:32:35 -0000 Message-ID: <002001c3eff3$7d9eb3f0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:32:35 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Does anyone know what silk "dupioni satin" is? I've seen it listed on Fabric.com (http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/fabric-apparel---fashion-fabrics-sil ks-silk-satins.html) and emailed them to ask, but I haven't received a reply. As far as I'm concerned, satin is a very smooth weave and dupioni a very slubby weave -- I don't understand how the two can be in the same fabric! Any guesses? - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 11:54:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AGstSd001261 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:54:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AGsGcP009330; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:54:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AGsFl6041086; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:54:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AGsDl6040983 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:54:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.8) with ESMTP id 694491 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:54:07 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 08:54:07 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200402092044.25910.cathy@thyrsus.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I live in the S.F. Bay area so my mileage varies from the usual. Having said that, I often see men in kilts/utilikilts out on the street in S.F. and Berkeley. Usually they have a certain uniform with it - a white tee-shirt advertising a band, Doc Martin-type boots, tattoos and piercings. They are often stocky and muscled. No one would question their masculinity. They are also usually in the 20-30 year old age group. I don't know if it's because I've seen faire Scots/Celts for the past 30 years or what, but I don't see them as a novelty anymore. At least HERE. LynnD On 2/9/04 5:44 PM, "Catherine Olanich Raymond" wrote: > On Monday 09 February 2004 03:31 pm, Kathy Hoover wrote: >> Dress, but not Costume. Modern, but Historic in their Inspiration..... >> >> Kathy >> >>>>> New York Times >>>>> DO REAL MEN WEAR SKIRTS? TRY DISPUTING A 340-POUNDER >>>>> By ALAN FEUER >>>>> Published: February 8, 2004 >>>>> >>>>> Consider the plight of the man who wears a skirt. > > > On the other hand, there is some momentum about changing this way of thinking. > > Utilikilts is making a business of selling kilts--"skirts", if you will, to > ordinary guys for everyday wear. > > http://www.utilikilts.com/ > > Most of the ones I've seen actually worn were basic black. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 12:17:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AHHtSd001427 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:17:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AHFtcP011293; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:15:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AHFrl6056060; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:15:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r03.mx.aol.com (imo-r03.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AHFpl6055999 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:15:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.11b.2ddd701b (24895) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:15:43 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <11b.2ddd701b.2d5a6bbe@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:15:42 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 11:40:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, kendra@tweedlebop.com writes: As far as I'm concerned, satin is a very smooth weave and dupioni a very slubby weave -- I don't understand how the two can be in the same fabric! Any guesses? It could be double-faced--slubbed on one side and satin on the other (similar to crepe-backed satin). I haven't seen it in silk, but, forgive me, I have seen it in polyester. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 12:53:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AHrSSd001603 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:53:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AHqbcP014951; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:52:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AHqYl6082356; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:52:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AHqTl6082270 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:52:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.147] (pm5-147.eos.net [205.133.149.147]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AHqQ2d010914 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:52:26 -0500 (EST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:52:49 -0500 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200402100508.i1A58Dl7034912@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: men in skirts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think those Utilikilts are great! When I first heard of them, I was going to buy one for my husband -- until I saw the price. Worth it, I'm sure, but out of our budgets. I've often thought a great topic for a thesis would be the psychological harm done to men by not allowing them to wear fancy clothes. After all, the guy in the NYT article was right -- through most of history, and in most countries, men have worn fancier, lovelier clothes than women. I think you could argue that it's a basic male need. So recent Western culture must be psychologically hard on men, forcing them into such drab garments. People buy "psychological harm" for all kinds of ridiculous feminist arguments. This idea sounds far more plausible to me! Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 12:55:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AHtOSd001611 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:55:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AHqwcP015004; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:52:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AHqvl6082645; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:52:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web20202.mail.yahoo.com (web20202.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.57]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1AHqkl6082526 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:52:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ivyharpdotcom@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040210174604.50825.qmail@web20202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.162.250.83] by web20202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:46:04 PST Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:46:04 -0800 (PST) From: Angela Kessler Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <002001c3eff3$7d9eb3f0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand it, dupioni is silk from when two silkworms built their cocoons touching each other. The resulting thread is consequently slubby. It is usually woven in a plain "tabby" weave, but technically the term refers to the fiber, not the weave. Satin is a weave where floating warp threads, not caught up in every pass of weft threads, create a smooth surface. It can be made of a variety of fiber types. So, technically, you could weave satin with dupioni thread, though why you would want to I don't know, as it does seem the slubbiness of the thread would cancel the smoothness of the weave. Also, and perhaps most importantly, retailers don't always understand or care about the technical definitions when they label their products, so the best way to find out what this retailer had in mind is to get a direct answer from them, or a swatch (does fabric.com do swatches?). My screen resolution is not high enough for me to see what's going on. Good price, though. -Angela --- Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > Does anyone know what silk "dupioni satin" is? I've > seen it listed on > Fabric.com > (http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/fabric-apparel---fashion-fabrics-sil > ks-silk-satins.html) and emailed them to ask, but I > haven't received a > reply. > > As far as I'm concerned, satin is a very smooth > weave and dupioni a very > slubby weave -- I don't understand how the two can > be in the same fabric! > Any guesses? > > - Kendra > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 13:29:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AITfSd001853 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:29:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIRUcP018502; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:27:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIROl6008198; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:27:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d20.mx.aol.com (imo-d20.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.136]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIRLl6008128 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:27:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1e2.191f37da (3657) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:27:09 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1e2.191f37da.2d5a7c7d@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:27:09 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 12:16:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, AnnBWass@aol.com writes: > I haven't seen it in silk, but, forgive me, I have > seen it in polyester. > Many a drapery was made of it [in polyester] in the 70's. When I was in collage a teacher [of whom I have/had zero respect] made this sky blue and white 1900 gown [with matching hat...same fabric] out of the stuff. It was worn by a dark skinned singer. God was it awful! Wrong color in the wrong fabric. In silk it might be interesting though. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 13:33:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AIXLSd001875 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:33:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIUYcP018856; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:30:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIUYl6010618; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:30:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIUWl6010545 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:30:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.3f.27a606cc (3657) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:30:21 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <3f.27a606cc.2d5a7d3d@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:30:21 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 1:28:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, AlbertCat@aol.com writes: > Many a drapery was made of it [in polyester] in the 70's. When I was in > collage a teacher That's college...not collage. Hey, I didn't major in English...whadaya want? And I'm talking "Crepe back satin" not "Dupioni satin". _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 13:40:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AIeiSd001904 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:40:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIdpcP020963; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:39:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIdpl6018144; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:39:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from cmsrelay01.mx.net (cmsrelay01.mx.net [165.212.11.110]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1AIdol6018050 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:39:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from younganne@usa.net) Received: from uadvg130.cms.usa.net (165.212.11.130) by cmsoutbound.mx.net with SMTP; 10 Feb 2004 18:33:04 -0000 Received: from uwdvg013.cms.usa.net [165.212.8.13] by uadvg130.cms.usa.net (ASMTP/) via mtad (C8.MAIN.3.13N) with ESMTP id 500iBJshB0309M30; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:33:01 GMT X-USANET-Auth: 165.212.8.13 AUTO younganne@usa.net uwdvg013.cms.usa.net Received: from 65.176.112.33 [65.176.112.33] by uwdvg013.cms.usa.net (USANET web-mailer CM.0402.7.03); Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:33:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:33:01 -0800 From: Shea Young To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: USANET web-mailer (CM.0402.7.03) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <466iBJshB7600S13.1076437981@uwdvg013.cms.usa.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1AIdol6018050 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] New fabric shop X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear list, especially those of you in or near Portland, Oregon. While searching for a new Russian restaurant Friday night we came across RUTH'S RAGS on Sandy Blvd. The address is 10602 NE Sandy Blvd., Portland, OR 97220 Phone: 503-261-7177 or 503-261-7717 Ruth carries nothing but natural fabrics; organic cotton, hemp, wool flannel, silk velvet (gorgeous deep purple and a blue/brown shot-like one, among others), wool Guatemala wovens by the bolt, etc.! The prices are not cheap, but neither are they at the high end. I know that folks are always looking for silk velvet ($25/yd) and wool flannel ($12/yd) Ruth just left Jansens (famous swimsuit company) after a take-over and is living out her dream of being surrounded by and retailing beautiful fabrics and notions. Her husband is working on a website to reach a larger market. I have no connection, just delighted that someone has provided us fabriholics with another source! Enjoy, Shea Shea Young ~ ~ ~ ~ "As you go the way of life, you will see a great chasm. JUMP! It is not as wide as you think." ~ Joesph Campbell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 13:43:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AIh2Sd001914 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:43:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIcpcP020811; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:38:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIcml6017389; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:38:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav31.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.88]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AIckl6017303 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:38:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:38:41 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav31.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:38:40 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040210174604.50825.qmail@web20202.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:39:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Feb 2004 18:38:41.0147 (UTC) FILETIME=[1ACA3CB0:01C3F005] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Also, and perhaps most importantly, retailers don't > always understand or care about the technical > definitions when they label their products, so the > best way to find out what this retailer had in mind is > to get a direct answer from them, or a swatch (does > fabric.com do swatches?). I agree on that. But usually fabric.com are pretty good about labelling and etc., and they know that a lot of costumers and historical re-enactors buy from them and care about those issues, so it is surprising to see a weird thing like that. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 15:38:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AKc1Sd002374 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:38:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AKZkcP002608; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:35:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AKZfl6004121; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:35:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AKZbl6004072 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:35:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-50.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.50]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AKYhbE013080 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:34:43 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040210123324.05367d10@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:34:00 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kate M Bunting writes, in a message sent 01:39 PM 2/10/04 +0000: > >>> kayta@frys.com 2/10/04 5:07:19 AM >>> wrote: > > >Hey - if I can dress top to toe in men's clothes (t-shirt, jeans, and > > >Nikes) then why can't men wear skirts? Greek men wear skirts too, and > >in the Middle East caftans (=dresses) are normal menswear. > >What about sarongs in Southeast Asia? And all over the Pacific islands. Yes, them too. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 16:04:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AL47Sd002494 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:04:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AL3IcP005088; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:03:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AL3El6023812; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:03:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m20.mx.aol.com (imo-m20.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AL3Bl6023710 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:03:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1a8.1f731480 (3924) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:57:48 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <1a8.1f731480.2d5a9fcc@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:57:48 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT food question To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/8/2004 7:47:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, theresa@misc.com writes: http://www.erasofelegance.com/regencyrecipes.html I have my doubts about the Manchester Chocolate Truffle. As far as I can tell, chocolate was strictly a beverage until about mid-19th century, when people began baking with it. But, as with many things concerning the early 19th century, I haven't been able to pinpoint it exactly. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 16:08:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AL8dSd002527 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:08:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AL4xcP005322; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:04:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AL4ul6025205; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:04:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AL4rl6025087 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:04:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.8) with ESMTP id 695739 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:04:48 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:04:47 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040210123324.05367d10@mail.frys.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On 2/10/04 12:34 PM, "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" wrote: > Kate M Bunting writes, in a message sent 01:39 PM 2/10/04 +0000: > > >>>>> kayta@frys.com 2/10/04 5:07:19 AM >>> wrote: >> >>> Hey - if I can dress top to toe in men's clothes (t-shirt, jeans, and >> >>> Nikes) then why can't men wear skirts? Greek men wear skirts too, and >>> in the Middle East caftans (=dresses) are normal menswear. >> >> What about sarongs in Southeast Asia? > > And all over the Pacific islands. Yes, them too. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows So right. There's a huge population of Samoans in San Francisco, and the men wear their sarongs and traditional clothing, especially for formal occasions. Who's going to tease a six foot plus man, 250 plus pounds because he's wearing a skirt? LynnD Kayta, you may have seen the families during Dicken's Fair in the area near the Cow Palace, where there's a church, a community center and several stores for the Samoan community in San Francisco. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 16:31:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ALV1Sd002597 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:31:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ALU8cP007785; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:30:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ALU0l6043922; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:30:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp813.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp813.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.83]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1ALTwl6043897 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:29:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sarah@modehistorique.com) Received: from unknown (HELO modehistorique.com) (lithiate@sbcglobal.net@67.125.13.3 with plain) by smtp813.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2004 20:50:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 12:50:20 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Sarah To: h-costume@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl8034165@net.indra.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey Kendra, I actually have several yards of this stuff from Fabric.com, and it's not duipioni. It's definitely a satin, although probably not a very high-grade silk. The black feels pretty papery, but the white was denser, like you'd expect from a silk satin. My guess is that the folks at Fabric.com mislabeled it. When I purchased it from them last year it was titled "Silk Satin". Sarah http://www.modehistorique.com --- Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > Does anyone know what silk "dupioni satin" is? I've > seen it listed on > Fabric.com > (http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/fabric-apparel---fashion- fabrics-sil > ks-silk-satins.html) and emailed them to ask, but I > haven't received a > reply. > > As far as I'm concerned, satin is a very smooth > weave and dupioni a very > slubby weave -- I don't understand how the two can > be in the same fabric! > Any guesses? > > - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 16:53:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ALrKSd002680 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:53:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ALp8cP010320; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:51:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ALp3l6060250; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:51:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ALovl7060165 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:50:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1ALvcLP019201 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:57:41 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040210134845.02494a00@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:50:52 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance In-Reply-To: References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl8034165@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Subject: [h-cost] silk velvet X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've been looking at silk velvet on the internet. Apparently most of it is 18% silk / 82% rayon. Is this standard? Why not more silk? Does the small silk content really make a difference? Thank you, Katie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 17:02:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AM2iSd002727 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:02:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ALxIcP011325; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:59:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ALxGl6066347; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:59:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ALxDl6066248 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:59:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f22.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.34]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 898704800E6 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:59:07 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000a01c3f021$294dd6e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:59:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] silk velvet. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1AM2iSd002727 Status: RO I've been looking at silk velvet on the internet. Apparently most of it is 18% silk / 82% rayon. Is this standard? Why not more silk? Does the small silk content really make a difference? Thank you, Katie As i understand it, the silk is the buttom fabric and not the raised part. The raised part is made of rayon. I dont know why they do it that way. But one thing is sure, if they made the raised part in silk, it would be very very expensive, think about all the silk they had to use in the weave. There are some of the "silk" velvets that i have seen wich are very close to the real thing in looks, but to work with it, is another story. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 18:02:18 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AN2ISd003042 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:02:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AN1McP017501; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:01:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AN1Jl6012430; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:01:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fed1mtai06.cox.net (fed1mtai06.cox.net [68.6.19.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AN1Dl6012279 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:01:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mudsleidi@cox.net) Received: from ZORRO.cox.net ([68.7.135.77]) by fed1mtao05.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.05 201-253-122-130-105-20030824) with ESMTP id <20040210221710.IPUC9536.fed1mtao05.cox.net@ZORRO.cox.net> for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:17:10 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.2.20040210141803.00b3da38@pop.west.cox.net> X-Sender: mudsleidi@pop.west.cox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 14:19:18 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Heidi Fox Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. In-Reply-To: <000a01c3f021$294dd6e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >As i understand it, the silk is the buttom fabric and not the raised part. >The raised part is made of rayon. >I dont know why they do it that way. But one thing is sure, if they made >the raised part in silk, it would be very very expensive, think about all >the silk they had to use in the weave. >There are some of the "silk" velvets that i have seen wich are very close >to the real thing in looks, but to work with it, is another story. > >Bjarne > This site: http://www.mini-magic.com/cgi-bin/new-mini/catalog/multitest.htm carries 100% silk velvet for $30 a yard. Cheers, Heidi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 18:05:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1AN5YSd003061 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:05:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AN3EcP017718; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:03:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AN3Dl6013892; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:03:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1AN39l7013865 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:03:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1AMxRPp010292 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:59:27 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:59:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4029632A.7070108@thibault.org> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:03:06 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. References: <000a01c3f021$294dd6e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <000a01c3f021$294dd6e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > As i understand it, the silk is the buttom fabric and not the raised part. The raised part is made of rayon. > I dont know why they do it that way. Because the current fashion is for "burn out" velvets. They can apply a chemical to the fabric like they'd apply an ink print, and it will dissolve the rayon, but not the silk, leaving a transparent silk ground with rayon pile patterns. I have some all-silk velvet I inherited from my grandmother. It's a robe/housecoat/something. Wearing it, one feels so sensuous that it's hard to describe! -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent You can't rely upon a madman. -- Pres. Bush _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 18:24:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ANOtSd003189 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:24:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ANLqcP019666; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:21:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ANLml6026878; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:21:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp801.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp801.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.180]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1ANLil6026852 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:21:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sarah@modehistorique.com) Received: from unknown (HELO modehistorique.com) (lithiate@sbcglobal.net@67.125.13.36 with plain) by smtp801.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2004 23:15:03 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:15:00 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <000a01c3f021$294dd6e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The question just struck me: Why would 100% silk velvet be prohibitively expensive like we all expect it to be? I mean, why shouldn't it be any more expensive than silk satin, or taffeta, or any other 100% silk fabric commonly available? Granted, there are some terribly expensive silks out there, but there's also quite an assortment of affordable silks in all types of weaves, so why not 100% silk velvet? Of course, the one and only time I saw 100% silk velvet was at Britex several years ago and it was about $600 a yard, but if I can go to Britex and find $100 a yard shantung, I can also go to the fabric store down the street from me and find virtually the same stuff for under $30/yard. Sometimes even in the range of $10/yard. Is this just a conspiracy or is there actually a legitimate reason for the assumption that silk velvet would be off the charts expensive and therefore no one would ever dare sell it retail? Inquiring minds want to know! Sarah http://www.modehistorique.com On Tuesday, February 10, 2004, at 01:59 PM, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > I've been looking at silk velvet on the internet. Apparently most of > it is > 18% silk / 82% rayon. > > Is this standard? > > Why not more silk? > > Does the small silk content really make a difference? > > Thank you, > > Katie > > As i understand it, the silk is the buttom fabric and not the raised > part. The raised part is made of rayon. > I dont know why they do it that way. But one thing is sure, if they > made the raised part in silk, it would be very very expensive, think > about all the silk they had to use in the weave. > There are some of the "silk" velvets that i have seen wich are very > close to the real thing in looks, but to work with it, is another > story. > > Bjarne > > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 18:27:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ANRiSd003217 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:27:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ANPJcP020098; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:25:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ANPIl6029237; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:25:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r02.mx.aol.com (imo-r02.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.98]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ANPGl6029167 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:25:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.142.21c2ae61 (657) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:24:47 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <142.21c2ae61.2d5ac23f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:24:47 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 6:22:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, sarah@modehistorique.com writes: Is this just a conspiracy or is there actually a legitimate reason for the assumption that silk velvet would be off the charts expensive and therefore no one would ever dare sell it retail? I think it is because the weaving of true velvet is very specialized and not done much by anyone anymore. True velvet is woven with the pile yarns going back and forth between two base fabrics and then cut in the middle, thus giving two velvet fabrics. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 18:36:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ANatSd003268 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:36:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ANYqcP020928; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:34:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ANYnl6035725; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:34:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r09.mx.aol.com (imo-r09.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.105]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ANYml6035664 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:34:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.229]) by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-7402968c5316; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:27:01 -0500 Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1e0.193159d5 (657) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:21:47 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <1e0.193159d5.2d5ac18a@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:21:46 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 6:02:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, mudsleidi@cox.net writes: This site: http://www.mini-magic.com/cgi-bin/new-mini/catalog/multitest.htm carries 100% silk velvet for $30 a yard. Amazing! Anyone have any experience with this? My first reaction is, "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is." Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 19:03:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B03jSd003387 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:03:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B00qcP023087; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:00:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B00kl6052954; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:00:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav12.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.116]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B00hl6052853 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:00:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 15:43:22 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav12.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:43:21 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.0.9.2.20040210141803.00b3da38@pop.west.cox.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:44:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Feb 2004 23:43:22.0238 (UTC) FILETIME=[AB2B59E0:01C3F02F] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > This > site: http://www.mini-magic.com/cgi-bin/new-mini/catalog/multitest.htm > carries 100% silk velvet for $30 a yard. > Has someone actually bought this and tested it? I'd be very interested, as will others on many lists, to know about it if it is really 100% silk... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 19:10:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B0AMSd003405 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:10:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B068cP023472; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:06:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B066l6056177; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:06:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pecan.cc.columbia.edu (IDENT:cu41754@pecan.cc.columbia.edu [128.59.59.178]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B05wl7056093 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:05:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from asj2001@columbia.edu) Received: from VAIO (dyn-shp-225-220.dyn.columbia.edu [160.39.225.220]) (user=asj2001 mech=LOGIN bits=0) by pecan.cc.columbia.edu (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1ANjwh7011831 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:45:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> From: "Alexia S. Jacobs" To: References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:40:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-No-Spam-Score: Local X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I had an old-school feminist male teacher in high school (three to seven years ago) who believed women should not wear skirts or dresses. I went to a school for girls, and our uniform options were a selection of solid-colored kilts and corduroy pants that no one wore because they were high-waisted, and tapered. A few of my classmates were discussing the need for better pants, and he interjected that we should not be allowed to wear skirts at all. I, who discovered a love of dresses and high heels early on and took great satisfaction in wearing them, asked him why, and his reply was that one could not be a serious scholar in a skirt. "So just because I am not afraid to be girly and have fun with clothes I can't be taken seriously?" "No." I think the concept of femininity rubbed him the wrong way in general and he was comfortable with women as long as he could look on them as on men. I do not feel particularly trapped by the expectations of femininity. I do not think I am presenting myself merely as a sexual object. Every once in a while something reminds me of him and I fume for an hour or so. I have never seen the Legally Blond movies, but from what I have seen of previews it seems that the main character's problem is ditziness rather than girliness. Sorry. Reading John Steinbeck, who also seems unnecessarily mystified by women, for my comp lit class brought on this small rant. Has anyone here had similar problems? Alexia _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 19:16:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B0GOSd003431 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:16:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B0CvcP024143; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:12:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B0Cul6060625; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:12:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav17.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.121]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B0Cpl6060538 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:12:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 16:12:45 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav17.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:12:45 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:12:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2004 00:12:45.0634 (UTC) FILETIME=[C63C3A20:01C3F033] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ok I'll admit to playing the part of a dumb _______ (insert color hair I have at the moment here) often enough to have protected any intelligence I might have. Is it wrong of me? Debatable. The area I live in and my family are not able to cope with in telligent females. Even my husband shies off when I begin spouting history but he's getting better all during "Attila" he kept asking me to compare fact with the movie. For the record I love girly girl clothes and often dress kinderwhore. I milk it for all I'm worth. Helpless to the last with iron inside the velvet glove. B~ ============================= On Ebay http://snipurl.com/3csb http://my.lulu.com/kristalori Elizabethan Ladies Calendar Rolled Florentine Cap Pattern www.swapking.com/hats ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alexia S. Jacobs" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 6:40 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! > I had an old-school feminist male teacher in high school (three to seven > years ago) who believed women should not wear skirts or dresses. I went to > a school for girls, and our uniform options were a selection of > solid-colored kilts and corduroy pants that no one wore because they were > high-waisted, and tapered. A few of my classmates were discussing the need > for better pants, and he interjected that we should not be allowed to wear > skirts at all. I, who discovered a love of dresses and high heels early on > and took great satisfaction in wearing them, asked him why, and his reply > was that one could not be a serious scholar in a skirt. "So just because I > am not afraid to be girly and have fun with clothes I can't be taken > seriously?" "No." > I think the concept of femininity rubbed him the wrong way in general and he > was comfortable with women as long as he could look on them as on men. I do > not feel particularly trapped by the expectations of femininity. I do not > think I am presenting myself merely as a sexual object. Every once in a > while something reminds me of him and I fume for an hour or so. I have > never seen the Legally Blond movies, but from what I have seen of previews > it seems that the main character's problem is ditziness rather than > girliness. Sorry. Reading John Steinbeck, who also seems unnecessarily > mystified by women, for my comp lit class brought on this small rant. Has > anyone here had similar problems? > Alexia > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 19:31:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B0VQSd003506 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:31:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B0UacP025525; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:30:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B0UQl6070968; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:30:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from thrednedlestrete.com (mail02.enterhost.com [69.93.13.234]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B0UOl6070920 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:30:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:06:12 -0600 Message-Id: <200402101806.AA18939966@thrednedlestrete.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. X-Mailer: Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO AnnBWass wrote >I think it is because the weaving of true velvet is very specialized and not >done much by anyone anymore. True velvet is woven with the pile yarns going >back and forth between two base fabrics and then cut in the middle, thus giving >two velvet fabrics. But if this was the case, cotton velvet, rayon/silk etc etc would also be astronomical as it involves the same manufacturing process. Not that I have the answer, just I'm puzzled too. Lisa _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 20:04:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B14HSd003666 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:04:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B13EcP027655; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:03:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B13Bl6089890; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:03:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r09.mx.aol.com (imo-r09.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.105]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B138l6089802 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:03:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.229]) by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-240297e062ca; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:57:42 -0500 Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.b4.280561e4 (4340) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:52:23 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:52:23 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 6:02:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, mudsleidi@cox.net writes: > http://www.mini-magic.com/cgi-bin/new-mini/catalog/multitest.htm > This high priced site has "Crepe Back Heavy Silk Satin"...like we were talking about in another thread [dupioni satins?]. Anyway, the site says "Often called Charmuese". Really? The poly crepe back satin wasn't like charmuese...not even poly charmuese. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 20:16:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B1GCSd003705 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:16:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B1E0cP028368; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:14:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B1Dwl6095936; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:13:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B1Dul6095867 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:13:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.6f.41986300 (16633) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:06:45 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <6f.41986300.2d5ada25@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:06:45 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And I just now realized--a silk velvet would take, what, roughly double the silk yarns of a non-piled fabric? True of other types of velvet, too, of course, but consider that not any old silk will do--it has to be high quality. And if these yarns are pricier than other fibers to begin with? Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 21:41:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B2ffSd003894 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:41:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2dCcP003245; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:39:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2d7l6043911; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:39:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2d4l7043895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:39:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1B2jqLP025165 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:45:54 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040210183856.00b35e20@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:39:02 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [SPAM] Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! In-Reply-To: References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 07:12 PM 2/10/2004 -0500, you wrote: > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 21:51:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B2pKSd003917 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:51:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2nccP003907; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:49:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2nal6048827; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:49:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2nYl7048801 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:49:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2o28v004993 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:50:02 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1B2o2BA004991 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:50:02 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] cloak and muff Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:50:02 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <000a01c3efe9$3f2c9290$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <000a01c3efe9$3f2c9290$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402102150.02014.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 10 February 2004 10:19 am, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Hi, > Today i made a lot. Almost finished the cloak and the muff wich i am going > to use in cold Sweden next months. > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/cloakandmuff.htm > Made of black wool and fake persian goatskin. You are to be commended, Bjarne. Beautiful work, as always. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 22:02:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B32GSd004001 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:02:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2x0cP004531; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:59:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2wxl6053155; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:58:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B2wvl7053108 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:58:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1B3M5Wm014843 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:22:06 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.117] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AAA1650B002E; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:59:45 -0500 Message-ID: <002b01c3f04b$b59bb5c0$755183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002001c3eff3$7d9eb3f0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:04:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Is dupioni a weave or weight of silk? If we can have silk satin and cotton sateen... My daughter's wedding dress was a swiss cotton shantung at $90 a yard. We found it on sale at 50% off and there was fortunately just enough left on the bolt. Gorgeous! Is satin such a particular weave that it never has slubs? Does dupioni in this case denote a "changeable" color in the satin? presuming that two colors of warp and woof are what makes it 'changeable?' I have a couple of pieces in my stash that are colored in this way and the face side is slubbed and the reverse is smooth. It was sold as 'antique satin'. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 11:32 AM Subject: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? > Does anyone know what silk "dupioni satin" is? I've seen it listed on > Fabric.com > (http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/fabric-apparel---fashion-fabrics-sil > ks-silk-satins.html) and emailed them to ask, but I haven't received a > reply. > > As far as I'm concerned, satin is a very smooth weave and dupioni a very > slubby weave -- I don't understand how the two can be in the same fabric! > Any guesses? > > - Kendra > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 22:11:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B3BlSd004026 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:11:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B38KcP005192; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:08:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B38Il6056947; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:08:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B38Gl7056927 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:08:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B38i8v005078 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:08:44 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1B38iNF005076 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:08:44 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:08:44 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> In-Reply-To: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 10 February 2004 06:40 pm, Alexia S. Jacobs wrote: [snip] > I think the concept of femininity rubbed him the wrong way in general and > he was comfortable with women as long as he could look on them as on men. > I do not feel particularly trapped by the expectations of femininity. I do > not think I am presenting myself merely as a sexual object. Every once in > a while something reminds me of him and I fume for an hour or so. I have > never seen the Legally Blond movies, but from what I have seen of previews > it seems that the main character's problem is ditziness rather than > girliness. Sorry. I haven't seen the "Legally Blonde" movies either, but what I have seen of the previews convinces me that my problem with the *movies* themselves is that they deliberately confuse ditziness with girliness. (OCC clue: Reese Witherspoon as the protagonist wears screaming pink throughout both movies.) Your high school teacher, on the other hand, was confusing seriousness with drabness. It's the same error--the focus is on a different set of stereotypes, that's all. It's the same error. Men and women are *people*, and the sooner we all realize that, the sooner we may be able to figure out what "masculine" and "feminine" means instead of assuming we *know* and tyrannizing people by imposing stupid stereotypes on gender roles. Sorry for the rant; I'll shut up now. :-) -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 22:12:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B3CiSd004041 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:12:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B38ncP005240; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:08:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B38ml6057182; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:08:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.suscom.net (smtp.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B38jl6057154 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:08:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from goofy1@suscom.net) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D67791B6304 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:08:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.suscom.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with SMTP id 32300-01 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:08:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id D81231B62F9 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:08:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <05c701c3f04c$59d35a30$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:08:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at suscom.net Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have > never seen the Legally Blond movies, but from what I have seen of previews > it seems that the main character's problem is ditziness rather than > girliness. Sorry. Reading John Steinbeck, who also seems unnecessarily > mystified by women, for my comp lit class brought on this small rant. Has > anyone here had similar problems? > Alexia (singing wildly off key) "I enjoy being a girl..." Men and women are different. Plain and simple. Unfotunately, femininity has now become equated (often) with vapid, brainless, helpless females. And people like Paris and Nicole don't help any... Dianne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 22:16:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B3GVSd004055 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:16:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3ERcP005704; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:14:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3EQl6059906; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:14:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3ENl7059892 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:14:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1B3bTWm029073 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:37:33 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.117] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AE3DC2410120; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:15:09 -0500 Message-ID: <006201c3f04d$dc534aa0$755183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:19:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO For me, charmeuse is soft and very supple. I think it first began to be used for underwear in the first quarter of the 20th C, and then made its way into the design of all those slinky gowns of the '30s. Not at all the same thing as crepe backed satin. It also was used for undies (think pink and toffee) but does not have the easy flow and drape as charmeuse. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 7:52 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. > In a message dated 2/10/2004 6:02:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, > mudsleidi@cox.net writes: > > > http://www.mini-magic.com/cgi-bin/new-mini/catalog/multitest.htm > > > > This high priced site has "Crepe Back Heavy Silk Satin"...like we were > talking about in another thread [dupioni satins?]. Anyway, the site says "Often > called Charmuese". > > Really? The poly crepe back satin wasn't like charmuese...not even poly > charmuese. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 22:18:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B3I5Sd004063 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:18:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3HDcP005888; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:17:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3HCl6061271; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:17:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from jabberwock.wonderland.com (jabberwock.wonderland.com [69.17.45.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3H8l6061235 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:17:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from alice@wonderland.com) Received: from [192.168.1.5] (adsl-63-207-103-207.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.207.103.207]) by jabberwock.wonderland.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 837232F8D0 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:00:22 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Historical Costume From: Heather Meadows Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 08:06:34 -0800 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) Cc: Subject: [h-cost] History of the sari X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm looking for some pointers to books on the history of the sari - is this anyone's field and can they recommend anything? Relatively high level is fine. Thank you! .heather.meadows. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 22:24:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B3OPSd004092 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:24:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3NacP006333; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:23:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3NZl6064192; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:23:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from webwarren.com (65.18.210.ptr [65.18.210.91] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3NXl6064114 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:23:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from webwarren@earthlink.net) Received: from jessie2.webwarren.com (pcp03026555pcs.plnfld01.nj.comcast.net [68.37.232.18]) by webwarren.com (8.12.10/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1B3N1Yi030339 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:23:26 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: webwarren.com: webbwarren owned process doing -bs Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20040210220915.0740fb30@earthlink.net> X-Sender: n2kye@mail.webwarren.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:22:16 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Brenda Bell Subject: Re: Re: [h-cost] silk velvet. In-Reply-To: <200402110114.i1B1EDl7096149@net.indra.com> References: <200402110114.i1B1EDl7096149@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:06:12 -0600, "Lisa Sinervo" wrote: >But if this was the case, cotton velvet, rayon/silk etc etc would also be >astronomical as it involves the same manufacturing process. Not that I >have the answer, just I'm puzzled too. I think I might... Based on what Ann wrote, which has been echoed by other people on this list and off, in a true velvet the pile-thread goes in one direction, and in velveteen, it goes in the other (I'm thinking velvet is warp, velveteen is weft?). Someone on one of my lists observed that the difference can be told by unravelling one or two rows of weft. I believe that most of what I've seen sold as "velvet" is technically "velveteen", which sounds like a much easier fabric to weave than true velvet and much more easily adapted to today's automated fabrication methods... which is why we have material sold as "velvet" at prices that are *arguably) affordable for the average person. Brenda webwarren@earthlink.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 22:48:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B3mOSd004157 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:48:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3kUcP007794; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:46:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B3kQl6074772; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:46:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1B3kOl6074726 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:46:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCp0FmLvIVqMbup4zBKVO3d+k/D0V5JA/UA==">; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:45:31 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JM3ZW8D6; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:45:31 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:36:45 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari Message-ID: <20040210.213645.-888209.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-4,6-10,12-27 From: seamstrix@juno.com Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO As far as I know, there is actually very little in the way of scholarship regarding saris. My favorite book on the subject is "Saris: An Illustrated Guide to the Indian Art of Draping" by Chantal Boulanger ISBN 0-966149601-0 I love wearing saris tho it can look a bit strange with my blonde hair, pale skin and grey eyes, but I do it anyway! Karen On Sun, 8 Feb 2004 08:06:34 -0800 Heather Meadows writes: > I'm looking for some pointers to books on the history of the sari - > is > this anyone's field and can they recommend anything? Relatively > high > level is fine. > > Thank you! > > .heather.meadows. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 23:25:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B4P3Sd004481 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:25:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B4LFcP010301; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:21:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B4LDl6090855; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:21:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav19.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.123]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B4LAl6090782 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:21:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:21:05 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav19.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 04:21:05 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002001c3eff3$7d9eb3f0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <002b01c3f04b$b59bb5c0$755183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:22:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2004 04:21:05.0685 (UTC) FILETIME=[775B9450:01C3F056] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Is dupioni a weave or weight of silk? It's a weave. Actually, dupioni is made from... I believe it's something like cocoons that have fused together, or something similar, so it produces slubs. Dupioni is, AFAIK, always the same weight, i.e. pretty light and crunchy, and shiny and slubby. Very easy to recognize. > Is satin such a particular weave that it never has slubs? I think you have to select the right cocoon for your silk to have slubs. It is now a desirable quality. But "real" silk doesn't have slubs. The silk thread comes off the cocoon and is spun in a smooth thread, woven in a smooth and unslubby fabric. It's not so much that satin is a particular weave. It's that the silk used to make duppioni is especially selected because it's slubby. Normal silk wouldn't be slubby. > Does dupioni in > this case denote a "changeable" color in the satin? Dupioni is usually changeable, meaning the warp and weft threads are different colors. I've seen some dupioni that's not changeable, but it's often seen only in white or black. Satin, I think, is usually not changeable. At least the ones I've seen (I haven't seen a great many of them :-) But I think the term "dupioni" denotes the slubs, not the changeable quality. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 10 23:52:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B4qZSd004670 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:52:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B4ogcP012055; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:50:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B4obl6004428; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:50:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r06.mx.aol.com (imo-r06.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B4oal6004386 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:50:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Cheryldee@aol.com) Received: from Cheryldee@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.b4.2807426e (4184) for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:45:19 -0500 (EST) From: Cheryldee@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:45:19 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5006 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 8:17:31 PM Mountain Standard Time, alice@wonderland.com writes: I'm looking for some pointers to books on the history of the sari - is this anyone's field and can they recommend anything? Relatively high level is fine. I have read in a number of books that the origination of the sari dates back to the conquest of India by Alexander the Great and that the sari is a loose interpretation of Greek dress. Cheryl _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 00:22:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B5MCSd004771 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:22:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B5IhcP013728; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:18:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B5Iel6017062; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:18:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B5Idl6017018 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 22:18:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lizyoung@fenris.net) Received: from fenris.net (c-24-7-132-137.client.comcast.net[24.7.132.137]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <2004021105132701300fmbrve>; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 05:13:27 +0000 Message-ID: <4029B9F8.8000708@fenris.net> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:13:28 -0800 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Cheryldee@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 2/10/2004 8:17:31 PM Mountain Standard Time, >alice@wonderland.com writes: >I'm looking for some pointers to books on the history of the sari - is >this anyone's field and can they recommend anything? Relatively high >level is fine. >I have read in a number of books that the origination of the sari dates back >to the conquest of India by Alexander the Great and that the sari is a loose >interpretation of Greek dress. > > > Sounds interesting. Do you recall offhand which books these were? liz young _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 01:03:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B63dSd004866 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 01:03:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B61vcP015794; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:01:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B61sl6035889; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:01:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp808.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp808.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.187]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1B61ql6035869 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:01:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.116.253.13 with login) by smtp808.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2004 05:55:12 -0000 Message-ID: <001f01c3f063$9c594330$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 21:55:05 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would take a look at: _The sari: styles, patterns, history, techniques_ by Linda Lynton. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0810944618/qid=1076478839/sr=1 -1/ref=sr_1_1/103-3518816-8715833?v=glance&s=books (We have it at work -- let me know if you want me to check it out so you can look through it before you decide to buy it!) - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 02:23:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B7NoSd024230 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 02:23:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7LrcP019361; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:21:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7Lql6067613; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:21:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7Kwl6067285 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:20:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-50.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.50]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7K4bG011478 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:20:05 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040210230735.05bd84b0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:20:50 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! In-Reply-To: References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >For the record I love girly >girl clothes and often dress kinderwhore. I milk it for all I'm worth. >Helpless to the last with iron inside the velvet glove. I have no problem with feminine, with skirts, even with women getting into being sexy. I find that I do have a problem with 'girly' and all that other ruffly pink stuff when worn by grown women, because I equate it with extreme youth. Sorry. I just can't take that costume seriously on anyone over about age 5, and have to ignore it, when talking to an over-5 female wearing it, in order to take her seriously. I have the same reaction to cutesy poo teddy bears and dollies, and geese wearing handkerchiefs around their necks. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 02:25:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B7OxSd025172 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 02:25:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7L8cP019311; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:21:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7L0l6067309; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:21:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7Kvl6067278 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:20:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-50.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.50]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7K4bE011478 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:20:04 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040210230223.05bdac70@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:04:06 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20040210123324.05367d10@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Kayta, you may have seen the families during Dicken's Fair in the area near >the Cow Palace, where there's a church, a community center and several >stores for the Samoan community in San Francisco. Their church is the same side of the street as the Cow Palace, between it and the McDonalds. Obligatory costume content - some of these large Samoan men wear brightly coloured floral sarongs. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 02:31:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1B7VESd029332 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 02:31:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7UNcP019720; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:30:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7UMl6070836; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:30:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.compassnet.com.au [203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1B7UHl7070718 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 00:30:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from glendar@compassnet.com.au) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.141]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.10/linuxconf) with SMTP id i1B7bTLO022309 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:37:30 +1100 Message-ID: <036a01c3f070$fc6840c0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com><001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <4.3.1.2.20040210230735.05bd84b0@mail.frys.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:30:52 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Wool shampoo X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I thought those of you that use Horse shampoo for washing their woolens and silks may find this amusing. A friend of ours has a couple of horses. What does she use to wash them? A locally available PH-Neutral Wool wash! Does well for their dog too. Makes sense to me. Glenda. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 07:31:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BCVXSd032273 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:31:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BCSGcP029752; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 05:28:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BCSCl6075734; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 05:28:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp2.suscom.net (smtp.suscom.net [64.78.83.231]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BCS9l6075723 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 05:28:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from goofy1@suscom.net) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88101484BD for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:11:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp2.suscom.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp2 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with SMTP id 30410-01 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:11:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 96CBB484C9 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:11:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <007001c3f098$28ee31a0$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com><001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <4.3.1.2.20040210230735.05bd84b0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:11:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at suscom.net Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have the same reaction to > cutesy poo teddy bears and dollies, and geese wearing handkerchiefs around > their necks. gakk...can't stand teddy bears and dollies. My MIL has gotten the idea nicely--her last two gifts for me were a charming little woodland elf and a dragon. Dianne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 08:49:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BDn4Sd032617 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:49:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BDjbcP003603; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 06:45:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BDjYl6005104; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 06:45:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BDjVl6005066 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 06:45:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA01556 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:14:50 -0600 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:14:50 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool shampoo In-Reply-To: <036a01c3f070$fc6840c0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wed, 11 Feb 2004, Glenda Robinson wrote: > A friend of ours has a couple of horses. What does she use to wash > them? A locally available PH-Neutral Wool wash! Does well for their > dog too. When I was a reporter for a newspaper in Iowa, I learned that the local 4-H kids washed their competition-bound sheep in Woolite. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 09:47:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BElmSd000402 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:47:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEiUcP007302; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:44:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEiSl6031889; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:44:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEiPl6031864 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:44:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a257.in-tch.com [66.62.107.57]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1BEM0h00692 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:22:01 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <402A4083.6000704@in-tch.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:47:31 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> In-Reply-To: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO With Steinbeck? or with men? Only in reverse, as there's very, very little about my personality or clothing choices that's "girly" or traditionally "feminine". And I get tired unto death, sometimes, for being taken as some kind of d@mn neutered "thing" because I don't give off the right girly signals. I'd love to be part of a culture in which men and women could adorn their bodies (or not) in whatever way they chose, and not have so many social cues and assumptions tacked onto appearance.... When reenacting (to bring this back on topic), I wear gender-appropriate clothing for the time period, rather than go through all of the "I'm a woman passing as a man for X weird reasons" silliness I've seen friends try (which is NOT the same as the men and women I've seen successfully *pass* as the opposite gender). Given my personal (physical) shape, there's no way I could look anything *but* female! I have finally, though, stopped trying to wear any of the lovely, impractical stuff I'd only get dirty or ruin....I could never wear any of the beautiful stuff Bjarne makes, for instance, whether it had skirts or pants! --sue, with a rant of her own.... Alexia S. Jacobs wrote: Has > anyone here had similar problems? > Alexia> _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 09:49:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BEnVSd000419 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:49:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEl8cP007501; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:47:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEl7l6033183; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:47:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEl5l6033163 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:47:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a257.in-tch.com [66.62.107.57]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1BEOfh02274 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:24:41 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <402A4123.1090008@in-tch.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:50:11 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Wool shampoo References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This former 4-H kid used to wash her competition chickens in a mild solution of shampoo with a bit of blueing in it (white chickens). --sue Robin Netherton wrote: > On Wed, 11 Feb 2004, Glenda Robinson wrote: > > >>A friend of ours has a couple of horses. What does she use to wash >>them? A locally available PH-Neutral Wool wash! Does well for their >>dog too. > > > When I was a reporter for a newspaper in Iowa, I learned that the local > 4-H kids washed their competition-bound sheep in Woolite. > > --Robin > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 09:52:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BEqaSd000445 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:52:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEoGcP007667; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:50:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEoFl6034851; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:50:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r03.mx.aol.com (imo-r03.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BEoCl6034748 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:50:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Cheryldee@aol.com) Received: from Cheryldee@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.1ce.1965b1ad (4568) for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:44:57 -0500 (EST) From: Cheryldee@aol.com Message-ID: <1ce.1965b1ad.2d5b99e9@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:44:57 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5006 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 10:19:15 PM Mountain Standard Time, lizyoung@fenris.net writes: Sounds interesting. Do you recall offhand which books these were? Sorry (sari?) I don't. And it may very well may not be true, like much of the costume mythology presented as fact in costume history books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 10:06:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BF60Sd000560 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:06:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BF2kcP008333; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:02:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BF2jl6041262; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:02:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m20.mx.aol.com (imo-m20.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BF2hl6041197 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:02:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.7c.4202ead7 (4362) for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:57:26 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <7c.4202ead7.2d5b9cd6@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:57:26 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/10/2004 10:47:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, seamstrix@juno.com writes: > As far as I know, there is actually very little in the way of scholarship > regarding saris. My favorite book on the subject is "Saris: An > Illustrated Guide to the Indian Art of Draping" by Chantal Boulanger > ISBN 0-966149601-0 > How about cholis? I want a traditional choli pattern. [not the one on the Web with the hanging pockets and the princess seams that everyone points me to....even if it is a traditional form] I want a pattern that is like what I see in the films "The Mahabharata" and "Kama Sutra". It appears to have no darts or shaping over the bust. In fact, it looks like the pattern pieces are all squares and rectangles. They are very tight fitting. I can't figure out how they close [though you rarely see the back]. Is there a choli [or perhaps a choli-like garment with another name] that takes this form? And some of the men's clothes look great. Those, again, square cut robes with triangular pieces at the sides for fullness....like a medieval tunic. And large unstructured things, like a West African Bou-bou. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 10:08:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BF84Sd000573 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:08:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BF5WcP008732; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:05:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BF5Ul6042948; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:05:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m20.mx.aol.com (imo-m20.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BF5Rl6042891 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:05:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.138.2af6f8ec (4362) for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:05:13 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <138.2af6f8ec.2d5b9ea9@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:05:13 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/11/2004 7:29:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, goofy1@suscom.net writes: > her last two gifts for me were a charming little woodland elf and a > dragon. > LOL...finally! Some grown up gifts! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 10:16:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BFGHSd000617 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:16:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BFCecP009357; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:12:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BFCdl6047021; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:12:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1BFCbl6046959 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:12:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCg84hS0jMAjSfh5UM9zO8DxX3KLVLM9T9w==">; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:11:55 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JM4873HE; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:11:55 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:01:58 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari Message-ID: <20040211.090158.-154929021.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 3,8-25 From: seamstrix@juno.com Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO According to Chantal Boulanger, the unsewn sari is more typical of the southern parts of India rather than the sewn chalwar/kameez style typical of the northern parts of India. I believe that Alexander was in the north of India rather than the south.....and besides, wasn't he Macedonian? Apparently, there is a religious component to the wearing of uncut cloth. In some aspect of the Hindu faith (or so I'm told) it is regarded as insulting to the cloth to cut and sew it, so it is worn (traditionally) by wrapping, tucking, and tying. Also there are a myriad of ethnic styles to wearing the sari for women as well as several male styles. Karen On Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:44:57 EST Cheryldee@aol.com writes: > In a message dated 2/10/2004 10:19:15 PM Mountain Standard Time, > lizyoung@fenris.net writes: > Sounds interesting. Do you recall offhand which books these were? > Sorry (sari?) I don't. And it may very well may not be true, like > much of > the costume mythology presented as fact in costume history books. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 10:24:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BFOQSd000674 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:24:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BFMScP010228; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:22:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BFMKl6052711; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:22:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from outbound1.mail.tds.net (outbound1.mail.tds.net [216.170.230.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BFMGl6052677 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:22:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from htackett@tds.net) Received: from death (smga1dsl-a801.ga.tds.net [216.170.255.34]) by outbound1.mail.tds.net (8.12.10/8.12.3) with SMTP id i1BFMBH9010848 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:22:14 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006301c3f0b2$d4677220$0202a8c0@death> From: "Harold and Dinah Tackett" To: "Historical Costume" References: <7c.4202ead7.2d5b9cd6@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:22:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO A lot of these questions have been a dressed on the Yahoo e-group SCA_India http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA_India/?yguid=4711870 There are several very knowledgeable people on the list who are very helpful in finding some of the answers. Dinah ----- Original Message ----- From: > In a message dated 2/10/2004 10:47:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, > seamstrix@juno.com writes: > > > As far as I know, there is actually very little in the way of scholarship > > regarding saris. My favorite book on the subject is "Saris: An > > Illustrated Guide to the Indian Art of Draping" by Chantal Boulanger > > ISBN 0-966149601-0 > > > > How about cholis? I want a traditional choli pattern. [not the one on the Web > with the hanging pockets and the princess seams that everyone points me > to....even if it is a traditional form] I want a pattern that is like what I see in > the films "The Mahabharata" and "Kama Sutra". It appears to have no darts or > shaping over the bust. In fact, it looks like the pattern pieces are all > squares and rectangles. They are very tight fitting. I can't figure out how they > close [though you rarely see the back]. Is there a choli [or perhaps a > choli-like garment with another name] that takes this form? > > And some of the men's clothes look great. Those, again, square cut robes with > triangular pieces at the sides for fullness....like a medieval tunic. And > large unstructured things, like a West African Bou-bou. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 10:28:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BFS2Sd000685 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:28:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BFPacP010549; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:25:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BFPZl6054760; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:25:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav61.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.196]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BFPXl6054695 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 08:25:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 07:08:13 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav61.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:08:12 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <7c.4202ead7.2d5b9cd6@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:08:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2004 15:08:13.0048 (UTC) FILETIME=[DE44FF80:01C3F0B0] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I know FolkWear makes a pretty decent choli pattern. And IIRC so does Attira. ----- Original Message ----- > How about cholis? I want a traditional choli pattern. [not the one on the Web > with the hanging pockets and the princess seams that everyone points me > to....even if it is a traditional form] I want a pattern that is like what I see in > the films "The Mahabharata" and "Kama Sutra". It appears to have no darts or > shaping over the bust. In fact, it looks like the pattern pieces are all > squares and rectangles. They are very tight fitting. I can't figure out how they > close [though you rarely see the back]. Is there a choli [or perhaps a > choli-like garment with another name] that takes this form? > > And some of the men's clothes look great. Those, again, square cut robes with > triangular pieces at the sides for fullness....like a medieval tunic. And > large unstructured things, like a West African Bou-bou. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 12:13:06 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BHD5Sd001123 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:13:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BHCJcP021050; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:12:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BHCAl6030478; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:12:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BHC6l6030361 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:12:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.8) with ESMTP id 698369 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:11:59 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 09:11:59 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: Skirting the issue From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040210230223.05bdac70@mail.frys.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On 2/10/04 11:04 PM, "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" wrote: > >> Kayta, you may have seen the families during Dicken's Fair in the area near >> the Cow Palace, where there's a church, a community center and several >> stores for the Samoan community in San Francisco. > > Their church is the same side of the street as the Cow Palace, between it > and the McDonalds. > > Obligatory costume content - some of these large Samoan men wear brightly > coloured floral sarongs. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows And suit jackets with their brightly colored floral sarongs. And they look regal - tall, solid, shoulders back and straight. They always make me remember to stand up straight for a couple of hours at least whenever I see them. The women are even more regal and more brightly dressed, and never garishly. LynnD _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 12:29:06 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BHT5Sd001179 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:29:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BHSAcP023016; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:28:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BHS9l6043237; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:28:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BHQ3l6041530 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:26:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.128.239.163] (helo=dan) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AqsI3-00078t-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 11:12:23 +0000 Message-ID: <005e01c3f090$299fc800$a3ef8051@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002001c3eff3$7d9eb3f0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 11:14:05 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kendra wrote on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 4:32 PM, re Silk dupioni satin? > Does anyone know what silk "dupioni satin" is? I've seen it listed on > Fabric.com > (http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/fabric-apparel---fashion-fabri cs-sil > ks-silk-satins.html) and emailed them to ask, but I haven't received a > reply. I haven't the foggiest about the technicalities, but the dupioni satin which Liberty's used to sell, before they abandoned most dressmaking fabrics, looked typical dupion silk on one side and typical satin silk on the other. So it does exist... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 15:32:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BKWwSd001901 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:32:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BKUncP013478; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:30:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BKUgl6095614; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:30:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BKUcl6095479 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:30:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f2d.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.45]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 7F765262967 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 21:30:29 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <001501c3f0dd$e9f852f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 21:30:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] men in skirts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1BKWwSd001901 Status: RO I could never wear any of the beautiful stuff Bjarne makes, for instance, whether it had skirts or pants! --sue, with a rant of her own.... Why thankyou Sue, but are you absolutely sure of that? That i could not do anything for you to look good in? Just kidding! In the swedish society of Gustafs Skĺl, there are some women who cross dresses in mens costumes. And they are very very good. It took me quite some time, before i found out of that. They looks so good! There also should be some men who cross dresses into womens dress, but i have not seen any of them yeat. There would be a problem with their wide shoulders though! Bjarne, who only cross dresses into another time.......... Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 15:41:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BKfYSd001919 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:41:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BKbMcP014200; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:37:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BKbJl6000826; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:37:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r06.mx.aol.com (imo-r06.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.102]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BKbHl6000742 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:37:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from PallasAMK@aol.com) Received: from PallasAMK@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.b7.3c57d81d (15887) for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:31:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from aol.com (mow-d16.webmail.aol.com [205.188.139.132]) by air-id08.mx.aol.com (v97.18) with ESMTP id MAILINID82-3e0f402a9138aa; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:31:52 -0500 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:31:52 -0500 From: PallasAMK@aol.com To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <15F9C3DA.480DA9BC.02708BA2@aol.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 X-AOL-IP: 63.251.31.10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: A Guy in a Sarong... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Just as an aside, in Samoa, (and in Papua NG, I think) a men's "sarong" is called a lavalava. And although "sarong" is used generically here in the states to refer to both the length of fabric as well as the wrapped garments, when one refers to a sarong in Samoan context, it is the garment worn by women. There are several other words for the male "sarong," too, BTW, depending on where you are. A guy in a sarong (unless he was doing drag), with or without a suit jacket, would be remarkable, indeed. Pallas _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 16:52:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BLqASd002186 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:52:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BLp2cP021987; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:51:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BLovl6057077; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:50:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from incoming.SIGENETICS.com ([209.172.110.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BLosl6056955 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:50:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sbuchler@silicongenetics.com) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 13:50:48 -0800 Message-ID: <0D3431E0FD777844A4ED9507E4D698D90D266C@incoming.sigenetics.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 97 Thread-Index: AcPwmwhGAe7nWqC6RpalU6H2VbV3wQAQgvmQ From: "Sunny Buchler" To: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1BLosl6056955 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Regency embroidery X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Does anyone know of any research done on French or English embroidery circa 1795-1820 (preferably on women's clothing)? I've been doing research for a set of regency outfits, and in the c.1805 era embroidery on women's clothes seems quite fashionable, and has (from my observation) standard placement on the dresses. However, I can't seem to find much on the actual designs/stitches/materials/patterns used in the embroidery. I'm especially interested in the patterns used -- some of the fashion books (the new Kyoto book, _Fashion_ and also _Fashion in the Age of Napoleon_) show some nice close-ups of embroidery on dresses, but they don't show enough to be able to duplicate the design, 'cause you can't see the whole design clearly while the dress is being worn... Websites, books, articles -- any suggestions would be helpful! Thanks! -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 17:23:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BMNoSd002329 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:23:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BMN3cP024872; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:23:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BMLZl6080419; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:21:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BMLLl6080159 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:21:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fa8.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.168]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 9FFAD5EE20F for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 23:21:11 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000d01c3f0ed$6249e070$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 23:21:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] regency embroidery X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1BMNoSd002329 Status: RO Hi Sunny, I have done quite a lot of research on 18th century embroidery for some years now, and you will find, that it is very difficult to find patterns. There are some few patternbooks from regency period. A book i have had a lot of use of is: Charlotte Paludan & Lone de Hemmer Egeberg: 98 Pattern books, for embroidery, lace and knitting. It is a book that tells you all about the Museum of Decorative Arts in Copenhagen and their Collektion of Pattern Books. Try to ask some of the larger museums with collektions if they have some old patterns. Some books are: Grosch, Henrik August. Haandbog Til Brodering Og Tegning med 26 illustrations. Copenhagen 1797 Another: Netto, Johann Friedrich 24 prints with embroidery Leipzig 1798 Another: Hirschmann, C.A Die junge Stickerinn. Ein Taschenbuch für Frauenzimmer zur Uebun im Sticken und Malen. Berlin : Friedrich Maurer, 1802 Another: Silling, Karl : Grand Magazin des plus nouveaux dessins francois De Broderie dessinés par Charles Silling, Karl Sillings Grosses Magazin für Stickerei. Leipzig: Industrie-Comptoir 1808 book 1-6 In your research try also to find some textile artists, like those who designed wowen fabrics for costume. I have found some embroidery patterns of Anna Maria Garthwaite who designed a lot of Spitalfields Silks. In some books with ornament, you also could be lucky to find some designer names, wich has made embroidery patterns. If you would email me with your private email address, i could give you some of my regency patterns wich i took at the museum. But you must promise me, not to use them in public, like take them onto a webpage or use in any public domain. They are from an old danish pattern book from 1795. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 17:26:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BMQ7Sd002359 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:26:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BMPOcP025096; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:25:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BMPMl6083235; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:25:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BMPFl6083140 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:25:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-123.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.123]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BMOJbE022690 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:24:20 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040211131253.05213470@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 14:08:32 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! In-Reply-To: <402A4083.6000704@in-tch.com> References: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >When reenacting (to bring this back on topic), I wear gender-appropriate >clothing for the time period, rather than go through all of the "I'm a >woman passing as a man for X weird reasons" silliness I've seen friends >try (which is NOT the same as the men and women I've seen successfully >*pass* as the opposite gender). Given my personal (physical) shape, >there's no way I could look anything *but* female! My Ren. Faire male character had to be short and paunchy for me to pass at all (our group was short on men). I looked thru all the possible Ren. costumes I could put a male character in, then decided on German because I could put him in long puffy German pluderhosen to best disguise the wrong curves in my bone structure. His fake moustache, his 'body shaper, and the fact that I speak in the tenor range not the soprano one, plus the fact that the group members treat him like one of the guys, all help. I am now contemplating a male character for my 18th century maritime group, for water safety reasons. If one of us rowers accidentally falls into the San Francisco Bay (off a rowboat maybe 20' long), it would be safer if we were wearing breeches, shirt, and sleeveless waistcoat than if we were wearing chemise, stays (or even jumps), and the right number of petticoats. So it was decided that all the rowers should be men of some kind. The subject of male cross dressing immediately came up, this being Northern CA, and we decided that of course our male members may wear women's clothes on dry land if they choose to. >I have finally, though, stopped trying to wear any of the lovely, >impractical stuff I'd only get dirty or ruin.... I too gave up on the more impractical historical woman-clothes. It's relatively easy for someone my age. I go for lots of period detailing rather than a super-fashionable, or super-feminine, look. One woman in our 18th century group only does male personae when she is around historical ships, because she is one of the folks who climb the rigging to do whatever they need to do up there. I stand on the deck in my skirt and answer questions from visitors (I'm confident I won't fall off a 256.5' ship tied to a pier). >I could never wear any of the beautiful stuff Bjarne makes, for instance, >whether it had skirts or pants! I habitually wear t-shirt and jeans, in preference to more the fragile kind of women's clothes, because I am hard on clothes, and for the most part mens' clothes are built stronger (double seams, more practical material, utilitarian pockets, repairable shoes, etc.). My mundane dresses are all simple in cut and easy to clean and, except for the acute lack of pockets, I actually prefer long flowing skirts to my usual jeans. My Sweetie wears only Levis brand jeans because he says that company makes the strongest pockets. I tend to put things in my pockets and not carry a purse, and I pretty much agree with him about Levis' pockets. >--sue, with a rant of her own.... CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 18:52:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BNqTSd003008 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:52:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BNoXcP002945; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:50:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BNoVl6042629; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:50:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mx6.wvu.edu (mx6.wvu.edu [157.182.140.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BNo4l6042192 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:50:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from khoover@wvu.edu) Received: from WVUGW01.wvu.edu (wvugw01.wvu.edu [157.182.215.110]) by mx6.wvu.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BNnuid000616 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:49:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from khoover@wvu.edu) Received: from WVUDOM1-MTA by WVUGW01.wvu.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:49:56 -0500 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:49:47 -0500 From: "Kathy Hoover" To: Subject: [H-Cost] Early 20th century photos of Russian Empire Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This may be old news, because this exhibit was presented in the spring and summer of 2001, but for anyone doing costumes and personas from areas that made up the Russian Empire, the Library of Congress has a great site. The Empire That Was Russia is part of the collection of photos by Sergei Mikhailovich Prokudin-Gorskii, taken to survey the Russian Empire in 1909-1912 and 1915. You can search by subject at: http://lcweb2.loc.gov/pp/prokhtml/proksubjindex1.html or begin at the beginning: http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/empire I couldn't find the main thing I was looking for, though, which is more pictures of that style of Ukrainian architecture with the slope-y, scoopy roofs. If anyone knows of any good websites or books, I'd appreciate the info. Thanks, Kathy Hoover _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 18:52:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1BNqrSd003011 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:52:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BNp1cP002983; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:51:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BNp0l6042923; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:51:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1BNoOl6042449 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 16:50:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lizyoung@fenris.net) Received: from fenris.net (c-24-7-132-137.client.comcast.net[24.7.132.137]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with ESMTP id <2004021123451101500cdotle>; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 23:45:11 +0000 Message-ID: <402ABE8A.20400@fenris.net> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:45:14 -0800 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! References: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <4.3.1.2.20040211131253.05213470@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040211131253.05213470@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > I habitually wear t-shirt and jeans, in preference to more the fragile > kind of women's clothes, because I am hard on clothes, and for the > most part mens' clothes are built stronger (double seams, more > practical material, utilitarian pockets, repairable shoes, etc.). My > mundane dresses are all simple in cut and easy to clean and, except > for the acute lack of pockets, I actually prefer long flowing skirts > to my usual jeans. My Sweetie wears only Levis brand jeans because he > says that company makes the strongest pockets. I tend to put things > in my pockets and not carry a purse, and I pretty much agree with him > about Levis' pockets. I like long flowing skirts also, and have thought about slits and hanging pockets to solve the no-pockets problem, and to avoid having one swaying, lumpy bit in the nice flowing skirt, as would happen w/ a regular pocket and all the stuff I try to cram into it. flat waistband and interior buttons, holes on the top of the pockets? still in the thinking-about-it stages liz young _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 20:37:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C1baSd003343 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:37:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C1ZbcP011284; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:35:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C1ZS4J000578; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:35:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C1ZN4J000530 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:35:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.147] (pm5-147.eos.net [205.133.149.147]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C1ZKCn021859 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:35:20 -0500 (EST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:34:50 -0500 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200402110114.i1B1EFl7096187@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Scanned-By: Scanned by EOS.Net Mailserver running MimeDefang and SPAMAssassin Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: smart women X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I go to school at a Catholic seminary. Most of my teachers are priests, and many of my classmates are too. They don't have any trouble working with feminine-looking women. The teachers expect me to get my theology right just like the men! I think engineers may have more trouble with the concept. Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 21:01:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C21ZSd003406 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 21:01:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C1wKcP012750; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:58:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C1wH4J011406; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:58:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fed1mtao04.cox.net (fed1mtao04.cox.net [68.6.19.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C1wE4J011332 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:58:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mudsleidi@cox.net) Received: from smtp.west.cox.net ([172.18.180.53]) by fed1mtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.05 201-253-122-130-105-20030824) with SMTP id <20040212015808.YMUC29509.fed1mtao04.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:58:08 -0500 From: To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:58:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20040212015808.YMUC29509.fed1mtao04.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I like long flowing skirts also, and have thought about >slits and hanging pockets to solve the no-pockets problem, >and to avoid having one swaying, lumpy bit in the nice >flowing skirt, as would happen w/ a regular pocket and all >the stuff I try to cram into it. >flat waistband and interior buttons, holes on the top of >the pockets? >still in the thinking-about-it stages >liz young Liz, For what it's worth, aprons are 'in' now! Cheers, Heidi F. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 21:26:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C2QCSd003520 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 21:26:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C2POcP014635; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:25:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C2PM4J023664; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:25:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C2PJ4J023581 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:25:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3EE9F008A; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:24:46 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3EA81B0150; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:24:42 -0600 Message-ID: <009501c3f10f$6b8026f0$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 21:25:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] For those with a big purse X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1C2QCSd003520 Status: RO Go look at this auction on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3585180652&category=29220 Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 21:50:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C2oZSd003618 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 21:50:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C2lLcP015859; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:47:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C2lF4J033340; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:47:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav60.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.195]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C2lC4J033276 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 19:47:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 18:29:50 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav60.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 02:29:49 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009501c3f10f$6b8026f0$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] For those with a big purse Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 21:30:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2004 02:29:50.0102 (UTC) FILETIME=[16D03360:01C3F110] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And that's on clearance folks!! Bah. I feel so broke now. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2004 9:25 PM Subject: [h-cost] For those with a big purse Go look at this auction on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3585180652&category=29220 Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 11 22:23:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C3NYSd003786 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 22:23:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C3LLcP017653; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:21:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C3LK4J047598; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:21:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C3LH4K047581 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:21:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C3Ln8v009181 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 22:21:49 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1C3Ln3C009179 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 22:21:49 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] History of the sari Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 22:21:49 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402112221.49143.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sunday 08 February 2004 11:06 am, Heather Meadows wrote: > I'm looking for some pointers to books on the history of the sari - is > this anyone's field and can they recommend anything? Relatively high > level is fine. I'd be delighted. Someone has already given you the full cite and ISBN for Chantal Boulanger's book, so I don't have to. I will tell you that the easiest way to get it is to buy it from her directly. The price is $30 US. It's worth the price even though it's spiral bound with wire, because it has information about regional draping styles, much of which she collected by traveling through India and personally asking sari wearers (so the information really can't be found anywhere else). You can contact her through this web site: http://www.idcw.org.uk/IDC.html This is part of the Institute for Draped Clothes site, which she founded. It's a fun site to explore, and includes draped garments of all kinds, not just the sari. Speaking of "The SARI," someone also mentioned Lynda Linton's book. Again, like Boulanger's book, this is more a cataloging of "traditional" sari styles by region, rather than a history per se (though there is a bit of historical detail in it). Unlike Boulanger's book, it focuses not on how saris are draped, but on what the cloth itself looks like. It is chock full of gorgeous color photos. Full citation info: Lynda Linton. The Sari: Styles-Patterns-History-Techniques. Harry N. Abrams, Inc., Publishers 1995. ISBN 0-8109-4461-8. (This is the ISBN for my hard-cover edition; I have since seen a softcover edition, though I don't have an ISBN for it). Two other books you will find interesting (assuming you can lay your hands on copies) are: Charles Fabri. Indian Dress. Sangam Books Limited, 1994. ISBN 0 86311 507 1. Roshen Alkazi. Ancient Indian Costume. National Book Trust, 1st ed. 1st reprint 1998. ISBN 81-237-1687-7 Both of these books are small paperbacks. The Fabri book is a timeline of Indian costume from about 150 B.C.E. to 1820 C.E.; the Alkazi book does the same sort of thing but covers less ground (321 B.C.E. to mid-8th century C.E.). Both are illustrated exclusively with line drawings Both have bibliographies that draw heavily from books on Indian art and sculpture. I bought Fabri's book in London during a 1995 visit. I obtained the Alkazi book, which I understand to be a condensation of a larger work, from this web site some years ago: http://www.indiaclub.com/shop/home.asp Good luck and happy hunting! -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 01:03:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C63OSd004353 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 01:03:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C61UcP025782; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 23:01:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C61N4J014433; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 23:01:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C61L4J014421 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 23:01:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hrjones@socrates.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1C61KFX024630 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 22:01:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from [136.152.197.136] (tnt-1-200.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.197.136]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C6181C024402 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2004 22:01:19 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-mailer: Eudora Pro 5.1r Macintosh Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 20:17:00 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:08 PM -0500 2/10/04, Catherine Olanich Raymond wrote: >On Tuesday 10 February 2004 06:40 pm, Alexia S. Jacobs wrote: >[snip] >> I think the concept of femininity rubbed him the wrong way in general and >> he was comfortable with women as long as he could look on them as on men. >> I do not feel particularly trapped by the expectations of femininity. I do >> not think I am presenting myself merely as a sexual object. Every once in >> a while something reminds me of him and I fume for an hour or so. I have >> never seen the Legally Blond movies, but from what I have seen of previews >> it seems that the main character's problem is ditziness rather than >> girliness. Sorry. > >I haven't seen the "Legally Blonde" movies either, but what I have seen of the >previews convinces me that my problem with the *movies* themselves is that >they deliberately confuse ditziness with girliness. (OCC clue: Reese >Witherspoon as the protagonist wears screaming pink throughout both movies.) >Your high school teacher, on the other hand, was confusing seriousness with >drabness. It's the same error--the focus is on a different set of >stereotypes, that's all. (Since "blonde" costume is a big part of the movies, I don't feel this is _entirely_ off topic to follow up on ....) If you ever have an evening to kill and a Legally Blonde video at hand, you might be pleasantly surprised. (I was.) The movies are -- in a rather twisted way -- very much about _not_ judging people's abilities or intelligence by appearance or style. The protagonist is ditzy, yes, (and girly) but she succeeds because she's smart (both book-smart and people-smart), holds to her principles, and never gives up. I was really startled to find myself thoroughly enjoying them -- radical femininst that I am. Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 03:13:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C8DkSd030378 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:13:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C8BqcP001878; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 01:11:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C8Bn4J064107; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 01:11:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C8Bm4J064096 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 01:11:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-123.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.123]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C8ArbG012382 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:10:54 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040212000936.051f2930@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:11:39 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! In-Reply-To: References: <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>I haven't seen the "Legally Blonde" movies either, but what I have seen >>of the >>previews convinces me that my problem with the *movies* themselves is that >>they deliberately confuse ditziness with girliness. (OCC clue: Reese >>Witherspoon as the protagonist wears screaming pink throughout both movies.) >>Your high school teacher, on the other hand, was confusing seriousness with >>drabness. It's the same error--the focus is on a different set of >>stereotypes, that's all. > >(Since "blonde" costume is a big part of the movies, I don't feel this is >_entirely_ off topic to follow up on ....) > >If you ever have an evening to kill and a Legally Blonde video at hand, >you might be pleasantly surprised. (I was.) The movies are -- in a >rather twisted way -- very much about _not_ judging people's abilities or >intelligence by appearance or style. The protagonist is ditzy, yes, (and >girly) but she succeeds because she's smart (both book-smart and >people-smart), holds to her principles, and never gives up. I was really >startled to find myself thoroughly enjoying them -- radical femininst that >I am. I've seen it too - ditto the sentiment above. Obligatory costume content: the heroine wears pink a lot (shudder). CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 04:43:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1C9hbSd031100 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 04:43:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C9djcP004631; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 02:39:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C9de4J093603; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 02:39:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1C9db4J093587 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 02:39:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net (heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.189]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1C8QsI03254 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:26:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-67.74.227.146.dial1.baltimore1.level3.net ([67.74.227.146] helo=HELENPINTO) by heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1ArCBQ-00008p-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:26:53 -0800 Message-ID: <01d701c3f141$f6b08e40$92e34a43@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009501c3f10f$6b8026f0$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] For those with a big purse Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:26:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9effb09dfaae18214f7e508ef97f36c6ef3350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks for the link. I'm mostly a bookbinder these days, so any historical book is worth looking at, especially with as many pictures as this one. -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 05:03:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CA3pSd031218 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 05:03:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CA0ccP005109; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:00:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CA0b4J001185; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:00:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CA0X4J001155 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:00:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net (heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.189]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1C8ArI25553 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:10:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-67.74.227.146.dial1.baltimore1.level3.net ([67.74.227.146] helo=HELENPINTO) by heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1ArBvv-00066y-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:10:52 -0800 Message-ID: <019201c3f13f$b98f3630$92e34a43@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO><4.3.1.2.20040211131253.05213470@mail.frys.com> <402ABE8A.20400@fenris.net> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:10:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9ef325a2de34475c3848c778f8a63281ec6350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Pockets in skirts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Have you considered making pockets which are completely supported by the waistband? Sort of a truncated tear-drop shape with a vertical slit opening, and reached via an opening in the side seams. You could make them as deep as necessary and place them on the waistband where they wouldn't be too lumpy. I remember seeing something similar in 18th c and earlier; the pockets were worn on a belt over the petticoat, but under the skirt. -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 10:12:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CFCeSd032468 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:12:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CF9IcP018607; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:09:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CF994J011824; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:09:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CF974J011801 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:09:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m219.in-tch.com [216.166.191.219]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1CEkfK12981 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 07:46:42 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <402B97CD.6040608@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:12:13 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] men in skirts References: <001501c3f0dd$e9f852f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <001501c3f0dd$e9f852f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Your stuff's so good, Bjarne, even somebody like me would look wonderful, but I'd be way too afraid of hurting the costume! I'd be afraid to even breathe on something that beautiful, expensive and fragile. I can sure admire them from afar, though! ;o) --sue Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > I could never wear any of the beautiful stuff > Bjarne makes, for instance, whether it had skirts or pants! > --sue, with a rant of her own.... > > > Why thankyou Sue, but are you absolutely sure of that? > That i could not do anything for you to look good in? > Just kidding! > In the swedish society of Gustafs Skĺl, there are some women who cross dresses in mens costumes. And they are very very good. It took me quite some time, before i found out of that. They looks so good! > There also should be some men who cross dresses into womens dress, but i have not seen any of them yeat. There would be a problem with their wide shoulders though! > > Bjarne, who only cross dresses into another time.......... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 11:00:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CG09Sd032630 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:00:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CFujcP022642; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:56:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CFuh4J038703; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:56:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CFud4J038665 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:56:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-123.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.123]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CFuY4T008194 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 09:56:36 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040212071512.00a61ad0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 07:56:28 -0800 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: Subject: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My boss at one of the living history sites at which I participate keeps making incorrect assertions about costumes, a field in which I demonstrably know more than she does (I can usually point to one of the resources in their docent library to back up things I say about costuming). She tells us that we are doing exactly 1901, then says we can wear clothes as far back as 1885 (I don't believe 1885 bustles being worn in 1901 in a city as cosmopolitan as San Francisco). She says we can't wear "bright colors" because they are too expensive, but allows us to play characters who are wealthy (some calicos from c.1901 were pretty brightly coloured, as were some patterned cotton feed sacks). She tells us that corsets, which she insists the woman docents wear, are necessarily uncomfortable because hers, not made by her, is uncomfortable (I amazed her by reaching over and touching my toes while wearing mine, which I had made). She insists we have to write up detailed character life histories, then says we can't do first person interpretation (she and several others discuss things like computers while eating lunch on site in full view of the visitors). It wouldn't be so bad if she didn't claim to be such a stickler for authenticity while being unable to recognize it, or its lack (some of the garments other docents wear are either way too late for 1901 or are blatantly modern). So how do I correct my living history boss when she's documentably wrong? Is it possible to gently do something about this situation without getting thrown out of the program for perceived insubordination? Please advise. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 11:21:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CGLVSd032760 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:21:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CGJTcP024760; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 09:19:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CGJP4J053726; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 09:19:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CGJM4J053685 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 09:19:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-123.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.123]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CGJJ4V002026 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:19:20 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040212081325.05faacd0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:19:01 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Pockets in skirts In-Reply-To: <019201c3f13f$b98f3630$92e34a43@HELENPINTO> References: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <4.3.1.2.20040211131253.05213470@mail.frys.com> <402ABE8A.20400@fenris.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Have you considered making pockets which are completely supported by the >waistband? No. I put lots of stuff in my pockets, and that makes this sort of pocket bang around inside the skirt, making moving lumps visible from the outside. >I remember seeing something similar in 18th c and earlier; the >pockets were worn on a belt over the petticoat, but under the skirt. This only works if your skirt is extra wide on the sides, or if you don't put your wallet, all your car keys, an Altoids box, and a couple of key chain tool kits in your pockets. In the 18th century there might be room for a little dog on one side and your knitting on the other. In the 21st century this is not possible. And yes, I have quite a collection of canvas craft-project-carrier bags. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 12:13:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CHDaSd000486 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:13:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CHAJcP029362; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:10:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CHAH4J089439; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:10:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.mc.surewest.net (smtp1.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.50]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1CHAC4J089407 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:10:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 31816 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2004 17:03:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21) (66.205.128.60) by smtp1.mc.surewest.net with SMTP; 12 Feb 2004 17:03:09 -0000 Message-Id: <4.2.2.20040212085121.0102d1b8@pop.surewest.net> X-Sender: joanmj@pop.surewest.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.2 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 09:01:48 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040212071512.00a61ad0@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-TST: smtp1 SNWK2 0.31-3 ip=66.205.128.60 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 07:56 AM 2/12/2004 -0800, you wrote: >My boss at one of the living history sites at which I participate keeps >making incorrect assertions about costumes, a field in which I >demonstrably know more than she does (I can usually point to one of the >resources in their docent library to back up things I say about >costuming). She tells us that we are doing exactly 1901, then says we can >wear clothes as far back as 1885 (I don't believe 1885 bustles being worn >in 1901 in a city as cosmopolitan as San Francisco). She says we can't >wear "bright colors" because they are too expensive, but allows us to play >characters who are wealthy (some calicos from c.1901 were pretty brightly >coloured, as were some patterned cotton feed sacks). She tells us that >corsets, which she insists the woman docents wear, are necessarily >uncomfortable because hers, not made by her, is uncomfortable (I amazed >her by reaching over and touching my toes while wearing mine, which I had >made). She insists we have to write up detailed character life histories, >then says we can't do first person interpretation (she and several others >discuss things like computers while eating lunch on site in full view of >the visitors). It wouldn't be so bad if she didn't claim to be such a >stickler for authenticity while being unable to recognize it, or its lack >(some of the garments other docents wear are either way too late for 1901 >or are blatantly modern). > >So how do I correct my living history boss when she's documentably >wrong? Is it possible to gently do something about this situation without >getting thrown out of the program for perceived insubordination? Please >advise. > > CarolynKayta Barrows Kayta, I don't know of any way to educate your "boss" if she doesn't want to learn. I, too, run into this problem with certain folks in living history activities that I participate in. All I can do is, by personal example, try to educate other folks so that the various myths about certain aspects of costume (corsets seem to be a major source for these) are refuted, or at least diluted. For example, I always emphasize to people who question the comfort of a corset that the corset must be made to fit the individual and cannot be off-the-rack and be truly comfortable for long-term wear, especially if you are doing physical work (like cooking in an open hearth). Is there any way you could offer to teach some classes on costuming (in which you are an acknowledged expert) to the docents or docents-in-training? It's too bad that she and other folks can't put aside their modern lives for even a few hours. Real living history is something most visitors find fascinating. Maybe you could aim it from the marketing angle-- e.g., more visitors will come, stay longer, and come more often if you work on really presenting a living history experience. Good luck to both of us in raising the quality level at our respective sites, _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 12:28:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CHSOSd000527 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:28:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CHOxcP000834; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:24:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CHOs4J099789; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:24:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m09.mx.aol.com (imo-m09.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.164]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CHOp4J099692 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:24:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.227]) by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (v93.8) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-2402bb5a31c6; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:19:31 -0500 Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.d1.50a6256 (4402) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:14:09 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:14:09 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/12/2004 10:57:49 AM Eastern Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: > So how do I correct my living history boss when she's documentably > wrong? Is it possible to gently do something about this situation without > getting thrown out of the program for perceived insubordination? Please > advise. > You leave this group and start your own. [Why do you want to stay there?] If you do enjoy the group because, after all it is a social kinda thing ....just make your own stuff the best. Make everyone want to look like you and then politely offer to do so. Only challenge her assessment when it directly concerns you and back up your assertion with research. Always be polite. You know this anyway. Wait...docents...are you getting paid? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 12:45:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CHjKSd000641 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:45:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CHiOcP002698; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:44:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CHiM4J013803; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:44:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m10.mx.aol.com (imo-m10.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.165]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CHiH4J013695 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:44:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from imo-d04.mx.aol.com (imo-d04.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.228]) by imo-m10.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/AOL-5.0.0) with ESMTP id MAA25593 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:44:01 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.89.334012d (4402) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:38:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <89.334012d.2d5d1427@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:38:47 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/12/2004 12:11:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, joanmj@surewest.net writes: > Good luck to both of us in raising > the quality level at our respective sites, > Indeed. I remember when in New Orleans working on "Interview with the Vampire" I when up to Oak Alley Plantation, where we had filmed, and did the tour. [It's also Jewel Mayhew's [sp] plantation in "Hush Hush Sweet Charlotte".] A beautiful place with Oaks planted in the 17 teens in front and the "baby oaks" planted in the1830s when the house that's there now was built. [The old oaks formed an alley that went from the Mississippi to a clearing where a house had stood, but no one knew exactly who's or when.] Anyway, the big years for the house are the1830s and [after the War it lay unused 'til] the 1930s. The poor girls who do the tour are in hoops. Why? Big ill fitting blouses and hoops. The funny thing is, there's a mannequin in a real and correct costume in the 1830s section. [Half the house in 1830, half 1930] I remember thinking how much less fuss an 1830s ensemble would probably be. And how it would be fun to have some girls in 1930s stuff...and talk about the differences 100 years makes. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 13:11:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CIBRSd000781 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:11:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CI8dcP005083; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:08:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CI8YAv031376; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:08:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CI8SAv031216 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:08:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.8) with ESMTP id 702088 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:08:09 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:08:08 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <89.334012d.2d5d1427@aol.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On 2/12/04 9:38 AM, "AlbertCat@aol.com" wrote: > In a message dated 2/12/2004 12:11:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, > joanmj@surewest.net writes: > >> Good luck to both of us in raising >> the quality level at our respective sites, >> > > Indeed. > > > I remember when in New Orleans working on "Interview with the Vampire" I when > up to Oak Alley Plantation, where we had filmed, and did the tour. [It's also > Jewel Mayhew's [sp] plantation in "Hush Hush Sweet Charlotte".] A beautiful > place with Oaks planted in the 17 teens in front and the "baby oaks" planted > in > the1830s when the house that's there now was built. [The old oaks formed an > alley that went from the Mississippi to a clearing where a house had stood, > but > no one knew exactly who's or when.] > Anyway, the big years for the house are the1830s and [after the War it lay > unused 'til] the 1930s. The poor girls who do the tour are in hoops. Why? Big > ill fitting blouses and hoops. The funny thing is, there's a mannequin in a > real > and correct costume in the 1830s section. [Half the house in 1830, half 1930] > > I remember thinking how much less fuss an 1830s ensemble would probably be. > And how it would be fun to have some girls in 1930s stuff...and talk about the > differences 100 years makes. I took that tour about five years ago, and I remember thinking the same thing. Here's this sample on view of a correct, simple outfit that the girls (and they were all teenagers) would have looked lovely in and felt comfortable in (humidity is high), but they had to wear acetate or poly taffeta costumes in hoops that didn't fit and bodices that fit even worse. For those who haven't been there, the building and surrounding grounds are beautiful, the tour is really informative. One thing our guide told us was that, because of the wet heat, the building has to be painted each and every year inside and out because the paint just peels off the walls. They were hoping to get air conditioning in the building in a couple of years to preserve the house and that, they hoped, would alleviate the problem. I felt so sorry for the guides in their hot, bulky outfits (no corsets) while I was wearing all cotton. Their costumes looked like costumes, not outfits. End of rant, LynnD _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 13:31:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CIVWSd000870 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:31:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CITPcP007375; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:29:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CITJAv047488; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:29:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (IDENT:LKAInemM8vxh69AaO5VgVd5dJgOS5G7T@jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CITEAv047428 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:29:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.10/8.12.3) with SMTP id i1CITD2v014172 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:29:13 -0500 Message-Id: <200402121829.i1CITD2v014172@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:29:08 -0000 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Carolyn, I know it's very frustrating, and I'm glad we all have this forum to vent! I see two issues here. One is her modern discussions, and the other is her costume assumptions. Her opinions on costume, as you describe them, sound a lot like reenactor-isms that we see in 18th century and I'm sure occur in other time periods as well. They are conservative ideas usually stated as "always" or "never". It may be about something that is most commonly worn in the era, or an edict against some current-day fashion that is not appopriate. For example, makeup. Say I'm a campfollower for the American Revolution - the upper class had makeup, and other classes may have had access to it as well. But doubtful for a campfollower, so the head of the group says no makeup. (I'm inventing this part) - What if I find an account of someone who could not afford powder and used another substance (maybe flour)? So I justify using it in camp, and, oh what the heck, why don't I just use some 21stC face powder, since that's what it's supposed to look like, and a bit of lipstick, and... By saying you can't use bright colors, maybe she's protecting the program against someone showing up in neon tones. She saves herself having to inspect a swatch of every suggested fabric and researching each one, and arguing with the person who already bought the fabric, or already made the garment, etc. I've heard people claim that they found the "exact" fabric from a portrait or extant gown, and while the colors might be the same the print was a 19thC calico vs. the correct 18thC brocade. Having rules on drab colors simplifies things. Is it fair? Correct? No, but if you get to break the rules then it's a whole can of worms for her to deal with regarding the rest of the participants. This may not help you any, but maybe knowing about the tendency may help. As far as the non-period conversation, that may be worth a confrontation with the group. Is there a meeting where you could bring it up? You don't need to cite any individuals, but say that there has been some modern talk in front of visitors. That, as well as some activities (drinking soda out of a can, visibly using a camera) make the interpretors look really foolish. Visitors love to catch them at it, and we see plenty of photos in the paper of someone doing that. (It's infuriating when most of the reenactors are being so careful!) Joseph Ruckman once pointed out that the fundamental difference between first person & third is the use of pronouns. "They would have cooked over a fire this way" vs. "I'm cooking over a fire". Ok, so an actual XX century person would not be describing the obvious that way, but she might start up a conversation about what she's doing. What is the boss's argument against first person? Sometimes an interpretor can get too much into playing the part and not really be interacting with the visitors. Some like to tell the visitors they are dressed strangely, instead of inviting them into the historic world. I've seen some interpretors posed with questions about the modern world which they handle with varying success. Some give a dumb look, others are able to answer the real question without letting on that they know anything about cars, computers, radiation therapy, or whatever. Again, is the boss making a blanket rule in order to save her the work of people doing first person badly? It may be worth showing her what you can do, practicing with other docents, even practicing the sorts of situations or questions visitors might have. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 13:46:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CIkeSd000942 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:46:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CIjmcP009028; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:45:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CIjkAv059282; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:45:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CIjfAv059232 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:45:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from brujne@creighton.edu) Received: from cindyabel (cla53081.creighton.edu [147.134.201.2]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_28810+JAGae91741)/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA15053 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:45:39 -0600 (CST) From: "Cindy Abel" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:45:38 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20040212085121.0102d1b8@pop.surewest.net> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If your boss is a reader, you can gently push her in the direction of sources on hand, or offer to lend her some of your books with a suggestion of "maybe we/I/group should do some research to see what is correct on this matter" Also in the corset matter, suggest that just as now custom-made clothing, shoes and underpinnings are more comfortable than mass-market offerings, couldn't the same have been true in circa 1901? For instance, women now still wear the wrong(usually too small)jeans, shoes and bra sizes in the name of fashion and there is historical proof that this was done in the past, especially during the corset era. As for the span of fashion to be worn in your 1901 era, surviving photographs will be the best evidence of what was really being worn and you can show your boss those. I can see some women clinging to the styles of their youth and even the younger women would be behind the latest styles. When I was researching the early medical school classes here at Creighton some years ago, I came across a photo in a 1901 med school bulletin, showing off one of the classrooms of 1900(it was most definately taken in 1900!)and what I noticed first is that the two female students(yes, more women were in medical schools from 1890-1920 than you might think!)wore bodices and sleeves definately not the denier cri of 1900. One wore a shirtwaist with a bodice and sleeve style au courant in 1897 while the other wore a plaid dress with the balloon sleeves of 1894-5. So I would say photographs of 1900-1901 would be your best source as you know, although a formal photograph with the subjects posed in their best dress would not be final evidence of what they wore day-to-day. Cindy Abel CUMC HSL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 15:00:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CK0tSd001235 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:00:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CK0DcP017073; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:00:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CJxAAv013422; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:00:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CJx3Aw013319 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 12:59:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1CJtHPp025524 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:55:17 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:55:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <402BDB07.8070601@thibault.org> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:59:03 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise References: <4.3.1.2.20040212071512.00a61ad0@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040212071512.00a61ad0@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > It wouldn't > be so bad if she didn't claim to be such a stickler for authenticity > while being unable to recognize it, or its lack Maybe you could press her to write up what sufficient documentation is in her eyes? Then use that "ruler" to show her there are things that would be better choices? Example: if you could get her to say that two contemporary examples of a color used in dresses from 1897-1900 are enough to support making something in that color. Then find two or five examples of a bright color that you want, and show her you've met her requirements? -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 15:09:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CK99Sd001248 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:09:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CK6wcP017797; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:06:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CK6sAv025257; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:06:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d22.mx.aol.com (imo-d22.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.208]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CK5pAv023287 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 13:06:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.c4.50e264b (4402) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:59:32 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:59:32 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/12/2004 1:46:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, brujne@creighton.edu writes: > I can see some > women clinging to the styles of their youth and even the younger women would > be behind the latest styles. > True. Most of out mother probably did this. But my mother did not wear 1940's clothes in the 60s or 1960s clothes in the 80s. She did however go for the current tailored suit with narrow skirt look...which she got used to in the 1940s. To wear an 1880s gown...even altered, is just a bit too much. Maybe if they were wretched and poor but perhaps well to do in the 1880s so...you get the idea and that's too much back story to justify it IMHO. There's a way to look old fashion without wearing old clothes. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 16:50:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CLoQSd001737 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:50:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CLmZcP027449; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:48:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CLmHAv005047; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:48:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CLmEAv004976 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:48:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7bedd.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.221]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 2F25D262A3F for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:48:11 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <002901c3f1b1$f21f5170$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:48:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] rice paper X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1CLoQSd001737 Status: RO Hi. Just wanted to ask if any of you ever tryed to use rice paper as transfers of patterns onto fabric. Someone told me i could do that just transferring the pattern to rice paper, and then put the rice paper onto the fabric and then embroider on top of the paper. Then the paper could be removed after the embroidery has finished. Was thinking about trying that, as i have some ribbed silk i want to embroider onto, and it is impossible to use my old method with pencil. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 17:32:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CMW7Sd001920 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:32:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMVJcP001523; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:31:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMVHAv034421; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:31:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav49.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMUtAx034114 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:30:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:13:30 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav49.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:13:29 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: smart women Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:14:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2004 22:13:30.0061 (UTC) FILETIME=[7201EFD0:01C3F1B5] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > The teachers expect me to get my theology right just > like the men! I think engineers may have more trouble with the concept. Well, think of it this way: engineers are very, very typical "boys", usually (I mean, cars, hockey, start trek and programming kind of guy)... A girl who isn't girly is very disorienting to them. They don't know what to make of us :-) Well, they don't know what to make of *me*, in any case :-) I fare better in my language courses :-) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 17:34:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CMYGSd001931 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:34:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMV3cP001489; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:31:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMUwAv034210; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:30:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav49.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMUtAv034114 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:30:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:15:23 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav49.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:15:23 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <009501c3f10f$6b8026f0$0500a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] For those with a big purse Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:15:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2004 22:15:23.0753 (UTC) FILETIME=[B5C5F590:01C3F1B5] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wow. I wish I could have just a *photocopy* of that! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2004 9:25 PM Subject: [h-cost] For those with a big purse Go look at this auction on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3585180652&category=29220 Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 17:57:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CMvPSd002006 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:57:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMtLcP003461; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:55:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMtJAv050579; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:55:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CMtEAw050547 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:55:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-204.sonic.net [209.148.112.204]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1CMtBbq011155 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:55:13 -0800 Message-ID: <402C052F.4000708@lavoltapress.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:58:55 -0800 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: smart women References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I missed the beginning of this thread . . . but speaking as the daughter of an engineer (nuclear reactors and other power sources), the sister of an engineer (OK, he defected and became a lawyer but he got his BA at MIT), the wife of an engineer (computer programmer), the former coworker of many engineers (programmers, system admins, and hardware designers), and, in my early college days, a dating magnet for guys who carried stacks of punch cards around campus. . . Engineeers don't like girly girls. They like women who are like them, whether engineers or not. Logical, straightforward, practical, and not overly sensitive to comments about how ignorant the woman is about some technical (or other!) subject, which comments they regard as merely factual and which are not designed to wound. They expect to take women at face value, no game playing. While they do not necessarily object to things like pretty clothes, regarding it as a woman's right to wear (or sew) them if she wishes, they usually don't give a damn about them. My husband once made the ultimate comment in this regard. Which is, who cares what I wear because it's all going to come off anyway. Fran Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: >>The teachers expect me to get my theology right just >>like the men! I think engineers may have more trouble with the concept. >> >> > >Well, think of it this way: engineers are very, very typical "boys", usually >(I mean, cars, hockey, start trek and programming kind of guy)... A girl who >isn't girly is very disorienting to them. They don't know what to make of us >:-) Well, they don't know what to make of *me*, in any case :-) I fare >better in my language courses :-) >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 18:32:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CNW2Sd002141 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:32:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNU4cP008826; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:30:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNTxAv075569; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:29:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1CNTvAv075547 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:29:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 21861 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2004 23:29:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail.inreach.com) (209.142.2.163) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2004 23:29:56 -0000 Received: from 24.4.69.40 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:29:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1155.24.4.69.40.1076628596.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> In-Reply-To: <402C052F.4000708@lavoltapress.com> References: <402C052F.4000708@lavoltapress.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:29:56 -0800 (PST) From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello list! I lent a friend one of my dresses a while ago and when she returned it to me, it had an overwhelming musty smell to it. The problem is that I can't seem to get the smell out. It is a fancy dress that I can't really wash in the washer. I tried putting it out in the sun and tumbling it in the drier. But to no avail. Does anyone have any suggestions on what else I can try? Thanks for your help! -- Diana Habra www.renaissancefabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 18:39:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CNdNSd002178 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:39:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNaEcP009371; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:36:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNaBAv079563; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:36:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNa7Aw079538 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:36:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1CNhWLP014609 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:43:33 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040212153142.027c9c18@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:36:04 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance In-Reply-To: <402C052F.4000708@lavoltapress.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: smart women X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Wow, does this ever describe my husband, (degree in electrical engineering), and his dad ( three engineering degrees)! Katie, who is absolutely amazed that Hubby will let her dress him up in SCA garb (obligatory costume content) >Engineeers don't like girly girls. They like women who are like them, >whether engineers or not. Logical, straightforward, practical, and not >overly sensitive to comments about how ignorant the woman is about some >technical (or other!) subject, which comments they regard as merely >factual and which are not designed to wound. They expect to take women at >face value, no game playing. While they do not necessarily object to >things like pretty clothes, regarding it as a woman's right to wear (or >sew) them if she wishes, they usually don't give a damn about them. My >husband once made the ultimate comment in this regard. Which is, who >cares what I wear because it's all going to come off anyway. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 18:50:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CNoaSd002215 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:50:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNntcP010477; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:49:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNnrAv088439; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:49:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNnlAv088324 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:49:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A45942624 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:33:42 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <402C0BC9.109@reddawn.net> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:27:05 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] rice paper References: <002901c3f1b1$f21f5170$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <002901c3f1b1$f21f5170$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Hi. > Just wanted to ask if any of you ever tryed to use rice paper as transfers of patterns onto fabric. Someone told me i could do that just transferring the pattern to rice paper, and then put the rice paper onto the fabric and then embroider on top of the paper. Then the paper could be removed after the embroidery has finished. > Was thinking about trying that, as i have some ribbed silk i want to embroider onto, and it is impossible to use my old method with pencil. > I think it depends on the rice paper. The ones I have seen are too thick for that, but here in the US you can get very thin tracing paper or vellum paper which will work like that. The only problem then is that you have paper under your embroidery, which can discolor with age or release acids that might harm your work. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 18:51:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CNpfSd002219 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:51:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNp0cP010576; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:51:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNowAv089183; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:50:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web60301.mail.yahoo.com (web60301.mail.yahoo.com [216.109.118.112]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1CNotAv089100 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:50:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jenrsmall@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040212234409.62858.qmail@web60301.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.52.135.9] by web60301.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:44:09 PST Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:44:09 -0800 (PST) From: Jen Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <1155.24.4.69.40.1076628596.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Febreeze spray saved some funky dresses of mine that I didn't unpack after Pennsic. They're not washable either... Diana Habra wrote:Hello list! I lent a friend one of my dresses a while ago and when she returned it to me, it had an overwhelming musty smell to it. The problem is that I can't seem to get the smell out. It is a fancy dress that I can't really wash in the washer. I tried putting it out in the sun and tumbling it in the drier. But to no avail. Does anyone have any suggestions on what else I can try? Thanks for your help! -- Diana Habra www.renaissancefabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 18:53:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1CNrWSd002226 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:53:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNoOcP010522; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:50:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNoNAv088822; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:50:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1CNoIAv088719 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:50:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/Or95lAnnuZrMUEiFYE9LV7o=">; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:49:36 PST Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JM8Q8PVP; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:49:36 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:41:52 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress Message-ID: <20040212.154856.596.0.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,5-29 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Tried spritzing it with Fabreze? Arlys On Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:29:56 -0800 (PST) "Diana Habra" writes: > Hello list! > > I lent a friend one of my dresses a while ago and when she returned > it to > me, it had an overwhelming musty smell to it. > > The problem is that I can't seem to get the smell out. It is a fancy > dress that I can't really wash in the washer. I tried putting it > out in > the sun and tumbling it in the drier. But to no avail. Does anyone > have > any suggestions on what else I can try? > > Thanks for your help! > > -- > Diana Habra > www.renaissancefabrics.net > "Everything for the Costumer" > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:05:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D05WSd002274 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:05:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D039cP011566; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:03:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D037Av096006; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:03:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1CNl0Aw086425 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:47:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1CNsMLP017061 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:54:23 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040212153856.00b37380@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:46:54 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: smart women In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Amen on that. In Hubby-the-Engineer's world, languages, history, geography, etc. have no value because their value cannot be quantified. Recently, I have been pushing towards more costume / history oriented movies to rent and he (who controls the control) has become accustomed to stopping the movie to ask me a question and to me blurting 'STOP' so that I can explain something that I *know* he knows nothing about. The depth of his ignorance in non-engineering topics is astounding! Maybe I could tell him that the garb that I want to make for him is just like Leonardo da Vinci (great engineer, right?) would have worn ... Katie >Well, they don't know what to make of *me*, in any case :-) I fare >better in my language courses :-) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:23:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0NBSd002354 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:23:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0KlcP012649; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:20:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0KhAv005601; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:20:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0KeAv005496 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:20:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CCC442624 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:32:48 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <402C19A2.8020402@reddawn.net> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:26:10 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress References: <20040212.154856.596.0.Cley@juno.com> In-Reply-To: <20040212.154856.596.0.Cley@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Cynthia J Ley wrote: > Tried spritzing it with Fabreze? > I would be wary of Febreeze, as I have used it in the past and it has left spots that turn brown about 3 months afterward. I didn't mind so much on the bathroom wall, I could wipe it off, but I'd be upset if it was a fancy dress. What is the dress made out of? I recently brought home a completely beaded and sequinned evening gown from the thrift shop that reeked of cigarette and body odour, and was able to clean the smell off by swishing it gently in a tub of cool water with a mild soap. Then I dried it on towels. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:27:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0RmSd002362 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:27:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0OUcP012857; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:24:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0OTAv007424; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:24:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav28.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.85]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0ORAv007344 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:24:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:24:21 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav28.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:24:21 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040212.154856.596.0.Cley@juno.com> <402C19A2.8020402@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:24:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2004 00:24:21.0748 (UTC) FILETIME=[B9FA4B40:01C3F1C7] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think then the option would be to turn the dress inside out and spray. Also my stuff gets stored with cedar bags and camphor. A plain airing on the line would also work most esp in this cold weather. The sun is the best of all cleaners we have at our disposal. B~ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 7:26 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress > Cynthia J Ley wrote: > > > Tried spritzing it with Fabreze? > > > > I would be wary of Febreeze, as I have used it in the past and it has > left spots that turn brown about 3 months afterward. I didn't mind so > much on the bathroom wall, I could wipe it off, but I'd be upset if it > was a fancy dress. > > What is the dress made out of? I recently brought home a completely > beaded and sequinned evening gown from the thrift shop that reeked of > cigarette and body odour, and was able to clean the smell off by > swishing it gently in a tub of cool water with a mild soap. Then I dried > it on towels. > > > > Dawn > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:30:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0ULSd002372 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:30:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0SPcP013133; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:28:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0SMAv009498; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:28:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0SKAv009481 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:28:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from khanson@kc.rr.com) Received: from karen (CPE-24-31-232-81.kc.rr.com [24.31.232.81]) by ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with SMTP id i1CNn8D8017352 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:49:09 -0600 (CST) From: "Talia" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: smart women Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:48:49 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20040212153142.027c9c18@mail.katiesorchids.com> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Completely off the mark in regard to my ex-husband. He wanted me to stay at home, cook and clean for him, and basically wait on him hand and foot. He's got a Masters in Mechanical Engineering and a Doctorate in Robotics. T. > >Engineeers don't like girly girls. They like women who are like them, > >whether engineers or not. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:34:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0YpSd002385 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:34:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0WtcP013452; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:32:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0WtAv011896; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:32:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1D0VwAv011278 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:31:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCi4yt7cemO+roApOd2vXD0TJ8XBxb70tHg==">; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:31:26 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JM8TMAQM; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:31:26 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:30:46 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress Message-ID: <20040212.183047.-504949.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4-6 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have found that a good spritzing with cheap vodka (or other grain alcohol) can kill of many, many nasty odors. It's one of the things we use at Bristol to get some seriously funky body smells out of our outfits which generally don't wash very easily. It also has the benefit of not leaving a scent of it's own after it's all evaporated. Karen ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:34:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0YuSd002388 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:34:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0VkcP013349; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:31:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0VjAv011201; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:31:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (sea1-f121.sea1.hotmail.com [207.68.163.121]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0VfAv011142 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:31:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nancy_kiel@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:14:20 -0800 Received: from 141.152.157.162 by sea1fd.sea1.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:14:20 GMT X-Originating-IP: [141.152.157.162] X-Originating-Email: [nancy_kiel@hotmail.com] X-Sender: nancy_kiel@hotmail.com From: "Nancy Kiel" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:14:20 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2004 00:14:20.0320 (UTC) FILETIME=[537FAA00:01C3F1C6] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Maybe you could also point out that we aren't used to wearing corsets, so perhaps we find them more uncomfortable because we haven't grown up wearing them. Nancy Kiel nancy_kiel@hotmail.com Never tease a weasel! This is very good advice. For the weasel will not like it And teasing isn't nice. >From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows She tells us that corsets, which >she insists the woman docents wear, are necessarily uncomfortable because >hers, not made by her, is uncomfortable (I amazed her by reaching over and >touching my toes while wearing mine, which I had made). _________________________________________________________________ Optimize your Internet experience to the max with the new MSN Premium Internet Software. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:35:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0ZfSd002393 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:35:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0ZBcP013641; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:35:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0Z8Av013104; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:35:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0Z2Aw013053 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:35:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1D0VFPp026544 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:31:15 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:31:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <402C1BB2.6080201@thibault.org> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:34:58 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress References: <20040212.154856.596.0.Cley@juno.com> <402C19A2.8020402@reddawn.net> In-Reply-To: <402C19A2.8020402@reddawn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I believe it was on this list in the past, that I learned one could try a spritz bottle with half-and-half cheap vodka and water, to get rid of such odors. I'd try a drop on an inside seam first, just in case, though. -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:35:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0ZqSd002396 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:35:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0XocP013551; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:33:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0XmAv012378; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:33:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0XgAv012341 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:33:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net (snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1CMQrI10627 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:26:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1ArPIJ-0001H7-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 14:26:52 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Wool shampoo Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 15:27:13 -0700 Message-ID: <000001c3f1b7$5d516370$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <036a01c3f070$fc6840c0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Funny, I wash my horses with human shampoo and conditioner. I even use T-gel on my flaky one....works great. What is that stuff that comes in a jar that everyone used to use on their white animals??? Can't remember the name....I might even have some... Corvus or something? -----Original Message----- Subject: [h-cost] Wool shampoo I thought those of you that use Horse shampoo for washing their woolens and silks may find this amusing. A friend of ours has a couple of horses. What does she use to wash them? A locally available PH-Neutral Wool wash! Does well for their dog too. Makes sense to me. Glenda. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:45:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0jBSd002432 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:45:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0emcP014030; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:40:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0ehAv016012; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:40:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0efAv015935 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:40:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.147.220d1df0 (18251) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:40:34 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <147.220d1df0.2d5d7701@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:40:33 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] rice paper To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/12/2004 4:50:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: Just wanted to ask if any of you ever tryed to use rice paper as transfers of patterns onto fabric. Someone told me i could do that just transferring the pattern to rice paper, and then put the rice paper onto the fabric and then embroider on top of the paper. Then the paper could be removed after the embroidery has finished. There are also tear-away stabilizers that are especially made for this purpose, and would probably tear away more easily than the paper would. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 19:56:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D0uUSd002463 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:56:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0sXcP014763; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:54:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0sQAv022576; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:54:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0sOAv022560 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:54:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-123.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.123]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D0rSbG016946 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:53:29 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040212154627.05a991b0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 16:53:43 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >You leave this group and start your own. [Why do you want to stay there?] 1901 is about my favorite year for living history and for costumes. They have the site and I don't have the money to rent a different one. >....just make your own stuff the best. Make everyone want to look like you >and then >politely offer to do so. Only challenge her assessment when it directly >concerns you and back up your assertion with research. Always be polite. Her assertions directly concern what she will allow me to wear. This means I am continually re-designing my next outfit. I am the only one in the group who sews my own stuff, my boss included, but I really hate sewing, which makes me unsuited to doing it for other people. And their costume budget just went away, so there's no money to pay a costumer anyway. About a year ago I gave the boss a cd with images of dozens of fashion plates from contemporary fashion magazines and surviving costumes and accessories from this period. Now, a year later, she says she has never looked at it. Hey - I tried to be helpful... >Wait...docents...are you getting paid? We're all volunteers. -snip- > By saying you can't use bright colors, maybe she's protecting the > program >against someone showing up in neon tones. All the other docents had their costumes provided, back when they had a budget. I'm the first docent who has offered to make all my own stuff (and keep it afterwards). I don't know what they will do if they get any new living history docents. > As far as the non-period conversation, that may be worth a > confrontation >with the group. Is there a meeting where you could bring it up? You don't >need to cite any individuals, but say that there has been some modern talk in >front of visitors. That, as well as some activities (drinking soda out of a >can, visibly using a camera) make the interpretors look really foolish. >Visitors love to catch them at it, and we see plenty of photos in the >paper of >someone doing that. (It's infuriating when most of the reenactors are >being so >careful!) Good suggestion. I'll have to try that. > What is the boss's argument against first person? She claims it "doesn't work", and says we aren't to do it, end of story. Some of the newer docents, who have come from places like Dickens' Fair, where we take workshops to learn to make it work, know how to make it work. About half of older docents are not in practice, the boss included, so the boss says nobody is to do it. (The other half of the older docents are perfectly willing to 'play' with me in first person, like the idea, and do it with me when the boss isn't around.) There are also non-costumed non-living-history docents at this site. There are many ways to get a non-costumed docent to answer questions our historical characters can't. In fact, this idea was brought up at a meeting last year, where some of us were trying to present first-person living history as do-able. She vetoed it. -snip- >Maybe you could press her to write up what sufficient documentation is in >her eyes? Then use that "ruler" to show her there are things that would >be better choices? She still isn't prepared for docents who make their own clothes, after a year of us being there. There used to be a costumer, of some local reputation, doing all their costumes for them, back when they had a budget. I think the boss took her word on everything (the current costumes are pretty good) and would revert to bad re-enactorisms if left to generate her own guidelines. And I don't think she'd let any of us docents help her generate such guidelines - she's really into being the boss. -snip- >When I was researching the early medical school classes here at Creighton >some years ago, I came across a photo in a 1901 med school bulletin, showing >off one of the classrooms of 1900(it was most definately taken in 1900!)and >what I noticed first is that the two female students(yes, more women were in >medical schools from 1890-1920 than you might think!)wore bodices and >sleeves definately not the denier cri of 1900. One wore a shirtwaist with a >bodice and sleeve style au courant in 1897 while the other wore a plaid >dress with the balloon sleeves of 1894-5. So I would say photographs of >1900-1901 would be your best source as you know, although a formal >photograph with the subjects posed in their best dress would not be final >evidence of what they wore day-to-day. I could believe leftover 1894 sleeves in 1900, especially on a student. I've probably got some informal photos of my own which could show that much fashion lag c.1900. But I just don't believe bustle dresses in a big city like San Francisco in 1901, which the boss seems to think is perfectly acceptable. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 20:06:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D161Sd002488 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:06:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D146cP015163; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:04:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D144Av026768; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:04:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.mc.surewest.net (smtp1.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.50]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1D141Av026744 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:04:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 8168 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2004 01:03:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21) (66.205.128.60) by smtp1.mc.surewest.net with SMTP; 13 Feb 2004 01:03:37 -0000 Message-Id: <4.2.2.20040212170238.01036d90@pop.surewest.net> X-Sender: joanmj@pop.surewest.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.2 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:03:54 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: RE: [h-cost] Wool shampoo In-Reply-To: <000001c3f1b7$5d516370$6501a8c0@SG01> References: <036a01c3f070$fc6840c0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-TST: smtp1 SNWK2 0.31-3 ip=66.205.128.60 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's Orvus. Distributed as a horse shampoo and used by quilters for washing their quilts. It's pure detergent, no additives. Great stuff. Joan At 03:27 PM 2/12/2004 -0700, you wrote: >Funny, I wash my horses with human shampoo and conditioner. I even use >T-gel on my flaky one....works great. What is that stuff that comes in a >jar that everyone used to use on their white animals??? Can't remember the >name....I might even have some... Corvus or something? > >-----Original Message----- > >Subject: [h-cost] Wool shampoo > >I thought those of you that use Horse shampoo for washing their woolens and >silks may find this amusing. > >A friend of ours has a couple of horses. What does she use to wash them? A >locally available PH-Neutral Wool wash! Does well for their dog too. > >Makes sense to me. > >Glenda. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 20:58:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D1w2Sd002716 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:58:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D1vKcP017622; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:57:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D1vHAv049470; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:57:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web12901.mail.yahoo.com (web12901.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1D1vFAv049455 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:57:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Message-ID: <20040213015035.83547.qmail@web12901.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.48.41.31] by web12901.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:50:35 EST Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:50:35 -0500 (EST) From: Kathy Page To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200402130032.i1D0W7Av011436@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 101 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne, What I have used in the past is a thoroughly modern supply, but it works on fabrics that can't be marked. In my case, I needed a very long repeating pattern on a slightly curved hem. I use either tear-away (also self-stick varieties as well, but heavier thickness) embroidery paper if the embroidery can handle a bit of a tug, or water-soluable embroidery film if it can't. In the latter case, if the fabric can handle a dip in water (no agitation) it's better since it won't leave a layer under the stitches, but if not, a damp sponge will take care of the tiny bits sticking out after the film is torn off - which should not seriously affect the stitching. In either case, you trace your pattern onto the film or paper then stitch right through it. It's designed for machine embroidery, but works for handstitching as well. Make sure that if you get the tear away paper that its the lightest weight available so that it's not murder trying to get a hand needle through it. I found this a! fast solution to trying to fudge a curved-hem embroidery into place without having to draw very single repeat in a different size till everything fit. Pin, adjust, pin, fold the pattern slightly, pin - 15 minutes time, tops. From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" Subject: [h-cost] rice paper Hi. Just wanted to ask if any of you ever tryed to use rice paper as transfers of patterns onto fabric. Someone told me i could do that just transferring the pattern to rice paper, and then put the rice paper onto the fabric and then embroider on top of the paper. Then the paper could be removed after the embroidery has finished. Was thinking about trying that, as i have some ribbed silk i want to embroider onto, and it is impossible to use my old method with pencil. Bjarne --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 21:41:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D2fUSd002850 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:41:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D2cEcP019481; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:38:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D2cBAv067099; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:38:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav44.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.16]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D2c9Av067026 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:38:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 18:20:49 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav44.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:20:49 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: smart women Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:21:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2004 02:20:49.0460 (UTC) FILETIME=[FEFA8740:01C3F1D7] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Maybe that's because I was going to school with 19-yr-old males :-) > Completely off the mark in regard to my ex-husband. He wanted me to stay at > home, cook and clean for him, and basically wait on him hand and foot. He's > got a Masters in Mechanical Engineering and a Doctorate in Robotics. > > T. > > > >Engineeers don't like girly girls. They like women who are like them, > > >whether engineers or not. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 22:03:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D33kSd002917 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:03:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D30bcP020554; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:00:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D30YAv075782; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:00:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D30WAv075732 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:00:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from lizyoung@fenris.net) Received: from fenris.net (c-24-7-132-137.client.comcast.net[24.7.132.137]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with ESMTP id <20040213030027015000hn9he>; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 03:00:27 +0000 Message-ID: <402C3DCE.2040701@fenris.net> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:00:30 -0800 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Pockets in skirts References: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO><4.3.1.2.20040211131253.05213470@mail.frys.com> <402ABE8A.20400@fenris.net> <019201c3f13f$b98f3630$92e34a43@HELENPINTO> In-Reply-To: <019201c3f13f$b98f3630$92e34a43@HELENPINTO> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Helen Pinto wrote: >Have you considered making pockets which are completely supported by the >waistband? Sort of a truncated tear-drop shape with a vertical slit >opening, and reached via an opening in the side seams. You could make them >as deep as necessary and place them on the waistband where they wouldn't be >too lumpy. I remember seeing something similar in 18th c and earlier; the >pockets were worn on a belt over the petticoat, but under the skirt. > -Helen/Aidan > > > > Yes! That's what I meant by hanging pockets liz young _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 22:04:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D34ISd002920 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:04:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D32McP020644; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:02:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D32KAv076527; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:02:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.compassnet.com.au [203.26.180.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D32HAw076427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:02:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from glendar@compassnet.com.au) Received: from glendaii ([203.26.180.167]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.10/linuxconf) with SMTP id i1D39aLO011635 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:09:37 +1100 Message-ID: <035001c3f1dd$e2e794c0$eaf4fea9@glendaii> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: smart women Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:02:57 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well, it makes a bit of sense - maybe he was looking for a human robot! Glenda. ----- Original Message ----- > Completely off the mark in regard to my ex-husband. He wanted me to stay at > home, cook and clean for him, and basically wait on him hand and foot. He's > got a Masters in Mechanical Engineering and a Doctorate in Robotics. > > T. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 22:05:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D35mSd002925 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:05:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D32fcP020667; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:02:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D32dAv076653; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:02:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D32aAw076631 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:02:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1D3QHWm029942 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:26:18 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.107] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AE7431E80130; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:03:16 -0500 Message-ID: <005b01c3f1de$8f9bec20$6b5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040212.154856.596.0.Cley@juno.com><402C19A2.8020402@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:07:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Another method that sometimes works is to put it in a plastic bin with cover and cover it with a towel. then sprinkle some baking soda on the towel side and cover tightly for about a week. Or you could just put the opened box of soda in one corner of the covered bin. I keep a lot of my rental wear in plastic bins and add a sheet or two of 'Bounce" or other smelly laundry sheets and they do a pretty good job over time of keeping clothgoods fresh. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 7:24 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress > > I think then the option would be to turn the dress inside out and spray. > Also my stuff gets stored with cedar bags and camphor. A plain airing on the > line would also work most esp in this cold weather. The sun is the best of > all cleaners we have at our disposal. > > B~ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dawn" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 7:26 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress > > > > Cynthia J Ley wrote: > > > > > Tried spritzing it with Fabreze? > > > > > > > I would be wary of Febreeze, as I have used it in the past and it has > > left spots that turn brown about 3 months afterward. I didn't mind so > > much on the bathroom wall, I could wipe it off, but I'd be upset if it > > was a fancy dress. > > > > What is the dress made out of? I recently brought home a completely > > beaded and sequinned evening gown from the thrift shop that reeked of > > cigarette and body odour, and was able to clean the smell off by > > swishing it gently in a tub of cool water with a mild soap. Then I dried > > it on towels. > > > > > > > > Dawn > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 22:51:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D3poSd003105 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:51:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D3mfcP022217; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:48:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D3mdAv095886; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:48:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1D3maAv095857 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 20:48:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 7969 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2004 03:48:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail.inreach.com) (209.142.2.163) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2004 03:48:36 -0000 Received: from 24.4.69.40 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:48:36 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1139.24.4.69.40.1076644116.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> In-Reply-To: <402C19A2.8020402@reddawn.net> References: <20040212.154856.596.0.Cley@juno.com> <402C19A2.8020402@reddawn.net> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 19:48:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks to everyone for the suggestions! > What is the dress made out of? The dress is cotton brocade of a black & tan color. I might try the vodka idea, though. My boyfriend is sensitive to odors and I think the Febreze might not go over too well. I also like the baking soda idea. That will my my second choice if the vodka doesn't work. Thanks again! -- Diana Habra www.renaissancefabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 23:07:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D47CSd003139 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:07:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D43wcP023202; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:03:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D42tAv002192; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:03:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from joplin.siteprotect.com (joplin.siteprotect.com [64.26.0.58]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D42rAv002176 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:02:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cschmitt@genteelarts.com) Received: from genteelarts (user34.net627.oh.sprint-hsd.net [65.41.48.34]) by joplin.siteprotect.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1D42rx25965 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 22:02:53 -0600 From: "Carolann Schmitt" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:02:36 -0500 Organization: Genteel Arts Message-ID: <004101c3f1e6$3b6f5530$0300a8c0@genteelarts> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <1139.24.4.69.40.1076644116.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1D42rAv002176 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've had good luck using deactivated charcoal (available in the aquarium department at your local pet store or mega-mart). I put the charcoal crystals inside an old nylon stocking or piece of tulle, then put the charcoal and the garment in a sealed plastic tub. (I make sure the charcoal is not touching the garment.) It usually takes 2-3 days, but the deactivated charcoal will remove any odor without damaging the fabric. Carolann Schmitt cschmitt@genteelarts.com www.genteelarts.com Ladies & Gentlemen of the 1860s Conference, March 5-7, 2004 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 23:33:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D4X1Sd003202 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:33:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4TscP024656; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:29:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4SqAv013842; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:29:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4RnAw013443 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:28:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4SP8v012936 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:28:25 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1D4SPOp012934 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:28:25 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:28:25 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <4.3.1.2.20040212154627.05a991b0@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040212154627.05a991b0@mail.frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402122328.25311.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 12 February 2004 07:53 pm, Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: [snip] > > I could believe leftover 1894 sleeves in 1900, especially on a > student. I've probably got some informal photos of my own which could show > that much fashion lag c.1900. Fashion lag varies by individual; I still own--and wear--suits that I bought in the late 1980s. >But I just don't believe bustle dresses in a > big city like San Francisco in 1901, which the boss seems to think is > perfectly acceptable. I can believe that there would still be bustle-wearers in 1901, even in a bigger city than San Francisco. What I doubt is that they would be common, and they certainly wouldn't be worn by fashionable women. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 23:34:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D4YsSd003206 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:34:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4WwcP024854; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:32:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4WvAv015571; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:32:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4VUAw014971 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:31:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4W68v012958 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:32:06 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1D4W69a012956 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:32:06 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: smart women Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:32:06 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402122332.06114.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 12 February 2004 06:48 pm, Talia wrote: > Completely off the mark in regard to my ex-husband. He wanted me to stay at > home, cook and clean for him, and basically wait on him hand and foot. He's > got a Masters in Mechanical Engineering and a Doctorate in Robotics. I daresay he did. But I bet he didn't want you to giggle and simper and wear frilly pastels while you did it! (There's a difference between what kind of women you like to interact with, and being selfish enough to want a wife to wait on you hand and foot.) -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 23:38:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D4cYSd003215 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:38:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4brcP025262; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:37:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4aqAv017057; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:37:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4anAw017019 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:36:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4bO8v013019 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:37:24 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1D4bOMo013017 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:37:24 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:37:24 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402122337.24530.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wednesday 11 February 2004 11:17 pm, Heather Rose Jones wrote: > If you ever have an evening to kill and a Legally Blonde video at > hand, you might be pleasantly surprised. (I was.) The movies are -- > in a rather twisted way -- very much about _not_ judging people's > abilities or intelligence by appearance or style. The protagonist is > ditzy, yes, (and girly) but she succeeds because she's smart (both > book-smart and people-smart), holds to her principles, and never > gives up. I was really startled to find myself thoroughly enjoying > them -- radical femininst that I am. I'll cheerfully take your word for it. I'm aware that the character actually is bright and succeeds on merit. But I suspect that her love of bubblegum pink would annoy me enough to distract me from enjoying her triumphs. :-) -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 12 23:53:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D4r3Sd003252 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 23:53:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4qLcP026010; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:52:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4qIAv023310; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:52:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D4pIAv022934 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 21:52:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.188]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1ArJw4-00040a-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:43:32 -0800 Received: from dialup-65.58.144.74.dial1.pittsburgh1.level3.net ([65.58.144.74] helo=HELENPINTO) by stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1ArJw2-0001NK-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 08:43:31 -0800 Message-ID: <00a701c3f187$556afde0$4a903a41@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO><200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com><001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO><4.3.1.2.20040211131253.05213470@mail.frys.com><402ABE8A.20400@fenris.net> <4.3.1.2.20040212081325.05faacd0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Pockets in skirts Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 11:43:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9ef64470f03914edfc147b89a84903b53de350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO CarolynKayta wrote: or if you don't > put your wallet, all your car keys, an Altoids box, and a couple of key > chain tool kits in your pockets. Pockets? We don't need no stinking pockets. I carry an old Coach briefcase; I'll see that and raise you a flashlight, Daytimer, cell, visegrips, tape measure... I've been simplifying... Really. -Heen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 02:19:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D7JfSd017343 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:19:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D7G8cP002089; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:16:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D7FxAv075712; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:16:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D7FvAv075692 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:15:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.189]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1ArCIj-00007n-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:34:25 -0800 Received: from dialup-67.74.227.146.dial1.baltimore1.level3.net ([67.74.227.146] helo=HELENPINTO) by heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1ArCIh-0001G8-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 12 Feb 2004 00:34:24 -0800 Message-ID: <021101c3f143$038ab270$92e34a43@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com><200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com><001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO><200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> <4.3.1.2.20040212000936.051f2930@mail.frys.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 03:34:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9ef4ecad7156701f5515e909fd4df2e403f350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Now "Legally Blonde" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I had to sit through the first movie and was expecting to hate it; I was also pleasantly surprised- I enjoyed it. That made me want to see the second one; unfortunately, it's nowhere near as good, and I really disliked it. -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 03:41:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D8fYSd029684 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 03:41:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D8escP004615; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 01:40:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D8eoAv005741; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 01:40:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D8emAv005721 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 01:40:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-123.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.123]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D8ekM9029186 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:40:46 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040213000131.057d0f00@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 00:19:40 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: <200402122328.25311.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <4.3.1.2.20040212154627.05a991b0@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20040212154627.05a991b0@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > >But I just don't believe bustle dresses in a > > big city like San Francisco in 1901, which the boss seems to think is > > perfectly acceptable. > >I can believe that there would still be bustle-wearers in 1901, even in a >bigger city than San Francisco. What I doubt is that they would be common, >and they certainly wouldn't be worn by fashionable women. I too wear garments that are 10 or 20 years old, but not the ones so dated that they read like their original decade. I prefer wearing those older garments that are sufficiently classic that they look ok in the current decade. But the 1880s silhouette is very different from that of 1901. So I can sort-of believe someone still wearing an 1880s bodice in 1901, if she was poor, unfashionable, or old, because the shape is sort-of similar to what was current. But I think the wearer would have been remade the skirt to modernize it a little, (and there's certainly enough material in them for that) or at least worn it without the bustle understructure. Some fashionable 1889 and 1890 skirts look like mid-1880s skirts that have had their understructures, and some of their drapery, recently removed. But I think we're in agreement that the mid-1880s look is not the 1901 look my boss says she wants. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 04:18:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D9IlSd030196 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 04:18:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D9GrcP005841; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:16:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D9GpAv017036; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:16:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D9GlAv016952 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:16:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be8c.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.140]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 1F021262B70 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:16:42 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <002801c3f212$214b6c30$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:16:57 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] regency embroidery X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1D9IlSd030196 Status: RO Sunny, you must email me with your email-address so that i can send you the patterns. My email is drewscph@post12.tele.dk The issue about the copyright is, that you cant publish the original photographs i give you, but if you make some drawings after my photos and embroidery, there is no problem in putting the embroidery or your own drawing on the internet. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 04:24:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1D9OVSd030217 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 04:24:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D9LLcP006035; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:21:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D9LLAv018358; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:21:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1D9LJAv018347 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 02:21:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be8c.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.140]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 79D3D480141 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:21:15 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <003501c3f212$c4a16330$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040213015035.83547.qmail@web12901.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 101 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:21:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Kathy. I see this is a very good idea. but the problem is that my fabric cant endure to be soaked in water. It is a fine ribbed silk. It will spoil my silk. But thanks a lot for your advise. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kathy Page" To: Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 2:50 AM Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 101 > Bjarne, > > What I have used in the past is a thoroughly modern supply, but it works on fabrics that can't be marked. In my case, I needed a very long repeating pattern on a slightly curved hem. I use either tear-away (also self-stick varieties as well, but heavier thickness) embroidery paper if the embroidery can handle a bit of a tug, or water-soluable embroidery film if it can't. In the latter case, if the fabric can handle a dip in water (no agitation) it's better since it won't leave a layer under the stitches, but if not, a damp sponge will take care of the tiny bits sticking out after the film is torn off - which should not seriously affect the stitching. In either case, you trace your pattern onto the film or paper then stitch right through it. It's designed for machine embroidery, but works for handstitching as well. Make sure that if you get the tear away paper that its the lightest weight available so that it's not murder trying to get a hand needle through it. I found this a! > fast > solution to trying to fudge a curved-hem embroidery into place without having to draw very single repeat in a different size till everything fit. Pin, adjust, pin, fold the pattern slightly, pin - 15 minutes time, tops. > > From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" > Subject: [h-cost] rice paper > > Hi. > Just wanted to ask if any of you ever tryed to use rice paper as transfers of patterns onto fabric. Someone told me i could do that just transferring the pattern to rice paper, and then put the rice paper onto the fabric and then embroider on top of the paper. Then the paper could be removed after the embroidery has finished. > Was thinking about trying that, as i have some ribbed silk i want to embroider onto, and it is impossible to use my old method with pencil. > > Bjarne > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 09:23:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DENmSd031583 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:23:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DELMcP017879; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:21:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DELDAv018358; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:21:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r04.mx.aol.com (imo-r04.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.100]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DELBAv018317 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:21:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id 6.156.2da0700d (24895) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:21:02 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <156.2da0700d.2d5e374e@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:21:02 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The question of whether women wear totally out of date garments does continue to rear its head, doesn't it? I once talked to a volunteer at a 1790s site who didn't like those styles and wanted to continue to wear the 1770s she loved. Gave the argument about being behind the times, etc. I told her I was afraid that was not valid--there are too many extant examples of gowns remade in later styles from earlier fabrics. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 09:26:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DEQXSd031611 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:26:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEMrcP017987; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:22:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEMrAv018976; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:22:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mx.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEMpAv018945 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:22:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.13.) id 6.5b.471dd905 (24895) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:17:37 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <5b.471dd905.2d5e3680@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:17:36 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Now "Legally Blonde" To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/13/2004 2:17:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, hpinto@mindspring.com writes: I had to sit through the first movie and was expecting to hate it; I was also pleasantly surprised- I enjoyed it. I enjoyed it too--saw it on an airplane, so I was a captive audience! Sorry to hear the second wasn't as good. It seemed to have potential, but I never made it to that one. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 09:32:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DEW0Sd031654 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:32:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEVLcP018799; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:31:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEVKAv022554; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:31:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu (kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu [169.147.4.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEVIAv022471 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:31:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ckinsey@kumc.edu) Received: from KUMC-SMTPOUT-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:31:12 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:31:04 -0600 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Help! musty smelling dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I believe it was on this list in the past, that I learned one could try a spritz bottle with half-and-half cheap vodka and water, to get rid of such odors. I'd try a drop on an inside seam first, just in case, though. -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I may have been one of those that mentioned this, I learned about it from a friend who sews for a local rep theater. If I remember right, distilled water was prefered since some areas might have harder water than others. No particular proportions and it was spritzed on the inside. We have used Frebreeze successfully on my husband's faire costumes but we only spritzed on the inside linings which were either cotton or linen. While I have not tried it I have also heard cat litter can remove some odors; put garment and (I think) loose (clean:)!) litter in a large bag and leave for a couple of days. Hadn't heard about the charcoal idea, sounds good, thanks. Do let us know what works :). Catherine who is still trying to picture Talia waiting on someone hand and foot. Not :)! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 09:41:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DEfTSd031707 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:41:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEeicP019424; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:40:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEehAv026742; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:40:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEeeAv026728 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:40:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-37-123.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.37.123]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEedM9025351 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:40:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040213063740.00daa1d0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:40:34 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: <156.2da0700d.2d5e374e@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >The question of whether women wear totally out of date garments does continue >to rear its head, doesn't it? I once talked to a volunteer at a 1790s site >who didn't like those styles and wanted to continue to wear the 1770s she >loved. Gave the argument about being behind the times, etc. I told her I >was >afraid that was not valid--there are too many extant examples of gowns >remade in later styles from earlier fabrics. "Why can't my boss be as reasonable as you folks who actually do know what you're doing", she asked the list, rhetorically. Oh well, at least I got some sympathy, and a few good suggestions. Thanx all. Maybe if I made an outfit so good that she thought it was a real antique, then she'd let me wear it... CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 09:41:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DEffSd031714 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:41:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEcYcP019211; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:38:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEcWAv025658; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:38:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web14009.mail.yahoo.com (web14009.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1DEcUAv025633 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:38:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyforbeys@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040213143830.97839.qmail@web14009.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [24.242.152.154] by web14009.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:38:30 GMT Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:38:30 +0000 (GMT) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Catalina=20Saravia=20Quicedo?= To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <402C052F.4000708@lavoltapress.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] smart women and engineers and historical clothing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO "Engineeers don't like girly girls. They like women who are like them, whether engineers or not. Logical, straightforward, practical" Speaking as the wife, sister, niece, mother and sister-in-law to engineers, this is true. However, my husband looks at costuming as another facet of understanding history. Historical costuming becomes another exercise in engineering when you understand what goes into it. I make all the clothes, but they enjoy wearing them and like to understand why what garments are appropriate to what time period. My husband and engineer daughter are proud of their court clothes not only because they look nice in them, they are proud of my skills. All of them have commented that they could never live with someone significantly less intelligent/logical than they were. ===== Seńora Catalina Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit ___________________________________________________________ BT Yahoo! Broadband - Free modem offer, sign up online today and save Ł80 http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 09:55:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DEtBSd031843 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:55:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEpvcP020312; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:51:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEptAv032005; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:51:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1DEprAv031938 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:51:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCi4yt7cemO+rXNVU+xGexNGyfXqVek+VdQ==">; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:51:23 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JNACTWBV; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:51:23 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:51:10 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Message-ID: <20040213.085110.-501929.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4-9,11-12,14-32 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey! That's a great idea!!! Why don't you reproduce an actual dress from the period that you like either by finding a fashion plate and doing that or by reproducing a surviving gown? 1901 is not so far in the past that surviving examples are rare. Let her tell you that an exact (or as exact as you can get) reproduction isn't appropriate to wear!! Karen On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:40:34 -0800 Carolyn Kayta Barrows writes: > Oh well, at least I got some sympathy, and a few good suggestions. > Thanx all. Maybe if I made an outfit so good that she thought it was a > real antique, then she'd let me wear it... > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 09:58:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DEwnSd031860 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:58:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEw6cP020825; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:58:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEw2Av034773; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:58:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav41.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.98]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DEvwAv034714 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:57:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:57:53 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav41.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:57:53 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040213.085110.-501929.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:57:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2004 14:57:53.0399 (UTC) FILETIME=[C1C19070:01C3F241] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And if you are pattern reliant like I tend to be may I recommend: http://www.pastpatterns.com/106.html http://www.pastpatterns.com/112.html http://www.pastpatterns.com/4879.html http://www.pastpatterns.com/1865.html If you need more let me know. You have my dream job even with all it's failings and I'd be happy to help. B~ ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 9:51 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise > Hey! That's a great idea!!! Why don't you reproduce an actual dress from > the period that you like either by finding a fashion plate and doing that > or by reproducing a surviving gown? 1901 is not so far in the past that > surviving examples are rare. Let her tell you that an exact (or as exact > as you can get) reproduction isn't appropriate to wear!! > > > Karen > > > On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:40:34 -0800 Carolyn Kayta Barrows > writes: > > Oh well, at least I got some sympathy, and a few good suggestions. > > Thanx all. Maybe if I made an outfit so good that she thought it was > a > > real antique, then she'd let me wear it... > > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > > www.FunStuft.com > > > > //// \\\ > > ////-@@\\\ > > (((( 7 ))) > > ((( <> )))) > > ) (((((( > > /----\ /---\)) > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 10:03:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DF3bSd031891 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:03:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DF2ucP021224; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:02:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DF2tAv037319; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:02:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1DF2pAv037251 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:02:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCi4yt7cemO+rlo9ERyQbEUQgc/cRffuMlw==">; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:02:09 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JNADFLXL; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:02:09 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:01:49 -0600 Message-ID: <20040213.090150.-501929.1.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-6 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 1901 Fashions X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO For a start you can look at these patterns to see if there is anything you like. http://www.pastpatterns.com/1900.html Karen ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 10:23:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DFNFSd031980 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:23:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFIpcP022431; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:18:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFIlAv044980; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:18:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m28.mx.aol.com (imo-m28.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.9]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFIkAv044934 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:18:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m28.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.147.22179ef3 (4529) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:13:21 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <147.22179ef3.2d5e4391@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:13:21 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/13/2004 9:58:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com writes: > http://www.pastpatterns.com/106.html > This pattern sux! Don't get it! It is not what is pictured on the envelope. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 10:39:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DFddSd032091 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:39:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFbbcP023844; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:37:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFbYAv055396; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:37:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFbTAv055280 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:37:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be8c.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.140]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 3BE594800F4 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:37:21 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <001001c3f247$50183770$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:37:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] regency embroidery patterns X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1DFddSd032091 Status: RO Sunny Buchler. If you email me your address, i shall send the patterns for you. My email is: drewscph@post12.tele.dk Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 10:42:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DFgJSd032106 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:42:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFfecP024177; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:41:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFfdAv057733; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:41:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav18.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFfZAv057644 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:41:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 07:24:14 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav18.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:24:13 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <147.22179ef3.2d5e4391@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:24:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2004 15:24:14.0029 (UTC) FILETIME=[6FE28FD0:01C3F245] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well I've used it sorry you had problems with it. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 10:13 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise > In a message dated 2/13/2004 9:58:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, > wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com writes: > > > http://www.pastpatterns.com/106.html > > > > This pattern sux! Don't get it! It is not what is pictured on the envelope. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 10:43:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DFhUSd032121 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:43:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFeJcP024044; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:40:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFeFAv056954; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:40:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFeEAv056924 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:40:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Received: from grouse.mail.pas.earthlink.net (grouse.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.116]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1DE48I16809 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:04:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from 209-165-56-015.jps.net ([209.165.56.15] helo=pavilion) by grouse.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Arduy-0004Ce-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:03:44 -0800 Message-ID: <003901c3f23b$96a69e40$0f38a5d1@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com><200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com><001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO><200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com><4.3.1.2.20040212000936.051f2930@mail.frys.com> <021101c3f143$038ab270$92e34a43@HELENPINTO> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Now "Legally Blonde" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 06:13:42 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think the basic problem with sequels is that in the first book or episode a character has a certain flaw to overcome, perhaps insecurity, ability to trust, find love etc and the events of the story assist the protagonist in overcoming this and all ends well. In stories such as legally blonde two and the second book of Bridget Jones' Diary the Elle and Bridget revert back to their old ways in the beginning of the new episodes and it's as if they made some psychological digression and it's very disappointing. They need new challenges not a re-hashing of old demons or what was the point of their success in the first installment???? Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 12:34 AM Subject: [h-cost] Now "Legally Blonde" > I had to sit through the first movie and was expecting to hate it; I was > also pleasantly surprised- I enjoyed it. That made me want to see the > second one; unfortunately, it's nowhere near as good, and I really disliked > it. > -Helen/Aidan > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 10:59:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DFxoSd032198 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:59:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFx8cP025895; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:59:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFx4Av068007; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:59:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com (imo-m24.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DFwnAv067832 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:58:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.dc.348cf65 (4529) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:48:14 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:48:13 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/13/2004 10:42:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com writes: > Well I've used it sorry you had problems with it. > You think the pattern looks like what is on the envelope???? I'm sure it works and is even a true period pattern, but I bought it because of that was pictured on the envelope, and that isn't what I got. I did find a real corset that looks like the envelope picture and made my own pattern from it. Would you like one [since you obviously "do" this period]? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 11:20:06 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DGK6Sd032288 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:20:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGI8cP027776; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:18:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGI5Av080011; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:18:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r09.mx.aol.com (imo-r09.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.105]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGI3Av079950 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:18:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from M311@aol.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.229]) by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id RELAYIN3-4402cf76523a; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:12:21 -0500 Received: from M311@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.18c.25ad19cf (3310) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:07:03 -0500 (EST) From: M311@aol.com Message-ID: <18c.25ad19cf.2d5e5027@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:07:03 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5006 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: rice paper X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/13/2004 9:04:39 AM Central Standard Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: Just wanted to ask if any of you ever tryed to use rice paper as transfers of patterns onto fabric. Someone told me i could do that just transferring the pattern to rice paper I haven't done this but I do have a suggestion. I think it depends on the kind of rice paper you use. I use a type of rice paper that is for lining cloth daipers. I think that kind would be the okay to use, it doesn't take much to tear it, it is thin and it is very see through. I got mine at Earthbaby: http://earthbaby.com/ My mom used to decorate cakes for a living. She used a rice paper to trace designs on then decorate the paper. That rice paper tears real easily, is softer and I think it might work also. I know she just got it from the cake shop. I think Wiltons might sell it online. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 11:34:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DGY4Sd032348 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:34:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGXHcP029105; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:33:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGXCAv089848; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:33:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (IDENT:vDHoZGGIi07we5+3ClpOk0lD2SbJWc77@jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGXAAv089817 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:33:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.10/8.12.3) with SMTP id i1DGX92v006103 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:33:09 -0500 Message-Id: <200402131633.i1DGX92v006103@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:33:04 -0000 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: rice paper From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Bjarne, Would you tell us why pencilling the design onto the fabric would not work? Is it because the silk has ridges? I think you said it was faille? I wonder if you could pencil on enough to see what you are doing, even if it's not as complete and perfect as when you mark the design onto smooth fabric. With the fine threads and delicate stitches, I would be concerned that tearing away the rice paper would distort the embroidery stitches. Another idea is to thread trace the designs - run a thread instead of marking with a pencil. This could define the shapes of the major motifs, though again you would not mark the small details. You could embroider over the thread trace, or remove it afterward. I don't think it would disturb the embroidery as much as tearing away the paper would do. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 11:53:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DGrUSd032409 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:53:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGo9cP000705; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:50:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGo5Av000876; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:50:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGo1Aw000819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:50:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1DGkEPp031200 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:46:14 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:46:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <402D0036.9090307@thibault.org> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:49:58 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: rice paper References: <18c.25ad19cf.2d5e5027@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <18c.25ad19cf.2d5e5027@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO M311@aol.com wrote: > I haven't done this but I do have a suggestion. I think it depends on the > kind of rice paper you use. I use a type of rice paper that is for lining cloth diapers Oh, right! Check what sort of thing you are talking about, and English may have different meanings than what is available in your area, Bjarne. "Rice paper" most commonly here in the US is a paper with lots of swirly fibers in it and somewhat translucent, very pretty, but has very little to do with rice at all! Then there are rice wrappers, used in asian foods, and apparently the stuff for diapers, and probably lots of other things called "rice paper." -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent Fear of the number thirteen: triskaidekaphobia fear of Friday the 13th: paraskevidekatriaphobia _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 11:54:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DGsBSd032415 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:54:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGrOcP001005; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:53:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGrMAv003132; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:53:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav70.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.205]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DGrHAv003059 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:53:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 08:35:55 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav70.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:35:54 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:36:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2004 16:35:55.0065 (UTC) FILETIME=[73809290:01C3F24F] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm not sure where you had the trouble with this pattern. Was it sizing? Was it style? Instructions? I've used this one and many of Saundra Altman's other patterns and hope to carry them on my website by summer. I'm always willing to hear problems people may have with a certain pattern to decided whether I should carry it on my site or not. I even test them myself on occasion. I don't "do" this period often but I do it often enough to have a number of patterns of this era. I tend to veer towards late Victorian and in fact recently suggested someone interested in the time line do the 1880's polonaise pattern put out by this company. B~ ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 10:48 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise > In a message dated 2/13/2004 10:42:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, > wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com writes: > > > Well I've used it sorry you had problems with it. > > > > You think the pattern looks like what is on the envelope???? > I'm sure it works and is even a true period pattern, but I bought it because > of that was pictured on the envelope, and that isn't what I got. > > I did find a real corset that looks like the envelope picture and made my own > pattern from it. Would you like one [since you obviously "do" this period]? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 12:26:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DHQdSd032577 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:26:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DHNOcP003853; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:23:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DHNHAv023566; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:23:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav34.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DHNFAv023475 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 10:23:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:05:53 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav34.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:05:52 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <18c.25ad19cf.2d5e5027@aol.com> <402D0036.9090307@thibault.org> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: rice paper Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:05:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2004 17:05:53.0028 (UTC) FILETIME=[A32BF440:01C3F253] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Then there is cosmetic rice paper with a fine powder on it used to get the glare off one's nose. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cynthia Virtue" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 11:49 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: rice paper > M311@aol.com wrote: > > > I haven't done this but I do have a suggestion. I think it depends on the > > kind of rice paper you use. I use a type of rice paper that is for lining cloth diapers > > Oh, right! Check what sort of thing you are talking about, and English > may have different meanings than what is available in your area, Bjarne. > "Rice paper" most commonly here in the US is a paper with lots of > swirly fibers in it and somewhat translucent, very pretty, but has very > little to do with rice at all! Then there are rice wrappers, used in > asian foods, and apparently the stuff for diapers, and probably lots of > other things called "rice paper." > > -- > Cynthia Virtue and/or > Cynthia du Pré Argent > > Fear of the number thirteen: triskaidekaphobia > fear of Friday the 13th: paraskevidekatriaphobia > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 13:28:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DISWSd000521 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:28:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DIQUcP010118; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:26:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DIQOAv066935; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:26:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DIQKAw066893 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=FAIL) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 11:26:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from lavoltapress.com (dial-209-148-112-178.sonic.net [209.148.112.178]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1DH8q6C028554 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:08:54 -0800 Message-ID: <402D0584.7030608@lavoltapress.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 09:12:36 -0800 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] smart women and engineers and historical clothing References: <20040213143830.97839.qmail@web14009.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20040213143830.97839.qmail@web14009.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >ineers or not. Logical, >straightforward, practical" > >Speaking as the wife, sister, niece, mother and >sister-in-law to engineers, this is true. However, my >husband looks at costuming as another facet of >understanding history. > > So does mine. But that has nothing to do with whether I am a "girly girl"--which I am not. Fran Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 14:44:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DJi1Sd000804 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:44:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJgmcP017850; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:42:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJgXAv015380; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:42:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pop2b.ripco.com (root@pop2b.ripco.com [209.100.227.27]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJgTAv015349 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:42:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zski@ripco.com) Received: from ripco.com (cybil2.ripco.com [209.100.224.203]) by pop2b.ripco.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1DJIBvN017704 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:18:11 -0600 (CST) From: zski@ripco.com To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:19:39 -0600 X-Mailer: CWMail Web to Mail Gateway 2.8c, http://netwinsite.com/top_mail.htm Message-id: <402d234e.18363.0@ripco.com> X-User-Info: 12.168.24.203 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: girly-girls X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am reminded of a guy I was dating - when I mentioned that I was "not a girly-girl", he replied "Oh, I know you're a girl - I checked!". Wendy Z giggling in Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 14:54:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DJsCSd000850 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:54:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJowcP018611; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:50:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJovAv020414; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:50:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.istop.com (dci.doncaster.on.ca [66.11.168.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJonAv020351 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:50:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from skud@infotrope.net) Received: from eggnog (skud.ott.istop.com [66.11.173.11]) by smtp.istop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4C0717C485 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:50:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from skud by eggnog with local (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1ArjK9-0003rf-00 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:50:05 -0500 To: Historical Costume Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:50:05 -0500 Message-Id: From: Kirrily Robert X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Hussars (early 19th century) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Can anyone give me some leads to online information about Hussars uniforms in the early 19th century? I'm writing something involving a character attached to the Swedish military and during the Napoleonic wars, who is described (by the person who created the original character) as wearing one, but I'm not quite sure what that entails. So far I've managed to figure out that there's decorative braid on the jacket, and a silly hat :) K. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 14:58:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DJwWSd000862 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:58:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJvqcP019110; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:57:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJvoAv024271; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:57:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DJvjAv024224 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:57:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be8c.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.140]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 455C047FF03 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:57:44 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000a01c3f26b$b4e588f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:58:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] danish peassant costume reconstrukted X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1DJwWSd000862 Status: RO Hi. I stumbled over this and thoaght i would share it with you. Very fine made rekonstrukted peassant costumes for folkdansers. http://www.lisbeth-green.dk/FOTO/photo.htm Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 15:01:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DK1dSd000882 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:01:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DK0rcP019351; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:00:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DK0qAv026138; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:00:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DK0lAw026045 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:00:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1DK8MLP007594 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:08:24 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040213115001.02806e50@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:00:38 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: girly-girls In-Reply-To: <402d234e.18363.0@ripco.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm curious about what constitutes a girly-girl. I'm a heavy-duty gardener; my last big project was digging a 70' long drainage ditch deeper than I am tall, putting in the drainpipe and water lines, and covering it up. It had to be done by hand because there was no way to get excavation machinery to the location. My current project is digging out the top 2' of the front yard, carting the adobe-clay in my commercial-strength trailer (a birthday present from Hubby!) to a waste site, putting in an irrigation system, and replacing the soil with wood chips that will become wonderous compost-soil in a couple years. Then the hundreds of roses will have a permanent home. BUT -- I also like to wear long skirts and pretty dresses inside the house. I even like having to pull up my long skirts when climbing the stairs! I don't think I'm a girly-girl if it means being a simpering twit, but I do like to be feminine. Of the two, I think Hubby likes my gardening more than my looking pretty when he comes home from work . However, he does brag about my zuppa toscana and chicken fricasee ... Katie At 01:19 PM 2/13/2004 -0600, you wrote: >I am reminded of a guy I was dating - when I mentioned that I was "not a >girly-girl", he replied "Oh, I know you're a girl - I checked!". > >Wendy Z >giggling in >Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 15:39:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DKdRSd001078 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:39:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DKbGcP022007; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:37:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DKb4Av046762; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:37:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DKb2Av046683 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:37:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from alfalfapress.com (c-24-21-157-61.client.comcast.net [24.21.157.61]) by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1DKavS15317 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:36:57 -0500 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:44:45 -0800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Althea Turner To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <75443774-5E65-11D8-B76F-000393C0A652@alfalfapress.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] digital microscopes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings, I just had to share this with folks who would get it. :D I stopped in my local Mac computer store to get ink cartridges. I was waiting at the register and glanced over at the "New Gizmos" table. I saw a digital microscope hooked up to an ibook. I got a glint in my eye and asked the cashier to demo it for me. Big Mistake. lol I now have a digital microscope that can go up to 50x and I can burn the images right to CD. Tres facile! :D :D :D I got the 50x lens, with variable field of focus for $198. The whole kit with several lens up to 200x costs about $700. A bit rich for my blood, but something to consider after I marry wealthy. I can't wait to try it out. It's on order and should be here in a couple weeks. Oh, it will be fun to take to museums this summer. :D Althea Turner *** althea@alfalfapress.com *** http://www.alfalfapress.com Public Relations Manager Sauron/Voldemort 2004 "One Bling to rule them all" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 16:09:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DL97Sd001197 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:09:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DL1ucP024081; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:01:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DL1pAv061525; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:01:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DL1mAv061496 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:01:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1ArkRW-000Fw2-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:01:47 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:00:37 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> <200402122337.24530.cathy@thyrsus.com> In-Reply-To: <200402122337.24530.cathy@thyrsus.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In message <200402122337.24530.cathy@thyrsus.com>, Catherine Olanich Raymond writes >On Wednesday 11 February 2004 11:17 pm, Heather Rose Jones wrote: > >> If you ever have an evening to kill and a Legally Blonde video at >> hand, you might be pleasantly surprised. (I was.) The movies are -- >> in a rather twisted way -- very much about _not_ judging people's >> abilities or intelligence by appearance or style. The protagonist is >> ditzy, yes, (and girly) but she succeeds because she's smart (both >> book-smart and people-smart), holds to her principles, and never >> gives up. I was really startled to find myself thoroughly enjoying >> them -- radical femininst that I am. > >I'll cheerfully take your word for it. > >I'm aware that the character actually is bright and succeeds on merit. But I >suspect that her love of bubblegum pink would annoy me enough to distract me >from enjoying her triumphs. :-) > I'm going nuts looking at this spring's fashion - everything's bloomin' pink!!! Now, OK, I'm red haired so pink is never going to be my best colour, but I just cannot understand why any adult woman would want to wear pink in these quantities. Eeeeugh! Sorry. Thanks for letting me vent. Jean -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 16:26:06 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DLQ5Sd001286 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:26:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DLLDcP025878; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:21:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DLL9Av076094; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:21:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DLL4Aw076054 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:21:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1DLSlLP026356 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:28:48 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040213131007.027d4ed0@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 13:21:02 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! In-Reply-To: References: <200402122337.24530.cathy@thyrsus.com> <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com> <200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> <200402122337.24530.cathy@thyrsus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO As I keep telling Hubby ... fashion and style have nothing to do with attractiveness and taste. All you have to do is look at some of the teenagers these days. A couple days ago I saw a young guy -- the crotch of his pants was almost down to his knees and he had to hold his crotch-seam up in order to walk! Tall and blonde, I wear a lot of pink tops and blue jeans with a high waist, even though I am in my late 50s. Put me in a blue top and my color completely washes away. Better yet, long circle-skirts that are lined so that they make swishing sounds when I walk ... For me, ready-to-wear rarely fits well anyway, so if I'm gonna sew, I'm gonna sew what *I* like. To heck with fashion! Katie >I'm going nuts looking at this spring's fashion - everything's bloomin' >pink!!! Now, OK, I'm red haired so pink is never going to be my best >colour, but I just cannot understand why any adult woman would want to >wear pink in these quantities. Eeeeugh! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 16:29:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DLT9Sd001302 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:29:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DLQgcP026419; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:26:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DLQdAv079307; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:26:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com (imo-m24.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DLQaAv079220 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 14:26:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.d8.350d096 (3948) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:21:11 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:21:11 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hussars (early 19th century) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/13/2004 2:51:25 PM Eastern Standard Time, skud@infotrope.net writes: Can anyone give me some leads to online information about Hussars uniforms in the early 19th century? "Age of Napoleon" (catalogue from exhibit at the Met) has a chapter on military uniforms, including Hussars. "Revolution in Fashion" also has a Hussar uniform in the back, as explanation for the "a la Hussar" style for women. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 17:02:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DM2sSd001385 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:02:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DM0acP029440; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:00:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DM0RAv099503; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:00:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DM0MAw099465 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:00:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1DMOHWm003577 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:24:17 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.105] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A91C281A00E2; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:01:00 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01c3f27d$8292d300$695183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402131633.i1DGX92v006103@jefferson.patriot.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: rice paper Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:05:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is the method that I used when I was working on y daughters wedding gown. My problem at that time was #1, the fabric was shantung and of course, slubbed. And #2, I had trouble finding the dainty design or transfer that suited the project. Solution for the design was found in a book of ribbon embroidery. Except, we wanted traditional needlework. I 'threaded the basic design on the fabric, marking the places for the larger motifs. Initially, it was a pain when I started, but as the work went along, I was gratified that the intricacies worked up well with great uniformity. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 11:33 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: rice paper > > Hi Bjarne, > > Would you tell us why pencilling the design onto the fabric would not > work? Is it because the silk has ridges? I think you said it was faille? I > wonder if you could pencil on enough to see what you are doing, even if it's > not as complete and perfect as when you mark the design onto smooth fabric. > > With the fine threads and delicate stitches, I would be concerned that > tearing away the rice paper would distort the embroidery stitches. > > Another idea is to thread trace the designs - run a thread instead of > marking with a pencil. This could define the shapes of the major motifs, > though again you would not mark the small details. You could embroider over > the thread trace, or remove it afterward. I don't think it would disturb the > embroidery as much as tearing away the paper would do. > > -Carol > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 17:05:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DM5vSd001393 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:05:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DM5AcP029862; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:05:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DM57Av002368; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:05:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DM54Aw002340 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:05:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1DMSxWm007096 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:28:59 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.105] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA371DF00100; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:05:43 -0500 Message-ID: <002101c3f27e$2b707fe0$695183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hussars (early 19th century) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:10:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO All three films of War and Peace have lots of various uniforms that probably include Hussars. I suspect that the basic shape is the same for the particular colors would be important as would the frogging and other trim. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kirrily Robert" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 2:50 PM Subject: [h-cost] Hussars (early 19th century) > Can anyone give me some leads to online information about Hussars > uniforms in the early 19th century? I'm writing something involving a > character attached to the Swedish military and during the Napoleonic > wars, who is described (by the person who created the original > character) as wearing one, but I'm not quite sure what that entails. So > far I've managed to figure out that there's decorative braid on the > jacket, and a silly hat :) > > K. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 18:04:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DN4DSd001624 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:04:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DN3VcP006830; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:03:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DN3SAv037863; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:03:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DN3NAv037844 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:03:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.121.247]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1Arjrj-0002MU-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:24:47 -0800 Received: from dialup-67.74.234.23.dial1.baltimore1.level3.net ([67.74.234.23] helo=HELENPINTO) by firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Arjrh-0002vY-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 12:24:46 -0800 Message-ID: <026001c3f26f$5dbd6210$17ea4a43@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Help! musty smelling dress Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:24:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9ef5a5316ecf921f7316eb3b664394fdf8e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bookbinders use charcoal and kitty litter to remove musty smells from books; I think it would work with the dress. You will need two containers- a small one without a lid to hold the dress and a larger one with a lid to hold the first one and the charcoal/kitty litter. Put the large container where it won't be disturbed, and fill it with a layer of charcoal/kitty litter. Put the dress in the smaller one, rest it on top of the charcoal/kitty litter, and seal the lid. Check it every couple of days, and re-fold the dress so another part is on top. It should lose the odor in about a week. -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 18:23:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1DNNLSd001692 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:23:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DNJccP009196; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:19:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DNJWAv048069; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:19:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r07.mx.aol.com (imo-r07.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.103]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DNJVAv048010 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:19:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.7d.46a0cd00 (3932) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:14:13 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <7d.46a0cd00.2d5eb445@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:14:13 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hussars (early 19th century) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/13/2004 5:05:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, rmitchell@washjeff.edu writes: So > far I've managed to figure out that there's decorative braid on the > jacket Also lots of decorative braid on the pantaloons. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 19:00:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E00eSd001865 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 19:00:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DNxqcP015799; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:59:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DNxi57071919; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:59:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DNxf57071892 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:59:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-126-14.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.126.14]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1DNxca4015533 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:59:39 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040213142025.00db53b0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 15:59:30 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: References: <20040213.085110.-501929.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >And if you are pattern reliant like I tend to be may I recommend: > >http://www.pastpatterns.com/4879.html Since this is the middle of my favorite period, I already have a comfortable straight-front corset made, plus basic skirt and basic shirtwaist patterns. And Janet Arnold III has a couple more patterns from the period. I also have a couple of skirts and shirtwaists made up. Thanx everybody for the encouragement. I think my next Edwardian project will be copying the c.1898 bodice I own, which will need to be re-created at twice it's original size so it will fit me. The front of the bodice has a black beaded sheer panel that hangs over a pouch-front panel of startling chartreuse velvet. The rest of the fabric is mostly maroon, woven with raised elements in black. There are bright green silk cuff facings that don't show from the outside, and the rest of the lining is brown glazed cotton. I have maroon fabric and velvet for the re-creation, tho if I could find more of that bright chartreuse silk velvet I'd use that. If my boss doesn't like that, when I wear one and hand her the other, I may well drop out of the program. >If you need more let me know. You have my dream job even with all it's >failings and I'd be happy to help. Thanx for pointing me toward those patterns. I may buy myself that 4879, even tho I will have to seriously size it up to fit. But I don't think unpaid volunteer docent is anyone's dream job, especially at lunch and parking prices in San Francisco. Another thing my boss doesn't understand is how anyone would want to go off site in costume to eat lunch. I delight in doing this, in first person if I can. So now that our budget and our attendance are down, I will take fliers with me next time, so people in the area can find our site. (I finally got her to say if anyone wanted to do this they could, because she sure wasn't going anywhere she didn't have to in the uncomfortable corset she wears.) CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 19:19:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E0JrSd001948 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 19:19:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E0GhcP017253; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:16:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E0Gd57079321; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:16:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E0Gc57079278 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:16:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fd5.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.213]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 8517147FEFF for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:16:32 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000a01c3f28f$d980ae00$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:16:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] swedish hussards X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1E0JrSd001948 Status: RO I tryed to search in swedish and i only found this site with pictures. There are very few websites with pictures of swedish uniforms, dont know why. http://www.algonet.se/~hogman/uniformer_armen_18.htm#1810-tal: Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 19:39:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E0dBSd002032 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 19:39:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E0cUcP018740; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:38:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E0cN57088050; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:38:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav52.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.41]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E0cK57087975 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:38:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 16:21:00 -0800 Received: from 24.58.97.140 by bay1-dav52.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 00:20:59 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.97.140] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040213.085110.-501929.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> <4.3.1.2.20040213142025.00db53b0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 19:21:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Feb 2004 00:21:00.0053 (UTC) FILETIME=[6C2BD450:01C3F290] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn you answered your own question. Yes it's an unpaid job yes conditions are far from ideal but you are doing it!! ----- Original Message ----- > >If you need more let me know. You have my dream job even with all it's > >failings and I'd be happy to help. > > Thanx for pointing me toward those patterns. I may buy myself that 4879, > even tho I will have to seriously size it up to fit. But I don't think > unpaid volunteer docent is anyone's dream job, especially at lunch and > parking prices in San Francisco. > > Another thing my boss doesn't understand is how anyone would want to go off > site in costume to eat lunch. I delight in doing this, in first person if > I can. So now that our budget and our attendance are down, I will take > fliers with me next time, so people in the area can find our site. (I > finally got her to say if anyone wanted to do this they could, because she > sure wasn't going anywhere she didn't have to in the uncomfortable corset > she wears.) > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 20:20:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E1KwSd002213 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:20:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E1HjcP021426; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:17:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E1Hg57003095; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:17:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E1Hf57003082 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 18:17:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-126-14.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.126.14]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E1GkhG002989 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:16:46 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040213171232.04c2f3a0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 17:17:36 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: References: <20040213.085110.-501929.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> <4.3.1.2.20040213142025.00db53b0@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Carolyn you answered your own question. Yes it's an unpaid job yes >conditions are far from ideal but you are doing it!! I do it because I like the site and I like the period and I want other people to have a chance at liking history. Some of them vote, and that's good too because one of our historical structures has just gotten a government allocation to be completely restored before it falls apart. But I wish there were a nice clean antidote to my boss. (God bless the Tzar, and keep the Tzar - far away from here.) CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 21:19:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E2JBSd002407 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:19:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E2G3cP024207; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 19:16:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E2Fx57023073; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 19:16:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from berlinr.sprint.ca (berlinr.sprint.ca [209.5.194.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E2Fv57023059 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 19:15:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from shooie@sprint.ca) Received: from shooie ([149.99.68.99]) by orval.sprint.ca (InterMail vM.5.01.02.00 201-253-122-103-101-20001108) with SMTP id <20040214021250.OTMN19825.orval.sprint.ca@shooie> for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:12:50 -0500 Message-ID: <014501c3f2a0$960e13e0$cb6afea9@shooie> From: "Sheridan & Shane" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040212.183047.-504949.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help!! Musty smelling dress Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:15:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings! I don't remember if it was ever posted on this list, but a trick that some Middle Eastern dancers use on their often very expensive, unwashable costumes is to (as previously mentioned) hang the costume in the sun, or to 'smoke' the garment with a *very* good quality incense. I use our bathroom as it is quite small; an empty closet would work as well. I hang my dresses and tops on the shower curtain rod and use several sticks of my preferred incense. I put a towel down in front of the door to keep the smoke in, and keep my fire alarm from going berserk. :-) It works like a charm, and makes my costumes smell nice. Usually I let my garments hang and air for a bit before I put them back in the costume closet. So far this has worked very well for me, for someone with scent alergies I would find another way. Hope this is a help to someone, Sheridan =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Not one shred of evidence supports the notion that life is serious. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 22:28:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E3SdSd002669 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:28:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E3PIcP026668; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:25:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E3PA57044404; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:25:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E3P758044385 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 20:25:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1E3n6Wm018740 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:49:06 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A5396ED40074; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:25:45 -0500 Message-ID: <001201c3f2aa$e171ce80$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040213.085110.-501929.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> <4.3.1.2.20040213142025.00db53b0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:30:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn, your description reminds me of one I have from the same period. The main fabric is a brocade of brownish purple brocade (aubrogene?) The inner accents are chartruese and coral. The sheer front facings are of a bright green in the same tone; also the ruffled edges of the sleeve facings. And like the unexpected pinks of the period, I was unprepared for this unusual shade of green...especially with the 'purple brown' of the main faabric. What was equally surprising is the pale salmon of the faille evening skirt that was mated with it! Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 6:59 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise > > >And if you are pattern reliant like I tend to be may I recommend: > > > >http://www.pastpatterns.com/4879.html > > Since this is the middle of my favorite period, I already have a > comfortable straight-front corset made, plus basic skirt and basic > shirtwaist patterns. And Janet Arnold III has a couple more patterns from > the period. I also have a couple of skirts and shirtwaists made up. > > Thanx everybody for the encouragement. I think my next Edwardian project > will be copying the c.1898 bodice I own, which will need to be re-created > at twice it's original size so it will fit me. The front of the bodice has > a black beaded sheer panel that hangs over a pouch-front panel of startling > chartreuse velvet. The rest of the fabric is mostly maroon, woven with > raised elements in black. There are bright green silk cuff facings that > don't show from the outside, and the rest of the lining is brown glazed > cotton. I have maroon fabric and velvet for the re-creation, tho if I > could find more of that bright chartreuse silk velvet I'd use that. If my > boss doesn't like that, when I wear one and hand her the other, I may well > drop out of the program. > > >If you need more let me know. You have my dream job even with all it's > >failings and I'd be happy to help. > > Thanx for pointing me toward those patterns. I may buy myself that 4879, > even tho I will have to seriously size it up to fit. But I don't think > unpaid volunteer docent is anyone's dream job, especially at lunch and > parking prices in San Francisco. > > Another thing my boss doesn't understand is how anyone would want to go off > site in costume to eat lunch. I delight in doing this, in first person if > I can. So now that our budget and our attendance are down, I will take > fliers with me next time, so people in the area can find our site. (I > finally got her to say if anyone wanted to do this they could, because she > sure wasn't going anywhere she didn't have to in the uncomfortable corset > she wears.) > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 23:00:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E40oSd002710 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:00:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E409cP028597; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:00:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E40657055373; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:00:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E40457055358 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:00:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from casamai@sbcglobal.net) Received: from casamai (adsl-66-138-142-166.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net [66.138.142.166]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1E3saa5010152 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:54:37 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003701c3f2ae$505847e0$3ce3fea9@sbcglobal.net> From: "Bruce & Nora Mai" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402101900.i1AJ0Xl6034165@net.indra.com><001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO><200402102208.44052.cathy@thyrsus.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:52:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Cholis (was: saris) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Fat Chance Belly Dance has produced a farily accurate choli pattern that's adaptable up to a D-cup and beyond. They specialize in Tribal style so have done considerable research particularly on wearability. BTW - most cholis fasten (usually tie) in the back at mid back and neck. Nora _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 13 23:26:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E4QnSd002777 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:26:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E4NfcP029659; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:23:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E4Nd57062320; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:23:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E4Nb57062311 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:23:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from casamai@sbcglobal.net) Received: from casamai (adsl-66-138-142-166.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net [66.138.142.166]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1E3saa3010152 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:54:37 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003601c3f2ae$500bfca0$3ce3fea9@sbcglobal.net> From: "Bruce & Nora Mai" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002001c3eff3$7d9eb3f0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <005e01c3f090$299fc800$a3ef8051@dan> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Silk dupioni satin? Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 21:49:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dupioni & Satin are both weaves and generally very different in appearance. Both can be be made in a variety of weights, although most silk dupioni you see is fairly light. As for the iridescence/cross-weave effect in dupionis - they can often be found in solids but frequently look slightly iridescent due to the sheen & irregularity of the fibers. The cross-weaves are currently more popular so you will definitely see them more often but most fabric stores can special order dupioni in dozens of colors; the place I used to work at had close to 100 different colors available to order. Nora _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 01:24:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E6NxSd003102 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:24:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6LvcP003750; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:21:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6Lt57097618; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:21:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6Lq57097600 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:21:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-35-69.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.35.69]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6KvhG020695 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:20:57 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040213220207.04c0a800@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:21:42 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: <001201c3f2aa$e171ce80$665183d1@rmitchellras> References: <20040213.085110.-501929.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> <4.3.1.2.20040213142025.00db53b0@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Carolyn, your description reminds me of one I have from the same period. The >main fabric is a brocade of brownish purple brocade (aubrogene?) Aubergine, meaning 'eggplant' in French. Puce, a more brownish purple, comes from the French for blood or for flea (the dictionary would know), and it was named, in Bay Privateer period, for the color of a blood-filled flea. I'm using a puce-maroon colored cotton damask for my copy, with maroon velvet and black beads. >The inner >accents are chartruese and coral. The sheer front facings are of a bright >green in the same tone; also the ruffled edges of the sleeve facings. And >like the unexpected pinks of the period, I was unprepared for this unusual >shade of green...especially with the 'purple brown' of the main faabric. >What was equally surprising is the pale salmon of the faille evening skirt >that was mated with it! My bodice didn't come with a skirt. It has the shoulder detailing so common just before 1900, but the front pooches down over the waistband a little, as was common after 1900. The beaded overlay hangs in bands down to the waist, and the pooched velvet under it only pooches between these bands, lying flat under them. The sheer overlay is black, as is all the beading (I collected nailheads for many years to get enough of the right sizes). I should probably lay the bodice on my scanner so I can have copies of the beadwork for reference while I work. If I really do scan it, I will have to post the scans someplace we can all see them. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 01:28:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E6S1Sd003111 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:28:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6OtcP003863; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:24:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6Os57098498; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:24:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6Oq58098487 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:24:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6PW8v021479 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:25:32 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1E6PWlK021477 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:25:32 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] danish peassant costume reconstrukted Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:25:32 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <000a01c3f26b$b4e588f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <000a01c3f26b$b4e588f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402140125.32520.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Friday 13 February 2004 02:58 pm, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Hi. > I stumbled over this and thoaght i would share it with you. > Very fine made rekonstrukted peassant costumes for folkdansers. > http://www.lisbeth-green.dk/FOTO/photo.htm' Thank you so much for sending the URL--I found this page very interesting. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 01:32:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E6WMSd003144 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:32:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6VTcP004075; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:31:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6VM57000661; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:31:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6VH58000632 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2004 23:31:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E6Vv8v021538 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:31:57 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1E6VvSj021536 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:31:57 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:31:57 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <4.3.1.2.20040212154627.05a991b0@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20040213000131.057d0f00@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040213000131.057d0f00@mail.frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402140131.57571.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Friday 13 February 2004 03:19 am, Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > >But I just don't believe bustle dresses in a > > > big city like San Francisco in 1901, which the boss seems to think is > > > perfectly acceptable. > > > >I can believe that there would still be bustle-wearers in 1901, even in a > >bigger city than San Francisco. What I doubt is that they would be > > common, and they certainly wouldn't be worn by fashionable women. > > I too wear garments that are 10 or 20 years old, but not the ones so dated > that they read like their original decade. I prefer wearing those older > garments that are sufficiently classic that they look ok in the current > decade. So do I. But there are always going to be a few eccentrics and/or elderly folk who disagree. However, I agree with you completely that your boss is wrong in okaying bustle wearing for 1901 reenactors. It gives a misleading impression for a reenactor, particularly one who is speaking and interacting directly with the public, to wear a fashion that was outdated and would have been obsolete and rare in period. > > But the 1880s silhouette is very different from that of 1901. Quite true. For that matter, the 1895 silhouette is very different from 1901, though most of the difference there is above the waist. >So I can > sort-of believe someone still wearing an 1880s bodice in 1901, if she was > poor, unfashionable, or old, because the shape is sort-of similar to what > was current. But I think the wearer would have been remade the skirt to > modernize it a little, (and there's certainly enough material in them for > that) or at least worn it without the bustle understructure. I'm not sure you could wear a late 1880's bustle skirt without the understructure without remaking it to redistribute the fabric, at least. You make a good point that most women would have reshaped theirs so they could continue to wear them. >Some > fashionable 1889 and 1890 skirts look like mid-1880s skirts that have had > their understructures, and some of their drapery, recently removed. I haven't seen any examples of what you mean, but I can well believe they exist. > > But I think we're in agreement that the mid-1880s look is not the 1901 look > my boss says she wants. We sure are! Thanks for your comments. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 04:46:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1E9ktSd031779 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 04:46:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E9j2cP010403; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 02:45:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E9is57056931; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 02:44:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E9ir57056921 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 02:44:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-35-69.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.35.69]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1E9io5m022015 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:44:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040214013750.059b0f00@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:44:31 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: <200402140131.57571.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <4.3.1.2.20040213000131.057d0f00@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20040212154627.05a991b0@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20040213000131.057d0f00@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >However, I agree with you completely that your boss is wrong in okaying >bustle >wearing for 1901 reenactors. It gives a misleading impression for a >reenactor, particularly one who is speaking and interacting directly with the >public, to wear a fashion that was outdated and would have been obsolete and >rare in period. Misleading impression - that's the phrase I was looking for. While I could believe a mid-80s house dress being worn well into the 90s, house dresses don't have much bustle. Everything about even a slightly fashionable mid-80s dress clashes with the 1901 silhouette. >For that matter, the 1895 silhouette is very different from 1901, >though most of the difference there is above the waist. The skirt is different too. mid-90s skirts are relatively cone-shaped, while as early as 1898 skirts lose that shape and all the material sweeps to the back. >You make a good point that most women would have reshaped theirs so they >could continue to wear them. Museums are full of examples of this, from many different decades. And I think bed quilts got the scraps. > >Some > > fashionable 1889 and 1890 skirts look like mid-1880s skirts that have had > > their understructures, and some of their drapery, recently removed. > >I haven't seen any examples of what you mean, but I can well believe they >exist. The bustle kind-of softens, shrinks, and slowly goes away, leaving most of the fabric behind (no pun intended). > > But I think we're in agreement that the mid-1880s look is not the 1901 look > > my boss says she wants. > >We sure are! Thanks for your comments. And thanx for yours. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 09:10:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1EEAeSd032621 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:10:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EE7ScP017802; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 07:07:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EE7M57024792; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 07:07:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EE7J58024777 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 07:07:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1EEVQWm003310 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:31:26 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.116] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id ABB62EC800E6; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:07:50 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01c3f304$958d73c0$745183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040213.085110.-501929.0.Seamstrix@juno.com><4.3.1.2.20040213142025.00db53b0@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20040213220207.04c0a800@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:12:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This sounds like a wonderful project. Will look forward to seeing it later. Today I am doing a 'trunk' show for the local Library. It involves a wide selection of underpinnings both Antique and replication garments. The two full costumes will be a wool suit of about 1902-3 and a very elaborate 'court gown' from about 1898. it is very similar to the green velvet gown with train that is in the "Hermitage Collection" (Russia). I will be wearing a black lace Repro that I made last year for my Photo show. The bead work and fringes and etc. sounds like your project. Have Fun! Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2004 1:21 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise > > >Carolyn, your description reminds me of one I have from the same period. The > >main fabric is a brocade of brownish purple brocade (aubrogene?) > > Aubergine, meaning 'eggplant' in French. Puce, a more brownish purple, > comes from the French for blood or for flea (the dictionary would know), > and it was named, in Bay Privateer period, for the color of a blood-filled > flea. I'm using a puce-maroon colored cotton damask for my copy, with > maroon velvet and black beads. > > >The inner > >accents are chartruese and coral. The sheer front facings are of a bright > >green in the same tone; also the ruffled edges of the sleeve facings. And > >like the unexpected pinks of the period, I was unprepared for this unusual > >shade of green...especially with the 'purple brown' of the main faabric. > >What was equally surprising is the pale salmon of the faille evening skirt > >that was mated with it! > > My bodice didn't come with a skirt. It has the shoulder detailing so > common just before 1900, but the front pooches down over the waistband a > little, as was common after 1900. The beaded overlay hangs in bands down > to the waist, and the pooched velvet under it only pooches between these > bands, lying flat under them. The sheer overlay is black, as is all the > beading (I collected nailheads for many years to get enough of the right > sizes). I should probably lay the bodice on my scanner so I can have > copies of the beadwork for reference while I work. If I really do scan it, > I will have to post the scans someplace we can all see them. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 11:10:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1EGAgSd000707 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 11:10:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EG3ncP020634; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:03:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EG3i57058047; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:03:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r07.mx.aol.com (imo-r07.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.103]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EG3g57057995 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:03:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.5b.4735c0c1 (4380) for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 10:58:24 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <5b.4735c0c1.2d5f9fa0@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 10:58:24 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6024 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/14/2004 4:45:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: > The bustle kind-of softens, shrinks, and slowly goes away, leaving most of > the fabric behind (no pun intended). > There's a little quiet film called "Day After the Fair" that takes place in 1891. The costuming is perfection. The fashionable women wear gowns with zero bustle but there is much fullness in the back and still some front drapery cut into the skirts and even apron-like front panels...but these are low key and not elaborate or full. The bodice is tight and controlled over a very rigid corset with some slight fullness appearing in the sleeve heads. Very detailed to this transitional period is this film. The 1895 skirt is sometimes stiff and super-controlled. It is "lined with buckram" [Janet Arnold] from the knees down in front and across the whole back sometimes. This with a circular cut or many trapezoidal back gores give it a half-closed umbrella look in the back. As the decade goes on, things soften up...even the leg-o-mutton sleeves. By 1901 the stiffness is gone. Things that were also found in 1895...trumpet shaped skirts and sleeves with full heads...are there but soft and droopy. I always associate the early 1900s with soft flowing light fabrics and super delicate lace. And those huge hats that protrude forward laden with trim. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 14:32:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1EJWoSd001494 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 14:32:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EJWAcP029339; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 12:32:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EJW457027389; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 12:32:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.115]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EJW257027373 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 12:32:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sherylnd@kc.rr.com) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com (CPE-65-30-107-115.kc.rr.com [65.30.107.115]) by ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1EJ06NL006542 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 13:00:09 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20040214131523.00a0f190@pop-server.kc.rr.com> X-Sender: sherylnd@pop-server.kc.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 13:16:47 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] digital microscopes In-Reply-To: <75443774-5E65-11D8-B76F-000393C0A652@alfalfapress.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Edmund Scientific sells them, as well. I saw them in the latest catalogue and had to quickly turn the page before I got too interested. http://scientificsonline.com/category.asp?c=421190 Sheryl N-D At 12:44 PM 2/13/04 -0800, you wrote: >Greetings, > >I just had to share this with folks who would get it. :D I stopped in my >local Mac computer store to get ink cartridges. I was waiting at the >register and glanced over at the "New Gizmos" table. I saw a digital >microscope hooked up to an ibook. I got a glint in my eye and asked the >cashier to demo it for me. Big Mistake. lol > >I now have a digital microscope that can go up to 50x and I can burn the >images right to CD. Tres facile! :D :D :D I got the 50x lens, with >variable field of focus for $198. The whole kit with several lens up to >200x costs about $700. A bit rich for my blood, but something to consider >after I marry wealthy. > >I can't wait to try it out. It's on order and should be here in a couple >weeks. Oh, it will be fun to take to museums this summer. :D > >Althea Turner >*** althea@alfalfapress.com >*** http://www.alfalfapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 17:33:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1EMX9Sd002133 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:33:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EMV4cP006492; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:31:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EMUr57083373; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:30:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EMUo57083364 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:30:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-126-14.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.126.14]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EMUn5m015108 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 14:30:49 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040214142734.04c2bb80@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 14:30:12 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: <5b.4735c0c1.2d5f9fa0@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >And those huge hats that protrude forward laden with trim. Hats start moving forward in 1902 or so, and really sit forward on the head later. C1900 hats are still pretty centered on the head. But the biggest hats are c1910 - great big round things with endangered bird feathers and lots of ostrich plumes. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 14 18:02:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1EN2iSd002191 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 18:02:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EMxZcP007564; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:59:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EMxW57092410; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:59:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1EMxU57092364 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:59:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E888E42624 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 18:11:49 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <402EA9B5.1050008@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:05:25 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise References: <4.3.1.2.20040212071512.00a61ad0@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040212071512.00a61ad0@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > So how do I correct my living history boss when she's documentably > wrong? Is it possible to gently do something about this situation > without getting thrown out of the program for perceived > insubordination? Please advise. I know I'm jumping into this late but a couple things occured to me very late last night that might help. Your boss, like most managers, wants to stay in control. If you keep suggesting changes, even good ones, she's going to feel like she is losing control. She wants people to listen to her, not you. And if you are making the decisions, and she isn't, then her job is at risk. So the trick, I think, is to make her feel that she is going to get the credit for any suggestions or changes that get made there. Somehow you need to make her believe that any "improvements" that you come up with are going to make her look good to whoever her boss is. The more accurate costumes and portrayals have to reflect on what a great job she is doing for the site. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 15 02:19:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1F7JpSd003328 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 02:19:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1F7J7cP027420; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 00:19:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1F7J057062142; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 00:19:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1F7Iu57062111 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 00:18:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-126-14.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.126.14]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1F7HwhG027291; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 23:17:58 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040214231457.05b1fa20@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 23:17:40 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise In-Reply-To: <402EA9B5.1050008@reddawn.net> References: <4.3.1.2.20040212071512.00a61ad0@mail.frys.com> <4.3.1.2.20040212071512.00a61ad0@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>So how do I correct my living history boss when she's documentably >>wrong? Is it possible to gently do something about this situation >>without getting thrown out of the program for perceived >>insubordination? Please advise. > >I know I'm jumping into this late but a couple things occured to me very >late last night that might help. Your boss, like most managers, wants to >stay in control. If you keep suggesting changes, even good ones, she's >going to feel like she is losing control. She wants people to listen to >her, not you. And if you are making the decisions, and she isn't, then her >job is at risk. > >So the trick, I think, is to make her feel that she is going to get the >credit for any suggestions or changes that get made there. Somehow you >need to make her believe that any "improvements" that you come up with are >going to make her look good to whoever her boss is. The more accurate >costumes and portrayals have to reflect on what a great job she is doing >for the site. Interesting slant, and not one I would have thought of. I will re-think my current approach, and will try to tweak it in your suggested direction. Couldn't hurt, especially since I don't really care who gets the credit - it's not like I get a merit raise or anything ;) Thank you. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 15 10:14:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1FFEDSd016786 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 10:14:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1FFB4cP011972; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 08:11:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1FFAx57097644; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 08:10:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1FFAv57097633 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 08:10:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.74]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AsNAj-0005SP-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 06:23:01 -0800 Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AsNAi-0006u6-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 06:23:00 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] danish peassant costume reconstrukted Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 07:23:28 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01c3f3cf$48695bb0$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 In-Reply-To: <000a01c3f26b$b4e588f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Very cool.....thanks!! -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Bjarne og Leif Drews Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 12:58 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] danish peassant costume reconstrukted Hi. I stumbled over this and thoaght i would share it with you. Very fine made rekonstrukted peassant costumes for folkdansers. http://www.lisbeth-green.dk/FOTO/photo.htm Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 15 15:22:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1FKMJSd018198 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 15:22:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1FKLPcP025765; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 13:21:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1FKLK57008582; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 13:21:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1FKLH57008569 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 13:21:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.128.231.148] (helo=dan) by zinc.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AsSlQ-0003pa-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 20:21:17 +0000 Message-ID: <002b01c3f401$82510bc0$94e78051@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 20:23:00 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Victorian Patterns Ebay UK X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all, This seller thingz2go has a number of Victorian patterns on EBay UK at what appear to be very reasonable prices. Auctions finish tomorrow, so if you are interested... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 15 21:22:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1G2M7Sd019238 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:22:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G2LKcP014149; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 19:21:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G2LA57047605; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 19:21:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G2L758047586 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 19:21:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1G2jdWm000760 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:45:39 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.109] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A92E68A400DC; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:21:34 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c3f434$43bf67c0$6d5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002b01c3f401$82510bc0$94e78051@dan> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Victorian Patterns Ebay UK Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 21:26:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stevie, I might be interested in these patterns but cannot find the eBay source. Any suggestions? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stevie Gamble" To: Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 3:23 PM Subject: [h-cost] Victorian Patterns Ebay UK > Hi all, > > This seller > > thingz2go > > > has a number of Victorian patterns on EBay UK at what appear to be > very reasonable prices. Auctions finish tomorrow, so if you are > interested... > > best wishes > Stevie > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 00:05:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1G55ZSd019728 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 00:05:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G52NcP021582; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 22:02:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G52I57019387; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 22:02:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo2.socket.net (mo2.socket.net [216.106.88.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G52G57019363 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 22:02:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo2.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A23041D7C8 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 22:17:56 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p288.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.215.34]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 7E449D4B0 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 22:17:55 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 22:18:06 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <000c01c3f3cf$48695bb0$6501a8c0@SG01> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Norwegian 1500s X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Looking for sources for Norwegian costumes during the 1500s and posibly earlier. Does anyone have a source? The bunad is, to my knowledge, after the 1700s. Though I can if I am unable to find anything, look at the different bunads and compare them to Danish and Germanic costumes of the period and get a rough idea. Thank you, De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 04:29:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1G9TRSd014232 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 04:29:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G9RScP002621; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 02:27:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G9RL57006198; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 02:27:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G9RE57006063 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 02:27:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i1G9QcT15497.; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:26:38 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:26:38 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:26:24 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Hussars (early 19th century) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hussars also wore a second jacket called a pelisse, usually slung over one shoulder - see http://vial.jean.free.fr/new_npi/revues_npi/17_2000/npi_1700/17_russ_huss1.htm for some Russian ones. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 04:42:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1G9gASd014265 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 04:42:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G9dccP003238; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 02:39:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G9da57009791; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 02:39:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1G9dZ57009784 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 02:39:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i1G9dYT16692.; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:39:34 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:39:34 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:39:10 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] disproving incorrect assertions, please advise Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kayta wrote: >Aubergine, meaning 'eggplant' in French. Puce, a more brownish >purple, comes from the French for blood or for flea (the dictionary would >know), and it was named, in Bay Privateer period, for the color of a >blood-filled flea. "Puce" means "flea". BTW, I don't want to stary another OT thread, but we use the French word "aubergine" in British English for the vegetable *and* the colour. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 09:40:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1GEeiSd016535 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:40:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GEcCcP013504; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 07:38:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GEc557004118; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 07:38:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m19.mx.aol.com (imo-m19.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GEc157004077 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 07:38:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LLWatts@aol.com) Received: from LLWatts@aol.com by imo-m19.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.1dc.1a15e28a (18555) for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:32:41 -0500 (EST) From: LLWatts@aol.com Message-ID: <1dc.1a15e28a.2d622e88@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:32:40 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part1_1dc.1a15e28a.2d622e88_boundary" X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6024 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Victoran Tux Needed (Cheap) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --part1_1dc.1a15e28a.2d622e88_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi everyone, Just got the following from my brother: > Once again, I've gotten my arm twisted and I find myself in a play. > Anyway, > to make a long story short, I'm looking for a Victorian style tux and > tophat. Any suggestions. The producer figures she can get one thru > offering ad space, but that would still leave us short. Didn't know if any > of your costumer contacts might have suggestions or not. > >>>>>> We're in Omaha, NE. He didn't say what group is putting on this play, but I'm guessing it's a group with a tight budget. Anyone know of someone who might have one for rent or loan? Alternately, anyone know a really cheap way to fake one? Leah --part1_1dc.1a15e28a.2d622e88_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --part1_1dc.1a15e28a.2d622e88_boundary-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 10:20:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1GFKPSd016668 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 10:20:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GFHGcP015380; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 08:17:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GFHD57021421; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 08:17:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GFHB57021366 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 08:17:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7318F42624 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 10:29:38 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <4030E06C.2040105@reddawn.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 09:23:24 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Victoran Tux Needed (Cheap) References: <1dc.1a15e28a.2d622e88@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <1dc.1a15e28a.2d622e88@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO LLWatts@aol.com wrote: > We're in Omaha, NE. He didn't say what group is putting on this play, but > I'm guessing it's a group with a tight budget. Anyone know of someone who might > have one for rent or loan? Alternately, anyone know a really cheap way to > fake one? IMO, for stage purposes, late Victorian formal wear is indistinguishable from modern formal wear. Thrift shops are a good place to find cheap shirts and vests. The bottom of the vest goes straight across, so if it is pointed they may want to do some quick alterations. The so-called "suicide" collar that is folded looks pretty cool and those can be found after prom season. Most guys already own a pair of black dress slacks and a plain tie. You can get matching gloves from formalwear shops, they're not too expensive. That only leaves the tuxedo jacket to be rented. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 14:02:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1GJ2pSd021777 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 14:02:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GIxKcP002733; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:59:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GIxB57046918; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:59:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GIx758046878 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 11:59:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1GJNoWm014475 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 14:23:50 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.116] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A31966CB0100; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 13:59:37 -0500 Message-ID: <001401c3f4bf$b2b45740$745183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1dc.1a15e28a.2d622e88@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Victoran Tux Needed (Cheap) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 14:04:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Size? Play title? Do you mean formal tails, a cut-away, or full frock ensemble? Do you require 'white tie, black tie (semi formal), or is the character a servant sort that might wear a striped or green vest? I have all of the above to rent, but would need more info. Also, of course, the date of the production. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 9:32 AM Subject: [h-cost] Victoran Tux Needed (Cheap) > Hi everyone, > > Just got the following from my brother: > > > Once again, I've gotten my arm twisted and I find myself in a play. > > Anyway, > > to make a long story short, I'm looking for a Victorian style tux and > > tophat. Any suggestions. The producer figures she can get one thru > > offering ad space, but that would still leave us short. Didn't know if any > > of your costumer contacts might have suggestions or not. > > > >>>>>> > > We're in Omaha, NE. He didn't say what group is putting on this play, but > I'm guessing it's a group with a tight budget. Anyone know of someone who might > have one for rent or loan? Alternately, anyone know a really cheap way to > fake one? > > Leah > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 14:30:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1GJURSd021955 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 14:30:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GJTbcP005479; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:29:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GJTW57064327; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:29:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GJTR57064297 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:29:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.10.203] (helo=dan) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AshSY-0005Ym-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:02:46 +0000 Message-ID: <001301c3f485$09242fa0$cb0a8151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002b01c3f401$82510bc0$94e78051@dan> <000f01c3f434$43bf67c0$6d5183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Victorian Patterns Ebay UK Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:04:31 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kathleen I don't know what is happening with this, since I cut and pasted the name but now it won't work. However, a search on Victorian patterns pulled up the same person: try http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2889222483&catego ry=38564 and hit view sellers other items for more. Some are for children and others for women... Good luck! Stevie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 2:26 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Victorian Patterns Ebay UK > Stevie, I might be interested in these patterns but cannot find the eBay > source. Any suggestions? > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Stevie Gamble" > To: > Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 3:23 PM > Subject: [h-cost] Victorian Patterns Ebay UK > > > > Hi all, > > > > This seller > > > > thingz2go > > > > > > has a number of Victorian patterns on EBay UK at what appear to be > > very reasonable prices. Auctions finish tomorrow, so if you are > > interested... > > > > best wishes > > Stevie > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 17:25:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1GMPrSd022768 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:25:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GMKVcP020182; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 15:20:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GMKLiM005907; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 15:20:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GMKEiM005811 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 15:20:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32ffc.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.252]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 302FF2629ED for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 23:20:09 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <001701c3f4db$0d972410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 23:20:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1GMPrSd022768 Status: RO I have found new evidense, about the danish courtdress i told you about wich had a "bumroll" lying on top of the skirt. I found a new picture wich shows exactly the same dress, only without the stuffed "bumroll" Now it is not evidense, it could also be some folds of the courttrain, i know that, but i find it strange, that she is not wearing her train in the other picture then, because it is an official picture two. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/frenchcourt Could it be right that it is a stuffed bumroll, made for the fashion? I made an other site on my other webpage about courtdresses in Denmark, and there is another dress, wich has the same mystery bumroll on top of the skirt, it is the black and white picture. http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/robedecour.htm I am very interrested in hearing others oppinions Thanks Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 18:06:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1GN67Sd022953 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:06:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GN2pcP023551; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:02:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GN2liM046856; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:02:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1GN2hiN046811 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:02:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1GNRTWm014583 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:27:29 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.107] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AC32483700E6; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:03:14 -0500 Message-ID: <001601c3f4e1$bb791740$6b5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001701c3f4db$0d972410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:08:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This reminds me of the various pictures of 'Elizabeth" wearing the same gown(s) that has elements missing, according to the painter. The various interpretations seem to present the idea that, for instance, a 'bum roll' that is seen in one interpretation of the sitting may have been forgotten or even assumed on another canvas. Certainly in these two views of court dress there are similarities in the opulence of the royal robes, but one artist understood how to do ' fur' better than the other. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 5:20 PM Subject: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark I have found new evidense, about the danish courtdress i told you about wich had a "bumroll" lying on top of the skirt. I found a new picture wich shows exactly the same dress, only without the stuffed "bumroll" Now it is not evidense, it could also be some folds of the courttrain, i know that, but i find it strange, that she is not wearing her train in the other picture then, because it is an official picture two. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/frenchcourt Could it be right that it is a stuffed bumroll, made for the fashion? I made an other site on my other webpage about courtdresses in Denmark, and there is another dress, wich has the same mystery bumroll on top of the skirt, it is the black and white picture. http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/robedecour.htm I am very interrested in hearing others oppinions Thanks Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 19:49:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1H0nSSd023411 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:49:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0mmcP000888; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:48:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0lUiM083473; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:47:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp4.pacifier.net (smtp4.pacifier.net [64.255.237.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0lRiM083434 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:47:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.132.124]) by smtp4.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1E956A9D6 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:47:26 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:47:25 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Message-ID: <4030F41D.24787.EC4605@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <001f01c3f02f$3f0d47f0$9865fea9@VAIO> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I have never seen the Legally Blond movies, but > from what I have seen of previews it seems that the main character's > problem is ditziness rather than girliness. It always seemed to me that the main character was just more socially adept than most intelligent women. She had learned to blend in with the society where she was expected but still maintain her intelligence. It's unfortunate, however, that it is expected that intelligent women would need to act "ditzy" or "girly" so that they can fit in socially. But at least she was able to figure out the behavioral cues which so often makes intelligent women outcasts. Frankly, I wish I had been able to figure out what made my clothes so much less acceptable than other peoples. (Well, I did figure out the high water thing, but it was impossible to find slacks long enough for my legs yet small enough for my college body so I just had to put up with the teasing.) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 19:53:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1H0rnSd023424 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:53:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0ohcP000968; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:50:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0nWiM084604; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:49:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net (smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net [207.172.4.62]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0nDiM084393 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:49:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from matchlck@erols.com) Received: from 66-44-1-50.s304.apx1.lnh.md.dialup.rcn.com ([66.44.1.50] helo=erols.com) by smtp03.mrf.mail.rcn.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 1AstQG-00067J-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:49:12 -0500 Message-ID: <40318F84.4279D9C6@erols.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:50:28 -0800 From: "David S. Mallinak" Organization: Red Dragon Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cleveland References: <1c7.14d3150a.2d56e61d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO JAMES OGILVIE wrote: > > For anyone who is going to or through Cleveland in the near future, the Cleveland Museum of Art has a small special exhibit of mostly Renaissance textiles (a few earlier). I think everything was from their collection but some of it is not usually on display. Unfortunately, there is no book available. (Former Northern Ohio resident) Write the Cleveland Art Museum. They do not do books but the sometimes do oversize "brochure" on local exhibits. Your humble and obediant servant, David S Mallinak _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 19:57:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1H0vUSd023435 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:57:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0tXcP001201; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:55:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0tUiM087759; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:55:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.pacifier.net (smtp1.pacifier.net [64.255.237.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0tSiM087629 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:55:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.132.124]) by smtp1.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD6C26F8A5 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:55:26 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:55:25 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: smart women Message-ID: <4030F5FD.2681.F39973@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <5.2.0.9.0.20040212153856.00b37380@mail.katiesorchids.com> References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > In Hubby-the-Engineer's world, languages, history, geography, etc. > have no value because their value cannot be quantified. Recently, I > have been pushing towards more costume / history oriented movies to > rent and he (who controls the control) has become accustomed to > stopping the movie to ask me a question and to me blurting 'STOP' so > that I can explain something that I *know* he knows nothing about. The > depth of his ignorance in non-engineering topics is astounding! Hey, I usually discuss costuming (especially patterning) in terms of engineering (especially in terms of statics and dynamics). > Maybe I could tell him that the garb that I want to make for him is > just like Leonardo da Vinci (great engineer, right?) would have worn > ... Maybe! ;) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 20:01:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1H11XSd023449 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:01:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0xdcP001537; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:59:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0xaiM010034; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:59:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp2.pacifier.net (smtp2.pacifier.net [64.255.237.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H0xWiM009026 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:59:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.132.124]) by smtp2.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C00B6ABE1 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:59:31 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 16:59:30 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: smart women Message-ID: <4030F6F2.10759.F75458@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20040212153142.027c9c18@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Completely off the mark in regard to my ex-husband. He wanted me to > stay at home, cook and clean for him, and basically wait on him hand > and foot. He's got a Masters in Mechanical Engineering and a Doctorate > in Robotics. > > T. > > > >Engineeers don't like girly girls. They like women who are like > > >them, whether engineers or not. Actually, the two are not mutually exclusive. They want their women to be able to converse intelligently with them (but not make them feel less intelligent), take care of them (like a mother, or the mother they wished they had) and be available for what they consider fun. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 20:47:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1H1lASd023688 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:47:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1kUcP004464; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:46:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1kTiM048672; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:46:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1kPiM048656 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:46:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-124-39-147.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.124.39.147]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1kObG003804 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:46:24 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040216174330.059eda70@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:46:20 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: smart women In-Reply-To: <4030F6F2.10759.F75458@localhost> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20040212153142.027c9c18@mail.katiesorchids.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > > >Engineeers don't like girly girls. They like women who are like > > > >them, whether engineers or not. > >Actually, the two are not mutually exclusive. They want their women >to be able to converse intelligently with them (but not make them >feel less intelligent), take care of them (like a mother, or the >mother they wished they had) and be available for what they consider >fun. The only time I was married to an engineer-type, I ended up divorcing him. He didn't know how to relate to people, I found out too late, including me. But he still has, and wears, all the historical costumes I made for him, and happily answers questions about history when the kids ask him. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 20:48:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1H1mZSd023695 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:48:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1kfcP004485; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:46:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1keiM048758; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:46:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1kWiN048696 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:46:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1lK8v011827 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:47:20 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1H1lKLv011825 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:47:20 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Men in skirts, and women! Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:47:20 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <4030F41D.24787.EC4605@localhost> In-Reply-To: <4030F41D.24787.EC4605@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402162047.20134.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday 16 February 2004 07:47 pm, kat@grendal.rain.com wrote: > > I have never seen the Legally Blond movies, but > > from what I have seen of previews it seems that the main character's > > problem is ditziness rather than girliness. > > It always seemed to me that the main character was just more socially > adept than most intelligent women. She had learned to blend in with > the society where she was expected but still maintain her > intelligence. > > It's unfortunate, however, that it is expected that intelligent women > would need to act "ditzy" or "girly" so that they can fit in > socially. But at least she was able to figure out the behavioral cues > which so often makes intelligent women outcasts. Very much agreed, on all points. Thanks for saying it so well. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 16 20:49:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1H1nCSd023699 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:49:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1k0cP004413; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:46:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1jqiM048411; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:45:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1jmiN048378 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:45:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1H1kd8v011812 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:46:39 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1H1kd5T011810 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:46:39 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: smart women Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:46:39 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <5.2.0.9.0.20040212153142.027c9c18@mail.katiesorchids.com> <4030F6F2.10759.F75458@localhost> In-Reply-To: <4030F6F2.10759.F75458@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402162046.39281.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO [snip] [T. said:] > > > >Engineeers don't like girly girls. They like women who are like > > > >them, whether engineers or not. [then Kat said:] > Actually, the two are not mutually exclusive. They want their women > to be able to converse intelligently with them (but not make them > feel less intelligent), take care of them (like a mother, or the > mother they wished they had) and be available for what they consider > fun. Agreed, but I suspect that one reason many men have no patience with "girly girls" is that they may be *less* interested in sex than in small cute animals or other substitutes for exercising the maternal instinct. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 08:16:06 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HDG5Sd019381 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 08:16:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HDChcP005819; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 06:12:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HDCViM091101; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 06:12:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HDCTiN091086 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 06:12:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1HDbOWm018583 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 08:37:25 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.118] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3567FAA004C; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 08:12:54 -0500 Message-ID: <004101c3f558$6f70daa0$765183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "H-Costume" Subject: Fw: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 08:17:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 6:08 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark > This reminds me of the various pictures of 'Elizabeth" wearing the same > gown(s) that has elements missing, according to the painter. The various > interpretations seem to present the idea that, for instance, a 'bum roll' > that is seen in one interpretation of the sitting may have been forgotten or > even assumed on another canvas. Certainly in these two views of court > dress there are similarities in the opulence of the royal robes, but one > artist understood how to do ' fur' better than the other. > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" > To: > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 5:20 PM > Subject: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark > > > > I have found new evidense, about the danish courtdress i told you about wich > had a "bumroll" lying on top of the skirt. > I found a new picture wich shows exactly the same dress, only without the > stuffed "bumroll" > Now it is not evidense, it could also be some folds of the courttrain, i > know that, but i find it strange, that she is not wearing her train in the > other picture then, because it is an official picture two. > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/frenchcourt > > Could it be right that it is a stuffed bumroll, made for the fashion? > > I made an other site on my other webpage about courtdresses in Denmark, and > there is another dress, wich has the same mystery bumroll on top of the > skirt, it is the black and white picture. > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/robedecour.htm > > I am very interrested in hearing others oppinions > Thanks > > Bjarne > > > > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 08:33:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HDXiSd019436 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 08:33:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HDUecP006408; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 06:30:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HDUdiM097157; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 06:30:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HDUbiM097099 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 06:30:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i1HDUOT05594.; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:30:24 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:30:23 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:29:49 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I don't know much about 18th century fashion, but to me Charlotte Amalie Skeel certainly seems to be wearing a separate train over her skirt, so I could easily believe that the similar "rolls" visible on other gowns are also the top of a train. Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 14:14:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HJEBSd020826 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:14:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HJAhcP005709; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 12:10:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HJAaiM002953; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 12:10:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HJAUiM002909 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 12:10:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.232]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1At8Kk-0007m5-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 08:44:30 -0800 Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1At8Kg-0005D7-00; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 08:44:26 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: "H-Costume@Indra. Com" Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 09:44:56 -0700 Message-ID: <001c01c3f575$62dd39b0$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: thefrazzledfrau@yahoogroups.com Subject: [h-cost] Janet Arnold work continuance X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1HJEBSd020826 Status: RO This forwarded note was posted by Kass on another list and I thought it would be of interest to folks. Sorry for cross posts. Sg -----Original Message----- From: historian@reconstructinghistory.com [mailto:historian@reconstructinghistory.com] Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 8:08 AM To: GermanRenCostume@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [GermanRenCostume] Shirt Patttern This was posted to the Ren Tailor list back in November. There is no mention of a medieval PoF, but instead a PoF on linen garments that were purposefully left out of the previous PoF books: > For those of you with an interest in the works of the late great > British costume historian, Janet Arnold, I offer the following news. I > have today, received a letter from Santina M. Levey, (the executor of > Janet Arnold's estate) updating me on the work that both she and > Millie Jaffe' have been conducting, to assemble one last final volume > in the "Patterns of Fashion" series. > > Those of you, who have followed my previous posts, will remember that > Ms. Levey and Mrs. Jaffe' have been working with previously > unpublished research materials of Ms. Arnold's, relating to fair linen > - coifs, shirts, shifts, ruffs, collars, etc. which were left as part > of the estate. > > Originally, they had hoped to be ready for a publication date of late > 2003 or early 2004. Ms. Levey informs me that unfortunately due to > "personal reasons", there will be at least a one year delay until the > new volume is published. > > She goes on to say the the new volume will be published by Macmillan > as part of the existing series of "Patterns of Fashion", but that we > should not expect to see it until late 2004 or early 2005. > > Please free to forward to other interested parties or lists, as > desired. > > In service to Crown and Coronet, yours faithful and ever assured, HL > Eleanor of Leycestershyre, AoA, JdL, etc Apprentice to Mistress Sine > Gillian MacDonald, OL "Purpure a Phoenix Or rising from Flames Gules, > on a Chief Or three Suns in Splendour Purpure" > Head of House Crone Henge > > Loquora unica veritatis Reconstructing History Patterns http://reconstructinghistory.com Join Our Pattern Discussion List: http://reconstructinghistory.com/mailman/listinfo/patterns_reconstructinghis tory.com -----Original Message----- From: Saragrace T. Knauf [mailto:saragrace@earthlink.net] Sent: 15 February 2004 3:58 PM To: GermanRenCostume@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [GermanRenCostume] Shirt Patttern Janet Arnold is dead. Her assistant was supposed to continue the POF series..who knows if it will really happen. I don't think I ever heard of a medieval one in the works. I had heard she was planning on combining some of her journal articles into another POF (As I recall the shirt article was one of them.) -----Original Message----- From: Julie [mailto:jtknits@cts.com] Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 12:39 PM To: GermanRenCostume@yahoogroups.com Subject: [GermanRenCostume] Shirt Patttern Thank you. I thought I'd bought all her books. I'd love to get a copy of the article. I'm about to turn in that shirt (minus the embroidery) as an arts project. If it's a German magazine probably not much chance it's carried at my local library. Any suggestions where I could get it? P.S. Is Janet Arnold still alive? I heard a rumor that she'd passed away and I'll never get to see her PoF on medieval garments. Julie _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GermanRenCostume/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: GermanRenCostume-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 14:53:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HJr1Sd020941 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:53:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HJogcP008868; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 12:50:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HJociM030721; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 12:50:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pop2a.ripco.com (root@pop2a.ripco.com [209.100.227.25]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HJoaiM030691 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 12:50:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from zski@ripco.com) Received: from ripco.com (cybil2.ripco.com [209.100.224.203]) by pop2a.ripco.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1HJqGGp005655 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:52:16 -0600 (CST) From: zski@ripco.com To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:50:30 -0600 X-Mailer: CWMail Web to Mail Gateway 2.8c, http://netwinsite.com/top_mail.htm Message-id: <4032708b.68b9.0@ripco.com> X-User-Info: 12.168.24.203 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 16th century Polish? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I have a friend who is looking for a faire outfit that reflects his Polish heritage. Can anyone recommend any books or sites with information on late 16th Century Polish clothing for men? (I already checked that link off Drea's site). I'm afraid that though I am half-Polish myself, I know next to nothing about this area. Wendy Z looking up pictures in Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 15:27:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HKRpSd021149 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:27:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HKMwcP011658; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:22:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HKMoZ3052399; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:22:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from providenceday.org (treebeard.providenceday.org [66.193.73.82]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HKMlZ3052326 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 13:22:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from grace.morris@providenceday.org) Received: from [172.20.1.3] (HELO providenceday.org) by providenceday.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.5) with ESMTP id 1033545 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:23:21 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:22:02 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] 16th century Polish? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Grace Morris To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <4032708b.68b9.0@ripco.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There's a little here: http://www.icbleu.org/artur/polishcostumes.htm Grace/Jessamyn jessamynscloset.com On Tuesday, February 17, 2004, at 02:50 PM, zski@ripco.com wrote: > I have a friend who is looking for a faire outfit that reflects his > Polish > heritage. > > Can anyone recommend any books or sites with information on late 16th > Century Polish clothing for men? (I already checked that link off > Drea's > site). I'm afraid that though I am half-Polish myself, I know next to > nothing about this area. > > Wendy Z > looking up pictures in > Chicago, IL > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 16:26:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HLQLSd021478 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:26:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HLPRcP017505; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:25:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HLPJZ3000206; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:25:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from siscom.net (counterstrike.siscom.net [209.251.2.97]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HLPGZ3000144 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:25:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drea@nospam) Received: from shell.siscom.net (unverified [209.251.2.80]) by siscom.net (SurgeMail) with ESMTP id 19945482 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:15:01 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:18:23 -0500 (EST) From: Drea Leed To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norwegian 1500s In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20040217161811.N33405@shell.siscom.net> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'd be interested in any information on this as well. Thanks, Drea On Sun, 15 Feb 2004, otsisto wrote: > Looking for sources for Norwegian costumes during the 1500s and posibly > earlier. > Does anyone have a source? > The bunad is, to my knowledge, after the 1700s. Though I can if I am unable > to find anything, look at the different bunads and compare them to Danish > and Germanic costumes of the period and get a rough idea. > > Thank you, > De > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 16:34:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HLYRSd021491 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:34:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HLXdcP018319; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:33:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HLXbZ3006028; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:33:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HLXXZ3005905 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:33:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be11.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.17]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id CE60526294B for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:33:25 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <003001c3f59d$b6041fa0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:33:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] norwegian costumes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1HLYRSd021491 Status: RO Hi, Norway was a province in Denmark in the 1500s so perhaps the styles were the same. But if you are looking for peassants costumes of the time, i dont think there are any picture documentation. The eldest danish folk costumes are from the 1700s Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 17:04:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HM4nSd021563 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:04:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HM2ncP021016; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:02:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HM2gZ3026359; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:02:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ns3.linuxwebnet.com (ns3.linuxwebnet.com [216.133.76.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1HM2ZZ3026264 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:02:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from judymitch@oldwaylane.net) Received: (qmail 18396 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2004 23:31:09 -0000 Received: from dialup-67.72.166.171.dial1.washington1.level3.net (HELO oldwaylane.net) (67.72.166.171) by shada.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2004 23:31:09 -0000 Message-ID: <40328DB7.1020102@oldwaylane.net> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:55:03 -0500 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.3.1) Gecko/20030425 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norwegian 1500s References: <20040217161811.N33405@shell.siscom.net> In-Reply-To: <20040217161811.N33405@shell.siscom.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Drea Leed wrote: > I'd be interested in any information on this as well. > > Thanks, > > Drea And me! I had a devil of a time trying to find mid 17th century Swedish. I'd love some early Norwegian. -Judy > > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004, otsisto wrote: > > >>Looking for sources for Norwegian costumes during the 1500s and posibly >>earlier. >>Does anyone have a source? >>The bunad is, to my knowledge, after the 1700s. Though I can if I am unable >>to find anything, look at the different bunads and compare them to Danish >>and Germanic costumes of the period and get a rough idea. >> >>Thank you, >>De >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 17:17:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HMHVSd021613 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:17:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HMFLcP022302; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:15:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HMFGZ3035128; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:15:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HMFBZ3035037 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:15:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92C3642615 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:27:43 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <403293CB.4020206@reddawn.net> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:20:59 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Is this a good deal on Godeys? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Just curious. I'm considering expanding my costume and history library into this period and I see that there are several of these volumes on ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3587049307&category=45108&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBWA%3AIT&rd=1 Is $40 a good price for something like this? Are there better places to buy these old magazines? I'd hate to start off by making foolish purchases. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 17:17:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HMHhSd021616 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:17:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HMGncP022417; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:16:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HMGmZ3036329; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:16:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HMGeZ3036245 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 15:16:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from brujne@creighton.edu) Received: from cindyabel (cla53081.creighton.edu [147.134.201.2]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_28810+JAGae91741)/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA23307 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:16:39 -0600 (CST) From: "Cindy Abel" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:16:39 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <001c01c3f575$62dd39b0$6501a8c0@SG01> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Jean Hunnisett book? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Does anyone on the list know when volume 5 of Period Costume for Stage and Screen is to be published in the U.S.? I have or have access via local public/state college libraries in my area the other four volumes : PCfSaS: 1500-1800, PCfSaS:1800-1909, PCfSaS: Medieval-1500, and PCfSaS: Capes, Cloaks..., but Volume 5 which is Coats, Pelisses, Coifs, and Caps is only available on the Brit side of the pond and with shipping and current exchange rates with the U.S. dollar, where available from a Brit source is rather pricey at present. Many thanks Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 18:28:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1HNSMSd021928 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 18:28:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HNQNcP028992; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:26:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HNQIZ3084891; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:26:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1HNQGZ3084856 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:26:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCBC21D165 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:50:01 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p278.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.215.24]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 84A22C482 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:50:00 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:50:17 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <004101c3f558$6f70daa0$765183d1@rmitchellras> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It doesn't look like a bumroll but a skirt or peplum, on the Blk and Wht picture. Also, up close, the picture with the "bumroll" {verses without) looks more like someone tied up the skirt a bit then a bumroll. De > I found a new picture wich shows exactly the same dress, only without the > stuffed "bumroll" > Now it is not evidense, it could also be some folds of the courttrain, i > know that, but i find it strange, that she is not wearing her train in the > other picture then, because it is an official picture two. > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/frenchcourt > > Could it be right that it is a stuffed bumroll, made for the fashion? > > I made an other site on my other webpage about courtdresses in Denmark, and > there is another dress, wich has the same mystery bumroll on top of the > skirt, it is the black and white picture. > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/robedecour.htm > > I am very interrested in hearing others oppinions > Thanks > > Bjarne > > > > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 19:36:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I0aRSd022185 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 19:36:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I0XGcP004235; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:33:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I0XAZ3040675; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:33:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I0X8Z4040648 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:33:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1I0gAo8019827 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 19:42:12 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040217162750.01be8548@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:33:03 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [h-cost] Norwegian 1500s In-Reply-To: <20040217161811.N33405@shell.siscom.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I happened to be in the Lacis store in Berkeley today and saw a book about bunads. I have zero knowledge about Scandinavian garments; I just happened to recognize the word . So I don't know if it's what you are looking for or not. Their web site isn't very helpful regarding books. They have a fantastic book collection. I was talking with Rebecca, the book maven, and she said that a direct call to the store will give much better service than an email. So, if you're interested tel: (510) 843-7290 Katie At 04:18 PM 2/17/2004 -0500, you wrote: >I'd be interested in any information on this as well. > >Thanks, > >Drea > >On Sun, 15 Feb 2004, otsisto wrote: > > > Looking for sources for Norwegian costumes during the 1500s and posibly > > earlier. > > Does anyone have a source? > > The bunad is, to my knowledge, after the 1700s. Though I can if I am unable > > to find anything, look at the different bunads and compare them to Danish > > and Germanic costumes of the period and get a rough idea. > > > > Thank you, > > De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 19:36:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I0aoSd022188 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 19:36:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I0XfcP004266; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:33:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I0XfZ3040949; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:33:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp3.pacifier.net (smtp3.pacifier.net [64.255.237.173]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I0XTZ3040835 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 17:33:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.133.84]) by smtp3.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9749B6D6F8 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:33:16 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 16:33:16 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Jean Hunnisett book? Message-ID: <4032424C.27401.605ADCC@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: <001c01c3f575$62dd39b0$6501a8c0@SG01> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Does anyone on the list know when volume 5 of Period Costume for Stage > and Screen is to be published in the U.S.? > > I have or have access via local public/state college libraries in my > area the other four volumes : PCfSaS: 1500-1800, PCfSaS:1800-1909, > PCfSaS: Medieval-1500, and PCfSaS: Capes, Cloaks..., but Volume 5 > which is Coats, Pelisses, Coifs, and Caps is only available on the > Brit side of the pond and with shipping and current exchange rates > with the U.S. dollar, where available from a Brit source is rather > pricey at present. I saw it for sale this past weekend from Pastiche. I don't recall the price however (but it seemed priced the same of the other Hunnisett books they were also selling.) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 20:05:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I15dSd022256 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:05:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I13gcP006556; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 18:03:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I13eZ3055716; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 18:03:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I13aZ3055690 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 18:03:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.117.49] (helo=dan) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1At5mw-0002rW-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:01:26 +0000 Message-ID: <003401c3f55e$c8406460$31758151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001701c3f4db$0d972410$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] french courtdress in Denmark Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:03:11 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne wrote: ........................................................ I have found new evidense, about the danish courtdress i told you about wich had a "bumroll" lying on top of the skirt. I found a new picture wich shows exactly the same dress, only without the stuffed "bumroll" Now it is not evidense, it could also be some folds of the courttrain, i know that, but i find it strange, that she is not wearing her train in the other picture then, because it is an official picture two. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/frenchcourt Could it be right that it is a stuffed bumroll, made for the fashion? I made an other site on my other webpage about courtdresses in Denmark, and there is another dress, wich has the same mystery bumroll on top of the skirt, it is the black and white picture. http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/robedecour.htm I am very interrested in hearing others oppinions Thanks ..................................................... This is very odd! I'm not sure that it is stuffed; it looks more like a vestigial remnant of the pleating over a skirt support so common in English courtwear at the end of the 16th century and the early 17th century. If that is so then the next question is what sort of skirt support was being used. The silk is so very stiff that I can't see any outline shape on the colour portraits, but the Brünniche portrait suggests that hip panniers of a rather strange shape are involved. All in all, very odd! best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 22:16:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I3GGSd022687 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:16:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I3EBcP013716; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:14:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I3E3Z3016141; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:14:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I3E0Z4016114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:14:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mikes@dandy.net) Received: from dandy.net (acty4045.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.249.45]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i1I3EhBq020302 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:14:44 -0500 Message-ID: <4032D874.2090402@dandy.net> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:13:56 -0500 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] 16th century Polish? References: <4032708b.68b9.0@ripco.com> In-Reply-To: <4032708b.68b9.0@ripco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, All. Wendy, you might want to look at Irena Turnau's book "History of Dress in Eastern and Central Europe from the 16th to the 18th Cent. " Institute of the History of Material Culture, Polish Academy of Sciences Warsaw 1991 ISBN 83-85463-03-8 -Also "Land of the Winged Horsemen, Art in Poland 1572-1764" Ed. by Jane Sweeney 1999 Art Svcs Intl. ISBN 0-88397-131-3 and finally, there are some illos of Eastern Europeans in Dover's reprint of the Vecellio Costume book on pg. 124 Also, I don't usually recommend their use for historical costuming, but the Osprey Men-at-Arms series (intended originally to help wargamers paint their miniature figures) has a few books on Polish armies of the 16th and 17th Cents. (#s 184 and 188) Avoid the artist illos in the center of the book, as well as any Victorian illos. If you stick to the documentable historical illos, you will do well. Of course, if this is for a Renfaire, they (the Faire) may or may not have standards depending on whether or not your friend will be working there or just visiting. Oh, also, try looking up the Westphalian Society and look at Boleslav Orlicki's Light Artillery (Rick Orli's site) His stuff is 17th Cent., but it is close enough to late 16th as to be virtually indistinguishable. If you send him a note, tell him I sent you and he will realise that you are interested in doing real historical stuff, and that you are not a high school kid looking to get him to do your school report for you ;) He will also probably share his source material with you . Maybe you can even form a unit out your way... who knows? Cheers, Mike Tartaglio (Mike T.) >Can anyone recommend any books or sites with information on late 16th >Century Polish clothing for men? (I already checked that link off Drea's >site). I'm afraid that though I am half-Polish myself, I know next to >nothing about this area. > > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 22:36:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I3aESd022738 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:36:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I3YEcP014804; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:34:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I3YBZ3024780; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:34:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I3Y7Z4024752 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:34:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1I3xDWm020854 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:59:13 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.101] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD4AC34D00DC; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:34:34 -0500 Message-ID: <002101c3f5d0$d0ace3e0$655183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <403293CB.4020206@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this a good deal on Godeys? Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:39:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dawn, 15=20 years ago I began to collect 19th C mags. At that time $40 was a good price in this area, if the books had not been stripped of the fashion plates and providing they had both covers! This copy that seems to have gone for over $80 looks to have been a good deal. The 1860s editions are more prolific and thus potentially available than, say. the '40s or '50s. Because of the wealth of other material relating to history, social and otherwise, along with info re domestic living and the "literature", I have also taken volumes that were 'naked' re illustration...but at a lower price. Keep your eyes open for Peterson's, Arthur's, and Grahams, also. All contain the general format of Godeys. I personally like the novels in Peterson's, but Grahams has a lot of references from both English and French fashion worlds that help to round out the "Known World" of that period. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2004 5:20 PM Subject: [h-cost] Is this a good deal on Godeys? > Just curious. I'm considering expanding my costume and history library > into this period and I see that there are several of these volumes on ebay. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3587049307&category=45108&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBWA%3AIT&rd=1 > > Is $40 a good price for something like this? Are there better places to > buy these old magazines? I'd hate to start off by making foolish purchases. > > > > Dawn > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 17 23:03:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I43aSd022827 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 23:03:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I42tcP016391; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 21:02:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I42qZ3036592; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 21:02:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (socrates.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.25.13]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I42mZ3036561 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 21:02:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hrjones@socrates.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from socrates.Berkeley.EDU (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1I42lbj001574 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:02:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from [136.152.197.120] (tnt-1-184.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.197.120]) by socrates.Berkeley.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I42jrh001523 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 20:02:46 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4032708b.68b9.0@ripco.com> References: <4032708b.68b9.0@ripco.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 19:51:39 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Heather Rose Jones Subject: Re: [h-cost] 16th century Polish? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 1:50 PM -0600 2/17/04, zski@ripco.com wrote: >I have a friend who is looking for a faire outfit that reflects his Polish >heritage. > >Can anyone recommend any books or sites with information on late 16th >Century Polish clothing for men? (I already checked that link off Drea's >site). I'm afraid that though I am half-Polish myself, I know next to >nothing about this area. If I'm remembering correctly, I think Gutkowska-Rychlewska, Maria. 1968. Historia Ubiorow. (not sure of the publisher) covers the relevant period. The text is in Polish, but there are lots of pictures and diagrams. Heather -- ***** Heather Rose Jones hrjones@socrates.berkeley.edu ***** _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 00:39:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I5dtSd023044 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:39:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I5d9cP021940; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:39:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I5d4Z3075615; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:39:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp2.mc.surewest.net (smtp2.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.51]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1I5d1Z3075595 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 22:39:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 13248 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2004 05:32:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21) (66.205.128.60) by smtp2.mc.surewest.net with SMTP; 18 Feb 2004 05:32:20 -0000 Message-Id: <4.2.2.20040217213007.01041db8@pop.surewest.net> X-Sender: joanmj@pop.surewest.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.2 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 21:32:16 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this a good deal on Godeys? In-Reply-To: <403293CB.4020206@reddawn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-TST: smtp2.mc.surewest.net SNWK2 0.31-3 ip=66.205.128.60 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 04:20 PM 2/17/2004 -0600, you wrote: >Just curious. I'm considering expanding my costume and history library >into this period and I see that there are several of these volumes on ebay. > >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3587049307&category=4510 >8&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBWA%3AIT&rd=1 > >Is $40 a good price for something like this? Are there better places to >buy these old magazines? I'd hate to start off by making foolish purchases. > >Dawn Actually, $40 would be a good price for this (the final bid, however, was nearly $82!), given its condition. I have found volumes of Godey's and Peterson's magazines at various places. My best shopping is usually at book shows. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 01:45:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I6jPSd023165 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 01:45:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I6gFcP024435; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 23:42:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I6g6Z3099178; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 23:42:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I6g4Z3099167 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 23:42:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claning@igc.org) Received: from blount.mail.mindspring.net (blount.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.226]) by fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1I5oPe20387 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:50:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from 209-165-35-031.jps.net ([209.165.35.31] helo=[209.165.41.127]) by blount.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AtKbH-0005OT-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:50:23 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: claning@pop.igc.org Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 21:32:55 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Chris Laning Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 10:18 PM -0600 2/15/04, otsisto wrote: >Looking for sources for Norwegian costumes during the 1500s and posibly >earlier. >Does anyone have a source? >The bunad is, to my knowledge, after the 1700s. Though I can if I am unable >to find anything, look at the different bunads and compare them to Danish >and Germanic costumes of the period and get a rough idea. You're right that the "bunad" is later. For those who haven't heard this term, Norway has a system of "official" folk costumes (bunader) for each province. Most, if not all, of them were codified in the "folk revival" movement of the very early 20th century -- 1911 is the date that sticks in my mind for some reason, and at 3:00AM I will probably wake up remembering the name of the woman who organized this particular aspect of the revival. (Aha! I looked it up -- Klara Semb.) There was, I should point out, quite a bit of political baggage attached to this particular "folk revival," since IIRC Norway was either pushing for, or had just achieved, its independence, after being subject to the Danish crown for quite a long time. Hence the revival of northern Norwegian dialect as "Nynorsk" or "New Norwegian," along with folk songs, folk dances, folk costumes etc. was all heavily nationalistic and tended to lay particular stress on _differences_ from Denmark and Sweden. (Disclaimer: all of what I'm saying here should be taken as "....if I'm remembering this correctly," since at the moment I can't lay my hands on one of the relevant books, the one with all the color postcards in it.) When I was there, many years ago, I knew at least enough about costume history to ask questions, and was told (IIRC) that some of the "official" costumes were derived from one or a group of surviving earlier costumes (mostly mid-1800s), while others simply took common construction techniques, picked a fabric common in the area, and declared it the "official" regional costume. These really were quite narrowly defined, right down to specific fabrics and what embroidery designs you were supposed to put on them, and while I was there I saw only a few deviations from the "official" versions. You could buy your "bunad" already made up, or as a pattern marked out on the cloth with the official embroidery designs drawn on the fabric. I don't think you could buy paper patterns, or I think I would have gotten a couple. What I particularly liked about it was that "bunad" is considered appropriate wear for any occasion, no matter how formal, and I knew quite a few people who bought them for their wedding outfits ("rather than wearing all that white stuff, like a ghost," one recent bride commented to me). The prices were way out of my reach, even for the do-it-yourself version -- several hundred dollars I think. So no, I would guess that, being basically a product of 19th-century romantic thinking, the generally accepted "folk costumes" of Norway would not be much help in trying to reconstruct what was worn in the 1500s. There actually probably _is_ some good information incorporated into the 19th-century designs, but without more evidence, it's hard to disentangle what it is. (I remember being fascinated at the time by the woman's costume for Setesdal, which was described to me then as having a "Bronze Age skirt." Worn over a white shirt or smock (as they all are), it consists of a band of red, green and black cloth that passes above the bosom and across the back, into which are gathered many yards of black wool that hang freely from there to the hem -- I seem to remember it looking almost like cartridge pleating, but at the time I wouldn't have known that. There are shoulder straps, and the skirt is relatively short, certainly not longer than mid-calf. The bottom of the skirt is heavily stiffened and bears appliqued red and green bands. In what respect this might be "Bronze Age" I now can't discern, unless it's perhaps a highly formalized "tube dress" that's been permanently gathered into a band.) I'd be interested to see what's happened to the state of research on Norwegian costumes since I was there. Quite a bit, I'm sure. -- _________________________________________________________ O Chris Laning | + Davis, California _________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 03:02:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I829Sd016601 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 03:02:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I7x1cP027035; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:59:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I7wvZ3027386; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:58:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I7wsZ3027365 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 00:58:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.117.49] (helo=dan) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1At5xT-0004ze-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:12:19 +0000 Message-ID: <003e01c3f560$4d99daa0$31758151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:14:05 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Madame Pompadour - unusual 18th century bodice X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all, I am trying to work out the construction of the unusual bodice shown in a Boucher porttrait of Madame le Pompador in the V&A painting http://gallery.euroweb.hu/art/b/boucher/2/pompado2.jpg It is obviously not front opening and is far looser than the robe francaise. Bjarne has suggested back lacing, but I am wondering whether side lacing may have been possible. Has anyone any thoughts? thanks and best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 04:03:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1I93ESd016995 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 04:03:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I906cP028597; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 02:00:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I903Z3046935; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 02:00:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1I901Z3046908 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 02:00:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i1I900T11277.; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:00:00 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:00:00 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:59:20 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>> claning@igc.org 18/02/04 05:32:55 >>> wrote: > Norway has a system of "official" folk costumes (bunader) >for each province. Most, if not all, of them were codified in the >"folk revival" movement of the very early 20th century -- 1911 is the >date that sticks in my mind for some reason, [snip] >There was, I should point out, quite a bit of political baggage >attached to this particular "folk revival," since IIRC Norway was >either pushing for, or had just achieved, its independence, after >being subject to the Danish crown for quite a long time. Prince Carl of Denmark and his British wife Princess Maud became King and Queen of an independent Norway in 1905. Kate Bunting (whose godfather is Norwegian) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 05:31:57 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IAVvSd017376 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 05:31:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IASucP002508; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 03:28:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IASpZ3075507; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 03:28:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IASmZ4075489 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 03:28:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1IAOpPp030793 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 05:24:52 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 05:24:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40333E5E.5010605@thibault.org> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 05:28:46 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Chris Laning wrote: > narrowly defined, right down to specific fabrics and what embroidery > designs you were supposed to put on them, and while I was there I saw > only a few deviations from the "official" versions. I was there with a conference a few years ago, and was told it was not allowed to sell deviations. Here is a great site with pictures, and is fairly easy to navigate even if you don't speak the language: http://www.husfliden.no/ The menu under the map lists the different regions. > What I particularly liked about it was that "bunad" is considered > appropriate wear for any occasion, no matter how formal, Yeah, it's the women's equivalent of a tailcoat. (There is men's bunad too.) I love this idea! But it costs thousands of dollars (hearsay). I was also really taken with the traditional jewelry, sřlje, which are round brooches with hanging dished circles. Modest ones are two or three inches across, and ones for weddings and such are larger! (I kept a trip diary, should anyone be interested; it's at http://www.virtue.to/articles/Oslo.html ) -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent Dinner was most tasty, and supported the guidebook's theory that in Norway, vegetables are something that happen to someone else. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 06:32:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IBWUSd017509 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:32:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IBTJcP004862; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 04:29:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IBSdZ3095224; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 04:28:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IBScZ3095218 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 04:28:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F04E81CF56 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 05:28:37 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p490.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.215.236]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A466CC596 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 05:28:36 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 05:28:55 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Looking at some of the Bunads I can see some of the styles look to have some Germanic 1400s or 1500s style to them. There are also some that look like they may have evolved from the old Norse apron dress. I am wondering if there has ever been an example of an Norse apron dress and if there is an example of how the straps were worn in the back. If so, was that way the most common way to wear it or not? I have noticed one consistency among the Scandinavian and Germanic regions is the apron. If the bunads are any indication, I would say that Norwegians in the 1500s might have probably worn aprons. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Kate M Bunting Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 2:59 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) >>> claning@igc.org 18/02/04 05:32:55 >>> wrote: > Norway has a system of "official" folk costumes (bunader) >for each province. Most, if not all, of them were codified in the >"folk revival" movement of the very early 20th century -- 1911 is the >date that sticks in my mind for some reason, [snip] >There was, I should point out, quite a bit of political baggage >attached to this particular "folk revival," since IIRC Norway was >either pushing for, or had just achieved, its independence, after >being subject to the Danish crown for quite a long time. Prince Carl of Denmark and his British wife Princess Maud became King and Queen of an independent Norway in 1905. Kate Bunting (whose godfather is Norwegian) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 08:38:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IDcpSd017809 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:38:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDVrcP008374; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:31:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDVpZ3037304; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:31:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDVmZ4037287 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:31:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1IDv1Wm024597 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:57:01 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.101] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A95E33B018E; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:32:14 -0500 Message-ID: <002101c3f624$4f26bc20$655183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:37:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO How do these costumes relate to the Danish peasant costumes of the 18th-19th C that Bjarne posted in the last few days? If the apron is one of the distinctive factors, how far back was the apron a true part of ethnic identity. One certainly finds it in the French regional costume too. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 6:28 AM Subject: RE: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) > Looking at some of the Bunads I can see some of the styles look to have some > Germanic 1400s or 1500s style to them. There are also some that look like > they may have evolved from the old Norse apron dress. > I am wondering if there has ever been an example of an Norse apron dress and > if there is an example of how the straps were worn in the back. If so, was > that way the most common way to wear it or not? > I have noticed one consistency among the Scandinavian and Germanic regions > is the apron. If the bunads are any indication, I would say that Norwegians > in the 1500s might have probably worn aprons. > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Kate M Bunting > Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 2:59 AM > To: h-costume@indra.com > Subject: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) > > > > > >>> claning@igc.org 18/02/04 05:32:55 >>> wrote: > > > Norway has a system of "official" folk costumes (bunader) > >for each province. Most, if not all, of them were codified in the > >"folk revival" movement of the very early 20th century -- 1911 is the > > >date that sticks in my mind for some reason, [snip] > > >There was, I should point out, quite a bit of political baggage > >attached to this particular "folk revival," since IIRC Norway was > >either pushing for, or had just achieved, its independence, after > >being subject to the Danish crown for quite a long time. > > Prince Carl of Denmark and his British wife Princess Maud became King > and Queen of an independent Norway in 1905. > > Kate Bunting (whose godfather is Norwegian) > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 08:41:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IDfrSd017819 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:41:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDOacP008122; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:24:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDOLZ3034340; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:24:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDOIZ4034317 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:24:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1IDnUWm017827 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:49:31 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.101] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7971C50190; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:24:39 -0500 Message-ID: <001701c3f623$40259940$655183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <003e01c3f560$4d99daa0$31758151@dan> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Madame Pompadour - unusual 18th century bodice Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:29:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My first thought would also be some kind of side fastening. Because of the way the ribbon tie is rusched in the front, it looks as if there might be some lacing in the front around which the ribbon is wound for the 'final effect'. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stevie Gamble" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2004 9:14 AM Subject: [h-cost] Madame Pompadour - unusual 18th century bodice > Hi all, > > I am trying to work out the construction of the unusual bodice shown > in a Boucher porttrait of Madame le Pompador in the V&A painting > > http://gallery.euroweb.hu/art/b/boucher/2/pompado2.jpg > > It is obviously not front opening and is far looser than the robe > francaise. Bjarne has suggested back lacing, but I am wondering > whether side lacing may have been possible. Has anyone any thoughts? > > thanks and best wishes > Stevie > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 08:42:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IDglSd017823 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:42:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDZocP008576; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:35:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDZoZ3038708; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:35:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from providenceday.org (treebeard.providenceday.org [66.193.73.82]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IDZmZ3038672 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 06:35:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from grace.morris@providenceday.org) Received: from [172.20.1.3] (HELO providenceday.org) by providenceday.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.5) with ESMTP id 1035013 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:36:25 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:35:04 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Grace Morris To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <40333E5E.5010605@thibault.org> Message-Id: <42AE5B84-6217-11D8-8EFE-000393DA0BCC@providenceday.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1IDZmZ3038672 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I came up with 2 possible via OCLC. They are both from the first half of the 19th century, which MIGHT mean that they have stuff from before the great folk dress "push" of the 19th century. One never knows... And if you ever want a feast for the eyes, be in Oslo on May 17, and see thousands of people (at least) dress in traditional folk dress! Grace/Jessamyn Title: Norske nationale Klćdedragter, Author(s): Senn, Johnannes, 1780-1861.  Publication: [Olso, Břrsums forlag, Year: 1969 Description: 80 l. of plates. 9 p. 33 cm. Language: Norwegian Standard No: LCCN: 72-365620 SUBJECT(S) Descriptor: Costume -- Norway -- History.  Note(s): Title also in German: Norwegische National-Kleidertrachten./ Captions in German and Norwegian: text in English and Norwegian./ Facsimile reprint of the 1812? Copenhagen ed./ "Er pá 100 nr. og signerte Title: Norske nationaldragter : Author(s): Třnsberg, Chr.; 1813-1897. ; (Christian),; Eckersberg, J. F.,; 1822-1870. ; (Johan Fredrik) Publication: [Oslo : Norges kunst og faksimile forlag, Year: 1994, 1852 Description: 136 p. : col. ill. ; 36 cm. Language: English Standard No: ISBN: 8244100346; LCCN: 95-160233 SUBJECT(S) Descriptor: Costume -- Norway -- History.  Clothing and dress in art.  Note(s): Text in English, German, and Norwegian./ Facsim. of 1852 ed. published in Christiania by Chr. Třnsberg, edited by Třnsberg, and with illustrations chiefly by J.F. Eckersberg. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 11:36:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IGaFSd018325 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:36:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IGY3cP021386; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:34:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IGXkZ3034060; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:33:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IGXhZ3033910 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:33:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Kitsune242@aol.com) Received: from Kitsune242@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.11.22c141d7 (16099) for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:28:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from aol.com (mow-m13.webmail.aol.com [64.12.180.129]) by air-id11.mx.aol.com (v97.18) with ESMTP id MAILINID113-3ee3403392a0139; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:28:17 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:28:16 -0500 From: Kitsune242@aol.com To: h-costume@indra.com (Historical Costume) MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <6176487E.4A6D7B90.0BD9917F@aol.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 X-AOL-IP: 169.237.109.158 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Costuming/Clothing/History Magazines X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings All, I am looking for a couple of interesting magazines to give a friend for her birthday. She already gets Threads. So I was wondering if any of you have any other suggestions. Kit If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 11:57:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IGvuSd018446 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:57:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IGtrcP024075; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:55:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IGtoZ3050480; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:55:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IGtkZ3050455 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:55:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claning@igc.org) Received: from tisch.mail.mindspring.net (tisch.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.157]) by fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1IGnND22827 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.167.48] (helo=wamui10.slb.atl.earthlink.net) by tisch.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AtUt0-0000Yh-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:49:22 -0500 Message-ID: <17721371.1077122962412.JavaMail.root@wamui10.slb.atl.earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 08:49:22 -0800 (GMT-08:00) From: Chris Laning To: Historical Costume Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1IGtkZ3050455 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Cynthia Virtue wrote: >I was also really taken with the traditional jewelry, sřlje, which are >round brooches with hanging dished circles. Modest ones are two or >three inches across, and ones for weddings and such are larger! Yes, I bought one while I was there. They twinkle as you move :) The only problem I have with mine is that I wear it so seldom (I rarely wear jewelry at all) that I have to polish the thing every time I want to wear it. The little silver mirrors tarnish *real* easy and are rather fiddly to polish up. ____________________________________________________________ 0 Chris Laning | + Davis, California ____________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 12:12:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IHC5Sd018533 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:12:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHBJcP026231; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:11:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHBGZ3061673; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:11:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHBAZ4061600 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:11:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1IH7CPp004232 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:07:12 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:07:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40339CAC.7030906@thibault.org> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:11:08 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) References: <17721371.1077122962412.JavaMail.root@wamui10.slb.atl.earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <17721371.1077122962412.JavaMail.root@wamui10.slb.atl.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Yes, I bought one while I was there. They twinkle as you move :) > > The only problem I have with mine is that I wear it so seldom (I rarely wear jewelry at all) that I have to polish the thing every time I want to wear it. The little silver mirrors tarnish *real* easy and are rather fiddly to polish up. Have you tried the aluminum foil-hot-water dip? Failing that, a jeweler's rouge cloth (silver polishing cloth) is easy to deal with and not messy. -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 12:25:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IHP5Sd018573 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:25:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHN4cP028002; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:23:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHN2Z3070725; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:23:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from cornell.edu (cornell.edu [132.236.56.6]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHMvZ3070680 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:22:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from VCS8.cornell.edu ([128.253.111.234]) by cornell.edu (8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA19231; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:59:58 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040218115503.00b9ae60@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:59:57 -0500 To: Historical Costume , , AmIPeriodorNot@yahoogroups.com From: M Stewart Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] urgh... need help X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi folks... sorry about the cross post... I've lost a link that I need - pretty desperately... sigh Was it on this list that the link to the folding stool recently came across? It was part of a larger recent archeological excavation. Hoping someone can send me the link to the site again. Bridgette, who is irked at herself for a lack of foresight... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 12:31:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IHV9Sd018589 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:31:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHT4cP028711; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:29:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHSxZ3074754; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:29:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp2.pacifier.net (smtp2.pacifier.net [64.255.237.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHSwZ3074732 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:28:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.130.5]) by smtp2.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 998376AD72 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:28:56 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:28:50 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <40333052.20301.153B1F9@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <003e01c3f560$4d99daa0$31758151@dan> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Tudor Shoes! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO When I was reading the news this morning, this popped up: http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/02/18/king.henry.wives.reut/i ndex.html It's about a pair of soccer shoes that Henry VIII ordered, but I was intrigued by the work done by the woman who found the order in an order for Henry VIII shoes. I would *love* to talk to her! Marc, have you heard of her? Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 12:51:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IHpJSd018650 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:51:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHohcP003165; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:50:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHoXZ3091107; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:50:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IHoVZ3091011 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:50:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.8) with ESMTP id 715301 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:50:25 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:50:24 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tudor Shoes! From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <40333052.20301.153B1F9@localhost> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO How interesting! I wonder if maybe he gave them away after wearing them once or twice, such as when our presidents and governors sign something with several pens and give them away to the people attending the signing. I can't imagine anyone, even Henry VIII or Imelda Marcos, wearing that many shoes in six months and keeping them around. LynnD On 2/18/04 9:28 AM, "kat@grendal.rain.com" wrote: > When I was reading the news this morning, this popped up: > > http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/02/18/king.henry.wives.reut/i > ndex.html > > It's about a pair of soccer shoes that Henry VIII ordered, but I was > intrigued by the work done by the woman who found the order in an > order for Henry VIII shoes. I would *love* to talk to her! > > Marc, have you heard of her? > > Kat > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 13:18:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1III8Sd018803 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:18:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIHGcP006335; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:17:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIH9Z3010509; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:17:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay11-dav120.bay11.hotmail.com [64.4.39.150]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIH7Z3010451 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:17:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bear_janet@msn.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:17:01 -0800 Received: from 4.10.36.229 by bay11-dav120.bay11.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:17:01 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [4.10.36.229] X-Originating-Email: [bear_janet@msn.com] X-Sender: bear_janet@msn.com From: "JAMES OGILVIE" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.1.1.2.20040218115503.00b9ae60@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Subject: Re: [h-cost] urgh... need help Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:16:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 8.5 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202 Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:16:58 -0500 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2004 18:17:01.0909 (UTC) FILETIME=[67B04050:01C3F64B] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1III8Sd018803 Status: RO Was this the one you needed? http://www.southendmuseums.co.uk/ This page links to another museum site with more information. Janet _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 13:22:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IIMhSd018844 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:22:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIJLcP006616; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:19:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIJKZ3011995; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:19:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from cornell.edu (cornell.edu [132.236.56.6]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIJFZ3011960 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:19:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from VCS8.cornell.edu ([128.253.111.234]) by cornell.edu (8.9.3p2/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA01465 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:19:14 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040218131844.00b4cd58@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:19:14 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: M Stewart Subject: Re: [h-cost] urgh... need help In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.1.1.2.20040218115503.00b9ae60@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Janet! THANK YOU! Yes that was it. Bridgette >Was this the one you needed? >http://www.southendmuseums.co.uk/ >This page links to another museum site with more information. > >Janet _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 13:52:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IIqOSd019008 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:52:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIpJcP010080; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:51:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIpCZ3035033; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:51:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IIp6Z3034932 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:51:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from brujne@creighton.edu) Received: from cindyabel (cla53081.creighton.edu [147.134.201.2]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_28810+JAGae91741)/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA26058 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:51:02 -0600 (CST) From: "Cindy Abel" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Tudor Shoes! Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:51:02 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Maybe there was a tamer "court" version of football, after all, this was 1526 before Henry started to morph from the very athletic, plus 6' ft golden boy of European royalty into the way more famous Holbein image imprinted on the collective public mind, or ol' Bluff King Hal ordered them for show(as he had a custom-made royal sailor outfit, complete with whistle, I believe, made for the launch of the "Mary Rose")when attending a football match. Or they could have been made for a court masque with a football theme. Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 14:35:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IJZWSd019219 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:35:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IJXUcP014436; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:33:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IJXPZ3064476; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:33:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IJXMZ3064391 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 12:33:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7bebf.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.191]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B333F47FF8C for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:33:16 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <002501c3f656$16676100$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <17721371.1077122962412.JavaMail.root@wamui10.slb.atl.earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:33:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. I two inherrited a very beautifull "Sřlvje" from my grandmother. She had it from Norway. But i gave it on to my brothers daughter, wich then can carry it on to her daughter, etc. My grandmother used it as a broche to close a neck shawl. I also inherrited a ring wich she had. It is special because she is wearing that ring in a portrait, my grandfather painted of her. That ring also went to my brothers daughter. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Laning" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 5:49 PM Subject: [h-cost] Re: Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) > Cynthia Virtue wrote: > > >I was also really taken with the traditional jewelry, sřlje, which are > >round brooches with hanging dished circles. Modest ones are two or > >three inches across, and ones for weddings and such are larger! > > Yes, I bought one while I was there. They twinkle as you move :) > > The only problem I have with mine is that I wear it so seldom (I rarely wear jewelry at all) that I have to polish the thing every time I want to wear it. The little silver mirrors tarnish *real* easy and are rather fiddly to polish up. > > > ____________________________________________________________ > 0 Chris Laning > | > + Davis, California > ____________________________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 15:15:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IKFcSd019351 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:15:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IKCAcP018302; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:12:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IKBrZ3090815; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:11:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (law9-f53.law9.hotmail.com [64.4.9.53]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IKBoZ3090700 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:11:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from marccarlson20@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 11:54:29 -0800 Received: from 129.244.6.162 by lw9fd.law9.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:54:29 GMT X-Originating-IP: [129.244.6.162] X-Originating-Email: [marccarlson20@hotmail.com] X-Sender: marccarlson20@hotmail.com From: "Marc Carlson" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:54:29 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2004 19:54:29.0878 (UTC) FILETIME=[05598160:01C3F659] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: Tudor Shoes! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >From: kat@grendal.rain.com >It's about a pair of soccer shoes that Henry VIII ordered, but I was >intrigued by the work done by the woman who found the order in an >order for Henry VIII shoes. I would *love* to talk to her! >Marc, have you heard of her? The name does not sound familiar - other than there is a Dr. Maria Hayward at the Textile Concervation center at the University of Southampton. I will say that calling Tudor era ball games "football" seems misleading, since they more resembled the modern fan riots, than the game :) (no teams, no separation of fans from "players" - just multiple mobs trying to posess a ball and move it from one place to another) - my guess is that Henry really did take part. Marc _________________________________________________________________ Watch high-quality video with fast playback at MSN Video. Free! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200365ave/direct/01/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 15:16:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IKG9Sd019356 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:16:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IKFLcP018615; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:15:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IKFGZ3093345; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:15:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IKFEZ3093282 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:15:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7bebf.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.191]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 48EB45EE260 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:15:11 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <008c01c3f65b$f4aa1570$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:15:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] new addiction X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1IKG9Sd019356 Status: RO Sigh! Today i found another thing wich makes me addicted. An embroidery shop in Copenhagen started to sell silk ribbon for embroidery................. Sigh............... Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 16:48:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ILmESd019773 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:48:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ILlDcP026476; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:47:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ILktZ3056671; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:46:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ILkrZ3056655 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:46:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFBB51D12D for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:46:52 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t3p136.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.220.138]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id BF918C5CC for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:46:50 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:47:09 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <17721371.1077122962412.JavaMail.root@wamui10.slb.atl.earthlink.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Having most of my jewelry silver, I have learned a trick or two. When storing them, either store the silver item in one of those anti tarnish silverware boxes or keep in a ziplock bag. As for cleaning I like to use the jewelers cloth, though if the item can handle it I use tarnX then a silver polish to help seal the item a bit. I don't use the tarnX unless it is necessary. I will have to try the aluminum trick sometime. De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Chris Laning Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 10:49 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Re: Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Cynthia Virtue wrote: >I was also really taken with the traditional jewelry, sřlje, which are >round brooches with hanging dished circles. Modest ones are two or >three inches across, and ones for weddings and such are larger! Yes, I bought one while I was there. They twinkle as you move :) The only problem I have with mine is that I wear it so seldom (I rarely wear jewelry at all) that I have to polish the thing every time I want to wear it. The little silver mirrors tarnish *real* easy and are rather fiddly to polish up. ____________________________________________________________ 0 Chris Laning | + Davis, California ____________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 17:00:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IM0rSd019799 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:00:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ILmYcP026591; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:48:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ILmXZ3057857; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:48:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ILktZ3056673 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 14:46:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26FE01D12D for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:46:55 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t3p136.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.220.138]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 4F393C5CC for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:46:53 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:47:12 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <002101c3f624$4f26bc20$655183d1@rmitchellras> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I am not sure how to reply to this as I am not sure of the question. I am looking for 1500's Norwegian costumes or earlier. The bunad is a starting point in that I have said that there are hints in the styles that look similar to dresses of other countries during the 1500s or earlier. The apron was quite popular during the 1500s in the Germanic Principalities, Northern France, Dutch, Danish, and Sweden. So I feel that there is a possibility that aprons might have been worn by the Norwegian. Does this make sense? De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Lloyd Mitchell Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 7:37 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) How do these costumes relate to the Danish peasant costumes of the 18th-19th C that Bjarne posted in the last few days? If the apron is one of the distinctive factors, how far back was the apron a true part of ethnic identity. One certainly finds it in the French regional costume too. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 6:28 AM Subject: RE: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) > Looking at some of the Bunads I can see some of the styles look to have some > Germanic 1400s or 1500s style to them. There are also some that look like > they may have evolved from the old Norse apron dress. > I am wondering if there has ever been an example of an Norse apron dress and > if there is an example of how the straps were worn in the back. If so, was > that way the most common way to wear it or not? > I have noticed one consistency among the Scandinavian and Germanic regions > is the apron. If the bunads are any indication, I would say that Norwegians > in the 1500s might have probably worn aprons. > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Kate M Bunting > Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 2:59 AM > To: h-costume@indra.com > Subject: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) > > > > > >>> claning@igc.org 18/02/04 05:32:55 >>> wrote: > > > Norway has a system of "official" folk costumes (bunader) > >for each province. Most, if not all, of them were codified in the > >"folk revival" movement of the very early 20th century -- 1911 is the > > >date that sticks in my mind for some reason, [snip] > > >There was, I should point out, quite a bit of political baggage > >attached to this particular "folk revival," since IIRC Norway was > >either pushing for, or had just achieved, its independence, after > >being subject to the Danish crown for quite a long time. > > Prince Carl of Denmark and his British wife Princess Maud became King > and Queen of an independent Norway in 1905. > > Kate Bunting (whose godfather is Norwegian) > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 17:30:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IMUdSd019895 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:30:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IMSXcP000892; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:28:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IMSTZ3085086; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:28:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IMSQZ4085053 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:28:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1IMrjWm032178 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:53:46 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.115] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A72357D007E; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:28:51 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c3f66f$462776a0$735183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <6176487E.4A6D7B90.0BD9917F@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costuming/Clothing/History Magazines Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:33:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Pieceworks! This magazine is the most interesting I think for anyone interested in any kind of handwork from the past. The articles are historical, ethnical,and totally interesting for people interested in how stitchery gets passed from one generation to the next. This past year alone has revealed so much from both the 18th and 19th C that is germane for those interested in Historical Costuming! Whether it is embroidery, knitting, knotting, lace making, hardanger, weaving, beading....You name it, the articles are well supported with proper research and enthusiasm for challenging the contemporary needleworker to "pass it on". Kathleen Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 11:28 AM Subject: [h-cost] Costuming/Clothing/History Magazines > Greetings All, > > I am looking for a couple of interesting magazines to give a friend for her birthday. She already gets Threads. So I was wondering if any of you have any other suggestions. > > Kit > If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - Kenneth Cole > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 17:56:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1IMuvSd019948 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:56:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IMspcP003429; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:54:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IMsjZ3002995; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:54:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r10.mx.aol.com (imo-r10.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.106]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1IMsgZ3002882 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:54:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from imo-d06.mx.aol.com (imo-d06.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.230]) by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (v92.15) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-0218174922; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:49:22 -0500 Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.19a.20a7cc05 (3980) for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:44:09 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <19a.20a7cc05.2d6544b9@aol.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:44:09 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] new addiction To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6024 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/18/2004 3:15:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: > Sigh! > Today i found another thing wich makes me addicted. > An embroidery shop in Copenhagen started to sell silk ribbon for > embroidery................. > I've seen that in the States for years now. Good color range, no? These narrow silk ribbons are great for running through casings in chemise necklines or shirt cuffs and the like. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 18:42:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1INg9Sd020080 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:42:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1INeWcP007308; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:40:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1INeUZ3038186; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:40:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out005.verizon.net (out005pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.143]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1INeRZ3038164 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:40:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from queenscorner@verizon.net) Received: from brandyscomp ([4.33.47.70]) by out005.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040218231143.BHX2677.out005.verizon.net@brandyscomp> for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:11:43 -0600 Message-ID: <002201c3f674$968f0360$462f2104@brandyscomp> From: "Brandy Deming" To: Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 15:11:48 -0800 Organization: Better Times for Small Business MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out005.verizon.net from [4.33.47.70] at Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:11:43 -0600 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Help! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1INg9Sd020080 Status: RO Greetings Everyone! I need some help. I hail from the land of Aquaterra in An Tir (Snohomish County, WA-namely Everett). Being of Scottish blood, sometimes my mouth gets the better of me. I managed to talk my way into costuming Fortinbras (a sequel to Hamlet written in 1991). I need every ounce of help I can get on ideas for costumes. It would be late period 1580-1630s??. Please email me any suggestions or links. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU! Brandy Deming Queen's Corner Publishing Handmade personalized books, costumes and toys for children. 425.252.7555 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 18:54:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1INsaSd020100 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:54:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1INpMcP008493; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:51:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1INpKZ3044955; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:51:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1INpFZ3044914 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:51:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sherylnd@kc.rr.com) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com (CPE-65-30-107-115.kc.rr.com [65.30.107.115]) by ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1INp8DA020347 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:51:13 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20040218180651.00a154d0@pop-server.kc.rr.com> X-Sender: sherylnd@pop-server.kc.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:08:03 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costuming/Clothing/History Magazines In-Reply-To: <6176487E.4A6D7B90.0BD9917F@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If she gets Threads, she might be interested in Belle Armoire. It's an art-to-wear magazine. Beautiful for inspiration. Almost a cross between Threads and a costuming magazine. Sheryl Nance-Durst At 11:28 AM 2/18/04 -0500, you wrote: >Greetings All, > >I am looking for a couple of interesting magazines to give a friend for >her birthday. She already gets Threads. So I was wondering if any of you >have any other suggestions. > >Kit >If you walk a mile in someone else's shoes, do you get to keep them? - >Kenneth Cole >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 19:03:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1J03DSd020127 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:03:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J01HcP009378; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:01:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J01FZ3051217; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:01:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J01DZ3051194 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:01:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from razorbill.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.121.248]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AtWcm-0002wQ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:40:44 -0800 Received: from dialup-65.56.2.211.dial1.pittsburgh1.level3.net ([65.56.2.211] helo=HELENPINTO) by razorbill.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AtWck-0003wk-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 10:40:43 -0800 Message-ID: <009d01c3f64e$b2c51bd0$d3023841@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: <40333E5E.5010605@thibault.org> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 13:40:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9ef282d5b516a39d075f54da455ab26384c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you have a copy of the Branagh "Hamlet", check out Queen Gertrude's ladies-in-waiting- they're wearing bunads, frequently with the short jacket. We got a good grasp on bunads several years ago, when we were doing the Christmas Revels Scandinavian show. We didn't just get to fake 19c Norweigian, we also got to fake 19c Danish, Swedish, and Finnish. It actually looked pretty good next to the real stuff on the "talent" from Norway and Finland. -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 19:39:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1J0djSd020246 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:39:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J0bqcP012884; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:37:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J0boZ3071411; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:37:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J0bkZ3071330 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:37:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C003642615 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:50:23 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <403406C2.4030300@reddawn.net> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:43:46 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help! References: <002201c3f674$968f0360$462f2104@brandyscomp> In-Reply-To: <002201c3f674$968f0360$462f2104@brandyscomp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Brandy Deming wrote: > Greetings Everyone! > > I managed to talk my way into costuming Fortinbras (a sequel to Hamlet written in 1991). I need every ounce of help I can get on ideas for costumes. It would be late period 1580-1630s??. > Please email me any suggestions or links. > THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU! > Well, on the one end of the scale there is Janet Arnold's _Patterns of Fashion 1560-1620 _, at bookstores everywhere. On the other hand, if you have volunteer sewers who rely on commercial patterns there is Simplicity 5574, which almost looks right and may be acceptable for stage use. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 19:47:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1J0lSSd020259 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:47:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J0kkcP013557; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:46:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J0kgZ3075672; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:46:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.fuse.net (smtp1.fuse.net [216.68.8.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J0kIZ3075463 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 17:46:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jemarshall@fuse.net) Received: from netzero.fuse.net ([66.161.252.247]) by smtp1.fuse.net (InterMail vM.6.00.05.02 201-2115-109-103-20031105) with ESMTP id <20040218214710.YPAI10318.smtp1.fuse.net@netzero.fuse.net> for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:47:10 -0500 Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20040218163802.00ba3cb0@pop.fuse.net> X-Sender: jemarshall@pop.fuse.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 16:41:26 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: "J.E. Marshall" Subject: Re: [h-cost] 16th century Polish? In-Reply-To: References: <4032708b.68b9.0@ripco.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Here are a couple of sites for 17th century. Fortunately, many of the rural dress changes little in that area. Jennifer MC http://www.kismeta.com/diGrasse/PoleCostume.htm This one is stills from a film set in the 17th century, but good to get ideas from http://www.ogniem-i-mieczem.pl/english/film.htm >>I have a friend who is looking for a faire outfit that reflects his Polish >>heritage. >> >>Can anyone recommend any books or sites with information on late 16th >>Century Polish clothing for men? (I already checked that link off Drea's >>site). I'm afraid that though I am half-Polish myself, I know next to >>nothing about this area. >> >>Wendy Z >>looking up pictures in >>Chicago, IL _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 20:38:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1J1cpSd020406 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:38:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J1b4cP016905; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:37:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J1avZ3099257; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:36:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J1auZ4099249 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 18:36:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1J1WwPp011892 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:32:58 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:32:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40341336.1040700@thibault.org> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:36:54 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costuming/Clothing/History Magazines References: <5.1.0.14.0.20040218180651.00a154d0@pop-server.kc.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20040218180651.00a154d0@pop-server.kc.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sheryl Nance-Durst wrote: > If she gets Threads, she might be interested in Belle Armoire. > It's an art-to-wear magazine. Beautiful for inspiration. Almost > a cross between Threads and a costuming magazine. Wow! Here's their website with a highlight of the current issue: http://www.stampington.com/html/ba_win04_sprds.html -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 18 21:32:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1J2WlSd020567 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:32:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J2W1cP019312; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:32:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J2VwZ3024574; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:31:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J2VrZ3024497 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 19:31:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A031168900DC; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:32:17 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A02E2EE0252; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 20:32:14 -0600 Message-ID: <014101c3f690$808773b0$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:31:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Video recording time! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1J2WlSd020567 Status: RO Oscar Movie Watch: Lust for Life: Movie about Vincent Van Gogh's life. It is on Turner Classic Movies Friday, 02/20/2004, 3:30 AM (Eastern time). You can go to their website and see a video on how the movie was made. More about the film on: http://www.turnerclassicmovies.com/ThisMonth/Article/0,,66921|66922|31554,00.html Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 19 00:51:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1J5prSd021021 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 00:51:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J5nqcP000678; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 22:49:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J5niZ3006346; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 22:49:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out012.verizon.net (out012pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J5ngZ3006337 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 22:49:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from queenscorner@verizon.net) Received: from brandyscomp ([4.33.47.70]) by out012.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040219052857.HUBU1590.out012.verizon.net@brandyscomp> for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:28:57 -0600 Message-ID: <001401c3f6a9$4a363bc0$462f2104@brandyscomp> From: "Brandy Deming" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002201c3f674$968f0360$462f2104@brandyscomp> <403406C2.4030300@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help! Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:29:04 -0800 Organization: Better Times for Small Business MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out012.verizon.net from [4.33.47.70] at Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:28:57 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO thank you, thank you! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 4:43 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help! > Brandy Deming wrote: > > > Greetings Everyone! > > > > I managed to talk my way into costuming Fortinbras (a sequel to Hamlet written in 1991). I need every ounce of help I can get on ideas for costumes. It would be late period 1580-1630s??. > > Please email me any suggestions or links. > > THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU! > > > > Well, on the one end of the scale there is Janet Arnold's _Patterns of > Fashion 1560-1620 _, at bookstores everywhere. On the other hand, if you > have volunteer sewers who rely on commercial patterns there is > Simplicity 5574, which almost looks right and may be acceptable for > stage use. > > > Dawn > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 19 03:07:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1J87bSd014678 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 03:07:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J86hcP004479; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 01:06:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J86eZ3054924; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 01:06:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1J86bZ3054909 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 01:06:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claning@igc.org) Received: from granger.mail.mindspring.net (granger.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.148]) by fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1J6ghe10229 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 01:42:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from 209-165-41-203.jps.net ([209.165.41.203]) by granger.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AthtR-0004CN-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 01:42:42 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: claning@pop.igc.org Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 22:28:25 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Chris Laning Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Norwegian 1500s (WAS: RE: Bunad) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 3:47 PM -0600 2/18/04, otsisto wrote: >I am looking for 1500's Norwegian costumes or earlier. The bunad is a >starting point in that I have said that there are hints in the styles that >look similar to dresses of other countries during the 1500s or earlier. Sorry about the digression into the 19th century; it's just that your post brought back some happy memories :) * * * * * * * * You also wrote: >I am wondering if there has ever been an example of an Norse apron dress and >if there is an example of how the straps were worn in the back. If so, was >that way the most common way to wear it or not? ...[snip]... > >The apron was quite popular during the 1500s in the Germanic >Principalities, Northern France, Dutch, Danish, and Sweden. So I >feel that there is a possibility that aprons might have been worn by >the Norwegian. Does this make sense? Ah. One thing that might be confusing you is the phrase "Norse apron dress." This indeed is a style from earlier than 1500, in fact quite a bit earlier. The first two sources listed below should have some information on it. It is not a dress with an apron, in the way we usually think of the terms. It is a different kind of garment, worn by women in the Viking era as an outer "dress" over an inner gown. It is described as an "apron dress" because when it was first being reconstructed in the 1960s, it was thought to consist of two separate rectangular panels of cloth, one worn in the front (called the "front apron") and one in the back (the "back apron"). I won't go into all the details, but it is now thought that in most cases it was probably a sewn-together, tube-shaped garment that draped loosely over the inner gown. So "apron dress" is something of a misnomer, but I can see why it would leave you thinking about aprons. * * * * * * * * As for sources -- there actually seems to be a fair amount of information about clothing during the "Viking era" (roughly late 800s to about 1100). You can find more information about this at sites like: Carolyn Priest-Dorman's web page The "Viking Answer Lady" at I know there is also information about Scandinavian clothing in the medieval era, but I'm not as certain where to start looking. You might ask Marc Carlson; he has a page on the (men's) garments from Boksten at: http://www.personal.utulsa.edu/~marc-carlson/cloth/bockhome.html All these are just places to start. As is always the case, the thing to do when no one seems to have the answers you're looking for is to ask the Magic Reference Question: "Well, then -- can you think of someone else who MIGHT know, and what's their address, and may I tell them you sent me?" Sometimes you have to go from one person to another to another, and it may take two or three "wrong" people before you finally find the right one. Hope this helps -- -- _________________________________________________________ O Chris Laning | + Davis, California _________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 19 07:41:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1JCfwSd015750 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 07:41:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JCeScP013467; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 05:40:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JCeLZ3039195; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 05:40:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JCeIZ3039177 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 05:40:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C0D81D083 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:40:18 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p212.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.214]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id EEBF0C596 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:40:16 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: Norwegian 1500s (WAS: RE: Bunad) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:40:18 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO That is alright, I like to hear them. It helped me revisit a site and got closer looks at the bunads which givens me a theory. The back of the old Norse looking "apron" bunad, I noticed that the shoulder blades were exposed. If these were based on the old Norse apron dress (this is not saying they are) but if they were, then perhaps the back could indicate that the straps on the original dress were crossed in the back. This is just theory and no hard evidence for it. De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Chris Laning Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2004 12:28 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Re: Norwegian 1500s (WAS: RE: Bunad) At 3:47 PM -0600 2/18/04, otsisto wrote: >I am looking for 1500's Norwegian costumes or earlier. The bunad is a >starting point in that I have said that there are hints in the styles that >look similar to dresses of other countries during the 1500s or earlier. Sorry about the digression into the 19th century; it's just that your post brought back some happy memories :) * * * * * * * * You also wrote: >I am wondering if there has ever been an example of an Norse apron dress and >if there is an example of how the straps were worn in the back. If so, was >that way the most common way to wear it or not? ...[snip]... > >The apron was quite popular during the 1500s in the Germanic >Principalities, Northern France, Dutch, Danish, and Sweden. So I >feel that there is a possibility that aprons might have been worn by >the Norwegian. Does this make sense? Ah. One thing that might be confusing you is the phrase "Norse apron dress." This indeed is a style from earlier than 1500, in fact quite a bit earlier. The first two sources listed below should have some information on it. It is not a dress with an apron, in the way we usually think of the terms. It is a different kind of garment, worn by women in the Viking era as an outer "dress" over an inner gown. It is described as an "apron dress" because when it was first being reconstructed in the 1960s, it was thought to consist of two separate rectangular panels of cloth, one worn in the front (called the "front apron") and one in the back (the "back apron"). I won't go into all the details, but it is now thought that in most cases it was probably a sewn-together, tube-shaped garment that draped loosely over the inner gown. So "apron dress" is something of a misnomer, but I can see why it would leave you thinking about aprons. * * * * * * * * As for sources -- there actually seems to be a fair amount of information about clothing during the "Viking era" (roughly late 800s to about 1100). You can find more information about this at sites like: Carolyn Priest-Dorman's web page The "Viking Answer Lady" at I know there is also information about Scandinavian clothing in the medieval era, but I'm not as certain where to start looking. You might ask Marc Carlson; he has a page on the (men's) garments from Boksten at: http://www.personal.utulsa.edu/~marc-carlson/cloth/bockhome.html All these are just places to start. As is always the case, the thing to do when no one seems to have the answers you're looking for is to ask the Magic Reference Question: "Well, then -- can you think of someone else who MIGHT know, and what's their address, and may I tell them you sent me?" Sometimes you have to go from one person to another to another, and it may take two or three "wrong" people before you finally find the right one. Hope this helps -- -- _________________________________________________________ O Chris Laning | + Davis, California _________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 19 07:43:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1JChqSd015754 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 07:43:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JCf8cP013505; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 05:41:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JCf8Z3039403; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 05:41:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JCeKZ3039185 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 05:40:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E167D1D083 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:40:19 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p212.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.214]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id DEB15C40E for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:40:18 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:40:19 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 1500s Sweden X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm not sure if it was this list or another. Someone was looking for 1400s -1500s Swedish outfits. I found this http://inky.library.yale.edu/medwomen/04183209.html No# 60 De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 19 08:28:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1JDS7Sd015883 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 08:28:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JDPucP015332; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:25:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JDPsZ3053685; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:25:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JDPoZ3053566 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 06:25:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i1JDPaT09668.; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 13:25:37 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 13:25:36 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 13:25:24 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: [h-cost] RE: Tudor Shoes! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>> marccarlson20@hotmail.com 18/02/04 19:54:29 >>>. >>From: kat@grendal.rain.com >>It's about a pair of soccer shoes that Henry VIII ordered, but I was >>intrigued by the work done by the woman who found the order in an >>order for Henry VIII shoes. I would *love* to talk to her! >>Marc, have you heard of her? >I will say that calling Tudor era ball games "football" seems misleading, >since they more resembled the modern fan riots, than the game :) ...and calling it "soccer" even more so, since it long pre-dates the Football Association! On the subject of football and royalty, an old-style "free-for-all" football game is traditionally played on Shrove Tuesday at Ashbourne here in Derbyshire. Nowadays a famous person is invited to start the game off by tossing the ball to the players, and last year Prince Charles did so. I don't suppose he was required to wear football boots, though! __________________________________________________________ Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 19 10:47:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1JFlPSd016232 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 10:47:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JFhgcP024303; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 08:43:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JFhZZ3014289; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 08:43:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp2.pacifier.net (smtp2.pacifier.net [64.255.237.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JFhRZ3014203 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 08:43:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.131.22]) by smtp2.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCA7B6ABEC for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 07:42:59 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 07:42:57 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: Tudor Shoes! Message-ID: <40346901.5363.6191BFB@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > On the subject of football and royalty, an > old-style "free-for-all" football game is traditionally played on > Shrove Tuesday at Ashbourne here in Derbyshire. Nowadays a famous > person is invited to start the game off by tossing the ball to the > players, and last year Prince Charles did so. I don't suppose he was > required to wear football boots, though! Perhaps Henry VIII, being the clothes horse he seemed to be, wanted a pair of football boots even if Prince Charles wasn't interested or required to have them. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 19 14:39:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1JJdrSd018919 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 14:39:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JJcZcP016804; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 12:38:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1JJc51r076577; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 12:38:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lycos.com (www2.mail.lycos.com [209.202.220.150]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1JJc01r076447 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 12:38:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katie_lewis@mailcity.com) Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by mailcity.com; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 19:31:12 -0000 To: "Historical Costume" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 14:31:12 -0500 From: "Katie Lewis" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off X-Mailer: MailCity Service X-Priority: 3 Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here-ROLL CALL X-Sender-Ip: 129.219.247.249 Organization: Lycos Mail (http://www.mail.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Katie Lewis Tempe, AZ I do American Civil War and SCA. In the SCA I do mainly mid-late 16th century English and Russian. The latter is because my husband has a Russian persona. For both periods I have a newly aquired interest in children's clothing as I have a 9 month old son I need to keep clothed. --- Willow: No, Ma, hear this! I'm a rebel! I'm having a rebellion! Sheila: Willow, honey, you don't need to act out like this to prove your specialness. Willow: Mom, I'm not acting out. I'm a witch! I-I can make pencils float. And I can summon the four elements. Okay, two, but four soon. A-and I'm dating a musician.I worship Beelzebub. I do his biddings. Do you see any goats around? No, because I sacrificed them. Sheila:I'm not listening to this. Willow:Prince of Night, I summon you. Come fill me with your black, naughty evil. ____________________________________________________________ Find what you are looking for with the Lycos Yellow Pages http://r.lycos.com/r/yp_emailfooter/http://yellowpages.lycos.com/default.asp?SRC=lycos10 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 19 22:31:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1K3VESd020786 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:31:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K3TGcP021733; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 20:29:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K3TBsR053457; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 20:29:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K3T7sR053387 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 20:29:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA03373 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:25:41 -0600 Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:25:41 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Just a quick reminder to the list that I've got two lecture appearances in the next few weeks: Feb. 28 (a week from Saturday) I'll be in Philadelphia. Details at http://www.cottesimple.com/robin_netherton/lecture_info.htm . I believe there may be a few spots left. March 13 I'll be in Springfield, Illinois. Big room, so you can still get a seat, but advance reservations would be wise. Details here: http://home.insightbb.com/~swordcliff/robin.html In each case, I'm giving a full day of lectures -- five in all, concentrating on women's dress of the 14th and 15th centuries. I expect I'll be seeing a few h-cost listmembers at both venues. Please introduce yourselves! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 00:28:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1K5SdSd021054 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 00:28:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K5RscP028259; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:27:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K5RisR002211; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:27:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out003.verizon.net (out003pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.103]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K5RfsR002177 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:27:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from queenscorner@verizon.net) Received: from brandyscomp ([4.35.51.184]) by out003.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040220051502.XQVC8426.out003.verizon.net@brandyscomp>; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:15:02 -0600 Message-ID: <002e01c3f770$7fd83720$b8332304@brandyscomp> From: "Brandy Deming" To: "SCA Costumes" , "Historic Costume List" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 21:15:03 -0800 Organization: Better Times for Small Business MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out003.verizon.net from [4.35.51.184] at Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:15:02 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] limp muslin X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1K5SdSd021054 Status: RO I was browsing through some books today and was wondering how one goes about puffing muslin. What centuries does the double sleeve belong to and what is the history behind it? :) The Chatterbox _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 00:33:57 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1K5XvSd021065 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 00:33:57 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K5UmcP028552; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:30:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K5UlsR003509; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:30:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K5UksR003483 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:30:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a249.in-tch.com [66.62.107.49]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1K58Bs02901 for ; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:08:11 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <40359C40.3040608@in-tch.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 22:33:52 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh, drool! I sure wish I could get the opportunity sometime to hear all five of them (boy, but you must be really tired at the end of the day!) --sue, who really enjoyed the ones she *has* heard ;o) Robin Netherton wrote: > Just a quick reminder to the list that I've got two lecture appearances in > the next few weeks: > > Feb. 28 (a week from Saturday) I'll be in Philadelphia. Details at > http://www.cottesimple.com/robin_netherton/lecture_info.htm . I believe > there may be a few spots left. > > March 13 I'll be in Springfield, Illinois. Big room, so you can still get > a seat, but advance reservations would be wise. Details here: > http://home.insightbb.com/~swordcliff/robin.html > > In each case, I'm giving a full day of lectures -- five in all, > concentrating on women's dress of the 14th and 15th centuries. > > I expect I'll be seeing a few h-cost listmembers at both venues. Please > introduce yourselves! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 02:52:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1K7qeSd014740 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 02:52:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K7q0cP004482; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 00:52:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K7pssR056629; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 00:51:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out007.verizon.net (out007pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.107]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1K7ppsR056603 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 00:51:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from queenscorner@verizon.net) Received: from brandyscomp ([4.35.51.184]) by out007.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040220072041.VIAW13340.out007.verizon.net@brandyscomp> for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 01:20:41 -0600 Message-ID: <006301c3f782$0dabfc10$b8332304@brandyscomp> From: "Brandy Deming" To: "Historical Costume" References: <40359C40.3040608@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:20:38 -0800 Organization: Better Times for Small Business MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out007.verizon.net from [4.35.51.184] at Fri, 20 Feb 2004 01:20:41 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Tell me about it... the only time I'd get to hear it is if she came out west. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2004 9:33 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming > Oh, drool! I sure wish I could get the opportunity sometime to hear all > five of them (boy, but you must be really tired at the end of the day!) > --sue, who really enjoyed the ones she *has* heard ;o) > > Robin Netherton wrote: > > > Just a quick reminder to the list that I've got two lecture appearances in > > the next few weeks: > > > > Feb. 28 (a week from Saturday) I'll be in Philadelphia. Details at > > http://www.cottesimple.com/robin_netherton/lecture_info.htm . I believe > > there may be a few spots left. > > > > March 13 I'll be in Springfield, Illinois. Big room, so you can still get > > a seat, but advance reservations would be wise. Details here: > > http://home.insightbb.com/~swordcliff/robin.html > > > > In each case, I'm giving a full day of lectures -- five in all, > > concentrating on women's dress of the 14th and 15th centuries. > > > > I expect I'll be seeing a few h-cost listmembers at both venues. Please > > introduce yourselves! > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 09:27:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KERxSd017233 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 09:27:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KER6cP019739; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:27:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KEPtsR016318; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:26:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KEOrsR015786 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:25:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AuBaE-000NKG-0W for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 14:24:51 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:11:49 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bunad (WAS: Re: Norwegian 1500s) References: <40333E5E.5010605@thibault.org> <42AE5B84-6217-11D8-8EFE-000393DA0BCC@providenceday.org> In-Reply-To: <42AE5B84-6217-11D8-8EFE-000393DA0BCC@providenceday.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Grace Morris wrote >I came up with 2 possible via OCLC. They are both from the first half >of the 19th century, which MIGHT mean that they have stuff from before >the great folk dress "push" of the 19th century. One never knows... > >And if you ever want a feast for the eyes, be in Oslo on May 17, and >see thousands of people (at least) dress in traditional folk dress! > >Grace/Jessamyn I was going to say, there's quite a big celebration of Norway Day in Edinburgh, which breaks up about the time I get out of work, and it's great to see people walking back through town in these spectacular outfits. Jean -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 10:30:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KFUfSd017394 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:30:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KFQvcP023426; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 08:26:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KFPtsR048377; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 08:26:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lioness.futureautomation.com (c-24-17-76-68.client.comcast.net [24.17.76.68]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KFPosS048294 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 08:25:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from colleen.mcdonald@comcast.net) Received: from cognospc (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lioness.futureautomation.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id i1KFPihZ027813 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:25:44 -0800 Message-ID: <002601c3f7c5$ce6d6680$1b03010a@mackie.com> From: "Colleen McDonald" To: "Historical Costume" References: <40359C40.3040608@in-tch.com> <006301c3f782$0dabfc10$b8332304@brandyscomp> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:25:43 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO << Tell me about it... the only time I'd get to hear it is if she came out > west.>> Actually, Robin has lectured in the Seattle area - last August - and it was great! We had a full house and a very energetic group. Colleen _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 10:57:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KFvBSd017480 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:57:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KFubcP025909; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 08:56:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KFtDsR067889; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 08:56:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KFt8sS067850 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 08:55:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1KFp8Pp025938 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:51:08 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:51:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40362DDB.1010801@thibault.org> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:55:07 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If folks hear of other scholars willing to lecture, do tell us about them. My local SCA group gets very excited about real-history information from acadamia. We brought Ms. Netherton here a few months ago and it was great! -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 12:08:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KH8iSd017690 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 12:08:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KH5WcP001915; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:05:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KH5PsR016420; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:05:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KH5LsR016354 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:05:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-125-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.125.111]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KFTeJ1010819 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:29:40 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040220072916.04c34ea0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 07:30:24 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] limp muslin In-Reply-To: <002e01c3f770$7fd83720$b8332304@brandyscomp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I was browsing through some books today and was wondering how one goes >about puffing muslin. What's that? >What centuries does the double sleeve belong to and what is the history >behind it? Which double sleeve are you talking about? So many centuries and countries had these, in one form or another... CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 13:03:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KI3RSd017943 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:03:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KI08cP007338; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:00:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KI04sR054580; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:00:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KHxssR054436 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:59:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA07120 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:29:33 -0600 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:29:33 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming In-Reply-To: <40359C40.3040608@in-tch.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thu, 19 Feb 2004, Sue Clemenger wrote: > Oh, drool! I sure wish I could get the opportunity sometime to hear all > five of them (boy, but you must be really tired at the end of the day!) Um, yeah ... :-) Mostly my voice, though. Fitting people is actually *more* tiring, on the whole. They sent me home from Boise in a bucket. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 13:28:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KISkSd018059 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:28:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KIRvcP010269; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:27:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KIRosR073750; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:27:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KIRlsR073690 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:27:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from alfalfapress.com (c-24-21-157-61.client.comcast.net [24.21.157.61]) by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1KIRfW12797 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:27:41 -0500 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 10:29:18 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed From: Althea Turner To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] early medieval sheep X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings, I was wondering if anyone knew a source for images of early medieval sheep. I have found images on line for the Soay, but am trying to find pictures of the breeds that appeared between the Soay and the Merino. Do those breeds even exist today? Thanks! Althea Turner *** althea@alfalfapress.com *** http://www.alfalfapress.com Public Relations Manager Sauron/Voldemort 2004 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 13:50:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KIohSd018173 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:50:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KIlNcP012235; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:47:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KIlKsR087484; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:47:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu [132.236.56.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KIlFsR087448 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 11:47:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from arkham.cornell.edu (vcs077.vet.cornell.edu [128.253.111.77]) by postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i1KIlCjT025230 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:47:13 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040220134608.00bb31f0@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:47:17 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: M Stewart Subject: Re: [h-cost] early medieval sheep In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The best place I can think to start is with a book called "Sheep and Man" by Ryder. It is -the- work concerning sheep history & breeds. Good luck. >Greetings, > >I was wondering if anyone knew a source for images of early medieval >sheep. I have found images on line for the Soay, but am trying to find >pictures of the breeds that appeared between the Soay and the Merino. >Do those breeds even exist today? Thanks! > >Althea Turner >*** althea@alfalfapress.com >*** http://www.alfalfapress.com > >Public Relations Manager >Sauron/Voldemort 2004 > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 15:01:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KK1FSd018438 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 15:01:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KK0McP019120; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:00:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KK0EsR039284; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:00:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out012.verizon.net (out012pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KK08sR039199 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:00:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from queenscorner@verizon.net) Received: from brandyscomp ([4.35.51.184]) by out012.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040220200006.DDUA1590.out012.verizon.net@brandyscomp> for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 14:00:06 -0600 Message-ID: <001001c3f7ec$269f6a30$b8332304@brandyscomp> From: "Brandy Deming" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20040220072916.04c34ea0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] limp muslin Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 12:00:11 -0800 Organization: Better Times for Small Business MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out012.verizon.net from [4.35.51.184] at Fri, 20 Feb 2004 14:00:06 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I saw a picture of it. it was the large bell sleeves with the muslin used for the interior sleeve, it was puffed enough that it filled the entire sleeve. The caption said it was puffed. I would like to know about any and all double sleeved garb :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, February 20, 2004 7:30 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] limp muslin > > >I was browsing through some books today and was wondering how one goes > >about puffing muslin. > > What's that? > > >What centuries does the double sleeve belong to and what is the history > >behind it? > > Which double sleeve are you talking about? So many centuries and countries > had these, in one form or another... > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 15:54:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1KKs2Sd019063 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 15:54:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KKptcP024257; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:51:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KKpqsR074766; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:51:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1KKpksR074720 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:51:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a241.in-tch.com [66.62.107.41]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1KKTDs03089 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:29:13 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <40367420.7010001@in-tch.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 13:54:56 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming References: <40359C40.3040608@in-tch.com> <006301c3f782$0dabfc10$b8332304@brandyscomp> In-Reply-To: <006301c3f782$0dabfc10$b8332304@brandyscomp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO She does come out west , which is when I got to meet her--at a weekend workshop in Boise. The experience was well worth the travel cost, and I'd highly recommend it to anyone who has the chance to go.... --sue Brandy Deming wrote: > Tell me about it... the only time I'd get to hear it is if she came out > west. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sue Clemenger" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2004 9:33 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lectures upcoming > > > >>Oh, drool! I sure wish I could get the opportunity sometime to hear all >>five of them (boy, but you must be really tired at the end of the day!) >>--sue, who really enjoyed the ones she *has* heard ;o) >> >>Robin Netherton wrote: >> >> >>>Just a quick reminder to the list that I've got two lecture appearances > > in > >>>the next few weeks: _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 19:57:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1L0vFSd020039 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 19:57:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1L0rxcP022327; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 17:53:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1L0rosR029798; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 17:53:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1L0rnsR029782 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 17:53:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E809F1D245 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 18:53:48 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p586.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.213.79]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B4983C482 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 18:53:47 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] limp muslin Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 18:53:53 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040220072916.04c34ea0@mail.frys.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ya know I'm tied when I read limp mussel instead of limp muslin. :) Hope everyone has a wonderful weekend! De I also saw muscle on the second reading but I don't think I should go there. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Carolyn Kayta Barrows Sent: Friday, February 20, 2004 9:30 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] limp muslin >I was browsing through some books today and was wondering how one goes >about puffing muslin. What's that? >What centuries does the double sleeve belong to and what is the history >behind it? Which double sleeve are you talking about? So many centuries and countries had these, in one form or another... CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 20 22:42:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1L3gdSd020702 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 22:42:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1L3eYcP001845; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 20:40:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1L3dVsR097311; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 20:40:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1L3dOsR097264 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 20:39:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-125-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.125.111]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1L3cPDR003120 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2004 19:38:26 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040220193719.00dbcba0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 19:38:40 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] limp muslin In-Reply-To: <001001c3f7ec$269f6a30$b8332304@brandyscomp> References: <4.3.1.2.20040220072916.04c34ea0@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >I saw a picture of it. it was the large bell sleeves with the muslin used >for the interior sleeve, it was puffed enough that it filled the entire >sleeve. The caption said it was puffed. >I would like to know about any and all double sleeved garb :) I'm sure you do, but without your being specific I'd have to tell you about perhaps twenty or thirty puffy sleeves I have seen - without knowing which one you really meant. Please be specific, so I can help you? Like, was there a date on your picture? CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 08:23:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LDNeSd016075 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 08:23:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LDLicP022128; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 06:21:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LDLdsR091689; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 06:21:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tmailb1.svr.pol.co.uk (tmailb1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.168.141]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LDLbsR091661 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 06:21:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hbgd103@soton.ac.uk) Received: from modem-33.aerodactyl.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.6.33] helo=soton.ac.uk) by tmailb1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1AtxvH-0003XL-LM for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:49:40 +0000 Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:50:07 +0000 Subject: [h-cost] tudor shoes Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) From: Hilary Davidson To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200402191901.i1JJ1F1u051812@net.indra.com> Message-Id: <587AD700-6336-11D8-BBD1-000A9567E116@soton.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1LDLbsR091661 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Her name is Dr. Maria Hayward, and she works/lectures at the Textile Conservation Centre in the Winchester School of Art (I'm studying there). She's very nice, and interesting, and has done a lot of work on Henrys VII and VIII. She's also organising the forthcoming conference on textile cultures between Spain and England from 1500, to celebrate the 450th anniversary of the wedding of Mary Tudor and Philip of Spain which happened in Winchester Cathedral in 1554. It's on the 22nd and 23rd of July and looks really juicy! If anyone is interested in coming, details are at http://www.wsa.soton.ac.uk/textilecultures.htm . I got a look at the abstracts, and there is a good focus on teh sixteenth century. Tickets are around Ł60 (??? - don't quote me on that). > > > >>>> marccarlson20@hotmail.com 18/02/04 19:54:29 >>>. >>> From: kat@grendal.rain.com >>> It's about a pair of soccer shoes that Henry VIII ordered, but I was >>> intrigued by the work done by the woman who found the order in an >>> order for Henry VIII shoes. I would *love* to talk to her! >>> Marc, have you heard of her? > >> I will say that calling Tudor era ball games "football" seems > misleading, >> since they more resembled the modern fan riots, than the game :) > > ...and calling it "soccer" even more so, since it long pre-dates the > Football Association! > On the subject of football and royalty, an old-style "free-for-all" > football game is traditionally played on Shrove Tuesday at Ashbourne > here in Derbyshire. Nowadays a famous person is invited to start the > game off by tossing the ball to the players, and last year Prince > Charles did so. I don't suppose he was required to wear football boots, > though! > > __________________________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 09:22:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LEMfSd016299 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 09:22:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LEM0cP024466; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 07:22:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LELvsR010705; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 07:21:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LELpsS010670 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 07:21:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1LEHmPp002393 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 09:17:49 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 09:17:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4037697D.2050809@thibault.org> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 09:21:49 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] tudor shoes References: <587AD700-6336-11D8-BBD1-000A9567E116@soton.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <587AD700-6336-11D8-BBD1-000A9567E116@soton.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO All of which reminds me: did that "ghost" at Hampton Court get figured out? -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 13:28:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LISsSd017286 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:28:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LIPfcP007797; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 11:25:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LIPXsR097258; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 11:25:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LIPUsR097238 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 11:25:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from grouse.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.116]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AuZEP-0000eu-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 07:39:53 -0800 Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by grouse.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AuZEM-0001zR-00; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 07:39:51 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: , , , "H-Costume@Indra. Com" Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 08:39:56 -0700 Message-ID: <003901c3f890$f5754bf0$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1LIPUsR097238 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Thought some of you would be interested: JKM adds Petersham Grosgrain & 100% Silk Satin SAMPLE CARDS X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lots of goodies here...sorry for the cross posts. -----Original Message----- From: JKM Ribbon and Trims [mailto:newsletter@jkmribbon.net] Sent: Friday, February 20, 2004 8:26 PM To: saragrace@earthlink.net Subject: ADV: JKM adds Petersham Grosgrain & 100% Silk Satin SAMPLE CARDS JKM RIBBON & TRIMS WHOLESALE PRICES for All Your RIBBON and TRIMS! at http://www.jkmribbon.com/ WE HAVE MADE SHOPPING for RIBBON and TRIMS SIMPLE, FUN AND SECURE! GO TO www.jkmribbon.com and click ALREADY REGISTERED or REGISTER on www.jkmribbon.com to access our SHOPPING CART WEBSITE ---------------------------------------------------------------------- JKM Ribbon & Trims is EXCITED TO ANNOUNCE THE ADDITION OF A NEW LINE OF FINER RIBBONS TO THE JKM SECTION OF OUR SHOPPING CART WEB SITE. THIS WEEK WE ADDED SAMPLE CARDS FOR THE 100% DOUBLE FACE SILK SATIN AND FOR THE PETERSHAM GROSGRAIN. Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/sample.html and they will be listed in the JKM Sample Card Section !! To purchase these cards at $9.99 each, Register on www.jkmribbon.com for access to our shopping cart website. OVER THE LAST FEW WEEKS, WE ADDED STRETCH VELVET IN 3 WIDTHS, 8 COLORS ON 11 YARD ROLLS STRETCH FOLDOVER VELVET IN 2 WIDTHS, 8 COLORS ON 11 YARD ROLLS STRETCH HALF PILE VELVET IN 8 COLORS ON 11 YARD ROLLS STRETCH VELVET PIPING IN 8 COLORS ON 33 YARD ROLLS NON STRETCH VELVET PIPING IN 8 COLORS ON 33 YARD ROLLS Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/rc/velvets.html to view VELVETS 100% PURE SILK SATIN RIBBON IN 50 COLORS IN 9 WIDTHS Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/silkribbon.html to view 100% PURE SILK POLYESTER FLOWER GARLAND, TAFFETA GARLAND, & ORGANDY SHEER GARLAND and PREMADE RIBBON BOWS in SMALL, MEDIUM and LARGE SIZES. PACKAGED 100 PIECES PER PACKAGE FOR YOUR BULK NEEDS. PREMADE BOWS WITH PEARLS Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/rc/ribaccess.html to view RIBBON GARLAND AND PREMADE BOWS PETERSHAM GROSGRAIN - 100% RAYON, SCALLOPED EDGE THIS FINE WOVEN GROSGRAIN IS AVAILABLE IN 11 WIDTHS RANGING FROM 1/8" UP TO 3" WIDE AND 80 COLORS Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/rc/petergros.html to view PETERSHAM GROSGRAIN ---------------------------------------------------------------------- In the next few weeks, we will add other exciting fine ribbons for your business needs..........! FINE SATINY SILKY FEEL TAFFETA GINGHAM CHECKS AND STRIPES COMING SOON !! EACH OF THESE HAS BEEN REQUESTED BY YOU!! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- SPRING RIBBON IS HERE................. BUY EARLY FOR THE BEST SELECTION! WE ARE FEATURING NEW SPRING PATTERNS TO SUPPORT YOUR PROJECTS, DESIGNS and OVERALL BUSINESS NEEDS. Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/prints/spring.html to view SPRING ---------------------------------------------------------------------- HELPFUL HINTS YOUR WEB BROWSER The JKM ONLINE SHOPPING CART WEB SITE works best with Internet Explorer 6.0 and higher. It may be difficult to open windows with earlier versions due to the expansive selection of ribbons and trims on www.jkmribbon.com RIBBON COLORS The best way to view JKM's Ribbon and Trims is to set your monitor at a BRIGHTNESS level of 65 - 75. This will lighten the screen and make the colors more vivid. READY FOR ONLINE SHOPPING If you are ALREADY REGISTERED on www.jkmribbon.com you can access JKM Ribbon & Trims ONLINE SHOPPING CART web site by going to http://www.jkmribbon.com/ and click ALREADY REGISTERED Enter on the log in screen, the username and password you already have received. Please read HOW TO SHOP and have FUN! If you are NOT REGISTERED, go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/ click Register for JKM's Wholesale Online Shopping Cart or Take a tour of our Showroom Website to see our products and some of our prices before you REGISTER. Click the RIBBON SEARCH BUTTON and a drop down menu appears to help you find a type of ribbon. If you know a ribbon name or ribbon type, click our KEYWORD SEARCH for links to these ribbons. We arranged our ribbons by manufacturers, and then by categories like sheers, metallics, satins, grosgrain and many others. Each manufacturer's page contains a description of what each company offers. Go To http://www.jkmribbon.com/hints.html for FAQ's and more Helpful Hints --------------------------------------------------------------------- EVERYONE AT JKM RIBBON & TRIMS APPRECIATES YOUR BUSINESS! ----------------------------------------------------------------------- We would like your feedback on ribbons and trims that you feel are needed for your work. Please email JKM at jkmribbon@jkmribbon.com We would love to hear from you! The products we have added are based on your input. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- You have received this free newsletter from JKM Ribbon because you are a customer or you have registered for email updates from JKM. TO BE REMOVED from the newsletter email list, Click the following link http://www.jkmribbon.net/~jkmribbo/scgi-bin/unsubscribe.html Enter each email address to be removed and we will promptly delete them. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 14:15:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LJFKSd018161 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:15:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LJCCcP010671; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:12:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LJC8sR015110; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:12:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9402.mail.yahoo.com (web9402.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.108]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1LJC6sR015089 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:12:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040221191206.82563.qmail@web9402.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9402.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 11:12:06 PST Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 11:12:06 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] Thought some of you would be interested: JKM adds Petersham Grosgrain & 100% Silk Satin SAMPLE CARDS To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <003901c3f890$f5754bf0$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks for sharing, Saragrace:) Albra "Saragrace T. Knauf" wrote: Lots of goodies here...sorry for the cross posts. -----Original Message----- From: JKM Ribbon and Trims [mailto:newsletter@jkmribbon.net] Sent: Friday, February 20, 2004 8:26 PM To: saragrace@earthlink.net Subject: ADV: JKM adds Petersham Grosgrain & 100% Silk Satin SAMPLE CARDS JKM RIBBON & TRIMS WHOLESALE PRICES for All Your RIBBON and TRIMS! at http://www.jkmribbon.com/ WE HAVE MADE SHOPPING for RIBBON and TRIMS SIMPLE, FUN AND SECURE! GO TO www.jkmribbon.com and click ALREADY REGISTERED or REGISTER on www.jkmribbon.com to access our SHOPPING CART WEBSITE ---------------------------------------------------------------------- JKM Ribbon & Trims is EXCITED TO ANNOUNCE THE ADDITION OF A NEW LINE OF FINER RIBBONS TO THE JKM SECTION OF OUR SHOPPING CART WEB SITE. THIS WEEK WE ADDED SAMPLE CARDS FOR THE 100% DOUBLE FACE SILK SATIN AND FOR THE PETERSHAM GROSGRAIN. Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/sample.html and they will be listed in the JKM Sample Card Section !! To purchase these cards at $9.99 each, Register on www.jkmribbon.com for access to our shopping cart website. OVER THE LAST FEW WEEKS, WE ADDED STRETCH VELVET IN 3 WIDTHS, 8 COLORS ON 11 YARD ROLLS STRETCH FOLDOVER VELVET IN 2 WIDTHS, 8 COLORS ON 11 YARD ROLLS STRETCH HALF PILE VELVET IN 8 COLORS ON 11 YARD ROLLS STRETCH VELVET PIPING IN 8 COLORS ON 33 YARD ROLLS NON STRETCH VELVET PIPING IN 8 COLORS ON 33 YARD ROLLS Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/rc/velvets.html to view VELVETS 100% PURE SILK SATIN RIBBON IN 50 COLORS IN 9 WIDTHS Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/silkribbon.html to view 100% PURE SILK POLYESTER FLOWER GARLAND, TAFFETA GARLAND, & ORGANDY SHEER GARLAND and PREMADE RIBBON BOWS in SMALL, MEDIUM and LARGE SIZES. PACKAGED 100 PIECES PER PACKAGE FOR YOUR BULK NEEDS. PREMADE BOWS WITH PEARLS Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/rc/ribaccess.html to view RIBBON GARLAND AND PREMADE BOWS PETERSHAM GROSGRAIN - 100% RAYON, SCALLOPED EDGE THIS FINE WOVEN GROSGRAIN IS AVAILABLE IN 11 WIDTHS RANGING FROM 1/8" UP TO 3" WIDE AND 80 COLORS Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/rc/petergros.html to view PETERSHAM GROSGRAIN ---------------------------------------------------------------------- In the next few weeks, we will add other exciting fine ribbons for your business needs..........! FINE SATINY SILKY FEEL TAFFETA GINGHAM CHECKS AND STRIPES COMING SOON !! EACH OF THESE HAS BEEN REQUESTED BY YOU!! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- SPRING RIBBON IS HERE................. BUY EARLY FOR THE BEST SELECTION! WE ARE FEATURING NEW SPRING PATTERNS TO SUPPORT YOUR PROJECTS, DESIGNS and OVERALL BUSINESS NEEDS. Go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/prints/spring.html to view SPRING ---------------------------------------------------------------------- HELPFUL HINTS YOUR WEB BROWSER The JKM ONLINE SHOPPING CART WEB SITE works best with Internet Explorer 6.0 and higher. It may be difficult to open windows with earlier versions due to the expansive selection of ribbons and trims on www.jkmribbon.com RIBBON COLORS The best way to view JKM's Ribbon and Trims is to set your monitor at a BRIGHTNESS level of 65 - 75. This will lighten the screen and make the colors more vivid. READY FOR ONLINE SHOPPING If you are ALREADY REGISTERED on www.jkmribbon.com you can access JKM Ribbon & Trims ONLINE SHOPPING CART web site by going to http://www.jkmribbon.com/ and click ALREADY REGISTERED Enter on the log in screen, the username and password you already have received. Please read HOW TO SHOP and have FUN! If you are NOT REGISTERED, go to http://www.jkmribbon.com/ click Register for JKM's Wholesale Online Shopping Cart or Take a tour of our Showroom Website to see our products and some of our prices before you REGISTER. Click the RIBBON SEARCH BUTTON and a drop down menu appears to help you find a type of ribbon. If you know a ribbon name or ribbon type, click our KEYWORD SEARCH for links to these ribbons. We arranged our ribbons by manufacturers, and then by categories like sheers, metallics, satins, grosgrain and many others. Each manufacturer's page contains a description of what each company offers. Go To http://www.jkmribbon.com/hints.html for FAQ's and more Helpful Hints --------------------------------------------------------------------- EVERYONE AT JKM RIBBON & TRIMS APPRECIATES YOUR BUSINESS! ----------------------------------------------------------------------- We would like your feedback on ribbons and trims that you feel are needed for your work. Please email JKM at jkmribbon@jkmribbon.com We would love to hear from you! The products we have added are based on your input. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- You have received this free newsletter from JKM Ribbon because you are a customer or you have registered for email updates from JKM. TO BE REMOVED from the newsletter email list, Click the following link http://www.jkmribbon.net/~jkmribbo/scgi-bin/unsubscribe.html Enter each email address to be removed and we will promptly delete them. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 14:33:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LJXNSd018263 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:33:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LJVQcP011806; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:31:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LJVOsR022875; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:31:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com (imo-m24.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LJVLsR022815 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:31:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from IceGirlNIN@aol.com) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.1c5.14d326bd (4238) for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:25:59 -0500 (EST) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <1c5.14d326bd.2d690ac7@aol.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:25:59 EST To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5006 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello all, Sorry for the semi off-topic post. The time has come for me to plan for a vast reorganization of my sewing area (the tiny space that it is), for when I get home during my college's spring break. At the moment, I have large quantities of various things, many of which are scattered...everywhere! So. One of the first steps is to organize my growing pattern collection. In the latest issue of Vogue Patterns, I spotted "The Pattern Finder" filing system. Is this worth the price ($13 plus shipping for three boxes that hold 30 patterns)? Or would I be better off making my own, using various boxes? These things look neat and tidy, but are there better alternatives? Thanks! Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 15:33:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LKXoSd018648 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:33:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LKXCcP015670; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:33:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LKX7sR046126; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:33:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp6.mindspring.com (smtp6.mindspring.com [207.69.200.110]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LKWZsR045903 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:32:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from sdn-ap-010masprip0173.dialsprint.net ([63.186.160.173]) by smtp6.mindspring.com with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Audne-0002Ac-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:32:35 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:33:11 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing From: ruthanne baumgartner To: Historical Costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1c5.14d326bd.2d690ac7@aol.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I haven't seen this Vogue filing system, so I can't comment directly on it. But a friend gave me last year a box designed for storing and filing patterns, and I don't use it because half my patterns are the wrong size: half are the standard commercial-pattern-envelope size that Vogue, Simplicity, et al. use; the other half are the FolkWear size used by a couple of historical-pattern publishers and the photocopy machine. Besides, I rarely have the patience or dexterity to get the patterns back into their envelopes properly (most of my sewing is while costuming shows, and in an appropriate frenzy). What I'm in the midst of doing is putting each pattern into a zip-lock plastic bag the size of the FolkWear patterns. The picture on the envelope shows through, but the larger size bag makes it possible to re-fold even Simplicity patterns neat and flat. I bought these bags wholesale at an outlet store, so it was an inexpensive way to go. I've also bought a number of smallish cartons that have a footprint the size of the pattern bags. The cartons are labeled by gender and period of the costumes inside. I might make a more specific listing later, but so far this is working fine. The cartons stack neatly on a couple of shelves in my closet. --R.A. Baumgartner scholar-gipsy and costumer Fairfield, CT on 2/21/04 2:25 PM, IceGirlNIN@aol.com at IceGirlNIN@aol.com wrote: > Hello all, > > Sorry for the semi off-topic post. The time has come for me to plan for a > vast reorganization of my sewing area (the tiny space that it is), for when I > get home during my college's spring break. At the moment, I have large > quantities of various things, many of which are scattered...everywhere! So. > One of > the first steps is to organize my growing pattern collection. In the latest > issue of Vogue Patterns, I spotted "The Pattern Finder" filing system. Is > this > worth the price ($13 plus shipping for three boxes that hold 30 patterns)? Or > would I be better off making my own, using various boxes? These things look > neat and tidy, but are there better alternatives? > > Thanks! > > Christine > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 15:51:06 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LKp5Sd018802 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:51:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LKoQcP016591; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:50:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LKoNsR052662; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:50:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.130]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LKoLsR052648 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:50:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net (firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.121.247]) by soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1LKLR909283 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:21:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-65.58.149.126.dial1.pittsburgh1.level3.net ([65.58.149.126] helo=HELENPINTO) by firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Audcr-0004tn-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 12:21:25 -0800 Message-ID: <013901c3f8b8$44a74670$7e953a41@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1c5.14d326bd.2d690ac7@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:21:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9effe5efcbf966f0201ae3936ca81e3561a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO re; pattern storage. I've never had much luck with carboard boxes, since every time you try to fit just one more in, it's time for the duct tape. I switched to plastic totes. Sterilite makes a clear one with a white lid and grey snapping handles. I don't remember the size by volume, but they're about 18"L x 12"W x 6"H. They stack nicely. I've bought them in both Target and K-mart, and they probably have them at Walmart. Each one cost about $4 US, and holds 30-35 patterns. Which is good, because I pigged out big time at JoAnn's this winter... -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 16:23:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LLNaSd019043 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 16:23:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LLKPcP018419; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:20:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LLKNsR063853; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:20:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp3.pacifier.net (smtp3.pacifier.net [64.255.237.173]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LLKEsR063806 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 14:20:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.133.36]) by smtp3.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28A7E6DACF for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:20:13 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 13:20:52 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing Message-ID: <40375B34.16216.119B345C@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <013901c3f8b8$44a74670$7e953a41@HELENPINTO> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > re; pattern storage. > > I've never had much luck with carboard boxes, since every time you try > to fit just one more in, it's time for the duct tape. I switched to > plastic totes. Sterilite makes a clear one with a white lid and grey > snapping handles. I don't remember the size by volume, but they're > about 18"L x 12"W x 6"H. They stack nicely. I've bought them in both > Target and K-mart, and they probably have them at Walmart. Each one > cost about $4 US, and holds 30-35 patterns. Which is good, because I > pigged out big time at JoAnn's this winter... > -Helen/Aidan The problem with plastic is that it is not conductive to long time storage. It can cause damage to the paper. But that takes time and if you only want to store them for a few years and don't care about deterioration over the long run, go for it. However, if you want to have them stick around for posterity, you need to use acid free cardboard. It helps cut down on the deterioration. (Of course, if you really want to cut down on the deterioration, you need to treat the patterns themselves with some of the products used to prevent newspapers from degrading. There are acid/lignen neutralizers which you can usually find in scrap book or archival supply stores.) The boxes themselves are pretty easy to find, especially if you have any good comic book stores around. The size for comic books is good for regular patterns and the ones for magazines works pretty well for the oversized patterns. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 17:04:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LM4uSd019327 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:04:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LM1HcP020709; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:01:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LM19sR081834; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:01:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LM14sS081765 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:01:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1LMRCWm016576 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:27:12 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.115] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A52EA1C100DA; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:01:18 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01c3f8c6$ec0269a0$735183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:06:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sounds like The way to go, re packaging. I would shop for plastic boxes (In office supplies?) for the ultimate storage. I have bought sooo many cardboard neat box sets through the years, and they Always have to be replaced with use. Unless you have some climate control of the storage area, tree products will fail consistently. At least this is how it is in the central north east. Too cold, too hot, too humid, not enough humidity....Alas Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "ruthanne baumgartner" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 3:33 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing > I haven't seen this Vogue filing system, so I can't comment directly on it. > But a friend gave me last year a box designed for storing and filing > patterns, and I don't use it because half my patterns are the wrong size: > half are the standard commercial-pattern-envelope size that Vogue, > Simplicity, et al. use; the other half are the FolkWear size used by a > couple of historical-pattern publishers and the photocopy machine. > Besides, I rarely have the patience or dexterity to get the patterns back > into their envelopes properly (most of my sewing is while costuming shows, > and in an appropriate frenzy). > What I'm in the midst of doing is putting each pattern into a zip-lock > plastic bag the size of the FolkWear patterns. The picture on the envelope > shows through, but the larger size bag makes it possible to re-fold even > Simplicity patterns neat and flat. I bought these bags wholesale at an > outlet store, so it was an inexpensive way to go. I've also bought a number > of smallish cartons that have a footprint the size of the pattern bags. The > cartons are labeled by gender and period of the costumes inside. I might > make a more specific listing later, but so far this is working fine. The > cartons stack neatly on a couple of shelves in my closet. > > --R.A. Baumgartner > scholar-gipsy and costumer > Fairfield, CT > > > > on 2/21/04 2:25 PM, IceGirlNIN@aol.com at IceGirlNIN@aol.com wrote: > > > Hello all, > > > > Sorry for the semi off-topic post. The time has come for me to plan for a > > vast reorganization of my sewing area (the tiny space that it is), for when I > > get home during my college's spring break. At the moment, I have large > > quantities of various things, many of which are scattered...everywhere! So. > > One of > > the first steps is to organize my growing pattern collection. In the latest > > issue of Vogue Patterns, I spotted "The Pattern Finder" filing system. Is > > this > > worth the price ($13 plus shipping for three boxes that hold 30 patterns)? Or > > would I be better off making my own, using various boxes? These things look > > neat and tidy, but are there better alternatives? > > > > Thanks! > > > > Christine > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 17:46:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1LMksSd019485 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:46:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LMkDcP023905; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:46:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LMkAsR098514; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:46:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo2.socket.net (mo2.socket.net [216.106.88.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1LMk8sR098489 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 15:46:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo2.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AE5F1D7F3 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 16:46:07 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p341.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.215.87]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 27541D4AD for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 16:46:06 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 16:46:14 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <40375B34.16216.119B345C@localhost> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My mother in law uses the Ziploc method and has for the past 20 years with no problems of deterioration to the patterns. My mother used the Ziploc method for years as well the only time there was a problem was not with patterns but old books. De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of kat@grendal.rain.com Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 3:21 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing > re; pattern storage. > > I've never had much luck with carboard boxes, since every time you try > to fit just one more in, it's time for the duct tape. I switched to > plastic totes. Sterilite makes a clear one with a white lid and grey > snapping handles. I don't remember the size by volume, but they're > about 18"L x 12"W x 6"H. They stack nicely. I've bought them in both > Target and K-mart, and they probably have them at Walmart. Each one > cost about $4 US, and holds 30-35 patterns. Which is good, because I > pigged out big time at JoAnn's this winter... > -Helen/Aidan The problem with plastic is that it is not conductive to long time storage. It can cause damage to the paper. But that takes time and if you only want to store them for a few years and don't care about deterioration over the long run, go for it. However, if you want to have them stick around for posterity, you need to use acid free cardboard. It helps cut down on the deterioration. (Of course, if you really want to cut down on the deterioration, you need to treat the patterns themselves with some of the products used to prevent newspapers from degrading. There are acid/lignen neutralizers which you can usually find in scrap book or archival supply stores.) The boxes themselves are pretty easy to find, especially if you have any good comic book stores around. The size for comic books is good for regular patterns and the ones for magazines works pretty well for the oversized patterns. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 19:11:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1M0B7Sd019982 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 19:11:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M07wcP028552; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:07:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M07tG5029480; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:07:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M07nG5029439 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:07:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fec.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.236]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 8474B47FF5F for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 01:07:44 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <003e01c3f8d7$f031d2c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 01:08:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] rice paper X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1M0B7Sd019982 Status: RO Dear Kathy. Thanks a lot for your wonderfull instruktions in using rice paper on embroidery. It is crazy that i never used that before, because it works so good. I started a new waistcoat yesterday with this paper, and it works so fine. It is the first time i try to use silk ribbon in embroidery. If you would like to see, go to: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm and scroll down to the bottom of the site. This is the lovely ribbed silk i found in London last year. I think it is very close to the original 18th century fabric called Gros de Tours. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 19:23:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1M0NVSd020045 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 19:23:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M0K4cP029254; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:20:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M0K3G5033928; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:20:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1M0K1G5033843 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:20:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/OshAm0n1aD3MjiXFrzeib/s=">; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 16:19:24 PST Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JNXYHQC5; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 16:19:24 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 16:18:44 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] rice paper Message-ID: <20040221.161845.880.0.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-5,7-32 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO (Swoon!) It's exquisite. :-) Thank you for sharing! Arlys On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 01:08:00 +0100 "Bjarne og Leif Drews" writes: > Dear Kathy. > Thanks a lot for your wonderfull instruktions in using rice paper on > embroidery. > It is crazy that i never used that before, because it works so good. > I started a new waistcoat yesterday with this paper, and it works so > fine. It is the first time i try to use silk ribbon in embroidery. > If you would like to see, go to: > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm > and scroll down to the bottom of the site. > This is the lovely ribbed silk i found in London last year. I think > it is very close to the original 18th century fabric called Gros de > Tours. > > Bjarne > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 19:45:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1M0jPSd020158 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 19:45:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M0hXcP000432; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:43:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M0hTG5042338; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:43:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M0hQG5042295 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 17:43:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 671A842615 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 19:56:17 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <4037FCB7.7030205@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 18:49:59 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing References: <1c5.14d326bd.2d690ac7@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <1c5.14d326bd.2d690ac7@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO IceGirlNIN@aol.com wrote: > In the latest > issue of Vogue Patterns, I spotted "The Pattern Finder" filing system. Is this > worth the price ($13 plus shipping for three boxes that hold 30 patterns)? Or > would I be better off making my own, using various boxes? These things look > neat and tidy, but are there better alternatives? I buy the pattern boxes sold at Joann's that retail for about two dollars. I buy two half yards of complimentary cotton quilting fabric and some stitch-witchery by the yard and iron the fabric onto those ugly blue boxes. They hold 10 or more patterns apiece, even the larger envelopes like Folkwear fit into them, and covered in fabric they are attractive in my sewing room. For the notions, lace, ribbon, beads, buttons, and general crap that accumulates I have clear plastic shoeboxes. I cleaned out two dollar-stores this past holiday season in a cleaning spree of my own. I like the shoebox size because it works for me on a project basis. Beaded trim project, in a box. Embroidered tamari balls, in a box. Collected buttons and trim for my husband's next doublet, in a box. They stack, they are see-through so I know what's in them, they are cheap, and they are easy to grab on my way out the door if I need a quick take-along project. I know not everyone likes plastic because it isn't archival, but I have an aging tomcat who, though neutered, still likes to 'mark' his territory on a regular basis, and the reality is that plastic protects my stuff. It also prevented a huge distaster when a previous landlord refused to fix a leaking roof to the point it flooded my sewing room once. And when I move, half my sewing room is instantly packed already! Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 22:36:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1M3aPSd020877 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 22:36:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M3XCcP007114; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 20:33:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M3X5G5003863; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 20:33:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M3X3G5003848 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 20:33:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-125-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.125.111]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M3WsZv020501 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 21:33:02 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040221192415.04a67c60@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 19:27:27 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing In-Reply-To: <40375B34.16216.119B345C@localhost> References: <013901c3f8b8$44a74670$7e953a41@HELENPINTO> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > I've never had much luck with carboard boxes, since every time you try > > to fit just one more in, it's time for the duct tape. I switched to > > plastic totes. Sterilite makes a clear one with a white lid and grey > > snapping handles. I don't remember the size by volume, but they're > > about 18"L x 12"W x 6"H. They stack nicely. I've bought them in both > > Target and K-mart, and they probably have them at Walmart. Each one > > cost about $4 US, and holds 30-35 patterns. Which is good, because I > > pigged out big time at JoAnn's this winter... > > -Helen/Aidan > >The problem with plastic is that it is not conductive to long time >storage. It can cause damage to the paper. But that takes time and if >you only want to store them for a few years and don't care about >deterioration over the long run, go for it. Freezer bags don't do that - can't by law because they're for long-term food storage. So bag your patterns in those, as per somebody else's suggestion, and box them in anything. You could even put silica gel packets in there with them if you're worried about moisture. (Buy these packets, or save them from things like candy boxes, shoe boxes, sushi-wrapper-seaweed packages, etc..) CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 23:17:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1M4HXSd021002 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:17:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M4EIcP008643; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 21:14:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M4EEG5017878; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 21:14:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mx.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M4EBG5017829 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 21:14:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from IceGirlNIN@aol.com) Received: from IceGirlNIN@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.131.2a4cc875 (4238) for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:08:53 -0500 (EST) From: IceGirlNIN@aol.com Message-ID: <131.2a4cc875.2d698555@aol.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:08:53 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5006 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/21/2004 10:34:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: >The problem with plastic is that it is not conductive to long time >storage. It can cause damage to the paper. But that takes time and if >you only want to store them for a few years and don't care about >deterioration over the long run, go for it. Freezer bags don't do that - can't by law because they're for long-term food storage. So bag your patterns in those, as per somebody else's suggestion, and box them in anything. You could even put silica gel packets in there with them if you're worried about moisture. (Buy these packets, or save them from things like candy boxes, shoe boxes, sushi-wrapper-seaweed packages, etc..) Hmm. So, I could get myself some nice big boxes from The Container Store or Target (Container store's probably cheaper- they have these big plastic boxes that don't cost much at all), split them into compartments somehow, put all of my patterns in ziploc/freezer bags, and, since I live in the northeast (New York), I can get some of those silica gel packets to keep the moisture out. Sounds like a plan, and I'm sure my mother will be...vastly pleased by my organization (given how messy I tend to be!) Thank you all! Christine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 21 23:46:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1M4kBSd021094 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:46:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M4i4cP009896; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 21:44:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M4i1G5028239; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 21:44:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay11-dav95.bay11.hotmail.com [64.4.39.125]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M4hxG5028201 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 21:43:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bear_janet@msn.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 20:26:39 -0800 Received: from 4.10.36.229 by bay11-dav95.bay11.hotmail.com with DAV; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 04:26:38 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [4.10.36.229] X-Originating-Email: [bear_janet@msn.com] X-Sender: bear_janet@msn.com From: "JAMES OGILVIE" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:26:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 8.5 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202 Seal-Send-Time: Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:26:30 -0500 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Feb 2004 04:26:39.0252 (UTC) FILETIME=[10B91D40:01C3F8FC] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1M4kBSd021094 Status: RO I've been using the Ziploc bag storage for at least 10 years. I have them in a box where they can stand up, so I can easily page through them, seeing the pictures on the front. The box has room for 2 rows of gallon size bags side by side with the odd size patterns in the back. I only do this with patterns I have actually taken out of the original envelope - I must have a hundred patterns from JoAnne's dollar sales that I might need for a sleeve shape or something. Janet _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 01:15:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1M6FSSd021399 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 01:15:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M6CLcP013393; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:12:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M6CHG5058499; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:12:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (mta7.pltn13.pbi.net [64.164.98.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M6CGG5058484 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 23:12:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from casamai@sbcglobal.net) Received: from casamai (adsl-66-138-141-66.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net [66.138.141.66]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1M63x9k019257 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2004 22:04:00 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <001901c3f909$bdf6dd00$3ce3fea9@sbcglobal.net> From: "Bruce & Nora Mai" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1c5.14d326bd.2d690ac7@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 00:04:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you can afford them -file cabinets are the best by far. Sturdy, durable, protective storage with lots of room and holds almost any size. You don't need hanging folders but some sort of hanging (or fixed) divider will make it easier to organize - by company, envelope size, type, etc. Also manila envelopes for those standard company size ones that will never fit back into the original envelope - staple or paper clip the orginal envelope to the front. You can also attach fabric samples and photos of the finished project if you want. The manila envelopes can also be used for patterns you drafted yourself, attach a copy of the original source picture to the front and put your research notes in with and you've got a pretty complette record of the project all in one spot. Again, add a phot of the finished outfit and you'll have a total history. Nora ----- Original Message ----- From: > Sorry for the semi off-topic post. The time has come for me to plan for a > vast reorganization of my sewing area (the tiny space that it is), for when I > get home during my college's spring break. At the moment, I have large > quantities of various things, many of which are scattered...everywhere! So. One of > the first steps is to organize my growing pattern collection. In the latest > issue of Vogue Patterns, I spotted "The Pattern Finder" filing system. Is this > worth the price ($13 plus shipping for three boxes that hold 30 patterns)? Or > would I be better off making my own, using various boxes? These things look > neat and tidy, but are there better alternatives? > > Thanks! > > Christine . _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 04:20:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1M9KQSd023395 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 04:20:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M9IVcP019214; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 02:18:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M9IKG5017242; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 02:18:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1M9IIG5017203 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 02:18:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3D63A0020; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 03:18:14 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3D466F00A0; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 03:18:12 -0600 Message-ID: <00f601c3f924$b83473d0$0500a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 04:17:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] A Different Type of Addition X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1M9KQSd023395 Status: RO We are in the process of adding a Spanish translation to A Year in Fashion:1863, http://www.costumegallery.com/1863 in our Library. The first month that we are working on is January. When you go to the Table of Contents, you will notice that today I have added buttons for English and Spanish translations for the Editorial Chit-chat. As the weeks go on, the areas with the dual translations you will see these buttons. I thought about making an index in Spanish for 1863, but we are still adding new articles and fashion plates to this year that have not been translated yet. Before the end of 2004, we will start translating A Year in Fashion: 1863 into French. We choose to start translating this "A Year in Fashion" first because it is one of our most popular years in our Library. Many, many thanks goes to our bi-lingual interns for making it possible for people of other languages to be able to read and study fashion history. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 10:03:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MF3eSd006379 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:03:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MF31cP029340; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 08:03:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MF2tG5018793; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 08:02:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta08-svc.ntlworld.com (mta08-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.48]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MF2pG5018744 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 08:02:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jill@jigrah.co.uk) Received: from HP411.jigrah.co.uk ([80.6.241.239]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with ESMTP id <20040218215755.FJRR16733.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@HP411.jigrah.co.uk> for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:57:55 +0000 Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20040218215439.00b46e80@pop.oneandone.co.uk> X-Sender: pt8296337-1938@pop.oneandone.co.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:58:23 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jill Hadfield Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: Tudor Shoes! In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-757F5A3C; boundary="=======3A9670F5=======" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --=======3A9670F5======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-757F5A3C; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sounds just like the Sedgefield Ball Game every shrove Tuesday. Just so happens, it's next Tuesday (24th), the shops all board up their windows and move everything they can off the roads and pavements. Jill At 13:54 18/02/2004 -0600, you wrote: >>From: kat@grendal.rain.com >>It's about a pair of soccer shoes that Henry VIII ordered, but I was >>intrigued by the work done by the woman who found the order in an >>order for Henry VIII shoes. I would *love* to talk to her! >>Marc, have you heard of her? > >The name does not sound familiar - other than there is a Dr. Maria Hayward >at the Textile Concervation center at the University of Southampton. > >I will say that calling Tudor era ball games "football" seems misleading, >since they more resembled the modern fan riots, than the game :) (no >teams, no separation of fans from "players" - just multiple mobs trying to >posess a ball and move it from one place to another) - my guess is that >Henry really did take part. > >Marc > >_________________________________________________________________ >Watch high-quality video with fast playback at MSN Video. Free! >http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200365ave/direct/01/ > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > JiGraH Resources - www.jigrah.co.uk --=======3A9670F5======= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --=======3A9670F5=======-- From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 12:29:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MHT5Sd007967 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 12:29:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MHSPcP006409; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:28:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MHSKG5090372; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:28:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MHSJG5090361 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:28:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sherylnd@kc.rr.com) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com (CPE-65-30-107-115.kc.rr.com [65.30.107.115]) by ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1MGe5fe004774 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:40:10 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20040222105533.00a0aec0@pop-server.kc.rr.com> X-Sender: sherylnd@pop-server.kc.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:57:13 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] rice paper In-Reply-To: <003e01c3f8d7$f031d2c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Every time you show us pictures of your work, I think that it can't get any better. And every time I'm wrong because it's always better than the last one. You are an artist, Bjarne! Sheryl At 01:08 AM 2/22/04 +0100, you wrote: >Dear Kathy. >Thanks a lot for your wonderfull instruktions in using rice paper on >embroidery. >It is crazy that i never used that before, because it works so good. >I started a new waistcoat yesterday with this paper, and it works so fine. >It is the first time i try to use silk ribbon in embroidery. >If you would like to see, go to: >http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm >and scroll down to the bottom of the site. >This is the lovely ribbed silk i found in London last year. I think it is >very close to the original 18th century fabric called Gros de Tours. > >Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 12:30:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MHUASd007996 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 12:30:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MHTTcP006493; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:29:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MHTTG5090794; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:29:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.inreach.com (smtp.inreach.com [209.142.2.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1MHTRG5090782 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:29:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dch@inreach.com) Received: (qmail 28022 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2004 17:29:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail.inreach.com) (209.142.2.163) by smtp.inreach.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2004 17:29:26 -0000 Received: from 24.4.69.40 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dch@inreach.com) by webmail.inreach.com with HTTP; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 09:29:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1068.24.4.69.40.1077470966.squirrel@webmail.inreach.com> In-Reply-To: <003e01c3f8d7$f031d2c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> References: <003e01c3f8d7$f031d2c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 09:29:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [h-cost] rice paper From: "Diana Habra" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Dear Kathy. > Thanks a lot for your wonderfull instruktions in using rice paper on > embroidery. > It is crazy that i never used that before, because it works so good. > I started a new waistcoat yesterday with this paper, and it works so fine. > It is the first time i try to use silk ribbon in embroidery. > If you would like to see, go to: > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm Bjarne, You are so amazing! I know people have said it before but it just amazes me how beautiful and accurate your creations are and how fast you can make one. My hat is off to you! -- Diana Habra www.renaissancefabrics.net "Everything for the Costumer" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 13:23:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MINPSd008763 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 13:23:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MILWcP008651; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:21:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MILPG5011849; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:21:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp800.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp800.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.179]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1MILNG5011833 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:21:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.144.252 with login) by smtp800.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2004 18:21:23 -0000 Message-ID: <001001c3f970$aabf1a10$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 10:21:18 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Photos from an event... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Yesterday the Greater (San Francisco) Bay Area Costumer's Guild held the Currier & Ives ice skating party, a Victorian themed event. I've posted some pictures to my website and I thought some of you here might like to see them! http://demode.tweedlebop.com/currier/ - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 15:59:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MKxfSd009968 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:59:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MKuQcP015780; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 13:56:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MKuIG5070249; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 13:56:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MKuGG5070220 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 13:56:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a243.in-tch.com [66.62.107.43]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1MKXes01066 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 13:33:40 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <4039182D.6050708@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 13:59:25 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... References: <001001c3f970$aabf1a10$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> In-Reply-To: <001001c3f970$aabf1a10$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh, great pictures! I particularly like the picture of the woman in the light-blue, below-hip jacket (?) with the black trimming and the mocha (?) skirt, [actually, I like the whole outfit, whatever it actually is ;o)] who's interacting with the little girl in red (who's just *adorable* in her ruffles). And I like the gowns on both the ladies in the middle picture, bottom row (the ones that look 1830s-ish to my mostly-ignorant eyes). Thanks for sharing! --sue (several centuries out of her normal historical element) Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > Yesterday the Greater (San Francisco) Bay Area Costumer's Guild held the > Currier & Ives ice skating party, a Victorian themed event. I've posted > some pictures to my website and I thought some of you here might like to see > them! > > http://demode.tweedlebop.com/currier/ > > - Kendra > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 16:08:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ML8KSd010081 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:08:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ML58cP016210; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 14:05:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ML57G5073612; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 14:05:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lakemtao02.cox.net (lakemtao02.cox.net [68.1.17.243]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ML50G5073528 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 14:05:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vmaa2@cox.net) Received: from VMAAHQ ([68.96.201.18]) by lakemtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.08 201-253-122-130-108-20031117) with ESMTP id <20040222172830.HWF7164.lakemtao02.cox.net@VMAAHQ> for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 12:28:30 -0500 From: "Linda Rice" To: Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 12:28:16 -0500 Message-ID: <00a401c3f969$44cf3b60$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] new technology in exhibition X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Anyone in London might want to check out this new type of exhibit. Click on "The Empress's New Clothes" and follow through. http://www.museumoflondon.org.uk/ I was wondering when technology was going to catch up! ::Linda:: _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 17:47:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MMlgSd010957 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:47:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MMiZcP020876; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:44:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MMiSG5011302; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:44:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MMiOG5011282 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:44:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claudine_on_the_net@yahoo.com) Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.122]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1Auze3-0006pq-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:52:07 -0800 Received: from h-68-164-153-117.snvacaid.dynamic.covad.net ([68.164.153.117] helo=GABRIEL.yahoo.com) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Auze2-00019n-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:52:06 -0800 Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.0.20040222113628.02924ec0@pop.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: claudine_on_the_net@pop.mail.yahoo.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:49:59 -0800 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Claudine Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello! I'm about to make a simple ruff, and for the ruffle I'm not using the selvedge edge of the fabric (the fabric I have doesn't have a proper-looking selvedge). Instead of turning a hem, I'm looking for a more interesting way to finish the edge of the ruffle. Can anyone recommend an edge finish that would be accurate for the last quarter of the 1500s? This is an economy, working-man's ruff, so the finish doesn't have to be fancy. I'm thinking of using a blanket stitch (sometimes called a buttonhole stitch, see www.heritageshoppe.com/heritage/stitches/blanketstitch.html) using plain linen sewing thread, but I can't document it's use for this application, or even for this century (I know next to *nothing* about historic needlework!) Thanks a bunch, Claudine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 18:06:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MN6OSd011082 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:06:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MN4WcP021974; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:04:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MN4NG5019235; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:04:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1MN4LG5019198 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:04:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCv1b+wTy9D4gASxOStX0D82yFkzAvaLU4Q==">; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:03:47 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JN2EKYD4; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 15:03:47 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:02:28 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Message-ID: <20040222.170229.-765667.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 7-12,14-48 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've never seen a representation of a ruff with just a blanket stitch kind of thing along the edge. But I have seen some with a narrow lace (less than a 1/4 inch) or with a twisted (silk?) cord along the edge. I have seen it in black and white or in red and white. I'd think that either of these would be appropriate for a middle-class/merchant kind of ruff. I'd also expect that a simple narrow 'shirt-tail' style hem would both finish the edge and add a bit of extra stiffening to accentuate the ripple of the edge. Karen On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:49:59 -0800 Claudine writes: > Hello! > > I'm about to make a simple ruff, and for the ruffle I'm not using > the > selvedge edge of the fabric (the fabric I have doesn't have a > proper-looking selvedge). Instead of turning a hem, I'm looking for > a more > interesting way to finish the edge of the ruffle. Can anyone > recommend an > edge finish that would be accurate for the last quarter of the > 1500s? This > is an economy, working-man's ruff, so the finish doesn't have to be > fancy. > > I'm thinking of using a blanket stitch (sometimes called a > buttonhole > stitch, see > www.heritageshoppe.com/heritage/stitches/blanketstitch.html) > using plain linen sewing thread, but I can't document it's use for > this > application, or even for this century (I know next to *nothing* > about > historic needlework!) > > > > Thanks a bunch, > Claudine > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 18:23:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MNNkSd011136 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:23:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNLtcP022771; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:21:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNLrG5025718; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:21:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNLpG5025671 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:21:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.1d9.1a931731 (4206) for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:21:43 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1d9.1a931731.2d6a9387@aol.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:21:43 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6024 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO That light brown printed 1830s dress is really lovely. And the girl, with her hair and face, look perfect. Very nice. The other 1830s dress is OK [same pattern?] but I'm not fond of that big striped collar thingie or the bonnet. A less startling collar effect and a rounder, decorated bonnet would've done the trick. What fun, watching period skaters. It never gets cold enough for that down here. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 18:34:18 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1MNYHSd011186 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:34:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNWLcP023371; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:32:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNWJG5029456; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:32:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNWGG5029442 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:32:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from theresa@misc.com) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1MMl852002678 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 14:47:08 -0800 Message-ID: <40392FF8.8040903@misc.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 14:40:56 -0800 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@net.indra.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] GBACG Skate Party X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This is a posting of my husband's photos from the same event Kendra took shots of at Winter Wonderland in Palo Alto, Ca: http://www.misc.com/costumes/2004_skating/index.php We were lucky in that our event took place between rainy periods, with even a little bit of sun. People brought goodies to snack on between triple toe loops and hot cider for thawing out. A good time was had by all!! Enjoy, Theresa and Brad Eacker _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 19:06:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N06cSd011592 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:06:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N04hcP025087; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:04:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N04QG5041573; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:04:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (alpha.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N04MG5041555 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:04:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.163] (pm5-163.eos.net [205.133.149.163]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N04I8s027356 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:04:19 -0500 (EST) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:04:21 -0500 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200402221900.i1MJ0dG6026703@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Scanned-By: Scanned by EOS.Net Mailserver running MimeDefang and SPAMAssassin X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: skating party X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kendra: Thanks so much for posting this! That looks like so much fun. It reminds me of SCA events, when wearing our medieval clothes makes us feel medieval despite our plastic camp chairs and tarps. Everyone looks as if just wearing their clothes to skate makes them so happy that they don't notice the paper plates and Zamboni machine! Gail Finke quote: Yesterday the Greater (San Francisco) Bay Area Costumer's Guild held the Currier & Ives ice skating party, a Victorian themed event. I've posted some pictures to my website and I thought some of you here might like to see them! http://demode.tweedlebop.com/currier/ - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 19:06:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N06oSd011597 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:06:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNhIcP023898; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:43:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNhGG5033313; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:43:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1MNhDG5033250 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 16:43:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from localhost (robin@localhost) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA20453; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:13:00 -0600 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:13:00 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] About Netherton lectures, Springfield, 13 March, IMPORTANT X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The organizer of this event asks that people please forward this urgent announcement to any relevant lists. I would be especially grateful if someone can send this on to the SCA-garb, Authentic-SCA, Midrealm, and Calontir lists. Thanks. Direct URL for the event flyer is http://home.insightbb.com/~swordcliff/robin.html ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 14:49:33 -0800 (PST) From: Mary Conrad Subject: ICK!! Spreadsheet with 3-13-04 reservations has been eaten by my computer! ICK!! Spreadsheet with 3-13-04 reservations has been eaten by my computer! The Excel spreadsheet I was recording the reservations for Robin Netherton's Women's Costume in the 14th & 15th Centuries has been eaten by my computer. I can't find it anywhere!!!!!!! After much hair-pulling, I have decided to ask you to re-send the reservations to me ASAP, I am very sorry (and very unhappy this has occurred!)... Anyone who sent a reservation before last weekend (2/14) needs to re-send their info to me. I need mundane name, address, a 'quick' contact (phone or E-mail, in case we should need to cancel for some horrible reason) and how you first heard about the seminar. IF you E-mail me a reservation and get a 'bounce' message that my mailbox is full - please phone me at 217-898-6509 and I'll get in and dump bulk mail & trash folders. I usually don't access the yahoo account from work during the week..... Remember, we have 200 seats that we can fill & we were only at about 75 when this 'crash' occurred. If you are reading this message and wondering 'what seminar is she talking about?' - please go to the MidRealm Home Page at midrealm.org and then go to the Calendar, select 3/13 and the link to this seminar which is being hosted by the Shire of Swordcliffe and the All Things Medieval Student Club at University of Illinois-Springfield IL. PLEASE FORWARD THIS EVERYWHERE YOU CAN!!!!!! Thanks so much, Baroness Anntionette Rose / Mary Conrad _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 19:41:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N0flSd012344 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:41:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N0cgcP027086; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:38:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N0cdG5054021; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:38:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N0caG5053977 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:38:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.64.3af5786b (16484) for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:38:25 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <64.3af5786b.2d6aa581@aol.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:38:25 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] new technology in exhibition To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/22/2004 4:06:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, vmaa2@cox.net writes: "The Empress's New Clothes" Wish they were a little more informative--which Empress, for example? Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 20:17:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N1H6Sd012611 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:17:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N1FDcP029121; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:15:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N1F9G5075382; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:15:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N1F7G5075365 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:15:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a231.in-tch.com [66.62.107.31]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1N0qXs08654 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 17:52:33 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <403954D9.3010000@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:18:17 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? References: <20040222.170229.-765667.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> In-Reply-To: <20040222.170229.-765667.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The ruffle on the 16th c. boy's shirt in the V&A is finished with a tiny line of buttonhole stitch along the edge, with the stitches holding down a narrow, little twisted cord of matching floss that sits *on* the edge. I should add, though, the the ruffle's a double layer of fabric, not a single layer, and I don't think it'd work to just do one layer with the buttonhole stitch and no other kind of hem--the linen would tend to ravel pretty bad. --sue seamstrix@juno.com wrote: > I've never seen a representation of a ruff with just a blanket stitch > kind of thing along the edge. But I have seen some with a narrow lace > (less than a 1/4 inch) or with a twisted (silk?) cord along the edge. I > have seen it in black and white or in red and white. I'd think that > either of these would be appropriate for a middle-class/merchant kind of > ruff. I'd also expect that a simple narrow 'shirt-tail' style hem would > both finish the edge and add a bit of extra stiffening to accentuate the > ripple of the edge. > > > Karen > > > On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:49:59 -0800 Claudine > writes: > >>Hello! >> >>I'm about to make a simple ruff, and for the ruffle I'm not using >>the >>selvedge edge of the fabric (the fabric I have doesn't have a >>proper-looking selvedge). Instead of turning a hem, I'm looking for >>a more >>interesting way to finish the edge of the ruffle. Can anyone >>recommend an >>edge finish that would be accurate for the last quarter of the >>1500s? This >>is an economy, working-man's ruff, so the finish doesn't have to be >>fancy. >> >>I'm thinking of using a blanket stitch (sometimes called a >>buttonhole >>stitch, see >>www.heritageshoppe.com/heritage/stitches/blanketstitch.html) >>using plain linen sewing thread, but I can't document it's use for >>this >>application, or even for this century (I know next to *nothing* >>about >>historic needlework!) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 20:19:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N1J3Sd012628 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:19:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N1ITcP029279; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:18:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N1ISG5076656; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:18:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rad.ess.washington.edu (rad.ess.washington.edu [128.95.233.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N1IRG6076649 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:18:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from handcock@rad.ess.washington.edu) Received: from rad.ess.washington.edu (rad [127.0.0.1]) by rad.ess.washington.edu (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1N8xp10017034; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 00:59:51 -0800 Received: from localhost (handcock@localhost) by rad.ess.washington.edu (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i1N8xpud017030; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 00:59:51 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 00:59:51 -0800 (PST) From: handcock@rad.ess.washington.edu To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Rebecca Handcock X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Bjarne, I am Rebecca, currently living in Seattle, USA, (I am Australian). I have been on the list in various forms since way-way back when it was new (96?), and it is one of my favorites. To reminisce, I remember when I was finishing up my Ph.D. a few years ago, I took a few minutes time-out to scan the list. I stumbled in on that amazon.com.uk special on "Queen Elizabeth Wardrobe Unlocked", which flew on email around the world that weekend and made such a puzzling flurry of activity for the amazon executives. I am a fan of the 18th/19th century transition periods, from panniers through to empire-line. I also make an obscure form of Italian bobbin lace, so you can imagine that I follow your posts with interest! I used to sew much more, but now days I only have time for costuming research and sewing everyday clothes. I do manage to squeeze in a couple of corsets for fun and evening wear. :-) Thanks Bec On Fri, 30 Jan 2004, Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > I would like to know who is on the list at pressent time. > Thankyou > Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 21:17:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N2HMSd013085 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 21:17:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2E9cP002178; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:14:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2DwG5097000; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:13:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp813.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp813.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.83]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1N2DuG5096953 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:13:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.144.252 with login) by smtp813.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2004 02:13:51 -0000 Message-ID: <006e01c3f9b2$ab9528c0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1d9.1a931731.2d6a9387@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:13:47 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: > That light brown printed 1830s dress is really lovely. And the girl, with her > hair and face, look perfect. Very nice. That was me! In fact, I suppose I have an FO here... my 1830s day dress. Lots of photos and commentary are at: http://demode.tweedlebop.com/indienne.html - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 21:20:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N2K8Sd013125 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 21:20:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2JXcP002377; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:19:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2JTG5098967; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:19:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp806.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp806.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.185]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1N2JSG5098905 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:19:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.144.252 with login) by smtp806.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2004 02:12:42 -0000 Message-ID: <006701c3f9b2$82580f90$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001001c3f970$aabf1a10$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <4039182D.6050708@in-tch.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:12:37 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------- From: "Sue Clemenger" > Oh, great pictures! I particularly like the picture of the woman in the > light-blue, below-hip jacket (?) with the black trimming and the mocha > (?) skirt, [actually, I like the whole outfit, whatever it actually is > ;o)] who's interacting with the little girl in red (who's just > *adorable* in her ruffles). And I like the gowns on both the ladies in Her dress was great. The underskirt is actually some kind of taffeta-esque fabric in brown that was printed with tiny blue squares (like 1/16"). - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 21:39:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N2daSd013262 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 21:39:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2bicP003024; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:37:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2bgG5005230; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:37:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2bdG5005172 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:37:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79FB742615 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 21:50:35 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <40396908.60805@reddawn.net> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:44:24 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... References: <1d9.1a931731.2d6a9387@aol.com> <006e01c3f9b2$ab9528c0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> In-Reply-To: <006e01c3f9b2$ab9528c0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > That was me! In fact, I suppose I have an FO here... my 1830s day dress. > Lots of photos and commentary are at: > http://demode.tweedlebop.com/indienne.html Wow! I have some of that fabric and never imagined it would look so good made up into something. Did you overdye it? It looks more/darker coffee-colored than mine is. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 21:45:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N2jZSd013309 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 21:45:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2hgcP003283; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:43:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N2hfG5007229; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:43:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp810.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp810.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.80]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1N2heG5007219 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:43:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.144.252 with login) by smtp810.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2004 02:43:39 -0000 Message-ID: <00c401c3f9b6$d58e6930$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1d9.1a931731.2d6a9387@aol.com><006e01c3f9b2$ab9528c0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <40396908.60805@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:43:35 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" > > Wow! I have some of that fabric and never imagined it would look so good > made up into something. Did you overdye it? It looks more/darker > coffee-colored than mine is. No I didn't -- in fact it lightened a shade when I washed it (there were posts a few months ago about washing it with salt to stop it from bleeding...). They did have various colorations of the fabric, so maybe we chose different ones? Or given that it's a vegetable dye, I think it would be quite logical that there would be variations in color. - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 22:35:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N3Z3Sd013656 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:35:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N3YMcP005992; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:34:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N3YHG5026731; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:34:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N3YBG5026670 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:34:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 962AF42615 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:47:07 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <40397648.8060804@reddawn.net> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 21:40:56 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... References: <1d9.1a931731.2d6a9387@aol.com><006e01c3f9b2$ab9528c0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <40396908.60805@reddawn.net> <00c401c3f9b6$d58e6930$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> In-Reply-To: <00c401c3f9b6$d58e6930$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dawn" > >>Wow! I have some of that fabric and never imagined it would look so good >>made up into something. Did you overdye it? It looks more/darker >>coffee-colored than mine is. > > > No I didn't -- in fact it lightened a shade when I washed it (there were > posts a few months ago about washing it with salt to stop it from > bleeding...). > > They did have various colorations of the fabric, so maybe we chose different > ones? Or given that it's a vegetable dye, I think it would be quite logical > that there would be variations in color. Very likely. The colors weren't consistent among bolts in the local stores either. Thanks for the reminder about washing it. I'll use Retayne on mine, it's great for fabrics that bleed, I use it on a lot of imported fabrics especially those fine super-saturated veils from Egypt. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 22 22:45:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N3jWSd013689 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:45:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N3fscP006368; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:41:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N3frG5031452; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:41:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1N3fnG5031185 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:41:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCl4T2CVUt7rQBTZLU1wdftv7UUZxn3rg5A==">; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:41:39 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JN2WGR2D; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 19:41:39 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 21:47:36 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... Message-ID: <20040222.214737.1236.0.seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4-9,11-32 From: Karen R Bergquist X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO You look terrific in your indienne print dress, Kendra. I still haven't started my 18th century indienne outfit yet.....but, gosh your outfit has inspired me to look at that whole 1830's era which I hadn't really considered before......darn this list! I didn't need another era to costume!!!! Karen On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 18:13:47 -0800 "Kendra Van Cleave" writes: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > > > That light brown printed 1830s dress is really lovely. And the > girl, with > her > > hair and face, look perfect. Very nice. > > That was me! In fact, I suppose I have an FO here... my 1830s day > dress. > Lots of photos and commentary are at: > http://demode.tweedlebop.com/indienne.html > > - Kendra > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 00:06:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N56ASd014184 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 00:06:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N52pcP009628; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:02:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N52lG5076227; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:02:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N52gG5075694 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:02:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B641E24F1 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 23:02:41 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t2p499.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.217.245]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 7D443C4F6 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 23:02:40 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Photos from an event... Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 23:02:52 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <00c401c3f9b6$d58e6930$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I was always told to wash with vinegar and salt to spot bleeders. What has other people heard or don't for this kind of problem? Arian -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Kendra Van Cleave Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 8:44 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" > > Wow! I have some of that fabric and never imagined it would look so good > made up into something. Did you overdye it? It looks more/darker > coffee-colored than mine is. No I didn't -- in fact it lightened a shade when I washed it (there were posts a few months ago about washing it with salt to stop it from bleeding...). They did have various colorations of the fabric, so maybe we chose different ones? Or given that it's a vegetable dye, I think it would be quite logical that there would be variations in color. - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 00:41:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N5fNSd014357 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 00:41:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N5dScP011004; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:39:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N5dLG5047334; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:39:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N5dJG5047323 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:39:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m123.in-tch.com [216.166.191.123]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1N5Gjs20544 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:16:45 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <403992C6.8090406@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:42:30 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT food question References: <1a8.1f731480.2d5a9fcc@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <1a8.1f731480.2d5a9fcc@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'd like to send out a belated thank-you to everyone who was so kind as to respond to my query. I've sent the info on to my friend, and eventually, maybe, I'll hear back from her on what they ended up doing.... --sue _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 01:01:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N61nSd014432 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 01:01:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N5xocP012148; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:59:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N5xnG5054294; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:59:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lakemtao07.cox.net (lakemtao07.cox.net [68.1.17.114]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N5xjG5054252 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 22:59:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from vmaa2@cox.net) Received: from VMAAHQ ([68.96.201.18]) by lakemtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.05 201-253-122-130-105-20030824) with ESMTP id <20040223010934.WJLP19895.lakemtao04.cox.net@VMAAHQ> for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:09:34 -0500 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] new technology in exhibition Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2004 20:09:16 -0500 Message-ID: <00b301c3f9a9$abb4adc0$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <64.3af5786b.2d6aa581@aol.com> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1N5xjG5054252 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Ann! I don't think the title should be taken literally, it's more a reference to the fairy tale, I believe. The link for the fashion exhibit is in the lower left corner of the main page. More than any particular set of costumes, they are showcasing the technology which they applied to viewing historic clothing in 3D as well as on a moving human form. They don't give the interactive video on site (that I could find) but maybe this is a first step toward good things to come. If anyone is in London it'd be fun to check it out! ::Linda:: -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of AnnBWass@aol.com Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 7:38 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] new technology in exhibition In a message dated 2/22/2004 4:06:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, vmaa2@cox.net writes: "The Empress's New Clothes" Wish they were a little more informative--which Empress, for example? Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 04:16:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N9GdSd009161 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 04:16:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N9ElcP020643; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:14:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N9EcG5017505; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:14:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N9EVG5017435 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:14:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i1N9ELT04236.; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:14:21 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:14:20 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:14:15 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] GBACG Skate Party Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Who does the gentleman in the red jacket represent? Is he one of those Zouaves you read about in the ACW period? Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 04:27:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1N9RPSd009193 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 04:27:26 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N9PXcP020956; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:25:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N9PVG5021400; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:25:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1N9PRG5021373 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 02:25:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B1C41D0DD for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 03:25:27 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p225.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.227]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 547E1C40E for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 03:25:26 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 03:25:38 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] fabric bleeds. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO oops, dyslexia stricts again. It should be "stops bleeders" not "spots bleeders" Arian -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of otsisto Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 11:03 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] Photos from an event... I was always told to wash with vinegar and salt to spot bleeders. What has other people heard or don't for this kind of problem? Arian -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Kendra Van Cleave Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 8:44 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dawn" > > Wow! I have some of that fabric and never imagined it would look so good > made up into something. Did you overdye it? It looks more/darker > coffee-colored than mine is. No I didn't -- in fact it lightened a shade when I washed it (there were posts a few months ago about washing it with salt to stop it from bleeding...). They did have various colorations of the fabric, so maybe we chose different ones? Or given that it's a vegetable dye, I think it would be quite logical that there would be variations in color. - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 08:32:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NDW3Sd010988 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:32:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDU0cP000871; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:30:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDTnG5092880; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:29:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m26.mx.aol.com (imo-m26.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.7]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDTkG5092843 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:29:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m26.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.68.3b70bd24 (3657) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:24:25 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <68.3b70bd24.2d6b5908@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:24:24 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] new technology in exhibition To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/23/2004 1:00:18 AM Eastern Standard Time, vmaa2@cox.net writes: link for the fashion exhibit is in the lower left corner of the main page. More than any particular set of costumes, they are showcasing the technology which they applied to viewing historic clothing in 3D as well as on a moving human form. I looked at all that, and I am most impressed at the technology, but would still like to know more about the dress! Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 08:35:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NDZESd011021 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:35:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDXOcP001019; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:33:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDXOG5094089; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:33:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu [132.236.56.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDXNG5094079 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:33:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from arkham.cornell.edu (vcs077.vet.cornell.edu [128.253.111.77]) by postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i1NDXMnF002620 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:33:22 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040223082833.00bbbea8@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:33:25 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: M Stewart Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? In-Reply-To: <6.0.1.1.0.20040222113628.02924ec0@pop.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey Claudine... just blanket stitch at the edge will not prevent fraying. A couple of quick and historically accurate edge finishes for the ruff include: A turned 1/4" hem with a hem stitch... creates an open work effect at the very edge /_/_/_/ You said you didn't want to turn a hem... but you'd be accurate in doing so, at least with the openwork you would. And then if you wanted to add some modest lace you could. Also... you could roll the edge and whip it... I imagine it would give you a good upper edge for the serpentine folds of the ruff... but I haven't seen that done - on a ruff... Good luck. Bridgette >I'm about to make a simple ruff, and for the ruffle I'm not using the >selvedge edge of the fabric (the fabric I have doesn't have a >proper-looking selvedge). Instead of turning a hem, I'm looking for a more >interesting way to finish the edge of the ruffle. Can anyone recommend an >edge finish that would be accurate for the last quarter of the 1500s? This >is an economy, working-man's ruff, so the finish doesn't have to be fancy. > >I'm thinking of using a blanket stitch (sometimes called a buttonhole >stitch, see www.heritageshoppe.com/heritage/stitches/blanketstitch.html) >using plain linen sewing thread, but I can't document it's use for this >application, or even for this century (I know next to *nothing* about >historic needlework!) Mari Stewart Cornell University _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 08:44:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NDidSd011128 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:44:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDfScP001272; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:41:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDfRG5096718; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:41:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m09.mx.aol.com (imo-m09.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.164]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NDfQG5096658 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 06:41:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.229]) by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (v93.8) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-2403a01c618f; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:36:06 -0500 Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.1c3.156fecaf (3657) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:30:54 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <1c3.156fecaf.2d6b5a8d@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:30:53 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/22/2004 8:18:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, handcock@rad.ess.washington.edu writes: but now days I only have time for costuming research and sewing everyday clothes. I've given up everyday clothes almost altogether. As a friend said, why sew what you can buy? And that is it exactly. The clothes I favor are not that expensive, and I am a great fan of thrift stores. I limit my sewing to my historic apparel--I do early 19th century, the occasional square dance dress (my husband is a caller, so I have to dress the part, and I've worked out a streamlined dress that is easy to make and allows me to have fun with fabric and trim choices), and, now that I have 2 granddaughters, I'm trying to do Christmas and perhaps birthday outfits for them. Once in a great while, I will undertake a project like an evening coat or something else that I can't buy. I really don't think sewing daywear is economical anymore, especially when one figures in the cost of one's labor. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 09:21:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NELDSd011442 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:21:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NEJOcP003111; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:19:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NEJMG5010124; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:19:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NEJKG6010114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:19:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1NEIf7j012063 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:18:41 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:18:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <403A0BE6.9070702@thibault.org> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:19:18 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here/regular clothes References: <1c3.156fecaf.2d6b5a8d@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <1c3.156fecaf.2d6b5a8d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO AnnBWass@aol.com wrote: > I really don't think sewing daywear is economical anymore, especially when > one figures in the cost of one's labor. I agree. The clothes I make for regular wear are more artsy than you can get off the rack. Most clothes are made in the less developed nations, where cost of labor is nearly nothing compared to the developed ones. And I read recently that most clothing donated to thrift stores is shipped to less developed nations as well. (I can dig up the cite if anyone cares.) This part of the economy isn't noticed so much, until you try to buy a decent recreation outfit, and it has a startling price tag! But that's what it's worth in local time & talent. -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 10:16:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NFGfSd011902 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:16:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFDAcP007264; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:13:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFD3G5033713; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:13:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m19.mx.aol.com (imo-m19.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFCuG5033613 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:12:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m19.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.14.234bd720 (4362) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:07:38 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <14.234bd720.2d6b7136@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:07:34 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here/regular clothes To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/23/2004 9:19:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, cvirtue+dated+1093097921.8a55a6@thibault.org writes: Most clothes are made in the less developed nations, where cost of labor is nearly nothing compared to the developed ones. And I read recently that most clothing donated to thrift stores is shipped to less developed nations as well. Yes, and some people may have problems with that. However, traditionally one of the first industries to be developed is apparel manufacturing, as the set up costs are low. And while the wages may be very low, they are an improvement over nothing or bare subsistence from agriculture. Made in the USA, we have learned, doesn't guarantee that the workers were paid a decent wage. I don't know if it is continuing, but as recently as a couple of years ago, there were still raids on those places in this country where the workers were basically enslaved--all their wages went to pay their living expenses, and they couldn't leave, but the clothes could be labeled made in USA. I had just heard that used clothes were being shipped overseas. All the more reason for us to buy them here, then. This is an aside, not directly related to the above, but I have noticed when I have gone to craft shows that feature "wearable art," that the artistic ideas might be good, but the workmanship isn't so great. So I seldom buy any of that, as I really CAN do better myself. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 10:23:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NFN3Sd012034 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:23:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFMIcP008175; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:22:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFMEG5038461; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:22:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9403.mail.yahoo.com (web9403.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1NFMBG5038437 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:22:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040223152211.4716.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9403.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:22:11 PST Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:22:11 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] Photos from an event... To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <40397648.8060804@reddawn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Where does one get 'Retayne'? Albra (delurking for a moment) Dawn wrote: Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dawn" > >>Wow! I have some of that fabric and never imagined it would look so good >>made up into something. Did you overdye it? It looks more/darker >>coffee-colored than mine is. > > > No I didn't -- in fact it lightened a shade when I washed it (there were > posts a few months ago about washing it with salt to stop it from > bleeding...). > > They did have various colorations of the fabric, so maybe we chose different > ones? Or given that it's a vegetable dye, I think it would be quite logical > that there would be variations in color. Very likely. The colors weren't consistent among bolts in the local stores either. Thanks for the reminder about washing it. I'll use Retayne on mine, it's great for fabrics that bleed, I use it on a lot of imported fabrics especially those fine super-saturated veils from Egypt. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 10:45:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NFj0Sd012249 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:45:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFh1cP010063; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:43:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFguG5050115; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:42:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFgpG5050058 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:42:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.83.37] (helo=dan) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AvFAh-00024E-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:26:51 +0000 Message-ID: <001001c3fa08$9101c300$25538151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00a401c3f969$44cf3b60$6401a8c0@VMAAHQ> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 18th century and new technology in exhibition Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:28:39 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Linda wrote, on Sunday, February 22, 2004 5:28 PM > Anyone in London might want to check out this new type of exhibit. > Click on "The Empress's New Clothes" and follow through. > > http://www.museumoflondon.org.uk/ > > I was wondering when technology was going to catch up! I already had, having spent 45 minutes staring at it, after 45 minutes staring at the Saxon gravefinds:-) But the technology, or the people using it, has a very long way to go, since it looks nothing like the way that particular dress would look in motion:-( They have officially noted that they need to factor in period undergarments, (I assume stays) which would help but I am trying to find a polite form of words for pointing out to them that silk taffeta looks nothing like the animation. Imagine a cross between a charmeuse satin and china silk in motion, and you know what the animation looks like. Not much different to Sleeping Beauty or indeed Fiona's dresses, alas. But the real thing is a very nice dress... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 10:51:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NFpDSd012280 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:51:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFoScP010754; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:50:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFoOG5054510; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:50:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com (imo-m24.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFoMG5054446 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:50:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.f6.370f17e4 (4116) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:50:14 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:50:13 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] 18th century and new technology in exhibition To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/23/2004 10:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, stevie.gamble@btinternet.com writes: But the real thing is a very nice dress... So, can you tell us more about the dress itself? Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 10:59:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NFxNSd012335 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:59:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFwfcP011355; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:58:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFweG5059205; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:58:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from localhost.localdomain (mail.cyberonic.com [4.17.179.4]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NFwZG6059133 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:58:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Katie@katiesorchids.com) Received: from KATIE.katiesorchids.com (node-40240b01.sjc.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.11.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1NG9Oo8015219 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:09:26 -0500 Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20040223075318.00b3bcf8@mail.katiesorchids.com> X-Sender: katie@katiesorchids.com@mail.katiesorchids.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:58:25 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here/regular clothes In-Reply-To: <403A0BE6.9070702@thibault.org> References: <1c3.156fecaf.2d6b5a8d@aol.com> <1c3.156fecaf.2d6b5a8d@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id i1NFwZG6059133 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I agree about the economics, but must add that, for me, there are three reasons that override economics: 1. If you cannot find off-the-rack that fits properly, it doesn't matter how cheap it is (assuming good fit is important), and 2. If you cannot find off-the-rack that you find attractive, the only way to get clothes that *you* think looks good on you is to sew it yourself,and 3. If you have the time and enjoy sewing. Katie At 09:19 AM 2/23/2004 -0500, you wrote: >AnnBWass@aol.com wrote: >>I really don't think sewing daywear is economical anymore, especially >>when one figures in the cost of one's labor. > >I agree. The clothes I make for regular wear are more artsy than you can >get off the rack. Most clothes are made in the less developed nations, >where cost of labor is nearly nothing compared to the developed ones. And >I read recently that most clothing donated to thrift stores is shipped to >less developed nations as well. (I can dig up the cite if anyone cares.) > >This part of the economy isn't noticed so much, until you try to buy a >decent recreation outfit, and it has a startling price tag! But that's >what it's worth in local time & talent. > >-- >Cynthia Virtue and/or >Cynthia du Pré Argent >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 11:15:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NGFUSd012455 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:15:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NGDPcP012630; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:13:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NGDMG5068635; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:13:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from x11.quik.com (x11.quik.com [209.213.140.111]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NGDIG5068609 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:13:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyanne@quik.com) Received: (from root@localhost) by x11.quik.com (8.12.9-20030926/8.12.5) id i1NFVDvW027880 for h-costume@indra.com.qbigmail; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:31:13 -0800 Received: from quik.com (x1.quik.com [216.176.27.101]) by x11.quik.com (8.12.9-20030926/8.12.5) with SMTP id i1NFVDkF027876 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:31:13 -0800 Received: from 68.109.3.201 (QuikMail authenticated user ladyanne) by webmail.quik.com with HTTP; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:31:13 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <2119.68.109.3.201.1077550273.squirrel@webmail.quik.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:31:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [h-cost] rice paper From: To: In-Reply-To: <003e01c3f8d7$f031d2c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> References: <003e01c3f8d7$f031d2c0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Mailer: QuikMail (version 1.2.10) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > First of all, I echo everyone else's opinion of your work, Bjarne. You are the most talented embroidere I have ever seen and your work is FABULOUS. Now I have a question. Were the rice paper instructions posted on this list? If they were, I must have missed them. My husband has been "tinkering" with the computer lately. If the instruactions were not poste, could they be? I would love to learn this technique as I need to embroider on some silk chiffon and we all know how "wimpy" that fabric is. Thanks and keep sending those wonderful photos Bjarne. You are an inspiration to all of us. Anne (back to lurk mode) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 11:50:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NGoeSd012719 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:50:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NGmacP015936; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:48:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NGmSG5092578; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:48:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail.cableone.net (scanmail2.cableone.net [24.116.0.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NGVJG5080764 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:31:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kbaird@cableone.net) Received: from kimathlon (unverified [24.119.176.69]) by smail2.cableone.net (SurgeMail 1.5d2) with ESMTP id 8064846 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 08:21:47 -0700 From: "kim baird" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:31:01 -0600 Message-ID: <000001c3fa22$0b22d4d0$0201a8c0@kimathlon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <20040223152211.4716.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Server: High Performance Mail Server - http://surgemail.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] retayne X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO http:www.dharmatrading.com or anywhere that caters to fabric dyers Kim Where does one get 'Retayne'? Albra (delurking for a moment) Dawn wrote: Kendra Van Cleave wrote: _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 12:31:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NHVFSd012919 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:31:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NHUQcP020322; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:30:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NHUMWI025805; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:30:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9404.mail.yahoo.com (web9404.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.110]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1NHUIWI025786 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:30:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040223173018.76627.qmail@web9404.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9404.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:30:18 PST Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:30:18 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] retayne To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000001c3fa22$0b22d4d0$0201a8c0@kimathlon> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO thanks mucho, Kim:) Albra kim baird wrote: http:www.dharmatrading.com or anywhere that caters to fabric dyers Kim Where does one get 'Retayne'? Albra (delurking for a moment) Dawn wrote: Kendra Van Cleave wrote: _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 13:39:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NIdESd013158 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:39:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NIZacP027741; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:35:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NIZUWI072198; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:35:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav47.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.19]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NIZSWI072128 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:35:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:35:22 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav47.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:35:22 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: <5.2.1.1.2.20040223082833.00bbbea8@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:36:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Feb 2004 18:35:22.0401 (UTC) FILETIME=[CBB2C110:01C3FA3B] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Also... you could roll the edge and whip it... I imagine it would give you > a good upper edge for the serpentine folds of the ruff... but I haven't > seen that done - on a ruff... I did that on a ruffle. Looks very good, and it's stiffer than a regular turned hem. Here's a picture http://www.geocities.com/audreybm_costumes/laudomia/images/17-Partlet_ruffle.jpg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 13:45:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NIjNSd013304 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:45:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NIhHcP028517; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:43:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NIhCWI077703; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:43:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NIh9WI077619 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 11:43:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D87D42615 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:56:08 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <403A4B59.2060704@reddawn.net> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:50:01 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] retayne References: <000001c3fa22$0b22d4d0$0201a8c0@kimathlon> In-Reply-To: <000001c3fa22$0b22d4d0$0201a8c0@kimathlon> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Where does one get 'Retayne'? You can sometimes also buy it in specialty quilt shops. It might be worth the cost of shipping to call and ask. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 14:09:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NJ9BSd013842 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:09:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NJ78cP001001; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:07:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NJ71WI095278; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:07:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pd8mo2no.prod.shaw.ca (idcmail-mo2no.cg.shawcable.net [64.59.134.9]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NJ6wWI095187 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 12:06:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from marga@shaw.ca) Received: from pd7mr2no.prod.shaw.ca (pd7mr2no-qfe3.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.144.129]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTJ00DJYTCFYT@l-daemon> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:45:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from shaw.ca ([10.0.145.163]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTJ00BWMTCFVO@l-daemon> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:45:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.0.144.80] by pd8ims1.prod.shaw.ca (mshttpd); Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:45:51 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 09:45:51 -0800 From: MARGARET SUTHERLAND Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here/regular clothes To: Historical Costume Message-id: <54415b549992.54999254415b@shaw.ca> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi I'm Margaret from Vancouver, Canada here, new to the list. I always find there's plenty for me to choose from at the thrift shops and consignment stores :-) before it gets shipped overseas or whatever. I am just not interested in paying retail prices for any garments except underwear and sox. Though I don't have the same "sales resistance" toward my costuming habit *grin* I was seriously considering paying $30 per meter for some hemp canvas to sew my first "serious re-enactment" garment (fortunately a friend had some in her stash...) About clothing manufacturing/wages, etc., there is a whole "fair trade" organization, the "Clean Clothes Campaign" http://www.cleanclothes.org that is working to expose the worst injustices. Kind of interesting to keep an eye on what's going on. I'm a fairly-new SCA costumer, though I've been sewing something or other since I was a small child. I find I really like hand-sewing, I'm just beginning to hand-sew with linen and silk sewing threads, rather than Gutterman's polyester. Best wishes, Margaret Sutherland Alienor Sanz-Argent _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 15:51:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NKpNSd014148 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:51:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NKkTcP010582; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:46:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NKkAWI066078; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:46:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NKk7WI066048 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:46:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claudine_on_the_net@yahoo.com) Received: from snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.62]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AvKSc-0003Ug-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:05:42 -0800 Received: from h-68-164-78-102.snvacaid.dynamic.covad.net ([68.164.78.102] helo=GABRIEL.yahoo.com) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AvKSb-0003z3-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:05:41 -0800 Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.0.20040223093858.029e3018@pop.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: claudine_on_the_net@pop.mail.yahoo.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:03:30 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Claudine Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? In-Reply-To: <20040222.170229.-765667.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> References: <20040222.170229.-765667.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Karen, Thanks for you input. I thought about using a bit of lace, but I understand from earlier discussions that finding accurate lace can be difficult. Are there any websites you can recommend for seeing what accurate lace should look like? Are there any good sources online for buying lace? Thanks, Claudine At 03:02 PM 2/22/2004, you wrote: >I've never seen a representation of a ruff with just a blanket stitch >kind of thing along the edge. But I have seen some with a narrow lace >(less than a 1/4 inch) or with a twisted (silk?) cord along the edge. I >have seen it in black and white or in red and white. I'd think that >either of these would be appropriate for a middle-class/merchant kind of >ruff. I'd also expect that a simple narrow 'shirt-tail' style hem would >both finish the edge and add a bit of extra stiffening to accentuate the >ripple of the edge. > > >Karen > > >On Sun, 22 Feb 2004 11:49:59 -0800 Claudine > writes: > > Hello! > > > > I'm about to make a simple ruff, and for the ruffle I'm not using > > the > > selvedge edge of the fabric (the fabric I have doesn't have a > > proper-looking selvedge). Instead of turning a hem, I'm looking for > > a more > > interesting way to finish the edge of the ruffle. Can anyone > > recommend an > > edge finish that would be accurate for the last quarter of the > > 1500s? This > > is an economy, working-man's ruff, so the finish doesn't have to be > > fancy. > > > > I'm thinking of using a blanket stitch (sometimes called a > > buttonhole > > stitch, see > > www.heritageshoppe.com/heritage/stitches/blanketstitch.html) > > using plain linen sewing thread, but I can't document it's use for > > this > > application, or even for this century (I know next to *nothing* > > about > > historic needlework!) > > > > > > > > Thanks a bunch, > > Claudine > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > >________________________________________________________________ >The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! >Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! >Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 16:18:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NLIUSd014234 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:18:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLF4cP013600; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:15:05 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLEwWI086476; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:14:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d21.mx.aol.com (imo-d21.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.207]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLEvWI086408 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:14:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.158.2e580388 (4362) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:09:33 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <158.2e580388.2d6bc60b@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:09:31 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6024 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO OK...I can't resist any longer... You sand it smooth, silly! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 16:25:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NLPsSd014272 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:25:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLP6cP014703; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:25:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLP2WI093903; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:25:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLOxWI093853 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:24:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-125-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.125.111]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLOtlm009637 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:24:56 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040223130144.00dbb5a0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:03:38 -0800 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I read, in an un-documented list of first occurrences, that the first life jacket was created for the English Navy in the 1700s. Where would I look to find an image of one of these, or the specifications on them? I don't even know where to start. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 16:34:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NLYUSd014304 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:34:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLXUcP015721; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:33:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NLXRWI099816; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:33:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web10406.mail.yahoo.com (web10406.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.130.98]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1NLXQWI099802 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:33:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claudine_on_the_net@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040223212646.54720.qmail@web10406.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [66.17.149.13] by web10406.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:26:46 PST Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:26:46 -0800 (PST) From: Claudine Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.2.20040223082833.00bbbea8@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi guys, Thanks for the responses! The "rolled and whipped" ruffle looks really nice, but is the techinique documentable for any garment around about 1580 in western Europe? I'm clinging to documentable, period techniques as much as I can. :) I like the idea of a turned hem with a bit of openwork, but I don't understand how I would accomplish that. When I do a hem I end up with little stitches on the outside of the garment that are basically perpendicular the the hem edge; I don't see how that converts to openwork. Bridgette, from your ASCII drawing, are you saying that I should throw in a horizontal stitch between the normal, slanted heming stitches? Would that be enough to create holes in the fabric, or should I pull threads out parallel to the hem? Sorry for all the questions, but I've only ever read about openwork and have never done it. I'd like to learn more about lace. That seems to be the leading suggestion for dressing up my modest little ruff. Would a Cluny lace be accurate? I have some lace that was originally for another project that looks a lot like this: http://www.cheeptrims.com/store/item.asp?Category=3&SubCategoryID=64&GroupID=&SKU=9538%2D02 except the stitches are a lot tighter and there are strongly defined arches at what in this photo is the upper edge. It's also 3/8", not 1/2". It might be cotton, I'm not sure, and it's pretty stiff. I got it at Jo-Ann and I think they carry it often. Thanks for all the suggestions! I'm going to search online now for images of lace. Claudine (iggerent, but learning fast :) --- M Stewart wrote: > > Hey Claudine... just blanket stitch at the edge > will not prevent > fraying. A couple of quick and historically > accurate edge finishes for the > ruff include: > > A turned 1/4" hem with a hem stitch... > creates an open work > effect at the very edge /_/_/_/ You said you > didn't want to turn a > hem... but you'd be accurate in doing so, at least > with the openwork you > would. And then if you wanted to add some modest > lace you could. > > Also... you could roll the edge and whip it... I > imagine it would give you > a good upper edge for the serpentine folds of the > ruff... but I haven't > seen that done - on a ruff... > > Good luck. > Bridgette > > > > >I'm about to make a simple ruff, and for the ruffle > I'm not using the > >selvedge edge of the fabric (the fabric I have > doesn't have a > >proper-looking selvedge). Instead of turning a hem, > I'm looking for a more > >interesting way to finish the edge of the ruffle. > Can anyone recommend an > >edge finish that would be accurate for the last > quarter of the 1500s? This > >is an economy, working-man's ruff, so the finish > doesn't have to be fancy. > > > >I'm thinking of using a blanket stitch (sometimes > called a buttonhole > >stitch, see > www.heritageshoppe.com/heritage/stitches/blanketstitch.html) > > >using plain linen sewing thread, but I can't > document it's use for this > >application, or even for this century (I know next > to *nothing* about > >historic needlework!) > > Mari Stewart > Cornell University > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 17:16:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NMGPSd014477 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:16:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NM4HcP018983; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:04:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NM49WI022408; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:04:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web10407.mail.yahoo.com (web10407.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.130.99]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1NM3iWI022117 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:03:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claudine_on_the_net@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040223215701.37060.qmail@web10407.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [66.17.149.13] by web10407.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:57:01 PST Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 13:57:01 -0800 (PST) From: Claudine Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <158.2e580388.2d6bc60b@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Well duh, *that's* what I keep sandpaper in my sewing kit for! Thank's for setting me straight. Claudine (not trying to be pun-y, but happy to amuse) p.s. Does anyone know where I can find images of extant lace online? --- AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > OK...I can't resist any longer... > > > You sand it smooth, silly! > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 17:41:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NMf2Sd014558 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:41:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NMUHcP021226; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:30:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NMUCWI039771; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:30:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NMUAWI039737 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:30:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net (heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.189]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1NMFs515861 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:15:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-65.56.2.224.dial1.pittsburgh1.level3.net ([65.56.2.224] helo=HELENPINTO) by heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AvOMi-0000Km-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 14:15:52 -0800 Message-ID: <02c201c3fa5a$95b0f9f0$e0023841@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20040223130144.00dbb5a0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:13:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9efa1f823c5526b138a2069548a5524e369350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's from 1810, but here's a citation from the advertisement: "MALLISON'S SEAMAN'S FRIEND AND BATHER'S COMPANION": PICTORIAL ADVERTISING HANDBILL (1810) 2pp. 15"x 8_", headed by attractive wood engraving of a man wearing the patent, cork life-jacket. Including testimonials from evidence presented to the Parliamentary Committee on the petition of the inventor, William Henry Mallison. Handbill printed by Dean & Munday, Threadneedle St., London. *** PHOTO - see plate no. 1 Ł The handbill was for sale by Cavendish Auctions in the UK; it was sold last year, and they have no picture on their site. Solid block cork flotation devices were made mandatory in the US in 1852 by federal statute; in 1857, shoulder straps were added by a second statute. Hope this helps, -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 17:56:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NMuoSd014629 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:56:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NMracP023509; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:53:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NMrYWI055414; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:53:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NMrRWI055326 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:53:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AvOx2-0008dK-0W; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:53:24 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:52:20 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] GBACG Skate Party References: <40392FF8.8040903@misc.com> In-Reply-To: <40392FF8.8040903@misc.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: h-costume@net.indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's lovely to see some of these outfits in motion. And I really like that mid-size picture feature. Sometimes thumbnails are so small you can't tell whether you want to open them - this really helps. Jean Theresa Eacker wrote >This is a posting of my husband's photos from the same event Kendra >took shots of at Winter Wonderland in Palo Alto, Ca: > >http://www.misc.com/costumes/2004_skating/index.php > >We were lucky in that our event took place between rainy periods, with >even a little bit of sun. People brought goodies to snack on between >triple toe loops and hot cider for thawing out. A good time was had by >all!! > >Enjoy, > >Theresa and Brad Eacker > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 18:11:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NNBTSd014690 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:11:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NN6McP024785; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:06:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NN6DWI064940; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:06:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1NN65WI064808 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:06:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCl4T2CVUt7rQc6RIMuYL3vlfhsiMbo6pkw==">; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:05:15 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JN4Y3DE6; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 15:05:15 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:03:35 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Message-ID: <20040223.170336.-165058487.2.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4-10,12-25 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Actually, the lace you referenced in the other post would be a good choice. The mistakes in lace happen when you are trying to use very wide laces. Simple narrow laces (esp. like you have found) are generally a period design. And Cheeptrims is my fav online source, so you have already found that! 8-) Karen On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 10:03:30 -0800 Claudine writes: > Hi Karen, > > Thanks for you input. I thought about using a bit of lace, but I > understand > from earlier discussions that finding accurate lace can be > difficult. Are > there any websites you can recommend for seeing what accurate lace > should > look like? Are there any good sources online for buying lace? > > > Thanks, > Claudine ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 18:20:26 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NNKPSd014728 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:20:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NNJicP025979; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:19:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NNJfWI074439; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:19:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NNJZWI074376 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:19:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AvOx2-0008dK-0W; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:53:24 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:52:20 +0000 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] GBACG Skate Party References: <40392FF8.8040903@misc.com> In-Reply-To: <40392FF8.8040903@misc.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-U (<$wEBjsSJlUex9q9c790bp3afMD>) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: h-costume@net.indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO It's lovely to see some of these outfits in motion. And I really like that mid-size picture feature. Sometimes thumbnails are so small you can't tell whether you want to open them - this really helps. Jean Theresa Eacker wrote >This is a posting of my husband's photos from the same event Kendra >took shots of at Winter Wonderland in Palo Alto, Ca: > >http://www.misc.com/costumes/2004_skating/index.php > >We were lucky in that our event took place between rainy periods, with >even a little bit of sun. People brought goodies to snack on between >triple toe loops and hot cider for thawing out. A good time was had by >all!! > >Enjoy, > >Theresa and Brad Eacker > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 18:37:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1NNbnSd014797 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:37:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NNZYcP027380; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:35:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NNZSWI084627; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:35:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1NNZQWI084591 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:35:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.83.37] (helo=dan) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AvIyR-0003wS-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:30:28 +0000 Message-ID: <008301c3fa2a$98fd1880$25538151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] 18th century and new technology in exhibition Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 16:32:15 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ann wrote on Monday, February 23, 2004 3:50 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] 18th century and new technology in exhibition > So, can you tell us more about the dress itself? Robe a la Francaise/sack-back style dress of taffeta silk, woven in Spitalfields c 1772. in a very dimly lit display cabinet - so the picture on the website is probably clearer than seeing it in real life, sleeves still cut so the pattern goes round rather than up and down, which perhaps would have made me date it a trifle earlier. It looked to me as if it was intended to be worn with hip pads rather than paniers- the rear end protrudes a little, but much flatter fronted than the hoop skirt you can see on the actress on the web site. There is not huge amounts of fabric in it- an economical sack-back... and the decoration is uninspired by comparison with the Rococo high spots we associate with Boucher, 30 or so years earlier. But it is definitely not charmeuse/china silk satin! best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 19:28:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O0SMSd014951 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:28:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O0NscP001212; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:23:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O0NqWI013791; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:23:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m02.mx.aol.com (imo-m02.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O0NkWI013721 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:23:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.53.5f660ce (3932) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:18:32 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <53.5f660ce.2d6bf257@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:18:31 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Exciting news To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/23/2004 6:17:15 PM Central Standard Time, penny@costumegallery.com writes: So you lucky ladies in England, will you please be a good Mom for Patrick come Sept. It will be a three years assignment. LOL! Penny E. Ladnier I'm new to the list, but wanted to say *Congratulations!!!* That's just wonderful! -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 19:28:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O0SXSd014954 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:28:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O0FIcP000436; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:15:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O0F6WI009069; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:15:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O0F3WI008964 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 17:15:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7721BA0098; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:14:42 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A76EE70244; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:14:38 -0600 Message-ID: <008701c3fa6b$12f6e180$0300a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:13:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Exciting news X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1O0SXSd014954 Status: RO Some of you may recall me talking about my son Patrick who has been doing theater tech work throughout high school. Today, Patrick was accepted into the Honors Bachelor's program at the Liverpool Institute of the Performing Arts, in England, for Technology of Theater and Performance. This is one of the best colleges for Patrick's specialty. They have an 85% placement rate for their graduates in the industry. That was such a higher percentage than any college that we checked out in the U.S. This college was founded by Paul McCartney from the Beatles in 1996. He wanted to provide a place to educate people about the industry; to give them a firm legal background; and provide them good contacts for employment in the industry. So you lucky ladies in England, will you please be a good Mom for Patrick come Sept. It will be a three years assignment. LOL! Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 20:49:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O1nISd015322 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:49:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O1mXcP007550; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:48:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O1mTWI055606; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:48:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m25.mx.aol.com (imo-m25.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.6]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O1SmWI046081 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:28:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m25.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.1ec.19aca062 (3657) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:22:08 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <1ec.19aca062.2d6c0140@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:22:08 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] 18th century and new technology in exhibition To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thanks for that info. No clue as to who owned/wore it? Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 21:28:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O2SKSd015438 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:28:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O2QPcP009549; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:26:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O2QJWI072816; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:26:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O2QHWI072783 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:26:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m13.in-tch.com [216.166.191.13]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1O23ds19520 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:03:40 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <403AB705.1030001@in-tch.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:29:25 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Exciting news References: <008701c3fa6b$12f6e180$0300a8c0@MOM> In-Reply-To: <008701c3fa6b$12f6e180$0300a8c0@MOM> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Oh, wow, Penny! That's so cool! Congrats to Patrick! --sue Penny Ladnier wrote: > Some of you may recall me talking about my son Patrick who has been > doing theater tech work throughout high school. Today, Patrick was > accepted into the Honors Bachelor's program at the Liverpool > Institute of the Performing Arts, in England, for Technology of > Theater and Performance. This is one of the best colleges for > Patrick's specialty. They have an 85% placement rate for their > graduates in the industry. That was such a higher percentage than > any college that we checked out in the U.S. > > This college was founded by Paul McCartney from the Beatles in 1996. > He wanted to provide a place to educate people about the industry; to > give them a firm legal background; and provide them good contacts for > employment in the industry. > > So you lucky ladies in England, will you please be a good Mom for > Patrick come Sept. It will be a three years assignment. LOL! > > Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom > www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing > list h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 21:50:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O2oVSd015534 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:50:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O2mVcP010675; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:48:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O2mTWI082169; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:48:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web12506.mail.yahoo.com (web12506.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.173.198]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1O2l1WI081591 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 19:47:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sorepaws@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040224024021.60977.qmail@web12506.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.43.239.90] by web12506.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:40:21 PST Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:40:21 -0800 (PST) From: Lil Sorepaws To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200402240227.i1O2QkWK073039@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] White Wool and Red Wine .. HELP!! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, trying to help out a friend .. she got red wine on a white wool coat .. especially soaked into the fringes .. she'd like to try to clean it herself before a dry-cleaner ends up setting the stain - any suggestions from you ladies (and gentlemen) who deal with wool? I am violently allergic so I never bothered to learn to clean it since I cannot wear it ... ANy advice is much appreciated! Thanks! - Lil the lethargic lurker ;) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 22:33:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O3XvSd015698 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:33:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O3UdcP013319; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:30:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O3UYWI000250; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:30:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback-mx3.atl.registeredsite.com (nobody@fallback-mx3.atl.registeredsite.com [64.224.219.97]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O3UWWI000238 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 20:30:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from athurman@cybergal.com) Received: from mail4.atl.registeredsite.com (mail4.atl.registeredsite.com [64.224.219.78]) by fallback-mx3.atl.registeredsite.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1O3UQSF001487 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:30:27 -0500 Received: from libra.hosting4u.net (libra.hosting4u.net [209.35.191.113]) by mail4.atl.registeredsite.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1O4UHS4013196 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:30:19 -0500 Received: from ctrlalt ([69.140.34.246]) by libra.hosting4u.net ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:30:23 -0600 From: "A.Thurman" To: Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:30:19 -0500 Message-ID: <01b301c3fa86$87cd5b90$336f6f6f@systemsfirm.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Rcpt-To: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: sewing regular clothes X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I agree with most of what is said below. Though lately most of my sewing energies are devoted to historical or other special occasion/invented in my head garments, the poor quality of MUCH of what I see in stores (not just Wal-Mart, but even fairly "upscale" retailers are guilty) makes me wish I had more time to make "everyday" clothing. Jeans, t-shirts and undies are ok, but to get a really well made suit, or tailored work pants, in anything resembling a natural fiber and with good fit you practically HAVE to do it yourself. Just my $.02. Allison T. Message: 15 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:58:25 -0800 From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here/regular clothes To: Historical Costume Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20040223075318.00b3bcf8@mail.katiesorchids.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed I agree about the economics, but must add that, for me, there are three reasons that override economics: 1. If you cannot find off-the-rack that fits properly, it doesn't matter how cheap it is (assuming good fit is important), and 2. If you cannot find off-the-rack that you find attractive, the only way to get clothes that *you* think looks good on you is to sew it yourself,and 3. If you have the time and enjoy sewing. Katie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 23:55:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O4tDSd015915 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:55:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O4sQcP018103; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:54:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O4sMWI035362; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:54:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.240]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O4sGWI035329 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:54:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claning@igc.org) Received: from smtp6.mindspring.com (smtp6.mindspring.com [207.69.200.110]) by fallback01.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1O4nMD10533 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:49:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from 209-165-42-219.jps.net ([209.165.42.219] helo=[209.165.47.25]) by smtp6.mindspring.com with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AvUVS-0004p5-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:49:19 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: claning@pop.igc.org Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <403A4B59.2060704@reddawn.net> References: <000001c3fa22$0b22d4d0$0201a8c0@kimathlon> <403A4B59.2060704@reddawn.net> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:01:55 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Chris Laning Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: retayne X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 12:50 PM -0600 2/23/04, Dawn wrote: >Where does one get 'Retayne'? In the U.S. at least, Rit Dye company has packaged it up in packets containing about 2 Tablespoons (enough for 1 laundry load) and sells it for something like $3.50 per packet -- unfortunately I can't remember their brand name for it at the moment. (It's not "Run-Away," that's something different.) The overpriced version is better than nothing, and it's available this way in lots of fabric stores, but if you do much dyeing it's well worth searching out a better deal on price. Dharma Trading Co. carries both the brand-name Retayne and their own "house brand" which is considerably cheaper -- 4 ounces for less than the price of one package of the Rit version. (All the usual disclaimers apply -- no affiliation with Dharma, test on a scrap of fabric first, et cetera.) -- _________________________________________________________ O Chris Laning | + Davis, California _________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Feb 23 23:59:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O4xASd015919 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:59:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O4wWcP018323; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:58:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O4wWWI036859; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:58:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rastaban.dandy.net (rastaban.dandy.net [209.128.224.29]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O4wTWJ036826 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:58:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mikes@dandy.net) Received: from dandy.net (acty5089.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.250.89]) by rastaban.dandy.net (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i1O506tB004098 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:00:06 -0500 Message-ID: <403AD9F1.8070300@dandy.net> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:58:25 -0500 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs References: <4.3.1.2.20040223130144.00dbb5a0@mail.frys.com> <02c201c3fa5a$95b0f9f0$e0023841@HELENPINTO> In-Reply-To: <02c201c3fa5a$95b0f9f0$e0023841@HELENPINTO> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi. I was just in the Franklin Museum in Philadelphia with my boys today. One of their exhibits showcases the "inventions" created by Franklin. Along with the stove bearing his name, and the bifocal glasses is an exhibit detailing the swim fins, hand fins and cork filled vest that he purportedly created for himself. I didn't get a date, but I seem to remember that he had them as a young man (perhaps in the 1730s/40s). Of course, in a museum bearing his name, he couldn't very well come out looking less than an 18th Cent. DaVinci, though, so I don't know the veracity of the claims. I know that some of his science, especially the electrical stuff, was founded on earlier works of the Royal Society and their friends throughout Europe. Hopefully this is something that you can use... Cheers, Mike T. Helen Pinto wrote: >It's from 1810, but here's a citation from the advertisement: > > "MALLISON'S SEAMAN'S FRIEND AND BATHER'S COMPANION": PICTORIAL >ADVERTISING HANDBILL (1810) 2pp. 15"x 8_", headed by attractive wood >engraving of a man wearing the patent, cork life-jacket. Including >testimonials from evidence presented to the Parliamentary Committee on the >petition of the inventor, William Henry Mallison. Handbill printed by Dean & >Munday, Threadneedle St., London. *** PHOTO - see plate no. 1 Ł > > >The handbill was for sale by Cavendish Auctions in the UK; it was sold last >year, and they have no picture on their site. > >Solid block cork flotation devices were made mandatory in the US in 1852 >by federal statute; in 1857, shoulder straps were added by a second statute. > >Hope this helps, > > -Helen/Aidan > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 00:50:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O5oPSd016061 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:50:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O5mVcP021125; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:48:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O5mTWI056580; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:48:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O5daWI052868 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 22:39:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Received: from mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net (mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.48]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1O5S5503883 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:28:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from 209-165-56-149.jps.net ([209.165.56.149] helo=pavilion) by mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AvV6y-0001oQ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:28:05 -0800 Message-ID: <002401c3fa98$76403c00$9538a5d1@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008701c3fa6b$12f6e180$0300a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Exciting news Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 21:38:40 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'll bet the whole family's excited!!! Congrats to Patrick, I'll start looking for his name on the film credits in 3.5 years no doubt. I always stay for those. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 4:13 PM Subject: [h-cost] Exciting news Some of you may recall me talking about my son Patrick who has been doing theater tech work throughout high school. Today, Patrick was accepted into the Honors Bachelor's program at the Liverpool Institute of the Performing Arts, in England, for Technology of Theater and Performance. This is one of the best colleges for Patrick's specialty. They have an 85% placement rate for their graduates in the industry. That was such a higher percentage than any college that we checked out in the U.S. This college was founded by Paul McCartney from the Beatles in 1996. He wanted to provide a place to educate people about the industry; to give them a firm legal background; and provide them good contacts for employment in the industry. So you lucky ladies in England, will you please be a good Mom for Patrick come Sept. It will be a three years assignment. LOL! Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 01:51:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O6pnSd016252 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 01:51:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O6mdcP023299; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:48:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O6mXMi078311; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:48:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O6mUMi078273 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2004 23:48:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3AAE330084; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:48:10 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3A7D8100B8; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:48:07 -0600 Message-ID: <002401c3faa2$0b9584a0$0300a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008701c3fa6b$12f6e180$0300a8c0@MOM> <002401c3fa98$76403c00$9538a5d1@pavilion> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Exciting news Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 01:47:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you all for the congrads. Patrick is our first to be leaving home to go to college. It makes me a little tearful but I know it is the best college for him. Lisa, you might see Pat's name in the credits before 3.5 years. Last summer he worked as a production asst. for a short film called Run-on Sentence. The film was made for competition and film festivals. So maybe you will see the film on HBO one day. We saw the premiere of the film at a movie house in Richmond just before Thanksgiving. I always knew I would see his name on the big screen one day, but I didn't expect it to be when he was a senior in high school. I cried buckets when I saw his name in the credits. Last week Pat worked lighting for a concert for the rock band Fighting Gravity. The club where the band performed offered him a sound engineering job. He also worked last week as a sound engineer for a performance of the Latin Ballet of Virginia. They also offered him a job too. He has been hired by a touring lighting company called Lite Tek. In two weeks, Pat will be working lighting at the National Cheerleading Competition in Jacksonville, Florida for a week. So if you happen to be there go by and say hi to Pat. Lite Tek is taking him touring with them all summer. They will be all over the U.S. Hopefully Pat will have socked away a lot of money for college. So far Pat has 25 plays, 17 concerts, 3 films, and numerous dance, choral, & cheerleading events under his belt. Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 02:33:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1O7X1Sd008345 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 02:33:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O7WLcP024710; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:32:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O7WILx092661; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:32:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo2.socket.net (mo2.socket.net [216.106.88.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1O7WHLx092651 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 00:32:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo2.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78B5A1D675 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 01:13:09 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p008.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.10]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 33DFED439 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 01:13:08 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: sewing regular clothes Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 01:13:23 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <01b301c3fa86$87cd5b90$336f6f6f@systemsfirm.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On a limited budget and a woman of ample size, It is hard to find decent clothes that don't look like you are going to a Luau or worse, the stretch knit polyester suits (I did not like the 70's style when I lived through it and I still don't like them, give me 1940's}. My hips are the problem but when I try on a dress listed for my size the armhole dips low, about 3 1/2" to low. I find myself having to make my outfits instead of being able to buy off the rack. Positive side is that I like to design and I get to wear a one of a kind outfit but its finding the time. De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of A.Thurman Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 9:30 PM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Re: sewing regular clothes I agree with most of what is said below. Though lately most of my sewing energies are devoted to historical or other special occasion/invented in my head garments, the poor quality of MUCH of what I see in stores (not just Wal-Mart, but even fairly "upscale" retailers are guilty) makes me wish I had more time to make "everyday" clothing. Jeans, t-shirts and undies are ok, but to get a really well made suit, or tailored work pants, in anything resembling a natural fiber and with good fit you practically HAVE to do it yourself. Just my $.02. Allison T. Message: 15 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2004 07:58:25 -0800 From: Katie Pleasance Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here/regular clothes To: Historical Costume Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20040223075318.00b3bcf8@mail.katiesorchids.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed I agree about the economics, but must add that, for me, there are three reasons that override economics: 1. If you cannot find off-the-rack that fits properly, it doesn't matter how cheap it is (assuming good fit is important), and 2. If you cannot find off-the-rack that you find attractive, the only way to get clothes that *you* think looks good on you is to sew it yourself,and 3. If you have the time and enjoy sewing. Katie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 06:42:33 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OBgWSd010883 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:42:33 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OBeXcP002615; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:40:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OBeQLx072986; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:40:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from colossus.systems.pipex.net (colossus.systems.pipex.net [62.241.160.73]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OBeNLx072960 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:40:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from linda.walton@dsl.pipex.com) Received: from bella (81-86-114-151.dsl.pipex.com [81.86.114.151]) by colossus.systems.pipex.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 5B6F21C0033A for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 11:40:19 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <004c01c3faca$f1aeac00$97725651@bella> From: "Linda Walton" To: References: <4.3.1.2.20040223130144.00dbb5a0@mail.frys.com><02c201c3fa5a$95b0f9f0$e0023841@HELENPINTO> <403AD9F1.8070300@dandy.net> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 11:40:03 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO For those who are interested in this period, here is a recently-recognised portrait of Catherine Parr, (the wife who survived Henry VIII):- http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/reports/arts/parr_20040224.shtml destined for the Queens' Chamber at Hever Castle. Linda Walton. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 06:59:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OBxKSd011057 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:59:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OBwecP003161; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:58:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OBwdLx078818; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:58:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.suscom.net (smtp.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OBwbLx078811 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 04:58:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from goofy1@suscom.net) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 781551B44F0 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:54:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.suscom.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (userweb.suscom.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with SMTP id 12930-08 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:54:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id F1DC91B44F4 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:54:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0e3301c3facd$87351af0$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008701c3fa6b$12f6e180$0300a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Exciting news Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:58:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at suscom.net Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 7:13 PM Subject: [h-cost] Exciting news Some of you may recall me talking about my son Patrick who has been doing theater tech work throughout high school. Today, Patrick was accepted into the Honors Bachelor's program at the Liverpool Institute of the Performing Arts, in England, for Technology of Theater and Performance. This is one of the best colleges for Patrick's specialty. They have an 85% placement rate for their graduates in the industry. That was such a higher percentage than any college that we checked out in the U.S. This college was founded by Paul McCartney from the Beatles in 1996. He wanted to provide a place to educate people about the industry; to give them a firm legal background; and provide them good contacts for employment in the industry. So you lucky ladies in England, will you please be a good Mom for Patrick come Sept. It will be a three years assignment. LOL! Congratulations to Patrick! Wow! Dianne Penny E. Ladnier _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 07:17:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OCHwSd011193 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:17:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OCEocP003990; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:14:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OCElLx083842; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:14:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.46.43]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OCEjLx083808 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 05:14:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from triade@kabelfoon.nl) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-cb01-0512.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.82.1]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4091419FC88 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:41:15 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <403B385D.5020105@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:41:17 +0100 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here References: <1c3.156fecaf.2d6b5a8d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I almost missed this thread. I am Deredere and am 27 years old. I live in the Netherlands. I am a memder of the SCA and was very interested in 15 and 16th century costumes. But I am having a bit of a burnout. Getting tired of researhing everything, than making it and then realize that it is still not perfectly correkt. Now I am more interested in fantasy costumes and 18th and 19th century costumes. Planning to make 18th century panniers that I can fold so I will fit in a car and small toilets :-) . The page is in Dutch but has some nice pictures.. http://www.deredere.dds.nl/Jurksupport/Jurksupport.html Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 08:38:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ODcoSd012469 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:38:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ODc2cP006797; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:38:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ODbwLx012686; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:37:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m27.mx.aol.com (imo-m27.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ODbuLx012639 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:37:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m27.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.28.44071ec6 (18251) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:32:25 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <28.44071ec6.2d6cac68@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:32:24 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] White Wool and Red Wine .. HELP!! To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO 1--Good dry cleaners are especially equipped to deal with stains, if they know about them. 2--If she wants to treat it herself, I have sometimes had good luck with the Carbona formula for red wine stains. But if it is really soaked in, she may be out of luck. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 08:46:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ODkGSd012499 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:46:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ODiOcP007039; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:44:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ODiMLx015114; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:44:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d22.mx.aol.com (imo-d22.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.208]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ODiKLx015077 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 06:44:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.199.2649e766 (18251) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:38:55 -0500 (EST) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <199.2649e766.2d6cadef@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:38:55 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: sewing regular clothes To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5002 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/23/2004 10:31:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, athurman@cybergal.com writes: or tailored work pants, in anything resembling a natural fiber and with good fit you practically HAVE to do it yourself. I have actually had very good luck the last couple of years (since I lost weight and got down to a size 14) finding moderately priced lined wool slacks--no way I would attempt to make those myself anymore, with fly front, applied waistband, lining, and all. But I have several large department stores to choose from in this area--metropolitan Washington. And I am satisfied with the workmanship. Almost bought some wool skirts from a catalogue this fall, but then found what I needed at a thrift store--another good source for quality made garments. I also lucked out and found a lined silk skirt last spring at another thrift store. As I am very "hippy," I prefer skirts with some fullness. They are getting hard to find--everything is either straight or a floaty print--so I may eventually have to resort to making some again. Haven't bought a suit in a long time, as I hardly ever wear one anymore. The last two I bought were a Pendleton in San Francisco and moderate sportswear separates (the Pendleton was separates, too, as I am always bigger at bottom than top, even at my best). Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 09:20:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OEKFSd012624 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:20:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OEH9cP008585; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:17:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OEH7Lx027363; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:17:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from equinox.shaysnet.com ([12.178.72.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OEH4Lx027340 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:17:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ceu@equinox.shaysnet.com) Received: (from ceu@localhost) by equinox.shaysnet.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) id i1OEIXAt002007; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:18:33 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:18:31 -0500 (EST) From: Catherine Ussailis Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: sewing regular clothes To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <199.2649e766.2d6cadef@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Almost bought some wool skirts from a catalogue this fall, but then found > what I needed at a thrift store--another good source for quality made garments. > I also lucked out and found a lined silk skirt last spring at another thrift > store. As I am very "hippy," I prefer skirts with some fullness. They are > getting hard to find--everything is either straight or a floaty print--so I may > eventually have to resort to making some again. > > > Ann Wass > Delurking... I am fairly curvy - small waist, wider hips - and have found that those dratted, off the rack skirts NEVER fit properly. Plus, the straight ones never look good, so I've become a lover of fuller skirts myself. I've found that a half-circle skirt is the solution to my problems. I'm not a great seamstress (and can only hope to accomplish a fraction of what you all have made in terms of costumes!) but can whip up one of these skirts in two or three hours. I usually use an invisible zipper and a hook and eye arrangement for the waistband. The whole affair is much cheaper in the longrun as it fits and I get lots of swishy fabric at the hem. Now, if only I could do a really neat embroidered border at the hem... By the way, I'm trying to find a petticoat pattern to go with my half-circle skirts. I sort of thought I would be able to use something from the 1890's or so, but haven't been able to really find something that doesn't involve LOTS of ruffles. It would be no problem to make my own pattern, I'm just not sure about how to go about it. I guess I need to find out more about petticoats in general. Any suggestions? Am particularly interested in the types of fabrics used. What about static cling? And what's the difference between a slip and petticoat anyway? Hopelessly ignorant of historic fashion, Kate _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 09:39:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OEcxSd012684 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:38:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OEXTcP009290; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:33:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OEXRLx034892; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:33:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OEXOLx034836 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:33:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m136.in-tch.com [216.166.191.136]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1OEAks26077 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:10:47 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <403B6171.2050903@in-tch.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:36:33 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr References: <4.3.1.2.20040223130144.00dbb5a0@mail.frys.com><02c201c3fa5a$95b0f9f0$e0023841@HELENPINTO> <403AD9F1.8070300@dandy.net> <004c01c3faca$f1aeac00$97725651@bella> In-Reply-To: <004c01c3faca$f1aeac00$97725651@bella> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ooh, thanks! I like the deep red of her gown. The folded-back lining of her oversleeves looks to be some sort of golden-colored fur. What kind of fur would that likely be? --sue Linda Walton wrote: > For those who are interested in this period, here is a recently-recognised > portrait of Catherine Parr, (the wife who survived Henry VIII):- > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/reports/arts/parr_20040224.shtml > destined for the Queens' Chamber at Hever Castle. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 09:54:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OEsLSd012732 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:54:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OErOcP010482; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:53:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OErELx043912; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:53:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from a34-mta02.direcway.com (a34-mta02.direcpc.com [66.82.4.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OErDLx043858 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:53:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bettina.anderson@direcway.com) Received: from phoenix (dpclt032001.direcpc.com [64.157.32.1]) by a34-mta02.direcway.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with SMTP id <0HTL001Z4D7P1A@a34-mta02.direcway.com> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:53:02 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:52:39 -0500 From: Bettina Anderson To: h-costume@net.indra.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I know this was a thread from last weekend, but I just got around to my e-mail today. What I use are two (so far) standard office file cabinets from WalMart or where ever (~$15-20each). I laid an 8ft piece of solid butcherblock across it (could be laminate countertop, from the homecenter) and that's my worktable. The patterns get filed in brown kraft envelopes (after they have been used) which get labeled with the pattern info and a copy of the pattern envelope on the outside. The envelope holds all the bits, so I don't have to try to fold everything back into the little pattern envelope. Muslins can be filed right with the pattern, in a regular hanging folder. Bettina _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 09:54:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OEsgSd012736 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:54:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OErtcP010519; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:53:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OErsLx044232; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:53:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from a34-mta02.direcway.com (a34-mta02.direcpc.com [66.82.4.91]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OErKLx043919 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:53:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from bettina.anderson@direcway.com) Received: from phoenix (dpclt032001.direcpc.com [64.157.32.1]) by a34-mta02.direcway.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with SMTP id <0HTL001Z4D7P1A@a34-mta02.direcway.com> for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:53:09 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:52:50 -0500 From: Bettina Anderson To: h-costume@net.indra.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If you can afford them -file cabinets are the best by far. Sturdy, durable, protective storage with lots of room and holds almost any size. You don't need hanging folders but some sort of hanging (or fixed) divider will make it easier to organize - by company, envelope size, type, etc. Also manila envelopes for those standard company size ones that will never fit back into the original envelope - staple or paper clip the orginal envelope to the front. You can also attach fabric samples and photos of the finished project if you want. The manila envelopes can also be used for patterns you drafted yourself, attach a copy of the original source picture to the front and put your research notes in with and you've got a pretty complette record of the project all in one spot. Again, add a phot of the finished outfit and you'll have a total history. Do I feel silly, now that I posted my suggestion, I come across this e-mail....well, I second what they suggested! Bettina _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 09:55:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OEtSSd012740 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:55:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OEsicP010610; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:54:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OEsfLx044634; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:54:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web14009.mail.yahoo.com (web14009.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1OEsdLx044619 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:54:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ladyforbeys@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040224145439.5900.qmail@web14009.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [24.242.152.154] by web14009.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:54:39 GMT Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:54:39 +0000 (GMT) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Catalina=20Saravia=20Quicedo?= Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <403B6171.2050903@in-tch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Have they taken this link down? > Linda Walton wrote: > > > For those who are interested in this period, here > is a recently-recognised > > portrait of Catherine Parr, (the wife who survived > Henry VIII):- > > > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/reports/arts/parr_20040224.shtml > > destined for the Queens' Chamber at Hever Castle. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ===== Seńora Catalina Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com/download/index.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 10:10:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OFAASd012823 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:10:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OF8HcP011336; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:08:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OF8ELx051213; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:08:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m25.mx.aol.com (imo-m25.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.6]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OF8BLx051146 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:08:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-m25.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.141.22d77ead (18403) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:57:41 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <141.22d77ead.2d6cc065@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:57:41 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/24/2004 8:54:30 AM Central Standard Time, bettina.anderson@direcway.com writes: Also manila envelopes for those standard company size ones that will never fit back into the original envelope - staple or paper clip the orginal envelope to the front. You can also attach fabric samples and photos of the finished project if you want. The manila envelopes can also be used for patterns you drafted yourself, attach a copy of the original source picture to the front and put your research notes in with and you've got a pretty complette record of the project all in one spot. Again, add a phot of the finished outfit and you'll have a total history. Actually, I did the manila envelope thing for a while, and discovered that even my envelopes were getting quite ragged and torn on the patterns that I used frequently. At that point, I switched to economy/gallon sized ziplock bags. They keep the whole thing completely protected, even from when my 3 year old nephew throws a cup of apple juice across my work area (has happened TWICE!) and I can see what pattern it is without having to staple anything to the front. -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 10:16:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OFGKSd012842 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:16:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFD0cP011715; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:13:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFCxLx053930; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:12:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFCvLx053885 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:12:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m136.in-tch.com [216.166.191.136]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1OEoJs13521 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:50:19 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <403B6AB6.1050509@in-tch.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:16:06 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr References: <20040224145439.5900.qmail@web14009.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20040224145439.5900.qmail@web14009.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Don't think so. I tried it successfully within the past hour. --sue Catalina Saravia Quicedo wrote: > Have they taken this link down? > > >>Linda Walton wrote: >> >> >>>For those who are interested in this period, here >> >>is a recently-recognised >> >>>portrait of Catherine Parr, (the wife who survived >> >>Henry VIII):- >> > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/reports/arts/parr_20040224.shtml > >>>destined for the Queens' Chamber at Hever Castle. >>> >> >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > ===== > Seńora Catalina > Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" > your friends today! Download Messenger Now > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com/download/index.html > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 10:18:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OFI1Sd012851 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:18:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFG0cP011938; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:16:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFFqLx055677; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:15:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d21.mx.aol.com (imo-d21.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.207]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFFkLx055602 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:15:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-d21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.6a.3bf9f535 (18403) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:05:16 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <6a.3bf9f535.2d6cc22c@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:05:16 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/24/2004 5:42:18 AM Central Standard Time, linda.walton@dsl.pipex.com writes: For those who are interested in this period, here is a recently-recognised portrait of Catherine Parr, (the wife who survived Henry VIII):- http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/reports/arts/parr_20040224.shtml destined for the Queens' Chamber at Hever Castle. Linda Walton. Now, that is interesting. I love it when they find a new portrait! I wish the site discussed their process in identifying the sitter, though. The headdress that she is wearing is more the style of the 15-teens and 1520's, which would have made Catherine Parr too young to be the sitter. The style of the dress is also earlier than the portrait date would have to be - I think the sitter looks at least 20-something? But obviously they must have had compelling reasons for identifying it as Parr. -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 10:18:27 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OFIRSd012854 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:18:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFHkcP012088; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:17:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFHjLx056807; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:17:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.pacifier.net (smtp1.pacifier.net [64.255.237.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFHOLx056602 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:17:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.132.99]) by smtp1.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A30FF6FE29 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:17:23 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:17:13 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Message-ID: <403AFA79.11849.1FC617E1@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <403B6171.2050903@in-tch.com> References: <004c01c3faca$f1aeac00$97725651@bella> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Ooh, thanks! > I like the deep red of her gown. The folded-back lining of her > oversleeves looks to be some sort of golden-colored fur. What kind of > fur would that likely be? --sue There is such a heavy coating of varnish on this that I don't believe I'd trust the color of the fur. Look at the "white" part of the gable. It's almost as yellow. So if this portrait were cleaned of its varnish it might be a grey fur. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 10:19:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OFJdSd012861 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:19:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFHbcP012070; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:17:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFHZLx056703; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:17:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.pacifier.net (smtp1.pacifier.net [64.255.237.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFHQLx056613 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:17:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.132.99]) by smtp1.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD7B36FE25 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:17:24 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:17:14 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Message-ID: <403AFA7A.1105.1FC6191A@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <004c01c3faca$f1aeac00$97725651@bella> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > For those who are interested in this period, here is a > recently-recognised portrait of Catherine Parr, (the wife who survived > Henry VIII):- > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/reports/arts/parr_20040224.shtml > destined for the Queens' Chamber at Hever Castle. That's a very interesting portrait. Another gable to add to my collection. I wonder how they decided who it is. They recently decided that a picture which I'd always been told was of Jane Grey was actually of Kat Parr by identifying the dress and the distinctive jewels from an inventory. The jewels and dress in this one aren't so distinctive. I was actually disappointed by some of the paintings at Hever. Some seemed to be poor obviously later copies of the people. I hope this one is of better calibre. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 10:25:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OFPPSd012889 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:25:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFIPcP012161; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:18:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OFILLx057171; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:18:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1OFIELx057021 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:18:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/OqpdGMm6TWhQd3B2w6taTkU=">; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:18:01 PST Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JN6QQKY4; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:18:01 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 07:09:50 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] White Wool and Red Wine .. HELP!! Message-ID: <20040224.071720.1740.1.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-5,7-27 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Tried soaking the stain in Oxyclean? As a sister highly-allergic-to-wool-type myself, I haven't tried this, but some of my friends have, and it seemed to work just fine. Arlys On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:40:21 -0800 (PST) Lil Sorepaws writes: > > Hi, trying to help out a friend .. she got red wine on a white wool > coat > .. especially soaked into the fringes .. she'd like to try to clean > it > herself before a dry-cleaner ends up setting the stain - any > suggestions > from you ladies (and gentlemen) who deal with wool? I am violently > allergic so I never bothered to learn to clean it since I cannot > wear it > ... ANy advice is much appreciated! > > Thanks! > > - Lil the lethargic lurker ;) > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 11:03:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OG3VSd013032 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 11:03:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OG2jcP016065; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:02:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OG2cLx083952; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:02:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail.gmx.net (pop.gmx.net [213.165.64.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1OG2aLx083865 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:02:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cassandra@greer.de) Received: (qmail 18871 invoked by uid 65534); 24 Feb 2004 15:55:51 -0000 Received: from pD9E8EFC4.dip.t-dialin.net (EHLO cassandr6a9wj0) (217.232.239.196) by mail.gmx.net (mp017) with SMTP; 24 Feb 2004 16:55:51 +0100 X-Authenticated: #13649924 From: "Cassandra Greer" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] who is here Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:10:20 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <403B385D.5020105@kabelfoon.nl> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I almost missed this thread. oh me too! My name is Cassandra and I am 37 years old. I'm an American living in Munich, Germany working as a translator and technical writer. I've been here this time round for 7.5 years. I have been sewing since I was 12. My mom always sewed and she used to make me yummy things and then I got started making my own school clothes because I never found what I really liked though when I did I couldn't afford it. I used to be a member of the SCA but life got a hold of me and I've let my membership lapse. My main interest was in garb (actually still is) of various centuries but meeting my husband and starting up a business has kept me from doing much for the past year and half - the last major thing I did was my first attempt at late 16th century - a dress I wore to Deredere's wedding. I have all sorts of projects in my head but not enough umpf to get them done at the moment - plus within the next few weeks a baby boy will invade my life and demand my attention :))) It might be good though - little kiddy clothes are faster to make than big people clothes most of the time :))) I wish I had the space and talent Deredere has :)))) Cass :) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 11:07:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OG7NSd013056 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 11:07:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OG5FcP016300; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:05:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OG5CLx085583; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:05:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu [132.236.56.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OG5ALx085556 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:05:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ms154@cornell.edu) Received: from arkham.cornell.edu (vcs077.vet.cornell.edu [128.253.111.77]) by postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i1OESI2Y009825 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:28:18 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.2.1.1.2.20040224091822.01955d98@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: ms154@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.1 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 09:28:22 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: M Stewart Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? In-Reply-To: <20040223212646.54720.qmail@web10406.mail.yahoo.com> References: <5.2.1.1.2.20040223082833.00bbbea8@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi there... sorry for the lousy ASCII art... didn't mean to confuse things. I'll try my best to explain ... Something you might want to look for is a reference to "hemstitch" or "Venetian hemstitch" or "Open hemstitch" ok... I'll give this a whirl... (20 minutes later... ) ok that didn't work... try this http://www.embroideryden.com.au/embroidery_stitch_guide.htm scroll down to "hemstitch" best of luck. Bridgette - who just can't seem to describe this stitch ; > >I like the idea of a turned hem with a bit of >openwork, but I don't understand how I would >accomplish that. When I do a hem I end up with little >stitches on the outside of the garment that are >basically perpendicular the the hem edge; I don't see >how that converts to openwork. Bridgette, from your >ASCII drawing, are you saying that I should throw in a >horizontal stitch between the normal, slanted heming >stitches? Would that be enough to create holes in the >fabric, or should I pull threads out parallel to the >hem? Sorry for all the questions, but I've only ever >read about openwork and have never done it. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 12:17:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OHHNSd013384 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:17:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OHDRcP023254; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:13:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OHDLLx033618; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:13:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from badger.uvm.edu (badger-ssl.uvm.edu [132.198.101.194]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OHDJLx033588 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:13:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hope.greenberg@uvm.edu) Received: from uvm.edu (ip095111.uvm.edu [132.198.95.111]) by badger.uvm.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OH4dI1017091 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:04:39 -0500 Message-ID: <403B8428.8070302@uvm.edu> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:04:40 -0500 From: Hope Greenberg User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr References: <4.3.1.2.20040223130144.00dbb5a0@mail.frys.com><02c201c3fa5a$95b0f9f0$e0023841@HELENPINTO> <403AD9F1.8070300@dandy.net> <004c01c3faca$f1aeac00$97725651@bella> <403B6171.2050903@in-tch.com> In-Reply-To: <403B6171.2050903@in-tch.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This portrait seems similar to the one at Lambeth (http://tudorhistory.org/parr/otherparr.jpg). Does anyone have info on the provenance of either one? Is one a copy? - Hope > Linda Walton wrote: > For those who are interested in this period, here is a > recently-recognised > portrait of Catherine Parr, (the wife who survived Henry VIII):- > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/reports/arts/parr_20040224.shtml > destined for the Queens' Chamber at Hever Castle. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 12:41:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OHfJSd013516 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:41:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OHeQcP026623; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:40:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OHeMLx055763; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:40:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mail1.derby.ac.uk (mail1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OHeDLx055496 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 10:40:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from K.M.Bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from CSV6.derby.ac.uk (csv6.derby.ac.uk [193.60.145.14]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.6+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id i1OHdtT03044.; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:39:55 GMT Received: from staff-MTA by CSV6.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:39:55 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:39:43 +0000 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I asked on a message board for Patrick O'Brian fans, and someone came up with http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/escape/timeship.html#lifejacket - not 18th century, though. >>> kayta@frys.com 2/23/04 9:03:38 PM >>> I read, in an un-documented list of first occurrences, that the first life jacket was created for the English Navy in the 1700s. Where would I look to find an image of one of these, or the specifications on them? I don't even know where to start. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ Kate Bunting Library, University of Derby _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 14:28:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OJSZSd013895 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:28:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OJQFcP006844; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:26:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OJQ6Lx030739; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:26:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OJQ0Lx030697 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:26:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fb8.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.184]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 2919A5EE037 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:25:57 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <003701c3fb0c$132cfa80$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:26:16 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] blue ribbed silk waistcoat X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1OJSZSd013895 Status: RO Hi. I have started a new hobby, i tryed to make some ribbon embroidery. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm Scroll down to the bottom of the side. However i ran out of ribbon, and in the waiting of new ribbons to come, i started to make the buttons. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 15:08:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OK8bSd014123 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:08:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OK6rcP010868; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:06:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OK5oLx059960; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:06:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9404.mail.yahoo.com (web9404.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.110]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1OK4jLx059126 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:05:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040224200444.55201.qmail@web9404.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9404.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:04:44 PST Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:04:44 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] blue ribbed silk waistcoat To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <003701c3fb0c$132cfa80$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO *Sigh* Gorgeous, as always , Bjarne! Albra Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: Hi. I have started a new hobby, i tryed to make some ribbon embroidery. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm Scroll down to the bottom of the side. However i ran out of ribbon, and in the waiting of new ribbons to come, i started to make the buttons. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 15:39:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OKddSd014248 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:39:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKbicP013999; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:37:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKbcLx084316; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:37:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out012.verizon.net (out012pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKbZLx084272 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:37:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jauncourt@verizon.net) Received: from verizon.net ([4.12.168.215]) by out012.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040224202833.RTOY1590.out012.verizon.net@verizon.net> for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:28:33 -0600 Message-ID: <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:28:43 -0600 From: Maura Folsom User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-CA; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en, en-ca MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr References: <200402241902.i1OJ21M0013891@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out012.verizon.net from [4.12.168.215] at Tue, 24 Feb 2004 14:28:33 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm replying to two messages: > From: kat@grendal.rain.com > I wonder how they decided who it is. They recently decided that a > picture which I'd always been told was of Jane Grey was actually of > Kat Parr by identifying the dress and the distinctive jewels from an > inventory. The jewels and dress in this one aren't so distinctive. > From: Hope Greenberg > This portrait seems similar to the one at Lambeth > (http://tudorhistory.org/parr/otherparr.jpg). Does anyone have info on > the provenance of either one? Is one a copy? My comments: I'm kind of suspicious of the identification of the 'new' portrait as K.P. for 2 reasons: 1) The obvious age of the sitter, which HAS to be at least 35 or older. Maybe much older. She looks awfully haggard, even accounting for the beauty standards of the day. 2) The style of the clothing is too early for her to have been painted in it at that age, IMO. I think this woman is too old to be K.P. Also, she doesn't look anything like other portraits of K.P.: http://www.marileecody.com/parr-scrots.jpg However, I think that it's likely that the 'new' one and the (virtually identical) one at Lambeth Palace are really of Catherine of Aragon. She was old enough at the time those clothes were fashionable to be the lady in the picture, and it bears stong resemblances to portraits done later in her life. In particular, this one: http://www.marileecody.com/aragon2.jpg Of course, I could be wrong. M. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 15:46:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OKkqSd014276 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:46:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKigcP014796; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:44:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKibLx089516; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:44:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (cardassian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.18]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKiXLx089450 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:44:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from triade@kabelfoon.nl) Received: from kabelfoon.nl (kf-ijss-cb01-0512.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.82.1]) by cardassian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E532CBF4B2 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:11:44 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <403BB003.4080109@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:11:47 +0100 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] blue ribbed silk waistcoat References: <003701c3fb0c$132cfa80$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO That looks absolutely cute! Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: >Hi. >I have started a new hobby, i tryed to make some ribbon embroidery. >http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm >Scroll down to the bottom of the side. >However i ran out of ribbon, and in the waiting of new ribbons to come, i started to make the buttons. > >Bjarne > > > > >Leif og Bjarne Drews >www.my-drewscostumes.dk > >http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 15:50:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OKo0Sd014284 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:50:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKkOcP014992; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:46:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKkHLx090684; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:46:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw6.prodigy.net (mtaw6.prodigy.net [64.164.98.56]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKkFLx090653 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:46:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-125-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.125.111]) by mtaw6.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OKjBDV000557 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:45:17 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040224120521.05c2e430@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 12:41:06 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you so much for this reference. We're having trouble with any period-like idea we have because of the drowning problem mentioned in this article. So we're stuck with using only Coast Guard approved modern ones when rowing our period replica boat wearing our period replica clothes. Coast Guard approved PFDs (personal flotation devices) can only be worn over clothing, not under it, and only seem to come in bright modern colors. The drowning hazard is also why it was decided that all our rowers had to wear men's clothing. Staying alive in the water is difficult to impossible in multiple wet petticoats, and 18th century cork bum rolls would only make the wearer float face down, and drown if they were unconscious. The Captain/owner of our rowboat says it is certain that one day the boat will capsize, and that's just a fact of maritime life. We might have to break character to explain to any mundane visitors about women-as-men rowers in breeches, but we decided that drowning was excessively authentic. >I asked on a message board for Patrick O'Brian fans, and someone came up >with http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/escape/timeship.html#lifejacket >- not 18th century, though. >I read, in an un-documented list of first occurrences, that the first >life >jacket was created for the English Navy in the 1700s. Where would I >look >to find an image of one of these, or the specifications on them? I >don't >even know where to start. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 17:08:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OM8bSd014750 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:08:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OM7ccP023448; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:07:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OM7TLx048968; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:07:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OM7QLx048866 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:07:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.d5.5f43458 (4004) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:02:09 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:02:09 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/24/2004 3:26:42 PM Central Standard Time, jauncourt@verizon.net writes: Of course, I could be wrong. M. Actually, I wholeheartedly agree with you ... that's why I was wondering what they were basing this on. The clothing, the style of the portrait, the age and appearance of the sitter ... none of this seems to indicate KP to me. But, I'm certainly no expert on antique art. -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 17:13:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1OMDeSd014776 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:13:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OMCpcP023919; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:12:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OMCkLx052860; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:12:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from deluge.cc.mcgill.ca (deluge.CC.McGill.CA [132.206.27.50]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OMCiLx052791 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 15:12:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jhobbi2@po-box.mcgill.ca) Received: from prion.mcgill.ca (prion.McGill.CA [132.206.27.58]) by deluge.cc.mcgill.ca (8.12.11/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i1OM4Ag9002560 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:04:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from wgrappe1.cc.mcgill.ca (web27-1.McGill.CA [132.206.27.100]) by prion.mcgill.ca (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OM3w6b012384 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:03:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from wgrappe1.cc.mcgill.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by wgrappe1.cc.mcgill.ca (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1OM2ZLZ017113 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:02:35 -0500 Received: (from apache@localhost) by wgrappe1.cc.mcgill.ca (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1OM2ZXD017111 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:02:35 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: wgrappe1.cc.mcgill.ca: apache set sender to jhobbi2@po-box.mcgill.ca using -f Received: from GIS131.Library.McGill.CA (GIS131.Library.McGill.CA [132.216.28.131]) by webmail.mcgill.ca (IMP) with HTTP for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:02:35 -0500 Message-ID: <1077660155.403bc9fb390d7@webmail.mcgill.ca> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:02:35 -0500 From: jhobbi2@po-box.mcgill.ca To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs References: <4.3.1.2.20040224120521.05c2e430@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20040224120521.05c2e430@mail.frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.2 X-Originating-IP: 132.216.28.131 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The OED has a citatation for life preserver from 1804 in the Naval Chronicles, a series of dispatches from 1793-1815. "The plan of the ‘Life Preserver’ here mentioned is borrowed from that of Commissary Bosquet". Although originals might be hard to track down, they have been rereleased as a five volume set called "The Naval chronicle : the contemporary record of the Royal Navy at war" edited by Nicholas Tracy The ISBNs are: 0811711072 (U.S. : v.1) 1861760914 (U.K. : v.1) 0811711080 (U.S. : v.2) 1861760922 (U.K. : v.2) 0811711099 (U.S. : v.3) 1861760930 (U.K. : v.3) 0811711080 (U.S. : v.4) 1861760949 (U.K. : v.4) 0811711110 (U.S. : v.5) 1861760957 (U.K. : v.5) cheers, Joanna Quoting Carolyn Kayta Barrows : > Thank you so much for this reference. We're having trouble with any > period-like idea we have because of the drowning problem mentioned in this > article. So we're stuck with using only Coast Guard approved modern ones > when rowing our period replica boat wearing our period replica > clothes. Coast Guard approved PFDs (personal flotation devices) can only > be worn over clothing, not under it, and only seem to come in bright modern > colors. > > The drowning hazard is also why it was decided that all our rowers had to > wear men's clothing. Staying alive in the water is difficult to impossible > in multiple wet petticoats, and 18th century cork bum rolls would only make > the wearer float face down, and drown if they were unconscious. The > Captain/owner of our rowboat says it is certain that one day the boat will > capsize, and that's just a fact of maritime life. We might have to break > character to explain to any mundane visitors about women-as-men rowers in > breeches, but we decided that drowning was excessively authentic. > > >I asked on a message board for Patrick O'Brian fans, and someone came up > >with http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/escape/timeship.html#lifejacket > >- not 18th century, though. > > >I read, in an un-documented list of first occurrences, that the first > >life > >jacket was created for the English Navy in the 1700s. Where would I > >look > >to find an image of one of these, or the specifications on them? I > >don't > >even know where to start. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > //// \\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > ((( <> )))) > ) (((((( > /----\ /---\)) > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 18:14:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ONEESd014985 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:14:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ONBlcP029932; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:11:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ONBkLx095216; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:11:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ONAqLx094571 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:10:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from brujne@creighton.edu) Received: from cindyabel (cla53081.creighton.edu [147.134.201.2]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_28810+JAGae91741)/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA02498 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:10:51 -0600 (CST) From: "Cindy Abel" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:10:51 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > From: kat@grendal.rain.com > I wonder how they decided who it is. They recently decided that a > picture which I'd always been told was of Jane Grey was actually of > Kat Parr by identifying the dress and the distinctive jewels from an > inventory. The jewels and dress in this one aren't so distinctive. It is pretty difficult to decide who is who in what portrait and what is "original" and what is a copy at this time period. Look at the painting long thought be of Katherine Howard, but now id'ed as a sister of Jane Seymour? One wonders how many portraits done by Holbein perhaps were deliberately destroyed when the person depicted was convicted of treason--Anne Boleyn, George Boleyn and others come to mind or perhaps later during the Civil War when supporting the royal family in any form was suspect. Painting on panel might be decent firewood for those with no respect for history, as well as Mother Nature's workings with fire, flood, etc. Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 18:17:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1ONHKSd014998 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:17:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ONEadd000336; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:16:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ON8ALx092544; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:08:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.130]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1ON87Lx092501 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:08:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net (stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.188]) by soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1OLrd908779 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:53:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-67.74.234.58.dial1.baltimore1.level3.net ([67.74.234.58] helo=HELENPINTO) by stork.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AvkUh-0006zJ-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:53:36 -0800 Message-ID: <034701c3fb20$a46d7d30$3aea4a43@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20040224120521.05c2e430@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 16:53:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9efa471b58460f7f4588043cdedd8eb7c91350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO CarolynKayta wrote: We're having trouble with any > period-like idea we have because of the drowning problem mentioned in this > article. So we're stuck with using only Coast Guard approved modern ones > when rowing our period replica boat wearing our period replica > clothes. Coast Guard approved PFDs (personal flotation devices) can only > be worn over clothing, not under it, and only seem to come in bright modern > colors. > It looks like there may be two possible solutions- either make a cork life-vest, following the Coast Guard regs by strengthening the collar to place the head at the correct angle and putting most of the blocks in the front to get the buoyancy in the correct place; or else, make a canvas cover for a modern life-vest, so at least it won't fluoresce and look as out of place with period clothing. -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 19:47:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P0lRSd015431 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:47:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P0kfcP007613; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:46:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P0kaLT052589; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:46:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P0kVLT052536 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:46:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.128.251.124] (helo=dan) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1Avb0d-0006KS-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 11:45:55 +0000 Message-ID: <001b01c3facc$03c32960$7cfb8051@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <1ec.19aca062.2d6c0140@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 18th century and new technology in exhibition Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 11:47:43 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ann wrote on Tuesday, February 24, 2004 1:22 AM > Thanks for that info. No clue as to who owned/wore it? Alas, no. Since it's a Spitalfields silk one assumes English, but we have no more than that... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 20:46:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P1ksSd015574 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:46:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P1kDcP011023; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:46:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P1kALT082030; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:46:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp806.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp806.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.185]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1P1k5LT081980 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:46:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.145.124 with login) by smtp806.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2004 01:46:03 -0000 Message-ID: <00c401c3fb41$1ced8500$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402241902.i1OJ21M0013891@net.indra.com> <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:45:57 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I agree about everyone else's suspicions about this portrait being Catherine of Aragon rather than Parr based on its resemblance to other portraits of both and the age/style of dress, so started poking around... You can listen to the actual interview on the BBC's site here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/listenagain/ (program 0822) In the interview Starkey (the historian who "discovered" the identity of this portrait, and who also hosted the recent "Six Wives of Henry VIII" BBC tv show) talks about dating it based on what she's wearing -- he says that the gable hood dates it to the late 1520s, when Parr was in her late teens, and that the pearls are a gift from her mother (Maud Green [sp?]). Tudor/Elizabethan people -- is that correct? I just looked up Parr and it looks like she was born in 1512, so by say 1530 she'd be 18. Starkey says in the interview that it's 90% likely to be Parr. I wonder if he'll publish anything to detail how he made identification? - Kendra http://demode.tweedlebop.com/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 21:01:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P211Sd015618 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:01:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P1vpcP011633; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:57:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P1voLT087189; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:57:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp812.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp812.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.82]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1P1viLT087148 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:57:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.145.124 with login) by smtp812.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2004 01:51:02 -0000 Message-ID: <00e901c3fb41$cf3d1a40$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 17:50:56 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all, For those of you who have made 1780s robes a l'anglaise, what do you find works best for skirt supports? I'm planning to make something along the lines of this dress: http://www.metmuseum.org/collections/view1zoom.asp?dep=11&zoom=0&full=1&mark =2&item=67%2E55%2E1 ...and I'm wondering how many under-petticoats I should make, and whether I should make a bumroll (by which I mean a roll that goes around the back AND hips) or just a bumpad (back only). Any suggestions appreciated! Thanks, Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 21:07:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P270Sd015631 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:07:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P1vUcP011613; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:57:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P1vRLT087033; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:57:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P1vMLU086986 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:57:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P1wh8v024221 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:58:43 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1P1whNa024219 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:58:43 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:58:43 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200402241902.i1OJ21M0013891@net.indra.com> <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> In-Reply-To: <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402242058.43614.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Tuesday 24 February 2004 03:28 pm, Maura Folsom wrote: > My comments: > > I'm kind of suspicious of the identification of the 'new' portrait as > K.P. for 2 reasons: > > 1) The obvious age of the sitter, which HAS to be at least 35 or older. > Maybe much older. She looks awfully haggard, even accounting for the > beauty standards of the day. Depends on when it is assumed to be done. Katherine Parr would have been in her 30s by the time she met King Henry, and her health went downhill quick after her pregnancy by subsequent husband Tom Seymour. Moreover, even if I thought the portrait showed her as looking too old for her likely age, I wouldn't necessarily assume the attribution was wrong. Some painters were merely incompentent. Witness the famous portrait of Anne Boleyn, which makes her look old and homely to boot. > 2) The style of the clothing is too early for her to have been painted > in it at that age, IMO. There I agree with you. If memory serves me, Katherine Parr met King Henry in the early 1540s when she was a bit past 30. The clothes in this picture, however, look like the clothing shown in the famous portrait of Katherine of Aragon--a generation earlier. [snip] > However, I think that it's likely that the 'new' one and the (virtually > identical) one at Lambeth Palace are really of Catherine of Aragon. She > was old enough at the time those clothes were fashionable to be the lady > in the picture, and it bears stong resemblances to portraits done later > in her life. In particular, this one: > http://www.marileecody.com/aragon2.jpg > > Of course, I could be wrong. You could. But if I had to bet on the outcome, I'd be more willing to bet on your theory than theirs. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 21:18:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P2IYSd015661 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:18:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P2HOcP012955; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:17:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P2HJLT096141; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:17:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d08.mx.aol.com (imo-d08.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.40]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P2HHLT096082 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:17:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-3403c01ba32f; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:00:26 -0500 Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.1ec.19c3e3f0 (17377) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:55:09 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <1ec.19c3e3f0.2d6d5a7d@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:55:09 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/24/2004 7:47:22 PM Central Standard Time, kendra@tweedlebop.com writes: In the interview Starkey (the historian who "discovered" the identity of this portrait, and who also hosted the recent "Six Wives of Henry VIII" BBC tv show) talks about dating it based on what she's wearing -- he says that the gable hood dates it to the late 1520s, when Parr was in her late teens, and that the pearls are a gift from her mother (Maud Green [sp?]). Tudor/Elizabethan people -- is that correct? I just looked up Parr and it looks like she was born in 1512, so by say 1530 she'd be 18. :oX Sheesh .. leave it to a guy. ::ducking:: I dunno. I would put that hood earlier than the late 1520's. By then the French Hood was very much becoming en vogue, and the gable hood began to shrink upwards. The jeweled part of the paste began to come up toward the chin, and then progressed on up to cheek height (think the famous portrait of Jane Seymour, in the mid 1530's). This hood looks to me much more like the 15teens or VERY early 20's at the latest. Also, the plainness of the fabrics in the gown just doesn't jive to me with that time period. Once the houppelande went out and gowns began to be what we now think of as "Tudor" in style, the progression was very fast toward using elaborate textiles, furs, and lots of beady trims. The other well-known portrait of KP shows her to have been extremely fashionable, wearing a stylish and up-to-date gown and the latest in headwear. Annnnnnd finally ... that person just does not look late teens to me at all, but much older. The later period portrait of KP, she looks her age if not younger, so I don't think it's that she just looked peaked at an early age. If he's solely basing this opinion on the pearls, then I wish someone would remind him that they could have been a family heirloom (and this portrait could be of someone in her family, but not her), or the pearl necklace could have been purchased or otherwise acquired by the family at some point between this portrait being painted, and the pearls being given to KP. -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 21:35:31 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P2ZVSd015715 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:35:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P2YlcP014056; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:34:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P2YkLT003504; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:34:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp808.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp808.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.187]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1P2YgLT003483 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 19:34:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sarah@modehistorique.com) Received: from unknown (HELO modehistorique.com) (lithiate@sbcglobal.net@69.105.81.39 with plain) by smtp808.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2004 02:28:02 -0000 Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1970 18:37:57 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <00c401c3fb41$1ced8500$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Message-Id: <21BFA4E2-2756-11B2-8B80-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > In the interview Starkey (the historian who "discovered" the identity > of > this portrait, and who also hosted the recent "Six Wives of Henry > VIII" BBC > tv show) talks about dating it based on what she's wearing -- he says > that > the gable hood dates it to the late 1520s, when Parr was in her late > teens, > and that the pearls are a gift from her mother (Maud Green [sp?]). > Tudor/Elizabethan people -- is that correct? Much as I dislike Starkey, I agree with him here. Catherine Parr was definitely "old enough" to be wearing the gable hood when it was in fashion, although it was certainly at the end of it's run as the hat of choice for fashionable women. Considering that Holbein painted Jane Seymore as Queen in the gable hood well into the 1530's, it's more than reasonable to assume that Parr would have continued to wear it as well. The other argument, that the sitter looks too old to be CP is really not relevant because the skills of the artist may be to blame for that one. Starkey mentions other items such as pearls that lead him to believe it's Catherine. As much as he annoys me, he's still much more educated than I am in the matter, so I'm going to trust he knows what he's talking about. :) Sarah http://www.modehistorique.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 22:21:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P3LsSd016337 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:21:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P3IMcP016240; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:18:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P3IFLT021647; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:18:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out003.verizon.net (out003pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.103]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P3IELT021629 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:18:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from r.carnegie@verizon.net) Received: from Fiona ([151.199.130.194]) by out003.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040225030648.EBJE8426.out003.verizon.net@Fiona> for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:06:48 -0600 From: "Ron Carnegie" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:06:45 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <034701c3fb20$a46d7d30$3aea4a43@HELENPINTO> Importance: Normal X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out003.verizon.net from [151.199.130.194] at Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:06:48 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I may have missed something here. Are those onboard in question under age? The coast guard requires floatation devices be available for all people present on a vessel, and certain extras depending upon the size of the vessel. They are NOT required to be worn however, just present. They are however sometimes required by insurance conventions, though this seems to have more to due with paying passengers and minors. That being said, of course in certain weather conditions it is a good idea to wear them, and some sailors always wear them, or so I am told. I have yet to see evidence of this. I do realize that I may have missed some important point here however as I had not been following this thread closely and I notice reference to some article which I have not read. I sail on a period vessel. Our safety equipment is all modern and I would suggest the same to you. Our pfds are usually out of sight, but easily available in need. Our vessel is large (well compared to yours) so we do have life rafts which are visible when we are underway, as are the man overboard flotation rings which are connected to bouys with flags. DO NOT try to make or alter a PFD as they do have to be USCG approved or they are in violation of the law. In a very lame attempt to bring my points back to topic (though they might still be as accessories). Back when I was still in Californian I used to work for the Renaissance Pleasure Faires (living history Centre in them days). There was a parade in the afternoon called the dead band. People would be costumed in various shades of black or gray and would play various often very funky instruments and walk or dance through out the faire. I always wanted to do a 16th century sailors outfit with a skull mask but with jewels for eyes (as referenced in Clarence's dreams in Shakespeare's Richard the Third. I would bedeck the whole ensemble with long strands of seaweed and kelp! Most impressive encounter I ever had with this parade was a noble lady. She wore a beautiful black and gray velvet Elizabethan gown and held before her a featureless white mask on a stick. She danced up to me in what seemed to me like a very seductive manner and I found her very attractive, even though in reality all I saw was the mask. When she was just in front of me, her face at least in my memory of the event only inches from mine, she dropped the mask, revealing a skull mask that she wore directly on her face. The effect was great! Not only was a completely startled by the transformation, but what a great visualization of the fleeting nature of beauty (or life for that matter)! Well done. I always wished I could let her know how impressed I was, but I never did find out who it was. Ron Carnegie > CarolynKayta wrote: > > We're having trouble with any > > period-like idea we have because of the drowning problem > mentioned in this > > article. So we're stuck with using only Coast Guard approved > modern ones > > when rowing our period replica boat wearing our period replica > > clothes. Coast Guard approved PFDs (personal flotation > devices) can only > > be worn over clothing, not under it, and only seem to come in bright > modern > > colors. > > > > It looks like there may be two possible solutions- either make a cork > life-vest, > following the Coast Guard regs by strengthening the collar to > place the head > at > the correct angle and putting most of the blocks in the front to get the > buoyancy > in the correct place; or else, make a canvas cover for a modern life-vest, > so at > least it won't fluoresce and look as out of place with period clothing. > -Helen/Aidan > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 22:27:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P3R7Sd016375 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:27:07 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P3NtcP016516; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:23:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P3NrLT023956; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:23:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P3NoLU023934 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 20:23:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P3PB8v024659 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:25:11 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1P3PB8I024657 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:25:11 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:25:11 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <21BFA4E2-2756-11B2-8B80-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> In-Reply-To: <21BFA4E2-2756-11B2-8B80-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402242225.11220.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Monday 12 January 1970 09:37 pm, Sarah wrote: [snip] > Much as I dislike Starkey, I agree with him here. Catherine Parr was > definitely "old enough" to be wearing the gable hood when it was in > fashion, although it was certainly at the end of it's run as the hat of > choice for fashionable women. Being no expert on the headwear of the period, I'll defer to your opinion here. > Considering that Holbein painted Jane > Seymore as Queen in the gable hood well into the 1530's, Albeit a somewhat different style of gable hood. >Though > it's more than > reasonable to assume that Parr would have continued to wear it as well. > The other argument, that the sitter looks too old to be CP is really > not relevant because the skills of the artist may be to blame for that > one. I agree with you completely there. Starkey is likely correct that the portrait was painted in the late 1520s. However, other than the pearls, the BBC article doesn't really explain why he thinks it's a young Catherine Parr rather than an older somebody else. > > Starkey mentions other items such as pearls that lead him to believe > it's Catherine. As much as he annoys me, he's still much more educated > than I am in the matter, so I'm going to trust he knows what he's > talking about. :) Maybe. But the BBC article doesn't give much of his reasoning, which I would be curious to hear. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Feb 24 23:46:39 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P4kdSd016806 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:46:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P4k0cP020519; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:46:00 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P4jqLT057779; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:45:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zephir.primus.ca (mail.tor.primus.ca [216.254.136.21]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P4jnLU057746 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:45:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jhobbi2@po-box.mcgill.ca) Received: from dsl-207-112-58-61.tor.primus.ca ([207.112.58.61] helo=pheonix) by zephir.primus.ca with smtp (Exim 3.36 #3) id 1Avqvc-00033R-0A for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 04:45:48 +0000 Message-ID: <005801c3fb59$fc01e6b0$3901a8c0@pheonix> From: "Joanna Hobbins" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e901c3fb41$cf3d1a40$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:43:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO While I have not yet made a robe a l'anglasie, I do have a copy of Pattern Diagrams for Three Eighteenth-Century Dresses in the Royal Ontario Museum (Series 1 and 2). The sewing instructions for the Robe a I'anglaise, c. 1783-1784 are as follows: The distinguishing feature of this dress is the pointed back of the bodice. By the 1780s the back of the bodice was no longer cut in one with the back of the skirt. Depending on the type of fabric used and on the trimmings, this style could be worn for day or evening. It was not "full dress". The original dress is made of paper-light pink silk and the petticoat of the same texture has vertical pink and white stripes. The hem is faced with very lightweight wool. The overskirt may be worn full length or drawn up in three puffs with a pair of looped tapes attached with buttons at the hips. Skirt and petticoat should be worn over a kidney-shaped bustle pad. The neckline may be filled in with a muslin fichu or edged with muslin-like lace. For the robe a I'anglaise a stiff foundation bodice is essential to obtain the correct shape and fit. The shape of the dress bodice is determined by that of the corset; in fact, the shape of the corset may be taken from the dress bodice pattern. I hope this helps. cheers, Joanna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 8:50 PM Subject: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports > Hi all, > > For those of you who have made 1780s robes a l'anglaise, what do you find > works best for skirt supports? I'm planning to make something along the > lines of this dress: > http://www.metmuseum.org/collections/view1zoom.asp?dep=11&zoom=0&full=1&mark > =2&item=67%2E55%2E1 > > ...and I'm wondering how many under-petticoats I should make, and whether I > should make a bumroll (by which I mean a roll that goes around the back AND > hips) or just a bumpad (back only). > > Any suggestions appreciated! > > Thanks, > > Kendra > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 00:49:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P5nkSd017053 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:49:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P5kVcP023163; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:46:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P5kRLT081287; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:46:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp4.pacifier.net (smtp4.pacifier.net [64.255.237.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P5kLLT081251 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:46:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.138.45]) by smtp4.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01F976A40F for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:46:20 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:46:16 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Message-ID: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <200402242058.43614.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Depends on when it is assumed to be done. Katherine Parr would have > been in her 30s by the time she met King Henry, and her health went > downhill quick after her pregnancy by subsequent husband Tom Seymour. Supposedly she was married to Latimer at the time of the "new" portrait. That would have been after Anne Boleyn. According to information from several books (such as quotes from the Lisle letters), the French Hoods we see during Anne Boleyn's time were almost forbidden under Jane Seymour. You start seeing them again during Kat Howard's time. During that middle period of time they went back to wearing the gable hood (although a few probably had never stopped wearing it.) As to her health going downhill after her pregnancy, that's a bit of an understatement, since she died of child bed fever (much like Jane Seymour.) > > 2) The style of the clothing is too early for her to have been > > painted in it at that age, IMO. > > There I agree with you. If memory serves me, Katherine Parr met King > Henry in the early 1540s when she was a bit past 30. The clothes in > this picture, however, look like the clothing shown in the famous > portrait of Katherine of Aragon--a generation earlier. But the portrait was painted while she was married to Lord Latimer, who was the husband she had before Henry. The clothes could very well be what was worn in that time period. It's very difficult to precisely date a portrait from this time period using clothing references because there was so much overlap in the styles which were being worn, especially from 1520-1540. While there were new style innovations, the same people who wore those would also wear some of the older styles at other times. It's not like some periods when "everyone wore their hem this length" or "this was the way they made their sleeves" or "their necklines always were shaped like this." > > However, I think that it's likely that the 'new' one and the > > (virtually identical) one at Lambeth Palace are really of Catherine > > of Aragon. She was old enough at the time those clothes were > > fashionable to be the lady in the picture, and it bears stong > > resemblances to portraits done later in her life. In particular, > > this one: http://www.marileecody.com/aragon2.jpg > > > > Of course, I could be wrong. > > You could. But if I had to bet on the outcome, I'd be more willing to > bet on your theory than theirs. On the other hand, Kateryne Parr (as *she* spelled her name) was well known to Catherine of Aragon's court. She could very well have deliberately been wearing clothes similar to CofA's clothing. (By the way, most of the "Catherines" in the early 16th C spelled their name "Kateryne" when they were signing. Later people tended to change them to the now more familiar "Catherine" or "Katherine.") Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 00:49:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P5nnSd017056 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:49:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P5l7cP023195; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:47:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P5l7LT081532; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:47:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d07.mx.aol.com (imo-d07.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.39]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P5l2LT081463 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 22:47:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-3403c359a144; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:41:46 -0500 Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.196.26372852 (3657) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:36:33 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <196.26372852.2d6d8e60@aol.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:36:32 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/24/2004 8:58:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, kendra@tweedlebop.com writes: > ...and I'm wondering how many under-petticoats I should make, Nice gown in the painting. I would think one medium weight petticoat would do. And without a ruffle or such thing at the hem. Look at how, especially at the front, the satin falls naturally. I don't detect any real bulk at the hem. and whether I > > should make a bumroll (by which I mean a roll that goes around the back AND > hips) or just a bumpad (back only). > Yes, you'll need some padding. A bum roll is in order...perhaps with some sort of softening mechanism. I made some with a ruffle made from commercial quilting pleated in big [like"] box pleats to cover and hang over the edge of the pad a little [maybe about 12" or so deep]. The pad need not be too big but should come around the sides a little. Think horizontally. You don't want that very narrow silhouette from the front you get with an 1880s bustle...with it still narrow as it comes around the side hip. You want some bulk at the side hip...though not like a pannier. Maybe a regular bustle pad with that box pleated ruffle brought around to the sides. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 01:02:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P629Sd017073 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:02:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P60BcP023680; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:00:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P609LT086147; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:00:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P606LT086093 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:00:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.a8.2896c6db (3657) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:54:49 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:54:49 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/25/2004 12:47:49 AM Eastern Standard Time, AlbertCat@aol.com writes: > big [like"] box pleats Oops.... make that big [like 2 to 3"] box pleats _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 01:33:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P6X7Sd017148 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:33:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P6WVcP024840; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:32:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P6WSLT097741; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:32:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-r05.mx.aol.com (imo-r05.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.101]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P6WQLT097710 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:32:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v37.4.) id 6.199.26536d6f (3932) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:27:06 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <199.26536d6f.2d6d9a3a@aol.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:27:06 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/24/2004 11:47:34 PM Central Standard Time, kat@grendal.rain.com writes: On the other hand, Kateryne Parr (as *she* spelled her name) was well known to Catherine of Aragon's court. She could very well have deliberately been wearing clothes similar to CofA's clothing. Okay, I'm a little confused by this. Katherine Parr was not raised at court, so I don't see how she could have been well known there in Catherine of Aragon's time? KP could not have been at court before the age of 13, and she married for the first time in 1526 at the age of 14. She and her first husband were not courtiers. By the time KP's first husband died in 1529, Catherine of Aragon didn't have a court anymore. And I would think that during the late 1520's/early 1530's, very few sane people deliberately tried to imitate Catherine of Aragon's anything. It would have been an unhealthy association at best. KP was married to Lord Latimer in 1533/4. Since he was one of the leaders of the catholic Pilgrimage of Grace and only narrowly escaped with his life, to me the idea that his wife would do anything during their marriage to *try* to look like a deceased catholic figurehead, is hard to imagine. It is possible that someone could have been wearing this outdated bonnet later than the 1520's, but it seems to me that it is unlikely for a woman like Katherine Parr, who was utterly up-to-date and fashionable in the portraits that are confirmed to be of her. -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 01:38:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P6cbSd017172 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:38:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P6ZScP024927; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:35:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P6ZSLT098741; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:35:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P6ZQLT098728 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:35:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B833B1D138 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:35:26 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p202.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.204]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 833FAC422 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:35:25 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] White Wool and Red Wine .. HELP!! Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:35:43 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <20040224.071720.1740.1.Cley@juno.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carbona should have a bottle specifically for wine stains. You can usually find this brand at Super Walmart or Jo Ann's Fabrics. De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Cynthia J Ley Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 9:10 AM To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] White Wool and Red Wine .. HELP!! Tried soaking the stain in Oxyclean? As a sister highly-allergic-to-wool-type myself, I haven't tried this, but some of my friends have, and it seemed to work just fine. Arlys On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:40:21 -0800 (PST) Lil Sorepaws writes: > > Hi, trying to help out a friend .. she got red wine on a white wool > coat > .. especially soaked into the fringes .. she'd like to try to clean > it > herself before a dry-cleaner ends up setting the stain - any > suggestions > from you ladies (and gentlemen) who deal with wool? I am violently > allergic so I never bothered to learn to clean it since I cannot > wear it > ... ANy advice is much appreciated! > > Thanks! > > - Lil the lethargic lurker ;) > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 02:40:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P7e0Sd010728 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:40:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7aqcP027203; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:36:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7ajLT020584; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:36:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7agLU020562 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:36:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7c48v025485 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:38:04 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1P7c4Jk025483 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:38:04 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:38:04 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> In-Reply-To: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402250238.04616.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wednesday 25 February 2004 12:46 am, kat@grendal.rain.com wrote: > > Depends on when it is assumed to be done. Katherine Parr would have > > been in her 30s by the time she met King Henry, and her health went > > downhill quick after her pregnancy by subsequent husband Tom Seymour. > > Supposedly she was married to Latimer at the time of the "new" > portrait. That would have been after Anne Boleyn. According to > information from several books (such as quotes from the Lisle > letters), the French Hoods we see during Anne Boleyn's time were > almost forbidden under Jane Seymour. You start seeing them again > during Kat Howard's time. During that middle period of time they went > back to wearing the gable hood (although a few probably had never > stopped wearing it.) > > As to her health going downhill after her pregnancy, that's a bit of > an understatement, since she died of child bed fever (much like Jane > Seymour.) I thought she'd survived the birth by several weeks, but yes, I was wallowing a bit in understatement, even so. :-) > > > 2) The style of the clothing is too early for her to have been > > > painted in it at that age, IMO. > > > > There I agree with you. If memory serves me, Katherine Parr met King > > Henry in the early 1540s when she was a bit past 30. The clothes in > > this picture, however, look like the clothing shown in the famous > > portrait of Katherine of Aragon--a generation earlier. > > But the portrait was painted while she was married to Lord Latimer, > who was the husband she had before Henry. The clothes could very well > be what was worn in that time period. I withdraw my prior comment, since at that point I hadn't read the BBC article and didn't realize that part of the evidence Starkey was relying upon to date the painting was evidence of the clothing style. > It's very difficult to precisely date a portrait from this time > period using clothing references because there was so much overlap in > the styles which were being worn, especially from 1520-1540. True. In addition, weren't some paintings later copies of earlier ones that, when originally done, did in fact show a fashionable style? >While > there were new style innovations, the same people who wore those > would also wear some of the older styles at other times. It's not > like some periods when "everyone wore their hem this length" or "this > was the way they made their sleeves" or "their necklines always were > shaped like this." > > > > However, I think that it's likely that the 'new' one and the > > > (virtually identical) one at Lambeth Palace are really of Catherine > > > of Aragon. She was old enough at the time those clothes were > > > fashionable to be the lady in the picture, and it bears stong > > > resemblances to portraits done later in her life. In particular, > > > this one: http://www.marileecody.com/aragon2.jpg > > > > > > Of course, I could be wrong. > > > > You could. But if I had to bet on the outcome, I'd be more willing to > > bet on your theory than theirs. > > On the other hand, Kateryne Parr (as *she* spelled her name) was well > known to Catherine of Aragon's court. She could very well have > deliberately been wearing clothes similar to CofA's clothing. Sure. But this is begging the question, isn't it? The fact that the clothing shown in the portrait is in a style fashionable in the late 1520s, and Catherine (or Katherine or Kateryne) Parr was an appropriate age to be wearing such clothes in the late 1520s, would not be sufficient to prove that the painting is of Catherine Parr, since the same would be true of many other noblewomen of Henry VIII's court (including, for that matter, Catherine of Aragon). So Starkey rightly looks to other evidence--namely, the pearls, which he claims are clearly the ones that Catherine Parr was given. (Since the image of the painting the BBC ran did not show the pearls very clearly, I have to assume that they were, somehow, visually distinctive.) > > (By the way, most of the "Catherines" in the early 16th C spelled > their name "Kateryne" when they were signing. Later people tended to > change them to the now more familiar "Catherine" or "Katherine.") Spelling in general was not real stable in the early 16th c., so I did not concern myself with which variations of the name I used in answering these posts. :-) -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 02:55:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P7t4Sd010794 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:55:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7pqcP027651; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:51:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7pnLT026560; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:51:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7pkLT026509 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:51:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3F534100AE; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:51:17 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A3E5400016A; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:51:01 -0600 Message-ID: <00d101c3fb74$03f71b50$0300a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008701c3fa6b$12f6e180$0300a8c0@MOM> <0e3301c3facd$87351af0$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Exciting news Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:50:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Thank you Dianne! I told Patrick about all of h-costumes' good wishes. He was so excited and thrilled with everyone's support. Mike T. has been a wonderful person in inspiring Pat to go to college. Tania has been emailing Pat about what it is like to go to college in England. She did a semester in England. All of you have been so wonderful! The LIPA students in the program that Pat is going in, started emailing him yesterday. They are giving him the skinny about the college. What to expect and such. Guess what Pat's first test will be???? Paul McCartney plays a concert for the students. His band deliberately messes up the lights and sound equipment. The students have up until the third song to fix the problems. If they don't fix it, the band messes up the equipment more, and the students try again. I don't think Patrick would get this kind of practical experience at any other college. BTW, the only other American student in this tech program... her mother is a costumer in Chicago who sells to films. The admissions counselor said, "I think this is becoming of trend with costumers' children in the U.S." Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Plugit.com Virus Scanners (http://www.plugit.com)] _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 03:02:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P82dSd010810 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 03:02:40 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7xUcP027920; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:59:31 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7xULT029564; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:59:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from www6.plugit.com (mail8.plugit.com [66.210.223.8]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P7xPLT029522 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 00:59:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from penny@costumegallery.com) Received: from costumegallery.com [66.210.222.51] by www6.plugit.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A5C01F0D008C; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:58:56 -0600 Received: from MOM [68.57.138.39] by costumegallery.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A5BC1CE019A; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:58:52 -0600 Message-ID: <00f701c3fb75$1bf544b0$0300a8c0@MOM> From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "h-costume" Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:58:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Plugit.com Electroshield (www.plugit.com) for viruses. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Costumer in NYC X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1P82dSd010810 Status: RO One of our students is looking for a costumer in NYC to make something. Please read below. If interested please email me privately. I live in the NYC area and was wondering if you knew of any good tailors who could custom make a period men's jacket for my boyfriend. He's looking for something post Civil War era and has some photo references of what he wants. Even if they aren't local, someone who might be able to do this remotely could work too... Penny E. Ladnier Owner, The Costume Gallery & Costume Classroom www.costumegallery.com www.costumeclassroom.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 04:48:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1P9m6Sd011518 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 04:48:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P9k7cP000893; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:46:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P9jrLT064897; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:45:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P9joLT064876 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 02:45:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-125-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.125.111]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1P9jjlq010459 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 01:45:48 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040224230822.05be59d0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2004 23:10:56 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: RE: [h-cost] period life perservers, PFDs In-Reply-To: References: <034701c3fb20$a46d7d30$3aea4a43@HELENPINTO> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I may have missed something here. Are those onboard in question > under age? Nope. > I sail on a period vessel. Our safety equipment is all modern and I >would suggest the same to you. It is already. >Our pfds are usually out of sight, but >easily available in need. Our vessel is large (well compared to yours) so >we do have life rafts which are visible when we are underway, as are the man >overboard flotation rings which are connected to bouys with flags. DO NOT >try to make or alter a PFD as they do have to be USCG approved or they are >in violation of the law. We already had that lecture from the Captain. No problem there. What I was wondering, speaking of on-topic, was if there was a way to have period PFDs that were Coast Guard approved. So far, the period ones are nothing like the Coast Guard would approve. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 06:52:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PBq1Sd011884 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 06:52:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PBpHcP005246; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 04:51:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PBpELT002984; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 04:51:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp.suscom.net (smtp.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PBpBLT002976 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 04:51:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from goofy1@suscom.net) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C46E1B643A for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 07:46:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.suscom.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (userweb.suscom.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with SMTP id 21792-04 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 07:46:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from yourzpvq75jcr6 (ip244.97.susc.suscom.net [64.78.97.244]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 43B611B6438 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 07:46:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <08ab01c3fb95$91fdbcd0$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008701c3fa6b$12f6e180$0300a8c0@MOM><0e3301c3facd$87351af0$f4614e40@yourzpvq75jcr6> <00d101c3fb74$03f71b50$0300a8c0@MOM> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Exciting news Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 06:50:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at suscom.net Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Penny Ladnier" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 2:50 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Exciting news > Thank you Dianne! I told Patrick about all of h-costumes' good wishes. He > was so excited and thrilled with everyone's support. Mike T. has been a > wonderful person in inspiring Pat to go to college. Tania has been emailing > Pat about what it is like to go to college in England. She did a semester in > England. All of you have been so wonderful! > > The LIPA students in the program that Pat is going in, started emailing him > yesterday. They are giving him the skinny about the college. What to > expect and such. Guess what Pat's first test will be???? Paul McCartney > plays a concert for the students. His band deliberately messes up the > lights and sound equipment. The students have up until the third song to > fix the problems. If they don't fix it, the band messes up the equipment > more, and the students try again. I don't think Patrick would get this kind > of practical experience at any other college. Geez, what a test. Can I go to school with Patrick? Please? Considering some of the stuff I have seen at McCartney shows, this could be quite a challenge! Dianne > BTW, the only other American student in this tech program... her mother is a > costumer in Chicago who sells to films. The admissions counselor said, "I > think this is becoming of trend with costumers' children in the U.S." > > Penny E. Ladnier /h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 10:00:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PF0LSd012647 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:00:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PEvAcP012402; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 07:57:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PEv0LT069333; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 07:57:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d08.mx.aol.com (imo-d08.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.40]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PEuxLT069290 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 07:56:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from imo-d04.mx.aol.com (imo-d04.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.36]) by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (v93.12) with ESMTP id RELAYIN4-5403cb796161; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:56:22 -0500 Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.15f.2c1a5c06 (17526) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:51:11 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <15f.2c1a5c06.2d6e105f@aol.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:51:11 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/25/2004 1:37:43 AM Central Standard Time, cathy@thyrsus.com writes: Spelling in general was not real stable in the early 16th c., There goes that talent for understatement again LOL -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 10:23:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PFNcSd013138 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:23:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFJEcP014274; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:19:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFJALT080760; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:19:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mxsf07.cluster1.charter.net (mxsf07.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.28.207]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFJ4LT080661 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:19:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from muirgheal@charter.net) Received: from dewshine (cpe-24-196-247-126.spa.sc.charter.com [24.196.247.126]) by mxsf07.cluster1.charter.net (8.12.10/8.12.8) with SMTP id i1PF7VXs080829 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:07:31 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from muirgheal@charter.net) Message-ID: <00ae01c3fbaf$9a7c6cc0$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> From: "Manly Summerfield" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:56:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with jewels" and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black bonnets". This is approximately 1522. I have never heard of a lace gown or a Milan bonnet. Can someone please help me figure out exactly what these garments are? Thank you so much Muirgheal Molann an obair an fear. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 10:36:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PFaCSd013193 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:36:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFY3cP015356; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:34:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFXxLT089405; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:34:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFXvLT089381 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:33:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from brujne@creighton.edu) Received: from cindyabel (cla53081.creighton.edu [147.134.201.2]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_28810+JAGae91741)/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA25396 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:33:56 -0600 (CST) From: "Cindy Abel" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr & spelling Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:33:57 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <15f.2c1a5c06.2d6e105f@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO While literacy was spreading thanks to the printing press, writing was definately optional. Spelling was usually what the word sounded like to the writer which leaves us fascinating clues to varying dialects and even perhaps, variations in pronounciation of the same word depending on its use with different words. No spelling dictionairies left writers free to experiment with spelling, their signatures, etc. It was an exciting time as the English language was starting to come into its own, even if it was for the English alone, and mostly the citizens educated in reading and writing. We also have to remember that being illiterate was not a negative thing--as most people were very literate in day-to-day living skills which were very complex in thought and action. Reading and writing were the preserves of those who could afford to have others do work to leave them free to read and write. Years ago, in a history class, our professor had us read old copies of letters aloud and suggested we pronounce the words as spelled. It does give you a hint of the original author as standardized spelling and grammar often removes. Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 10:40:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PFeZSd013205 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:40:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFducP015840; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:39:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFdrLT093071; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:39:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFdpLT092975 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:39:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f5d.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.93]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id EF9472628A7 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:39:43 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <002801c3fbb5$a36c1e10$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00ae01c3fbaf$9a7c6cc0$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:40:03 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello. As far as the Milan point lace gowns i can tell you that it must be a dress with decorations made of needle laces. At that time, bobbin lace was on its birdh, and needle laces were in fashion. Needle lace is a lace made of one thread and a needle - a sewed lace. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Manly Summerfield" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 3:56 PM Subject: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking about. > I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments during the > age of Henry VIII. > It says that the ladies wore "Milan point lace gowns of white satin" and > "Milan bonnets of gold with jewels" and that other ladies were dressed "like > Indian Women in black bonnets". > This is approximately 1522. > I have never heard of a lace gown or a Milan bonnet. Can someone please help > me figure out exactly what these garments are? > > Thank you so much > Muirgheal > Molann an obair an fear. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 10:43:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PFhZSd013224 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:43:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFgncP016094; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:42:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFglLT094883; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:42:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFggLT094859 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:42:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f5d.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.93]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 3CE8126283C for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:42:41 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <004201c3fbb6$0d9a46e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e901c3fb41$cf3d1a40$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:43:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Kendra. You only need a single petticoat for this silhuette and a small bum roll starting at the mid hip and going back, thickest at the center back. This is the last trace of panner fashion dying out. Wonderfull dress, are you going to make it? Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 2:50 AM Subject: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports > Hi all, > > For those of you who have made 1780s robes a l'anglaise, what do you find > works best for skirt supports? I'm planning to make something along the > lines of this dress: > http://www.metmuseum.org/collections/view1zoom.asp?dep=11&zoom=0&full=1&mark > =2&item=67%2E55%2E1 > > ...and I'm wondering how many under-petticoats I should make, and whether I > should make a bumroll (by which I mean a roll that goes around the back AND > hips) or just a bumpad (back only). > > Any suggestions appreciated! > > Thanks, > > Kendra > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 10:47:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PFlbSd013233 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:47:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFjZcP016324; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:45:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFjYLT096746; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:45:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PFiwLT096325 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 08:44:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f5d.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.93]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 2F04847FE19 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:44:57 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <004801c3fbb6$5ec479a0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040224145439.5900.qmail@web14009.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:45:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi The link worked for me. Interresting to se Catherine Parr in english costume, in the six wifes of Henry VIII she only wears funny duch costume. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catalina Saravia Quicedo" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 3:54 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr > Have they taken this link down? > > > Linda Walton wrote: > > > > > For those who are interested in this period, here > > is a recently-recognised > > > portrait of Catherine Parr, (the wife who survived > > Henry VIII):- > > > > > > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/reports/arts/parr_20040224.shtml > > > destined for the Queens' Chamber at Hever Castle. > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ===== > Seńora Catalina > Aurum peccamenes multifariam texit > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" > your friends today! Download Messenger Now > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com/download/index.html > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 11:19:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PGJ8Sd013316 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:19:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PGGLd3019182; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:17:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PG68LT010281; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:06:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from scc074.its.state.nc.us (scc074.its.state.nc.us [207.4.22.38]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PG65LT010207 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:06:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Ellen.Dappert@ncmail.net) Received: from scc074.its.state.nc.us (127.0.0.1) by scc074.its.state.nc.us (6.5.029) id 401CD58300120217 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:05:54 -0500 Received: from ncmail.net (207.4.90.6) by scc074.its.state.nc.us (6.5.029) id 401CD5800011C0F0 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:05:53 -0500 Message-ID: <403CC7F7.6CD00D0A@ncmail.net> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:06:15 -0500 From: Ellen Dappert Organization: NC-DJJDP / District 26 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200402250752.i1P7q7LU026645@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 3, Issue 126 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > 4. Re: 1780s skirt supports (Joanna Hobbins) > > For the robe a I'anglaise a stiff foundation bodice is essential to obtain > the correct shape and fit. The shape of the dress bodice is determined by > that of the corset; in fact, the shape of the corset may be taken from the > dress bodice pattern. OK...All those who know 18th cent... How do you achieve the proper stiff foundation bodice. I have a good, stiff set of stays, but the bodice of the dress is always floppy. It don't have that wonderful STIFF look, even over the stays. My question is , how do you get it to look so smooth. I've lined my regular day dress with linnen but it still isn't enough. My challenges are 1. I am some what of a dumpling. 2. I want to be reasonably authentic. I want to look like a real thing of the middling sort, not a costume. This is OK for the everyday, slatternly, Hogarth's Gin Lane, I've just walked with the other baggage from Charleston South Carolina, look that I go for at most times, but the 64th is going to England next year for an event, and I don't want to look like I've been dragged backwards through the bushes at the trooping of the colours at the 250th anniversary of the real regiment, when everyone and his brother will be there...and possibly a ROYAL in the form of the honorary Col. of the regiment. Help me please Mia Dappert of HMS 64th of foot., in Charlotte NC _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 12:30:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PHU3Sd013639 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:30:04 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PHTHcP026067; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:29:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PHTALT067396; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:29:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from badger.uvm.edu (badger.uvm.edu [132.198.101.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PHT6LT067354 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:29:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hope.greenberg@uvm.edu) Received: from uvm.edu (ip095111.uvm.edu [132.198.95.111]) by badger.uvm.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PHT5I1019947 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:29:05 -0500 Message-ID: <403CDB60.9040102@uvm.edu> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:29:04 -0500 From: Hope Greenberg User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr References: <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> In-Reply-To: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Some random musings to further muddy the waters: - David Starkley, as evidenced by the amount of time he devotes to her in his book, really seems to like and respect Catherine of Aragon. But he is also quick to comment negatively on her weight/size as she aged. He made much of his early identification of a portrait of a young woman as being that of Catherine of Aragon, so in identifying this portrait as Catherine Parr he may be looking for a second coup. - The headdress, while it is not what we are used to seeing from Holbein, is not impossible even for a rather later date than Starkey is claiming for this portrait. Holbein does depict a number of women in a gable headdress in his second period in England, though they tend to be of the "short" variety. Actually, this hood looks very similar in dimensions, though not in construction, to that worn by Margaret de la Pole. (http://www.geocities.com/anoria_j/Medieval_images/Margaret_de_la_Pole_CountessOfSalisbury.jpg) - While royalty is depicted in ornate brocades and fur, non-royalty clothing (or, if this is Katherine, I suppose that would be pre-royalty!) is generally more simple--solids, maybe a jewel or necklace. - A few dates: Born 1512. Father, Sir Thomas Parr, dies 1517. Mother, Maud Green, does not remarry. She is one of Catherine of Aragon's ladies (dates?). She provides good education for Katherine (and K's brother William) including humanist ideas. Maud dies in 1529. Katherine marries Borough in 1529. He dies shortly thereafter. She marries Lord Latimer in 1533. He dies March 1543. She marries Henry July 1543. He dies Jan 1547. She marries Thomas Seymour, and dies in childbed, 1548. Some articles on the Parr/Jane Grey portrait debate: http://tudorhistory.org/news/portrait.html Katherine was painted by several people. There is the famous debated one mentioned above, the "red dress" portrait and a Horenbout miniature as well as the Lambeth and now the Hever ones (which, though not identical, are certainly similar). Given her acknowledged intelligence and her political astuteness, I wonder if she cultivated portraiture as a form of iconography. - Hope _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 13:14:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PIEZSd013860 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:14:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PIDncP000241; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:13:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PIDhLT098346; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:13:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.pacifier.net (smtp1.pacifier.net [64.255.237.171]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PIDYLT098232 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:13:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.129.82]) by smtp1.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 481726FE71 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:13:33 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:13:34 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Message-ID: <403C754E.15721.258DE5B7@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <00ae01c3fbaf$9a7c6cc0$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking > about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments > during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan > point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with > jewels" and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black > bonnets". This is approximately 1522. I have never heard of a lace > gown or a Milan bonnet. Can someone please help me figure out exactly > what these garments are? A Milan point lace gown would be a gown decorated with Milan point lace (a type of needle lace.) The Milan bonnet is a type of hat which is sort of like a beret with a brim which turns up. Where did you find the passage? Is it a modern description of a picture someone saw or is it a quote from someone who was there (actually written by someone in the same time period.) If I could read it myself in the place where you found it, I might be able to give you more information about it. (Sometimes it's the context which is the most important.) As to "dressed like Indian Women", that's a hard one. It's almost too vague to be helpful. Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 13:29:42 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PITgSd013935 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:29:42 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PISTcP001551; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:28:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PISRLT008674; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:28:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from badger.uvm.edu (badger.uvm.edu [132.198.101.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PISLLT008634 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:28:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hope.greenberg@uvm.edu) Received: from uvm.edu (ip095111.uvm.edu [132.198.95.111]) by badger.uvm.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PISLI1001434 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:28:21 -0500 Message-ID: <403CE942.4020305@uvm.edu> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:28:18 -0500 From: Hope Greenberg User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr References: <200402241902.i1OJ21M0013891@net.indra.com> <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net> <00c401c3fb41$1ced8500$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> In-Reply-To: <00c401c3fb41$1ced8500$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Do you know the broadcast date? Thanks. - Hope Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > You can listen to the actual interview on the BBC's site here: > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/listenagain/ (program 0822) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 13:58:03 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PIw2Sd014058 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:58:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PItUcP003872; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:55:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PItSLT027451; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:55:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav19.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.123]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PItOLT027363 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:55:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:55:19 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav19.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:55:18 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:56:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2004 18:55:19.0056 (UTC) FILETIME=[E9C95100:01C3FBD0] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Vogue 2239 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi, I know this is a little OT, but I'm looking for Vintage Vogue 2239 pattern, in small sizes (10 or 12). If you have one you're willing to part with, if you know a place where I can buy it, or even if you're willing to provide a copy of pattern+instructions (I'd pay for it, of course), I'd be eternally grateful. Yes, I checked eBay. It'll probably show up one of those days, but it hasn't been there the past few days. Thank you. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 14:12:25 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PJCPSd014165 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:12:25 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJ8ncP005215; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:08:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJ8jLT036570; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:08:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJ8gLT036495 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:08:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.8) with ESMTP id 763087 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:08:36 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:08:36 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Vogue 2239 From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Audrey, could you please describe this (year and style) so those of us with a stash of patterns can help you? I bought most of them (some by accident twice), often even out of my size range because I knew someone, sometime would need them. My list is at home, but I could check tonight and let you know tomorrow. LynnD On 2/25/04 10:56 AM, "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" wrote: > Hi, > I know this is a little OT, but I'm looking for Vintage Vogue 2239 pattern, > in small sizes (10 or 12). If you have one you're willing to part with, if > you know a place where I can buy it, or even if you're willing to provide a > copy of pattern+instructions (I'd pay for it, of course), I'd be eternally > grateful. > Yes, I checked eBay. It'll probably show up one of those days, but it hasn't > been there the past few days. > Thank you. > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 14:17:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PJH0Sd014180 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:17:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PIpJcP003497; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:51:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PIpFLT024680; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:51:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp3.pacifier.net (smtp3.pacifier.net [64.255.237.173]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PIpCLT024650 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:51:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.129.82]) by smtp3.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 659796DB10 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:51:10 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:50:54 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Message-ID: <403C7E0E.26833.25B01434@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <200402250238.04616.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I thought she'd survived the birth by several weeks, but yes, I was > wallowing a bit in understatement, even so. :-) Jane lived longer afterward than Katherine Parr. Kat Parr went into labor on August 30 and died on September 3. So, it was only a few days (during which she was febrile and frequently in a paranoid delerium. It sounds like a nasty way to go.) > > It's very difficult to precisely date a portrait from this time > > period using clothing references because there was so much overlap > > in the styles which were being worn, especially from 1520-1540. > > True. In addition, weren't some paintings later copies of earlier > ones that, when originally done, did in fact show a fashionable style? Definitely. This is especially true in paintings, for example of Elizabeth I. There is a book specifically about this written by Roy Strong. > The fact that the clothing shown in the portrait is in a style > fashionable in the late 1520s, and Catherine (or Katherine or > Kateryne) Parr was an appropriate age to be wearing such clothes in > the late 1520s, would not be sufficient to prove that the painting is > of Catherine Parr, since the same would be true of many other > noblewomen of Henry VIII's court (including, for that matter, > Catherine of Aragon). So Starkey rightly looks to other > evidence--namely, the pearls, which he claims are clearly the ones > that Catherine Parr was given. (Since the image of the painting the > BBC ran did not show the pearls very clearly, I have to assume that > they were, somehow, visually distinctive.) Having seen the inventory descriptions, they aren't all that "descriptive." I have to keep reminding myself that they were written by men who were just there to make sure that what belonged to the King was there. These men may not have had any fashion sense at all. (I can just see them saying "yep, that necklace with the 100 pearls seems to be in its box." Just watch or listen to store people inventorying and you'll get what I'm imagining.) It's not like they wrote things like "a pearl necklace of X # of pearls ranging in size from Y to Z in a graduated fashion." They are more like: "A lace for the neck conteyning C perles onelie" which is item 2690 in Henry's inventory. How many other women in other families might have had a necklace of 100 pearls? That's not really all that descriptive. (Some of the enameled chains, on the otherhand, are a bit more distinctive: "Item a Cheyne conteyning xxvij peces of golde in euery of them ij litle Turkeys and xxvij litle perles.") > > (By the way, most of the "Catherines" in the early 16th C spelled > > their name "Kateryne" when they were signing. Later people tended to > > change them to the now more familiar "Catherine" or "Katherine.") > > Spelling in general was not real stable in the early 16th c., so I did > not concern myself with which variations of the name I used in > answering these posts. :-) I just find it interesting that history never uses the names by which the Queens actually signed their names. In almost every history book I've ever seen, the Katherines of Henry VIII's life were all spelled either Katherine or Catherine, neither of which would have been used in their time period. ;) (And these queens pretty consistently spelled their names the same way each time, unlike Shakespeare who seemed to do different spellings just for fun, yet everyone always uses him as an example of how names in period were always spelled in many ways by the same person.) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 14:17:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PJHtSd014187 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:17:55 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJFlcP005792; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:15:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJFiLT041158; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:15:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu (kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu [169.147.4.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJFgLT041077 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:15:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ckinsey@kumc.edu) Received: from KUMC-SMTPOUT-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:15:35 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:15:22 -0600 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Portrait of Catherine Parr X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO - A few dates: Born 1512. Father, Sir Thomas Parr, dies 1517. Mother, Maud Green, does not remarry. She is one of Catherine of Aragon's ladies (dates?). She provides good education for Katherine (and K's brother William) including humanist ideas. Maud dies in 1529. Katherine marries Borough in 1529. He dies shortly thereafter. She marries Lord Latimer in 1533. He dies March 1543. She marries Henry July 1543. He dies Jan 1547. She marries Thomas Seymour, and dies in childbed, 1548. - Hope >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have to agree that this new portrait just doesn't look 'right' for Catherine Parr. If the pearls are one of the identifying marks, perhaps it is of Catherine Parr's mother? Catherine (that's my spelling and I'm sticking to it :) ) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 14:37:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PJbTSd014283 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:37:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJXncP007323; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:33:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJXhLT054191; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:33:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from chori.chori.org (mail.chori.org [209.77.137.59]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJXWLT054014 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:33:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from LDownward@chori.org) X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Received: from [172.19.1.35] ([172.19.1.35] verified) by chori.chori.org (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.1.8) with ESMTP id 763212 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:33:26 -0800 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.1.4.030702.0 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:33:25 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Vogue 2239 From: Lynn Downward To: h costume Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO That's (of course) one I didn't buy because it would look so dreadful on me and there are so many modern dress patterns that look the same. I'm actually making something very similar for my daughter's prom dress from a black silk satin with white. I'm maaking the skirt and bodice separate and adding godots to the skirt back (thanks to the current Threads magazine) so it hangs large in the back and straight in the front (my daughter's terms). Sorry I can't help. LynnD On 2/25/04 11:21 AM, "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" wrote: > I've just found out that, even though the Vintage patterns are not in my > local fabric stores' catalogues, the pattern is still in the online catalog. > If I can't find it anywhere else, I can still order online (even if it's > really expensive). It's a major relief :-) > > Here's the address, so you can take a look > http://tinyurl.com/3xnyy > > The long address > http://store.sewingtoday.com/cgi-bin/voguepatterns/shop.cgi?s.item.2239=x&TI=' > 2239'&pageNum=1&M=&UK=30825611 > > It's 1950 evening dress. > It's described as MISSES' DRESS, BELT & SASH > Dress, floor length, has bias band, close-fitting, boned, lined > bodice, inside belt, flared skirt, back zipper, belt and double-layered > sash. Purchased petticoat. B: contrast bodice/band. > > >> Audrey, could you please describe this (year and style) > >>> Hi, >>> I know this is a little OT, but I'm looking for Vintage Vogue 2239 > pattern, >>> in small sizes (10 or 12). If you have one you're willing to part with, > if >>> you know a place where I can buy it, or even if you're willing to > provide a >>> copy of pattern+instructions (I'd pay for it, of course), I'd be > eternally >>> grateful. >>> Yes, I checked eBay. It'll probably show up one of those days, but it > hasn't >>> been there the past few days. >>> Thank you. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 14:37:35 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PJbYSd014286 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:37:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJRpcP006830; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:27:51 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJRkLT050367; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:27:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay9-dav64.bay9.hotmail.com [64.4.46.199]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PJRhLT050298 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:27:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from audreybmorin2@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 11:27:38 -0800 Received: from 66.130.28.116 by bay9-dav64.bay9.hotmail.com with DAV; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:27:38 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [66.130.28.116] X-Originating-Email: [audreybmorin2@hotmail.com] X-Sender: audreybmorin2@hotmail.com From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Vogue 2239 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:21:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2004 19:27:38.0458 (UTC) FILETIME=[6DC293A0:01C3FBD5] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I've just found out that, even though the Vintage patterns are not in my local fabric stores' catalogues, the pattern is still in the online catalog. If I can't find it anywhere else, I can still order online (even if it's really expensive). It's a major relief :-) Here's the address, so you can take a look http://tinyurl.com/3xnyy The long address http://store.sewingtoday.com/cgi-bin/voguepatterns/shop.cgi?s.item.2239=x&TI='2239'&pageNum=1&M=&UK=30825611 It's 1950 evening dress. It's described as MISSES' DRESS, BELT & SASH Dress, floor length, has bias band, close-fitting, boned, lined bodice, inside belt, flared skirt, back zipper, belt and double-layered sash. Purchased petticoat. B: contrast bodice/band. > Audrey, could you please describe this (year and style) > > Hi, > > I know this is a little OT, but I'm looking for Vintage Vogue 2239 pattern, > > in small sizes (10 or 12). If you have one you're willing to part with, if > > you know a place where I can buy it, or even if you're willing to provide a > > copy of pattern+instructions (I'd pay for it, of course), I'd be eternally > > grateful. > > Yes, I checked eBay. It'll probably show up one of those days, but it hasn't > > been there the past few days. > > Thank you. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 15:22:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PKMKSd015333 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:22:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PKLMcP011136; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:21:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PKKJLT089962; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:21:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mxsf02.cluster1.charter.net (mxsf02.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.28.202]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PKKGLT089883 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:20:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from muirgheal@charter.net) Received: from dewshine (cpe-24-196-247-126.spa.sc.charter.com [24.196.247.126]) by mxsf02.cluster1.charter.net (8.12.10/8.12.8) with SMTP id i1PK2wQE069623 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:02:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from muirgheal@charter.net) Message-ID: <002901c3fbd8$402cee60$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> From: "Manly Summerfield" To: "Historical Costume" References: <403C754E.15721.258DE5B7@localhost> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:47:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I read the quote in Alison Weir's Henry VIII The King and his Court. I came across an almost identical description (This is from the Chateu Vert pagaent given in honor of the betrothal of Princess Mary and Emperor Charles) in the fiction book, The Other Boleyn - which Im reading in the carpool line at school. Weir sites her source as "Letters and Papers, Foreign and Domestic, of the Reign of Henry VIII, 1509-1603. Im in the process of trying to track an additional source. Muirgheal ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 1:13 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > > > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking > > about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments > > during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan > > point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with > > jewels" and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black > > bonnets". This is approximately 1522. I have never heard of a lace > > gown or a Milan bonnet. Can someone please help me figure out exactly > > what these garments are? > > A Milan point lace gown would be a gown decorated with Milan point > lace (a type of needle lace.) > > The Milan bonnet is a type of hat which is sort of like a beret with > a brim which turns up. > > Where did you find the passage? Is it a modern description of a > picture someone saw or is it a quote from someone who was there > (actually written by someone in the same time period.) If I could > read it myself in the place where you found it, I might be able to > give you more information about it. (Sometimes it's the context which > is the most important.) > > As to "dressed like Indian Women", that's a hard one. It's almost too > vague to be helpful. > > Kat > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 15:32:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PKWlSd015487 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:32:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PKTIcP011916; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:29:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PKTGLT096624; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:29:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PKTALT096536 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:29:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be17.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.23]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id D22E947FE61 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:29:05 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000c01c3fbde$1389df20$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:29:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] bodice smothness X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1PKWlSd015487 Status: RO How do you achieve the proper stiff foundation bodice. I have a good, stiff set of stays, but the bodice of the dress is always floppy. It What type of dress is it you are talking about. Is it a robe francaise with back pleats? When you drape your bodice over the stays, you should keep the fabric tight and smooth all over. If your bodice always is floppy as you call it, then you have made it two big! When you construkt the bodice over your stays, then you shall stretch the fabric smooth all over and make the bodice assembley. Then sew together the pieces and try again to fit it over your stays. Then your bodice gets errect, smooth and beautifull. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 15:44:01 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PKi0Sd019890 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:44:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PKedcP013001; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:40:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PKebLT005343; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:40:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web61104.mail.yahoo.com (web61104.mail.yahoo.com [216.155.196.106]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1PKeULT005230 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:40:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dragonwolfcat@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040225203338.43535.qmail@web61104.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [146.82.36.102] by web61104.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:33:38 PST Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:33:38 -0800 (PST) From: "Angharad ver' Reynulf" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Semi-OT: Pattern Filing To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I keep patterns in 9" x 12" manila envelopes, which are then stored in file cabinets that I picked up used for really cheap. (Tacoma and Seattle got hit badly by the "dot com bomb" a while back) I put the original pattern envelope in sheet protectors and have several 3 ring binders sorted by clothing type. The file cabinets live in the basement, along with all of the shelving holding the fabric hoard not currently being worked on, 2 file cabinets holding my scraps, 1 more holding my yarns and magazines and clippings. I just picked up hanging files to sort out all of my piles of research-so that those may be easier to access. Now I simply need to get them done before Friday and the stepsons come over and need that bed to sleep on! (oy, and this weekend's the sewing expo too!) Angharad / Jonnalyhn Wolfcat __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 16:04:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PL4oSd020189 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:04:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PL3scP015104; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:03:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PL2bLT020630; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:02:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PL2YLU020582 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:02:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1PLTmWm015824 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:29:49 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.124] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AD6D853D0148; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:02:37 -0500 Message-ID: <001d01c3fbe3$69eb92a0$7c5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <403C754E.15721.258DE5B7@localhost> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:07:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO "Indian women"...dare I ask East or West? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 1:13 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > > > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking > > about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments > > during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan > > point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with > > jewels" and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black > > bonnets". This is approximately 1522. I have never heard of a lace > > gown or a Milan bonnet. Can someone please help me figure out exactly > > what these garments are? > > A Milan point lace gown would be a gown decorated with Milan point > lace (a type of needle lace.) > > The Milan bonnet is a type of hat which is sort of like a beret with > a brim which turns up. > > Where did you find the passage? Is it a modern description of a > picture someone saw or is it a quote from someone who was there > (actually written by someone in the same time period.) If I could > read it myself in the place where you found it, I might be able to > give you more information about it. (Sometimes it's the context which > is the most important.) > > As to "dressed like Indian Women", that's a hard one. It's almost too > vague to be helpful. > > Kat > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 16:43:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PLhxSd020490 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:43:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PLgBcP018272; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:42:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PLenLT047086; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:40:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mxsf26.cluster1.charter.net (mxsf26.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.28.226]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PLehLT046970 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:40:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from muirgheal@charter.net) Received: from dewshine (cpe-24-196-247-126.spa.sc.charter.com [24.196.247.126]) by mxsf26.cluster1.charter.net (8.12.10/8.12.8) with SMTP id i1PLV53c047773 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:31:05 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from muirgheal@charter.net) Message-ID: <001601c3fbe6$a16b00a0$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> From: "Manly Summerfield" To: "Historical Costume" References: <403C754E.15721.258DE5B7@localhost> <001d01c3fbe3$69eb92a0$7c5183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:30:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Considering this was 1522 . .it could have been either. Id assume they are talking "American" Indians as these ladies were depicted as being "evil" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > "Indian women"...dare I ask East or West? > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 1:13 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > > > > > > > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking > > > about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments > > > during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan > > > point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with > > > jewels" and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black > > > bonnets". This is approximately 1522. I have never heard of a lace > > > gown or a Milan bonnet. Can someone please help me figure out exactly > > > what these garments are? > > > > A Milan point lace gown would be a gown decorated with Milan point > > lace (a type of needle lace.) > > > > The Milan bonnet is a type of hat which is sort of like a beret with > > a brim which turns up. > > > > Where did you find the passage? Is it a modern description of a > > picture someone saw or is it a quote from someone who was there > > (actually written by someone in the same time period.) If I could > > read it myself in the place where you found it, I might be able to > > give you more information about it. (Sometimes it's the context which > > is the most important.) > > > > As to "dressed like Indian Women", that's a hard one. It's almost too > > vague to be helpful. > > > > Kat > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 17:07:17 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PM7HSd020628 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:07:17 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PM6YcP020822; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:06:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PM5ELT063998; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:05:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d10.mx.aol.com (imo-d10.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.42]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PM5CLT063919 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:05:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com (imo-d03.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.35]) by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (v92.16) with ESMTP id RELAYIN4-5403d1aae143; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:59:10 1900 Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.27.51ab513c (25508) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:53:53 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <27.51ab513c.2d6e7370@aol.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:53:52 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] bodice smothness To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/25/2004 2:30:09 PM Central Standard Time, drewscph@post12.tele.dk writes: Then sew together the pieces and try again to fit it over your stays. Then your bodice gets errect, smooth and beautifull. Bjarne This is very true. In addendum, I just wanted to add: There were various methods used in various periods to stiffenup bodice fabrics like silk. Most of these methods are not something that we would want or be able to duplicate now (stiffening with glue or minerals, for example). If you just want to add a bit of body to a fabric that drapes in a lovely manner for the skirts but just seems too thin or *floppy* in the bodice, try a featherweight fusible interfacing. The featherweight is enough to just add a little body to a thin or fine fabric, without being detectible once the garment is made. -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 17:11:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PMBXSd020637 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:11:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PM9jcP021186; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:09:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PM8RLT066375; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:08:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PM8OLT066342 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:08:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from claudine_on_the_net@yahoo.com) Received: from flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.232]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1PHVC501303 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:31:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from h-68-164-155-223.snvacaid.dynamic.covad.net ([68.164.155.223] helo=GABRIEL.yahoo.com) by flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Aw2sI-0000j0-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:31:11 -0800 Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.0.20040225092304.029e0830@pop.mail.yahoo.com> X-Sender: claudine_on_the_net@pop.mail.yahoo.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:28:54 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Claudine Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.2.20040224091822.01955d98@postoffice8.mail.cornell .edu> References: <5.2.1.1.2.20040223082833.00bbbea8@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> <5.2.1.1.2.20040224091822.01955d98@postoffice8.mail.cornell.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Bridgette, That's perfect! I understand now what you mean. Thanks also for finding this page, I'm collecting links to pages with instructions for stitches. I didn't know openwork was done in the late 1500s. I thought the decorations on collars and cuffs were just variations on lace. I'll file that under "new thing I learned this week." :) Thanks everyone for all the help! Claudine At 06:28 AM 2/24/2004, you wrote: >Hi there... sorry for the lousy ASCII art... didn't mean to confuse >things. I'll try my best to explain ... > Something you might want to look for is a reference to > "hemstitch" or "Venetian hemstitch" or "Open hemstitch" > >ok... I'll give this a whirl... > >(20 minutes later... ) ok that didn't work... try this >http://www.embroideryden.com.au/embroidery_stitch_guide.htm scroll down >to "hemstitch" > >best of luck. >Bridgette - who just can't seem to describe this stitch ; > > > > > >>I like the idea of a turned hem with a bit of >>openwork, but I don't understand how I would >>accomplish that. When I do a hem I end up with little >>stitches on the outside of the garment that are >>basically perpendicular the the hem edge; I don't see >>how that converts to openwork. Bridgette, from your >>ASCII drawing, are you saying that I should throw in a >>horizontal stitch between the normal, slanted heming >>stitches? Would that be enough to create holes in the >>fabric, or should I pull threads out parallel to the >>hem? Sorry for all the questions, but I've only ever >>read about openwork and have never done it. > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 17:45:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PMjNSd020818 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:45:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PMidcP025677; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:44:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PMhKLT091722; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:43:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m08.lax.untd.com (m08.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.71]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1PMgHLT090784 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:43:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"QHEuP/IhRKUiOZTU6Ir/Ovq0IsN57R7Ai6hDGl09ERI=">; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:34:49 PST Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m08.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JN9344QJ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:34:49 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:31:12 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Portrait of Catherine Parr Message-ID: <20040225.143342.1256.1.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-8,10-11 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > I have to agree that this new portrait just doesn't look 'right' for > Catherine Parr. If the pearls are one of the identifying marks, > perhaps > it is of Catherine Parr's mother? > > Catherine > (that's my spelling and I'm sticking to it :) ) I wondered about that too. The fashion looks too old to my untrained eyes. Gabled headdresses that late? Arlys ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 17:51:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PMpVSd020864 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:51:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PMnmcP026410; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:49:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PMmXLT095788; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:48:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PMd4LT088258 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:39:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from brujne@creighton.edu) Received: from cindyabel (cla53081.creighton.edu [147.134.201.2]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_28810+JAGae91741)/8.9.3) with SMTP id QAA15265 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:39:03 -0600 (CST) From: "Cindy Abel" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:39:02 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <001601c3fbe6$a16b00a0$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Status: RO > > > > > > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking > > > about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments > > > during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan > > > point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with > > > jewels" My guess is that the Milan point lace gowns and Milan bonnets refers to Italian-style as worn in Milan(or English interpretation of Milan fashions), Italy. I would suggest finding a book on the history of lace as there is still a lot of controversy as to when lace became used as we know it. Garments described as all or in part as lace or laced could also be interpreted as garments with lacing fastening and/or trim, rather than decorative lace as we know it. The lace could also be more of what we know of as a braid trim--see early neck ruffs for examples. and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black > > > bonnets". As this is 1522, I would suspect that this more likely refers to women of India and/or Asia although of course, it could refer to those of Spanish and Portuguese-occupied America as imagined by those creating the look of the masque--Master of the Revels and his assistants or just the court ladies creating their costumes. The Indian bonnets certainly doesn't refer to North American Indian war bonnets, but could have been either a filtered down fashion from India/Asia which was seen by Western Europe as far away exotic lands that were the source of most spicies, silks, perfumes and other trade goods the Western European wealthy hankered after. The bonnets could have been purely made-up headwear for a fantasy effect. Remember, this was a court masque, where the known historic and present was mixed freely with fantasy and imagination to produce a rich otherworld that only the priviledged could inhabit. See information on the court masques created under James I by Inigo Jones for examples of such fantastic masque costume at a later date. They bear little actual resemblance to what they refer to, whether St. George and the Dragon or men and women of distant lands. And there was always interpretation of supposed animals and flora and fauna of distant places when the real thing wasn't available for display. Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 18:23:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PNNMSd021080 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:23:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNLGcP029154; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:21:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNJuLT017857; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:19:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from citrine.spiritone.com (citrine.spiritone.com [216.99.193.133]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNJsLU017826 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:19:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by citrine.spiritone.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1PNLQBh030921 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:21:27 -0800 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:21:27 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 In-Reply-To: <002901c3fbd8$402cee60$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Just a warning about the Letters and Papers - I found out after trying to ILL it that it is a 21 volume set. Assuming we are talking about the same ones here. Portland State University has most of the Volumes and University of Oregon has them all. Regina Romsey > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Manly Summerfield > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 11:47 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help deciphering a source (Tudor) > > > I read the quote in Alison Weir's Henry VIII The King and his > Court. I came > across an almost identical description (This is from the Chateu > Vert pagaent > given in honor of the betrothal of Princess Mary and Emperor > Charles) in the > fiction book, The Other Boleyn - which Im reading in the carpool line at > school. Weir sites her source as "Letters and Papers, Foreign and > Domestic, > of the Reign of Henry VIII, 1509-1603. Im in the process of > trying to track > an additional source. > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 18:25:14 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PNPESd021085 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:25:14 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNNxcP029415; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:23:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNMhLT019737; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:22:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from rad.ess.washington.edu (rad.ess.washington.edu [128.95.233.174]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNLMLU018765 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:21:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from handcock@rad.ess.washington.edu) Received: from rad.ess.washington.edu (rad [127.0.0.1]) by rad.ess.washington.edu (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1PNLJ10027342; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:21:19 -0800 Received: from localhost (handcock@localhost) by rad.ess.washington.edu (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i1PNLJRx027338; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:21:19 -0800 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:21:19 -0800 (PST) From: handcock@rad.ess.washington.edu To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] who is here/regular clothes Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Rebecca Handcock X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 AnnBWass@aol.com wrote: > > handcock@rad.ess.washington.edu writes: > > but now days I only have time for costuming research and > > sewing everyday clothes. > I really don't think sewing daywear is economical anymore, especially when > one figures in the cost of one's labor. Hi Ann, While you are absolutely correct about the cost of sewing ordinary clothes compared to buying them, what I can't get, at even medium-high cost, are clothes that fit. I don't have a standard size, so I either have to wear badly-fitting clothes, or make them myself. I am not even that big, but I have had snooty 16 y-olds look me up and down in places like Banana Republic, and say that they don't sell 'MY' size in-store. The items that I make tend to me the ones that are hard to buy ready-made and well-fitting, like pants or Oscar-night-style evening gowns. And these tend to have 18th century silhouettes and fully boned under-structures ;-) Things like simple tops, underwear etc, I just purchase. The other aspect is style, since finding funky/interesting clothes that also fit is even more difficult. I subscribe to the idea that anyone can look wonderful if they only dress in well-fitting clothes which accent their positives. This is an interesting topic though, since I think that many people here face this issue. Rebecca _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 18:37:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PNbiSd021144 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:37:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNafcP000567; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:36:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNZMLT027961; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:35:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNZHLT027894 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:35:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from brujne@creighton.edu) Received: from cindyabel (cla53081.creighton.edu [147.134.201.2]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_28810+JAGae91741)/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA04390 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:35:16 -0600 (CST) From: "Cindy Abel" To: "h-costume@indra. com" Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:35:17 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] New Hans Holbein book upcoming X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I just preordered a new book at Amazon.com Entitled "Hans Holbein the Younger: Painter at the Court of Henry VIII" it highlights the work of Holbein during his English sojourn. In hardcover, it promises to be generously illustrated and the cover on the website is the portrait of the year old future Edward VI by Holbein. Choose Super Saver Shipping and it can be yours for $31.50, rather than $45 +ship. Appox ship date is Apr 6th(my birthday--so this is my Happy Birthday to Me present). With the current discussion of Katherine Parr on this list, this book may be of interest to some. Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 18:51:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1PNpBSd021201 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:51:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNiWcP001249; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:44:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNhcLT033287; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:43:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m28.mx.aol.com (imo-m28.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.9]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1PNhaLT033228 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:43:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-m28.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.a8.28a1750e (4262) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:38:13 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:38:12 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] New Hans Holbein book upcoming To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/25/2004 5:37:26 PM Central Standard Time, brujne@creighton.edu writes: With the current discussion of Katherine Parr on this list, this book may be of interest to some. Cindy Abel Thanks so much for sharing that, I'll definitely be pre-ordering that one!!! -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 20:03:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q13SSd021725 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:03:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q11dcP006419; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:01:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q11WLT077674; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:01:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from thrednedlestrete.com (mail02.enterhost.com [69.93.13.234]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q11ULT077509 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:01:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:01:14 -0600 Message-Id: <200402251901.AA29753544@thrednedlestrete.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? X-Mailer: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO well now I'm confused, this hemstich illustration is one that would leave fringed edges. I've tried a narrow hem with a blanket stitch over the top. This way the edge is finished. I've interpreted some portraits with blackworked sleeves has having this type of finish. Lisa Sinervo ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Claudine Reply-To: Historical Costume Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:28:54 -0800 >Hi Bridgette, > >That's perfect! I understand now what you mean. Thanks also for finding >this page, I'm collecting links to pages with instructions for stitches. > >I didn't know openwork was done in the late 1500s. I thought the >decorations on collars and cuffs were just variations on lace. I'll file >that under "new thing I learned this week." :) > >Thanks everyone for all the help! > > > >Claudine > >At 06:28 AM 2/24/2004, you wrote: > >>Hi there... sorry for the lousy ASCII art... didn't mean to confuse >>things. I'll try my best to explain ... >> Something you might want to look for is a reference to >> "hemstitch" or "Venetian hemstitch" or "Open hemstitch" >> >>ok... I'll give this a whirl... >> >>(20 minutes later... ) ok that didn't work... try this >>http://www.embroideryden.com.au/embroidery_stitch_guide.htm scroll down >>to "hemstitch" >> >>best of luck. >>Bridgette - who just can't seem to describe this stitch ; > >> >> >> >> >>>I like the idea of a turned hem with a bit of >>>openwork, but I don't understand how I would >>>accomplish that. When I do a hem I end up with little >>>stitches on the outside of the garment that are >>>basically perpendicular the the hem edge; I don't see >>>how that converts to openwork. Bridgette, from your >>>ASCII drawing, are you saying that I should throw in a >>>horizontal stitch between the normal, slanted heming >>>stitches? Would that be enough to create holes in the >>>fabric, or should I pull threads out parallel to the >>>hem? Sorry for all the questions, but I've only ever >>>read about openwork and have never done it. >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 20:45:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q1jKSd021875 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:45:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q1hMcP009154; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:43:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q1hHLT097241; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:43:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.130]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q1hFLT097226 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:43:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hpinto@mindspring.com) Received: from heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net (heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.189]) by soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1Q0wF918367 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:58:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-67.74.234.70.dial1.baltimore1.level3.net ([67.74.234.70] helo=HELENPINTO) by heron.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Aw9qv-0000YI-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:58:14 -0800 Message-ID: <00b301c3fc03$9a4217b0$46ea4a43@HELENPINTO> From: "Helen Pinto" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:57:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-ELNK-Trace: f3dec0b0682ec1505e89bb4777695beb702e37df12b9c9ef49db43353a1822ed8310ac5614bbfc75350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Cindy wrote: Garments described as all or in part as lace or laced could also be interpreted as garments with lacing fastening and/or trim, rather than decorative lace as we know it. The lace could also be more of what we know of as a braid trim--see early neck ruffs for examples. I have to second that, as a narrow-wares weaver. The instructions for finger-looped braids from Harleian 2320- "Directions for Making Many Sorts of Laces" (15th c. English) refers to all the braids as laces, of various patterns and thicknesses. (The number of looped threads used were called bowes, hence "a lace of five bowes" or "a lace of eight bowes", etc.) -Helen/Aidan _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 20:59:18 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q1xISd021983 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:59:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q1LncP007883; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:21:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q1LHLT087347; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:21:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.241]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q1LFLT087325 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:21:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cahuff@mindspring.com) Received: from maynard.mail.mindspring.net (maynard.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.243]) by fallback02.mail.atl.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1Q0Pee06891 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:25:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from user-2inilh2.dialup.mindspring.com ([165.121.86.34] helo=[165.121.82.181]) by maynard.mail.mindspring.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1Aw9LO-0006p3-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:25:39 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200402252245.i1PMjULV093389@net.indra.com> References: <200402252245.i1PMjULV093389@net.indra.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:25:28 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: fastusminimus Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: bodice stiffening X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 3:45 PM -0700 2/25/04, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: >these methods are not something that we would want or be able to duplicate now >(stiffening with glue or minerals, for example). If you just want to add a Ya know, you could try Elmer's School glue--washes out with water/soap, stiffens like a charm (makes *excellent* warp sizing for a delicate, fine warp--7 yards of fine single handspun--NO breaks!!!) and then leaves nicely when asked.... Minerals, I have no clue... Ta Carol, who does low life 18 cent servant scum in hand me downs One day I'll have the courage to cut into the good cloth.... -- Creative Clutter is Better Than Idle Neatness! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 21:05:50 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q25nSd022032 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:05:50 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q253cP010591; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:05:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q24wLT006970; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:04:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp802.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp802.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.181]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1Q24uLT006946 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:04:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.145.28 with login) by smtp802.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2004 01:57:35 -0000 Message-ID: <007101c3fc0b$e4099960$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402241902.i1OJ21M0013891@net.indra.com> <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net><00c401c3fb41$1ced8500$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <403CE942.4020305@uvm.edu> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:57:29 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sorry -- it was yesterday, so Feb. 24 2004. - Kendra ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hope Greenberg" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr > Do you know the broadcast date? Thanks. > > - Hope > > Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > > You can listen to the actual interview on the BBC's site here: > > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/today/listenagain/ (program 0822) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 21:08:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q28USd022043 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:08:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q27ccP010729; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:07:38 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q27cLT008138; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:07:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q27YLU008110 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:07:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1Q2YqWm019464 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:34:52 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.120] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A4E9B1F600E0; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:07:37 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c3fc0e$05c76080$785183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:12:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Some good points here I think...especially the Inigo Jones comment re the fantasy connection. I have a vivid image of a 'feather costume'... And the Asian influences in head gear were certainly not London or Paris! kATHLEEN Message ----- From: "Cindy Abel" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 5:39 PM Subject: RE: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking > > > > about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments > > > > during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan > > > > point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with > > > > jewels" > > My guess is that the Milan point lace gowns and Milan bonnets refers to > Italian-style as worn in Milan(or English interpretation of Milan fashions), > Italy. I would suggest finding a book on the history of lace as there is > still a lot of controversy as to when lace became used as we know it. > Garments described as all or in part as lace or laced could also be > interpreted as garments with lacing fastening and/or trim, rather than > decorative lace as we know it. The lace could also be more of what we know > of as a braid trim--see early neck ruffs for examples. > > and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black > > > > bonnets". > > As this is 1522, I would suspect that this more likely refers to women of > India and/or Asia although of course, it could refer to those of Spanish and > Portuguese-occupied America as imagined by those creating the look of the > masque--Master of the Revels and his assistants or just the court ladies > creating their costumes. The Indian bonnets certainly doesn't refer to > North American Indian war bonnets, but could have been either a filtered > down fashion from India/Asia which was seen by Western Europe as far away > exotic lands that were the source of most spicies, silks, perfumes and other > trade goods the Western European wealthy hankered after. The bonnets could > have been purely made-up headwear for a fantasy effect. > > Remember, this was a court masque, where the known historic and present was > mixed freely with fantasy and imagination to produce a rich otherworld that > only the priviledged could inhabit. See information on the court masques > created under James I by Inigo Jones for examples of such fantastic masque > costume at a later date. They bear little actual resemblance to what they > refer to, whether St. George and the Dragon or men and women of distant > lands. And there was always interpretation of supposed animals and flora > and fauna of distant places when the real thing wasn't available for > display. > > Cindy Abel > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 21:26:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q2QuSd022115 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:26:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2QDcP011575; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:26:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2QALT015824; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:26:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2Q5LU015782 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:26:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2RK8v028945 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:27:20 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1Q2RKt9028943 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:27:20 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:27:20 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> <403C7E0E.26833.25B01434@localhost> In-Reply-To: <403C7E0E.26833.25B01434@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402252127.20046.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wednesday 25 February 2004 01:50 pm, kat@grendal.rain.com wrote: > > I thought she'd survived the birth by several weeks, but yes, I was > > wallowing a bit in understatement, even so. :-) > > Jane lived longer afterward than Katherine Parr. Kat Parr went into > labor on August 30 and died on September 3. So, it was only a few > days (during which she was febrile and frequently in a paranoid > delerium. It sounds like a nasty way to go.) Yes it does. I probably knew this, once, but it's been a long time since my initial craze for the life and times of Henry VIII and his contemporaries. > > > It's very difficult to precisely date a portrait from this time > > > period using clothing references because there was so much overlap > > > in the styles which were being worn, especially from 1520-1540. > > > > True. In addition, weren't some paintings later copies of earlier > > ones that, when originally done, did in fact show a fashionable style? > > Definitely. This is especially true in paintings, for example of > Elizabeth I. There is a book specifically about this written by Roy > Strong. I believe it. > > > The fact that the clothing shown in the portrait is in a style > > fashionable in the late 1520s, and Catherine (or Katherine or > > Kateryne) Parr was an appropriate age to be wearing such clothes in > > the late 1520s, would not be sufficient to prove that the painting is > > of Catherine Parr, since the same would be true of many other > > noblewomen of Henry VIII's court (including, for that matter, > > Catherine of Aragon). So Starkey rightly looks to other > > evidence--namely, the pearls, which he claims are clearly the ones > > that Catherine Parr was given. (Since the image of the painting the > > BBC ran did not show the pearls very clearly, I have to assume that > > they were, somehow, visually distinctive.) > > Having seen the inventory descriptions, they aren't all that > "descriptive." I have to keep reminding myself that they were written > by men who were just there to make sure that what belonged to the > King was there. These men may not have had any fashion sense at all. > (I can just see them saying "yep, that necklace with the 100 pearls > seems to be in its box." Just watch or listen to store people > inventorying and you'll get what I'm imagining.) Maybe he wasn't working off of an inventory description. I suppose it's possible that the necklace in question still exists, and can be seen and visually compared to what the lady in the portrait wears. Though I'm still skeptical--the necklace I see appears to be a simple strand; how is it possible to say that it shows Catherine's pearl necklace? > > It's not like they wrote things like "a pearl necklace of X # of > pearls ranging in size from Y to Z in a graduated fashion." They are > more like: "A lace for the neck conteyning C perles onelie" which is > item 2690 in Henry's inventory. How many other women in other > families might have had a necklace of 100 pearls? That's not really > all that descriptive. (Some of the enameled chains, on the otherhand, > are a bit more distinctive: "Item a Cheyne conteyning xxvij peces of > golde in euery of them ij litle Turkeys and xxvij litle perles.") Now that kind of chain is what I call distinctive. :-) > > > > (By the way, most of the "Catherines" in the early 16th C spelled > > > their name "Kateryne" when they were signing. Later people tended to > > > change them to the now more familiar "Catherine" or "Katherine.") > > > > Spelling in general was not real stable in the early 16th c., so I did > > not concern myself with which variations of the name I used in > > answering these posts. :-) > > I just find it interesting that history never uses the names by which > the Queens actually signed their names. It would be a kindness in many cases, considering how many Catherines of note there were in that time period. >In almost every history book > I've ever seen, the Katherines of Henry VIII's life were all spelled > either Katherine or Catherine, neither of which would have been used > in their time period. ;) (And these queens pretty consistently > spelled their names the same way each time, unlike Shakespeare who > seemed to do different spellings just for fun, yet everyone always > uses him as an example of how names in period were always spelled in > many ways by the same person.) Interesting. I did not know the ladies in question were that consistent. Thank you. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 21:35:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q2ZTSd022153 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:35:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2WJcP011890; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:32:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2WGLT018440; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:32:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2WBLU018392 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:32:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2XZ8v029060 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:33:35 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1Q2XZuV029058 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:33:35 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:33:35 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <15f.2c1a5c06.2d6e105f@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <15f.2c1a5c06.2d6e105f@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402252133.35286.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wednesday 25 February 2004 09:51 am, Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/25/2004 1:37:43 AM Central Standard Time, > cathy@thyrsus.com writes: > Spelling in general was not real stable in the early 16th c., > > > There goes that talent for understatement again LOL :-) :-) :-) :-) No comment. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 21:44:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q2iSSd022196 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:44:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2gTcP012457; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:42:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2gQLT022585; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:42:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1Q2gNLT022554 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:42:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.145.28 with login) by smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2004 02:35:43 -0000 Message-ID: <001501c3fc11$3793e9f0$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:35:37 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Fw: [18cWoman] 18th Century Clothing Exhibit at the Met X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sounds exciting! - Kendra ----- Original Message ----- From: "K.Hewitt" To: <18cWoman@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 11:46 AM Subject: [18cWoman] 18th Century Clothing Exhibit at the Met > Dangerous Liaisons: Fashion and Furniture in the > 18th Century > > April 29, 2004-August 8, 2004 > The European Sculpture and Decorative Arts > Galleries > > Dangerous Liaisons focuses on dress and its > aesthetic interplay with art, furniture, and the > broader decorative arts between 1750 and 1789. > > Presented in the dramatic setting of The > Wrightsman Galleries, the Museum's French period > rooms, the exhibition will explore the dressed > body's spatial negotiation of the 18th-century > interior as a choreography of seduction and > erotic play. The coquettish Polonaise dress with > its hem raised to reveal the ankle will be > juxtaposed with a side table that transforms into > a dressing table through mechanisms similar to > the gown's hidden ties. The arch of the foot > introduced by shoes with a Louis-style heel will > be seen with the scrolling legs of tables and > chairs from the period shod in ormolu sabots. > Lavish banyans, the "undress" of 18th-century > rakes, and fans, an accessory that could be > wielded with both decorous and flirtatious > intent, will be presented as the favored modes of > beguilement of the 18th-century man about town > and his femme du monde counterpart. > > Accompanied by a publication _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 21:54:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q2s8Sd022237 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:54:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2oscP012895; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:50:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2ooLT026255; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:50:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2omLT026231 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:50:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DFEA1D0FF for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:50:47 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p232.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.234]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 4E97FC40F for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:50:46 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:51:06 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <001601c3fbe6$a16b00a0$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I do not understand how the reference is easily identifiable as American Indian. How are the "indian dressed ladies depicting "evil"? I would more likely think that the "Indian" is more in reference to India as there would be more of an influence on clothing from India than from the Americas. De To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > "Indian women"...dare I ask East or West? > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 1:13 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > > > > > > > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking > > > about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments > > > during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan > > > point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with > > > jewels" and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black > > > bonnets". This is approximately 1522. I have never heard of a lace > > > gown or a Milan bonnet. Can someone please help me figure out exactly > > > what these garments are? > > > > A Milan point lace gown would be a gown decorated with Milan point > > lace (a type of needle lace.) > > > > The Milan bonnet is a type of hat which is sort of like a beret with > > a brim which turns up. > > > > Where did you find the passage? Is it a modern description of a > > picture someone saw or is it a quote from someone who was there > > (actually written by someone in the same time period.) If I could > > read it myself in the place where you found it, I might be able to > > give you more information about it. (Sometimes it's the context which > > is the most important.) > > > > As to "dressed like Indian Women", that's a hard one. It's almost too > > vague to be helpful. > > > > Kat > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 21:54:45 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q2sjSd022248 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:54:45 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2s7cP013051; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:54:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2s5LT027605; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:54:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp805.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp805.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1Q2s3LT027592 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:54:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.145.28 with login) by smtp805.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2004 02:47:23 -0000 Message-ID: <004101c3fc12$d8b53130$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00e901c3fb41$cf3d1a40$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <004201c3fbb6$0d9a46e0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:47:16 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" Subject: Re: [h-cost] 1780s skirt supports > Dear Kendra. > You only need a single petticoat for this silhuette and a small bum roll > starting at the mid hip and going back, thickest at the center back. This is > the last trace of panner fashion dying out. Thanks for the input everyone -- I think I'm going to start with 1-2 petticoats and a more-towards-the-back bumpad and see where that gets me. My underskirt will be made of silk poplin, so I'm hoping that should have some stiffness to it. I like AlbertCat's suggestion of adding a quilted overlay to the bumpad, so I'll add that if my bumpad doesn't have enough hip to it (luckily I am MORE than well endowed in that area, so my body may help me out here). > Wonderfull dress, are you going to make it? Isn't it great? I'm going to make something similar in terms of cut and the stripes, but different color scheme... You can see my fabric choices here: http://demode.tweedlebop.com/anglaise.html - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 21:57:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q2v9Sd022261 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:57:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2tkcP013132; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:55:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q2tjLT028296; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:55:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp803.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp803.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.182]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1Q2tiLT028285 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:55:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.145.28 with login) by smtp803.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2004 02:55:44 -0000 Message-ID: <006501c3fc14$03706970$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402250752.i1P7q7LU026645@net.indra.com> <403CC7F7.6CD00D0A@ncmail.net> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:55:38 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Bodice smoothness X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Here's another thought: how are you closing your bodices? If you're not, can use lacing (which would allow you to stretch your bodice slightly when you close it) -- under a stomacher if you're doing a robe a la francaise, or under a "flap" for robes a l'anglaise (like on these dresses: http://web.infinito.it/utenti/a/a.linda/nuova_pagina_37.htm or http://web.infinito.it/utenti/a/a.linda/nuova_pagina_38.htm -- not very clear photos, but some of the few where I've been able to clearly see these flaps). I've also got a photo of a 1780s robe a l'anglaise with a zone-front bodice, from the Museum of London, that is laced closed in the center front. Anyway, lacing = stretching, and stretching = smoother look! I'm thinking about doing in on my 1780s robe a l'anglaise... - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 22:04:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q349Sd022299 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:04:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q30rcP013353; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:00:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q30pLT030416; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:00:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q30nLT030402 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:00:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E60FB1CE40 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:00:49 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p232.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.234]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 857C4C4F6 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:00:48 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:01:09 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200402251901.AA29753544@thrednedlestrete.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The illustration is showing you hemstitch for drawn threadwork but it can be applied to a regular hem. It does not leave you with fringe unless you want fringe. The gap with vertical threads is the area that had thread drawn. Most cases with drawn thread hemming, the bottom of the picture is the hem, not the gap area above it. The floss is not on the edge and will not wear as fast as a blanket stitched edge. If you want a fancy somewhat scalloped looked edge, I would say the blanket stitch is what you want but I have only seen it on chemises, I don't know if that technique was used on ruffs. De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Lisa Sinervo Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 7:01 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? well now I'm confused, this hemstich illustration is one that would leave fringed edges. I've tried a narrow hem with a blanket stitch over the top. This way the edge is finished. I've interpreted some portraits with blackworked sleeves has having this type of finish. Lisa Sinervo ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Claudine Reply-To: Historical Costume Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:28:54 -0800 >Hi Bridgette, > >That's perfect! I understand now what you mean. Thanks also for finding >this page, I'm collecting links to pages with instructions for stitches. > >I didn't know openwork was done in the late 1500s. I thought the >decorations on collars and cuffs were just variations on lace. I'll file >that under "new thing I learned this week." :) > >Thanks everyone for all the help! > > > >Claudine > >At 06:28 AM 2/24/2004, you wrote: > >>Hi there... sorry for the lousy ASCII art... didn't mean to confuse >>things. I'll try my best to explain ... >> Something you might want to look for is a reference to >> "hemstitch" or "Venetian hemstitch" or "Open hemstitch" >> >>ok... I'll give this a whirl... >> >>(20 minutes later... ) ok that didn't work... try this >>http://www.embroideryden.com.au/embroidery_stitch_guide.htm scroll down >>to "hemstitch" >> >>best of luck. >>Bridgette - who just can't seem to describe this stitch ; > >> >> >> >> >>>I like the idea of a turned hem with a bit of >>>openwork, but I don't understand how I would >>>accomplish that. When I do a hem I end up with little >>>stitches on the outside of the garment that are >>>basically perpendicular the the hem edge; I don't see >>>how that converts to openwork. Bridgette, from your >>>ASCII drawing, are you saying that I should throw in a >>>horizontal stitch between the normal, slanted heming >>>stitches? Would that be enough to create holes in the >>>fabric, or should I pull threads out parallel to the >>>hem? Sorry for all the questions, but I've only ever >>>read about openwork and have never done it. >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 22:09:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q39jSd022319 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:09:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q36XcP013618; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:06:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q36TLT032559; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:06:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp801.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp801.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.180]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1Q36RLT032539 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:06:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kendra@tweedlebop.com) Received: from unknown (HELO hopperflop2) (kendrav@sbcglobal.net@67.121.145.28 with login) by smtp801.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2004 02:59:47 -0000 Message-ID: <007a01c3fc14$949a9510$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> From: "Kendra Van Cleave" To: "Historical Costume" References: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost><403C7E0E.26833.25B01434@localhost> <200402252127.20046.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:59:41 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr > Maybe he wasn't working off of an inventory description. I suppose it's > possible that the necklace in question still exists, and can be seen and > visually compared to what the lady in the portrait wears. Though I'm still > skeptical--the necklace I see appears to be a simple strand; how is it > possible to say that it shows Catherine's pearl necklace? Although this Guardian article says that "...the pearls which Catherine is recorded as inheriting from her mother... [were] the clincher..." http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,1155548,00.html - Kendra _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 22:21:52 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q3LpSd022350 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:21:52 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3IbcP014140; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:18:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3IZLT037852; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:18:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3IYLT037840 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:18:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Received: from mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net (mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.48]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1Q22O507861 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:02:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from 209-165-50-216.jps.net ([209.165.50.216] helo=pavilion) by mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AwAr0-0004e0-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:02:23 -0800 Message-ID: <000f01c3fc0e$11c3eb60$d832a5d1@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402251901.AA29753544@thrednedlestrete.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:13:03 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO oops, never mind, I'd missed the post about the fringe effect. This a very nice treatment too. Lisa ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 5:01 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? > well now I'm confused, this hemstich illustration is one that would leave fringed edges. I've tried a narrow hem with a blanket stitch over the top. This way the edge is finished. I've interpreted some portraits with blackworked sleeves has having this type of finish. > > Lisa Sinervo > > > > ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- > From: Claudine > Reply-To: Historical Costume > Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 09:28:54 -0800 > > >Hi Bridgette, > > > >That's perfect! I understand now what you mean. Thanks also for finding > >this page, I'm collecting links to pages with instructions for stitches. > > > >I didn't know openwork was done in the late 1500s. I thought the > >decorations on collars and cuffs were just variations on lace. I'll file > >that under "new thing I learned this week." :) > > > >Thanks everyone for all the help! > > > > > > > >Claudine > > > >At 06:28 AM 2/24/2004, you wrote: > > > >>Hi there... sorry for the lousy ASCII art... didn't mean to confuse > >>things. I'll try my best to explain ... > >> Something you might want to look for is a reference to > >> "hemstitch" or "Venetian hemstitch" or "Open hemstitch" > >> > >>ok... I'll give this a whirl... > >> > >>(20 minutes later... ) ok that didn't work... try this > >>http://www.embroideryden.com.au/embroidery_stitch_guide.htm scroll down > >>to "hemstitch" > >> > >>best of luck. > >>Bridgette - who just can't seem to describe this stitch ; > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>>I like the idea of a turned hem with a bit of > >>>openwork, but I don't understand how I would > >>>accomplish that. When I do a hem I end up with little > >>>stitches on the outside of the garment that are > >>>basically perpendicular the the hem edge; I don't see > >>>how that converts to openwork. Bridgette, from your > >>>ASCII drawing, are you saying that I should throw in a > >>>horizontal stitch between the normal, slanted heming > >>>stitches? Would that be enough to create holes in the > >>>fabric, or should I pull threads out parallel to the > >>>hem? Sorry for all the questions, but I've only ever > >>>read about openwork and have never done it. > >> > >>_______________________________________________ > >>h-costume mailing list > >>h-costume@mail.indra.com > >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > >_______________________________________________ > >h-costume mailing list > >h-costume@mail.indra.com > >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 22:22:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q3MuSd022357 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:22:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3KscP014288; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:20:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3KqLT038855; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:20:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3KpLT038845 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:20:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6ABC1D121 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:20:51 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p232.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.234]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A8C20C4F6 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:20:50 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:21:11 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <403C7E0E.26833.25B01434@localhost> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The various spellings of Shakespeare may not have been due to his spelling it differently but in the possibility that William Shaksper of Stratford-on-Avon, a business man with no, as yet, connection to theatre that everyone claims is the Bard of the plays may not have written the plays and that Shakespeare of the plays was a pseudonym for a nobleman who would have had the education that shows in the plays that a business man would not have had. Using C instead of K seems to be a misinformation that has been handed down for a long time. De (sorry if this comes across as rambling) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Feb 25 22:30:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1Q3UCSd022375 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:30:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3SFcP014689; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:28:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3SBLT041657; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:28:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3S8LU041612 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:28:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1Q3TU8v029579 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:29:30 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1Q3TUwh029577 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:29:30 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:29:30 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> <200402252127.20046.cathy@thyrsus.com> <007a01c3fc14$949a9510$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> In-Reply-To: <007a01c3fc14$949a9510$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402252229.30290.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Wednesday 25 February 2004 09:59 pm, Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr > > > > > Maybe he wasn't working off of an inventory description. I suppose it's > > possible that the necklace in question still exists, and can be seen and > > visually compared to what the lady in the portrait wears. Though I'm > still skeptical--the necklace I see appears to be a simple strand; how is it > possible to say that it shows Catherine's pearl necklace? > > Although this Guardian article says that "...the pearls which Catherine is > recorded as inheriting from her mother... [were] the clincher..." > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,1155548,00.html He was reported as saying that in the BBC article that started this thread, too, but it didn't say why he was so sure the pearls in the portrait are the strand inherited by Catherine. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 07:25:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QCPFSd018342 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:25:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QCN1cP005105; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 05:23:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QCLpLT042667; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 05:22:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net (aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.69]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QCKnLT042212 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 05:21:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.22]) by aftermath.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AwDMy-0006as-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:43:32 -0800 Received: from 209-165-40-248.jps.net ([209.165.40.248] helo=pavilion) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AwDMr-00041R-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:43:28 -0800 Message-ID: <000d01c3fc24$8ccd68c0$f828a5d1@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:53:43 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO There's an exquisite ruff on Sir Edward Hoby with a likely blanket stitch or similar edging. see www.thrednedlestrete.com/Bulletinboard.htm but I'd really like to see a better reproduction and in colour, sometimes it looks like a mirco mini ruffle and the edge, but I doubt that. I'm trying to make a similar one right now with machine blackwork. I believe it's part of the National Portrait Gallery's collection but it's not on their web site unfortunately. I'm glad you mentioned the fringe edgings, it really solidified the construction for me on so many of those images I've seen. Lisa Sinervo ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 7:01 PM Subject: RE: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? > The illustration is showing you hemstitch for drawn threadwork but it can be > applied to a regular hem. It does not leave you with fringe unless you want > fringe. The gap with vertical threads is the area that had thread drawn. > Most cases with drawn thread hemming, the bottom of the picture is the hem, > not the gap area above it. The floss is not on the edge and will not wear as > fast as a blanket stitched edge. > If you want a fancy somewhat scalloped looked edge, I would say the blanket > stitch is what you want but I have only seen it on chemises, I don't know if > that technique was used on ruffs. > > De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 09:33:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QEXSSd018925 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:33:28 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QEUGcP010445; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:30:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QEUCLT095280; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:30:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu (kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu [169.147.4.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QEUALT095238 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:30:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ckinsey@kumc.edu) Received: from KUMC-SMTPOUT-DOMAIN-MTA by kumc-smtpout.kumc.edu with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:30:03 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.5.1 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:29:46 -0600 From: "Catherine Kinsey" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Help decifering a source (Tudor) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I would suggest finding a book on the history of lace as there is still a lot of controversy as to when lace became used as we know it. Garments described as all or in part as lace or laced could also be interpreted as garments with lacing fastening and/or trim, rather than decorative lace as we know it. The lace could also be more of what we know of as a braid trim--see early neck ruffs for examples. Cindy Abel >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Naturally my notes are at home but I just finished researching a history of lace class and found that as late as, I think, 1596 or 8, 'lace' in one of the first dictionarys was still defined as a cord for tying things up, rather than something used for decorating a costume. Catherine _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 09:53:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QEr9Sd018994 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:53:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QEpAcP011763; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:51:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QEp7LT004880; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:51:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QEp3LU004856 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:51:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1QFIUWm017531 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:18:30 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.125] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A7D82A7C0102; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:51:04 -0500 Message-ID: <000501c3fc78$af294b60$7d5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000d01c3fc24$8ccd68c0$f828a5d1@pavilion> Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:56:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And what do you make of the other trim(Braid?) in the jacket. In black and white, it could be tiny pearls or maybe embroidered knots to look like pearls? Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 11:53 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? > There's an exquisite ruff on Sir Edward Hoby with a likely blanket stitch or > similar edging. see www.thrednedlestrete.com/Bulletinboard.htm but I'd > really like to see a better reproduction and in colour, sometimes it looks > like a mirco mini ruffle and the edge, but I doubt that. I'm trying to make > a similar one right now with machine blackwork. I believe it's part of the > National Portrait Gallery's collection but it's not on their web site > unfortunately. I'm glad you mentioned the fringe edgings, it really > solidified the construction for me on so many of those images I've seen. > > Lisa Sinervo > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "otsisto" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 7:01 PM > Subject: RE: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? > > > > The illustration is showing you hemstitch for drawn threadwork but it can > be > > applied to a regular hem. It does not leave you with fringe unless you > want > > fringe. The gap with vertical threads is the area that had thread drawn. > > Most cases with drawn thread hemming, the bottom of the picture is the > hem, > > not the gap area above it. The floss is not on the edge and will not wear > as > > fast as a blanket stitched edge. > > If you want a fancy somewhat scalloped looked edge, I would say the > blanket > > stitch is what you want but I have only seen it on chemises, I don't know > if > > that technique was used on ruffs. > > > > De > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 10:08:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QF8BSd019042 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:08:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QF7OcP012691; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:07:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QF79LT012570; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:07:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QF76LU012552 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:07:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1QFYXWm003938 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:34:33 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.125] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id AB992E390122; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:07:05 -0500 Message-ID: <001501c3fc7a$ed108b80$7d5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:12:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My query was the "East" or "West".. But to the point,the equation of 'evil' and "inhospitable" has often been seen in the long trail of civilization . At least from my point of view. Look at the attitudes of the Brits and the Celts. And even other barbarians (from the Roman point of view). or the Greeks Or the Sumarians or Egyptians...etc. By the Age of Enlightenment, the attitude toward the American 'Indian' was greatly romanticized. But in this earlier Period, except for the reports of early explorers, the settlements of Jamestown and Plimouth and those involved in the fur trade saw them as more 'inconvenient' than 'evil'. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 9:51 PM Subject: RE: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > > I do not understand how the reference is easily identifiable as American > Indian. How are the "indian dressed ladies depicting "evil"? > I would more likely think that the "Indian" is more in reference to India as > there would be more of an influence on clothing from India than from the > Americas. > De > > > talking "American" Indians as these ladies were depicted as being "evil" > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lloyd Mitchell" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 4:07 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > > > > "Indian women"...dare I ask East or West? > > Kathleen > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: "Historical Costume" > > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 1:13 PM > > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) > > > > > > > > > > > Hello all, I need some help figuring out what a source is talking > > > > about. I came across this passage in my research into the Tournaments > > > > during the age of Henry VIII. It says that the ladies wore "Milan > > > > point lace gowns of white satin" and "Milan bonnets of gold with > > > > jewels" and that other ladies were dressed "like Indian Women in black > > > > bonnets". This is approximately 1522. I have never heard of a lace > > > > gown or a Milan bonnet. Can someone please help me figure out exactly > > > > what these garments are? > > > > > > A Milan point lace gown would be a gown decorated with Milan point > > > lace (a type of needle lace.) > > > > > > The Milan bonnet is a type of hat which is sort of like a beret with > > > a brim which turns up. > > > > > > Where did you find the passage? Is it a modern description of a > > > picture someone saw or is it a quote from someone who was there > > > (actually written by someone in the same time period.) If I could > > > read it myself in the place where you found it, I might be able to > > > give you more information about it. (Sometimes it's the context which > > > is the most important.) > > > > > > As to "dressed like Indian Women", that's a hard one. It's almost too > > > vague to be helpful. > > > > > > Kat > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > h-costume mailing list > > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 10:10:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QFAVSd019055 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:10:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QF8UcP012879; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:08:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QF8ULT013552; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:08:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1QF7GLT012591 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:07:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCojlleBdbV0jVj1+Eb3CNtmyroOM/+6V8Q==">; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:06:44 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JPBUVCU5; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 07:06:44 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:06:45 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Message-ID: <20040226.090645.-374377.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 8-13,15-100 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO While it certainly looks like a blanket stitch, I have to think that something else is going on here as a blanket stitch that would be visible at the proportion of that painting would be really big! The needlework I've seen from the era (hours spent drooling on the cases at the V&A) seems to indicate that fine stitching was the norm. In fact, the linen I've seen is much finer than the linen available today and as a result the stitching tends to be almost microscopically fine. I also seem to see a 'loop' effect when you see the ruff in profile so I'd tend to think that it's a needlelace of some sort rather than an embroidery stitch. Just my tuppence, Karen On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:56:15 -0500 "Lloyd Mitchell" writes: > And what do you make of the other trim(Braid?) in the jacket. In > black and > white, it could be tiny pearls or maybe embroidered knots to look > like > pearls? > Kathleen > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lisa Sinervo" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 11:53 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? > > > > There's an exquisite ruff on Sir Edward Hoby with a likely blanket > stitch > or > > similar edging. see www.thrednedlestrete.com/Bulletinboard.htm > but I'd > > really like to see a better reproduction and in colour, sometimes > it looks > > like a mirco mini ruffle and the edge, but I doubt that. I'm > trying to > make > > a similar one right now with machine blackwork. I believe it's > part of > the > > National Portrait Gallery's collection but it's not on their web > site > > unfortunately. I'm glad you mentioned the fringe edgings, it > really > > solidified the construction for me on so many of those images I've > seen. > > > > Lisa Sinervo > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "otsisto" > > To: "Historical Costume" > > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 7:01 PM > > Subject: RE: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? > > > > > > > The illustration is showing you hemstitch for drawn threadwork > but it > can > > be > > > applied to a regular hem. It does not leave you with fringe > unless you > > want > > > fringe. The gap with vertical threads is the area that had > thread drawn. > > > Most cases with drawn thread hemming, the bottom of the picture > is the > > hem, > > > not the gap area above it. The floss is not on the edge and will > not > wear > > as > > > fast as a blanket stitched edge. > > > If you want a fancy somewhat scalloped looked edge, I would say > the > > blanket > > > stitch is what you want but I have only seen it on chemises, I > don't > know > > if > > > that technique was used on ruffs. > > > > > > De > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 10:19:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QFJJSd019094 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:19:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QFHLcP013479; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:17:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QFGKLT018325; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:17:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QFGHLU018293 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:16:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1QFhiWm012910 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:43:44 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.125] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id ADBE2F2A0102; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:16:14 -0500 Message-ID: <002701c3fc7c$334c79a0$7d5183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost><200402252127.20046.cathy@thyrsus.com><007a01c3fc14$949a9510$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <200402252229.30290.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:21:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I think that the idea that the ownership of the pearls can be put to the mother, and that the presence of them on the subject of the portrait illustrates what they looked like. If a viewer later equates that these were given to Catherine with this particular portrait in view, the anachronisms of the dress and gable headdress would point to the earlier subject...ie, Katherine's mother. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 10:29 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr > On Wednesday 25 February 2004 09:59 pm, Kendra Van Cleave wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" > > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr > > > > > > > > > Maybe he wasn't working off of an inventory description. I suppose it's > > > possible that the necklace in question still exists, and can be seen and > > > visually compared to what the lady in the portrait wears. Though I'm > > still skeptical--the necklace I see appears to be a simple strand; how is it > > possible to say that it shows Catherine's pearl necklace? > > > > Although this Guardian article says that "...the pearls which Catherine is > > recorded as inheriting from her mother... [were] the clincher..." > > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,1155548,00.html > > He was reported as saying that in the BBC article that started this thread, > too, but it didn't say why he was so sure the pearls in the portrait are the > strand inherited by Catherine. > > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 12:35:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QHZISd019720 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:35:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QH1ncP022547; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:01:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QH1hLT086412; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:01:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web40913.mail.yahoo.com (web40913.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.210]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1QH1bLT086319 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:01:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from demontsegur@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040226165452.41114.qmail@web40913.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.105.108.103] by web40913.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:54:52 PST Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:54:52 -0800 (PST) From: Tasha McGann To: EK Laurel list , Maunche List , h-costume list , Classes List , Hartshorn-dale list , aotc list , Bhakail list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Last update before Robin Netherton lectures in Philly area X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Greetings everyone, I just wanted to drop a quick note reminding folks that Robin Netherton will be coming to town for a day of slide-enhanced dress history lectures at Bryn Mawr University this Saturday, February 28th. For those who are already signed up, don't forget! :^D For those who might still be interested in coming but have not signed up, the good news is there are a few seats remaining, available solely on a walk-in, first-come, first-served basis. Our registration desk opens at 9AM sharp. Please be prepared to pay with a check in the amount of $35. The web flier has some updated information concerning lunch: http://www.cottesimple.com/robin_netherton/lecture_info.htm Thank you for your time, Tasha McGann (Marcele de Montsegur in the SCA) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 14:13:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QJDDSd020079 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:13:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QJAvcP004252; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:10:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QJApLT075373; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:10:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mxsf25.cluster1.charter.net (mxsf25.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.28.225]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QJAILT074952 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:10:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from muirgheal@charter.net) Received: from dewshine (cpe-24-197-120-167.spa.sc.charter.com [24.197.120.167]) by mxsf25.cluster1.charter.net (8.12.10/8.12.8) with SMTP id i1QJ9kHc003160 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:09:46 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from muirgheal@charter.net) Message-ID: <001401c3fc9a$51106d20$6401a8c0@spa.sc.charter.com> From: "Manly Summerfield" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001501c3fc7a$ed108b80$7d5183d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Help decifering a source (Tudor) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:57:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040211', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > My query was the "East" or "West".. > But to the point,the equation of 'evil' and > "inhospitable" has often been seen in the long trail of civilization . At > least from my point of view. Look at the attitudes of the Brits and the > Celts. And even other barbarians (from the Roman point of view). or the > Greeks Or the Sumarians or Egyptians...etc. > By the Age of Enlightenment, the attitude toward the American 'Indian' was > greatly romanticized. But in this earlier Period, except for the reports of > early explorers, the settlements of Jamestown and Plimouth and those > involved in the fur trade saw them as more 'inconvenient' than 'evil'. > Kathleen > I should have been more specific. The ladies in the Milan lace dresses are portraying Beauty, Kindness, Perseverance etc. The ladies dressed as Indians are Disdain, Scorn, Sharp Tongue, Unkindness etc. I was wondering if the new world was still so new and the natives were seen as savages that it might be those types of Indians they were portraying. Muirgheal who appreciates the opinions thus far. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 16:01:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QL1VSd020661 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:01:31 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QKwfcP013443; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:58:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QKweLT059280; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:58:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from badger.uvm.edu (badger.uvm.edu [132.198.101.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QKwaLT059248 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:58:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hope.greenberg@uvm.edu) Received: from uvm.edu (ip104112.uvm.edu [132.198.104.112]) by badger.uvm.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QKwQI1002810 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:58:27 -0500 Message-ID: <403E5DF9.8040704@uvm.edu> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:58:33 -0500 From: Hope Greenberg User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr References: <200402241902.i1OJ21M0013891@net.indra.com> <403BB3FB.1020207@verizon.net><00c401c3fb41$1ced8500$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> <403CE942.4020305@uvm.edu> <007101c3fc0b$e4099960$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> In-Reply-To: <007101c3fc0b$e4099960$ea44fea9@hopperflop2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO The Guardian has a story about the Starkey interview here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,1155548,00.html One thing mentioned in the BBC recording is that the portrait was used to be thought that of Jane Seymour. That doesn't make much sense, though. The idea that it is Parr seems much more likely. - Hope _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 16:04:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QL4mSd020672 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:04:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QKrIcP012970; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:53:19 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QKrBLT055625; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:53:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.130]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QKr6LT055579 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:53:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Received: from snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net (snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1QKTW916116 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:29:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from 209-165-59-029.jps.net ([209.165.59.29] helo=pavilion) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AwS8P-0001zi-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:29:29 -0800 Message-ID: <001401c3fca8$bbde01e0$122ca5d1@pavilion> From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040226.090645.-374377.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:40:10 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Karen wrote: > While it certainly looks like a blanket stitch, I have to think that > something else is going on here as a blanket stitch that would be visible > at the proportion of that painting would be really big! The needlework > I've seen from the era (hours spent drooling on the cases at the V&A) > seems to indicate that fine stitching was the norm. In fact, the linen > I've seen is much finer than the linen available today and as a result > the stitching tends to be almost microscopically fine. I also seem to see > a 'loop' effect when you see the ruff in profile so I'd tend to think > that it's a needlelace of some sort rather than an embroidery stitch. > I definitely see that wavy/loop appearing on the very edge, which wouldn't happen with a straight blanket stitch. Just pulled out "Elizabethan Lace" by Gilian Dye and she describes a Venetian Picot stitch under the section "Decorated Edges" - (describing finishing for ruffs and cuffs). The linear effect is similar to a blanket stitch but would be more raised as there is a bit of looping around various threads going on. I might experiment with this as a likely edging for the ruff in question. She does not give details references unfortunately. But I'll bet it would produce a slight up and down effect to between the thread and fabric in a way straight blanket stitching wouldn't. I wonder what Digby has to say about this. ..... another source to look through. Lisa Sinervo _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 17:29:20 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QMTKSd021058 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:29:20 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMREcP021575; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:27:14 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMR8LT021307; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:27:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMR3LT021208 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:27:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be5f.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.95]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 174AB5EE06C for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:26:57 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000a01c3fcb7$aecd9830$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20040226.090645.-374377.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> <001401c3fca8$bbde01e0$122ca5d1@pavilion> Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:27:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Dear Lisa, This was a very fine answer you have come with. And i agree with you. I have also read an old letter written by a sewing teacher wich writes to the young ladies father and mother, explaining that they have learned to do that stitching for ruffs as you describes. The danish word is "ruer" and unfortunately i cant translate that to english, as the word "ruer" is not used today. But young noble girls/ladies was teached to make their own ruffs. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 9:40 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? > Karen wrote: > > > > While it certainly looks like a blanket stitch, I have to think that > > something else is going on here as a blanket stitch that would be visible > > at the proportion of that painting would be really big! The needlework > > I've seen from the era (hours spent drooling on the cases at the V&A) > > seems to indicate that fine stitching was the norm. In fact, the linen > > I've seen is much finer than the linen available today and as a result > > the stitching tends to be almost microscopically fine. I also seem to see > > a 'loop' effect when you see the ruff in profile so I'd tend to think > > that it's a needlelace of some sort rather than an embroidery stitch. > > > I definitely see that wavy/loop appearing on the very edge, which wouldn't > happen with a straight blanket stitch. Just pulled out "Elizabethan Lace" > by Gilian Dye and she describes a Venetian Picot stitch under the section > "Decorated Edges" - (describing finishing for ruffs and cuffs). The linear > effect is similar to a blanket stitch but would be more raised as there is a > bit of looping around various threads going on. I might experiment with > this as a likely edging for the ruff in question. She does not give details > references unfortunately. But I'll bet it would produce a slight up and > down effect to between the thread and fabric in a way straight blanket > stitching wouldn't. I wonder what Digby has to say about this. ..... another > source to look through. > > Lisa Sinervo > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 17:31:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QMVuSd021066 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:31:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMV3cP021905; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:31:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMV3LT023793; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:31:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMV0LT023768 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:31:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be5f.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.95]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 2A29C5EE03C for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:30:59 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <001501c3fcb8$4048f110$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:31:17 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] portrait of Catherine Parr X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1QMVuSd021066 Status: RO Just a blushing Bjarne, who begs for forgivenes in my ignorance, taking mistakes of Catherine Parr and Anne of Cleves. I should learn from this and shut my mouth in things i dont know anything about. :-) Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 17:37:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QMbpSd021096 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:37:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMaacP022366; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:36:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMaYLT027299; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:36:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMaTLT027246 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:36:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be5f.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.95]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 08ED5262817 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:36:27 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <003401c3fcb9$040f0b70$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:36:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1QMbpSd021096 Status: RO Dear Lisa, This was a very fine answer you have come with. And i agree with you. I have also read an old letter written by a sewing teacher wich writes to the young ladies father and mother, explaining that they have learned to do that stitching for ruffs as you describes. The danish word is "ruer" and unfortunately i cant translate that to english, as the word "ruer" is not used today. But young noble girls/ladies was teached to make their own ruffs. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 17:59:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QMxASd021237 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:59:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMt2cP023994; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:55:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMswLT039333; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:54:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QMsuLT039312 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:54:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Camelothorse@earthlink.net) Received: from cardinal.mail.pas.earthlink.net (cardinal.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.121.226]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1QIvV513977 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:57:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from dialup-67.74.132.48.dial1.houston1.level3.net ([67.74.132.48] helo=diane) by cardinal.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AwQgy-0000bK-00 for H-costume@indra.com; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 10:57:06 -0800 Message-ID: <051201c3fc9a$680a3b50$a58f4a43@diane> From: "Diane Maynard" To: "H-costume" Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 12:57:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] bodice smoothness---different use X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1QMxASd021237 Status: RO If you just want to add a bit of body to a fabric that drapes in a lovely manner for the skirts but just seems too thin or *floppy* in the bodice, try a featherweight fusible interfacing. The featherweight is enough to just add a little body to a thin or fine fabric, without being detectible once the garment is made. -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth OMG----Thank you !! This is why I LOVE this list and read the posts even if they do not pertain to the period I am doing right now. This has given me the way to solve a problem I am having with some gorgeous silk tapestry I have to make an Elizabethan with. The material is very expensive but, the threads of the tapestry sections do not go from selvege to selvege but are instead "cut" at the end of the section they are used in. This makes it possible (and probable) that the individual threads will continually work their way out of the base as the garment is worn or cleaned. Using the featherweight fusible interfacing would "lock" these threads in place without changing the look of the outer material. I do not know why I had not thought of this before. Thanks----Diane _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 18:09:08 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QN98Sd021288 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:09:08 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QN7AcP025367; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:07:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QN77LT047500; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:07:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1QN72LT047397 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:07:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCojlleBdbV0j1IB2zDGPZuMNZIeWLYRYdg==">; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:06:28 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JPCQBR35; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:06:28 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:06:08 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Message-ID: <20040226.170608.-374377.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 7-15,17-32 From: seamstrix@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO This portrait is almost identical to one that has been labelled as Catherine of Aragon for years, including the hand held in front of the chest. It's not impossible that it could be KP, but I agree with folks that it looks nothing like her and a lot more like CoA. And if I am remembering my history correctly, KP was a staunch Protestant and very much into the Humanist way of thinking which makes me think that she wouldn't be keen on being portrayed in the guise of an icon of Catholicism. My vote is for Catherine of Aragon. Karen On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:58:33 -0500 Hope Greenberg writes: > The Guardian has a story about the Starkey interview here: > http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,1155548,00.html > > One thing mentioned in the BBC recording is that the portrait was > used > to be thought that of Jane Seymour. That doesn't make much sense, > though. The idea that it is Parr seems much more likely. > > - Hope > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 18:24:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QNOZSd021368 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:24:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QNLMcP026535; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:21:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QNLJLT057449; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:21:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QNLHLT057421 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:21:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from saragrace@earthlink.net) Received: from bittern.mail.pas.earthlink.net (bittern.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.119]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1QNBm520585 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:11:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from cpe-24-221-40-235.az.sprintbbd.net ([24.221.40.235] helo=SG01) by bittern.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AwUgU-0002fV-00; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:12:50 -0800 From: "Saragrace T. Knauf" To: , , "H-Costume@Indra. Com" Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:12:11 -0700 Message-ID: <000b01c3fcbd$fa9feff0$6501a8c0@SG01> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Cc: Subject: [h-cost] FW: ONLINE SWATCHES X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >From the Hidehouse...I don't know why I got this email (I've never ordered from them before), but thought some of you might find it useful. Sg -----Original Message----- From: hideinfo@hidehouse.com [mailto:hideinfo@hidehouse.com] Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 3:44 PM To: saragrace@earthlink.net Subject: ONLINE SWATCHES Dear Valued Customers We are pleased to announce that our website has been further enhanced so that you may view our complete color product line from your computer! Once you are at http://www.hidehouse.com go to either the "our hides" section or "online tools", from there you will select swatches. We hope this assists you in your leather needs! Come and see us at the Reno Western Leatherworkers Trade Show! This show is March 26-28 at the Reno Livestock Event Center, 1350 N Wells Ave Reno, NV 89512 Hope to see you there! The Hide House http://www.hidehouse.com hideinfo@hidehouse.com 800 4LEATHR _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 18:49:24 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1QNnOSd021506 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:49:24 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QNmgcP029003; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:48:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QNmcLT075562; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:48:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp2.pacifier.net (smtp2.pacifier.net [64.255.237.172]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1QNmULT075466 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:48:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.133.62]) by smtp2.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C707B6F876 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:48:28 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 15:48:30 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Message-ID: <403E154E.10523.50CB4BD@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <20040226.170608.-374377.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > This portrait is almost identical to one that has been labelled as > Catherine of Aragon for years, including the hand held in front of the > chest. It's not impossible that it could be KP, but I agree with folks > that it looks nothing like her and a lot more like CoA. And if I am > remembering my history correctly, KP was a staunch Protestant and very > much into the Humanist way of thinking which makes me think that she > wouldn't be keen on being portrayed in the guise of an icon of > Catholicism. My vote is for Catherine of Aragon. K. Parr *became* a staunch reformist in the Humanist tradition, but she was raised Catholic and seemed to have changed during her marriage to Latimer (around 1540). (Latimer himself may have been more reformist than Catholic by the time he was pressured into being part of the Catholic rebellion.) Of course, it all depends on those silly pearls as to who it is. Who did K. Parr supposedly inherit them from? Could they have been CoA's (since K. Parr was supposedly named after her and CoA was supposedly one of her god parents) and given to K.Parr by CoA? (At this point I'd like it if we could get David Starkey here and ask him these questions. Trying to parse it out from an article on the BBC is difficult.) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 19:12:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R0CZSd021644 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:12:35 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0AgcP000813; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:10:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0AcLT088131; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:10:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m28.mx.aol.com (imo-m28.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.9]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0AaLT088084 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:10:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-m28.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.1d7.1ab84abf (4116) for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:10:20 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <1d7.1ab84abf.2d6fe4eb@aol.com> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:10:19 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] bodice smoothness---different use To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/26/2004 4:55:29 PM Central Standard Time, Camelothorse@earthlink.net writes: I do not know why I had not thought of this before. Thanks----Diane Diane, You're very welcome! I think that a lot of times fusible interfacing is not something that we think of in relation to period attire, because it's so un-period LOL. But, they had their methods for stiffening/giving weight and body to fabrics as well; to me this is just an alternative that works really well to achieve a period look, and no one has to know!!! -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 19:17:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R0HSSd021688 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:17:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0GocP001274; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0GnLT091464; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp804.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp804.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.168.183]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1R0GkLT091414 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:16:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sarah@modehistorique.com) Received: from unknown (HELO modehistorique.com) (lithiate@sbcglobal.net@68.126.135.193 with plain) by smtp804.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2004 00:10:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:10:00 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <20040226.170608.-374377.3.Seamstrix@juno.com> Message-Id: <48D163B6-68B9-11D8-A386-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > This portrait is almost identical to one that has been labelled as > Catherine of Aragon for years, including the hand held in front of the > chest. It's not impossible that it could be KP, but I agree with folks > that it looks nothing like her and a lot more like CoA. And if I am > remembering my history correctly, KP was a staunch Protestant and very > much into the Humanist way of thinking which makes me think that she > wouldn't be keen on being portrayed in the guise of an icon of > Catholicism. > My vote is for Catherine of Aragon. The only hole in that theory is that KP wasn't openly a staunch protestant at least until after Jane Seymore had come and gone. It was safe to assume that you were "Catholic" in Henry's time because he believed himself to be a son of the true faith, even after the break with Rome in the early 1530's. KP was born far before the reformation even was conceived, so for argument's sake, even though she turned to Protestantism in her adulthood, she was more than likely born and raised (at least in part) as Catholic. Not that her religion has anything to do with the question of the sitter in this portrait... Catherine of Aragon was by and far a terribly popular queen and pretty much all of Henry's subsequent wives with the exclusion of Anne Boleyn sought to emulate her in terms of her piety, her humility and her devotion to Henry. If KP's mother was indeed in CA's retinue (someone mentioned this earlier but I haven't bothered to verify it), then KP was certainly reared with CA's example as a woman and queen during her formative years. *If* this painting is of KP in her late teens, as Starkey thinks, it's entirely logical that her style of dress would fit well with who was seen as a "good role model" for young women. Also, remember Henry didn't divorce CA until the early 1530's (don't have the exact date off hand, but it was between 1530-33), so she was probably still queen when this portrait was painted, if it it's been definitely dated to the late 1520's. I don't have any idea if Starkey is right in his assumption that the sitter is KP, but he has got some valid arguments and KP fits squarely into that time frame as a possibility. But I'd also have to wonder if the woman in the painting isn't KP's mother, or another close female relative that might have had a connection with the pearls. Sarah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 19:21:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R0LxSd021716 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:21:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0K7cP001516; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:20:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0JlLT093013; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:20:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web61005.mail.yahoo.com (web61005.mail.yahoo.com [216.155.196.94]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1R0IjLT092349 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:19:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from carolshistory3@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040227001200.14091.qmail@web61005.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.107.3.126] by web61005.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:12:00 PST Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:12:00 -0800 (PST) From: Carol Mitchell To: h-costume@net.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Polish costuming X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I remember there was a recent thread on this subject. If the information is still relevant, perhaps this would be helpful Carol 1. Polish Costuming Resource You have found Art and Jocelyn's online Polish costuming resource. These pictures have been carefully selected to represent the ... http://www.icbleu.org/artur/polcostumes.htm 3. Polish Folk Costumes Extensive information, history and general background; custom costumes. Extensive information, history and general background of Polish Folks... http://www.chebucto.ns.ca/~aa051/pfc.html 4. The Costumer's Manifesto: Traditional Dress, "Ethnic" Costumes and ... ... Greek Folk Dance Resource Manual. Polish Costuming Resource. Old Armenia Family. Welcome to greektownimports.com - Your source for Greek gifts and Greek music. ... http://www.costumes.org/ethnic/1PAGES/ETHNOLNK.HTM 5. Party links ... Polish Christmas Traditions. Polish Circus Posters. Polish Collector. Polish Composers. Polish Costuming Resource. Polish Culture (Bella ... http://members.aol.com/pietruszka/Links.html 6. Clothing and Costume Links Polish. Polish Costuming Resource... http://moas.atlantia.sca.org/topics/clot.htm 7. Perfekt: Polish Regional Costumes PERFEKT s.c. - manufacturer of Polish folk costumes. Web catalogue of costumes. http://www.perfekt.krakow.pl/index_en.php 8. Polish Folk Costumes: Introduction Polish Folk Costumes [Nowi Sacz Costume From Polish http://www.chebucto.ns.ca/~aa051/pfc_intro.html 9. Polish Costumes, Customs and Crafts The Collectors Guide: Folk Arts of Poland Polish Art Center Polart Polish American Journal's Internet Bookstore Polish Folk Resources... http://geocities.com/musetti.geo/ccc.html 10. Polish Folk Resources ... Usenet Groups. alt.history.costuming; rec.folk-dancing; soc.culture.polish. Polish Folk Costumes selected as Polish Site of the Month! ... http://www.chebucto.ns.ca/~aa051/polish.html --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 19:32:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R0WISd021768 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:32:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0UQcP002445; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:30:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0UPLT098660; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:30:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0ULLU098634 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 17:30:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R0Vo8v001511 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:31:50 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i1R0Vo8l001509 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:31:50 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:31:49 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <403BC628.3247.22E1BA12@localhost> <200402252229.30290.cathy@thyrsus.com> <002701c3fc7c$334c79a0$7d5183d1@rmitchellras> In-Reply-To: <002701c3fc7c$334c79a0$7d5183d1@rmitchellras> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402261931.49898.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226, clamav-milter version 0.67h Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Thursday 26 February 2004 10:21 am, Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > I think that the idea that the ownership of the pearls can be put to the > mother, and that the presence of them on the subject of the portrait > illustrates what they looked like. If a viewer later equates that these > were given to Catherine with this particular portrait in view, the > anachronisms of the dress and gable headdress would point to the earlier > subject...ie, Katherine's mother. Hmmm. That's an idea I hadn't had. However, your suggestion does illustrate my point. Without more information than the BBC and Guardian articles provide, it's hard to rule out possibilities like the one you just raised from Starkey's theory in any principled way. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 21:48:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R2mDSd022471 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:48:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R2lUcP010462; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:47:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R2lMLT069879; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:47:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from obsidian.spiritone.com (obsidian.spiritone.com [216.99.193.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R2lKLU069869 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:47:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by obsidian.spiritone.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1R2oJQd027865 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:50:19 -0800 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:48:51 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 In-Reply-To: <403E154E.10523.50CB4BD@localhost> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO If so much depends on the pearls, it kinda makes you wonder how it happened that only one rope of pearls existed in all Tudor Nobility since no other woman could possibly have had such a strand. (Except for Mary Queen of Scots black ones of course). One thing about it. In a few years, another Art Historian is probably going to come out with another identification. Regina > Of course, it all depends on those silly pearls as to who it is. Who > did K. Parr supposedly inherit them from? Could they have been CoA's > (since K. Parr was supposedly named after her and CoA was supposedly > one of her god parents) and given to K.Parr by CoA? (At this point > I'd like it if we could get David Starkey here and ask him these > questions. Trying to parse it out from an article on the BBC is > difficult.) > > Kat > > > > _____ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Feb 26 23:15:37 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R4FaSd022768 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:15:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R4DdcP014818; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:13:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R4DULT003787; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:13:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo2.socket.net (mo2.socket.net [216.106.88.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R4DSLT003778 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:13:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo2.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A19041D567 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:13:28 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p666.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.213.159]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 79CE5D41F for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:13:27 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:13:30 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-reply-to: Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I kind of wonder about Mary's famous black pearls. I've seen other portraits of the period with black pearl necklaces. If he is making the identification solely on the necklace then that is poor research. Comes across as someone just wanting to be in the spotlight. De -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Wanda Pease Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 8:49 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr If so much depends on the pearls, it kinda makes you wonder how it happened that only one rope of pearls existed in all Tudor Nobility since no other woman could possibly have had such a strand. (Except for Mary Queen of Scots black ones of course). One thing about it. In a few years, another Art Historian is probably going to come out with another identification. Regina > Of course, it all depends on those silly pearls as to who it is. Who > did K. Parr supposedly inherit them from? Could they have been CoA's > (since K. Parr was supposedly named after her and CoA was supposedly > one of her god parents) and given to K.Parr by CoA? (At this point > I'd like it if we could get David Starkey here and ask him these > questions. Trying to parse it out from an article on the BBC is > difficult.) > > Kat > > > > _____ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 00:04:29 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R54SSd024025 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 00:04:29 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R51LcP017000; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:01:21 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R51HLT022554; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:01:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1R51FLT022540 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:01:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sarah@modehistorique.com) Received: from unknown (HELO modehistorique.com) (lithiate@sbcglobal.net@68.126.135.193 with plain) by smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2004 04:54:35 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 20:54:30 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <07543E1D-68E1-11D8-9EBB-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I kind of wonder about Mary's famous black pearls. I've seen other > portraits > of the period with black pearl necklaces. > If he is making the identification solely on the necklace then that is > poor > research. Comes across as someone just wanting to be in the spotlight. That's really what bugs me about Starkey. He's very sensationalistic and he makes his subjects sound as though they were nothing more than sex-crazed drama queens. I can understand wanting to "sex things up" for a modern audience, but to me, Starkey often crosses the line and winds up sounding like a salacious old man who thinks every woman back in the Renaissance was solely concerned with what was going on between her legs. Either that or they're portrayed as airheads... But that's just my personal problem with him. On the whole, he does seem to do his homework, even if he tends to really water down the facts to make a quick buck. I quite prefer Alison Weir over Starkey, but others may disagree. I think she tells it much more realistically and stays truer to the personality of her subjects than most historians. Although she does occassionally bore me to tears (I'm still trying to wade through "Mary Queen of Scots and the Murder of Lord Darnley"). ;) Sarah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 00:16:09 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R5G9Sd024071 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 00:16:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R5CwcP017699; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:12:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R5CuLT027288; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:12:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mx.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R5CpLT027211 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:12:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.131.2a872da1 (16484) for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 00:07:30 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <131.2a872da1.2d702a91@aol.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 00:07:29 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/26/2004 11:01:55 PM Central Standard Time, sarah@modehistorique.com writes: Although she does occassionally bore me to tears (I'm still trying to wade through "Mary Queen of Scots and the Murder of Lord Darnley"). ;) Sarah Have you read Margaret George's "Mary Queen of Scotland and the Isles"? It's really pretty good. I still want to smack some sense into Mary, but it does the best job I've found so far of making her sympathetic and almost likeable. It also drags a bit in places, but really ... how do you make two decades of imprisonment interesting? -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 00:33:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R5X1Sd024155 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 00:33:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R5V9cP018452; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:31:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R5V7LT034130; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:31:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.84]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1R5V5LT034121 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:31:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sarah@modehistorique.com) Received: from unknown (HELO modehistorique.com) (lithiate@sbcglobal.net@68.126.135.193 with plain) by smtp814.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2004 05:31:05 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:31:00 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Sarah To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: <131.2a872da1.2d702a91@aol.com> Message-Id: <20AE29B4-68E6-11D8-9EBB-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > > Have you read Margaret George's "Mary Queen of Scotland and the > Isles"? It's > really pretty good. I still want to smack some sense into Mary, but > it does > the best job I've found so far of making her sympathetic and almost > likeable. > It also drags a bit in places, but really ... how do you make two > decades of > imprisonment interesting? LOL! Good point. I'll have to check it out! Sarah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 04:15:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1R9FkSd018654 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 04:15:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R9F1cP025293; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:15:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R9EtLT009038; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:14:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1R9EqLT008993 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 02:14:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7be84.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.132]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id B84EB47FE50 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:14:46 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000c01c3fd12$334abac0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:15:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] gold work buttons X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1R9FkSd018654 Status: RO Hi, In making my embroidered buttons for the new waistcoat, i experimented with the gold passing thread. And i think the experiment went very well. This would also be a wonderfull way to make trimmings on a waistcoat or suit. 1row of gold passing thread, 1 row of gold spangels, and 1 row of gold passing thread. Pictures are at the bottom of the side: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 09:49:56 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1REntSd020223 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:49:56 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1REkdcP007106; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 07:46:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1REkTLT018910; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 07:46:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web20729.mail.yahoo.com (web20729.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.119]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1REkQLT018871 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 07:46:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from elvestoorder@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040227143936.58364.qmail@web20729.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [204.60.172.50] by web20729.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:39:36 PST Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:39:36 -0800 (PST) From: Ann Catelli Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <001401c3fca8$bbde01e0$122ca5d1@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Isn't needle lace quite a lot of elaborated blanket &/or buttonhole stitch? I know there are some other things that may go on with needle lace, but the start is a blanket stitch with something extra in the way of twists, loops, etc. at the loopy end. of course, I tend to think of nalbinding as a fancy form of blanket stitch, too, so what do I know. Ann in CT Lisa Sinervo wrote: Karen wrote: [on a ruff}] >looks like a blanket stitch, something else is going on here as a blanket >stitch tat would be visible at the proportion of that painting would be really big! >I'd tend to think that it's a needlelace of some sort rather than an embroidery >stitch. > loop on the very edge, which wouldn't happen with a straight blanket stitch. "Elizabethan Lace"by Gilian Dye . . . Venetian Picot stitch section"Decorated Edges" . The linear effect is similar to a blanket stitch but would be more raised as there is abit of looping around various threads going on. Digby [may be useful]..... another source to look through. Lisa Sinervo --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 11:07:12 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RG7CSd020585 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:07:12 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RG58cP013167; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:05:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RG53LT061392; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:05:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RG4jLT061215 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:04:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from brujne@creighton.edu) Received: from cindyabel (cla53081.creighton.edu [147.134.201.2]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_28810+JAGae91741)/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA04959 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:04:44 -0600 (CST) From: "Cindy Abel" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr and women Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:04:45 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <07543E1D-68E1-11D8-9EBB-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Sarah Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 10:55 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr > I kind of wonder about Mary's famous black pearls. I've seen other > portraits > of the period with black pearl necklaces. > If he is making the identification solely on the necklace then that is > poor > research. Comes across as someone just wanting to be in the spotlight. That's really what bugs me about Starkey. He's very sensationalistic and he makes his subjects sound as though they were nothing more than sex-crazed drama queens. I can understand wanting to "sex things up" for a modern audience, but to me, Starkey often crosses the line and winds up sounding like a salacious old man who thinks every woman back in the Renaissance was solely concerned with what was going on between her legs. Either that or they're portrayed as airheads... Yes, but that is how men saw the ideal woman--produce babies, keep quiet, run the homefront and keep their looks without spending hubby's money(even if it was her own or her family's before the marriage)because that would be the sin of vanity and empty outlay of cash! Hmm...not too far from today when you start thinking about it. That men were afraid of the educated woman does make sense in those days, when you think of the skill and work it took just to get one meal on the table and men assuming that women had limited brain power so of course women should concentrate said limited brain power on running the home because without the home... No wonder the Puritains later were so hard on anyone who sloughed off work-wise when we read of how much sheer work went into everything for survival for the average person. But that's just my personal problem with him. On the whole, he does seem to do his homework, even if he tends to really water down the facts to make a quick buck. I quite prefer Alison Weir over Starkey, but others may disagree. I think she tells it much more realistically and stays truer to the personality of her subjects than most historians. Although she does occassionally bore me to tears (I'm still trying to wade through "Mary Queen of Scots and the Murder of Lord Darnley"). ;) I have some criticism of some of both Starkey and Weir suppositions, sometimes. But both are so knowledgeable about the period that it is easy for the researcher to get sucked in and have their favorites and not-so-favorite people. I did appreciate how Starkey broke some of the stereotype of Katherine of Aragon as not quite the saintly queen and corrected the timeline of Anne's affair with Henry Percy up to Henry VIII's interest in her. And all authors have always viewed history from the prism of their own times. I've preordered Joanna Denny's new biog of Anne Boleyn from Amazon.com.uk due out on Apr 29th as I try to read everything on Anne, and it will be interesting to see how Denny sees Anne. If anyone has advance reviews on this book, please let me know. I am probably very sympathetic to Anne, and from reading both Starkey and Weir wonder why no one has brought up the following. Its a bit off-topic, but I'll throw it out. According to Cavendish, Wolsey broke the relationship between Anne and Percy because Anne wasn't of equal birth and Henry was interested in her. But what if Wolsey was throwing up a smoke-screen, i.e., that during yet another time in English history where the monarch had no set male heir or heirs, such a marriage between Percy and Anne could possibly endanger the throne. Look at it this way: if Percy did wed Anne, it would expand the affinities of both the Northumberland and Howard-Boleyn families, giving two geographically and politically separate families unity. And while young Percy was no Warwick, no Kingmaker of the previous century, as it turned out, Wolsey had no means of assuming that the recently rehabilitated Howard clan or Thomas Boleyn wouldn't dream of becoming another Warwick, as Thomas Howard and Thomas Boleyn were pretty ambitious on promoting the good of their families(as one was supposed to do, anyway. Historic memories were long and a previous Northumberland had rebelled against the crown, so the family was not to be trusted. With no legitimate, unquestioned Tudor male heir, to allow such a marriage, would be courting disaster, while finalizing a betrothal and marriage between Percy and Talbot families would just be maintaining the status quo, since both families were allies and near neighbors, compared to a Percy/Howard Boleyn marriage alliance. And Heaven knows what ideas other families might get if Anne had been allowed to wed Henry Percy. I got this idea while reading Starkey's corrected timeline(he cites surviving documents)of the Anne Percy affair, Wolsey's repeated refusals of Thomas Boleyn's bargining's for higher office and rank(Boleyn's claim of the Ormond estates and title via his wife's claims), and Wolsey's hammering of Anne's not being good enough for a Northumberland, while later having to promote her to being the future Queen. But of course, Wolsey couldn't say to Anne and Percy or their families "No you can't marry, because such an alliance could present a danger to the Throne." It could give the nobility all kinds of ideas. Henry's daughter, Elizabeth was later more forthright in denying marriages she saw as endangering her. But Henry couldn't risk that--the Tudor dynasty was only in its second generation on the throne and the Buckingham affair was proof that the nobility were far from tame dogs with no asperations to the throne. Cindy Abel Sarah _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 11:28:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RGSLSd020691 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:28:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RGP7cP014996; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:25:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RGP2LT075724; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:25:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web9403.mail.yahoo.com (web9403.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.109]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1RGOxLT075674 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:24:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from albrakat7@yahoo.com) Message-ID: <20040227162458.76635.qmail@web9403.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.201.200.82] by web9403.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 08:24:58 PST Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 08:24:58 -0800 (PST) From: KATHRYN WOLTERS Subject: Re: [h-cost] gold work buttons To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000c01c3fd12$334abac0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO That's the wonderful thing about metal thread embroidery---it looks spectacular--with a minimum of effort:) Your experiment looks marvelous, Bjarne! Albra Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: Hi, In making my embroidered buttons for the new waistcoat, i experimented with the gold passing thread. And i think the experiment went very well. This would also be a wonderfull way to make trimmings on a waistcoat or suit. 1row of gold passing thread, 1 row of gold spangels, and 1 row of gold passing thread. Pictures are at the bottom of the side: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/chenillesuit.htm Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 12:15:07 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RHF6Sd021489 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 12:15:06 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RHEScP019592; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:14:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RHEOKj009191; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:14:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from thrednedlestrete.com (mail02.enterhost.com [69.93.13.234]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RHEIKj009108 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:14:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Lisa-list@thrednedlestrete.com) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:14:12 -0600 Message-Id: <200402271114.AA121897138@thrednedlestrete.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Lisa Sinervo" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] how to finish a ruff edge? X-Mailer: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO What you described Ann is probably the Venetian Picot stitch. I know little about needle lace so I would not be able to connect "needlelace" with "Venetian Picot" myself. But they sound very much the same to me and quite probably are. It's also nice to have Bjarne's mention of a letter for this type of stitch being used for ruffs. Boy would I like to have the opportunity to stand in front of the cases at the V & A one day. Lisa Sinervo ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Ann Catelli Reply-To: Historical Costume Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 06:39:36 -0800 (PST) >Isn't needle lace quite a lot of elaborated blanket &/or buttonhole stitch? > >I know there are some other things that may go on with needle lace, but the start is a blanket stitch with something extra in the way of twists, loops, etc. at the loopy end. > >of course, I tend to think of nalbinding as a fancy form of blanket stitch, too, so what do I know. > >Ann in CT > >Lisa Sinervo wrote: > >Karen wrote: >[on a ruff}] >>looks like a blanket stitch, something else is going on here as a blanket >stitch tat would be visible at the proportion of that painting would be really big! >I'd tend to think that it's a needlelace of some sort rather than an embroidery >stitch. >> >loop on the very edge, which wouldn't happen with a straight blanket stitch. > > "Elizabethan Lace"by Gilian Dye . . . Venetian Picot stitch section"Decorated Edges" . The linear effect is similar to a blanket stitch but would be more raised as there is abit of looping around various threads going on. > >Digby [may be useful]..... another source to look through. > >Lisa Sinervo > > > >--------------------------------- >Do you Yahoo!? >Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 12:54:30 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RHsSSd021654 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 12:54:30 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RHpGcP023836; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:51:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RHpAKj034725; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:51:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from smtp3.pacifier.net (smtp3.pacifier.net [64.255.237.173]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RHowKj034623 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:51:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kat@grendal.rain.com) Received: from KATHOUSE (unknown [67.136.137.233]) by smtp3.pacifier.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 240E76D624 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:50:57 -0800 (PST) From: kat@grendal.rain.com To: Historical Costume Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:50:55 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Message-ID: <403F12FF.4625.8EBB257@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <07543E1D-68E1-11D8-9EBB-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.12a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > That's really what bugs me about Starkey. He's very sensationalistic > and he makes his subjects sound as though they were nothing more than > sex-crazed drama queens. I can understand wanting to "sex things up" > for a modern audience, but to me, Starkey often crosses the line and > winds up sounding like a salacious old man who thinks every woman back > in the Renaissance was solely concerned with what was going on between > her legs. Either that or they're portrayed as airheads... Interesting. I just finished Starkey's 6 wives and it was the first time I'd seen any of the queens (with the exception of K. Parr) depicted as anything but stupid or airhead or sex maniacs. In fact, as far as the "what was going on between her legs" I think he put it in better perspective than most. I felt he made us look at it in a way other than Victorian "oh my god look what they did!" and more of a "look, it's just a natural function and we shouldn't condemn them according to our own ideas of morality." Even with K. Parr I learned new things (based on evidence, rather than speculation or rehashing of old author's speculation) such as her role in Henry's invasion of France. And CoA's similar role during the earlier one. (Interestingly, Spain was supposedly their ally and both times sold them out to France. It made me wonder why Henry would even think of depending on them as an ally.) I've also been amazed at Starkey's willingness to say "I learned this that I didn't know when I was writing X book on the subject." That seems to me to be a willingness to be convinced by newer and better evidence as opposed to many writers who seem to stick to old theories even when presented with solid evidence that debunks them. But then, I've only read 3 of Starkey's books (and Hope has given me a list of several more than I didn't know about. I wonder if it's too late to put them on my birthday wish list?) Kat _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 14:46:05 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RJk5Sd027167 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:46:05 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RJjHcP004368; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 12:45:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RJjCKj010945; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 12:45:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from badger.uvm.edu (badger.uvm.edu [132.198.101.184]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RJjBKj010901 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 12:45:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hope.greenberg@uvm.edu) Received: from uvm.edu (ip094068.uvm.edu [132.198.94.68]) by badger.uvm.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RJj7I1014818 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:45:07 -0500 Message-ID: <403F9E46.2020904@uvm.edu> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:45:10 -0500 From: Hope Greenberg User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr References: <48D163B6-68B9-11D8-A386-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> In-Reply-To: <48D163B6-68B9-11D8-A386-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sarah wrote: > I don't have any idea if Starkey is right in his assumption that the > sitter is KP, but he has got some valid arguments and KP fits squarely > into that time frame as a possibility. But I'd also have to wonder if > the woman in the painting isn't KP's mother, or another close female > relative that might have had a connection with the pearls. The argument I'd make for it not being her mother is that a portrait was traditionally done for an event like a wedding. And, I suppose, a portrait of a Queen (though she would not have been queen at that time) would perhaps be more likely to be preserved and handed down to future generations. I don't know enough about the history of portraiture to date, more precisely, when portraits of English royalty began to be used in more complicated ways. Certainly Elizabeth was adept at using her image for political purposes, both by giving away portraits and by having herself portrayed in many ways and forms. Who knows, maybe she learned some of that at Katherine's knee! On the question of dating based on the headdress--is it really so far out of line for late 1520s? When you look at non-royal images, especially those outside London, (funeral brasses, too, though they are more bound by conventions than portraits) the fashions seem to trail by a wide margin. - Hope _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 15:26:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RKQmSd028339 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:26:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RKNYcP007398; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:23:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RKNTKj035369; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:23:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from web.antekhou.com (adsl-66-136-30-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net [66.136.30.169]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RKNRKj035331 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 13:23:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cbucheger@paclp.com) Received: from escom.antek [192.168.0.151] by web.antekhou.com (SMTPD32-8.00) id A73376D0138; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:23:15 -0600 Received: From PACws22 ([65.45.18.250]) by escom.antek (WebShield SMTP v4.5 MR1a); id 1077913394596; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:23:14 -0600 Message-ID: <003701c3fd6d$ee332e20$1d64a8c0@algx> From: "Cyn Bucheger" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 14:11:45 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] looking for a painting X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I need to find a painting pretty quick that is similar to this one, in that the lady is wearing one of these pearled partlets. The one in particular that I am looking for the lady is wearing a necklace of simple garnet beads with a large pendent. I've made the partlet, and would like to have a necklace similar to the garnet one, but can't for the life of me remember what the pendent was or what it looked like. Thanks for any help Cyn http://cgfa.sunsite.dk/c/p-clouet5.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 17:31:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RMV9Sd029391 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:31:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RMSucP018470; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:28:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RMSlKj017234; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:28:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RMSjKj017200 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:28:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.95.218] (helo=dan) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1Awm8P-0003o9-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:50:49 +0000 Message-ID: <02ad01c3fd5a$7de74ba0$da5f8151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:52:39 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi all, I am grappling with the joys of my mid 18th c. stays, and I am searching for pictures of busks of this period. And not finding any... I am making my stays front lacing, to aid getting in and out of it, which I think was reasonably common practise judging from my research so far, and there seemed to be a pocket behind the lacing for the busk in a number of these. All the references I have seen so far on this point suggest that it was triangular in cross section, with, I presume the flat edge to the skin. But I suspect, however that this may derive from Jean Hunnisset's book, and I am not sure of her sources on this. Can anyone point me to some, please? Also, I shall be stiffening my stomacher with a layer of buckram; do I need to add more strength to this, say some of the Wissner boning I am using for my stays? thanks and best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 18:01:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RN1bSd029498 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:01:37 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RMtPcP021652; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:55:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RMtKKj035310; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:55:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (IDENT:dzej/xhCqyJXffBOiLPU9Fpnw+wRsnQx@jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RMtFKj035265 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 15:55:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from patriot.net (support.patriot.net [209.249.176.6]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.10/8.12.3) with SMTP id i1RMtD4r030806 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:55:13 -0500 Message-Id: <200402272255.i1RMtD4r030806@jefferson.patriot.net> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 22:55:03 -0000 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers From: X-Mailer: TWIG 2.3.2 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stevie Gamble said: > I am making my stays front lacing, to aid getting in and out of it, > which I think was reasonably common practise judging from my research > so far, Hi Stevie, Please tell me why you think this was common! From what I've seen, back- lacing stays are the norm. Yes, we find them less-than-convenient today. :-) There are a few sets of extant stays that are both front and back lacing, and the back laces appear to be the way they were put on (the holes are more worn on the back). I think there are only one or two sets of front-only lacing stays around, they appear to be very rare. This includes strapless "common" stays that are found in some museum collections, they are also most commonly back-lacing. Thanks! -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 18:14:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RNEhSd029547 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:14:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RNClcP024511; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:12:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RNCjKj047653; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:12:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RNCbKj047524 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:12:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f5d.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.93]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 4990047FE4F for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:12:30 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <000a01c3fd87$39b1c5f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:12:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] picots for ruffs X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1RNEhSd029547 Status: RO Hi I uploaded 3 different ways to make picots in needlelace for edging ruffs. There also is a picture of a real ruff from about 1600 i would share with you. It is a picture from my danish textile history society. http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/picots.htm Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 18:23:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1RNNMSd029587 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:23:22 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RNKEcP025897; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:20:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RNKAKj052984; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:20:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1RNK8Kj052947 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:20:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32f5d.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.93]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id EE35F5EE050 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:20:06 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <002401c3fd88$4a4aedf0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:20:29 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] stays and busks X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1RNNMSd029587 Status: RO Dear Stevie. It is fine to make your stay to be laced in front also. It is known. But i am a little confused, because if your stays are open in the front, then you wont be able to make a pocket for the busk. The pocket should be sewed to both ends in the front then, and that is imposible. You cant open your stays in the front then. (or am i making a mistake) Another thing i would say is, that you really dont need to have a busk in your stays. This boning you are using, is very nice, and dont need any more stiffening. If you want to use a busk, then the pocket is sewed inside the stays center front along one of the boning channels. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 20:32:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1S1WwSd030576 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:32:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S1V3cP009261; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:31:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S1UqKj027304; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:30:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d22.mx.aol.com (imo-d22.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.208]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S1UoKj027269 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:30:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.1d4.1b2b5a60 (17079) for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:30:41 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <1d4.1b2b5a60.2d714941@aol.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:30:41 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO When you say you are lacing your stays up the front, do you mean over a stomacher? This is OK but they usually lace up the back too. I don't think you need a busk especially if there is a stomacher in front. Just make the stomacher very stiff [completely boned] perhaps putting some horizontal bones across the bust. This will round out the bust nicely. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 22:28:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1S3SpSd030928 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 22:28:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S3SDcP014828; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:28:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S3RtKj078527; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:27:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S3RqKj078506 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 20:27:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from theresa@misc.com) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1S3V352005621 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 19:31:03 -0800 Message-ID: <404009CD.2040508@misc.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 19:23:57 -0800 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] picots for ruffs References: <000a01c3fd87$39b1c5f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Bjarne!! Awesome, a pic is worth a bunch of words...thanks so much for sharing this...the light bulb just went - AHHHHH!!!! Theresa Eacker Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Hi > I uploaded 3 different ways to make picots in needlelace for edging ruffs. > There also is a picture of a real ruff from about 1600 i would share with you. It is a picture from my danish textile history society. > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/picots.htm > > Bjarne > > > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Feb 27 23:44:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1S4irSd031098 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 23:44:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S4iFcP018212; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:44:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S4i8Kj007562; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:44:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S4i6Kj007536 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:44:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla-r1a1m92.in-tch.com [216.166.191.92]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1S4LPs22755 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:21:26 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <40401D56.5000507@in-tch.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:47:18 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] picots for ruffs References: <000a01c3fd87$39b1c5f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <000a01c3fd87$39b1c5f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Ah, Bjarne, you're a blessing to costumers world-wide. I always enjoy reading your posts and drooling at your latest projects. I've tried the first kind of picot, as a future edging for the neckline of a 16th-century shift. It works quite well as long as my thread is thick enough--the embroidery for the sleeves was done with one thread, but I found I had to use 2 threads for a good picot loop. The ruff is just plain yummy. --sue, who's sitting here on a Friday evening, listening to a lovely Jazz & Pop program on our local public radio station and contemplating cleaning enough of my little living room to be able to lay out fabric for my new garb this weekend, and I'm endlessly enjoying the wonder of being able to click on a little line of typing and instantly connect with a computer in Denmark, which is so many 1000s of miles away! Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > Hi > I uploaded 3 different ways to make picots in needlelace for edging ruffs. > There also is a picture of a real ruff from about 1600 i would share with you. It is a picture from my danish textile history society. > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/picots.htm > > Bjarne > > > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 28 01:20:32 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1S6KWSd031346 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 01:20:32 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S6IacP021570; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 23:18:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S6IYKj039936; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 23:18:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from softwareinnovation.com (w002.z064000176.dfw-tx.dsl.cnc.net [64.0.176.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S6IOKj039843 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2004 23:18:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from betsy@softwareinnovation.com) Received: from theforce ([64.0.176.13]) by softwareinnovation.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.0); Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:18:14 -0600 From: "Betsy Marshall" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] picots for ruffs Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:18:30 -0600 Message-ID: <000d01c3fdc2$afd60f30$0db00040@softwareinnovation.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: <40401D56.5000507@in-tch.com> Importance: Normal X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2004 06:18:14.0380 (UTC) FILETIME=[A5CF12C0:01C3FDC2] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Truly, we are living in an Age of Miracles. -Thanks for reminding me! Betsy; who's also having a (mentally) odd evening... -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Sue Clemenger Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 10:47 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] picots for ruffs Ah, Bjarne, you're a blessing to costumers world-wide. --sue, who's sitting here on a Friday evening, listening to a lovely Jazz & Pop program on our local public radio station and contemplating cleaning enough of my little living room to be able to lay out fabric for my new garb this weekend, and I'm endlessly enjoying the wonder of being able to click on a little line of typing and instantly connect with a computer in Denmark, which is so many 1000s of miles away! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 28 04:01:21 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1S91LSd025027 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 04:01:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S8xKcP024956; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 01:59:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S8xAKj090526; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 01:59:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S8x9Kj090514 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 01:59:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-67-121-125-180.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [67.121.125.180]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1S8x5ka025038 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:59:06 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040228005317.04c12350@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:58:14 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] picots for ruffs In-Reply-To: <000a01c3fd87$39b1c5f0$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >There also is a picture of a real ruff from about 1600 i would share with >you. It is a picture from my danish textile history society. >http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/picots.htm Thank you so much for this image of the ruff. I had always suspected that these were tightly gathered and then shaped, but here is one to prove that at least somebody did it that way. I got the idea from looking at how the 16th century ones always got thinner right at the neck, and from those images of Mary Queen of Scots where the ruff looked different one side from the other and, from the side, appeared to be gathered super-tightly into toe top of a shirt neckband. I feel much better now. Thank you again. 17th century "mill wheel" ruffs may well be made by pleating material onto a neckband, since they seem the same thickness at the neck and at the outside edge. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 28 15:05:49 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1SK5mSd028058 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:05:49 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SK57cP020986; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:05:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SK4xKj033017; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:04:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from out012.verizon.net (out012pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SK4vKj032999 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:04:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jauncourt@verizon.net) Received: from verizon.net ([4.12.175.251]) by out012.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040228200456.OUYP1590.out012.verizon.net@verizon.net> for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:04:56 -0600 Message-ID: <4040F46B.6070902@verizon.net> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:04:59 -0600 From: Maura Folsom User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-CA; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en, en-ca MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com References: <200402281901.i1SJ10Kk008684@net.indra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out012.verizon.net from [4.12.175.251] at Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:04:56 -0600 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Odd costume-related question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I'm on a baby-wearing bulletin board and one of the forums discusses tradtional forms of babywearing (putting baby in a shawl, sarong, structured carrier, etc). Recently the question of traditional forms of baby carrying in Early Modern Europe has come up, and all that has been found is the Welsh method of carrying baby in a shawl or rectangular cloak. I have read about Highland Scots and Irish women doing a similar thing, but it was a long time ago and now I'm not so sure about the scholarship of the book involved, so I've been loath to mention it. On top of this mystery, I tossed the following into the discussion today: "All this makes me wonder what sort of babywearing/carrying solution was used by the colonists in the New World (we're talking poorer people, who lived in remote places, usually former indentured servants, usually only a husband/wife and children, not necessarily townspeople) during the 17th and 18th centuries... I used to reenact F&I period (mid 18th century, during the French and Indian wars), but I didn't have a child, so I didn't give it much thought. Come to think of it, when I was researching costume, I never saw references to such a thing, except among slaves and native people. :/ " So, has anyone out there seen references to shawls or other accessories being used to carry baby in either Early Modern Europe or the Colonies? M. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 28 15:56:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1SKu0Sd028269 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:56:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SKqkcP022943; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:52:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SKqiKj049586; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:52:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SKqdKj049557 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:52:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.53.196] (helo=dan) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AxALx-0004fF-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:42:25 +0000 Message-ID: <005801c3fe33$3f7c3e00$c4358151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402272255.i1RMtD4r030806@jefferson.patriot.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:44:15 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carol wrote: > > I am making my stays front lacing, to aid getting in and out of it, > > which I think was reasonably common practise judging from my research > > so far, > > > > Please tell me why you think this was common! From what I've seen, back- > lacing stays are the norm. Yes, we find them less-than-convenient today. :-) > There are a few sets of extant stays that are both front and back lacing, and > the back laces appear to be the way they were put on (the holes are more worn > on the back). I think there are only one or two sets of front-only lacing > stays around, they appear to be very rare. Well, the three sets of 18th century women's English stays shown on pages 130-131 of 'Fashion', Kyoto Costume Institute are all front lacing, which appears perfectly logical given the different structure of the robe a l'anglaise. The last thing one would want is to spoil the line of those immaculate, unwrinkled, tight bodices with the perfect symmetry of the seams, by having the bulging of the laces underneath them. Front laced stays would keep any bulges hidden under the stomacher. And whilst the Kyoto collection is a wide ranging one, it seems improbable that it has managed to acquire the only three front lacing 18th century English women's stays in existence... best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 28 17:34:28 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1SMYRSd028780 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:34:27 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SMW2cP027418; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:32:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SMVuKj096805; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:31:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (IDENT:blvSgfTHcmrJ5ZRTA+ps2O2u/9Vlu1yT@jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SMVrKj096768 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:31:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.116] (pool180-116.patriot.net [209.249.180.116]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.10/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i1SMVb4s016218 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:31:43 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <005801c3fe33$3f7c3e00$c4358151@dan> References: <200402272255.i1RMtD4r030806@jefferson.patriot.net> <005801c3fe33$3f7c3e00$c4358151@dan> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:29:20 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hi Stevie, Are the stays in the Kyoto book all front-lacing only, or front and back lacing? I can't get at my copy of the book easily right now. The laces used for 18thC stays were most likely flat woven tape, and the lacing holes in extant stays are fairly small, so not enough to create bulges. Also the stays are laced with one tape, in a spiral, which would also keep the tape flat & not bulging. More examples of stays can be found in Corsets & Crinolines, and also there are several pictured on the web these days from museum collections. You may also want to check out the 18cWoman list, which is a Yahoogroup. There have been many discussions of 18thC stays on that list. -Carol >Well, the three sets of 18th century women's English stays shown on >pages 130-131 of 'Fashion', Kyoto Costume Institute are all front >lacing, which appears perfectly logical given the different structure >of the robe a l'anglaise. The last thing one would want is to spoil >the line of those immaculate, unwrinkled, tight bodices with the >perfect symmetry of the seams, by having the bulging of the laces >underneath them. Front laced stays would keep any bulges hidden under >the stomacher. And whilst the Kyoto collection is a wide ranging one, >it seems improbable that it has managed to acquire the only three >front lacing 18th century English women's stays in existence... > >best wishes >Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 28 18:06:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1SN6sSd028933 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:06:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SN51cP028757; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:05:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SN4xKj008593; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:04:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m20.mx.aol.com (imo-m20.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SN4uKj008546 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:04:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.166.2c33b37c (3948) for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:04:45 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <166.2c33b37c.2d72788d@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:04:45 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/28/2004 3:53:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, stevie.gamble@btinternet.com writes: > Well, the three sets of 18th century women's English stays shown on > pages 130-131 of 'Fashion', Kyoto Costume Institute are all front > lacing, which appears perfectly logical given the different structure > of the robe a l'anglaise. Indeed. But didn't you just say you were making 18th century stays? [Sorry, don't have your original post.] These are late in the century and I think they are transitional garments and not representative of typical 18th century stays or even typical late 18th century stays. Yes, the Kyoto may have 3 of them [did they come from the same source?] but I'll bet they don't even represent the norm in 18th century stays at the Kyoto. That being said.....you do have good research to back up your front lacing stays and I say go for it! But I don't think they are typical. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 28 23:05:36 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1T45aSd029895 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 23:05:36 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T44qcP012722; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 21:04:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T44iKj008179; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 21:04:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T44hKj008163 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 21:04:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from madlystitching@earthlink.net) Received: from firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net (firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.121.247]) by flavatown.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i1T2sRc26155 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:54:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from 209-165-58-160.jps.net ([209.165.58.160] helo=w7m1l6) by firecrest.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1AxH61-0004Xv-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:54:26 -0800 Message-ID: <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> From: "Stephen Bergdahl" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402281901.i1SJ10Kk008684@net.indra.com> <4040F46B.6070902@verizon.net> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:52:23 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-ELNK-Trace: 08dba192340bde6e1a6ab3b9b70940f894f5150ab1c16ac050a736d1df7ddf74508a53115fe430643bfc1ccf2416d399350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Fabric Question X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello all I would like a second, or third opinion on a fabric. It's at: http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/ua-107.html I am thinking of making a Houp (?) out of this. I'm not looking for perfect period, it's for the SCA. But I want to be sure I am in the ball park. And textile patterns is not my strong suit. So what does everyone think? Stephen Bergdahl - Lord Vich "This ring, no other, is made by the elves, Who'd pawn their own mother to grab it themselves. Ruler of creeper, mortal, and scallop, This is a sleeper that packs quite a wallop. The Power almighty rests in this Lone Ring. The Power, alrightly, for doing your Own Thing. If broken or busted it cannot be remade If found, send to Sorhed (the postage is prepaid)." _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Feb 28 23:18:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1T4IbSd029935 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 23:18:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T4I9cP013501; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 21:18:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T4I8Kj013048; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 21:18:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T4I3Kk013018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 21:18:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1T4HF7j024890 for ; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 23:17:16 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 23:17:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <404167FE.9000706@thibault.org> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 23:18:06 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric Question References: <200402281901.i1SJ10Kk008684@net.indra.com> <4040F46B.6070902@verizon.net> <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> In-Reply-To: <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > I would like a second, or third opinion on a fabric. It's at: > > http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/ua-107.html > > I am thinking of making a Houp (?) out of this. It's not too bad. My own choice would be for richer colors, but the design is regular and stylized, which is a big plus, and unlike many available weaves. Keep in mind that you'll need a lot of it! -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent Vote early, vote often! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 02:52:46 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1T7qkSd030400 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 02:52:46 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T7q6cP021329; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 00:52:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T7pwKj081802; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 00:51:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T7ppKj081736 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 00:51:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC59642615 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 03:05:14 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <40419BCB.4000909@reddawn.net> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:59:07 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric Question References: <200402281901.i1SJ10Kk008684@net.indra.com> <4040F46B.6070902@verizon.net> <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> In-Reply-To: <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stephen Bergdahl wrote: > Hello all > > I would like a second, or third opinion on a fabric. It's at: > > http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/ua-107.html > > I am thinking of making a Houp (?) out of this. I'm not looking for perfect > period, it's for the SCA. But I want to be sure I am in the ball park. And > textile patterns is not my strong suit. So what does everyone think? > It's a plausibly period fabric design and colour, though the red is not one I would choose to wear, just not my color. I think it would look nice with a light (non-metallic) gold or cream contrasting lining. The fabric is cotton, at least it is a natural fiber and should be somewhat comfortable. At 54" the width is going to let you get nice wide sleeves and skirts out of it without too much piecing. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 02:54:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1T7scSd030404 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 02:54:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T7qkcP021361; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 00:52:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T7qkKj082123; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 00:52:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo2.socket.net (mo2.socket.net [216.106.88.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T7qaKj082066 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 00:52:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo2.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5724D1D5A6 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:52:36 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p092.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.94]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 0E984D3EE for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:52:35 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:52:43 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20040218163802.00ba3cb0@pop.fuse.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] men's late fifteen hundreds X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO My husband has volunteered me to help a friend with a man's 1500s costume for the St. Louis Ren Faire. Menswear in this late period is not something I know a lot about. So, I believe he is middle to upper class. This is his first time and I don't think he cares about authenticity just that it blends in with the other costumes. The SLRF though is trying to be more authentic in the costuming area. I will see if he wants to get more specific (German,Italian....) But what I need is possible patterns. Pretty much anything you think can help in getting this pulled together by May. Shirt is not a problem. It will most likely be cotton unless he real wants the linen. eggshell in color, basically not a brilliant white. Hose - anyone have a suggestion for a pattern. jerkin - short poofypants-(can't think of the correct name right now) shoes- china shoes or I know of a few websites if he can afford it. Thank you, Thank you very, very much, De Now I need to go have a long talk with my husband about volunteering me before asking. :} _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 04:18:43 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1T9IgSd031143 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 04:18:43 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T9GncP023890; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 02:16:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T9GjKj006598; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 02:16:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo2.socket.net (mo2.socket.net [216.106.88.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1T9GhKj006587 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 02:16:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo2.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA95F1D589 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 03:16:43 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p092.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.94]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id BCACED3EA for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 03:16:42 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 03:16:51 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20040218163802.00ba3cb0@pop.fuse.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Swedish 1528 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Found this on late swedish http://www.frazzledfrau.glittersweet.com/1528margwasastockholm.html De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 05:10:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TAA9Sd006346 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 05:10:09 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TA71cP024920; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 03:07:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TA6xKj020388; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 03:06:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo2.socket.net (mo2.socket.net [216.106.88.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TA6wKj020378 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 03:06:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mf2.socket.net [216.106.88.48]) by mo2.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC84A1D001 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 04:06:57 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p092.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.214.94]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 9FD35D3EC for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 04:06:56 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Fabric Question Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 04:07:05 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <40419BCB.4000909@reddawn.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I agree with the gold but I was thinking maybe an old gold lining (of coarse that is personal preference. I think the material squeaks by for a houppelaude. Just a thought, if you get the material, try it with the pattern upside-down giving it a sort of weird ermine tail design. On a personal note, I don't know why but the circle spots on the bottom of each design screams to me pearls, must put pearl in this spot.:) De Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TBBBSd006524 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:11:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TB6ncP027354; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 04:06:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TB6hKj036433; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 04:06:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from kline.thibault.org (komarr.thibault.org [66.92.75.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TB6eKk036418 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 04:06:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cvirtue+keyword+histcostume.aa1b43@thibault.org) Received: from kline-station.local.thibault.org (kline-station.local.thibault.org [127.0.0.1]) by kline.thibault.org (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1TB5q7j002142 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:05:53 -0500 Received: from thibault.org (cetaganda.local.thibault.org [192.168.10.21]) by kline-station.local.thibault.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:05:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4041C7C2.3010105@thibault.org> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:06:42 -0500 Organization: Medieval Hats: http://www.virtue.to User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric Question References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Cynthia Virtue X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/0.78 (Hill Gail) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO otsisto wrote: > I agree with the gold but I was thinking maybe an old gold lining (of coarse > that is personal preference. I think the material squeaks by for a > houppelaude. Just a thought, if you get the material, try it with the > pattern upside-down giving it a sort of weird ermine tail design. > On a personal note, I don't know why but the circle spots on the bottom of > each design screams to me pearls, must put pearl in this spot.:) Upside-down is interesting. Before you pearl the whole thing, you might want to see if you can find examples of that sort of beading on fabric. -- Cynthia Virtue and/or Cynthia du Pré Argent Vote early, vote often! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 08:14:41 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TDEeSd011058 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 08:14:41 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TDB1cP001481; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:11:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TDAwKj069904; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:10:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from uranium.btinternet.com (uranium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.89]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TDAtKj069883 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:10:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.39.222] (helo=dan) by uranium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AxQia-0002zv-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:10:52 +0000 Message-ID: <000f01c3fec5$b7dc8200$de278151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402272255.i1RMtD4r030806@jefferson.patriot.net><005801c3fe33$3f7c3e00$c4358151@dan> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:12:43 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carol wrote: > Are the stays in the Kyoto book all front-lacing only, or front > and back lacing? I can't get at my copy of the book easily right now. > The three English stays I cited are all front lacing only; the one on page 126 are laced front and back, and the one on page 127 is back and sides. > The laces used for 18thC stays were most likely flat woven tape, > and the lacing holes in extant stays are fairly small, so not enough > to create bulges. Also the stays are laced with one tape, in a > spiral, which would also keep the tape flat & not bulging. Yes; I'd gathered this. On the other hand, given the difficulties another list member has had in getting the tight unwrinkled effect, I would prefer to eliminate the possibility altogether. > > More examples of stays can be found in Corsets & Crinolines, Corsets and Crinolines was published in 1954, and whilst I have great regard for Norah Waugh's research, I don't propose to rely on conclusions reached over 50 years ago... Incidentally, Garsault asserts, in 'Description des Artes et Metiers', Paris, 1769, in his observations on stay makers, that English stays (corps a l'anglaise) lace in front, and he gives a diagram. I'm not sure why you consider Garsault to have been mistaken; can you explain, further, please? best wishes Stevie > >Well, the three sets of 18th century women's English stays shown on > >pages 130-131 of 'Fashion', Kyoto Costume Institute are all front > >lacing, which appears perfectly logical given the different structure > >of the robe a l'anglaise. The last thing one would want is to spoil > >the line of those immaculate, unwrinkled, tight bodices with the > >perfect symmetry of the seams, by having the bulging of the laces > >underneath them. Front laced stays would keep any bulges hidden under > >the stomacher. And whilst the Kyoto collection is a wide ranging one, > >it seems improbable that it has managed to acquire the only three > >front lacing 18th century English women's stays in existence... > > > >best wishes > >Stevie > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 08:37:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TDb2Sd011159 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 08:37:02 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TDXZcP002312; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:33:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TDXWKj075981; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:33:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TDXVKj075947 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:33:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fc6.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.198]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 7822326284F for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:33:12 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <001801c3fec8$a0ec9780$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:33:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 18th century style X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1TDb2Sd011159 Status: RO I want to come with my arguments here two, In a book i have called Moden i 1700 ĺrene written by a very skilled knowledged lady, (fashion in the 1700 years) she writes that corsets were made in two fashions. English fashion laced center front and french fashion laced center back, and then some had both with a seperate stomacher front. This is a huge book wich tell very detailed of all the knowns fashions in 18th century. And i surely trust her. So Stevie, there is absolutely nothing wrong in making a corset laced center front. Go for it! Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 09:23:13 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TENCSd011370 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:23:13 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TEMWcP003913; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:22:32 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TEKRKj091956; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:22:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pqueuea.post.tele.dk (pqueuea.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.9]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TEJOKj091565 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:20:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by pqueuea.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8ACA7378210 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:52:35 +0100 (CET) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x3ef32fc6.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [62.243.47.198]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 3EB17262860 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:51:21 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <006701c3fecb$2ca2aa60$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:51:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 18th century stays X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i1TENCSd011370 Status: RO At my other homepage i have a pattern of a pair of 18th century stays wich are laced center front and center front. It has a separate stomacher two. http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/underpinnings_.htm If you scroll down on the buttom of the side. The tabs and the little hip roll are made of white kit. Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 09:28:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TESiSd011386 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:28:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TEQscP004055; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:26:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TEPsKj093931; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:26:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from m2.nyc.untd.com (m2.nyc.untd.com [64.136.22.65]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i1TEOqKj093494 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:25:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from seamstrix@juno.com) Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"VlQqLyNLY6dl7D8HNF4VCg/q6RpRTob4vOqxgQqy62fV26+MZ53BrA==">; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:23:48 PST Received: (from seamstrix@juno.com) by m2.nyc.untd.com (jqueuemail) id JPKHLV3H; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:23:48 PST To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 08:21:06 -0600 Subject: Re: [h-cost] men's late fifteen hundreds Message-ID: <20040229.082107.-473005.0.Seamstrix@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4-53 From: seamstrix@juno.com Cc: h-costume@indra.com X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO For just your basic, 'looks good, not necessarily period' look I'd go with Simplicity pattern #5574. Probably easy to make, has all the required pieces and can be gussied up or stripped down for various social levels. Of course the Cadillac of Elizabethan patterns is Margo Anderson's set, but I'm not sure how involved you want to get. http://www.simplicity.com/index.cfm?cat=4&type=19&sec=0&id=63 Just my tuppence, Karen On Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:52:43 -0600 "otsisto" writes: > > My husband has volunteered me to help a friend with a man's 1500s > costume > for the St. Louis Ren Faire. Menswear in this late period is not > something I > know a lot about. > So, I believe he is middle to upper class. This is his first time > and I > don't think he cares about authenticity just that it blends in with > the > other costumes. The SLRF though is trying to be more authentic in > the > costuming area. I will see if he wants to get more specific > (German,Italian....) > But what I need is possible patterns. Pretty much anything you think > can > help in getting this pulled together by May. > Shirt is not a problem. It will most likely be cotton unless he real > wants > the linen. eggshell in color, basically not a brilliant white. > Hose - anyone have a suggestion for a pattern. > jerkin - > short poofypants-(can't think of the correct name right now) > shoes- china shoes or I know of a few websites if he can afford it. > > Thank you, Thank you very, very much, > De > Now I need to go have a long talk with my husband about volunteering > me > before asking. :} > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 09:48:15 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TEmESd011451 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:48:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TEkOcP004738; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:46:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TEkNKj001352; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:46:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mx.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TEjLKj000866 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 07:46:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.c4.65cecdc (17079) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:45:13 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:45:12 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] men's late fifteen hundreds To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1074; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/29/2004 8:27:58 AM Central Standard Time, seamstrix@juno.com writes: For just your basic, 'looks good, not necessarily period' look I'd go with Simplicity pattern #5574. Probably easy to make, has all the required pieces and can be gussied up or stripped down for various social levels. Of course the Cadillac of Elizabethan patterns is Margo Anderson's set, but I'm not sure how involved you want to get. I have a suggestion for a nice middle ground ::smile:: - Fantasy Fashions' "Dashing Doublet" and "Paned Breeches" patterns. The benefits to them are the patterns are period-accurate so you won't have to worry about whether he fits in; they're *extremely* simple to make and fit (and do not waste fabric as many of the commercial patterns do); and to me FF patterns are a great investment because they are made out of heavy weight paper, not tissue, so they *last*. They can be purchased at Grannd Garb and many other places online. Fantasy Fashions: Grannd Shoppes -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 10:51:53 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TFprSd011758 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:51:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TFpAcP007635; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 08:51:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TFp8Kj024955; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 08:51:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TFp6Kj024911 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 08:51:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B1FD42615 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:04:31 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <40420C21.3030404@reddawn.net> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:58:25 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] men's late fifteen hundreds References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO > For just your basic, 'looks good, not necessarily period' look I'd go > with Simplicity pattern #5574. and > I have a suggestion for a nice middle ground ::smile:: - Fantasy Fashions' > "Dashing Doublet" and "Paned Breeches" patterns. I'll second both suggestions. They will both get your husband a nice 'renfest' late 1500's outfit. I'd also like to add the url to my pattern reviews, which gives you an idea of which other major commercial patterns you can pull pieces from: (and which to avoid) www.reddawn.net/costume/costpat.htm Shirt you said you had covered. Hose I would buy, unless you really enjoy sewing bias or stretchy material. If you want to make them, look in the sports patterns for women's excercise tights or something similar. Shoes, I'd suggest crawling thrift shops and the discount shoe places looking for low, square-toed or round-toed dress shoes. They'll be easier on the feet than the china flats. Also, if he is going upper class, he will need a hat. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 11:19:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TGJmSd011906 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:19:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TGJBcP008955; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:19:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TGJAKj034059; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:19:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TGJ8Kj034052 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:19:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.39.222] (helo=dan) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AxRSZ-0003L3-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:58:23 +0000 Message-ID: <001401c3fecc$5b3b43e0$de278151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <166.2c33b37c.2d72788d@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:00:14 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Albert wrote: > > Well, the three sets of 18th century women's English stays shown on > > pages 130-131 of 'Fashion', Kyoto Costume Institute are all front > > lacing, which appears perfectly logical given the different structure > > of the robe a l'anglaise. > Indeed. But didn't you just say you were making 18th century stays? [Sorry, > don't have your original post.] These are late in the century and I think they > are transitional garments and not representative of typical 18th century stays > or even typical late 18th century stays. > Yes, the Kyoto may have 3 of them > [did they come from the same source?] but I'll bet they don't even represent the > norm in 18th century stays at the Kyoto. > > That being said.....you do have good research to back up your front lacing > stays and I say go for it! But I don't think they are typical. Well, looking at the English stays the centre one is said to have probably been altered from a mid-18th century garment, and the other 2 are dated 1785 and 1790 respectively. The 1760 french pair of stays on page 126 lace front and back, and the other pair, described early 18th century, on page 127 are side and back lacing. Even if we take only the 2 French garments we can hardly suggest that this supports the thesis that stays were only backlacing. The odd looking 'corset' on page 129 has no provenance or origin given, and is dated 1760-1770, and even that one appears to do up most of the way down the front, as well as being laced down the back. Garsault's front lacing corps a l'anglaise pattern was printed in 1769, which suggests that French tailors had been making front lacing stays long before the late 18th century, and regarded them as English in origin. One cannot judge what is 'typical' without reviewing a full range of representative garments, and even then there would be major problems. How do we establish our sample range in the first place? Remember, I am interested in English stays of a particular period; an aristocratic Englishwoman with fashionable pretentions might well have bought stays in Paris, particularly if she was paying for new gowns to be made also, but that's the limit of the known world as far as fashion was concerned. Particularly when attending a Ball in Bath, fashionable Mecca for the upper classes... thanks and best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 11:38:23 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TGcMSd011956 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:38:23 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TGZCcP009565; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:35:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TGZAKj039222; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:35:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TGZ5Kj039193 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:35:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from in-tch.com (msla_r1a212.in-tch.com [66.62.107.12]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1TGCMs18959 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:12:22 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <40421579.2000304@in-tch.com> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:38:17 -0700 From: Sue Clemenger User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric Question References: <200402281901.i1SJ10Kk008684@net.indra.com> <4040F46B.6070902@verizon.net> <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> In-Reply-To: <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Mmmm...don't think so. I've never seen a pattern anything like that in art from the period in which one sees houpelandes. Some brocades and such, sure, but not something that looks (at least to my eyes) more like a stylized palm tree. Patterned fabrics are hard to get "right," so you might go with a plain color--a wool, maybe? since you can sometimes find them pretty cheaply this time of year, and they'd be more appropriate for a houp. --sue (Mst. Maire in the SCA) Stephen Bergdahl wrote: > Hello all > > I would like a second, or third opinion on a fabric. It's at: > > http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/ua-107.html > > I am thinking of making a Houp (?) out of this. I'm not looking for perfect > period, it's for the SCA. But I want to be sure I am in the ball park. And > textile patterns is not my strong suit. So what does everyone think? > > Stephen Bergdahl - Lord Vich _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 13:15:48 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TIFlSd012505 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:15:48 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TICAd1013716; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:12:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1THl4Kj063696; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:47:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (IDENT:0lnnPjHeLHZyZKexmc0SWi1oYnfnjsnl@jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1THl3Kj063681 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:47:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from [209.249.180.14] (pool180-94.patriot.net [209.249.180.94]) (authenticated bits=0) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.12.10/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i1THkxAc023525 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:47:00 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: aquazoo@mail.patriot.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <000f01c3fec5$b7dc8200$de278151@dan> References: <200402272255.i1RMtD4r030806@jefferson.patriot.net><005801c3fe33$3f7c3e00$ c4358151@dan> <000f01c3fec5$b7dc8200$de278151@dan> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:46:12 -0500 To: Historical Costume From: Carol Kocian Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Yes; I'd gathered this. On the other hand, given the difficulties >another list member has had in getting the tight unwrinkled effect, >I would prefer to eliminate the possibility altogether. I thought she had trouble with the gown not being smooth all over, not lumps caused by the lacing. >Corsets and Crinolines was published in 1954, and whilst I have >great regard for Norah Waugh's research, I don't propose to rely on >conclusions reached over 50 years ago... I wasn't looking at conclusions so much as the extant examples that the pattern drafts were made from. >Incidentally, Garsault asserts, in 'Description des Artes et >Metiers', Paris, 1769, in his observations on stay makers, that >English stays (corps a l'anglaise) lace in front, and he gives a >diagram. I'm not sure why you consider Garsault to have been >mistaken; can you explain, further, please? Some of the diagrams can be unclear, depending on the size & printing, but I thought the diagram showed it to be both front & back lacing. >Even if we take only the 2 French garments we can hardly suggest >that this supports the thesis that stays were only backlacing. I don't think anyone said they were *only* backlacing, but that backlacing stays were the most common. Front & back lacing existed, as did some front-lacing only, but the front lacing only were rare. I wondered why you thought front lacing only were the most common. >One cannot judge what is 'typical' without reviewing a full range of >representative garments, and even then there would be major >problems. How do we establish our sample range in the first place? People have reviewed stays, in books and in collections, and they've come to the conclusion about back-lacing stays. Some of this research has been recent, within the past five years, so it's not just from 50 years ago. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 16:13:47 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TLDlSd013287 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:13:47 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLD6cP023013; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:13:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLD0Kj046311; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:13:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLCeKj046170 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:12:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sherylnd@kc.rr.com) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com (CPE-65-30-107-115.kc.rr.com [65.30.107.115]) by ms-smtp-03.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1TLCTeg014902 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:12:38 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20040229150903.00a13a00@pop-server.kc.rr.com> X-Sender: sherylnd@pop-server.kc.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:13:48 -0600 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Turkey Red fabrics X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hey, I was looking at the new Hancock Fabrics sale flyer & noticed that they are advertising a new line of historical fabrics with Turkey Red and walnut brown colors. They are advertising them as 1850-1880s patterns. Since this is not my area of expertise, any opinions on the historical accuracy of these patterns and / or colors from those who know? To see them, go to Hancock Fabrics http://www.hancockfabrics.com and put the word "archive" in the search box at the top of the page. Sheryl N-D _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 16:18:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TLIGSd013301 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:18:16 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLFAcP023107; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:15:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLF7Kj047137; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:15:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from misc.com (h-66-134-203-2.SNVACAID.covad.net [66.134.203.2]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLF5Kj047119 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:15:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from theresa@misc.com) Received: from misc.com (mac.misc.com [192.168.254.109]) by misc.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1TLIO52029071 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:18:24 -0800 Message-ID: <40425568.8070103@misc.com> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:11:04 -0800 From: Theresa Eacker User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric Question References: <200402281901.i1SJ10Kk008684@net.indra.com> <4040F46B.6070902@verizon.net> <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> <40419BCB.4000909@reddawn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Stephen- Nice to hear from you!!! Re the brocade: its description is billed as heavyweight - I'd been concerned about the accumulated tonnage of the garment with that fabric done up in a houpelande. Do you think the houp would fall into nice folds with such a dense textile? I'd also wonder about being able to move about. Can you get a swatch before committing to the goods? Either way, let us know what you decide!!! Theresa Eacker Dawn wrote: > Stephen Bergdahl wrote: > >> Hello all >> >> I would like a second, or third opinion on a fabric. It's at: >> >> http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/ua-107.html >> >> I am thinking of making a Houp (?) out of this. I'm not looking for >> perfect >> period, it's for the SCA. But I want to be sure I am in the ball >> park. And >> textile patterns is not my strong suit. So what does everyone think? >> > > It's a plausibly period fabric design and colour, though the red is not > one I would choose to wear, just not my color. I think it would look > nice with a light (non-metallic) gold or cream contrasting lining. The > fabric is cotton, at least it is a natural fiber and should be somewhat > comfortable. At 54" the width is going to let you get nice wide sleeves > and skirts out of it without too much piecing. > > > > Dawn > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 16:49:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TLnISd013448 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:49:18 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLkCcP024756; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:46:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLk9Kj058594; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:46:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m12.mx.aol.com (imo-m12.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.202]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLk6Kj058551 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:46:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m12.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.d.22e12e30 (25508) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:40:44 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:40:44 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/29/2004 11:19:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, stevie.gamble@btinternet.com writes: > The odd looking 'corset' on page 129 has no provenance or origin > given, and is dated 1760-1770, and even that one appears to do up most > of the way down the front, as well as being laced down the back. > I think the front lacings here are decorative and not functional. And like I said, there's nothing to stop you from making front lacing stays which clearly exist in the period you're doing. I still think that back lacing is the norm. But I'm not arguing, y'know. Just sorta playing devil's advocate. Keeps the discussion, which is interesting, going. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 16:50:58 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TLovSd013452 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:50:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLoMcP024905; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:50:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLoMKj060037; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:50:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-m19.mx.aol.com (imo-m19.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.11]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TLoLKj060004 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:50:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m19.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v37.4.) id 6.5b.486e23e2 (25508) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:45:03 -0500 (EST) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <5b.486e23e2.2d73b75f@aol.com> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:45:03 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Turkey Red fabrics To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6014 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/29/2004 4:14:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, sherylnd@kc.rr.com writes: > http://www.hancockfabrics.com > I like 17666B a lot. I wish someone would do some spacious prints. Everything is so dense! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 17:33:16 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TMXFSd013632 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:33:15 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMSscP027046; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:28:55 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMSqKj075718; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:28:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMSmKk075680 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:28:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1TMvAWm015712 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:57:10 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A794594C0134; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:28:36 -0500 Message-ID: <001b01c3ff14$24416480$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402272255.i1RMtD4r030806@jefferson.patriot.net><005801c3fe33$3f7c3e00$c4358151@dan> <000f01c3fec5$b7dc8200$de278151@dan> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:34:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO May be OT, but I have a volume entitled "The Corset and the Cronoline", a book of modes and costumes, by W.B.L.,Ward, Lock, and Tyler; circa 1868-70. >From my previous perusals of it, I feel that this was a major reference for the earlier periods (up to 1870) that Nora Waugh used as background for her book on "C&C". I guess I should put some time in trying to see what references were being cited. Much of the writing seems to quote visual as well as investigative (what ever that might mean in the 19th C1) evidence. Since the writer was closer to a time when he/she might have actually seen corsets from the 18th C, it id worth the further gander... Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carol Kocian" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 12:46 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers > >Yes; I'd gathered this. On the other hand, given the difficulties > >another list member has had in getting the tight unwrinkled effect, > >I would prefer to eliminate the possibility altogether. > > I thought she had trouble with the gown not being smooth all > over, not lumps caused by the lacing. > > >Corsets and Crinolines was published in 1954, and whilst I have > >great regard for Norah Waugh's research, I don't propose to rely on > >conclusions reached over 50 years ago... > > I wasn't looking at conclusions so much as the extant examples > that the pattern drafts were made from. > > >Incidentally, Garsault asserts, in 'Description des Artes et > >Metiers', Paris, 1769, in his observations on stay makers, that > >English stays (corps a l'anglaise) lace in front, and he gives a > >diagram. I'm not sure why you consider Garsault to have been > >mistaken; can you explain, further, please? > > Some of the diagrams can be unclear, depending on the size & > printing, but I thought the diagram showed it to be both front & back > lacing. > > >Even if we take only the 2 French garments we can hardly suggest > >that this supports the thesis that stays were only backlacing. > > I don't think anyone said they were *only* backlacing, but that > backlacing stays were the most common. Front & back lacing existed, > as did some front-lacing only, but the front lacing only were rare. > I wondered why you thought front lacing only were the most common. > > >One cannot judge what is 'typical' without reviewing a full range of > >representative garments, and even then there would be major > >problems. How do we establish our sample range in the first place? > > People have reviewed stays, in books and in collections, and > they've come to the conclusion about back-lacing stays. Some of this > research has been recent, within the past five years, so it's not > just from 50 years ago. > > -Carol > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 17:33:59 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TMXxSd013638 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:33:59 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMUqcP027170; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:30:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMUqKj076524; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:30:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.ettu.net (rrcs-west-65-26-169-212.biz.rr.com [65.26.169.212]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMU3Kj076151 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:30:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from reddawn.net (js.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.ettu.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE30E42615 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:43:29 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <404269A6.8080003@reddawn.net> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:37:26 -0600 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.5b) Gecko/20030827 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Turkey Red fabrics References: <5.1.0.14.0.20040229150903.00a13a00@pop-server.kc.rr.com> In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20040229150903.00a13a00@pop-server.kc.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Sheryl Nance-Durst wrote: > > Since this is not my area of expertise, any > opinions on the historical accuracy of these > patterns and / or colors from those who know? > Comparing them to swatches in the book "Dating Fabrics: a color guide 1800-1960" my opinion is that they look generally ok for printed fabrics of the period. However the color seems a touch too purple and not enough orange-red, maybe it's my monitor. While the book shows a number of densely printed patterns like these, there are also a good number (equal or greater) of samples with more spacious prints, not so tightly designed. The website says nothing about the origin of these fabrics. Have you seen them in the stores? Do you know who the manufacturer is? There is a demand among quilters for authentic repro prints. From time to time fabric manufacturers will reproduce a historic collection, and they usally advertise the source in order to promote the line. Hancock Fabrics may not know anything about the line, and I doubt the average store clerk will either, but if you can get the MFR name off the bolt they might tell you which "archive" they got the prints from. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 17:35:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TMZiSd013649 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:35:44 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMWRcP027229; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:32:27 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMWQKj077087; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:32:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tacitus.washjeff.edu (tacitus.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.5]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMWHKk077035 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:32:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from mail.washjeff.edu (mail.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.100]) by tacitus.washjeff.edu (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id i1TN0eWm021862 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:00:40 -0500 Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.81.102] by mail.washjeff.edu (SMTPD32-7.15) id A869364E0120; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:32:09 -0500 Message-ID: <002401c3ff14$a325d420$665183d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402281901.i1SJ10Kk008684@net.indra.com> <4040F46B.6070902@verizon.net> <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6><40419BCB.4000909@reddawn.net> <40425568.8070103@misc.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric Question Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:37:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO And I would concur. I finally sprung for one of the marvelous "waverly" fabrics from Phoenix, with peacocks, with a Watteau pattern in mind, and it is going to be "weighty"...but, I hope Beautiful. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Theresa Eacker" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 4:11 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Fabric Question > Stephen- > > Nice to hear from you!!! Re the brocade: its description is billed as > heavyweight - I'd been concerned about the accumulated tonnage of the > garment with that fabric done up in a houpelande. Do you think the houp > would fall into nice folds with such a dense textile? I'd also wonder > about being able to move about. Can you get a swatch before committing > to the goods? > > Either way, let us know what you decide!!! > > Theresa Eacker > > Dawn wrote: > > Stephen Bergdahl wrote: > > > >> Hello all > >> > >> I would like a second, or third opinion on a fabric. It's at: > >> > >> http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/ua-107.html > >> > >> I am thinking of making a Houp (?) out of this. I'm not looking for > >> perfect > >> period, it's for the SCA. But I want to be sure I am in the ball > >> park. And > >> textile patterns is not my strong suit. So what does everyone think? > >> > > > > It's a plausibly period fabric design and colour, though the red is not > > one I would choose to wear, just not my color. I think it would look > > nice with a light (non-metallic) gold or cream contrasting lining. The > > fabric is cotton, at least it is a natural fiber and should be somewhat > > comfortable. At 54" the width is going to let you get nice wide sleeves > > and skirts out of it without too much piecing. > > > > > > > > Dawn > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 17:51:54 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i1TMprSd013677 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:51:53 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMnjcP028070; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:49:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMnfKj083662; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:49:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.122]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1TMndKj083649 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:49:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from sherylnd@kc.rr.com) Received: from oemcomputer.kc.rr.com (CPE-65-30-107-115.kc.rr.com [65.30.107.115]) by ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1TMnYfe017832 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:49:37 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20040229164600.009ee670@pop-server.kc.rr.com> X-Sender: sherylnd@pop-server.kc.rr.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:50:53 -0600 To: Historical Costume From: Sheryl Nance-Durst Subject: Re: [h-cost] Turkey Red fabrics In-Reply-To: <404269A6.8080003@reddawn.net> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20040229150903.00a13a00@pop-server.kc.rr.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20040229150903.00a13a00@pop-server.kc.rr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO At 04:37 PM 2/29/04 -0600, you wrote: >The website says nothing about the origin of these fabrics. Have you seen >them in the stores? Do you know who the manufacturer is? There is a demand >among quilters for authentic repro prints. From time to time fabric >manufacturers will reproduce a historic collection, and they usally >advertise the source in order to promote the line. Hancock Fabrics may not >know anything about the line, and I doubt the average store clerk will >either, but if you can get the MFR name off the bolt they might tell you >which "archive" they got the prints from. > >Dawn I saw them in the stores for a few minutes today. Several of them do seem to be a little more orange-y than the web site shows. And I think that the patterns are dense because they are marketing them to quilters. That was one problem that I had with them. I really wanted one to be a more widely spaced roller-print-look so that I could do a late regency day dress. Anyway...I didn't get a look to see who the manufacturer was. I'll look for that the next time I'm there. Sheryl N-D _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 21:00:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2120YSd014337 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:00:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i211v3cP007075; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:57:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i211uuKj049601; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:56:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from zinc.btinternet.com (zinc.btinternet.com [194.73.73.148]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i211urKj049581 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:56:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from stevie.gamble@btinternet.com) Received: from [81.129.39.222] (helo=dan) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #25) id 1AxXSi-0001Fs-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:22:56 +0000 Message-ID: <004c01c3ff02$13d74b80$de278151@dan> From: "Stevie Gamble" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200402272255.i1RMtD4r030806@jefferson.patriot.net><005801c3fe33$3f7c3e00$c4358151@dan> <000f01c3fec5$b7dc8200$de278151@dan> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Mid 18th c. busks and stomachers Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:24:47 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Carol wrote: > >Corsets and Crinolines was published in 1954, and whilst I have > >great regard for Norah Waugh's research, I don't propose to rely on > >conclusions reached over 50 years ago... > > I wasn't looking at conclusions so much as the extant examples > that the pattern drafts were made from. Indeed, but by definition a book published 50 years ago, before even the Kyoto Costume Institute existed, can hardly have reflected the holdings of that museum. Norah Waugh died in 1966, also long before the foundation of the KCI. > > >Incidentally, Garsault asserts, in 'Description des Artes et > >Metiers', Paris, 1769, in his observations on stay makers, that > >English stays (corps a l'anglaise) lace in front, and he gives a > >diagram. I'm not sure why you consider Garsault to have been > >mistaken; can you explain, further, please? > > Some of the diagrams can be unclear, depending on the size & > printing, but I thought the diagram showed it to be both front & back > lacing. No, it doesn't. Incidentally, Norah Waugh gives the diagram etc. of 'corps a l'anglaise' under the heading "Eighteenth-century Tailors' and Dressmakers' Patterns' at page 107 The Cut of Women's Clothes, No.12 at the top of the page. > >Even if we take only the 2 French garments we can hardly suggest > >that this supports the thesis that stays were only backlacing. > > I don't think anyone said they were *only* backlacing, but that > backlacing stays were the most common. Front & back lacing existed, > as did some front-lacing only, but the front lacing only were rare. > I wondered why you thought front lacing only were the most common. Actually, what I said was 'I think [it] was reasonably common practise judging from my research so far'. > >One cannot judge what is 'typical' without reviewing a full range of > >representative garments, and even then there would be major > >problems. How do we establish our sample range in the first place? > People have reviewed stays, in books and in collections, and > they've come to the conclusion about back-lacing stays. Some of this > research has been recent, within the past five years, so it's not > just from 50 years ago. My question was as to the statistical basis of any sampling exercise; peoples' conclusions are not relevant to that question. But I should, of course, be most interested in any published research you can point me to on the question of aristocratic womens' stays in England during the relevant period. best wishes Stevie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 21:57:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i212vJSd014570 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:57:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i212u7cP009661; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:56:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i212t1Kj070369; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:56:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i212sxKj070338 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:54:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-34-186.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.34.186]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i212ssqL006792 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:54:54 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040229183744.04c86de0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:52:00 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] men's late fifteen hundreds In-Reply-To: <40420C21.3030404@reddawn.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Shoes, I'd suggest crawling thrift shops and the discount shoe places >looking for low, square-toed or round-toed dress shoes. They'll be easier >on the feet than the china flats. Also, if he is going upper class, he >will need a hat. Two things about China Flats. First; buy them in a size big enough to accommodate cushioned insoles. Bring the insoles with you when you shop. Second; these shoes, being all cloth on top, can be slip-covered in any shape you want, including making flat-soled thigh-high boots or pointy toed medievals out of them. Drape the pattern of the shoe/boot you want over a foot wearing the China Flat, then stitch the finished slip-cover right to the cloth of the shoe underneath. Pointy-toed shoes will need additional sole leather stitched under the pointy part that hangs over the original shoe sole. Finish off with waterproof glue over this stitching, to protect it. Unless anyone wants to look at the bottoms of your shoes, these will look as authentic as real ones. Slip-covering over cloth-upper tennis shoes makes for a much more comfortable shoe to walk all day in. Cut away any part of the original shoe that makes a bulge in the slip-covering, like the lacing grommets or the original edge binding. Start with the cheapest tennis shoes you can buy, like from a discount shoe outlet. If the side of the sole shows too badly, overlap the side with the edge of slip-covering, or color with Sharpie marker on the exposed part. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 22:00:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2130pSd014589 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:00:51 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2130CcP009857; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:00:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i212xBKj071979; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:00:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i212x9Kj071964 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:59:09 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-64-175-34-186.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [64.175.34.186]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i212ssqN006792 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:54:58 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20040229185245.04c91bd0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:53:39 -0800 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Turkey Red fabrics In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20040229150903.00a13a00@pop-server.kc.rr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO >Hey, I was looking at the new Hancock Fabrics >sale flyer & noticed that they are advertising a new >line of historical fabrics with Turkey Red and >walnut brown colors. They are advertising them >as 1850-1880s patterns. > >Since this is not my area of expertise, any >opinions on the historical accuracy of these >patterns and / or colors from those who know? They've had these for a while, and they look good, in person, to me. I'd have to check a swatch out from under their fluorescent lights to be sure. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com //// \\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) ((( <> )))) ) (((((( /----\ /---\)) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 22:29:10 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i213TASd014677 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:29:10 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i213PwcP011003; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:25:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i213OtKj082508; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:25:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i213OqKk082484 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:24:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i213QW8v027193 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:26:32 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i213QW4k027191 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:26:32 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:26:32 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <48D163B6-68B9-11D8-A386-0003934DD4B0@modehistorique.com> <403F9E46.2020904@uvm.edu> In-Reply-To: <403F9E46.2020904@uvm.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402292226.32475.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Friday 27 February 2004 02:45 pm, Hope Greenberg wrote: [snip] > On the question of dating based on the headdress--is it really so far > out of line for late 1520s? When you look at non-royal images, > especially those outside London, (funeral brasses, too, though they are > more bound by conventions than portraits) the fashions seem to trail by > a wide margin. At this point, I think the consensus is that the headdress is not at all out of line for the late 1520s. The question now is, how strongly does that fact indicate that the subject was Catherine Parr. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 22:32:22 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i213WLSd014686 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:32:21 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i213VhcP011194; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:31:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i213VhKj085224; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:31:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i213VeKk085210 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:31:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i213XL8v027249 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:33:21 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i213XLYX027247 for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:33:21 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:33:20 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <403F12FF.4625.8EBB257@localhost> In-Reply-To: <403F12FF.4625.8EBB257@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402292233.20818.cathy@thyrsus.com> Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Friday 27 February 2004 12:50 pm, kat@grendal.rain.com wrote: > > That's really what bugs me about Starkey. He's very sensationalistic > > and he makes his subjects sound as though they were nothing more than > > sex-crazed drama queens. I can understand wanting to "sex things up" > > for a modern audience, but to me, Starkey often crosses the line and > > winds up sounding like a salacious old man who thinks every woman back > > in the Renaissance was solely concerned with what was going on between > > her legs. Either that or they're portrayed as airheads... > > Interesting. I just finished Starkey's 6 wives and it was the first > time I'd seen any of the queens (with the exception of K. Parr) > depicted as anything but stupid or airhead or sex maniacs. ????? The only queen I've ever seen depicted as stupid *or* a sex maniac was Catherine Howard--who arguably was both anyway. Either way, though, it sounds like Starkey's Six Wives is worth reading. -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 23:39:19 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i214dJSd014827 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:39:19 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214a1cP014205; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:36:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214ZsKj010853; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:35:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav15.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.119]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214ZqKj010816 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:35:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:15:30 -0800 Received: from 24.58.109.191 by bay1-dav15.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 04:15:30 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.109.191] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: <403F12FF.4625.8EBB257@localhost> <200402292233.20818.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:15:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Mar 2004 04:15:30.0263 (UTC) FILETIME=[D5477E70:01C3FF43] Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO I read his "Elizabeth" and it was horrible. One hopes "Wives" is better. Bice > ????? The only queen I've ever seen depicted as stupid *or* a sex maniac was > Catherine Howard--who arguably was both anyway. > > Either way, though, it sounds like Starkey's Six Wives is worth reading. > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 23:39:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i214ddSd014830 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:39:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214blcP014306; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:37:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214blKj011526; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:37:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from imo-d22.mx.aol.com (imo-d22.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.208]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214bkKj011491 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:37:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com) Received: from Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.14.) id 6.9e.4887dac (17377) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:32:20 -0500 (EST) From: Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com Message-ID: <9e.4887dac.2d7416d4@aol.com> Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:32:20 EST Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5003 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO In a message dated 2/29/2004 9:32:07 PM Central Standard Time, cathy@thyrsus.com writes: Either way, though, it sounds like Starkey's Six Wives is worth reading. Absolutely ... I think really anything is worth reading that's about the period, to understand the evolution of theory with regard to history, if nothing else. And there are so many different views about almost every topic with regard to the Tudors, I think the only way to develop a really balanced opinion, is to read 'em all! LOL -Tiffany Reflections*of*Worth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 23:47:00 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i214l0Sd014844 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:47:00 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214hlcP014549; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:43:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214hjKj013770; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:43:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from simmts7-srv.bellnexxia.net (simmts7.bellnexxia.net [206.47.199.165]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214hhKj013719 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:43:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from elizabeth@alabasterstyle.com) Received: from Elizabeth ([64.229.26.5]) by simmts7-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.05 201-253-122-130-105-20030824) with SMTP id <20040301043841.TVOM1231.simmts7-srv.bellnexxia.net@Elizabeth> for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:38:41 -0500 From: "Alabaster" To: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:38:37 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Popular periods for pearl decorations ? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Hello I'm interested in re-creating a gown decorated with pearls. I realize that pearls have been very popular for ornaments & jewellery for centuries but am wondering about periods when they were actually sewn right onto the garments. I'm aware of Elizabeth I's love of pearls but what about more recent times - 18th c (Rococo) or 19th c (bustle-era)? I know Marie Antoinette loved pearls but the images I've been able to find of her wearing pearls always show them used as only jewellery. If anyone could help me narrow down the options or maybe even point me to some images I would be very grateful! (When I google for images of pearls on gowns all I get are scores of contemporary wedding gowns.) Thanks Elizabeth www.alabasterstyle.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Feb 29 23:47:34 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i214lYSd014847 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:47:34 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214jacP014646; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:45:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214jZKj014360; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:45:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from hotmail.com (bay1-dav17.bay1.hotmail.com [65.54.244.121]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i214jXKj014333 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:45:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:45:28 -0800 Received: from 24.58.109.191 by bay1-dav17.bay1.hotmail.com with DAV; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 04:45:28 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [24.58.109.191] X-Originating-Email: [wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com] X-Sender: wantstobecorsetted1@hotmail.com From: "Bice d'Este" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Popular periods for pearl decorations ? Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:45:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Mar 2004 04:45:28.0302 (UTC) FILETIME=[04FE78E0:01C3FF48] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Here is my favorite: http://www.tate.org.uk/magazine/issue4/pearlyqueen.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alabaster" To: Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 11:38 PM Subject: [h-cost] Popular periods for pearl decorations ? > Hello > > I'm interested in re-creating a gown decorated with pearls. I realize that > pearls have been very popular for ornaments & jewellery for centuries but am > wondering about periods when they were actually sewn right onto the > garments. I'm aware of Elizabeth I's love of pearls but what about more > recent times - 18th c (Rococo) or 19th c (bustle-era)? I know Marie > Antoinette loved pearls but the images I've been able to find of her wearing > pearls always show them used as only jewellery. If anyone could help me > narrow down the options or maybe even point me to some images I would be > very grateful! (When I google for images of pearls on gowns all I get are > scores of contemporary wedding gowns.) > > Thanks > > Elizabeth > > www.alabasterstyle.com > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Mar 1 00:18:11 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i215IBSd014888 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:18:11 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215HTcP015911; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:17:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215HNKj025158; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:17:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from mo1.socket.net (mo1.socket.net [216.106.88.129]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215HKKj025148 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:17:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mf1.socket.net [216.106.88.20]) by mo1.socket.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BA701D1D2 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:17:20 -0600 (CST) Received: from CAT1 (t1p389.stmo2.socket.net [64.85.215.135]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id EEAE0C4BB for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:17:18 -0600 (CST) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Fabric Question Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:17:30 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <4041C7C2.3010105@thibault.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Actually I was thinking of a different style of costume, later period than a houppelaude. I don't recall having seen houppelaudes with pearls. Doesn't mean that there wasn't just I have not come across them. De Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i215KwSd014898 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:20:58 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215HocP015945; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:17:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215HnKj025311; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:17:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215HbKk025233 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:17:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215JH8v027900 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:19:17 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i215JHE7027898 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:19:17 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:19:17 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <9e.4887dac.2d7416d4@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <9e.4887dac.2d7416d4@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200403010019.17422.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sunday 29 February 2004 11:32 pm, Tiffsewsstuff@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/29/2004 9:32:07 PM Central Standard Time, > cathy@thyrsus.com writes: > Either way, though, it sounds like Starkey's Six Wives is worth reading. > > > Absolutely ... I think really anything is worth reading that's about the > period, to understand the evolution of theory with regard to history, if > nothing else. And there are so many different views about almost every > topic with regard to the Tudors, I think the only way to develop a really > balanced opinion, is to read 'em all! LOL That's usually what I end up doing with any historical area I become interested in--read as much of what's out there as I can get my hands on. :-) -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Mar 1 00:22:38 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i215McSd014905 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:22:38 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215KkcP016050; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:20:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215KjKj026292; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:20:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215KgKk026256 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:20:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from cathy@minx.thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215MN8v027937 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:22:23 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by minx.thyrsus.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i215MNrU027935 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:22:23 -0500 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Portrait of Catherine Parr Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:22:23 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <200402292233.20818.cathy@thyrsus.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200403010022.23241.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO On Sunday 29 February 2004 11:15 pm, Bice d'Este wrote: > I read his "Elizabeth" and it was horrible. One hopes "Wives" is better. I I've also read Starkey's "Elizabeth" and, while he's rather rude about expressing his opinion, I think most of what he says about her is defensible and that it's useful for someone to be saying it so clearly. Whether I think he's automatically right about his assessment of her character is, of course, another question. :-) -- Cathy Raymond "Anything's within walking distance if you have the time." -Steven Wright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Mar 1 00:49:04 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i215n3Sd014964 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:49:03 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215lAcP017032; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:47:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215l8Kj035462; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:47:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from obsidian.spiritone.com (obsidian.spiritone.com [216.99.193.137]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i215l5Kk035445 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:47:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wandap@hevanet.com) Received: from xena (216-99-218-31.dsl.aracnet.com [216.99.218.31]) (authenticated bits=0) by obsidian.spiritone.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i215ocQd008013 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:50:40 -0800 From: "Wanda Pease" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Fabric Question Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:48:28 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 In-Reply-To: <009501c3fe6f$10409a00$a03aa5d1@w7m1l6> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO Lord Vich :-) Elaine de Montgris heard my "Oh, but it's so Ugly!" and came running out of her room. She said to tell you that it was "be you ti full" (we don't share quite the same esthetic when it comes to orange :-) As Elaine does early houpelands and I do late ones (one size fits all - for another 35 pounds) we also looked at the weight of the fabric and the fact that it said "dry clean only" and that brought us into agreement that it wasn't a good choice. We both feel that it would be too heavy and stiff. Wanda Pease/Regina Romsey Never attribute to malice what can as easily be attributed to simple social ineptness > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Stephen Bergdahl > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 6:52 PM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: [h-cost] Fabric Question > > > Hello all > > I would like a second, or third opinion on a fabric. It's at: > > http://store.yahoo.com/phoenixtextiles/ua-107.html > > I am thinking of making a Houp (?) out of this. I'm not looking > for perfect > period, it's for the SCA. But I want to be sure I am in the ball > park. And > textile patterns is not my strong suit. So what does everyone think? > > Stephen Bergdahl - Lord Vich > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Mar 1 01:29:55 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i216TsSd015053 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 01:29:54 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i216S1cP019221; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:28:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i216RxKj048015; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:27:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from lycos.com (www1.mail.lycos.com [209.202.220.140]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id i216RvKj047988 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:27:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from katie_lewis@mailcity.com) Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by mailcity.com; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 06:20:17 -0000 To: "Historical Costume" Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 01:20:17 -0500 From: "Katie Lewis" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off X-Mailer: MailCity Service X-Priority: 3 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Odd costume-related question X-Sender-Ip: 129.219.5.145 Organization: Lycos Mail (http://www.mail.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO --------- Original Message --------- DATE: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:04:59 From: Maura Folsom To: h-costume@indra.com Cc: >I'm on a baby-wearing bulletin board and one of the forums discusses >tradtional forms of babywearing (putting baby in a shawl, sarong, >structured carrier, etc). Recently the question of traditional forms of >baby carrying in Early Modern Europe has come up, and all that has been >found is the Welsh method of carrying baby in a shawl or rectangular cloak. I don't know where the website is (iirc I found it by searching for medival clothing children on google) but I recently saw a image on the web that may help. It was a early Ren. picture of the Flight into Egypt and Mary was carrying baby Jesus in a sling. The thing that really stuck in my mind is that it looked identical to "tie a knot in a rectangular piece of fabric to make a pocket for the baby" slings used by modern Guatemalan women. It also looked like the slings that I've improvised using a baby blanket when I've forgotten my sling at home. This makes me think that with the possible exception of the modern Maya-wrap type slings that baby slings pretty much look the same. -Katie who has threatened to enter nursing as a A&S project. ____________________________________________________________ Find what you are looking for with the Lycos Yellow Pages http://r.lycos.com/r/yp_emailfooter/http://yellowpages.lycos.com/default.asp?SRC=lycos10 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Mar 1 02:34:02 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i217Y1Sd007810 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 02:34:01 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i217W9cP021067; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:32:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i217W4Kj067258; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:32:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i217W0Kj067216 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:32:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0xc3d7bee2.boanxx5.adsl.tele.dk [195.215.190.226]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id E85C147FE44 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:31:56 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <001001c3ff5f$487db600$4096fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:31:57 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.3 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] popular periods for pearls X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id i217Y1Sd007810 Status: RO Hello Elizabeth. At the exhibition on Castle Rosenborg here in Copenhagen about the Queens Dresses, there was a kind of Choker or what ever you would call it. A heavily beaded piece to cover the decolletage. It was a piece that Caroline Mathilde actually made herself, she was our queen in 1766. Many kinds of beads was used in this piece, multi coloured. I also noticed some long beads, like suction pipes. So it was used in 18th. century. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Mar 1 02:34:40 2004 Return-Path: Received: from www1.indra.com (www1.indra.com [204.144.142.3]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i217YdSd008121 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 02:34:39 -0500 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i217WncP021096; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:32:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i217WmKj067489; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:32:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@net.indra.com) Received: from tmailb1.svr.pol.co.uk (tmailb1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.168.141]) by net.indra.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i217WkKj067460 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:32:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from hbgd103@soton.ac.uk) Received: from modem-33.aerodactyl.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.6.33] helo=soton.ac.uk) by tmailb1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Atxyg-0004Ff-Mq for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:53:11 +0000 Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2004 23:53:29 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Subject: [h-cost] tudor shoes II From: Hilary Davidson To: Historical Costume Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 'clamd / ClamAV version devel-20040226', clamav-milter version '0.66m' Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Status: RO now that I'm with the program and have read the rest of yesterday's digest, sorry to double up on Marc's info! I'll go back to lurking in my fog of deadlines now.... Cheers, Hilary _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume