From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 12:12:04 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71GC03u015357 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:12:04 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71GBsbx023048 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:11:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71GBAlX039436 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 10:11:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71GB5EX049493; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 10:11:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from atlas.concentric.com (atlas.concentric.com [207.155.252.115]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71GAvvB049293 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 10:11:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) Received: (www@localhost) by atlas.concentric.com id MAA14206; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:10:56 -0400 (EDT) [ConcentricHost SMTP Relay 1.17] Message-ID: <200608011610.MAA14206@atlas.concentric.com> From: Julie To: Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2006 09:10:56 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <200607311801.k6VI0ldl038027@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k71GAvvB049293 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] for Bjarne - bezants update X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 12:11:58 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44CF7D4A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi Bjarne I know you've been working with spangles/bezants and thought you'd be interested in this site. This came from the SCA Bead list. ***I know there are a number of peopel who are hungry for these things and have been toying with making some - tonight was a useful night of not sleeping. This is the last time I will call them bezants. They aren't bezants. They are something different, something almost purely germamic that orginally can from scadinavia and the vikings. They are/were money. At least they were to the 15th C. They were being made decoratively I'm sure as soon as folks started sewing them on to things to keep from losing them. Schmuckbrateaten (Ornamental thin coins) or Bracteaten thats what I will call them now. I have a number of links up , (more on the way I'm sure) including one that has a diagram (and a few described processes) on how they were made (just as I have said all this time, stamped baby) They are just thin one sided coins. http://medievalbeads.com/docs/docs-bezants.shtml (I also got my classes on the front page for pennsic, updated the "bezants" page, and redid the class notes page - much clearer now) now to bed griz*** Julie in San DIego _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 14:13:57 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71IDvVd018102 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:13:57 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71IDosQ000525 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:13:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71ID1LL057648 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:13:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71ICos8066937; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:12:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71ICinv066819 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:12:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x50a24793.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.162.71.147]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id C6116A50065 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:12:41 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003701c6b596$2211edc0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200607311800.k6VI0ldk038027@net.indra.com> <6.0.0.22.0.20060731142702.02345890@mail.alltel.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] little note.... Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:13:04 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 14:13:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44CF99DE.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi, I read in an antique magazine about the exhibition. It says the exhibition is on now and last the rest of this year. Its at Rosenborg Pallace in the heart of Copenhagen, so it should not be difficult for you to find it. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Beth and Bob Matney" To: Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 9:40 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] little note.... > Hi Bjarne! > > Nice to see back on the list. Hot here also.. that's why we leave for > Copenhagen on 25 August! ;) When and where is the exhibit? Our primary > interests are a bit earlier, but it sounds interesting. We'll only be in > Denmark for a week before we have to leave for Sweden and then Norway. > > Beth > >>Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2006 21:16:46 +0200 >>From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" >> >>I hope that its ben very booring while i have ben away, god knows its ben >>very boring here, and damned two hot, Europe has had one of the badest >>summers heatwise, we still have, and i pray it soon gets away. >>I must tell you costume wise, that a very important exhibition is taking >>place in Copenhagen by all places in September, showing court fashions of >>men from 17th century to 18th century. >>Bjarne > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 14:30:21 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71IULsQ018407 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:30:21 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71IUFlf006689 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:30:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71IToiL059938 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:29:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71ITneH082446; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:29:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.249]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k71ITj3t082328 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:29:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 96958 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Aug 2006 18:29:40 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=Zy57lmQ5W0bFd7UGqqaxu2AtsClKigdToITZEqEjHBN3zk3LNghHV0RMD95HivsX+GBIz8Vr3m3Hy4V0rR+hvGCsi79My94h5M6o6H8u3WRZRHmUU1+7+QzBX9oxzfe34k2C1vdiWhdbhBocIAPVz4Xay6d7xn60jB+K/wdnCWY= ; Message-ID: <20060801182940.96956.qmail@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [148.107.3.20] by web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 01 Aug 2006 11:29:40 PDT Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 11:29:40 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <000801c6b40c$b601b410$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Costume College 2006 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 14:30:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44CF9DB7.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi all, Just wondering if anyone else is going to be at Costume College this weekend. After all these years of it being practically in my back yard, I'm actually going! MaggiRos _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 14:45:10 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71IjA9P018720 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:45:10 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71Ij47g005585 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:45:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71IiFtH062247 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:44:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71IiBe8096062; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:44:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.prismnet.com (smtp.prismnet.com [209.198.128.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71Ii7DP095884 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:44:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from webmail.io.com (webmail.io.com [209.198.128.99]) by smtp.prismnet.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k71Ii0gt091662 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:44:00 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from 65.117.156.5 (SquirrelMail authenticated user ches) by webmail.io.com with HTTP; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:44:00 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <10631.65.117.156.5.1154457840.squirrel@webmail.io.com> In-Reply-To: <20060801182940.96956.qmail@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <000801c6b40c$b601b410$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <20060801182940.96956.qmail@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:44:00 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006 From: "Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.1, clamav-milter version 0.88.1 on smtp.prismnet.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.4 required=7.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.0 (2005-09-13) on smtp.prismnet.com Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 14:45:08 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44CFA130.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO OOOO Maggi!! Can you possibly please get a copy of the glove class doc's for me? Please? :) Let me know what I will owe you for them. :) The college coordinators will not give me any information on how to contact the teacher or give her my information. :( Chiara On Tue, August 1, 2006 1:29 pm, MaggiRos said: > > Hi all, > > Just wondering if anyone else is going to be at > Costume College this weekend. After all these years of > it being practically in my back yard, I'm actually > going! > > MaggiRos > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 15:58:33 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71JwThP020015 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 15:58:33 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71JwNPt003276 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 15:58:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71Jva0V073747 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:57:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71JvT9f066966; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:57:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web30113.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web30113.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.201.221]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k71JvPnO066820 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:57:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from snappylunch_2001@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 69132 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Aug 2006 19:57:18 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=02D+ZdKFP253HzXm2RdUtOjgMAkI7B5PzTqGbnKGwt5fJ9qr9LUBq7uYeZGGBqPU1nFA8zbSYSgUtqueGro/bDE++VmIljtw3mYkkdLnZ7ebwmuGZdsUzmevmrOiFbzW4KC6b2eFXRLK7fh+R/Xli6ibidFfT4ZM+FbWQ0bQzIY= ; Message-ID: <20060801195718.69130.qmail@web30113.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [207.4.90.6] by web30113.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 01 Aug 2006 12:57:18 PDT Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 12:57:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Mia Dappert To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200607282147.k6SLlCGS010970@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re:History Channel X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 15:58:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44CFB25F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO 3. RE: Re:History Channel (monica spence) Message: 3 Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2006 12:13:58 -0400 From: monica spence Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re:History Channel To: Historical Costume Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I feel badly that the people at the HC are being ripped. They have a limited budget, it is difficult to get permission to film in some of the real sites and many times their actors are the reinactors that "do" a period-- unpaid, but not stars or people who have anything to say about scripts, production values, etc.. Not to mention that costumes are usually rented from a costume house that is more interested in genaric than specialty work. And then there are time constraints... I have a friend who is set to do a Civil War program for the HC. Who knows what it will be like, but he is working with people who know the period. My husband is slated to play a soldier-- no lines, or he would have to be payed Equity scale. We were in Philadelphia this past November and visited the USS Olympia, Admiral Dewey'S flagship. As we followed the electrical cables aboard and passed a cabin filled with men in uniforms of the period (Spanish American War) we were informed that the HC was doing a documentary on the SA War. It was very exciting-- the air was filled with smoke from a "fire" or a battle-- but we couldn't see it because it was cordoned off for filming. The people were really helpful, and the technical people put up with us tourists, and we hooked up with one ofthe reinactors who have a a tour that was not to be believed ! We got to stand on the bridge, and got to see the crow's nesy, which was rusted and needed repair. Most people don't get to see half that stuff... Anyhoo... unless you have ever been directly involved with a production you don't know the limitations put on a director by the chanel, the director etc. It is not as easy as you may think. Monica Spence -AND----------------------------- Message: 5 Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2006 11:50:17 -0500 From: Dawn Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re:History Channel To: Historical Costume Message-ID: <44CA4049.5020207@reddawn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed monica spence wrote: > I feel badly that the people at the HC are being ripped. They have a limited > budget, it is difficult to get permission to film in some of the real sites > and many times their actors are the reinactors that "do" a period-- unpaid, > but not stars or people who have anything to say about scripts, production > values, etc.. Not to mention that costumes are usually rented from a costume > house that is more interested in genaric than specialty work. And then there > are time constraints... I had an interesting chat with one of the guys who did the costuming for the Revolutionary War series on HC. From the sounds of it, the producers left the costuming entirely to the unpaid actors... quote: "I do not-for-profit living history demonstrations. I started with The Revolutionary War time period. I could not afford to buy clothing so I learned how to make my own, by hand. I researched historical garments and began making them with historical construction techniques. Soon I started and outfitted an entire re-enacting group. I served as the Historical Advisor on the new 13 Episode History Channel series on the Revolution, which will air this summer. Not only did I review the scripts and coach the producers, writers and actors but I also made most of the clothing worn in the production (hand made museum quality pieces). The wardrobe people came with nothing and knew nothing (actually they are Civil War specialists). They will be creditted with wardrobe but, oh well, at least things are accurate now." endquote So, someone did try. Dawn Actually, The History Channel deserves to be ripped for the pirate thing...It was JUST BAD! And they's don't so many good things too!! AND the Revolution is almost bad, well, maybe worse to me, it's boring. If you are good at what you do and use your imagination and make good choices, you can work around limitations ( i.e real whale bone is not so easy to find in 21st century NOW, but you can still make a plausible set of stays.) I know it can't be easy, that's why they call it work. It's not about money either, many of the resources give it away for pretty much free. and are willing to lend kit if it's taken care of, but frequently it is not.... And act as free backgrounds in miles and mile of stock footage. Hmm historic costume content.....It doesn't cost any more to do it right, If that is what you want., but don't try to pass off bad as good to me 18c Mia in Charlotte, going back to trying to make that cute little cap, the one with the little dip in the front, Burnely and Trowbrige, the 18c cent fabric merchants is putting out the patterns., but i have to work a bit on the whipped gather thing, it's harder thatn ti out to be --------------------------------- See the all-new, redesigned Yahoo.com. Check it out. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 16:18:19 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71KIJC6020363 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:18:19 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71KIBXd008101 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:18:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71KHRSG077176 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:17:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71KHN8Z085421; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:17:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.247]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k71KHG4Q085264 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:17:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 62987 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Aug 2006 20:17:10 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=EvDWHGGKKY+YafTfYRAdoOx1FsKFnSxE4oCtJNp9Jw7BtZXzu1BLz3Euc29Szw9LjSbDdpHuFoleCeg6d0SyaZOgePo5NsOLLpc/E40918XPvEFSG7hb6qDL5+7x6IWTYS+lrQB5xQqUevUNp6abVOyAcrmFlY0DxIhoDG/JCjE= ; Message-ID: <20060801201710.62985.qmail@web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [148.107.3.20] by web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 01 Aug 2006 13:17:10 PDT Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 13:17:10 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <10631.65.117.156.5.1154457840.squirrel@webmail.io.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 16:18:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44CFB703.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Oh dear, I'm not taking the class, but I'll see what I can do. If nothing else, I can get the instructor's name (I can check when I get home this afternoon) and see where that takes me. Maggie --- Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio wrote: > OOOO Maggi!! > > Can you possibly please get a copy of the glove > class doc's for me? > Please? :) > > Let me know what I will owe you for them. :) > > The college coordinators will not give me any > information on how to > contact the teacher or give her my information. :( > > Chiara > > > On Tue, August 1, 2006 1:29 pm, MaggiRos said: > > > > Hi all, > > > > Just wondering if anyone else is going to be at > > Costume College this weekend. After all these > years of > > it being practically in my back yard, I'm actually > > going! > > > > MaggiRos > > _______________________________________________ > > h-costume mailing list > > h-costume@mail.indra.com > > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 18:15:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71MFjcx022275 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 18:15:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71MFdEP002040 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 18:15:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71MExeo094324 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:14:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71MEu9U000610; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:14:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp102.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com (smtp102.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.198.201]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k71MErq8000516 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:14:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lizyoung@fenris.net) Received: (qmail 75254 invoked from network); 1 Aug 2006 22:14:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?127.0.0.1?) (glenn.mcgregor@sbcglobal.net@71.142.202.231 with plain) by smtp102.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Aug 2006 22:14:47 -0000 Message-ID: <44CFD25B.6020404@fenris.net> Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2006 15:14:51 -0700 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 18:15:42 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44CFD28B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO BBC America's "Playhouse" show has been running the series of 2 hour Sharpe movies lately. All 1813. What do you (collectively) think of the costuming, both civilian and military? I like it, but what do I know? :) liz young _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 18:39:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71Mdi2q022797 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 18:39:44 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71Mdceh008303 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 18:39:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71Md1p4097546 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:39:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71Mcwt8022349; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:38:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cantva.canterbury.ac.nz (cantva.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.2.27]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71Mcshr022249 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:38:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladyadele@paradise.net.nz) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.it.canterbury.ac.nz by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) id <01M5IHXDUYG09BXLB1@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 10:38:42 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Received: from [132.181.4.133] (rcmt-cad45.it.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.4.133]) by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) with ESMTP id <01M5IHWK072C9ANIP0@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 10:34:39 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 10:34:55 +1200 From: Adele de Maisieres Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series In-reply-to: <44CFD25B.6020404@fenris.net> To: Historical Costume Message-id: <44CFD70F.7040604@paradise.net.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) References: <44CFD25B.6020404@fenris.net> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 18:39:42 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44CFD82A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Elizabeth Young wrote: > BBC America's "Playhouse" show has been running the series of 2 hour > Sharpe movies lately. All 1813. > What do you (collectively) think of the costuming, both civilian and > military? > I like it, but what do I know? :) The men's costuming is pretty good. The women's falls somewhere between mediocre and appalling. -- Adele de Maisieres ----------------------------- Habeo metrum - musicamque, hominem meam. Expectat alium quid? -Georgeus Gershwinus ----------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 19:08:10 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71N8ABn023356 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 19:08:10 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k71N8482006906 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 19:08:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71N7KO8003150 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 17:07:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71N7FGo045291; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 17:07:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32209.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32209.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k71N7ARK045160 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 17:07:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sstormwatch@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 4433 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Aug 2006 23:07:05 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=nwDMCn2aSOiemrDnp6TuIvIL5zIeWTZ/KGccK9pgzf9RG37UjI2k34oe2mAPiRXWszFDEIffW/a7L2X8FWx0a0/bvhh+YgLuKDs8f74swkFo16im5BJESHoDVZgiQj/F2vMADe8YFIJ4Twcy9lhR8GJ1T6IqvVg/Hzw55iQbGVA= ; Message-ID: <20060801230705.4431.qmail@web32209.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [129.8.206.204] by web32209.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 01 Aug 2006 16:07:05 PDT Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:07:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Kimiko Small Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20060801182940.96956.qmail@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 19:08:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44CFDED4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I will be there again! Woohoo! I need to start packing up my stuff tonight. And I hope to see many of you this weekend. Kimiko MaggiRos wrote: Hi all, Just wondering if anyone else is going to be at Costume College this weekend. After all these years of it being practically in my back yard, I'm actually going! MaggiRos _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 1 21:14:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k721EovA026476 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 21:14:54 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k721Eigl005937 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 21:14:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k721E4qp018499 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 1 Aug 2006 19:14:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k721Dx5Z028974; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 19:14:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from S1.cableone.net (s1.cableone.net [24.116.0.227]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k71MY9Me018632 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 2006 16:34:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kbaird@cableone.net) Received: from anteckim (unverified [72.24.227.122]) by S1.cableone.net (CableOne SMTP Service S1) with ESMTP id 69189088 for ; Tue, 01 Aug 2006 15:34:28 -0700 From: "Kim Baird" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 17:36:07 -0500 Message-ID: <004601c6b5ba$e1a5c5c0$6501a8c0@anteckim> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: Aca1uOP5rKN/Gz2RRQiuDqEyRdSjzQAAdxfg In-Reply-To: <44CFD25B.6020404@fenris.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-IP-stats: Incoming Last 1, First 246, in=415, out=0, spam=0 X-External-IP: 72.24.227.122 X-Abuse-Info: Send abuse complaints to abuse@cableone.net X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=11% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 01 Aug 2006 21:14:48 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44CFFC84.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I saw the series when it ran years ago on Masterpiece Theater. I don't remember the costumes particularly, but Sean Ban was to die for! Kim -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Elizabeth Young Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 5:15 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series BBC America's "Playhouse" show has been running the series of 2 hour Sharpe movies lately. All 1813. What do you (collectively) think of the costuming, both civilian and military? I like it, but what do I know? :) liz young _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 03:51:40 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k727pdOH002922 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 03:51:39 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k727pX1b017608 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 03:51:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k727ospT057707 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 01:50:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k727onft037002; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 01:50:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k727oi4L036961 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 01:50:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.7560391; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 08:50:21 0100 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id k727oJZ12380.; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 08:50:20 +0100 (BST) Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 08:50:19 +0100 Message-Id: <44D0673E02000014000BC98E@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 08:50:06 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series References: <44CFD25B.6020404@fenris.net> In-Reply-To: <44CFD25B.6020404@fenris.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 03:51:37 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D05985.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I thought the Sharpe stories were set at various times during the Peninsular War (1808-13) and after. I believe the military uniforms were pretty accurate. Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor >>> Elizabeth Young 01/08/2006 23:14 >>> BBC America's "Playhouse" show has been running the series of 2 hour Sharpe movies lately. All 1813. What do you (collectively) think of the costuming, both civilian and military? I like it, but what do I know? :) liz young _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 11:52:25 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72FqOu6023308 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:52:25 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72FqIEQ005224 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 11:52:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72FpFVN015871 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:51:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72Fp8GA047029; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:51:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.129]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k72Fp3v0046825 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:51:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ctrvlyfarm@sbcglobal.net) Received: (qmail 39969 invoked by uid 60001); 2 Aug 2006 15:49:41 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=E0dfVtegr7+I7f1BeIC15p6eayzdKa6gQ/Molt4GX7hFq2tV0IvkoroX+UUPcmQOK1k9fzyUHzugsJgZFwIxYZgukluje4fdPvxcUuc0G1LuAmg7qrh3Vtc9KOQpdQq7i/b97niWLgG+kEWfZc2sfIPQ8kudXS8S/jNISsJomCA= ; Message-ID: <20060802154941.39967.qmail@web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.250.177.112] by web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 08:49:40 PDT Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 08:49:40 -0700 (PDT) From: REBECCA BURCH Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20060801182940.96956.qmail@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 11:52:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D0CA32.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO What and where is Costume College? And the GenCon that everybody was going to last week? Isn't there some big deal in Kalamazoo, MI in the spring? As I am just getting into historic costuming after years of sewing, I would love to meet others with similar interests and learn new things. Is there like a master listing of this type of event? Where could I find more info? Rebecca --- MaggiRos wrote: > > Hi all, > > Just wondering if anyone else is going to be at > Costume College this weekend. After all these years > of > it being practically in my back yard, I'm actually > going! > > MaggiRos > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > Rebecca Burch Center Valley Farm Duncan Falls, Ohio, USA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 12:00:17 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72G0H9I023454 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:00:17 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72G0BAC011633 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:00:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72FxR2j017768 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:59:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72FxO1T055094; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:59:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72FxKOZ054995 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 09:59:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from anne@montgomerie.demon.co.uk) Received: from montgomerie.demon.co.uk ([80.177.117.223]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.42) id 1G8J7r-000Ipw-8Y for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 15:59:16 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 16:56:35 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Jean Waddie Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series References: <44CFD25B.6020404@fenris.net> <44CFD70F.7040604@paradise.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <44CFD70F.7040604@paradise.net.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.04-U () X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 12:00:15 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D0CC0B.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Adele de Maisieres wrote >Elizabeth Young wrote: > >> BBC America's "Playhouse" show has been running the series of 2 hour >>Sharpe movies lately. All 1813. >> What do you (collectively) think of the costuming, both civilian and >>military? >> I like it, but what do I know? :) > > >The men's costuming is pretty good. The women's falls somewhere >between mediocre and appalling. > I've never read the books, but from watching the series (mainly to drool over Sean Bean) I suspect this is an accurate reflection of the relative importance of the female characters! -- Jean Waddie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 14:16:51 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72IGpHE026416 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 14:16:51 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72IGjfl015351 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 14:16:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72IFnOD042664 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:15:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72IFapY088838; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:15:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ispmxmta06-srv.windstream.net (ispmxmta06-srv.windstream.net [166.102.165.167]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72IFWs0088703 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 12:15:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from bmatney@alltel.net) Received: from ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net ([162.40.179.5]) by ispmxmta06-srv.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060802181526.NWSZ4897.ispmxmta06-srv.windstream.net@ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net> for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:15:26 -0500 Received: from emachine_T4155.alltel.net ([162.40.179.5]) by ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060802181525.ADN560.ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net@emachine_T4155.alltel.net> for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:15:25 -0500 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20060802131317.02343280@mail.alltel.net> X-Sender: bmatney@mail.alltel.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 13:15:19 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Beth and Bob Matney Subject: Re: [h-cost] little note.... In-Reply-To: <200608021801.k72I0whK073725@net.indra.com> References: <200608021801.k72I0whK073725@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 14:16:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D0EC0D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thank you Bjarne. I will certainly try to get to it. Beth >Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:13:04 +0200 >From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" > >Hi, >I read in an antique magazine about the exhibition. It says the exhibition >is on now and last the rest of this year. >Its at Rosenborg Pallace in the heart of Copenhagen, so it should not be >difficult for you to find it. > >Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 15:48:36 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72JmVa2028276 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 15:48:35 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72JmPVg031109 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 15:48:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72JlMaX056931 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:47:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72Jkxax077411; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:47:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cantva.canterbury.ac.nz (cantva.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.2.27]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72Jkq0R077284 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:46:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladyadele@paradise.net.nz) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.it.canterbury.ac.nz by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) id <01M5JQCN0Y409BY3JD@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 07:46:41 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Received: from [132.181.4.133] (rcmt-cad45.it.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.4.133]) by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) with ESMTP id <01M5JQCFOIVS9ANQL7@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 07:46:32 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 07:46:46 +1200 From: Adele de Maisieres Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series In-reply-to: To: Historical Costume Message-id: <44D10126.7050805@paradise.net.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) References: <44CFD25B.6020404@fenris.net> <44CFD70F.7040604@paradise.net.nz> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 15:48:29 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D10189.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Jean Waddie wrote: > Adele de Maisieres wrote > >> >> The men's costuming [in _Sharpe_] is pretty good. The women's falls >> somewhere between mediocre and appalling. >> > I've never read the books, but from watching the series (mainly to > drool over Sean Bean) I suspect this is an accurate reflection of the > relative importance of the female characters! Quite. -- Adele de Maisieres ----------------------------- Habeo metrum - musicamque, hominem meam. Expectat alium quid? -Georgeus Gershwinus ----------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 16:50:59 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72Kot2q029509 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 16:50:59 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72Kon88017703 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 16:50:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72Ko6fO065808 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 14:50:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72KnuUW033321; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 14:49:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32701.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32701.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k72KnpfJ033150 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 14:49:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 63281 invoked by uid 60001); 2 Aug 2006 20:49:43 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=nvPvaNKm3a8kvCw+pGwMNFPAkv9sDxUbQq/eBfFDLG//D/LLmjMfGgeEj3f0d8vJo1b7AUl+oKWHeISo5YCvLlic3q5MiHQ/gdXpQ4SXOkY3LE/dynfoCbpPWyE4ybZsI5PRZ8NAvjOZhPDxZYQthDO7FoedJwUf6LAWA8zA9YY= ; Message-ID: <20060802204943.63279.qmail@web32701.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [148.107.3.20] by web32701.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 13:49:43 PDT Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 13:49:43 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20060802154941.39967.qmail@web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:50:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D11029.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO http://www.costumecollege.org/ I believe they're going to be changing the name for next year, but this link will tell you everything there is to know for now. Unfortunately, it's so popular, you can't just drop in. No memberships at the door, not even for the day! But if you happen to be in town, you can drop in to the Dealers' Room without being a member. I live practically on their doorstep, and I've never gotten around to going until now. Which is especially weird since I do so little costuming anymore. Oh well, it will be nice to see people, at least! Maggie --- REBECCA BURCH wrote: > What and where is Costume College? And the GenCon > that everybody was going to last week? Isn't there > some big deal in Kalamazoo, MI in the spring? > > As I am just getting into historic costuming after > years of sewing, I would love to meet others with > similar interests and learn new things. Is there > like > a master listing of this type of event? Where could > I > find more info? > > Rebecca > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 18:26:44 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72MQeee031307 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 18:26:44 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72MQYGQ007288 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 18:26:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72MPU0A078704 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 16:25:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72MPRkB019815; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 16:25:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72MPNKd019673 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 16:25:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31EB5A6E44 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:25:05 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44D12646.7000905@reddawn.net> Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 17:25:10 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006 References: <20060802154941.39967.qmail@web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20060802154941.39967.qmail@web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 18:26:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D1269A.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO REBECCA BURCH wrote: > And the GenCon > that everybody was going to last week? GenCon is a gaming convention, as in Dungeons & Dragons, Magic card tournaments, and napoleonic miniatures. They host, among other events, a Masquerade on Saturday evening. It's held these days in Indianapolis, where they have a contract through at least 2010. It begins this year on Aug 10 and runs through the 13th , and you can buy day passes at the door. www.gencon.com Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 19:11:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NBRbS032088 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:11:27 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72NBKBp010150 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:11:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NAWeP084722 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:10:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NARJr057409; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:10:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com (ug-out-1314.google.com [66.249.92.168]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NAPIf057358 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:10:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from audreybmorin@gmail.com) Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id u40so2119348ugc for ; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:10:24 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:from:to:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole; b=Br4CCo74LVJib9EjIjQJBlpgNjHu4W6X9ai9KYBmILdnfW4UF6S0nseKGpExojnh9Ko8uVfLVzSDkLowXBJIld1pzIMjLA3suL/zz62sJHMvFRp6rYkm4lFYaBho6VO4t5QycwZ/uXAP0rD67SKQmkaa7N/tHSqEoWby2k8NgLY= Received: by 10.65.114.11 with SMTP id r11mr2286432qbm; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:10:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p4audrey ( [74.56.121.126]) by mx.gmail.com with ESMTP id e13sm3541226qbe.2006.08.02.16.10.22; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 16:10:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <008301c6b688$d50686a0$0302a8c0@p4audrey> From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:10:22 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 19:11:25 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D13119.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi all, I remember someone telling us (maybe here, maybe on another list, but this one has more members so I'll try here first) that to embroider and embellish fabrics and not get them dirty, he/she cut the tips off simple white cotton gloves. What kind of gloves did you use, and where would I find this? Thanks, Audrey _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 19:25:40 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NPeQ8032333 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:25:40 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72NPYFU018948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:25:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NOkiC086158 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:24:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NOevu067740; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:24:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mail.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NOaYb067582 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:24:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.499.6a75197 (42807) for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:24:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: <499.6a75197.32028e22@aol.com> Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:24:18 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 670 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 19:25:37 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D1346E.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/2/06 7:04:30 PM GMT Daylight Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: > >The men's costuming is pretty good. The women's falls somewhere > >between mediocre and appalling. > > > I've never read the books, but from watching the series (mainly to drool > over Sean Bean) I suspect this is an accurate reflection of the relative > importance of the female characters! Also never read the books, but have seen pretty much every ep. of the series (was de rigeur at college in the early - mid 90s, for the seen bean factor) - and would agree about the women. They're mostly there to be slept with or rescued, and although a bit pants in terms of accuracy, the clothes do reflect that quite well (eg demure and white for the rescu-ees, and flamenco-esque for sharpe's mrs)! The military uniforms are quite accurate for the principles (of course they're awful for the extras, if you can be bothered to look that closely). That said - if you get the chance, check out the back of Sharpes officers dolman in the Indian ep that was shown over here a while ago. It's accurate from the front, but clearly the person who made it had no clue what the back was like :o) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 19:57:59 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NvtEB000526 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:57:59 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k72NvnKu010389 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 19:57:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NptZr088896 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:51:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72NpoVD087080; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:51:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net (ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net [166.102.165.170]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k72Npkcg086966 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:51:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from bmatney@alltel.net) Received: from ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net ([162.40.179.211]) by ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060802235140.HNYU3855.ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net@ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net> for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 18:51:40 -0500 Received: from emachine_T4155.alltel.net ([162.40.179.211]) by ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060802235139.TNWQ8966.ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net@emachine_T4155.alltel.net> for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 18:51:39 -0500 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20060802183802.02883cc0@mail.alltel.net> X-Sender: bmatney@mail.alltel.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2006 18:51:13 -0500 To: From: Beth and Bob Matney Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Filmer Collection in the Manchester Gallery of Costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 19:57:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D13BFD.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO A friend has asked me for information about two garments in the Filmer Collection in the Manchester Gallery of Costume (below). What she is looking for is how the seams were treated (and edges finished) and how the pieces were sewn together and also about the round neckline "front" opening in garment 2. Has anyone had a chance to examine either of these (and possibly has photos) or can give me a contact person who can answer these questions? Thanks. Beth >Garment 1 >shift & chemise >women > >Date Made (earliest) 1575 >Date Made (latest) 1600 >Date Made 1575-1600 >Place Made >Europe England > >Subject Classification period: 17th century >women >underwear > >Description Linen, straight section back and front, with square yoke and >square neck, opening at back and lower cut in front; long sleeves in one >section, seamed under arm, open at wrist; square gusset under each arm; >one full length gore and second gore in lower half of garment; front of >neck to shoulder embroidered with black silk in 3cm band of embroidery in >formal acorn pattern and 1cm band of simple embroidery at back opening; >three bands of embroidery in black silk down each sleeve, in different >formalized pattern of acorn and oak leaves in back and braid stitches. >Material linen >silk > >Technique embroidered >blackwork > >Size Type Height Width Depth Diameter Unit >Length 111 cm >Chest 95 cm > >Accession Number 2003.76 >Then Garment 2 I want to know about the round neckline "front" opening and >(of course) about the stitching and seam treatment. >shift & chemise >women >Date Made (earliest) 1600 >Date Made (latest) 1650 >Date Made 1600-1650 >Place Made >England > >Cultural Origin >English > >Subject Classification Women >Female >Adult >17th century > >Description Smock made from linen. Two full-length gores inserted each >side, small gusset underarm. Round neck with front opening. All seams open >with patterned stitching of bars on a single vertical thread. Bordered >with two lines of silk back stitch, three narrow bands of drawn thread >embroidery round neck opening and sleeves. >Material linen > >Size Type Height Width Depth Diameter Unit >Length 47 inches >Hem 89 inches >Sleeve 23 inches > >Accession Number 2003.75 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 2 20:33:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k730XSOg001231 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 20:33:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k730XMA7032040 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 20:33:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k730WZVQ093520 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 2 Aug 2006 18:32:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k730WXbI013749; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 18:32:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from py-out-1112.google.com (py-out-1112.google.com [64.233.166.183]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k730WUmN013713 for ; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 18:32:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by py-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id n25so1784789pyg for ; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 17:32:30 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=ssn2olILuQlElL7GwjbUXSGo5pYO9neDlU+4NnSmvtlDO2aHimDEAIDMtsN+AUlzcQmYd01cQcQ6939Uj7ws+UVshUJSNS4HdWVO0njpK1domuOwbCWbDzJrX9wUayHZaqyIj1re1yQrovdUpKTSYKjRnQXPb0DurXRjTTmLHQo= Received: by 10.35.131.10 with SMTP id i10mr2307844pyn; Wed, 02 Aug 2006 17:32:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.35.22.15 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:32:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2006 17:32:29 -0700 From: Cin To: h-cost Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006, et al MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 02 Aug 2006 20:33:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D14452.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >What and where is Costume College? LA area, in Va Nuys CA. Look around for the International Costumers Guild sites. Next year's CostumeCon is in San Jose CA http://www.cc26.info/ >And the GenCon >that everybody was going to last week? Isn't there That starts on Thurs next and is a board games, role-playing games, collectible card games, games, games show that just happens to have fans who dress like characters, superheros, Conan the barbarian hero's, manga characters, et al. If you're into historical, I dont recommend this one. >some big deal in Kalamazoo, MI in the spring? That's for the medieval crowd. I've never been. If you're also into Dance, you might consider some of the historic dance weeks on offer all over the world. Well, you're going to be in a stir trying to choose among all the tasty offerings. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 08:20:19 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73CK9fl026201 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:20:19 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73CK2F5026907 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:20:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73CJ6Yd078550 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:19:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73CJ0NR023747; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:19:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from staff.washjeff.edu (staff.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73CIt2w023640 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:18:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.83.40] by staff.washjeff.edu with ESMTP (SMTPD-8.21) id A9A80324; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 08:18:48 -0400 Received: from 209.131.80.151 ([209.131.80.151] helo=rmitchellras) by ASSP-nospam; 3 Aug 2006 08:18:34 -0400 Message-ID: <001f01c6b6f7$785a50c0$975083d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008301c6b688$d50686a0$0302a8c0@p4audrey> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:22:18 -0400 Organization: Washington & Jefferson College MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 08:20:06 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D1E9F2.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Try googling gloves on line. The ones you are looking for will be the cheap sort used for Band gloves (as in "marching band").Also, many of companies which provide dance assessories will also include gloves The will be about $3.00 a pair. Another resource might be thrift stores or flea markets. These will be ladies' dress gloves...which even though dingy, will suit your purpose quite nicely. If your project is a large one, you might try putting the piece in a pillow case exposing only the portion being worked on, pinning the top of the case shut around it. This has worked for me especially when traveling. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 7:10 PM Subject: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? > Hi all, > > I remember someone telling us (maybe here, maybe on another list, but this > one has more members so I'll try here first) that to embroider and embellish > fabrics and not get them dirty, he/she cut the tips off simple white cotton > gloves. What kind of gloves did you use, and where would I find this? > > Thanks, > > Audrey > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 08:44:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73CilGb028190 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:44:47 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73CifZQ001821 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:44:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73Ci8GX081561 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:44:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73Ci7Nl040211; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:44:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cgp.netins.net (f1phy.netins.net [167.142.228.65]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73Chsun040056 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:44:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from landofoz@netins.net) X-netINS-McAfee: scanned Received: from [66.43.209.43] (HELO denise8541f2db) by cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3.10) with SMTP id 1014856417 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 07:36:50 -0500 Message-ID: <00c701c6b6f9$824fd620$2bd12b42@denise8541f2db> From: "Land of Oz" To: "Historical Costume" References: <008301c6b688$d50686a0$0302a8c0@p4audrey> <001f01c6b6f7$785a50c0$975083d1@rmitchellras> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 07:36:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 08:44:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D1EFB9.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO You can buy finger cots in most pharmacies (in the US). They are stretchy cotton tubes for your fingers. hmmm...I just did a quick google search and found only latex finger cots -- but they are very cheap. Less than $3 for a gross. Denise Iowa > Try googling gloves on line. The ones you are looking for will be the > cheap > sort used for Band gloves (as in "marching band").Also, many of companies > which provide dance assessories will also include gloves The will be > about > $3.00 a pair. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 08:49:39 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73Cncdu028321 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:49:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73CnWcW010736 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:49:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73ChkmM081491 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:43:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73ChhZ9039934; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:43:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from eastrmmtao04.cox.net (eastrmmtao04.cox.net [68.230.240.35]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73ChdBw039851 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:43:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladyanne@quik.com) Received: from ANNESCOMPUTER ([70.160.145.75]) by eastrmmtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.01 201-2131-130-101-20060113) with ESMTP id <20060803124333.CVBD25210.eastrmmtao04.cox.net@ANNESCOMPUTER> for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:43:33 -0400 From: "Anne Moeller" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:43:30 -0400 Message-ID: <003a01c6b6fa$6ca7bfd0$0300a8c0@ANNESCOMPUTER> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 thread-index: Aca292tM3Ijri+QpR++pCbawBJ5IowAAq8EA In-Reply-To: <001f01c6b6f7$785a50c0$975083d1@rmitchellras> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 08:49:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D1F0DC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I have found that most gloves are too heavy. The thin cotton gloves we used in the photography business are much thinner and work well. Anne -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.5/406 - Release Date: 8/2/2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 09:43:50 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73DhjfG029576 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:43:50 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73Dhdlh026135 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:43:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73DgVIX088014 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 07:42:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73DgQbF087473; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 07:42:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.190]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73DgNRx087442 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 07:42:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from katybishop64@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id a4so54290nfc for ; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 06:42:23 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=eTSM+FGxhlMto0DxED9b2VxPXsQYJ8UKP9tC6qoVdH/Yr42gUKllfZioW7patLY2QIW/J9l+fHs3dh5PDCBX1qVksiJLRU85NOzR2HFXExHxqtGbol9/4LcOM7Avf1sKkWoEiN63xh4yoTxzbWz8ob5GtDKlIfHv3D1vLR5o+zo= Received: by 10.82.120.14 with SMTP id s14mr424377buc; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 06:42:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.82.99.6 with HTTP; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 06:42:22 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3586f5070608030642l49f57dcfm1d2a75812467352@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:42:22 -0400 From: "Katy Bishop" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? In-Reply-To: <008301c6b688$d50686a0$0302a8c0@p4audrey> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <008301c6b688$d50686a0$0302a8c0@p4audrey> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 09:43:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D1FD8B.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Inspired by this question I did an online search for cotton gloves, since I always forget to order gloves in time for Newport Dance week, and my usual supplier went out of business last year. I came up with this site: http://www.gloves-online.com/about.htm I have ordered their cotton wrist length gloves with snaps to try for Men's Vintage Dance formal wear. (ITEM #CP150 (Doz)) They also have kids size cotton gloves which I have been looking for for ages. You can order by the dozen to save a bit of money. I can report on how they are when I get them. Katy On 8/2/06, Audrey Bergeron-Morin wrote: > Hi all, > > I remember someone telling us (maybe here, maybe on another list, but this > one has more members so I'll try here first) that to embroider and embellish > fabrics and not get them dirty, he/she cut the tips off simple white cotton > gloves. What kind of gloves did you use, and where would I find this? > > Thanks, > > Audrey > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 11:04:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73F4o4f032346 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:04:55 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73F4jHw001494 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:04:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73F439Q098705 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:04:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73F3t9i050550; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:03:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.153]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k73F3nnp050357 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:03:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 331 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Aug 2006 15:03:44 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=UPeYlnAZU5fSuE2OUuyIz48wLcRn0wVmlAvnmHUdI60nlcEDYma8DfmpB/jBpfiC6BPK6Rux8TrgV+ugVLJS2hunn+tYj7Nj5mX6xOLRiGS/8i4O3Arka+Mr132j7ZYwr/BuM0rEW7HeLjfWgrsn8uPah1gKqmcCfAS9R/weuAM= ; Message-ID: <20060803150344.329.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [86.133.210.9] by web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 08:03:44 PDT Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:03:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova To: h-costume MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] straight front corset X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 11:04:48 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D2108D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi all, does anyone know a good pattern of a 1900-1909 straight front corset? Something like this one: http://www.marquise.de/database/dbout.php?name=k1902_1&pfad=1900 ... Not too long over the hips. I'd welcome a pattern which would fit on a modern figure but giving it the S-shape and a slim waist. Many thanks, Zuzana --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs.Try it free. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 11:06:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73F6ApB032367 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:06:10 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73F63AQ029490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:06:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73F4uqO098822 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:04:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73F4sKW051393; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:04:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.neei.com (drake.neei.com [66.92.211.100]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73F4l1a051282 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:04:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladybug@neei.com) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (unknown [192.168.1.140]) by mail.neei.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE74B246EE for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:04:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <44D21080.10703@neei.com> Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 11:04:32 -0400 From: Carol Newby User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? References: <003a01c6b6fa$6ca7bfd0$0300a8c0@ANNESCOMPUTER> In-Reply-To: <003a01c6b6fa$6ca7bfd0$0300a8c0@ANNESCOMPUTER> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1250; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 11:06:08 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44D210DB.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO You can also check the cosmetics/personal care section of a drug store. That's where I found mine. If I remember correctly they were with the lotions for the ladies who wear cotton gloves to sleep in after slathering on lotion. Mine are similar but perhaps a bit lighter weight than my son's marching band gloves. Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 11:49:40 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73FnenP001623 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:49:40 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73FnYVb011845 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:49:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73Fmkfu004729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:48:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73FmgW4089101; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:48:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.206.27]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k73FmbP4089001 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:48:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 74095 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Aug 2006 15:48:35 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=g9aAsAL2ICYNCmRQ7EcpXVyV/9y2/oiye4VoCQDLoGhbWrViPLkJOViQ/ORJaJw/RE0kztQn9AnLKB6KKGsWL4sAkS3C3xexvA5jtl9cNCYmzg5FIy4Q5TTBcXTVd7cTtlgMllNCZYBqYDf+IcrxzS+EuOqt8tFcNRdow3Y0tVI= ; Message-ID: <20060803154835.74093.qmail@web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [148.107.3.20] by web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 08:48:35 PDT Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:48:35 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Sharpe BBC(A) series To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <499.6a75197.32028e22@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 11:49:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44D21B0E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO --- Debloughcostumes@aol.com wrote: > That said - if you get the chance, check out the > back of Sharpes officers > dolman in the Indian ep that was shown over here a > while ago. It's accurate from > the front, but clearly the person who made it had no > clue what the back was > like :o) We haven't seen that one here in the US yet. BBC America is showing all the films in order, leading up to the new one at the end. It's going to be weird having a 10-years-older Sean Bean playing his, what, 15- to 20-years-younger self. I've read all the books several times and own all the videos (time to start replacing them with DVDs in fact). It's not my eara, so I can't speak to the costuming but heck, I'm not watching it for the costumes (blasphemy!) but for Sean Bean. :-) MaggiRos _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 11:51:52 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73FpqHw001670 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:51:52 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73Fpklp015975 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:51:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73FoLCr005062 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:50:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73FoJa4090697; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:50:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32709.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32709.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.253]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k73FoE9W090551 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:50:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 79571 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Aug 2006 15:50:09 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=0s90YybYwmfP5OyVxgJkmkDfo8ILjyv+6JNgG3knxeNi3PKi7PvZzMv5mXomBNKiRRwHFFb+Kr7R2KRZ3/Ygse/DCuxXD/kHlKoI3Ws1ukaQmEHA8SFgjhhobwhfIA2WP3ybxQddSFdwxupsPXeVThcK8B2OO90oFK2cdmCesjo= ; Message-ID: <20060803155009.79569.qmail@web32709.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [148.107.3.20] by web32709.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 08:50:09 PDT Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 08:50:09 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006, et al To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 11:51:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D21B92.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO --- Cin wrote: > >What and where is Costume College? > > LA area, in Va Nuys CA. Look around for the > International Costumers > Guild sites. > Next year's CostumeCon is in San Jose CA > http://www.cc26.info/ > Note that CostumeCon and Costume College aren't the same thing. MaggiRos _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 12:01:23 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73G1LDV001868 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 12:01:21 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73G1FhE015067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 12:01:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73G0PGC006640 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 10:00:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73G0EIN099712; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 10:00:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.185]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73G07mQ099600 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 10:00:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from audreybmorin@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id x29so979207nfb for ; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 09:00:02 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=LtHViZLECN2HfN60+vzHpijtJZIEI2KQgpNFbZYpmpN9usM3kRVjSU5Vtgo0PwMqDP13wG2saz6VrdOebAyljtODjpGaQDnBDWH54+mFYUdqMLXglY/oWjqq9CZ96CuQkiA+tRFoQy62sbhgNWDgOGjYLZgNlWc7yU/0bWZEeW0= Received: by 10.49.8.4 with SMTP id l4mr4011258nfi; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 09:00:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.49.9.16 with HTTP; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:00:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <16a2233a0608030900h808ff58t97aa9031b67388ab@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 12:00:02 -0400 From: "Audrey Bergeron-Morin" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? In-Reply-To: <00c701c6b6f9$824fd620$2bd12b42@denise8541f2db> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <008301c6b688$d50686a0$0302a8c0@p4audrey> <001f01c6b6f7$785a50c0$975083d1@rmitchellras> <00c701c6b6f9$824fd620$2bd12b42@denise8541f2db> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 12:01:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44D21DCB.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > You can buy finger cots in most pharmacies (in the US). They are stretchy > cotton tubes for your fingers. Yes, but I think that won't work because most of the dirt comes from the sides of your hands brushing against the fabric as you work, not so much your fingers. I really need something to wrap the whole hand. I'll be working on white fabric, see... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 12:29:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73GTBPK002466 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 12:29:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73GT5EO026698 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 12:29:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73GRQE3010666 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 10:27:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73GR91X025206; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 10:27:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.187]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73GR47Q025126 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 10:27:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from katybishop64@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id x29so986910nfb for ; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 09:26:56 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=IfRDp6uHpdcUBiYd6V4iw+bNrblgeXWTuUthSbYxxMYyKYKIVO5LQ4vsfeAJgRgS1C9YbZvtuFh21MbtEWV/KHIAmMWVKVqk380vMvKVbExvhWlp4wlSDMpjAgt5u6/Mpa+89eJyp9g9Hq2Hj+4cV/d01DGDHIiNRgT78vH4U1M= Received: by 10.82.107.15 with SMTP id f15mr564782buc; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 09:26:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.82.99.6 with HTTP; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 09:26:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3586f5070608030926j67a2053v75f26a464d79eea3@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 12:26:55 -0400 From: "Katy Bishop" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset In-Reply-To: <20060803150344.329.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20060803150344.329.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 12:29:08 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D22451.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Have you looked at the Past Patterns #106 corset: http://www.pastpatterns.com/106.html I find it gives a wonderful line for c. 1900-1905 (not the most comfortable corset era, at least for me) Katy On 8/3/06, Zuzana Kraemerova wrote: > Hi all, > does anyone know a good pattern of a 1900-1909 straight front corset? Something like this one: http://www.marquise.de/database/dbout.php?name=k1902_1&pfad=1900 ... Not too long over the hips. I'd welcome a pattern which would fit on a modern figure but giving it the S-shape and a slim waist. Many thanks, > > Zuzana > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs.Try it free. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- Katy Bishop, Vintage Victorian vintage@shore.net www.VintageVictorian.com Custom reproduction gowns of the Victorian Era. Publisher of the Vintage Dress Series books. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 13:19:53 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73HJr1K004211 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 13:19:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73HJl0N005636 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 13:19:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73HIdPe017266 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:18:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73HICQt070291; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:18:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73HI4Ca070162 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 11:18:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 71-81-238-29.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([71.81.238.29]:23987 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1G8gpP-0007CW-Jk for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 12:17:48 -0500 Message-ID: <017201c6b720$bc88db80$2e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060803150344.329.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <3586f5070608030926j67a2053v75f26a464d79eea3@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 12:17:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 13:19:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D23033.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I've never seen the actual pattern pieces for the Past Patterns version of the straight front corset, so please bear that in mind when I say this: I've been horribly disappointed in the accuracy of the patterns out there for straight front corsets. In this I even must include the Norah Waugh pattern in Corsets & Crinolines; while it may well be based on an extant corset, it is in no way representative of the straight front corset, and if you're trying to get that look, you'll be disappointed. If you want accuracy and aren't afraid to try to figure out a difficult pattern, try this: http://www.agelesspatterns.com/corsets_5.htm #1339 (early Edwardian) or #1522 (late Edwardian). Both are representative of the lower cut Edwardians that were actually worn. Also, remembering that they are NOT to scale except for the last one, you may want to glance at the pattern pieces you'll see in the photos section of one of my yahoo groups: http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/straightfrontcorsets/photos/browse/1bcb That last one is the pattern to the coral corset you'll see me wearing elsewhere in the photos section; it's got a mid-decade straight front fit, but the top and bottom lines are very early decade. (You should be able to select Large under View in order to make out enough detail for it to be useable, but if not I can send you a larger version of the image.) If I remember right, that's a 26" waist, 40" bust, 42" hips, tall. By the way, whenever I get around to moving over all the files, the straight front yahoo group will be absorbed by my other corset group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Historical_Corsets/ which does have some good discussions on occasion. This is because for some reason, "straight front corsets" seems to mean "let me tell you all about my sex life and send you a link to my 923432 favorite bondage sites" to 75% of the potential members. Luckily, we haven't had too much of that trouble on historical corsets. Since many people ask, yes that is a corset I made on the front page, but sorry, I do make all my own patterns. If I ever decide to give a class in that, it'll be at FFC and I'll let the group know. -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 18:40:02 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73Me1pG012826 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 18:40:01 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73MdtPG021901 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 18:39:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73Md1ma063632 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 16:39:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73Mcmxh052522; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 16:38:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.153]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k73MchmF052405 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 16:38:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 96934 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Aug 2006 22:38:38 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=3xT9T36QLwrBnnQm+K7TdfjWmE696rL4mk8N/5qYwfonZqBc2gQrtOFA8W0mhObTntoEmOO1hFATSSKROB7l+9sQ1wH5720q7EQeHvS0VQ82ayl/GPFLUnkMu1Wq1tpZokOoIGFt1b5MhE5Gz9KMLAwhNaBztpkcCTz1WUOj+NQ= ; Message-ID: <20060803223838.96932.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [86.133.210.9] by web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 15:38:38 PDT Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 15:38:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <017201c6b720$bc88db80$2e00a8c0@compaqub> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 18:39:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D27B3B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Well, I've seen the past patterns corset before, it looks exactly like the one I'm looking for, but I find it very risky to purchase such a pattern where it is impossible to see the finished garment. That's why I'm asking for experiences... Has anyone made a corset from this pattern? The both ageless patterns corsets (n. 1339, 1522) seem a bit too straight to me, and they go too long over the hips. I'm searching for a stronger difference between bust, waist and hips. But thanks for the links to the both yahoo groups, and to the patterns there - maybe I could just use them and modify them a bit rather than purchasing something online and waiting for ages to get the pattern... But, well, I don't really know where and how to modify the pattern pieces - I'd say that the construction methods hundred years ago were too different from today to try some great manipulations with the pattern. May I ask you, how did you learn to make patterns for corsets? I know very well how to draft custom-made patterns for all sorts of modern garments and some historical ones, but I don't dare to draft any corset patterns, because the tight-laced figure gets different proportions, you have to take care of the ribs and the pelvis and the corset shape varies so much. I never found any book which would tell me how to draft corsets. I only saw a book called "Waisted efforts" on the internet and it claimed to be a "guide to corsetmaking". It sounds promising, but I could never look inside the book. But I found an excerpt, at least: http://www.farthingales.on.ca/waisted_efforts/page35.htm Do you know that book? Is it helpful? Or do you know any other good sources? Thanks, Zuzana --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs.Try it free. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 19:15:18 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73NFIfD013625 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 19:15:18 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k73NFCkh028465 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 19:15:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73NEabQ068792 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 17:14:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73NEYUD081487; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 17:14:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpout.eastlink.ca (smtpout.eastlink.ca [24.222.0.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k73NEWl0081417 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 17:14:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca) Received: from ip02.eastlink.ca ([24.222.10.10]) by mta01.eastlink.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-4.03 (built Sep 22 2005)) with ESMTP id <0J3G00GFF38PXHZ0@mta01.eastlink.ca> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 20:14:49 -0300 (ADT) Received: from blk-137-68-3.eastlink.ca (HELO THIRDFLOOR) ([24.137.68.3]) by ip02.eastlink.ca with SMTP; Thu, 03 Aug 2006 20:14:11 -0300 Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 20:14:14 -0300 From: SPaterson Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset To: Historical Costume Message-id: <000a01c6b752$896cfba0$6501a8c0@THIRDFLOOR> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAA+k= X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0631-2, 08/02/2006), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean References: <20060803223838.96932.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 19:15:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D28380.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I know the book & the author, it does not, in my opinion, teach you how to draft corsets. It does show draping but you have to know how to make corsets first or be very familiar with the medium. Sarah Paterson ----- Original Message ----- > http://www.farthingales.on.ca/waisted_efforts/page35.htm > Do you know that book? Is it helpful? Or do you know any other good > sources? > Thanks, > > Zuzana _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 20:51:39 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k740pYTe015755 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 20:51:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k740pSLx025728 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 20:51:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k740oj2T079237 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 18:50:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k740ohlN043825; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 18:50:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:Llca520W67zyj90V6Xeffb0WRAqdpVTh@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k740odlm043795 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 18:50:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.35] (206-124-5-35.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.35]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k740j0K15702; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 18:45:00 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 18:50:36 -0600 To: TheCostumersManifesto@yahoogroups.com X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Fashion industry books X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 20:51:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D29A10.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I may have the opportunity to teach a class in the costume and fashion industries. Now while I consider myself quite knowledgeable about the costume industry, I am less well-versed in the fashion industry. I worked as a patternmaker for a clothing manufacturer for a couple years, but that's about it. Is anyone on either of these lists involved in the garment/fashion biz? If so, I am looking for some book recommendations that might help me. Sylrog _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 3 21:59:41 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k741xbSK017087 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 21:59:41 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k741xV4O007110 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 21:59:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k741wg1O086307 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 19:58:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k741wbVa081211; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 19:58:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k741wYIY081172 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 19:58:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A86E3F604B2; Fri, 04 Aug 2006 01:52:46 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] straight front corset Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 18:58:42 -0700 Message-ID: <003801c6b769$8353e3c0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 In-Reply-To: <20060803150344.329.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Importance: Normal X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k741wYIY081172 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 03 Aug 2006 21:59:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D2AA03.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Don't know of a pattern, but know of a supplier. -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Zuzana Kraemerova Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2006 8:04 AM To: h-costume Subject: [h-cost] straight front corset Hi all, does anyone know a good pattern of a 1900-1909 straight front corset? Something like this one: http://www.marquise.de/database/dbout.php?name=k1902_1&pfad=1900 ... Not too long over the hips. I'd welcome a pattern which would fit on a modern figure but giving it the S-shape and a slim waist. Many thanks, Zuzana --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs.Try it free. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 4 00:01:24 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7441KsA019396 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 00:01:24 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7441EQq031253 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 00:01:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7440YQw097973 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:00:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7440UCL047003; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:00:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7440QoJ046759 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:00:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA07146 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:38:56 -0500 Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:38:56 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Costume College 2006 In-Reply-To: <20060802154941.39967.qmail@web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 04 Aug 2006 00:01:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D2C68A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wed, 2 Aug 2006, REBECCA BURCH wrote: > What and where is Costume College? And the GenCon that everybody was > going to last week? Isn't there some big deal in Kalamazoo, MI in the > spring? Just back from a trip and catching up, and I don't know if anyone has answered the last part of this. The International Congress on Medieval Studies, held each May in Kalamazoo, Michigan (home of the Medieval Institute at Western Michigan University) is the world's largest interdisciplinary conference on medieval studies. It's an academic conference, not a costume event. There are 600-plus sessions, averaging three papers each, in all areas of medieval studies (literature, art, history, etc.); among these are several sessions on medieval dress and textiles. About four of these sessions are the ones I organize, under the sponsorship of the organization DISTAFF; there's often another dress-related session or two elsewhere in the Congress, and a handful of dress-related papers scattered about in other sessions, plus additional papers/sessions on topics that might be of interest to the costume scholar, e.g. on trade, economics, law, archaeology, or material culture. However, it is not something that would appeal to the typical costumer, but rather to the serious scholar of historic dress. More information on request, or see http://www.wmich.edu/medieval/congress/ Completely unrelated to that: A costume event not on your list above, but worth mentioning, is CostumeCon, which rotates among cities. There's a large overlap with the sf/fantasy con costuming community there. Next one is in St. Louis in March/April: http://www.cc25.net/start.htm --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 4 01:01:31 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7451UmW019893 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 01:01:30 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7451OmN006130 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 01:01:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k744xX80003237 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:59:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k744xUME076874; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:59:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k744xQ3o076841 for ; Thu, 3 Aug 2006 22:59:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) Received: from user-12l234i.cable.mindspring.com ([69.81.12.146] helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1G8rmQ-0005wq-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 04 Aug 2006 00:59:26 -0400 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20060803235508.036f7cf0@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 23:59:13 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200608031930.k73JUAaR087838@net.indra.com> References: <200608031930.k73JUAaR087838@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Costume Con X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 04 Aug 2006 01:01:28 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D2D4A4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO And the San Jose Costume Con isn't next year, it's 2008. Next year's is in St. Louis, MO. http://www.cc25.net/ March 30 - Apr. 2, 2007 Sandy At 02:30 PM 8/3/2006, you wrote: >--- Cin wrote: > > > >What and where is Costume College? > > > > LA area, in Va Nuys CA. Look around for the > > International Costumers > > Guild sites. > > Next year's CostumeCon is in San Jose CA > > http://www.cc26.info/ > > > >Note that CostumeCon and Costume College aren't the >same thing. > >MaggiRos "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 4 02:03:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7462rD7021699 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 02:02:57 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7462lUS000603 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 02:02:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7461jNl007898 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 00:01:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7461glC008263; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 00:01:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7461Z8M008209 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 00:01:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.94.0] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-94-0.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.94.0]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7460IqV025616 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 02:01:21 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060803225320.026465a8@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2006 22:56:57 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset In-Reply-To: <017201c6b720$bc88db80$2e00a8c0@compaqub> References: <20060803150344.329.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <3586f5070608030926j67a2053v75f26a464d79eea3@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 04 Aug 2006 02:02:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D2E307.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >In this I even must include the Norah Waugh pattern in Corsets & >Crinolines; while it may well be based on an extant corset, it is in no >way representative of the straight front corset, and if you're trying to >get that look, you'll be disappointed. Gee. I have one of those, straight out of Waugh's book, and I find that it generates the "straight-front" look just fine on me. It even looks like the ones in the Sears catalogs of 1900 and 1902, (which I have in reprint) right down to the seams. I like mine fine and have worn it for many years. It was no fun to construct, but it is unique among my various period-repro corsets in that it has never lost a bone. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 4 11:19:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k74FJnmK028955 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 11:19:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k74FJhvb009742 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 11:19:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k74FIupj071360 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 09:18:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k74FIlox050583; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 09:18:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from navgw2.mccc.edu (navgw2.mccc.edu [198.133.170.232]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k74FIdm8050405 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 09:18:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from pinner@mccc.edu) Received: from tecoma.mccc.edu ([198.133.170.1]) by navgw2.mccc.edu (SMSSMTP 4.1.0.19) with SMTP id M2006080411183309389 for ; Fri, 04 Aug 2006 11:18:33 -0400 Received: from TH103A ([198.133.170.246]) by tecoma.mccc.edu (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k74FIOa0010141 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 11:18:33 -0400 (EDT) From: "Kate Pinner" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 11:18:18 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4024 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 04 Aug 2006 11:19:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D3658F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO May not be able to find them now, but the party/costume shops sell cheap thin ones at Christmas time to go with Santa costumes. Kate 609-570-3584 -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Audrey Bergeron-Morin Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2006 12:00 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Cotton gloves? > You can buy finger cots in most pharmacies (in the US). They are stretchy > cotton tubes for your fingers. Yes, but I think that won't work because most of the dirt comes from the sides of your hands brushing against the fabric as you work, not so much your fingers. I really need something to wrap the whole hand. I'll be working on white fabric, see... _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 4 13:29:13 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k74HT8TY032722 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 13:29:13 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k74HT0Md000892 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 13:29:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k74HRGCp090650 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 11:27:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k74HR74X073243; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 11:27:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k74HQkaI072987 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 11:26:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 71-81-238-29.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([71.81.238.29]:26158 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1G93Ri-0004TT-CW for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 04 Aug 2006 12:26:51 -0500 Message-ID: <020401c6b7eb$2b09d4e0$2e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060803223838.96932.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 12:26:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 04 Aug 2006 13:29:06 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D383DC.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I learned through lots and lots of trial and error, and staring at extant corsets and ads, magazines, etc until my eyes bled. For years. I don't think you can really come up with a formula for drafting them, and that's not how I do it, anyway. You get to know the shape the pattern pieces should be, and how that shape changes when the hips are larger or smaller, when the waist is high or low, and so on. I look at the measurements, build a mental picture of the person's figure, and then just ... adjust. Kinda but not exactly like those scary tailors who can take 2 measurements and then make you a suit that fits like a glove. (If only I could do it with other garments.) It's been a long time since I glanced through the waisted efforts book, so I won't really give a critique of it, but I'll say this: you do not fit a corset to the wearer's skin. A corset reshapes, rather than matching, the figure; therefore, you should instead fit the corset to the parts of the wearer that are NOT reshapeable. In other words, you fit the muscle and the bone, and let the fat fall where it may. I won't categorically reject the possibility of drafting a well-fitting corset from a pattern block, but I will dogmatically state that it's impossible unless you stop looking at it as being like any other garment. The results I see from those who use the pattern block approach are often beautifully designed and constructed, but the fit is that of a skin-tight bodice with the shoulders cut off, which misses the point entirely! One look at the sides of the waist gives the show away, and my goodness, those things must be uncomfortable. That sounded really, really, rude, so I'd like to apologize now and avoid the rush. =} I'm passionate about the fit of corsets, and when I see people wearing ill-fitting corsets and then going on and on about how uncomfortable and torturous corsets are, it makes my teeth itch. As to the Waugh corset, again, I'm not saying it's inaccurate; I'm saying it's not representative. The straight front was technically invented in 1900, but there are corsets that provided a straight front from before then, and corsets that didn't after then. In those first couple of years, there was a LOT of experimentation with the general idea; the Waugh corset is clearly from this era, and is one of the dead-end lines of experimentation. It's really just not that well-designed a corset, since a horizontal seam all the way across the side of the waist is a Bad Idea when it comes to this sort of thing. The early straight fronts were different in a lot of ways from what came about after the experimental period, and while they would have been considered real straight fronts in 1900 and 1901, by the latter half of 1902 they would have been completely out of step with the fashion and incapable of producing the fashionable silhouette. To go back to the original question, the silhouette desired was that of the middle of the decade, and the corset desired was one that would enforce that forward-leaning pose sometimes called an S-curve. The Waugh corset is not of the style used to create this silhouette. When I first saw it 15 years ago, I thought, "Wow, yep, that's a stereotypical Edwardian corset!" When I look at it now, I think, "Wow! What a weird example of an Edwardian corset! It must be from--yep, I knew it: 1901." These are typical example of the seaming used to get that mid-decade silhouette: http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/straightfrontcorsets/photos/view/3b35?b=7 http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/straightfrontcorsets/photos/view/3b35?b=17 http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/straightfrontcorsets/photos/view/3b35?b=15 (click large) And for fun, this is from bizzaro-world (thank you, Lib of Congress): http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/straightfrontcorsets/photos/view/3b35?b=5 -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 4 20:56:18 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k750uICR009030 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 20:56:18 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k750uC7L020025 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 20:56:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k750tMQQ045088 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 18:55:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k750tIRe022227; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 18:55:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k750tDMc022124 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 18:55:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos2.cos.agilent.com (relcos2.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.237]) by msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2C491CC29 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 18:55:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com [130.29.153.221]) by relcos2.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B6CE146C01 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 18:55:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from wcosbh01.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.125]) by wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Fri, 04 Aug 2006 18:55:07 -0600 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh01.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 18:55:07 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 18:55:06 -0600 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D964011C2C18@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] straight front corset Thread-Index: Aca3/kcsPpuUy9AsQfSgnTuxbL3B8AACsPNQ From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Aug 2006 00:55:07.0045 (UTC) FILETIME=[CB4A4550:01C6B829] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k750tDMc022124 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 04 Aug 2006 20:56:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D3ECAC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO A friend and I made me a corset from the Past Patterns straight front corset pattern. However, it was not a simple/easy project: 1) Following the initial sizing, did not give me the S-bend shape I was looking for -- we ended up making the top much more tight fitting then the bottom which causes me to relax into the S-bend shape. (This kind of fitting problem is endemic to corset patterns, though - they fit too close to easily be slotted into sizes). 2) The more problematic part of the pattern was insufficient instructions for where to place the boning. There is a picture one is supposed to use, but it's a drawing of the corset crumpled up... It's very hard to figure out exact bone placement. Eventually we simply ignored the picture and marked where we thought the bones should go while I was wearing the corset. The funny thing is we ended up with a boning pattern that looks (when crumpled up as in the picture) a lot like the picture. As a side note, my S shaped corset/straight front corset is not one of my most comfortable corsets - I think this is due to the S curve that it causes me to relax into. I'm used to corsets giving quite a lot of back support, but I find the S shaped corset gives me minor lower back aches - no worse then I get from sitting at my desk at work, but not the lovely support that I have from my hourglass (1890s) and regency corsets. As to _Waisted Efforts_ -- I own the book, but it's mostly mock-ups and comparisons of mock-ups of the corsets from Waugh's _Corsets and Crinolines_. It uses a "block" technique for drafting the corsets to the right size...but I couldn't make heads or tails of that method. But I think the real "trick" to corsets comes in the fitting stage, in which millimeter differences in seams are actually noticeable, both to the shape and to how the corset fits. Unfortunately fitting yourself that closely is nearly impossible. Hope that helps! -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 4 21:25:13 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k751PDr0009816 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:25:13 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k751P7DE023169 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:25:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k751MDdX047575 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 19:22:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k751MBX3036385; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 19:22:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m23.mail.aol.com (imo-m23.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.4]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k751M7po036303 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 19:22:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.be3.17f7c24 (43931) for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:21:55 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:21:55 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 04 Aug 2006 21:25:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D3F373.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/4/2006 8:56:41 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, sunshine_buchler@agilent.com writes: A friend and I made me a corset from the Past Patterns straight front corset pattern. ***************** I don't like this pattern For one, I don't think the actual pattern looks like the illustration on the envelope. The illustration is what I wanted but I had to make a pattern from a real corset of the period to get that. And that was very time consuming [needed resizing...with all those narrow curving pieces...ay yay yay!] and that's what I was trying to save...TIME...with getting the pattern in the 1st place. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 4 21:29:39 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k751TdgP009952 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:29:39 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k751TXSP024008 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:29:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k751SbKG048216 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 19:28:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k751SYvn039607; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 19:28:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com (imo-m24.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k751SUVR039526 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 19:28:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.bfb.65f42c (43931) for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:28:23 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 4 Aug 2006 21:28:23 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 04 Aug 2006 21:29:37 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D3F47D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/4/2006 9:22:59 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, AlbertCat@aol.com writes: I don't like this pattern **************** In the interest of not being negative...I would like to add that Past Patterns makes a pattern for my favorite corset of all time... #708 1845-1860 corset I added a bone between each bone of this lightly boned corset and this has made it most useful. I think you get a good silhouette for 1830's to Bustle with it. It's a beautiful shape! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 01:14:37 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k755EVVk017501 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 01:14:35 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k755EPZA008131 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 01:14:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k755DjFD069101 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 4 Aug 2006 23:13:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k755DeCF059937; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 23:13:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm01.prodigy.net (ylpvm01-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k755DaEe059909 for ; Fri, 4 Aug 2006 23:13:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.94.0] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-94-0.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.94.0]) by ylpvm01.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k755D4Vk010449 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 01:13:11 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060804215955.025c44d0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2006 22:04:54 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset In-Reply-To: <020401c6b7eb$2b09d4e0$2e00a8c0@compaqub> References: <20060803223838.96932.qmail@web37506.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 01:14:28 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D42931.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >That sounded really, really, rude, so I'd like to apologize now and avoid >the rush. =} I'm passionate about the fit of corsets, and when I see >people wearing ill-fitting corsets and then going on and on about how >uncomfortable and torturous corsets are, it makes my teeth itch. But my Waugh corset fits me well enough that I can wear it all living history day and live to tell the tale. I'm not sure what your objection to it is. >As to the Waugh corset, again, I'm not saying it's inaccurate; I'm saying >it's not representative. The straight front was technically invented in >1900, but there are corsets that provided a straight front from before >then, and corsets that didn't after then. In those first couple of years, >there was a LOT of experimentation with the general idea; the Waugh corset >is clearly from this era, and is one of the dead-end lines of >experimentation. It's really just not that well-designed a corset, since a >horizontal seam all the way across the side of the waist is a Bad Idea >when it comes to this sort of thing. Mine is lined, and the seam at the waist doesn't cause a problem. But then, I don't lace it super tightly, only tightly enough to produce the right curves, and I wear something for a chemise under it. >The early straight fronts were different in a lot of ways from what came >about after the experimental period, and while they would have been >considered real straight fronts in 1900 and 1901, by the latter half of >1902 they would have been completely out of step with the fashion and >incapable of producing the fashionable silhouette. To go back to the >original question, the silhouette desired was that of the middle of the >decade, and the corset desired was one that would enforce that >forward-leaning pose sometimes called an S-curve. The Waugh corset is not >of the style used to create this silhouette. We do 1901, and the Waugh one does fine for that. I think it would do fine for 1904 or 1906 when that S-curve is much more pronounced. > When I first saw it 15 years ago, I thought, "Wow, yep, that's a > stereotypical Edwardian corset!" When I look at it now, I think, > "Wow! What a weird example of an Edwardian corset! It must be > from--yep, I knew it: 1901." Wierd example it may be, but I've seen early examples, in like Sears catalogs, of pretty much the same thing. Again, I'm not sure what your objection to it is. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 04:51:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k758pnZf029760 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 04:51:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k758pgfG006850 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 04:51:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k758p4bY084713 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 02:51:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k758p0Ht069571; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 02:51:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.162]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k758ovp8069494 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 02:50:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 94833 invoked by uid 60001); 5 Aug 2006 08:50:52 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=pySqyr7bDqbdUWkd+++HxVT6imnzL0DbzE3Hn905+WNSKvrk5rV3K3pq7y/44f+Ruk8axlnMgrbU7OJUJCZfoGUEgPM7pzvUVxWWA1YP+f+NcB+WrNbq8IPCvs07na9ljrKMgkQ+6pFiHz+5We3U5v646BpIddszlEqrbFn/yts= ; Message-ID: <20060805085052.94831.qmail@web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [86.133.210.9] by web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 05 Aug 2006 01:50:52 PDT Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 01:50:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D964011C2C18@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 04:51:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44D45C1E.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO "A friend and I made me a corset from the Past Patterns straight front corset pattern. However, it was not a simple/easy project. (...)" This sounds exactly like I was afraid the pattern might be. As for comfort, I know very well that the straight-fronted corsets were actually the most uncomfortable and dangerous ones. However, this beautiful S-shape of the edwardian times can only be achieved by such a corset... "In the interest of not being negative...I would like to add that Past Patterns makes a pattern for my favorite corset of all time... #708 1845-1860 corset" I've never used that pattern, but I have one favorite as well: the simplicity #7215. I've seen a 1869 corset which looks almost the same as the simplicity corset: http://www.tudorlinks.com/treasury/freepatterns/w1869scorsetpatt.html So it should be accurate:-)) And it is very comfortable even when tight-laced. It is not, however, a straight-front corset:-(( --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail Beta. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 05:19:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k759JpuM004371 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 05:19:51 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k759Ji4t018402 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 05:19:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k759HkFO088277 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 03:17:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k759HiD9084416; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 03:17:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k759HeAh084378 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 03:17:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.94.0] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-94-0.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.94.0]) by ylpvm15.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k759Hagm026879 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 05:17:38 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060805021556.026634e8@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 02:17:43 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] straight front corset In-Reply-To: <20060805085052.94831.qmail@web37515.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D964011C2C18@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 05:19:48 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D462B1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >However, this beautiful S-shape of the edwardian times can only be >achieved by such a corset... It can be faked to some extent by pooching out the front of the bodice or shirtwaist, and adding a little fullness to the back of a straight-front skirt. This enhancement seems to have been done in the period, in addition to the use of the straight-front corset. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 09:18:30 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75DIUg2000376 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 09:18:30 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k75DIOtq010239 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 09:18:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75DHhUC027043 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 07:17:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75DHdU7009306; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 07:17:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s3.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s3.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.75]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75DHZbJ009236 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 07:17:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladycatalina@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.224.33]) by bay0-omc1-s3.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 06:17:30 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 06:17:29 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.224.200 by by105fd.bay105.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 05 Aug 2006 13:17:27 GMT X-Originating-IP: [4.225.190.106] X-Originating-Email: [ladycatalina@hotmail.com] X-Sender: ladycatalina@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <200608031549.k73Fmi2c089136@net.indra.com> From: "Catalina Elvira Osorio Lopez de Xerez" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 15:17:27 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Aug 2006 13:17:29.0893 (UTC) FILETIME=[80E57D50:01C6B891] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] white cotton gloves for detail work. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 09:18:28 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D49AA0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO sadly, I've had to buy white cotton gloves off ebay. I can't seem to find any in stores. The price isn't too bad. Catalina nunca sin mi vino _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 09:41:02 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75Df2DN000954 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 09:41:02 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k75Deu1R008492 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 09:41:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75DeHYe030224 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 07:40:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75DeFvi021272; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 07:40:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ultra7.eskimo.com (IDENT:root@ultra7.eskimo.com [204.122.16.70]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75DeBl9021247 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 07:40:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from judymitch@theoldforest.net) Received: from [69.72.28.81] (core-dc-3-81.dynamic-dialup.coretel.net [69.72.28.81]) by ultra7.eskimo.com (8.13.6/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k75De6j9004701 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 06:40:07 -0700 Message-ID: <44D49FE5.1020103@theoldforest.net> Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 09:40:53 -0400 From: Judy Mitchell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20041217 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] white cotton gloves for detail work. References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 09:41:00 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D49FE8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Catalina Elvira Osorio Lopez de Xerez wrote: > sadly, I've had to buy white cotton gloves off ebay. I can't seem to > find any in stores. The price isn't too bad. > have you tried Vermont country Store? They carry both cotton dress gloves, sleeping gloves (not sure what the diffrence is, 0ther than price), and a sheer crocheted dress glove. I understand military supply places also carry them. -Judy Mitchell _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 12:04:34 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75G4TI9005044 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 12:04:33 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k75G4Nv0002361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 12:04:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75G3dj8056645 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 10:03:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75G3ZBb008182; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 10:03:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-1.dnv.wideopenwest.com (pop-1.dnv.wideopenwest.com [64.233.207.6]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75G3VHA008103 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 10:03:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mplumb@wideopenwest.com) Received: from [192.168.1.101] (d14-69-62-55.try.wideopenwest.com [69.14.55.62]) by pop-1.dnv.wideopenwest.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id k75GOLs5001999 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 11:24:22 -0500 Message-ID: <44D4C1E8.9030200@wideopenwest.com> Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 12:06:00 -0400 From: Michelle Plumb User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (X11/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Pattern making books X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 12:04:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D4C187.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hello, all. I've been sewing for myself for a long time, and decided it might be time to make a few of my own designs. I never follow sewing patterns to the letter anyway, they're just a launch point. Can anyone recommend good pattern making books? Thanks, Michelle _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 12:18:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75GIS7t005369 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 12:18:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k75GIN1d005154 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 12:18:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75GHYNg058623 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 10:17:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75GHX05016097; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 10:17:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc15.comcast.net (rwcrmhc15.comcast.net [216.148.227.155] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75GHUDn016022 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 10:17:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from cheslaptop (c-24-1-85-230.hsd1.tx.comcast.net[24.1.85.230]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc15) with SMTP id <20060805161724m1500r47oke>; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 16:17:24 +0000 Message-ID: <094001c6b8aa$a4e6d460$070ba8c0@CHESLAPTOP> From: "Chiara Francesca" To: "Historical Costume" References: <44D4C1E8.9030200@wideopenwest.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Pattern making books Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 11:16:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 12:18:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D4C4CF.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Actually ... Vogue patterns has a booklet that you can purchase about this. It is pretty damn good. Everyone that I know of that has ever used it loves it. They even have a drafting pattern kit, well, they used to, that would be hidden in the very back of the last pattern case in the stores that carries their patterns. Good luck! Chiara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michelle Plumb" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 11:06 AM Subject: [h-cost] Pattern making books > Hello, all. > > I've been sewing for myself for a long time, and decided it might be time > to make a few of my own designs. I never follow sewing patterns to the > letter anyway, they're just a launch point. > > Can anyone recommend good pattern making books? > > Thanks, > Michelle > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 14:40:50 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75Iejeg010172 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 14:40:50 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k75IedkM003331 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 14:40:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75IdrY8080553 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 12:39:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75IdkLW003341; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 12:39:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s34.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s34.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.106]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75IdiCp003265 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 12:39:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([64.4.51.24]) by bay0-omc1-s34.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 11:39:38 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 11:39:38 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 64.4.51.220 by by107fd.bay107.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 05 Aug 2006 18:39:36 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.222.128.141] X-Originating-Email: [estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com] X-Sender: estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <44D4C1E8.9030200@wideopenwest.com> From: "Kelly Grant" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] Pattern making books Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 15:39:36 -0300 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Aug 2006 18:39:38.0815 (UTC) FILETIME=[81D4ECF0:01C6B8BE] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 14:40:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D4E627.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO "The Metric cutting system" books by Winifred Aldrich! Amazing books! There's one for men, one for woen, and another for childern. Kelly "Bravery is something you can experience on the spur of the moment, faced with danger. To have courage, you must think about the dangers in advance, then weigh the risks, and then do what you have to do, despite your fears" Caius Merlyn Britannicus >From: Michelle Plumb >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: Historical Costume >Subject: [h-cost] Pattern making books >Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 12:06:00 -0400 > >Hello, all. > >I've been sewing for myself for a long time, and decided it might be time >to make a few of my own designs. I never follow sewing patterns to the >letter anyway, they're just a launch point. > >Can anyone recommend good pattern making books? > >Thanks, >Michelle >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 17:18:21 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75LIGYN015563 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 17:18:21 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k75LIAX0018576 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 17:18:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75LHPRd003349 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 15:17:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75LHLjg094389; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 15:17:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.148]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k75LH87f094235 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 15:17:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 88319 invoked by uid 60001); 5 Aug 2006 21:17:02 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=UxTq3GQkEn/kigs4GHbN7fggPess90Kndh4R4adNF3YNoToqqzq9Box3ZjtFmc3cUy3j3SWQMKCzj9vcfubSink3Ew0d8fYKUV54FPj7vG0xRsB1G1EvmpI7bbiMzwhea3CC+FLZTUzHcbp+zHrDQpPvhO3sdKk8pVSHuDZsFmY= ; Message-ID: <20060805211702.88317.qmail@web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [86.133.210.9] by web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 05 Aug 2006 14:17:02 PDT Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 14:17:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] Pattern making books To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <44D4C1E8.9030200@wideopenwest.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 17:18:14 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D50B12.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I know some very, very good source I've once briefly mentioned on this list before. It's all in German, however, but once you know the principe you don't really need to read the instructions, you just look at the pictures. It is a monthly magazine issued by a clothing academy in Münich (Deutsche Bekleidungsakademie München) called "Rundschau", which is probably the only magazine which concentrates on patternmaking. There are two magazines: one for women, one for men. In each issue, there are about 15 pages on patternmaking and the rest tells you about contemporary fashion, designers, modern techniques and general news for professional tailors. The pattern section itself teaches you how to make all sorts of clothes reaching from basic patterns for dress, trousers and skirts to very special items like ballet dress or even historical costume. Unfortunately, the costume part was more fashionable in the past than today, I think the latest costume part came out about ten years ago. But they don't sell only magazines, they also sell books - f.ex. book on making evening dresses. These books are actually collections from the magazines in which there was a section on the corresponding topic. The good new is that they have books on costumes, too! One for women's costume and one for men's. The periods they cover are all from renaissance to the beginning of the 20th century. The patterns out there are surprisingly good and the final shape looks quite period, the seams are all on the good places and the shape of the pattern pieces looks very accurate. There are, of course, little mistakes, but not very significant. I purchased the women's costume book and I'm now waiting for it to get to the CZ, so I could then maybe scan one page or so for you to get an idea about what it is, if you were interested. The only problem is that they do not explain in each issue what do all the measurements mean and how to take them, and they tell you the instructions about how to make the slopes only once in about three years. And you have to learn their system, which may seem quite complicated on the first sight, but is actually quite nice when you get into it:-)) Well, if you were VERY interested, I think I could help you there a bit... Unfortunately, they don't have any real website, but here you can find some general info (in DE): http://www.ebnerpublishing.de/index.php?start=0&m1=2&m2=14&select=&search=rundschau&detail=67 I've once found an ordering/subscription card and all the books and things you may purchase from them on the internet, but I think it isn't there any more or at least I can't find it. Again, if very interested, I could scan it for you, or send it to you by post. After an extensive search, I think I can afford to say that this source is probably the best patternmaking source (of modern fashion) that exists. As for historical costume making, I don't really know, but I think it's a real help. At least I haven't found anything similar. Don't hesitate to ask for more details:-)) Zuzana __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 17:39:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75Ld0V4016286 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 17:39:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k75Lct1s022284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 17:38:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75LcLTV006978 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 15:38:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75LcKpt005861; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 15:38:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75LcHGb005838 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 15:38:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.37] (209-148-118-37.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.37]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k75LcEvI026793; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 14:38:15 -0700 Message-ID: <44D50FCB.4010300@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2006 14:38:19 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com, zkraemerova@yahoo.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Pattern Making Books X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 17:38:58 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D50FEF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO years ago. But they don't sell only magazines, they also sell books - f.ex. book on making evening dresses. These books are actually collections from the magazines in which there was a section on the corresponding topic. The good new is that they have books on costumes, too! One for women's costume and one for men's. The periods they cover are all from renaissance to the beginning of the 20th century. The patterns out there are surprisingly good and the final shape looks quite period, the seams are all on the good places and the shape of the pattern pieces looks very accurate. There are, of course, little mistakes, but not very significant. ----------------- Could you post the titles, authors, and any other relevant publication data on the books? ----------------------- I've once found an ordering/subscription card and all the books and things you may purchase from them on the internet, but I think it isn't there any more or at least I can't find it. Again, if very interested, I could scan it for you, or send it to you by post. ------------------ Yes, thanks. ------------- Fran Lavolta Press Books of Historic Costume Patterns http://www.lavoltapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 5 21:21:29 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k761LOkE022145 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 21:21:29 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k761LIim011588 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 21:21:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k761KN95036546 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 5 Aug 2006 19:20:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k761K7L2020826; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 19:20:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k761JpsT020416 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 19:20:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.411.78f86700 (41810) for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 21:19:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: <411.78f86700.32069db0@aol.com> Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 21:19:44 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 670 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 563 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 05 Aug 2006 21:21:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D5440E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/5/06 7:01:36 PM GMT Daylight Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: > [h-cost] Pattern making books > metric pattern cutting by winifred aldwych (sp??) as the title suggests, it's in centimetres, etc, but it's a standard text (in the uk at least), and the patterns (and blocks) are quite simple (once you get over the scary look of the thing!!) pretty much foolproof if you can do basic geometry and maths. I started using it when I was about 11 and found it in the local library, so it can't be that hard! it was later a required text for my university course. only thing I'll say is don't trust the standard sizes in the size charts - they're based on the british standard, which is way out of date. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 6 10:31:46 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76EVkdK019350 for ; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 10:31:46 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k76EVe23030245 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 10:31:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76EV0GJ002269 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 08:31:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76EUtT4072220; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 08:30:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mxsf09.cluster1.charter.net (mxsf09.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.28.209]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k75KUHW1068679 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 14:30:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from CatDevereaux@alleycatscratch.com) Received: from mxip08a.cluster1.charter.net (mxip08a.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.28.138]) by mxsf09.cluster1.charter.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id k75KU8d1008409 for ; Sat, 5 Aug 2006 16:30:08 -0400 Received: from 24-205-12-18.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com (HELO Maxwell) ([24.205.12.18]) by mxip08a.cluster1.charter.net with ESMTP; 05 Aug 2006 16:30:08 -0400 From: "Cat Devereaux" To: Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 13:30:14 -0700 Message-ID: <00f601c6b8cd$f5c32050$120ccd18@Maxwell> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200608051800.k75I0QQj076340@net.indra.com> X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=1% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k75KUHW1068679 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: straight front corset X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 06 Aug 2006 10:31:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D5FD4C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I needed to make a straight front corset to work with my sister's wedding gown, a reproduction of Janet Arnold's 1901 ribbon dress. The extra trick, my sister has some scoliosis so I wasn't going to tight-lace her for her wedding. I started with Laughing Moon's basic corset. The front pieces I straightened out... and boned even for fittings. I flared out the hip pieces so she went in a bit tightly and the hips flared very smoothly over her... vs. doing much shaping. This hip fitting gives the back of the "S". I don't have a good picture scanned, but even in the vamp shot here where she's bending forward you can see the front and lack of curves there. http://www.alleycatscratch.com/costumes/arnold1901/undervamp200.jpg What you can't see is the extra hip (which I did see in looking at pics of the period corsets) I laced her in a bit... but refused to tight lace. You could pull it in with one hand... and that's as far as we went. I got the "S" quiet easily with the corset cover. The front was heavily gathered. (Sorry no pic I can reach.) These were just vertical in almost a stomacher pattern - sorry, after 3 moves the books aren't in reach... but again, it was in a book. However, I've also seen extra ruffles added to the top of the corset cover or as a tie on. She went though corset training, wearing it at least 2 horus a day 3 days a week before the wedding. The day of the wedding she was in it 18 hours, all over the dance floor and the last one standing. So... you can get the look without killing the wearer. Here's the final on the dummy who's also wearing the corset: http://www.alleycatscratch.com/costumes/arnold1901/dummy1w.jpg . In a side shot... which I don't have scanned... there is a light "S"... even on the rigid dummy. Remember, part of this look is also created from the dresses of the time anyway. The skirts were very slick in back and fitted smooth showing the hip. That was a new concept then... showing the real hip. Well, kindof... given it was under a couple layers of petticoats and the corset... but a different shape. The front is accentuated again by the style of the dress... with the gathers and the short jacket. http://www.alleycatscratch.com/costumes/arnold1901/Line300.gif Oh, and for pictures she could lean forward for a few moments to give the really curvy "S"... but most times she stood straight and just had the light "S" in front and the big "S" in back. Then again... if she's had more bust, we might have had more of a natural "S" flowing out over the top. >>As a side note, my S shaped corset/straight front corset is not one of my most comfortable corsets - I think this is due to the S curve that it causes me to relax into. I'm used to corsets giving quite a lot of back support, but I find the S shaped corset gives me minor lower back aches - no worse then I get from sitting at my desk at work, but not the lovely support that I have from my hourglass (1890s) and regency corsets. Try expanding the back and side hip gussets next time but keep the solid boning. You're less likely to "relax" into it... and find it just sits there. (Yes, some of the waist pieces will be very thin strips at the waist.) >> This sounds exactly like I was afraid the pattern might be. As for comfort, I know very well that the straight-fronted corsets were actually the most uncomfortable and dangerous ones. However, this beautiful S-shape of the edwardian times can only be achieved by such a corset... Any extreme can be uncomfortable like that. Using the same technique, I helped fit other straight front corset muslins releasing hordes at the back hip area but keeping the waist controlled and even taking a bit more in. That one turned out comfortable too. She didn't add much fluff to the front for the "S" as she was better equipped in the front. -Cat- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 6 10:36:13 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76EaCst019423 for ; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 10:36:12 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k76Ea63q020201 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 10:36:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76EZ7sm002958 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 08:35:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76EZ5So074951; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 08:35:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc3-s11.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s11.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.211]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76DmUBf048179 for ; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 07:48:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.162.18]) by bay0-omc3-s11.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 06:48:24 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 06:48:24 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.162.200 by by108fd.bay108.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 06 Aug 2006 13:48:20 GMT X-Originating-IP: [69.217.52.246] X-Originating-Email: [robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com] X-Sender: robinandkellydorman@hotmail.com From: "RobinandKelly Dorman" To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2006 09:48:20 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Aug 2006 13:48:24.0718 (UTC) FILETIME=[FCDF12E0:01C6B95E] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Straight front corset X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 06 Aug 2006 10:36:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D5FE56.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >However, this beautiful S-shape of the edwardian times can only be achieved >by such a corset... >It can be faked to some extent by pooching out the front of the bodice or >shirtwaist, and adding a little fullness to the back of a straight-front >skirt. This enhancement seems to have been done in the period, in addition >to the use of the straight-front corset. I've found that one's , uhm "natural enhancements" can aid extensively in creating the S-curve - I recently was shown a photo of myself taken at SIT weekend in full Edwardian dress, where I know I am not wearing my corset (I was running late and had to come down the hill by bicycle) but you would never know it from my stance - forward thrust bustline and backward thrust behind - all from the dress, petticoat, shoes and natural build. So it makes sense that design elements can help fake the look, but will not be as effective as a proper corset. Kelly Dorman Backward Glances www.backwardglances.net (new purses recently added, hatpins following shortly!) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 6 13:45:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76HjhUZ023988 for ; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 13:45:47 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k76Hjbuc019401 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 13:45:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76Hinrp024193 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 11:44:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76Hiiw1080546; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 11:44:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k76HicL2080468 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 11:44:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 71-81-238-29.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([71.81.238.29]:12149 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1G9mg6-0007a7-VL for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 06 Aug 2006 12:44:43 -0500 Message-ID: <027e01c6b97f$fcc85390$2e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 12:44:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 06 Aug 2006 13:45:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D62AC1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The "rude comment" part referred to my criticism of corset patterns developed from a pattern block as seen in Waisted Efforts--unless someone with a great deal of skill alters the pattern, the result is almost always all wrong. As to extra padding, the Edwardians came up with an amazing range of garments and products to generate the right shape, from the inflatable bust pad to heavily boned bust forms and beyond. Examples: http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/straightfrontcorsets/photos/browse/92a0 -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 6 22:31:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k772VeXi011791 for ; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 22:31:44 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k772VYQY031851 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 22:31:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k772Uipb082986 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 6 Aug 2006 20:30:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k772Udr5079608; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 20:30:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm29.prodigy.net (ylpvm29-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.60]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k772UPDx079469 for ; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 20:30:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.94.0] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-94-0.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.94.0]) by ylpvm29.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k772TsSm000333 for ; Sun, 6 Aug 2006 22:30:01 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060806192203.025fb590@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2006 19:23:27 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset In-Reply-To: <027e01c6b97f$fcc85390$2e00a8c0@compaqub> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 06 Aug 2006 22:31:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D6A606.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >The "rude comment" part referred to my criticism of corset patterns >developed from a pattern block as seen in Waisted Efforts--unless someone >with a great deal of skill alters the pattern, the result is almost always >all wrong. If you really didn't like the pattern I can see where you'd want to make rude comments about it. >As to extra padding, the Edwardians came up with an amazing range of >garments and products to generate the right shape, from the inflatable >bust pad to heavily boned bust forms and beyond. Examples: >http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/straightfrontcorsets/photos/browse/92a0 Yep. It's absolutely period to improve nature - for about any historical period there is - and, in fact, one of the things Edwardians used was called a "Bust Improver". CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 7 03:32:26 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k777WLcA016106 for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 03:32:25 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k777WFCr009042 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 7 Aug 2006 03:32:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k777UgTH031490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 7 Aug 2006 01:30:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k777UZfe053372; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 01:30:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web25705.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (web25705.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.12.10.177]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k777UV7n053281 for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 01:30:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from katherinejsanders@yahoo.co.uk) Received: (qmail 72614 invoked by uid 60001); 7 Aug 2006 07:30:26 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.co.uk; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=aorgAxA3OHgrnrLjBtbWgfd/dVI8RngX1ppYYBXlFW5fYe+0VneLzQ2JZhpNhflvkp8K1Qgjrf/g/lW7j0sseDNWVCiI8Ky6Ms9cS+B4ak5LJwwuXZbv4fqpNLBi6JB5PrCZ97Id6Of6XRqbfBxddpNOvP0jtwL0YGRGjx42tY8= ; Message-ID: <20060807073026.72612.qmail@web25705.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.155.204.82] by web25705.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 07 Aug 2006 07:30:26 GMT Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 07:30:26 +0000 (GMT) From: katherine sanders To: h-costume@mail.indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608051800.k75I0QQk076340@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Re: white cotton gloves X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 07 Aug 2006 03:32:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D6EC7F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Have you tried the local chemist/pharmacy? I used to buy mine there when i had awful eczema - not incredibly cheap but a really useful thing indeed :-) Katherine "A positive attitude may not solve all of your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort" - Herm Albright _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 7 13:39:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k77Hdh2i007545 for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 13:39:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k77HdXiV025281 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 7 Aug 2006 13:39:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k77HcJBW020511 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 7 Aug 2006 11:38:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k77Hc6Sj094976; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 11:38:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k77HbqrP094819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 11:37:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.175] (209-148-118-175.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.175]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k77HbooU022485 for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 10:37:51 -0700 Message-ID: <44D77A74.5070803@lavoltapress.com> Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2006 10:37:56 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset References: <027e01c6b97f$fcc85390$2e00a8c0@compaqub> In-Reply-To: <027e01c6b97f$fcc85390$2e00a8c0@compaqub> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 07 Aug 2006 13:39:41 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D77AD5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The idea that simply disagreeing with someone about something is "rude" is absurd. As for _Waisted Efforts_: Although I make corsets I've never drafted one from a pattern block. But one thing I can say about that book, is that it seriously needs editing and proofreading. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com E House wrote: > The "rude comment" part referred to my criticism of corset patterns > developed from a pattern block as seen in Waisted Efforts--unless > someone with a great deal of skill alters the pattern, the result is > almost always all wrong. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 7 17:01:24 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k77L1J9W012560 for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 17:01:24 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k77L1D9l000480 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 7 Aug 2006 17:01:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k77L0Jsr051951 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 7 Aug 2006 15:00:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k77L0B4G084130; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 15:00:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k77L037U083990 for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 15:00:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from CynthiaAbel@creighton.edu) Received: from exbe01.blue.jays.creighton.edu (exbe01.creighton.edu [147.134.2.111]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_29774)/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA08105 for ; Mon, 7 Aug 2006 15:59:53 -0500 (CDT) x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2006 15:59:51 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Sept Vogue magazine cover. Thread-Index: Aca6SLY3sn+DV8vQRXuwwvZtvv0r1gAGkgBw From: "Abel, Cynthia" To: "Historical Costume" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k77L037U083990 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Sept Vogue magazine cover. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 07 Aug 2006 17:01:17 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D7AA19.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO It has not yet hit the newsstands, but it looks like the September cover of Vogue magazine will have Kirsten Dunst costumed in the title role of the movie "Marie Antoinette" Signals a photospread inside that should have all of us on the list discussing the accuracy/inaccuracy of the costuming and movie aesthetics, making the stars look good, director's vision, and costume budget vs what is historically correct even before the movie hits our local multiplexes. And for some of us, before the book tie-in and/or DVD availability since the film may never arrive on our local movie screens. Promises to be lots of fun! Until then, brush up on 18th century fashion books, read or re-read "Hollywood and History" by Edward Maeder, and pre-order "What Marie Antoinette Wore to the Revolution." Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 07:38:14 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78BcCE7029848 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 07:38:12 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78Bc6vL007756 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 07:38:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78BbLLE042412 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 05:37:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78BbDxJ082181; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 05:37:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-scotia.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-scotia.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.65]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Bb6qM082105 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 05:37:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.185.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.185] helo=faucet.net) by pop-scotia.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GAPtR-0000cf-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 07:37:05 -0400 Message-ID: <44D884F2.8040609@faucet.net> Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 07:34:58 -0500 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset (Waisted Efforts) References: <027e01c6b97f$fcc85390$2e00a8c0@compaqub> <44D77A74.5070803@lavoltapress.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 07:38:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D8779E.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I've seen this book, and I didn't care for it for the very same reason. It seems counterintuitive to try to make a corset from a pattern block. There's an entirely different principle at work--a different kind of engineering, if you will. It seems to be a book for people who want something that looks like a corset but doesn't actually function as one. Also politely disagreeing, Melanie Schuessler Lavolta Press wrote: > The idea that simply disagreeing with someone about something is "rude" > is absurd. > > As for _Waisted Efforts_: Although I make corsets I've never drafted > one from a pattern block. But one thing I can say about that book, is > that it seriously needs editing and proofreading. > > Fran > Lavolta Press > http://www.lavoltapress.com > > E House wrote: > >> The "rude comment" part referred to my criticism of corset patterns >> developed from a pattern block as seen in Waisted Efforts--unless >> someone with a great deal of skill alters the pattern, the result is >> almost always all wrong. > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 08:00:21 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78C0KTw030275 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:00:20 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78C0ElA004671 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:00:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78BxkOg044969 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 05:59:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78BxhNI095484; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 05:59:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78A8gRj038958 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 04:08:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Deredere.Galbraith@kabelfoon.nl) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (kf-ijss-cb01-0470.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.81.215]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4229F319275 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:08:36 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <44D862A9.4070008@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 12:08:41 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=15% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Regency robe 1812 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 08:00:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D87CCE.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi, I found a beautifull picture on the web from a 1812 robe. http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page8.html http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page5.html I have been asked to make a wedding dress in this style but I don't know much about it. She send me two small drawings and the dress above was the only one I could find in the same style It looks very french to me. I can't seem to find more pictures of this style of dress. I would love to have more pictures to see what types of fabric and embellishmend was used. Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 08:13:46 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78CDj9W030556 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:13:45 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78CDdCn010864 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:13:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78CBni4046049 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 06:11:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78CBlpO002437; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 06:11:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78CBeDu002324 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 06:11:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from 88-107-112-172.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com (HELO mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com) ([88.107.112.172]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 08 Aug 2006 13:11:26 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AcwMAIIa2ESBUYkU Received: from 88-107-112-172.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.112.172]:2382 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1GAQQf-000MaS-T4 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 12:11:25 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060808130509.0255b4a0@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 13:11:23 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] Regency robe 1812 In-Reply-To: <44D862A9.4070008@kabelfoon.nl> References: <44D862A9.4070008@kabelfoon.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 08:13:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D87FF3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 11:08 08/08/2006, you wrote: >Hi, > >I found a beautifull picture on the web from a 1812 robe. >http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page8.html >http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page5.html > >I have been asked to make a wedding dress in this style but I don't >know much about it. >She send me two small drawings and the dress above was the only one >I could find in the same style >It looks very french to me. >I can't seem to find more pictures of this style of dress. >I would love to have more pictures to see what types of fabric and >embellishmend was used. I think this is a gown with a separate court train attached at the waist (and possibly with straps over the shoulders.) This is probably the most famous image of the style. (Various versions of the same painting by David.) http://images.google.co.uk/images?q=Josephine+Coronation&hl=en&btnG=Search+Images Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 08:35:12 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78CZCmu030943 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:35:12 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78CZ6hv020256 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:35:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78CXiDE048284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 06:33:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78CXfsH015124; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 06:33:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d22.mx.aol.com (imo-d22.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.208]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78CXb4n015030 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 06:33:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Taniampembroke@aol.com) Received: from Taniampembroke@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.3c1.8b2c33d (60449) for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:33:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from MBLK-M04 (mblk-m04.mblk.aol.com [64.12.136.37]) by ciaaol-r01.mx.aol.com (v110.15) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLR012-ec2144d88497db; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 08:33:27 -0400 Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 08:33:26 -0400 Message-Id: <8C888FDFB3EB4DC-A8C-353C@MBLK-M04.sysops.aol.com> From: taniampembroke@aol.com References: <44D862A9.4070008@kabelfoon.nl> Received: from 68.223.138.147 by MBLK-M04.sysops.aol.com (64.12.136.37) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 08:33:26 -0400 X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI X-MB-Message-Type: User In-Reply-To: <44D862A9.4070008@kabelfoon.nl> X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 19144 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Regency robe 1812 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com X-AOL-IP: 64.12.136.37 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 08:35:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D884FA.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id k78CZCmu030943 Status: RO Hi Deredere, The picture looks a lot the one titled Robe de mousseline brodée c.1806 et châle Cachemire from Gallery 4, but with a train and slighty more embellishment for a ceremonial engagement. -----Original Message----- From: Deredere.Galbraith@kabelfoon.nl To: h-costume@indra.com Sent: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 6:08 AM Subject: [h-cost] Regency robe 1812 Hi, I found a beautifull picture on the web from a 1812 robe. http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page8.html http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page5.html I have been asked to make a wedding dress in this style but I don't know much about it. She send me two small drawings and the dress above was the only one I could find in the same style It looks very french to me. I can't seem to find more pictures of this style of dress. I would love to have more pictures to see what types of fabric and embellishmend was used. Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ________________________________________________________________________ Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand. Always Free. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 09:34:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78DYSDh032062 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:34:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78DYMxX030670 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:34:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78DXfQM056948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 07:33:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78DXbpE054718; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 07:33:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78DXDfV054502 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 07:33:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.4bd.3aed5700 (63024) for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:33:06 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <4bd.3aed5700.3209ec92@aol.com> Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:33:06 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Regency robe 1812 To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 09:34:25 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D892DE.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/8/2006 8:35:05 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, taniampembroke@aol.com writes: have been asked to make a wedding dress in this style but I don't know much about it. She send me two small drawings and the dress above was the only one I could find in the same style It looks very french to me. I can't seem to find more pictures of this style of dress. I would love to have more pictures to see what types of fabric and embellishmend was used. The book, "Age of Napoleon" has some nice pictures of French court dress. While most of the trains were velvet, there is one pictured, if memory serves, where the train was the same fabric as the dress. The train would be separate and, if heavy, it would indeed have straps over the shoulders. This dress looks like it is all silk, with embroidery edging the train. Perhaps you could find a nice wide embroidered edging that you could use instead--shaping it around the train could be a little tricky, but not impossible. The ruff around the neck was most like tulle, although you could probably also use silk organza or lace. There used to be all kinds of wedding dress patterns with detachable trains, but they seem to have disappeared. Still, it shouldn't be too hard to create a train to the dimensions you want. Of course, much depends on if the bride wants her dress exactly like that, or just inspired by it. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 11:19:37 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78FJbpi001844 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 11:19:37 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78FJV5c023852 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 11:19:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78FImTR069845 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:18:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78FIbf2039507; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:18:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mail.marz.com [216.106.88.97] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78FITEk039381 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:18:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A347437110 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 10:18:28 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Regency robe 1812 Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 10:18:34 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <44D862A9.4070008@kabelfoon.nl> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 11:19:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D8AB83.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO This might help with ideas as well. http://demode.tweedlebop.com/realvict/1800s.html The poicture you posted, the train is a separate piece from the main gown. This works well for a wedding dress as the train can be removed for the reception. Wedding dress. This is a coat style with under dress. http://www.mfa.org/collections/search_art.asp?recview=true&id=49614&coll_key words=wedding%20dress&coll_package=0&coll_start=1 Note, not all trains are removable. :) I think the museum have the paisley's listed as being printed on the fabric. http://www.museumofcostume.co.uk/userimages/collection/large/batmc_i_09_906. jpg The site were your picture came from http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page4.html http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page7.html http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page5.html w/train http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/dreh/ho_C.I.37.46.1.htm De -----Original Message----- Hi, I found a beautifull picture on the web from a 1812 robe. http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page8.html http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page5.html I have been asked to make a wedding dress in this style but I don't know much about it. She send me two small drawings and the dress above was the only one I could find in the same style It looks very french to me. I can't seem to find more pictures of this style of dress. I would love to have more pictures to see what types of fabric and embellishmend was used. Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 11:48:30 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78FmUKO002507 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 11:48:30 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78FmOu8001806 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 11:48:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Flmpa073811 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:47:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78FlfYG069253; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:47:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s38.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s38.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.174]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78FlXQr069058 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:47:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([64.4.51.26]) by bay0-omc2-s38.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:47:28 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 08:47:28 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 64.4.51.220 by by107fd.bay107.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 15:47:25 GMT X-Originating-IP: [198.166.214.5] X-Originating-Email: [estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com] X-Sender: estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <44D884F2.8040609@faucet.net> From: "Kelly Grant" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset (Waisted Efforts) Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 12:47:25 -0300 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Aug 2006 15:47:28.0142 (UTC) FILETIME=[F38292E0:01C6BB01] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 11:48:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D8B248.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO While I totally agree with the dislike of 'Waisted Efforts', it is for other reasons...the lack of important information. Bob Doyle uses many different methods in his work, but leaves out crucial information in both this book and his latest on Tailoring. I have always drafted corsets from blocks, I was taught the full method while at school, and have never had a problem. They do the job very nicely. Probably a stupid question, but how do you all develope the pattern for the different corsets you do? Kelly "Bravery is something you can experience on the spur of the moment, faced with danger. To have courage, you must think about the dangers in advance, then weigh the risks, and then do what you have to do, despite your fears" Caius Merlyn Britannicus >From: Melanie Schuessler >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: Historical Costume >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset (Waisted Efforts) >Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 07:34:58 -0500 > >I've seen this book, and I didn't care for it for the very same reason. It >seems counterintuitive to try to make a corset from a pattern block. >There's an entirely different principle at work--a different kind of >engineering, if you will. It seems to be a book for people who want >something that looks like a corset but doesn't actually function as one. > >Also politely disagreeing, >Melanie Schuessler > > >Lavolta Press wrote: >>The idea that simply disagreeing with someone about something is "rude" is >>absurd. >> >>As for _Waisted Efforts_: Although I make corsets I've never drafted one >>from a pattern block. But one thing I can say about that book, is that it >>seriously needs editing and proofreading. >> >>Fran >>Lavolta Press >>http://www.lavoltapress.com >> >>E House wrote: >> >>>The "rude comment" part referred to my criticism of corset patterns >>>developed from a pattern block as seen in Waisted Efforts--unless someone >>>with a great deal of skill alters the pattern, the result is almost >>>always all wrong. >> >> >>_______________________________________________ >>h-costume mailing list >>h-costume@mail.indra.com >>http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 14:05:19 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78I5FUu006115 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:05:19 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78I59Jb017494 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:05:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78I4AUA095204 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:04:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78I41nQ002448; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:04:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78I3swx002315 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:03:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x50a247e5.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.162.71.229]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 00623A50035 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 20:03:51 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002501c6bb15$101c1120$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 20:04:12 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 14:05:13 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D8D255.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO This is a style i made some years ago with a long train, embroidered with seaquins. It was made of pink dupioni, because the hairdressers who ordered it, couldnt afford more. It is a seperate train attached round the waist with a belt closed in the front. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 14:53:09 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Ir9ei007763 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:53:09 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78Ir0d8030999 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:53:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Iq6lR001858 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:52:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78IoogD046484; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:51:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78In2lQ043963 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:49:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos2.cos.agilent.com (relcos2.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.237]) by msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39ED526F6F for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:48:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com [130.29.153.221]) by relcos2.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 292D2146EAA for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:48:28 -0600 (MDT) Received: from wcosbh03.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.128]) by wcosvs01.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 12:48:27 -0600 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh03.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:48:27 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset (Waisted Efforts) Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 12:48:26 -0600 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D964011C3635@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Straight front corset (Waisted Efforts) Thread-Index: Aca7FV59ap7+huIRQxSCZmtdbdJL0wABHEqQ From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Aug 2006 18:48:27.0355 (UTC) FILETIME=[3C1AFAB0:01C6BB1B] X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k78In2lQ043963 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 14:53:06 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D8DD8C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > Probably a stupid question, but how do you all develope the > pattern for the different corsets you do? I prefer to start from an existing pattern - either from blowing up one of Waugh's _Corsets & Crinolines_ patterns or from a commercial pattern (like Past Patterns) and then fit the heck out of a mock up. Followed by more fitting of the actual corset. The final shape of each piece is almost never exactly from the pattern, but it get's the right shape and lines. The biggest drawback of my method is that I cannot make a corset for myself without _a whole lot_ of help from someone who is skilled at fitting, especially how corsets fit -- since the slightest bubbles that would appear non-existent in a comparatively loose fitting 20th century dress can be quite uncomfortable in a corset, when worn tight-laced all day. -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 16:15:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78KFskU010164 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:15:54 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78KFjYE027495 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:15:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78KEb69011398 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:14:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78KETgx033490; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:14:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.152]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k78KENCD033312 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:14:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 32164 invoked by uid 60001); 8 Aug 2006 20:14:13 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=wLwhvJFQMfzqI5USgkV5/BU/vN4d/mJHLifL/6O4kPCfdRPbiBKJjvYXVb1P545lIXyTOiCpR4f6oksY/ULO7wEcT6/IiQTylFmZ6eL1rAh9UlauI1YWFiZp1q+WZxHZmL2j7N1mgBELfquJcctwc8+p79n5BO2BZMjgDRHyhQM= ; Message-ID: <20060808201413.32162.qmail@web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [86.138.46.191] by web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 13:14:13 PDT Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 13:14:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D964011C3635@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 16:15:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D8F0F2.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I've got another probably stupid question: How do you do the fitting??? I mean the corset is - at leat at the waist - much smaller than your real figure, so how can you actually try it on when not yet finished? It must be tight laced and there must be bones in it, else I cannot imagine a fitting. If there are no bones, there will always be wrinkles. And what about the stitching? It must be quite strong to not tear when laced up... Zuzana --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail Beta. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 16:48:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78KmB7W011112 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:48:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78Km5u1011361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:48:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Kl9EX015126 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:47:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Kl0j7061452; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:47:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Kktb2061364 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:46:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:10111 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1GAYTc-0000GH-Gt for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 15:47:01 -0500 Message-ID: <001701c6bb2b$c8013cf0$f500a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060808201413.32162.qmail@web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 15:46:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 16:48:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D8F885.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Make up a fitting corset out of inexpensive but heavy & non-stretch fabric. (You may want to mine the $1/yd table at walmart, or your local equivalent.) For fitting purposes, you only need one bone per side at the front, side, and back; front-side and back-side bones can be added to combat wrinkles on larger figures. Since the fit of the busk pocket at front and the lacing strips in the rear won't change, go ahead and make those with your real corset fabric, and baste them to the fitting corset. Then, each element of the fitting corset will be useful for the real corset: the fitting corset itself will become the pattern, and the busk and laces sections will go into the real corset. If you make corsets often, you may want to make and save a re-useable busk and laces set. Sew the fitting corset by machine; use a long stitch length, and a tension loose enough that it will be relatively easy to pick out the stitches, but use a strong thread (such as hand quilting thread). To simulate the fit of a garment with finished seams, clip all seam allowances at the curves, then push the seam allowances to one side and topstitch. This sort of construction won't be up to long term use, but it will definitely be enough for the fitting process. While you have the fitting corset on, you might want to take the opportunity to mark where the bones should go. (Only do this after you are satisfied with the fit of the corset!) Even with the few bones you've put into the fitting corset, you'll probably find that they're not in quite the right spot; you can tell this if it feels like the bones twist slightly, rather than laying flat along your body. This is especially problematic with the side-front bones of a straight-front! To mark where the bones should go, get a roll of tape about 3/4" to 1" wide. The wideness of the tape helps avoid errors; if you can get something that wide to lay flat, then the much narrower bone channels certainly will. Cut a piece of tape long enough for a bone channel, and while wearing the corset, lay it where you think the bone channel should be. I find it helps to affix the tape first at the waist, then smooth it up and down; it gives you the best control of where the channel will wind up. -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 16:50:53 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78KorL8011218 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:50:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78Kolru012188 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:50:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78KmWHc015259 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:48:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78KmUfY062654; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:48:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78KmO3s062519 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 14:48:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.4] (209-148-118-4.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.4]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k78KmIvl023563 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 13:48:19 -0700 Message-ID: <44D8F89A.7080507@lavoltapress.com> Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 13:48:26 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting References: <20060808201413.32162.qmail@web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20060808201413.32162.qmail@web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 16:50:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44D8F927.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO You do not have to tight lace to get the correct silhouette for any period. You can make a corset your size, or an inch smaller, without tight lacing. Support and a period silhouette are one thing, extreme body modification (temporary or permanent) is another. As various people have said, a period silhoutte does not depend entirely on the corset. Depending on the period, a period silhouette also depends on padding, hoopskirts, bustles, petticoats, ruffles, optical illusions in the dress style, and conscious posture and movement that is not actually forced by any understructure. However, one thing you can do is make two lacing strips. These are strips of strong fabric with eyelets in them like a corset, more or less the length of a corset. You baste them to each side of every corset muslin you make, so you can lace it up like a corset to try on. Also, the person fitting you does not have to be skilled at fitting or sewing. (My husband fits my corsets.) What you need is someone able to follow directions, and a two-mirror system. You can get cheap full-length mirrors, meant for bathroom doors and so on, at hardware stores and building supply places. Set up one in front of you and one behind you, so you can look at your back while the person fits your garment and tell them what to do. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Zuzana Kraemerova wrote: > I've got another probably stupid question: How do you do the fitting??? I mean the corset is - at leat at the waist - much smaller than your real figure, so how can you actually try it on when not yet finished? It must be tight laced and there must be bones in it, else I cannot imagine a fitting. If there are no bones, there will always be wrinkles. And what about the stitching? It must be quite strong to not tear when laced up... > > Zuzana > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail Beta. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 18:20:12 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78MK7N3013477 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 18:20:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78MK1e2030112 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 18:20:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78MIiA2027898 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:18:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78MIVAK044038; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:18:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78MIMLZ043830 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:18:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.39]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 08 Aug 2006 23:10:39 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AQAAADqq2ESBUYkfAgsRBg Received: from 88-107-112-172.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.112.172]:3569 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1GAZmZ-0004LV-3y for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 22:10:39 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060808230749.0255fca0@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 23:11:15 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting In-Reply-To: <001701c6bb2b$c8013cf0$f500a8c0@compaqub> References: <20060808201413.32162.qmail@web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <001701c6bb2b$c8013cf0$f500a8c0@compaqub> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 18:20:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D90E11.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 21:46 08/08/2006, you wrote: >Make up a fitting corset out of inexpensive but heavy & non-stretch >fabric. (You may want to mine the $1/yd table at walmart, or your >local equivalent.) For fitting purposes, you only need one bone per >side at the front, side, and back; front-side and back-side bones >can be added to combat wrinkles on larger figures. Since the fit of >the busk pocket at front and the lacing strips in the rear won't >change, go ahead and make those with your real corset fabric, and >baste them to the fitting corset. Then, each element of the fitting >corset will be useful for the real corset: the fitting corset itself >will become the pattern, and the busk and laces sections will go >into the real corset. If you make corsets often, you may want to >make and save a re-useable busk and laces set. > >Sew the fitting corset by machine; use a long stitch length, and a >tension loose enough that it will be relatively easy to pick out the >stitches, but use a strong thread (such as hand quilting >thread). To simulate the fit of a garment with finished seams, clip >all seam allowances at the curves, then push the seam allowances to >one side and topstitch. This sort of construction won't be up to >long term use, but it will definitely be enough for the fitting process. > >While you have the fitting corset on, you might want to take the >opportunity to mark where the bones should go. (Only do this after >you are satisfied with the fit of the corset!) Even with the few >bones you've put into the fitting corset, you'll probably find that >they're not in quite the right spot; you can tell this if it feels >like the bones twist slightly, rather than laying flat along your >body. This is especially problematic with the side-front bones of a >straight-front! To mark where the bones should go, get a roll of >tape about 3/4" to 1" wide. The wideness of the tape helps avoid >errors; if you can get something that wide to lay flat, then the >much narrower bone channels certainly will. Cut a piece of tape >long enough for a bone channel, and while wearing the corset, lay it >where you think the bone channel should be. I find it helps to >affix the tape first at the waist, then smooth it up and down; it >gives you the best control of where the channel will wind up. Good Lord, how complicated!! I make up a corset, in the fabric I intend to use, from a customer's measurements, seam the centre front instead of using a busk, but eyelet the back in the normal way. I fit with the seams on the outside, with plenty of seam allowance. But then I have been doing it for 25 years. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 18:50:30 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78MoUvL014027 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 18:50:30 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78MoOiB005313 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 18:50:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Mnitr031648 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:49:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78MnfS7067056; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:49:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d22.mx.aol.com (imo-d22.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.208]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78MnaJT066884 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:49:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.276.dd49c4f (63000) for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 18:49:28 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <276.dd49c4f.320a6ef8@aol.com> Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 18:49:28 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 18:50:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44D91530.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/8/2006 6:20:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, suzi@suziclarke.co.uk writes: Good Lord, how complicated!! I make up a corset, in the fabric I intend to use, from a customer's measurements, seam the centre front instead of using a busk, but eyelet the back in the normal way. I fit with the seams on the outside, with plenty of seam allowance. But then I have been doing it for 25 years. ***************** This is what I do. On "Last of the Mohicans" we made up boned mock-up corsets out of muslin using grosgrain ribbon for boning casings, fixed [as in not to be changed] the CF and laced CB and left much seam allowance on the outside when the other seams were based up. This mock up was then fitted. Any changes were marked on the pattern and the real corset of real fabric was then made up from the corrected pattern. The mock up...now taken apart, was covered with a better fabric, sewn up with the seam allowance on the inside, bound, and an extra or day player wore them. Also...for theatre [after my "Mohicans" experience] I would make up the lining of the real corset and bone it, again using ribbon for casings. [An advantage of this is the seam allowances on the outside and the boning on the outside are where they will be in the finished piece.] Then after it was fitted, and corrections marked, the outside fabric would be laid over the lining, now taken apart [but it could be done all put together], with the boning casings [and seam allowances if you want] sandwiched between. Then, using the machine stitched lines of the casings in the lining as a guide, hand stitched the vent lines through all layers to the front. [Now you can put it all back together if it's not already.] You end up with what looks like a hand sewn corset! Perfect for those scenes where you see it. If you don't have time for hand sewing [those already marked straight lines really don't take too long to do...and you can curve the corset a bit as you do it for a really smooth look.] you can just leave it, or do it by machine. I was talking 18th century stays here...where a bone rarely if ever crosses a seam. But you could do it for a 19th century corset too. In fact, later 19th century corsets have the boning casings on the outside. If you use a fancy [but sturdy] ribbon for that, it can look quite fetching. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 8 18:52:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Mqt74014060 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 18:52:55 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k78Mqnmv002892 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 18:52:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Mq6l0032137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:52:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78Mq4ND069121; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:52:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k78MpwGr069031 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 16:52:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:10442 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1GAaQe-0008F2-At for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 08 Aug 2006 17:52:06 -0500 Message-ID: <007901c6bb3d$3fed6700$f500a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060808201413.32162.qmail@web37505.mail.mud.yahoo.com><001701c6bb2b$c8013cf0$f500a8c0@compaqub> <7.0.1.0.2.20060808230749.0255fca0@suziclarke.co.uk> Subject: Re: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 17:51:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 08 Aug 2006 18:52:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D915C1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Suzi Clarke" > Good Lord, how complicated!! I make up a corset, in the fabric I intend > to use, from a customer's measurements, seam the centre front instead of > using a busk, but eyelet the back in the normal way. I fit with the seams > on the outside, with plenty of seam allowance. But then I have been doing > it for 25 years. It sounds more complicated than it is, and is only necessary for the fiddly corsets, like straightfronts. With the extremely narrow pieces involved in the straight front, and the importance of having the exact right curve in those narrow pieces, you'll definitely need to test it out first. Otherwise, you'll find yourself needing seam allowances several times wider than the pattern piece itself! Picture a curved piece that's about an inch wide, and the same piece with a slightly sharper curve. Lay one on top of the other, and the ends don't match up at ALL. Granted, I've only been making straight fronts for about a decade, but believe me, it's enough time to learn this lesson. =} For corsets with less complicated seaming, such as the Elizabethans or the Victorians, a fitting corset is rarely necessary. -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 03:51:29 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k797pNXM020764 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 03:51:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k797pHTr026951 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 03:51:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k797onn4088642 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 01:50:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k797og3W047765; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 01:50:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pelian.kabelfoon.nl (pelian.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.45.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k797oa2V047700 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 01:50:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Deredere.Galbraith@kabelfoon.nl) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (kf-ijss-cb01-0470.dial.kabelfoon.nl [62.45.81.215]) by pelian.kabelfoon.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C91D31911A for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:50:31 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <44D993CE.5000809@kabelfoon.nl> Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:50:38 +0200 From: Deredere Galbraith User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 References: <002501c6bb15$101c1120$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> In-Reply-To: <002501c6bb15$101c1120$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 03:51:21 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44D993F5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thanks for the response. I think it is a great style for a wedding dress. And a removable train makes it even better. But the waist is a little higher than normal waist how do you keep the belt at the right hight? Bjarne do you have pictures of the dress you made? Maby she wants hand embroidery or machine embroidery on her train. Or I could use applications and hand embroidery... Greetings, Deredere Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: > This is a style i made some years ago with a long train, embroidered > with seaquins. It was made of pink dupioni, because the hairdressers > who ordered it, couldnt afford more. It is a seperate train attached > round the waist with a belt closed in the front. > > Bjarne > > > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 04:26:30 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k798QRWI027922 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 04:26:27 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k798QLxB005084 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 04:26:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k798PxKp091631 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 02:25:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k798PwBl062436; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 02:25:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k798Ptic062391 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 02:25:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.25] (209-148-118-25.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.25]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k78GoTqN010266 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 2006 09:50:32 -0700 Message-ID: <44D8C0DC.5050309@lavoltapress.com> Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2006 09:50:36 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset (Waisted Efforts) References: <027e01c6b97f$fcc85390$2e00a8c0@compaqub> <44D77A74.5070803@lavoltapress.com> <44D884F2.8040609@faucet.net> In-Reply-To: <44D884F2.8040609@faucet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 04:26:24 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44D99C2D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The problem with starting from a pattern block/sloper is, that a modern sloper is a modern pattern with modern seam lines, etc. Now, you _can_ turn it into a historic pattern of any kind for any era, and some people do. (BTW, the Victorians manufactured a large number of "sloper" systems, many as cardboard "charts", some in metal (such as the McDowell system, which were designed to create a perfect-fitting "pattern block" the user could adapt to any fashionable variant. AND if the company stayed in business they had to update their sloper shape every few years to keep their customers. Because, the basic bodice pattern shapes and even the number of pieces in the bodice kept changing.) Some people who are really comfortable with one method of producing a pattern, such as using a pattern block/sloper or draping, get so familiar with it that for them it is the easiest way to produce all patterns, and they are sincerely convinced that therefore it is the easiest method for everyone and everything. However, in order to turn a pattern block into a historic corset or any other kind of historic pattern, you already have to know a lot about where seam lines are placed and other aspects of fit. Again, some people do, and anyone else can research this. But for some people, whether they have this information or not, it is easier to start out with a historic pattern that already has the correct number of pieces and correctly arranged seam lines--both very important for a corset--and make the pattern fit their body. In other words, if you are not using a presized pattern such as Past Patterns, you have a choice between altering the style (using the pattern block) and altering the fit (using the period pattern). Of course, a one-size period pattern will be closer to some people's size than other people's. One area of confusion in discussing making corsets is that people do not always say how much they are tight lacing. The more extreme the changes you are trying to make in your body, the harder it is to make the corset work. And yes, fashionable S-bend Edwardians did often pad or otherwise "fake" their bosoms (with things like a camisole under the dress with rows of starched ruffles in front), and they did sometimes wear hip pads, and there were many ingenious contrivances to create the silhouette in addition to the corset. They also assumed different fashionable postures in walking, standing, etc. The basic high-fashion posture show in period illustrations is to lean forward from the waist, push the bosom out, throw the head back, and stick the behind out; and you'll notice sometimes, they push the back of one hand in the small of the back. Fran Lavolta Press Books on Historic Costuming http://www.lavoltapress.com Melanie Schuessler wrote: > I've seen this book, and I didn't care for it for the very same reason. > It seems counterintuitive to try to make a corset from a pattern > block. There's an entirely different principle at work--a different > kind of engineering, if you will. It seems to be a book for people who > want something that looks like a corset but doesn't actually function as > one. > > Also politely disagreeing, > Melanie Schuessler > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 04:39:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k798dWeC030328 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 04:39:32 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k798dRPA006599 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 04:39:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k798d2Ao092674 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 02:39:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k798d1Zw068181; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 02:39:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mail.marz.com [216.106.88.97] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k798cwNi068152 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 02:38:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 46BF53C466 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 03:38:57 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 03:39:07 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 In-Reply-To: <44D993CE.5000809@kabelfoon.nl> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 04:39:30 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44D99F3F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO It appears that there are straps. http://exposition2005.monsite.wanadoo.fr/page8.html follow the roses up to the bodice, there seems to be something that looks like a strap just under the sleeve that matches the waist band of the train. De -----Original Message----- But the waist is a little higher than normal waist how do you keep the belt at the right hight? Greetings, Deredere _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 10:19:24 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EJOgK003410 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:19:24 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79EJI6x025315 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:19:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EHF12021459 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:17:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EH7WP032459; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:17:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EH17Q032347 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:17:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.be1.1ebbea2 (65099) for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:16:45 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:16:45 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset (Waisted Efforts) To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 10:19:21 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D9EEE6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/9/2006 4:26:32 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, fran@lavoltapress.com writes: They also assumed different fashionable postures in walking, standing, etc. ****************** This can be really important. You can dress someone up to the nines and if they slouch....or don't slouch, whichever the period requires, it won't be convincing. That erect, hands folded at about waist level stance of the 18th century just wouldn't fly where the leaning back contraposto pose of the 1920's and 30's is supposed to be. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 10:33:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EXl9v003775 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:33:47 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79EXfaK008638 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:33:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EWxgN023146 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:32:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EWwsq044444; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:32:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EWrLp044303 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:32:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.276.dde2748 (43932) for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:32:38 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <276.dde2748.320b4c06@aol.com> Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:32:38 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 10:33:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44D9F245.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/9/2006 3:52:57 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, Deredere.Galbraith@kabelfoon.nl writes: But the waist is a little higher than normal waist how do you keep the belt at the right hight? Yes, it is hard to keep a belt at the raised waist. I would put big skirt hooks and eyes on to hold the train--hooks on the train, eyes on the dress, with a bias band, just attached on the top edge, around the waist, that would flip down to hide the eyes when the train was detached. I don't have any of my 1960s era wedding dress patterns anymore, but, if memory serves, this is how they handled the detachable train. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 10:48:09 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79Em9kQ004126 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:48:09 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79Em36m000384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:48:06 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79ElW99024729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:47:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79ElUxc057945; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:47:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EdAQx049916 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:39:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.bc2.249d28c (65099) for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:38:57 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:38:56 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 10:48:06 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D9F5A3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/9/2006 10:33:41 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, AnnBWass@aol.com writes: I would put big skirt hooks and eyes on to hold the train--hooks on the train, eyes on the dress, with a bias band, just attached on the top edge, around the waist, that would flip down to hide the eyes when the train was detached. Mmmmm...not bad. But what's wrong with thread loops? or thread bars for the hooks? I hope the train is not THAT heavy. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 11:22:01 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79FLu0j005789 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:22:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79FLost012935 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:21:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79FL2BP028822 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:21:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79FKvTU086608; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:20:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.37]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79FKkHc086410 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:20:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos2.cos.agilent.com (relcos2.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.237]) by msgbas2x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21F5E68E for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:20:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: from wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.233]) by relcos2.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07BF1146C49 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:20:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from wcosbh01.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.125]) by wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:20:40 -0600 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh01.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:20:40 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Re: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:20:39 -0600 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D964011C3AB4@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting Thread-Index: Aca7vzxA8lpE7RvUTpCNNkzRSp4rtgABgaJg From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Aug 2006 15:20:40.0115 (UTC) FILETIME=[5F76E030:01C6BBC7] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k79FKkHc086410 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 11:21:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44D9FD8E.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > I've got another probably stupid question: How do you do the > fitting??? I mean the corset is - at leat at the waist - much > smaller than your real figure, so how can you actually try it > on when not yet finished? It must be tight laced and there > must be bones in it, else I cannot imagine a fitting. If > there are no bones, there will always be wrinkles. And what > about the stitching? It must be quite strong to not tear when > laced up... The mock-up is made out of heavy non-stretchy fabric -- cotton drill, canvas, jean, and you have to use regular stitching, not basting length stitches. I use a "sew on" set of eyelets (as Jen Thompson describes using for fitting her 1515 Italian dress - I'd give the web link, but the site appears to be down so I can't be sure of the url). I first fit using that shell. Bones are actually not required to get the initial fit - certain seams may require them, but mostly they just smooth out wrinkle-spots. After the initial mostly unboned fitting, I mark where I think the bones will go, and use twill-tape casings to put them in. Then fit the mock-up again, smoothing out wrinkles and undesired bulges :-) (which are usually dealt with by minute adjustments of the width of a seam. Sometimes I skip the mock-up and just do all the alterations and bone-placement stuff on the actual corset. This works best if the corset is unlined, which I only do if I'm using coutil as the corset fabric. I only skip the mock up step if I'm starting from a commercial pattern, and am therefore pretty assured that the initial corset is close to my size or bigger. Hope that makes sense! -sunny _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 12:28:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79GRtZS008201 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:28:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79GRnIK004018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:27:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79GQn4l039067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:26:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79GQSoM046444; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:26:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from a.mail.sonic.net (a.mail.sonic.net [64.142.16.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79GQMTZ046305 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:26:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.86] (209-148-118-86.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.86]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k79GQID6017973 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:26:21 -0700 Message-ID: <44DA0CAC.2050000@lavoltapress.com> Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:26:20 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Straight front corset (Waisted Efforts) References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 12:27:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44DA0D05.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Yes. I think sometimes people expect foundation garments alone to give a period posture. They don't. Fran AlbertCat@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 8/9/2006 4:26:32 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > fran@lavoltapress.com writes: > > They also assumed different fashionable postures in walking, standing, > etc. > > > ****************** > > This can be really important. You can dress someone up to the nines and if > they slouch....or don't slouch, whichever the period requires, it won't be > convincing. That erect, hands folded at about waist level stance of the 18th > century just wouldn't fly where the leaning back contraposto pose of the 1920's > and 30's is supposed to be. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 13:58:26 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79HwLUW009766 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:58:25 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79HwFJZ032494 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 13:58:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79HvED0050493 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:57:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79Hv7qi030939; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:57:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mail.socket.net [216.106.88.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79Hv0B6030770 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:57:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 4015138726 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:56:59 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:57:11 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 13:58:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44DA2237.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO http://store.sewingtoday.com/cgi-bin/butterick/shop.cgi?s.item.B4890=x&TI=10 013&page=1 The tall lace at neckline I believe would be on A but you would most likely have a different closing. The skirt of B would only come the side seams would be to match the pink gown's train. The bodice front would be open more. No darts in the back but back side seams, back neckline would be wider and lower (if doing the "jacket" bodice style). Or use the "skirt" of B and sew on a "waistband" with matching arm loops (or if appliqué' on the train, have it go up and match it on the arm loops. Think simple harness with train attached. The trains were usually ceremonial. http://www.centraalmuseum.nl/database/Item.phtml?ItemId=21&Terug=1 A variation, coat style http://www.musees-nationaux-napoleoniens.org/pages/page_id19241_u1l2.htm I have my doubts about the hook and eyes to hold up the train. I think it will hang funny. De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 14:18:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IIn3m010138 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:18:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79IIg9F009604 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:18:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IHxu4053200 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:17:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IHrbd049895; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:17:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mtiwmhc11.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc11.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.115]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IHmbK049738 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:17:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Kiloran@worldnet.att.net) Received: from sharplaptop.worldnet.att.net (d11-20.rb.gh.centurytel.net[69.29.202.20]) by worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc11) with SMTP id <20060809181742111005086je>; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 18:17:42 +0000 Message-Id: <6.2.0.14.0.20060809111614.0206a810@ipostoffice.worldnet.att.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.0.14 Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2006 11:17:35 -0700 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Kiloran@worldnet.att.net In-Reply-To: <200608091800.k79I0SEh034134@net.indra.com> References: <200608091800.k79I0SEh034134@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] A Festive Attyre website X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 14:18:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44DA2702.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 11:00 AM 8/9/2006, you wrote: >Message: 4 >Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 09:20:39 -0600 >From: >Subject: Re: [h-cost] (Straight front) corset - fitting >To: >Message-ID: > <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D964011C3AB4@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > I've got another probably stupid question: How do you do the > > fitting??? I mean the corset is - at leat at the waist - much > > smaller than your real figure, so how can you actually try it > > on when not yet finished? It must be tight laced and there > > must be bones in it, else I cannot imagine a fitting. If > > there are no bones, there will always be wrinkles. And what > > about the stitching? It must be quite strong to not tear when > > laced up... > > >The mock-up is made out of heavy non-stretchy fabric -- cotton drill, >canvas, jean, and you have to use regular stitching, not basting length >stitches. I use a "sew on" set of eyelets (as Jen Thompson describes using >for fitting her 1515 Italian dress - I'd give the web link, but the site >appears to be down so I can't be sure of the url). Jen Thompson's website has a new address: www.festiveattyre.com I just stumbled across this last week. Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 14:19:27 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IJRfE010171 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:19:27 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79IJL74018570 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:19:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IInpc053343 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:18:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IIiSC050698; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:18:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IIcKo050576 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:18:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x50a24758.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.162.71.88]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 5D3638A005B for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 20:18:34 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001601c6bbe0$3d167c30$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002501c6bb15$101c1120$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> <44D993CE.5000809@kabelfoon.nl> Subject: Re: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 20:18:39 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 14:19:24 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44DA2729.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi, I dont have pictures of that dress online anymore, it was years ago i made it. But i remember i pinned the belt at the high waist, to make it stay there.................. I have a costume catalogue from Lisboa where they had a great exhibition about royal dresses of the period, there were many many with this style, all embroidered. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deredere Galbraith" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, August 09, 2006 9:50 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 > Thanks for the response. > I think it is a great style for a wedding dress. > And a removable train makes it even better. > > But the waist is a little higher than normal waist how do you keep the > belt at the right hight? > > Bjarne do you have pictures of the dress you made? > Maby she wants hand embroidery or machine embroidery on her train. > Or I could use applications and hand embroidery... > > Greetings, > Deredere > > > Bjarne og Leif Drews wrote: >> This is a style i made some years ago with a long train, embroidered with >> seaquins. It was made of pink dupioni, because the hairdressers who >> ordered it, couldnt afford more. It is a seperate train attached round >> the waist with a belt closed in the front. >> >> Bjarne >> >> >> >> >> >> Leif og Bjarne Drews >> www.my-drewscostumes.dk >> >> http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 14:26:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IQsc6010351 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:26:54 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k79IQm6x032494 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:26:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IQD0A054239 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:26:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IQA3x057566; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:26:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IQ1Hb057405 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:26:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x50a24758.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.162.71.88]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 36A5EFAC02E for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 20:26:00 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003b01c6bbe1$470937e0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4bd.3aed5700.3209ec92@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Regency robe 1812 Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 20:26:01 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 14:26:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44DA28E8.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi again, As mentioned the museum catalogue i have, most of these dresses are made of silk taffeta, embroidered along the train border wich is rounded at the end, and on the hem of the dress skirts. They are to match the heavily embroidered mens costumes, wich continued to be worn into the 1800 years. Embroideries are silk embroideries. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 3:33 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Regency robe 1812 > > In a message dated 8/8/2006 8:35:05 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > taniampembroke@aol.com writes: > > have been asked to make a wedding dress in this style but I don't know > much > about it. > She send me two small drawings and the dress above was the only one I > could > find in the same style > It looks very french to me. > I can't seem to find more pictures of this style of dress. > I would love to have more pictures to see what types of fabric and > embellishmend was used. > > > > > The book, "Age of Napoleon" has some nice pictures of French court dress. > While most of the trains were velvet, there is one pictured, if memory > serves, > where the train was the same fabric as the dress. > > The train would be separate and, if heavy, it would indeed have straps > over > the shoulders. This dress looks like it is all silk, with embroidery > edging > the train. Perhaps you could find a nice wide embroidered edging that > you > could use instead--shaping it around the train could be a little tricky, > but > not impossible. The ruff around the neck was most like tulle, although > you > could probably also use silk organza or lace. > > There used to be all kinds of wedding dress patterns with detachable > trains, > but they seem to have disappeared. Still, it shouldn't be too hard to > create a train to the dimensions you want. > > Of course, much depends on if the bride wants her dress exactly like that, > or just inspired by it. > > Ann Wass > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 20:24:25 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7A0OPaj020969 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 20:24:25 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7A0OIuU015764 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 20:24:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7A0NXPc098878 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 18:23:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7A0NR1D050465; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 18:23:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m16.mx.aol.com (imo-m16.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.206]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79EkorJ057355 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 08:46:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.bf5.ddfed2 (43932) for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:46:42 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 10:46:42 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] regency robe 1812 To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 20:24:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44DA7CB2.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/9/2006 10:41:49 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, AlbertCat@aol.com writes: But what's wrong with thread loops? or thread bars for the hooks? I hope the train is not THAT heavy. Yes, those would work, too, and "hide" better. I have usually seen those used on gowns with lace trim, where they blend in, but a matching color of thread, right on the waistline seam, should be fairly inconspicuous. I take it this is not going to be one of the long velvet variety that is so heavy it would absolutely need the shoulder straps. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 9 20:25:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7A0PtWO021017 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 20:25:55 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7A0PnNn016039 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 20:25:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7A0PB5c099175 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 9 Aug 2006 18:25:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7A0PAoX051549; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 18:25:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc14.comcast.net ([63.240.77.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k79IIfgg050025 for ; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 12:18:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.101] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc14) with SMTP id <20060809181800014006rc2ke>; Wed, 9 Aug 2006 18:18:00 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Message-Id: <80EAAB6D-D20A-48C0-8822-23B6200E6DF0@comcast.net> From: Lauren Walker Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 14:19:36 -0400 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] India cotton prints X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 09 Aug 2006 20:25:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44DA7D0D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Dear Costumers, I've been in lurk mode for a while -- you know that moment where you realize all your insights and information are only new and wonderful to you? But in the meantime, I've been assembling a Web store to show the India cotton block prints I've been importing. The store is now operational at http://www.timetraveltextiles.com. Most of what I've got is suitable for 18th century -- I began this project in an effort to make more appropriate cotton prints available for 18th-century re-enactors. About a third of the wares resemble medieval India trade fabrics. I've got both yard goods and saris, as well as a few block printed dupattas. I use PayPal for handling payments, but you do not need a PayPal account to buy through the store -- it also allows me to accept credit cards. I hope to continue to improve both the site and the selection of goods. Please visit, and enjoy the fabrics. Thank you for your indulgence. Sincerely, Lauren Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net lauren@timetraveltextiles.com http://www.timetraveltextiles.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 11 19:44:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7BNiltC031321 for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2006 19:44:47 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7BNifwx029237 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 11 Aug 2006 19:44:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7BNi187030380 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 11 Aug 2006 17:44:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7BNhsQ8068745; Fri, 11 Aug 2006 17:43:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52113.mail.yahoo.com (web52113.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.116]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7BJ2o0g048200 for ; Fri, 11 Aug 2006 13:02:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Received: (qmail 72999 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Aug 2006 19:02:43 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=oUaTGwaktuiZJmYZNZKREzH4moM787ZqEI/Eu8cW6qbEElMQAugRyD7PXVKutf7SsTLg2wFdLBkxTHUGxzqItFGwgv6U2lCtqFqjR0J7HdzsJt0EImkya/4/QGLASStQcn5bQq5eETQOPOGzVjhRmxpreZhipNfcPhbVkEOoYAY= ; Message-ID: <20060811190243.72997.qmail@web52113.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [72.57.170.28] by web52113.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Aug 2006 12:02:43 PDT Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 12:02:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Kathy Page To: Historical Costume List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7BJ2o0g048200 Subject: [h-cost] Patterns on Ebay X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 11 Aug 2006 19:44:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44DD1669.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I have finally gotten around to listing my patterns. I have everything except my Past Patterns collections up, which those will go up later this evening. My seller ID is insaneseamstress: http://search.ebay.ca/_W0QQfgtpZ1QQfrppZ25QQsassZinsaneseamstress Hope that link works. I have listed everything with a starting price below current market values - or at least the ones I could find. Kathy Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert(Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. Its never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 12 12:43:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CGhlFG028170 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:43:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7CGhfe8018087 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:43:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CGguG4023831 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:42:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CGgoIV065413; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:42:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CGglsV065332 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:42:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from [10.0.1.3] (c-24-21-156-164.hsd1.or.comcast.net [24.21.156.164]) by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7CGggQ10601 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:42:42 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <55B51CA5-CFFC-4E7F-85F2-11E0CCB44B06@alfalfapress.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed To: Historical Costume From: Althea Turner Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 09:42:39 -0700 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] dream class X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:43:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44DE053D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hello all, I am developing a couple classes for ecampus. I began to wonder what kind of textiles/ apparel classes people want, but can never find. I know what I like, but what would you like to see offered? Althea Turner althea@alfalfapress.com "Ignorant themselves of the forces of nature and wanting to have company in their ignorance, they don't want people to look into anything; they want us to believe like peasants and not ask the reasons behind things." William of Conches, 12th century _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 12 13:53:58 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CHrsDF029204 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 13:53:58 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7CHrlbX028415 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 13:53:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CHr31g032154 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 11:53:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CHr0Y9004660; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 11:53:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web33903.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web33903.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.181]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7CHqv28004578 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 11:52:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wildthangstreasures@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 23707 invoked by uid 60001); 12 Aug 2006 17:52:52 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=EdgJx6vSyZgdAEIgzmZ1brzF8JQOC7TGYKW84IBlJfUv5zU67Xzb+AFqpyyAAPxMLSzjM9WY3j7CaQ/ZkZJWynxnMN0mFhSDcSSj0ur5tJSpxr+nUg+Wae2gfuzBsKEo7fW7l6QTOBjWGxOPIOqbAP6QvUE0C+F38Zu170O4E8E= ; Message-ID: <20060812175252.23705.qmail@web33903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.187.49.72] by web33903.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:52:52 PDT Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:52:52 -0700 (PDT) From: "Voncile W. Dudley" Subject: Re: [h-cost] dream class To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <55B51CA5-CFFC-4E7F-85F2-11E0CCB44B06@alfalfapress.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 13:53:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44DE15AB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi Althea. I would love any class that is offered. We can never stop learning. Lady Von http://www.wildthangstreasures.com Althea Turner wrote: Hello all, I am developing a couple classes for ecampus. I began to wonder what kind of textiles/ apparel classes people want, but can never find. I know what I like, but what would you like to see offered? Althea Turner althea@alfalfapress.com "Ignorant themselves of the forces of nature and wanting to have company in their ignorance, they don't want people to look into anything; they want us to believe like peasants and not ask the reasons behind things." William of Conches, 12th century _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 12 14:50:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CIocD0029706 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 14:50:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7CIoVMo007225 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 14:50:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CInuCJ041184 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:49:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CInsgZ035111; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:49:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc3-s10.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s10.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.210]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CInoOm035042 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:49:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zeartiste@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.229.43]) by bay0-omc3-s10.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 11:49:45 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 11:49:45 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.229.220 by by110fd.bay110.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 18:49:40 GMT X-Originating-IP: [72.70.142.24] X-Originating-Email: [zeartiste@hotmail.com] X-Sender: zeartiste@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <55B51CA5-CFFC-4E7F-85F2-11E0CCB44B06@alfalfapress.com> From: "Becky Rautine" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] dream class Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 14:49:40 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Aug 2006 18:49:45.0338 (UTC) FILETIME=[143D3DA0:01C6BE40] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 14:50:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44DE22F7.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I'd like to learn more on how to adapt a pattern such as tailoring or altering a pattern for every size. Suggestions of what to do when something sags or when something is too tight. Just being told "make it smaller or take a tuck here" may not fully explain what is needed. Step by Step alterations for costuming and period productions. Sincerely, Becky Rautine From: Althea Turner Reply-To: Historical Costume To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] dream class Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 09:42:39 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Received: from www1.indra.com ([209.169.0.7]) by bay0-mc3-f9.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.2444); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 09:46:17 -0700 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1])by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CGhZM7023967(version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK);Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:43:35 -0600 (MDT)(envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1])by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CGgoIX065413;Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:43:06 -0600 (MDT)(envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15])by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7CGglsV065332for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:42:49 -0600 (MDT)(envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from [10.0.1.3] (c-24-21-156-164.hsd1.or.comcast.net [24.21.156.164])by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7CGggQ10601for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 12:42:42 -0400 X-Message-Info: txF49lGdW43+brIjbbiuII7NktxvmdqJ0Pxjlj8Da4c= X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2,clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Return-Path: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Aug 2006 16:46:17.0892 (UTC) FILETIME=[D50EAE40:01C6BE2E] Hello all, I am developing a couple classes for ecampus. I began to wonder what kind of textiles/ apparel classes people want, but can never find. I know what I like, but what would you like to see offered? Althea Turner althea@alfalfapress.com "Ignorant themselves of the forces of nature and wanting to have company in their ignorance, they don't want people to look into anything; they want us to believe like peasants and not ask the reasons behind things." William of Conches, 12th century _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 13 00:37:34 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7D4bTN8004118 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 00:37:33 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7D4bNPe031022 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 00:37:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7D4abHR091085 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:36:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7D4aVGQ012126; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:36:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7D4aRw8012093 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:36:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA32256 for ; Sat, 12 Aug 2006 23:16:00 -0500 Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 23:16:00 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Need feedback on possible lecture appearance X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 00:37:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44DEAC83.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO [Please feel free to forward this to other lists or people who might be interested. Please copy me in if you forward it to a list, so I know where this message travels. Thanks.] As many of you on this list know, I periodically do full-day lecture programs on medieval dress, usually focusing on the 14th and 15th century, directed toward historical costumers and re-enactors. Although I've lived here in St. Louis, Missouri, for the last seven years, I have not yet given a set of public lectures here in my hometown, although I've done some guest lectures at local universities. So: I've been discussing with the planners of CostumeCon 25 the possibility of my presenting such a lecture program in affiliation with that event. CostumeCon is an convention structured rather like an sf con, but focused specifically on costuming: fantasy and sf, theatrical, historical, re-enactment, cosplay, and more. CC25 will be here in St. Louis, March 30 through April 2, 2007. The website is here: http://www.cc25.net/ The con planners are committed to reaching out to a broad range of costumers. It has occurred to some of us that if CC25 sponsors one of my "lecture days" as an ancillary activity to the con, it might attract some historical costumers who haven't yet had contact with the CostumeCon community. That would give CC some broader exposure, and also provide a programming feature that some existing CC members would enjoy. However, the con can't commit the function space and other resources for my appearance unless it's clear that a sufficient number of people would be interested in attending my lectures. (That would include people who decide to spend the day in my lecture room as part of attending the larger convention, and it would also include people who buy a one-day membership just to go to my lectures.) Ideally we would firm this up before the next price break on advance memberships, in case it influences people's plans, but we can't know what the numbers look like till much later than that. So, we thought we'd ask around. I've found that my appearances often draw people from a multi-state area and from a variety of fields (re-enactment, academic, theatrical), so I'd be very grateful if this message gets passed around to appropriate groups (particularly SCA/medieval/theatrical groups in the Midwest), and if people who are interested could give me feedback on the following questions: -- If I gave a lecture program at CostumeCon, would you seriously consider attending? -- If so, would you go just for a single day (my lectures plus any evening con programming on that day), or would you go ahead and sign up for the whole con? (Membership reservations for the four-day convention right now cost $85; the price will go up after Halloween.) -- Would it make a difference in your decision if my lecture series were scheduled at CostumeCon on Friday, March 30, or on Saturday, March 31? (I would ask not to be scheduled on Sunday, as I'd overlap with the historical costume competition, and obviously the con attendees interested in historic costume would have a conflict.) If you'd be doing a day trip, I should note that the fee for the lecture series (including access to rest of the con) would probably be about $25 on Friday. On Saturday, it would be about $50, because there's more programming on Saturday, including the knock-em-dead f/sf costume competition in the evening. If there's enough interest, I'd find out whether we can arrange for a limited-access membership on Saturday for people interested only in my lectures and not the rest of the con. However, the con is a pretty exciting event, and I'd hope that the chance to attend my lectures would offer some people the motivation to attend the con itself, for one day or the whole event. -- Finally, if you think you would come for the lectures (and all or part of the con), would you (or your party) also expect to take a hotel room at the con? I should add that my most likely lecture program would cover four topics: the Gothic fitted dress ("cotehardie"), the Greenland gored dress (the so-called "ten-gore gown"), the sideless surcote, and the 15th century ("Burgundian") V-necked gown. Depending on time, I might be able to add in a fifth lecture on women's heraldic dress. My lectures focus heavily on how to interpret art, documentary evidence, and extant artifacts for clues on how a given style might have been made and worn, and what it would have meant to the people who wore or observed it. I use lots of slides and some reproduction examples, and I discuss construction as an element of the overall topics. Your responses -- send them straight to me, NOT to the list -- will help us figure out whether it's worthwhile to devote function space to my program. Thanks for reading. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 13 12:56:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7DGupeQ027709 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 12:56:55 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7DGuje7016576 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 12:56:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7DGtvhT063528 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 10:55:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7DGtrTs061145; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 10:55:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32702.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32702.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.246]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7DGtngR061039 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 10:55:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 24505 invoked by uid 60001); 13 Aug 2006 16:55:44 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=hoEML3U5pH6VxxWzShaRqYfNHXhr2b00qQrmbK8yQCKONBqISh+PIlSth4aO6J7aCVBsV8w5pQ2YSgeAfY0WdD5fmDrd4iHKAEhX4M7++sNxdajw0RQ6uePK0NRfEBjGMpCf2N4+G3IIUaY2dY1JjinfGXzkoTG9Nif0wdHRamQ= ; Message-ID: <20060813165544.24503.qmail@web32702.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32702.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 09:55:44 PDT Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 09:55:44 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: RE: [h-cost] dream class To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 12:56:48 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44DF59CD.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO How to draft a sleeve pattern that matches the armhole. Draping the body is easy. Figuring out how to make the sleeve so it doesn't pull or bind is a trick I've yet to figure out ( (And why I love tie-in sleeves). MaggiRos --- Becky Rautine wrote: > I'd like to learn more on how to adapt a pattern > such as tailoring or > altering a pattern for every size. Suggestions of > what to do when something > sags or when something is too tight. Just being told > "make it smaller or > take a tuck here" may not fully explain what is > needed. Step by Step > alterations for costuming and period productions. > > Sincerely, > Becky Rautine > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 13 17:11:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7DLBcx0032421 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:11:42 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7DLBWHs014050 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:11:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7DLAkMK088482 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 15:10:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7DLAgJJ095751; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 15:10:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web54713.mail.yahoo.com (web54713.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.49.203]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7DLAdit095692 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 15:10:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from carolscostuming5@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 51070 invoked by uid 60001); 13 Aug 2006 21:10:34 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=T2TfLqxxcPgOA+9sxtwflHl35/HvAVhUkGyXTMu8qG7ncNqBxQ3Q5yevKT0jGXrIXXNaNBx28tHIZ02oRyosBFDiT3nuNuwe3ebJvP1+FgY1zwW9OGroPFgooD+cAJ0gejaXReoZ2d1fEV6bHLnJ6eaYgLutt3khms/anQqF2yI= ; Message-ID: <20060813211034.51068.qmail@web54713.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.107.144.127] by web54713.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 14:10:34 PDT Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 14:10:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Carol Mitchell To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608121800.k7CI0Ds4008510@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 570 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:11:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44DF9584.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO What is ecampus, please? I haven't been able to keep up with the digest very well for health reasons. Thanks Carol h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: Send h-costume mailing list submissions to h-costume@mail.indra.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to h-costume-request@mail.indra.com You can reach the person managing the list at h-costume-owner@mail.indra.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of h-costume digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Patterns on Ebay (Kathy Page) 2. dream class (Althea Turner) 3. Re: dream class (Voncile W. Dudley) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2006 12:02:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Kathy Page Subject: [h-cost] Patterns on Ebay To: Historical Costume List Message-ID: <20060811190243.72997.qmail@web52113.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 I have finally gotten around to listing my patterns. I have everything except my Past Patterns collections up, which those will go up later this evening. My seller ID is insaneseamstress: http://search.ebay.ca/_W0QQfgtpZ1QQfrppZ25QQsassZinsaneseamstress Hope that link works. I have listed everything with a starting price below current market values - or at least the ones I could find. Kathy Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert(Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. Its never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 09:42:39 -0700 From: Althea Turner Subject: [h-cost] dream class To: Historical Costume Message-ID: <55B51CA5-CFFC-4E7F-85F2-11E0CCB44B06@alfalfapress.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Hello all, I am developing a couple classes for ecampus. I began to wonder what kind of textiles/ apparel classes people want, but can never find. I know what I like, but what would you like to see offered? Althea Turner althea@alfalfapress.com "Ignorant themselves of the forces of nature and wanting to have company in their ignorance, they don't want people to look into anything; they want us to believe like peasants and not ask the reasons behind things." William of Conches, 12th century ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2006 10:52:52 -0700 (PDT) From: "Voncile W. Dudley" Subject: Re: [h-cost] dream class To: Historical Costume Message-ID: <20060812175252.23705.qmail@web33903.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hi Althea. I would love any class that is offered. We can never stop learning. Lady Von http://www.wildthangstreasures.com Althea Turner wrote: Hello all, I am developing a couple classes for ecampus. I began to wonder what kind of textiles/ apparel classes people want, but can never find. I know what I like, but what would you like to see offered? Althea Turner althea@alfalfapress.com "Ignorant themselves of the forces of nature and wanting to have company in their ignorance, they don't want people to look into anything; they want us to believe like peasants and not ask the reasons behind things." William of Conches, 12th century _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume End of h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 570 ***************************************** Carol Mitchell listowner Costumemidwest www.yahoogroups.com/group/costumemidwest --------------------------------- Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 13 20:35:41 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E0Zfg5001945 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:35:41 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7E0ZYbE007926 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:35:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E0YfwC008526 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:34:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E0YZg3093915; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:34:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m25.mx.aol.com (imo-m25.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.6]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E0YV2K093844 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:34:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-m25.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.be7.28b9f13 (32913) for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:34:23 -0400 (EDT) From: TeaRoseS@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:34:22 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Period for Heidi X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:35:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44DFC556.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi all! Does anyone know the decade that the Heidi story is supposed to be set in? I'm especially interested in the orange dress here: _http://tinyurl.com/qfsak_ (http://tinyurl.com/qfsak) Is there a name for this type of little-girl dress? Is the petticoat underneath probably just a skirt, or would it be a whole dress? The reason I'm asking is that I'm making a doll and this is just the kind of dress I had pictured for her. I will be making the rest of her family later and I suppose I should think about making them all match. :) Thanks! Tea Rose _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 13 20:55:08 2006 Return-Path: Received: from minos.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E0t8cd002135 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:55:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by minos.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7E0t16l024684 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:55:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E0sR5r011673 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:54:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E0sOpf005238; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:54:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qb-out-0506.google.com (qb-out-0506.google.com [72.14.204.226]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E0sMOB005228 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 18:54:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from thirling@gmail.com) Received: by qb-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id z8so720330qbc for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:54:22 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=TRoPC/rQ2QwlcFMMwZdEJyx/S7SIDb0YxEh4ObNBfD7p1G4K0aKo5HPM8iCGOBKxft8PnXmftQh634uIGhRvOS4KxK+kOE5MzE1W2aU14Jv9f2hcjQblZNz1bZm3iqDubJLYsGhDPhlKfyJvwx91HTsl/bexMB3ZjYgHrk0rKxU= Received: by 10.78.147.3 with SMTP id u3mr3055532hud; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:54:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.78.81.16 with HTTP; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 17:54:21 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <6c845a440608131754s60ad135di80f471365964c34d@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:54:21 -0500 From: "Terri Hirling" To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Men' Flemish Garb X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (minos.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:55:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at minos with ID 44DFC9E5.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Greetings to the list from a lurker. My husband is in the process of making mid-16th century Flemish garb and has the following questions he's asked me to post to the list. 1) In Breughel "The Peasant's Wedding," ( http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/bruegel/wedding.jpg) the shirt tails of the fellows in the red doublets are out and the point holes are empty (difficult to see in the above link). Still the laces can be seen hanging below the shirt. Did the shirt also have point holes to which the tights were fastened? 2) Are sleeve seams under the arm? That's the way they appear to me. Or down the back? 3) Was the usual peasant's jerkin cut short? If longer, how much longer (from the waist)? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Regards, Baroness Isabeau _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 13 21:12:05 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E1C490002272 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:12:04 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7E1Bw5Q008448 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:12:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E1BIQL013487 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:11:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E1BFSl015232; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:11:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cantva.canterbury.ac.nz (cantva.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.2.27]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E1BAlm015110 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:11:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladyadele@paradise.net.nz) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.it.canterbury.ac.nz by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) id <01M5ZEV3W64W9C0ZBD@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 13:10:40 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Received: from [132.181.4.133] (rcmt-cad45.it.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.4.133]) by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) with ESMTP id <01M5ZEVGEHWY9I9FWY@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 13:10:56 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 13:10:44 +1200 From: Adele de Maisieres Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men' Flemish Garb In-reply-to: <6c845a440608131754s60ad135di80f471365964c34d@mail.gmail.com> To: Historical Costume Message-id: <44DFCD94.3000702@paradise.net.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) References: <6c845a440608131754s60ad135di80f471365964c34d@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:12:02 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44DFCDDE.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Terri Hirling wrote: > 1) In Breughel "The Peasant's Wedding," ( > http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/bruegel/wedding.jpg) the shirt > tails of > the fellows in the red doublets are out and the point holes are empty > (difficult to see in the above link). Still the laces can be seen > hanging > below the shirt. Did the shirt also have point holes to which the > tights > were fastened? I don't believe so. I think they've probably just got few/none of the laces done up-- rather like this fellow http://www.wga.hu/art/b/bruegel/pieter_e/painting/cockayne.jpg > > 2) Are sleeve seams under the arm? That's the way they appear to me. Or > down the back? Down the back, as far as I can tell. This is the construction method I'm most familiar with in 16th-century clothing, and you can see a hint of it on the man in blue in the foreground, and on the bagpiper in tan. > > 3) Was the usual peasant's jerkin cut short? If longer, how much longer > (from the waist)? Don't know. The men in Breughel that I can think of have doublets/jackets but no jerkins. -- Adele de Maisieres ----------------------------- Habeo metrum - musicamque, hominem meam. Expectat alium quid? -Georgeus Gershwinus ----------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 13 22:00:15 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E20E8E002575 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 22:00:15 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7E206gE003086 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 22:00:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E1xMAV017285 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:59:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E1xHAH039281; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:59:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E1xD58039255 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:59:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GCRj3-0003EF-5D; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:58:45 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:58:45 -0400 Message-ID: <20060813215845.35s1vy3oe8wk4oos@www.goldsword.com> Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 21:58:45 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: SCA garb list , Historical Costume MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Meridies-CostumeGuild Subject: [h-cost] Humor -- natural fibers X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 22:00:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44DFD926.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Sorry for the cross-post, but this was just too funny! http://www.foxtrot.com/ If you're looking at this on a day other than Sunday, August 13, 2006 -- you want to see the comic for that particular day. susan/ jerusha ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 13 22:09:20 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E29Kwl002619 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 22:09:20 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7E29Ewv005254 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 22:09:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E28kke018147 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:08:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E28iL4043693; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:08:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm29.prodigy.net (ylpvm29-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.60]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E28fBA043662 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:08:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm29.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7E27w6q017769 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 22:08:08 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060813185843.025c5cc8@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2006 19:04:32 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 22:09:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44DFDB4A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >Hi all! Does anyone know the decade that the Heidi story is supposed to be >set in? The girl in the wheelchair looks vaguely like mid-1880s. In another one of those 39 images, it looks like there's an adult woman wearing a mid-1880s dress and hat. In no other image is the year, or even the decade, or even the country, apparent. > I'm especially interested in the orange dress here: >_http://tinyurl.com/qfsak_ (http://tinyurl.com/qfsak) > >Is there a name for this type of little-girl dress? Is the petticoat >underneath probably just a skirt, or would it be a whole dress? The reason >I'm >asking is that I'm making a doll and this is just the kind of dress I >had pictured >for her. I will be making the rest of her family later and I suppose I >should think about making them all match. :) The orange dress looks "old-timey" to me. That is to say "Hollywood historical". I've never seen any photos of any little girl wearing a dress with a high waist like your orange one. I've only seen Napoleonic fashion plates of such things, and I don't believe that period for this film. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 01:54:56 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E5stNT005481 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:54:56 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7E5sntL009792 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:54:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E5s7Ij037273 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 13 Aug 2006 23:54:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E5s2f5046389; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 23:54:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep01.xtra.co.nz (fep01.xtra.co.nz [210.54.141.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E5rvgQ046329 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2006 23:54:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from thebruce@ihug.co.nz) Received: from [10.1.1.3] (really [219.89.170.15]) by fep01.xtra.co.nz with ESMTP id <20060814055346.MTIM9780.fep01.xtra.co.nz@[10.1.1.3]> for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:53:46 +1200 Received: from 127.0.0.1 (AVG SMTP 7.1.405 [268.10.9/417]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:53:46 +1200 Message-ID: <002301c6bf66$01d5dc40$0301010a@michaela> From: "michaela" To: "Historical Costume" References: <6c845a440608131754s60ad135di80f471365964c34d@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men' Flemish Garb Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:53:42 +1200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:54:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E01029.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > 2) Are sleeve seams under the arm? That's the way they appear to me. Or > down the back? It's a bit hard to say for sure. If you look at the peasants by Hans Sebald Beham of the similar timeframe, most almost certainly have seams going up under the arm, then in some other woodcuts of a similar subject also by Beham show a much earlier cut in the shoulders and seams down the back of the arm. http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/MWEBimages/P_d02_mm/full/61_41_3.jpg seam up the back of the arm. http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/MWEBimages/P_d02_mm/full/61_41_10.jpg http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/MWEBimages/P_d02_mm/full/61_41_7.jpg seams most likely underneath. http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/MWEBimages/P_d02_mm/full/61_41_11.jpg Figure second from right, the seam is under the arm. These are German though show many similarities. > Any help would be greatly appreciated. Just a lead on some further images: http://www.bildindex.de/bilder/mi04530g09a.jpg It'sa bit later but looks like the seam goes up the back. http://www.bildindex.de/bilder/mi00302c04a.jpg Odd shoulder piecing, but seams likely under the arm or only slightly rotated to the back (which seems to work well for German garb as well rather than stright under the arm or right up the back of the arm. http://www.bildindex.de/bilder/fmc650778a.jpg The paint possibly shows an indication of a back seam on both figures, but that's up to interpretation. http://www.bildindex.de/bilder/mi04530g08a.jpg Farmers? I think the figure on the left is female. http://www.bildindex.de/bilder/mi03974g09a.jpg Especially compared to this figure of a farmer's(?) wife. http://www.bildindex.de/bilder/mi03974g08a.jpg Woodcutters. I'm sure I've seen another costume study by Bruegel, but I simply can't find it. Michaela de Bruce http://glittersweet.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.9/417 - Release Date: 11/08/2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 03:23:12 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E7N7GA000598 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 03:23:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7E7N1Rv011958 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 03:23:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E7MIR7044726 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:22:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E7MF9M086407; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:22:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mail.socket.net [216.106.88.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7E7M9Yn086359 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 01:22:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 6ACC2368C8 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 02:22:08 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 02:22:10 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 In-Reply-To: <80EAAB6D-D20A-48C0-8822-23B6200E6DF0@comcast.net> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] late 1300s "French" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 03:23:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E024D5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I've been trying to find pictures online of garments worn in "France" during the late 1300s. early 1400s are acceptable. Anyone have a url for a good site? De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 08:07:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EC7sXs017281 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:07:54 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EC7lVO030137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:07:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EC757n068428 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 06:07:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EC6uxZ020933; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 06:06:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from staff.washjeff.edu (staff.washjeff.edu [209.131.83.40]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EC6rQ3020854 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 06:06:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from rmitchell@washjeff.edu) Received: from rmitchellras [209.131.83.40] by staff.washjeff.edu with ESMTP (SMTPD-8.21) id A75501CC; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:06:45 -0400 Received: from 209.131.80.159 ([209.131.80.159] helo=rmitchellras) by ASSP-nospam; 14 Aug 2006 08:06:32 -0400 Message-ID: <001701c6bf9a$9efa2420$9f5083d1@rmitchellras> From: "Lloyd Mitchell" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20060813185843.025c5cc8@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:10:20 -0400 Organization: Washington & Jefferson College MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:07:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E06793.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The girls' dresses look very "Kate Greenway" to me. I am not sure when this style was vogue. The Kate Greenway paperdoll book has a lot of illustrations of those designs. Kathleen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 10:04 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi > > >Hi all! Does anyone know the decade that the Heidi story is supposed to be > >set in? > > The girl in the wheelchair looks vaguely like mid-1880s. In another one of > those 39 images, it looks like there's an adult woman wearing a mid-1880s > dress and hat. In no other image is the year, or even the decade, or even > the country, apparent. > > > I'm especially interested in the orange dress here: > >_http://tinyurl.com/qfsak_ (http://tinyurl.com/qfsak) > > > >Is there a name for this type of little-girl dress? Is the petticoat > >underneath probably just a skirt, or would it be a whole dress? The reason > >I'm > >asking is that I'm making a doll and this is just the kind of dress I > >had pictured > >for her. I will be making the rest of her family later and I suppose I > >should think about making them all match. :) > > The orange dress looks "old-timey" to me. That is to say "Hollywood > historical". I've never seen any photos of any little girl wearing a dress > with a high waist like your orange one. I've only seen Napoleonic fashion > plates of such things, and I don't believe that period for this film. > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > ///\\\\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > )(( <> ))( > * ) ( * > /----\ /---\ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 09:52:10 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EDq5U8020088 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:52:09 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EDpxKh023598 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:52:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EDp6qN077874 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:51:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EDp2P7093837; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:51:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pony.uvm.edu (pony.uvm.edu [132.198.101.202]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EDovaL093770 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:51:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from hope.greenberg@uvm.edu) Received: from [132.198.104.191] (ip104191.uvm.edu [132.198.104.191]) (authenticated bits=0) by pony.uvm.edu (8.13.7/8.13.5) with ESMTP id k7EDouIu024945 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:50:56 -0400 Message-ID: <44E07FBF.30209@uvm.edu> Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:50:55 -0400 From: Hope Greenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi References: <4.3.1.2.20060813185843.025c5cc8@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20060813185843.025c5cc8@mail.frys.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:52:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E07FFF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > >> Hi all! Does anyone know the decade that the Heidi story is supposed >> to be >> set in? Published in 1880 with the first edition in English published in 1884, the visual images we've come to associate with Heidi seem mostly to be based on the illustrations done a bit later by Alice Carsey in 1916 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300014656445&ssPageName=MERCOSI_VI_ROSI_PR4_PCN_BIX_Stores&refitem=330013878471&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&refwidgettype=osi_widget#ebayphotohosting) and by Jessie Wilcox Smith in 1922. http://www.bpib.com/illustrat/jwsmith.htm and http://www.art.com/asp/display-asp/_/ID--16112/Heidi.asp?ui=2B9819F00CA546B8B14DDD908FE040ED). There was also a very popular edition done in the 30s, and the Shirley Temple movie in 1937. - Hope _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 10:06:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EE665F020398 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:06:06 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EE60m3012984 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:06:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EE5Tfx079359 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:05:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EE5SIM006456; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:05:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm01.prodigy.net (ylpvm01-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EE5F49006268 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:05:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm01.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7EE4Yl0002892 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:04:36 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060814070053.0271e068@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:05:08 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi In-Reply-To: <001701c6bf9a$9efa2420$9f5083d1@rmitchellras> References: <4.3.1.2.20060813185843.025c5cc8@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:06:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E08348.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >The girls' dresses look very "Kate Greenway" to me. I am not sure when this >style was vogue. The Kate Greenway paperdoll book has a lot of >illustrations of those designs. Kate Greenaway illustrations reflect what the Aesthetics were wearing in the late-1870s-early-1880s. It's not mainstream. The woman was a commercial illustrator, not a fashion historian. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 11:08:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EF8ctW022450 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:08:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EF8V2s002950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:08:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EF7hNP086747 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:07:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EF7U1p058197; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:07:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.28]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EF7PQ6058120 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:07:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.146.222.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.146.222]) by pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GCe2G-00053D-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:07:24 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <001701c6bf9a$9efa2420$9f5083d1@rmitchellras> References: <4.3.1.2.20060813185843.025c5cc8@mail.frys.com> <001701c6bf9a$9efa2420$9f5083d1@rmitchellras> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:10:09 -0400 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:08:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E091EF.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO That dress seems to me to smack of Little House on the Prairie. In my own mind, Heidi wears dirndls--maybe my childhood Heidi book dressed Heidi that way? --R.A. Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer On Aug 14, 2006, at 8:10 AM, Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > The girls' dresses look very "Kate Greenway" to me. I am not sure > when this > style was vogue. The Kate Greenway paperdoll book has a lot of > illustrations of those designs. > > Kathleen > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 10:04 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi > > >> >>> Hi all! Does anyone know the decade that the Heidi story is supposed >>> to > be >>> set in? >> >> The girl in the wheelchair looks vaguely like mid-1880s. In another >> one > of >> those 39 images, it looks like there's an adult woman wearing a >> mid-1880s >> dress and hat. In no other image is the year, or even the decade, or >> even >> the country, apparent. >> >>> I'm especially interested in the orange dress here: >>> _http://tinyurl.com/qfsak_ (http://tinyurl.com/qfsak) >>> >>> Is there a name for this type of little-girl dress? Is the petticoat >>> underneath probably just a skirt, or would it be a whole dress? The > reason >>> I'm >>> asking is that I'm making a doll and this is just the kind of dress I >>> had pictured >>> for her. I will be making the rest of her family later and I suppose >>> I >>> should think about making them all match. :) >> >> The orange dress looks "old-timey" to me. That is to say "Hollywood >> historical". I've never seen any photos of any little girl wearing a > dress >> with a high waist like your orange one. I've only seen Napoleonic >> fashion >> plates of such things, and I don't believe that period for this film. >> >> CarolynKayta Barrows >> dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian >> www.FunStuft.com >> >> ///\\\\\ >> ////-@@\\\ >> (((( 7 ))) >> )(( <> ))( >> * ) ( * >> /----\ /---\ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 12:12:17 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGCGHv024806 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:12:17 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EGCAD7005418 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:12:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGAwa0097797 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:10:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGAsAo018636; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:10:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGAoF3018581 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:10:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from CynthiaAbel@creighton.edu) Received: from exbe01.blue.jays.creighton.edu (exbe01.creighton.edu [147.134.2.111]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_29774)/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA04570 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:10:49 -0500 (CDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Period for Heidi Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:10:48 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Period for Heidi Thread-Index: Aca/s6Vi4wJUJ4FMSYm8eLaw20GG6AABaMzQ From: "Abel, Cynthia" To: "Historical Costume" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7EGAoF3018581 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:12:14 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E0A0DA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Kate Greenaway illustrations of children were popular from the early 1880's-1900. It has been some 40 years since I read "Heidi" at age 9 or 10 and I don't recall either the original publication date or if Johanna Spiyi(sp/)the author set it in the years she was writing it or in a more distant era. Check the copyright page of the book; it may give the original copyright and/or publication date. Cindy Abel -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Ruth Anne Baumgartner Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 10:10 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi That dress seems to me to smack of Little House on the Prairie. In my own mind, Heidi wears dirndls--maybe my childhood Heidi book dressed Heidi that way? --R.A. Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer On Aug 14, 2006, at 8:10 AM, Lloyd Mitchell wrote: > The girls' dresses look very "Kate Greenway" to me. I am not sure > when this style was vogue. The Kate Greenway paperdoll book has a lot > of illustrations of those designs. > > Kathleen > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 10:04 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi > > >> >>> Hi all! Does anyone know the decade that the Heidi story is supposed >>> to > be >>> set in? >> >> The girl in the wheelchair looks vaguely like mid-1880s. In another >> one > of >> those 39 images, it looks like there's an adult woman wearing a >> mid-1880s dress and hat. In no other image is the year, or even the >> decade, or even the country, apparent. >> >>> I'm especially interested in the orange dress here: >>> _http://tinyurl.com/qfsak_ (http://tinyurl.com/qfsak) >>> >>> Is there a name for this type of little-girl dress? Is the petticoat >>> underneath probably just a skirt, or would it be a whole dress? The > reason >>> I'm >>> asking is that I'm making a doll and this is just the kind of dress >>> I had pictured for her. I will be making the rest of her family >>> later and I suppose I should think about making them all match. :) >> >> The orange dress looks "old-timey" to me. That is to say "Hollywood >> historical". I've never seen any photos of any little girl wearing a > dress >> with a high waist like your orange one. I've only seen Napoleonic >> fashion plates of such things, and I don't believe that period for >> this film. >> >> CarolynKayta Barrows >> dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian >> www.FunStuft.com >> >> ///\\\\\ >> ////-@@\\\ >> (((( 7 ))) >> )(( <> ))( >> * ) ( * >> /----\ /---\ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> h-costume mailing list >> h-costume@mail.indra.com >> http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume >> > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 12:34:26 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGYPmE025447 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:34:25 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EGYJYm011353 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:34:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGXRmh000793 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:33:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGXOpJ039028; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:33:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGXLo1038974 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:33:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GCfNF-0004jB-Kw; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:33:09 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:33:09 -0400 Message-ID: <20060814123309.f7y02gh40gw8kogk@www.goldsword.com> Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:33:09 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men' Flemish Garb References: <6c845a440608131754s60ad135di80f471365964c34d@mail.gmail.com> <002301c6bf66$01d5dc40$0301010a@michaela> In-Reply-To: <002301c6bf66$01d5dc40$0301010a@michaela> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:34:23 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E0A60B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting michaela : >> 2) Are sleeve seams under the arm? That's the way they appear to me. Or >> down the back? > > It's a bit hard to say for sure. If you look at the peasants by Hans Sebald > Beham of the similar timeframe, most almost certainly have seams going up > under the arm, then in some other woodcuts of a similar subject also by > Beham show a much earlier cut in the shoulders and seams down the back of > the arm. > http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/MWEBimages/P_d02_mm/full/61_41_3.jpg > seam up the back of the arm. Cool pictures. I assume that these are from the same "work." Do you have a URL for that? I tried backing through the image URL but it didn't work, and I don't have a clue what keywords to search for! Thanks, susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 12:55:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGtsBj025802 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:55:54 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EGtm0i017912 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:55:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGtJpL003745 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:55:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGtGOq059280; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:55:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.189]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EGtB4J059209 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 10:55:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from thirling@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id n28so9524nfc for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:55:09 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=fEUsiv2fCoNeE5Gsj5A1037njJD9ffenCdf9WNEkPv3V4lbmgyHwMZfY0JBcbMvDHM1QPkcaG21Vp5r39QeNA9WmHj7FGzFRd8WhQLjVntpQdf6m04A9t5W21wwbZMOfOqGnZBjgBqGCu+dryXOf6IZF3DXF+T/LjMPe71maT0c= Received: by 10.78.160.2 with SMTP id i2mr3324805hue; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:55:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.78.81.16 with HTTP; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:55:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <6c845a440608140955h639c3de2id8014349b8df7e9c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:55:09 -0500 From: "Terri Hirling" To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Re: Men's Flemish Garb X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:55:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E0AB14.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thanks, Michaela and Adele for your input. I'll pass it on to him. Isabeau _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 14:09:53 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EI9mb2026717 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:09:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EI9gF4013809 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:09:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EI3UDn014354 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:03:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EI3MnL022985; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:03:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc3-s26.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s26.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.226]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EI37uP022753 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:03:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wickedfrau@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([64.4.38.47]) by bay0-omc3-s26.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:03:01 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:03:01 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 64.4.38.200 by by116fd.bay116.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:03:00 GMT X-Originating-IP: [70.56.182.65] X-Originating-Email: [wickedfrau@msn.com] X-Sender: wickedfrau@msn.com From: "Saragrace Knauf" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:03:00 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Aug 2006 18:03:01.0527 (UTC) FILETIME=[E1DD2270:01C6BFCB] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] In NY City August 25th - 27th? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:09:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E0BC66.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Anyone from the list going to be in NY City from the 25th through the 27th? I will be going to the various museums, shopping in the fabric district etc if anyone is interested! Thanks, Sg _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 14:42:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EIgcYm027666 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:42:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EIgTgx031765 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:42:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EIfSoA020280 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:41:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EIfOqM058574; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:41:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm01.prodigy.net (ylpvm01-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EIfIZ7058491 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:41:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm01.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7EIeQC3019657 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:40:35 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060814110348.025cad38@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 11:07:45 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi In-Reply-To: References: <001701c6bf9a$9efa2420$9f5083d1@rmitchellras> <4.3.1.2.20060813185843.025c5cc8@mail.frys.com> <001701c6bf9a$9efa2420$9f5083d1@rmitchellras> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:42:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E0C415.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >That dress seems to me to smack of Little House on the Prairie. In my own >mind, Heidi wears dirndls--maybe my childhood Heidi book dressed Heidi >that way? You're right. Austrian, German, and Swiss peasants could wear dresses that look like dirndls. Folkwear (folkwear.com) has a pattern (#123) so you can see what they look like. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 14:52:27 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EIqR4D027914 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:52:27 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EIqLR4003902 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:52:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EIpUtn021507 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:51:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EIpTc1067024; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:51:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m16.mx.aol.com (imo-m16.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.206]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EIpOrk066843 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 12:51:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.54d.5cc222d (39330) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:51:08 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <54d.5cc222d.32122019@aol.com> Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:51:05 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Period for Heidi To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 14:52:24 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E0C665.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/14/2006 2:42:10 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: That dress seems to me to smack of Little House on the Prairie. In my own >mind, Heidi wears dirndls--maybe my childhood Heidi book dressed Heidi >that way? Perhaps the designer feared making it look like Busch Gardens...y'know that European folk dress nether-world look. So instead the designer opted for the general 19th century child nether-world of "Little House". Of course both these nether-worlds derive from actual clothing. Naturally, for me, the challenge is to make things look REAL, without alienating or confusing young viewers expectations... too much. But using startling choices that are correct is a great thing. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 17:17:29 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ELHOfk029876 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:17:29 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7ELHIAT005861 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:17:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ELGSNM039720 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:16:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ELGNPu089686; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:16:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ELGISx089532 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:16:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.320.91484b3 (45783) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:15:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from FWM-M45 (fwm-m45.webmail.aol.com [64.12.193.247]) by ciaaol-m03.mx.aol.com (v111.7) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLM035-b2d744e0e8012b7; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:15:45 -0400 Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:15:38 -0400 Message-Id: <8C88DFDED00EBAC-8B4-6812@FWM-M45.sysops.aol.com> From: tearoses@aol.com References: <200608141800.k7EI0YKW020646@net.indra.com> Received: from 68.143.196.38 by FWM-M45.sysops.aol.com (64.12.193.247) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:15:38 -0400 X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI X-MB-Message-Type: User In-Reply-To: <200608141800.k7EI0YKW020646@net.indra.com> X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 19144 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com X-AOL-IP: 64.12.193.247 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Men' Flemish Garb X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:17:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E0E85E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Pyotr's Men's Flemish Peasant diary: http://tinyurl.com/gqapm Some pictures I scanned from my super-cool Brueghel book: http://tinyurl.com/gsajq Hope this helps! Tea Rose ________________________________________________________________________ Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand. Always Free. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 17:19:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ELJms6029896 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:19:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7ELJfuH011705 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:19:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ELIpEI039940 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:18:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ELIodB091677; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:18:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mail.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ELIkwi091560 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:18:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c10.17478bd (45782) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:18:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from FWM-M45 (fwm-m45.webmail.aol.com [64.12.193.247]) by ciaaol-m02.mx.aol.com (v111.7) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLM025-b2d644e0e8aae7; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:18:34 -0400 Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:18:34 -0400 Message-Id: <8C88DFE55E837AC-8B4-6842@FWM-M45.sysops.aol.com> From: tearoses@aol.com References: <200608141611.k7EGAsZC018643@net.indra.com> Received: from 68.143.196.38 by FWM-M45.sysops.aol.com (64.12.193.247) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:18:34 -0400 X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI X-MB-Message-Type: User In-Reply-To: <200608141611.k7EGAsZC018643@net.indra.com> X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 19144 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com X-AOL-IP: 64.12.193.247 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Period for Heidi X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:19:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E0E8ED.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thanks for the input, guys. I'm making a fantasy character, so Hollywood Historical is close enough. But I thought little girls sometimes wore high-waisted gowns when they weren't in style for adults? Tea Rose ________________________________________________________________________ Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand. Always Free. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 18:56:23 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EMuJ4v030706 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:56:23 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EMuD3t017468 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:56:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EMsgZT053423 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 16:54:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EMsYAN071275; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 16:54:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m24.mx.aol.com (imo-m24.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EMsQL0070997 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 16:54:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.318.89eae68 (14467) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:54:09 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <318.89eae68.32125911@aol.com> Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:54:09 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Period for Heidi To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:56:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E0FF8D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/14/2006 5:19:18 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, tearoses@aol.com writes: But I thought little girls sometimes wore high-waisted gowns when they weren't in style for adults? ****************** It often appears that way because of child proportions. And if the skirt is attached at the natural waist [even in adults] it can look high. Also, children tend to grow up more than out so a dress in January that had a skirt at the child's waist might have the skirt a little higher than the waist by the next November. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 19:06:07 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EN67Im030758 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:06:07 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7EN61ab005797 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:06:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EN5O1T055476 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:05:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EN5LxC079740; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:05:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s7.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s7.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.143]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7EN5HcS079634 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:05:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladycatalina@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.224.18]) by bay0-omc2-s7.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 16:05:11 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 16:05:11 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.224.200 by by105fd.bay105.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 23:05:08 GMT X-Originating-IP: [4.225.184.122] X-Originating-Email: [ladycatalina@hotmail.com] X-Sender: ladycatalina@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <200608131800.k7DI03w5093342@net.indra.com> From: "Catalina Elvira Osorio Lopez de Xerez" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 01:05:08 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Aug 2006 23:05:11.0339 (UTC) FILETIME=[1812E7B0:01C6BFF6] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: redrafting patterns to fit. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:06:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E101D9.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO If there is a way to alter something to fit without having the body around for fittings, I haven't found it. If you take all the measurements directly from the body you can flatten these onto into a two-dimensional outline. I usually use the back of old wrapping paper to draw these out. Then you can overlay your pattern pieces and see where you need to add or subtract a little. Caution: if you are making something to be worn over a corset, you need to take measurements while the corset is being worn. I'm sure that's pretty obvious to you already. Catalina nunca sin mi vino > >--- Becky Rautine wrote: > > > I'd like to learn more on how to adapt a pattern > > such as tailoring or > > altering a pattern for every size. Suggestions of > > what to do when something > > sags or when something is too tight. Just being told > > "make it smaller or > > take a tuck here" may not fully explain what is > > needed. Step by Step > > alterations for costuming and period productions. > > > > Sincerely, > > Becky Rautine > > > > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 19:11:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENBnIr030799 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:11:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7ENBhb5007419 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:11:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENAomd056043 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:10:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENAniY083295; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:10:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d22.mx.aol.com (imo-d22.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.208]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENAkL7083219 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:10:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-d22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.be4.281e7a5 (14467) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:10:36 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:10:36 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: redrafting patterns to fit. To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:11:47 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E1032F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/14/2006 7:06:17 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, ladycatalina@hotmail.com writes: If there is a way to alter something to fit without having the body around for fittings, I haven't found it. Really. A pattern is just a pattern. Even an altered mockup that fits perfectly, when made of some different fabric will need fitting sometimes. Fitting is just a fact. That's why I don't understand all this angst over the pattern fitting. The pattern is for cutting. The garment is for fitting. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 19:23:30 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENNU0d030848 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:23:30 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7ENNOfo009721 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:23:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENMdex057052 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:22:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENMbmD091042; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:22:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep03.xtra.co.nz (fep03.xtra.co.nz [210.54.141.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENMU9R090897 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:22:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from thebruce@ihug.co.nz) Received: from [10.1.1.3] (really [219.89.170.15]) by fep03.xtra.co.nz with ESMTP id <20060814232218.GWIN5275.fep03.xtra.co.nz@[10.1.1.3]> for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:22:18 +1200 Received: from 127.0.0.1 (AVG SMTP 7.1.405 [268.10.10/418]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:22:15 +1200 Message-ID: <005e01c6bff8$7aca9810$0301010a@michaela> From: "michaela" To: "Historical Costume" References: <6c845a440608131754s60ad135di80f471365964c34d@mail.gmail.com><002301c6bf66$01d5dc40$0301010a@michaela> <20060814123309.f7y02gh40gw8kogk@www.goldsword.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men' Flemish Garb Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:22:13 +1200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:23:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E105EC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > > http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/MWEBimages/P_d02_mm/full/61_41_3.jpg > Cool pictures. I assume that these are from the same "work." Do you > have a URL for that? I tried backing through the image URL but it > didn't work, and I don't have a clue what keywords to search for! Unfortunately LACMA has super long URLs and those tinyurl things only last for so long;) I was going to write a how to to get to all the information pages but I figured if anyone was curious they would ask;) http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/ Then click "search" then type in Beham (or Beham peasant should get those specific woodcuts.) Most of the images were from a series of the 12 months, but a few are from other works. Getting to all the bildindex Bruegel images is as easy but the site is in German and can be confusing. Though http://www.artcyclopedia.com is really good for finding the individual galleries for each Bruegel who painted. Michaela de Bruce http://glittersweet.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.10/418 - Release Date: 14/08/2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 19:36:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENacrQ030933 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:36:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7ENaWLm025700 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:36:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENZdfH058291 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:35:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENZbbg099434; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:35:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ENZYw2099409 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:35:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GClxv-00034k-R5; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 18:35:27 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:35:27 -0400 Message-ID: <20060814193527.65i4lmb0gw0wok0k@www.goldsword.com> Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:35:27 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Men' Flemish Garb References: <6c845a440608131754s60ad135di80f471365964c34d@mail.gmail.com><002301c6bf66$01d5dc40$0301010a@michaela> <20060814123309.f7y02gh40gw8kogk@www.goldsword.com> <005e01c6bff8$7aca9810$0301010a@michaela> In-Reply-To: <005e01c6bff8$7aca9810$0301010a@michaela> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 19:36:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E10900.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting michaela : >> > http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/MWEBimages/P_d02_mm/full/61_41_3.jpg > >> Cool pictures. I assume that these are from the same "work." Do you >> have a URL for that? I tried backing through the image URL but it >> didn't work, and I don't have a clue what keywords to search for! > > Unfortunately LACMA has super long URLs and those tinyurl things only last > for so long;) I was going to write a how to to get to all the information > pages but I figured if anyone was curious they would ask;) > > http://collectionsonline.lacma.org/ > Then click "search" then type in Beham (or Beham peasant should get those > specific woodcuts.) Thanks! That's exactly what I wanted to know! susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 14 23:32:27 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F3WQPc002554 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 23:32:27 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7F3WJOh000895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 23:32:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F3V9Mc082017 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 21:31:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F3V5hB027291; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 21:31:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F3V09t027207 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 21:31:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA13539 for ; Mon, 14 Aug 2006 22:10:39 -0500 Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 22:10:38 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Some old linen X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 14 Aug 2006 23:32:24 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E14043.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I'm clearing things out, and came across an old white linen tablecloth and four napkins. All have some sort of floral damask pattern (napkins are two each of two patterns). Very worn, frayed at some edges, a number of spots and stains. I have no use for them, and will send them to the Goodwill unless they can be useful to someone on this list who does things with old linen bits. Yours for the cost of a mailing envelope and postage. E-mail privately, not to the list. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 03:37:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F7bAc8003259 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:37:10 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7F7b3Tv012305 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:37:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F7a1Kp001189 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 01:36:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F7Zqnx034693; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 01:35:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32114.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32114.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.128]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7F7Zmn1034575 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 01:35:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sismith42@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 43008 invoked by uid 60001); 15 Aug 2006 07:35:43 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=eOMi4K531a5u8LF+oyfbhUMpZtscgXzpoMuuXphWuj7O797oOwFKl7mz0b6jmMfY2Tye5Zcfcex5EpoLULC7z9tfotSIdz/pYQEM5SB7tQeqJ74TkzB2l/oBAVOD3lgFZhwTKPGY3XZmjoRU5WybmNgw9Jtl3yoAWM3XiXz8bts= ; Message-ID: <20060815073543.43006.qmail@web32114.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [82.10.33.18] by web32114.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 00:35:43 PDT Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 00:35:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Stephanie Smith To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608141611.k7EGAsZC018643@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:37:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E1799F.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO someone wrote: > >The girls' dresses look very "Kate Greenway" to me. > I am not sure when this style was vogue. The Kate Greenway paperdoll book has a lot of > >illustrations of those designs. CarolynKayta Barrows replied: > Kate Greenaway illustrations reflect what the > Aesthetics were wearing in the late-1870s-early-1880s. It's not mainstream. The woman was a > commercial illustrator, not a fashion historian. But isn't a fashion historian a modern construct, and by definition one who looks at the past and not the present? And isn't your critiscism/clarification of Kate Greenway equally applicable to the people who design stuff for Hot Topic and other "alternative" fashion? Basically, i'm confused as to why you would point out the difference-- surely there aren't fashion historians out there, slavishly trying to document 2005! Of course, it is great to know that Kate Greenway represents the tastes of a minor group :-) (if I were more awake, I'd try to form this into some better question/argument about what IS a good source, if not a commercial illustrator who depicts the style of HER group at HER time!) Stephanie __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 03:54:45 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F7sirY004661 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:54:44 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7F7scqU023254 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:54:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F7rajA002350 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 01:53:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F7rZdN042160; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 01:53:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.148]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7F7rVqR042115 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 01:53:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 56988 invoked by uid 60001); 15 Aug 2006 07:53:26 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=x7W6EuGNf79X9JRv9iWZ6Hn4NaohV87/NKakwFmSGIjKblr8FvkIxrs8899v2C++GyqsQ9yduYXo1XqCjAAz8WiP+5LZF4r450Xhyd2sZ8f2RHeZhdKV6bd11om4UAmqh2g7s3AQgV1ayzF7RDWNKxbrfnMAziey/7XVrIS3dS0= ; Message-ID: <20060815075326.56986.qmail@web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 00:53:26 PDT Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 00:53:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova To: h-costume MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] formula for spiral lacing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:54:41 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E17DBE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi, I've made up a formula for how to calculate the distance between the holes in spiral lacing: y = x/b + x/(2b2) y....distance between two holes x....length of the opening, from the first hole to the last b....number of holes (without the 1/2 distance hole) It may sound a bit weird, but it's much quicker to use this formula then to wonder 2 hours about how to make the holes. I give an example using the second picture (the one on the left side) on this webpage: http://www.festiveattyre.com/research/lacing/lacing.html let's say the length of the lacing, from first hole to last, is 3,5cm (1+1+1+0,5). (There you can see, the distance between two holes is 1. But that's what you should get in the end). x = 3,5 The number of holes without the half-distance hole is 4. b = 4. Now, count with these numbers, and you get y = 0,98... is approx. 1 So, it's right! I hope this helps a bit when making this kind of lacing. At least it helped me:-)) Zuzana --------------------------------- Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 04:22:24 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F8MF4n010412 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:22:15 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7F8M7f6022437 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:22:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F8LT9d004530 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 02:21:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F8LR3g053887; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 02:21:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from derby.ac.uk (uodgw1.derby.ac.uk [193.60.149.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F8LNsY053860 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 02:21:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from k.m.bunting@derby.ac.uk) Received: from ([193.60.149.5]) by uodgw1.derby.ac.uk with ESMTP id 5202112.8300211; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:20:59 0100 Received: from Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk (uodx.derby.ac.uk [195.194.178.251]) by mail1.derby.ac.uk (8.11.7p2+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id k7F8KwJ27466.; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:20:58 +0100 (BST) Received: from DOMGWIA-MTA by Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:20:58 +0100 Message-Id: <44E191ED02000014000BD5D5@Cluster1_gwise3_server.derby.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 7.0.1 Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 09:20:45 +0100 From: "Kate M Bunting" To: Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian References: <200608141611.k7EGAsZC018643@net.indra.com> <20060815073543.43006.qmail@web32114.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20060815073543.43006.qmail@web32114.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:22:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E1842F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I believe that Kate Greenaway's typical pictures interpreted the children's fashions of the Regency era (though she did portray other styles in some of her book illustrations). According to the Wikipedia article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kate_Greenaway , it was the Aesthetic movement that imitated her rather than the other way round. Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor >>> Stephanie Smith 15/08/2006 08:35 >>> CarolynKayta Barrows replied: > Kate Greenaway illustrations reflect what the > Aesthetics were wearing in the late-1870s-early-1880s. It's not mainstream. The woman was a > commercial illustrator, not a fashion historian. But isn't a fashion historian a modern construct, and by definition one who looks at the past and not the present? ______________________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 05:56:18 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F9uFLC029846 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:56:15 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7F9u9mn011141 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:56:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F9tNF2013090 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:55:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F9tKDM098757; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:55:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm43.prodigy.net (ylpvm43-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.74]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7F9tGec098728 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:55:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm43.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7F9tFVO029155 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:55:17 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060815021142.025c7440@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 02:53:41 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian In-Reply-To: <20060815073543.43006.qmail@web32114.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <200608141611.k7EGAsZC018643@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7F9tGec098728 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:56:13 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E19A39.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >But isn't a fashion historian a modern construct, and >by definition one who looks at the past and not the >present? You've got your definition about right, but no, "fashion historian" is not a modern construct. There have been fashion historians since at least the mid-1800s, if we include the folks like Violet-le-Duc and Köhler who produced those Victorian costume books we now laugh at as inaccurate Victorian re-drawings. Heck - Vecellio was something of a fashion historian in the late-1500s-early-1600s, in his own way, and Dover has reprinted the book of his on which I'm basing that opinion. These are the giants on whose shoulders folks like Janet Arnold stood. >And isn't your critiscism/clarification of >Kate Greenway BTW, I don't criticize Kate Greenaway's work for what it isn't, rather I love it for what it is. > equally applicable to the people who >design stuff for Hot Topic and other "alternative" >fashion? Basically, i'm confused as to why you would >point out the difference We use her work to document something which is, from a 2006 perspective, historical, but she didn't set out to "do" historical when she was working, and neither do the designers from Hot Topic. Both were/are designing to their contemporary markets. And yes, some of her stuff shows people in historically based costumery. That makes them historical examples of how a person of her period interpreted these other periods. But that doesn't make her a costume historian, only an illustrator putting historical clothes on some of her models. And she might well have gone to the books of costume historians of her day to get her examples. (My personal favorite one-period-interprets-another is the early 1920s doing American colonial 1770s, complete with the dropped early-20s waist. I actively collect examples of this.) >-- surely there aren't fashion >historians out there, slavishly trying to document >2005! Ah, but there are. That's why folks like the V&A and Metropolitan Museum haven't stopped collecting currently fashionable garments. They're storing these things now for the historians many years in the future who will thank them for having done so. Consider, we would have more historical garments now if people in the past had specifically done this for us. Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, like as they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years from now. And that some theatre costumer or historical researcher then would kill for a photo or actual example of it. Scarey, huh? >Of course, it is great to know that Kate >Greenway represents the tastes of a minor group :-) ...those aforementioned Aesthetics, some of whom dressed very much like what her illustrations show. >(if I were more awake, I'd try to form this into some >better question/argument about what IS a good source, >if not a commercial illustrator who depicts the style >of HER group at HER time!) If you mean is she a source for what her group was wearing, you're right, just like Vogue Magazine will continue to be a good source for whatever style it is they document every month. But Vogue doesn't set out to document history, it's just that back issues of it are used by historians who do. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 06:50:07 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FAo4OA011616 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:50:04 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7FAnwbK023212 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:50:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FAn5Pp018471 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:49:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FAn0fp024098; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:49:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FAmvWc024068 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:48:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A5386F0566; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 10:43:04 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:49:29 -0700 Message-ID: <001201c6c058$7c63fb20$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20060815021142.025c7440@mail.frys.com> Importance: Normal X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7FAmvWc024068 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:50:01 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E1A6D6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO (My personal favorite one-period-interprets-another is the early 1920s doing American colonial 1770s, complete with the dropped early-20s waist. I actively collect examples of this.) I saw a perfectly hideous example of a "renaissance" dress, as interpreted by a 1950's costumer,and don't forget Julie Christie's hair in "Dr. Zhivago". Sharon -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Carolyn Kayta Barrows Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 2:54 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian >But isn't a fashion historian a modern construct, and >by definition one who looks at the past and not the >present? You've got your definition about right, but no, "fashion historian" is not a modern construct. There have been fashion historians since at least the mid-1800s, if we include the folks like Violet-le-Duc and Köhler who produced those Victorian costume books we now laugh at as inaccurate Victorian re-drawings. Heck - Vecellio was something of a fashion historian in the late-1500s-early-1600s, in his own way, and Dover has reprinted the book of his on which I'm basing that opinion. These are the giants on whose shoulders folks like Janet Arnold stood. >And isn't your critiscism/clarification of >Kate Greenway BTW, I don't criticize Kate Greenaway's work for what it isn't, rather I love it for what it is. > equally applicable to the people who >design stuff for Hot Topic and other "alternative" >fashion? Basically, i'm confused as to why you would >point out the difference We use her work to document something which is, from a 2006 perspective, historical, but she didn't set out to "do" historical when she was working, and neither do the designers from Hot Topic. Both were/are designing to their contemporary markets. And yes, some of her stuff shows people in historically based costumery. That makes them historical examples of how a person of her period interpreted these other periods. But that doesn't make her a costume historian, only an illustrator putting historical clothes on some of her models. And she might well have gone to the books of costume historians of her day to get her examples. (My personal favorite one-period-interprets-another is the early 1920s doing American colonial 1770s, complete with the dropped early-20s waist. I actively collect examples of this.) >-- surely there aren't fashion >historians out there, slavishly trying to document >2005! Ah, but there are. That's why folks like the V&A and Metropolitan Museum haven't stopped collecting currently fashionable garments. They're storing these things now for the historians many years in the future who will thank them for having done so. Consider, we would have more historical garments now if people in the past had specifically done this for us. Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, like as they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years from now. And that some theatre costumer or historical researcher then would kill for a photo or actual example of it. Scarey, huh? >Of course, it is great to know that Kate >Greenway represents the tastes of a minor group :-) ...those aforementioned Aesthetics, some of whom dressed very much like what her illustrations show. >(if I were more awake, I'd try to form this into some >better question/argument about what IS a good source, >if not a commercial illustrator who depicts the style >of HER group at HER time!) If you mean is she a source for what her group was wearing, you're right, just like Vogue Magazine will continue to be a good source for whatever style it is they document every month. But Vogue doesn't set out to document history, it's just that back issues of it are used by historians who do. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 07:15:05 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FBExNt016553 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 07:15:03 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7FBEq1m027384 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 07:14:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FBEAoA020481 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:14:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FBE6Wq036647; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:14:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37507.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37507.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.154]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7FBE2BC036566 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:14:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 63411 invoked by uid 60001); 15 Aug 2006 11:13:57 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=fsg2SFZTHnmSOkbVN2VszfMKgyWKm9nfvXNfh64EkwOpz7Y/AjOtb8i8s5iraCV1F4xS0XdH1BqPELlFer9v5PhPI9QvricqvQm9ZwucwtdXEGyN2uC8FoirPGsPZ9vvM/c5nE3DJoN5sNr9u5dCh4gczth+fawWIP+HmcseCTI= ; Message-ID: <20060815111357.63409.qmail@web37507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37507.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:13:57 PDT Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:13:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: [h-cost] formula for spiral lacing II To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20060815075326.56986.qmail@web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 07:14:56 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E1ACAC.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO P.S.: the 2b2 means two times b square --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Next-gen email? Have it all with the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 08:51:56 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FCpqAg019907 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:51:56 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7FCpjua019116 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:51:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FConkC029361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:50:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FCojb7092617; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:50:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m28.mx.aol.com (imo-m28.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.9]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FCohub092511 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 06:50:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m28.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c17.18423c4 (39953) for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:50:31 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:50:31 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:51:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E1C361.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/15/2006 5:56:23 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, like as they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years from now. ******************** Sure we do! But I suppose people who don't care about clothes don't think about it in those terms. But this works in many other areas than fashion. I recently got some old "Laugh In" episodes on DVD. The minute I saw that old NBC peacock come up on the screen a million synapses fired in my brain that hadn't fired since 1968! I remembered piling into the car with the folks to go see my Dad's friend's new color TV. It was the 1st color TV on the block and there were only like 3 shows in color then...that peacock was the 1st thing I ever saw in color on a TV. Look at music... The vinyl record is gone. The CD disc is well on the way out being replaced by iPod technology. When one's in the thick of it, it's hard to see sometimes. Anyway, as far as clothes go, who knows what the future will latch onto or how they will interpret it. Going back to 1968....I have like 3 dresses of Mother's made of grey flannel, decorated with rhinestones. Grey flannel and rhinestones? Three of them? Was that a "thing" that fall? Will it be documented in fashion mags? How will the Kyoto accessorize it? What would an 18th century person think of the way the Kyoto displayed those 18th century gowns? We love it [well, I do] but would our 18th century time travelers approve? _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 13:16:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FHGbM6029229 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:16:37 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7FHGUvP016727 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:16:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FHDw0d074975 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:13:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FHDmWx045940; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:13:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FHDWWa045637 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:13:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GD2Te-0004iR-Us; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 12:13:18 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:13:18 -0400 Message-ID: <20060815131318.nd8cm7zq04c8k4o0@www.goldsword.com> Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:13:18 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume , Robin Netherton Subject: Re: [h-cost] Some old linen References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Historic Costume List X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:16:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E2016E.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting Robin Netherton : > > I'm clearing things out, and came across an old white linen tablecloth and > four napkins. What size is the tablecloth? susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 15:07:01 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FJ70rR001995 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:07:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7FJ6rLO021850 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:06:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FJ5Jwr092910 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:05:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FJ5CUE067879; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:05:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FJ55Lh067715 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:05:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm15.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7FJ4XJ1022471 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:04:36 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060815113011.025f4da8@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:36:12 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: what will become historical costume (wasRe: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:06:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E21B4D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >When one's in the thick of it, it's hard >to see sometimes. Remembering to see such things is a mindset. Now every new thing that comes out, in any field, I remember that it will get old some day. > Anyway, as far as clothes go, who knows what the future will latch onto or >how they will interpret it. Going back to 1968....I have like 3 dresses of >Mother's made of grey flannel, decorated with rhinestones. Grey flannel and >rhinestones? Three of them? Was that a "thing" that fall? Will it be >documented >in fashion mags? How will the Kyoto accessorize it? I like how your brain works. >What would an 18th century person think of the way the Kyoto displayed those >18th century gowns? We love it [well, I do] but would our 18th century time >travelers approve? These days I'm writing alternate-universe science fiction. My current story involves time-traveling clothes as a plot device. When a re-enactor puts on his or her historical costume, they start to become their characters. Parts of my plot hinge on this point. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 20:12:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0CYWt018905 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:12:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G0CRRY022805 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:12:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0BhCn038162 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:11:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0BaOx056544; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:11:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7FHHg4c050671 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:17:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GD2XU-0005NJ-85; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 12:17:16 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:17:16 -0400 Message-ID: <20060815131716.6cbr3nfccog88sok@www.goldsword.com> Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 13:17:16 -0400 From: Susan Farmer To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Some old linen MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:12:31 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E262EB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting "Susan B. Farmer" : > Quoting Robin Netherton : > >> >> I'm clearing things out, and came across an old white linen tablecloth and >> four napkins. > > What size is the tablecloth? *isgh* braif fart -- as I hit send I noticed 2 things -- one it was going to the list too (bad Susan), and 2 Robin's message came in *yesterday* so it's probably all gone by now. *sigh* apologies, all. susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 20:39:23 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0dMTZ020523 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:39:22 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G0dGBJ002838 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:39:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0ckDD042037 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:38:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0cjCA076327; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:38:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cantvc.canterbury.ac.nz (cantvc.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.2.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0cfJ0076236 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:38:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladyadele@paradise.net.nz) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.it.canterbury.ac.nz by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) id <01M626BGGVOW9C1XOI@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:38:08 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Received: from [132.181.4.133] (rcmt-cad45.it.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.4.133]) by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) with ESMTP id <01M626BGA8H89C1NI3@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:38:07 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:38:16 +1200 From: Adele de Maisieres Subject: Re: [h-cost] Some old linen In-reply-to: <20060815131716.6cbr3nfccog88sok@www.goldsword.com> To: Historical Costume Message-id: <44E268F8.4050701@paradise.net.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) References: <20060815131716.6cbr3nfccog88sok@www.goldsword.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:39:20 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E26934.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Susan Farmer wrote: >*isgh* > >braif fart > > Isn't that that ghastly movie with Mel Gibson? -- Adele de Maisieres ----------------------------- Habeo metrum - musicamque, hominem meam. Expectat alium quid? -Georgeus Gershwinus ----------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 20:55:56 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0tu4T020976 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:55:56 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G0tl45007315 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:55:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0tN3p044366 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:55:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0tM7N087805; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:55:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G0tH9N087754 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:55:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GD9go-0003j1-R2; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:55:22 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:55:22 -0400 Message-ID: <20060815205522.1121ev65wcckso4o@www.goldsword.com> Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:55:22 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Some old linen References: <20060815131716.6cbr3nfccog88sok@www.goldsword.com> <44E268F8.4050701@paradise.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <44E268F8.4050701@paradise.net.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:55:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E26D13.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting Adele de Maisieres : > Susan Farmer wrote: > >> *isgh* >> >> braif fart > Isn't that that ghastly movie with Mel Gibson? > ROTFLOLWTOOME! boy, when I can't type, I *really* can't type can I? *blush* susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 21:13:37 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1DaCn021607 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:13:37 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G1DUNm009980 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:13:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1Ctgr047999 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:12:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1Cnj0099846; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:12:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp-send.myrealbox.com (smtp-send.myrealbox.com [151.155.5.143]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1CkL6099759 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:12:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from rnweb@myrealbox.com) Received: from rnweb [209.176.170.164] by myrealbox.com with NetMail ModWeb Module; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:12:41 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] Some old linen From: "R. Netherton" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:12:41 -0500 X-Mailer: NetMail ModWeb Module X-Sender: rnweb MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <1155690761.c7d04f7crnweb@myrealbox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7G1CkL6099759 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:13:34 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E2713A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Susan Farmer wrote: > braif fart Adele wrote: > Isn't that that ghastly movie with Mel Gibson? Adele, I believe you owe me a new keyboard. This one has cocoa all over it. Susan: Yes, the linen has been claimed. Von: That's you. I'll contact you shortly, after I weigh the package. Everyone: My regular e-mail is down today. If anyone has written me, I won't see it till the ISP guy fixes things. (I use a very small ISP. The owner is also the tech guy, and he answers the phone when I call, and knows me by name. So, I know he really is working on it.) If you need to reach me before I'm fully functional, please use this address -- rnweb (at) myrealbox.com ... but don't file that away, as I use it only for backup and don't check it unless I'm having a problem with my main box. --Robin Robin Netherton This is my webmail box. Please reply to . _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 21:19:31 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1JVnV021719 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:19:31 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G1JNtN006382 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:19:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1IWgP048616 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:18:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1IUmF003461; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:18:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s30.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s30.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.166]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1IRRE003358 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:18:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from laswa@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.168.48]) by bay0-omc2-s30.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:18:21 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:18:21 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.168.200 by by113fd.bay113.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 01:18:18 GMT X-Originating-IP: [68.248.201.170] X-Originating-Email: [laswa@hotmail.com] X-Sender: laswa@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <44E268F8.4050701@paradise.net.nz> From: "zelda crusher" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost]Briaf fart (was Some old linen) Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:18:18 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Aug 2006 01:18:21.0622 (UTC) FILETIME=[DD111560:01C6C0D1] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:19:28 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E2729B.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thank you Adele!, I will forever hear/read that "Braif Fart" instead of "Brave Heart", changing my feelings from distaste to glee. Champion! Laurie >Susan Farmer wrote: > >>*isgh* >> >>braif fart >> >Isn't that that ghastly movie with Mel Gibson? > > >-- >Adele de Maisieres > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 21:27:57 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1RvJv021863 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:27:57 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G1Rpm6013645 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:27:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1ROFd049754 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:27:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1RN3c009417; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:27:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.198]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7G1RLmS009354 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:27:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from devilangel016@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 82545 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Aug 2006 01:27:15 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=1++Cv40r9n0MJDNGXVr+IFuIL4SNSO/eI/EqJ30BrRb1Zbet+t3xxuGZACu29vEN49r0966c4+HqthyV1qeszweNZcfwHrZj/yiPSz2HCL6/sUYWkIcxrE+vMMr2sNFbnh4aOLHxMrKGXt3qeuB3w3m8LrD0feI42IdKSJsh8WY= ; Message-ID: <20060816012715.82543.qmail@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [69.235.215.228] by web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:27:15 PDT Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:27:15 -0700 (PDT) From: dara fargotstein To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608150955.k7F9tPpJ098798@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re:In NY City August 25th - 27th? (devilangel016@yahoo.com) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:27:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E27497.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I'm moving to White Plains the 23rd. Email me if you want a museum buddy for the weekend. --------------------------------- Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 21:55:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1tlP6023406 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:55:47 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G1teYE005649 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:55:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1tJeo054136 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:55:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1tGK1029520; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:55:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp-send.myrealbox.com (smtp-send.myrealbox.com [151.155.5.143]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G1tCR6029382 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:55:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from rnweb@myrealbox.com) Received: from rnweb [209.176.170.164] by myrealbox.com with NetMail ModWeb Module; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:55:07 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] late 1300s "French" From: "R. Netherton" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:55:07 -0500 X-Mailer: NetMail ModWeb Module X-Sender: rnweb MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <1155693307.c7d04f7crnweb@myrealbox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7G1tCR6029382 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:55:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E27B1C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO De wrote: > I've been trying to find pictures online of garments > worn in "France" during the late 1300s. early 1400s > are acceptable. Anyone have a url for a good site? Your best artwork from this period for costume research purposes is in manuscripts, so you need the Bibliotheque Nationale de France. Here's a list of the medieval mss online so far: http://gallica.bnf.fr/themes/ImaMA2.htm Finding your way through the listings of mss is difficult unless you know what you're looking for; you'll have to browse and check the dates as you go. A lot of the ones I have bookmarked for myself are 15th c. and probably a bit too late for you, but I would suggest you look at the Grandes Chroniques de France (MS Fr. 73), which is around 1400. The BNF hasn't webbed a lot of my favorites yet, but each time I look there's something new up there. I'm more familiar with books than websites. If you want hardcopy references, e-mail me directly. --Robin Robin Netherton This is my webmail box. Please reply to . _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 15 22:21:25 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G2LO8F025944 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:21:24 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G2LIRL023018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:21:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G2KdN6057422 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:20:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G2KZGV046664; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:20:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp-send.myrealbox.com (smtp-send.myrealbox.com [151.155.5.143]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G2KVWk046547 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:20:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from rnweb@myrealbox.com) Received: from rnweb [209.176.170.164] by myrealbox.com with NetMail ModWeb Module; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:20:26 -0500 Subject: Re: [h-cost] formula for spiral lacing From: "R. Netherton" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:20:26 -0500 X-Mailer: NetMail ModWeb Module X-Sender: rnweb MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <1155694826.c7d04f7crnweb@myrealbox.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7G2KVWk046547 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:21:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E2811E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Zuzana wrote: << I've made up a formula for how to calculate the distance between the holes in spiral lacing: y = x/b + x/(2b2) y....distance between two holes x....length of the opening, from the first hole to the last b....number of holes (without the 1/2 distance hole) It may sound a bit weird, but it's much quicker to use this formula then to wonder 2 hours about how to make the holes. >> Now I've wondered more than 2 hours why you would need to wonder 2 hours! No one else has posted to ask about this, so I guess I will: Where was your difficulty originally, that made you come up with this formula? It sounds like the formula determines distance between holes based on the number of holes. But I would determine the spacing of the holes first, and the number of holes would be however many I needed at that spacing. I frankly wouldn't know how many holes I was going to use till I was done, and I don't think I've ever bothered to count them. It's the spacing I care about. In other words: I've learned that to make a non-gapping opening down the front of my fitted dresses, I need to place the holes about 5/8 or 3/4 inch apart. (Not coincidentially, this is the width of my finger.) So, I start at the top. I go just below the area of the seam allowances (which are folded inside the lining and trimmed) and mark the first hole with a sharp chalk line or a sharp pencil line. Then I mark the rest of them, one at a time, one finger-width apart. I do the marking on the inside, with the dress turned inside-out. I do this down to the end of the opening and usually put one more hole past the point where the center seam begins. (I've already sewn the center front so that there's a slight overlap, but that's a nicety and not absolutely necessary.) Then I hold the unmarked edge up next to the marked edge, just as they will lie in wear. I mark the first hole at the same point, straight across from its mate. Then I go down half a fingerwidth and mark another hole. (This is easy to eyeball.) I continue then at one finger-width apart, always watching the opposite side to make sure I'm staying at the midpoints between the first set of marks, on the opposite side. At the bottom, I leave them uneven. The lacing cord eventually will come through whichever bottom hole sits lower, after being fastened on the inside of the garment on the opposite side, at the same level as the lower hole (meaning the lace will be fastened a little below the last hole on that side). I do all the marking before I sew because sewing the eyelets can change the stretch/tension of the fabric and interfere with the evenness of the measurements. Something I do before I start all of this: I baste a line down each edge, exactly 1/2 or 5/8 inch from the edge and parallel to it. When I mark my eyelets, my marking lines cross the basting line, forming a + . The eyelets go on those intersections. The basting helps keep the lining and the main fabric from getting off-kilter while I sew the eyelets. I remove the basting after the eyelets are sewn. Once you're used to this method, you don't need pins or measuring tape, though I only abandoned those a little while ago, after many dresses. It's really simpler now. The more I sew, the less I measure. It's quite likely that 14th-century seamstresses did not use measuring tapes marked in numerical increments. (If anyone has any evidence that they did, let me know. The closest I've heard of are tapes with a specific person's body measurements marked on it, for reference, but even that appears to be rather later, and something that tailors used when sewing independently of the wearer's body.) --Robin Robin Netherton This is my webmail box. Please reply to . _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 00:31:45 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G4VeV5008622 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 00:31:45 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7G4VYXA017551 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 00:31:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G4Uqlm073788 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:30:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G4UjZF032356; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:30:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mail.marz.com [216.106.88.97] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7G4UcrM032279 for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:30:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B4DFA3CF3D for ; Tue, 15 Aug 2006 23:30:37 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] late 1300s "French" Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 23:30:45 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <1155693307.c7d04f7crnweb@myrealbox.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7G4UcrM032279 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 00:31:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E29FA6.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thank you. The neighboring SCA group is doing an event based loosely on the manuscript "Le Livre de Chasse" by Gaston Phoebus I found a few posted pictures from the manuscript but they have only men in them (no surprise there) and though I might make some men's clothes for the day, I would like something feminine for the evening. Presently I only have norse garb. :) Thank you again. De -----Original Message----- Your best artwork from this period for costume research purposes is in manuscripts, so you need the Bibliotheque Nationale de France. Here's a list of the medieval mss online so far: http://gallica.bnf.fr/themes/ImaMA2.htm Finding your way through the listings of mss is difficult unless you know what you're looking for; you'll have to browse and check the dates as you go. A lot of the ones I have bookmarked for myself are 15th c. and probably a bit too late for you, but I would suggest you look at the Grandes Chroniques de France (MS Fr. 73), which is around 1400. The BNF hasn't webbed a lot of my favorites yet, but each time I look there's something new up there. I'm more familiar with books than websites. If you want hardcopy references, e-mail me directly. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 09:35:12 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GDZCvQ007066 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:35:12 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GDZ5Qa009881 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:35:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GDXv29033813 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 07:33:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GDXkIc050239; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 07:33:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web33913.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web33913.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.191]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7GDXffs050105 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 07:33:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wildthangstreasures@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 38579 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Aug 2006 13:33:36 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=UfylgMwM+w+k9g71dy564jD7AAeJJAfXR86iNAhHxv0J6zHlcwz49L/8Ge6ze6YwJTl9AyhVovwGw6/Yf5pMIY4ka308klztoPqGBu+MH1+0/6Mdt1x/HhoICTcza3edqEXp/gr7DE0yeetOEfDz5m+Wc8SnVO7uQx9YLWWysuA= ; Message-ID: <20060816133336.38577.qmail@web33913.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.187.49.72] by web33913.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 06:33:36 PDT Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 06:33:36 -0700 (PDT) From: "Voncile W. Dudley" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Some old linen To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <1155690761.c7d04f7crnweb@myrealbox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:35:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E31F09.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Great! I look forward to your email. Lady Von "R. Netherton" wrote: Susan Farmer wrote: > braif fart Adele wrote: > Isn't that that ghastly movie with Mel Gibson? Adele, I believe you owe me a new keyboard. This one has cocoa all over it. Susan: Yes, the linen has been claimed. Von: That's you. I'll contact you shortly, after I weigh the package. Everyone: My regular e-mail is down today. If anyone has written me, I won't see it till the ISP guy fixes things. (I use a very small ISP. The owner is also the tech guy, and he answers the phone when I call, and knows me by name. So, I know he really is working on it.) If you need to reach me before I'm fully functional, please use this address -- rnweb (at) myrealbox.com ... but don't file that away, as I use it only for backup and don't check it unless I'm having a problem with my main box. --Robin Robin Netherton This is my webmail box. Please reply to . _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lady Von http://www.wildthangstreasures.com --------------------------------- Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 11:33:58 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFXqhX009972 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:33:52 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GFX6Sa026129 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:33:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFVa9M051105 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:31:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFVWb1047599; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:31:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web35615.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web35615.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.163.179.154]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7GFVIHW047345 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:31:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kahlara@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 20049 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Aug 2006 15:31:13 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=DCcy6FJj9bNzeP1FdbZGlFXYDpuK1n3/VrQUfjZj3uQlS+HOOhdjNOlaaWN5VRQn8qJh+5GFDG2huYAC2ZoAjBcYU5xWbfGYXxrZ1LsqxHuYEx9MAY1s9kDAgMjZ7BaWHLN+2tVZCILo8U/Nb11z0IfUn4vWZOKUP4Db+SUBY9M= ; Message-ID: <20060816153113.20047.qmail@web35615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [71.117.13.102] by web35615.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 08:31:13 PDT Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 08:31:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Kahlara To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608151802.k7FI0iAb099089@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.3, clamav-milter version 0.88.3 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:33:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E33AB2.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >Message: 3 >Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 08:50:31 EDT >From: AlbertCat@aol.com >Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian > > >In a message dated 8/15/2006 5:56:23 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, >kayta@frys.com writes: > >Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, like as >they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years >from >now. So I should carefully preserve this old ratty bathrobe for posterity?? Sorry, I couldn't resist! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 11:54:24 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFsMTX010374 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:54:22 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GFsGsc002773 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:54:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFoKeV054538 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:50:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFoIeM065102; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:50:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm43.prodigy.net (ylpvm43-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.74]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFoCim064985 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:50:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm43.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7GFoB5Z010447 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:50:12 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060816084752.02670008@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 08:50:04 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian In-Reply-To: <20060816153113.20047.qmail@web35615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <200608151802.k7FI0iAb099089@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:54:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E33FA8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > >Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, like as > >they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years > >from > >now. > > So I should carefully preserve this old ratty bathrobe for > posterity?? Sorry, I couldn't resist! Oh yes, you really must. Think how posterity will thank you. ROTFLMposteriorO CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 12:02:05 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GG25bs010532 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:02:05 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GG1w0G006316 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:02:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFvWPX055729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:57:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFvVrp071429; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:57:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from victory.concentric.com (victory.concentric.com [207.155.253.154]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GFvRK6071353 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:57:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) Received: (www@localhost) by victory.concentric.com id LAA02249; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:57:23 -0400 (EDT) [ConcentricHost SMTP Relay 1.17] Message-ID: <200608161557.LAA02249@victory.concentric.com> From: Julie To: Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 08:57:23 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <200608151802.k7FI0iAb099089@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7GFvRK6071353 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:02:02 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E34176.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO ---- wrote: > BTW, I don't criticize Kate Greenaway's work for what it isn't, rather I > love it for what it is. **I must have missed the first part of this. Who is Kate Greenaway? (My personal favorite one-period-interprets-another is the early 1920s doing American colonial 1770s, complete with the dropped early-20s waist. I actively collect examples of this.) **Can you put this up in files or on your website? I'd love to see this. What a scream. > Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, like as > they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years from now. **I do. I think about what a reenactor from the future might wear to portray the turn of the century. Maybe Levis and T-shirts for both men and women. (Hmmm...how could those folks tell men from women back then. And both men and women could have any length hair. Weird ;-) Julie _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 12:16:51 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GGGp0W011014 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:16:51 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GGGi4L012315 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:16:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GGDx2x058535 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:13:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GGDr5c086484; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:13:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52505.mail.yahoo.com (web52505.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.188]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7GGDn67086330 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:13:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from info_fourquarters@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 10761 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Aug 2006 16:13:44 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=MAtSUC/CLY5QcdKI0urkuiSRL7gH9iKbOBysGeLrWqNTCO5OXl0fZ6RzPIRQtrlF8rnmu49mqTLgXIm78nhiGthcqvrAyvRnAVTFW1U6KrgU/mzaKQffG2zW9ayO+1NsJMbjS46Wb7Jzjfzi3RSLLHN9k9UXzqovpK6HOuuJa7E= ; Message-ID: <20060816161344.10759.qmail@web52505.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.132.237.219] by web52505.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:13:43 PDT Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:13:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Four Quarters Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20060816084752.02670008@mail.frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:16:48 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E344EC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Keep it, unless your "posterity" is hanging out the backside, *snicker* --- Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > >Most people don't realize that what they're > wearing right now, like as > > >they're reading this e-mail, will be considered > historical 100 years > > >from > > >now. > > > > So I should carefully preserve this old ratty > bathrobe for > > posterity?? Sorry, I couldn't resist! > > Oh yes, you really must. Think how posterity will > thank you. ROTFLMposteriorO > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > ///\\\\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > )(( <> ))( > * ) ( * > /----\ /---\ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 12:23:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GGNBSt011143 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:23:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GGN5Ms014670 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:23:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GGEqaF058659 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:14:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GGEnfU087423; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:14:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GGEamx087151 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:14:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 271133B61F for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:14:31 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44E34469.7000507@reddawn.net> Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:14:33 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian References: <200608161557.LAA02249@victory.concentric.com> In-Reply-To: <200608161557.LAA02249@victory.concentric.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:23:08 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E34669.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >>Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, like as >>they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years from now. > > > **I do. I think about what a reenactor from the future might wear to portray the turn of the century. Maybe Levis and T-shirts for both men and women. (Hmmm...how could those folks tell men from women back then. And both men and women could have any length hair. Weird ;-) > After looking at how some folks today build their 'historical' costumes, I expect to see 3pc suits made out of denim, worn with grunge flannel shirts, 80's gel shoes, 70's long hair, and the occasional body piercing. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 13:18:44 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHIdKF013246 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:18:44 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GHIXFM001290 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:18:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHGG1H075247 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:16:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHG5e0051501; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:16:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-03.ohiordc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.ohiordc.rr.com [65.24.5.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHFwYP051346 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:16:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ailith@neo.rr.com) Received: from Duncan (cpe-71-66-106-198.neo.res.rr.com [71.66.106.198]) by ms-smtp-03.ohiordc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7GHFtKH024022 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:15:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <006b01c6c157$a2149050$2f02a8c0@Duncan> From: "Ailith Mackintosh" To: "Historical Costume" Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:15:53 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:18:37 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E35369.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Greetings. I have received a request for help: "It seems that in a lot of extant garments, the protein fibers (wool and silk) have survived, while the plant fibers have not. We can only speculate that linen thread was used because there are stitching holes and no thread (and it seems unlikely that they would have pulled the silk or wool sewing thread out before tossing the rest in the trash). I was hoping you might be able to help me find some sort of documentation that I can use as a reference that explains how this works? It doesn't have to be overly technical." Right now I cannot get to my books and my brain is not working...so I'm turning to the best group of costuming/clothing/historians that I can think of. Can any of you help, please? Thanks so much. kate Outgoing email scanned by Norton AntiVirus _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 13:21:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHLhE4013294 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:21:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GHLbj8030868 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:21:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHIbdt076041 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:18:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHIWUg054301; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:18:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHIRam054195 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:18:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from CynthiaAbel@creighton.edu) Received: from exbe01.blue.jays.creighton.edu (exbe01.creighton.edu [147.134.2.111]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_29774)/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA24268 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:18:27 -0500 (CDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:18:21 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian Thread-Index: AcbBUdx0S/ahSFXsS12hTnfEMWwvLAABPHog From: "Abel, Cynthia" To: "Historical Costume" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7GHIRam054195 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:21:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E35421.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Think how much futurists will be horrified by all the polyester/nylon, and other synthetic fabricated clothing we tossed out that will still be "living" in landfills! Especially all the 70's polyester. Lived then. Wore that. Rule one: Don't ever buy white 70's polyester! Ever! How will they judge clothing made from finite resources(like oil, etc) versus renewable resources? How will they view the great use of fur and leather standing alongside the great number of PETA and other animal protection agencies? And will in a century or so, be able to custom order our clothing via a "Star Trek" replicator? I know that one did food, but where did all the clothes come from? There had to be a clothing replicator on board. Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 13:25:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHP0rw013529 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:25:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GHOrh1020681 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:24:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHHFOK075613 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:17:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHHAV6052743; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:17:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.58]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHH1Yt052564 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:17:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.173.232.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.173.232]) by pop05.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GDP0l-0000Fr-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:17:00 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <44E34469.7000507@reddawn.net> References: <200608161557.LAA02249@victory.concentric.com> <44E34469.7000507@reddawn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <663E8936-2D4B-11DB-BB38-0030656EBF34@mindspring.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:19:39 -0400 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:24:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E354E5.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Not so funny-- sounds like a "look"! It will probably show up on the runways next year.... --Ruth Anne Baumgartner gypsy scholar and amateur costumer p.s. Actually, now that I get to musing about this, maybe those "yore" costumes aren't as far off as we think....aren't designers' models and chic young things walking around in very "now" outfits that mix nineteenth-century skirts, 'twenties jewelry, bustiers (fantasy out-of-time corsets), generic modern T shirts, traditional Indian sandals, flower-child crocheted fringed vests, and hats reminiscent of caps worn by working-class men 400 years ago? On Aug 16, 2006, at 12:14 PM, Dawn wrote: > > After looking at how some folks today build their 'historical' > costumes, I expect to see 3pc suits made out of denim, worn with > grunge flannel shirts, 80's gel shoes, 70's long hair, and the > occasional body piercing. > > > > Dawn > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 13:30:04 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHU4TG013731 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:30:04 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GHTv8f021997 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:30:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHRDA7077531 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:27:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHQoAS063080; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:26:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.148]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7GHQV4U062631 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:26:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 58323 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Aug 2006 17:26:21 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=ZAzBu7tnGg8xyuGPOgLB3o0tsIc5OOLH0PppXvTFBdruZgw63949MgXGgI0zmSou6vdqyaMYWamTawNY0v6iNhD2QbDTilfQy9TkwuH+3pDq0HysK7cyHdjwoHMtNbibGSLUgKk7H+V6oF2hxdTbKGONx9lZ7mrdJIFTCmLZbZ0= ; Message-ID: <20060816172621.58321.qmail@web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:26:21 PDT Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:26:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] formula for spiral lacing To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <1155694826.c7d04f7crnweb@myrealbox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:30:01 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E35615.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO "Now I've wondered more than 2 hours why you would need to wonder 2 hours! No one else has posted to ask about this, so I guess I will: Where was your difficulty originally, that made you come up with this formula? It sounds like the formula determines distance between holes based on the number of holes. But I would determine the spacing of the holes first, and the number of holes would be however many I needed at that spacing. I frankly wouldn't know how many holes I was going to use till I was done, and I don't think I've ever bothered to count them. It's the spacing I care about." Well, I make a larger distance between the holes, at least 1inch, so if I started marking the holes from the top to the bottom, in the bottom there might be an either too small or too large distance from the center front seam. That wouldn't, I guess, look very good. So that's why I first mark the first and last hole, then measure the distance, say how many holes I want (to make approx. the distance between them I want) and calculate the exact distance between the holes. I admit, it really sounds complicated, but for me it's not and I'm sure that the last hole will be in the right place. By the way, the making of that formula didn't take me more than 5 minutes, I just wondered a bit about how do I actually calculate it and put it into a formula. But if you place holes even under the center front seam (that means the holes are in place where there is no opening any more, did I get that right?), then your method is surely easier. I actually never even thought about placing the holes there. I never had the chance to go to a museum where I could see a dress with spiral lacing clearly in detail. So that's why I didn't even think about it:-)) Now when thinking about it, I don't only make medieval dresses, I make corsets and other garments of later periods where I use spiral lacing. And there it's sometimes important to have the first and last hole in the right place, so that's maybe why I'm making it all so difficult:-) "Something I do before I start all of this: I baste a line down each edge, exactly 1/2 or 5/8 inch from the edge and parallel to it. When I mark my eyelets, my marking lines cross the basting line, forming a + . The eyelets go on those intersections. The basting helps keep the lining and the main fabric from getting off-kilter while I sew the eyelets. I remove the basting after the eyelets are sewn." I do that, too. Zuzana --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 13:36:13 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHaD01013852 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:36:13 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GHa72o002334 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:36:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHZVHh079438 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:35:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHZQI7071937; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:35:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHZIka071805 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:35:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA02113 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:14:28 -0500 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:14:28 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments In-Reply-To: <006b01c6c157$a2149050$2f02a8c0@Duncan> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:36:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E35787.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wed, 16 Aug 2006, Ailith Mackintosh wrote: > "It seems that in a lot of extant garments, the protein fibers (wool > and silk) have survived, while the plant fibers have not. We can only > speculate that linen thread was used because there are stitching holes > and no thread (and it seems unlikely that they would have pulled the > silk or wool sewing thread out before tossing the rest in the trash). > I was hoping you might be able to help me find some sort of > documentation that I can use as a reference that explains how this > works? It doesn't have to be overly technical." I've seen this mentioned in a number of places but don't have a cite offhand. If I were to look for one, it would be in the Museum of London's "Textiles and Dress" book. Another possibility is Else Ostergard's "Woven Into the Earth," which mentions the paucity of linen survivals in Greenland; whether it discusses thread, I'm not sure. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 13:42:46 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHgkPk013971 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:42:46 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GHgd4Z008734 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:42:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHanhc079646 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:36:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHaZLs073022; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:36:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from eagle.uvm.edu (eagle.uvm.edu [132.198.101.203]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHaSM1072856 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:36:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from hope.greenberg@uvm.edu) Received: from [10.0.1.2] (wllstn-cuda2-24-53-127-86.sbtnvt.adelphia.net [24.53.127.86]) (authenticated bits=0) by eagle.uvm.edu (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7GHa7l9004625 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:36:21 -0400 Message-ID: <44E3563D.8020500@uvm.edu> Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:30:37 -0400 From: Hope Greenberg User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Macintosh/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:42:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E3590F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Abel, Cynthia wrote: > And will in a century or so, be able to custom order our clothing via a > "Star Trek" replicator? I know that one did food, but where did all the > clothes come from? There had to be a clothing replicator on board. Yup, there was. That detail comes up in the original series in several episodes. And even the replicator has fitting problems! In one episode Dr. McCoy is delayed aboard when the replicator gives him the wrong size gestapo boots. I don't recal explicit mentions of clothing replicators in subsequent series, though. Of course, what I would like is a replicator that would give me some of that 1960s velour! I wish I could find some of that stuff. - Hope _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 14:15:09 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GIF8vn014641 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:15:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GIF1SH002777 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:15:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHtxKL083140 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:55:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHtrOW091573; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:55:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHta88091257 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:55:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA02190 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:34:38 -0500 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:34:38 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] formula for spiral lacing In-Reply-To: <20060816172621.58321.qmail@web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:15:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E360A5.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wed, 16 Aug 2006, Zuzana Kraemerova wrote: > But if you place holes even under the center front seam (that means > the holes are in place where there is no opening any more, did I get > that right?), then your method is surely easier. I actually never even > thought about placing the holes there. I never had the chance to go to > a museum where I could see a dress with spiral lacing clearly in > detail. So that's why I didn't even think about it:-)) To my knowledge, there are no existing dresses from my period (14th-15th c.) complete enough to tell us about the front lacing. We have some survivals of garment edges with lacing holes, but we don't know what kinds of garments they came from. We have some garments with intact lacing holes in other uses (e.g. a Herjolfsnes garment with a few holes at the neckline). But no center front openings that show how the lacing holes related to the end of the opening. There are a number of useful sculptures, brasses, and paintings that show spiral lacing down the center front, but when the dress is depicted as laced-up, you can't see where the holes go in relation to the edge or the bottom seam. For practical purposes, though, on a full-length fitted dress, you can start that opening a little higher or lower if you want to put it in a particular relationship to the eyelets. Even if you've already sewn the lower front part together, if you're hand-sewing, it's a trivial matter to add or remove a few stitches after you've marked your eyelets or even after you've sewn them. If you're machine-sewing, you might have to make that adjustment by hand -- but of course the medieval seamstress wouldn't have had that consideration, and the style developed using medieval techniques as parameters, not modern ones. One of the nice things about spiral lacing is that it enables the sides to overlap, as the lace does not pass between the two garment edges; it "wraps" around them, turning them into a solid column. If that column includes the outer layer, the lining, and the seam allowances for both turned to the inside, and all that on each of two edges that overlap into a single stack, that makes a narrow line of eight layers of fabric wrapped around with a lace -- almost as strong as boning, but flexible, and it resists gapping. To encourage that overlap, I sew the center front seam with the overlap already in place, so that there isn't a pucker at the bottom of the laced area. And if the overlap is built into the bottom of the opening, it's very easy to continue the holes slightly past the point at which the opening is sewn shut. The point at which it changes from sewn-closed to laced-closed is invisible. > Now when thinking about it, I don't only make medieval dresses, I > make corsets and other garments of later periods where I use spiral > lacing. And there it's sometimes important to have the first and last > hole in the right place, so that's maybe why I'm making it all so > difficult:-) On a corset, bodice, or anything else where the lacing has to end at the end of the garment or at a waist seam, you definitely need to have the last hole at a certain place. I'd daresay, though, that for earlier garments, the holes may end up being a bit uneven in distance to accomplish that, reflecting a laxity in measuring. By the 18th or 19th century, I'd not be surprised to see them more precisely measured. And for the decorative sorts of lacings -- say, on a German or Italian Renaissance bodice, particularly the ones where a carefully arranged open front lacing is a design element -- I'd also expect the measurements to be more precise. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 14:23:34 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GINTie014838 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:23:34 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GINNSq015019 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:23:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GIKZFP087310 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:20:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GIKUgS014811; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:20:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.prismnet.com (smtp.prismnet.com [209.198.128.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GIKK2H014575 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:20:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from webmail.io.com (webmail.io.com [209.198.128.99]) by smtp.prismnet.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7GIKFp0058807 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:20:15 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from 63.145.104.192 (SquirrelMail authenticated user ches) by webmail.io.com with HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:20:15 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <5557.63.145.104.192.1155752415.squirrel@webmail.io.com> In-Reply-To: <006b01c6c157$a2149050$2f02a8c0@Duncan> References: <006b01c6c157$a2149050$2f02a8c0@Duncan> Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:20:15 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments From: "Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.1, clamav-milter version 0.88.1 on smtp.prismnet.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:23:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E3629B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO This may or may not be related but in research that someone recently put up on the web after her trip to England and allowed to handle primary source material she found that if the garments had precious metal in any form on them that the metal was removed. Hope that helps. It may not have been linen but a precious metal thread and it may have been removed. Not sure how they could test for it though. Chiara On Wed, August 16, 2006 12:15 pm, Ailith Mackintosh said: > Greetings. > > I have received a request for help: > > "It seems that in a lot of extant garments, the protein fibers > (wool and silk) have survived, while the plant fibers have not. We > can only > speculate that linen thread was used because there are stitching > holes and > no thread (and it seems unlikely that they would have pulled the > silk or > wool sewing thread out before tossing the rest in the trash). I was > hoping > you might be able to help me find some sort of documentation that I > can use > as a reference that explains how this works? It doesn't have to be > overly > technical." > > Right now I cannot get to my books and my brain is not working...so > I'm > turning to the best group of costuming/clothing/historians that I > can think > of. Can any of you help, please? > > Thanks so much. > > kate > Outgoing email scanned by Norton AntiVirus > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 15:48:33 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJmNrn017265 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:48:27 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GJlSuE026305 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:48:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJjeau003849 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:45:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJjYnn096472; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:45:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52107.mail.yahoo.com (web52107.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.110]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7GJjWjs096343 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:45:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Received: (qmail 11421 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Aug 2006 19:45:27 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=zwso6ORqOqi3cx3+eWuFsquKuvbo/TYtp1x3ScvQujPB1EHHNPzRBgxiWLAn20fEOyz9EM005ZBzeV6eafsWEKttwEyjCDVEBHFbhHWSfKSWVTzzKVarw5oKiL159RBDQpJju4J3gIhwh5ITwD4FEoAvf+mKiWkFi6d+czGqSN4= ; Message-ID: <20060816194527.11419.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [72.57.170.28] by web52107.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:45:27 PDT Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:45:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Kathy Page To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608161800.k7GI0Bpo095738@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7GJjWjs096343 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 577 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:48:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E37650.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I can give you an extant source where the linen thread DID survive - The Bocksten bog man. I have an in situ photograph of it, which is the only state it survived in. It disintegrated the moment they moved the textile. Wool sewing thread, if used in wool garments would likely full into place like The extant Irish Moy gown shows. I don't recall hearing of wool being sewn with silk though - I could likely be wrong, though. I would suspect that silk would cut the wool with the movement of the wearer. Kathy Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert(Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. Its never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 > "It seems that in a lot of extant garments, the protein fibers (wool > and silk) have survived, while the plant fibers have not. We can only > speculate that linen thread was used because there are stitching holes > and no thread (and it seems unlikely that they would have pulled the > silk or wool sewing thread out before tossing the rest in the trash). > I was hoping you might be able to help me find some sort of > documentation that I can use as a reference that explains how this > works? It doesn't have to be overly technical." I've seen this mentioned in a number of places but don't have a cite offhand. If I were to look for one, it would be in the Museum of London's "Textiles and Dress" book. Another possibility is Else Ostergard's "Woven Into the Earth," which mentions the paucity of linen survivals in Greenland; whether it discusses thread, I'm not sure. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 15:56:52 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJuq6i017841 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:56:52 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GJujFK002807 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:56:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJttxg005918 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:55:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJtq2d006794; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:55:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJtkLo006680 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:55:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7GJt8Lg000721 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:55:10 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060816122516.02726958@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:51:00 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: finding recent historical fabric (was Re: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian In-Reply-To: <44E3563D.8020500@uvm.edu> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:56:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E3787D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >Of course, what I would like is a replicator that would give me some of >that 1960s velour! I wish I could find some of that stuff. It's still around. Look in thrift stores that have fabric. These won't be the clean places like Goodwill, but I'm sure, if you do thrift stores at all, you know of a funky-junky thrift store or two. Yard sales, garage sales, and estate sales are also possible sources. Discount fabric stores are another possible sources. Some of them have the most amazing out-of-date stuff. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 15:57:02 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJv2PG017850 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:57:02 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GJus1o024773 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:56:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJt4eu005779 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:55:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJt2Ew005866; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:55:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [216.148.227.153]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJsvKG005681 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:55:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lauren.walker@comcast.net) Received: from [192.168.1.102] (c-24-61-47-3.hsd1.ma.comcast.net[24.61.47.3]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <20060816195452m13005upuhe>; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 19:54:52 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <20060816153113.20047.qmail@web35615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20060816153113.20047.qmail@web35615.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-Id: From: Lauren Walker Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:56:41 -0400 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:56:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E37886.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Aug 16, 2006, at 11:31 AM, Kahlara wrote: >> >> Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, >> like as >> they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years >> from >> now. > > So I should carefully preserve this old ratty bathrobe for > posterity?? Sorry, I couldn't resist! Absolutely. WITH the bunny slippers. Lauren M. Walker lauren.walker@comcast.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 17:12:19 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GLCFON020068 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:12:19 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GLC8Fd019497 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:12:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GLBFab019859 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:11:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GLB9Qm076777; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:11:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc3-s11.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc3-s11.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.211]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GLB4fZ076596 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:11:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from laswa@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.168.19]) by bay0-omc3-s11.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:10:57 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:10:57 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.168.200 by by113fd.bay113.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:10:54 GMT X-Originating-IP: [69.215.144.216] X-Originating-Email: [laswa@hotmail.com] X-Sender: laswa@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <20060816172621.58321.qmail@web37501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> From: "zelda crusher" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] formula for spiral lacing Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:10:54 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Aug 2006 21:10:57.0488 (UTC) FILETIME=[77AFBD00:01C6C178] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 17:12:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E38A28.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I always thought this site said it all. http://www.festiveattyre.com/research/lacing/lacing.html > Well, I make a larger distance between the holes, at least 1inch, so if >I started marking the holes from the top to the bottom, in the bottom there >might be an either too small or too large distance from the center front >seam. That wouldn't, I guess, look very good. So that's why I first mark >the first and last hole, then measure the distance, say how many holes I >want (to make approx. the distance between them I want) and calculate the >exact distance between the holes. I admit, it really sounds complicated, >but for me it's not and I'm sure that the last hole will be in the right >place. > By the way, the making of that formula didn't take me more than 5 >minutes, I just wondered a bit about how do I actually calculate it and put >it into a formula. > > But if you place holes even under the center front seam (that means the >holes are in place where there is no opening any more, did I get that >right?), then your method is surely easier. I actually never even thought >about placing the holes there. I never had the chance to go to a museum >where I could see a dress with spiral lacing clearly in detail. So that's >why I didn't even think about it:-)) > Now when thinking about it, I don't only make medieval dresses, I make >corsets and other garments of later periods where I use spiral lacing. And >there it's sometimes important to have the first and last hole in the right >place, so that's maybe why I'm making it all so difficult:-) > > "Something I do before I start all of this: I baste a line down each >edge, exactly 1/2 or 5/8 inch from the edge and parallel to it. When I mark >my eyelets, my marking lines cross the basting line, forming a + . The >eyelets go on those intersections. The basting helps keep the lining and >the main fabric from getting off-kilter while I sew the eyelets. I remove >the basting after the eyelets are sewn." > > I do that, too. > > Zuzana > > >--------------------------------- >Do you Yahoo!? > Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 18:00:23 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GM0Mjv020933 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:00:22 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GM0FoV001204 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:00:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GLxewJ028232 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:59:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GLxYKi021296; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:59:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf2.socket.net (mail.socket.net [216.106.88.39]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GLxTlZ021218 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:59:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf2.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 68F4D34831 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 16:59:28 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historic Costume" Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 16:59:38 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7GLxTlZ021218 Subject: [h-cost] Robin FW: Your French costume X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:00:20 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E3956F.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Your email address returned my reply. De -----Original Message----- The event is in Standing Stones/Columbia. I'm with Amlesmore but we are doing the inn and assisting as SS had a major portion of their active membership graduate/move and many are in their Highness' entourage. I am not interested in this period as I am overweight and do like the thought of form fitting garments on my form. :P But majority of both Shires seem to gravitate to the period and so to help with the ambiance of the events and future events, I need to make some late 1300s/early 1400s garments. With the men's I just need to find time to get someone to help fit the hosen. I will be using linen blends as wool is hard to come by around here and when it comes by I don't have the money for it (sigh). Thank you for the help. I have looked at the site you gave me earlier and have a rough idea of what I will be making. "The Hunt" was written in 1390s but the illustrations were created in the 1400s. So yes I guess since the event is loosely based that I can swing over to the 1400s and look at the houppelandes. :) De PS. I have found myself looking into Burgundian and Samotigitian fashions of the mid to late 1400s. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 18:06:29 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GM6THE021527 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:06:29 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GM6NfC002900 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:06:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHMuLK076835 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:22:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHMlKK058848; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:22:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GHMSeT058506 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 11:22:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GDP66-0000Vb-Kw; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:22:30 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:22:30 -0400 Message-ID: <20060816132230.dwf6v1lhk0gg4k08@www.goldsword.com> Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:22:30 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian References: <200608161557.LAA02249@victory.concentric.com> <44E34469.7000507@reddawn.net> In-Reply-To: <44E34469.7000507@reddawn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.0.3) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:06:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E396DF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting Dawn : > > After looking at how some folks today build their 'historical' > costumes, I expect to see 3pc suits made out of denim, My husband still has a 3-piece suit made out of denim ... My son wears it now ..... (but not with a grunge flannel shirt ...) Susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 18:16:59 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GMGnw9021852 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:16:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GMFpU9028869 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:16:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GMEsIu030784 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 16:14:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GMEl5p034508; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 16:14:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web26513.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (web26513.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.146.177.60]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7GMEddU034349 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 16:14:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lenastrid@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 68630 invoked by uid 60001); 16 Aug 2006 22:14:33 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=IbD3evZY/YSvjLD4I5xgNiSegfvjgi0NU2U/T1BosTIGhPqv3PSdOkC7hFobGWCnWfMKAEp/CuLr5xyNUJhMgbwWJi7UE1E2GipSIc2mWnpAtCWexsVnxjzPmY44TDXIL1Bb9yXzcAbF9/zkohQOaVamfwUw33MNS1I5fmrtCnA= ; Message-ID: <20060816221433.68628.qmail@web26513.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [82.163.122.133] by web26513.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:14:33 BST Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:14:33 +0100 (BST) From: Lena Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <006b01c6c157$a2149050$2f02a8c0@Duncan> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:16:34 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E39917.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO --- Ailith Mackintosh wrote: > Greetings. > > I have received a request for help: > > "It seems that in a lot of extant garments, the > protein fibers > (wool and silk) have survived, while the plant > fibers have not. We can only > speculate that linen thread was used because there > are stitching holes and > no thread (and it seems unlikely that they would > have pulled the silk or > wool sewing thread out before tossing the rest in > the trash). I was hoping > you might be able to help me find some sort of > documentation that I can use > as a reference that explains how this works? It > doesn't have to be overly > technical." > > Right now I cannot get to my books and my brain is > not working...so I'm > turning to the best group of > costuming/clothing/historians that I can think > of. Can any of you help, please? Quoting "Museum of London: Textiles and clothing", page 2: "...surviving textiles are biased by the types of deposit in which they are preserved. They occur most frequently where anaerobic conditions prevail, along the Thames waterfront, for example, and occasionally in cesspits. These acid conditions have the effect of causing cellulose fibres to break down very rapidly, particularly through fungal attack, and linen is, therefore, poorly represented." Hope this helps, Lena ___________________________________________________________ Inbox full of spam? Get leading spam protection and 1GB storage with All New Yahoo! Mail. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 18:41:37 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GMfbg1022386 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:41:37 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7GMfU3O010073 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:41:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GMf2vc035046 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 16:41:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GMevKU055799; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 16:40:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (mail.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GMej2q055569 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 16:40:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.156] (pm5-156.eos.net [205.133.149.156]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id k7GMedHK018751 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:40:40 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:25:38 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200608161800.k7GI0Bpp095738@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: formula for spiral lacing X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:41:34 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E39F1A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Zuzana wrote: > Well, I make a larger distance between the holes, at least 1inch, so if I > started marking the holes from the top to the bottom, in the bottom there > might be an either too small or too large distance from the center front seam. > That wouldn't, I guess, look very good. So that's why I first mark the first > and last hole, then measure the distance, say how many holes I want (to make > approx. the distance between them I want) and calculate the exact distance > between the holes. I admit, it really sounds complicated, but for me it's not > and I'm sure that the last hole will be in the right place. I am not that precise. I mark them about an inch apart, and if I am too far from the seam at the bottom I smoosh them a little closer. IMHO, nobody is really checking how even the lacing holes are there. However, I am not a precise sewer. I have a friend whose every seam is absolutely perfect and I'm sure she would love your formula! Zuzana also wrote: "Something I do before I start all of this: I baste a line down each edge, exactly 1/2 or 5/8 inch from the edge and parallel to it. When I mark my eyelets, my marking lines cross the basting line, forming a + . The eyelets go on those intersections. The basting helps keep the lining and the main fabric from getting off-kilter while I sew the eyelets. I remove the basting after the eyelets are sewn." ACK! Way too much work. I would never DREAM of basting a line down each edge. I mark the holes with dots, in chalk. But then, I do the eyelets by machine and sort of wing them as very short button holes (I don't have an eyelet attachment). I have only so much time to sew, and I take shortcuts when I can. But I admire precision in others! Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 23:08:51 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H38l5F028447 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:08:51 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H38el2005977 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:08:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H381EC077550 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:08:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H37saC050795; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:07:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GIStJP022290 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:29:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA02299 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:08:06 -0500 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:08:06 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments In-Reply-To: <5557.63.145.104.192.1155752415.squirrel@webmail.io.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:08:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E3DDB8.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wed, 16 Aug 2006, Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio wrote: > It may not have been linen but a precious metal thread and it may have > been removed. Not sure how they could test for it though. I have never heard of any instances in which precious metal thread is used for structural seams. Even in embroidery, precious metal thread is typically couched (laid on top of the fabric and held down with stitching of a non-metal thread), as the act of repeatedly passing the metal thread through fabric tends to strip the metal wrapping off the thread core. My knowledge is limited, and strictly medieval in any case. I'd be curious whether anyone knows of examples of metal thread used for seams. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 23:09:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H39sLs028477 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:09:54 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H39mOh013483 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:09:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H39V5a077741 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:09:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H39U5o051827; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:09:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJtsjc006835 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:55:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7GJt8Le000721 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:55:09 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060816120233.027188c8@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:22:47 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian In-Reply-To: <200608161557.LAA02249@victory.concentric.com> References: <200608151802.k7FI0iAb099089@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=18% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:09:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E3DDFC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >**I must have missed the first part of this. Who is Kate Greenaway? Kate Greenaway (Kate Greenaway medal for children's book illustration) was a children's book illustrator active in the 1880s, and a contemporary of Randolph Caldecot (Caldecot medal for children's picture books) and Walter Crane. Googling on her name finds: http://www.ortakales.com/illustrators/Greenaway.html bio http://www.geocities.com/loveillust/kg/kgreenaway.html images I have reprints of her Pied Piper of Hamlyn, Language of Flowers, and probably several others I can't recall at the moment. All her illustrations show reproducible costumes, which is lots of fun. >(My personal favorite one-period-interprets-another is the early 1920s >doing American colonial 1770s, complete with the dropped early-20s >waist. I actively collect examples of this.) > >**Can you put this up in files or on your website? I'd love to see >this. What a scream. I'll see what I can do. I think they are all in storage at the moment. > > Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, like as > > they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 years > from now. > >**I do. I think about what a reenactor from the future might wear to >portray the turn of the century. Maybe Levis and T-shirts for both men >and women. (Hmmm...how could those folks tell men from women back >then. And both men and women could have any length hair. Weird ;-) Think about it: Men's hairstyles and women's hairstyles are somewhat different for the same length of hair, and the shoes will be different too, not to mention a slight possible difference in the cut of the t-shirt. A bad costume book, 100 years from now, will document this whole look in one image, and a good one will catch the subtle differences. Hollywood will still probably do it wrong... CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 23:23:52 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3NpR2028731 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:23:51 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H3NjGh017221 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:23:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3N3BW079930 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:23:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3N1o7060715; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:23:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3Mv0U060619 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:22:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 607527501D for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:22:52 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44E3E113.7000509@reddawn.net> Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:22:59 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] thread offer X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:23:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E3E141.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I received an email this morning from someone who has some things to give away for the price of postage. "I have just finished sorting and organizing all her quilting fabric, tools, books and thread. ... Do you have any suggestions as to giving away the quilting thread? In addition there is a collection of antique thread from my great grandmother. It is from the early 1900's. She was a commercial seamstress and made the clothes for most of the family back then. Is antique thread ever used for decorative stitching or used in restoration? I would be happy to pass it along to someone or an organization that could use it. " Email me if you are interested. First come, first served. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 23:34:35 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3YY2B028926 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:34:34 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H3YSfc016658 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:34:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3Xw7a081286 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:33:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3XtI4067147; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:33:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s39.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s39.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.175]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3XnjL067033 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:33:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from luann_mason@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.161.91]) by bay0-omc2-s39.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 20:33:44 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 20:33:44 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 71.32.249.108 by BAY106-DAV19.phx.gbl with DAV; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 03:33:39 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [71.32.249.108] X-Originating-Email: [luann_mason@msn.com] X-Sender: luann_mason@msn.com From: "LuAnn Mason" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: favorite one-period-interprets-another Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 20:34:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 9 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V9.20.0029.3000 Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 20:34:57 -0700 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Aug 2006 03:33:44.0262 (UTC) FILETIME=[F0F35660:01C6C1AD] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:34:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E3E3C4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id k7H3YY2B028926 Status: RO Oh, fun. I have a "Centennial Dress" from the 1870's that's a really interesting take on quasi-Colonial. I'm still trying to figure out what they were doing with the flat-fronted skirt that has some really odd seams to make quasi-panniers, and the bias-wrapped elbow-triangles are a hoot. LuAnn in WA ----- Original Message ----- From: Cin To: h-cost Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 12:32 PM Subject: [h-cost] re: favorite one-period-interprets-another >From: Julie > >(My personal favorite one-period-interprets-another is the early 1920s >doing American colonial 1770s, complete with the dropped early-20s >waist. I actively collect examples of this.) oooh fun topic! I'd like to offer one of our California contenders. In one of the California Missions, there is a fashionable Madonna. Now these missions were established by Spanish Catholic missionaries, over the approximate period 1776-1820s for the most part. One of the delightful Madonnas wears her traditional blue robe... with panniers. I believe it's at Mission La Purissima. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 23:42:57 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3gvjY029082 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:42:57 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H3gpTD018427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:42:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3gTH9082300 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:42:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3gSYa072110; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:42:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [216.148.227.153]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3gOKB072036 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:42:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from cheslaptop (c-24-1-85-230.hsd1.tx.comcast.net[24.1.85.230]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <20060817034219m13005pvtue>; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 03:42:19 +0000 Message-ID: <218d01c6c1af$23fa1f70$070ba8c0@CHESLAPTOP> From: "Chiara Francesca" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:32:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:42:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E3E5BB.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Button holes, that is what I was referring to more than seams. I totally misread that post then. I thought she was talking about the button holes. :( Yes, you are correct, they were couched for decoration. I also have never seen them used going through fabric or leather other than to anchor for lace cuffs an then it was the wire form not the thread form. My personal experience is only with gloves. If it was precious metal, it was couched or added in some similar fashion. Where I am extracting my thoughts from is this: http://medievalbeads.com/docs/items/12th-germie-parchement.html I chatted with her about the missing bits of thread and beads. She had some interesting comments based on the documentation that she read in books as well as with the textile experts in the area. I am certain that she could speak to this so much better than I about the removal of precious metal threads that were used for decoration. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 1:08 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments > > On Wed, 16 Aug 2006, Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio wrote: > >> It may not have been linen but a precious metal thread and it may have >> been removed. Not sure how they could test for it though. > > I have never heard of any instances in which precious metal thread is used > for structural seams. Even in embroidery, precious metal thread is > typically couched (laid on top of the fabric and held down with stitching > of a non-metal thread), as the act of repeatedly passing the metal thread > through fabric tends to strip the metal wrapping off the thread core. > > My knowledge is limited, and strictly medieval in any case. I'd be curious > whether anyone knows of examples of metal thread used for seams. > > --Robin > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 16 23:57:13 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3vCc7029277 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:57:12 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H3v6di021021 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:57:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3paCB083345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:51:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3pYfT077264; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:51:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.netspace.net.au (lightening.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.77]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H3pVCB077234 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:51:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from stilskin@netspace.net.au) Received: from localhost (webmail2.netspace.net.au [203.10.110.185]) by mail.netspace.net.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF4DD3759C1 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:51:29 +1000 (EST) Received: from 220-253-122-202.VIC.netspace.net.au (220-253-122-202.VIC.netspace.net.au [220.253.122.202]) by webmail.netspace.net.au (IMP) with HTTP for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:51:33 +1000 Message-ID: <1155786693.44e3e7c57b523@webmail.netspace.net.au> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:51:33 +1000 From: stilskin@netspace.net.au To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian References: <200608151802.k7FI0iAb099089@net.indra.com> <4.3.1.2.20060816120233.027188c8@mail.frys.com> In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20060816120233.027188c8@mail.frys.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2.1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:57:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E3E912.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO One of the best examples of illustrator/historian I know was during a series on fashion that I have on video (remember video, those things with all the good entertainment that will not fit into a DVD player?). Karl Lagerfeld sat with a sketchbook, describing fashion changes and trends and explaining them with terrific line drawings. If I can work out how to jam a video into the DVD machine and make it work, I will have another look and post the name of the series as, like all normal people, I did not label the tapes, -C. ------------------------------------------------------------ This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 00:07:22 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H47Mht029491 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:07:22 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H47GUZ026700 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:07:19 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H46s5V084844 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:06:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H46rdw085695; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:06:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H46lFw085644 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:06:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA03904 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:46:00 -0500 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:46:00 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments In-Reply-To: <218d01c6c1af$23fa1f70$070ba8c0@CHESLAPTOP> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:07:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E3EB74.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wed, 16 Aug 2006, Chiara Francesca wrote: > Button holes, that is what I was referring to more than seams. I > totally misread that post then. I thought she was talking about the > button holes. :( Yes, that would make a difference! > I am certain that she could speak to this so much better than I about the > removal of precious metal threads that were used for decoration. >From what I've read, the usual way of "removing" metal threads was actually to remove everything *but* the metal, by burning the item and retrieving the metal from the ashes. Countless embroidered garments, accessories, and furnishings have been burnt over the centuries by people seeking to reclaim the gold from the threads. (This is mentioned in passing in an article in the upcoming Medieval Clothing & Textiles 3, about vestments embroidered in Opus Anglicanum style, which involved much laid gold.) --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 00:09:01 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H48ucK029511 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:09:01 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H48o1P026995 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:08:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H48P0w085079 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:08:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H48Mdf086654; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:08:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm01.prodigy.net (ylpvm01-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H48JLN086614 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:08:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm01.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7H481OE017202 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:08:09 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060816210058.027329c0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:03:56 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: favorite one-period-interprets-another In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:08:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E3EBD2.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >Oh, fun. I have a "Centennial Dress" from the 1870's that's a really >interesting take on quasi-Colonial. I'm still trying to figure out what >they were doing with the flat-fronted skirt that has some really odd seams >to make quasi-panniers, and the bias-wrapped elbow-triangles are a hoot. Look in the 1870s, or later, for "Dolly Varden" costumes. I have an illustrated history of American theatre, from the 1860s to the 1960s (with some very interesting photos of people who got famous in the movies or TV later), and Dolly Varden was a play that kept getting revived. It seems you can always tell the decade the photo is from. Victorian Fancy Dress costumes are just as hoot-like. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 00:17:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4HpIw030101 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:17:51 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H4HjOX020043 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:17:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4HLWv086028 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:17:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4HKpb091336; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:17:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from onenetom20.sge.net (onenetom20.sge.net [152.91.1.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4HGKf091266 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:17:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Annette.Wilson@deh.gov.au) Received: from onenetvs15.sge.net (onenetvs-om.sge.net [152.91.1.17]) by onenetom20.sge.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64DF81D7705 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:17:08 +1000 (EST) Received: from onenetvs15.sge.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTP id 476EA27D96 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:17:08 +1000 (EST) Received: from onenetim2.sge.net (onenetim-vs.sge.net [152.91.1.9]) by onenetvs15.sge.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 362E41C580 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:17:08 +1000 (EST) Received: from iceberg.bar.gwy (iceberg.sge.net [152.91.9.131]) by onenetim2.sge.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 0762EC20B for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:17:08 +1000 (EST) Received: from proxy.ea.gov.au (mail-in.deh.bar.gwy [155.187.160.31]) by iceberg.bar.gwy with ESMTP id k7H4H7kJ014025 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:17:07 +1000 (EST) Received: from email-filter1 (email-filter1 [155.187.160.110]) by proxy.ea.gov.au (8.13.6/8.12.8) with ESMTP id k7H4H6Kt027919 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:17:06 +1000 (EST) Received: from act01excfelb1a.internal.govt ([155.187.66.20]) by email-filter1 with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:14:36 +1000 Received: from act02mf01.internal.govt ([155.187.12.21]) by act01excfelb1a.internal.govt with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:17:15 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 x-classification-fullclassification: SEC=UNCLASSIFIED: #:# x-classification-classification: 1 - SEC=UNCLASSIFIED x-classification-level1: SEC=UNCLASSIFIED x-classification-level2: x-titus-version: 2.41.0.1 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:15:21 +1000 Message-ID: <19FFF895B5F1524999BFB8C0ACCEA3CF500AB7@act02mf01.internal.govt> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: surviving linen [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED] Thread-Index: AcbBrRqzR03QqyVMSmCVq8jOZcZPmQABMN4A From: "Wilson, Annette" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Aug 2006 04:17:15.0171 (UTC) FILETIME=[052C6F30:01C6C1B4] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7H4HGKf091266 Subject: [h-cost] surviving linen [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED] X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:17:48 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E3EDE9.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thanks Lena for providing the quote. Quoting "Museum of London: Textiles and clothing", page 2: "...surviving textiles are biased by the types of deposit in which they are preserved. They occur most frequently where anaerobic conditions prevail, along the Thames waterfront, for example, and occasionally in cesspits. These acid conditions have the effect of causing cellulose fibres to break down very rapidly, particularly through fungal attack, and linen is, therefore, poorly represented." I think there is another reason why very little linen survives in any medieval context, and that is paper. Paper was made of rags. These days good quality rag paper is mostly cotton fibres, but in period linen was more common at least in northern Europe. People didn't need to throw away even the most worn pieces of linen, or offcuts, because it could all be recycled into paper (especially since it was usually not dyed). Soft worn linen was also sought for the making of those oft-quoted 30-layer jacks. On a side note, I have prepared a sample for one of these jacks, using a 10-year-old linen teatowel. The 32 layers, when quilted together, become a flexible, but impenetrable material which would provide good arrow portection. 32 layers of new linen is almost rigid, and very hard to sew. It would stop arrows, but it also stop you making a wearable garment :-) So the absence of thread in a seam may be due to linen thread having distintegrated, but the scarcity of linen in any deposits is, I think, because it was rarely dumped in the first place. Small or damaged pieces go to the paper mills, larger pieces can be used again, including in "armour" Annette Wilson If you have received this transmission in error please notify us immediately by return e-mail and delete all copies. If this e-mail or any attachments have been sent to you in error, that error does not constitute waiver of any confidentiality, privilege or copyright in respect of information in the e-mail or attachments. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 00:32:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4Wnpq030407 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:32:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H4WgIj032668 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:32:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4VUMd088021 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:31:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4VSgU098529; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:31:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-siberian.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-siberian.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.71]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4VNES098497 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:31:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from costumrs@radiks.net) Received: from user-12l236r.cable.mindspring.com ([69.81.12.219] helo=pierre-ynmjysj2.radiks.net) by pop-siberian.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GDZXN-0000ED-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:31:22 -0400 Message-Id: <6.2.3.4.2.20060816231030.03567e20@pop.radiks.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.3.4 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:18:39 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Pierre & Sandy Pettinger In-Reply-To: <200608161800.k7GI0Bpp095738@net.indra.com> References: <200608161800.k7GI0Bpp095738@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Clothing replicator X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:32:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E3F16A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 01:00 PM 8/16/2006, you wrote: >Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:30:37 -0400 >From: Hope Greenberg >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian > >Abel, Cynthia wrote: > > > And will in a century or so, be able to custom order our clothing via a > > "Star Trek" replicator? I know that one did food, but where did all the > > clothes come from? There had to be a clothing replicator on board. > >Yup, there was. That detail comes up in the original series in several >episodes. And even the replicator has fitting problems! In one episode >Dr. McCoy is delayed aboard when the replicator gives him the wrong size >gestapo boots. I don't recal explicit mentions of clothing replicators >in subsequent series, though. > >Of course, what I would like is a replicator that would give me some of >that 1960s velour! I wish I could find some of that stuff. > >- Hope In Deep Space Nine, an important secondary character was the Cardassian, Garak, who was a "simple tailor". Several episodes showed people being scanned for clothing, and there were some interesting things on display in his shop. Sandy "Those Who Fail To Learn History Are Doomed to Repeat It; Those Who Fail To Learn History Correctly -- Why They Are Simply Doomed. Achemdro'hm "The Illusion of Historical Fact" -- C.Y. 4971 Andromeda _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 00:49:08 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4n8HV030753 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:49:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H4n22e031698 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:49:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4mPSn090000 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:48:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H4mLXQ007171; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:48:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web35610.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web35610.mail.mud.yahoo.com [66.163.179.149]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7H4mHLR007110 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 22:48:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kahlara@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 3449 invoked by uid 60001); 17 Aug 2006 04:48:11 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=AyQwLoyPufkRe4XxL70lVLdS7sz8QyVJPwaHyxAV4I5dK8N9KFJbOYm4gsPS6YtvEx+FQmk90awB4M5aFG2eWw/tbOL05MobSWcrFlxvqtbmRgf9C6HUD2ebcF/NbGStFWgF1HWtbJd7oLFwo/X99igNFHaxDBZofw3du9Akahw= ; Message-ID: <20060817044811.3447.qmail@web35610.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [71.117.13.102] by web35610.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:48:11 PDT Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:48:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Kahlara To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608170323.k7H3NBwQ060844@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 00:49:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E3F53E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >Message: 6 >Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:56:41 -0400 >From: Lauren Walker >Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: illustrator vs fashion historian > > >On Aug 16, 2006, at 11:31 AM, Kahlara wrote: > >>> >>> Most people don't realize that what they're wearing right now, >>> like as >>> they're reading this e-mail, will be considered historical 100 >years >>> from >>> now. >> >> So I should carefully preserve this old ratty bathrobe for >> posterity?? Sorry, I couldn't resist! > >Absolutely. WITH the bunny slippers. > >Lauren M. Walker >lauren.walker@comcast.net Ack! I didn't realize I had a hidden web cam aimed at my feet!! LOL --------------------------------- Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 01:01:52 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H51p5h031190 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 01:01:51 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H51jsU006634 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 01:01:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H51KJU091430 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:01:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H51Fh0013703; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:01:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pne-smtpout2-sn1.fre.skanova.net (pne-smtpout2-sn1.fre.skanova.net [81.228.11.159]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H517ks013547 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 23:01:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from eva.andersson@comhem.se) Received: from dator1 (83.248.106.114) by pne-smtpout2-sn1.fre.skanova.net (7.2.075) id 44A135F100A4B022 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:01:02 +0200 From: "Eva Andersson" To: Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:13:12 +0200 Message-ID: <000801c6c1bb$d649be40$726af853@dator1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <200608170324.k7H3NBwR060844@net.indra.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7H517ks013547 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] SV: Thread in extant medieval garments X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 01:01:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E3F839.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The thread in the Bocksten Bog man's costume did NOT survive. It was therefore most likely either linen or hemp, both grown in Scandinavia at the time. All the thread was gone when they found it in 1936. This can be seen from the report/book from this time "Bockstensmannen och hans dräkt" edited by Margareta Nockert. It is now 70 years since the Bocksten man was found and for the last two years a research project has been running. I was the person doing the dress historical research and has thus had the opportunity to handle the garment as well as seeing all the original documentation photos. As for wool thread fulling and becoming almost invisible; that is not always the case. Some of the Herjolfsnes finds have quite visible thread. For sewing worsted yarn was often used, it is stronger and doesn't full. Oh, and I sew a lot of wool with silk thread, that is actually the way it was done in more recent times before the invention of polyester thread. It does not cut the wool fibres. /Eva I Andersson Message: 5 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:45:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Kathy Page Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 577 To: h-costume@indra.com Message-ID: <20060816194527.11419.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >I can give you an extant source where the linen thread DID survive - The Bocksten bog >man. I have an in situ photograph of it, which is the only state it survived in. >It disintegrated the moment they moved the textile. Wool sewing thread, if used in wool >garments would likely full into place like The extant Irish Moy gown shows. I don't >recall hearing of wool being sewn with silk though - I could likely be wrong, though. I >would suspect that silk would cut the wool with the movement of the wearer. Kathy Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert(Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. Its never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 02:21:52 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H6Lq8Y008569 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:21:52 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H6LjAZ015666 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:21:48 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H39E1n077696 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:09:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H39DDc051638; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:09:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com (nz-out-0102.google.com [64.233.162.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GJWmXr083635 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:32:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id 12so169504nzp for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:32:43 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=g5QvDUbdO7wjodzJwNbHuq27qdkG+z76ROnG7nSBxAOKgiKb53/K4/a4qikNioE3IonhUA61+RSKqJU7I6XceSgFO1m1HK4xlU2G9Cu1QR4SYdoGlN1b3EBHvm+a51AYcKN+9t/uy8el3G3HD+9Dc8taoSbZtfjpr4Nv7NF/tso= Received: by 10.65.139.9 with SMTP id r9mr1150922qbn; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:32:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.213.19 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:32:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:32:43 -0400 From: Cin To: h-cost MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] re: favorite one-period-interprets-another X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:21:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E40AF9.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >From: Julie >(My personal favorite one-period-interprets-another is the early 1920s >doing American colonial 1770s, complete with the dropped early-20s >waist. I actively collect examples of this.) oooh fun topic! I'd like to offer one of our California contenders. In one of the California Missions, there is a fashionable Madonna. Now these missions were established by Spanish Catholic missionaries, over the approximate period 1776-1820s for the most part. One of the delightful Madonnas wears her traditional blue robe... with panniers. I believe it's at Mission La Purissima. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 02:21:53 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H6Lq8a008569 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:21:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H6LjAb015666 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:21:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H38sYk077630 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:08:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H38rCw051368; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 21:08:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.202]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7GIs6f6045630 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 12:54:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from jaurbik@optonline.net) Received: from optonline.net (hamstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.10]) by mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <0J43003ZVTTJMJ20@mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:53:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [10.240.3.44] (Forwarded-For: [24.189.236.194]) by mstr3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mshttpd); Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:53:43 -0400 Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 14:53:43 -0400 From: jaurbik@optonline.net Subject: Re: [h-cost] In NY City August 25th - 27th? In-reply-to: To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Sun Java(tm) System Messenger Express 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal References: X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=11% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:21:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E40AF9.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I live right outside of NY city, but i will be in london when your in NY, too bad, I would have looved to join mesuem trips and such. jordana ----- Original Message ----- From: Saragrace Knauf Date: Monday, August 14, 2006 2:03 pm Subject: [h-cost] In NY City August 25th - 27th? > Anyone from the list going to be in NY City from the 25th through > the 27th? > I will be going to the various museums, shopping in the fabric > district etc > if anyone is interested! > > > Thanks, > > Sg > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 04:37:20 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H8bF07006722 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:37:19 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7H8b8Gp009585 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:37:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H8aHCU018286 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:36:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H8aBrN033519; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:36:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.wightman.on.ca (server01.gorrie.wightman.ca [216.110.227.151]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7H8a1Xr033427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 02:36:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix, from userid 99) id 149B084A7F; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:36:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from MAIN (unknown [216.110.230.37]) by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id C927F84A5D for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:35:54 -0400 (EDT) From: "Five Rivers Chapmanry" To: Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:35:57 -0400 Organization: Five Rivers Message-ID: <000201c6c1d8$2be28500$6400a8c0@MAIN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200608170323.k7H3NBwP060844@net.indra.com> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on server01.gorrie X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.8 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED=-2.82, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100 autolearn=disabled version=3.0.1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: metal thread (was Lack of thread in extant garments) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:37:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E42AB4.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Robin wrote: Even in embroidery, precious metal thread is typically couched (laid on top of the fabric and held down with stitching of a non-metal thread), as the act of repeatedly passing the metal thread through fabric tends to strip the metal wrapping off the thread core. This is partially correct, and partially not, Robin. :-) Wire threads such as plate, jaceron, facconnee, purl, torsade, are indeed couched, as to pass these through the cloth would damage the ground, and in some case destroy the integrity of the manufacture of the gold wire thread. There is no fibre core in any of these, and hence no foil to strip away. Passing thread, however, the most fragile of all the gold threads, and the most difficult to work, is as you say, a gold foil (lower grades have a copper core, laid with silver, laid with gold, while better grades have a silver core with gold) over a cotton (modern), linen or silk core (historic). These threads are called passing because they pass through the cloth, and if you have failed to pass the thread through between warp and weft, at just the right angle, working slowly, you will indeed strip away that delicate membrane of foil. This is long experience talking, as well as research. :-) Regards, Lorina Five Rivers Chapmanry purveyors of historical sewing patterns, quality hand-crafted cooperage, re-enactor and embroidery supplies, and more. 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 06:42:09 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HAg2LH001515 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 06:42:06 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HAfHBk012988 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 06:41:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HAeOuU031749 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:40:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HAeLnr097672; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:40:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mail.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HAeF4h097583 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:40:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.bec.231b8c5 (58677) for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 06:40:07 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 06:40:07 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: favorite one-period-interprets-another To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 06:41:47 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E447CD.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/16/2006 11:34:42 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, luann_mason@msn.com writes: I have a "Centennial Dress" from the 1870's that's a really interesting take on quasi-Colonial. I'm still trying to figure out what they were doing with the flat-fronted skirt that has some really odd seams to make quasi-panniers, and the bias-wrapped elbow-triangles are a hoot. What really drives costume historians crazy is the Centennial dresses that were re-made from real 18th century dresses. So you have that wonderful fabric remade, as one historian put it, as "Little Bo Peep." Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 07:12:08 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBC8VZ002095 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:12:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HBC1n9008882 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:12:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBBK8u036174 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:11:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBBIIZ015237; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:11:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m22.mail.aol.com (imo-m22.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBBBBD015116 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:11:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.517.599d786 (43932) for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:11:00 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <517.599d786.3215a8c4@aol.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:11:00 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:12:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E44F01.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/16/2006 11:10:07 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, kayta@frys.com writes: not to mention a slight possible difference in the cut of the t-shirt. And, at least around here, the fit of the jeans. Guys wear them ridiculously over-sized and baggy, and gals wear them ridiculously tight! No way to confuse the two. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 07:33:07 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBX4o0002482 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:33:04 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HBWwUT013670 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:33:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBWOhp038160 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:32:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBWM4C027019; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:32:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBWGgx026917 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:32:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.47]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 17 Aug 2006 12:32:10 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AQAAAJ7v40SBUYlHAgIHAgwHBh0 Received: from 88-107-115-154.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.115.154]:1719 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1GDg6c-000Du3-Cl for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:32:10 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060817122950.02629398@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:32:16 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian In-Reply-To: <517.599d786.3215a8c4@aol.com> References: <517.599d786.3215a8c4@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:33:02 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E453EA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 12:11 17/08/2006, you wrote: > >In a message dated 8/16/2006 11:10:07 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >kayta@frys.com writes: > >not to mention a slight possible difference in the cut of the t-shirt. > > >And, at least around here, the fit of the jeans. Guys wear them >ridiculously over-sized and baggy, And hanging half way down the *rse in London - I swear some of them will fall down as there is no waist and hips to stop them. >and gals wear them ridiculously tight! but showing builder's b*ms and thongs - lovely >No way to >confuse the two. > Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 07:50:30 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBoQjm002806 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:50:30 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HBoK43001553 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:50:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBnC2M040066 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:49:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBn7KF036935; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:49:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBn4f7036883 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:49:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA04647 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 06:28:18 -0500 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 06:28:18 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: metal thread (was Lack of thread in extant garments) In-Reply-To: <000201c6c1d8$2be28500$6400a8c0@MAIN> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:50:23 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E457FC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Thu, 17 Aug 2006, Five Rivers Chapmanry wrote: > Passing thread, however, the most fragile of all the gold > threads, and the most difficult to work, is as you say, a gold foil > (lower grades have a copper core, laid with silver, laid with gold, > while better grades have a silver core with gold) over a cotton > (modern), linen or silk core (historic). These threads are called > passing because they pass through the cloth, and if you have failed to > pass the thread through between warp and weft, at just the right > angle, working slowly, you will indeed strip away that delicate > membrane of foil. This is long experience talking, as well as > research. :-) Odd. The article I was just editing on Opus Anglicanum embroidery, written by someone who has handled a lot of surviving pieces, specifies that the thread was metal wrapped around a silk core, and always couched (which is consistent with what I had read earlier in other places). So that would be the opposite of what you describe above. However, as I mentioned earlier, my familiarity is strictly with medieval examples. Perhaps wrapped threads that pass through the cloth were later than that? Or was this a medieval practice in some particular types of styles/uses I'm not familiar with? Embroidery is not my specialty area, to I tend to know about certain styles only because I've worked with articles or projects about them, and my knowledge is completely lacking in others. (No argument that metal threads that are not wrapped would not be pulled through the cloth because of potential damage to the cloth.) --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 09:51:40 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HDpakl004955 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:51:40 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HDpTA8024676 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:51:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HDmtkC057541 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:48:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HDmpjj018068; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:48:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HCYL1d064636 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 06:34:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 73A44FAC02A for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:34:15 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001501c6c1f9$7591e170$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: metal thread (was Lack of thread in extant garments) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:34:18 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:51:33 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E47461.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi, I wondered about this also. I have used gold passing thread, but it is way two thick to embroider stitches with. I cauch it on the outlines i make, to embellish them more. Using couching silk to the gold. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 1:28 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: metal thread (was Lack of thread in extant garments) > > On Thu, 17 Aug 2006, Five Rivers Chapmanry wrote: > >> Passing thread, however, the most fragile of all the gold >> threads, and the most difficult to work, is as you say, a gold foil >> (lower grades have a copper core, laid with silver, laid with gold, >> while better grades have a silver core with gold) over a cotton >> (modern), linen or silk core (historic). These threads are called >> passing because they pass through the cloth, and if you have failed to >> pass the thread through between warp and weft, at just the right >> angle, working slowly, you will indeed strip away that delicate >> membrane of foil. This is long experience talking, as well as >> research. :-) > > Odd. The article I was just editing on Opus Anglicanum embroidery, written > by someone who has handled a lot of surviving pieces, specifies that the > thread was metal wrapped around a silk core, and always couched (which is > consistent with what I had read earlier in other places). So that would be > the opposite of what you describe above. However, as I mentioned earlier, > my familiarity is strictly with medieval examples. Perhaps wrapped threads > that pass through the cloth were later than that? Or was this a medieval > practice in some particular types of styles/uses I'm not familiar with? > Embroidery is not my specialty area, to I tend to know about certain > styles only because I've worked with articles or projects about them, and > my knowledge is completely lacking in others. > > (No argument that metal threads that are not wrapped would not be pulled > through the cloth because of potential damage to the cloth.) > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 09:52:23 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HDqFkR004983 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:52:15 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HDpHBL029054 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:52:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HDlldR056992 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:47:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HDlaDO016770; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:47:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.po.exetel.com.au (pecan-mail.exetel.com.au [220.233.0.8]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HBx28h042670 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:59:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from glendaslists@exemail.com.au) Received: from 249.88.233.220.exetel.com.au ([220.233.88.249] helo=mycomputer) by smtp.po.exetel.com.au with smtp (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1GDgWb-000428-ET for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:59:01 +1000 Message-ID: <08bf01c6c1f4$81468020$0202a8c0@mycomputer> From: "Glenda Robinson" To: "Historical Costume" References: <517.599d786.3215a8c4@aol.com> <7.0.1.0.2.20060817122950.02629398@suziclarke.co.uk> Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:49:40 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:52:00 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E47455.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I have a theory that there's a reason only boys wear them like this - the girls don't have the equipment to hold them up :-) Glenda. (my teenage boys are glad it's the style - both are very thin, and that's the way their trousers go anyway) ----- Original Message ----- >>And, at least around here, the fit of the jeans. Guys wear them >>ridiculously over-sized and baggy, > > And hanging half way down the *rse in London - I swear some of them will > fall down as there is no waist and hips to stop them. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 10:24:05 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HEO5EN005655 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:24:05 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HENuOc000382 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:24:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HEMmRI062484 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:22:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HEMkOY044113; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:22:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net (ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net [166.102.165.166]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HEMgta043981 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:22:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from bmatney@alltel.net) Received: from ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net ([162.40.179.60]) by ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060817142237.XQDB28894.ispmxmta05-srv.windstream.net@ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net> for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:22:37 -0500 Received: from emachine_T4155.alltel.net ([162.40.179.60]) by ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060817142236.ONLU8966.ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net@emachine_T4155.alltel.net> for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:22:36 -0500 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20060817091505.02d4f810@mail.alltel.net> X-Sender: bmatney@mail.alltel.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:22:31 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Beth and Bob Matney In-Reply-To: <200608171346.k7HDkgKM015984@net.indra.com> References: <200608171346.k7HDkgKM015984@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7HEMgta043981 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Thread in extant medieval garments X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:24:02 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E47BFC.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Eva, When and where will your work on this be published? Will it be available in English? Beth Matney At 08:46 AM 8/17/2006, you wrote: >Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 07:13:12 +0200 >From: "Eva Andersson" > >The thread in the Bocksten Bog man's costume did NOT survive. It was >therefore most likely either linen or hemp, both grown in Scandinavia at >the time. All the thread was gone when they found it in 1936. This can >be seen from the report/book from this time "Bockstensmannen och hans >dräkt" edited by Margareta Nockert. It is now 70 years since the >Bocksten man was found and for the last two years a research project has >been running. I was the person doing the dress historical research and >has thus had the opportunity to handle the garment as well as seeing all >the original documentation photos. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 11:20:52 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HFKfgZ006808 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:20:46 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HFJojU023544 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:20:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HFGJBC071535 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:16:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HFGEP3099239; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:16:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HFG4Vw099040 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:16:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m162.in-tch.com [216.166.191.162]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id k7HF4pQ29151 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:04:51 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <003101c6c211$2b559760$a2bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: metal thread (was Lack of thread in extant garments) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:24:00 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:20:30 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E48916.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I was under the impression (perhaps misinformed, and certainly relatively inexperienced) that a lot of opus anglicanum was couched with silk threads. Especially when done as "underside couching," which needs a stronger thread for the couching, but produces a remarkably flexible fabric. In "underside couching," according to my notes from my Linn Skinner workshop, you're couching your gold thread/cord onto a sturdy, but not too tightly-woven fabric. You come up in one spot, go over the gold bit, and go back down into the same hole, very carefully pulling on the gold so that it almost looks like a stitch done on a modern sewing machine. Repeating this creates a series of little hinges, making the embroidered areas more flexible. According to my notes, this technique was used primarily on garments in large areas, and not so much on small items or furnishings. Another medieval technique shows up in St Cuthbert's stole and manciple, which my notes label as the earliest Saxon embroideries. They're laid gold, mostly in red, on silk gauze, and the stitches on the back side loop into the previous row, forming a sort of fabric on the back side. And then, of course, there's all the later techniques--chipwork, and embroidery stitches that are not couching. I'm a bit familiar with them from studying Elizabethan stuff.... --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 5:28 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: metal thread (was Lack of thread in extant garments) > > On Thu, 17 Aug 2006, Five Rivers Chapmanry wrote: > > > Passing thread, however, the most fragile of all the gold > > threads, and the most difficult to work, is as you say, a gold foil > > (lower grades have a copper core, laid with silver, laid with gold, > > while better grades have a silver core with gold) over a cotton > > (modern), linen or silk core (historic). These threads are called > > passing because they pass through the cloth, and if you have failed to > > pass the thread through between warp and weft, at just the right > > angle, working slowly, you will indeed strip away that delicate > > membrane of foil. This is long experience talking, as well as > > research. :-) > > Odd. The article I was just editing on Opus Anglicanum embroidery, written > by someone who has handled a lot of surviving pieces, specifies that the > thread was metal wrapped around a silk core, and always couched (which is > consistent with what I had read earlier in other places). So that would be > the opposite of what you describe above. However, as I mentioned earlier, > my familiarity is strictly with medieval examples. Perhaps wrapped threads > that pass through the cloth were later than that? Or was this a medieval > practice in some particular types of styles/uses I'm not familiar with? > Embroidery is not my specialty area, to I tend to know about certain > styles only because I've worked with articles or projects about them, and > my knowledge is completely lacking in others. > > (No argument that metal threads that are not wrapped would not be pulled > through the cloth because of potential damage to the cloth.) > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 12:00:18 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HG0Iud007702 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:00:18 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HG0CLE003611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:00:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HExWxU068801 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:59:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HExREw083302; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:59:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HExN6n083232 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:59:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m162.in-tch.com [216.166.191.162]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id k7HEmCQ25269 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 08:48:13 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <001001c6c20e$d8733f40$a2bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20060816210058.027329c0@mail.frys.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: favorite one-period-interprets-another Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 09:07:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:00:15 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E4928C.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I've got a two-volume, illustrated set of Shakespeare's plays that's been in the family since the late-ish 1800s. The illustrations are priceless--famous actors of the day, wearing what they would have worn on stage in the various roles. A 19th century's version of 16th century stage clothing.... --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Kayta Barrows" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 10:03 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: favorite one-period-interprets-another > > >Oh, fun. I have a "Centennial Dress" from the 1870's that's a really > >interesting take on quasi-Colonial. I'm still trying to figure out what > >they were doing with the flat-fronted skirt that has some really odd seams > >to make quasi-panniers, and the bias-wrapped elbow-triangles are a hoot. > > Look in the 1870s, or later, for "Dolly Varden" costumes. I have an > illustrated history of American theatre, from the 1860s to the 1960s (with > some very interesting photos of people who got famous in the movies or TV > later), and Dolly Varden was a play that kept getting revived. It seems > you can always tell the decade the photo is from. > > Victorian Fancy Dress costumes are just as hoot-like. > > > CarolynKayta Barrows > dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian > www.FunStuft.com > > ///\\\\\ > ////-@@\\\ > (((( 7 ))) > )(( <> ))( > * ) ( * > /----\ /---\ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 14:52:22 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HIqI53011873 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:52:22 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HIqBjj001321 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:52:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HIoW6G022777 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:50:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HIoOdf021754; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:50:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from theseus.concentric.com (theseus.concentric.com [207.155.252.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HIoHo5021651 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:50:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from jtknits@jtknits.cts.com) Received: (www@localhost) by theseus.concentric.com id OAA10591; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:50:17 -0400 (EDT) [ConcentricHost SMTP Relay 1.17] Message-ID: <200608171850.OAA10591@theseus.concentric.com> From: Julie To: Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:50:17 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <200608171346.k7HDkgKN015984@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7HIoHo5021651 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] favorite one-period-interprets-another X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:52:15 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E4BADB.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO But I, and others of "mature" years do not wear my jeans ridiculously baggy or tight. Shoes seem to be the best giveaway to gender. Can you really tell me that you haven't seen someone whose gender you couldn't tell by their clothing? I'm not talking the folks walking in Hollywood purposely trying to confuse things. So, I still think that a future reenactor, particularly male, could be reasonably accurate from the 1950's in jeans and a t-shirt. Clear back to the 1850s if he wore a plain shirt, not unlike a man's shirt from Renaissance times and earlier . However, since that's not "pretty" wouldn't it be deemed beginner garb? Julie in San Diego with tongue firmly in cheek > > And, at least around here, the fit of the jeans. Guys wear them > ridiculously over-sized and baggy, and gals wear them ridiculously tight! No way to > confuse the two. > > Ann Wass > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 15:09:08 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJ98fg012328 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:09:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HJ92TX000929 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:09:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJ7i1n026373 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:07:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJ7flk038091; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:07:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HGDdlh060398 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:13:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA09081 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:52:30 -0500 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:52:24 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE: metal thread (was Lack of thread in extant garments) In-Reply-To: <003101c6c211$2b559760$a2bfa6d8@pavilion> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:09:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E4BECE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Thu, 17 Aug 2006, Sue Clemenger wrote: > I was under the impression (perhaps misinformed, and certainly > relatively inexperienced) that a lot of opus anglicanum was couched > with silk threads. Yes. That's what I described. > Especially when done as "underside couching," which > needs a stronger thread for the couching, but produces a remarkably > flexible fabric. In "underside couching," according to my notes from > my Linn Skinner workshop, you're couching your gold thread/cord onto a > sturdy, but not too tightly-woven fabric. You come up in one spot, go > over the gold bit, and go back down into the same hole, very carefully > pulling on the gold so that it almost looks like a stitch done on a > modern sewing machine. Yes again on technique, according to my author (again, I'm not an expert on this!), though she didn't say anything about flexibility. It does make an uninterrupted gold area, and even though a bit of the thread goes through the fabric at each stitch, the technique doesn't require the entire working length of the thread to pass repeatedly through the fabric. The comparison to a modern sewing machine stitch is apt; in essence the difference between the structure of couching and underside couching would be like machine stitching with two different bobbin tensions. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 15:11:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJBqF2012406 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:11:52 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HJBkVC001896 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:11:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJAwvj027160 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:10:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJAsNE041374; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:10:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm01.prodigy.net (ylpvm01-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HIeUem011126 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 12:40:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm01.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7HIePKR020898 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:40:26 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060817103856.034c14f8@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 10:51:11 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] illustrator vs fashion historian In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20060817122950.02629398@suziclarke.co.uk> References: <517.599d786.3215a8c4@aol.com> <517.599d786.3215a8c4@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:11:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E4BF72.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >>And, at least around here, the fit of the jeans. Guys wear them >>ridiculously over-sized and baggy, > >And hanging half way down the *rse in London - I swear some of them will >fall down as there is no waist and hips to stop them. > >>and gals wear them ridiculously tight! > >but showing builder's b*ms and thongs - lovely > >>No way to >>confuse the two. Notice also that different subsets of the jeans-wearing population wear them differently. Old Hippies might still want them embroidered where their kids want them machine embroidered (a recent trend). Construction crews want them with many pockets and maybe with paint on them. Punks want them with studs, paint, safety pins, and artificial rips. Kids into Grunge want more natural rips. Female kids into the sexy look might want rhinestones with the machine embroidery, while their male counterpart will want their jeans oversized and dragging on the ground, possibly with Rap logos or graffiti on them. Businessmen, on casual clothing days, want them really clean, maybe with cuffs. Cowboys, real or imagined, like them tight and with straight legs. 30-something women, and middle-aged women who weren't Hippies, don't necessarily want the Levi look with double-stitched seams done in orange thread. And the latest thing here (near San Francisco) seems to be jeans with the hems about a foot off the ground. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 15:22:56 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJMnqJ012686 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:22:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HJLtt8026794 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:22:34 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJLD6R029318 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:21:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJLBEN051246; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:21:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m27.mx.aol.com (imo-m27.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.8]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJL744051089 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:21:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AnnBWass@aol.com) Received: from AnnBWass@aol.com by imo-m27.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.3b5.58990a5 (29672) for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:20:56 -0400 (EDT) From: AnnBWass@aol.com Message-ID: <3b5.58990a5.32161b98@aol.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:20:56 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] favorite one-period-interprets-another To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:22:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E4C1D3.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/17/2006 2:53:06 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jtknits@jtknits.cts.com writes: But I, and others of "mature" years do not wear my jeans ridiculously baggy or tight. My husband and I, both of "mature" years, do not wear jeans at all. Ann Wass _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 15:37:14 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJb8Cb013043 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:37:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HJaNGd030505 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:36:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJZh6Z032220 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:35:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJZao2064431; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:35:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-6.dnv.wideopenwest.com (pop-6.dnv.wideopenwest.com [64.233.207.24]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HJZUc1064260 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 13:35:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mplumb@wideopenwest.com) Received: from [192.168.1.101] (d14-69-62-55.try.wideopenwest.com [69.14.55.62]) by pop-6.dnv.wideopenwest.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7HJZPK30092 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:35:25 -0500 Message-ID: <44E4C5C1.5030207@wideopenwest.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:38:41 -0400 From: Michelle Plumb User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (X11/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.87, clamav-milter version 0.87 on pop-6.dnv.wideopenwest.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] An interesting book find. X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:36:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E4C537.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hello, all. My spinning guild had its annual garage sale Saturday. You never know what you're going to find there. I dove into a pile of books looking for treasure, and came up with something interesting: English Domestic Needlework of the 16th, 17th and 18th Centuries, by Preston Remington, curator of the Metropolitan Museum of Art, published in 1945. All the photos are black and white, but the detail is very good. The verbal descriptions fill in the blanks. And it only cost me 2 dollars. I've been contemplating a 1680s-ish gown for a while, and there is a stunning example in the book: Late 17th century gray wool with brown and blue striped edged in red. Embroidered throughout in silver-gilt thread. The gown in complete, and the closeup of the embroidery is all the information I need. It's a monumental embroidery task, but would be well worth the effort. Michelle _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 16:07:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HK7iBx013926 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:07:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HK6nrc005628 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:07:29 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HK68mq038434 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:06:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HK64G1092546; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:06:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.23]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HK5to5092306 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:05:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-9.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.48]) by mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 17 Aug 2006 21:05:48 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AQAAAIVo5ESBUYlGCgMMBwYd Received: from 88-107-115-154.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.115.154]:3242 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-9.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1GDo71-000OpB-Pu for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:05:07 +0100 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060817210316.02644008@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:05:53 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] An interesting book find. In-Reply-To: <44E4C5C1.5030207@wideopenwest.com> References: <44E4C5C1.5030207@wideopenwest.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:07:29 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E4CC59.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 20:38 17/08/2006, you wrote: >Hello, all. > >My spinning guild had its annual garage sale Saturday. You never >know what you're going to find there. > >I dove into a pile of books looking for treasure, and came up with >something interesting: > >English Domestic Needlework of the 16th, 17th and 18th Centuries, by >Preston Remington, curator of the Metropolitan Museum of Art, >published in 1945. > >All the photos are black and white, but the detail is very >good. The verbal descriptions fill in the blanks. And it only cost >me 2 dollars. > >I've been contemplating a 1680s-ish gown for a while, and there is a >stunning example in the book: > >Late 17th century gray wool with brown and blue striped edged in >red. Embroidered throughout in silver-gilt thread. > >The gown in complete, and the closeup of the embroidery is all the >information I need. It's a monumental embroidery task, but would be >well worth the effort. Would this be the dress? It's a beautiful mantua in the costume collection at the Met. http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/eudr/hob_33.54a,b.htm Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 16:38:29 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HKcSmn014710 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:38:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HKcLXX023859 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:38:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HKbaGv044042 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:37:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HKbTcX019276; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:37:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-4.dnv.wideopenwest.com (pop-4.dnv.wideopenwest.com [64.233.207.9]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HKbIWV019029 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 14:37:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mplumb@wideopenwest.com) Received: from [192.168.1.101] (d14-69-62-55.try.wideopenwest.com [69.14.55.62]) by pop-4.dnv.wideopenwest.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id k7HKam1W006514 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:36:48 -0500 Message-ID: <44E4D434.2080407@wideopenwest.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:40:20 -0400 From: Michelle Plumb User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (X11/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] An interesting book find. References: <44E4C5C1.5030207@wideopenwest.com> <7.0.1.0.2.20060817210316.02644008@suziclarke.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20060817210316.02644008@suziclarke.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:38:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E4D3BD.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Yes, that's the dress! Thanks, Suzi. The color photo will help a lot. Michelle _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 17:19:02 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HLIvPd015791 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 17:19:01 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HLIpPO018615 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 17:18:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HLHsaa051278 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:17:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HLHh46054510; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:17:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.wightman.on.ca (server01.clifford.wightman.ca [216.110.227.141]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HLHYJQ054389 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:17:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix, from userid 99) id CD421D4441; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 17:17:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from MAIN (unknown [216.110.230.37]) by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37916D40E2 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 17:17:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "Five Rivers Chapmanry" To: Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 17:17:27 -0400 Organization: Five Rivers Message-ID: <000201c6c242$8d739470$6400a8c0@MAIN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 In-Reply-To: <200608171910.k7HJ9wDI040289@net.indra.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on server01.clifford X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.8 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED=-2.82, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100 autolearn=disabled version=3.0.1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7HLHYJQ054389 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: metal thread (loquacious) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 17:18:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E4DD3B.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Robin wrote: Odd. The article I was just editing on Opus Anglicanum embroidery, written by someone who has handled a lot of surviving pieces, specifies that the thread was metal wrapped around a silk core, and always couched (which is consistent with what I had read earlier in other places). So that would be the opposite of what you describe above Well, yes and no. :-) The author is, of course, completely correct. Opus Anglicanum is another whole techinique and body of work unto itself. I've done copious (oh, pun alert!) amounts of this style of embroidery. A cartoon is painted onto the ground. Then the passing thread is attached to the ground, with either end being stitched down, not couched, so that the entire cartoon is covered in gold thread and the cartoon is all but obscured. Then, with coloured silk threads, the cartoon is 'painted' in a somewhat needlepoint type of manner, couching over every two or three threads, depending on the detail required. The density of the silk threads is spread out to allow more and more gold to show through as the highlights of the subject approach, until whole expanses of gold thread are left exposed. The couching of the passing thread was done solely as a manner of achieving a painterly effect, which, in the end, became a means to an end for securing the passing thread in place. Cennini and later St. Aubin describe the processes of this technique, which is known as or nue, which literally translated means shaded gold. Apologies, there should be an accent over the 'e'. Passing thread, however, was and is also found in satin stitch and stem stitch on some garments during the medieval period, and then toward the Renaissance we find more and more use of passing thread in embroidery stitches, until we reach the Elizabethan, where we find some extant examples of gorgeous 'blackwork' done in passing thread on a black ground. There is a wonderful examples of silver passing thread having been used on a cerise doublet and breeches from around the 1500s (as I recall) cited in the book Restoration of Historical Embroideries, or some such title. (The book's in my studio in the loft on the third floor, and I'm on the main in my office and too tired to climb up to heaven.) What is even more fascinating is that the doublet and breeches were reworked into a chausable. As we progress into the Baroque, passing thread used in satin stitch reaches its zenith in garment embellishment, particularly on men's coats. This lavish use of gold and embroidery begins to diminish during the Regency, until it fades away into obscurity with the demise of the professional embroidery houses. Gold thread work is my fascination, my passion, and my nemesis. :-) If you're interested, in some of my work is on our website under Fine Art in the Catalogue, way down at the end under Gallery of Other Work. Although there are the four Celtic inspired embroideries near the beginning. Regards, Lorina Five Rivers Chapmanry purveyors of historical sewing patterns, quality hand-crafted cooperage, re-enactor and embroidery supplies, and more. 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 18:50:46 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HMoc6h019295 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:50:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7HMneMl007282 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:50:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HMmbhU066855 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:48:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HMmVOl038580; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:48:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm12.prodigy.net (ylpvm12-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.43]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7HMmQhH038502 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 16:48:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm12.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7HMmM6a031820 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:48:23 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060817154021.025f49e0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 15:48:03 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] favorite one-period-interprets-another In-Reply-To: <200608171850.OAA10591@theseus.concentric.com> References: <200608171346.k7HDkgKN015984@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:50:23 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E4F284.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > Shoes seem to be the best giveaway to gender. Can you really tell me > that you haven't seen someone whose gender you couldn't tell by their > clothing? Not from the front anyway. >So, I still think that a future reenactor, particularly male, could be >reasonably accurate from the 1950's in jeans and a t-shirt. Clear back to >the 1850s if he wore a plain shirt, not unlike a man's shirt from >Renaissance times and earlier . Hairstyle is another indicator, so from the neck down you might be right, but above that you won't be. (You knew that.) >However, since that's not "pretty" wouldn't it be deemed beginner garb? As it happens, I went round and round with one of my Victorian groups, where they actually thought Working Class was what you did till you could afford Middle Class. I, one of the costume resource people for that group, had been doing Working Class for years, with triple piping where appropriate on my Sunday best dress, etc. That year we attracted lots of Working Class Newbies who, at my instigation, did it just to have fun. And fun we had - at the expense of some of those same misguided Middle Class folks. Now, years later, some of those Working Class not-Newbies-anymore are still doing it, same reason. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 20:47:35 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I0lWo2024124 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:47:32 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7I0kk3l030156 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:47:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I0jpwZ084947 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:45:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I0jjWj019466; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:45:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web51307.mail.yahoo.com (web51307.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.38.173]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7I0jNXj019187 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 18:45:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from elvestoorder@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 23294 invoked by uid 60001); 18 Aug 2006 00:45:17 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=fkikjvdXYdrK8RCNWAczwm1DQCZkDwlklGaATCUtar/PTMFLcc7Y3++1ky7nRjuRBzI+Z0g7F6e/or40VKE1TyKPk1lx+tS6nbt7wkgfnmSBnqNElCI+9QFhAdDlvN5fstYtAspDXwr6Cr/PCUFL6XFMaqi97zdv/rdO3tO5Ol8= ; Message-ID: <20060818004517.23292.qmail@web51307.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [69.182.164.99] by web51307.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 17:45:17 PDT Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 17:45:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Ann Catelli Subject: Re: [h-cost] An interesting book find. To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <44E4C5C1.5030207@wideopenwest.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:47:17 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E50DF6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO --- Michelle Plumb wrote: > I've been contemplating a 1680s-ish gown for a > while, and there is a stunning example in the book: > > Late 17th century gray wool with brown and blue > striped edged in red. > Embroidered throughout in silver-gilt thread. > > The gown in complete, and the closeup of the > embroidery is all the > information I need. It's a monumental embroidery > task, but would be > well worth the effort. > Michelle The Met manteau. Oh, what a fabulous garment. I was fortunate enough to see it in person when it was on exhibit (the theme was around the seasons) at the Costume Institute. There was a catalog, but it lacked a different gown in the exhibit and I did not purchase it. The colors are richer in life than in any photo I'd ever seen of it. Not brighter or darker, but a difference in texture, I think. It is quite the task you've set for yourself, but I expect you can do it. Ann in CT __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? 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Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 22:10:22 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I2AD5e027334 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:10:17 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7I29Ro9012023 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:10:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I27ORa093476 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:07:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I24Qmk065240; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:05:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I21q9A063533 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:03:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7I2qXet009189 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:52:33 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] favorite one-period-interprets-another Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:15:44 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.1 References: <200608171850.OAA10591@theseus.concentric.com> In-Reply-To: <200608171850.OAA10591@theseus.concentric.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200608172115.45056.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:10:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E52157.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean Status: RO On Thursday 17 August 2006 2:50 pm, Julie wrote: > But I, and others of "mature" years do not wear my jeans ridiculously baggy > or tight. Shoes seem to be the best giveaway to gender. Can you really > tell me that you haven't seen someone whose gender you couldn't tell by > their clothing? I'm not talking the folks walking in Hollywood purposely > trying to confuse things. Absolutely. Today I saw a young person with a crewcut in an airplane terminal. The person was wearing a gray t-shirt, jeans, and (I think) what they call river sandals (a two-strap sandal, made for both men and women). I thought the person was male--till I took a second look and saw that she had discernible--and quite large!--breasts. > > So, I still think that a future reenactor, particularly male, could be > reasonably accurate from the 1950's in jeans and a t-shirt. Clear back to > the 1850s if he wore a plain shirt, not unlike a man's shirt from > Renaissance times and earlier . However, since that's not "pretty" > wouldn't it be deemed beginner garb? Julie in San Diego with tongue firmly > in cheek > > > And, at least around here, the fit of the jeans. Guys wear them > > ridiculously over-sized and baggy, and gals wear them ridiculously tight! True sometimes, but by no means always. I've seen many young women -- even slender ones--who wear their jeans with plenty of ease. I haven't typically seen men wear jeans tight, but I've seen plenty of people of both sexes who wear normal, close-to-the-body but not horrendously tight, jeans. In that case, it can be harder to tell the gender by body shape and clothing alone. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 22:41:14 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I2fDe1029617 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:41:13 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7I2f7PQ009637 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:41:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I2dXcp096540 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:39:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I2a01W085028; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:37:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web.vaxxine.com (web.vaxxine.com [209.5.212.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I2OHnY077488 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 20:25:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from alderweb@vaxxine.com) Received: from pc ([209.5.212.16]) by web.vaxxine.com (8.13.6/8.13.5) with SMTP id k7I2RHOM474870 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:27:18 -0400 (EDT) X-RCPT-To: Received: from ppp149.digi-t3.st-cath.niagara.net (alderweb@ppp149.digi-t3.st-cath.niagara.net [209.5.232.149]) by slipstream2 (SlipStream SP Server 4.0.193 built 2005/12/15 17:19:52 -0500 (EST)); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:20:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Originating-IP: [209.5.232.149] X-Originating-User: [alderweb] Message-ID: From: "david webb" To: "Historical Costume" References: <4.3.1.2.20060816210058.027329c0@mail.frys.com> <001001c6c20e$d8733f40$a2bfa6d8@pavilion> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 23:26:08 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Favorite one-period-interprets-another - Victor's book of the opera X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:41:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E528C3.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean Status: RO Has anyone else inherited the c. 1910's "Victor book of the opera" from their grandparents? I had the reputation of a bookworm as a child, so maybe someone else pawned it off on my parents for me. It includes heaps of photographs of Edwardian opera stars in costume, acting very hard for the camera. As I remember, some of the costumes are not too bad, but most are sooooo Edwardian- interpretations of the time periods of the various operas. As I remember (Lord knows where my copy is now) there were a lot of "Gibson Girl" interpretations of costume, still, - the pouch just above the waist and the outthrust butt. On the other hand, many of the male, as well as the female, singers are quite chunky (sturdy?), which is rather refreshing as our culture obsesses about obesity. Keep an eye out for it in second book stores - it's worth the purchase for amusement! Sheridan Alder _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 17 23:40:05 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I3dtKJ032339 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 23:39:59 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7I3d1g0027158 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 23:39:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I3b8iL004338 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:37:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I3aDqd024636; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:36:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I3a8uO024554 for ; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 21:36:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from claning@igc.org) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=igc.org; b=Wc5YHWPnVVQJABy10SmhuJkblM8Lr+dE0OsdsN/opfSiQmeQKxi4UH8gVuxNNUV4; h=Received:Mime-Version:X-Sender:Message-Id:In-Reply-To:References:Date:To:From:Subject:Content-Type:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.105.202.157] (helo=[172.16.1.11]) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1GDu8w-00057e-AK for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:31:30 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: claning@igc.org@pop.igc.org Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20060817103856.034c14f8@mail.frys.com> References: <517.599d786.3215a8c4@aol.com> <517.599d786.3215a8c4@aol.com> <4.3.1.2.20060817103856.034c14f8@mail.frys.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 19:31:23 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Chris Laning Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-ELNK-Trace: 295639c8be741617f84080ff3e30f22c72703f4378c94e4031808a293d7bea91350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.105.202.157 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Jeans (WAS: illustrator vs fashion historian) X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 17 Aug 2006 23:39:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44E53655.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Every so often the conversation comes around to a point where I feel like mentioning again Drea Leed's hilarious little essay on 21st-century "superwide" jeans -- a paper (to be) given at the CXII Interplanetary Costume Collegium, 2543 A.D. Her excellent Elizabethan Costuming site has moved since the last time I tried to access this article, and it isn't mentioned anywhere on her index page. But -- acting on a hunch of what its address might be -- I was delighted to find that presto! It's still there, right along with the rest of the site. It can now be found at: http://www.elizabethancostume.net/superwides.htm Enjoy. -- ____________________________________________________________ O Chris Laning - Davis, California + http://paternoster-row.org - http://paternosters.blogspot.com ____________________________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 04:54:46 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I8sdZn015166 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 04:54:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7I8sV4m015841 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 04:54:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I8rVj1043018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 02:53:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I8rQWq008941; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 02:53:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm29.prodigy.net (ylpvm29-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.60]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I8rIlV008895 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 02:53:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm29.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7I8qqYi027312 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 04:53:09 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060818014633.034a8088@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 01:49:35 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Favorite one-period-interprets-another - Victor's book of the opera In-Reply-To: References: <4.3.1.2.20060816210058.027329c0@mail.frys.com> <001001c6c20e$d8733f40$a2bfa6d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 04:54:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E58047.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >On the other hand, many of the male, as well as the female, singers are >quite chunky (sturdy?), which is rather refreshing as our culture obsesses >about obesity. I believe I heard, someplace, that Lillian Russel, the sexy young thing of the 1890s, weighed 175 pounds. Don't know how tall she was, but think Mae West. >Keep an eye out for it in second book stores - it's worth the purchase for >amusement! Thanx. I'll keep my eyes open. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 08:59:04 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ICwvGW009627 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:59:01 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7ICwp6r005111 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:58:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ICv9RG069636 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 06:57:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ICv5lr046678; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 06:57:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ICuxD3046627 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 06:57:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.243.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.243] helo=faucet.net) by pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GE3uE-00046f-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:56:58 -0400 Message-ID: <44E5C689.6090904@faucet.net> Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:54:17 -0500 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] re: favorite one-period-interprets-another References: <4.3.1.2.20060816210058.027329c0@mail.frys.com> <001001c6c20e$d8733f40$a2bfa6d8@pavilion> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:58:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E5B98B.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Sue Clemenger wrote: > I've got a two-volume, illustrated set of Shakespeare's plays that's been in > the family since the late-ish 1800s. The illustrations are > priceless--famous actors of the day, wearing what they would have worn on > stage in the various roles. A 19th century's version of 16th century stage > clothing.... > --Sue There are photos online of some turn of the century actors in costume at http://www.siue.edu/COSTUMES/actors/pics.html Only a few of them are truly hysterical, but it is an interesting collection of costume design from that period. Melanie Schuessler _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 09:53:26 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IDrO0r010735 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:53:24 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7IDrHGg029748 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:53:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IDqPk5076190 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 07:52:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IDqHSt085039; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 07:52:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm29.prodigy.net (ylpvm29-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.60]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I8r2D8008773 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 02:53:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.64.21] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-64-21.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.64.21]) by ylpvm29.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7I8qqYg027312 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 04:52:56 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060818014421.025dece0@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 01:45:50 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] favorite one-period-interprets-another In-Reply-To: <200608172115.45056.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <200608171850.OAA10591@theseus.concentric.com> <200608171850.OAA10591@theseus.concentric.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=5% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:53:21 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E5C64D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > > > And, at least around here, the fit of the jeans. Guys wear them > > > ridiculously over-sized and baggy, and gals wear them ridiculously tight! > >True sometimes, but by no means always. I've seen many young women -- even >slender ones--who wear their jeans with plenty of ease. I haven't typically >seen men wear jeans tight, but I've seen plenty of people of both sexes who >wear normal, close-to-the-body but not horrendously tight, jeans. In that >case, it can be harder to tell the gender by body shape and clothing alone. There are neighborhoods in San Francisco where some men wear horrendously tight jeans, and their "body shape" leaves very little to the imagination... CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 09:54:45 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IDsd2V010761 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:54:39 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7IDsXVh030120 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:54:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IDsA9r076455 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 07:54:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IDs8nd086564; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 07:54:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.23]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7I94xkg014942 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 03:05:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.47]) by mk-ironport-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 18 Aug 2006 10:04:45 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AQAAAFMf5USBUYlDAgIHAgwHBh0 Received: from 88-107-115-154.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.115.154]:1541 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1GE0HS-0004BX-Qw for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:04:42 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060818100143.02689748@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:04:47 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] Favorite one-period-interprets-another - Victor's book of the opera/Singers In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20060818014633.034a8088@mail.frys.com> References: <4.3.1.2.20060816210058.027329c0@mail.frys.com> <001001c6c20e$d8733f40$a2bfa6d8@pavilion> <4.3.1.2.20060818014633.034a8088@mail.frys.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=12% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:54:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E5C699.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 09:49 18/08/2006, you wrote: >>On the other hand, many of the male, as well as the female, singers are >>quite chunky (sturdy?), which is rather refreshing as our culture obsesses >>about obesity. > >I believe I heard, someplace, that Lillian Russel, the sexy young >thing of the 1890s, weighed 175 pounds. Don't know how tall she >was, but think Mae West. > >>Keep an eye out for it in second book stores - it's worth the purchase for >>amusement! I once saw aMadam Butterfly played by a woman of 5'10", strapping to say the least, with a large mono-bosom, and all of fifty, possibly older. Made a mockery of "my little Butterfly"!! (And Pinkerton should have retired about 10 years earlier, as he was not only in his sixties, but shorter than her, and as fat. Put me off Puccini forever! Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 10:28:26 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IESMeO011501 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:28:26 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7IESFVp005494 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:28:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IELt6B081837 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:21:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IELpWn008837; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:21:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IELk81008771 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:21:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 6140EA50021 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 16:21:44 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001901c6c2d1$a7da8ff0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <44E4C5C1.5030207@wideopenwest.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] An interesting book find. Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 16:21:54 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:28:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E5CE7F.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi Michelle, This is the Mantua from Cut of Womens Clothes by Norah Waugh. Its gorgeous, but what a work to make ;-( Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michelle Plumb" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 9:38 PM Subject: [h-cost] An interesting book find. > Hello, all. > > My spinning guild had its annual garage sale Saturday. You never know > what you're going to find there. > > I dove into a pile of books looking for treasure, and came up with > something interesting: > > English Domestic Needlework of the 16th, 17th and 18th Centuries, by > Preston Remington, curator of the Metropolitan Museum of Art, published in > 1945. > > All the photos are black and white, but the detail is very good. The > verbal descriptions fill in the blanks. And it only cost me 2 dollars. > > I've been contemplating a 1680s-ish gown for a while, and there is a > stunning example in the book: > > Late 17th century gray wool with brown and blue striped edged in red. > Embroidered throughout in silver-gilt thread. > > The gown in complete, and the closeup of the embroidery is all the > information I need. It's a monumental embroidery task, but would be well > worth the effort. > Michelle > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 10:38:44 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IEci9k011744 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:38:44 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7IEcbuK011090 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:38:41 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IEbPOm083955 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:37:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IEbLqV021232; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:37:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IEbGim021143 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 08:37:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id C140EA5002C for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 16:37:12 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <005f01c6c2d3$d1d9fcd0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 16:37:23 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] a question about couching gold X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 10:38:41 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E5D0EE.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I just wondered if any of you have some good advises regarding couching. I have used it in outlinings in my embroideries, and i have noticed, when i take it out of the frame, it has a little tendensy to gather the fabric slightly together. Is this because i use two big distance between each couching stitch? How can i avoid this? Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 11:07:56 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IF7ucx012408 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:07:56 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7IF7n9p017725 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:07:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IF7OXJ091571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:07:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IF7F5S048110; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:07:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net (pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net [207.69.200.28]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IF6i1N047705 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:06:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ruthanneb@mindspring.com) Received: from dialup-4.245.146.145.dial1.stamford1.level3.net ([4.245.146.145]) by pop04.mail.atl.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GE5vn-0006rP-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:06:43 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v609) In-Reply-To: <200608172115.45056.cathy@thyrsus.com> References: <200608171850.OAA10591@theseus.concentric.com> <200608172115.45056.cathy@thyrsus.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <8B61774E-2ECB-11DB-BB3C-0030656EBF34@mindspring.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ruth Anne Baumgartner Subject: Re: [h-cost] favorite one-period-interprets-another Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:09:28 -0400 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=10% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:07:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E5D7C5.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO If the two straps were parallel, you were probably looking at Birkenstocks, the Arizona model, possibly the single most popular sandal with Americans of both sexes between the ages of 25 and 70, and generally associated in the media with "liberals" and "tree-huggers." "River sandals" might be Teva sandals, which have a straight strap across the toes, a diagonal strap to the ankle, and, I believe, an ankle strap (my brother-in-law and sister wear those, but I haven't really looked closely at them, being a Birkenstock person myself). Some (not all) Tevas are made of waterproof materials. (The popular image of the Teva wearer is, I believe, "young outdoorsman" and Sierra Club.) --RA Baumgartner scholar gypsy and amateur costumer On Aug 17, 2006, at 9:15 PM, Catherine Olanich Raymond wrote: > > Today I saw a young person with a crewcut in an airplane terminal. > The person > was wearing a gray t-shirt, jeans, and (I think) what they call river > sandals > (a two-strap sandal, made for both men and women). > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 11:18:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IFIgr7012576 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:18:42 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7IFIaua025045 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:18:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IFHPiM093076 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:17:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IFHLSO057548; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:17:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pne-smtpout1-sn1.fre.skanova.net (pne-smtpout1-sn1.fre.skanova.net [81.228.11.98]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IFHA5A057304 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 09:17:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from eva.andersson@comhem.se) Received: from dator1 (83.248.106.114) by pne-smtpout1-sn1.fre.skanova.net (7.2.075) id 44A1364D00ADB7DE for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 17:17:05 +0200 From: "Eva Andersson" To: Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 17:30:09 +0200 Message-ID: <000401c6c2db$30ef3fd0$726af853@dator1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <200608181353.k7IDrMN3085866@net.indra.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Bocksten bog man research X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:18:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E5DA4C.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I recently got the question when my research on the Bocksten bog man's costume was going to be published. I'm sorry it ttok me acouple of days to answer, but my PhD-dissertation just arrived from the printer and I've been busy sendingit to libraries, other universities etc the last two days. (An abstract for the dissertation can be found here:http://web.comhem.se/~u41200125/abstract.htm). What I did concernign the Bocksten bog man was an unpublished report for the museum, which they used when they built the new exhibition. There will probably be a new book some time next year (and I'm doing my best to convince them to make an english version too), but nothing is decided yet (funding is of course an issue) Ev _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 13:27:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IHR68C015146 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 13:27:06 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7IHQxKB030128 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 13:27:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IHPtaM017432 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:25:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IHPkgo095615; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:25:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (mail.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IHPcU5095476 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 11:25:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.167] (pm5-167.eos.net [205.133.149.167]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id k7IHPIHK023258 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 13:25:29 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 13:10:01 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200608181353.k7IDrMN1085866@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Lillian Russell/Mae West X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 13:27:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E5F863.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I read recently that "studies" have shown that men, despite fads in different clothes and body types, steadily prefer women who had a waist-to-hip ratio 70%. The book said that whatever the shape or age of the woman (they used photos to test this) men consistently rate the ones with the hourglass figures as attractive. This was in a new book about body language -- a best seller I saw last week at someone's house. I don't know the title. FWIW -- Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 19:55:23 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7INtNIX023421 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:55:23 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7INtG1R030605 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:55:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7INql6Q089202 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 17:52:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7INqdRc048694; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 17:52:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mail.socket.net [216.106.88.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IIwTDw085763 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 12:58:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 5F4F9380E5 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 13:58:28 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] a question about couching gold Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 13:58:44 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 In-Reply-To: <005f01c6c2d3$d1d9fcd0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Importance: Normal X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:55:20 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E65364.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I have found that when I get that result I have too much tension with the couching thread. De -----Original Message----- I just wondered if any of you have some good advises regarding couching. I have used it in outlinings in my embroideries, and i have noticed, when i take it out of the frame, it has a little tendensy to gather the fabric slightly together. Is this because i use two big distance between each couching stitch? How can i avoid this? Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 19:57:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7INuxUi023443 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:56:59 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7INurQj031010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:56:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7INtCdg089543 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 17:55:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7INt9nP051706; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 17:55:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7IL7p5m010293 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 15:07:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from CynthiaAbel@creighton.edu) Received: from exbe01.blue.jays.creighton.edu (exbe01.creighton.edu [147.134.2.111]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_29774)/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA02299 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 16:07:51 -0500 (CDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: [h-cost] An interesting book find. Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 16:07:47 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] An interesting book find. Thread-Index: AcbC0p89ycNoQmw/RFiAYUjO3tClFwANNTZw From: "Abel, Cynthia" To: "Historical Costume" X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7IL7p5m010293 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:56:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E653C5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The September issue of Vogue is just out on newsstands and as well as being the usual massive Fall Fashion issue, it has Kirsten Dunst on the cover in full regalia as Marie Antoinette in the upcoming movie. There is a multipage spread on MA's life, which includes large and small pics of some of the actors as shot within the environs of Versailles. Costumes look pretty accurate, but since people behind the movie have already admitted they "updated" the look to appeal to the modern audience, it should be fun to play "separate fact from modern fantasy" while watching the film. Always a fun game to play while watching any historically-set film or TV show that is good or bad, especially bad. Of course Versailles will be a super-clean and sparkling that never existed in the 18th century. Well, historically-correct-wise, it can't be more "off" than the Norma Shearer "Marie Antoinette" There is also an excerpt from the upcoming book on Marie Antoinette's influence on fashion "What Marie Antoinette Wore to the Revolution" You can preorder it as I already have from B&N or Amazon. And there will also be a making of the movie book. There is a third spread with Dunst in several majorally fantastic fantasy fashions commissioned by Vogue from different top of the fashion house mountain denizens, again photographed around Versailles. Apparently, the original Marie Antoinette perfume has also been "reimagined" and produced by a tres famous French perfumer. If you have a mere $500 laying around doing rien, you can have the mere mortals edition. For $8,000+ you can grab the exclusive flacon for those with unlimited clothing funds from the treasury. Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 20:08:10 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J08AVv023720 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 20:08:10 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7J083ef032278 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 20:08:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J07Q9N090883 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 18:07:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J07NSx064011; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 18:07:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta10.adelphia.net (mta10.adelphia.net [68.168.78.202]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J07JCS063935 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 18:07:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from tgilbert737@adelphia.net) Received: from VAIO ([68.71.173.61]) by mta10.adelphia.net (InterMail vM.6.01.05.02 201-2131-123-102-20050715) with SMTP id <20060819000708.BSPL3509.mta10.adelphia.net@VAIO> for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 20:07:08 -0400 Message-ID: <126c01c6c323$691344e0$3dad4744@VAIO> From: "Gilbert" To: "Historical Costume" References: Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 20:07:07 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Introduction X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 20:08:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E65663.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I am a new member who has been lurking a few days. Wow, this is a great list! I am a historical novelist/stay-at-home-mom/costume enthusiast from Maine who is currently making an Empire gown, thanks to Janet Arnold. Other projects included a Spencer from the same volume (_Patterns of Fashion 1, Englishwomen's dresses and their construction, c 1660 - 1860_) and a c 1936 gown from Volume 2 of the series. I got inspired to dive into such projects because of a wonderful costume designer, Hilary Derby (or Darby--I can't quite remember) who created lovely costumes for the Theater at Monmouth, in Monmouth, Maine (the Shakespearian Theater of Maine). Thank you for letting me be a member of this list! Marjorie Marjorie Gilbert author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England www.marjoriegilbert.net Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 21:37:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J1b7XK025341 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 21:37:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7J1b05m018951 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 21:37:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J1aKH9007990 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:36:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J1aDsJ024231; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:36:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net (ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net [166.102.165.170]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J1a9vm024115 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 19:36:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from bmatney@alltel.net) Received: from ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net ([162.40.179.15]) by ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060819013603.CHYA3855.ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net@ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net> for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 20:36:03 -0500 Received: from emachine_T4155.alltel.net ([162.40.179.15]) by ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060819013603.TFKI8966.ispmxaamta04-gx.windstream.net@emachine_T4155.alltel.net> for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 20:36:03 -0500 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20060818202000.02c85cb0@mail.alltel.net> X-Sender: bmatney@mail.alltel.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 20:29:45 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Beth and Bob Matney Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bocksten bog man research In-Reply-To: <200608182351.k7INpaFd047505@net.indra.com> References: <200608182351.k7INpaFd047505@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 21:37:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E66B3C.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I look forward to seeing the Bocksten book. Please keep us informed as the project progresses.... and now I have to find a copy of your dissertation! Beth >Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 17:30:09 +0200 >From: "Eva Andersson" > >I recently got the question when my research on the Bocksten bog man's >costume was going to be published. I'm sorry it took me a couple of days >to answer, but my PhD-dissertation just arrived from the printer and >I've been busy sending it to libraries, other universities etc the last >two days. (An abstract for the dissertation can be found >here:http://web.comhem.se/~u41200125/abstract.htm. > What I did concerning the Bocksten bog man was an unpublished report >for the museum, which they used when they built the new exhibition. >There will probably be a new book some time next year (and I'm doing my >best to convince them to make an english version too), but nothing is >decided yet (funding is of course an issue) >Ev _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 18 23:15:19 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J3FIe3028004 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 23:15:19 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7J3F90E027980 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 23:15:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J3ESqQ017863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 21:14:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J3EMih083925; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 21:14:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-61.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7J3EKVl083867 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 21:14:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 521F3452D4 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2006 22:14:10 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44E68219.4030004@reddawn.net> Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2006 22:14:33 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Introduction References: <126c01c6c323$691344e0$3dad4744@VAIO> In-Reply-To: <126c01c6c323$691344e0$3dad4744@VAIO> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 18 Aug 2006 23:15:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E6823D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Gilbert wrote: > > I am a historical novelist/stay-at-home-mom/costume enthusiast from Maine > who is currently making an Empire gown, thanks to Janet Arnold. Other > projects included a Spencer from the same volume (_Patterns of Fashion 1, > Englishwomen's dresses and their construction, c 1660 - 1860_) and a c 1936 > gown from Volume 2 of the series. Mmmn, yummy! Be sure to show us pictures when you get finished! Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 19 11:53:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JFrhpp009687 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 11:53:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7JFrb8T021543 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 11:53:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JFqkUG096258 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 09:52:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JFqUK3029294; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 09:52:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web33901.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web33901.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.179]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7JFqPZo029180 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 09:52:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from wildthangstreasures@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 34280 invoked by uid 60001); 19 Aug 2006 15:52:20 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=k1yd46rbds6ZEhRWr7jEFG6iEVWe5VHY5PMnPiMXEnjbbvRVAj0RM4EPkPUG4rGEcD0hMZhENghlAZJXPcCmuCz8FeUrcjH3nz82X+2bv0xdv0piUPgkTvnE0xivc6AHQOFfMaZNx0VO9GENWnude5Kw3WoZfyDIysaNWGsALmg= ; Message-ID: <20060819155220.34278.qmail@web33901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.187.49.72] by web33901.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 08:52:20 PDT Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 08:52:20 -0700 (PDT) From: "Voncile W. Dudley" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Introduction To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <126c01c6c323$691344e0$3dad4744@VAIO> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 11:53:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E73401.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Welcome Marjorie. Lady Von http://www.wildthangstreasures.com Gilbert wrote: I am a new member who has been lurking a few days. Wow, this is a great list! I am a historical novelist/stay-at-home-mom/costume enthusiast from Maine who is currently making an Empire gown, thanks to Janet Arnold. Other projects included a Spencer from the same volume (_Patterns of Fashion 1, Englishwomen's dresses and their construction, c 1660 - 1860_) and a c 1936 gown from Volume 2 of the series. I got inspired to dive into such projects because of a wonderful costume designer, Hilary Derby (or Darby--I can't quite remember) who created lovely costumes for the Theater at Monmouth, in Monmouth, Maine (the Shakespearian Theater of Maine). Thank you for letting me be a member of this list! Marjorie Marjorie Gilbert author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England www.marjoriegilbert.net Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Lady Von http://www.wildthangstreasures.com --------------------------------- How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 19 14:41:57 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JIfuIO014151 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:41:57 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7JIfocP001041 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:41:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JIf0hJ019668 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 12:41:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JIeurU055221; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 12:40:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.wightman.on.ca (server01.gorrie.wightman.ca [216.110.227.151]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JIerW5055166 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 12:40:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lgsteph@wightman.ca) Received: by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix, from userid 99) id B7DA984AFE; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:40:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from MAIN (unknown [216.110.230.37]) by mail.wightman.on.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 828B284ADF for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:40:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Five Rivers Chapmanry" To: Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:40:53 -0400 Organization: Five Rivers Message-ID: <000601c6c3bf$00962e90$6400a8c0@MAIN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <200608182351.k7INpaFd047505@net.indra.com> X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on server01.gorrie X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.8 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED=-2.82, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100 autolearn=disabled version=3.0.1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7JIerW5055166 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE:a question about couching gold X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:41:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E75B6E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Bjarne wrote: I have used it in outlinings in my embroideries, and i have noticed, when i take it out of the frame, it has a little tendensy to gather the fabric slightly together. Is this because i use two big distance between each couching stitch? Your problem could be caused by several problems. 1. You're stretching your ground too tightly in the frame and consequently it puckers when released from tension, particularly around metal thread which isn't as elastic as textile. 2. As you surmise, your stitch length between couching stitches may be too long. About 5mm apart is long enough. 3. You may be pulling your couching stitches too tightly. Hope this is of some help. Regards, Lorina Five Rivers Chapmanry purveyors of historical sewing patterns, quality hand-crafted cooperage, re-enactor and embroidery supplies, and more. 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 19 16:18:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JKI79X015757 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:18:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7JKI05U026946 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:18:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JKHEaR030505 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:17:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JKH7u0022136; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:17:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s37.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s37.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.173]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JKH34M022057 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:17:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladycatalina@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.224.24]) by bay0-omc2-s37.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 13:16:58 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 13:16:58 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.224.200 by by105fd.bay105.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 20:16:56 GMT X-Originating-IP: [4.225.185.151] X-Originating-Email: [ladycatalina@hotmail.com] X-Sender: ladycatalina@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <200608191800.k7JI07YP024781@net.indra.com> From: "Catalina Elvira Osorio Lopez de Xerez" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 22:16:56 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Aug 2006 20:16:58.0107 (UTC) FILETIME=[6C1AACB0:01C6C3CC] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Renaisance doublet-practical solution X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:18:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E771F8.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The solution I have come up with for lacing sleeves on men's renaissance doublets is not quick, but it seems to last. I make 'tabs' with button holes the same fabric as the doublet and sew them on. I do the same thing to the sleeves. Then the fabric of the sleeve fits over the tabs on the doublet and the two are laced together. The tabs are hidden when the sleeves are on. Because they are the same fabric as the doublet, they are not obvious if the sleeves are removed. Catalina _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 19 18:43:45 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JMhjgQ018267 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:43:45 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7JMhcSE020044 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:43:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JMhA3P047219 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:43:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JMeJbK013360; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:40:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta11.adelphia.net (mta11.adelphia.net [68.168.78.205]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JMeDNg013208 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:40:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from tgilbert737@adelphia.net) Received: from VAIO ([68.71.173.61]) by mta11.adelphia.net (InterMail vM.6.01.05.02 201-2131-123-102-20050715) with SMTP id <20060819224008.PAEX28299.mta11.adelphia.net@VAIO> for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:40:08 -0400 Message-ID: <13bf01c6c3e0$6b046aa0$3dad4744@VAIO> From: "Gilbert" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060819155220.34278.qmail@web33901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Introduction Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:40:05 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:43:42 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E7941A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thank you! Marjorie Marjorie Gilbert author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England www.marjoriegilbert.net Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Voncile W. Dudley" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2006 11:52 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Introduction > Welcome Marjorie. > Lady Von > http://www.wildthangstreasures.com > > > Gilbert wrote: > I am a new member who has been lurking a few days. Wow, this is a great > list! > > I am a historical novelist/stay-at-home-mom/costume enthusiast from Maine > who is currently making an Empire gown, thanks to Janet Arnold. Other > projects included a Spencer from the same volume (_Patterns of Fashion 1, > Englishwomen's dresses and their construction, c 1660 - 1860_) and a c 1936 > gown from Volume 2 of the series. I got inspired to dive into such projects > because of a wonderful costume designer, Hilary Derby (or Darby--I can't > quite remember) who created lovely costumes for the Theater at Monmouth, in > Monmouth, Maine (the Shakespearian Theater of Maine). > > Thank you for letting me be a member of this list! > > Marjorie > > Marjorie Gilbert > author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England > www.marjoriegilbert.net > Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown > http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > > Lady Von > > http://www.wildthangstreasures.com > > > > --------------------------------- > How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 19 18:47:12 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JMlCvM018333 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:47:12 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7JMl56d020791 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:47:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JMkArP047568 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:46:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JMk95e018328; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:46:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta11.adelphia.net (mta11.adelphia.net [68.168.78.205]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7JMk3jf018251 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 16:46:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from tgilbert737@adelphia.net) Received: from VAIO ([68.71.173.61]) by mta11.adelphia.net (InterMail vM.6.01.05.02 201-2131-123-102-20050715) with SMTP id <20060819224558.PEGN28299.mta11.adelphia.net@VAIO> for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:45:58 -0400 Message-ID: <13d701c6c3e1$3b98b7c0$3dad4744@VAIO> From: "Gilbert" To: "Historical Costume" References: <126c01c6c323$691344e0$3dad4744@VAIO> <44E68219.4030004@reddawn.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Introduction Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:45:55 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 18:47:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E794E9.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > > I am a historical novelist/stay-at-home-mom/costume enthusiast from Maine > > who is currently making an Empire gown, thanks to Janet Arnold. Other > > projects included a Spencer from the same volume (_Patterns of Fashion 1, > > Englishwomen's dresses and their construction, c 1660 - 1860_) and a c 1936 > > gown from Volume 2 of the series. > > > Mmmn, yummy! Be sure to show us pictures when you get finished! > > > Dawn Will do! Marjorie Marjorie Gilbert author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England www.marjoriegilbert.net Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 19 23:19:31 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7K3JQ3E023042 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 23:19:31 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7K3JKvR001109 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 23:19:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7K3I6UL083475 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 21:18:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7K3Hxgi002395; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 21:18:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from carp.serverhost.net (carp.serverhost.net [216.71.32.15]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7K3Hs4W002257 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 21:17:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from althea@alfalfapress.com) Received: from [10.0.1.3] (c-24-21-156-164.hsd1.or.comcast.net [24.21.156.164]) by carp.serverhost.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7K3Hm728227 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 23:17:48 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <6E404828-3658-4C03-A8D9-4F76C7B3AEC1@alfalfapress.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed To: Historical Costume From: Althea Turner Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 20:17:44 -0700 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re-examining extant garments X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 23:19:23 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E7D4B8.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Greetings all, I know that in the last few years, there have been several finds re- examined with new interpretations coming from them. I can't recall which finds are the ones being re-examined. I am pretty sure that the "Arnegunde" garments are at German-en-Laye for re-conservation. Does anyone know which garments have been re-conserved and new things learned? Any publications on them? Thanks! Althea Turner althea@alfalfapress.com "Ignorant themselves of the forces of nature and wanting to have company in their ignorance, they don't want people to look into anything; they want us to believe like peasants and not ask the reasons behind things." William of Conches, 12th century _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 08:51:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KCprO6012729 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 08:51:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KCpl96015361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 08:51:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KCp2r7047718 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 06:51:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KCowOO041748; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 06:50:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52107.mail.yahoo.com (web52107.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.110]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7KCKpUW023664 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 06:20:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from caitlin_oduibhir@yahoo.ca) Received: (qmail 92472 invoked by uid 60001); 20 Aug 2006 12:20:46 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.ca; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=yZXdtwnoaTOmMKCK7WJsTcPiwmFT7S+gevCjerYywxskQF/J12MO0aXoKmMq1okGydVO/NyzmCeffZ/l0s8DG9bwbX0f5wp9HDCXaC4hBHGujN5SKQYM6dGpA6Vl9Rp0eu1EOfK/OGwGkLqbOTVaw+vFPV6vghF/qAZxGkErGlI= ; Message-ID: <20060820122046.92470.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [72.57.170.28] by web52107.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 05:20:46 PDT Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 05:20:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Kathy Page To: E List , Historical Costume List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7KCKpUW023664 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Useful Resource X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 08:51:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E85AE3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO When the itinerant textile/costume research folks are back from Pennsic, some might find this pdf useful: URL: http://www.textilemuseum.org/PDFs/Worldwidetextilecollections.pdf Description: The International Directory of Textile Collections has been compiled by members of staff and volunteers at the Arthur D. Jenkins Library at the Textile Museum in Washington, D.C. Compiled from the Library's resources, the directory lists "museums specializing in textiles, costumes, or rugs or museums listing them among their collections". Locations are listed in alphabetical order. Adobe Reader is required in order to view the document. Kathy/Cait. Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert(Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. Its never too late to be who you might have been. -George Eliot Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 11:54:57 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KFsqJO015766 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:54:56 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KFsj4k016376 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:54:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KFrcXn071944 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 09:53:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KFrNwN068303; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 09:53:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KFr34A067936 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 09:53:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:20394 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1GEpbh-0005mw-6J for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:53:01 -0500 Message-ID: <02a401c6c470$b5c14000$7e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060820122046.92470.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:52:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] OT: civil war experts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:54:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E885C5.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO For those of you involved in civil war costuming, I have a slightly odd request. Do you know any historians, professional or amateur, who know everything about Shiloh and events around the same time & area? See, for the past 15 years, I've had this very frustrating, completely impossible research project that I've been picking up every few years, and now that the internet has become such a useful research tool, I'm going to try to take it up again. Pardon me if my memory is fuzzy on the details, since it's been a while and I haven't looked back through my info. Anyway, in Friendship Cemetary, in Columbus, MS, there is a mysterious grave: it's among the CSA soldiers' grave, but is labeled only "Nurse Canant, CSA." To the knowledge of the history professor who assigned me this research project in the first place (the college-two-years-early boarding school I went to did a "Tales from the Crypt" event every year), no other woman was officially buried as though she were a soldier (not taking into account crossdressers) in any CSA graveyard. Obviously, there's an interesting story in there somewhere, but what on earth did she do to get that honor, and why didn't they know anything else about her? I researched her as best I could with local resources, and discovered that she would most likely have died in the battle of Shiloh, but was unable to find any Canants or Cannants in the area, or anything else of real use in solving the mystery. Hopefully some of you can understand why I can't let this go! A few years back, I did the rounds of the geneaology websites, with no luck, but I'm not giving up yet. -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 12:38:30 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KGcUEN016520 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:38:30 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KGcOsd009193 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:38:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KGbqIi078110 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:37:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KGbnRq003460; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:37:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s39.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s39.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.175]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KGbiCs003301 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:37:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from laswa@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.168.27]) by bay0-omc2-s39.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 09:37:37 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 09:37:37 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.168.200 by by113fd.bay113.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 16:37:33 GMT X-Originating-IP: [68.250.155.130] X-Originating-Email: [laswa@hotmail.com] X-Sender: laswa@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <02a401c6c470$b5c14000$7e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "zelda crusher" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: RE: [h-cost] OT: civil war experts Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 09:37:33 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Aug 2006 16:37:37.0047 (UTC) FILETIME=[F1EA0A70:01C6C476] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:38:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E89000.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At the risk of being obvious, are you sure that Nurse Canant was a female? Laurie, RN, BSN >From: "E House" >Reply-To: Historical Costume >To: "Historical Costume" >Subject: [h-cost] OT: civil war experts >Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:52:56 -0500 > >For those of you involved in civil war costuming, I have a slightly odd >request. Do you know any historians, professional or amateur, who know >everything about Shiloh and events around the same time & area? > >See, for the past 15 years, I've had this very frustrating, completely >impossible research project that I've been picking up every few years, and >now that the internet has become such a useful research tool, I'm going to >try to take it up again. Pardon me if my memory is fuzzy on the details, >since it's been a while and I haven't looked back through my info. Anyway, >in Friendship Cemetary, in Columbus, MS, there is a mysterious grave: it's >among the CSA soldiers' grave, but is labeled only "Nurse Canant, CSA." To >the knowledge of the history professor who assigned me this research >project in the first place (the college-two-years-early boarding school I >went to did a "Tales from the Crypt" event every year), no other woman was >officially buried as though she were a soldier (not taking into account >crossdressers) in any CSA graveyard. Obviously, there's an interesting >story in there somewhere, but what on earth did she do to get that honor, >and why didn't they know anything else about her? I researched her as best >I could with local resources, and discovered that she would most likely >have died in the battle of Shiloh, but was unable to find any Canants or >Cannants in the area, or anything else of real use in solving the mystery. > >Hopefully some of you can understand why I can't let this go! A few years >back, I did the rounds of the geneaology websites, with no luck, but I'm >not giving up yet. > >-E House > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 13:40:44 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KHeeW3017723 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:40:44 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KHeYDu028006 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:40:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KHdrIN085328 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:39:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KHdoSY047187; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:39:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from py-out-1112.google.com (py-out-1112.google.com [64.233.166.182]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KHdmsr047156 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:39:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from garbaholic@gmail.com) Received: by py-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id o67so2056098pye for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:39:48 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=t8khFwU0yNRAEfO3eOC+4h/VCBSK9kckh6wyyqZpWOSdRmXagAGftA0LchfigLp2+V1obBndSmt1ZeENZEqlP+DeYEU8hVly0bIs5jacqrc3GnpYrso7qv9qVNlMUiU0iARTb/WPRCUGLuUfP9Gbc95LPmA52fsXGU8NPWuih/U= Received: by 10.65.119.14 with SMTP id w14mr5750687qbm; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:39:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.189.19 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:39:48 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <870801590608201039v257d6820w947149ef4d182e28@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:39:48 -0500 From: "Alexandria Doyle" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: civil war experts In-Reply-To: <02a401c6c470$b5c14000$7e00a8c0@compaqub> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20060820122046.92470.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> <02a401c6c470$b5c14000$7e00a8c0@compaqub> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:40:37 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E89E92.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Just asked my historian/civil war buff roommate and he hadn't heard of her, but did a quick search on "nurse canant" on msn and came up with several hits, the first mentioning the marking of one grave marked "Mrs. Canant, volunteer nurse CSA" Alex On 8/20/06, E House wrote: > For those of you involved in civil war costuming, I have a slightly odd > request. Do you know any historians, professional or amateur, who know > everything about Shiloh and events around the same time & area? > > See, for the past 15 years, I've had this very frustrating, completely > impossible research project that I've been picking up every few years, and > now that the internet has become such a useful research tool, I'm going to > try to take it up again. Pardon me if my memory is fuzzy on the details, > since it's been a while and I haven't looked back through my info. Anyway, > in Friendship Cemetary, in Columbus, MS, there is a mysterious grave: it's > among the CSA soldiers' grave, but is labeled only "Nurse Canant, CSA." To > the knowledge of the history professor who assigned me this research project > in the first place (the college-two-years-early boarding school I went to > did a "Tales from the Crypt" event every year), no other woman was > officially buried as though she were a soldier (not taking into account > crossdressers) in any CSA graveyard. Obviously, there's an interesting > story in there somewhere, but what on earth did she do to get that honor, > and why didn't they know anything else about her? I researched her as best > I could with local resources, and discovered that she would most likely have > died in the battle of Shiloh, but was unable to find any Canants or Cannants > in the area, or anything else of real use in solving the mystery. > > Hopefully some of you can understand why I can't let this go! A few years > back, I did the rounds of the geneaology websites, with no luck, but I'm not > giving up yet. > > -E House > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 13:55:36 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KHta6i017957 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:55:36 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KHtTeG003261 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:55:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KHssBn087010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:54:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KHsqcQ057674; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:54:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KHsnDW057623 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:54:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id CB18BFAC03A for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 19:54:47 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001301c6c481$c72da340$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000601c6c3bf$00962e90$6400a8c0@MAIN> Subject: Re: [h-cost] RE:a question about couching gold Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 19:55:09 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:55:33 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E8A211.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hello, Thanks for the responses. I think in my case it could be that i pull the thread two much, ill have that in note next time. Many thanks Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Five Rivers Chapmanry" To: Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2006 8:40 PM Subject: [h-cost] RE:a question about couching gold > Bjarne wrote: > I have used it in outlinings in my embroideries, and i have noticed, when > i > take it out of the frame, it has a little tendensy to gather the fabric > slightly together. Is this because i use two big distance between each > couching stitch? > > Your problem could be caused by several problems. > > 1. You're stretching your ground too tightly in the frame and consequently > it puckers when released from tension, particularly around metal thread > which isn't as elastic as textile. > > 2. As you surmise, your stitch length between couching stitches may be too > long. About 5mm apart is long enough. > > 3. You may be pulling your couching stitches too tightly. > > Hope this is of some help. > > Regards, > Lorina > Five Rivers Chapmanry > purveyors of historical sewing patterns, quality hand-crafted cooperage, > re-enactor and embroidery supplies, and more. > 519-799-5577 info@5rivers.org - www.5rivers.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 14:07:41 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KI7fBt018181 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 14:07:41 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KI7Zi1007341 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 14:07:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KI74Z9088542 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:07:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KI73FN067007; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:07:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com (wx-out-0506.google.com [66.249.82.236]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KI712s066970 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:07:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from athurman@gmail.com) Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id s13so1255568wxc for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:07:00 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=krWEnRqVQoDJ/7i7elM6808R4d+UhYXbZ1A7A2/jjJUvGHbOrPeUNXlNQnZxZu+j41ESPNmSEzZopLFbNMe5ErKne/Mpvc45Mbtqoc6A5rxizI0smVuQRtq+rh+RXek3AdEtdv93SP9qIcA+ZgeS0C/mveaKE1kyL8Tm8Uc/JNk= Received: by 10.70.52.2 with SMTP id z2mr8266656wxz; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:07:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.70.78.3 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:07:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <7d21ac190608201107m5443d790qc037286e18b86c8a@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 14:07:00 -0400 From: "A. Thurman" To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7KI712s066970 Cc: h-costume@mail.indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Re: Useful Resource X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 14:07:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E8A4E7.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 05:20:46 -0700 (PDT) > From: Kathy Page > Subject: [h-cost] Useful Resource > To: E List , Historical Costume List > > Message-ID: <20060820122046.92470.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > > When the itinerant textile/costume research folks are back from Pennsic, some might find this pdf useful: > URL: http://www.textilemuseum.org/PDFs/Worldwidetextilecollections.pdf > > Description: The International Directory of Textile Collections has been compiled by members of staff and volunteers at the Arthur D. Jenkins Library at the Textile Museum in Washington, D.C. Compiled from the Library's resources, the directory lists "museums specializing in textiles, costumes, or rugs or museums listing them among their collections". Locations are listed in alphabetical order. Adobe Reader is required in order to view the document. Thank you for posting this! I'm going to download and hang on to. Also, for people in the U.S., there's a new guide put out by the Costume Society of America listing all clothing and textile collections: http://www.americasclosets.com/guide.htm > > Kathy/Cait. > > Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert(Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. > > Its never too late to be who you might have been. > -George Eliot > Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 > Allison T. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 15:04:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KJ42ZF019542 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:04:05 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KJ3uSV020490 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:03:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KJ2dOB095123 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:02:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KJ2X5a010572; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:02:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com (wx-out-0506.google.com [66.249.82.232]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KI71CR066969 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:07:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from athurman@gmail.com) Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i31so1332963wxd for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:07:00 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=krWEnRqVQoDJ/7i7elM6808R4d+UhYXbZ1A7A2/jjJUvGHbOrPeUNXlNQnZxZu+j41ESPNmSEzZopLFbNMe5ErKne/Mpvc45Mbtqoc6A5rxizI0smVuQRtq+rh+RXek3AdEtdv93SP9qIcA+ZgeS0C/mveaKE1kyL8Tm8Uc/JNk= Received: by 10.70.52.2 with SMTP id z2mr8266656wxz; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:07:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.70.78.3 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 11:07:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <7d21ac190608201107m5443d790qc037286e18b86c8a@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 14:07:00 -0400 From: "A. Thurman" To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 rep=7% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7KI71CR066969 Cc: h-costume@mail.indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Re: Useful Resource X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:04:00 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E8B21C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 05:20:46 -0700 (PDT) > From: Kathy Page > Subject: [h-cost] Useful Resource > To: E List , Historical Costume List > > Message-ID: <20060820122046.92470.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > > When the itinerant textile/costume research folks are back from Pennsic, some might find this pdf useful: > URL: http://www.textilemuseum.org/PDFs/Worldwidetextilecollections.pdf > > Description: The International Directory of Textile Collections has been compiled by members of staff and volunteers at the Arthur D. Jenkins Library at the Textile Museum in Washington, D.C. Compiled from the Library's resources, the directory lists "museums specializing in textiles, costumes, or rugs or museums listing them among their collections". Locations are listed in alphabetical order. Adobe Reader is required in order to view the document. Thank you for posting this! I'm going to download and hang on to. Also, for people in the U.S., there's a new guide put out by the Costume Society of America listing all clothing and textile collections: http://www.americasclosets.com/guide.htm > > Kathy/Cait. > > Ermine, a lion rampant tail nowed gules charged on the shoulder with a rose Or barbed, seeded, slipped and leaved vert(Fieldless) On a rose Or barbed vert a lion's head erased gules. > > Its never too late to be who you might have been. > -George Eliot > Tosach eólais imchomarc. - Questioning is the beginning of knowledge. http://www.sengoidelc.com/node/131 > Allison T. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 15:04:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KJ410Q019541 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:04:05 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KJ3srY028618 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:03:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KJ3ORB095271 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:03:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KJ3NeM011215; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:03:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from dithers.gower.net (dithers.gower.net [205.230.30.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KIGagF074379 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 12:16:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from vbetts@gower.net) Received: from gower.net (user-12.annex-02.tyler.tx.gower.net [208.218.191.63]) by dithers.gower.net (8.13.1/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7KIEaGH046239 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:14:50 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from vbetts@gower.net) Message-ID: <44E8A6BB.1040502@gower.net> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 13:15:23 -0500 From: Vicki Betts User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: civil war experts References: <20060820122046.92470.qmail@web52107.mail.yahoo.com> <02a401c6c470$b5c14000$7e00a8c0@compaqub> In-Reply-To: <02a401c6c470$b5c14000$7e00a8c0@compaqub> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:03:58 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E8B21A.006 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO She probably didn't die *in* the battle of Shiloh, but from an illness contracted while nursing in the Columbus, MS hospital (either military or private) after the battle of Shiloh. A number of women, in groups and singly, converged in northern Mississippi from across the South immediately after the battle, including the famous Kate Cumming of Mobile who left a journal. Therefore you are not just looking at local women. However, you are lucky in that Canant is such an uncommon name. Have you tried the 1860 and 1870 census search in Heritage Quest? There are no Canants listed in Mississippi, but there are three in Alabama, plus a few more in Georgia. What adult married women named Canant appeared in the 1860 census that did not appear anywhere (allowing for the large movement of people after the war) in the 1870 census? Then you may have to check out places like Tallapoosa County, Alabama, home of the widow Mary S. Canant, age 40, but with small children. Did she die during the war, or just remarry? It certainly won't be easy, but it looks like you've tried the more obvious places already. BTW, she did not appear in _Confederate Hospitals on the Move_, and I have not spotted her in my Southern newspaper research for the Civil War. To tie this back to costuming, the clothing of Northern Civil War nurses is explored in: Hoisington, Daniel. ‘Women of Discreet Manners’: Union Army Nurses and Their Attire.” Citizens’ Companion 4 no. 5 (December 1997-January 1998): 12-19. Vicki Betts E House wrote: > I researched her as best I could with local resources, and discovered > that she would most likely have died in the battle of Shiloh, but was > unable to find any Canants or Cannants in the area, or anything else > of real use in solving the mystery. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 17:50:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KLo6Hg023809 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 17:50:06 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7KLnvh8014138 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 17:50:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KLnFM5018881 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:49:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KLnBVp027983; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:49:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s38.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s38.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.174]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7KLn7AU027882 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 15:49:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladycatalina@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.224.33]) by bay0-omc2-s38.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 14:49:02 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 14:49:02 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 65.54.224.200 by by105fd.bay105.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 21:48:57 GMT X-Originating-IP: [4.225.188.239] X-Originating-Email: [ladycatalina@hotmail.com] X-Sender: ladycatalina@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <200608201800.k7KI03EA061796@net.indra.com> From: "Catalina Elvira Osorio Lopez de Xerez" To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:48:57 +0200 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Aug 2006 21:49:02.0210 (UTC) FILETIME=[7323A620:01C6C4A2] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] RE: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 584 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 17:50:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E8D905.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Friendship Cemetery in Columbus; resting among the soldiers in the center section is a volunteer nurse killed in the battle of Shiloh. The headstone reads “ Mrs. Canant, Vol. Nurse, CSA.” Definitely female. Catalina Sanguinem dumtaxat causam virtutis pendate >Message: 8 >Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 09:37:33 -0700 >From: "zelda crusher" >Subject: RE: [h-cost] OT: civil war experts >To: h-costume@indra.com >Message-ID: >Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed > >At the risk of being obvious, are you sure that Nurse Canant was a female? > >Laurie, RN, BSN > > > >From: "E House" > >Reply-To: Historical Costume > >To: "Historical Costume" > >Subject: [h-cost] OT: civil war experts > >Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 10:52:56 -0500 > > > >For those of you involved in civil war costuming, I have a slightly odd > >request. Do you know any historians, professional or amateur, who know > >everything about Shiloh and events around the same time & area? > > > >See, for the past 15 years, I've had this very frustrating, completely > >impossible research project that I've been picking up every few years, >and > >now that the internet has become such a useful research tool, I'm going >to > >try to take it up again. Pardon me if my memory is fuzzy on the details, > >since it's been a while and I haven't looked back through my info. >Anyway, > >in Friendship Cemetary, in Columbus, MS, there is a mysterious grave: >it's > >among the CSA soldiers' grave, but is labeled only "Nurse Canant, CSA." >To > >the knowledge of the history professor who assigned me this research > >project in the first place (the college-two-years-early boarding school I > >went to did a "Tales from the Crypt" event every year), no other woman >was > >officially buried as though she were a soldier (not taking into account > >crossdressers) in any CSA graveyard. Obviously, there's an interesting > >story in there somewhere, but what on earth did she do to get that honor, > >and why didn't they know anything else about her? I researched her as >best > >I could with local resources, and discovered that she would most likely > >have died in the battle of Shiloh, but was unable to find any Canants or > >Cannants in the area, or anything else of real use in solving the >mystery. > > > >Hopefully some of you can understand why I can't let this go! A few >years > >back, I did the rounds of the geneaology websites, with no luck, but I'm > >not giving up yet. > > > >-E House > > > >_______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 20:06:18 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L06H3P026106 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 20:06:18 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7L06AjY026340 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 20:06:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L05U4m033470 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 18:05:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L05PPN014089; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 18:05:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L05GB2013959 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 18:05:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:20888 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1GExI7-0003te-Tc for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 19:05:20 -0500 Message-ID: <02ac01c6c4b5$798546a0$7e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] OT: civil war experts Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 19:05:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 20:06:14 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E8F8F3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "zelda crusher" > At the risk of being obvious, are you sure that Nurse Canant was a female? I'm not 100% positive, but the person in the grave is recorded as being female in the cemetary's records. (Accordingly to out-of-date memory, mind you.) -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 20 23:56:21 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L3uKcV031202 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:56:21 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7L3uEMQ016716 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:56:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L3tZN8059960 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 21:55:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L3tW5c062577; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 21:55:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d21.mx.aol.com (imo-d21.mx.aol.com [205.188.144.207]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L3tRFl062476 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 21:55:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from SNSpies@aol.com) Received: from SNSpies@aol.com by imo-d21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id f.534.6448cb9 (41810); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:55:17 -0400 (EDT) From: SNSpies@aol.com Message-ID: <534.6448cb9.321a88a5@aol.com> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:55:17 EDT To: sca-laurels@ansteorra.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: h-costume@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] "Dress in Egypt in the First Millennium AD" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:56:17 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E92EDE.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Pritchard, Frances. "Clothing Culture: Dress in Egypt in the First Millenium AD". Manchester: Whitworth Art Gallery, 2006. 25 pounds + 14 pounds shipping to the US Just received my copy of this book from The Whitworth Art Gallery at the University of Manchester in England. Wow. It is an oversized (9.5" x 12") book with 154 pages of photographs, all in brilliant color. The pictures of the sprang alone were, to me, worth the cost. Nancy Nancy Spies Arelate Studio _www.weavershand.com/ArelateStudio.html_ (http://www.weavershand.com/ArelateStudio.html) Ingvild Josefsdatter, OL Kingdom of Atlantia "But if by 'Liberal' they mean someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people -- their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties -- someone who believes we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, if that is what they mean by 'Liberal', then I'm proud to say I'm a 'Liberal'." John F. Kennedy, 14 Sept 1960 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 01:54:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L5slaF002246 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:54:52 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7L5sfKg017741 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:54:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L5rqQC072388 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:53:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L5rmxW028700; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:53:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L5rg5c028632 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 23:53:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id A90037102BE; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 05:47:44 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Introduction Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 22:54:27 -0700 Message-ID: <000701c6c4e6$43757090$0300a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <126c01c6c323$691344e0$3dad4744@VAIO> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:54:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E94AA1.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Welcome. Got pictures? -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Gilbert Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 5:07 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Introduction I am a new member who has been lurking a few days. Wow, this is a great list! I am a historical novelist/stay-at-home-mom/costume enthusiast from Maine who is currently making an Empire gown, thanks to Janet Arnold. Other projects included a Spencer from the same volume (_Patterns of Fashion 1, Englishwomen's dresses and their construction, c 1660 - 1860_) and a c 1936 gown from Volume 2 of the series. I got inspired to dive into such projects because of a wonderful costume designer, Hilary Derby (or Darby--I can't quite remember) who created lovely costumes for the Theater at Monmouth, in Monmouth, Maine (the Shakespearian Theater of Maine). Thank you for letting me be a member of this list! Marjorie Marjorie Gilbert author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England www.marjoriegilbert.net Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 04:09:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L88xo0003270 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 04:09:03 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7L88qhf005821 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 04:08:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L887Vx091222 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 02:08:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L881xs011583; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 02:08:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from py-out-1112.google.com (py-out-1112.google.com [64.233.166.178]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L87wjI011556 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 02:07:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zeninegits@gmail.com) Received: by py-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id o67so2315044pye for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:07:58 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:to:references:subject:date:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:x-priority:x-msmail-priority:x-mailer:x-mimeole:from; b=Ms+L7lUGrvfsBFh5m5fMZ97xp8y5K17qwDvV5aU1UKT06ti505zd4LeCT919009EQTm6ulher0dtmnISI/CvUDQzblSt4U1D+5lKfy9g0IJRl7Ka1IJiAPJ7obFLU905/EBjqDjGPgN5Chdrh97Eyd+2uA9AE+ka9OXNCCoiHnE= Received: by 10.35.26.14 with SMTP id d14mr12740680pyj; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:07:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Lisa ( [69.146.25.135]) by mx.gmail.com with ESMTP id 55sm32065pyf.2006.08.21.01.07.57; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 01:07:58 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <004501c6c4f8$e9a117a0$87199245@Lisa> To: "Historical Costume" References: <000701c6c4e6$43757090$0300a8c0@bob3pc> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 02:07:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1807 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 From: "L. Williams" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Ben Franklin era or late 1700's America X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 04:08:56 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E96A15.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Greetings all, Today I volunteered to participate in a program involving BenFranklin. I also volunteered to sew his costume and mine. I have until March to get this done so I am not in a huge rush. However, the lady who asked me to do it KNOWS I do medieval garb and am slowly "loosing" my not-period-correct garb and replacing it with better quality stuff. She is really wanting to do period correct for this show. I can't sew without a pattern. Can anyone recommend a really good pattern for a man's outfit and for a maid (my part) ? A quick look on the internet turned up The Towsend catalog website, does anyone know if their patterns are period correct? My thanks in advance, Lisa in MT _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 07:57:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LBvlCX006076 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 07:57:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7LBvbMd028942 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 07:57:44 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LBullU019288 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 05:56:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LBudIH052879; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 05:56:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from orion.dandy.net (orion.dandy.net [209.128.224.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7L0t0q1046441 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 18:55:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mikes@dandy.net) Received: from [209.128.243.152] (acty2152.dialup.dandy.net [209.128.243.152]) by orion.dandy.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16F095D1C5 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 2006 20:54:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <44E90460.1000302@dandy.net> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2006 20:54:56 -0400 From: michael tartaglio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Netscape/7.2 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lack of thread in extant garments References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 07:57:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44E99FB1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi. The recent book (2005) on the Mary Rose finds mentions some silk thread being found in conjunction with the leather jerkins. I can quote the source if needed. Mike T. >I've seen this mentioned in a number of places but don't have a cite >offhand. If I were to look for one, it would be in the Museum of London's >"Textiles and Dress" book. Another possibility is Else Ostergard's "Woven >Into the Earth," which mentions the paucity of linen survivals in >Greenland; whether it discusses thread, I'm not sure. > >--Robin > >_______________________________________________ >h-costume mailing list >h-costume@mail.indra.com >http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 14:24:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LIOoh8014215 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:24:54 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7LIOQBM030591 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:24:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LIMJiM074920 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:22:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LILc1O017561; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:21:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com (nz-out-0102.google.com [64.233.162.206]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LILSuf017421 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:21:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id m7so802442nzf for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:21:23 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=C77L3qB7WvrQ20tX2WtKdvYnoa4UlzZCSC3quV2zkxQPijuBD8SEG8NaW00DOAqnYUViDbCJJC6BXAyq11AzLJ6btfgVAk0eid2oZddCRDggf5/NvdOkF40Zlrko93tGmHCA6c7/sPDQy/b7QY2oII5kUeE0jIVxO7GdL7GYIAI= Received: by 10.65.98.4 with SMTP id a4mr7180299qbm; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:21:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.237.12 with HTTP; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:21:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:21:23 -0700 From: Cin To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: h-costume@mail.indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Ben Franklin era or late 1700's America X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:24:47 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44E9FA5A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On 8/21/06, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: You want Costume Close-Up, Linda Baumgartner, published by Colonial Williamsburg. Patterns plus the "how-to". Color pictures showing what tailors really want to see. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com > Today I volunteered to participate in a program involving BenFranklin. I > also volunteered to sew his costume and mine. I have until March to get this > done so I am not in a huge rush. However, the lady who asked me to do it > KNOWS I do medieval garb and am slowly "loosing" my not-period-correct garb > and replacing it with better quality stuff. She is really wanting to do > period correct for this show. I can't sew without a pattern. Can anyone > recommend a really good pattern for a man's outfit and for a maid (my part) > ? A quick look on the internet turned up The Towsend catalog website, does > anyone know if their patterns are period correct? > > My thanks in advance, > Lisa in MT _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 14:25:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LIPSjB014233 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:25:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7LIORj5006153 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:25:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LIMJZN074919 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:22:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LILVva017467; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:21:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com (nz-out-0102.google.com [64.233.162.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LILOfW017356 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:21:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id 16so775078nzp for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:21:23 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=C77L3qB7WvrQ20tX2WtKdvYnoa4UlzZCSC3quV2zkxQPijuBD8SEG8NaW00DOAqnYUViDbCJJC6BXAyq11AzLJ6btfgVAk0eid2oZddCRDggf5/NvdOkF40Zlrko93tGmHCA6c7/sPDQy/b7QY2oII5kUeE0jIVxO7GdL7GYIAI= Received: by 10.65.98.4 with SMTP id a4mr7180299qbm; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:21:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.237.12 with HTTP; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:21:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:21:23 -0700 From: Cin To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: h-costume@mail.indra.com Subject: [h-cost] Ben Franklin era or late 1700's America X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:25:25 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44E9FA5B.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On 8/21/06, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: You want Costume Close-Up, Linda Baumgartner, published by Colonial Williamsburg. Patterns plus the "how-to". Color pictures showing what tailors really want to see. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com > Today I volunteered to participate in a program involving BenFranklin. I > also volunteered to sew his costume and mine. I have until March to get this > done so I am not in a huge rush. However, the lady who asked me to do it > KNOWS I do medieval garb and am slowly "loosing" my not-period-correct garb > and replacing it with better quality stuff. She is really wanting to do > period correct for this show. I can't sew without a pattern. Can anyone > recommend a really good pattern for a man's outfit and for a maid (my part) > ? A quick look on the internet turned up The Towsend catalog website, does > anyone know if their patterns are period correct? > > My thanks in advance, > Lisa in MT _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 14:57:19 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LIvJQn015205 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:57:19 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7LIv25u017663 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:57:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LIu3X6080207 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:56:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LItvIW052404; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:55:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp101.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com (smtp101.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.198.200]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7LItnsK052161 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:55:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cabbagerose@sbcglobal.net) Received: (qmail 39305 invoked from network); 21 Aug 2006 18:55:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Angela) (cabbagerose@sbcglobal.net@63.202.198.62 with login) by smtp101.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Aug 2006 18:55:38 -0000 Message-ID: <03bc01c6c553$64b7ea90$080010ac@Angela> From: "H_Costume" To: "Historical Costume" References: <534.6448cb9.321a88a5@aol.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] "Dress in Egypt in the First Millennium AD" Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:55:37 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 14:57:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EA01FE.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO How does one purchase a copy? Is it available overseas (I'm in the US)? angela +++++ Angela F. Lazear Cabbage Rose Costumes Theatrical Costume Design "Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none: be able for thine enemy rather in power than use, and keep thy friend under thy own life's key: be checked for silence, but never taxed for speech..." All's Well That Ends Well 1.1.65-6, Countess to Bertram W. Shakespeare http://www.cabbagerosecostumes.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2006 8:55 PM Subject: [h-cost] "Dress in Egypt in the First Millennium AD" > Pritchard, Frances. "Clothing Culture: Dress in Egypt in the First > Millenium AD". Manchester: Whitworth Art Gallery, 2006. 25 pounds + 14 > pounds > shipping to the US > > Just received my copy of this book from The Whitworth Art Gallery at the > University of Manchester in England. Wow. > > It is an oversized (9.5" x 12") book with 154 pages of photographs, all in > brilliant color. The pictures of the sprang alone were, to me, worth the > cost. > > Nancy > > Nancy Spies > Arelate Studio > _www.weavershand.com/ArelateStudio.html_ > (http://www.weavershand.com/ArelateStudio.html) > Ingvild Josefsdatter, OL > Kingdom of Atlantia > > "But if by 'Liberal' they mean someone who looks ahead and not behind, > someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares > about > the welfare of the people -- their health, their housing, their schools, > their > jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties -- someone who > believes > we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our > policies > abroad, if that is what they mean by 'Liberal', then I'm proud to say I'm > a > 'Liberal'." John F. Kennedy, 14 Sept 1960 > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 15:19:19 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJJJTm015782 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:19:19 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7LJJBkm032704 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:19:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJILKh083648 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:18:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJIGrW074586; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:18:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web30115.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web30115.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.69.47]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7LJIDgK074440 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:18:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from snappylunch_2001@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 76021 invoked by uid 60001); 21 Aug 2006 19:18:07 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=zH9FU5VRPOX4Lmfc9gA0wFsDzfa5LtOAIOxD9Gjz25Z2k0S1WaRw7eBBkEzUkJYj8yWwVRxKEoAaxSWrV0112RJB91e0hFlDD/exPlaTd490BhiuC9/sCUITEzelLGcFLKe4uNqVc6nIZHTQg5bO3zjmzlScIW/ubf7NXrZQfHY= ; Message-ID: <20060821191807.76019.qmail@web30115.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [207.4.90.6] by web30115.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:18:07 PDT Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 12:18:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Mia Dappert To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608211800.k7LI07wo096119@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Townsend/Franklin X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:19:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EA072F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Message: 9 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 02:07:53 -0600 From: "L. Williams" Subject: [h-cost] Ben Franklin era or late 1700's America To: "Historical Costume" Message-ID: <004501c6c4f8$e9a117a0$87199245@Lisa> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Greetings all, Today I volunteered to participate in a program involving BenFranklin. I also volunteered to sew his costume and mine. I have until March to get this done so I am not in a huge rush. However, the lady who asked me to do it KNOWS I do medieval garb and am slowly "loosing" my not-period-correct garb and replacing it with better quality stuff. She is really wanting to do period correct for this show. I can't sew without a pattern. Can anyone recommend a really good pattern for a man's outfit and for a maid (my part) ? A quick look on the internet turned up The Towsend catalog website, does anyone know if their patterns are period correct? My thanks in advance, Lisa in MT The simple answer is yes and no....Be careful of what you get from Townsend. Their off the rack is if-y, some it authentic, some is not. Their patterns are the same way (some are authentic, some are not...but it seems to my recollection that more are authentic, than not. JP Ryan is a good line, as is Kanicks Korner Try to stay away from Eagles view, and Pegee's of Williamsburg, the scholarship on these has been passed by the first two lines. Also. go to the library and get, (inter library loan if they don't have them) Fitting and Proper, The williamsburg costume close up book and just for fun What clothes reveal from Williams burg. These have digrams of garments and fairly involed instruction on 18th cent construction The good news, there are many pictures and portraits from life of Ben franklin. The bad news, Where and when is the maid from In France? in Philly, London, That will help point you in some direction (Oh, like the french maid in the Kyoto book, little jacket, big cap. Welcome to the dark side, the 18th cent.... Mia in Charlotte --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail Beta. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 15:30:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJUdds016114 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:30:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7LJUV86024171 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:30:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJT3Cn085159 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:29:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJSwhM084345; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:28:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta10.adelphia.net (mta10.adelphia.net [68.168.78.202]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJSspS084199 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:28:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from tgilbert737@adelphia.net) Received: from VAIO ([68.71.173.61]) by mta10.adelphia.net (InterMail vM.6.01.05.02 201-2131-123-102-20050715) with SMTP id <20060821192849.QBYW3509.mta10.adelphia.net@VAIO> for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:28:49 -0400 Message-ID: <17a701c6c558$0546d580$3dad4744@VAIO> From: "Gilbert" To: "Historical Costume" References: <000701c6c4e6$43757090$0300a8c0@bob3pc> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Introduction Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:28:46 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:30:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EA09D7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > Welcome. Got pictures? Thank you! As to pictures, go to http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm. I've got the bodice and bodice piece done--now for the sleeves (inner and outer). Marjorie Marjorie Gilbert author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England www.marjoriegilbert.net Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 15:48:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJmqbs016557 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:48:52 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7LJmiEU012150 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:48:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJlMPa088016 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:47:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJlIO4002006; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:47:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7LJlETF001944 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 13:47:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.120.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.120] helo=faucet.net) by pop-tawny.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GFFjt-000133-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:47:13 -0400 Message-ID: <44EA1B2B.2000702@faucet.net> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:44:27 -0500 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Marjorie's pics; was Re: [h-cost] Introduction References: <000701c6c4e6$43757090$0300a8c0@bob3pc> <17a701c6c558$0546d580$3dad4744@VAIO> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 15:48:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EA0E1C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > Thank you! As to pictures, go to > http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm. I've got the bodice and bodice > piece done--now for the sleeves (inner and outer). A hint for others who would like to see the progress of this: keep clicking on the title to go to the next page. Looking forward to seeing the final product, Marjorie--it looks like you're well on your way. Melanie Schuessler _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 21 20:12:32 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7M0CR3N024349 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 20:12:32 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7M0CLH3018203 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 20:12:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7M0BYhp029484 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 18:11:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7M0BSYX044567; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 18:11:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7M0BMvX044500 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 2006 18:11:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id AA4548803C8; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 00:05:25 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 17:11:21 -0700 Message-ID: <001601c6c57f$7f651fd0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 21 Aug 2006 20:12:25 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EA4BE5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id k7M0CR3N024349 Status: RO Someone within the past few months posted a link to a place that sells jewelry findings, especially flat "plaques", in filigree-ish styles, etc. I've lost the link. Please, if you know where I can get these, let me know. Thank you, Sharon C. Young lovers seek perfection, Old lovers learn the art of sewing shreds together And of seeing beauty in a multiplicity of patches - "How To Make An American Quilt" _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 12:58:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MGwjJA018852 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:58:46 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MGwcde018075 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:58:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MDxBnE045218 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:59:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MDx5SP009355; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:59:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp1.suscom.net (smtp1.suscom.net [64.78.119.247]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MDx1uM009223 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:59:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from goofy1@suscom.net) Received: from localhost (smtp1 [127.0.0.1]) by smtp1.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B9C81D0008 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 09:59:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp1.suscom.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26344-05 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 09:59:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Stuckis (c-71-207-16-152.hsd1.pa.comcast.net [71.207.16.152]) by smtp1.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 2D0421D0002 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 09:59:50 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <008001c6c5f3$1b1084b0$9810cf47@Stuckis> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001601c6c57f$7f651fd0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 09:58:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at suscom.net Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:58:42 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EB37BE.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Status: Clean Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 8:11 PM Subject: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? Someone within the past few months posted a link to a place that sells jewelry findings, especially flat "plaques", in filigree-ish styles, etc. I've lost the link. Please, if you know where I can get these, let me know. Thank you, Sharon C. On list, please! Dianne http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 13:20:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MHKZ00019459 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:20:35 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MHKSqg010088 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:20:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MD32DT040067 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:03:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MD30p6069064; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:03:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-borzoi.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-borzoi.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.70]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MD2sQu068936 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:02:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.199.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.199] helo=faucet.net) by pop-borzoi.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GFVu9-0000vU-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 09:02:53 -0400 Message-ID: <44EB0DE5.2030508@faucet.net> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 09:00:05 -0500 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? References: <001601c6c57f$7f651fd0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:20:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EB3CDC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean Status: RO Sharon at Collierfam.com wrote: > Someone within the past few months posted a link to a place that sells > jewelry findings, especially flat "plaques", in filigree-ish styles, etc. > I've lost the link. Please, if you know where I can get these, let me know. I don't know if this is what you seek, but give it a try: http://www.natures-gems.com/ Melanie Schuessler _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 14:34:07 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MIY3HA021791 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:34:07 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MIXuo8005935 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:34:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MIW6HY010333 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:32:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MIV6rc090841; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:31:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net (ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net [166.102.165.170]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MIUj9t090127 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:30:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from bmatney@alltel.net) Received: from ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net ([162.40.179.38]) by ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060822183036.UJNC3855.ispmxmta09-srv.windstream.net@ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net> for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:30:36 -0500 Received: from emachine_T4155.alltel.net ([162.40.179.38]) by ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20060822183035.ENBV560.ispmxaamta05-gx.windstream.net@emachine_T4155.alltel.net> for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:30:35 -0500 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20060822132057.026b60f0@mail.alltel.net> X-Sender: bmatney@mail.alltel.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:30:30 -0500 To: h-costume@indra.com From: Beth and Bob Matney Subject: Re: [h-cost] "Dress in Egypt in the First Millennium AD" In-Reply-To: <200608221814.k7MID4gc067013@net.indra.com> References: <200608221814.k7MID4gc067013@net.indra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7MIUj9t090127 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:34:00 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EB4E14.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Angela, When I contacted them last month, they replied that one could not order online, but that you could call their gift shop and order via phone with a credit card. See the message below.. I have not done so as yet. Beth >Thank you for your enquiry regarding the Clothing Culture catalogue. The >catalogue is priced £25, and postage to the USA is £14 via airmail, making a >total of £39. > >If you would like to purchase a copy please call the gallery shop with >credit card details on +44 (0) 161 275 7498. Alternatively, please send a >cheque for the correct amount made payable to 'University of Manchester' to: > >The Whitworth Art Gallery Shop >University of Manchester >Oxford Road >Manchester >UK >M15 6ER At 01:14 PM 8/22/2006, you wrote: >Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:55:37 -0700 >From: "H_Costume" >Subject: Re: [h-cost] "Dress in Egypt in the First Millennium AD" > >How does one purchase a copy? Is it available overseas (I'm in the US)? > >angela >+++++ >Angela F. Lazear _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 14:43:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MIhkS1022050 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:43:46 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MIhdeE010161 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:43:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MDG5nB041405 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:16:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MDG4e2078160; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:16:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail6.tpgi.com.au (mail6.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.113]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MDFxrh078098 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 07:16:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed Received: from user4712b7d135 (220-245-217-81-act-pppoe.tpgi.com.au [220.245.217.81]) by mail6.tpgi.com.au (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7MDFulP018127 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:15:58 +1000 Message-ID: <008a01c6c5ed$1b33abd0$51d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historic Costume" Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:15:56 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: GFD and cleavage X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:43:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EB505B.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historic Costume" Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 10:27 PM Subject: GFD and cleavage > Hello everyone, > Over the last few weeks I've been trying to fit a Gothic Fitted Dress (she > wants to replicate this style of dress > http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/images/Woodville,Elizabeth.jpg ) I just found a better example of this style for those who aren't familiar with the style of 1480s England http://www.mbs-brasses.co.uk/pic_lib/Elizabeth_Seyntmour.htm and you can see an indication of some cleavage there (although unfortunately she is posed in the typical fashion for medieval funereal brasses which gets in the way of seeing her neckline properly), and another example from the same site http://www.mbs-brasses.co.uk/pic_lib/Isabel_Cheyne.htm Elizabeth -------------------------------------------- Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 16:00:45 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MK0fvJ024227 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:00:45 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MK0YV7006556 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:00:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MJxZfL034096 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:59:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MJxMhw089572; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:59:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com (nz-out-0102.google.com [64.233.162.200]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MJxEFT089419 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:59:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id 16so1019002nzp for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:59:11 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=BlbIs9Mpjq+olXf+Lr64SI0j1AGpmtDKrJw289IHYDoxkiF9WAYMNXrLuU/O+9wLrI7Y7dAk8aNkBXOrQ3hxwpxzniNLwPLRTisV9DV9FOTnHnNMjuxZCPCTjbA54VEX00tRx/0tIUCjn/JplAOIcM/X5uHrN7+spbC6Et3hjDY= Received: by 10.65.95.14 with SMTP id x14mr9065239qbl; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:59:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.237.12 with HTTP; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:59:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:59:10 -0700 From: Cin To: h-cost MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Memorial Brasses X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:00:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EB6262.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO From: "Elizabeth Walpole" >I just found a better example of this style for those who aren't familiar >with the style of 1480s England >http://www.mbs-brasses.co.uk/pic_lib/Elizabeth_Seyntmour.htm and you can see >an indication of some cleavage there (although unfortunately she is posed in >the typical fashion for medieval funereal brasses which gets in the way of >seeing her neckline properly), and another example from the same site >http://www.mbs-brasses.co.uk/pic_lib/Isabel_Cheyne.htm Hadnt seen this site before. Thanks for helping me waste a good chunk of the day. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 16:54:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MKsrCj025764 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:54:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MKsko5010659 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:54:50 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MCSHqY035316 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:28:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MCS34A046356; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:28:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail5.tpgi.com.au (mail5.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.101]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MCRv9D046304 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:28:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed Received: from user4712b7d135 (220-245-217-81-act-pppoe.tpgi.com.au [220.245.217.81]) by mail5.tpgi.com.au (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7MCRtiv009794 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:27:57 +1000 Message-ID: <000901c6c5e6$65f6c960$51d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historic Costume" Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:27:55 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:54:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EB6F16.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean Status: RO Hello everyone, Over the last few weeks I've been trying to fit a Gothic Fitted Dress (she wants to replicate this style of dress http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/images/Woodville,Elizabeth.jpg ) at our group's weekly meeting (she wants to wear it to an upcoming event in 2 weeks) I've got it fitted enough that her bust won't fall down, but she wants cleavage and nothing I've tried so far is going to do that. Her bust is relatively small and I just can't get the dress to exert the right sort of pressure to push her breasts together. I know cleavage isn't necessarily a period feature of this style but I thought I would ask here before I gave up and told her the dress just won't give her the look she wants. thanks Elizabeth -------------------------------------------- Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 17:02:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ML2g8T025991 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:02:47 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7ML2Zuf025770 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:02:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MCSIQW035321 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:28:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MCSHQ1046515; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:28:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail2.mx.voyager.net (mail2.mx.voyager.net [216.93.66.206]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MCSDTI046464 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 06:28:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from natalieae@voyager.net) Received: from wks013lnng (brick.voyager.net [209.153.128.248]) by mail2.mx.voyager.net (8.13.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id k7MCSDcw047731 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 08:28:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <008c01c6c5e6$6fbdaf90$220310ac@wks013lnng> From: "Natalie" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060517071704.31509.qmail@web36612.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <446B47D4.7070208@faucet.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] filigree metal plaques... Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 08:28:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1807 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:02:39 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EB70EC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id k7ML2g8T025991 Status: RO Here you go, Sharon. Natalie ----- Original Message ----- From: Melanie Schuessler To: Historical Costume Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:57 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] filigree metal plaques... I've used some from these pages before: http://www.natures-gems.com/mefi.html http://www.natures-gems.com/plgo.html They're thin enough that you can bend them if you try, but I have a girdle and carcanet made from some with glass pearls in between, and they've held up for years. Melanie Schuessler Melody Watts wrote: > Hi, > Does anyone know where you can purchase filigree metal plaques for making a Tudor / Elizabethan girdle? > I'd like to be able to glue stones to the plaques to "dress" them up. > I know there are people selling these girdles premade, so they have to be getting them from somewhere. > Thanks > Melody > > > --------------------------------- > Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 17:30:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLU5WF026911 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:30:05 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MLTw4a001924 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:30:02 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLTap1051215 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:29:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLTRe0079106; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:29:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpout.eastlink.ca (smtpout.eastlink.ca [24.222.0.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MIuJR2022126 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 12:56:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca) Received: from sms01.eastlink.ca ([24.222.10.26]) by mta01.eastlink.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-4.03 (built Sep 22 2005)) with ESMTP id <0J4E00ATGXU8ZC20@mta01.eastlink.ca> for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:54:08 -0300 (ADT) Received: from THIRDFLOOR (blk-137-68-3.eastlink.ca [24.137.68.3]) by sms01.eastlink.ca (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 34967444013 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:55:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:56:10 -0300 From: SPaterson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: GFD and cleavage To: Historic Costume Message-id: <001b01c6c61c$a217f1e0$6501a8c0@THIRDFLOOR> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0634-0, 08/21/2006), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== References: <008a01c6c5ed$1b33abd0$51d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:30:02 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EB7756.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I have a friend who is particularly savvy on this subject and got pics of effigies while in Britain - do you want her contact info? Sarah Paterson ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historic Costume" Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 10:15 AM Subject: [h-cost] Re: GFD and cleavage > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Elizabeth Walpole" > To: "Historic Costume" > Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 10:27 PM > Subject: GFD and cleavage > > >> Hello everyone, >> Over the last few weeks I've been trying to fit a Gothic Fitted Dress >> (she wants to replicate this style of dress >> http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/images/Woodville,Elizabeth.jpg ) > I just found a better example of this style for those who aren't familiar > with the style of 1480s England > http://www.mbs-brasses.co.uk/pic_lib/Elizabeth_Seyntmour.htm and you can > see an indication of some cleavage there (although unfortunately she is > posed in the typical fashion for medieval funereal brasses which gets in > the way of seeing her neckline properly), and another example from the > same site http://www.mbs-brasses.co.uk/pic_lib/Isabel_Cheyne.htm > > Elizabeth > -------------------------------------------- > Elizabeth Walpole > Canberra Australia > ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au > http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 17:32:59 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLWwfI027010 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:32:58 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MLWpt0003762 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:32:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLWAb1051605 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:32:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLW3J9081666; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:32:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.prismnet.com (smtp.prismnet.com [209.198.128.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MJZW3Q063393 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 13:35:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from webmail.io.com (webmail.io.com [209.198.128.99]) by smtp.prismnet.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7MJZPqp050451 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:35:25 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from 65.117.156.5 (SquirrelMail authenticated user ches) by webmail.io.com with HTTP; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:35:25 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <12049.65.117.156.5.1156275325.squirrel@webmail.io.com> In-Reply-To: <000901c6c5e6$65f6c960$51d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> References: <000901c6c5e6$65f6c960$51d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 14:35:25 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage From: "Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.1, clamav-milter version 0.88.1 on smtp.prismnet.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-DCC-wuwien-Metrics: net.indra.com 1290; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:32:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EB7803.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Well ... at the risk of sounding completely off period here, at least for Gothic of whatever region she is from ... go the hollywood route, use double stick tape. (You can actually purchase it off Victoria Secret's website and store.) Once you have her breasts taped in place you can alter the cut of the underarm seams until the fabric is flush with the skin. I do not remember why I was taught to take in under the arms and not up front. Robin? Do you have any ideas? If the tape will not give her the natural cleavage she seeks it is time to call in the village and add some stuffing. ;) Now I do remember someone putting a small roll of batting under the breast line to keep her A cup breast from falling. She had it wired so that it would act as a shelf bra that is now so popular. By the same design you can cup the wire on each side to bring her breasts together. Chiara On Tue, August 22, 2006 7:27 am, Elizabeth Walpole said: > Hello everyone, > Over the last few weeks I've been trying to fit a Gothic Fitted > Dress (she > wants to replicate this style of dress > http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/images/Woodville,Elizabeth.jpg ) at our > group's > weekly meeting (she wants to wear it to an upcoming event in 2 > weeks) I've > got it fitted enough that her bust won't fall down, but she wants > cleavage > and nothing I've tried so far is going to do that. Her bust is > relatively > small and I just can't get the dress to exert the right sort of > pressure to > push her breasts together. I know cleavage isn't necessarily a > period > feature of this style but I thought I would ask here before I gave > up and > told her the dress just won't give her the look she wants. > thanks > Elizabeth > -------------------------------------------- > Elizabeth Walpole > Canberra Australia > ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au > http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 17:48:23 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLmNqD027606 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:48:23 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MLmHYn028059 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:48:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLlgh1054291 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:47:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLlfw8097102; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:47:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLla6H096937 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:47:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from SNSpies@aol.com) Received: from SNSpies@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.3a8.25f75ff (14501) for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:47:22 -0400 (EDT) From: SNSpies@aol.com Message-ID: <3a8.25f75ff.321cd56a@aol.com> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:47:22 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] "Dress in Egypt in the First Millennium AD" X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:48:20 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EB7BA1.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO To order a copy of this book, you need to contact The Whitworth Art Gallery at the University of Manchester, directly. You will also need to send them actual money in pounds sterling or arrange with them some other form of payment as, apparently, they do not take credit cards. I sent 40 pounds (the total is 39 pounds) which reached them safely, although they did kvetch a bit about having to return one pound with the book. I had forgotten to tell them to "keep the change". Nancy Nancy Spies Arelate Studio _www.weavershand.com/ArelateStudio.html_ (http://www.weavershand.com/ArelateStudio.html) Ingvild Josefsdatter, OL Kingdom of Atlantia "But if by 'Liberal' they mean someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people -- their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties -- someone who believes we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, if that is what they mean by 'Liberal', then I'm proud to say I'm a 'Liberal'." John F. Kennedy, 14 Sept 1960 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 17:57:32 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLvWwi027898 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:57:32 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MLvPQD011600 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:57:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLurdf055936 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:56:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLunJT006862; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:56:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.115]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLuffj006740 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:56:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from khanson@kc.rr.com) Received: from karen (CPE-72-128-23-84.kc.res.rr.com [72.128.23.84]) by ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7MLudc9011160 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:56:39 -0500 (CDT) From: "KLH" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:01:08 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 In-reply-to: <12049.65.117.156.5.1156275325.squirrel@webmail.io.com> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:57:29 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EB7DC5.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO If you take it in across the front, you will be pulling the side seams forward and end up with them being wonky. Yes, that's a technical term :) By taking it in under the arms you are pulling from both the front and the back and thus keep the side seams in their proper position. Talia -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 2:35 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage Once you have her breasts taped in place you can alter the cut of the underarm seams until the fabric is flush with the skin. I do not remember why I was taught to take in under the arms and not up front. Robin? Do you have any ideas? Chiara -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.5/425 - Release Date: 8/22/2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 17:58:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLwhoK027947 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:58:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MLwbdw011943 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:58:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLvwcF056062 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:57:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLvvkS007820; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:57:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf4.socket.net (mf4.socket.net [216.106.88.196] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MLvrw1007760 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 15:57:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf4.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 47F6436AE2 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:57:53 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:57:53 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 In-Reply-To: <12049.65.117.156.5.1156275325.squirrel@webmail.io.com> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:58:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EB7E0D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Have you looked at this site? http://www.cottesimple.com/cottesimple_feminine_silhouette.pdf De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 18:16:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMGd2r028440 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:16:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MMGWN9003886 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:16:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMFDqU059097 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:15:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMFBKh023105; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:15:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf4.socket.net (mf4.socket.net [216.106.88.196] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMF8N3023062 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:15:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf4.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id A9E203689B for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:15:07 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:15:08 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:16:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EB8240.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Oops sent before I was finished. You want the straight front cotehardie -----Original Message----- Have you looked at this site? http://www.cottesimple.com/cottesimple_feminine_silhouette.pdf De _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 18:21:58 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMLvo3028553 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:21:57 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MMLoNV017403 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:21:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMKxls059983 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:20:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMKttB027963; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:20:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from cantva.canterbury.ac.nz (cantva.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.2.27]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMKoG3027731 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:20:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ladyadele@paradise.net.nz) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.it.canterbury.ac.nz by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) id <01M6BTIXCA8W9C3H1P@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:20:14 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Received: from [132.181.4.133] (rcmt-cad45.it.canterbury.ac.nz [132.181.4.133]) by it.canterbury.ac.nz (PMDF V6.2-X27 #31178) with ESMTP id <01M6BTIX5BQ29C31ZR@it.canterbury.ac.nz> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:20:14 +1200 (NEW ZEALAND STANDARD TIME) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:20:28 +1200 From: Adele de Maisieres Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage In-reply-to: To: Historical Costume Message-id: <44EB832C.3080302@paradise.net.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) References: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:21:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EB837E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Just a comment on this subject: sometimes, what someone wants in terms of cleavage can't be done. I did a couple of gowns for a friend of mine a few years ago. Her breasts are fairly small and quite firm and hemispherical (ie, no loose flesh at all, no need for a bra). I made various adjustments trying to give her a bit more oomph, but eventually, I had to conclude that it was simply not possible to give her cleavage. There was simply no slack (so to speak) to manipulate-- the firmness that meant that her breasts didn't droop at all meant that they couldn't really be pushed in _any_ direction. She had to settle for some slight uplift but no cleavage. -- Adele de Maisieres ----------------------------- Habeo metrum - musicamque, hominem meam. Expectat alium quid? -Georgeus Gershwinus ----------------------------- _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 18:55:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMt6DP029232 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:55:06 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MMt0L7014107 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:55:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMsDo2064608 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:54:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMsAG4054833; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:54:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MMs4lI054772 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 16:54:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from webmail.patriot.net (vanburen.patriot.net [209.249.176.8]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3sarge1) with ESMTP id k7MMs0To016877 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:54:03 -0400 Received: from 72.13.239.193 (SquirrelMail authenticated user aquazoo) by webmail.patriot.net with HTTP; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:54:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <58361.72.13.239.193.1156287244.squirrel@webmail.patriot.net> In-Reply-To: <44EB832C.3080302@paradise.net.nz> References: <44EB832C.3080302@paradise.net.nz> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:54:04 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage From: aquazoo@patriot.net To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:55:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EB8B44.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > Just a comment on this subject: sometimes, what someone wants in terms > of cleavage can't be done. This brings up a question — how does the person define "cleavage"? I think of it as the visible line when the breasts touch, but others think of it as some swell of breast above the neckline. Is the cleavage "line" fashionable for this time period? The link given has the prayer hands obscuring that spot, and the other link does not show a line. So is it possible a bit of swell above the neckline is enough, and you don't need to go for an actual line? -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 19:32:57 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MNWreY029852 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 19:32:57 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7MNWkkt007009 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 19:32:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MNUmW5068870 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:30:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MNUkYb084126; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:30:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7MNUgJq084065 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 17:30:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA22806 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:10:20 -0500 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 18:10:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage In-Reply-To: <008a01c6c5ed$1b33abd0$51d9f5dc@user4712b7d135> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 19:32:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EB941E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO This entire thread just dumped into my mailbox; obviously things were hung up somewhere. I'll add a few thoughts to the various responses. First: This is on the late side to be called a GFD, and there were a variety of fitting techniques available at this point. It's important to note that the dress you see on the surface is an outer garment, and there's another garment under that, the neckline of which is hidden under a placket. So the support comes from the underdress, which is not visible in these pictures. I myself, though, would use pretty much the same technique that I use for an earlier 15th c. fitted dress, as the silhouette you're looking for is much the same (although there are other silhouettes that appear concurrently by this point). Second: You cited three images: the Woodville portrait (maybe 1465-75?), the Seyntmour brass (1475), and the Cheyne brass (1485). I would not take the cleavage in the Seyntmour brass as being particularly realistic; brasses were made from stock patterns, not from life, and different schools included particular shorthand elements in the depictions (sometimes for artistic purposes, sometimes symbolic) for reasons that had little to do with the look a style would have in wear. The Woodville portrait is probably most accurate, if very posed; you can see a clearer view here: http://www.queens.cam.ac.uk/Queens/Misc/Elizabeth.html ...which shows that the bust expansion is rather below the line of the placket. Cleavage would be unlikely except for an extremely large-busted woman. The Cheyne brass is rather later and has a somewhat lower neckline, with more bosom distending the necklines, but it's uncertain whether this was an accurate rendition of this style of dress, or the transference of standard artistic "female" characteristics onto a style that might not look this way in wear. That said: It is possible to get cleavage, or a sense thereof, using a GFD method and a small-busted woman. A lot depends, though, on just how small-busted she is, and whether the breasts are at all malleable. You say that you "can't get the dress to exert the right sort of pressure to push her breasts together." Can you do so with your hands? If so, you can make the dress do that too. If not, that means there isn't enough mass to accomplish conventional cleavage (meaning a crease between the breasts). However, you might be able to emphasize the presence of two independent "mounds" even if you don't get noticable "cleavage" by a modern definition. This is what Adele described, regarding her friend who had no loose tissue to move around. To do this, you need to exert pressure on the bottom of the breasts. This effect will be familiar to anyone who's seen me demonstrate this in my lecture. It involves the depth of the neckline. If your dress covers the top half of the breasts, you will get a rather flattened "monobosom" that is, in fact, correct for some eras (e.g. 1380). Over the ensuing decades, necklines crept downword, and the pressure on the top of the breasts was gradually eliminated, allowing the breast mass to shift upward. A lower-necked style is correspondingly a little tighter on the ribcage and the lower half of the breasts, to account for the fact that there is less of the breast mass at the lower levels and to maintain the pressure there. It helps to keep in mind that the breast itself stays in the same (high) position; you're just moving the internal stuffing around to change the profile. The easy way to see if this will work on your model: Have her lie down. If you press on the bottom side of her breast, does the top "plump"? If so, you can make the dress do that. (It should go without saying that you are fitting lying down -- right? You'll never get the mass positioned correctly if you fit her standing.) But wait, there's more. I normally use a straight front seam on my dresses, for a variety of reasons, including support. (This is particularly important for large-busted women; the last time I tried a curved-front seam, I watched my breasts drop to what felt like my knees, as they took advantage of the off-grain elasticity.) However, I will sometimes use a curve on the front to help "push up" a very small bosom that would otherwise be squashed into oblivion. This is *not* the same as the curve Tasha (at cottesimple) uses, which creates a rather lower expansion at the bustline. The front curve I use to plump a small-busted woman goes the other way: It presses in at the ribcage, then flares outward (as you follow the center front profile upward). This *must* be used in conjunction with a very low neckline, just over the nipples. The bust area acts like a funnel, being narrower under the bust and expanding upward so the widest part of the front curve is at the neckline. The entire front seam, from neckline to navel, looks like a parenthesis -- ( -- with the narrowest part over the ribcage. The outermost reach of the manipulated breast will be above the nipple, at the level of the neckline. Hope this helps. It's much easier to explain in person! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 21:57:22 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N1vLxb002573 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:57:21 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7N1vBjh030768 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:57:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N1u4Lo085345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 19:56:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N1tqUp074452; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 19:55:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail4.tpgi.com.au (mail4.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.61]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N1thnt074341 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 19:55:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed Received: from user4712b7d135 (220-245-223-188-act-pppoe.tpgi.com.au [220.245.223.188]) by mail4.tpgi.com.au (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7N1tewx016625 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:55:41 +1000 Message-ID: <002101c6c657$3d137ea0$bcdff5dc@user4712b7d135> From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:55:39 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:57:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EBB5F7.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > First: This is on the late side to be called a GFD, and there were a > variety of fitting techniques available at this point. It's important to > note that the dress you see on the surface is an outer garment, and > there's another garment under that, the neckline of which is hidden under > a placket. So the support comes from the underdress, which is not visible > in these pictures. Yes, I forgot to mention we are fitting the under-dress not the outer dress (I think her ambitions to have this and the overdress finished in 2 weeks is a little ambitious, but if we get the under-dress done at least she has something to wear that's not a discard from the Chandlery (loaner garb for those unfamiliar with SCA terminology). I myself, though, would use pretty much the same > technique that I use for an earlier 15th c. fitted dress, as the > silhouette you're looking for is much the same (although there are other > silhouettes that appear concurrently by this point). > > Second: You cited three images: the Woodville portrait (maybe 1465-75?), > the Seyntmour brass (1475), and the Cheyne brass (1485). She's aiming for about 1480, she has a particular brass she wants to replicate (which does show cleavage) but I don't know where to find her image. I found another image which shows cleavage from 1479 http://www.mbs-brasses.co.uk/pic_lib/Sotterley_Brass.htm which is probably a better representation of what she wants. > > That said: It is possible to get cleavage, or a sense thereof, using a GFD > method and a small-busted woman. A lot depends, though, on just how > small-busted she is, and whether the breasts are at all malleable. You say > that you "can't get the dress to exert the right sort of pressure to push > her breasts together." Can you do so with your hands? If so, you can make > the dress do that too. If not, that means there isn't enough mass to > accomplish conventional cleavage (meaning a crease between the breasts). > However, you might be able to emphasize the presence of two independent > "mounds" even if you don't get noticable "cleavage" by a modern > definition. This is what Adele described, regarding her friend who had no > loose tissue to move around. Yes she can bush her breasts together to create cleavage but I can't get the dress to push her breasts inwards. > > To do this, you need to exert pressure on the bottom of the breasts. This > effect will be familiar to anyone who's seen me demonstrate this in my > lecture. It involves the depth of the neckline. If your dress covers the > top half of the breasts, you will get a rather flattened "monobosom" that > is, in fact, correct for some eras (e.g. 1380). Over the ensuing decades, > necklines crept downword, and the pressure on the top of the breasts was > gradually eliminated, allowing the breast mass to shift upward. A > lower-necked style is correspondingly a little tighter on the ribcage and > the lower half of the breasts, to account for the fact that there is less > of the breast mass at the lower levels and to maintain the pressure there. > It helps to keep in mind that the breast itself stays in the same (high) > position; you're just moving the internal stuffing around to change the > profile. The neckline is definitely low, in fact she is in danger falling out (somebody else began the fitting process on this dress a year or two ago so certain things, like the neckline, are already established and can't be changed) > > The easy way to see if this will work on your model: Have her lie down. If > you press on the bottom side of her breast, does the top "plump"? If so, > you can make the dress do that. (It should go without saying that you are > fitting lying down -- right? You'll never get the mass positioned > correctly if you fit her standing.) Hmm, I might try lying down again, we tried it in the early stages of the fitting but couldn't get it firm enough to give her much support, then again, now I'm manipulating the side seams rather than the front seam it might work better (when I started I tried a curved front seam but then decided to go for a straight front seam instead) > > But wait, there's more. I normally use a straight front seam on my > dresses, for a variety of reasons, including support. (This is > particularly important for large-busted women; the last time I tried a > curved-front seam, I watched my breasts drop to what felt like my knees, > as they took advantage of the off-grain elasticity.) However, I will > sometimes use a curve on the front to help "push up" a very small bosom > that would otherwise be squashed into oblivion. This is *not* the same as > the curve Tasha (at cottesimple) uses, which creates a rather lower > expansion at the bustline. The front curve I use to plump a small-busted > woman goes the other way: It presses in at the ribcage, then flares > outward (as you follow the center front profile upward). This *must* be > used in conjunction with a very low neckline, just over the nipples. The > bust area acts like a funnel, being narrower under the bust and expanding > upward so the widest part of the front curve is at the neckline. The > entire front seam, from neckline to navel, looks like a parenthesis -- ( > -- with the narrowest part over the ribcage. The outermost reach of the > manipulated breast will be above the nipple, at the level of the neckline. > > Hope this helps. It's much easier to explain in person! > > --Robin Thanks for these tips I'll try them out and see what sort of success we get. Elizabeth -------------------------------------------- Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 22:16:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N2Gn89002990 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:16:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7N2GgQ4003441 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:16:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N2GLUj087349 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:16:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N2GJ5Y086989; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:16:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N2GEHX086933 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:16:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA23333 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:55:53 -0500 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:55:53 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage In-Reply-To: <002101c6c657$3d137ea0$bcdff5dc@user4712b7d135> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:16:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EBBA8A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wed, 23 Aug 2006, Elizabeth Walpole wrote: > Yes she can bush her breasts together to create cleavage but I can't > get the dress to push her breasts inwards. Hmm. If it really involves pushing them inward from the sides, you probably can't do it with the dress (now that I think about it) -- and it wouldn't be a period figure if you did. If you can get the cleavage by pressing them both toward the chest wall so that they spread out and meet in the middle, then the dress could do the same thing. But unless she's got a fair amount to move around, she won't look like the Sotterley brass! > The neckline is definitely low, in fact she is in danger falling out > (somebody else began the fitting process on this dress a year or two > ago so certain things, like the neckline, are already established and > can't be changed) Oh, that's awkward. The way you keep from falling out of this kind of dress is to position the breasts as high as they go before you determine the neckline height. Then they can't go any higher, and can't fall out even if they look like they're going to. If you're trying to keep them inside a neckline that is too low, you won't be able to position them high enough to plump by pressing on the bottom. I suspect this is part of your problem. Adding an extension to the neckline might allow you to do this, if it is less than an inch and you can match the grainlines. But if this much is already cut, you may be out of luck; there may be too many pieces already positioned for you to get the stretch and angles you need. (Normally the last thing I fit is the neckline/shoulders, because their placement depends on what you've done with the bust.) --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 22:39:04 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N2d3R8003348 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:39:03 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7N2cuBX001657 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:39:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N2cEb1090649 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:38:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N2cCVp099617; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:38:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail6.tpgi.com.au (mail6.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.113]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N2c6Dp099558 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:38:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed Received: from user4712b7d135 (220-245-223-188-act-pppoe.tpgi.com.au [220.245.223.188]) by mail6.tpgi.com.au (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7N2c0kX028844 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 12:38:03 +1000 Message-ID: <003d01c6c65d$28481a70$bcdff5dc@user4712b7d135> From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historical Costume" References: <001601c6c57f$7f651fd0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 12:37:59 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:39:00 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EBBFC0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 10:11 AM Subject: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? Someone within the past few months posted a link to a place that sells jewelry findings, especially flat "plaques", in filigree-ish styles, etc. I've lost the link. Please, if you know where I can get these, let me know. Thank you, Sharon C. was this what you were looking for? http://www.fancifulsinc.com/mall/lobby.htm it's got a larger selection than the one Melanie posted but the descriptions aren't as detailed. Elizabeth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 23:10:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3ARkl004085 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:10:27 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7N3AINg011916 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:10:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N39Goq093676 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:09:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3961L017870; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:09:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from fep02.xtra.co.nz (fep02.xtra.co.nz [210.54.141.244]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N38uwS017714 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:09:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from thebruce@ihug.co.nz) Received: from [10.1.1.3] (really [219.89.175.25]) by fep02.xtra.co.nz with ESMTP id <20060823030850.WGSV28703.fep02.xtra.co.nz@[10.1.1.3]> for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 15:08:50 +1200 Received: from 127.0.0.1 (AVG SMTP 7.1.405 [268.11.5/425]); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 15:08:52 +1200 Message-ID: <005a01c6c661$75ffbee0$0301010a@michaela> From: "michaela" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002101c6c657$3d137ea0$bcdff5dc@user4712b7d135> Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 15:08:45 +1200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:10:24 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EBC71A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > > The easy way to see if this will work on your model: Have her lie down. If > > you press on the bottom side of her breast, does the top "plump"? If so, > > you can make the dress do that. (It should go without saying that you are > > fitting lying down -- right? You'll never get the mass positioned > > correctly if you fit her standing.) > Hmm, I might try lying down again, we tried it in the early stages of the > fitting but couldn't get it firm enough to give her much support, then > again, now I'm manipulating the side seams rather than the front seam it > might work better (when I started I tried a curved front seam but then > decided to go for a straight front seam instead) Speaking as a very small busted woman, I have to say here the lying down method really will not help. Especially not if her ribcage is very rounded. The bosom just winds up shifting around the ribcage to do the complete opposite of what you want the bust to do. It requires far too much effort to then lift the bosom as you are working against far more gravity than you normally would. The only way I've found to get the breasts close together enough to get any kind of clevage is to stand up and lean forward, just like you do to settle into a bra. To get support without flattening out, you also will need to have a shaped centre front. This way you can easily have the body very well fitted from waist to under the bust (well a little higher than that to make the bust settle a little higher and so a little rounder) then ease the fabric over the bust. This means you don't flatten the bust which is usually as easy to squish as any other bust, but because of the size will easily flatten to nothing. I find it easiest to cut the backs of my bodices/bodies of gowns slightly narrower than expected specifically for this type of issue. I cannot do most of the fitting on the side seams as it makes me wider rather than rounder, which is not the shape disired in any of my chosen periods. By cutting the back quite narrow I can really pull at the centre font to get a good amount of tension in the torso (and thus narrow the area below the bust) and then give a bit of ease over the bust which also helps visually make it look fuller than the area directly under it. Something I also as I fit myself, is to wear my best supportive bra, and fit from waist to under bust, and then take my bra off to fit over the bust. That way the rest of the bodice/body is fitted enough to focus soleyy on the one area. A few years ago I also played a role in a modern play where I had to have a very defined bosom, preferably with cleavage.* I was only able to acheive it by a padded bra with extra padding supplied by shoulder pads and the front of the bra sewn so the underwires touched. Even then, no cleavage. Big bust, no crease. So I had to use bronzing powder to create it. Michaela de Bruce very lucky as most women in my family are overendowed and have all kinds of back pain. http://glittersweet.com *cleavage n. The act of splitting or cleaving. The state of being split or cleft; a fissure or division. So it refers to the crease, not just the mound of the breast. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.5/425 - Release Date: 22/08/2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 22 23:41:50 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3foKO004672 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:41:50 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7N3fh20019859 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:41:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3fClp096819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:41:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3fBXe035833; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:41:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3f5dw035759 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:41:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ACED6EB0308; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 03:35:09 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] filigree metal plaques... Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:41:07 -0700 Message-ID: <001401c6c665$f7747980$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <008c01c6c5e6$6fbdaf90$220310ac@wks013lnng> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7N3f5dw035759 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:41:47 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EBCE77.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thank you! -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Natalie Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 5:28 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] filigree metal plaques... Here you go, Sharon. Natalie ----- Original Message ----- From: Melanie Schuessler To: Historical Costume Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 11:57 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] filigree metal plaques... I've used some from these pages before: http://www.natures-gems.com/mefi.html http://www.natures-gems.com/plgo.html They're thin enough that you can bend them if you try, but I have a girdle and carcanet made from some with glass pearls in between, and they've held up for years. Melanie Schuessler Melody Watts wrote: > Hi, > Does anyone know where you can purchase filigree metal plaques for making a Tudor / Elizabethan girdle? > I'd like to be able to glue stones to the plaques to "dress" them up. > I know there are people selling these girdles premade, so they have to be getting them from somewhere. > Thanks > Melody > > > --------------------------------- > Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2¢/min with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 23 00:20:53 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N4KmAZ005808 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 00:20:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7N4KgX7031492 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 00:20:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N4JGnv003020 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:19:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N4Ic9d057986; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:18:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N4IYp7057863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 22:18:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:24247 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1GFkCO-0001Mo-53 for h-costume@indra.com; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:18:40 -0500 Message-ID: <032e01c6c66b$31525f00$7e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 23:18:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 00:20:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EBD79A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Though the lie-down-to-fit method works beautifully for full or firm busts, especially on average-to-large sizes, there's another technique that seems to work well for smaller (or in my case, NOT firm) busts. Instead of laying down for the final fitting around the bust, have the person you're fitting lean over so that their ribcage is parallel to the ground. The bust will point straight down. This pose will make it possible to get a much tighter underbust & lower bust fit than lying down, which is absolutely essential for small or not-firm busts. However, this technique will result in a high bust, so it may not be the solution for this particular situation! Given the time period, you have another option that you may not have considered. A good number of illustrations of the time show women wearing supportive gowns that lace up the front, but don't actually lace all the way shut; there's a gap between ~1.5 and ~5 inches. The wider gaps do have the effect of pushing the breasts together, and at least on me, it produces rather dramatic cleavage, unlike my other up-but-not-together supportive dresses, all of which lace fully shut. (It also has the advantage of being adjustable for someone with a yo-yo dieting problem!) When worn under a V-necked dress, the laced-up gap would be concealed with a piece; a decorated piece would give the exact same look as in the Elizabeth Woodville painting. -E House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 23 02:23:01 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N6MsEB017916 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 02:22:58 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7N6Mlh5031772 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 02:22:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3fCaH096818 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:41:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3f80K035798; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:41:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.collierfam.com (collierfam.com [216.65.44.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7N3f517035756 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 2006 21:41:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sharon@collierfam.com) Received: from bob3pc [216.65.44.63] by mail.collierfam.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-7.15) id ACEC6EB0308; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 03:35:08 +0000 From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:41:05 -0700 Message-ID: <001301c6c665$f715b7b0$0200a8c0@bob3pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <003d01c6c65d$28481a70$bcdff5dc@user4712b7d135> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Note: This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail (www.declude.com) for spam. 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Status: RO Thank you! -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com] On Behalf Of Elizabeth Walpole Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 7:38 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sharon at Collierfam.com" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 10:11 AM Subject: [h-cost] Jewelry plaques? Someone within the past few months posted a link to a place that sells jewelry findings, especially flat "plaques", in filigree-ish styles, etc. I've lost the link. Please, if you know where I can get these, let me know. Thank you, Sharon C. was this what you were looking for? http://www.fancifulsinc.com/mall/lobby.htm it's got a larger selection than the one Melanie posted but the descriptions aren't as detailed. Elizabeth _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 23 06:28:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NASAML011013 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:28:10 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7NAS3gW024554 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:28:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NARJU0045677 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 04:27:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NAOq6c083517; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 04:24:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtpout.eastlink.ca (smtpout.eastlink.ca [24.222.0.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NAOnxx083441 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 04:24:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sjpaterson@tru.eastlink.ca) Received: from sms01.eastlink.ca ([24.222.10.26]) by mta01.eastlink.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-4.03 (built Sep 22 2005)) with ESMTP id <0J4G00K064YCM381@mta01.eastlink.ca> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 07:25:25 -0300 (ADT) Received: from THIRDFLOOR (blk-137-68-3.eastlink.ca [24.137.68.3]) by sms01.eastlink.ca (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 3B769444014 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 07:23:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 07:24:37 -0300 From: SPaterson To: Historical Costume Message-id: <006601c6c69e$55f80d90$6501a8c0@THIRDFLOOR> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=response Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0634-0, 08/21/2006), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== References: <002101c6c657$3d137ea0$bcdff5dc@user4712b7d135> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] late 15th c English under dress & dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:28:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44EC2DB3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Again I give the offer of someone who is small breasted and wears this: http://www.freewebs.com/bessdarnley/mistressisobelmowbray.htm she can be reached at georginaisobel@yahoo.ca Sarah Paterson _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 23 08:59:59 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NCxw8W018180 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 08:59:58 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7NCxZsx030511 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 08:59:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NCx02X062773 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:59:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NCwqFr087686; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:58:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail9.tpgi.com.au (mail9.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.104]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NCwjve087587 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:58:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) X-TPG-Antivirus: Passed Received: from user4712b7d135 (220-245-220-44-act-pppoe.tpgi.com.au [220.245.220.44]) by mail9.tpgi.com.au (envelope-from ewalpole@tpg.com.au) (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7NCwg2E005215 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 22:58:44 +1000 Message-ID: <003201c6c6b3$dd820850$2cdcf5dc@user4712b7d135> From: "Elizabeth Walpole" To: "Historical Costume" References: <002101c6c657$3d137ea0$bcdff5dc@user4712b7d135> <006601c6c69e$55f80d90$6501a8c0@THIRDFLOOR> Subject: Re: [h-cost] late 15th c English under dress & dress Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 22:58:42 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 08:59:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EC5137.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "SPaterson" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 8:24 PM Subject: [h-cost] late 15th c English under dress & dress > Again I give the offer of someone who is small breasted and wears this: > http://www.freewebs.com/bessdarnley/mistressisobelmowbray.htm > she can be reached at georginaisobel@yahoo.ca > > Sarah Paterson If your friend is happy to be contacted I'll pass on this info to the lady being fitted, her documentation may come in handy another time but right now there's not much time to change the method we're using. Elizabeth -------------------------------------------- Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 23 11:10:37 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NFAbN1022736 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:10:37 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7NFAOrq010399 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:10:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NC3DCm056655 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:03:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NC39gF047842; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:03:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NC32hT047675 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:03:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id GAA24751 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:42:43 -0500 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 06:42:43 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] GFD and cleavage In-Reply-To: <005a01c6c661$75ffbee0$0301010a@michaela> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:10:34 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44EC6FE0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wed, 23 Aug 2006, michaela wrote: > Speaking as a very small busted woman, I have to say here the lying > down method really will not help. It has worked when I've done it, but clearly there are other methods, as you and Elena have indicated. I should not have implied that there's just one way -- when I teach I try to underscore that people need to experiment. I would guess also that a person's success with any one method depends on a lot of other factors, such as the sequence in which you do various parts of the fitting, the exact angles of the seams and neckline, the fabric, etc., not to mention the particular silhouette you're aiming for. (There's a *lot* of variation in silhouette over the 100-plus years the style was worn, so techniques must have varied in period as well.) I haven't had to try a leaning-forward method yet, but I may at some point find a woman whose particular characteristics require it, so I'm glad to hear other people's descriptions. I'm still encountering new figure issues and having to determine solutions on a case-by-case basis, and you'd think after this many dresses I'd have seen them all. I should also note that when I made my first fitted dress (for myself) I was a small A cup. I grew (a lot), but I'm still using much the same method (though with many improvements to better emulate period practice, e.g. use of lining). --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 23 11:53:04 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NFqxoK024032 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:53:04 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7NFqoMD016346 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:52:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NFoQIg086259 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 09:50:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NFmlZb034466; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 09:48:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from Bluejay.creighton.edu (Bluejay.creighton.edu [147.134.2.20]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7NFmhQs034368 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 09:48:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from CynthiaAbel@creighton.edu) Received: from exbe01.blue.jays.creighton.edu (exbe01.creighton.edu [147.134.2.111]) by Bluejay.creighton.edu (8.9.3 (PHNE_29774)/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA19343 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:48:42 -0500 (CDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2006 10:48:28 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Tudor Tailor arrived! Thread-Index: AcbGtClZseLIaEgRTrWR4yI9qfIX+gAFf63A From: "Abel, Cynthia" To: "Historical Costume" X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7NFmhQs034368 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Tudor Tailor arrived! X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 23 Aug 2006 11:52:56 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44EC79D2.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO My copy of the Tudor Tailor arrived on my desk from Amazon.com this morning. Only have time for a short look, but it is stunning with scale patterns that are easy to read and clear, lovely pics of comtempory illustrations, finished and underconstruction garments from the skin out for not just the rich, but for working class and merchant class as well. The section on headwear and how it make it alone is worth the price of the book. Also included is a guide to choosing materials, a color sample of modern yarns dyed in reproduced dyes available in the 16th century. A book well worth waiting for. Cindy Abel _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 24 13:29:14 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OHTECd020655 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:29:14 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7OHT5Kh017341 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:29:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OHRRDd074285 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:27:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OHQe8B062018; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:26:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m28.mx.aol.com (imo-m28.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.9]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OHQWwN061733 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:26:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-m28.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c04.21ecbfd (60470) for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:26:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from FWM-R17 (fwm-r17.webmail.aol.com [152.163.211.145]) by ciaaol-m02.mx.aol.com (v112.5) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLM023-ec3644ede13520e; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:26:13 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:26:11 -0400 Message-Id: <8C895B98736853B-1614-11C1@FWM-R17.sysops.aol.com> From: tearoses@aol.com References: <200608240404.k7O449Yv045455@net.indra.com> Received: from 68.143.196.38 by FWM-R17.sysops.aol.com (152.163.211.145) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:26:11 -0400 X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI X-MB-Message-Type: User In-Reply-To: <200608240404.k7O449Yv045455@net.indra.com> X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 19144 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: h-costume@indra.com X-AOL-IP: 152.163.211.145 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:29:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EDE1E1.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi guys, Thanks for all the input on my question about Heidi. (I know this is late, but I'm a little behind on my e-mail.) I really appreciated the suggestion of Kate Greenaway -- I've been collecting reprints of classic children's book illustrators, just because I like the art, but it didn't occur to me to check there for inspiration. Since someone mentioned Aesthetic dress, I went looking at pictures, and I think I really like it! Can anyone recommend a good book with lots of pictures? Or, failing that, some detailed websites? Thanks! Tea Rose ________________________________________________________________________ Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand. Always Free. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 24 13:55:53 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OHtmPU021746 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:55:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7OHtgDg021309 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:55:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OHt4wf078609 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:55:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OHsfg8091895; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:54:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OHsKeL091516 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:54:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA29916 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 12:34:03 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 12:34:03 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress In-Reply-To: <8C895B98736853B-1614-11C1@FWM-R17.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:55:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EDE81E.00A by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 tearoses@aol.com wrote: > Since someone mentioned Aesthetic dress, I went looking at pictures, > and I think I really like it! Can anyone recommend a good book with > lots of pictures? Or, failing that, some detailed websites? None of these are loaded with pictures, but all are useful: Book: Stella Mary Newton, Health, Art & Reason: Dress reformers of the 19th century (London: John Murray, 1974). This is the comprehensive study of the Rational/Artistic/Aesthetic dress movement. Follow her footnotes for more sources. Two articles from the journal _Costume_: Shonfield, Zuzanna, "Miss Marshall and the Cimabue Browns," Costume, No. 13 (1979), pp. 62-72. Ormond, Leonee, "Female Costume in the Aesthetic Movement of the 1870 and 1880s," Costume, No. 2, 33-38; reprinted in combined Nos. 1-2, pp. 47-52. Web sites (here's where you'll find pictures!): http://costume.osu.edu/Reforming_Fashion/reformdress.htm http://web.nwe.ufl.edu/~kchancey/corsetaesthetic.html http://www.fashion-era.com/rational_dress.htm http://www.fashion-era.com/aesthetics.htm There's also some overlap with the Pre-Raphaelites, and you can find some pictures of people like Jane Morris and Oscar Wilde in artistic dress if you spend enough time looking through books about the lives of these people. Fashion magazines of the period, such as Harper's, would be another good source, but I haven't followed the chain that far. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 24 15:47:42 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OJlgOI024965 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 15:47:42 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7OJlX5a001296 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 15:47:38 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OJkAVX091831 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:46:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OJj0YK003921; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:46:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pqueueb.post.tele.dk (pqueueb.post.tele.dk [193.162.153.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OJiCGT003134 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:44:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by pqueueb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D0123DF186 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:23:48 +0200 (CEST) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 9F2498A0057 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:23:44 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002201c6c7b2$dd2121c0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:24:04 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] question about purse X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 15:47:39 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE0255.008 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hello, I would like to ask your oppoinions about a projekt i want to make. Last year i made this purse: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/purseembroideries26.htm Can i use this design of the purse (with another embroidery) for 18th century reenacting? I found this purse on V&A: http://tinyurl.co.uk/kd17 Wich is similar with a lit. Any responses greatfully apreciated. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 24 16:09:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OK9mhn026174 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:09:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7OK9goT026074 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:09:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OK8Lho094607 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:08:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OK7aii026622; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:08:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.250]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7OK6uap025835 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:07:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 92493 invoked by uid 60001); 24 Aug 2006 20:06:51 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=LEGUwgs2m3k6f2oKShN/H7c9IhIM8EkUhfEgR4L/Y3Qy5kZXosb1fCLpAgd7zuPHH0M6MOtU1B2U9ZvcbXCjgOfxqs8DJJ34/LSoQq6yX1v7/zYE/RwgDu0iW1WcoryNe7RAxbYd2Fgkb+o10+57flay5kkl+VDFdNGGI/NXoY4= ; Message-ID: <20060824200651.92491.qmail@web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [148.107.3.20] by web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:06:51 PDT Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:06:51 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:09:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE0786.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I seem to remember (long ago) someone on the list posted a website for commercial patterns for an Aesthetic tea dress or something. Would anyone happen to know of such a thing? Maggie --- Robin Netherton wrote: > > On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 tearoses@aol.com wrote: > > > Since someone mentioned Aesthetic dress, I went > looking at pictures, > > and I think I really like it! Can anyone recommend > a good book with > > lots of pictures? Or, failing that, some detailed > websites? > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 24 18:04:21 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OM4Kpo029391 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:04:20 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7OM4E28018923 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:04:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OM3JMS007264 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:03:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OM2A59042428; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:03:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OM1KPo041660 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:02:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA30589 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:41:07 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:41:07 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress In-Reply-To: <20060824200651.92491.qmail@web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:04:17 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE225E.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, MaggiRos wrote: > I seem to remember (long ago) someone on the list posted a website for > commercial patterns for an Aesthetic tea dress or something. Would > anyone happen to know of such a thing? I just mentioned Folkwear, but I was wrong. The one I was thinking about was from La Mode Bagatelle: http://www.ravenrook.com/bagatelle/art.jsp http://www.sewingcentral.com/cgi-bin/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=lmb002.html&cart_id=7858735_12881 ...and probably other vendors too. Some reviews here, bottom of page: http://www.gbacg.org/Patterns/lmb.htm No, I've never done this period. I just love looking at it. IIRC, some of the St. Louis Costume Guild people (including a few on this list?) made artistic dresses for the most recent CostumeCon, but I don't know which pattern, if any, they used. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 24 18:28:02 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OMS2P1030043 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:28:02 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7OMRuR5005938 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:27:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OMRVQ4009375 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:27:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OMQvsL063964; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:27:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OMPeeW062906 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:26:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA30513 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:27:05 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:27:05 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress In-Reply-To: <20060824200651.92491.qmail@web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:27:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE27EC.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, MaggiRos wrote: > I seem to remember (long ago) someone on the list posted a website for > commercial patterns for an Aesthetic tea dress or something. Would > anyone happen to know of such a thing? I think Folkwear has one. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 24 22:01:18 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P21IVN002234 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:01:18 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7P21CAT030039 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:01:15 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P20Oep027925 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 20:00:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P1xbc5022982; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 20:00:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com (nz-out-0102.google.com [64.233.162.206]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P1x40P022506 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 19:59:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id 12so467268nzp for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:59:04 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=R1EvGgGCMuR2HgLZMRuQwmgqbYJnvLUpjF1DwCpXuwzLUwW2ZLyRhpQa4vswsbMtDqfg31XV1zKp7uc9g373mGnTzcjq9a6LA1wSw9nkOc5w19CtPm6FdUZOHE/ut2NKB3DJ3BxynGWENuATjdMA7ZfbblWI7S0OeHiC8lxgjGQ= Received: by 10.64.7.20 with SMTP id 20mr3058192qbg; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:52:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.237.12 with HTTP; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:52:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:52:12 -0700 From: Cin To: h-costume@indra.com In-Reply-To: <200608241806.k7OI4TdV002577@net.indra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <200608241806.k7OI4TdV002577@net.indra.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 589 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:01:15 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE59E8.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 tearoses@aol.com wrote: > > > Since someone mentioned Aesthetic dress, I went looking at pictures, > > and I think I really like it! Can anyone recommend a good book with > > lots of pictures? Or, failing that, some detailed websites? The Tate Museum, London is chock full of that terrific stuff. I would guess you can noodle around the website or any of the other art-URLs. Or find someone with the museum catalog. Try "Pre-Raphaelite Brotherhood" and/or "Pre-Raphelite Brotherhood" in google images. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 24 23:24:08 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P3O8qX004069 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:24:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7P3O14f032646 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:24:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P3N7N0034465 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:23:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P3MlBT083154; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:22:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P3MdTp082941 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:22:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA31205 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:02:25 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:02:25 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 589 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:24:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE6D51.007 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Status: Clean Status: RO On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, Cin wrote: > > On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 tearoses@aol.com wrote: > > > > > Since someone mentioned Aesthetic dress, I went looking at pictures, > > > and I think I really like it! Can anyone recommend a good book with > > > lots of pictures? Or, failing that, some detailed websites? > > The Tate Museum, London is chock full of that terrific stuff. I would > guess you can noodle around the website or any of the other art-URLs. > Or find someone with the museum catalog. Try "Pre-Raphaelite > Brotherhood" and/or "Pre-Raphelite Brotherhood" in google images. It should be noted that although the Pre-Raphaelite crowd (for the most part) championed artistic/aesthetic dress, what appeared in their *paintings* were usually attempts at period costume for whatever they were depicting (usually wrong by our standards, but pretty good given the available reference material). That's not the same thing as what the Aesthetes were wearing. However, some photographs and drawings of members of the Brotherhood, their wives and lovers, and their friends show them in artistic dress, and written accounts describe them. Other useful written sources from the period include Gilbert & Sullivan's operetta "Patience," which spoofs the Aesthetes (and accounts from that time about the staging and background of the operetta); Oscar Wilde's essay "The Relation of Dress to Art" (1885, reprinted in various collections of his work); and the writings of dress reformer (and Chaucer scholar!) Mary Eliza Haweis, particularly her books The Art of Beauty (1878) and The Art of Dress (1879). There's also a nice description of a girl's dress-reform outfit in Louisa May Alcott's "Eight Cousins" (I think that's the right one) that someone on this list sent me a few years ago when we were talking about this. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 00:11:05 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P4B44T005144 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:11:04 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7P4Awkt006458 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:11:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P4A10R041474 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:10:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P49cja016470; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:09:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ylpvm15.prodigy.net (ylpvm15-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.57.46]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P49B6L016138 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:09:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from kayta@frys.com) X-ORBL: [69.107.94.49] Received: from thelema.frys.com (adsl-69-107-94-49.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.107.94.49]) by ylpvm15.prodigy.net (8.13.7 out spool5000 dk/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7P48sZR005457 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:08:57 -0400 Message-Id: <4.3.1.2.20060824200414.025fcf98@mail.frys.com> X-Sender: kayta@mail.frys.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.1 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 20:06:18 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Carolyn Kayta Barrows Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress In-Reply-To: References: <8C895B98736853B-1614-11C1@FWM-R17.sysops.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:11:01 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE7852.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >Fashion magazines of the period, such as Harper's, would be another good >source, but I haven't followed the chain that far. I'd say humor and satire magazines, like Punch, would have more coverage of Aesthetic-style clothing than regular fashion magazines. The Aesthetics weren't high fashion, they were counter-culture, the Beatniks, Hippies, and Punks of their day. CarolynKayta Barrows dollmaker, fibre artist, textillian www.FunStuft.com ///\\\\\ ////-@@\\\ (((( 7 ))) )(( <> ))( * ) ( * /----\ /---\ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 00:52:16 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P4qGS9006259 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:52:16 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7P4q9Da002469 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:52:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P4pWDj046690 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:51:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P4pQ07040981; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:51:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P4pKDW040907 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 22:51:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA31425 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:31:08 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 23:31:08 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress In-Reply-To: <4.3.1.2.20060824200414.025fcf98@mail.frys.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:52:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE81F9.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > I'd say humor and satire magazines, like Punch, would have more > coverage of Aesthetic-style clothing than regular fashion magazines. > The Aesthetics weren't high fashion, they were counter-culture, the > Beatniks, Hippies, and Punks of their day. The Aesthetics themselves, yes -- they were not quite respectable, and some of them were considered scandalous. But just as fashion-conscious people in the 1960s and 70s adopted tie-dye and denims from the hippies, mainstream 19th century designers adopted a version of the Aesthetic look and tidied it up for fashionable wear. In 1884, a high-fashion London store, Liberty, opened a special department called the Artistic and Historic Costume Studio. This became the top shopping spot of the Aesthetic set, but it also got plenty of business selling clothes with "artistic" or "historical" elements to more conventional shoppers. Stella Mary Newton's book has some good information on this, including some pictures of fashion plates of artistic dress from Harper's and a picture of an extant artistic dress from Liberty. Punch did have good cartoons about the Aesthetes, though. --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 02:08:07 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P6875h010817 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 02:08:07 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7P680XI022833 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 02:08:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P66Z9I055364 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:06:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P66TKp081769; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:06:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf1.socket.net (mail.socket.net [216.106.88.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7P66PqE081724 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 00:06:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf1.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id E1E58389C0 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 01:06:24 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] question about purse Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 01:06:34 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 In-Reply-To: <002201c6c7b2$dd2121c0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 02:08:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EE93C0.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I was looking for something else and found these. 1780 http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_240.htm 1750 http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_204.htm 1730 http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_188.htm 1762 http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_156.htm This is not a purse but thought you might be interested. 1790 -1805 http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_116.htm De -----Original Message----- Hello, I would like to ask your oppoinions about a projekt i want to make. Last year i made this purse: http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/purseembroideries26.htm Can i use this design of the purse (with another embroidery) for 18th century reenacting? I found this purse on V&A: http://tinyurl.co.uk/kd17 Wich is similar with a lit. Any responses greatfully apreciated. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 06:28:03 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PAS2Sj006962 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 06:28:02 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7PARuX6025135 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 06:27:59 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PAR3nD085275 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 04:27:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PAQqmg032394; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 04:26:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PAQmL1032353 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 04:26:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from carynsobel@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=X3k+N7wnTuILswhamDXnYeTB6oY0h++fWhPfMHaDiyaig+Wr6j8nCgltDuqhyNQV; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [4.156.228.198] (helo=SobelWriting) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1GGYtj-00013q-DM for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 06:26:48 -0400 Message-ID: <00aa01c6c830$e625f330$c6e49c04@SobelWriting> From: "Caryn Sobel" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 06:26:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-ELNK-Trace: 251666aee31a72c3c5fbd2bc086b8747239a348a220c2609bdb86cf33c6d66e3c229d88e3ebb1d79350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 4.156.228.198 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 06:27:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EED0AC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO lots of pictures? Or, failing that, some detailed websites?> Karin Larsson, the wife of Swedish artist Carl Larsson, was known for her own take on Aesthetic-style dresses, and her husband often painted her in her designs. The book _Carl and Karin Larsson: Creators of the Swedish Style_ has paintings and photos of her, as well as mention of her style. Hope this helps, Caryn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 09:15:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDFm0K012959 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:15:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7PDFgV1015242 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:15:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDElfS004608 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:14:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDEhMU031643; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:14:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from email.accessus.net (email.accessus.net [209.145.128.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OMCeAV051835 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:14:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from axejudge@accessus.net) X-AUS-Server: EMAIL Received: from [12.10.125.94] (account axejudge@accessus.net) by email.accessus.net (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 4.3.9) with HTTP id 420254915 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 17:12:32 -0500 From: "Karen Heim" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: CommuniGate Pro WebUser Interface v.4.3.9 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 17:12:32 -0500 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:15:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EEF7FE.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO They used that pattern. However, I don't believe it is still available. Karen On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:41:07 -0500 (CDT) Robin Netherton wrote: > > On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, MaggiRos wrote: > >> I seem to remember (long ago) someone on the list posted >>a website for >> commercial patterns for an Aesthetic tea dress or >>something. Would >> anyone happen to know of such a thing? > > I just mentioned Folkwear, but I was wrong. The one I >was thinking about > was from La Mode Bagatelle: > > http://www.ravenrook.com/bagatelle/art.jsp > http://www.sewingcentral.com/cgi-bin/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=lmb002.html&cart_id=7858735_12881 > ...and probably other vendors too. > > Some reviews here, bottom of page: > > http://www.gbacg.org/Patterns/lmb.htm > > No, I've never done this period. I just love looking at >it. > > IIRC, some of the St. Louis Costume Guild people >(including a few on this > list?) made artistic dresses for the most recent >CostumeCon, but I don't > know which pattern, if any, they used. > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 09:24:27 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDOQZv013263 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:24:26 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7PDOKvb022594 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:24:23 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDNvxl005894 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:23:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDNu3I038795; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:23:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDNoQV038710 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:23:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 20883FAC064 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:23:49 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000b01c6c849$ba9ee0a0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] question about purse Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:24:01 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:24:23 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EEFA04.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi De Thanks for your response, it is nice to have the example with the frame hinge and gussets in the sides, i think i can make this, with a good consious. Many thanks for the lovely examples......... Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 8:06 AM Subject: RE: [h-cost] question about purse >I was looking for something else and found these. > > 1780 > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_240.htm > > 1750 > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_204.htm > > 1730 > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_188.htm > > 1762 > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_156.htm > > This is not a purse but thought you might be interested. 1790 -1805 > http://www.vintagetextile.com/new_page_116.htm > > De > -----Original Message----- > Hello, > I would like to ask your oppoinions about a projekt i want to make. > Last year i made this purse: > http://www.my-drewscostumes.dk/purseembroideries26.htm > Can i use this design of the purse (with another embroidery) for 18th > century reenacting? > I found this purse on V&A: > http://tinyurl.co.uk/kd17 > Wich is similar with a lit. > Any responses greatfully apreciated. > > Bjarne > > > > Leif og Bjarne Drews > www.my-drewscostumes.dk > > http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 09:44:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDiBcw013864 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:44:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7PDi40G009016 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:44:08 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDh1or008517 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:43:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDgvlN053161; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:42:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDgqXS053101 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:42:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 69B4EFAC048 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:42:46 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <003101c6c84c$621f5c90$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00aa01c6c830$e625f330$c6e49c04@SobelWriting> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 15:42:56 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 09:44:08 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EEFEA4.00B by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi Yeah thats right, and also the danish female artist called Anna Anker was wearing these dresses. I believe there is a portrait that her husband made of her, his name was Michael Anker. But if these are online i dont have a clue about. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Caryn Sobel" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress > > lots of pictures? Or, failing that, some detailed websites?> > > Karin Larsson, the wife of Swedish artist Carl Larsson, was known for her > own take on Aesthetic-style dresses, and her husband often painted her in > her designs. > > The book _Carl and Karin Larsson: Creators of the Swedish Style_ has > paintings and photos of her, as well as mention of her style. > > Hope this helps, > > Caryn > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 10:28:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PESS0m014934 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:28:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7PESJvJ020378 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:28:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PEQ0Du013010 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:26:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PEPrBB087895; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:25:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PEPmB0087823 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:25:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from carynsobel@earthlink.net) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=Yn+RrDedtSYP6QsZTJS5asufxFF+BYWH2TSQ3Do0tfx2+7BmsJPyHDaPkC5x5hL+; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [4.156.153.128] (helo=SobelWriting) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1GGcd1-0004gK-9J for h-costume@indra.com; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:25:48 -0400 Message-ID: <005001c6c852$49a71d00$80999c04@SobelWriting> From: "Caryn Sobel" To: "Historical Costume" References: <00aa01c6c830$e625f330$c6e49c04@SobelWriting> <003101c6c84c$621f5c90$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:25:07 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-ELNK-Trace: 251666aee31a72c3c5fbd2bc086b8747239a348a220c260949cd73ca4f88e3dd4680f5f30099cdad667c3043c0873f7e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 4.156.153.128 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:28:25 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EF0903.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Bjarne said: Thanks, Bjarne,I didn't know about the Ankers. I found a print at Art.com of Anna Anker (Ancher, by their spelling) by Michael. The link is very long, but if you go to www.art.com and put in Michael Anker, the portrait is right there. It's a great sunny portrait on a very gray, rainy day here, too. Caryn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 11:07:03 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PF73Ji015813 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 11:07:03 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7PF6v3e027374 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 11:07:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDFVXP004689 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:15:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PDFUWi032212; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:15:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta11.adelphia.net (mta11.adelphia.net [68.168.78.205]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7OMk6fH081050 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:46:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from tgilbert737@adelphia.net) Received: from VAIO ([68.71.173.61]) by mta11.adelphia.net (InterMail vM.6.01.05.02 201-2131-123-102-20050715) with SMTP id <20060824224556.NMWB4932.mta11.adelphia.net@VAIO> for ; Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:45:56 -0400 Message-ID: <1de301c6c7cf$0f2134f0$3dad4744@VAIO> From: "Gilbert" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:45:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-DCC-indra.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1044; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=2% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 11:07:00 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EF1211.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO If you are speaking of an Empire gown sort of dress (I can't remember the period for this dress, but the Kate Greenway children et al are attired in Empire gowns with the boys in breeches, etc), the pattern by Folkwear has, to my taste, excessive gathers in the bodice. I prefer a pattern with a smoother bodice (picky, I know) where the gathers are present but not obvious. I highly recommend the patterns found in the _Patterns of History_ books by Janet Arnold. They are not commercial patterns, per se, but are not difficult to follow. Marjorie Marjorie Marjorie Gilbert author of THE RETURN, a historical novel set in Georgian England www.marjoriegilbert.net Creating a Circa 1798 - 1805 Empire Gown http://marjoriegilbert.net/album_30_028.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robin Netherton" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 5:27 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress > > On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, MaggiRos wrote: > > > I seem to remember (long ago) someone on the list posted a website for > > commercial patterns for an Aesthetic tea dress or something. Would > > anyone happen to know of such a thing? > > I think Folkwear has one. > > --Robin > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 13:13:07 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PHD7xo019343 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 13:13:07 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7PHD1Hl004092 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 13:13:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PERxjs013309 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:28:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7PERvQC089635; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:27:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from m00.lax.untd.com (m00.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7PERpGh089487 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 08:27:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from m00.lax.untd.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by m00.lax.untd.com with SMTP id AABCQ8CGJACWWS5J for (sender ); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:27:20 -0700 (PDT) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: QHEuP/IhRKXTJ0EJwxwhgnQpu99UF4yp5uSWUPg8BaM= Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m00.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id LYMJPUYL; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:27:16 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:26:45 -0700 Message-ID: <20060825.072647.1872.4.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4-6 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-ContentStamp: 2:3:2514363052 X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 127.0.0.1|localhost|m00.lax.untd.com|cley@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: cley@juno.com Subject: [h-cost] contracts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 13:13:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EF2F9D.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi all. I was wondering if I could ask all you professionals out there for some advice. I have a friend who is starting to make high-quality SCA garb for sale, and is interested in doing custom work. She was wondering about the wording on contracts, whether these be pay for garment or barter for garment. Any suggestions that I could share with her? thanks! Arlys _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Fri Aug 25 22:33:27 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7Q2XRcX000638 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 22:33:27 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7Q2XKRt025017 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 22:33:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7Q2W5tg023950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 20:32:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7Q2VvtA016310; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 20:31:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (mail.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7Q2VrVg016272 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 20:31:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.173] (pm5-173.eos.net [205.133.149.173]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id k7Q2VpHK005925 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 22:31:51 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 22:16:06 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200608241805.k7OI4TdU002577@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: aesthetic dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Fri, 25 Aug 2006 22:33:24 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44EFB2F0.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Lovely as it may seem now, aesthetic dress was considered strange and subversive at the time. Gilbert and Sullivan had a great show (I have never seen it, unfortunately) about the aesthetic movement -- "Patience; or, Bunthorne's Bride." The heroine is a young girl who thinks she can't be in love unless she's suffering, so she ignores the nice young man who loves her in favor of the Oscar Wilde-ish poet whom she can't stand. Whenever she's around him, she suffers, so she thinks she must be in love. During the operetta, all the young soldiers give up their uniforms for velvet suits and lilies, to catch the women who are swooning over poets. "When I Go Out the Door" is the final song describing the poet and the hero. The poet is: "A most intense young man, A soulful-eyed young man, An ultra-poetical, super-aesthetical, Out-of-the-way young man! and "A pallid and thin young man, A haggard and lank young man, A greenery-yallery, Grosvenor Gallery, Foot-in-the-grave young man!" Of course, the aesthetic folks didn't see themselves that way. There's also a great cartoon by G.K. Chesterton called "Vision in Bedford Park." I can't find it online, unfortunately, but it's in the edition of "The Man Who Was Thursday" published by Ignatius and annotated by Martin Gardner. It shows a "pallid and thin" man carrying a lily and a woman in a loose, aesthetic gown staring in shock at the shadow of a man in a respectable coat, carrying a prayer book. The caption is "Bedford Parkers see a Dreadful Vision of the Future: an old acquaintance going to Church." Bedford Park was an artsy area of London where poets and the like hung out, and Chesterton was an old "Bedford Parker" himself, before his famous conversion, after which he preferred common sense and religious orthodoxy to aesthetic movements, atheism, and intellectual fads. But his associating aesthetic dress to these things gives you an idea of the way it was regarded. Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 26 17:38:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7QLcYMV026763 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 17:38:34 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7QLcD2m022818 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 17:38:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7QLbNeQ062253 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 15:37:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7QLaiM1044418; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 15:37:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37513.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37513.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.160]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7QLaCUG043994 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 15:36:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 80218 invoked by uid 60001); 26 Aug 2006 21:36:06 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=LKuNXQezjjr7FsHPpa/JnLVsaXBGOcPijYW0hYHwh9MleXYzRmEQONW3nLGP3mwyYfLtGpBCjXsAxL/e3qjLG6OIx0la64iSLy80S6QBqwn6C/WWIZt/v3IjeTgMGBF+ST0ZzFq9idlpjTjkEi4nNk+7b6e5IYKsLLrWJL+3kRQ= ; Message-ID: <20060826213606.80216.qmail@web37513.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37513.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 14:36:06 PDT Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 14:36:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova To: h-costume MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Subject: [h-cost] duvetyn X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 17:38:28 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44F0BF45.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Does anyone know when duvetyn/duvetine came into use? I've searched on the internet but couldn't find any info about duvetyn and its use in the past. Thanks, Zuzana --------------------------------- Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 26 22:17:36 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2HWqQ001704 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:17:32 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R2HPLQ019706 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:17:28 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2GR4Z088119 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:16:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2FJ1O014918; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:16:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7QLrBtO055635 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 15:53:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A97E3A6EB3 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 16:53:05 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44F0C2DF.5010404@reddawn.net> Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 16:53:35 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] duvetyn References: <20060826213606.80216.qmail@web37513.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20060826213606.80216.qmail@web37513.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:17:28 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F100B5.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Zuzana Kraemerova wrote: > Does anyone know when duvetyn/duvetine came into use? I've searched on the internet but couldn't find any info about duvetyn and its use in the past. > Thanks, > Never heard the word. What do you use it for? Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 26 22:48:07 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2m7Vk002435 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:48:07 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R2m1Rq007246 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:48:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2lXO5089903 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:47:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2k2QA031934; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:47:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.252]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7R2ioKn031200 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:45:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 56830 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 02:44:44 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=h5iL6kSJk/6AXe7Ur5ulIY+YT3hnpDhzPI6yAWcipecatfygHgXA8+9OyBGyD4PwFLURoU3JUFJXqx5dR6s9Itutlp0LqEAKd6mPobgZfYE8sZaboHldZzYFuCvhB1MNaw6Cdha7OQZWyxXeVxI+fqSSamwvjRvN1LI6ue05wSM= ; Message-ID: <20060827024444.56828.qmail@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 19:44:44 PDT Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 19:44:44 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] duvetyn To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <44F0C2DF.5010404@reddawn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:48:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F107E1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO http://www.bartleby.com/61/93/D0439300.html SYLLABICATION: du·ve·tyn PRONUNCIATION: dv-tn, dy-, dv-tn, dy- VARIANT FORMS: also du·ve·tyne NOUN: A soft, short-napped fabric with a twill weave, made of wool, cotton, rayon, or silk. ETYMOLOGY: French duvetine, from duvet, down. See duvet. It sucks up light (non-reflective) and holds a very deep black ciolor, so it's used as a drape in theatre for projection curtains, cycs, etc. It also makes up into a very serviceable working woman's doublet. :) MW11 puts the first use of the word at 1913. MaggiRos --- Dawn wrote: > Zuzana Kraemerova wrote: > > > Does anyone know when duvetyn/duvetine came into > use? I've searched on the internet but couldn't find > any info about duvetyn and its use in the past. > > Thanks, > > > > Never heard the word. What do you use it for? > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 26 22:56:42 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2ua9J003480 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:56:36 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R2u3ec002778 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:56:27 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2tdbS090504 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:55:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2t1aT038008; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:55:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.206.27]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7R2s3Tn037356 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:54:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 50285 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 02:47:16 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=5Igfy1SeufAuuOm2762XsARfZcr32BOOV1+1jT3UtYDZePXLoJVzRMS7SkBK6QJuCmQ+WsW1KkUvmPHvXtOUkSqLhkuWyUTlcvSxJjwWG148JZyezmMJaBuVRYtG0DA0q41EpUSABq7/tuWzTL+ihuNaOmSzolLT9ZB1JdqUudc= ; Message-ID: <20060827024716.50283.qmail@web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 19:47:16 PDT Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 19:47:16 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20060825.072647.1872.4.Cley@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:56:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44F109C3.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Does anyone have any comments or observations on this pattern? I'm looking at view I. MaggiRos _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sat Aug 26 23:23:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R3MuFv003854 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:23:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R3MnjN013753 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:22:52 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R3LPoN092164 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 21:21:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R3Jpn1052143; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 21:21:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R3FJdn049780 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 21:16:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m103.in-tch.com [216.166.191.103]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id k7R342Q16909 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 21:04:02 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <000601c6c988$26e1b820$67bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060827024716.50283.qmail@web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 21:23:21 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:22:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44F11009.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Which one is it? I tend not to remember them as "#21," or whatever, but as the houp one, or the ItalianRen one, etc.... --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "MaggiRos" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Saturday, August 26, 2006 8:47 PM Subject: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 > Does anyone have any comments or observations on this > pattern? I'm looking at view I. > > MaggiRos > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 00:55:42 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R4tcHd005574 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:55:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R4t8pw017177 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:55:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2lnni089917 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:47:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R2kbm5032237; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:47:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32707.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32707.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.251]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7R2jfgd031680 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 20:46:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 31024 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 02:45:35 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=e4DvlvC4UiscST1X/hLojzT7HDpkPkFZCCpxA1x+TiK/cXiNCmL04zKEQGHQdHc+ONmzdtfwjY3G8ewrQkmHxz7BHj3ueIBjOYTpH7morFRPGgUZnaiBa5I3U55l6JLstHPM3J6ukJ/Ib9OHe9TKKoj29aheGDUzSnuPOFQJlYw= ; Message-ID: <20060827024535.31022.qmail@web32707.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32707.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 19:45:35 PDT Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 19:45:35 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:55:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44F125AC.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Are there any commercial patterns available online? MaggiRos --- Robin Netherton wrote: > > On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, Carolyn Kayta Barrows wrote: > > > I'd say humor and satire magazines, like Punch, > would have more > > coverage of Aesthetic-style clothing than regular > fashion magazines. > > The Aesthetics weren't high fashion, they were > counter-culture, the > > Beatniks, Hippies, and Punks of their day. > > The Aesthetics themselves, yes -- they were not > quite respectable, and > some of them were considered scandalous. But just as > fashion-conscious > people in the 1960s and 70s adopted tie-dye and > denims from the hippies, > mainstream 19th century designers adopted a version > of the Aesthetic look > and tidied it up for fashionable wear. In 1884, a > high-fashion London > store, Liberty, opened a special department called > the Artistic and > Historic Costume Studio. This became the top > shopping spot of the > Aesthetic set, but it also got plenty of business > selling clothes with > "artistic" or "historical" elements to more > conventional shoppers. Stella > Mary Newton's book has some good information on > this, including some > pictures of fashion plates of artistic dress from > Harper's and a picture > of an extant artistic dress from Liberty. > > Punch did have good cartoons about the Aesthetes, > though. > > --Robin > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 00:56:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R4umC1005592 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:56:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R4ugSk018998 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:56:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R4suUJ098642 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:54:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R4sMBv003701; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:54:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m14.mx.aol.com (imo-m14.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R4ruT6003392 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:54:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from AlbertCat@aol.com) Received: from AlbertCat@aol.com by imo-m14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.3b3.60d5308 (41809) for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:53:48 -0400 (EDT) From: AlbertCat@aol.com Message-ID: <3b3.60d5308.32227f5c@aol.com> Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:53:48 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] duvetyn To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5331 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:56:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F1260A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/26/2006 10:19:20 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, dawn@reddawn.net writes: Never heard the word. What do you use it for? ****************** For blocking out light....in theatre and film. And it does it very well too. The fabric is thick and felted. It doesn't have a nap. It doesn't ravel much either if at all. It's kinda like 18th or 19th century wool. We even made some frock coats out of some left over from the scene dept. once. It's not wool though, but made of some synthetic. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 01:23:33 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5NTQi006009 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:23:29 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R5NM53001737 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:23:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5M0uh001863 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:22:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5LaO6020760; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:21:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from b.mail.sonic.net (b.mail.sonic.net [64.142.19.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5LDSZ020457 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:21:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from fran@lavoltapress.com) Received: from [209.148.118.254] (209-148-118-254.dial.dynamic.sonic.net [209.148.118.254]) (authenticated bits=0) by b.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id k7R5LCKQ029949 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:21:13 -0700 Message-ID: <44F12BCF.1080803@lavoltapress.com> Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 22:21:19 -0700 From: Lavolta Press Organization: Lavolta Press User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume References: <20060827024535.31022.qmail@web32707.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20060827024535.31022.qmail@web32707.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Aesthetic dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:23:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F12C4A.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO But just as >>fashion-conscious >>people in the 1960s and 70s adopted tie-dye and >>denims from the hippies, >>mainstream 19th century designers adopted a version >>of the Aesthetic look >>and tidied it up for fashionable wear. The less extreme Aesthetic look appealed to middle-class women on a budget, because it had a number of solid advantages. Less expensive materials could be used, jewelry tended to be things like amber instead of diamonds, you could have a skimpier style that used less material, and you could have a quasi-historic style that didn't have to be updated every few months to keep up with fashion. Also, the Aesthetic look celebrated some physical characteristics, such as red hair, and a square jaw on a woman, that were commonly considered downright ugly in mainstream fashion. Also, the "muddy" and "greenery-yallery" Aesthetic colors looked better on some people than fashionable bright colors. There was also an intellectual, "arty" aspect to the look that appealed to people who liked to be thought artistic, even though they had no intention of becoming professional artists. And there was some crossover with the dress reform movement, which also had moderate as well as extremist adherents. For example, the Aesthetic look often either omitted the corset or used a modified light corset. (I put a pattern for one, from a how-to guide to "moderate" Aesthetic dress, in the first volume of _Fashions of the Gilded Age_.) The Aesthetic look lent elements to mainstream fashion--over time it influenced colors, for one thing--but the extreme Aesthetic look seldom appeared in fashionable magazines. I do have some original how-to directions (not a pattern) for reproducing a dress from a production (one of many) of _Patience_, from a mainstream fashionable magazine. Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 01:25:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5P6B3006025 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:25:06 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R5P0eR002539 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:25:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5OAfG002100 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:24:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5NvNQ022581; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:24:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5NmVe022374 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:23:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE01BA6EB4 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:23:42 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44F12C7F.3040306@reddawn.net> Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:24:15 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 References: <20060827024716.50283.qmail@web32714.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <000601c6c988$26e1b820$67bfa6d8@pavilion> In-Reply-To: <000601c6c988$26e1b820$67bfa6d8@pavilion> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:25:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F12CAC.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Sue Clemenger wrote: > Which one is it? I tend not to remember them as "#21," or whatever, but as > the houp one, or the ItalianRen one, etc.... > > >>Does anyone have any comments or observations on this >>pattern? I'm looking at view I. >> "14th and 15th century cotehardies" I have it (and the male pattern) but haven't used them yet. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 01:56:38 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5uc2T006736 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:56:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R5uRra022112 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:56:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5tmss005522 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:55:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5tI2T041935; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:55:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R5sfTK041500 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 23:54:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from TeaRoseS@aol.com) Received: from TeaRoseS@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.549.62e0073 (32915) for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:54:30 -0400 (EDT) From: TeaRoseS@aol.com Message-ID: <549.62e0073.32228d96@aol.com> Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:54:30 EDT To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: aesthetic dress X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:56:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F1340B.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thanks, Gail -- but darn it, I even have a copy of "The Man Who Was Thursday," but no illustrations. Oh well. Thanks for all your input, guys, I really enjoy this kind of discussion. That tea dress pattern is totally yummy! And I'm going to have some fun looking up all those links and reading them. Tea Rose, who likes to imagine she bears a resemblance to that redhead in all those Waterhouse paintings. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 03:29:18 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R7TEut008607 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 03:29:18 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R7T8NP028367 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 03:29:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R7RVBZ015874 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:27:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R7RSEh095456; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:27:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.206.26]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7R7ROVS095388 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:27:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 21920 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 07:27:19 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=ILpw2AbyG9abZGrG9EiT7fleS2OLVXdUzJc+GgJN6ce3WGTO9DtF1sXRR2vvVwBv6u9AP9wnXEbp3QziuCKR8jumMzHZRZOqUqd1+Ihs+FOqYwmiIB+ruDizTbqYYFY/qdc1VW5LGSFvkfkqk2xLtm1L2SycNQ1bSBdGPq89ERQ= ; Message-ID: <20060827072719.21918.qmail@web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:27:19 PDT Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:27:19 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <000601c6c988$26e1b820$67bfa6d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 03:29:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44F149C4.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO It's the 14th & 15th century cotehardies & "sideless surcoates" one. All I want to create is the blue dress from June in the Duke of Berry's book of hours. I've been 16th century for so long, I hardly know where to begin with a cotehardie. I expect to look frumpy and middle-aged in any case. Just curious how the pattern works, how true to size it might be, how accurate to period, and so on. Being MM, I don't expect much from the directions. I presume that anyone with either rapturously fond or rabidly contrary opinions would know the pattern both by name and number. :-) MaggiRos --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > Which one is it? I tend not to remember them as > "#21," or whatever, but as > the houp one, or the ItalianRen one, etc.... > --Sue > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MaggiRos" > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Saturday, August 26, 2006 8:47 PM > Subject: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 > > > > Does anyone have any comments or observations on > this > > pattern? I'm looking at view I. > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 03:31:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R7V0Yl008641 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 03:31:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R7Ushw030036 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 03:30:57 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R7UVjr016202 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:30:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R7UUjd097037; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:30:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.250]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7R7UR43096944 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:30:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 49788 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 07:30:21 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=5deqDFJD7a8LJUJCiwQqaMu3ctov0vQncAAM1M/3p5cPLo3pFHH0j9IJKt6X3k5+7vg+FTKT9GrlaXeZgtupFChm9MlXtkeqwnmm6LhWdr2RcAKMwfFGrOPRNZ7cPZqJ8FH4Rj2E7soiiyZ5JJUXDsr3ahn+HdEq1GzK9KyJdTw= ; Message-ID: <20060827073021.49786.qmail@web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32706.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:30:21 PDT Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 00:30:21 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 03:30:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F14A2E.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Ah yes. I've seen this before and apparently lost the links. Thank you! MaggiRos --- Robin Netherton wrote: > > On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, MaggiRos wrote: > > > I seem to remember (long ago) someone on the list > posted a website for > > commercial patterns for an Aesthetic tea dress or > something. Would > > anyone happen to know of such a thing? > > I just mentioned Folkwear, but I was wrong. The one > I was thinking about > was from La Mode Bagatelle: > > http://www.ravenrook.com/bagatelle/art.jsp > http://www.sewingcentral.com/cgi-bin/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=lmb002.html&cart_id=7858735_12881 > ...and probably other vendors too. > > Some reviews here, bottom of page: > > http://www.gbacg.org/Patterns/lmb.htm > > No, I've never done this period. I just love looking > at it. > > IIRC, some of the St. Louis Costume Guild people > (including a few on this > list?) made artistic dresses for the most recent > CostumeCon, but I don't > know which pattern, if any, they used. > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 04:37:27 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8bITD018446 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:37:22 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R8aiBr013184 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:37:11 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8ZmaA022549 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:35:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8ZiNO036162; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:35:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepc.post.tele.dk (pfepc.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.237]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8ZexU036107 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:35:42 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepc.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 8FB5C8A0048 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:35:39 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001301c6c9b3$d3393af0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060826213606.80216.qmail@web37513.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] duvetyn Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:36:00 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:37:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44F1599C.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi Zuzanna, My bobbin lace pillow is covered with a moss green wool duvetine. It is very durable and yeat very soft. It had this cover when i baught it as new. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zuzana Kraemerova" To: "h-costume" Sent: Saturday, August 26, 2006 11:36 PM Subject: [h-cost] duvetyn > Does anyone know when duvetyn/duvetine came into use? I've searched on the > internet but couldn't find any info about duvetyn and its use in the past. > Thanks, > > Zuzana > > > --------------------------------- > Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out. > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 04:37:33 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8bXiI018454 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:37:33 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R8bQtZ031159 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:37:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8awbh022693 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:36:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8avYQ036912; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:36:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37507.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37507.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.154]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7R8astg036847 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:36:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 38078 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 08:36:49 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=gGUhbC0PaTdy963TuXhW6ZA0mzN+kj7GPveC4tmm7/8dgca3dMeiNJpnI9TS45Ol09xv3aXwWJ70dJCNqkMjKoqd5o+hX+3BG9E5aQjUJaoYFxplc0KlLWPiXuWkgAcZcj1P2sTBZhn4MrTWnRL/3mBN928vjP6i1nY2ddym9XE= ; Message-ID: <20060827083649.38076.qmail@web37507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37507.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:36:49 PDT Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:36:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20060827072719.21918.qmail@web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:37:30 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F159C6.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Did you look here? http://www.mediaevalmisc.com/pp21-ex.htm There are some photos of the finished garments, which give a much better idea about the patterns rather than the pictures. Zuzana --------------------------------- Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Yahoo! Small Business. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 04:50:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8o0Z9018545 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:50:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7R8ns0l006602 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:49:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8nPbm024125 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:49:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R8nNsc045010; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:49:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web37502.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web37502.mail.mud.yahoo.com [209.191.91.149]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7R8nJm0044853 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 02:49:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from zkraemerova@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 66345 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 08:49:14 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=vQfRSssdCiZW+ZwN2344Z8YkimwBWgil91diXHLBuQaTUYtzKO4fqur/Ye6jytw9R2ag4KleTVuqrElHVcU4fiywJRSFhaBLrSedpDT+8ogqiRTSeR02tbji2QHTaYBlQEVh9D/jqYtRgPcZkPhF7xlDiQi6Jk8nSB5kf8XG64A= ; Message-ID: <20060827084914.66343.qmail@web37502.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [212.24.150.227] by web37502.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:49:14 PDT Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 01:49:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova Subject: Re: [h-cost] duvetyn To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <3b3.60d5308.32227f5c@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 04:49:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F15CB2.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I was asking because in my country this is a very popular sort of fabric used by re-enactors (whose knowledge of historical costumes is, mostly, very poor). I've never seen it mentioned in any book on costumes, so I was wondering where does its popularity come from. The people use it mostly for heavy garments like cloaks, but now it's being used even for the leg wear... Maybe it's so popular because there's simply no other kind of fabric of natural material (cotton) which provides warmth on the market, except for velvet. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 09:55:20 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RDtKYQ031020 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:55:20 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RDtEun013528 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:55:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RDsIZx059485 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:54:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RDsC40034761; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:54:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m21.mx.aol.com (imo-m21.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RDs7vL034601 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:54:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Cheryldee@aol.com) Received: from Cheryldee@aol.com by imo-m21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.317.7e6bc400 (39330) for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:53:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Cheryldee@aol.com Message-ID: <317.7e6bc400.3222fdf6@aol.com> Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:53:58 EDT Subject: Re: [h-cost] duvetyn To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5330 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:55:17 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F1A442.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/26/2006 11:01:47 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, AlbertCat@aol.com writes: For blocking out light....in theatre and film. And it does it very well too. The fabric is thick and felted. It doesn't have a nap. It doesn't ravel much either if at all. It's kinda like 18th or 19th century wool. We even made some frock coats out of some left over from the scene dept. once. It's not wool though, but made of some synthetic. Actually, the duvetyn made for theatre drapes is cotton and fireproofed. It is relatively inexpensive, given what it is, and comes in incredible widths. (118" wide at Dazians and in two thicknesses. And I suspect the original product (lost in the mists of time) was made of wool and used for outer garments??? It doesn't have a nap because it is brushed, like flannel. And in the theatre the spelling is Duvateen. I would caution against using it for clothing next to the body, given the fireproofing which can irritate and dry the skin. Most fireproofing has salt in it. However, you could wash it and remove most of the fireproofing, allowing for shrinkage. And there now appears to be a synthetic version of it, although I have not experienced it. Cheryl Odom, College of Santa Fe _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 10:29:19 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RETC1L031575 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:29:12 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7REST0o004370 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:28:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RERnI6064652 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 08:27:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RERbot058851; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 08:27:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RERPNJ058662 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 08:27:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.47]) by mk-ironport-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 27 Aug 2006 15:27:19 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AQAAAPRH8USBT4lbAgIHAgwHBh0 Received: from 88-107-122-144.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.122.144]:1542 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1GHLbb-000Hai-0h for h-costume@indra.com; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:27:19 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060827152513.0266ce08@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 15:27:04 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke In-Reply-To: <000801c6c1bb$d649be40$726af853@dator1> References: <200608170324.k7H3NBwR060844@net.indra.com> <000801c6c1bb$d649be40$726af853@dator1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Duvateen X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:28:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44F1AC0D.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Interesting that duvateen is used in theatre in America. My husband, senior stage technician at the Barbican, in London, has never heard of it. They use black wool serge, inherently fireproof, although it is also proofed. Also they use velveteen occasionally. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 12:00:22 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RG0Mln001064 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:00:22 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RG0FAG016598 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:00:18 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RFr1xT075402 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:53:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RFqwmH025796; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:52:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RFqsu7025747 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:52:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m111.in-tch.com [216.166.191.111]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id k7RFfXQ08295 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:41:33 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <001201c6c9f1$fa6bade0$6fbfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060827072719.21918.qmail@web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:00:52 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:00:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F1C18F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I used their patterns a lot, when I was first starting out in the SCA, but that was many (mumblety) years ago, so I've forgotten some of the specifics. I settled into 16th century England rather firmly after that, although in the last few years, I've been dabbling with Early Medieval stuff. As it turns out, my very first SCA garb was made using the MM cotehardie pattern. Sleeves fit okay, from what I recall. I had serious problems with the neckline, which was sort of scooped. The first time I put the dress on, the neckline widened itself into sort of a boat shape, and the whole gown dropped to the floor. We had to make all kinds of weird tucks and adjustments for it to be usable, and even then, I still had to adhere it to my bra straps (used woven tape and snaps). Now, granted, we were inexperienced and the fabric was cotton, but even so.... I also, over the years of use, had issues with their sizing. It always seemed to me that the larger the size you were using, the longer they made the damned things. My ItalianRen gown had a skirt more than 18" longer than necessary. I did make at least one or two of the surcoats from the same MM pattern. The biggest issue I remember with those is that the scoops/open areas on the sides were waaaay too large, and a bit low, and had the very unfortunate habit of emphasizing my least favorite part of my body (tummy). I never had the problem with their pattern instructions that some people have, and I did like their research--at the time, they were quite the thing, this being pre-internet, and pre-most of the wonderful stuff that's come out since. And I did like the variety of styles and patterns available, although I despised the practice of printing one view right on top of another's pattern pieces (within the same packet), which meant if you wanted to make more than one style from the same envelope, you were stuck copying your pieces or something. So it's a mixed bag.....If I were you, and thinking of using the pattern, I'd use it with caution, but not completely discount it. Watch for length, fitting, reinforce neckline edges, consider lining it at least to one's hips, etc. There are other patterns out there, I believe, although I haven't used them (I've got a copy of the Simplicity one, somewhere), and there are a lot of websites with wonderful research done on these styles, so if I were doing my first one fitted gown today, I'd probably avoid the patterns altogether, and use one of the fitting methods (Robin's or Tasha's, or some of the other options I've seen and bookmarked, and of course can't remember right now when it would be very helpful and cool if I could...sigh) --Sue, off in search of more memory-enhancing coffee ;o) ----- Original Message ----- From: "MaggiRos" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, August 27, 2006 1:27 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 > It's the 14th & 15th century cotehardies & "sideless > surcoates" one. All I want to create is the blue dress > from June in the Duke of Berry's book of hours. I've > been 16th century for so long, I hardly know where to > begin with a cotehardie. I expect to look frumpy and > middle-aged in any case. Just curious how the pattern > works, how true to size it might be, how accurate to > period, and so on. Being MM, I don't expect much from > the directions. > > I presume that anyone with either rapturously fond or > rabidly contrary opinions would know the pattern both > by name and number. :-) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 12:14:26 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RGEQvZ001418 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:14:26 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RGEJAf024704 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:14:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RGDS9h077802 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:13:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RGDQKI039793; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:13:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s25.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s25.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.97]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RFETXo095679 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:14:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from bear_janet@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.161.88]) by bay0-omc1-s25.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 08:14:23 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 08:14:23 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 71.116.18.29 by BAY106-DAV16.phx.gbl with DAV; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 15:14:20 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [71.116.18.29] X-Originating-Email: [bear_janet@msn.com] X-Sender: bear_janet@msn.com From: "JAMES OGILVIE" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060827072719.21918.qmail@web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:14:22 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 8.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202 Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:14:23 -0400 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Aug 2006 15:14:23.0584 (UTC) FILETIME=[7A784E00:01C6C9EB] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:14:23 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44F1C4DB.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id k7RGEQvZ001418 Status: RO All I want to create is the blue dress from June in the Duke of Berry's book of hours. I would not expect that look from this pattern. The body isn't close-fitting enough and the skirts are too skimpy. I I made it about 13 years ago and thought it made me look "frumpy and middle-aged" then. (On the other hand, I just washed it again last night - it is very useful for wearing during things like camp set-up, inclement weather...) I have had much better luck getting that look with mundane patterns with princess seams. Janet _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 13:14:41 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHEa7C003496 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:14:40 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RHEU2P020018 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:14:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHDYSQ086811 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:13:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHDUYM085367; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:13:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc2-s31.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s31.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.167]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHDQpL085247 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:13:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from bear_janet@msn.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([65.54.161.86]) by bay0-omc2-s31.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:13:19 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:13:18 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 71.116.18.29 by BAY106-DAV14.phx.gbl with DAV; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 17:13:18 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [71.116.18.29] X-Originating-Email: [bear_janet@msn.com] X-Sender: bear_janet@msn.com From: "JAMES OGILVIE" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060827072719.21918.qmail@web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <001201c6c9f1$fa6bade0$6fbfa6d8@pavilion> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:13:19 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: MSN 8.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By MSN MimeOLE V8.50.0017.1202 Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:13:20 -0400 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Aug 2006 17:13:18.0858 (UTC) FILETIME=[176CB6A0:01C6C9FC] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:14:33 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44F1D2F6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id k7RHEa7C003496 Status: RO It always seemed to me that the larger the size you were using, the longer they made the damned things. My ItalianRen gown had a skirt more than 18" longer than necessary. The woman who designed these patterns is quite tall so they are designed for her idea of a normal body. Janet _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 13:32:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHWhL0003917 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:32:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RHWbcN010219 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:32:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHVw85089173 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:31:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHVtaP098511; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:31:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHVqV9098465 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:31:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GHOUF-0003HN-Gv; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:31:55 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:31:55 -0400 Message-ID: <20060827133155.colucjxjnjy84gww@www.goldsword.com> Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:31:55 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 References: <20060827072719.21918.qmail@web32713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <001201c6c9f1$fa6bade0$6fbfa6d8@pavilion> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.1) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:32:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F1D735.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting JAMES OGILVIE : > It always > seemed to me that the larger the size you were using, the longer they made > the damned things. My ItalianRen gown had a skirt more than 18" longer than > necessary. > > The woman who designed these patterns is quite tall so they are > designed for her idea of a normal body. > Who designed the MM patterns, do we know? susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 14:00:12 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RI0CHR004501 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:00:12 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RI06P8003845 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:00:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHxZ94092782 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:59:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RHxXAl019425; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:59:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.249]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7RHxVJQ019321 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:59:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 85486 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 17:59:25 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=I71v/WT+YkCWRZE7abV+5FbTEoK7Xb6pdVkLV+FgfaW9hS2gcbSxwxI4p8npsqnLz3eQ/vV1ndgxqpebnSfv/+Whq0CCSriyu3QBcuuuFISZTL0Xz19XnicnKy0Vn8rw/W8kW8q2s4NYZBntsPvtN1g2xY8AxcH+AJdO72tR+qQ= ; Message-ID: <20060827175925.85484.qmail@web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32705.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:59:25 PDT Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 10:59:25 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:00:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44F1DDA6.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I expect to need to raise the waist anyway, so the extra length should be useful. That way I can keep the width-at-hem instead of cutting it off and making a narrower skirt. But yes, she does seem to add 2" length for every dress size. I got chubbier, not taller! :) I really appreciate all the input on this pattern. I'd love to use Robin's method, but I'm doing this mainly alone and her very clever method requires more help than I want to rely on. Good thing there's no hard deadline. MaggiRos --- JAMES OGILVIE wrote: > It always > seemed to me that the larger the size you were > using, the longer they made > the damned things. My ItalianRen gown had a skirt > more than 18" longer than > necessary. > > The woman who designed these patterns is quite tall > so they are designed for her idea of a normal body. > > Janet > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 14:00:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RI0t1d004520 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:00:55 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RI0mAG029829 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:00:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RI0NK3092946 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:00:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RI0NGm020037; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:00:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.206.25]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7RI0C3C019855 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:00:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 37080 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 18:00:06 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=i3TKg5+RWORmX7r879z7J0B2KiATEBGscldizyLm/AMvc2bbkrdaWbiW2lRym1KEYzCD397meBI5UfQRkuMGcKpaNFm8AU1Lkr0CvlyYaZncZNbE9jzc3kh4kzsApiR7+8Ceg6XnvgceMaptkANrG/fniIOmlKj7PwZzsOIyAKg= ; Message-ID: <20060827180006.37078.qmail@web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32712.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:00:06 PDT Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:00:06 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20060827133155.colucjxjnjy84gww@www.goldsword.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:00:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F1DDD1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Coryn Weigel? I think? --- "Susan B. Farmer" wrote: > Quoting JAMES OGILVIE : > > > It always > > seemed to me that the larger the size you were > using, the longer they made > > the damned things. My ItalianRen gown had a skirt > more than 18" longer than > > necessary. > > > > The woman who designed these patterns is quite > tall so they are > > designed for her idea of a normal body. > > > > Who designed the MM patterns, do we know? > > susan > ----- > Susan Farmer > sfarmer@goldsword.com > University of Tennessee > Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 14:54:13 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RIsD4l005624 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:54:13 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RIs7Rd004966 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:54:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RIrTp3099767 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:53:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RIrQZQ059008; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:53:26 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com (nz-out-0102.google.com [64.233.162.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RIrOIR058984 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:53:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id 12so783710nzp for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:53:24 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=oJLhp+7Ag28eOwacRBkwPv33EMydvB23ZDfJOLuIhT2zI/ttM4CalhFQ0KYaqB8giehSgpwC3rEecVSMtytIaoE8UlEtrFdVeD5ChgnM2EfqjruDFgVCz9tcoi2ZuXO2HA75U6DA+vEh8UPkPd0lqPP4NBLiCzHQAsLIX+nbuXo= Received: by 10.64.184.14 with SMTP id h14mr5895521qbf; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:53:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.237.12 with HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:53:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:53:23 -0700 From: Cin To: h-cost MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Lund, Sweden X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:54:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F1EA4F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hey, list folks, in particular the Swedish contingent, I have a fiance going to Lund, Sweden for a brief business trip. Could you recommend any local museums or castles with excellent early costume collections? My clever plan is to send him for the catalog. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 16:45:43 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RKjcx6008214 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 16:45:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RKjWer000592 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 16:45:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RKifio013582 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:44:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RKiZ9K037511; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:44:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web52215.mail.yahoo.com (web52215.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.48.138]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7RKiWEX037425 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:44:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from childishwhims@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 82784 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 20:44:26 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=t6fx6wEsTrjfeERR5vKC+eU7XiHrIzHSrTD6iJpk9gPIhgUbYRwd7nMRLv3UEuGRmGtEiiW6+2pXbxS6w7ZI+n5pgDlEfnjKTjxo9of2bUBDaLWljdUtwkeJSGBXW2/C/K1BR3Og0lX6CO3pgsIB9hMLdE0OjCiBF/tU2THIOKk= ; Message-ID: <20060827204426.82782.qmail@web52215.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [66.19.114.52] by web52215.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:44:26 PDT Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 13:44:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Teena Robertson Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <001201c6c9f1$fa6bade0$6fbfa6d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 16:45:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44F2046C.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I've been reading most of the posts on this subject and I have to agree on the comments about the sizing on the MM patterns. I used the discontinued Tudor Court pattern for my wedding 9yrs ago and my mother and I had to do ALOT of adjustment to it the whole time we were making it. So good luck and please send pictures when you do make it. Teena Sue Clemenger wrote: I used their patterns a lot, when I was first starting out in the SCA, but that was many (mumblety) years ago, so I've forgotten some of the specifics. I settled into 16th century England rather firmly after that, although in the last few years, I've been dabbling with Early Medieval stuff. As it turns out, my very first SCA garb was made using the MM cotehardie pattern. Sleeves fit okay, from what I recall. I had serious problems with the neckline, which was sort of scooped. The first time I put the dress on, the neckline widened itself into sort of a boat shape, and the whole gown dropped to the floor. We had to make all kinds of weird tucks and adjustments for it to be usable, and even then, I still had to adhere it to my bra straps (used woven tape and snaps). Now, granted, we were inexperienced and the fabric was cotton, but even so.... I also, over the years of use, had issues with their sizing. It always seemed to me that the larger the size you were using, the longer they made the damned things. My ItalianRen gown had a skirt more than 18" longer than necessary. I did make at least one or two of the surcoats from the same MM pattern. The biggest issue I remember with those is that the scoops/open areas on the sides were waaaay too large, and a bit low, and had the very unfortunate habit of emphasizing my least favorite part of my body (tummy). I never had the problem with their pattern instructions that some people have, and I did like their research--at the time, they were quite the thing, this being pre-internet, and pre-most of the wonderful stuff that's come out since. And I did like the variety of styles and patterns available, although I despised the practice of printing one view right on top of another's pattern pieces (within the same packet), which meant if you wanted to make more than one style from the same envelope, you were stuck copying your pieces or something. So it's a mixed bag.....If I were you, and thinking of using the pattern, I'd use it with caution, but not completely discount it. Watch for length, fitting, reinforce neckline edges, consider lining it at least to one's hips, etc. There are other patterns out there, I believe, although I haven't used them (I've got a copy of the Simplicity one, somewhere), and there are a lot of websites with wonderful research done on these styles, so if I were doing my first one fitted gown today, I'd probably avoid the patterns altogether, and use one of the fitting methods (Robin's or Tasha's, or some of the other options I've seen and bookmarked, and of course can't remember right now when it would be very helpful and cool if I could...sigh) --Sue, off in search of more memory-enhancing coffee ;o) ----- Original Message ----- From: "MaggiRos" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Sunday, August 27, 2006 1:27 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 > It's the 14th & 15th century cotehardies & "sideless > surcoates" one. All I want to create is the blue dress > from June in the Duke of Berry's book of hours. I've > been 16th century for so long, I hardly know where to > begin with a cotehardie. I expect to look frumpy and > middle-aged in any case. Just curious how the pattern > works, how true to size it might be, how accurate to > period, and so on. Being MM, I don't expect much from > the directions. > > I presume that anyone with either rapturously fond or > rabidly contrary opinions would know the pattern both > by name and number. :-) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 17:05:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RL5nTF008595 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 17:05:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RL5hTw032628 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 17:05:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RL58vi015808 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 15:05:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RL56Vw051597; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 15:05:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.247]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7RL4xpo051446 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 15:05:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 68566 invoked by uid 60001); 27 Aug 2006 21:04:54 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=KpoxF12XdJ0k1mGfp/MUeMHY/Yr9hAyRO2PUIkGhHwNwoAGP5BGS2epVMAm0Xq9mS7aDpmy+yUH4IJj5ZKtlMOYT1WDsksiWmobntgLWlvVD7DXpe7+h/9ZFgQeexOXCN2+ZdQybz5hyrsisQuoIf/jzdNkM73UlIXEECJpOcFA= ; Message-ID: <20060827210454.68564.qmail@web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32703.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:04:54 PDT Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 14:04:54 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Heidi, Kate Greenaway, and Aesthetic dress To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 17:05:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44F20927.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Ah now I recall why I didn't buy this before. It's pricey! But it looks wonderful. Maybe next year... MaggiRos --- Robin Netherton wrote: > > On Thu, 24 Aug 2006, MaggiRos wrote: > > > I seem to remember (long ago) someone on the list > posted a website for > > commercial patterns for an Aesthetic tea dress or > something. Would > > anyone happen to know of such a thing? > > I just mentioned Folkwear, but I was wrong. The one > I was thinking about > was from La Mode Bagatelle: > > http://www.ravenrook.com/bagatelle/art.jsp > http://www.sewingcentral.com/cgi-bin/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=lmb002.html&cart_id=7858735_12881 > ...and probably other vendors too. > > Some reviews here, bottom of page: > > http://www.gbacg.org/Patterns/lmb.htm > > No, I've never done this period. I just love looking > at it. > > IIRC, some of the St. Louis Costume Guild people > (including a few on this > list?) made artistic dresses for the most recent > CostumeCon, but I don't > know which pattern, if any, they used. > > --Robin > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 18:25:15 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RMPBNC009867 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 18:25:15 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7RMP4AB015758 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 18:25:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RMO642024785 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 16:24:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RMNwXk000463; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 16:23:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepa.post.tele.dk (pfepa.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.235]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7RMNrst000403 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 16:23:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepa.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id 8731BFAC02D for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:23:52 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000d01c6ca27$8e5617e0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: "Historical Costume" References: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Lund, Sweden Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:24:22 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 18:25:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44F21BC0.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hi Cin, There is the museum called "Kulturen" wich has a department with Historical Costumes, i think they change their exhibitis from time to time. I was there 3 years ago to see womens clothes from early 18th to 20th century. I know they have a ruff from 16th century amongst other rare things. Bjarne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cin" To: "h-cost" Sent: Sunday, August 27, 2006 8:53 PM Subject: [h-cost] Lund, Sweden > Hey, list folks, in particular the Swedish contingent, > I have a fiance going to Lund, Sweden for a brief business trip. > Could you recommend any local museums or castles with excellent early > costume collections? My clever plan is to send him for the catalog. > > --cin > Cynthia Barnes > CinBarnes@gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Sun Aug 27 22:12:10 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7S2C0Ca014049 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:12:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7S2BE1F016992 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:11:47 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7S28qkY065595 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 20:08:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7S28irX061639; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 20:08:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mail.eos.net (mail.eos.net [205.133.149.17]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7S28fRc061585 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 20:08:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from gailscott@eos.net) Received: from [205.133.149.178] (pm5-178.eos.net [205.133.149.178]) by mail.eos.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id k7S28cHK027934 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:08:39 -0400 (EDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:53:21 -0400 From: Gail & Scott Finke To: Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200608271354.k7RDsDpb034770@net.indra.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: cotehardie pattern X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:11:47 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44F250C2.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO MaggiRos: I don't have those Book of Hours illustrations handy, and I have never used that pattern... the reason being that I have never liked the fit in the made-up ones I've seen. How closely fit is the one on "Miss June"? I have had very good success with a method I made up in a fit of creative energy but with no patterns handy -- but it won't work for a very tight gown. This method works for a gown that is tighter fit than modern dresses, but not supportive enough to use without modern undergarments. I made several camp/work gowns from it, and they look very good when worn with a hood, a hip belt, and medieval shoes. Here's what I did: I decided to make a gown from all rectangles and squares. I measured the widest part of me and divided that into four. Then I added two inches for seam allowance and ease, and cut four rectangles that width by the measurement from my shoulders to the ground (plus a little for hem and seams). Have enough fabric left over for sleeves (rectangles) and gores. Next I sewed two together, so I had two rectangles. Then I cut a neck hole (just pick one from something you have that fits -- but don't forget to cut smaller so that you can hem around it). Next do the sleeves. Make the sleeves as rectangles, with the fold at the shoulder and the seam underneath -- or in the back if you prefer. Sew them to the shoulders, which you leave straight. Where the sleeve meets the side seam, sew a little square gore (is that the word?). It's not difficult to sew this as an actual square, but it's even easier to use two right-angle triangles, sewn into the right angle between the sleeve and the side seam, and then sew the sleeve from the wrist to the triangle, and then down the unfinished part of the triangle to meet the side seam. Try to use the smallest square you can -- the sleeves should be tight, unlike modern shirt sleeves, but the square should give you plenty of ease. My wedding gown, made in the 1950s, has very narrow sleeves with ease created by the same little square. >From there you just pin it until it fits. If someone can help you, that's better -- but you can do it yourself too. Just baste it and try it out before you cut! Make this fit from your underarm until the widest part of your hips, if you have an hourglass figure. Otherwise use your waist -- wherever is widest. Finally, do gores for the hip (or widest spot) to the floor. You only need two, at the sides, but you can do three (add a back gore) or four (add a front) to make it luxurious and swirly. If you have to piece fabric for one or more gores, you will feel even more medieval! The gown should be fairly tight, just loose enough to slip over your head with a little difficulty. You can sew buttons up the front to mimic a fancier cotehardie. The fit depends on your skill, of course, but I have found that the look is very "real" -- something about all those geometric pieces. It is easy and even kind of fun to take a bunch of rectangles and make a fitted dress! Gail Finke _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 14:47:40 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SIldhU031750 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:47:39 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SIlWvm027472 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:47:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SIjWoG090995 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:45:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SIhKLp083553; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:43:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com [192.25.240.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SCtTQV054428 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 06:55:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sunshine_buchler@agilent.com) Received: from relcos2.cos.agilent.com (relcos2.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.237]) by msgbas1x.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01E6522ABF for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 06:55:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com (wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com [130.29.152.233]) by relcos2.cos.agilent.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E730014791A for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 06:55:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: from wcosbh01.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.125]) by wcosvs03.cos.agilent.com with InterScan Messaging Security Suite; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 06:55:22 -0600 Received: from wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com ([130.29.152.72]) by wcosbh01.cos.agilent.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 06:55:21 -0600 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Subject: RE: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 06:55:20 -0600 Message-ID: <63D1F08E0E9EAF4185B5AE02D5C0D964013AA362@wcosmb05.cos.agilent.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [h-cost] Medieval Miscellanea #21 thread-index: AcbJ4KZBMgKYbN58QoCD2X1btZb8fQAv5aIQ From: To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Aug 2006 12:55:22.0219 (UTC) FILETIME=[390AC3B0:01C6CAA1] X-DCC--Metrics: net.indra.com 1356; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7SCtTQV054428 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:47:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44F33A44.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > Does anyone have any comments or observations on this pattern > [Medieval Miscellanea #21, 14th and 15th century cotehardies]? > I'm looking at view I. It's a find pattern for a modern princess seamed dress with lacing down the front. It's not a GFD at all. However, the pictures in the instructions/documentation are a nice collection. I used it to make cotehardies, um...15 years ago or so, and didn't have much trouble with it as a novice seamstress (except I remember being utterly confused by what "easing a sleeve into a sleeve hole meant... :-) ) So I'd actually say that the instructions were good. -s _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 15:31:16 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJVGqo000464 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:31:16 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SJVAhi023687 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:31:13 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJUJxV097664 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:30:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJTxW7030416; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:30:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mxo3.broadbandsupport.net (mxo3.broadbandsupport.net [209.55.3.83]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJTsv0030221 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:29:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cahuff@clearviewcatv.net) Received: from [192.168.1.2] (host-67-128-70-97.clearviewcatv.net [67.128.70.97]) by mxo3.broadbandsupport.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 787F4A5C6C for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:29:18 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: cahuff@mail.clearviewcatv.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200608281802.k7SI20XN041136@net.indra.com> References: <200608281802.k7SI20XN041136@net.indra.com> Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:29:08 -0400 To: h-costume@indra.com From: cahuff Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-broadbandsupport-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-broadbandsupport-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-broadbandsupport-MailScanner-From: cahuff@clearviewcatv.net X-Spam-Status: No X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re:Cotehardie pattern... X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:31:13 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F3447E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 12:02 PM -0600 8/28/06, h-costume-request@indra.com wrote: >front) to make it luxurious and swirly. If you have to piece fabric for one >or more gores, you will feel even more medieval! > >The gown should be fairly tight, just loose enough to slip over your head >with a little difficulty. You can sew buttons up the front to mimic a >fancier cotehardie. > >The fit depends on your skill, of course, but I have found that the look is >very "real" -- something about all those geometric pieces. It is easy and >even kind of fun to take a bunch of rectangles and make a fitted dress! Dang Woman--you've been hiding in my sewing room! And here it would be soo much easier with another set of hands! < VBEG> (I swiped my ideas from 'Cut my Cote' and the Hartely book back in the mid 70's...when I was younger and could actually reach my entire back seam myself, I did several skin tight fitted "GFD"...now they just aren't as fitted) Ta Carol-- who thinks cutting and fitting by rectangles is sooo spiffy *and* efficient! And as a weaver it's a 'Good Thang' -- Creative Clutter is Better Than Idle Neatness! _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 15:55:04 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJt4fw001010 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:55:04 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SJsraC013115 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:55:01 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJrraC001571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:53:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJrf5p053606; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:53:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.207.252]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7SJrcsm053456 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:53:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 39006 invoked by uid 60001); 28 Aug 2006 19:53:32 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=1LzEZsRPMlCqTm4GphnEkxQ4sWcHWRUIZ/qddVi1GFg1nhtRLwX+l5HGAYxbTnIVP4o9yIaY6uRg0cYxbLw6XxueIcr72b47gLbEXiFANo0jBbsgq4uZCPXJMr/FGc99yfymsSIT/ELl25hdJC2NahNOj8EM909vOo5DvwnHO7Q= ; Message-ID: <20060828195332.39004.qmail@web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [148.107.3.20] by web32708.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:53:32 PDT Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:53:32 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: cotehardie pattern To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:55:01 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F34A0D.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Here's the picture itself. I have this amazing blue wool that's just the color of the one on the right. I basically need a work/camp dress as shown, over an underdress/shift. Mind you, that woman is in better shape than I am, and I don't really want anything that hugs the figure (especially over the tum) too completely. Not the most fashionable sillhouette, but a useful one. MaggiRos --- Gail & Scott Finke wrote: > > MaggiRos: > > I don't have those Book of Hours illustrations > handy, and I have never used > that pattern... the reason being that I have never > liked the fit in the > made-up ones I've seen. > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 16:00:20 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SK0KmU001139 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:00:20 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aeacus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SK0Dfx007135 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:00:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJwx7J002689 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:58:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJwgAx058599; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:58:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp.prismnet.com (smtp.prismnet.com [209.198.128.91]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SJwZWj058377 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:58:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from webmail.io.com (webmail.io.com [209.198.128.99]) by smtp.prismnet.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7SJic4X070596 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:44:38 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from 65.117.156.5 (SquirrelMail authenticated user ches) by webmail.io.com with HTTP; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:44:38 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <34748.65.117.156.5.1156794278.squirrel@webmail.io.com> In-Reply-To: References: <200608281802.k7SI20XN041136@net.indra.com> Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:44:38 -0500 (CDT) From: "Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio" To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.1, clamav-milter version 0.88.1 on smtp.prismnet.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.4 required=7.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.0 (2005-09-13) on smtp.prismnet.com Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Glove booklett published X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (aeacus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:00:17 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aeacus with ID 44F34B4D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO After nearly 20 years of off and on working on it I got my book published. :) The Compleat Anachronist Spring 2006 Making Elizabethan Gloves CA0131 http://tinyurl.com/q4lh7 It says Spring but it actually got published this month. It arrived in most mail boxes this weekend. :) HL Chiara _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 16:25:20 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SKPEBm001736 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:25:14 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SKOVeY004346 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:25:04 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SKKR2h006870 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:23:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SKGqMe077119; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:17:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pfepb.post.tele.dk (pfepb.post.tele.dk [195.41.46.236]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SKGL9x076450 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:16:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from drewscph@post12.tele.dk) Received: from CPQ21932199711 (0x503f5585.bynxx11.adsl.tele.dk [80.63.85.133]) by pfepb.post.tele.dk (Postfix) with SMTP id D18A7A50034 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:16:05 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000501c6cade$d7f117d0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> From: "Bjarne og Leif Drews" To: Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:16:23 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] holliday X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:25:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44F350FF.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Hello all, I am off tomorrow morning for 14 days holliday at Scicilly, i am unsubscribing in the period but will return. Bjarne Leif og Bjarne Drews www.my-drewscostumes.dk http://home0.inet.tele.dk/drewscph/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 17:03:54 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SL3qcl002574 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:03:52 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SL3kRs003912 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:03:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SL2G8s016149 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:02:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SL22UP024843; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:02:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp4.mc.surewest.net (qsmtp.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.145]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7SL1rWS024677 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:01:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 19496 invoked from network); 28 Aug 2006 13:59:46 -0700 Received: by simscan 1.1.0 ppid: 19440, pid: 19448, t: 6.7206s scanners: regex: 1.1.0 attach: 1.1.0 clamav: 0.84/m:40/d:1722 spam: 3.0.3 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21.surewest.net) (64.30.124.102) by qsmtp4 with SMTP; 28 Aug 2006 13:59:39 -0700 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060828140112.022aa6f8@surewest.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:01:32 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] holliday In-Reply-To: <000501c6cade$d7f117d0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> References: <000501c6cade$d7f117d0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.3 (2005-04-27) on qsmtp4.surewest.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.3 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:03:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F35A32.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 01:16 PM 8/28/2006, you wrote: >Hello all, >I am off tomorrow morning for 14 days holliday at Scicilly, i am >unsubscribing in the period but will return. > >Bjarne Have a great trip! Joan Jurancich joanmj@surewest.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 17:15:58 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SLFwZd002841 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:15:58 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SLFq6j012150 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:15:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SLEegw017801 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:14:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SLEZIn036254; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:14:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.203]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SLETmb036103 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:14:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from your1a4d29f243 (ool-45757a12.dyn.optonline.net [69.117.122.18]) by mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <0J4Q001KI89A8XX1@mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:12:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:14:02 -0400 From: monica spence Subject: RE: [h-cost] Glove booklett published In-reply-to: <34748.65.117.156.5.1156794278.squirrel@webmail.io.com> To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:15:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F35D08.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Congrats! I got mine the other day! Monica (Dame Catriona MacDuff East) -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio Sent: Monday, August 28, 2006 3:45 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Glove booklett published After nearly 20 years of off and on working on it I got my book published. :) The Compleat Anachronist Spring 2006 Making Elizabethan Gloves CA0131 http://tinyurl.com/q4lh7 It says Spring but it actually got published this month. It arrived in most mail boxes this weekend. :) HL Chiara _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 17:27:59 2006 Return-Path: Received: from persephone.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SLRxw1003107 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:27:59 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by persephone.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SLRqGo017345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:27:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SLQKvh019576 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:26:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SLQFNo047209; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:26:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:root@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SLQ64n047069 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 15:26:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from robin@shell.nightowl.net) Received: from shell.nightowl.net (IDENT:robin@shell.nightowl.net [209.176.170.30]) by shell.nightowl.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA13403 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:06:09 -0500 Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:06:09 -0500 (CDT) From: Robin Netherton To: Historic Costume List Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Lecture possibility, again X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (persephone.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:27:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at persephone with ID 44F35FD8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO A couple of weeks ago I posted to this list a note about the possibility I might give some lectures on medieval costume at CostumeCon 25 (April 2007 in St. Louis) if there were enough interest. I didn't realize till after I posted that the note went out at a time when many people who do medieval costuming in this part of the country were at the SCA's Pennsic War and away from their e-mail. So, the message didn't propogate as far as I'd hoped. Some people have suggested to me that I try again. To my knowledge, the message did go to the list for the SCA kingdom of Calontir, the Meridies costumers list, and a few specialty lists (including aotc, Laurels, Authentic SCA). I would be very grateful if I could get the message sent along to the other kingdoms that serve the greater Midwest, and to any regional costume lists of medieval interest in the same regions. I don't know the names of all the kingdoms. If you are on one of those lists where the message did not appear, and you would be willing to forward the message, please e-mail me privately and I'll send you a copy. (Don't forward *this* note; it doesn't have the necessary information!) Thanks! --Robin _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 18:16:41 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SMGeo7004109 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 18:16:40 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SMGYnZ019428 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 18:16:37 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SMFuM9029162 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:15:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SMFoWo094259; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:15:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mf3.socket.net (mf3.socket.net [216.106.88.97] (may be forged)) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SMFgrb094084 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:15:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from otsisto@socket.net) Received: from CAT1 (unknown [216.106.93.239]) by mf3.socket.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 127813D941 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:15:38 -0500 (CDT) From: "otsisto" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] holliday Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:15:58 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <000501c6cade$d7f117d0$7c83fea9@CPQ21932199711> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 18:16:37 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F36B42.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Have a wonderful trip. De -----Original Message----- Hello all, I am off tomorrow morning for 14 days holliday at Scicilly, i am unsubscribing in the period but will return. Bjarne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 21:25:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from demeter.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T1OuIY007613 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:25:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by demeter.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7T1OMlx014555 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:24:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T1MBfc059922 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:22:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T1M2ww042154; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:22:02 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T1LxFL042052 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:22:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m51.in-tch.com [216.166.191.51]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id k7T1AZQ24384 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:10:35 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <004001c6cb0a$a40a7ca0$33bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200608281802.k7SI20XN041136@net.indra.com> <34748.65.117.156.5.1156794278.squirrel@webmail.io.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Glove booklett published Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:29:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (demeter.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:24:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at demeter with ID 44F39746.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I got mine. It looks very thorough! ;o) I was showing it to another (SCA) friend, and she was drooling at your biblio! Well done! --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, August 28, 2006 1:44 PM Subject: [h-cost] Glove booklett published > After nearly 20 years of off and on working on it I got my book > published. :) > > The Compleat Anachronist Spring 2006 > Making Elizabethan Gloves > CA0131 > http://tinyurl.com/q4lh7 > > It says Spring but it actually got published this month. It arrived > in most mail boxes this weekend. :) > > HL Chiara > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 21:31:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T1VSDd007728 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:31:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7T1VMxU027802 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:31:25 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T1Ux5T061038 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:30:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T1UvvB048754; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:30:57 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web32715.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web32715.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.206.28]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7T1UspS048617 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 19:30:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maggiros@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 6429 invoked by uid 60001); 29 Aug 2006 01:30:47 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=lKz3iqbI/Yb6ogy/9oZSsz2K2TG/JC/hp5ah6x+3k7zCpdlTenfJBZQolQfsIAb/1Ua2gv3gOsJuDeSi0Ss0buYl/JB6wZ+8DQZbBmCnJfg4Bfh4vSqQEdis1Ou+m4J2OUKxSf4j2JxEzN0rsDgB416991SM9705MM1/Z7EYTUk= ; Message-ID: <20060829013047.6426.qmail@web32715.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [70.34.229.63] by web32715.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 18:30:47 PDT Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 18:30:47 -0700 (PDT) From: MaggiRos Subject: Re: [h-cost] Glove booklett published To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <004001c6cb0a$a40a7ca0$33bfa6d8@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:31:25 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F398EA.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Darn, I didn't subscribe to CA this year! Waah. Maggie --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > I got mine. It looks very thorough! ;o) I was > showing it to another (SCA) > friend, and she was drooling at your biblio! > Well done! > --Sue > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio" > > To: "Historical Costume" > Sent: Monday, August 28, 2006 1:44 PM > Subject: [h-cost] Glove booklett published > > > > After nearly 20 years of off and on working on it > I got my book > > published. :) > > > > The Compleat Anachronist Spring 2006 > > Making Elizabethan Gloves > > CA0131 > > http://tinyurl.com/q4lh7 > > > > It says Spring but it actually got published this > month. It arrived > > in most mail boxes this weekend. :) > > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 22:38:34 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2cUxZ008789 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:38:30 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7T2cN8P003429 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:38:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2binf069908 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:37:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2bepT093548; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:37:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2bboG093421 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:37:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E56CA7719 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:37:13 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44F3A87A.7080200@reddawn.net> Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:37:46 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Glove booklett published References: <20060829013047.6426.qmail@web32715.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20060829013047.6426.qmail@web32715.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:38:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F3A89F.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO MaggiRos wrote: > Darn, I didn't subscribe to CA this year! Waah. > I don't either. I just go through the list every few years and pick out the issues that interest me. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 22:38:56 2006 Return-Path: Received: from rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2cuN7008794 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:38:56 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7T2cnSV015697 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:38:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2cTmq069960 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:38:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2cSgf094053; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:38:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from sccrmhc15.comcast.net (sccrmhc15.comcast.net [63.240.77.85]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2cOLB093939 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:38:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from chiara@io.com) Received: from cheslaptop (c-24-1-85-230.hsd1.tx.comcast.net[24.1.85.230]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc15) with SMTP id <2006082902381801500cv6cce>; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 02:38:18 +0000 Message-ID: <08dd01c6cb14$2ea3a9a0$070ba8c0@CHESLAPTOP> From: "Chiara Francesca" To: "Historical Costume" References: <20060829013047.6426.qmail@web32715.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Glove booklett published Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:25:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0 (rhadamanthus.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:38:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at rhadamanthus with ID 44F3A8B9.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thank you all!!! :) I started the booklet in '84 if that gives you any idea how much of me is in there. :) It is already on the order page, that is the tinyrul I added there at the bottom. :) It is what I used for my class kit so I will be ordering quite a few to put in the kits. :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "MaggiRos" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Monday, August 28, 2006 8:30 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Glove booklett published > Darn, I didn't subscribe to CA this year! Waah. > > Maggie > > --- Sue Clemenger wrote: > >> I got mine. It looks very thorough! ;o) I was >> showing it to another (SCA) >> friend, and she was drooling at your biblio! >> Well done! >> --Sue >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Chiara Francesca Arianna d'Onofrio" >> >> To: "Historical Costume" >> Sent: Monday, August 28, 2006 1:44 PM >> Subject: [h-cost] Glove booklett published >> >> >> > After nearly 20 years of off and on working on it >> I got my book >> > published. :) >> > >> > The Compleat Anachronist Spring 2006 >> > Making Elizabethan Gloves >> > CA0131 >> > http://tinyurl.com/q4lh7 >> > >> > It says Spring but it actually got published this >> month. It arrived >> > in most mail boxes this weekend. :) >> > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Mon Aug 28 23:51:29 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T3pTOe009860 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 23:51:29 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7T3pNXI009987 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 23:51:26 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T3oYcx078321 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:50:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T3oUfF040378; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:50:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com (nz-out-0102.google.com [64.233.162.199]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T3oRV5040346 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:50:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cinbarnes@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id 12so1072303nzp for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:50:27 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=tTEw/i2LwD92jusCGnxLQQYBGgB+WFUSKb3XPmD2Y37qQ5eCBcq+N43Q2DnTypOsSp9g/6zglzGqG5+JGATf/mRq3KlaNoEP6X/AYlzI+n27+ELwLiOKkSOzVZ+RZt1IfhuaKQwHZ4P61wYBE+Urj6c/ZlS1t3TMH8zeMrfQCOg= Received: by 10.64.148.8 with SMTP id v8mr7938423qbd; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:50:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.65.237.12 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:50:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:50:25 -0700 From: Cin To: drewscph@post12.tele.dk, h-cost MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Re: Lund, Sweden X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Mon, 28 Aug 2006 23:51:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F3B9BB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO >Hi Cin, >There is the museum called "Kulturen" wich has a department with Historical >Costumes, i think they change their exhibitis from time to time. I was there >3 years ago to see womens clothes from early 18th to 20th century. I know >they have a ruff from 16th century amongst other rare things. Thanks so much, Bjarne. He said the exhibit had closed. His note is copied below. --cin Cynthia Barnes CinBarnes@gmail.com > I was at that Museum. The exhibits changed and they did not have the > women's clothes exhibit. Their bookstore did not have anything (in any > language) on clothes. That was the first thing I looked for :) I was > hoping to surprise you with a good catalog but no such luck. > > Raz _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 29 08:22:13 2006 Return-Path: Received: from psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TCMDYd014495 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 08:22:13 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by psamathe.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7TCM4OU010556 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 08:22:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TCLPtW039162 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 06:21:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TCLL4T035714; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 06:21:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mtiwmhc12.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc12.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.116]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T3In9R020599 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:18:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from m.p.decker@att.net) Received: from toshibauser (223.birmingham-03rh16rt-04rh15rt.al.dial-access.att.net[12.74.174.223]) by worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc12) with SMTP id <200608290318381120072june>; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 03:18:38 +0000 Message-ID: <000e01c6cb19$cedb5760$dfae4a0c@toshibauser> From: "margaret" To: "Historical Costume" References: <200608281802.k7SI20XN041136@net.indra.com> <34748.65.117.156.5.1156794278.squirrel@webmail.io.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Glove booklett published Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 22:18:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=3% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (psamathe.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 08:22:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at psamathe with ID 44F4316C.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I have only had time to skim so far, but I like what I've seen so far. Good job. > After nearly 20 years of off and on working on it I got my book > published. :) > > The Compleat Anachronist Spring 2006 > Making Elizabethan Gloves > CA0131 > http://tinyurl.com/q4lh7 > > It says Spring but it actually got published this month. It arrived > in most mail boxes this weekend. :) > > HL Chiara > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 29 17:52:42 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TLqgiC001080 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 17:52:42 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7TLqa0q018626 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 17:52:39 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TLonwl026667 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 15:50:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TLocRK082751; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 15:50:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web26504.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (web26504.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.146.176.41]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7THeXM3028560 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 11:40:40 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lenastrid@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 52255 invoked by uid 60001); 29 Aug 2006 17:40:18 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=QmqA4puU6SpXojW0B7O/M5tSTA8MSdWKPJxDdg96L1Bo3+NOjZkVWEkXfanVueJZqZjUZWuZRdKwyixbkzTR437VJfl/Ut0kktUD9Aoca+Oc3lN0Czg3FouUPpF8/AhrIZJDpc4PjhGc4A1Y3o7IG4jplQscmZ0gRdj36F48ysU= ; Message-ID: <20060829174018.52253.qmail@web26504.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Received: from [82.163.122.133] by web26504.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:40:18 BST Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:40:18 +0100 (BST) From: Lena Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Lund, Sweden To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-DCC-Servercave-Metrics: net.indra.com 1183; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 17:52:39 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F4B724.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO However, if you contact them, maybe you can arrange to be shown clothes that are not on exhibit? (info@kulturen.com) I went there on a "behind the stage" day a few years ago, and they have wonderful stuff. /Lena --- Cin wrote: > >Hi Cin, > >There is the museum called "Kulturen" wich has a > department with Historical > >Costumes, i think they change their exhibitis from > time to time. I was there > >3 years ago to see womens clothes from early 18th > to 20th century. I know > >they have a ruff from 16th century amongst other > rare things. > > Thanks so much, Bjarne. He said the exhibit had > closed. His note is > copied below. > --cin > Cynthia Barnes > CinBarnes@gmail.com > > > I was at that Museum. The exhibits changed and > they did not have the > > women's clothes exhibit. Their bookstore did not > have anything (in any > > language) on clothes. That was the first thing I > looked for :) I was > > hoping to surprise you with a good catalog but no > such luck. > > > > Raz > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > ___________________________________________________________ All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 29 18:06:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TM6njb001455 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:06:49 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7TM6h5U028011 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:06:46 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TM4HPa029210 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 16:04:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TM3uAB095640; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 16:03:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7TM3YtK095022 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 16:03:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from PasoVasz@aol.com) Received: from PasoVasz@aol.com by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id r.57a.4284d72 (48378); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:02:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.0.104] (host-24-225-211-205.patmedia.net [24.225.211.205]) by ciaaol-r03.mx.aol.com (v112.5) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLR036-bcfa44f4b96138; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:02:09 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) To: 18cWoman@yahoogroups.com, "MetropolitanLadiesSociety@yaho MetropolitanLadiesSociety@yaho" MetropolitanLadiesSociety@yahoMetropolitanLadiesSociety@yahoMetropolitanLadiesSociety@yahoogroups.com, Historical Costume Message-Id: From: Susan Data-Samtak Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:02:08 -0400 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-AOL-IP: 24.225.211.205 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 18:06:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F4BA73.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO http://www.fabric.com/apparel-fashion-fabric-wool-fabric-wool-flannel- fabric.aspx?cm_mmc=Email-_-8/29/06%20Labor%20day%20sale-_-Real%20Deal- _-Wool%20Flannel Susan "Creative Clutter is Better Than Idle Neatness" Carol H. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 29 21:38:34 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U1cYxN006787 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:38:34 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7U1cR0a002646 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:38:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U1bMh5059972 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 19:37:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U1bIGJ059549; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 19:37:18 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net (tomts16.bellnexxia.net [209.226.175.4]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U1bDsm059492 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 19:37:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from shaneandsheridan@sympatico.ca) Received: from smtp1.sympatico.ca ([209.226.175.146]) by tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.13 201-253-122-130-113-20050324) with SMTP id <20060830013711.EDHC27612.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:37:11 -0400 X-Mailer: Openwave WebEngine, version 2.8.11 (webedge20-101-194-20030622) From: Sheridan To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: aesthetic dress Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:37:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20060830013711.EDHC27612.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@smtp1.sympatico.ca> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:38:31 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F4EC13.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Sounds oh so Gothic to me. (everything old is new again...) Sheridan P. :-) > > From: Gail & Scott Finke > Date: 2006/08/25 Fri PM 10:16:06 EST > To: > Subject: [h-cost] Re: aesthetic dress > > > Lovely as it may seem now, aesthetic dress was considered strange and > subversive at the time. Gilbert and Sullivan had a great show (I have never > seen it, unfortunately) about the aesthetic movement -- "Patience; or, > Bunthorne's Bride." The heroine is a young girl who thinks she can't be in > love unless she's suffering, so she ignores the nice young man who loves her > in favor of the Oscar Wilde-ish poet whom she can't stand. Whenever she's > around him, she suffers, so she thinks she must be in love. During the > operetta, all the young soldiers give up their uniforms for velvet suits and > lilies, to catch the women who are swooning over poets. > > "When I Go Out the Door" is the final song describing the poet and the hero. > The poet is: > > "A most intense young man, > A soulful-eyed young man, > An ultra-poetical, super-aesthetical, > Out-of-the-way young man! > > and > > "A pallid and thin young man, > A haggard and lank young man, > A greenery-yallery, Grosvenor Gallery, > Foot-in-the-grave young man!" > > Of course, the aesthetic folks didn't see themselves that way. > > There's also a great cartoon by G.K. Chesterton called "Vision in Bedford > Park." I can't find it online, unfortunately, but it's in the edition of > "The Man Who Was Thursday" published by Ignatius and annotated by Martin > Gardner. It shows a "pallid and thin" man carrying a lily and a woman in a > loose, aesthetic gown staring in shock at the shadow of a man in a > respectable coat, carrying a prayer book. The caption is "Bedford Parkers > see a Dreadful Vision of the Future: an old acquaintance going to Church." > Bedford Park was an artsy area of London where poets and the like hung out, > and Chesterton was an old "Bedford Parker" himself, before his famous > conversion, after which he preferred common sense and religious orthodoxy to > aesthetic movements, atheism, and intellectual fads. But his associating > aesthetic dress to these things gives you an idea of the way it was > regarded. > > Gail Finke > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 29 23:24:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U3O168008399 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:24:01 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7U3NtJB019586 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:23:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U3MwRA071352 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:22:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U3MsNQ031356; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:22:54 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from liberty3.libertyactivist.org (mail.libertyactivist.org [72.54.7.237]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U3MmGv031293 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:22:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from raelee@rachelsampsel.com) Received: from localhost (liberty3 [127.0.0.1]) by liberty3.libertyactivist.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4552162A3A for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:21:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from liberty3.libertyactivist.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (liberty3 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 09519-06 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:21:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: by liberty3.libertyactivist.org (Postfix, from userid 48) id 5306962A23; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:21:24 -0600 (MDT) Received: from 148.64.47.113 (SquirrelMail authenticated user raelee) by www.libertyactivist.org with HTTP; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:21:24 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <1683.148.64.47.113.1156908084.squirrel@www.libertyactivist.org> In-Reply-To: <200608260332.k7Q3W0Qg052713@net.indra.com> References: <200608260332.k7Q3W0Qg052713@net.indra.com> Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:21:24 -0600 (MDT) From: "Rachel Sampsel" To: h-costume@indra.com User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at libertyactivist.org X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] contracts X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:23:58 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F504CB.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Message: 1 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:26:45 -0700 From: Cynthia J Ley Subject: [h-cost] contracts To: h-costume@indra.com Cc: cley@juno.com Message-ID: <20060825.072647.1872.4.Cley@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain Hi all. I was wondering if I could ask all you professionals out there for some advice. I have a friend who is starting to make high-quality SCA garb for sale, and is interested in doing custom work. She was wondering about the wording on contracts, whether these be pay for garment or barter for garment. Any suggestions that I could share with her? thanks! Arlys ****Tell your friend to be aware that if she puts "Barter" in writing in a contract, she will probably have to report it to the IRS. Technically, all barter situations are like that - you're suppposed to report every single one to the IRS, but if it isn't in writing, it can be very difficult to prove. The minute it ends up on paper, you're stuck with it, and then the reporting has to occur. Or you have to get very creative on your paperwork when you're selected for a random audit. Patches _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Tue Aug 29 23:36:08 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U3a8wn008624 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:36:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7U3a2EC029332 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:36:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U3YtE1072519 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:34:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U3YrCX038863; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:34:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp4.mc.surewest.net (qsmtp.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.145]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7U3YmP9038770 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:34:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 17177 invoked from network); 29 Aug 2006 20:32:45 -0700 Received: by simscan 1.1.0 ppid: 17146, pid: 17160, t: 7.5184s scanners: regex: 1.1.0 attach: 1.1.0 clamav: 0.84/m:40/d:1761 spam: 3.0.3 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21.surewest.net) (64.30.124.102) by qsmtp4 with SMTP; 29 Aug 2006 20:32:38 -0700 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060829203246.022aa2d0@surewest.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 20:34:26 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.3 (2005-04-27) on qsmtp4.surewest.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,HTML_40_50, HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=ham version=3.0.3 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:36:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F507A2.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 03:02 PM 8/29/2006, you wrote: >http://www.fabric.com/apparel-fashion-fabric-wool-fabric-wool-flannel- >fabric.aspx?cm_mmc=Email-_-8/29/06%20Labor%20day%20sale-_-Real%20Deal- >_-Wool%20Flannel > > >Susan Looks lovely to me. What sort of use do you have in mind? Joan Jurancich joanmj@surewest.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 00:14:39 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U4EZDO009518 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 00:14:35 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7U4ETVV005273 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 00:14:32 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U4Dx97077124 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 22:13:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U4BbCd060943; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 22:11:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from m00.lax.untd.com (m00.lax.untd.com [64.136.30.63]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7U4BWLx060868 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 22:11:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cley@juno.com) Received: from m00.lax.untd.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by m00.lax.untd.com with SMTP id AABCRLD76ASVZ26J for (sender ); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:10:36 -0700 (PDT) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: QHEuP/IhRKXTJ0EJwxwhgkSYJSOlQBmkXEnWlp993nU= Received: (from cley@juno.com) by m00.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id LYZBDLRA; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:10:13 PDT To: h-costume@indra.com Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 20:58:21 -0700 Subject: Re: [h-cost] contracts Message-ID: <20060829.210915.2896.1.Cley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 4.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-2,4-46 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 From: Cynthia J Ley X-ContentStamp: 18:9:3095214291 X-MAIL-INFO: 5aed2095208d31c18d313de1313dad7160f004097521f000bda1754000a511690030a90ced94edf5393d3531ede1 X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 127.0.0.1|localhost|m00.lax.untd.com|cley@juno.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 00:14:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F510A5.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Thanks! I'll pass this along. Arlys On Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:21:24 -0600 (MDT) "Rachel Sampsel" writes: > Message: 1 > Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 07:26:45 -0700 > From: Cynthia J Ley > Subject: [h-cost] contracts > To: h-costume@indra.com > Cc: cley@juno.com > Message-ID: <20060825.072647.1872.4.Cley@juno.com> > Content-Type: text/plain > > Hi all. I was wondering if I could ask all you professionals out > there > for some advice. I have a friend who is starting to make > high-quality SCA > garb for sale, and is interested in doing custom work. She was > wondering > about the wording on contracts, whether these be pay for garment or > barter for garment. Any suggestions that I could share with her? > > thanks! > Arlys > > > > ****Tell your friend to be aware that if she puts "Barter" in > writing in a > contract, she will probably have to report it to the IRS. > Technically, > all barter situations are like that - you're suppposed to report > every > single one to the IRS, but if it isn't in writing, it can be very > difficult to prove. The minute it ends up on paper, you're stuck > with it, > and then the reporting has to occur. Or you have to get very > creative on > your paperwork when you're selected for a random audit. > > Patches > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 08:45:30 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UCjPgN024532 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:45:25 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UCjHYU029128 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:45:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UChnA0033757 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 06:43:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UChdOH056516; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 06:43:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:RCkvyKNlibvflz7Ra3gjX2l+sGVv9mYX@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U2vSxV014243 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 20:57:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.122] (206-124-5-122.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.122]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7U2pGf01374 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 20:51:16 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Historical Costume From: Sylvia Rognstad Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 20:57:26 -0600 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] Racinet X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:45:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F5885D.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would like to use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts think of it in terms of accuracy? Sylrog _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 08:46:55 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UCktSW024560 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:46:55 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UCkm69025856 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:46:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UCjEvS034016 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 06:45:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UCjCj4057706; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 06:45:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m27.mx.aol.com (imo-m27.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.8]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7U3ijOE044894 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:44:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from PasoVasz@aol.com) Received: from PasoVasz@aol.com by imo-m27.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.c27.28d0b97 (60469) for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:44:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.0.104] (host-24-225-211-205.patmedia.net [24.225.211.205]) by ciaaol-m02.mx.aol.com (v112.5) with ESMTP id MAILCIAAOLM022-ec3544f5098b236; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:44:12 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20060829203246.022aa2d0@surewest.net> References: <7.0.1.0.2.20060829203246.022aa2d0@surewest.net> Message-Id: <243e5adc72293cfda2c0c61cc5e579e8@aol.com> From: Susan Data-Samtak Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:44:10 -0400 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-AOL-IP: 24.225.211.205 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:46:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F588B8.008 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by sca.uwaterloo.ca id k7UCktSW024560 Status: RO Saw this on fabric.com website and thought I would alert folks to it and ask if it was worthy of use in Period Attire. I am primarily interested in Rev War and Civil War/Victorian (USA). Most interested in Sidesaddle Riding Habits for those time periods, but am expanding to unmounted clothing as well. Husband will "dress" for those time periods, if I provide the clothing. He has his own horse, as well. Susan "Slow down. The trail is the thing, not the end of the trail. Travel too fast and you miss all you are traveling for".  - "Ride the Dark Trail" by Louis L'Amour On Aug 29, 2006, at 11:34 PM, Joan Jurancich wrote: > At 03:02 PM 8/29/2006, you wrote: >> http://www.fabric.com/apparel-fashion-fabric-wool-fabric-wool- >> flannel- >> fabric.aspx?cm_mmc=Email-_-8/29/06%20Labor%20day%20sale-_- >> Real%20Deal- _-Wool%20Flannel >> >> >> Susan > > Looks lovely to me. What sort of use do you have in mind? > > > Joan Jurancich > joanmj@surewest.net _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 08:57:14 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UCvE78024924 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:57:14 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UCv7WW003892 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:57:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UCtn3V035479 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 06:55:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UCtlWP065645; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 06:55:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from eastrmmtao03.cox.net (eastrmmtao03.cox.net [68.230.240.36]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UCtfaE065529 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 06:55:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from vmaa2@cox.net) Received: from eastrmimpo02.cox.net ([68.1.16.120]) by eastrmmtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.06.01 201-2131-130-101-20060113) with ESMTP id <20060830125536.FYHX23863.eastrmmtao03.cox.net@eastrmimpo02.cox.net> for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:55:36 -0400 Received: from dell ([68.225.179.207]) by eastrmimpo02.cox.net with bizsmtp id GCvX1V0044UskY40000000 Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:55:31 -0400 From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:55:30 -0400 Message-ID: <005801c6cc33$92f2ec70$6501a8c0@dell> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <243e5adc72293cfda2c0c61cc5e579e8@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:57:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F58B23.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I saw this yesterday morning as well. And I was pretty darned excited, until I saw the fiber content. It's 20% nylon, which is too much for me. Also, I'm not all that thrilled with the colors. It all depends on your needs, for ACW/Victorian it might be just fine. For Early Period, it's not what I'm looking for. It is an excellent price, though. ::Linda:: -----Original Message----- On Behalf Of Susan Data-Samtak Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 11:44 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Saw this on fabric.com website and thought I would alert folks to it and ask if it was worthy of use in Period Attire. _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 10:04:09 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UE48H0027045 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:04:08 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UE42pp020627 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:04:05 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UE1jon046933 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:01:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UE1e25020118; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:01:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UE0bFR019208 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:00:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m182.in-tch.com [216.166.191.182]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id k7UDn3Q17503 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 07:49:04 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <001701c6cc3d$c4dc96a0$b6bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <005801c6cc33$92f2ec70$6501a8c0@dell> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:08:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-DCC-dcc.uncw.edu-Metrics: net.indra.com 1201; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:04:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F59AD2.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO 20% Nylon? Well, crap.... I was excited, too, but hadn't had time yet to check it out. Bummer..... --Sue, looking for some wool for an early-Medieval clothing item (gardecorps) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Rice" To: "'Historical Costume'" Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 6:55 AM Subject: RE: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? > I saw this yesterday morning as well. And I was pretty darned excited, > until I saw the fiber content. It's 20% nylon, which is too much for me. > Also, I'm not all that thrilled with the colors. It all depends on your > needs, for ACW/Victorian it might be just fine. For Early Period, it's > not what I'm looking for. > > It is an excellent price, though. > > ::Linda:: > > > -----Original Message----- > On Behalf Of Susan Data-Samtak > Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 11:44 PM > Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming > uses? > > Saw this on fabric.com website and thought I would alert folks to it > and ask if it was worthy of use in Period Attire. > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 10:57:28 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UEvSCs030380 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:57:28 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UEvJaL021783 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:57:24 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UEtrwn055272 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:55:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UEtnwq068290; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:55:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from qsmtp4.mc.surewest.net (qsmtp.mc.surewest.net [66.60.130.145]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7UEti2k068199 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 08:55:46 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from joanmj@surewest.net) Received: (qmail 18964 invoked from network); 30 Aug 2006 07:53:40 -0700 Received: by simscan 1.1.0 ppid: 18925, pid: 18936, t: 7.3320s scanners: regex: 1.1.0 attach: 1.1.0 clamav: 0.84/m:40/d:1761 spam: 3.0.3 Received: from unknown (HELO DD84JW21.surewest.net) (64.30.124.102) by qsmtp4 with SMTP; 30 Aug 2006 07:53:33 -0700 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060830075353.022ad5a0@surewest.net> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 07:55:25 -0700 To: Historical Costume From: Joan Jurancich Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? In-Reply-To: <001701c6cc3d$c4dc96a0$b6bfa6d8@pavilion> References: <005801c6cc33$92f2ec70$6501a8c0@dell> <001701c6cc3d$c4dc96a0$b6bfa6d8@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.3 (2005-04-27) on qsmtp4.surewest.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.3 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:57:24 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F5A74F.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 07:08 AM 8/30/2006, you wrote: >20% Nylon? Well, crap.... >I was excited, too, but hadn't had time yet to check it out. Bummer..... >--Sue, looking for some wool for an early-Medieval clothing item >(gardecorps) Fooey! I didn't look at the individual fabric listings, so I missed the nylon content. But they do have some 100% wool gabardine which might be nice, it's a bit lighter weight, though. http://www.fabric.com/apparel-fashion-fabric-wool-fabric-wool-gabardine.aspx Joan Jurancich joanmj@surewest.net _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 11:08:39 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UF8dcF031398 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:08:39 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UF8XsK022096 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:08:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UF6LZu056651 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:06:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UF5w66078381; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:06:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.122]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UF5mYe078201 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:05:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from khanson@kc.rr.com) Received: from karen (CPE-72-128-23-84.kc.res.rr.com [72.128.23.84]) by ms-smtp-02.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7UF5iAm013700 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:05:45 -0500 (CDT) From: "KLH" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:10:21 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-reply-to: Importance: Normal X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:08:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F5A9F1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO He drew very pretty pictures...that's about all I can say about Racinet. :) For me, if I can't see what the original subject looked like, or track down a reference for the drawing, then it's useless as far as accuracy goes. Talia -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 9:57 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Racinet I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would like to use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts think of it in terms of accuracy? Sylrog _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.6/430 - Release Date: 8/28/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/433 - Release Date: 8/30/2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 11:16:44 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFGhTH032071 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:16:43 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UFGbLp001608 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:16:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFFoiR058361 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:15:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFFgtw088275; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:15:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.204]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFFYWa088036 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:15:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from optonline.net (hamstr8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.23]) by mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with ESMTP id <0J4T00H2YH0LJVK2@mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:14:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [10.240.3.42] (Forwarded-For: [161.38.223.246]) by mstr8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mshttpd); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:15:20 -0400 Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:15:20 -0400 From: monicaspence@optonline.net Subject: Re: [h-cost] Racinet In-reply-to: To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Sun Java(tm) System Messenger Express 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal References: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:16:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F5ABD5.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Not much. They were redrawings of famous paintings and illustrations. Better you should use primary, not secondary sources. Monica Spence Fashion History instructor/ costume historian ----- Original Message ----- From: Sylvia Rognstad Date: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 10:57 pm Subject: [h-cost] Racinet > I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would > like to > use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. > Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts > think of it in terms of accuracy? > > Sylrog > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 11:23:03 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFMxsb032481 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:22:59 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UFMqdL004887 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:22:55 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFLMWs059074 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:21:22 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFLHHa093673; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:21:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFL8Vh093425 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:21:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:20200 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1GIRsH-0000rd-9o for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:21:05 -0500 Message-ID: <064801c6cc47$e98e28b0$7e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <005801c6cc33$92f2ec70$6501a8c0@dell><001701c6cc3d$c4dc96a0$b6bfa6d8@pavilion> <7.0.1.0.2.20060830075353.022ad5a0@surewest.net> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:21:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:22:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F5AD4C.005 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO There's a reason I became very biased towards FFC, and its name is selection: http://www.fashionfabricsclub.com/Catalog_items.aspx?Query=100%%20wool -E "biased" House _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 11:35:35 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFZZx7000721 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:35:35 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UFZSlh012101 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:35:31 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFYMd3060973 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:34:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFYF4M006808; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:34:16 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:sWs/Ce54VkSRVHXp5kO/XJGB1nJ7Sgq8@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFY2ma006590 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:34:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.194] (206-124-5-194.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.194]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7UFRkf22008 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:27:46 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <4c12ea1202ef81e2fbdff96f3b522c77@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:33:53 -0600 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:35:31 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F5B040.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Yes, I'm starting to realize that my costume library from when I studied costume history eons ago is full of inaccurate information. Does anyone know of a comprehensive book on costume history that is really good with lots of primary sources? Sylrog On Aug 30, 2006, at 9:10 AM, KLH wrote: > He drew very pretty pictures...that's about all I can say about > Racinet. :) > For me, if I can't see what the original subject looked like, or track > down > a reference for the drawing, then it's useless as far as accuracy goes. > > Talia > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com > [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad > Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2006 9:57 PM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: [h-cost] Racinet > > > I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would like to > use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. > Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts > think of it in terms of accuracy? > > Sylrog > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.6/430 - Release Date: > 8/28/2006 > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/433 - Release Date: > 8/30/2006 > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 12:29:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGT20e002800 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:29:02 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UGStkh013086 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:28:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGRROG068284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:27:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGRGjL061462; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:27:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGRBI4061389 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:27:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GISuI-0005LQ-31; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:27:14 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:27:14 -0400 Message-ID: <20060830122714.duy9lnl12jt6oscw@www.goldsword.com> Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:27:14 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.1) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:28:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F5BCC7.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting Sylvia Rognstad : > I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would like to > use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. > Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts > think of it in terms of accuracy? In light of the negative responses to this question, what book would you use? susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 12:38:25 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGcPg2002982 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:38:25 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UGcIiY018360 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:38:21 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGb4eP069742 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:37:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGasJ8071808; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:37:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com (ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com [24.94.166.115]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGa2Wh070991 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:36:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from khanson@kc.rr.com) Received: from karen (CPE-72-128-23-84.kc.res.rr.com [72.128.23.84]) by ms-smtp-01.rdc-kc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7UGa0Ai018146 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:36:01 -0500 (CDT) From: "KLH" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: RE: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:40:37 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-reply-to: <20060830122714.duy9lnl12jt6oscw@www.goldsword.com> Importance: Normal X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:38:21 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F5BEFA.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO It really would depend on the time period I was teaching, and the geographical area. There's so many choices... Talia -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Susan B. Farmer Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 11:27 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Quoting Sylvia Rognstad : > I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would like to > use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. > Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts > think of it in terms of accuracy? In light of the negative responses to this question, what book would you use? susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/433 - Release Date: 8/30/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/433 - Release Date: 8/30/2006 _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 12:46:03 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGk3le003165 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:46:03 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UGjv4X015602 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:46:00 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGj4VS071148 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:45:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGixkO081042; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:45:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from audi.websitewelcome.com (audi.websitewelcome.com [67.19.210.130]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UGikQm080823 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:44:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sfarmer@goldsword.com) Received: from cpanel by audi.websitewelcome.com with local (Exim 4.52) id 1GITBF-0007s5-7O; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:44:45 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 ([127.0.0.1]) by www.goldsword.com (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:44:45 -0400 Message-ID: <20060830124445.gluhziydzdq8ckog@www.goldsword.com> Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:44:45 -0400 From: "Susan B. Farmer" To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.1) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - audi.websitewelcome.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [32001 32001] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - goldsword.com X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:46:00 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F5C0C5.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Quoting KLH : > It really would depend on the time period I was teaching, and the > geographical area. There's so many choices... The assumption that *I* was making is that it was a survey of Western European Clothing. susan ----- Susan Farmer sfarmer@goldsword.com University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 13:17:06 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UHH6vQ003672 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 13:17:06 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UHH0Eh000483 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 13:17:03 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UHGcxi075692 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:16:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UHGYpD014159; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:16:34 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.120]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7UHGUE3013989 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:16:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cabbagerose@sbcglobal.net) Received: (qmail 4268 invoked by uid 60001); 30 Aug 2006 17:16:25 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Gcni/Rj3SIJagPOOQ9AcnZ9T0+2sQBV9kcRA+OJI5PKW62zr5iPBRmwtkeFQqSe0rgzT+/PIePP8i8QB+klyonJdMbHh4nxuU2WIOMKPKmMiY6E4PS83J7yqCAVLoABmIvNm+4d6Vq2gLy+jqOjUAL6PEEQEUs+qWtIlBsXw9S8= ; Message-ID: <20060830171625.4266.qmail@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [67.118.230.145] by web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:16:25 PDT Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 10:16:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Angela Lazear Subject: Re: [h-cost] contracts To: Historical Costume In-Reply-To: <20060825.072647.1872.4.Cley@juno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 13:17:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F5C80C.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Cynthia, I drafted my own contract(s), but I am a paralegal by day. If your friend has any lawyer buddies, she should ask them for forms she can use. Or make a list of what her goods are, what she wants to charge, any detail she can think of, and her friend can tell her what she needs to state in her contract. If there is no such friend, there are a series of books by "Nolo Press" which are very helpful to folks who wish to "be their own lawyer" and in some cases it can be done without disastrous results. I'm sure she can find one for contracts for small businesses and adapt it. For most transactions, a simple fairly short (about two pages or so) document that is CLEAR about the biggies should be fine. My biggest caveat is don't be afraid to be clear and forthright. If a client is going to be upset about one of your condiions, much better to find out about that BEFORE you've done a bunch of work for which they do not pay. For selling garments you have already made, all of this will be less of an issue, as they will just buy it or not. But when you make someone a garment, you are working for them, and it is much easier if you are both on the same page. Essentially a contract for this type of work should be a list of what you want to provide, when you want to provide it, how much it will cost, and a payment schedule, and a few other things I'm not thinking of right now. Go through your list and think about all the things that can go wrong, where the stressers were when you've done this for friends, etc. For instance I find that payment is a stresser, so I list when I will be paid, how much I will be paid, and what I will do in terms of alterations or additions or whatever, before I will have to ask for more money. In other words, everything that is "included" and what is not. I always get a deposit for at least the full cost of materials. But these are terms that work for me. If your friend doesn't already have one, he or she should get a resale license for their state, so they are not paying taxes on the goods that they purchase to make into the garments, and can buy supplies and fabric at wholesale prices. The other side of that privilege is that they will have to pay sales tax to the state they live in on the cost of the garments, including labor. That's the extent of my "advice" (let me repeat I am NOT an attorney, so this is not legal advice, but personal opinion). I would also not avoid reporting income (including barter) because for me I feel I have to follow all the rules to really be a true professional, but that again, is just my personal opinion. Hope this bit was helpful. angela Angela F. Lazear Cabbage Rose Costumes Theatrical Costume Design www.cabbagerosecostumes.com ----- Original Message ---- From: Cynthia J Ley To: h-costume@indra.com Cc: cley@juno.com Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 7:26:45 AM Subject: [h-cost] contracts Hi all. I was wondering if I could ask all you professionals out there for some advice. I have a friend who is starting to make high-quality SCA garb for sale, and is interested in doing custom work. She was wondering about the wording on contracts, whether these be pay for garment or barter for garment. Any suggestions that I could share with her? thanks! Arlys _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 15:00:11 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UJ0A8R005982 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:00:10 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UJ04Pq004616 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:00:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UIx6xp089291 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:59:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UIwwNR016971; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:58:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from navgw2.mccc.edu (navgw2.mccc.edu [198.133.170.232]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7UIwpsh016791 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 12:58:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from pinner@mccc.edu) Received: from tecoma.mccc.edu ([198.133.170.1]) by navgw2.mccc.edu (SMSSMTP 4.1.0.19) with SMTP id M2006083014584427546 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 14:58:44 -0400 Received: from TH103A ([198.133.170.246]) by tecoma.mccc.edu (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UIwZno017821 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 14:58:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Kate Pinner" To: "'Historical Costume'" Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 14:58:29 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4024 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Subject: [h-cost] 20th c. link X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:00:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F5E034.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO A link I hadn't seen before: http://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/hispanicdesigners/ _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 15:55:20 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UJtKcV007300 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:55:20 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UJtD3U026939 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:55:16 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UJq5gA096626 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 13:52:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UJppqc069849; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 13:51:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from rwcrmhc12.comcast.net (rwcrmhc12.comcast.net [204.127.192.82]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UJpdfp069494 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 13:51:44 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from skskaw@comcast.net) Received: from rmailcenter19.comcast.net ([204.127.197.129]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc12) with SMTP id <20060830195132m1200mmefqe>; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:51:33 +0000 Received: from [24.21.118.52] by rmailcenter19.comcast.net; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:51:32 +0000 From: skskaw@comcast.net (SKneeland) To: steps@antir.sca.org, "Historical Costume" Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:51:32 +0000 Message-Id: <083020061951.14071.44F5EC43000E9634000036F72206998499990E059C059C@comcast.net> X-Mailer: AT&T Message Center Version 1 (Apr 11 2006) X-Authenticated-Sender: c2tza2F3QGNvbWNhc3QubmV0 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: NWColonial@yahoogroups.com Subject: [h-cost] Off topic, way off_museum assistant position X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:55:16 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F5ED21.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Greetings, There is a federal position (for those who might also be interested) involving museum curator assistant-ship (i believe those are the titles). They require knowledge of museum procedures for cataloging and storing and safe handling, 19th century I believe. Is there an expert in this field who would be willing to share what those _skills_ are? TIA, SKneeland _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 19:59:17 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UNxHf5013893 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:59:17 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7UNxArt030557 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:59:14 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UNwKnu031182 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:58:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UNwFUj096918; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:58:15 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:hNux+N+J40FlbRGZKJamSDlaQTkLo+CF@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UNwBUE096860 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:58:13 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.70] (206-124-5-70.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.70]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7UNpwf03014 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:51:58 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:58:06 -0600 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 19:59:14 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F6264E.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO It's an overview of costume history, not any one particular period, and it will not go into much depth, since the class is on the costume and fashion business. I just need to introduce the students into the very basic history. Sylvia On Aug 30, 2006, at 10:40 AM, KLH wrote: > It really would depend on the time period I was teaching, and the > geographical area. There's so many choices... > > Talia > > -----Original Message----- > From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com > [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On > Behalf Of Susan B. Farmer > Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 11:27 AM > To: Historical Costume > Subject: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet > > > Quoting Sylvia Rognstad : > >> I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would like >> to >> use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. >> Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts >> think of it in terms of accuracy? > > In light of the negative responses to this question, what book would > you > use? > > susan > ----- > Susan Farmer > sfarmer@goldsword.com > University of Tennessee > Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/433 - Release Date: > 8/30/2006 > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.11.7/433 - Release Date: > 8/30/2006 > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 20:00:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V00kKD013928 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:00:46 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7V00eke030988 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:00:43 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UNxSSG031314 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:59:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UNxRGB097703; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:59:27 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:iT5TJpKQKceTkZsKO2gk3ePXlpdZiBxy@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UNwhbQ097232 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:58:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.70] (206-124-5-70.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.70]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7UNqVf03060 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:52:31 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: <20060830124445.gluhziydzdq8ckog@www.goldsword.com> References: <20060830124445.gluhziydzdq8ckog@www.goldsword.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <643f0dc746cab35464611d50290de126@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:58:41 -0600 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:00:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F626A8.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO That is correct. On Aug 30, 2006, at 10:44 AM, Susan B. Farmer wrote: > Quoting KLH : > >> It really would depend on the time period I was teaching, and the >> geographical area. There's so many choices... > > The assumption that *I* was making is that it was a survey of Western > European Clothing. > > susan > ----- > Susan Farmer > sfarmer@goldsword.com > University of Tennessee > Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 22:08:39 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V28dka016046 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:08:39 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7V28WkY023156 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:08:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V27cXr044566 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:07:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V27WYX083939; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:07:32 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:+u4p31m5Y7rjmkOm6A9vpzP0HnaA1ZrJ@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V27SWN083906 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:07:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.70] (206-124-5-70.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.70]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7V21Ff12385 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:01:16 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: <20060830122714.duy9lnl12jt6oscw@www.goldsword.com> References: <20060830122714.duy9lnl12jt6oscw@www.goldsword.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <532430775004ba00602b3e27f9b9c8da@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:07:25 -0600 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:08:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F644A0.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO If you don't think much of Racinet, what about Kohler? ALthough his book was written in the twenties, he appears to have a lot of primary sources. I find his diagrammed patterns of clothing interesting, although they are conjecture. They seem well thought out. Sylrog On Aug 30, 2006, at 10:27 AM, Susan B. Farmer wrote: > Quoting Sylvia Rognstad : > >> I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would like >> to >> use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. >> Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts >> think of it in terms of accuracy? > > In light of the negative responses to this question, what book would > you use? > > susan > ----- > Susan Farmer > sfarmer@goldsword.com > University of Tennessee > Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 22:46:56 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2jBef016619 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:45:11 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7V2j494002424 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:45:07 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2ifq0048660 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:44:41 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2iZkR008558; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:44:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2iUSf008448 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:44:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7V3aLma021838 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:36:21 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 21:59:37 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.1 References: <005801c6cc33$92f2ec70$6501a8c0@dell> <001701c6cc3d$c4dc96a0$b6bfa6d8@pavilion> <7.0.1.0.2.20060830075353.022ad5a0@surewest.net> In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20060830075353.022ad5a0@surewest.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200608302159.37167.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:45:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F64D30.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wednesday 30 August 2006 10:55 am, Joan Jurancich wrote: > At 07:08 AM 8/30/2006, you wrote: > >20% Nylon? Well, crap.... > >I was excited, too, but hadn't had time yet to check it out. Bummer..... > >--Sue, looking for some wool for an early-Medieval clothing item > >(gardecorps) > > Fooey! I didn't look at the individual fabric listings, so I missed > the nylon content. But they do have some 100% wool gabardine which > might be nice, it's a bit lighter weight, > though. > http://www.fabric.com/apparel-fashion-fabric-wool-fabric-wool-gabardine.asp I don't believe in wool gabardine for medieval clothing; it looks way too shiny, even if it is 100% wool. Fabric.com does have nice flannels from time to time, though the color choice is often too restricted for my taste. The selection varies a lot; they often do have 100% wool melton and flannel, just not now (apparently). -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Wed Aug 30 22:52:20 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2qGfB016760 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:52:16 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7V2q9Qx008825 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:52:12 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2pB7n049443 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:51:11 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2pAAC013082; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:51:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2p4Hl012908 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:51:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE52AA7745 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 21:50:53 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44F64E94.1060406@reddawn.net> Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 21:51:00 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet References: <20060830122714.duy9lnl12jt6oscw@www.goldsword.com> <532430775004ba00602b3e27f9b9c8da@ntw.net> In-Reply-To: <532430775004ba00602b3e27f9b9c8da@ntw.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:52:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F64ED9.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The list seems to have eaten my first response: The current favorites, based on a quick web survey of posted class syllabi, are: The History of Costume: From Ancient Mesopotamia through the Twentieth Century. Payne, B., Winakor, G., and Farrell-Beck, J. New York: HarperCollins, 1992. Laver, J. Fashion: A Concise History. Thames & Hudson 2002. Survey of Historic Costume, 3rd edition, by Phyllis Tortora and Keith Eubank Any of those ought to be a good start, supplemented by the teacher's notes, of course. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 01:06:14 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V56EiC019132 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 01:06:14 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7V567sN029086 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 01:06:10 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V4oUds062090 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:50:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V4oNDK081901; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:50:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from taisp2.in-tch.com (taisp2.in-tch.com [199.96.34.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V4oJHP081851 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:50:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from mooncat@in-tch.com) Received: from pavilion (msla-r1a1m211.in-tch.com [216.166.191.211]) by taisp2.in-tch.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id k7V4ctQ07200 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:38:55 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <004c01c6ccba$14cb77e0$d3bfa6d8@pavilion> From: "Sue Clemenger" To: "Historical Costume" References: <005801c6cc33$92f2ec70$6501a8c0@dell><001701c6cc3d$c4dc96a0$b6bfa6d8@pavilion><7.0.1.0.2.20060830075353.022ad5a0@surewest.net> <200608302159.37167.cathy@thyrsus.com> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:58:19 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 01:06:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F66E3F.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I've got some lovely, lovely flannel, purchased earlier this summer from Pastiche, but was looking for a few more yards for a 13th century project, and then some wool that's in between flannel and melton, weight-wise. I want it for an outer garment (the gardecorps), but I don't want it so stiff and heavy that it's like wearing armor. I'm built like a tank as it is , so I need something that drapes a bit more than the meltons I've met. --Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Olanich Raymond" To: "Historical Costume" Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 7:59 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? > On Wednesday 30 August 2006 10:55 am, Joan Jurancich wrote: > > At 07:08 AM 8/30/2006, you wrote: > > >20% Nylon? Well, crap.... > > >I was excited, too, but hadn't had time yet to check it out. Bummer..... > > >--Sue, looking for some wool for an early-Medieval clothing item > > >(gardecorps) > > > > Fooey! I didn't look at the individual fabric listings, so I missed > > the nylon content. But they do have some 100% wool gabardine which > > might be nice, it's a bit lighter weight, > > though. > > http://www.fabric.com/apparel-fashion-fabric-wool-fabric-wool-gabardine.asp > > I don't believe in wool gabardine for medieval clothing; it looks way too > shiny, even if it is 100% wool. > > Fabric.com does have nice flannels from time to time, though the color choice > is often too restricted for my taste. The selection varies a lot; they often > do have 100% wool melton and flannel, just not now (apparently). > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point > of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 06:14:34 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VAEXTg013795 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:14:33 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VAERQK028247 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:14:30 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VADjDt090738 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 04:13:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VADbxM062532; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 04:13:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.89]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VADYEx062441 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 04:13:36 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com) Received: from hotmail.com ([207.46.10.110]) by bay0-omc1-s17.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 03:13:29 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 03:13:29 -0700 Message-ID: Received: from 207.46.10.123 by by121fd.bay121.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:13:26 GMT X-Originating-IP: [198.166.214.5] X-Originating-Email: [estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com] X-Sender: estela_dufrayse@hotmail.com In-Reply-To: <44F64E94.1060406@reddawn.net> From: "Kelly Grant" To: h-costume@indra.com Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:13:26 -0300 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Aug 2006 10:13:29.0142 (UTC) FILETIME=[1AD61560:01C6CCE6] X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:14:30 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F6B683.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I am agreeing with Dawn on these two books, not sure about the third, I don't own it. The Survey of Historic Costume comes up to modern times, I think the late 1970's/80's and has quite a bit on modern fashion that should be helpful when tying the course into the rest of your fashion program. I would suplement it though, as it's just a survey and doesn't go in depth on any one era or culture. Maybe a suggested reading list to go with the textbook and class notes. Kelly "Bravery is something you can experience on the spur of the moment, faced with danger. To have courage, you must think about the dangers in advance, then weigh the risks, and then do what you have to do, despite your fears" Caius Merlyn Britannicus > >Laver, J. Fashion: A Concise History. Thames & Hudson 2002. > >Survey of Historic Costume, 3rd edition, by Phyllis Tortora and Keith >Eubank > > >Any of those ought to be a good start, supplemented by the teacher's notes, >of course. > > > >Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 07:58:46 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VBwkfM022249 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:58:46 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VBwdYD016746 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:58:42 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VBvtsC003131 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 05:57:56 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VBvowU028816; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 05:57:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.38]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UFvj6X030338 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:57:49 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from suzi@suziclarke.co.uk) Received: from mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com ([212.74.114.47]) by mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com with ESMTP; 30 Aug 2006 16:52:31 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AQAAAEpQ9USBT4lYAQECBwIMBwYd Received: from 88-107-116-157.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.116.157]:3208 helo=suzi.suziclarke.co.uk) by mk-smarthost-8.mail.uk.tiscali.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1GISMg-0006T0-H3 for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:52:30 +0000 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20060830165038.05127748@suziclarke.co.uk> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 16:52:34 +0100 To: Historical Costume From: Suzi Clarke Subject: Re: [h-cost] Racinet In-Reply-To: <4c12ea1202ef81e2fbdff96f3b522c77@ntw.net> References: <4c12ea1202ef81e2fbdff96f3b522c77@ntw.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; bulk rep Body=many Fuz1=many Fuz2=many rep=10% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:58:42 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F6CEEF.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO At 16:33 30/08/2006, you wrote: >Yes, I'm starting to realize that my costume library from when I >studied costume history eons ago is full of inaccurate information. >Does anyone know of a comprehensive book on costume history that is >really good with lots of primary sources? > >Sylrog Francois Boucher "History of Costume in the Western World" is my favourite, with lots of text, great photos of garments, accessories, and paintings, although some are black and white. Mostly there is good dating and sources, i.e. Prado, V and A etc. Suzi _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 08:03:25 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC3Plc022345 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:03:25 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VC3JmZ020303 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:03:22 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC1pVe004160 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:01:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC1pdf032640; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:01:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7UH0H4s097836 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:00:20 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9128A7745 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:59:50 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44F5C40A.5040101@reddawn.net> Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 11:59:54 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet References: <20060830122714.duy9lnl12jt6oscw@www.goldsword.com> In-Reply-To: <20060830122714.duy9lnl12jt6oscw@www.goldsword.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:03:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F6D007.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Susan B. Farmer wrote: > Quoting Sylvia Rognstad : > > > In light of the negative responses to this question, what book would you > use? > The current favorites, based on a quick web survey of posted class syllabi, are: The History of Costume: From Ancient Mesopotamia through the Twentieth Century. Payne, B., Winakor, G., and Farrell-Beck, J. New York: HarperCollins, 1992. Laver, J. Fashion: A Concise History. Thames & Hudson 2002. Survey of Historic Costume, 3rd edition, by Phyllis Tortora and Keith Eubank Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 08:03:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC3mU8022359 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:03:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VC3gbn019882 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:03:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC3Mpe004688 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:03:23 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC3L9X034222; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:03:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from imo-m20.mx.aol.com (imo-m20.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7ULZk3o078322 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 15:35:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from Debloughcostumes@aol.com) Received: from Debloughcostumes@aol.com by imo-m20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r7.6.) id 6.491.8319c2d (48624) for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:35:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Debloughcostumes@aol.com Message-ID: <491.8319c2d.32275ea2@aol.com> Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 17:35:30 EDT Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet To: h-costume@indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 670 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:03:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F6D01E.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO In a message dated 8/30/06 7:02:01 PM GMT Daylight Time, h-costume-request@indra.com writes: > In light of the negative responses to this question, what book would you > >use? history of costume by james laver (actually has a couple of names, depending on the version, as it's been re-issued a couple of times), by james laver pretty much anything by the cunningtons (some books (eg occupational costume) use a lot of re-drawings, but they're generally faithful to the original, and usually impeccably sourced, and not too hard to find if you want to look at the originals) the visual history of costume books (either the one volume version, or if you can find them, the separate volumes (by various authors, published by batsford and now out of print) several books on different aspects of costume by Aileen Ribeiro debbie PS, most of these deal with english / western european costume since c 1K ad) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 08:05:23 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC5N4k022410 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:05:23 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VC5HZ6021493 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:05:20 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC4qnN005173 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:04:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC4piW035757; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:04:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.197]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V2aVmM003194 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 20:36:33 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from your1a4d29f243 (ool-45757a12.dyn.optonline.net [69.117.122.18]) by mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <0J4U00FAICKL4R1F@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:36:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:36:15 -0400 From: monica spence Subject: RE: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet In-reply-to: <532430775004ba00602b3e27f9b9c8da@ntw.net> To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=6% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:05:20 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F6D07D.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I don't think much of Kohler. There are better sources. Janet Arnold's 3 books "Patterns of fashion" are a good start if you are doing 16th-20th Centuries. There are no perfect costume books. Start with the primary sources (art) and extant clothing of whatever period you need. Powerpoint is a good way to go, since you can put whatever you want into the presentation. So many pictures are available online, it makes it easy. Monica -----Original Message----- From: h-costume-bounces@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-bounces@indra.com]On Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2006 10:07 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet If you don't think much of Racinet, what about Kohler? ALthough his book was written in the twenties, he appears to have a lot of primary sources. I find his diagrammed patterns of clothing interesting, although they are conjecture. They seem well thought out. Sylrog On Aug 30, 2006, at 10:27 AM, Susan B. Farmer wrote: > Quoting Sylvia Rognstad : > >> I'm teaching a class on costume and fashion this fall and would like >> to >> use Racinet's illustrations to supplement the history section. >> Considering his book was written in the 1800s, what do you experts >> think of it in terms of accuracy? > > In light of the negative responses to this question, what book would > you use? > > susan > ----- > Susan Farmer > sfarmer@goldsword.com > University of Tennessee > Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology > http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 08:55:21 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VCtLQh023783 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:55:21 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VCtEHt017154 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:55:17 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VCrmVV016174 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:53:48 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VCrld2076798; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:53:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.196]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VCrinp076673 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:53:45 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from monicaspence@optonline.net) Received: from your1a4d29f243 (ool-45757a12.dyn.optonline.net [69.117.122.18]) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-6.01 (built Apr 3 2006)) with SMTP id <0J4V001N357FB0I3@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:54:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:53:28 -0400 From: monica spence Subject: RE: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet In-reply-to: <200608302221.42513.cathy@thyrsus.com> To: Historical Costume Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:55:18 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F6DC32.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO The problem with costume books is that they are all too general. If you want to see the most artwork-- use Davenport. However, the book is in B&W, the pics are small and the text is gossipy. If you are looking for specific periods , a how to : The Janet Arnold books, Norah Waugh, The Tudor Tailor, The Medieval Tailor's assistant, the Jean Hunniset books. They have various degrees of historical accuracy. For the various periods, there are specialty books like Queen Elizabeth's Wardrobe Unlo'ked, Moda di Firenze, Hispanic Costume, etc. Very specific time periods. A pretty good source for life and times is the Time-Life series: What life was like" Loaded with color pics and decent short essays. The Tortora/ Eubanks book does not have nearly enough color pics. (We use that as the new text where I teach) One day there will be the perfect textbook. It will weigh 100lbs and cost $2000. :-) Monica Spence -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 08:59:00 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VCx0Ah023832 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:59:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VCwrft019241 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:58:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VCv4Oj016807 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:57:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VCv3R1079496; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:57:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net (tomts13.bellnexxia.net [209.226.175.34]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VCuwcU079431 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:57:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dluckham@sympatico.ca) Received: from Main.sympatico.ca ([69.156.108.240]) by tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.13 201-253-122-130-113-20050324) with ESMTP id <20060831125657.CFWB29052.tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net@Main.sympatico.ca> for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:56:57 -0400 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.2.20060831084454.00c18bd0@pop8.sympatico.ca> X-Sender: b1jerw63@pop8.sympatico.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:56:48 -0400 To: h-costume@mail.indra.com From: Dawn Luckham Subject: RE: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:58:56 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F6DD0D.004 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I just finished a college level program that used "Survey of Historic Costume: A History of Western Dress" by Phyllis G. Tortora, Keith Eubank. It's current and it brushes past history and costume, combining social and political influences. As someone who was already very interested in historic costume before I took the class, I must admit, I found this book vague and well, lacking. My favourite for teaching a class on Historic Costume would be 20,000 Years of Fashion by Francois Boucher. I like the text and I like that it is full of art that illustrates style. Dawn Luckham _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 09:24:49 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VDOmYi024268 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:24:48 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VDOgAF004660 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:24:45 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VDN07A020989 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:23:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VDMtMs001220; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:22:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from randymail-a10.dreamhost.com (mailbigip.dreamhost.com [208.97.132.5]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VDMpke001178 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:22:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from guenievre@erminespot.com) Received: from JS (nsc69.38.51-212.newsouth.net [69.38.51.212]) by randymail-a10.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13E8D10EE76 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:22:49 -0700 (PDT) From: "Guenievre de Monmarche" To: "'Historical Costume'" Subject: RE: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:24:26 -0400 Message-ID: <049301c6cd00$c8d90e00$020aa8c0@tereckoffice.local> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 Thread-Index: AcbMp5eAtF84SoeQRu6j2iHvQPT2tgAWQ3Kw In-Reply-To: <200608302159.37167.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k7VDMpke001178 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:24:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F6E31A.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > I don't believe in wool gabardine for medieval clothing; it looks way > too > shiny, even if it is 100% wool. > > Fabric.com does have nice flannels from time to time, though the color > choice > is often too restricted for my taste. The selection varies a lot; they > often > do have 100% wool melton and flannel, just not now (apparently). > Yes, but you can often "unshine" it by ignoring all the care instructions and washing it/drying it a couple times really roughly... Guenièvre _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 10:25:04 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEP0Cj026081 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:25:00 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VEOrki010460 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:24:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VENHwD028259 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:23:17 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VENAcg048056; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:23:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from isis.ntw.net (IDENT:SJK3SPkCashCqClZVBWzuPoHumQfq8u+@isis.ntw.net [199.165.233.10]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEN7W7048011 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:23:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from sylvia@ntw.net) Received: from [206.124.5.84] (206-124-5-84.denver.dial.forethought.net [206.124.5.84]) by isis.ntw.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id k7VEGrf29282 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:16:53 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v624) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <0852aff2e7777deb2e2aaf13c0eb23b5@ntw.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Sylvia Rognstad Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:23:03 -0600 To: Historical Costume X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.624) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:24:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F6F135.007 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I am aware of the generality problem and will definitely use more sources when I teach a costume history class next semester, but the class I am currently teaching just requires a broad overview of history, something that will only require a couple of weeks at the most. I was really trying to find one of those costume silhouette timelines I have seen in the past, but haven't been able to locate one anywhere. Sylrog On Aug 31, 2006, at 6:53 AM, monica spence wrote: > The problem with costume books is that they are all too general. If > you want > to see the most artwork-- use Davenport. However, the book is in B&W, > the > pics are small and the text is gossipy. If you are looking for > specific > periods , a how to : The Janet Arnold books, Norah Waugh, The Tudor > Tailor, > The Medieval Tailor's assistant, the Jean Hunniset books. They have > various > degrees of historical accuracy. > > For the various periods, there are specialty books like Queen > Elizabeth's > Wardrobe Unlo'ked, Moda di Firenze, Hispanic Costume, etc. Very > specific > time periods. > > A pretty good source for life and times is the Time-Life series: What > life > was like" Loaded with color pics and decent short essays. > > The Tortora/ Eubanks book does not have nearly enough color pics. (We > use > that as the new text where I teach) > > One day there will be the perfect textbook. It will weigh 100lbs and > cost > $2000. :-) > > Monica Spence > > > > -- > Cathy Raymond > > "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point > of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > > > _______________________________________________ > h-costume mailing list > h-costume@mail.indra.com > http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume > _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 10:37:41 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEbcOG026332 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:37:38 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VEbWX3019412 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:37:35 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEaTce030392 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:36:29 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEaOqH060025; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:36:24 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from aethelwulf.jatol.com (aethelwulf.jatol.com [147.202.37.243]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEaJ4i059848 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:36:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from formfunc@formfunction.org) Received: from 24-216-120-37.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([24.216.120.37]:22795 helo=compaqub) by aethelwulf.jatol.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1GIneS-0000Ea-Oo for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:36:17 -0500 Message-ID: <005c01c6cd0a$d21d7230$7e00a8c0@compaqub> From: "E House" To: "Historical Costume" References: <049301c6cd00$c8d90e00$020aa8c0@tereckoffice.local> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:36:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - aethelwulf.jatol.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - indra.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - formfunction.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:37:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F6F42C.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO For what it's worth, I recently did a thread count comparison between the counts given in "Medieval Textiles" and "Woven into the Earth," and some common types of modern wool (including gabardine). To my surprise, even the normal-to-coarse modern wools that should have been comparable based on text descriptions were FAR finer (like 2-3 times the thread count) than even the extant textiles that were described as being extremely fine. If anyone is interested in more detail, I'll look around for the notebook that has my preliminary notes and post 'em here. Long story short, though, go for the coarser woolens if you want a really authentic-looking fabric, at least for pre ~1475, and for early period & vikingish stuff, try to find a coarse worsted. (Woolens didn't get hip until what, around 12thC-13thC? sorry, posting without my references.) -E House (Loves the fine worsteds far too much to give them up. Besides, I haven't gotten thread counts for the early 16thC yet. Maybe things were different then! Anyone have any references?) _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 10:43:58 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEhw7W026423 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:43:58 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VEhpwK022819 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:43:54 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEgtaG031621 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:42:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEgrM1066499; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:42:53 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com (web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.199.132]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7VEgnlR066366 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:42:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ctrvlyfarm@sbcglobal.net) Received: (qmail 40283 invoked by uid 60001); 31 Aug 2006 14:42:44 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=lcVcOsFrJuUyJvADDYb6lGzqD1W1LnwW3HZjGo7HxXzyZ5cDgEFGuuMH7GhatF8P2iIp2YWh1eeloi/IQ71OyJUfbKMhZJ8E77jo6+a6lqlU3ncF/6tLH10+tZr97qsSesPmZb8AO2EGHIKBSnAgontJ1OCkRLYak7CgiX71gXI= ; Message-ID: <20060831144244.40281.qmail@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.250.189.44] by web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:42:44 PDT Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 07:42:44 -0700 (PDT) From: REBECCA BURCH To: h-costume@mail.indra.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Roman Soldiers X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:43:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F6F5A7.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Here's an interesting problem we could use your collective input on: I ran into a woman I know yesterday and she presented me with an interesting question. Seems she has taken over the costumes for a local Bethlehem Walk and is in a little bit of a panic. A little background - a Bethlehem Walk is scenes from the life of Jesus. This particular one is presented by a group of about 10 country churches here in my little corner of Southeastern Ohio. Many of the churches are lucky if they have a congregation of more than 20 folks. They aren't interested in historical accuracy just general impression - since none of the audience stays in one place for more than a couple minutes as they walk past the setting. Plus the Walk takes place outside in the evenings over Thanksgiving weekend. So it is pretty dark and the players are generally bundled up under all their robes. All that said, the major frustration at the moment is the helmets for the Roman soldiers. Currently they are using baseball batting helmets worn backwards with - get this - red feather boas glued across the top. There is nothing to be done about the helmets - they were donated and there is no money to replace them - but the feathers across the top seem to have molted terribly over the summer. So the question is - Any ideas for cheap, easy to apply replacements for the boas? Any ideas will be greatfully accepted. Thanks Rebecca Burch Center Valley Farm Duncan Falls, Ohio, USA _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 10:44:47 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEh2fq026413 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:43:02 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VEgt86022253 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:42:58 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC55sI005244 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:05:05 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VC54QO035987; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 06:05:04 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7V36ZkT022873 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 21:06:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7V3wQYj022530 for ; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:58:26 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 22:21:42 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.1 References: <532430775004ba00602b3e27f9b9c8da@ntw.net> <44F64E94.1060406@reddawn.net> In-Reply-To: <44F64E94.1060406@reddawn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200608302221.42513.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:42:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F6F56F.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wednesday 30 August 2006 10:51 pm, Dawn wrote: > The list seems to have eaten my first response: > > The current favorites, based on a quick web survey of posted class > syllabi, are: > > The History of Costume: From Ancient Mesopotamia through the Twentieth > Century. Payne, B., Winakor, G., and Farrell-Beck, J. New York: > HarperCollins, 1992. > > Laver, J. Fashion: A Concise History. Thames & Hudson 2002. > > Survey of Historic Costume, 3rd edition, by Phyllis Tortora and Keith > Eubank Here's my 2 cents (in the currency of your choice): Laver isn't bad, but he's very, very general. His book alone doesn't give nearly enough detail, even for a survey of Western costume. Payne is sufficiently comprehensive. I'm not familiar with the 1992 version, but older versions did not incorporate the recent archaeological research, particularly on dark ages costume. Tortora and Eubank is used by many college curricula in the subject, or so I understand. I haven't read it either, but I flipped through it in a bookstore once and was impressed by the clarity of its diagrams. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 11:03:56 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VF3uFS027737 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:03:56 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VF3nKX002827 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:03:53 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VF2TuH035884 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:02:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VF2O0h087270; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:02:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from nz-out-0102.google.com (nz-out-0102.google.com [64.233.162.195]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VF2JkH087160 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:02:21 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from maricelt@gmail.com) Received: by nz-out-0102.google.com with SMTP id 12so350685nzp for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:02:19 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=eBxQBkQgo0da6302409d7BrazeiAY4fadorKWII3jz/fgKuqZ0iZ/WNBht3w0ev6O+eKx2yu6zfZpBQpCSce8bBDHyrKjzYG8l3DMmX12VmHjM5N60/V/ApwvldkCwAfYQMqZswA2aRlpJtyMQUHcyJlMGbOWsyCAFSg3VUhKdQ= Received: by 10.35.78.1 with SMTP id f1mr888100pyl; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:02:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.35.90.10 with HTTP; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:02:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <72adc2660608310802s1e375bccyd52de38c2828f633@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:02:19 -0400 From: "Marie Stewart" To: "Historical Costume" Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roman Soldiers In-Reply-To: <20060831144244.40281.qmail@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20060831144244.40281.qmail@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:03:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F6FA56.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Nylon broom straw, in red if you can find it. Or regular broom straw, dyed, or painted. put a bunch together with a rubber band, make a puddle of glue (hot glue) stand the bundle up in it. ? Bridgette _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 12:00:03 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VFxx9L029275 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:59:59 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VFxq4B007306 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:59:56 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VFvwYh046997 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:58:00 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VFvnsn042883; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:57:51 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp101.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com (smtp101.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.198.200]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id k7VFvQuQ042321 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:57:31 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lizyoung@fenris.net) Received: (qmail 22648 invoked from network); 31 Aug 2006 15:57:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?127.0.0.1?) (glenn.mcgregor@sbcglobal.net@71.142.202.231 with plain) by smtp101.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Aug 2006 15:57:11 -0000 Message-ID: <44F706D6.1000304@fenris.net> Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 08:57:10 -0700 From: Elizabeth Young User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roman Soldiers References: <20060831144244.40281.qmail@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <72adc2660608310802s1e375bccyd52de38c2828f633@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <72adc2660608310802s1e375bccyd52de38c2828f633@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:59:56 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F70778.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Marie Stewart wrote: > Nylon broom straw, in red if you can find it. Or regular broom straw, > dyed, or painted. > > put a bunch together with a rubber band, make a puddle of glue (hot > glue) stand the bundle up in it. > > ? that's what I was thinking of as well, just remember to take the handle off the broom or your roman soldiers will look like Marvin the Martian liz young _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 12:58:53 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VGwr0k032550 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:58:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VGwkHL021891 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:58:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VGvhcE057282 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:57:43 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VGvcQo004001; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:57:38 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from pop-savannah.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-savannah.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.69]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VGvXlV003922 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:57:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from melanie@faucet.net) Received: from dialup-4.229.66.6.dial1.detroit1.level3.net ([4.229.66.6] helo=faucet.net) by pop-savannah.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1GIprA-0007ao-00 for h-costume@indra.com; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:57:32 -0400 Message-ID: <44F7225D.5010003@faucet.net> Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:54:37 -0500 From: Melanie Schuessler User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: What would *you* use? (was Re: [h-cost] Racinet References: <20060830122714.duy9lnl12jt6oscw@www.goldsword.com> <44F5C40A.5040101@reddawn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:58:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F71546.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO I used the James Laver book last semester to teach a general Western European/American clothing history class. It was cheap, which is always good for the students, but it's very much a brief history and has about five pages on the entire middle ages. It was extremely lacking in details, and you can certainly tell when it was written. Laver likes to put in his own opinions on how unlovely past fashions were. I would love to have used Boucher, but it went out of print, and I hate to ask students to search around for OOP books at who knows what price. The text in Boucher is pretty iffy in places, but the images are great and plentiful. In the end, I supplemented with lots of readings from other sources. I don't think there's really a good textbook out there right now for this. Melanie Schuessler Eastern Michigan University _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 13:43:48 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VHhiU3002703 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:43:44 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VHhbng019903 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:43:40 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VHgBho064439 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:42:12 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VHflGc050269; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:41:47 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from smtp5.suscom.net (smtp5.suscom.net [64.78.83.245]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VHfFGx049720 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:41:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from goofy1@suscom.net) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by smtp5.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5DE2510628 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp5.suscom.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp5 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20799-01-26 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:41:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Stuckis (c-71-207-16-152.hsd1.pa.comcast.net [71.207.16.152]) by smtp5.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id C3178510622 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:41:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <027201c6cd24$a039d820$9810cf47@Stuckis> From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" To: "Historical Costume" References: <049301c6cd00$c8d90e00$020aa8c0@tereckoffice.local> Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:41:01 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:43:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F71FC9.002 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Guenievre de Monmarche" To: "'Historical Costume'" Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 9:24 AM Subject: RE: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? > > I don't believe in wool gabardine for medieval clothing; it looks way > > too > > shiny, even if it is 100% wool. > > Yes, but you can often "unshine" it by ignoring all the care instructions > and washing it/drying it a couple times really roughly... > > Guenièvre I wash and dry mine when it needs it...doesn't appear to have hurt it in the least! Dianne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 19:11:53 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNBr5I018004 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:11:53 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VNBkTH025589 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:11:49 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNAqm6010883 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 17:10:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNAdEV066534; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 17:10:39 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from zenobia.reddawn.net (rrcs-67-52-227-84.west.biz.rr.com [67.52.227.84]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VGovq8096843 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 10:50:59 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from dawn@reddawn.net) Received: from [10.0.0.3] (angel.reddawn.net [10.0.0.3]) by zenobia.reddawn.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6A54A7721 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:50:51 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <44F71378.2060304@reddawn.net> Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:51:04 -0500 From: Dawn User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040910 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roman Soldiers References: <20060831144244.40281.qmail@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20060831144244.40281.qmail@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-dmv.com-Metrics: net.indra.com 1181; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:11:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F76CB2.007 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > > So the question is - Any ideas for cheap, easy to > apply replacements for the boas? > IIRC the boa lengths were pretty cheap at Joann's ($5-10?), and they could get several helmets covered with one length. However, there are places that sell plastic costume helmets pretty cheap too, for example this is $4.50: http://www.unitedmaskandparty.com/Character_Heads_And_Helmets/images/roman_helmet_adult.JPG I suspect they only need a few, surely they can scrounge up $5 a person and replace the baseball helmets. Dawn _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 19:12:59 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNCtVu018040 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:12:55 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VNCmxJ025737 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:12:51 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNC8eS011093 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 17:12:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNC7h4067824; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 17:12:07 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from jefferson.patriot.net (jefferson.patriot.net [209.249.176.3]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VH6kXn013364 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:06:55 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from aquazoo@patriot.net) Received: from webmail.patriot.net (vanburen.patriot.net [209.249.176.8]) by jefferson.patriot.net (8.13.4/8.13.4/Debian-3sarge1) with ESMTP id k7VH6XYp000332 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:06:40 -0400 Received: from 72.13.239.193 (SquirrelMail authenticated user aquazoo) by webmail.patriot.net with HTTP; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:06:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <61245.72.13.239.193.1157044000.squirrel@webmail.patriot.net> In-Reply-To: <20060831144244.40281.qmail@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20060831144244.40281.qmail@web81404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:06:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [h-cost] Roman Soldiers From: aquazoo@patriot.net To: "Historical Costume" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-DCC-Servercave-Metrics: net.indra.com 1183; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 rep=4% X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:12:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F76CF0.003 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO > All that said, the major frustration at the moment is > the helmets for the Roman soldiers. Currently they are > using baseball batting helmets worn backwards with - > get this - red feather boas glued across the top. > There is nothing to be done about the helmets - they > were donated and there is no money to replace them - > but the feathers across the top seem to have molted > terribly over the summer. I was in a Roman reenactment group for a while. The crest on the helmet is a brush made of horsehair, not feathers. If you're on a budget and just giving the impression of the look, why not just make the crest shape out of cardboard and paint it red? There is a church near me that does a Bethlehem walk every other year. They actually had the soldiers from the reenactment group volunteer to participate and harass the populace. The only difficulty is that hobnails are very slippery on linoleum. -Carol _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 19:15:13 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNFDWs018125 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:15:13 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7VNF6uh027134 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:15:09 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNETmf011540 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 17:14:30 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VNESDi069722; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 17:14:28 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VMBWKV014791 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 16:11:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from gcshc-h-costume@gmane.org) Received: from root by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1GItsM-0005ht-1A for h-costume@mail.indra.com; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 23:15:02 +0200 Received: from rrcs-72-43-68-175.nys.biz.rr.com ([72.43.68.175]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 23:15:02 +0200 Received: from adelaide by rrcs-72-43-68-175.nys.biz.rr.com with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 23:15:02 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: h-costume@mail.indra.com From: Anne Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 11:08:31 -0400 Lines: 29 Message-ID: References: <083020061951.14071.44F5EC43000E9634000036F72206998499990E059C059C@comcast.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: rrcs-72-43-68-175.nys.biz.rr.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.7.1) Gecko/20040707 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en In-Reply-To: <083020061951.14071.44F5EC43000E9634000036F72206998499990E059C059C@comcast.net> X-DCC-Rhyolite-Metrics: net.indra.com 101; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Subject: [h-cost] Re: Off topic, way off_museum assistant position X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:15:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F76D7A.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO Working in a museum as an educator, I know what these skills are, but don't proclaim to be an expert. Cataloging skills generally means knowledge of how to properly catalog an object for accession into a museum's collection. That is, a systematic way of describing objects that (ideally) allows others to understand the meaning, use, context, etc. of the item regardless of the institution. The most common naming system used in the US I beleive is Nomenclature. There may be other systems for costume collecting, but I don't know. For example, in our collection clothing is categorized as outerwear, underwear, footwear, accessory, etc. Then they might be in subcategories, such as dress, jacket, boot, etc. A dress could be listed as a dress, gown, wedding gown, jumper or uniform, depending on its use and the museum's system of cataloging. A system of cataloging is supposed to resolve confusion over whether something is an item of dress, a personal object, a tool, etc. While putting items in categories seems very straight forward, it can get very complicated since objects often have multiple uses. Is an item a work of art? A utilitarian item? Training or experience in cataloging helps a registar or curator figure out how to make these choices. Storage and safe handling: knowing when to lay a dress flat vs. hang it on a padded hanger; use of acid-free materials and proper humidity control; how to display and arrange clothing so that it is not damaged by light or movement--try dressing a 1950s mannequin with a 1850s dress and you will soon find that this requires a great deal of skill or proper display forms (speaking from experience here!) For non clothing--knowing which items might be made from hazardous or combustible materials and how to protect them, staff and the storage facility from any danger they might present. Hope this helps! Anne _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 20:00:42 2006 Return-Path: Received: from endeis.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k8100d3c019651 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 20:00:39 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by endeis.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k8100XAH018116 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 20:00:36 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k8100Awq016984 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 18:00:10 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k81008E3002264; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 18:00:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k81002kU002108 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 18:00:06 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k810psnj025738 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 20:51:54 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Racinet Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:15:10 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.1 References: <4c12ea1202ef81e2fbdff96f3b522c77@ntw.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20060830165038.05127748@suziclarke.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20060830165038.05127748@suziclarke.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200608311915.10818.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (endeis.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 20:00:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at endeis with ID 44F77821.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Wednesday 30 August 2006 11:52 am, Suzi Clarke wrote: > At 16:33 30/08/2006, you wrote: > >Yes, I'm starting to realize that my costume library from when I > >studied costume history eons ago is full of inaccurate information. > >Does anyone know of a comprehensive book on costume history that is > >really good with lots of primary sources? > > > >Sylrog > > Francois Boucher "History of Costume in the Western World" is my > favourite, with lots of text, great photos of garments, accessories, > and paintings, although some are black and white. Mostly there is > good dating and sources, i.e. Prado, V and A etc. Boucher has a lot of great pictures, some you can't find anywhere else, but I've never been impressed by his text. I wouldn't assign his book alone as course reading, but in conjunction with something like Tortora and Eubanks, it would be very helpful. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume From h-costume-bounces@indra.com Thu Aug 31 20:06:36 2006 Return-Path: Received: from aegina.uwaterloo.ca (mailservices.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.141]) by sca.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k8106arg019834 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 20:06:36 -0400 Received: from www1.indra.com (smtp-www1.indra.com [209.169.0.7]) by aegina.uwaterloo.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k8106UT6022750 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 20:06:33 -0400 Received: from net.indra.com (net.indra.com [204.144.142.1]) by www1.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k81063eP017666 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 18:06:03 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@indra.com) Received: from net.indra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k8106028006367; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 18:06:01 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from h-costume-bounces@mail.indra.com) Received: from grelber.thyrsus.com (dsl092-053-140.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net [66.92.53.140]) by net.indra.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k8105t6b006201 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 18:05:58 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from cathy@thyrsus.com) Received: from minx.thyrsus.com (minx.thyrsus.com [192.168.1.21]) by grelber.thyrsus.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k810vpDe025876 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 20:57:51 -0400 From: Catherine Olanich Raymond To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Is this wool flannel appropriate for any costuming uses? Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:21:07 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.1 References: <049301c6cd00$c8d90e00$020aa8c0@tereckoffice.local> In-Reply-To: <049301c6cd00$c8d90e00$020aa8c0@tereckoffice.local> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200608311921.08066.cathy@thyrsus.com> X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.4, clamav-milter version 0.88.4 on localhost X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV version 0.88.2, clamav-milter version 0.88.2 on lysol.indra.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by net.indra.com id k8105t6b006201 Cc: X-BeenThere: h-costume@mail.indra.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Historical Costume List-Id: Historical Costume List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: h-costume-bounces@indra.com Errors-To: h-costume-bounces@indra.com X-Greylist: IP, sender and recipient auto-whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-1.6 (aegina.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.128.232]); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 20:06:33 -0400 (EDT) X-Miltered: at aegina with ID 44F77986.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http://j-chkmail.ensmp.fr)! Status: RO On Thursday 31 August 2006 9:24 am, Guenievre de Monmarche wrote: [actually, I said:] > > I don't believe in wool gabardine for medieval clothing; it looks way > > too > > shiny, even if it is 100% wool. > > > > Fabric.com does have nice flannels from time to time, though the color > > choice > > is often too restricted for my taste. The selection varies a lot; they > > often > > do have 100% wool melton and flannel, just not now (apparently). [and Guenièvre replied:] > Yes, but you can often "unshine" it by ignoring all the care instructions > and washing it/drying it a couple times really roughly... That will take care of the shine, I'm sure, though I'm not convinced that it will have the right hand or be thick enough when done. I will defer, however, to the opinions of those who have tried it. -- Cathy Raymond "A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity." --Robert Frost _______________________________________________ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume